227: Disclose or Nah?!

Summary

Two Hot Takes: Episode 227 - "Disclose or Nah?!"

Release Date: July 31, 2025

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Introduction

In Episode 227 of Two Hot Takes, host Morgan Absher and co-host Mikayla delve into the nuanced and often controversial topic of disclosure within relationships. Drawing from a variety of Reddit stories, listener write-ins, and internet anecdotes, the duo explores when it's essential to disclose personal information and when it might be unnecessary or even harmful. The overarching question for the episode is: "To disclose or not to disclose?"

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1. Am I the Asshole for Not Disclosing Plastic Surgery to My Boyfriend?

Summary: A 26-year-old woman grapples with whether she is in the wrong for not initially disclosing her past plastic surgeries to her 25-year-old boyfriend. Having had a nose job at 22 and breast augmentation at 23, she did not mention these procedures early in her four-month relationship. The issue surfaced when her boyfriend expressed disdain for women with implants after seeing a friend's photos, leading to feelings of betrayal and questioning her actions.

Discussion: Mikayla asserts, “He is the asshole” for being derogatory towards women with implants and not appreciating her for who she is. Morgan adds, “Don't talk about any women like that. That's gross.” The hosts agree that cosmetic surgeries, when not affecting the partner directly, do not require immediate disclosure. They emphasize the importance of honesty but also recognize that personal enhancements like nose jobs or breast augmentations fall under individual choices that don't necessarily impact the relationship dynamics.

Notable Quotes:

• Morgan (01:52): “If you can touch it, they're real.”
• Top Comment: “You lucked out that he showed you this side at four months in. You could have been married before you found out he's this shallow and misogynistic.”

Conclusion: The consensus is clear: the woman is not the asshole. The boyfriend's shallow standards and lack of respect make him the real problem. Disclosure in this context is deemed unnecessary unless directly impacting the partner's well-being.

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2. Am I the Asshole for Not Disclosing I'm Not Christian to My Client?

Summary: A commissioned artist, who is not Christian, created a piece featuring Christian iconography for a client. When asked about her favorite scripture, she admitted her non-Christian beliefs, leading the client to feel deceived and question the spiritual value of the artwork. The artist wonders if she should have disclosed her faith upfront.

Discussion: Morgan and Mikayla discuss the importance of context in disclosures. They argue that personal beliefs do not necessarily impact professional services unless explicitly requested by the client. Morgan states, “If you have those preferences, you should go out and… ask upfront.” They highlight that clients seeking specific intentions behind commissioned work should communicate their expectations clearly rather than assuming the artist's personal beliefs.

Notable Quotes:

• Morgan (32:10): “If you have those preferences, you should go out and, like, ensure that and ask the questions up front.”
• Top Comment: “You don't discriminate, but apparently they do.”

Conclusion: The artist is not the asshole. Professionalism entails delivering services regardless of personal beliefs, and unless faith-based intentions are a specified requirement, non-disclosure does not constitute wrongdoing.

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3. Reporting an Unethical Therapist Who Married a Former Patient

Summary: A woman discovers that her ex-boyfriend married their shared couple's therapist a year after their sessions ended. Feeling violated and disturbed by the therapist's dual relationships, she contemplates reporting her therapist to the American Counseling Association.

Discussion: Morgan and Mikayla delve into the ethical boundaries therapists must uphold. They highlight that forming personal relationships with former patients is strictly prohibited within ethical and legal guidelines, typically requiring a waiting period of two to five years post-therapy. The hosts emphasize the abuse of power dynamics inherent in such relationships and the potential psychological harm to clients.

Notable Quotes:

• Morgan (43:51): “After therapy ends, there is a waiting period before a therapist can date a former patient, which varies, but is typically at least two to five years.”
• Top Comment: “Please report her.”

Conclusion: The therapist's actions are deemed unethical and unacceptable. The episode underscores the importance of maintaining professional boundaries to protect clients from potential exploitation and psychological harm.

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4. Am I the Asshole for Using My Friend’s Nail Clippers and Causing Tension?

Summary: A 30-year-old man house-sat for his friend, using his friend's nail clippers to address a split nail. Upon the friend's return, it was discovered that his girlfriend was germ-conscious and upset about the clippers being used, leading the boyfriend to lie about their usage. This deception escalated tensions, making the man question if he is at fault.

Discussion: Mikayla finds the situation perplexing, questioning the extent of the girlfriend's germophobia and the boyfriend's dishonesty over a minor issue. Morgan echoes this confusion, emphasizing that minor breaches should not warrant such significant relational fallout. They suggest that open communication about small matters could prevent unnecessary drama and distrust.

Notable Quotes:

• Morgan (64:11): “You are making it an issue by just not communicating.”
• Top Comment: “He put himself in this situation by lying and his girlfriend is super weird for wanting the entire bathroom deep cleaned over a pair of clippers.”

Conclusion: The man is not the asshole. Using nail clippers during house-sitting is a minor issue, and the escalation stems from the boyfriend's and girlfriend's overreactions and lack of straightforward communication. Transparency could have easily resolved the misunderstanding.

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5. My Wife Thinks We're Soulmates, but I Think I Settled

Summary: A man, after nine years together and six years of marriage, realizes he has never been in love with his wife. He acknowledges her positive qualities but feels their relationship was founded on his need for stability rather than genuine love. Conflicted about ending the marriage without causing harm, he wrestles with feelings of guilt and regret.

Discussion: Morgan and Mikayla empathize with his struggle, highlighting the pain of unrequited love within a long-term relationship. They discuss societal pressures to conform to traditional relationship milestones and the importance of honest self-reflection. The hosts encourage open and compassionate communication, possibly involving therapy to navigate the complex emotions involved in ending such a relationship.

Notable Quotes:

• Mikayla: “She deserves someone who loves her for who she is.”
• Morgan (83:04): “And I think this person is potentially not coming from a negative place. It's not about mal intent.”

Conclusion: While the man is grappling with a deeply personal and painful realization, the episode underscores the importance of authenticity in relationships. Remaining in a marriage without love is portrayed as emotionally taxing for both parties, suggesting that honest disclosure, though difficult, is ultimately healthier.

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6. My Boyfriend Kept Asking Me to Moan Louder. Turns Out He Was Recording Me.

Summary: A 25-year-old woman discovers that her 27-year-old boyfriend was secretly recording their intimate moments without her consent. After confronting him, she learns he shared these recordings with friends under the guise of jokes. Feeling violated, she immediately ends the relationship, blocks him, and files a report.

Discussion: Morgan and Mikayla condemn the boyfriend's unethical and invasive behavior. They discuss the critical importance of consent, especially concerning recording intimate encounters. The hosts highlight the betrayal of trust and the severe emotional impact such actions can have on the victim. They emphasize that regardless of the legality in certain states, the moral breach is intolerable.

Notable Quotes:

• Mikayla: “He's a terrible person. Saying it was a joke and then having his friends defend him too.”
• Morgan (112:01): “Consent is key. Consent is necessary and needed.”

Conclusion: The boyfriend is unequivocally the asshole. Secretly recording intimate moments without consent is a profound violation of trust and personal boundaries, warranting immediate termination of the relationship and legal action.

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Closing Thoughts

Throughout Episode 227, Morgan and Mikayla navigate the intricate landscape of disclosure in personal relationships, highlighting the thin line between necessary honesty and overstepping boundaries. They emphasize the importance of context, consent, and respectful communication in maintaining healthy relationships. The hosts encourage listeners to evaluate their own boundaries and the ethical considerations of disclosure, fostering a community grounded in mutual respect and understanding.

Notable Takeaway: "Disclosure is not just about honesty; it's about understanding the impact of sharing personal information and respecting both your own boundaries and those of others."

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Connect with Two Hot Takes

• Instagram: @TwoHotTakes
• YouTube: Two Hot Takes YouTube Channel
• Patreon: Exclusive Bonus Stories
• Merch: Two Hot Takes Shop

For more in-depth discussions and additional stories, consider supporting the show on Patreon.

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Support for This Episode

• Sol de Janeiro: Embrace 24-hour hydration with their new Body Bottleata lotion, available at Sephora and soldejaneriao.com.
• HelloFresh: Simplify your meal planning with fresh ingredients delivered to your door. Visit hellofresh.com/hottakes10fm for a special offer.
• eBay: Discover unique pre-loved and vintage fashion at eBay.

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Thank you for tuning into Two Hot Takes! Join Morgan and Mikayla next week as they continue to explore the hottest takes on dating, relationships, and life’s juicy stories.

Transcript

[Morgan]

This episode is brought to you by Disney's Freakier Friday on Friday, August 8th, prepare for the frequel. Jamie Lee Curtis and Lindsay Lohan are back in Disney's Freak Year Friday. And this time the whole family is switching. A new generation joins the chaos, making this swap wilder, weirder, and more heartwarming than ever. It's the perfect summer event for the whole family. Disney's Freak Year Friday Only in theaters August 8th. Get tickets now. This episode of Two Hot Takes is presented by State Farm. Whether you're debating scrolling on your phone for hours or rewatching your comfort comedy movie for the 10th time or both, choices are important when it comes to choosing coverage. A State Farm agent can help you find options that are right for you. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

[Mikayla]

We just, like, slowly add nalongs.

[Morgan]

I know, like, up for dialing. You guys, look how cute my little friend is. Look at my little friend.

[Mikayla]

He's got flowers.

[Morgan]

Oh, I thought they were a bowl of fruit.

[Mikayla]

I also initially thought they were grapes, but I think that it's a bouquet and he's, like, nervous and about to present it to somebody.

[Morgan]

He's so cute.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I love him so much. He's just the most adorable little guy. But here we go.

[Mikayla]

Yes.

[Morgan]

Another week, another episode, another crazy batch of stories.

[Mikayla]

I'm so excited for this theme. We've been talking about this theme for a while now, and I've been, like.

[Morgan]

Anticipating almost a month. Actually. This theme's been on my radar for almost a month. And you guys are probably reading the title and you're like, what is this gonna be? So I think there's a lot of stories I've seen lately and they kind of all have the underlying theme of disclosure and like, to disclose or not to disclose.

[Mikayla]

Right. Like, should I tell this person this thing?

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

And like, am I obligated to tell this person this thing?

[Morgan]

Yes. And I think there's so many instances in life where it comes up whether it's like a relations and a partner and it's like, do you have to disclose the past or a job? And it's like you're applying for a new job and you know you're pregnant but you're not going to tell them. Right. Because otherwise you're not going to get hired. So there's so many things. And like, the stories I keep seeing are, like, all about disclosure and like, someone might have disclosed something and they didn't need to or they're thinking about disclosing. So that's the Vibe today.

[Mikayla]

I'm excited.

[Morgan]

We've got some crazy ones. And you found one as well.

[Mikayla]

Yes, of course. And I'm thrilled to present it to you. It's like if you listen to one of our bonus episodes, it's sort of a different POV on a story we had there. So I'm excited about that.

[Morgan]

Yes. Oh, my gosh. The Patreons for this month have been so fun too. It's literally all you, me and Lauren.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like, we did a trio episode. So if you guys have been wanting the Michaela Lauren me trio, we test, trial run, it, test, whatever.

[Mikayla]

It's so sleepover vibes. Like, it really feels like that's my feeling.

[Morgan]

It was so fun. It was total sleepover vibes. So that's on Patreon. And then me and you did one and I still had my, my like, chin wrap from surgery.

[Mikayla]

Is that the one where we have the two outtakes? The like the.

[Morgan]

Our patches.

[Mikayla]

Our patches.

[Morgan]

Our patch sweatshirts. Yes. So you'd see those over there. And then the other one is me and Lauren. So, like, it is. It's a girls girls month on Patreon.

[Mikayla]

That's awesome.

[Morgan]

If you want some good bonus stuff, head over to Patreon. But let's get into these stories.

[Mikayla]

Okay?

[Morgan]

Okay, I'm ready.

[Mikayla]

I'm buckled.

[Morgan]

Let's dive in. SA before we dive into today's stories, this episode is presented by Sol de Janeiro. So you love to take care of your skin and you love to smell great. That's why the new body Bottleata lotion from Sol de Janeiro is for you and me. It's fast absorbing and non sticky. It gives you 24 hours of non stop weightless daily hydration. And it's made with their iconic Shirosa 62 scent. From sunrise to the after party, new body Bottleata by Sol de Janeiro should be your new lotion obsession. I know it's mine, so give it a try. You know you wanna shop now at Sephora and SOL de janeiro.com.

[Mikayla]

Woo wee.

[Morgan]

Okay. I've been waiting for this one. And we kind of talked about it a little bit, like right after my surgery.

[Mikayla]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Morgan]

And everyone's like, surgery, what the hell did you do? So I ended up getting a deep plain neck contour. I think that's the formal.

[Mikayla]

Wow, that sounded so scientific. I believe you. I think that's right.

[Morgan]

I still don't really like, I understand what we did because, like your brother Tyler Oakland, who was my surgeon, I know him. It's so crazy. But he did such a good job explaining it. And he's like, you know, we just do a little incision here and then we go behind your platysmus muscle or whatever that one's called. Like.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Honestly, like, and I'm not just saying this because he's your brother. No, he has the best bedside manner out of any doctor I've ever met. And that includes working in hospitals, emergency rooms, anywhere.

[Mikayla]

Thank you.

[Morgan]

Like, I had to. I saw like someone else this week for like chin filler and who's also a plastic surgeon and like, couldn't explain anything. Like, couldn't do. I'm just like, it's such a big.

