American Murder: Gabby Petito (from Patreon)

Summary

True Crime Obsessed: American Murder – Gabby Petito
Episode Summary
Release Date: March 27, 2025

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Introduction to the Episode

In this poignant episode of True Crime Obsessed, hosts Julianne Pizzavalli and Patrick Hines delve deep into the tragic story of Gabby Petito, exploring the intricate details of her relationship with Brian Laundrie and the events leading up to her mysterious disappearance. Utilizing a combination of documentary footage, personal interviews, and exclusive insights, the hosts provide a comprehensive overview of the case, highlighting both the beauty and the darkness that characterized Gabby’s final days.

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Gabby Petito’s Background

Gabrielle Vanora Petito, born on March 19, 1999, in Long Island, New York, was a vibrant young woman with a passion for art and a dream of starting a travel vlog. Raised by a loving family that included her parents, step-parents, and siblings, Gabby was known for her artistic talents and her infectious enthusiasm.

Julianne Pizzavalli [05:00]: "We are in March 19, 1999, Long Island, New York. Gabrielle Vanora Petito is born."

Gabby’s upbringing was marked by strong familial support, with both her parents remarrying and creating a close-knit extended family environment. This foundation instilled in her a sense of self-esteem and ambition, which she channeled into her creative pursuits.

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Relationship Dynamics with Brian Laundrie

Gabby’s relationship with Brian Laundrie, a 25-year-old with a troubled past, was complex from the onset. Brian’s presence in her life introduced a mix of love and manipulation that would ultimately play a significant role in the unfolding tragedy.

Patrick Hines [12:00]: "Brian was a very intense love bombing, hoovering, manipulative, abuser from the beginning."

Initially, Gabby perceived Brian’s actions as gestures of love, but over time, his controlling behavior became evident. Brian sought to isolate Gabby from her supportive network, including her friends and family, under the guise of wanting to build a life together.

Julianne Pizzavalli [13:30]: "Gabby says, but you're my brother."

Brian’s attempts at isolation were subtle yet pervasive, gradually diminishing Gabby’s independence and her ability to seek help.

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Friendship with Rose Davis

Gabby’s friendship with Rose Davis, whom she met through a platonic social app, became a crucial lifeline as Brian’s controlling behavior intensified. Rose, a Domino’s delivery driver, provided Gabby with the emotional support and encouragement she desperately needed.

Patrick Hines [20:16]: "Rose explains she met Gabby at a super low point in her life. Their friendship meant a lot."

Despite the challenges, Rose remained patient and vigilant, often reaching out to Gabby to ensure her well-being. This friendship highlighted Gabby’s innate desire for connection and support outside of her tumultuous relationship with Brian.

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The Van Life Journey

In December 2019, Gabby and Brian decided to embark on a “van life” adventure, purchasing a 2012 Ford Transit Connect. Gabby was deeply invested in documenting their journey through vlogs and a planned YouTube channel, aiming to capture the essence of their nomadic lifestyle.

Gabby Petito [30:03]: "We bought a van, a 2012 Ford Transit Connect. We are going to have so much fun designing and building this van together."

However, Brian’s disinterest and lack of support for Gabby’s creative endeavors became a source of tension. His actions were less about shared dreams and more about exerting control over Gabby’s life and choices.

Patrick Hines [31:26]: "Brian didn't care. He thought it was stupid. He's not supportive."

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Manipulative Behavior and Isolation Tactics

Brian employed various manipulative tactics to control Gabby, including emotional blackmail, constant monitoring, and undermining her relationships with others. These behaviors were subtle at first but escalated over time, severely impacting Gabby’s mental and emotional well-being.

Gabby Petito [23:57]: "Brian stole my ID. I'm sobbing right now."

Instances such as Brian stealing Gabby’s ID to prevent her from leaving or attending work underscored his intent to isolate and dominate her, effectively cutting her off from external support systems.

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Interaction with Law Enforcement and the 911 Call

A pivotal moment in the case was the harrowing 911 call made on August 21, 2021, by a concerned bystander who witnessed Brian assaulting Gabby. The subsequent police interaction, captured on bodycam footage, revealed alarming discrepancies in how authorities perceived and treated the situation.

Patrick Hines [04:08]: "They should know it. I know, but they don't."

Despite clear evidence of domestic abuse, the police seemed more inclined to view Gabby as the aggressor, largely due to Brian’s manipulative behavior and the narratives he presented during the encounter.

Julianne Pizzavalli [47:35]: "Nothing's ever enough. No one's good enough for Brian. She always needed attention."

This misinterpretation by law enforcement highlighted systemic issues in handling domestic violence cases, where victims are often blamed or doubted.

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The Tragic Conclusion

Following the failed police intervention, Gabby continued her van life journey with Brian, but the mounting tension and isolation led to her untimely disappearance on August 22, 2021. The episode poignantly captures the final moments through Gabby’s own footage and the chilling bodycam recordings, offering listeners a heartbreaking glimpse into the last day of her life.

Gabby Petito [40:33]: "He looked at me and he smiled and he said, I will."

The juxtaposition of Gabby’s vibrant aspirations against the dark turn of events serves as a somber reminder of the dangers of manipulative relationships and the importance of recognizing red flags early on.

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Conclusion and Insights

Julianne and Patrick conclude the episode by reflecting on the broader implications of Gabby Petito’s story. They emphasize the critical need for awareness regarding manipulative relationships and the importance of supporting victims in their pursuit of independence and happiness.

Julianne Pizzavalli [25:14]: "If this can happen to Gabby, this can happen to any of us."

The hosts also commend Rose Davis for her unwavering support and highlight the devastating consequences of unchecked abusive behavior. Through their heartfelt analysis and detailed exploration, Julianne and Patrick offer listeners both a detailed recounting of the Gabby Petito case and a powerful call to action for vigilance and compassion in similar situations.

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Notable Quotes

• Julianne Pizzavalli [05:00]: "Gabrielle Vanora Petito is born."
• Patrick Hines [12:00]: "Brian was a very intense love bombing, hoovering, manipulative, abuser from the beginning."
• Gabby Petito [30:03]: "We bought a van, a 2012 Ford Transit Connect. We are going to have so much fun designing and building this van together."
• Patrick Hines [31:26]: "Brian didn't care. He thought it was stupid. He's not supportive."
• Julianne Pizzavalli [25:14]: "If this can happen to Gabby, this can happen to any of us."

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Final Thoughts

This episode of True Crime Obsessed masterfully intertwines factual recounting with emotional depth, providing listeners with an immersive understanding of Gabby Petito’s life and the circumstances that led to her tragic end. Through meticulous analysis and empathetic storytelling, Julianne and Patrick honor Gabby’s memory while shedding light on the pervasive issues surrounding domestic abuse and manipulation.

For listeners seeking further exploration of this case and access to over 450 ad-free bonus episodes, Julianne and Patrick encourage visiting their Patreon page.

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Disclaimer: This summary is based on the provided transcript and aims to capture the essence and key points of the podcast episode. For a complete and detailed experience, listeners are encouraged to tune into the full episode of True Crime Obsessed.

Transcript

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I wasn't really ready for this today.

[Patrick Hines]

I know it's. It's a lot. But her family's here and some of you know, her friend Rose is here, who I love.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I love Rose.

[Patrick Hines]

She's very cool.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I love her.

[Patrick Hines]

Hi.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Julianne Pizzavalli.

[Patrick Hines]

Hello. Patrick Hines.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Hi, fam. Ugh. This is like my favorite thing that we get to do. We're going to drop an episode from a series we just finished covering on Patreon in the regular feed. Tell them what this is.

[Patrick Hines]

This is on Netflix. American Murder. Gabby Petito. And we know we covered this case on the regular feed a few years ago. There was a very sort of hastily made one off documentary. But this has a lot of information. Gabby, focus. Her friends and family are here.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes. It's why we did it, because her family signed off on it. They're all involved in it. And like you said, there's a ton of new information. We both knew a bit about this case. There's revelations in this series that we definitely did not know before this.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

So this is episode one. Episodes two and three are available right now and ad free on the Patreon. It's where you're going to get over 450 full ad free bonus episodes the second you sign up. This is just one of the hundreds of series that we've covered. Everything from the Jinx to.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah, Anatomy of Lies. We're doing Scamanda. We're doing Fox Hollow. We do that. Wild crime. Remember? Wild crime.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah, yeah. That's a great staircase from back in the day. Just basically every series that's more than one episode that's come out on Hulu, Netflix. Max, whatever. This is where we cover those things. So 450 full bonus episodes. There's an ad free tier. There's also where. Drag bingo at the $5 level.

[Patrick Hines]

Drag bingo. Let me just say drag bingo is at the $5.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

You heard that, right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

It's once a month. It is so much fun. It's like an hour and a half. The playlist is fire Schwa. Our host is fire. The prizes are fucking fire. It's fun. But I just want to say, like, that's not at the 20, that's at the 5.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Totally.

[Patrick Hines]

And it's really, really fun.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Hundreds and hundreds of people show up to do this.

[Patrick Hines]

It's like so fun. I'm in the chat. Patrick's trying to win.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

Bingo.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You're so good at the chat. My brain doesn't work fast enough. Grandma's eyes are going, stop.

