254: MORE Updates!

Summary

Two Hot Takes — Episode 254: "MORE Updates!"

Published: February 5, 2026
Host: Morgan Absher
Co-Host: Jenna

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Morgan and Jenna dive into more Reddit stories with juicy updates, following last week’s theme. The stories span relationship drama, awkward family encounters, troubling crushes, and fraught friendships—each with a fresh update or resolution. Their discussions are lively, often irreverent, and always empathetic, balancing hot takes with thoughtful analysis.

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Main Segments & Story Summaries

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1. Jealousy, Insecurity, and a Friendship in Flames

[05:45–30:51]

Story:
A husband asks Reddit if he's the asshole for telling his wife, who continually ridicules his friend’s attractive fiancé, that she is "just jealous because Rachel is hotter than you."

• The wife has made increasingly unkind and sometimes racially-charged comments toward Rachel (the friend’s fiancé), culminating in a public put-down at a bar.
• The husband, after his wife compares Rachel to Whoopi Goldberg in front of others, calls her out as jealous, inadvertently hurting her deeply.
• Updates reveal escalating fallout: Matt and Rachel (the friends) uninvite the wife from their wedding and cut off the couple, citing bullying and possibly racially-motivated remarks.

Key Discussion Points:

• The podcast hosts don’t mince words—Morgan calls the wife a "mean girl" and "a bully," highlighting the obvious insecurity and cruelty.
• Jenna empathizes with insecurities but draws a hard line: “It’s never okay to have your reaction to bad feelings be like, oh, now I’m gonna, like, ruin someone else.”
• Morgan is disturbed by tactics like comparing Rachel to Whoopi Goldberg:

  "First of all, ma’am, did you see Whoopi Goldberg in Sister Act 1 and 2? Even in that nun habit, Whoopi was slaying. Fuck you." [11:09]

Memorable Quotes:

• "Anyone can read this. This is like reading 'the brown fox jumped over the log.' Like, it is so simple." — Morgan, [10:40]
• "She is just not as conventionally attractive to me. She is the most beautiful woman on the planet. But objectively, Rachel is better looking." — Husband/OP, as read by Morgan, [17:10]
• "If someone doesn’t have close friends, it’s kind of like, well, why?" — Morgan, [15:45]
• "You don’t need to be jealous of the attention she’s getting because…it shouldn’t be to him that she’s hotter." — Jenna, [28:23]

Update:

• The husband, after seeing his wife's full-side of mean behavior and the lingering racial undertones, decides to consider counseling—but signals the marriage may be over:

  "She admitted that she is jealous…my wife has sent an apology to Rachel, but I don’t think the friendship is salvageable. I will still attend the wedding, but my wife won’t be coming along if she is reinvited." [22:44]

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2. Dad Confronts Daughter’s Boyfriend’s Vulgar T-Shirt

[32:05–49:15]

Story:
A father’s 19-year-old daughter's boyfriend shows up for a family dinner in a T-shirt reading “It’s Not Gonna Suck Itself.” The father gives the boyfriend $40 and gently orders him to buy a new shirt before returning.

Key Discussion Points:

• Jenna is shocked the daughter and wife suggest the dad "humiliated" the boyfriend, saying, "He could have been way worse. I would have punched him in the face." [35:16].
• Morgan calls his handling "eloquent" and "discreet."
• They both rail on the disrespect and absurdity of the boyfriend’s choice—"Do you have any fucking respect?" [33:27]
• Discovery that the shirt was a dare from the boyfriend’s older brother adds depth—and comedy.
• Updates bring the boyfriend’s parents onto Reddit, who fully support the dad’s response. A family dinner brings closure (and flowers), and the older brother is humorously punished with pink shirts.

Memorable Moments:

• "He handled it perfectly. Splendidly!" — Jenna, [33:17]
• "My daughter called him about an hour ago, and this will be informative.…His reply was telling: 'Because it was embarrassing.'" — Morgan, quoting the boyfriend’s explanation for not telling the daughter, [42:08]
• "Pink shirts, no cash!" — Morgan, [47:00], on the older brother’s punishment.

Final Update:

• The families meet for dinner, apologies exchanged, and everyone comes away better, with the hosts praising the maturity and the "happy ending."

  "Lessons were learned." — Both hosts, [48:38]

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3. Crush Confession & Crossing the Line

[50:25–76:32]

Story:
A 38-year-old man’s wife admits to an obsessive crush on her personal trainer—detailing intense feelings, wardrobe changes, social media fixation, and even fantasizing about him during sex. She confesses after guilt overwhelms her.

Key Discussion Points:

• Morgan and Jenna debate the value (and limits) of brutal honesty: “Do you think that there's a time when…that is too honest?…I don’t think you need to tell him you’re thinking of him [during sex].” — Jenna, [53:58]
• The hosts agree the situation is past a "normal crush":

  "This isn’t right. I’m gonna switch gyms…Going in my car and crying because I saw him laughing with someone else—no, that’s crazy." — Both hosts, [56:52]

• Discussion of limerence—a psychological state of obsessive, unreciprocated infatuation—illuminates the dynamic.
• Shocking update: the wife has been sending the trainer nude photos, lying about her marriage, and harassing him despite no reciprocation. The husband learns this directly from the (very polite, shocked) personal trainer.
• The trainer had to block her; the wife admits to further past indiscretions. Husband initiates divorce.

Memorable Quotes:

• "It was almost like a magician being like, look over here, look over here...not over here, it’s over here." — Morgan, [68:51]
• "This is just a midlife crisis, but for a woman." — Jenna, [65:12]
• "She was sexually harassing this man and he is not interested in you. Like, this is icky." — Jenna, [70:15]
• "She isn’t fit to be in a relationship or a marriage right now. This is really the best thing for both of them." — Jenna, [74:35]

Final Outcome:

• The host reads the last update: the husband is moving for divorce, noting “life really can turn upside down in a week.” [74:04]
• Both hosts stress the importance of boundaries, self-accountability, and seeking therapy rather than destroying lives with denial and obsession.

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4. Friendship Fallout: Exclusions and Emotional Warfare

[77:22–89:11]

Story:
A woman’s best friend asks her not to bring her baby, and then—one week before the party—not to bring her husband to her engagement celebration. Despite others being allowed to bring spouses and babies, her husband is specifically excluded; when she refuses to attend alone, the friend ends their friendship and spreads rumors within their circle.

Key Discussion Points:

• Both hosts question the (undisclosed) underlying motive—Is it rivalry? Jealousy? Unspoken attraction?

  "Is she in love with her friend?...Don’t bring your husband, because you should be paying attention to me…" — Morgan, [80:54]

• They analyze possible codependency, manipulation, and "emotional warfare"—with Jenna wondering if there’s missing context about the husband’s behavior.
• Jenna and Morgan are amused by the narratively-juicy drama, calling it "very intense homoerotic friendship." [89:05]

Quotes:

• "Keep my baby’s name out of your mouth." — Jenna, [79:32]
• "No bad blood. We’re just…we’re complete." — Morgan, [84:27]

Update:

• OP directly confronts her ex-friend, who lacks self-awareness and responsibility. The friend group is filled with rumors—OP explains herself, and, feeling the relationship was always unbalanced, cuts ties for good.

Takeaway:

• Boundaries are healthy; protecting your family and peace is self-respect, not cruelty.

  "I protected my family." — OP, as read by Jenna, [88:32]

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5. Best Friends, Exes, and Repeated Boundaries

[94:23–124:20]

Story:
A woman’s best friend (13-year friendship) asks her to promise not to sleep with a mutual male friend (Aaron) whom the friend briefly dated many years ago (while currently in a committed relationship herself). OP refuses to make an absolute promise, but states she’s not planning to. The friendship strains as a result.

Key Discussion Points:

• Jenna staunchly sides with the friend: "Honestly, if someone to me was like, well, I’m not planning on it, but—no promises—like, that sounds like you want to." [98:38]
• Morgan waffles, sympathizing with both sides but highlighting the exhaustion of repeated requests to control OP’s relationships, given a pattern in their friendship.
• Extensive context reveals long-standing “dibs” issues, dating back to university, with the friend often controlling or trying to preempt OP’s romantic prospects.
• Both hosts agree that friendships surviving over many years and difficult conflicts are powerful, but urge maturity—"At a certain point, you need to grow up."

Notable Quotes:

• "That's how you know." — Jenna, after the coin flip; then, "I'm on her side. Like what if they have an amazing sexual tension?” [95:07]
• "I don't like her. I think she's mean." — Jenna, [115:51]

Final Update:

• After honest discussion, OP and her friend restore trust and continue the planned trip—with the understanding that their pattern of conflict needs further discussion. The trip passes without incident, and new boundaries set.

Takeaway:

• Friendships, like romantic relationships, sometimes need tough conversations to evolve. Still, both hosts and OP suggest growing out of possessiveness and competition.

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Notable Themes Throughout

• Jealousy and Insecurity: Both romantic and platonic stories revolve around how people handle envy and competition—whether with spouses, friends, or within friend groups.
• Boundaries and Self-Respect: Multiple stories deal with the struggle to assert boundaries or make peace when others violate them.
• Communication Styles: Public vs. private confrontation, oversharing, controlling narratives, and defensiveness recur—Morgan and Jenna highlight how different approaches can help or hurt.
• Modern Relationships: Many scenarios reflect contemporary anxieties—age gaps, social media-induced FOMO, friend group drama, and "situationships."

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Unforgettable Moments

• Morgan’s passionate Whoopi Goldberg defense and fit of swearing about “slaying” in a nun habit. [11:09]
• Dad’s calmly orchestrated T-shirt swap and the later reveal that Redditors are his boyfriend’s parents.
• The wild gym wife’s full unraveling, sending nudes to a personal trainer and attempting to manipulate both her husband and the trainer with lies.
• Friendly rivalry that might be something more—Morgan and Jenna speculating about the homoerotic undercurrents in female friendships.
• The emotional tennis match of OPs and friends negotiating boundaries, jealousy, and the unwritten rules of best-friendship.

