Lofi Girl

Summary

Twenty Thousand Hertz: Episode Summary – Lofi Girl

Podcast Information

• Title: Twenty Thousand Hertz
• Host: Dallas Taylor
• Episode Title: Lofi Girl
• Release Date: August 28, 2024
• Description: Exploring the stories behind the world's most recognizable and interesting sounds.

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Introduction to Lofi Girl

In this episode, host Dallas Taylor delves into the phenomenon of Lofi Girl, the iconic figure behind one of the most popular lo-fi hip hop streams on YouTube. Taylor shares his personal connection to lo-fi music, describing it as a crucial element in his daily routine for maintaining focus and reducing stress. He poses several intriguing questions about the effectiveness of lo-fi music, its creators, and the community that has formed around it.

Dallas Taylor [00:50]: "Lo fi is this super useful thing in my personal and professional life, but I've never really known much about it."

Kevin Weatherwax’s Journey with Lo-Fi Music

Kevin Weatherwax, a central figure in this episode, shares his unconventional path through education, marked by multiple high school dropouts and an eventual ADHD diagnosis. Struggling with focus, Kevin found solace in ambient music, which played a significant role in his academic resurgence.

Kevin Weatherwax [02:29]: "Really early on, what I found is it was really beneficial for me to sort of carve out feelings of anxiety and frustration... with some kind of ambient music, kind of low key stuff going on."

Kevin's discovery of the Lofi Girl stream during his doctoral studies at the University of California, Santa Cruz, was a turning point. The serene animation of a girl studying with lo-fi beats provided the perfect backdrop for his late-night lab sessions, fostering a sense of calm and focus.

Ben Brock Johnson [03:35]: "He was working in the lab late one night and he discovered the be all end all of study buddies, a YouTube channel with a girl sitting at a window that looks out onto a European cityscape, doing her own work and listening to Lo Fi Hip hop."

The Rise of Lofi Girl and Its Community

The Lofi Girl channel, officially titled "Lo Fi Hip Hop Radio – Beats to Study/Relax To," was created by a mysterious French producer known as Dimitri. Since its inception, the channel has amassed over 13 million subscribers, becoming a mainstay for students, professionals, and anyone seeking a tranquil auditory environment.

Nora Sacks [04:41]: "It really helps you focus and calm and kind of get in your peaceful place."

The animation features a girl with brown hair, big eyes, and headphones, energetically yet peacefully studying in a cozy room. This visual, coupled with the endless stream of lo-fi beats, creates a loop that feels both familiar and comforting to millions worldwide.

Ben Brock Johnson [05:15]: "The anime style girl with brown hair, big eyes, wearing headphones... there's just enough animation for it to not be static."

Parasocial Relationships and Emotional Connections

A significant aspect discussed is the parasocial relationships listeners form with Lofi Girl. Kevin defines it as an emotional bond with a media-presented character that isn't reciprocated, yet provides comfort and a sense of companionship.

Kevin Weatherwax [08:53]: "It's this idea that you can have an emotional connection to a character... that is not reciprocated or can't be reciprocated by the nature of the relationship."

Emily Heap, a marketing specialist from Cleveland, shares her experience, highlighting how Lofi Girl serves as a non-demanding companion that helps her relax and focus without the need for active interaction.

Emily Heap [10:59]: "A companion that you don't need to expend any energy interacting with and yet helps you feel calm and stay focused."

Academic Exploration of Lo-Fi’s Impact

Intrigued by his own behavioral responses to the channel, Kevin Weatherwax co-authored an academic paper investigating the effects of lo-fi music and its online community. Through data analysis of live chat interactions and participant interviews, he uncovered that Lofi Girl fosters a supportive and positive environment, enhancing relaxation and concentration.

Kevin Weatherwax [10:47]: "I saw a lot of this thing of people talking about oh, the lo fi girl... She's this kind of partner, this almost... a safe."