[Patrick Hines]

Playing bingo. I'm just in the chat now that' Keep my secret. I won't fake keep my secret.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

That's so early on. You don't have a need to win like I do.

[Patrick Hines]

Just to be clear, if Patrick or I win, we just get to exclaim bingo. We're not actually taking the prize. And then the game continues until someone. If someone real wins. Just to be clear, we're not hijacking the prizes that we bought for.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

There's also an amazing playlist, by the way, which I took your advice. I've been working out to.

[Patrick Hines]

It's a great workout list. It's just a party list. It's so fun and it's like being built in real time. Like, people are just taking. Like we're taking your requests and adding it to the list. So it's wonderful. It's so much fun. But it's at the five. I just want to stress that I'm not the five. Totally.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And that's our Patreon. Enjoy episode one of American Murder. Gabby Petito. And we'll say a quick bye on the way out.

[Patrick Hines]

Yep.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Hi, I'm Brian.

[Gabby Petito]

And I'm Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And this is our Ford Transit Connect that we've been living in. And we thought it was finally time.

[Patrick Hines]

To give you a tour.

[Brian Laundrie]

Gabby and Brian seemed like a loving.

[Patrick Hines]

Couple, talking about you, baby. Burning hot.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, no.

[Brian Laundrie]

But behind the scenes, they would get into arguments.

[Gabby Petito]

No turn in Mexican. Baby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Come here.

[Gabby Petito]

I want to retake this video.

[Brian Laundrie]

Brian thought the vlog was stupid.

[Gabby Petito]

Big open floor for you to keep your dirty feet.

[Brian Laundrie]

The happiest people on social media usually have the darkest skeletons in their closet.

[Patrick Hines]

I'd like to report a domestic dispute.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Gentleman was slapping the girl. You said it's a white van. Kinda looks like something like hitting you in the face.

[Patrick Hines]

Gabby Petito has not been heard for run for weeks.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

We had officers go to the laundry. Family home. We don't know anything.

[Patrick Hines]

Was Gabriel here?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No, she's not here.

[Patrick Hines]

Is this her vehicle?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Two people went on a trip. One person returned. I knew something bad happened. We now have two missing young people.

[Brian Laundrie]

I was screaming. What did he do?

[Gabby Petito]

I remember saying to Brian, you'd keep her safe. And he looked at me and he smiled. He said, I will.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

So we open on August 21, 2012. We're in Moab, Utah, and we hear a harrowing 911 call from, like, a good Samaritan.

[Patrick Hines]

Yes, hi. I'd like to report a domestic dispute.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Florida license plate, white van. What were they doing? We drove by and the gentleman was slapping the girl. He was slapping her.

[Patrick Hines]

Yes.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And they drove off. It cuts to the cop's body cam, and we see them trailing what we know is Gabby Petito and Brian Laundrie's van.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And then the driver hits the curb, and the cop kind of jumps, and then he pulls them over.

[Patrick Hines]

And we dive into this at the end of this episode. But it's that horrible, famous footage of Gabby crying and endlessly apologizing. And I'm sorry. I'm so mean. And you instantly know, like, something is very, very wrong here.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Well, we know it. The cops don't seem to know.

[Patrick Hines]

They should know it. I know, but they don't.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. So we'll get back to that at the end of the episode.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. So we start March 19, 1999, Long Island, New York. Gabrielle Vanora Petito is born. Vanora is such a cool name.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Such a great name.

[Patrick Hines]

Old 1940s name.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And Gabby does, too. Kind of like it's a Gabrielle. But, like, we even see the video of the mom going to the hospital to have.

[Patrick Hines]

I know.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Like, we are at that point in history where, like, the beginning of a documentary that happened a long time ago still has plenty of video footage.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. And I like that we have so much footage of Gabby in the van and footage of her that we have footage of her before she's even here on this.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know. That's true. And we learned that, you know, that Gabby's parents only stayed together until she was six months old, and then they separated, but amicably keeping, like, Gabby at the center of their lives. Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So Nicole is Gabby's mom. She was 20 years old when she had Gabby, and Joe is Gabby's dad. And they divorce state. It's a great situation for what it is, really.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's because they both remarry and they remarry. Great people. So it's Joe, the dad, and Tara, his wife. Nicole, the mom, and Jim, her husband. And they all think of Gabby as their kid.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah, it's. They're a foursome unit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

They all seem to, like, get along and, like, they want to raise her together. Like, can you imagine having four parents?

[Patrick Hines]

I know. Four awesome parents.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Really love you. Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

But Gabby, Gabby was always very artistic. And Tara, her stepmom. It's just so Long island. And I love it.

[Gabby Petito]

Gabby used to spread all of her artwork on our kitchen island, and she.

[Patrick Hines]

Would just sit there for hours. Growing up, everything she did always had, like, such detail. When she got older, it came so naturally without even giving it any thought, she'd just be sitting there and then you'd look down 10 minutes later and she has this amazing piece of art. She would have all her artwork all over the kitchen islands. I just love. I'm like, oh, Tara.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

That she definitely has thoughts on the wallpaper and the downstairs.

[Patrick Hines]

100%.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You know what I mean?

[Patrick Hines]

You know, we are gonna get a lot of Gabby here, and I'll talk about that more specifically in a little bit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I'm always in awe of the people. Like, I had friends in high school who could, like, draw.

[Patrick Hines]

I know.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And, like, you're just like, my friend Christian could, like, do the most gorgeous pottery. How do you know how to do that?

[Patrick Hines]

You think about it, you imagine it, and then you take your hands and you make it and you. And now, like, the world gets to enjoy it.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

What's that about?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know people who can draw realistic looking other people. I will never understand that gift.

[Patrick Hines]

Gabby was doing a lot of really colorful, like, colored pencil drawings. It's just, like, really stunning work.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's really incredible.

[Patrick Hines]

So here's something interesting. There's a friend here, and their descriptor is Gabby and Brian's friend.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I totally get this. I know why she did this, because she does not want people fucking googling her for the rest of her life.

[Patrick Hines]

Well, too bad TikTok found. I didn't know what TikTok did. Oh, yeah?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. I mean, it's an attempt to, like, have her voice in the documentary without having to be hounded for the rest of her life.

[Patrick Hines]

We see her face, we see her voice. She's not in shadow. She's not hiding who she is. She's just known as Gabby and Brian's friend.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Because this is like, I remember talking to Julie Murray about this kind of thing because there was Maura Murray's friend Kate, who was like, one of the last people to ever see Maura. And, like, people have hounded this woman for the rest of her life. And she never gives interviews. She never does anything. She. She participated in Julie's podcast about Maura, and that was the first time that she had spoken, like, since Maura went missing. Because this is what happens to people who are associated to famous like this. Like, the world just won't leave them alone.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. So this friend says that she was super, very, very close with Brian. Gabby was a sophomore. This person was a freshman. And then she and Gabby were kind of in the friend group with all, like, the older cool guys.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. And, like, Gabby was like, her first real girlfriend. Which was, like, meaning really meaningful to her.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. So Brian looked, like, 10 years older than everyone.

[Brian Laundrie]

A lot of our guy friends were the cooler, older group of kids. Brian especially. You looked 10 years older than he actually was.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, you can film the zoom.

[Brian Laundrie]

I remember one of my friends met him and was like, there's a narc in our high school. Like, this guy, he can't be 16. He's gotta be someone undercover right now.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

He was, like, losing his hair in high school.

[Patrick Hines]

I know. Shit. Yeah.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No.

[Patrick Hines]

And I'm not gonna go down a conspiracy theory rabbit hole.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Give me a little.

[Patrick Hines]

But it's a little bit like, what's your deal, bro?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I need to know more. Do you think he was, like, legitimately older?

[Patrick Hines]

No. I don't know. Maybe he's, like, skipped a grade, didn't tell anybody. He probably lied about something because he's a piece of shit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But he really. I went. I've said this before. I went to high school with a kid who came back to high school in his 20s. He, like, dropped out as a sophomore and came back as a 21 year old.

[Patrick Hines]

That's a really problematic movie that Drew Barrymore was in called Never Been Kissed.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I don't know what you're talking about. Oh, my God. That's right.

[Patrick Hines]

I don't know what you're talking about.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But it really hits. And his name was Brian Biermann. Like, he was the beer man.

[Patrick Hines]

Wait, why did he come back?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

He dropped out because he was having a hard time. And he came back because he wanted to finish high school in person, but also to be popular by buying all the alcohol for all the kids.

[Patrick Hines]

He was how old?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

21.

[Patrick Hines]

And in high school?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yep.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, fraternizing with 16 year olds.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Dating one of my friends. It's. I mean, the more we talk about it, the more I'm like, wow, that.

[Patrick Hines]

Was really fucked up, I gotta tell you. So is the entire plot of Never Been Kissed.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

Really bad. I thought you're only saying that because I'm your teacher. Actually, I shouldn't be saying that because I'm your teacher. Excuse me.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

That's the guy from Alias.

[Patrick Hines]

Oh, God, we're back to alias. It's 21 years. Okay, I know.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Well, the other thing about Never Been Kissed that's so awful is there's that whole scene in the. In the cafeteria where he's eating the coleslaw bucket, like, with his hands and you know my thing with coleslaw.