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Timestamps of Major Stories & Segments

• 05:45–30:51: Jealousy & Marriage Fallout
• 32:05–49:15: Vulgar T-Shirt Showdown & Updates
• 50:25–76:32: Obsessive Gym Crush Exposed
• 77:22–89:11: Engagement Party Exclusion & Friendship Collapse
• 94:23–124:20: Friendship vs. Romantic Boundaries (& Many, Many Updates)

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This episode is a rollercoaster of drama, closure, and insight into messy modern relationships. Morgan and Jenna handle cringe, heartbreak, and hilarity with equal wit and empathy, leaving listeners both entertained and a bit more introspective.

Transcript

[Morgan]

This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Just like choosing a carrot cake recipe, if you know you know State Farm has options to choose from to help you find coverage that best fits your needs. Sounds a lot easier than a coin flip. So talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts, and savings and eligibility vary by state. This episode is brought to you by Credit Karma. When it comes to your money, Credit Karma keeps you ahead of the game. You can count on Credit Karma to keep up with your financial needs. As they evolve, they'll help you monitor your progress and give personalized recommendations so you can make strides towards your goals and find your way to money. Make sure you're on the right track, no matter where you are on your financial journey. Intuit. Credit Karma. Karma you can count on.

[Jenna]

We rolling.

[Morgan]

We are up. Running. Rolling. Hop. Skipping a.

[Jenna]

Jumping on a river. Rolling on a river.

[Morgan]

Dude, every time I hear river, all I hear is that I think it was Wendy Williams. Denial is a river in Egypt.

[Jenna]

I have seen that one.

[Morgan]

Your husband is gay.

[Jenna]

I have seen that one.

[Morgan]

That's like, I don't know. Every time I hear river or like, denial, like, I just hear Wendy in my ear.

[Jenna]

That's kind of a beautiful ear worm. It kind of is. Is that the right. Yeah, yeah.

[Morgan]

Audio stim. It's an interesting one. It's not one I would say out loud unless it's to my closest, nearest and dearest friends, you guys. But, yeah, I don't know. I'm just like, I'm in a weird funk right now. I feel like everyone's kind of in a funk.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

With everything going on, like, it's so crazy, too, recording something and then like, okay, this comes out two weeks later or three weeks later.

[Jenna]

Yeah. We don't know what's gonna be happening.

[Morgan]

We don't even know. So it's like, it's with the podcast and, like, banking episodes. Cause, like, a lot of my episodes that I'm recording in the next couple weeks, like, won't even be seen for months. And it's just like.

[Jenna]

Yeah. And every. So much is happening every day.

[Morgan]

Every day.

[Jenna]

It's crazy.

[Morgan]

Each and every day. So we're kind of continuing on our theme. We did updates Happy Endings with Jenna last week. We're gonna do another update episode. Like, I.

[Jenna]

But not Happy Endings.

[Morgan]

Not happy Endings. A lot of them. I haven't read the endings, actually. Oh, okay.

[Jenna]

So it could. It could conceivably have a happy ending.

[Morgan]

Could.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

And it also depends on your definition of a happy ending.

[Jenna]

Oh, wow.

[Morgan]

Is breaking up a happy ending? If it's for the best, yeah. A lot of the time that counts for me. So these are just a lot of chaotic, crazy stories with updates. We just need something. Another week of predictability and chaos, but closure.

[Jenna]

I love updates. I just, like, leave the story feeling more like, okay, well, at least I know.

[Morgan]

At least you know, I feel the same way.

[Jenna]

Even if it's bad. Like, at least it's resolved.

[Morgan]

At least, you know. Yeah, I'm with you. So let's just hop right into it.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

I don't know if I have anything else to say. You guys are about to hear me talk enough. So, yeah, let's just get to the.

[Jenna]

Stories in as possible.

[Morgan]

Ooh. Okay. Let's dive in.

[Jenna]

Sam.

[Morgan]

This episode of two Hot Takes is presented by State Farm. It can be hard choosing the juiciest story for you guys on this podcast. And if you need help making a choice, State Farm helps you choose the coverage that matters most to you. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on ratings plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer availability, amount of discounts, and savings and eligibility vary by state. Up first. And again, I'm checking all of my Reddit master doc sheets for all of these stories. So if you feel like you've heard this story, don't just say, I've heard this story. Morgan, give me the timestamps of the episode because I go crazy. I feel like we're all in this Mandela effect. And I'm like, did I read it?

[Jenna]

But I. I feel like I would think that whether I just read it myself on Reddit, whether I listened to another podcast, whether I saw it on Facebook, like, I feel like if especially was a long time ago, you would mix up in your head where you heard it from.

[Morgan]

It happens. And honestly, you guys, my memory is horrible these days. I'm getting a brain scan, so memory is very unreliable.

[Jenna]

It's crazy, actually.

[Morgan]

I don't know. I just feel like I'm like, I have weird, almost like expressive aphasia, and I'm just like, the words I'm saying, it's just like, what the hell are you trying to say? Most of the time and watching back the edits has been brutal lately. And I'm like, okay, I just. I'm going to get a brain scan and just make sure we're good.

[Jenna]

I haven't seen that at all.

[Morgan]

Okay, okay.

[Jenna]

I'll tell you that.

[Morgan]

Thank you. I'm just.

[Jenna]

But do whatever makes you feel, you know, safe.

[Morgan]

Safe than sorry. Oh, and if you're having tummy issues, colon cancer rates just shot up again. So eat your fiber. Get your colonoscopy. Story one.

[Jenna]

It's like my soapbox that out of the way.

[Morgan]

Yeah, we're good. We're good. We're locked in now. So this is coming from Am I the. It's titled, Am I the Asshole for telling my wife to stop being so jealous of my friend's fiance. My wife, 35, female, and I, 36, male, are good friends with another couple. My best friend Matt, 36, male, and his fiance Rachel, 24, female. Rachel models and is very attractive. My wife is less conventionally attractive, but I fell in love with her for her humor and good spirit, which I personally find more attractive than good looks. Recently, I've noticed my wife making a lot of comments about Rachel, calling her an airhead and just kind of being mean. When my wife makes these comments in private, I'm able to stand up for Rachel, but when they're made in public, I obviously don't want to embarrass my wife by calling her out. My wife and I went on a trip away with Matt and Rachel last weekend, which we had been planning for a while and really looking forward to it. At dinner one night, my wife made a really mean comment. After we started talking about the economy, she remarked, don't worry, Rachel, you can join in the conversation once the smart people are done. She was the only one that laughed. I was completely embarrassed. And once we were alone, I told my wife she had been really rude and I was ashamed of her. I told her she needs to stop making nasty comments, and she agreed. However, the next night, we all went out to a bar. Rachel was getting a lot of attention from guys there who were sending over drinks. My wife was looking visibly annoyed that she wasn't receiving the same attention. So I tried to lift her spirits by paying for all of her drinks and making a fuss of her. One guy came over and said that Rachel looked just like the model Zendaya. My wife let out a massive laugh and said, did you mean to say Whoopi Goldberg?

[Jenna]

What?

[Morgan]

I turned to my wife and straight up said, you really are so jealous, aren't you. She looked hurt, but didn't have time to respond as Rachel had left the table in tears. I followed Matt and told Rachel directly that I was so sorry for my wife's words and that I was ashamed of her behavior. When I reunited with my wife, she told me I was horrible for calling her jealous in front of everyone and embarrassing her. I told her straight up that she was jealous of Rachel, as Rachel is more attractive than her. I realize in hindsight this was a very heavy thing to say and can see why she would be hurt by it. However, I stand by the fact it was said in anger. Am I the asshole?

[Jenna]

This is a doozy. This is like, oh, my God. This was a journey to take me on.

[Morgan]

This woman sounds horrible to be around her.

[Jenna]

First of all. Yeah, this also. Wait, what was their ages again?

[Morgan]

Op is 36. Wife is 35. His friend is 36. So all of them are around the same age. And then friend's fiance is 24.

[Jenna]

Rachel.

[Morgan]

Is 24 Rachel. Yeah.

[Jenna]

Oh, my God. So that's another whole layer of this.

[Morgan]

A little baby.

[Jenna]

This whole thing. Get her out of there. Actually, get Rachel safe. Get Rachel.

[Morgan]

Rachel needs to be marked as safe.

[Jenna]

I'm, like, worried about her. Yeah. I think this is tough. This is very high school behavior. First of all, like, it brings me back to just, like, being in friendships with people who were actually, like, didn't like you, and this is how they acted. And I guess these people aren't really friends by choice. They're friends by, like, husband friendships or something.

[Morgan]

Yeah, like, association. Not your choosing. Yeah.

[Jenna]

I don't know. Again, like, in the start of the story, it was one of those situations where I was like, I do think there needs to be a deeper conversation between Op and his wife about this. And, like, to have a conversation of, why do you feel so insecure about Rachel? Like, you are the person that I'm married to. I. I love you. I do. I do think, though, at the end, saying, like, you're jealous because she's more attractive than you. Ooh, I don't know how you come back from that either.

[Morgan]

Yeah, it's unhealthy. Like, you shouldn't keep bringing your wife around. Like, you can have a relationship with your friend, but, like, your wife is a mean girl. Like, that's just the reality that you're dealing with. And if you want to stay married to her, then you're going to have to think long and hard about the relationships you want to have with everyone else and how you want your social Circle to look, because your wife is a bully, people are going to get to a point where they don't want her around. And she is clearly insecure. Anyone can read this. This is like reading the brown fox jumped over the log. Like, it's. It's rudimentary. Like, it is so simple.