[Mikayla]

Part of it, I feel. Because, like, it's such a big decision. You get so nervous and like, you want to be able to talk through all of your concerns and not feel like you're going to annoy them by asking a question.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And like, he's just so great at explaining and making you feel comfortable and just like, it was just the best, best, best experience. And this is something I've wanted for years now. Like, I've always been so self conscious of like my little turkey neck. And it's very genetic for me if you look at like my grandma and my mom. And so it's something I really wanted to do, especially before the wedding. I just like wanted to feel my absolute best.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

So I did that and I'm like two weeks post op right now, so, like still a little swelling, but it's just, it's such a faster recovery though.

[Mikayla]

Than like one would expect. I feel.

[Morgan]

I never had pain. Really?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like a little sore, but like no pain. It's been like the easiest recovery ever. Yay. And the results already for like two weeks out, still swollen. I'm like, okay. I can already see such a difference.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

So I'm really excited.

[Mikayla]

That's so awesome.

[Morgan]

Yeah. So if anyone wants to look into like neck contouring, like deep plain neck lift, Tyler Oakland is amazing. And I'm not getting paid to say that. Like, that's just genuinely, like 10 out of 10 would do this again tomorrow.

[Mikayla]

Thanks, diva. I mean, there are a lot of like non surgical alternatives. Like. Yeah. Like Kybella. I think they like put acid in your neck or something.

[Morgan]

I've tried Kybella. It didn't work.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I just think you bullfrog and it. It honestly feels like venom.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

In your face.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. I just think it's like actually getting a little bit of liposuction is less invasive and like Dangerous. But I don't know.

[Morgan]

I had a good time. If anyone has any questions, send me a message like, I'm so down to talk about it. And I'll probably do a full video down the line, like in a couple months once my swelling is completely gone, just so we can see the full results. But I know people have been curious and I wanted to talk about it because it's been a really good experience. And it leads us into our first story today.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, that's your full disclosure right there.

[Morgan]

My full disclosure. I had plastic surgery. I'm not gonna lie and say I did mewing. And that's how I. I've been taping.

[Mikayla]

My mouth at night.

[Morgan]

Like, okay, I'm like, yeah, you can do all those things and it might help. But like, if you have genetics and that's the way your face is like, it is like, you could mew till the cows come home.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And when I mew or whatever that thing is, it bulges on me really.

[Mikayla]

Like, opposite of that. Opposite of mewing. I've never tried mewing because I'm not good at anything that you have to sort of do every day.

[Morgan]

It's too much. And then there's that thing people were like ordering that jar thing that you like chew on all day. And I'm like, yeah, you're going to like give yourself some joint issues.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, there's a lot of. There are a lot of at home recipes.

[Morgan]

But yeah, no, I like my surgical recipe. So this first one is about plastic surgery. It's coming from R. Am I the asshole? Titled Am I the asshole for not disclosing I had plastic surgery to my boyfriend. I, 26, female, have been dating Max, 25, male, for four months. When I was 22, I had a nose job as I broke my nose twice as a kid and it left a large bump. Then at 23, I had a breast augmentation that bumped me up two cup sizes. These were lifelong insecurities that I was bullied over and it was really relieving to get them done. On to the present. I met Max through a friend and things have been great. Last night I was strolling through my social media while on the sofa with him, I stopped on an old classmates vacation photo where she wore a bikini and frankly had very obvious implants. She looks great. Happy for her, but you can tell Max glanced over at that moment and said, quote, gross. I asked him what the deal was and he said women who get implants or other surgeries are a huge turnoff to most Guys. And how men prefer natural over two balloons and how insecure she looks. I couldn't help but laugh and said, quote, so you're turned off by me. He got very confused and asked what I meant. I informed him I had procedures done before. He kept denying it and saying I was joking until I showed him old photos of me. He got quiet and left. Shortly after, I got a text saying that I should have disclosed this on the first date, how I led him on, and that he needs to reconsider things. It's the next day. I haven't heard anything. I'm bewildered. Am I the asshole?

[Mikayla]

First of all, like, I think that this poses an interesting question beyond, like, just their own relationship. Yeah, but in the confines of their relationship. First, he is an absolute asshole. He was not only an asshole to her, but also to this, like, girl's photo. If I were looking at any woman's photo and a man, you know, peered over my shoulder and said, ew, gross. Clearly insecure, I'd be like, watch your photo mouth. Watch your tone. Like, who do you think you're talking about? First of all, that might be my friend, but even if it isn't, like, don't talk about any women like that. That's gross. But then, yeah, that's such an interesting. Maybe he should have disclosed on the first date that he has those deal breakers. Like, I don't know. Like, I. That's crazy to me also, that he couldn't tell. Like, she probably thought he knew.

[Morgan]

I mean, I wonder. Like, I've never felt an implant breast. Like, I've never. I'm, like, so curious if you can tell a difference even. Because I know, depending on what you do, saline versus silicone, it can feel different. Saline feels supernatural. That's what they plug it, at least. So I'm just so curious. And it's also, like, I love when I read this story to Justin, I loved his response. And he's like, if you can touch it, they're real. He's like, it just like, it is what it is. And it's one of those things that's like, you were attracted to her. What does it change? Yeah, what does it change for you?

[Mikayla]

I don't know. It's not like he asked ever, and she lied about it or like she was purposefully keeping this insane secret. Like, they haven't been dating that long, first of all. Like, four months.

[Morgan]

Four months.

[Mikayla]

So I think that there are things that maybe just naturally haven't come up. But I think it's crazy to expect like on date one, for someone to be like, okay, it's very important that I disclose to you. I have had a rhinoplasty. I have had a boob job. I have had, like, this, like, that. There are so many things that are so much more important when getting to know somebody, in my opinion of, like, who they are. And I don't know. That's just such. He sounds like an asshole.

[Morgan]

Totally. And I think I do, like, question this. When it's something that doesn't affect the other person, A nose job, not gonna affect him. I don't think a boob job affects him either. When do you have to disclose or do you ever have to disclose? It's not like a huge deal to me. Like, I don't think telling someone that you got a nose job on the first date is a requirement. Like, that's just one of those things. Like, it. It doesn't matter at all.

[Mikayla]

Right?

[Morgan]

So I'm like, are there rules? Obviously health things like if you have an std, like, that should be disclosed pretty early on, especially before sleeping together. But if it's something like this, do you even ever have to disclose it?

[Mikayla]

Yeah. And I'm trying to think about it from the other gender. Like, if there was a man and he'd gotten like, hair, like, what's that called?

[Morgan]

Oh, hair plugs.

[Mikayla]

Like, hair plugs? Yeah. Like, would it matter if he disclosed that or not? Like, would you be like. Like, no, I wouldn't care. I. I'd be curious to know because I do think, like, it'd be an interesting conversation to talk to someone about an insecurity that they had their whole life and, like, that their journey in, you know, making that decision, like, I think it could be an interesting conversation due to that. But in terms of feeling, like, betrayed or feeling like they've misled me, I would not feel, oh, I don't want to, like, give a spoiler. But there's like in Materialist. Nevermind, never mind. Did you see Materialist?

[Morgan]

No. It's on my list.

[Mikayla]

There's basically, they talk about the surgery where you, like, can make yourself taller as a man.

[Morgan]

Oh, my God. I've heard like horror stories from that. Yeah, it's like a very dangerous.

[Mikayla]

So, yeah, I don't know. But then. Wait, do you think celebrities should have to disclose plastic surgery to their followers?

[Morgan]

I think if you're a public facing figure that a lot of people are looking up to as body goals, and if you're creating like a beauty standard and you're using tools that alter and, like, create something that's not naturally achievable. I think you should. I think it just helps, like, set the standard. Like, that's. That's. For me, it's like, I'm. I've had lip filler, I've had chin filler, I've had Botox. I just got my neck chin lift contour thing. Like, I'm not going to lie about that because I don't want to make it seem like it's anything. Like. It's also not something I'm ashamed of. Like, if you want to address your insecurities and use tools or whatever to make yourself feel better, that's cool. But just don't lie to people to make it seem like you're doing it naturally. I feel like celebrities, especially should. Like, I don't get why they continue to lie when it's very clear they've had work done.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Where you can watch these progressive pictures, and clearly the person's gotten nose job. Like, everything.

[Mikayla]

I do feel sometimes those accounts, like, sometimes I think those accounts I don't always feel are coming from the best place. No, there are certain accounts that will show just, like, the worst photo ever of somebody maybe as, like, a teenager or a preteen, then be like, clearly they've had work done.

[Morgan]

I'm like, maybe.

[Mikayla]

I don't know, Like. Like, contouring can do a lot. Like, noses can look so different even over time. Like, I don't know, your nose can.

[Morgan]

Change after you're pregnant, too.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

It's not necessarily. Yeah, that's a fine line. Because it's like, there's a lot of those accounts that I've seen exposing people. They're just ragging on these people. It's like, I don't think she actually got work done. I think she's overlining her lips and, like.

[Mikayla]

Right.

[Morgan]

Has just matured in her face.

[Mikayla]

I think in the perfect world, like, people wouldn't hide that and they'd be clear about that, but then they'd also be clear every time they're using a filter or, like, Facetune or any type of thing. Like, if Jennifer Lawrence got a boob job, I wouldn't feel like, okay, she needs to, like, make a video now telling us she got a boob job. But, like, if someone asked, I guess in, like, a normal way that didn't. Wasn't too invasive. If she went on call her daddy or something, and Alex Cooper was like, hey, have you ever gotten a boob job? I would imagine she'd Be honest about that.

[Morgan]

Hopefully. Yeah.

[Mikayla]

It's such a fine line. Like feeling entitled to the information about other people's bodies.

[Morgan]

Well, and it's, it's really interesting too. And I think there was like a great documentary on it. But why do we have insecurities and like, why do we even compare ourselves to other people? And like, why are we looking at these models and things and people you see in media as like the standard of beauty and then why does that make you feel bad? And so it's like this vicious cycle. And so if you're a public facing figure, I think ideally disclose. If people ask you if it is something that you've gotten done, I think like, we're beyond lying about it at this point.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Especially if you're an influencer who specifically, like you're making these makeup videos or something and all of your comments are like, oh, I'm so jealous of your nose, I'm so jealous of your jawline, like, blah, blah. Like, if you're seeing that, I feel it would be hard to not be like, wait, guys, like, this is the case.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And there's a lot of people that are now very transparent about it. Like Victoria Paris talks about everything she's gotten done. There's a lot of people that now are like, I've done this, this, this and this. Like, I'm not natural, like, I'm not a standard. Like I've literally gotten all this done in a relationship. I don't think you need to like jump out of the gate and disclose everything. I think over time you would anyways, as you get comfortable with that partner, as you maybe are like, oh, you know, I'm kind of hitting a 12 year mark, I'm gonna have to get my breasts redone or whatever that looks like. I think it naturally comes out.

[Mikayla]

And that's what's happening in this story. Like they're four months in and plastic surgery has probably come up as a topic for the first time.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

Because if he had ever brought up his concerns, clearly then she would have said it. But like, yeah, they're, they're noticing breast augmentation. He's saying, I don't like that. She's saying, I have that. Like that's kind of what happens. It comes up in the world and then you have a conversation about it.

[Morgan]

I know. And again, you couldn't tell.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

So it, it's not unnatural looking because you quite literally could not tell.

[Mikayla]

I think the argument I've seen is like, if you're going to have children with someone, Is it, like, important to disclose that this is actually the feature that you would be passing down to those children?

[Morgan]

Dude, that's so crazy to me, though, because it's like, if your kid didn't like their nose, they could get a nose job.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like, I think that's the same thing about, like, oh, we'll take her swimming on the first day.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

It's like, it's so funny because I've seen videos too, where they'll take pictures of people with, like, very natural makeup on. And they're like, oh, does this girl have makeup on? And the guys are always like, no, very natural.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Love that.

[Mikayla]

It's like, yeah, they don't actually care.

[Morgan]

She's got a full beat.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like, she's got a full face on. Like, you don't know. You don't know. Natural.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. He's clearly the asshole. She didn't do anything wrong. I think in a relationship, I would want to know as much about that person as possible and hope that all of those things would come out over time. But I wouldn't feel slighted or betrayed if it came out later in the relationship or like, a conversation happened at any point. Again, I just think it could be important for understanding the person you're with and, like, their journey with certain things. Because if you've had a lifelong insecurity, like, that plays a big part into your development. And I, you know, that's why I would want to talk about it. Not because I'm like, oh, there's this hidden, like, secret thing that you've done that you're hiding from me. Yeah.

[Morgan]

You know, I think it's. It is really important to talk about because it's like, it's like, how have you felt? Who are you? And also, like, depending on the insecurity, it could bleed into how you raise kids.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like, for me, I grew up in a household where, like, weight was talked about constantly. And so it's even something that, like, I've had issues with. I've had a lot of, you know, body image issues. And so looking at the language that I heard around weight and, oh, being fat and blah, blah, blah, blah. Like, I won't even use that word around my kids. Like, I'm not going to even have that language.

[Mikayla]

Because it was even about yourself.

[Morgan]

Even about myself in front of your kids?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And, like, my brother and his wife have done a really good job of that. Like, they don't talk negatively about their bodies. And it's kind of like our generation, because like, weight and diet culture was, like, so prevalent for our moms and dads too. Maybe, but it's just interesting how it can bleed into the next generation, too. Top comment on this one. Not the asshole. You lucked out that he showed you this side at four months in. You could have been married before you found out he's this shallow and misogynistic. Yeah, and that's true. Like, I think you made a great point when you were like, if I heard the guy I'm dating talk like this, I'd be like, whoa, who do you think you're talking to? Because talking about another woman like that, that you don't even know, saying she's.