Kevin posits that lo-fi music acts as assistive technology for neurodivergent individuals, including himself, by providing structured auditory stimuli that aid in focus and emotional regulation without attempting to alter their neurodivergent traits.

Kevin Weatherwax [12:33]: "It's almost like assistive technology for them. It's kind of co-opted or colloquial assistive technology."

Neurological Benefits of Lo-Fi Music

Dr. Concetta Tameno, a board-certified music therapist, explains the scientific basis for lo-fi music’s effectiveness. Music engages multiple brain regions, and its rhythmic consistency can entrain brain waves, promoting a relaxed and organized mental state. The steady beats and minimal frequency variation in lo-fi music help reduce cognitive overload, making it easier for individuals with ADHD to concentrate.

Antonio [22:28]: "The pulse at which those rhythms take place is now influencing the pulse at which the neurons are firing."

Additionally, her explanation of entrainment likens lo-fi music to a metronome, aligning external rhythms with the brain’s internal processes to enhance focus and relaxation.

Antonio [23:00]: "So think about how a musician uses a metronome... The external rhythm actually does the same thing."

Expansion of the Lo-Fi Universe

The success of Lofi Girl has inspired a myriad of themed lo-fi streams, expanding the genre into various niches such as medieval lo-fi, Zelda lo-fi, animal crossing lo-fi, and even Taylor Swift lo-fi. This diversification caters to specific interests, allowing listeners to find a lo-fi stream that resonates with their personal hobbies or preferences.

Dallas Taylor [26:04]: "There's nature, lo fi, medieval lo fi, Zelda, lo fi, animal crossing, lo fi, star wars, lo fi, Taylor swift lo fi."

Artist Perspectives: The Case of Mondo Loops

Antonio, known as Mondo Loops, a British producer, provides insight into how the lo-fi scene supports artists. Unlike fears that Lofi Girl might depersonalize music production, Antonio credits the platform with significantly boosting his career. After submitting demos to the Lofi Girl team, his music gained substantial exposure, allowing him to transition into a full-time music career.

Mondo Loops [28:49]: "I owe my career really to lo fi girl supporting my music."

He emphasizes the collaborative and international nature of the lo-fi community, highlighting how it fosters growth and financial stability for artists through high streaming volumes.

Mondo Loops [29:59]: "With lo fi music, you get the financial element of people put it on in the background and they'll listen to 100 songs, 200 songs while they're studying."

Conclusion: The Symbiotic Relationship Between Listeners and Creators

The episode concludes by reflecting on the mutual benefits that Lofi Girl offers both listeners and artists. Listeners, particularly those who are neurodivergent, find a valuable tool for focus and relaxation, while artists gain a platform for exposure and financial support. Emily Heap expresses her appreciation for this symbiotic relationship, recognizing the positive impact on both sides.

Emily Heap [31:06]: "It's something good for the listeners and good for the makers in Internet music... it's a rare feeling I'm going to cherish and keep jamming to."

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Notable Quotes:

• Dallas Taylor [00:50]: "Lo fi is this super useful thing in my personal and professional life..."
• Kevin Weatherwax [08:53]: "It's this idea that you can have an emotional connection to a character..."
• Emily Heap [10:59]: "A companion that you don't need to expend any energy interacting with..."
• Antonio [22:28]: "The pulse at which those rhythms take place is now influencing the pulse at which the neurons are firing."
• Mondo Loops [28:49]: "I owe my career really to lo fi girl supporting my music."

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Final Thoughts

The Lofi Girl episode of Twenty Thousand Hertz offers a comprehensive exploration of the lo-fi hip hop phenomenon, uncovering its profound impact on both individual listeners and the broader music community. Through personal stories, academic insights, and artist perspectives, the episode highlights how a simple animated stream can foster meaningful connections, enhance cognitive functions, and support creative professionals worldwide.