[Jenna]

It doesn't make her look, like, smarter, better, more interesting. It's, like, very clearly, from anyone watching, that would be like, oh, yeah, she is jealous and insecure of this girl.

[Morgan]

Well, and, like, have someone compliment her and be like, you look like Zendaya. Zendaya is gorgeous. Like, yeah, top model. Gorgeous, beautiful. And then for you to clap back and be like, don't you mean Whoopi Goldberg? First of all, ma', am, did you see Whoopi Goldberg in Sister Act 1 and 2? Even in that nun habit, Whoopi was slaying. Fuck you. Fuck you.

[Jenna]

I'm not as familiar with Whoopi Goldberg's, like, illustrious career, but.

[Morgan]

Oh, man.

[Jenna]

But I trust I will be looking into it later.

[Morgan]

Whoopi's always had those cheekbones. And in that little nun habit, she worked it.

[Jenna]

Okay, she worked it.

[Morgan]

She went into hiding.

[Jenna]

But then, yeah, it's so sad. Like, Rachel runs away crying. She's also, like, over a decade younger than all of these people, is a fiance. They've all been, like, probably friends for a very long time. It's like married couples. She's, like, new to the group. It just. I think Rachel is the most blameless one in all of this.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

I think the husband was, like, trying to do the right thing for a long time. But then also, that last comment is like, you're not an asshole. Like, in the grand scheme of everything that's happened based on her actions.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

But I also, like, don't know how you come back from that comment.

[Morgan]

Well, and I think you can call someone jealous, but then you kind of went a step further, and it's like, you're jealous because Rachel's hotter than you.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And it's like, clearly she's insecure. Clearly she's struggling with something.

[Jenna]

His original, like, comment on this Reddit thing was about how his wife is not conventionally attractive.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Jenna]

So I do think there's probably a dynamic at play here that could be contributing to her insecurity.

[Morgan]

You wonder.

[Jenna]

But I don't know. I mean, neither of them are right.

[Morgan]

I know. Well, and I think from her point, like, op's friend is 36. Rachel's 24. Like, that age gap is a big age gap. It's a 12 year age gap.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And so in her head she's like, okay, this is when it begins. Like we get replaced by hot and younger models.

[Jenna]

Like, true.

[Morgan]

I'm sure she's coming at this from just so many angles of attack. But here's the thing. Like, this girl is with your husband's best friend. She's not trying to go for your husband. This could be your friend. Like, why are you being cruel?

[Jenna]

And to that point, if you, even though it is valid to be like, oh, here come the younger models. And like, here, like, I'm insecure about this, like, then still Rachel wouldn't be the subject of the anger in that situation. She is the only one who was like innocent of that. And if, if you're mad about it, like, make a comment to the friend about how like, oh, like you love younger. Like, you know, make your little snide, petty comments to him. He's the one bringing the young girl around. Yeah, like, she didn't do anything.

[Morgan]

No top comments. Not the asshole. Aside from the way you handled it at the end, she's the asshole. Stop bringing her around. When you hang out with Matt and Rachel, don't lie to her though. Just don't bring her anywhere they are going to be. If she doesn't like it, then, oh well, she doesn't get to bully people and get rewarded.

[Jenna]

Yeah, totally. I'm reading, I'm hearing that comment though and I'm like, are they gonna stay together? Like, like, I don't know. This is crazy to just like this seems like such a difference of morals on one hand and then also such a like slap in the face at the end. And it's also like now his friend has a young girlfriend and he's also like privately taking her side. I don't know, I just feel like there's a weird. I don't know if I have a lot of hope for this relationship, but I guess people get through things.

[Morgan]

So I'm curious if they have like kids or what their history is, how long they've been together or are they, you know, 36, 35. I know, but recently got married after a year of dating. Like, I'm so curious what the backstory is here.

[Jenna]

Has this happened before? Has there ever been something with anyone else?

[Morgan]

Does she have any female friends? Or is she a mean girl, doesn't have friends? Because I do think, like, it's hard to have a lot of friends nowadays. I think, like, socially we just seem like really disconnected. But if someone doesn't have Any friends or, like, a woman, like, if they don't have any, like, girlfriends. Like, I do think that's kind of a little bit of a red flag. And then, like, you have to suss it out. Obviously, there's a lot of nuance there, but it's just like, if someone doesn't have close friends, it's kind of like, well, why, like, do you have a history of bad behavior and treating people bad? And that's why you're not close with anyone. It just gets you wondering, like, what does this guy's wife like? What does she really look like outside of this? Like, is it really just Rachel?

[Jenna]

I do feel like.

[Morgan]

Or is it everyone?

[Jenna]

Yeah. Usually in these stories, we do get a moment of, like, I've never seen this before. Or on the opposite hand, it would be like, she has done this before with this person or that person. So I would love, like. Yeah, more context on that.

[Morgan]

You know, OP does have an edit.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

I forgot to mention that since the trip, Matt has messaged me to let me know that my wife is no longer welcome at their wedding and that as a couple, himself and Rachel have decided that they aren't interested in our friendship anymore if my wife is around.

[Jenna]

Wow.

[Morgan]

Rachel feels as if my wife has bullied her and has even suggested that some of the comments were racially motivated.

[Jenna]

I was wondering that, like, I was wondering what the race of OP and his wife were. Because it did feel like microaggressions. Like, she's specifically very bothered by this woman and, like, all the attention that this woman is getting. And it's like, yeah, that could be an age thing, but sometimes it's also, like, a microaggression.

[Morgan]

I mean, the Zendaya to. You mean Whoopi Goldberg. I mean, that's kind of. There's a lot you can read in on that.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

OP Ends that edit with, I am so humiliated. And then there is another edit underneath. Sorry, another edit. Just wanted to clarify. My wife is stunning. I wouldn't have married her if I didn't think she was beautiful. She is just not as conventionally attractive to me. She is the most beautiful woman on the planet. But objectively, Rachel is better looking. I'm very open to being the asshole in this situation, but I definitely wouldn't want people to think I'm not attracted to my wife.

[Jenna]

Well, thank you for saying it finally. I mean, I don't.

[Morgan]

What does it even mean, though? Like, what does it even mean? Beauty is like, yes, okay, there's conventionally attractive, but beauty is so in the eye of the beholder.

[Jenna]

Yeah. I don't understand. I mean, here I'm single, so there are some things that I don't always immediately understand. But to say, like, she's the most beautiful woman in the world to me, but obviously very clearly Rachel is hotter.

[Morgan]

That's what I'm saying.

[Jenna]

What does it mean, like, to me, like, that doesn't make sense.

[Morgan]

Sense, dude, I'm.

[Jenna]

And it's also like, it's not a comment about like, you know, some random actress and like, celebrity or something. It's like your friend's fiance who is one of like, the people you hang out with most. So it's just.

[Morgan]

I honestly don't know how I'd proceed forward. It's obviously a lot more complex if, like, they have kids and stuff like that. But yeah, if you're kind of starting to have like, your blinders come off and see this other side of your wife, like, oh, she's mean and maybe this is racially motivated, like, oh, you're gonna like, I'd have a tough time proceeding forward with this person and they're kind of just not nice and just.

[Jenna]

Yeah, yeah.

[Morgan]

I don't know.

[Jenna]

I'm excited to hear the update on this one.

[Morgan]

Update. Thanks for the feedback, guys. Just to add, although I didn't call out my wife in public, I regularly called her out in private after she made the comments. The reason we continued to hang out as a group is because my wife reassured me her and Rachel got on well and the comments were in good spirit. Matt would also continue to invite us out, so I didn't think it was too much of a problem. Also, in regards to the free drinks, Rachel accepted them for the table. We all shared the drinks and were joking around. The drinks were sent from the same two creepy guys and it wasn't like the whole bar was buying Rachel drinks. Matt isn't insecure and would rather accept the free alcohol. Haha. Also, my wife earns more than me, so we split costs 50, 50. Most of the time. I paid for her drinks this time to make her feel better. That's not gonna make her feel better. Before I update, I also want to make it clear that I don't have feelings for Rachel. I think she is conventionally.

[Jenna]

How many times can you be like. But conventionally, she is the most beautiful woman in the world that I've ever seen. And anyone would agree with that, but I don't. But like my wife, in my eyes, I love her. Like, how many times can you say that?

[Morgan]

That's what we get to. I think she is a conventionally attractive girl and she is a model. I'm not even really friends with Rachel. As some of you pointed out. She's younger, so we don't have much in common. I also want to make it clear that my wife is conventionally attractive also, just less so than Rachel. Rachel is a model. My wife is not. This doesn't mean I don't think my wife is more attractive than Rachel to me. I just mean objectively. Rachel is better looking.

[Jenna]

I swear, like King, you have made that clear. You do not need to reword that for us one more time.

[Morgan]

We're good.

[Jenna]

Yep. Rachel. Model, young, hot, gorgeous. Looks like the most beautiful woman in the world. Anyone would say this.

[Morgan]

I feel like he's just like, people must have been attacking him. Be like, damn, you don't even like your wife. Damn, you think your wife's ugly. And he's like, no, no, no, no, no. My wife's beautiful. I just. I'm just. She's just not. She's. She's conventionally attractive actually, too. Like, he's just panicked.

[Jenna]

I know. Well, because, okay, in the original, he sort of. Yeah, maybe his wife found the post. Right?

[Morgan]

My wife is hot too.

[Jenna]

That's what the edit sounded like. When he was like, my wife is the most beautiful woman in the world to me. I was like, did the wife find this?