[Mikayla]

Gross, like, yeah, it's just.

[Morgan]

It's. It is insane.

[Mikayla]

So insecure. Okay. We are, like, everyone is a little insecure. You're insecure about something, dude. Like, let's be real, or else you wouldn't be talking like this.

[Morgan]

I know. I think, like, insecurities are so normal. It's just, like, how you handle them is, like, kind of the thing. Next comment down is from OP I agree. Honestly, if he texts me again saying he's okay to continue, I really don't think I'm interested.

[Mikayla]

Of course.

[Morgan]

Go, OP.

[Mikayla]

This is such good time. I love when one of your stories is, like, early on in their dating, and they're like, they're not married. They don't have children yet. There aren't these strings yet. Because sometimes I'm like, oh, this sucks.

[Morgan]

I know, I know. No, no attachments here with this one, which is very nice. Next comment down. Not the asshole. His reaction and comment that, quote, should have disclosed this on the first date makes him childish. OP Goes, yeah, that threw me off. I don't really think, quote, oh, by the way, my boobs are fake is really typical first date talk.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I don't think so either. Also, I like, if you could think of so many other things that you'd be like, ooh, you have to disclose that on the first date. Like, family health history. Like, I don't know, you can, like, think of all these crazy things, but that's not real life. Like, that would be a crazy conversation to have.

[Morgan]

It's super. You'd almost look at it as like, why is she telling me this on the first date? And he probably would have. Like, if, realistically, if she would have done that, he would have hated that too. Yeah, he would have been like, she's shallow. Why is she telling me about surgery?

[Mikayla]

And if you seriously have, like, that intense of A deal breaker. And you feel that strongly about it, maybe you should bring it up at some point and then show people who you are right away. Like, yeah, that should be. I think it'd do a lot of women a favor if he brings that up on the first date instead.

[Morgan]

Tell me your preferences. Yeah. Next comment. Not the asshole. You shouldn't have to disclose your medical history for someone to date you. And OP goes, yeah, that's what I thought. Even though it's mainly cosmetic history, clearly he liked how I look enough to start dating me. So what's the issue?

[Mikayla]

Yeah, thank you.

[Morgan]

Someone responds to that though, and they go, the issue is he now realizes he's a hypocrite.

[Mikayla]

Wow. Yep.

[Morgan]

Guess what? We got some edits on this one.

[Mikayla]

Ooh.

[Morgan]

Feeling like a little bit of an update.

[Mikayla]

I love that edit.

[Morgan]

All right, y'. All. I got a text from him a few minutes ago asking to meet up as he thinks he wants to continue the relationship and wants to talk things over. After all of these comments and some thinking, I sent back along the lines of that his reaction made me realize he's not the partner I'm looking for and that I've decided to not continue our relationship.

[Mikayla]

Awesome.

[Morgan]

So, yeah, I'm single now. Kind of confused if I should mention this to future dates before we're official to weed out any more like him. How do you even bring this up? Oh, well, I like me. I'm content with my natural and unnatural parts. And I'll find someone who doesn't have a huge hang up on plastic surgery.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I mean, he liked the way she looked and he liked her personality. It sounds like he just holds this misogynistic ideal about women in this specific way. And once that clashed, he was like, oh, kind of hurts my brain. Like. Like women, plastic surgery. Insecure, bad. So embarrassing. So weird looking like I can't, like, can't put those two things together. Don't make sense. And I'm so glad that she's left him. That's awesome.

[Morgan]

You know, we do have another edit. He finally replied to my text quote. I was hopeful we could start over on an honest beginning, but I guess only one of us is mature enough to look past each other's shortcomings in the relationship.

[Mikayla]

Shortcomings? Oh, my God.

[Morgan]

I'm glad you revealed this about yourself before I got too involved. Goodbye. Good luck finding someone, because no real man would respect someone who can't even respect their own body.

[Mikayla]

Sir, you just said you wanted to continue things and start over.

[Morgan]

I hate when people do that, I. I really like you. I want to continue. Oh, you don't like me. Oh, well, I never liked you anyways.

[Mikayla]

And no one ever, no one who respected himself actually ever would like you.

[Morgan]

No one would ever touch you with a ten foot pole.

[Mikayla]

My ex, Girlfri.

[Morgan]

Like, oh, my God, you liked me? What? You thought I was hot?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

You like fake boobs. Just get over it.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, like, what.

[Morgan]

What mental gymnastics are you. Are you doing?

[Mikayla]

No. Yeah, she got out like, scot free. Like, that's amazing. I'm so happy for her. Thank God.

[Morgan]

I guess only one of us is mature enough to look past each other's shortcomings.

[Mikayla]

Your shortcoming being a freak? Her shortcoming having plastic surgery that you liked. Yeah.

[Morgan]

Shortcomings.

[Mikayla]

No. I would probably crash out actually, though, if someone said that to me.

[Morgan]

I am just like, beyond. I just. This is so crazy. And it's not. It's not a big deal.

[Mikayla]

Like.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I mean, what if she wanted a mommy makeover down the road? Like, what, you're not gonna let her? You're gonna be disgusted by it? Like, let people live?

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I just.

[Morgan]

I think it's goofy and it's like, you don't have to encourage it if you're not for it or if you think it's risky or whatever. But, like, you also can't control people. And you can't even say, I'm not attracted to people with plastic surgery because you are.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, that's just not true.

[Morgan]

So get off this weird little soapbox where you think you're better than people and like, oh, a real man's not gonna respect someone who doesn't respect. Yeah, you're conflating a lot of stuff.

[Mikayla]

You drew a very good parallel earlier with like, the whole makeup thing of it's like, no, you actually do, like, makeup on women. You just like to think of yourself as someone who likes more natural women and like, I don't know, it's almost.

[Morgan]

This morally superior thing.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, like a morally superior thing. And also trying to, like, control what women do and. And like, be like, oh, these are the ones who deserve respect. But it's like, that's just not even your own preference actually. Like, you just don't know shit about fuck.

[Morgan]

I like that you don't know shit about fuck. And that's this. Dude, this post is a little vintage. Three years old now at this point in time and no other updates after that.

[Mikayla]

Wow. Well, I'm thrilled with the last one that we got.

[Morgan]

I think it's Freya, I'm just taking a peek to see if there's any other things. I think a good point, too, that I see in one of OP's comments is, like, my nose was fine. Naturally it looked bad because I broke it. And, like, regardless of what reason you get a nose job for, it could be cosmetic. It could. Because you had a deviated septum. It could because you broke it. Like, it doesn't matter. It's a choice you make, and if you like the way you look, that's what matters.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Freak. He's a freak.

[Mikayla]

It's not his choice. At the end of the day, it all comes down to that. It's not his body. It's not his choice. Yeah.

[Morgan]

Okay. Moving along. So this one is coming from Am I the Asshole? As well. It is two months old, titled Am I the Asshole for Not Disclosing that I am not Christian. To preface this, I do commissioned artwork and do not discriminate against any subject unless it's racist, homophobic, otherwise hateful or sexually disturbing. I did a commissioned art piece with Christian iconography. A beautiful ornate cross, a saint, and scripture in calligraphy. The client was happy with my work, paid me, and then asked me what my favorite scripture was. I was honest and just said, quote, oh, I don't really have one because I'm not a Christian and wouldn't really know which ones I'd like to. He became upset and told me that he felt lied to because I have posted artwork of Christian subjects before and he assumed I would be Christian. He said the art doesn't hold the same spiritual value because it wasn't made with, quote, faithful intention. I was kind of unsure of what to say. I said, quote, I'm sorry you feel that way, but I do artwork for everyone, and I am open to doing Christian artwork because it's for the client, not me. Should I be disclosing if I don't share a certain faith when commissioned to do artwork for it, Am I the asshole?

[Mikayla]

No. This reminds me of, like, the conversation about the first date with plastic surgery of, it would feel weird for someone to say that to me. If I had a religion and I hired an artist to paint something and they were like, by the way, like, I don't really fuck with that, but I'm happy to do it for you, you know, Like, I like that feels weirder to me.

[Morgan]

I know, because you'd be like, whoa, this is kind of a spiel when I'm just like, hey, can you make a picture of a horse?

[Mikayla]

Right? Like, I didn't ask you your personal opinion on the matter.

[Morgan]

No. And it's also like, I don't think it matters if you're getting a product that you like. This is what's so crazy to me too, with like all the bakery drama. And I don't know why it's bakeries, but all these bakeries that are like, I'm not going to make a cake for a gay couple.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Why are people so fucking weird?

[Mikayla]

I don't know. This is interest. This is sort of like the inverse of the gay cake.

[Morgan]

I know. It's kind of the exact opposite.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. There's a part of me that's like, okay, if I were marrying a woman and the cake person I hired were homophobic, I guess I'd want to know because then I wouldn't give that person money. But at the same time, if I don't, if I don't know and I never know and I have a lovely time and the cake is beautiful and I go on my merry way, like that's okay as well, you know, I don't know. I'm not religious anymore, so it's hard to relate to this. I could understand, I guess a tiny bit being like, there would be more meaning if this were painted by someone who shared the faith that they're painting. Sure. But you can't get mad like that. That's not the expectation here. You're hiring an artist for a job. They did a beautiful job. It means what it means to you.

[Morgan]

That.

[Mikayla]

And that's what counts.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And I feel like if you're the one that you have a preference. Right. Like you want your art created by someone who shares the fate as you. You should go out and you should ensure that you could have asked that artist up front. You could have gone and found a nun who does art.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And like that is even more magical and spiritual for you to have the nun make your painting.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Put out like an inquiry through your church, Put a little flyer up at your church, do something like that. If, if you want that kind of meaning on what you're commissioning, then that could be lovely. But just make sure you're the one who's taking care of that. If I want, you know, to buy from a women owned business, I can do my own research and find a woman owned business. Like that is on the person hiring the other person. If you're getting hired for a job, you're just doing the job. Yeah. You know, that's how I feel too.

[Morgan]

I think that's like the Best way to put it, like, if you have those preferences, you should go out and, like, ensure that and ask the questions up front. Yeah, Almost like the same with the plastic surgery. Like, if the guy would have been like, hey, I have these hard preferences, like, I don't want to date anyone with. Yeah, a breast augmentation. Then it's like, oh, well, I'm. I'm out then. Like, it was great to meet you. Bye. Yeah, like, I guess if you have these strong preferences and guidelines, like, you should be disclosing that versus putting the blame on the other people.

[Mikayla]

I think that makes a lot of sense.

[Morgan]

Yeah. Top comment on this one. Not the asshole. You don't discriminate, but apparently they do. Laughing my ass off. OP responds. Okay, this made me laugh a little bit. Thank you. Next comment down. It's true, though. If he wanted an artist creating it with faithful intentions, he should have said so during negotiations. I'm baptized and used to be quite active in the church. However, I'm an atheist and might look Christian to others, but I'm not. If I made something like this, it wouldn't have been with faithful intentions either. That's a very specific intention you can't just assume someone will fulfill without speaking up.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Mikayla]

If you want holy water, you gotta find a priest. You know, you can't just be buying water from the farmer's market and getting mad that it's not holy. I don't know if that.

[Morgan]

How do you even guarantee you're getting holy water? Someone could just bottle it up.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Morgan]

It's the same with the bathwater. All these weirdos buying people's bath water. Yeah.

[Mikayla]

And again, it's like, it's not a bad thing to have a preference and to be like, I would really like to find somebody who shares this same value with me to create this thing for me. That's okay. Like, that's not this horrible feeling to have. But then it's on you to find somebody who shares that. And then you can't get mad when you've already paid someone and they've already done the work. And then, uh, oh, like now you find that out because you just asked, what's your favorite scripture like? Uh.

[Morgan]

Oh, I know.

[Mikayla]

I'd be like, John 3:16.

[Morgan]

I know. Isn't that the one, like, Tim Tebow put on everything for God so loved.

[Mikayla]

The world that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believed in him shall not perish, would have everlasting life.

[Morgan]

Really sticks with you. Huh?

[Mikayla]

Yes. I went to like church camp and you win points for your cabin if you memorize the most verses. So. Wow, there's my memories there.

[Morgan]

The only thing I like know is like this bedtime prayer that like, even though I'm like, not really religious now, it's. It's like a Pavlov. Like if, if I remember. Yeah, I have to say it. Otherwise, like, I can't fall asleep.

[Mikayla]

Wow.

[Morgan]

Now I write, now I lay down, sleep, whatever.

[Mikayla]

I pray to God my soul to keep.

[Morgan]

She just watched me through the night until I wake in morning light.

[Mikayla]

I've heard a lot of variations of that same lullaby, by the way.

[Morgan]

I just like, I am just so. I don't know. And that's like.

[Mikayla]

Because the other version I know is I don't know. And if I die before I wake, I pray to God my soul to take.

[Morgan]

Yeah, no, I don't say that version. I. I knew that version and that felt a little dark for me because it was like almost like a manifestation. I'm like, I'm not going there. Keep me down here.

[Mikayla]

All right, we're on his side again. Not. Not discussing disclosing.

[Morgan]

Okay, well, let's see if I can give us one where disclose is needed.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, that's important because there are times, like there are times we should be disclosing things. Look at your mischievous grip.