[Patrick Hines]

I know your thing with coleslaw. I only know, like, two scenes. From never been. I only know the two problematic things. I. I missed the coleslaw.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I loved that movie. But I'm now realizing I'm not allowed to.

[Patrick Hines]

You know what I mean?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's not good.

[Patrick Hines]

Really. Not good. So Brian is much older. Look, he looks much older than everyone.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You believe he's 25.

[Patrick Hines]

I don't know.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Well, the friend tells us that after graduation, Brian texted her and was like, let's hang out.

[Brian Laundrie]

And she says he was unsure of his plan for the next few months. He didn't want to go to college. He was working, just living to survive after he had graduated. He had everything he owned in his car. He was staying with our friend on his couch. And at one point I was just like, we have a bedroom. Brian stayed with us. We had gotten very close.

[Patrick Hines]

But you and your parents. She's like, oh, live with us. And I'm like, who's usually.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So I'm like, something's going on. They're in love, they're together. She likes him, he likes her. I don't know.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But they kind of don't like. We get the story where she says they built a desk together in her room. And he leaves a note in the desk that says, you're either my best friend or the love of my life, and I'm too dumb to tell the difference. Brian, shut up. Totally. But then she's like, but I wasn't into him like that. So now we're not friends anymore.

[Patrick Hines]

Well, because he texted her this, this is just like a little bit like, oh, this is just who he is. Yeah, because the love, the weird love bombing. But he texts this friend, it's National Bluebird Day. It is.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

The bluebird, known for its beauty and the joy it brings through its song. Like how Doris Day sings in her classic, bluebird, on your windowsill There's a bluebird, there's a rainbow. The rainy days may come and go but the clouds will soon roll away. Don't sweat the small stuff. Bluebird. Happy birthday. So Brian is a very intense love bombing, hoovering, manipulative, abuser from the beginning. She seems to heavy for a happy birthday text.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I couldn't agree more. There seems to definitely be some kind of romantic something between them. But she's saying that she doesn't see him that way. She says she sees him as a slash brother.

[Patrick Hines]

And then when he sort of made it clear that he was into her and she's like, but you're my brother. Then they sort of stop being close. And that's when, according to this friend, Brian falls madly in love with Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Like, so we jumped in March 2019, and Brian, like, gets a townhouse or whatever in Long Island. And, like, right. This story is weird. He sees Gabby going into a deli. He pulls over and runs up to her.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

He says, it's love at first sight.

[Patrick Hines]

But they knew each other. They were all in the same friend group.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

According to the friend, they were all in the same friend group. So, like, what is. Or, like, they reconnected.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Yes, that's right. Okay.

[Patrick Hines]

They're all in the same friend group.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And so. But then Gabby would later also say that it was love at first sight. And, like, all of a sudden, they're just together.

[Patrick Hines]

There's also a video of him playing guitar at her. Like, of course there is.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No, but the mom says, I had heard about Brian.

[Gabby Petito]

While Gabby was in high school, some friends that she hung out with were friends with Brian. I didn't realize that that was the same Brian until she reminded me.

[Patrick Hines]

We would ask her, are you dating Brian?

[Gabby Petito]

Are you not dating Brian?

[Patrick Hines]

She was like, no, no, we're just.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

We're just friends.

[Gabby Petito]

One day, Gabby came to me and asked what I thought of her moving to Florida with Brian. I remember saying to her, well, I guess you guys are a thing now.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I don't know. It also reads to me like a. He's trying to isolate her immediately. Because what happens is, like, Gabby says to her mom, we're not dating. And then, like, a day later is like, mom, what do you think if I move to Florida with Brian?

[Patrick Hines]

I think she. Her gut was always like, this is weird.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

But he's kind of pushing it, and this is really intense.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right. And, like. And I think that those intense feelings can be mistaken for love.

[Patrick Hines]

Sure.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

When you're young. And so she, like.

[Patrick Hines]

And the intensity. How many times have we said, like, drama isn't.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Fun, or. That doesn't mean, like, it's okay to be boring a little bit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

And just go to the deli and have everything be okay.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Like, you're. Because when you're falling in love with somebody anyway, there's a lot of chemical shit that's happening in your. But you're gonna. You're gonna feel those butterflies, right?

[Patrick Hines]

That infatuation. Oh, my God.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Feeling a little trepidatious as we feel like Gabby kind of was because he's whisking her away from everything she knows overnight.

[Patrick Hines]

Right. Because the whole, you know, I'm not defining love for anyone, but you want to Tell everybody.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right? Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. And it's like when you. It's like, it's the same thing as like finding a song you love or an artist you love or a play you love. You want people to. You want to share it with people.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes. Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So for.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And she, she specifically does not want people to know that she's dating him with her.

[Patrick Hines]

Especially with her mom, who she was super close with.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And that you would. To say, like, mom, I'm in love.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah, totally.

[Patrick Hines]

So they drive Gabby's car all the way down to Florida.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Now.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And we're seeing a lot of like videos that they're making along the way.

[Patrick Hines]

And they had so much footage.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know. And they do seem like really lovey dovey. Like it's very early in the relationship and they're happy.

[Patrick Hines]

It's the love bombing phase. It's the perfect. Everything's going to be great. And like, wait till you get down to Florida and oh my God.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Because they're not just moving to Florida, they're moving to Florida to live with his family.

[Patrick Hines]

So it's December 2019. They're dating nine months. He wants to go down there. They say, like he wanted to be down there to be with his family. I'm like. But also to isolate Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

100% now his parents. I'm just going to say it. The laundries. His name is Brian. Laundry. I say it weird. I'm going to say Florida a lot. I'm going to say laundry a lot.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, I forgot we were in for that treat today.

[Patrick Hines]

So pardon me, but not me. Sorry. Not sorry. You know what? You know who hears me and sees me? Gabby's entire family.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Totally. Because they're all.

[Patrick Hines]

They know that we say Florida and we say the laundries because Tara. Tara saying her art all over the kitchen island.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Tara, I could listen to you do that accent all day long.

[Patrick Hines]

It feeds me.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God, it's so good.

[Patrick Hines]

It feeds me in a certain way, but I know. Especially Nicole and Tara, they're. They're saying Florida too. No, I got a Florida. Incite anybody?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And it feels weird when you say.

[Patrick Hines]

Florida because it's weird.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It doesn't sound right coming out of your mouth.

[Patrick Hines]

Thank you.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You're welcome.

[Patrick Hines]

So I feel seen.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Okay, good.

[Patrick Hines]

So Brian's parents had him when they were a little bit older. His s, Cassie is 10 years older than Brian is. So Gabby and Brian are living with his parents. And Roberta, Brian's mom, is a toxic boy. Mom.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

If you are a piece of shit.

[Patrick Hines]

If You're a cool boy, mom. This doesn't apply to you. Yeah, that's great. But Roberta was one of those moms that was a nightmare to Gabby and also everyone in general.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

See, I don't want to diagnose someone, but she seems like she's a borderline person.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She loves to knit, which I liked about her.

[Patrick Hines]

That's cool. Whatever. But her jealous. Someone says her jealousy was very odd of Gabby.

[Gabby Petito]

Brian's mom was having problems with how time Gabby and Brian were spending together. Her jealousy was definitely very odd. Gabby told me that one night at the dinner table, Brian's mom was freaking out that nobody was focusing on her pie. I think she got mad and wasn't even talking to them. I thought that was really strange.

[Patrick Hines]

Nothing's ever enough. No one's good enough for Brian. She always needed attention. She baked a pie and no one was gu. I'm sure Gabby was like, this is really good pie, Mrs. Laundrie. And then it was like, oh, that bitch. Like, she woman is not well. Like, she's obsessed with her son. It's a weird fucking dynamic. And he's obsessed back y. And. But there are lots of texts. Not only do we get video footage that Gabby took of herself and the body cam footage, but we get like text messages, we get journal entries. We see a lot of texts between Gabby and Brian about this. Like, his mom's always in a bad mood and Gabby was feeling uncomfortable.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She's literally afraid to walk into rooms and walk out of rooms.

[Patrick Hines]

She can't. She wants to go food shopping. And she's uncomfortable to leave the bedroom because his mom is in such a bad mood that she doesn't know what's going to happen. So. So Gabby would say to Brian, like, I'm uncomfortable. And Brian would be like, just say goodbye to her, Gabby. Right. Just give her the attention she wants.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And then one day, Gabby's mom gets a notification from the post office.

[Gabby Petito]

I received a letter in the mail from the post office that her address was changed back to our address. I texted her and I said, did you change your address back to home? Are you moving back here? And she said, no, I didn't change it. I said, so who did this? And she said, I think it was Brian's mom, but we don't want to talk about it.

[Patrick Hines]

You're an immature weirdo. Nightmare. Roberta, I hope you're listening to this.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

I will not budge on this take on this woman.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I cannot believe that laundries are still out there. I can't believe.

[Patrick Hines]

I can't believe they're not behind bars.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

1 million percent complete complicit pieces of shit. I couldn't agree with you hear me?

[Patrick Hines]

Roberta? Hi. Hi. Roberta. You fucking weirdo nightmare. You immature piece of shit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

Deb, you welcomed that girl into your home. Yes, she was. Eventually. We'll learn in a minute. Gonna be your daughter in law.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She had to lure Gabby down there to get Brian down there. That's the only way she was getting Ryan, you know, so.