[Morgan]

Blink if you're okay, King. I agree with the comments that both my wife and I were the assholes in this situation. My wife's behavior is unacceptable and mine was cruel and has probably done lasting damage to my wife's self esteem. She was already a little wrecked, though. That's. That's me. I don't think I'm the asshole for failing to call out my wife sooner. In my opinion, you should never publicly criticize your partner. So for me, telling her privately that the jokes were inappropriate is enough. I also want to point out my wife and I have already had couples counseling and my wife individual therapy. When I initially made the comment that Rachel is more attractive than her, my wife was furious. And rightly so. She said that it was a cruel thing to say and that she wasn't jealous of Rachel and insisted that the jokes were not offensive and everyone was just tiptoeing around the pretty girl. When we returned home from the trip and I received Matt's message, I let my wife know. At first she was hurt, but she eventually came around and said her behavior was inappropriate. She admitted that she is jealous of Rachel due to her looks and was embarrassed by her behavior. I also asked her if she felt as if I found Rachel more attractive than her, but she said she didn't think that it was. That it was just difficult seeing a younger, prettier girl get treated way better than her and she felt like second best. I think my wife noticed Rachel getting special treatment from other people and was jealous she didn't receive the same. My wife has sent an apology to Rachel, but I don't think the friendship is salvageable. I will still attend the wedding, but my wife won't be coming along even if she is reinvited. I think it's worth my wife having some more therapy, and I'll have to rethink things. This has definitely made me see things in a different light, and I'm really disappointed. Thanks again, everyone, for the feedback.

[Jenna]

Yeah, I mean, I do think it depends on the person, but if you were, like, at a bar with two men and one other woman, and the other woman was constantly getting free drinks sent to her, and, like, you're just kind of standing there like chopped liver, you would feel very insecure. Like, it would be a shitty feeling.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

That does not make it okay to try to then tear her down and embarrass her and humiliate her in front of everybody. And, like, it's never okay to have your reaction to bad feelings be like, oh, now I'm gonna, like, ruin someone else. I'm gonna make someone else feel awful and seem awful to everyone else. But I can see why she was insecure, especially given how the husband was writing about it for the whole time. It's just. That doesn't excuse then how you act about it.

[Morgan]

I don't know. Honestly, though, I think his writing is just him, like, almost overthinking it, and then the comments being like, do you even like your wife? Like, I'm. I'm curious what the comments on the original were, and I'm just gonna peek because it just feels like he over explained way more than he had to. And the over explaining was clearly overthinking and anxiety, to me, at least. And then it almost, like, dug him in a hole. And it's like, I don't even know if based on this. Like, I don't even feel like he was necessarily giving her a reason to be insecure. I am curious why they went to couples therapy. Like, what was kind of a motivating factor there. Yeah, but she's also an individual's therapy, so it's like, it's kind of clear that she's dealing with insecurity or, you know, some other issues with confidence or something.

[Jenna]

I mean, I don't know. Yeah, I don't know if someone being in therapy individually, like, automatically means that they're the one with more issues. I think that, like, sometimes.

[Morgan]

Sometimes they're more aware and they're working on it, which is great.

[Jenna]

I feel like he mentioned her being less attractive in, like, the first two sentences. I'm sure he didn't, like, noticeably, like, say anything to her before to make her feel that way, but I think there was some kind of vibe.

[Morgan]

I'm curious what everyone thinks. I don't know. Like, I'm looking at myself and, like, I have always had issues with, like, my, like, body image and how comfortable I feel in my own skin. And my partner has never, ever done anything to make me feel like I'm not beautiful. Like, he's the only one that's made me feel good ever. But I'm still insecure. So it's like I'm kind of putting myself at it, like, from that perspective. Am I mean, to other people that are conventionally more attractive than me? No, because I've done some self work, but, like, I still feel insecure in my own head. I want to, like, put the power more on her in this because I do think her behavior is horrible.

[Jenna]

No, totally. I think the reason I'm coming at from not even, like, her not being an asshole, just saying that. I think part of it also might have been there's more. There's that she could tell him feeling that way is because he said it to her very loudly and assuredly at the end. So, like, I don't think it's a huge leap to be like, maybe he was dropping any kind of, like, nonverbal hints of that before saying it. Cause he felt that way and he said it. You know what I mean?

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

Like, it's not like it's making up that he thinks that about her. He's said it, like, four times now and said it to her face, which.

[Morgan]

I will say a lot of people in the comments are actually like, I'm not seeing a lot of people say, you're the asshole. Op Actually, like, no, I don't think.

[Jenna]

He is the asshole.

[Morgan]

A lot of people love that he. He clapped back at her. Like, a lot of people are like, you actually should have said something in public sooner.

[Jenna]

I think he should have said something, but not that I think he should have said, hey, that's not really kind. Or like, he should have Said something that is, like, more conducive to making everyone feel better. I don't think he needed to say the worst thing he could possibly say.

[Morgan]

It's definitely a low blow, but a lot of people point to it and they say, not the asshole. Op. The only person here who is not acting like a mature adult is your wife. You talked to her in private and she didn't listen. Unfortunately, sometimes people have to be called out in public in order for them to get the point. Jumping on here to add that the wife had no problem embarrassing Rachel in public, but got mad when hubby did the same to her. So a lot of.

[Jenna]

I do think it's different between two kind of like associates versus a husband to his wife calling another woman right there more attractive. I don't know. The thing is, like, yes, saying something made sense, but he didn't need to say, well, it's because she's hotter than you that you feel this way. Like, I think there's an in between place here where we can meet. And like, he says something to defeat to kind of scold her in public and be like, hey, that's not okay. You know that's not true. She's a beautiful. Even just saying, like, you know, she's a beautiful woman. You don't need to tear her down. Anything would be fine.

[Morgan]

I feel like if he would have just said, you're jealous of her.

[Jenna]

Yeah, that's also fine.

[Morgan]

That's. That's still like, okay, there's the stop sign after that.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Because it's driving the point home.

[Jenna]

Or you don't need to be jealous of the attention she's getting because it's not about, like, it shouldn't be to him that she's hotter. It should just be like, okay, clearly you're insecure about the way other people are treating her. I just, I still don't think that between spouses, you need to say you're doing this because she's hotter than you.

[Morgan]

Yeah, in an ideal world, he would have just said, you're jealous. But, like, I do think it's time he said something in public. Like, hey, babe, not okay. Yeah, your jealousy is showing. Like, it's time to reprimand her in front of people. I do kind of agree with that. Because you were saying everything in private and she wasn't getting the message and she was going to continue this forever until, yeah, you said something. Or, you know, Rachel and her fiance, Op's friend said, no, enough is enough. We don't even want to be around her, and that's where we're at. So now OP's gotta move forward and evaluate how this goes from here, and.

[Jenna]

The wife has some work to do. Like, really? Like, what? You're just never gonna be friends with like, an attractive person ever in your life.

[Morgan]

Like, I mean, how many Reddit stories have we had on here, though, where people are like, my sister picked all of her bridesmaids that were less attractive friends. She didn't even ask her best friends because all of her best friends are, I don't think I've heard, prettier than her. Like, people are so insecure and it's. It's easy to be insecure. Like, I'm insecure about stuff. Like, it. It's just like this little venom bug and it's just like, it's hard. But at the same time, I think you said you had a comment where you're like, just because you're dealing with something doesn't mean you can make everyone miserable because of it. Yeah, and that's the reality. It's like, we all have our own issues, we're all battling something, but you need to address it. It's not everyone else's problem. And they shouldn't suffer and be made to feel like shit because you feel inadequate and less than.

[Jenna]

Yeah, especially this poor 24 year old girl who's just trying to become friends with her fiance's friends.

[Morgan]

I know. And how hard would that be? I'm so curious how they met, but that's besides the point in this story.

[Jenna]

I know. Why can't when we read a Reddit story, every single person involved also write their version of events and then we can put it together.

[Morgan]

I need a full synopsis of the friend group.

[Jenna]

Yes.

[Morgan]

How everyone met, a full timeline. Thank you.

[Jenna]

Yes, thank you.

[Morgan]

Okay, moving on to this next one. This episode is brought to you by Credit Karma. When it comes to your money, credit Karma keeps you ahead of the game. And you can count on Credit Karma to keep up with your financial needs. As they evolve, they'll help you monitor your progress and give personalized recommendations so you can make strides towards your goals and find your way to money. Make sure you're on the right track no matter where you are on your financial journey. Intuit. Credit Karma. Karma you can count on. Okay, so this one is coming from Aitah. It is titled Am I the asshole for making my daughter's boyfriend buy a new T shirt? Okay, can you please settle a mild dispute for my family? 23rd December, my daughters 19 boyfriend 19 came over for dinner. We had a dinner then because he's going away with his family for Christmas. He arrived, rang the bell, and I answered the door. He came in, took off his jacket, and that's when I saw it. He was wearing a T shirt that said, quote, it's not gonna suck itself.

[Jenna]

That is not what I was expecting.

[Morgan]

I took one look at that shirt and asked him if he had any money. He said no and asked why. I told him that that shirt showed a marked lack of respect for both my daughter and my wife. I pulled two twenties out of my wallet and quietly ushered him back out the door and towards the Walmart three miles away and told him to buy a more respectful shirt and then come back with it on. Mind you, this whole exchange took place between him and I without an audience. He was gone for 15 minutes, came back with a nice polo shirt on. We had a nice dinner together, and nothing was mentioned about the incident. The next day, my daughter came to me and her mother and told us what I did. How I humiliated him.

[Jenna]

Oh, my God.

[Morgan]

They aren't in breakup territory or anything. And no yelling or anything of the sort went on. My wife did tell me I could have handled it differently. So, Reddit, am I wrong for handling it this way? And if so, how could I have handled it?

[Jenna]

He handled it perfectly.

[Morgan]

Splendidly. Are you kidding? This was an eloquent way to teach him a lesson about tact, appropriateness.