[Morgan]

I know. I have so many saved for this theme, you guys. So there will be a Patreon episode with similar vibes in August as well. This episode is brought to you by HelloFresh. Spring is here and wow, has it been busy. I've been doing lots of yard work, wedding planning, starting a new podcast, and I don't really have a lot of time for meal planning, grocery shopping and then also cooking. Which is why I love HelloFresh. They take so many steps of having a good, delicious meal out of the equation. For me, HelloFresh makes meal times easy. They deliver fresh produce, seasonal snacks and treats, and delicious recipes straight to my door. And they even have ready made meals. These are chef crafted dishes that are ready to eat in three minutes and you're not sacrificing on taste, health or quality. Now this is right up my alley. Feel great with meals that fit your spring schedule and make the season even more delicious. Go to hellofresh.com hot takes 10fm now to get 10 free meals with a free item for life. One per box with active subscription free meals applied as discount on first box. New subscribers only. Varies by planning. This episode is brought to you by ebay. We all have that piece. The one that's so you. You've basically become known for it. And if you don't yet fashionistas, you'll find it on ebay. That Miu Miu red leather bomber, the cousteau Barcelona cowboy top. Or that Patagonia fleece in the 2017 colorway. All these finds are all on ebay, along with millions of more main character pieces backed by authenticity guarantee. Ebay is the place for pre loved and vintage fashion. Ebay things people love. Okay, this is coming from Am I the Again, just an Am I the asshole Day apparently. And it is titled Am I the asshole? If I report the couple's therapist that married my ex boyfriend a year after our sessions with her.

[Mikayla]

Wait, I literally have a friend who went to a couple's therapist with her husband and the therapist like got a crush on my friend's husband but they like, like he wasn't about it. But yeah.

[Morgan]

Oh my God, this could have been them.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Or it was like their marriage counselor. Like there's like something for before the marriage like I don't know. Anyway.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I wonder if this is a really common thing. Chime in you guys.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

In 2017, I, female, 25, saw a couple's therapist with my then boyfriend, male, 36. After three sessions with her, I refused to return due to her blatant flirtatious behavior and extremely judgmental attitude towards me, which my ex boyfriend called me delusional for pointing out she had told me that I seemed too immature, not ready for therapy or a serious relationship. The whole thing was focused on my ex boyfriend and his complaints about me. She never asked about my feelings or perspective in the relationship. We broke up about two months after the sessions, but I stayed living with my ex boyfriend until November. Once I moved out, I had to return to our old apartment to get mail. This was in December and that was the first time I saw the therapist with my ex. They happened to be getting ready to go out on his motorcycle and were both wearing full face motorcycle helmets. But I knew from her body type and hair that it was her along with my instincts which suspected something was going on the whole time. But nevertheless I moved on with my life. I just found out yesterday my ex got married due to a friend telling me about a photo he posted on Facebook. The photo was of him and my ex therapist celebrating their one year anniversary. I found her Facebook with the name change and sure enough they got married September of 2018 or earlier. That's just when she posted the Wedding photos. This was less than a year after the breakup with me and my ex and barely over a year after our sessions with her ended. I'm considering filing a complaint with the American Counseling Association. My friends and mental health counselors I know say I have enough evidence. I am not upset that my ex moved on. So have I. I thank the universe every day that I am no longer with that narcissist. I, however, I feel deeply disturbed to find out he married our therapist. Especially remembering all the harmful stuff she said to me in the sessions, which, to be honest, really messed with my head. I fear of coming off as a bitter ex. Am I the asshole?

[Mikayla]

This is crazy. Wait, there are two situations here. Like, possibilities. Like, I know, was he seeing the therapist before he brought.

[Morgan]

And that's her.

[Mikayla]

To her. Yeah. Or did it happen, like, over the course of the sessions? Because to tell a client, like, you aren't mature enough for therapy, like, that's.

[Morgan]

Why you go to therapy, to work on yourself.

[Mikayla]

That is, there was already some, like, animosity there.

[Morgan]

Diabolical.

[Mikayla]

One thing to, you know, develop a crush on somebody and to maybe see them in a little bit more of a. A golden light. But then to have such negativity toward the current girlfriend, I would more so be like, oh, I feel guilty about feeling this way if I'm developing a crush. Which is why it leads me more to feel like something was already going on.

[Morgan]

I'm. I'm very curious. And his defending of the therapist, too, kind of points to that direction.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Because after three sessions, why are you defending this stranger versus me, your partner, who you're seemingly trying to work on things with?

[Mikayla]

Right. And how would this therapist have fallen for him so quickly in three sessions, but also have been acting like this kind of from the first one. Like, is he really that handsome? I don't know about that.

[Morgan]

I know. How do you meet someone after that short amount of time? And, like. Or you have such a three sessions an hour each, and you're like, I'm gonna target her because I want him for myself. Yeah. And it happened in what it sounds like all the sessions.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Especially the last two. So it's like, you met him, you had 60 minutes with this guy, and then we're like, I'm gonna go for him.

[Mikayla]

He's mine.

[Morgan]

Mine.

[Mikayla]

That's my king. Yeah. I. I don't think that there would be anything wrong with reporting this, because I do feel that one of, like, the key foundations of being a therapist would be, like, separating your own personal emotions from from the help that you give other people and the advice that you give them. And like, I mean you're leading people down roads and they're trusting that you are a professional and you know what you're doing. And like that, that can put people in very dangerous situations to be like, oh no, he's doing amazing. And like, you actually have things you need to be like, like she's still questioning herself years later because it's like I went to a professional and this is what they told me.

[Morgan]

I know, I'm very curious what the timeline is. Yeah, I'm very curious. Also the requirements for her license and dating patients afterwards. I know for me as an ot, you had to wait six months after seeing a patient and then you could legally date them.

[Mikayla]

Okay.

[Morgan]

I think mental health providers, it's different. It might be longer. If you're a mental health provider out there, please chime in in the comments. I'm just googling to see like what I can find online on some of the sources I'm seeing. Mental health professionals generally cannot date current patients due to ethical and legal guidelines that protect patient well being. After therapy ends, there is a waiting period before a therapist can date a former patient, which varies, but is typically at least two to five years.

[Mikayla]

Wait, this two to five years is like a really long time.

[Morgan]

But I understand it because like there.

[Mikayla]

Is such a power dynamic as well. I mean it's like dating your boss, but maybe even more like more of a power dynamic between a therapist and yeah, I, I, anyone can fall in love. So like that's tough. Like people wait, this happened all married at first sight. One of the experts who like matches up the couples ended up marrying one of the people that they messed up. One of the guys that they met matched up. It was so I think it was in one of the earlier seasons too.

[Morgan]

Oh my God.

[Mikayla]

But she was like removed from the show because of it.

[Morgan]

Wow.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Okay, so I'm on GoodRx and apparently varies by state therapist license. All of that jazz. Per the American Psychological Association, a psychologist can't date a patient for at least two years and the ACA has a five year waiting period after therapy has ended. And so OP wrote in about a complaint with the American Counseling Association. So aca. So five years then based on what I'm seeing from a quick Google.

[Mikayla]

Do we know if it's different if like they only had one session and they like met and they were like, oh, actually I don't know if I should see you as a therapist.

[Morgan]

I wonder. I Don't think that would matter.

[Mikayla]

Right.

[Morgan]

Like, I feel like patient is patient.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

The Goodrx, like, article on this whole thing does say this, though. Even then, a therapist must demonstrate that the relationship is not exploitative to avoid legal issues.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I mean, I think that that's like, an important law to have in place because again, that's so. I mean, it's almost like grooming could take place in that scenario because you are going to this person. Their word is sort of like up to heaven to you, and you really trust them, and you, like, trust them with your. With your mind.

[Morgan]

I know this is apparently a common issue. This whole article is titled can you date your therapist? No, and here's why. And essentially, it's just, like, it's normal to develop intimate feelings for your therapist.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But a therapist dating their client is unethical and in many states, against law. And I think exactly as you said, like, you're in this vulnerable position. They could be telling you things almost like grooming. Like, it could be that, like, subconscious coercion to where you think you're getting the help you need, but it's actually them manipulating you, which, like, you. How, in what ethical world could you ever date a patient? Like, you can't. Like, I kind of, as this thing says, like, you really shouldn't.

[Mikayla]

And it's so understandable to develop a crush because it's like, you become so intimate with this person. You're sharing so much of yourself with them. Like, you're. You're bear to them about all these things that you maybe are scared to talk about with anybody else. Yeah. So, you know, it's not on the patient to, like.

[Morgan]

Like, it's.

[Mikayla]

They've done something wrong if they develop feelings for their therapist. It has to be on the therapist to draw that line.

[Morgan]

I agree. That's, like, one thing I feel like if things are really bad, you should disclose. That's that one Facebook page. Like, are we dating the same guy? I know. Like, there's some issues with it a little bit. It can get a little about that recently.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But, like, if there's someone you go on a date with that is truly just horrendous and scary. Like, you should disclose that like this. You should absolutely disclose.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Like, there are both elements of it of, like, her being a bad therapist because those feelings got confused and, like, kind of messing with this girl. But then there's also, like, is this an okay dynamic between him and her? And then if she actually was dating him before, then that's A different ethical issue then it's like abusing your power in a completely different way.

[Morgan]

Yeah, no, I definitely think she. She needs to report 100%. Disclose.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, disclose that.

[Morgan]

Disclose. So there is a comment here. Hi, I'm a therapist. All caps. Please report her.

[Mikayla]

Wow.

[Morgan]

Her behavior is ridiculously unethical. And who knows what else she has done or if she even should be allowed to practice. Not the Times a Million edit. I gotta say, I'm loving this veritable Greek chorus of therapists showing up to chant, report her. Report her. Opie, if you see this, please don't feel like you're obligated to report her. You do what you need to do to find peace and closure. All right. But that's true. Like, I think someone who's willing to do this to a client, a patient, also could be messing with people.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Just to mess with people and, like, assert control or power.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Which is scary.

[Mikayla]

It's not safe to have someone in such a position of, like, influence over people.

[Morgan]

Yeah. Because she might not want to steal the next man, but she could still, like, target someone in such a. A bad way and someone who is vulnerable. Like, even Op said, like, this really messed with my head. So someone who isn't abiding by their ethical code and moral guidelines as a provider, which is so important, shouldn't provide.

[Mikayla]

Mm. Disclose. Wow.

[Morgan]

This.

[Mikayla]

That's crazy. I wish we knew, though. I wish we knew if they just somehow fell in love over those sessions or if this was before. I wonder, like, which is worse. I almost feel like the conspiring would be worse of, like, oh, we're going to make her feel crazy, dude.

[Morgan]

If they were talking before and planned that, and that was like, oh, I don't want to break up with her. Well, I'll end it for you.

[Mikayla]

Right?

[Morgan]

And it's like, they go to therapy then in hopes of, like, oh, that's so. Ooh, that's the worst that's crazy scenario.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

So we do have a little bit of an update.

[Mikayla]

You're lying.

[Morgan]

We've had enough.

[Mikayla]

Is it Christmas? Like, wait, what the hell?

[Morgan]

Wow. Thank you, everyone, for your sponsors. I realize that as the ex, it's pretty much impossible for it to not seem like, I'm jealous, petty, bitter, whatever you want to say. However, it is also impossible to have sat in those sessions and then see your therapist and ex, get married and have zero feelings about it, regardless of having moved on. Please give me a break. I'm human. Anyways, I've made my decision. I'm not going to participate in this post anymore, but I sincerely thank those of you that made meaningful contributions. So one of my friends has basically taken it upon herself to investigate the therapist. I swear, she should be in the FBI. Lol.

[Mikayla]

That's so important. Okay.

[Morgan]

I love that she found out that this is the third last name that this woman has practiced psychotherapy with under the first last name. In 2014, she was charged with a DUI with property damage. She also comes up on health grades with five one star reviews and an overall three star rating. Essentially, what this new information does for me is confirm that she has been a shitty human being with shitty morals for quite some time. There's no way this is the first time she has caused undue harm to a client. Therefore, I can say with certainty that I am reporting.

[Mikayla]

Awesome. Awesome. Mm. Wait, everything's kind of like, going our way this episode. Like, the girl left that guy. She's reporting this therapist. They're letting us know about these things. This is awesome.

[Morgan]

Unless we're, like, really off with our takes and then, like, you guys are gonna have to let us know because, you know, it takes a village sometimes.

[Mikayla]

No. And also, love that FBI friend. Like, community is so important.

[Morgan]

The people that can sleuth. Like, I have a friend that can, like, sleuth like this and has, like, multiple times, like, found out that, like, a guy she met and was, like, going on dates with, like, had a secret girlfriend. And, like, well, that should be disclosed. I'm absolutely. I just, like, I don't understand how people have the time. Like, I barely have enough time to, like, have fun friends and, like, get out of my house. And, like, how do people have time to date multiple.

[Mikayla]

Multiple people I don't even know, even in a casual sense. That's not something I've ever been good at doing.

[Morgan]

No, like, if you're early on and not exclusive, like, yeah, go on a couple dates a week with different people.

[Mikayla]

Oh, yeah, you absolutely can. I'm just saying, I have never been able to, like, handle that.

[Morgan]

It takes stamina for sure. But if you're exclusive and you're like, seeing the same person a couple times a week.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

How?

[Mikayla]

Tinder. Swindler. That was crazy.

[Morgan]

What was that one?

[Mikayla]

That was the guy who was, like, on a Netflix show and he was, like, swindling money from all these women, but he had such intense relationships with them.

[Morgan]

Oh, my God.

[Mikayla]

And he was like, I work for, like, the FBI and, like, dude, that's.

[Morgan]

Like the seniors and, like, even people. My mom's Age that are like, oh, my God, Brad Pitt messaged me. He needs 5,000. And I'm like, brad Pitt's not messaging you.

[Mikayla]

Brad Pitt's not real. He never was.