Transcript

[Dallas Taylor]

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[Ben Brock Johnson]

Let producer Nora Sacks and I introduce you to Kevin.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

I had really kind of atypical path through school. I was a high school dropout. I kicked out over and over again. You know, as a kid, I got all these diagnoses really young about why, what was wrong with me, and that kind of just pursued me through my life, right? And it was always this thing, well, what's wrong with you? How can you be more like other people and stop being like you?

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Kevin would eventually be diagnosed with adhd, which was listed as the source of his academic challenges.

[Emily Heap]

Kevin was a curious person and a hard worker, though eventually in his mid to late 20s, he dove back into school. He says there was a lot of relearning he had to do, part of.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Which was just learning how he could do work in the right way.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Really early on, what I found is it was really beneficial for me to sort of carve out feelings of anxiety and frustration or worrying about the future and stay focused in my space that I was in. If I had some kind of ambient music, kind of low key stuff going on.

[Emily Heap]

Kevin was an early adopter of early Internet based ambient music listening channels, some of which were on YouTube. They used visuals often connected with anime, which helped too.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

They made me feel calm and safe and I would kind of curate my workspace to not just use the music, but I would include the visuals when.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

I could, as in have a screen up with the actual visual as well as listening to the music.

[Dallas Taylor]

While he was studying, Kevin completed his undergrad degree, then started working on a doctoral program at the University of California, Santa Cruz. At one point during his studies, I.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Always joke like I was working in the lab late one night, which was accurate. And I was he was working in.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

The lab late one night and he discovered the be all end all of study buddies, a YouTube channel with a girl sitting at a window that looks out onto a European cityscape, doing her own work and listening to Lo Fi Hip hop.

[Emily Heap]

Kevin was far from alone. He was part of an exploding audience for a mysterious and popular YouTube channel which would have several names, but would be most commonly referred to as Lo fi girl.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

The YouTube channel is officially called quote Lo Fi Hip Hop Radio Beats to Study, Relax To. It was apparently started by this young and somewhat mysterious French producer known only as Dimitri. It NOW plays an infinite 247 curated live stream of what is known as Lo Fi Hip Hop. It's a type of mostly instrumental hip hop that features downtempo beats with some low fidelity elements thrown in that sort of creates a perfectly imperfect kind of nostalgic, atmospheric, uber chill vibe.

[Nora Sacks]

It really helps you focus and calm and kind of get in your peaceful place.

[Emily Heap]

Emily Heap, a 29 year old marketing specialist and makeup artist from Cleveland, is a lot like Kevin.

[Nora Sacks]

So it got me through a lot of late nights of homework, long days at work, and I even listen to it now every night to go to sleep.

[Emily Heap]

This stream has become massively popular. It has 13 million subscribers, a loyal following, and it's been a huge force in underground music. And yet somehow it still feels like a secret, but one everybody knows about.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Definitely an open secret. Any time of the day or night you start streaming this channel, there are tens of thousands of people streaming too. Even if you've never heard of this channel, you'd probably recognize the animation that goes with it. The anime style girl with brown hair, big eyes, wearing headphones. She is always writing in her journal or studying at her desk in her cozy little room, petting her orange cat while it stares out the window. The animation transitions transitions from day into night. The cityscape outside the window gets dark and lights come on in other windows. There's just enough animation for it to not be static. It's a loop, but somehow it doesn't really feel like a loop. And it's been that way for years.

[Emily Heap]

But then, back in April, I was.

[Nora Sacks]

Getting ready for work. I had worked from home that day, and I went on as I do every single morning, and I put on my Lo Fi girl and she was gone.

[Emily Heap]

Meaning she was out of the room in the animation, which, if you're one of the millions who expect Lo Fi girl to be in her place, turning her head, playing with her pencil on a loop like she always is. It was a huge change. Emily was so rattled, she started recording on TikTok.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Hi, guys.

[Nora Sacks]

I just woke up. Everything is happening all at once. Let's go over the Lo Fi Girl lore.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Before Lo Fi girl and her cat disappeared from the anim, a blue light in a far off window had started blinking.