[Patrick Hines]

But now we meet Rose Davis, Gabby's friend. I love her.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You have to explain that.

[Patrick Hines]

No, it's. It's exactly what it sounds like. It's like people saying like this, these are my interests. Like, they just want to meet people. So it's hard to meet people.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But it's just so wild. As a gay person. It is so wild that there is a same sex site for people to meet and not have sex.

[Patrick Hines]

I don't think it's all same sex. I don't know. Bumble for friends I have.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Okay, it sounds amazing. I want to be clear. I'm so, so, so glad this exists. But I was just like, that would just.

[Patrick Hines]

People are using apps for not sex.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

We would just end up making out.

[Patrick Hines]

What a world.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I was like, down anywhere. Like, if I was single and using like Grindr to make friends. That's not a thing. No, that's not how Grindr works.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, they're texting on the app and Gabby Rose is like, what are you doing, girl? And she's like, I'm watching 3rd Rock from the sun with my boyfriend. And Rose is like, oh, my God. I'm obsessed.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God. So third Rock from the sun is a show that you and I really have never talked about.

[Patrick Hines]

No.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Are you familiar with it?

[Patrick Hines]

I'm familiar with it, but it was not my thing.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I love that show. Kristin Johnson is such an. She is a revelation in this show. She is a male alien that had to embody the woman in the house. Like, they had to embody these people. And when it was that male alien's turn.

[Patrick Hines]

Is that right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

The only thing that was left was the woman. Kristen Johnson. She's won like four Emmys for this thing. She is so.

[Patrick Hines]

She's great. Anyway, like, I'm not. I'm not surprised to hear this by any stretch.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But also she wrote a memoir called Guts about getting sober because she almost died. And it is like. It is one of the best books I've ever read. The third Rock from the sun is amazing. Fumble for Friends is amazing. Everything about this party is great.

[Patrick Hines]

Wait till we get to Taco Bell. Girl. Talk about amazing.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And I mean it.

[Patrick Hines]

And nothing makes me happier than hearing about that Taco Bell story.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

They have a taco family.

[Patrick Hines]

We'll get to it. We'll get to it. Don't say. Don't spoil it. They were instantly super tight. They're hanging out a few times a week. They're making Tiktoks. And Rose explains. She's like, I met Gabby at a super low point in my life. Their friendship meant a lot. And I'm like, I think Gabby would agree.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, she's uncomfortable and lonely in Brian's house with his awful mother.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She's so uncomfortable in Brian's house that Rose. Rose is a Domino's delivery person, and she's doing it, like, eight hours a day. And Gabby's a ride along. Yeah, she's riding along for all the deliveries because she wants to be with her friend Rose, who she met on. Not a lesbian site called Bumble for Friends.

[Patrick Hines]

They're just buds.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

They're just buds.

[Patrick Hines]

And of course, this isn't gonna fly with Brian. No. Because it's such a good friendship. They see each other. They're, like, bonding. They hit it out of the park. They're best of friends. Brian, that's not okay.

[Brian Laundrie]

We were hanging out so much. She was like, brian wants to meet you. I was like, okay. We were all going to the beach together, and he kind of just sat back there and read his book while Gabby and I hung out. It felt like a parent was watching us on a play date. It was very weird, but he was very nice. I do remember coming home and saying to my mom, she's like, how was it? How was her boyfriend? And I was like, he's a really nice guy, but there is something off about him.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But it started with Gabby's parents. It's what everybody says about Brian. He was nice enough, but there's something off about him.

[Patrick Hines]

Off. A little scared. A little distant.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

A little.

[Patrick Hines]

And that's like. And it sucks. Cause, like, I know people who are great and a little quiet.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Well, you know, my husband, for example, like when. Like in the beginning of our relationship, when we would go out with my friends, he would hang back, you know, like, he. My husband is not like.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, in what way?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

He would either just be quiet, not hang back. Like. Like, not come to the bar with us, but it would take a little bit to get him to open up. It's one of the things that drew me to Him. He's a very. He's an introspective, thoughtful person who. He's become much more gregarious over the years. But in the be, it was a little challenging to sort of get him to, like, be who he was with me, with other people.

[Patrick Hines]

But he wouldn't feel like a parent on a plane.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No. Like, there were no red flags. Like, these are all red flags that we're seeing with Brian Laundrie that Steve didn't have. Like, what I'm saying is it's okay to be kind of quiet.

[Patrick Hines]

Sure.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But, like, to be the parent, like, sort of like babysitting these kids. Like, it. Making it feel like a play date.

[Patrick Hines]

Sure was. Like, I want to meet this Rose character. It wasn't like, oh, wow, person. I love you have a new friend. Like, that's really great.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's his competition, Rose. He's, like, sizing up the competition.

[Patrick Hines]

That's 100% right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

There was also a dark side to him here, because now we get footage of he's filming Gabby shooting a gun out of the window of a moving car. And I hate it every second.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's so awful because she's shooting the gun, and then she's got the gun in her hand, and she's just kind of, like, freewheeling with it. Like, she could have shot.

[Patrick Hines]

And she's in the car. Like, just to be clear, they're down in Florida somewhere, and there's, like, this brush. And so, like, they're driving down, and I'm like, what if there was, like, a person in the woods or something and she's just, like, shooting, and she's feeling, like, exhilarated by it, and he's encouraging this behavior.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's very like Bonnie and Clyde. It was very.

[Patrick Hines]

Right. And, like, her art is, like, beautiful and colorful, and his art is, like, really, really dark.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And, you know, red.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's, like, dripping with blood.

[Patrick Hines]

It's saying, like, help on it. And normally, like, I love, like, dark, creepy art. Like, there's a. A whole genre of it. I think it's very fudgeing. Cool.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

But this is not that.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No. And it reminded me of that kid, the high school shoot. The high school shooting one. The one about the parents that, like, got, like, crumblies. The crumbly. Remember, his art was like, I need help.

[Patrick Hines]

I'm struggling.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Screaming for help. Right. Like, they're putting it down on paper. Why is nobody paying attention?

[Patrick Hines]

Right. So he was also incredibly manipulative because. And we. But, like, Rose is here to tell Us some really specific examples of what Brian would do.

[Brian Laundrie]

One night I waited an hour and a half for Gabby so we could go line dancing. And it's a 30, 40 minute drive. So I was like, what is taking her so long? Well, Gabby had got right near my house and then realized her ID was not in her wallet. And I just remember getting the text message, I'm so sorry, I'm running late. Brian stole my id. I'm sobbing right now. Brian admitted that he stole it because he didn't want her to go out.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I want people to hear this. This is not normal behavior. If you're in a relationship where this is happening, like, and you're wondering if this is normal and it's normal for you to be wondering if it's normal. Yes, it is not normal. This is manipulation. This person is trying to control you.

[Patrick Hines]

Disagreements and arguments. Normal, yes. This not normal, no.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And like, not letting her have a life, not letting her go out with her friend, like. And Rose is so fucking patient about it all. Texting Gabby, are you okay?

[Patrick Hines]

An hour and a half late.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right? It's manipulation. That is manipulation.

[Patrick Hines]

And then he also like hoover her, love bomb her the next day about how, like, he's so glad they had this amazing night together, but it wasn't an amazing night.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No. And to the point that she would say to Rose, like, he's so amazing, I don't deserve him. She says that over and over again.

[Patrick Hines]

He's like training her to think that way. He's brainwashing her.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So July 2020, they're dating a year and three months.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I just want to say, like, if this can happen to Gabby, this can happen to any of us. Gabby, who is. Had four amazing parents, like, instilling self esteem in her and like telling her, like, raising this child. Oh, yeah, you know, so if this can happen to a person with four parents.

[Patrick Hines]

When people like this get their sights in you, it doesn't matter what your circumstances are. They are relentless. They will destroy you. That's their whole goal. So when they have those blinders on, it doesn't matter how much love she was surrounded by, because it's not about that. It's not about her and her strength. It's about this person.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Because evil.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I was saying to Jillian before we started, I've been traveling and I came back today and I was like. We were like both with Daisy for the morning and I was realizing how much Daisy benefits me and Steve.

[Patrick Hines]

Not me and you.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No, me and Steve. We're like, how much Daisy benefits by having both of us there. Now, listen, single parents are the fucking hardest working people in the world. I have the most respect for single parents. Single parents can do anything. They are amazing. But I was just thinking, like, wow, I was raised by a single parent, and, like, Daisy's got two parents, and isn't she lucky? Gabby had four parents, you know what I mean? And still this motherfucker was able to get into her.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. And it's all him. Yeah, it's all him.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So the friend is back. That's all. We know them as, their friend to say. Brian was super happy with Gabby. And Brian tells the friend about this big proposal, right? He tells her about the plans for the proposal, and he explains that they propose. They were already camping. They were already sort of on the road down in Florida, and he proposes while they're camping and he didn't have a ring. And Brian tells his friend that a firefly landed on Gabby's ring finger. And I'm like, that would have been cool if Brian wasn't involved.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly. And if that story was even true. But what. The craziest part of this to me is that Gabby's mom finds out about the engagement from a Facebook post from Brian's mother.