[Morgan]

Like, Zendaya does not need to 2000 for a dress. Like, oh, my God, she's got law.

[Mikayla]

Even when I was in, like, high school, there was a lot more success with catfishing at that time. I def. I had a catfish. I catfished one of my boyfriends into cheating on me with her just to prove it.

[Morgan]

Michaela, wow. We're disclosing all sorts of things today.

[Mikayla]

I was like, you know what? I don't think he's that loyal to me.

[Morgan]

Who did you. Whose pictures did you steal?

[Mikayla]

Some, like, Internet girl. I was, like, 16.

[Morgan]

You know, this is why you have people that use your pictures and catfish others now. This is the karma that you got. This is the karma.

[Mikayla]

But I just like, well, it was. I didn't. I only, like, had a profile picture for her, so I only had, like, a profile picture. And I was like, oh, my God, like, you're so cute. And he was like, wait, you're so cute. And I was like. And. And then I.

[Morgan]

You're funny.

[Mikayla]

I think I didn't break up with him. I think he was like, oh, no. Like, my friends and I just, like, saw that, and we knew it was so obviously fake, and we thought it'd be funny to entertain it. And I was like, I. Like, I. I revealed myself too soon.

[Morgan]

Shoot. Shoot.

[Mikayla]

Whatever. Who among us hasn't?

[Morgan]

That's. I've never catfished anyone. Never. Never. Unless you call whitening my teeth in photos catfishing.

[Mikayla]

To be fair, like, the catfishing only lasted, like, five messages.

[Morgan]

Oh, well, okay. You were 16.

[Mikayla]

Probably, like, around that.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I'll give you a break. I'll give you a break.

[Mikayla]

I'd do it again.

[Morgan]

Okay, we do have one final comment from OP Ooh. Definitely a huge thank you to all the therapists showing up to support me. And also, thank you for adding that last bit. I just updated the post with the new information I have about her character. I'm definitely reporting this woman should not be a therapist. I hope that she really did find her true love for my ex and that it will be worth it for her. Really, I do. But she should not be trusted by another vulnerable person ever again.

[Mikayla]

I do feel like having all those therapists comment that must have been really validating for OP and, like, help them feel like, okay, this is the right choice.

[Morgan]

I know. It helped me.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Especially because I think some people by the sounds of her first edit came in, like, you're just jealous, you're better, you're jealous. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like I would then start to feel like, wow, I'm way off base here.

[Mikayla]

Like, and it's a big thing to like report somebody. Like I, I, it would take a lot. Like even giving someone a bad review on Google. Like I feel very guilty about doing that and would only do it under like this was a really, really bad situation bordering dangerous. Yeah, you know, like I, I think it's normal to feel very guilty and like nervous about doing that. But then yeah, if it's like endangering the safety of others and like this is somebody who really shouldn't be in this or like sometimes that that's what needs to be done, I think.

[Morgan]

So I, this feels totally justifiable. Yeah, totally justifiable. This next one is coming from Am I the Asshole? Two months old, titled Am I the Asshole for using my friend's nail clippers and kind of screwing things up with his girlfriend.

[Mikayla]

Oh, take me on this journey.

[Morgan]

It is a journey, my friends. So this got way more dramatic than I expected. And now I'm not sure if I actually did something wrong or if this is just completely blown out of proportion. I, 30, male, was house sitting for my friend Tom, 32, male, for a few days while he and his girlfriend were out of town visiting her family. It wasn't a huge deal. I've done it before. I was feeding his cat, watering his plants, bringing in his mail. He told me I could crash there if I wanted to and to help myself to whatever. On the second morning I was there, I noticed I had a nasty split nail on my thumb. Like one of those deep ones that keeps snagging on stuff. Of course I didn't pack my own nail clippers and I didn't want to leave it, so I figured I would just use his. Not a huge deal, right? I've known the guy for 10 years. We've literally shared food and beers and stuff. It's not like I used his toothbrush. So I found the clippers in his bathroom drawer, used them once just on my thumb. Not like I went on a foot trimming spree. Ran them under hot water, wiped them off and put them back where I thought they went. Anyways, a couple of days after he gets back, he texts me, hey, did you use my nail clippers? I said, yeah, sorry, had a split nail, cleaned them after, figured it was fine. He says, quote, okay, but then a Little later he calls me and goes, quote, so now there's kind of a problem.

[Mikayla]

What?

[Morgan]

Turns out his girlfriend noticed they weren't where she left them. Question mark, question mark, question mark, and asked if he used them. He hadn't. But instead of just saying it was me, he says he didn't know who used them, which now makes it sound like someone broke in or snooped around the bathroom while they were gone. She's apparently super germ conscious and now she doesn't want to stay over until the bathroom has been deep cleaned. She's creeped out. I told him, dude, just tell her it was me. It's not like I was going through her stuff. I used one clipper, cleaned it and left. He says no, because now he's already lied and if he comes clean, it'll be a whole thing and she'll think he's gross for not caring that someone used them. So now I'm weirdly trapped in this lie he made up, even though I offered to tell her myself. I get that I didn't ask at first, but I genuinely didn't think nail clippers were that personal. I didn't touch anything else, didn't damage them, didn't even mention it because I figured it was a non issue. But now apparently I've, quote, violated trust and there's this whole narrative that I disrespected their space and now she's mad at him and everything's tense. Am I the asshole for using the clippers or for pushing him to just tell her the truth? I feel like this all went way off the rails over something super minor.

[Mikayla]

I'm so confused about this. I mean, first of all, having a brain where you would even notice that the nail clippers are in a slightly different place from where you left them. I can't imagine being that, like, organized in my head.

[Morgan]

I wish I was that organized.

[Mikayla]

That's amazing. But did she not know that he was house sitting at all? And also, why is it like a lot so this guy was like, I don't know who used them. Why would it allow to be like, oh, I found out who used them?

[Morgan]

That's what I'm like, dude, I'm so confused about this. Why are you making your own issue like this is a non issue. You're making it an issue by just not communicating.

[Mikayla]

And wouldn't like, wouldn't she know someone was house sitting? And maybe that would be the first assumption. So she thinks someone broke in and.

[Morgan]

Used the nail clippers.

[Mikayla]

And used the nail clippers.

[Morgan]

But nothing else is missing.

[Mikayla]

So I, like, she's a germaphobe.

[Morgan]

I. I wonder if she, like, genuinely has, like, contamination ocd.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Which is really bad. And, like, that's difficult.

[Morgan]

That's tough to work, to work through.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, yeah. And then. Yeah. Especially if you actually think someone broke into your house but, like, didn't take.

[Morgan]

Anything that's just used the nail clippers.

[Mikayla]

I mean, you never know why someone might be breaking the. Maybe they were canvassing.

[Morgan]

That is true. And I've had a couple cases on clues where the serial killers would, like, break in before or like, that was the start of their stuff. And they would, like, ransack houses and, like, eat people's ice cream and then, like, not steal anything.

[Mikayla]

Everyone who's listening is gonna start getting so paranoid about things being in, like, a slightly different place or, like, so, sorry, did I eat all my ice cream?

[Morgan]

Like, I know. Yeah.

[Mikayla]

I'm just. This seems like a very easily fixed communication issue, which is why I'm so confused by this. Like, why does he think she would be mad at him being like, oh, it was my friend. Sorry, I don't.

[Morgan]

That's what I'm confused about too, because I think the initial answer, like, oh, I don't know, it slips your brain.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

That's not a lie. But then it's like, oh, you. You ask your buddy, he did use them. You say, hey, babe. Actually, I figured it out. It was just tomorrow I asked him since, you know, he was cat sitting for us and Tom used them instead.

[Mikayla]

Of, like, letting her think someone broke into the house.

[Morgan]

Way worse. Way worse. If you're like, putting the two on a scale, like, I'd rather someone use my nail clippers versus someone broke in and went through our stuff.

[Mikayla]

Absolutely. And that's the only thing he used. At first I was like, why is he using their nail clippers but split like, split nail. Absolutely.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Mikayla]

I mean, you see that coming, you gotta get ahead of it. Something bad could happen.

[Morgan]

I just. I felt it too, when he was like, you know, it snags on stuff. I'm like, oh, yeah. No, quick fix, quick fix. I am curious if you think if you're house sitting for someone and like, you use something, do you have to disclose, like, everything? Like, hey, Mikayla, I actually, I used your can opener and then I needed a Q tip, so I took a Q tip and then. No, I. I did wipe my ass. So you are a little lower on toilet paper now.

[Mikayla]

I would never expect any of that. Maybe there are people with different opinions on nail clippers though. I don't know. I personally don't care because my fingernails are generally quite clean. And like, I don't think you could.

[Morgan]

Also just soak your clippers in some alcohol.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I. I know. I don't think I would. If I ate someone's food, I might be like, oh, by the way, like, you might need to refill the cheez. Its cause a hurricane came.

[Morgan]

But.

[Mikayla]

But yeah, no, I don't think that you need to disclose stuff like that.

[Morgan]

I think if you have someone that's coming into your house to do you a favor, like watch your pet water your plants, like, I think they can have a couple beverages and I would probably ask some snacks.

[Mikayla]

I would probably be like, hey, is it okay if I use this? But again, I would. I wouldn't feel offended by someone doing it.

[Morgan]

I know. Well, especially when the guy I just like, looked up and read too. His friend did tell him, like, you could crash there if you wanted and to help yourself to whatever.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. If someone's sleeping over at your house. Like, I generally prepare a lot of things for guests, but then it's also like. And anything else that I have forgotten to specifically provide you with, like, feel free to ask or like, use whatever foods in the kitchen, use whatever tools, use anything.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

You know, this is so weird.

[Morgan]

I don't know why people are so scared to have like basic conversations with their partners. Yeah, because also on the flip side, like, if I were her, I'd be annoyed that my partner's lying to me over something so silly. Yeah, no, I mean, and then making me spiral more.

[Mikayla]

How are we gonna handle big conversations?

[Morgan]

Literally?

[Mikayla]

Very weird. Are people in the comments also confused about why he won't just say this? Because I need, like, I feel like I'm missing something almost.

[Morgan]

So the top comment on this one, Tom put himself in this situation by line and his girlfriend is super weird for wanting the entire bathroom deep cleaned over a pair of clippers. She obviously doesn't know you stayed there because, gasp, you might have sat on the toilet and took a shower and maybe even used a towel. Colin Hazmat, not the asshole.

[Mikayla]

Okay, so is. Is the lie actually that he doesn't want to tell his girlfriend a friend stayed there because of her contamination anxiety.

[Morgan]

Which is kind of what the next comment in response to that one says.

[Mikayla]

Okay.

[Morgan]

Right. Like it sounds like there must be a bigger lie Tom is covering up. Yeah, but then who did you think was taking care of your cat and your plants? Right?

[Mikayla]

Right. Maybe she thought that he hired someone and they weren't using any of, like, like, staying there or whatever. But I would just be like, yeah, we have to have a conversation about this. Like, I needed someone to watch the cats. My friend was willing to do it for free as a favor to me. He probably used some stuff, but I know you struggle with contamination anxiety, so let's have some cleaners come. Like, that's fine.

[Morgan]

And this is something we kind of see a lot in these Reddit stories, where, like, people lie about the smallest things. And it's like, if you're willing to lie about the small things, how can I trust you with big things? Yeah, you shouldn't have to disclose nail clipper use, and it shouldn't be a big deal. And she's coming from a place of, like, probably does have OCD or something. Yeah, like, severe germaphobe. And that's, you know, that's tough. That's a battle she has to work with. But, like, you don't need to make it worse by lying.

[Mikayla]

Oh, my God.

[Morgan]

Wait.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I feel that her anxiety would get so much worse now, finding out that, like, actually he does have people come to the house, but, like, doesn't just tell her that that's the case.

[Morgan]

Yeah, because then she could probably set boundaries and be like, okay, they can come and stay and take care of the cat and the plants, but can they stay out of our room?

[Mikayla]

But now she's probably like, oh, I need to clean everything before I use it, because he's not gonna tell me. If someone came to the house and.

[Morgan]

She doesn't know what got touched.

[Mikayla]

Y.

[Morgan]

If the nail clippers got touched, everything else probably got touched.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, everything.

[Morgan]

So it's like, you're making it worse by not just being an adult.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

It's so weird. People are fully convinced that Tom is lying about having people stay there and stuff like that. I'm gonna go look at the account, see if we ever get any updates from op. No updates. Only one comment. It is a newer relationship, so I've only met her a handful of times. That's why I wanted to just tell the truth, because I'd hate to mess something up with Tom.

[Mikayla]

So she doesn't live there?

[Morgan]

It doesn't sound like it. Okay, if it's newer, I would assume. No, if it's newer.

[Mikayla]

I just think this is something that having a conversation and having clear communication would be so beneficial for, like, her being. Being very clear about her boundaries of, like, hey, I know this isn't typical, but this is Something I've struggled with my whole life. And like, I'm trying to get better about it and it hasn't gotten better. But, you know, if you have other people in the bathroom, like, could you let me know and I'll just like clean it before I use it or like, things like that. Like, there has to be working together in order for this to work. And he doesn't seem willing to do that.

[Morgan]

No, I know, but.

[Mikayla]

No, you don't need to disclose.

[Morgan]

You don't need to disclose on that one. But this next one, we'll see. We'll see.

[Mikayla]

This episode is brought to you by Lifelock. When you visit the doctor, you probably hand over your insurance, your ID and contact details. It's just one of the many places.

[Morgan]

That has your personal info.

[Mikayla]

And if any of them accidentally expose it, you could be at risk for identity theft. LifeLock monitors millions of data points a second.