[Nora Sacks]

And they turn their heads and they look at it, because that is not normal. Normally, she's looking at the computer.

[Emily Heap]

The shot zooms closer and closer to that blue window until it's inside. A door appears.

[Nora Sacks]

And that's when I started to realize that something a little deeper was going on.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

So if you were on the Lo Fi girl stream on April 12, instead of study girl doing her thing, you were zooming into this blue window collectively staring at a door.

[Nora Sacks]

There's keys jingling. Did it go?

[Dallas Taylor]

I was right.

[Nora Sacks]

I was right. And he has a dog.

[Emily Heap]

This is Emily's TikTok reaction to the expansion of the Lo Fi girl universe, the debut of a whole new character, and his own live stream. If Lo Fi girl's aesthetic is chill study vibes, Lo Fi boy or synth boy is chill gamer vibes. He's sitting in front of a computer, a Nintendo controller to his left, lava lamp to his right, with all kind of nerdy accoutrements sprinkled around him. And fittingly, his channel is synthwave Radio. Beats to chill or Game two. So Ben, in the end, Lo Fi girl didn't disappear. She just gained a cute little friend. And clearly this was all still a very big deal to devotees like Emily.

[Nora Sacks]

Lo Fi Girl, like I said, has always been kind of in the background. Just a fun little character that's been a part of my life for so long. And when something changed, it was then that I realized, like, oh, my gosh, I kind of do have this weird parasocial relationship with her.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Kevin defines parasocial this way.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

It's this idea that you can have an emotional connection to a character or a space or an idea that is presented to you in media that is not reciprocated or can't be reciprocated by the nature of the relationship.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Color Me is a little bit skeptical even as a podcast host of the idea of value in parasocial relationships. But then again, I am a fan of this channel too.

[Emily Heap]

Kevin says people who form parasocial relationships aren't weird. They know it's one sided and aren't under any illusion that the other party knows they exist, let alone is going to return their feelings.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

With the lo fi girl stream humming along next to him, as he would start to lose his focus, Kevin would glance over at this short animated loop he's seen millions of times before. And this is part of how Kevin's interest in the channel transitioned from fandom to true academic study.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

I noticed that when she would get back to work in the loop where she would sort of kind of phase out for a second and then start again, I was finding myself feeling prompted to get back to my own work and I started thinking, well that's really odd. Why am I taking behavioral cues from something that I know is going to occur every couple seconds and is just an animated character? How is this prompting me to do anything to change my behavior?

[Dallas Taylor]

Kevin was so intrigued that he ended up co writing an academic paper about lo fi music and the online community around it.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

He and his colleagues collected and analyzed data from the live chat windows, which is the main place streamers interact with each other, at least on YouTube. They also did lots of exploratory interviews with people who listen and watch assorted lo fi music streams. And a clear theme started to emerge.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

And I saw a lot of this thing of people talking about oh, the lo fi girl. She works in studies like I do. She's this kind of partner, this almost, you know, not a friend, but like someone that you relate to, a safe.

[Emily Heap]

Companion that you don't need to expend any energy interacting with and yet helps you feel calm and stay focused. A key ingredient, aside from the music, is the environments the characters exist within.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

There's something inviting but not over engaging. There's a degree of animation that invites somebody to feel a part of the space, almost like this kind of window into this idyllic world. But it's not so engaging as they be distracting or to really encourage you to lose yourself in it.