[Gabby Petito]

I remember texting Gabby right away, and I said, whoa, you're engaged? And she told me, yeah, you know, Brian proposed to me while we were camping. It was really sweet. And then I said, well, where's your ring? And she said, oh, I don't have a ring yet. We'll get one. I immediately asked Joey, and he had no idea. Brian never asked for Gabby's hand, so that was a little bit shocking. She didn't want to tell anybody. I thought that was really strange.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Gabby does not want her family or anybody in her life to know about this engagement.

[Patrick Hines]

And this is a trend because she didn't want them to know they were dating in the first place.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Anyway, once again, like, I ask you, I beg you for your own safety if you're in a situation like this where you're trying to hide your relationship milestones from your family, like, there's an issue in the relationship.

[Patrick Hines]

Yes. And I remember my mom said, by.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And large, like, if you're unsafe to tell, like, if your family doesn't support you because you're LGBTQ or whatever.

[Patrick Hines]

No, no, no.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Obviously, that's not what I'm talking about.

[Patrick Hines]

No, I was just gonna say my mom gave advice to a friend of mine years ago where she was like, if something's gnawing at you now, it's not going to get better.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No.

[Patrick Hines]

If you're like, young and it's like, if a relationship is tumultuous at the beginning.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

It's not going to get any better as it goes on.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No.

[Patrick Hines]

So if you're already like, not wanting to say the words out loud that this is your boyfriend, that makes you, like, why doesn't that feel right? I don't know why, but like, something's not right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And it's not going to get better.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I am not saying this is Gabby's story, but, like, I heard this quote the other day by Dr. Romani and somebody was asking her, what is the number one indicator of a person who suffered childhood trauma? Her answer was, as an adult trying to make difficult people like you. And I relate to that. Like, I used to think that I, like, loved loving difficult people and that, like, getting to be, like, getting difficult people to. For me to be the one that they loved. And her whole thing is that is the clearest indication of a person who suffered childhood trauma.

[Patrick Hines]

Oh, interesting.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Yeah. And I'm just saying, like, Brian Laundrie, like, that's the draw to him is that she's trying to make this difficult, awful person love her.

[Patrick Hines]

Well, she's nice and he's not right. She's great. He's not.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

She's a light and he's not right. And like, that can't exist.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

On his watch.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

Or. And people like him, Brian is a dime a fucking dozen. So stay safe out there, everybody. So, yeah. Gabby's parents find out the engagement from, of course, a post from Brian's mother.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

I just hate this so much.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Gabby's family is shocked that, like, Brian hasn't reached out to them either.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, you know what I mean? Whatever. Traditions aside, it's not like, oh, he needs to, like, come ask for her hand, but maybe have a relationship with these people. You took their 20 year old away from them.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And now she's getting married and like, she didn't tell them. You should want everyone to get along. It's never going to happen.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, families are families and there's dynamics there. You should at least want. This is the family of the person you love.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Like you a little. Say hi.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly. Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

A little bit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And Rose, the friend, Rose, the Florida friend from Bumble, is dumbfounded. She did not see this coming.

[Patrick Hines]

Now this is something huge that happens. We get. So we get a lot of text messages, a lot of audio from the videos that Gabby was taking.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And we get on screen text written with AI in Gabby's handwriting that says Gabby Petito's journal entries and text messages are brought to life in this series in her own voice using voice recognition technology.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It is unbelievable.

[Patrick Hines]

And she's reading her journal entries. This AI voice is reading Gabby's journal entries. These text messages, these letters to Brian.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Gabby Petito]

We bought a van, a 2012 Ford Transit Connect. We are going to have so much fun designing and building this van together. Even though our plans got pushed back like wedding slash baby plans.

[Patrick Hines]

I'm very happy the whole family is here. So they approved it. They gave her this voice.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

I understand that using a. This is very controversial.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And using AI is a major issue, especially in true crime. But Gabby's parents and family have signed off, are here and signed off. But it's is. It's a thing. And I understand why people are very turned off by it.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

But I also understand the side of it of like, we gave her her voice back, you know, that I missed.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

That on screen text and all of a sudden I was hearing her, I was like, wait, what? And I had to go back and be like, oh, my God.

[Patrick Hines]

I SCREAMS and that it's written in her journal entry handwriting. It's not on screen text. Like someone typed it, she wrote it. So that's when you hear Gabby's voice.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right, Right.

[Patrick Hines]

It's a voice recognition.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But then you do hear her voice in videos.

[Patrick Hines]

That is real.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So they were going to do the van life thing. Gabby, Brian, and you know, they didn't care about when they got married. They were just going to drive around the country, living off the land like, this is the plan.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

One of the new things that I got from this documentary is that she really wanted to start a vlog and a YouTube channel and she took it really serious.

[Patrick Hines]

This is going to be her career.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Now, I didn't. From the first documentary and the covers that I saw back, I didn't fully get that Gabby is really, really serious about making this travel Life vlog and YouTube channel A Real.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. And it takes a ton of work and she wasn't shying away from any of it. She knew it was going to be hard work and this was her passion and it's what she wanted to do. Now, Brian didn't care.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

He was not into it. It was not his passion. He kind of thought it was stupid. He's not supportive. And one, because it didn't involve him. And two, because if she's successful, that will also be a problem for Him.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Rose also makes the point that, like, he's probably also afraid having this camera on him all the time, that he's going to show his real self.

[Patrick Hines]

Right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

He's going to say something cruel to her, he's going to yell at her. So something's going to be caught on.

[Patrick Hines]

And we see the mask falls. You see it in some of the footage now. This shit costs a ton of money. You have equipment, you have a website, you get a van, whatever. A van. Gabby gets a job at Taco Bell. She loved every second of it and I loved hearing that because Rose is like the way she goes. She would text me and go, I have to tell everyone to have a taco tastic day. And I love it. She loves her job. I love that she loved it. Gabby's picking up every shift she could. She's working a million hours a week. She's having a great time. She loves her coworkers, she's making money to pursue her dream.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And she's out of that fucking house.

[Patrick Hines]

For 10 hours at Taco Bell. God bless her. And I mean that bottom of my heart.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Can I tell you, when I worked at the W hotel, we had to answer the phone like this. Welcome to Whatever Whenever at the W New York. This is Patrick. How can I help you?

[Patrick Hines]

Oh, that's the biggest tongue twister.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Because Whatever Whenever was like their thing. Like, you get. As long as it wasn't illegal, unsafe.

[Patrick Hines]

Or downright wrong, it's Whatever Whenever.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. They had a whole department called Whatever Whenever. So you would have. Welcome to Whatever Whenever W New York. This is Patrick. What is your wish? That's what you have to say.

[Patrick Hines]

What is your.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And I mean, several times people would be like, you've got to be.

[Patrick Hines]

You've got to.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

They would literally say that. I know, it was horrible.

[Patrick Hines]

Now, what would happen if you got tongue tied? Start over.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Even with internal. Like if the front desk called, the concierge desk, you had to answer the phone. Welcome. Not you had to ask, welcome.

[Patrick Hines]

The person who insists on you doing that.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Why?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I think it's branding. Like, they think that, oh, like this is going to be the W brand.

[Patrick Hines]

See you as a guest. See you answer the phone that way. And that's.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yep. And it's to remind you that you can have whatever you want. You know what I mean? It's just branding. It's so awful.

[Patrick Hines]

But like intercompany calls, I'm saying you still have to answer it a certain way.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Culture, it's all about, like, culture, you know?

[Patrick Hines]

Whatever.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Welcome is how you would have to.

[Patrick Hines]

We'll have a taco Tastic day. And you know, Gabby was having a. She was so happy. She was doing it on her own. She's, like, working towards her dream. So of course Brian has to ruin it.

[Brian Laundrie]

So she would work and then hang out with me. That's when Brian started feeling neglected and having this possessiveness over Gabby. Just completely disregarding anything that made Gabby happy, especially reaching out to her mother.

[Gabby Petito]

He called me and he was like, gabby's working really late every night and she's hanging out with these people and they're bad. And I believed him.

[Patrick Hines]

Gabby is working at Taco Bell. She's working hard to pursue her dreams. She's picking up shifts. She's having the time of her life. She's not doing anything wrong.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No, she's doing everything right.

[Patrick Hines]

He texts her, he goes, I'll be happy when I see you, but I'm so pissed right now. I fucking hate that you ever worked at Taco Bell. With all those low lives, I don't know why you had to turn into one of them. It's fudgeing. Disgusting.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God.

[Patrick Hines]

Gabby is at work and this is what he's saying to her because she's not spending enough time with him, right? So then he calls her mother, calls her mother and worries her mother, who's already worried about her daughter for no reason.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And the mom says, I believed him.

[Patrick Hines]

Well, of course.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

I'm so worried about your daughter. She barely knows Brian, so of course she's going to say, he's calling me. He's never said hello to me.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

He's calling me. She must really be in danger.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And God damn it, she is. So, Brian, more texts. Please, please, please forgive me for calling your mom, but I'm fucked in every aspect of my life now. I just wanted this week to go spread smoothly. Sad face. I'm crying so hard in the dumb fucking bathroom typing this. And I know you love me and I'm so sorry. I'm just worried you'll leave. I couldn't have my life without you. Oh, she is at work.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

He's name calling, essentially telling her she's fucking disgusting. Then the love bombing. I'm so sorry. I just don't want to leave you.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Also, I couldn't have my life without you is a threat.