[Morgan]

If you become a victim, they'll fix.

[Mikayla]

It, guaranteed or your money back.

[Morgan]

Save up to 40% your first [e-mail] podcast terms apply. Okay, I'm ready for your story now.

[Mikayla]

Oh my gosh, I'm so excited to share this with you for the first time ever. Okay, this is coming from a different place. It's r relationship advice. And it's 31 days old.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Mikayla]

Not too new, not too old.

[Morgan]

I like it.

[Mikayla]

Okay, how do I tell my friend that he'll never date an influencer like girl. Hi, everyone. This is a sensitive topic and I want to approach it as respectfully and compassionately as possible. I, 27 male, have a friend, also 27 male, whom I've known since our freshman year of college. He's never really dated, at least not that I'm aware of. And he never seemed particularly interested in pursuing anyone seriously. He'd occasionally mention girls, but it was always in a vague or surface level way. Two years ago, I broke up with my long term girlfriend and re entered the dating world. That's been a whole journey of its own. But that's another story. Since then, he's started talking more about dating and women. I think he now feels like we're in the same boat. And honestly, I'm glad he's opening up more. Here's where I'm struggling. My friend is an amazing person. Funny, smart, thoughtful, a great cook, and he has a solid job. But on a purely superficial level, he's not conventionally attractive. Some people might even consider him ugly. When we were younger, that kind of thing might have mattered more. But now that I'm Dating again. I've realized how much broader and more complex attraction can be. At our age, there are so many different kinds of beauty, and what I find attractive has definitely evolved since I was 18. Unfortunately, my friend doesn't seem to see it that way. He only seems interested in women who look like Instagram influencers, very stereotypically hot, and being brutally honest, those types of women are typically looking for guys who match their aesthetic. And he just doesn't fit that mold. It's starting to really hurt his self esteem. Not dating is making him feel like he's worthless. I've tried to gently steer him toward more realistic and fulfilling possibilities. For example, a friend of a friend often compliments his cooking. I suggested he ask her over for a homemade dinner sometime and his response was, she's ugly. That really bothered me. At our age, I feel like we should be past this superficial mindset and actually see people for who they are. I don't want to shame him or be cruel, but I also don't want to sit back and watch him spiral because he's chasing an ideal that's not going to happen. He's not going to date or hook up with supermodel type women. That's just reality. And it's okay. There's someone out there for him, someone who will love him for who he is, but he's blocking those possibilities because of his narrow idea of what's attractive. How can I talk to him about this without sounding condescending or mean? I want to help him see his own worth without reinforcing unrealistic standards. Any advice would be appreciated.

[Morgan]

This is really tough. It seems like OP is coming from such a good place. I know at first I was like, like, damn, you're just calling your friend ugly like that. Which I still think I'm like, you in the same breath are saying, like, everyone is beautiful in their own way. But then you're still being like, but he's ugly, right? Yeah, I'm just like, I think you can just like, keep trying to be like, well, why don't you give so and so a shot? Like, why don't you open your mind a bit more? Like, yeah, you never know who you could end up really liking or falling in love with. Like, give it a shot. But other than that, let him find out the hard way.

[Mikayla]

I think this is a very tough position to be in. I. I don't know if it would be right to disclose also, like, people can date anybody. There are some very famous women, and I don't want to Shame. Any specific people. So I'm not gonna name exactly who those women are and who they're dating, but it's, it makes one stop and think. Yeah, there's like, like it technically could happen for him. I think the reason he's gotten to this point is just that like he isn't dating anyone and it's hurting his self esteem that he's been single for so long. But he also won't budge on this. Like they have, but the most important thing is them looking this very specific way.

[Morgan]

Yeah. Which is interesting. I mean, everyone's entitled to their attraction preferences.

[Mikayla]

Right.

[Morgan]

I think you could maybe give a little tough love. I wouldn't say, like, you'll never end up dating an influencer type model.

[Mikayla]

Like.

[Morgan]

Yeah, because never say never. Like never say never really. But I think you could be like, hey, you know what? Like, I think you're being a little closed minded.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Clearly you're unhappy being single and like something's got to give so why don't you consider some other people, maybe branch out. You never know who you're going to end up liking. Like, get some practice dating at the very least.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like, come on.

[Mikayla]

And I, I mean, I know this is the case for women especially. Like attraction changes so much over time and like, the more you get to know somebody, the more attractive they become and the more that you know about them. So maybe I would approach it from that angle of like, you know, there are people that like I've met and maybe upon my first meeting with them it was like, oh, this is just friends vibes. But then like something about them over time really grew on me and I think you've got too narrow of an expectation right now.

[Morgan]

Yeah, that's a good way to put it. Your expectations are too narrow. Cast your net a little wider otherwise you're not gonna see all the fish in the pond.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. So not disclose, but maybe like find ways around it.

[Morgan]

Encourage some expansion of the horizon. Yeah, yeah, I think that would be good. I mean, and at the end of the day, like you can say this and then he can choose to take the advice or not.

[Mikayla]

Right. And then he'll be alone.

[Morgan]

Probably won't.

[Mikayla]

And that sucks.

[Morgan]

And then you just gotta let him, let him do his thing. And like I, I know I have had like conversations with friends where like they kind of continue to have the same problem. And it's like you can only give your advice so much and if they take it, yay. If they don't, there's nothing you can do. About it.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And if it keeps coming up as an issue that they're constantly, you know, mentioning or complaining about or venting about or whatever, like, you then have the choice to, like, set that boundary where you're like, hey, you know what? I've heard about your dating quite a bit. We've had the conversation that maybe you should expand your horizons and, like, try dating other people. You're not willing to do that. I really don't want to keep hearing about this because it's. It's really. It's almost stressful for me. Yeah, like, can we talk about other. Other topics? Yeah, like, you can do that.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. I've given you my advice.

[Morgan]

Like, you don't want my advice, buddy. Yeah, that's hard because, like, we've all been in that situation with friends where it's like, you keep giving this friend advice and, like, they're not taking it and there's just nothing you can do. So at the end of the day, like, you then need to control what's good for your mental health. And if distancing yourself so you don't hear about those problems. Yeah, like, that's an option.

[Mikayla]

And especially if it's like, oh, my God, you're still complaining that you can't be with a supermodel.

[Morgan]

And, like, when you say it like that, like, damn.

[Mikayla]

Like, oh, my God, we have to be realistic, but we can't be mean about it. No, the top comment I really like, by the way.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. They say, I find that guys like this often aren't chasing something they find attractive. They're chasing approval by other guys. Ooh, they want a trophy wife. They want other men to see their insta model girlfriend as a status symbol. I think the best thing to do here would be to try and counteract that narrative in his head. Compliment women that are not conventionally attractive in front of him. If he calls someone ugly, say, no, she's not. She has a really pretty smile or whatever. Don't engage in any weird lusting over bombshell women behavior. If asked, empathize that social media isn't real, or dating a famous person must be super annoying, or that it looks like it requires a lot of upkeep. Hopefully if you model health. Damn, that's crazy. Hopefully, if you model healthy dating behaviors, he catches on and comes back down to earth a bit.

[Morgan]

That, Yeah, I mean, overall, it seems like a good tactic. Little bit of a Jedi mind trick, which I usually love. Yeah, I think that is, like, a good thing to point out too, because, like, he could be coming from just like, kind of a emotionally immature place. Like, you know, if he hasn't had dating experience or, like, he could look at Instagram and be like, what I'm seeing on Instagram.

[Mikayla]

Right.

[Morgan]

100. No Facetune there. Yeah. So, like, he could even have these unrealistic standards in his head. And, like, all he's seen is that. And so that's what he thinks he should get.

[Mikayla]

I know. Yeah. Because all of you with people that they're listing here, like Instagram models, supermodels, it's all, like, people that they do not know in the real world. Yeah. And I think you go on Instagram, you go on Tick Tock and, like, it kind of goes back to our conversation in the first story of, like, you think you have a different warped perspective of what the real world actually looks like. Yeah. And, like, you can go to an airport and there are thousands of people and there's not one person who looks like that sometimes. Like, it's really not the actual reality that we're living in.

[Morgan]

No. And there's so many people that are doing it right, being themselves, and then there's so many influencers that are, like, feeding into that really bad, toxic, like, ideal. And I think a great example is, like, I don't really follow her, but I saw a video of her the other day, and it's Olivia Ponton.

[Mikayla]

That sounds super familiar.

[Morgan]

I think there's, like, rumors about, like, her and Joe Burrows or something right now, but she posted a video and it just popped up and she's sitting there crying in the airport, like, she can't navigate the airport, which, hey, been there. That's real. And then she's, like, not wearing makeup, like, has a breakout. And I'm like, as someone who's having, like, the worst adult acne of my life, like, yeah. I'm, like, so relatable. There's no beauty filter on her video. And I'm like, I love to see that.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I love to see that.

[Mikayla]

That.

[Morgan]

That seems real. I love that. And then you have, like, other influencers that are, like, literally gymnasts and still facetuning their photos to make themselves even smaller.

[Mikayla]

And it's like, yeah, what?

[Morgan]

Why?

[Mikayla]

And, like, why? Yeah. And even, like, people who are preaching about, like, those types of things might still be FaceTuning their photos and, like, having these filters on. And, like, I'm not above. I. I use filters on sometimes. When I found out that what the TikTok Beauty Filter was, I found out about the TikTok Beauty Filter. A year ago, I was like, oh, this makes a lot of fucking sense. Because I have been scrolling my feed and being like, how are all of these people naturally appearing in the wild? This is shocking to me. And then I was like, I'm throwing that on a couple of videos too.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Mikayla]

I mean, I. I do like that on Instagram. It shows usually if there's like a filter on it. Yeah. But people just, like, they see that and now they find a workaround.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

Now they do something else.

[Morgan]

I know. And that's the part of the disclosure. It's.

[Mikayla]

It's tough. And. And it seems to be affecting all genders. Like, which makes sense. It makes sense that it would be like, okay, women are feeling insecure, men are. Their expectations are crazy. Like, you think that everybody out there is just looking like that? Like, that is not the real world.

[Morgan]

No.

[Mikayla]

So Op did reply to that first comment earlier and said, I think you are right with the trophy comment. You've put into words what I've been thinking for a time now. We all have insecurities. And his is this. Maybe he's looking for a way out of the insecurities using women instead of actually facing the root problem. And then.

[Morgan]

That's deep.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I know. This person's really thinking about it, and he used whom properly as well, which I really liked.

[Morgan]

Oh, my God. Justin would love that. Like, I don't know whom, whom, who, whatever. Who, who, who.

[Mikayla]

You just replace it with him or he and whichever one makes sense. Then, you know.

[Morgan]

No, it's like math. We're not. No, too hard.

[Mikayla]

And then he did say, because other people were like, wait for him to figure it out on his own. Yeah. He said the figuring it out on his own has been my approach for two years and it obviously hasn't worked. I'm writing this after an uncomfortable situation the other day in a bar where he basically made a fool of himself by making inappropriate jokes to a group of girls. I know he's a jerk, and I know I should not tolerate certain comments. I should start answering back immediately instead of after the fact.

[Morgan]

Yeah, maybe he'll learn, like this, some gentle parenting. But also, at the end of the day, like, you don't have to be his friend if, like, you know he's a jerk and you know he's shitty. Like, yeah, let him just keep doing his thing and being single and not finding someone that's going to be a good partner and cares for him and you go on and live your life. And I feel like, you can self aware King.

[Mikayla]

You can say, like, clearly holding out for an Instagram. Instagram model isn't working for you without having to explicitly say because you are not attractive enough.

[Morgan]

That's true. Like, that's true.

[Mikayla]

This method that you have of like waiting for a supermodel to come around and fall out of the sky, like, that's not happening. So why don't we try something else?

[Morgan]

Maybe he needs the tough love after now, knowing this has been two years.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like, it's no wonder OP is kind of going crazy. I'd be going crazy.

[Mikayla]

And like, making rude. Like, I don't know if this is saying that in the bar where he made a fool of himself by making inappropriate jokes to a group of girls means he was calling them ugly or if he was just being sexually inappropriate to girls who didn't want anything to do with him. It sounds like one of those two situations.

[Morgan]

I know I could see him being in a bar and being like, well, you're a five year four.

[Mikayla]

So at that point, that's when I'd be like, dude, like, bye.

[Morgan]

We've got like, yeah, and why not call him out?

[Mikayla]

Yeah, like, what?

[Morgan]

You're annoyed by the behavior. It's frustrating to be around. You haven't called him out. You haven't addressed it in the moment. Time to start. Otherwise, like, why even be friends with him?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

What's he offering? Sounds like he was a more jokes.

[Mikayla]

Compelling friend before he ever talked about dating.

[Morgan]

Literally. Like, literally. Well, that's all she wrote over there.

[Mikayla]

I guess we're kind of saying disclose a bit. Like disclose nicely.

[Morgan]

Disclose with tact.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, disclose with tact.

[Morgan]

And I think that's a general rule with all disclosures. Like, I hate the saying. Oh, well, I'm just brutally honest.

[Mikayla]

I hate that.

[Morgan]

No, you're just brutal.

[Mikayla]

Honesty isn't just like automatically moral.

[Morgan]

I know. And there's. There's more to that saying where it's like, honesty without tact is just cruelness or something like that. Like, there is a saying like that.

[Mikayla]

No, I think you said it before. It was like, honesty without kindness is this. And then kindness without honesty is something irresponsible.

[Morgan]

Something. Yeah, I'm like butchering my saying right now, but I think, like, if you're going to make a disclosure, it should be tactful, it should be kind. It shouldn't be, like, using it in a moment where like. And I've. Oh, my God, you guys. I've had to.