[Emily Heap]

And this connection to the character and or their space seem to hit on a feeling of nostalgia for people or an escape to a different time or even world. And in addition to the nostalgia bathed listening and viewing experience, people in the chats also openly discuss stress, fear or trauma they're dealing with from school or work or really just being a human on the planet.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

People in the chats, they go in there and they leave just these positive comments. Hey everybody that's doing this right now. You're doing great. Keep trying. It doesn't matter if it feels bad, like it's a surprisingly non toxic environment.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

In his preliminary study, Kevin concluded that some users did form parasocial relationships and that this almost static animation and super chill lo fi really does increase relaxation and focus. But Kevin has another theory too.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

I think part of what's useful about this or some of the people that are using this are neurodivergent like myself and that something about this relationship to this character is almost like assistive technology for them. It's kind of co opted or colloquial assistive technology. It's not designed with them in mind, but it happens to strike some specific chord that's helpful for people like me.

[Dallas Taylor]

After the break How Lo Fi Affects the Rhythms of the Brain in the Explosion of the lofi Multiverse Predicting the future of your business can be really hard, especially when you're looking at data from a bunch of different apps and tools. And that's one of the things that makes NetSuite so helpful. NetSuite is the world's number one cloud based ERP, which stands for Enterprise Resource Planning. Now that term sounds kind of complicated, but what it really means is that NetSuite is a unified platform where you can manage your accounting, inventory, payroll, HR and more with one integrated system. You don't have to waste time and money training people on multiple pieces of software and manually transferring information from one place to another. Better yet, netsuite has real time stats and forecasting tools that allow you to make informed decisions about your company's future. Over 38,000 companies have future proofed their business with NetSuite. And speaking of the future, you can now download the CFO's guide to AI and machine [e-mail] 20,000. The guide is free to [e-mail] 20 thousand. That's netsuite.com 20. Congratulations to Eric Lauber for getting last episode's mystery sound right. That's the old login sound for the Ubuntu operating system. The sound was apparently created by a community contributor named Peter Savage. It was enabled by default for about six years from 2006 to 2012. Since then, Ubuntu hasn't had a login sound enabled by default and here's this episode's mystery Sound. If you know where that sound came from, tell us at the web address mystery.20.org anyone who guesses it right will be entered to win one of our super soft 20,000Hz T shirts. And if you want to snag a super soft shirt without guessing, just head to 20k.org shop let me play you a sound that I really love. That's the sound of my Sonos speakers calibrating and to me it perfectly represents what I love about Sonos. All you do is open the Sonos app, find the device and select True Play. Then it calibrates your speakers with these pings as you walk around the room. When it's done, you get this sound, which to me is just so satisfying. The result is that your Sonos speaker is now tuned to the acoustics of the room it's in. This kind of attention to detail is why I have almost 20 Sonos products in my home. For instance, I keep Sonos One speakers in each of my kids bedrooms so they can wind down to relaxing music. The holidays are just around the corner and Sonos speakers make great gifts. They're not just cool pieces of gear, they're a way to make someone's world sound amazing. In my opinion, it doesn't get much better than that. Sonos has great gifts for everyone on your list. Visit sonos.comhertz to wrap up your holiday shopping. That's sonos.comhertz and as always, be sure to use our custom URL to let them know you came from us. Sonos.comhertz.

[Connie Tameno]

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[Dallas Taylor]

Registered trademark of the Bose Corporation. Growing up, Kevin Weatherwax had a really hard time staying focused. Eventually he was diagnosed with ADHD.

[Emily Heap]

According to WebMD, it's the most commonly diagnosed mental disorder in children, one that can neither be prevented nor cured. It continues on into teenage and adulthood years and has lots of different kinds.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Of symptoms, many of which Feel very familiar to me. In fact, when Kevin asked me about how I ended up on this lo fi journey myself, It's a great question. I suppose it's always tricky to say this kind of thing. I'm pretty sure I'm like, undiagnosed adhd.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Not tricky. Anybody, I think, should be able to.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Say that that's what it feels.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Because it is hard to get a diagnosis.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Yeah.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

And you had to be a extreme problem. But if you were functional or able to engage with the space, you weren't going to get it. And as an adult, you can't really. And so it's like, what are people to do?