[Patrick Hines]

It's a threat and gets her to respond, because she does. And she says, no, no, honey, I don't want you to be sad today. I love you so much. I'M sorry. I'll never leave you.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God.

[Patrick Hines]

He tells her once again, he's crying, right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

The crying is the manipulation. I'm crying because it seems soft and it's a visual.

[Patrick Hines]

He's sitting in the bathroom crying because I'm at Taco Bell. Is Taco Bell really that important? Yes, it is.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right? She's the monster.

[Patrick Hines]

And I'm saying this. I'm not being funny. Whatever your Taco Bell is, it's important 100%. It's your life. You know what I mean? So he goes, I'm crying right now, but it's okay. I was just saying how it's so crazy. I was alone for so long, and I was so happy, but now that I love you so much, every second alone, alone, I'm stuck with a person I hate. Meaning he hates himself.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God.

[Patrick Hines]

So she goes, no hate. No hate. All love here. It keeps going.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Because he says, I don't want to keep bothering you, girl.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

And he knows exactly what he's doing. He's not crying.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No.

[Patrick Hines]

You think he's crying in the bathroom? Of course not.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, I actually did think he was crying in the bath, but. But even the crying. The crying, to me, just felt like manipulation.

[Patrick Hines]

Right. So now that he's got her.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

He got her to pay attention when she's at work, which could get her fired.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I was just gonna say she's probably in trouble.

[Patrick Hines]

Being on her phone, feeling she's in trouble in his mind, right? So she. He's got her attention, which is all he wants now that, like, he's got her attention now. It's all love right now. It's. I don't want to keep bothering you. I love you so much. I really miss you. I'm sorry I've been so anxious. I'm focusing on getting our life together so we can hit the road. I'm definitely getting a lot done. Don't worry. I'm working on the van now. And then she doesn't answer, and this is the thing that made me go, oh, my God. He goes, oh, man. You took over the Spotify, but you can't text me back? I miss you so much. You just keep hurting my feelings.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God.

[Patrick Hines]

Meaning he's stalking her every move online. Notice she was on Spotify. And Gabby goes, I just got service back. I tried to text you. Relax. Oh, so you know where he got this from? His fucking mother?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Patrick Hines]

Like the same shit she do to Gabby and everyone else. What are you doing? What Are you doing? Where are you? Why? You didn't talk about my pie?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Didn't you like my pie enough?

[Patrick Hines]

She's at work.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

To earn money to live this life that you don't really care about, to.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Do this dream that she has and she wants to take you with her.

[Patrick Hines]

And you know she's going to be great at it. And that's a big problem.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

That's the thing.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

So.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And.

[Patrick Hines]

But Rose is here to say, like, she, like, hears us screaming about it somewhere in the ether. Because Rose is like, Gabby was constantly.

[Brian Laundrie]

Over at my house and kind of getting more frustrated. I think it was all clicking for her. The more it went on and the more her and I were together and talking and having a good time, she actually felt more independent. And that's when he was like, okay, I gotta do something to change this. Let me isolate her. If I get her away from her job, I get her away from her friend. She only has me.

[Patrick Hines]

Before they started their van life, Gabby starts to see the cracks, Right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Because she's spending time with Rose away from Brian and seeing. I mean, and I even might just be, like, how fucking annoying he is.

[Patrick Hines]

He's so annoying. And she's saying, like, brian, you know how much I love you. Please stop calling me names.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

And she even says, this is a text, verbatim. Gabby to Brian.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

After all of the shit he's been doing to her, she says, don't try to control me because it only makes me mad. I love you so much, but it's the way you speak to me that hurts the most.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And it's like, don't go, Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And it's also like, where did he learn that?

[Patrick Hines]

His mother.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes. I mean, like, you have to hear people in your life talking. Like, I can only imagine what he's saying to her.

[Patrick Hines]

Right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You're a loser. You're nothing without you.

[Patrick Hines]

Called her a lowlife for working at Taco Bell and being happy about it. It's like, Gabby. So she's getting close with Rose and telling Rose all about this.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Which is, like, never going to go over well with Brian.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But this is the other piece of it that became clear to me today. Like, Brian, who doesn't really care about the Van life thing, all of a sudden has to do the van life thing because it's his only way left to isolate her.

[Patrick Hines]

It's the ultimate isolation. Right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And she doesn't see it. She thinks he's just being supportive. Suddenly, out of nowhere, which is all she wanted.

[Patrick Hines]

A Guy she thinks she loves, helping her with her dreams.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

That was a real revelation to me that going on the trip not about supporting her at all. It was about isolating her.

[Patrick Hines]

And it's not just isolation in Florida. It's isolating her on the road in this van, where the whole point is that you're isolated, you're just the two.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Of you and nobody else for days.

[Patrick Hines]

And Rose can't call you because you won't have any service most of the time.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

Ultimate isolation.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

So Nicole. Oh, my God. Her. Gabby's mom describes saying goodbye to Gabby because it's like van life. And she's so excited. And here's my trip and here's my work and here's my website.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And they drive up to Gabby's mom. You know, like, as they're about to leave, Gabby's mom gives her $200. She's like, this is for gas or for emergencies. Gabby starts to cry. And the mom is like, but you're going on this adventure you've been planning for. For months. Why are you crying? And she doesn't know. And like this, I just. I can't even. The mom says.

[Gabby Petito]

So I gave her this hug, and I'll never forget how tight she hugged me, so tightly. And it was just the best hug ever that you could get from your kid.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Like, it was.

[Gabby Petito]

It was just a squeeze. And I remember saying to Brian, you take care of her, keep her safe. And he looked at me and he smiled and he said, I will.

[Patrick Hines]

And they never saw Gabby again. So on July 2, 2021, one year after their engagement, Gabby and Brian took off on their van life journey. And we see all of her footage, this behind the scenes footage. Yeah, her first take, her second take.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No, I want to talk about this for a second. Because Gabbie, we are seeing the stuff that she wants to cut together into the V, right? And it's her dream and she wants it to be perfect. And it's that Ira Glass thing of, like, he's got this great quote that's something like, you have to stick with the thing that you're making because you have this idea of the brilliance it's going to be, but you have to get there. You can only get there by making mistakes and learning and making. So the first take, the first crack at it is gonna be bad. Gabi doesn't know that, and she's instantly disappointed that she's not perfect at it. And she's got this partner who's confirming to her that she's not Good at it. Yes. And it was so heartbreaking for you as a creator to watch this because it's like, I only know this because of the years that we've put into this, you know? And the thing doesn't start out great, it gets great. And then you look back at episode one and be like, oh, my God, that was so bad. But I love it. And I'm just watching this young girl who had it in her to make this the YouTube channel and the vlog, everything she wanted it to be. We see shots of her, like, trying to fly a drone. And the shots are so beautiful.

[Patrick Hines]

They're beautiful.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But she doesn't see it. She doesn't know that it's beautiful.

[Patrick Hines]

And you get such a sense of her in this footage. And she's explaining what she's doing and she's. And she's, like, excited, but she's feeling self conscious. To me, I heard. Agreed. Cosign with everything you said. In addition, because sometimes she's not with Brian.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

And she's a little freer. And to me, what really struck me is when she's filming herself in front of Brian, it's clear that she kind of wishes he wasn't there.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But. And that's the other thing. She can't do this without his participation.

[Patrick Hines]

And she doesn't want him to hear. Or she nervously laugh. And it felt like she felt his judging eyes on her.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

It's just this feeling I have where she would do one take and maybe she wouldn't feel confident enough to do a second take as he was watching. So the first take will just have to.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

That's exactly right. And I was feeling for her because she's in this van with him. She didn't go on this journey alone. She went with Brian. So she's gonna document her journey. He's gotta be a part of it. And he's not helping. He's not giving her anything. He's not being supportive, he's not being fun. And, like, I can feel her sort of frustration of like, do I include him? Do I not? How could I possibly do this and not include him?

[Patrick Hines]

Right. And she's in her own head and there's no way for her to be like, was that good? Because he'd say no, he wouldn't care.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And we don't see the conversations when the camera isn't on. For all we know, he's saying to her, why are you doing this? This is so stupid. Why are you even bothering?

[Patrick Hines]

He's 100% saying that. And you see a little bit of it on the footage. Like, he's kind of, like, judging her. He is judging her and.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And not giving her anything. Like, you need to give in a take in a scene like that.

[Patrick Hines]

And he's, like, rolling his eyes at her. And there's one point where she's, like, doing a take, and, like, he's driving and she's doing a take about something. And he interrupts her.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

About something he saw on the road. For the sake of interrupting her. Not, like, talking to the camera. Like, this is part of it. I just saw this thing. Thing.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Interrupting it because he's like, I want your attention now.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

What about my pie? What about. But he screws up a take. That was a good take.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

For the sake of it. And you ruin it.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I'm sure that you felt it too. Like, as a fellow creator, I was seeing the potential in her because she.

[Patrick Hines]

Was going to be amazing at this.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You don't have to be good. You just have to do it.

[Patrick Hines]

She would have done it right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And she was doing it right. I could see what this could have been, and I could see that she had the drive and she had the one. It was just. I just wanted to, like, hug her and be like, you can do this.