[Mikayla]

Oh, yeah. The moment that you choose to do it is so important.

[Morgan]

This is so important. Like, I've had just like some communication issues, like, with my dad lately and just like trying to like, find times to record his show. And like, we're both really busy, so there's gotta be a lot of give and take. And there's just like this, this thing that keeps coming up and I don't know how much I want to get.

[Mikayla]

Into the drama right now. Ooh, drama.

[Morgan]

But essentially, like, he isn't getting a plus one for the wedding just because of, like, issues regarding that. And so there was something that came up with, like, trying to find a recording date and like a thing being an issue. And I, in the moment just wanted to be like, this is exactly why you're not getting a plus one to the wedding. But I held it in.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And that's the reality.

[Mikayla]

Like, it's like, that could be the truth.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

But in this moment, it's going to be so emotionally charged and hurtful.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

Whereas if you approached it in a neutral environment without any kind of heated conversation going on, you could have potentially a conversation where you both come out of it having gained something.

[Morgan]

Exactly. And it's all, it's all about, like, the tact and the timing and it's like you want to be the most effective. It's not gonna be effective if you're super emotional or like the other person is coming from a weird place. Like, you have to really have a sit down conversation. And like, that's just life. Like, I'm not perfect. My family's not perfect. Like, that is life. And it's like, how do you address it? So, like, you do have the best time or the best relationship and, like, carry it forward. And so I almost feel like this.

[Mikayla]

Guy needs to address it before it accidentally comes out in like a heated moment. You know what I mean? It's so on his mind and been bothering him for years now where it's like I could easily see them getting into a fight and him just spluttering out. Well, you're ugly. And that's why no Instagram models want to date you. Or I don't know, you know, I know, I know.

[Morgan]

It's so hard knowing when and where and how to address certain things, but it's gotta be addressed.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And for sure, at the end of.

[Mikayla]

The day, like, disclose. But I don't think there's any situation in which you need to tell your friend, hey, you're not attractive.

[Morgan]

I agree.

[Mikayla]

I think that we had a similar story on a bonus episode. I Don't know if it's out yet.

[Morgan]

It will be.

[Mikayla]

It's like a. It's a very different perspective, which is fun.

[Morgan]

Yeah. It is kind of an inverse of.

[Mikayla]

It in a way.

[Morgan]

Yeah. It's a good story for sure.

[Mikayla]

It's just like we don't need to be humbling our friends with, like, mal intent in our hearts, but I don't think that this person was ever coming from that angle.

[Morgan]

It's just like, no, this person doesn't seem like he's a hater.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And I think that other story, it's very like that person was trying to humble their friend. And it's like, why are you friends with someone if you don't even like them? Yeah, I think that was that energy. Yeah, for sure. Okay, moving on. I've got a couple more for us. Support for this podcast and the following.

[Mikayla]

Message comes from America's Navy.

[Morgan]

The Navy offers new graduates, hands on training and experience in careers like computer science, aviation and medicine. Plus education and sign on bonuses. Parents help your grad start their career [e-mail]. okay, this one is so toxic. Ooh, so toxic. And it's very fresh. It is two days old. Coming from R. Off my chest titled My wife thinks we're soulmates. I think I settled.

[Mikayla]

Oh, if I take back my. Ooh.

[Morgan]

We've been together for nine years, married for six. She is kind, loyal, sweet, smart. She loves me deeply and she believes we were destined to meet. I treat her well. I've never cheated. We laugh together. On paper, we're perfect. But if I'm being honest, I've never been in love with her. I cared about her, yes, but I was heartbroken when we met. She came into my life when I needed stability and comfort, and I mistook that for love. I kept thinking it would grow. It never did. Now we're in our 30s. We talk about kids. She looks at me like I'm the best thing that ever happened to her. And I feel like a fraud. I don't want to hurt her. I don't want to blow up both of our lives. But every night I lie awake feeling like I stole the future of someone who could have had real, epic love. And I don't think I'll ever forgive myself for it. We.

[Mikayla]

I'm like, heartbroken. And that wasn't even that long. And, like, I feel so attached to the. I mean, yeah, like, she. She deserves someone who loves her.

[Morgan]

I know she.

[Mikayla]

Like, she deserves someone who looks at her the way she's looking at him.

[Morgan]

Oh, just. That's Twist the Knife. Sad.

[Mikayla]

I also, like, my fear is that the guy in the last story is gonna end up like, this guy of being like, oh, I think I settled. Like, I think I. I mean. I mean, this. This guy seems like he's potentially not coming from a negative place. It's. He's not. Like, she's ugly and I could do better. He's just saying, like, I. I've just never really been in love with her, which is really heartbreaking.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Mikayla]

Am I reading that right? Did he say anything?

[Morgan]

Yeah, no, he. He's literally said, like, I've. I was waiting for the feelings to grow. I. I thought it would come and never did. And it's just. It's sad because I think, you know, there's another post I saw, and I. I don't know if we'll get into it on this episode. Maybe we should. Maybe. Maybe we should. But it's about kind of, like, disclosing things. And it's just like, I think people do things out of obligation. Get married, have kids. It's. It's those societal pressures that are making it feel like that's what you should do, what you have to do.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And you don't have to do anything. And so for this guy, I feel like he was like, oh, well, she's nice, she's smart, she's sweet, she's loyal, have to propose. You know, we've been together so many.

[Mikayla]

Years, like, and she feels so confident that I'm the person she's supposed to be with. And, I mean, I have definitely felt this way in a few relationships of, like, I could fall in love with this person. I feel like this is someone who so many people could fall in love with. Like, they're. They're so wonderful. Like, they're. They're xyz, they're all of these things. But I don't feel that way about them. But, like, because they're so amazing, I'm sure that has to grow. Like, I'm sure that I would get there, and then, you know, it doesn't. And inevitably, I have to be like, all right, I guess that's not happening. But I can understand feeling like someone is so amazing that, like, you are bound to get there with them and, like, not wanting to let go of such an amazing person. But at a certain point, it's like, oh, it's really not happening for me. Like, I'm really not getting there, and I never have been.

[Morgan]

I know. And it's. It's crazy. That you would go nine years. It's crazy that you would propose and.

[Mikayla]

Right.

[Morgan]

That's what, like, really confuses me. And it's like, even out of obligation, like, that's a crazy thing to do out of obligation and societal pressure. Like, it honestly is scary because for her, it's not like she hasn't felt the love. Because if she hasn't felt love, Right. She probably would have ended it or, like, you know, moved on or not said yes to a proposal. So it's like, he's definitely displayed these things and he's faked it, which is, like. Like, honestly really selfish too. It's like, is that a psychopath kind of, like, behavior? Like, you know what I mean, where it's like, you're not even being real. Like, you're completely putting on this front, this Persona, this mask that, like, in your head you're like, I don't love her.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But if you ask.

[Mikayla]

But I'm gonna say the things. I'm sure his wedding vows were beautiful.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

You know, I mean, they're talking about kids. Yeah.

[Morgan]

They're talking about life and, like, growing old together. And it's like. Like, she's gonna feel like the rug got pulled out from her.

[Mikayla]

That's such a good point of, like. Of course, I think, as I was saying earlier, she, like, deserves to find somebody. But to hear now that your husband and a person you've been with of nine years, like, has not loved you this whole time, what mental damage does that do to you going into any relationship going forward and, like, trusting that people really feel the way about you that they're saying and, like. Like, just how many insecurities and, like, not trusting your own self will that now bring up? Is it almost better to just be like, I've fallen out of love with you, or I get like, damn, this actually is a hard conversation about disclosure because it's like we just were saying about honesty not always being fully the.

[Morgan]

Right thing to do is. I don't know what it is best.

[Mikayla]

Here to be completely honest about never being in love with someone, or will that just hurt them unnecessarily? Like, I think they. He should break up with her and, like, give her a chance to find someone.

[Morgan]

But this would.

[Mikayla]

This would really do a number.

[Morgan]

I know. I'm curious what you guys think as far as disclosure and honesty with this one. Like, I definitely think they need partial disclosure to get divorced.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

They both need to move on. Like, he. She really deserves the chance to find someone that loves her and so does he.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

You know, he did this for whatever reason. Weird, you know, reason in his head, but yeah. Do you say, I've never been in love with you or do you kind of like white lie, truth it where you're like, you know, as we've grown older, I just realize I want different.

[Mikayla]

Things and maybe call it a midlife crisis. I don't know, like, literally put it on you.

[Morgan]

I don't. I'm just not in love anymore. Like, I've noticed that my feelings have kind of changed and it has nothing to do with you. And like, Like, I don't know, like, I feel like you need like a therapist involved to prevent like the most damage. Like, you need to prevent as much damage as you can.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. I'm very curious about audience comments on this one because I. I'm unsure about what the right thing to do is.

[Morgan]

I know. And so it's like, you probably should involve a therapist. Like you yourself, dude should go to a couple sessions and be like, this is how I feel. How do I have this conversation and like, protect her feelings as much as I can? Because it seems like he wants to do that based on this write in. Like, I know this write in is like, it's obviously a shitty thing he's done, but it does seem like he's.

[Mikayla]

Like, he's not mal intentioned, but it was like, it's. It's pass. It's passive. Hurting somebody. It's passive. Like it's, it's selfish. It's taking the easy route and someone else's. The. What's it called when someone else gets hurt because of your actions?

[Morgan]

Like you're caught in the crossfire. Like, it's not.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, yeah, she's the collateral.

[Morgan]

Collateral.

[Mikayla]

She's the collateral of you just like passively not facing your own emotions and not. And not taking this seriously. But then. Yeah, again, then I'm like, maybe she should know the full truth. Because how do you fully, like, go back through it and heal from it and like, understand what happened if you're getting a different. Like, then she may be wondering, when did it change? Like, how did I not notice when it changed? Like, I don't know. Because it's gonna hurt no matter what.

[Morgan]

I think mentally, it would mess me up more if I found out that my husband never loved me. Because if I started dating again and like a person was showing me the same things proposed to me, which seemed like love, I'd be like, I can't trust anything.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like it's all fake and Then that.

[Mikayla]

Questioning of those relationships is going to cause those relationships to end. Because no one wants to be, like, questioned on their feelings for you all the time, you know?

[Morgan]

And that's something that, like, I've seen come up where it's like, my girlfriend does not trust what I tell her. And it's like, are you sure you love me? Are you sure you love me? Are you sure you love me? Do you love me? Do you love me? It's like, that can instill doubt in the other person that's being asked that constantly. So you do have to have that trust. So it's like, like, how do you allow her to move forward after this big bombshell? I'm curious if you guys think disclose on this one, maybe this is the poll we do on this episode. Because this is crazy, because he has.

[Mikayla]

Been doing what's easy for him this whole time, and the only thing that's right now is to make it as easy as possible for her in this breakup. Yeah. And I think that's fair. There's no way it's going to be easy. But, like, yeah, no.

[Morgan]

It'S so tough. It's so tough. I just, like, don't even know what to think of it. The other post I was thinking of that is super similar is also from, like, true off my chest. So same kind of, like, off your chest vibes. And it's titled I found my dad's secret Reddit account and now I can't look at him the same. I'm gonna read it on Patreon for you guys. But essentially it's kind of like this person found their dad's Reddit account that said similar things to this guy and.

[Mikayla]

Was just like, oh, I'm not in love with.

[Morgan]

I don't love my wife. I don't love my kids. And so this person's like, wait, I'm the kid? Like, you regret having me? Like, what?

[Mikayla]

Oh, that's so heartbreaking.

[Morgan]

So we'll get into that on Patreon, but I think it feeds into this when it feels really similar.

[Mikayla]

Oh, I'm subscribed to the Patreon immediately. That's crazy. I need to know.

[Morgan]

So OP has since removed the post.

[Mikayla]

Oh, wow.

[Morgan]

They themselves took it down. No moderator involvement here. And the top comment is, may this love never find me.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Which is literally what I was thinking as I read the post myself.

[Mikayla]

Nightmare. Like, worst nightmare. Yeah.

[Morgan]

That comment only has 694 upvotes right now. Like, it seems like this post has kind of flown under the radar A little bit. Next comment down to that is this. Went on a few dates with a guy recently. We were around the time things should start to get serious. He was perfect, but I had a weird feeling in my gut, so I told him I felt like I was the smart choice, but not the one that he wanted to make. Lo and behold, he told me that I tick every single box he could think of, and even the ones that he didn't know could be ticked. His words. And that's why he kept seeing me. But he feels nothing for me whatsoever.

[Mikayla]

Oh, my God.

[Morgan]

Why would you want someone like that for yourself and trick another person into it? I'll never understand people like OP I.

[Mikayla]

Do feel like this happens. I mean, there's that whole thing about, like, a lot of the time men will marry someone because of the timing in their life, being like, oh, like, this is now I'm ready to get married. So whoever's around is like, who I'll marry. And there's also kind of, like, a convenience aspect of having a wife that's, like, a little bit different. And I don't know. Like, I. I do think love can grow between two people in so many situations. And to, like, have this expectation that love could grow between you and somebody else, isn't that crazy? Like, arranged marriages happen in most of the world, and, like, amazing love grows out of that. But if you have this, like, feeling of, like, oh, this is really just the smart choice, like, you should disclose, like, I don't know.