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Yeah, that's. Yeah. I do think that is like a fundamental part of my personality. Like, I can hyper focus, but I'm also like, extremely consistently and constantly distractible.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Me too. Which is why I accidentally have two dissertation tracks that I'm having competing for which one's going to be the final one. One is on my human robots interaction research and one is on the lo fi stuff.

[Emily Heap]

When it comes to assistive technology for neurodivergent people, Kevin says he's observed a strong tendency for interventions that seek to.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Sort of transform someone from neurodivergent to neurotypical or neurotypical behaving right rather than being augmentive, which is what I really like about the lo fi. My relationship to lo fi as part of my work and study practice, and what I see other neurodivergent people also having, which is that it's augmentative. It's not about making me not be neurodivergent or to behave as someone who's neurotypical. It just helps butress some of the areas where I struggle while building up my strengths.

[Emily Heap]

Another probably not coincidence, Emily Heap, the Cleveland tiktoker we talked to, also volunteered that she has add and we should say that this is how she described it. Although these days most people describe this disorder not as add, but adhd. Either way, it kind of like tickles.

[Nora Sacks]

Your brain the right way, if that makes sense. It just like scratches that itch in there and I'm like, ugh, it's perfect.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Yep. And I can keep working.

[Nora Sacks]

Yes, yes. It helps me focus so much.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Maybe it's a pharmaceutical company that's behind it.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

Who knows?

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Maybe.

[Nora Sacks]

Maybe they're like, there's an Adderall shortage. Give them lo fi.

[Emily Heap]

So we know anecdotally, at least, that these lo fi hip hop music streams help neurodivergent folks like Kevin and Emily and probably Others relax and focus, but not necessarily why or how. What's really going on up there inside our Nawkins?

[Ben Brock Johnson]

I wish I knew. I honestly wish I knew. But we did get some help. We turned to Dr. Concetta Tameno, aka Connie from the Bronx.

[Antonio]

I am the executive director and co founder of the Institute for Music and Neurologic Function. I'm a board certified music therapist with a master's and doctorate in music therapy and have been a music therapist for 44 years.

[Emily Heap]

Over the decades, Connie has witnessed music work magic as medicine.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Is music a net positive on brain function?

[Antonio]

Oh, absolutely. I think I could say that. I think the science supports that too.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

There was the old man who had a stroke and couldn't talk, but then all of a sudden started singing Old Man River.

[Emily Heap]

And the young girl who had seizures every night before she was about to fall asleep, until Connie created and prescribed a music track.

[Antonio]

The rhythm would gradually get slower and slower and slower, so it would ease her brain into a more relaxed state.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Hmm. Softer landing.

[Antonio]

Exactly. And it actually worked. So I was very happy.

[Emily Heap]

The reason music is used as and in therapy is because it engages all parts of the brain in different ways.

[Antonio]

And so we have a way of not only organizing the brain in a very purposeful way, but stimulating and arousing areas that may be a little out of sync.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Take someone with adhd.

[Antonio]

The main thing is that there's hyperactivity in different areas of the brain, which.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Makes it hard to focus because there's.

[Antonio]

Too much noise and too much activity going on that distracts the type of focus that's needed to learn or to do a task.

[Emily Heap]

Okay, now listen up, because this is the coolest thing I've heard in a really long time. Music doesn't only engage your gray matter. The rhythm of the music can actually entrain the rhythm of the brain.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

This was like a galaxy brain explosion moment for me. Nora. Connie says entrainment is basically when one stimulus influences another.

[Antonio]

The pulse at which those rhythms take place is now influencing the pulse at which the neurons are firing.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

What that makes me think of is like, music can serve almost as a metronome for the way that the brain is functioning and organizing information.

[Antonio]

Absolutely. So think about how a musician uses a metronome.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Yeah.

[Antonio]

And they use it to stay in time in their performance or to be able to perform the music with other musicians.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Sure.

[Antonio]

The external rhythm actually does the same thing. And in fact, that's why it's effective with somebody with adhd is it's providing a steady beat and Organizing brain rhythms that the person internally isn't able to organize.