[Jenna]

Do you have any fucking respect showing up to your girlfriend's family's house in a shirt that says it's not gonna suck itself? Are you kidding me?

[Morgan]

In front of her parents?

[Jenna]

In front. Yeah, in front of her parents. And in front of anyone I like. I hate that. I hate that. That's so disrespect. Like, and you're with your girlfriend, like, ugh, insane.

[Morgan]

I'm googling pictures of the shirt. From what I can find online especially.

[Jenna]

I feel like I've seen that before.

[Morgan]

Well, given the context, like, this is the holidays too. I'm assuming it's this one that has, like, a big candy cane on it and it just says it ain't gonna suck itself with, like, a candy cane kind of wrapped up. Yeah, we all know what it means though, right? Like, it doesn't matter.

[Jenna]

I mean, it could be that one.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I don't know, it could be this lollipop version.

[Jenna]

There's also one that just has the text on it and an arrow pointing down. Like, it could be any version of that shirt. They're all bad. I mean, like, maybe it's a seasonal one. Sounds like this kid doesn't potentially have the money to be just buying seasonal specific shirts. In that way though, I feel like I wasn't doing that when I was younger. Getting a Christmas themed. It's not going to suck itself.

[Morgan]

This is insane. Like, there's another version of it with like a guy in a sombrero doing a dab with a tequila lime shot thing in his hand. Like, it's just.

[Jenna]

Either way, it's a reference to suck my dick. And you are at your daughter's family's house. And I am shocked that the daughter and the mom are both like, oh, you could have handled it better. Like, what? He could have been way worse. I would have punched him in the face. You come to. You come with my child in tow, wearing a shirt that says it's not gonna suck itself. I am beating your ass.

[Morgan]

What?

[Jenna]

I am. Like, you're leaving with bruises.

[Morgan]

Like, I. I don't understand. Who do you think you are? I don't understand in what world he ever thought that would be appropriate.

[Jenna]

Have some respect for my child. This is also. How old are they again? Like 17.

[Morgan]

They're not 17.

[Jenna]

Okay, well, still, that's teenagers.

[Morgan]

Yeah. First year of college, even if your kids are out of the house, old enough to be sexually active, like, I feel like it's not one of those things you wanna.

[Jenna]

They could be 35 and it's still inappropriate and disrespectful.

[Morgan]

Dude, it's so, it's so interesting. And this is like a conversation that's come up a lot lately. When people like start trying to get pregnant, they're like, yeah, we're, you know, we're actively trying and like, they have these like, intense conversations.

[Jenna]

It's like, it's like, so you're coming inside of me?

[Morgan]

Yeah. I was just like, okay, thanks. Great.

[Jenna]

Uh huh.

[Morgan]

It's like, okay, everyone be mature. But it's like, I know, but still, it's just not my ideal vision.

[Jenna]

And this is much worse. I also just feel like, how much could he care about and respect his partner if he like looked at himself in the mirror and didn't even think, oh, this might come off as disrespectful or like, oh, I want to, I want to make a good impression on her parents, you know what I mean? Like, when my parents met my last boyfriend, after he left, they were like, yeah, it was good. He seemed, he seemed nervous, which made us feel better because it shows he cared and like, you know, like all of those things. It's like there are things that people do if they really value the person they're with. And I don't know. That's just on so many levels. The dad could have done worse. And I support him in all future endeavors.

[Morgan]

I think he did great. He didn't even mention the incident.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

He kept it discreet. He was gone. He went to Walmart. Fifteen minutes away, there and back. He's prim and proper. Like, this is a win, win. And then he'll think twice because it was inappropriate. This was you going to your girlfriend's house and celebrating Christmas with her family. Yeah. Put a nice shirt on. Like you're showing a lack of respect for your girlfriend, her body, your girlfriend's family.

[Jenna]

And he could have worn like probably the most raggedy shirt as long as it didn't say something sexually offensive about their daughter.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

You know, like, it's not even about it being a nice. He should have worn just a nice shirt. But it's not even about it being a nice shirt or not. It's about what it said.

[Morgan]

It's the message. Yeah. Top comment. You were very classy about it and even gave him the opportunity to get a new shirt instead of just going home and changing. Not the asshole. Next comment. And paid for the new shirt. Kid probably spent 15 on the shirt. So he's probably up $25 too.

[Jenna]

Yeah. Yeah. Giving him $40 for a shirt at Walmart. He's got change. I hope he gave him the change. He probably pocketed it. Asshole.

[Morgan]

I was actually. I did some angel tree shopping at Walmart this year. I didn't know you could take the angel tree things and go to other stores, so I just did it there. But like, especially if you've got a little kid. Kids go through clothes so quickly. Their clothes. Kids clothes prices were so good. Yeah.

[Jenna]

No, children's clothes prices are very affordable.

[Morgan]

And they're cute.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like I.

[Jenna]

It's nice because I do have like a niece and a nephew and I've been getting them stuff and it's like some of it is more. But it's such little fabric compared to adult clothes. So it's like able to be, I know, less expensive.

[Morgan]

I had a good time. I love shopping and I know everyone. Like, it's like I get confused where you can and can't shop these days. I love shopping. So drop any good racks? Not that. Any baby clothes. My mom's got all my baby clothes in bins, so I'm hopefully not going to have to Buy anything. Okay, we do get an edit.

[Jenna]

Oh wait. Oh my God, I forgot it was the updates episode. This is my Christmas.

[Morgan]

I'm 57 and a long haul truck driver. So I've had my share of bad moments. Most of us guys here can remember stupid things that we did as a teen, even into our 20s. The one that stands out for me are the ones where someone didn't react with anger or malice. They were the ones that someone reacted with constructive kindness. One where a quiet redemption was offered, where a mirror was quietly held up to my behavior. Those are the ones I learned from and appreciated the most. Hopefully he comes out the other side with a new appreciation for kindness offered quietly and without fanfare. Just my thoughts.

[Jenna]

I mean, that's all nice to say, but I do think the boyfriend's reaction to all of it and like complaining to the girlfriend in private kind of shows that he like, isn't taking this in a way that makes me feel hopeful that this was a moment for change. I mean, like, he needed a kick in the butt, but I don't know if he heard it. You know what I mean?

[Morgan]

We get more updates. That was just the edit.

[Jenna]

Oh, oh, okay. That was the edit. So.

[Morgan]

Update 1. After reading these comments and listening to everyone's point of view, I sat my daughter down this morning and asked what her boyfriend actually said to her. This changes my opinion of him too. Apparently he had not told my daughter what the phrase was on the shirt, but did tell her accurately what I said to him and asked him to do. He didn't use the word humiliated. That was my daughter's interpretation. Her rush to defend him came from our examples. Apparently she took notes of times I've defended my wife and vice versa. She also took note of our disagreements in private after the fact. She's going to talk to him when he gets back tomorrow to follow up on why he thought the shirt was appropriate for a family setting. I'll update again after that conversation.

[Jenna]

Okay, this explains so much because I was so confused why the daughter and the wife were like coming at him with that energy and now it's like, oh, he didn't tell her what the shirt said.

[Morgan]

Which is the whole context of, hey, your dad made me go to Walmart to go get a new shirt. What was up with that? He humiliated me. What was on your shirt? Why would he make you change?

[Jenna]

Yeah, and him not saying that shows he knows there's a problem with it.

[Morgan]

Uh huh.

[Jenna]

So like, what are we doing?

[Morgan]

Update 2. My daughter called him about an hour Ago and this will be informative. She asked him why he had not told her what the shirt said when he talked to her. His reply was telling, quote, because it was embarrassing.

[Jenna]

Right? So now why are you trying to like, oh my God, you could have just skirted by this incident then if you hadn't brought the dad into it like this.

[Morgan]

Then she went on to ask him why he wore it originally and he admitted that the shirt had been a gift from his older brother, 21 and that the older brother had dared him to and called him a chicken when he objected. Dumb. Oh my God, dumb sibling crap. Apparently. She went on to tell him that none of what he'd done was cool and that she really liked him and that he had always been kind to her. She said she wasn't breaking up with him, but that these steps needed to be done. First, he needed to explain to his parents the entire situation. Second, he needed to show up in person to our home and bring the money for the shirt. And as she put it, put in a whole ass kissing session that included the explanation of the dare, et cetera. She said that if this was handled well, they could talk about moving forward and what that looked like. After the phone call, she talked to her mom and I and admitted that she forgot her worth. She said that I, as long as she had been alive, had never gone out of my way to embarrass her mom and that I had always been respectful and not let anyone be disrespectful to her mom. That made me feel good so she wasn't going to settle for less. Good for her. I'll update after his visit later tomorrow afternoon.

[Jenna]

Good for her putting down those rules. I love it. The oh my God, my brother dared me and said I'd be a chicken. Say okay then I'm a chicken asshole. I don't want to disrespect my girlfriend in front of her parents.

[Morgan]

Or you wear it out of the house and then change in your car.

[Jenna]

But also, just like doing a dare to not be called a chicken makes you a chicken. Like that makes you a bitch. Like, are you kidding? You can't handle your brother being like, oh, you're a chicken. Stand up for something. Be a man. Yeah.

[Morgan]

Update three. Oh, this will make most of you following this saga laugh. I received a call this evening from Mr. Boyfriend's parents. Firstly, they are mortified and extremely apologetic. Also, I feel like these kids are still in high school, like with the parents being involved.

[Jenna]

I know, but 19 is really young.

[Morgan]

They could be seniors in high school and just old for their grade.

[Jenna]

They could be or like going to a community college or living at home. Still living at home. Yeah, like a nearby college. True.

[Morgan]

Very true. True. Secondly, and the whole best part of this update, I have their permission to squeal is that his parents are on Reddit and commented on my post in support of the way I handled the situation.