[Patrick Hines]

And nothing is scarier to a person like Brian.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Than someone who has a vision, who has the drive to do it.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And he's doing it anyway.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

He couldn't just watch this woman he supposedly loved fly and soar.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

And how cool is that when you. When it's not really your interest? Also, like, that's kind of cool where it's like, I don't know anything about this. But you know everything about it.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You love it and you love it.

[Patrick Hines]

I just get to watch you love it. And I kind of don't care about it. But now I definitely care. Because I mean, care.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I mean, that is 100% my story with Steve. I have a scene in my book where I lost my job, and I had been making podcasts for years, and I was so scared. Cause we had this new baby and I didn't know what to do. And I'm trying to apply for jobs online, and Steve took me by the shoulders and was like, you need to stop right now. You need to. From this moment forward, you are a podcaster. I'm gonna cry. Cause he was like, it wasn't his thing. He didn't really care that much about it. But he's like, I know you love it, and I know you will do this. And fucking look at us now.

[Patrick Hines]

You know, we've been talking a lot on the Hamilcast. It's been coming up a lot of, like. There's no better feeling than watching your friends succeed at the thing they love. Being in the front row or being watching someone make their debut and you just wann hit the person next to you. Do you see what you're seeing?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And then you go home and you're on the subway and these idiots don't even know what happened. My best friend did this.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

My friend just did a thing that they wanted to do and they killed.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And they did it.

[Patrick Hines]

That should make you float home.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And instead he's finding ways to ruin her tape.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

Motherfucker.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I'm sweating.

[Patrick Hines]

God. So as time goes on, though, Gabby is distancing herself from her loved ones. Not. And that's also like, the nature of the gift gig.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

She's in the middle of the desert.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Rose is saying, like, we would FaceTime from time to time, but she was distancing herself from me for sure.

[Patrick Hines]

And also, I just. Another quick note. This country is stunning.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, absolutely.

[Patrick Hines]

All of the footage is so.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's so beautiful.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, we gotta protect it, please.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

So beautiful.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

How are you? You look at it and you're like. Just like my little, like, being in my bubble, it's like, is she allowed to be there?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

It's just this, like, this beautiful desert and these mountains, and you're like, she's just there.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And it's like, I have. You'd think that you have no interest. And then you see it and you're like, oh, my God, it's gorgeous. Absolutely gorgeous.

[Patrick Hines]

Every location is beautiful. She's in these hot springs.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And so, you know, she's writing in her journal.

[Gabby Petito]

I feel bad. I'm always on my phone. I should give Brian more attention. He loves me so much. I don't deserve it, but I'm lucky he sticks with me.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's so hard. Like, he has convinced her of this.

[Patrick Hines]

So what the documentary does here is that we see all this footage and the romanticized version, her Instagram final photo of them, like, kissing under rocks or whatever. And then we get August 12, 41 days on the road, and we see a photo of Gabby that was retrieved.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

From her phone, and she's got this enormous black eye. And I. My note here is the way I gasped when I saw that black eye.

[Patrick Hines]

And she's crying. And it really is a juxtaposition because we Were just seeing her very curated, beautiful Instagram feed. Yeah, we see like the real photo.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Like he beat her.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. And her eyes all red. And you could tell she's been hit in the face and she's crying and she's like documenting what happened. And this leads us into the very famous and infuriating body cam footage, which.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Is where we started. So we hear that 911 call again and we get a little bit more context. Now the driver is saying they were outside the van. He was slapping her multiple times. Multiple times. They were running up and down the sidewalk. And then they get in the van and they take off and.

[Patrick Hines]

And this witness, we said this last time, gives the cops all the information they need to track down the white van, the make and model of the car, the color, the Florida license plate, the direction. Like, this witness is a great witness, everything they possibly could do.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And so we're back to like, you know, in the beginning we saw Gabby, like crying. They get her out of the car, she's just apologizing and apologizing. All she can say is, I'm a nightmare. She is putting this all on herself.

[Patrick Hines]

Immediately shaking like a leaf. She's apologizing endlessly. Talks about her ocd, her anxiety. Now Brian is on his best behavior. Yes.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

The students gets worked up sometimes and I try and really distance myself from her. So like, I locked her car and I walked away from her. What happened this morning is that she's trying to start up like your own little website blog and everything. So I give her time. We really had a nice morning with anything. But you want to tell me about those scratches on your purse? She had itself on her hand. That's why I was pushing her away, because I see she wanted. I like the keen start to walk where I started. Let's just take a breather and let's not go anywhere. Let's just calm down for a minute.

[Patrick Hines]

Brian is an innocent little flower and 110 pound nervous wreck. Gabby is a violent aggressor.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Now, remember the 911 call? The guy saw him hitting her.

[Patrick Hines]

That's why the cops tracked down this van. Yes, because a witness said a woman was being hit repeatedly on the street.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

And now they put Gabby in the back of the cop car. They're totally falling for Brian's bullshit.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

Gabby says she's really stressed out and they had a rough morning. Brian says they had a great morning.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

That's a red flag, 100%. Why are you two telling me you had a totally different morning, right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And the cops do like they say to her. You've got bruises on your arm, scratches on your face. But because Gabby is saying she hit him first, she's the aggressor in the cops. She's the one who stands to get in trouble here.

[Patrick Hines]

And they're trying to say, like, what happened to your face? They're trying to get her to say. And she won't say it. And we see this all the time. She's saying, you know, well, he grabbed my face. And the only thing she'll say is, well, I guess I did hit him first.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And then at one point, Brian and one of the cops are laughing about Brian being a victim of domestic violence.

[Patrick Hines]

It is. They are so desperate to make Brian the good guy here. It is wild to see and hear him play out in real time. Wild because Brian's story is that Gabby went crazy like she always does, and he was pushing her away. And the cop goes, well, to create some distance, obviously.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Obviously.

[Patrick Hines]

Now Brian is saying, I love Gabby. I just hope she doesn't have too many complaints about me and the cops. Like, well, you're the victim of domestic assault right now. Brian is doing this whole act. I hope I can explain this right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah, yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Where the whole vibe is almost that, like, he pities his insane girlfriend, but it's almost like, I feel so bad, but what can I do? This is all just happening to me, Brian. And instead of, like, shutting it down, he's allowing the Gabby beat me up now narrative to play out. Look how crazy she is. Can't you see how crazy she is? I told you they'd all think you were crazy, Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right? And she's sitting in the back of the cop car saying, he's right. I hit him. I beat him. I was the opponent.

[Patrick Hines]

I'm crazy.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Like, I don't know. You have to explain to me. Why is she doing that?

[Patrick Hines]

Ask a question, cop. Ask her why she's so anxious. What? Has he hit you before?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Ask her a single question. So Gabby calls her mother.

[Gabby Petito]

Gabby called me crying and upset. She said that her and Brian had an argument. I asked her what happened. She said that Brian had locked her out of the van. I was like, for what? And she said, oh, my God. It was just stupid. And it kind of brushed everything off.

[Patrick Hines]

Now, once again, when Gabby is asked what happened, she doesn't give a straight answer. Now, Rose was telling us the same thing all the time. Like, yeah, she would say, oh, he stole my phone or he stole my wallet or whatever. And Rose would be like, but why are you guys fighting in the first place? And Gabby could never really answer because when you're in a relationship like this, you don't know how anything started because nothing bad happened. You were just going to work.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right, right, right, right.

[Patrick Hines]

Can't tell Rose. Well, I went to work and he got mad at me because you do sound crazy. And then Rose will tell you what you're telling yourself. You have to leave. You don't want to hear that because you can't leave because you're stuck 100%. She can't say what happened because either nothing really happened or saying it out loud makes it really real.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And that's too much.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And she's brushing it off to her mom saying that like I was the nightmare. It's not that big because the mom is like, girl, come home. And the trip. Come home, come home.

[Patrick Hines]

No questions asked. Come home now. Yeah, come home now. The cops are like talk themselves circled up.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And the cop says, how far do you want to go with this? And he says, how far do you.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Want to go with this? Like, the reason why they don't give us discretion on these things is because too many times women who are at risk want to go back to their abuser and then they end up getting worse and worse treatment and then they end up getting killed in no way, shape or form that I can perceive that this is going to digress into the situation where he's going to be a battered man.

[Patrick Hines]

Right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

But then again, I don't have a crystal ball.

[Patrick Hines]

And I'm like, you had me in the first half. Also hate the word want. It's not about want.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right. I mean, the cop seems to know what's going on here. He seems to be the one that understands that this woman could potentially really be at risk of being murdered. And what he's saying is, I don't think that he's the battered one here, even though that's what everybody is saying, she could die. But I leave it up to you guys, what you want to do.

[Patrick Hines]

What do you guys want to do?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

What do you guys want to do?

[Patrick Hines]

Because they say everything she's saying tells me that she's the primary aggressor.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

It's a quote.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

I took the screenshot of it and.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

There'S a woman cop involved in this. We should point out there is.