[Emily Heap]

One of the reasons lo fi hip hop music is such an awesome metronome for folks with hyperactive brains is because it's slow.

[Antonio]

You know, 70 to 90 beats per minute, I believe, is the standard for lo fi. So that low rhythm in and of itself is producing a very relaxed state.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Also, Connie says it doesn't usually have a huge range of frequencies or sudden changes in pitch, which helps our physiological state get calm. And yet there's just enough going on in the music to filter out background noises, but also engage your brain all at the same time.

[Emily Heap]

Scientists are still trying to figure out exactly how this all works on beta and theta waves and all that good stuff. But for now, I think we can safely say lo fi music does have an influence on brain activity.

[Antonio]

And I think it's because of that very regular rhythmic beat that is engaging the brain in such a way that helps regulate then how the brain is functioning.

[Emily Heap]

Another very exciting discovery. There's so much more to the lo fi world than just our old digital friend lo fi girl and her new friend, or is it boyfriend, lofi boy. If that channel really was the big bang, the lofi universe has just kept on expanding and diversifying even beyond other.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Very popular and very similar channels with almost identical names like college music's lofi hip hop radio, Mellow chill, study beats.

[Emily Heap]

Yeah, it's real close to home.

[Dallas Taylor]

There's nature, lo fi, medieval lo fi, Zelda, lo fi, animal crossing, lo fi, star wars, lo fi, Taylor swift lo fi. There's cooking lo fi and workout lo fi, Beatles, lo fi and K pop lo fi. You can basically pick a thing that people are into, then type in lo fi and chances are something will come up.

[Kevin Weatherwax]

I mean, such a labor of love to just build something that is. You're like, oh, this other thing makes me feel really good. But I would also love to see myself in it. So I'm just going to make that.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Learning from Kevin and Connie from the Bronx about the lo fi girl multiverse was really surprising for me as a low key lo fi girl fan. Learning that these channels are good for me and my brain is great. But I also had started with a more skeptical question. Is lo fi girl good for music or is it in a weird way, part of this, like, general degradation of artistry, let the algorithms take over and remove the person behind the art, et cetera?

[Emily Heap]

Yeah, it's a really good question. And I should say here that we tried our darndest to reach Dimitri or Really? Anyone from Lo Fi Girl? We didn't get a response except that they wanted to stay anonymous. And we also contacted a bunch of their different artists around the globe and they also seemed not so into talking, which I kind of get. You know, they just want to have their alias or moniker and keep making their chill vibes. But one was game.

[Mondo Loops]

So, yeah, this is an upcoming track that I'm working on. It's not quite finished.

[Emily Heap]

This is Antonio, AKA Mondo Loops, generously walking me through a Lo Fi hip hop song work in progress. Mondo means world in Italian and Antonio makes a lot of guitar loops.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Antonio is based in northwest England and he's a full time producer, mostly of Lo Fi hip hop stuff. And now he's started messing around with field recordings as well, of things like leaves crunching and twigs snapping. Very asmr.

[Mondo Loops]

And before that I sort of started off releasing guitar based music, mostly instrumental, just pure guitar stuff. And it sort of evolved into the sort of LO5 thing quite naturally. It's quite a similar sound palette.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

We wanted to talk to Antonio because, you know, again, I was just worried about this idea that maybe Lo Fi hip Hop Girl was so kind of in the background that it sort of just removed the artist from, I don't know, the art in a way, you know, turning people into more sort of faceless, nameless chill music generator bots. Right. But at least for this young British producer, that didn't feel like the case. Actually, he says it was the exact opposite.

[Emily Heap]

Right. Antonio told us that a few years ago, very early on into his music career, he sent some demos to the team behind the Lo Fi Girl stream, who also now run a record label. And Lo Fi Girl liked them and dropped some of his tracks into their playlists on Spotify and other streaming platforms. And this bumped his audience big time in the region of few hundred a.