[Jenna]

You're kidding.

[Morgan]

They told me that they love my daughter and that we had raised her right and had not raised their sons to show this level of disrespect for anyone, let alone his girlfriend. Apparently, boyfriend was following up on one of my daughter's conditions and went to talk to his parents. As the story unfolded, his mom reached for her phone, opened Reddit and yelled, is this about fucking you? To quote his dad quote as the son read the first half paragraph, he died a little inside. So anyways, they are going to come to dinner tomorrow evening with boyfriend. More updates tomorrow night.

[Jenna]

That's crazy. This is very vindicating, I'll tell you, because in the original post I was like, why is everyone saying that the dad was wrong, but once they heard the actual story, it sounds like every single person, including the kid's parents, are like, you were right.

[Morgan]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, this is good. Update 4 Dinner was very pleasant. Let me say that his parents are great. Boyfriend showed up with red roses for my daughter and yellow roses for my wife. He offered what I thought was a very sincere apology and a card with the entire $40 in it. Even though he'd given me the change and receipt on the original night I cooked tonight to give my wife a break, I made an Indian dish called butter chicken with basmati rice. Neither had eaten curry before, but loved it. Woohoo. As it turns out, older brother is the family athlete. JV soccer, varsity soccer and sports scholarship for soccer. The quintessential jock little brother is the exact opposite. Artistic, he's got real talent. Sensitive, quiet, and felt like he never measured up to big brother and works to gain big brother's respect. Brother takes full advantage of this and exploits his little brother for shits and giggles. Near the end of dinner, daughter says, I think I'll keep him around for a little longer. You guys okay with that? We are good with that. For now. His mom is the boss though, for thinking outside the box. As punishment to older brother, mom went into his clothing drawers and closet, took every shirt off of him and bought him eight very bright pink T shirts that he'll wear until he realizes just how damaging exploiting someone, anyone is his access to cash is also cut off until the lesson is learned.

[Jenna]

Wait, how old are they? I keep getting so confused.

[Morgan]

Older brother's 21.

[Jenna]

Oh, oh, she's.

[Morgan]

They're cutting off the older one.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

Pink shirts, no cash.

[Jenna]

I was cut off at. I was living my life at 21.

[Morgan]

But okay, sure, right.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Again, take over what you will. Anyways, a successful night with new friends was enjoyed. Hope this was the update you hoped for.

[Jenna]

Yeah, I mean, listen, I'm open to, to change to. It looks like they'll, you know, if everything works out from here, their families have a great relationship. That's always fun. It's nice that he was vindicated on all sides in this way.

[Morgan]

I think so too. And it's kind of nice. Like brother. Older brothers getting a taste of his own medicine. Like someone on the best of Redditor. Update comments oh, what a delicious punishment for the older brother. I know plenty of guys who could have confidently rocked pink, but if his mom specifically chose it, you know it's going to hurt him.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And he's probably in college. Like he's getting a ride or whatever for soccer in college. But I'm sure mom and dad are still sending him money for everything else.

[Jenna]

Can wear pink in college. And everyone's like, oh, that's so cool that you're doing that, bro. Like I, I frat guys, they're wearing the hell out of salmon.

[Morgan]

Are you kidding me? They love pink.

[Jenna]

They love fucking salmon pink shirts.

[Morgan]

But his on left, right, center. She said my son don't rock pink.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And now he's got eight T shirts. That's all he's got is pink.

[Jenna]

Yeah, it's sort of like a good punishment, but it's really not like that. Like terrible.

[Morgan]

Yeah, no, no. I mean it could have been worse for him. But all around everyone wins.

[Jenna]

Lessons were learned.

[Morgan]

Lessons were learned.

[Jenna]

Showing up with the flowers after, that's so funny. I mean it's clearly his parents money.

[Morgan]

It's really, it's cute though.

[Jenna]

Like yeah, sure, of course.

[Morgan]

I mean I remember, I don't know, I started working really young. I was like 15 when I got my first job at Perkins and so like I, I bought everything with my own money. High school, college. Like I had some help with rent here and there, but I don't know.

[Jenna]

I just feel like he's using his parents money because they're talking about cutting off their 21 year old son.

[Morgan]

True.

[Jenna]

So I just like I don't think these kids are. Yeah, I don't know.

[Morgan]

It doesn't sound like anyone has a job. I mean, he didn't have money to go buy the new shirt in the first place, but I like it. I think this is a happy ending. By totally.

[Jenna]

No. Yeah, it's a happy ending. Happy for all of them. You know, stay on track, stay the course. Follow the lessons your parents have given you. Don't follow the lessons of that older brother. And I hope the older brother also, you know, like why are you messing.

[Morgan]

With your younger this episode is brought to you by Intuit TurboTax doing your taxes. The old school stress spiral way endless paperwork, confusion and unsure if you're even doing it right. Yeah, we're leaving that in the past with TurboTax. Get matched with a dedicated full service expert who can jump in and handle everything for you even as soon as Today it's the update tax finally needed. Way easier, way smoother and your TurboTax expert will still get every dollar you deserve. Visit TurboTax.com today.

[Jenna]

Younger brother like that? Why are you setting him up?

[Morgan]

Older siblings are mean. Yeah, I got tortured. My brother hated me.

[Jenna]

My older siblings were pretty nice to me.

[Morgan]

I didn't get that experience. I did not get that. Okay, moving on to this next one. This is a weird one. Could be a little scary. I don't know. Okay, I don't know. This third story is coming from R Relationship Advice. Just posted about a week ago. A little less six days ago.

[Jenna]

Wow.

[Morgan]

It is titled My 38 male wife, 38 female. Admitted to me that she has quite an intense crush on her personal trainer. What's the next step?

[Jenna]

I hope you know, I hope that the personal trainer is objectively hotter than.

[Morgan]

The husband, but he's conventionally more attractive. We've been together for 15 years, married for 10. In that time she's always done something fitness wise, be it running or the gym or cycling. About a year ago she decided she wanted to be stronger. She started doing weights at the gym and she was getting there. But around four months ago she said she needed some guidance and started doing sessions with one of the gym's personal trainers. She was really enjoying it and about a month ago she upped it from two sessions a week to three. There has been a noticeable change in her strength and I was happy for her as she seemed really proud of herself. Then this weekend she dropped a bombshell on me. I had noticed our sex life had pretty much come to a stop a couple of months ago and I spoke to her about it and she said that she was sorry it was just the stress of starting a new job mixed with the cold weather and she just wasn't in the mood. I thought that was fair enough and I'd leave it at that and let her lead the pace when she was ready to again. Well, this weekend she told me that she has developed a very intense crush on her personal trainer and that while she knows crushes happen in relationships, this feels like it's more she said she finds herself constantly seeking his attention either at the gym or on social media. She has started tagging him in all of her posts, but I just assumed it was more of a giving credit thing. Then she admitted she has started wearing less and less at the gym to get his attention, which is something I hadn't noticed as she always takes a gym bag with her and gets changed there. She admitted that the last few times we had sex she fantasized that it was him and that's why she stopped having sex as she felt too guilty. Probably the worst thing she told me was that a few days ago she saw him having a personal session with someone else, a younger woman more his age, and she saw them laughing together and that she got jealous and upset and she had to leave the gym and go cry in her car. She said he has done nothing to encourage this and has been nothing but professional throughout all of this and he is not at fault. I don't know what to do. I'm crushed. Do I sit back and wait for the crush to stop? Do I demand she changes gyms and blocks this guy? We've all had crushes in relationships and eventually they go, but I feel like this one won't. She's being alone with him three times a week and follows him on all of her social media accounts. I feel like distance is how you get over this, but I don't want to come across as controlling. What do you think? She doesn't want to change anything and thinks it will just go away on its own.

[Jenna]

Can I ask you something? Do you think that there's a time when, like that is too honest? Like the details she was giving him, like it kept going, it kept going and like, I actually don't think you need to tell him you're thinking of him when you're having sex with him. Like maybe it made her feel better to get this all off her chest, but I don't think it actually helps him to know all that.

[Morgan]

I think no.

[Jenna]

Like, obviously you do have to be honest to an extent of like, but you could just really be basic about it and be like, I have had feelings for my trainer and I'm very her being. Like, and I've been trying to dress slutty too. Like, why do you need to tell him that?

[Morgan]

Yeah, the last time we had sex I was envisioning fucking him and hoping he would get me off, but it was you. And I just, I felt so guilty about envisioning him. So that's why I stopped you.

[Jenna]

And then I saw him laughing with someone and I went to the car and cried.

[Morgan]

That's delusional.

[Jenna]

Like, what, why are you telling all of this to him?

[Morgan]

Because it makes her feel better.

[Jenna]

It's just going to make him feel worse.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And I think a lot of times you need to ask yourself that, like when you're sharing information with people or apologizing or being honest, is it for you or them? Like you can be honest but like to an extent. Right. Like, honey, I just, I feel guilty about this crush I have on my trainer at the gym. Yeah, I think I need to change gyms.

[Jenna]

Yes. Yeah. Because I was going to say, like, if you have a crush on someone but technically like haven't actually done anything, like at that point, do you say something if you genuinely think it's going to pass and you're not going to act on it and nothing's going to. Like, I don't know what the right thing to do is in that, in that situation.

[Morgan]

I don't know either. Like even now, I mean, obviously these two have been together for 15 years, married for 10.

[Jenna]

Right.

[Morgan]

I've been with Justin for seven, but like, I don't have co workers, I don't have workplace crushes. Like I haven't had a crush.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But like I feel like we both have crushes on the same people. Like oddly, where we're like, oh, that TV announcer, we love him, he's so great, he's so cute.

[Jenna]

It's different.

[Morgan]

It's different. Like I don't have a crush on someone.