[Patrick Hines]

And so. But he says, and this killed me. He says, I'm looking at 110 pound woman. She is not a threat to him. Nothing more than slight abrasions from her fingernails. And I said, do you mean like defensive wounds?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Is that what you're saying to me right now?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And they're now saying to each other, we could either arrest this girl or let her go. Like, they are talking about Gabby as the aggressor.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. Their options are do nothing.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

Or fully pursue a domestic assault charge against Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Against Gabby.

[Patrick Hines]

I feel absolutely insane.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No, I want to know that all of these cops have been fired. That like all of these cops have, like, now that this woman has been murdered.

[Patrick Hines]

No, but they feel real bad about it.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, my God. Do we talk to them? Eventually?

[Patrick Hines]

No.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Okay, good.

[Patrick Hines]

They decide to not charge Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Well, that was kind.

[Patrick Hines]

Even kinder. They pay to put Brian up in a hotel so he can enjoy a nice shower and the air conditioning and some television. And they force Gabby to sleep alone in the van.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

This 20 year old 90 pound girl.

[Patrick Hines]

Now this makes Gabby hysterical. Not for the unfairness of it, all, right, but because she's begging them, please, please, please, we're a team. Please, please, please don't separate us.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right? Because like, is this going to make him more mad? What is, what's he going to do? When?

[Patrick Hines]

Also, it's all she knows, right? Being alone.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She's in the middle of the country where her cell phone doesn't work, in a van by herself.

[Patrick Hines]

What is she going to do? This is all she knows now. And he made it that way.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right?

[Patrick Hines]

So the cops want to be friends with Brian so bad, it's crazy.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

And as Gabby is sobbing, she goes, it's just a silly argument. I just went to get water.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And the woman cop goes, right, but it ended with you putting hands on each other. And he's got marks. So does Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And she goes, silly arguments shouldn't go that far. Yes, you idiot.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

Exactly.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

She said the thing that she wouldn't say to Rose. I just went to get water.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Y.

[Patrick Hines]

Now I'm here.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right?

[Patrick Hines]

And the woman cop goes, well, how does he end up with marks on him? Not the right question, lady. Why is she shaking like a leaf? Why is she terrified? Ask a question.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She's going to be dead in a matter of weeks.

[Patrick Hines]

Like, no one's asking her anything. And the cops are just like, you know, go to your separate corners, don't text each other. Brian will decide when he's ready to speak to you again, Gabby.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right. Do not contact him tonight. Do. He's saying goodnight to you now. Do not text him.

[Patrick Hines]

Brian's going to go to the nice AC in the shower, in the bed and the television. And you stay away from him. This, this. He's calling the shots here.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

You are clearly a danger to him.

[Patrick Hines]

As she's leaving, the cop goes, hey, wait.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Also, something I want you to know there. Stand over here. Real, real fast forward. If you go over to City Market, they have a list of places where you can get yourself a shower for like four or five bucks, something like that. Be pretty cheap place where you can shower, decompress de stress a little bit. Alrighty. Yeah, I just showered yesterday at one of those. Well, you didn't have today happen yesterday, so it does. My wife wonders when she gets stressed out. It's like, get in the shower, get in the shower. Go take a shower. Relax.

[Patrick Hines]

I know where you can get one of those shitty showers for like four bucks.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Does he pay for that shower right? Not. It was their budget all spent on Brian's hotel room.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly. And he's like, I know that you need a shower because my wife, who also gets hysterical, all feels better when she takes it. I say to her, get in the shower. Get in the shower.

[Patrick Hines]

My wife's an anxious dummy like you, and the shower always makes her feel better, let me tell you. It gives me some alone time, Gabs. Oh, she a pain in the ass that all she does is yap, yap, yap, that wife of mine. And it gets to the point where I'm like, just get in the shower. You know what I mean? So you should do the same thing, Gabby. Yeah, in the middle of nowhere, crazy. Never been to before. You crazy, crazy idiot.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I can't believe you hit him.

[Patrick Hines]

I can't believe you hit him. How dare you do that? He's so nice.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

He's so nice, says the cops.

[Patrick Hines]

Now we're in the car with the cops and their new best friend, Brian Ryan wants to hook up his phone.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know.

[Patrick Hines]

To the car so he can play his own music as they drive him to the hotel room that the taxpayer just paid.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know, I know.

[Patrick Hines]

And he keeps going on about his wife. He's two seconds away from my wife. I mean, this guy, he's like. He's so much like my wife. She's on medication, but it's not enough. The shower always helps. So I said, gabby, he's sitting next.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

To that woman's murderer. He's sitting next to that woman's murderer.

[Patrick Hines]

And he's like, yeah, everyone, I sent Gabby to a place in the middle of nowhere where she can get a shower for five bucks. I'll probably get the Medal of Honor. I don't like to use the word hero.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right, but here's what.

[Patrick Hines]

But just so I'm clear, I'm giving Brian the hotel room and sending Gabby on her way, telling her if she can scrounge up four bucks, maybe she can get a shower somewhere. Sure. Helps my crazy wife.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

She's in the middle of nowhere. No, she's uns. Oh, my.

[Patrick Hines]

And I gotta tell you, to all my Columbo girlies, this is not the way Columbo talks about his wife. When he does it, it's masterful. And he's. She's awesome. And he's using it against you.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

This cop, again, is two seconds away from doing a my wife routine. Yes, it's crazy. So that night, Gabby speaks to her mom.

[Gabby Petito]

She said that her and Brian just were told to spend the night apart, that that's what they do in situations like this just to cool off. I said, I don't like you being alone in your van. Where's Brian going? And she said, oh, they're taking him to a hotel. I was like, why is he going to a hotel and you're in your van by yourself? And I was still in shock and, like, you need to come home. Let's just end the trip. And she said, mom, I. I promise, everything's fine. We're just going to continue the trip.

[Patrick Hines]

Now, I remember we said last time we did this documentary that we were wondering if maybe they were giving her a chance to leave. She has the van. She can go, right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah. Yeah, maybe.

[Patrick Hines]

But seeing everything we saw now, and the way the cops talking to her and about her, I don't think they gave a shit about her experience.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

No. And nobody intimated to her, this might be a good time for you to get the fuck out of here?

[Patrick Hines]

Nobody, no one was giving her resources. No one was sort of given the. I say.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

When the cops started to say, hey, I know a place downtown where you can go, I thought he was talking about, like, a battered women's shelter. I thought he was going to give her resources for. No, no, no, no, no. They believe that she's the batterer.

[Patrick Hines]

You're crazy. Like my wife.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Exactly.

[Patrick Hines]

And he tells her, have a nice cup of coffee. It'll make you feel better.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

And then in the end, we get the. Onscreen, Gabby and Brian met up later that night after being separated by law.

[Patrick Hines]

Enforcement, because they, of course, meet up later that night, like you said, like, hey, idiot cop, remember what you said about women going back to their abusers and how it gets worse and worse, and then they end up dead. We're living it. Great job, asshole.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I mean, there was literally the foreshadowing of this exact story of.

[Patrick Hines]

Am I right?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

So August 22, 10 days after the Moab incident, Gabby texts Jackson, her ex boyfriend. He is here.

[Patrick Hines]

Okay. She sends a text that says, hi, I'm sure I'm the last person on the planet you want to hear from. Doctor.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

The minute Jackson came on scene, my heart sank because I thought, this is where it all comes together.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right.

[Patrick Hines]

This is why Brian snapped. She was gonna leave, right? She called her ex.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yes.

[Patrick Hines]

Whatever happened, it happened because she was close to leaving. And that's what always happens. The minute she reached out to someone who could help her or someone. The ultimate threat. The ex.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And the minute he sat down, I went, oh, and if she knew information.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

To us, we didn't know about her.

[Patrick Hines]

I didn't know about Jackson.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

I didn't. I also wasn't intensely following this case. Like, many, many people were, like, in real time. Like, I remember people found his Spotify playlist. Like, people were. He was missing, remember?

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Right. Brian, Laundry. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

And we'll get into that. But there were people who were actively, like, searching for him and following the case. I wasn't doing that.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Wow.

[Patrick Hines]

So I wasn't really. I did my deep dive when we were covering this.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

Because I knew all the information was out, but this was the first time I heard about Jackson. And everything fell into place immediately when I was like, oh, oh. She texted her ex. Oh, of course.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Oh, girl. This story is just so tragic and it's so sad, but this documentary is so well done.

[Patrick Hines]

Yeah. All of the footage of Gabby, and it's just really. It's really amazing. So I know this was a story that people were following in real time.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

So we.

[Patrick Hines]

We actually get to see some of that in episodes two and three. Like, all the people who helped and. Yeah, like, all of the footage of the. The van life people, like, all their camera footage. It's crazy.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

It's really wild. So as we're saying, episodes two and three are available right now and ad free at the $5 tier on Patreon. That's where you get all the other 450 full ad free bonus apps, all the other wonderful stuff that we have to offer on our Patreon, which we've been doing for, like, eight years now.

[Patrick Hines]

Crazy.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

I know. There's so, so, so much there, but we love you. Thank you for listening. You can click the link in the show notes here if you want to go right to the Patreon page. Or it's patreon.com true crime obsessed.

[Patrick Hines]

There you go. Come join us. Everyone is welcome.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

Everyone is welcome. Yeah.

[Patrick Hines]

We love you. All right.

[Julianne Pizzavalli]

We love you.

[Patrick Hines]

Okay, bye.