[Mondo Loops]

Week to tens of thousands a week. It was a big jump.

[Emily Heap]

Then they asked him to write a song for this compilation album they released called 1am Study Sessions. They put it out on vinyl and YouTube and since then Antonio has released several albums with the Lo Fi Girl label and contributed to loads more compilations since. And he characterized the lo Fi scene as super international, very collaborative and generally pretty open and sharing oriented.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

My first impression was that infinite livestreams like Lo Fi Girl and a lot of its spin offs wouldn't be great for producers like Mondo Loops.

[Emily Heap]

But Antonio didn't seem to feel flattened or anonymous or like he was just another Lo Fi cog in the wheel or Chill music generator bot at all.

[Mondo Loops]

It works both ways because whilst it's not necessarily artist focused, the model quite naturally works in the artist's favor financially when it moves onto streaming services. Not that it was the intention of the channel at all, but with sites like Spotify you get paid obviously per listen and with a lot of artists it can be a real struggle to get the fan base and the following to get any substantial earnings from Spotify and Apple and that sort of thing. You get paid three or four dollars per thousand streams. But when it comes to lo fi music, you've got the financial element of people put it on in the background and they'll listen to 100 songs, 200 songs while they're studying, which reflects in much higher streaming. And as an artist it supported me financially to make this my full time career. Without this I don't think I'd be a full time music producer. I owe my career really to lo fi girl supporting my music.

[Ben Brock Johnson]

Nora, you may not be a lo fi girl superfan, but what do you come away from all of this with?

[Emily Heap]

Well, I'm not a super fan, but I've become a fan where I wasn't one before and I actually have found myself like turning to the stream sometimes and listening to more of Mondaloop's and other artists music. And I mean I love thinking about how my brain is being engaged and also freed to focus and I'm not saddled with this burden of like oh, all the artists you know are just musicified and this is bad for them. Like actually every time I stream them on Spotify or play it, I'm actively supporting an independent artist on this record label and to feel just like there's something good for the listeners and good for the makers in Internet music is. It's a rare feeling I'm going to cherish and keep jamming to.

[Dallas Taylor]

That story came from the Endless Thread podcast. Though we made some edits for Time and adult language. Endless Thread is all about the vast and curious ecosystems of online communities. On their show you'll hear untold histories, unsolved mysteries and all kinds of jaw dropping stories. In recent episodes they've explored YouTube's sword fighters, catfishing scams and how to fight off a shark. Subscribe to Endless Thread right here in your podcast player. 20,000 Hz is produced out of the sound design studios of Defacto Sound. Hear [e-mail] Endless Thread is a production.

[Emily Heap]

Of WBUR in Boston. This episode was produced and co hosted by me, Nora Ruth, Valerie Sachs, with help from Endless Thread co hosts Ben Brock Johnson and Dean Russell. Dimitri, if you're out there, still love to talk. Our sound designer on this episode was the super chill Paul Vikas. The rest of our team is Sama Tajoshi, Matt Reed, Amory Sievertsen, Quincy Walters, Emily Jankowski, and Grace Tatter.

[Dallas Taylor]

I'm Dallas Taylor. Thanks for listening. What you're hearing right now is called the post roll of a podcast. In podcasting, the post roll is any ads or announcements that happen after the credits. Now, if you're still listening to me right now, it's because you either sincerely care about everything I have to tell you, or you just haven't picked another episode to listen to yet. Either way, before you go, I want to remind you that it's our advertising that keeps this show going, and if we want these advertisers to keep booking with us, which we do, then we need people like you to use our unique URLs and promo codes. With that in mind, book a top rated [e-mail] 20K test out Oracle's cloud infrastructure at oracle.com 20K. Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at shopify.com 20 and get 10% off your first month of therapy at betterhelp.com 20. You can find all of our active offers and discount [e-mail] sponsors or click the link in the Show Notes.