[Morgan]

I know. Because there might be someone that just wants a relationship of convenience.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

They just want someone to, like, live together and have an emotional connection with on a basic platonic level. And, like, there are those relationships out there. Like, some people want that.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But they don't want anything physical or whatever. And, like, I don't know. I feel like OP doesn't necessarily know what he wants or who he. And, like, I don't. I want to be crystal clear. Like, I'm not saying this is necessarily OP I'm not saying OP could potentially be dangerous. I'm coming from a place right now of, like, I've recorded four Clues episodes this week, and, like, my brain is, like, very true crime. And I think there's, like, this crazy thing to me in a lot of the cases we have, especially serial killers that have families and kids.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And some of the most, like, notorious ones do. And so we just did the case of Dennis Raider, who gave himself the name btk, and he was very involved in the community. He was a Church leader. He had a wife. He had a kid.

[Mikayla]

What does BTK mean?

[Morgan]

Bind, torture, kill.

[Mikayla]

Oh, okay.

[Morgan]

Very bad. Very bad.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And his daughter was, like, you know, giving interviews and, like, has since, like, wrote a book after he was convicted. And his daughter is just like, I never, ever would have imagined. He was a pretty good dad. He built us tree houses and, like, all this stuff. But then, like, you listen to him describe what he did, and he's so emotionally detached, and it's just like, there's this disconnect of, like, he did what he thought was normal and what he should do, but did he ever, like, have real feelings?

[Mikayla]

I know what you're saying. You're not saying, like, OP is this person.

[Morgan]

No.

[Mikayla]

But there also is a dangerous type of person who will go with the. They. They struggle with emotions, and they struggle understanding societal expectations themselves, like, personally, emotionally. So they just do what they see other people doing and, like, what seems to be socially normal. Yeah. And, like, then get caught up in that type of life. And, like, that is very scary.

[Morgan]

That. And it's like, create the own normal that you want to live. Like, don't follow all of these societal expectations. Like, if that. That's truly not what you want, and you have to mask or put on this front to do that. And I think this comment is interesting, and maybe this. I've, like, glanced at the first line, so I'm like, maybe this is what I'm trying to say in, like, a cohesive way, because my brain is, like, fumbling today, it feels like. But this person goes. A lot of people consider a partner or spouse an acquisition rather than a fellow human you're doing life with. Much like a job or a car. They feel getting one is an important life milestone, and you hope for the best one you can get. You don't have to be overjoyed being at work or driving your car. It just has to provide you with everything you want from it for what you put into it and be of sufficiently high quality to feel proud of having. But relationships don't work like that, and a lot of people get way too far in before they figure that out.

[Mikayla]

That's also sort of, like, partially what I was trying to say earlier, too.

[Morgan]

With the Instagram one model. One.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Morgan]

Literally, like, that mindset.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And is that from all of, like, the societal pressure that I keep talking about? Like, where does that stem from?

[Mikayla]

There are definitely, like, a lot of people who. Their biggest desire is to just, like, fit in and, like, seem normal and seem like they're doing all of the things that you're supposed to do in this life to be normal. And I don't know, that's got to be a tough thing to unlearn or like, undo.

[Morgan]

The person who posted that initial comment about the guy who, like, ticking the boxes or whatever, people were like, how was he with you? Like, what did he act like? And they go on to say he was perfect. In fact, too perfect. It's maybe a stupid metaphor, but I felt like he was treating me like a beautiful and expensive painting and he somehow came in possession of and had to treat it like a treasure for no other reason but its price. He was not treating me like an old picture of your grandma that you found somewhere and that reminds you of her and makes you miss her. While it has no monetary value, you want to make sure you hung it properly and protected at all costs. Does that make sense? By all means. He's a great guy and the moment I brought up how I felt, he took it seriously and basically candidly admitted to it. But this is not love. This is not enough and never should be.

[Mikayla]

That's such a good metaphor. Like, that is such a good way of describing it. Amazing.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

No notes on that, but yeah, that's.

[Morgan]

Kind of all we have on this one. Obviously, OP removed the post. I don't think we're gonna get an update. But again, if you want that other story, it's going to be on Patreon, the one also from True off my chest titled I found my dad's secret Reddit account and now I can't look at him the same. I think it's kind of in the same vein as this and is going to be an interesting conversation for sure.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Such a good disclosure, such a good topic because I. It's like really the gray area of a lot of these situations. Like actually, I don't know what the right thing to, like, this is. There's not a moral rule book.

[Morgan]

No.

[Mikayla]

In the world where you can like, clearly find the answer of like, how is the best way to go about this situation. Yeah.

[Morgan]

And there's also that saying too, where it's like, are you telling someone something because it's going to make them feel.

[Mikayla]

Better or apologizing or is it going.

[Morgan]

To make you feel less guilty?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And so it's like, why are you actually telling someone something? Is it to clear your own conscience and it's going to make their life exponentially worse? Like, then you maybe shouldn't tell them.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. You really need to be thinking about like, when you do things from the angle of, like, what will be the outcome of me saying this for that other person? Like, what will happen if I say this to, like, even, like, things online? When people get mad about things online, I'm like, is this an actionable thing that you're saying? Like. Like, what do you think will come out of this in a good way? Or will this actually hurt the cause that you're fighting for? You know, like, I just feel like approaching things from an angle of, like, what will my words actually do? And, like, how will it impact these other people? And will it actually create what I'm hoping will happen? Or will it just feel good to say this? Because we're oftentimes just saying things because they will feel good to say them.

[Morgan]

Exactly. So ask yourself. And I think, like, we can have takes on these stories, but, like, you could ask me a similar story, and I might have a totally different disclosure answer. It is so context by context.

[Mikayla]

Or if I'm going through something different that week, I might, like, have a different.

[Morgan]

I could have fully evolved as a person. Yeah. Like, over the next six months, like.

[Mikayla]

Maybe a friend pissed me off, and, like, now I'm really sensitive to that topic, and so now I'm.

[Morgan]

It's a sore spot.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I think that's what's interesting about this show. It's like, I can. One, I can't listen to old episodes. I cringe, cringe. But it's like, we're constantly evolving in our takes, in our thought process, our experiences. So, like, no, like, you cannot hold me to a take. I said a month ago.

[Mikayla]

You know what?

[Morgan]

You cannot hold me to a take. I said two years ago. I am hopefully always growing in a positive way.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Like, this isn't my permanent take on, like, I could very easily see a comment the second you post this. This episode. That completely changes my perspective.

[Morgan]

And then I'll feel like, oh, that.

[Mikayla]

Like, that's really changes the way that I look at this. And that makes a lot of sense. And I've never had that experience. So now that I'm reading this, like, I do have a different opinion.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Mikayla]

And that's important.

[Morgan]

That is so important for all of us to feel that way because that's how you grow by having conversations and trying to find middle ground and, like, connecting on things. I think that's, like, especially important in the times we're in right now. It's like, we need to get to a spot where, like, we can have conversations and kind of, like, come together and, like, grow and, like, otherwise, like, how do we move forward?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And I love seeing comments that are, like, very constructive in a way where, like, you're providing your own opinion. Because I read that and I'm like, oh, that's your thought process.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Oh, my God, that makes so much sense. And then, like, it's helps me grow in my thought process. I love learning.

[Mikayla]

Or getting a therapist to comment on the story about. Is it okay for a therapist to do this? Like, that's so interesting.

[Morgan]

Yeah. Or like, if you've been through something and you're like, no, Morgan, like, I've been through this. Here's my take on that story. I love, love seeing your takes.

[Mikayla]

Like, it.

[Morgan]

It helps us grow.

[Mikayla]

Like, it's really all of our. All of our hot takes. A village, you guys.

[Morgan]

It's a village. I know. It's probably like, what is it now?

[Mikayla]

Like, maybe it's not just two anymore.

[Morgan]

No, we gotta change the show name. I'm like, how many of us are out there now? 2 million? 10 million? Like, 10 million hot takes. Like, the show has. The show has reached a lot of corners of the world.

[Mikayla]

That's beautiful.

[Morgan]

Beautiful. Okay, I only have you for a few more minutes. This is gonna be, I think, a straight off the bat one.

[Mikayla]

Whoa.

[Morgan]

Last one for us today coming from our very own Too Hot Takes subreddit 15 days old titled My boyfriend kept asking me to moan louder. Turns out he was recording me. This still doesn't feel real. To write. I, 25, female, have been dating a 27 male for a year. Things were good. We had amazing chemistry and he made me feel sexy. Until recently, he kept asking me to moan louder during sex. At first, I didn't think much of it. Some people are just into that. But it got to a point where it felt forced, like I was performing, not enjoying. I told him it made me self conscious. He said it was just a turn on and dropped it. Or so I thought. Last week, I used his laptop to log into my email because mine was glitching. He'd left a folder open by accident. It was full of audio files literally labeled by date. When I clicked one, it was me moaning, saying his name. Our sex recorded without my consent. I confronted him immediately. He didn't even deny it. Just said it wasn't that serious and that he only used the mic, not a camera. Like that made it better. He also admitted he, quote, shared a few clips with his friends in a group chat as a joke. I dumped him on the spot, blocked him, and filed A report. His friends have tried texting me to chill and that he's going through it. Good. I hope he rots. I feel violated in a way I can't even describe.

[Mikayla]

Oh, he should die. Yeah, he should die. That's disgusting. He's a terrible person. Saying it was a joke and then having his friends defend him too. All of you fucking suck. You're all the worse.

[Morgan]

He sent it to these friends.

[Mikayla]

Like, that's so awful.

[Morgan]

Also, it just kept getting worse and worse.

[Mikayla]

And then like trying to turn your intimate sexual relationship, like into pornography. It's like porn isn't real. Like there is a reason that that doesn't feel natural for her. And it's like it's making her uncomfortable. And like that's just like, not like he, he wants it to be a show for him to show to his friends and show later instead of like actually having a good sexual experience with her.

[Morgan]

I know. To be crystal clear, you always need to disclose if you want to record.

[Mikayla]

Yes.

[Morgan]

You need two consenting parties for things like that. And that's what's like so weird to me. In some states you can record audio. It's a, like a one party state. You don't have to tell the other person you're recording them, which is. But even of that, like weird.

[Mikayla]

Even of. Even of a sexual encounter.

[Morgan]

Sexual. Always. Yeah, Always non negotiable.

[Mikayla]

And then sending that, even if it's like, then that's revenge porn.

[Morgan]

Yeah. No, she's got a case.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And this is a two hot takes listener out there. Like, I'm so sorry. I'm so. But I'm so proud of you for dumping him on the spot and reporting smiling and just like, I'm so.

[Mikayla]

And he tried to gaslight you and be like, oh, it was just a joke. And like all my friends think it's fine. It's fun. It's not a big deal. Why do you think it's such a big deal? You. You should be shot.

[Morgan]

It's a huge deal. It is a huge deal.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

You can't involve someone else in something and not disclose what you're doing.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Especially in relation to sex.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Come on. Consent is key. Consent is. Makes it fun. Consent is necessary and needed.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. It's like sort of just the most important part of all of it.

[Morgan]

And some people would be into recording.

[Mikayla]

She even might have been had he approached it in like a. Oh, I just want one to save for later. Like the fact that he wasn't asking her. That shows more like he either knew she would say no or he got off on the fact that she wasn't consenting to it and he was like sneakily doing this.

[Morgan]

Hell no. Hell no. Top comment. He's going through it. He and his friends are morons and none of them should get into a relationship. Keep pushing for the charges. Don't let the police or him stop you pushing forward.

[Mikayla]

Absolutely.

[Morgan]

Keep us posted. Op, I know a lot of us would love an update and sending you all the support, all the support. That's just so invasive, so invasive to go through. Yeah, I'm so sorry, but you got this. Keep pressing. As the top comment said, those charges, that's all I got on the disclosure theme.

[Mikayla]

I loved this.

[Morgan]

We'll have way more on Patreon because I have literally 20 other tabs open and I feel like they're all pretty good stories.

[Mikayla]

I know they're all your children. It's like, which one do I like, let go of?

[Morgan]

I know that I sit here even as we're recording, I click through all the tabs and I'm like, oh my God, what is going to like make the people happy? Like, I always think about like what you guys want story wise and also what do you want for episodes coming up? I would love to hear any themes you guys would like to see, any guests you'd like to see. I really try to curate a show you guys will love and like, I give myself anxiety probably picking these stories. I've wanted to do like kind of a happy feel good theme but traditionally like those episodes don't perform well. So I'm like, do you not want feel good? I'm like, just let me know what you want.

[Mikayla]

Maybe like one at the end or something. I don't know.

[Morgan]

I know. Is the feel good sandwich? Was that a good tactic for these episodes? I can try to structure more of those episodes and themes. So just let me know. You know, we're heading into August very soon. I've got my wedding coming up in September so I'm really trying to work ahead and get ahead on stuff and you know, this is a village, as I've said, it's a community and want to make sure you guys are getting content you love. But other than that, head over to Patreon. We've got new merch out, limited run on certain items. So head over there. That's all I got.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, thanks for having me. I love it.

[Morgan]

Always a pleasure.

[Mikayla]

Queen, a regular.

[Morgan]

I've had so many people say, I just gotta tell you, I love Mikayla becoming more of a regular.

[Mikayla]

No way. No way.

[Morgan]

That's awesome. I just did an interview with Betches. It's not how you say it. Why did I say it like that? I feel like that's how you say it. Yeah. And Marissa Dow over there. Who listens? Hi, Marissa. And she was like, I just gotta tell you, I love Michaela. Coming on.

[Mikayla]

Yay.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Mikayla]

That's awesome.

[Morgan]

I know. It's always a good time.

[Mikayla]

Thanks, divas.

[Morgan]

I love these episodes, but thanks, guys. And until next time. Bye.

[Mikayla]

Bye.

[Morgan]

Sam.