[Jenna]

I don't think in my last two or like they were very like a lot shorter than a marriage. But like in my last two relationships there wasn't a point where I had a crush on someone else either.

[Morgan]

I feel like for me a crush when I'm in a relationship is just like a, oh, I think you're cute in like a teddy bear way. Like I don't find you physically attractive, but I haven't had that type of crush yet. If I did have this type of crush, I'm a very solution based person. I would be in my head. This isn't good.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I'm not healthy in the way I'm feeling.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

This isn't right. I'm gonna switch gems.

[Jenna]

This could ruin my life.

[Morgan]

I'm gonna remove myself from this. I love my husband. This clearly isn't healthy for me.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Going in my car and crying because I saw him laughing with someone else.

[Jenna]

No, that's crazy.

[Morgan]

I need to go talk to someone. Like, that's not good. But would I mention it to my partner? It's interesting because it feels like almost like, was she telling him this for permission to be like, you should explore, babe. Let's open the relationship. Like, I don't know.

[Jenna]

I'm like, I guess.

[Morgan]

Like, I don't know. Like, are there any of you out there that you. You would share this with your. Your partner and be like, I have this intense crush. I'm crying when I see him with other people.

[Jenna]

I don't think one or the other is, like, right or wrong. I think, like, either option could be right in both situations. Like, I think it could be right to just move gyms, never say anything. And I think it also could be right in another relationship to be like, I just wanted you to know I was feeling this way, and I knew it was wrong, and I value our relationship more, so I stopped seeing this person. I don't know. It's interesting because OP also said we've all had crushes in all of our relationships or whatever, so it sounds like maybe he also has had a crush, but I don't think it would ever have been to, like, the extent that he's talking about in this situation. No.

[Morgan]

And, like, even if you did have a crush, like, it's. A crush is, like, more innocent. Like, it doesn't mean you see that person with someone else.

[Jenna]

This is more deep. Yeah.

[Morgan]

And you're so emotionally torn up about it, you have to leave to go cry privately. You're married. Not to that person. Like, if you saw your husband flirting with someone else. Okay, but, like, I will, ma'.

[Jenna]

Am.

[Morgan]

This has gone too far.

[Jenna]

I will say, when he is writing in this, I'm wondering if it's even up to him at this point. It almost sounds like she's trying to leave him.

[Morgan]

That's what I'm like, why?

[Jenna]

Because he's like, what should I do? And I'm like, how many options do you have? Like, does she even still want to be in this relationship? Or was that, like, a goodbye? It almost sounded like a goodbye, a goodbye.

[Morgan]

Or, like, she's trying to test the waters of, like, opening things up. I haven't read the update for this one. I have no idea what we're about to encounter. I'm just like, I'm blown away because I, I, I totally agree. It's like you don't really have an option besides setting a boundary and being like, I would appreciate it if you switch gyms.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But at the end of the day, if she doesn't want to switch gyms, you can't control her. And then you have to say, I'm uncomfortable with this. Let's go to couples counseling. Let's move towards separation, because clearly something's up.

[Jenna]

Yeah. And if you're gonna keep seeing someone that you have said you have this encounter, extremely intense crush on, then that is not valuing the commitment to our marriage over this other thing.

[Morgan]

100.

[Jenna]

So I'm so curious.

[Morgan]

Top comment on this one. Crying in her car because he talked to another client. That sounds like a lot more than just a crush. Someone responds and they go, sounds like limerence. When a crush crosses over into unhealthy obsession territory, it usually isn't about the person. It's a coping mechanism in order to fill a deficit, so to speak, in her own life through someone else.

[Jenna]

That makes a lot of sense to me because even hearing that, I was like, I don't think she would even feel that way if she saw her husband, like, laughing with a co worker, you know? So this just feels like, it just doesn't feel like real almost.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And I don't, it's totally, I think it's totally one sided.

[Jenna]

Oh, of course.

[Morgan]

Like, I, well, I mean, maybe he'd.

[Jenna]

Have sex with her, but I don't.

[Morgan]

Or she's just lying about it being one sided and there is something more going on, but she doesn't want to.

[Jenna]

Why would she tell everything else? I know. It's so weird.

[Morgan]

It's so odd. I did click because the person in that comment about limerence linked another subreddit and there is a subreddit for limerence support and information. Apparently. It's a term invented by psychologist Dorothy Tenov and it's from her book Love and Limerence. It describes the state of being madly in love or intensely infatuated when reciprocation is uncertain. Yes.

[Jenna]

Okay. I was gonna say, I tweeted this once. I was like, I wish someone would love me the way people on catfish love strangers that won't video chat with them. And it's, it's such a thing of like this intense obsession where it's like, you wouldn't even feel that way about someone you had an actual healthy, perfect, incredible relationship with. And it's like the fantasy of it all. And I absolutely think that that might be what's at play here. I don't think, like, the reality of a relationship with anybody would really be as intense as what you're making it out to be like in your mind. But then where does that leave the person that's actually in a relationship with you? So I don't know.

[Morgan]

The third wheel.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Like the third wheel to your unhealthy obsession. Yeah. And your infatuation with a reality that doesn't exist. OP has an edit on the original post. Okay, thank you all for the replies. There's too many to keep up with. I spoke to her last night and got a bit more information and then went and spoke to him and got some more.

[Jenna]

The drama.

[Morgan]

He has done nothing wrong. I'll post an update after work tonight.

[Jenna]

Oh. Oh, I'm seated. He spoke to him?

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

Wait. I feel like something must have. I don't know, like she must have tried something in order for him to have gone and talked to him.

[Morgan]

Or he just wanted to know the truth from his perspective.

[Jenna]

Right.

[Morgan]

Because what she's saying is a little.

[Jenna]

Oh, my God out there.

[Morgan]

So the update comes three days later.

[Jenna]

Okay, so that's like, three days ago.

[Morgan]

Three days. It came on the 24th. Yeah.

[Jenna]

Wow.

[Morgan]

Three days ago. So I spoke to my wife the night after my original post. I said, she needs to leave her personal trainer quit that gym, and we need to start going to couples counseling. She wasn't happy and started arguing, saying, it's only a crush and it'll pass, and she's making good progress, and then started to frame it as me not caring about her health. Once she realized I wasn't budging, she started trying to bargain with me and saying, what if she stopped seeing the personal trainer? Could she still go to the gym? And if she started having sex with me again, we don't need couples counseling. I lost my temper at this point, I admit, and I shouted, enough. I want to know everything. Tell me everything you've done. I want to read your messages with him. I want to see these outfits you are wearing. I need to know everything now. She said, fine, and stormed off upstairs. She came back down wearing an outfit that was a bit much to be fair for the gym in a cold country. But I didn't say anything and I asked to see her phone, putting on.

[Jenna]

The outfit and coming back downstairs is so funny. Like, I'm picturing her just, like, storming down in this like it's a fashion show.

[Morgan]

Okay. She said she deleted the messages.

[Jenna]

Oh, of course.

[Morgan]

When I asked why, she was honest and said she sent him a topless selfie on Christmas Day when I was downstairs cooking the dinner for her bloody family.

[Jenna]

Oh, that just escalated so much.

[Morgan]

She then said that while she's confessing, she also kissed another man on a night out in the first year of our relationship.

[Jenna]

Oh, my God.

[Morgan]

Fifteen fucking years ago. This lady's just like, here, let's just. Let's get it all out.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I already knew this because her friend, who fancied me at the time, told me about it. I asked her, why him and not me? What's he got that I haven't? She said nothing. And it was more about the situation than him. She said she's starting to feel a regret and, like, she missed out on her youth. She had a boyfriend from school to her early 20s, was single for a year and then met me. She said she started to regret not having more fun and she's starting to enjoy attention from other men more and more, especially younger men.

[Jenna]

So this is just a midlife crisis, but for a woman.

[Morgan]

When she was telling me originally, she said a couple of times, quote, I'm not planning on doing anything. It's just a fantasy, unless you want me to do something.

[Jenna]

Wait. You were right.

[Morgan]

With a nervous laughter. And at the time, it felt a bit like she wanted to do something but was trying to frame it as my idea. But I never really clicked properly. I asked her if, when she told me she was expecting me to give her permission, and she said she genuinely thought, because I don't get jealous, I would be okay with it. I fucking knew it. I still feel like I wasn't being given everything, though. The outfit and the kiss. Confession felt like distractions and something was missing. Even telling me about all of this in the first place felt a bit like she was trying to get her story in before someone else told me. I said, I'm going for a drive. And then I went to the gym to speak to her personal trainer. I approached him and said, I'm not here for trouble. I understand my wife has been harassing you. He wasn't happy being approached this way, which I get. But he asked me who my wife was, and when I told him, he's.

[Jenna]

Like, there's a few.

[Morgan]

He said he knew something like this was going to happen. He told me that he hadn't trained her since Christmas as he let her go after she had been sending pictures. Oh, plural, plural, plural. Not just the one she told me about. He said since then she had kept messaging, but he ignored her. He let me read the messages and she had sent 12 pictures over a three month period. One was fully naked and when he told her not to send them, she said she was just showing her progress. The worst part was that she was messaging him. Stuff like, quote, we've had another argument. Could really do with a session to burn off some anger and quote, he's out drinking with his friends again, ignoring me, I'm so lonely. Neither of which are true. And then she told him mid December that she had kicked me out and we were divorcing with the Christmas Day picture. She even said, quote, first Christmas alone.

[Jenna]

This girl's crazy.

[Morgan]

And just last week she messaged him saying I was already seeing someone else. I thanked him and asked him to send me them and I went home. When I got home, she was already gone and just wrote me a note saying, sorry. She's at her friend's house and we've been texting a bit the last couple of days and have a marriage counselor booked for next week, but I think it's done. I'm not even that bothered about the pictures or the flirting or the outfit, the lying about me and our marital status. I don't drink and we haven't argued in years. I'm downstairs entertaining her family while she's sending nudes. She's never sent me one. And telling him she's alone. I'm working all this weekend to try and keep my mind busy. Sorry if I don't reply quick enough. And thank you to everyone who took the time to read and reply to my last post.

[Jenna]

I have so many thoughts and may I start with. Okay, so now it does make sense that she was oversharing so much in the beginning because actually there was so much more.

[Morgan]

That's why I'm like, for what? Like, why do you feel so guilty if it's just a little crush?

[Jenna]

Yeah, like, why would you tell him every single, like, thought you've had that, like, hasn't been acted on, but it's because she was overcompensating with those details to cover, like, the bigger details.

[Morgan]

It was almost like a magician being like, like, look over here, look over here. Not over here, it's over here. It's. Yep, right here.

[Jenna]

I feel like, I mean, and then, yeah, him saying, like, I wasn't even bothered by the news I was like, I guess she's right about him not being a very jealous person. Like, them. So confused. But, like, she was, like, sexually harassing this guy.

[Morgan]

Yeah. No, that is horrible. Getting unsolicited nudes from someone.

[Jenna]

It's just my progress.

[Morgan]

Pictures, especially a client. Like, you're trying to keep it so professional. This is your job. And then now you're getting harassed through your work, and she's, like, obsessed with him.

[Jenna]

It's very.

[Morgan]

Yeah, that limerence. That's a new one.

[Jenna]

I think that that comment was very illuminating. Yeah, I was gonna say illuminative, but I was like, there's no way that's illuminating.

[Morgan]

We can make up a word illuminating.

[Jenna]

Yeah. I mean, that's crazy. I just. I don't know how. Also, you would, like, look at the messages of your wife sending to someone else, like, unanswered, like, desperate for them, and then, like, not feel like they were settling with you or, like, I don't know. It would just be, like, an ick. Also.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

Like, ugh. Like, you are sexually harassing this man and he is not interested in you. Like, this is icky.

[Morgan]

No. And, like, the thing is, with her, this guy kept it really professional. He was not interested. But she was actively trying to cheat.

[Jenna]

That's the thing. That's the thing.

[Morgan]

If he would have said yes. She's been having an affair for months.

[Jenna]

Yeah. I mean, my friend's boyfriend tried to cheat on her, but the girl he tried to cheat with replied no. And then it's like, well, I didn't cheat, babe. It's like, yeah, but that's.

[Morgan]

You tried.

[Jenna]

You tried. It's because the other.

[Morgan]

Embarrassing that no one wanted to sleep with you, so why do I want to now?

[Jenna]

And her, like, also bringing up the kiss from 15 years ago. Honestly, I bet it felt good as fuck to finally say that. Like, Jesus Christ. Holding onto that for 15 years. It's interesting because he almost seems, like, not 100% sure it's over. I know he had that little comment at the end. Like, I'm pretty sure it's over, but sometimes, like, sometimes people get pulled back in after, like, a. We've been texting again. We've been talking. Especially if he's already not a very jealous person in general. And the only thing that bothers him is her lying about their marriage and their marriage, which was crazy, by the way.

[Morgan]

He's drunk again with his friends. Like, you're slandering his name.

[Jenna]

He's already with another woman. Like, the drama of this Girl.

[Morgan]

Also, like, I just can't even imagine this. Text. Ma'. Am. First Christmas alone. Yes. Here's my tits.

[Jenna]

What? I don't know. Like, it's crazy.

[Morgan]

The first couple nudes didn't work. You think?

[Jenna]

Number 12 on Christmas with a sad caption.

[Morgan]

Also, I definitely have regrets about, like, having a boyfriend in college. But, like, like, I. I fully enjoyed my. My twenties. Like, my early twenties and dating and getting out there. I'm so thankful for that. But, like, her coming out, this perspective of, like, I feel like I missed out. It's like.

[Jenna]

Well, yeah, I feel like a lot of people say that, though. Like, I feel like we hear that a lot.

[Morgan]

That then, like, how do you combat those feelings? If you're married, you have kids, and now you're looking back at your life and you're like, damn, I missed out. Like, why do you feel like you need to resort to, like, unhealthy habits and cheating? Why can't you be like, hey, I'm gonna go on a girls trip to, I don't know, Vegas or Cancun or wherever you want to go and, like, have a good girls trip. Why do you have to ruin your life?

[Jenna]

When I was, like, 15, 16 years old, I dabbled in some emotional cheating.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Jenna]

And let me just be honest about that, because I was very, very insecure at the time. And, like, it just meant so much to me that, like, someone cared about me in that way. And then I grew up a little bit, stopped feeling insecure. Hadn't done that in any relationship after that. And I'm almost wondering if, like, if it's this level of, like, security versus insecurity and it, like, feeling better at certain points in your life, like, because you're not feeling your best to then get that outside attention because you don't have as much of it, like, internally.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

I don't know. Like, that's just kind of my guess with how this, like, trends sometimes with, like, people's aging and stuff. Yeah, but it's just like, this is an extreme. Like, I mean, you don't have to harass someone like this about it.

[Morgan]

No. We do have one final edit from op. Thank you all for all of the replies. I really do appreciate it. There's been so many. I just can't keep up. Thank you to the people who have DMed me as well. I really appreciate it. I've decided to not bother with marriage counseling and just start divorce proceedings this week.

[Jenna]

Wow.

[Morgan]

Life really can turn upside in a week. I never thought I'd Be single again. But here we are.

[Jenna]

And I mean, like, you know, who's not gonna be waiting for her when those divorce papers are signed? The personal trainer.

[Morgan]

No. He's gonna get a restraining order.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I mean, that's insane.

[Jenna]

I know.

[Morgan]

Like, insane. She really needs to go to therapy and get some help and just. I mean, she.

[Jenna]

Yeah, she isn't fit to be in a relationship or a marriage right now. Like, this is really the best thing for both of them, I don't think. Like, what? Even if you were to work on the marriage and, like, try to stay together, is that. Is that feeling she's having gonna go away?

[Morgan]

No.

[Jenna]

And all of a sudden, she's gonna be, like, so fulfilled by this relationship and not. Not want to, like, cheat on you anymore.

[Morgan]

No. And someone does point out here, like. Like, wait, your wife started arguing with you about leaving a personal trainer, but he had already fired her as a client. She was arguing to get to stay just to keep harassing him. She's a troubled person. Please protect yourself. And OP replies and says, as soon as she said she'll stop going to him but still use the gym, it flicked an alarm in my head that something wasn't right. And that, to me, is like, she doesn't even need to talk to him. She just wants to see him from afar. What does that sound like, a stalker?

[Jenna]

It's very Joe from you.

[Morgan]

She's just giving really mentally unhealthy right now, and I get a midlife crisis. I don't know. Like, I. I can see how it happens. But, like, you had a really, seemingly great, supportive husband, and you need to now, like, kind of scale back, get some help, maybe find yourself. Go eat, pray, love, go. I don't know. But, like, don't sexually harass people that are just trying to do their jobs.

[Jenna]

Yeah. Leave that Jim. Leave that man alone. Also, like, just a quick aside, the fact that when the husband came, he was like, which wife is yours? And didn't immediately know for sure is kind of crazy, given all the context that we know now.

[Morgan]

Well, she's probably never been like, this is my husband. This is a picture of him. This is me and him.

[Jenna]

Like, I know, but you would hope that that's the only wife of someone that, like, he would imagine would come to him that way.

[Morgan]

You know, honestly, I wonder if that's a job, like, where you deal with a lot of, like, inappropriate behaviors from.

[Jenna]

I don't know. My trainers have always been inappropriate to me.

[Morgan]

Yeah. What the hell? But maybe I don't Know someone let me know. Moving on to this next one. Did we have the siblings but our cousins or no? What was that story we just had?

[Jenna]

Yes. And like, please don't do another incest story with me. Like, I really, like, I hate them. Literally. Their mothers were twins.

[Morgan]

So this one. I let my stepsister move into my apartment and now she's trying to seduce me. No, not that one.

[Jenna]

Why is it every single one's about a girl? This episode.

[Morgan]

I know we've had a lot of, like, bad women. Am I the asshole for refusing to attend my best friend's engagement party after she uninvited my husband?

[Jenna]

I'm interested.

[Morgan]

Okay. This is coming from Aitah. Titled Am I the asshole for refusing to attend my best friend's engagement party after she uninvited my husband? I, 30, female, never expected my best friend's engagement to end our friendship. But that's what happened. We've been close for years. A few months before her engagement party, she asked me not to bring my baby. I agreed. I understood her reasons. Then, about a week before the party, she told me not to bring my husband. Her reasoning was that if I came with him, other guests would ask why I was allowed to bring my husband while they weren't. The problem is, some of our male friends were invited. My husband and I have been together for 10 years. We're married, and he isn't a stranger to anyone. He's known her for years. We're a friend group. We've spent entire days together, had game nights with mutual friends, and everyone knows us as a couple. I didn't argue or create a scene. I simply told her I wasn't comfortable attending an event celebrating her relationship while being asked to exclude mine. So I didn't go. The reaction was extreme. She accused me of being passive aggressive, sent long messages listing every good thing she had done for me, and told me to forget she ever existed. She ignored my attempts to discuss it. Later, I learned that other babies had been at the party despite her rule for mine months earlier. Eventually, she sent a crying voice note saying that she was hurt and that she waited for me to come to her party. I never insulted her. I didn't retaliate. I just didn't attend the party. I simply stayed home because I refused to exclude my husband. So am I the asshole?

[Jenna]

I kind of like. I just. I wish I could hear both sides. Like, why? I don't know. It is weird that she allowed other babies and didn't allow her baby.

[Morgan]

Yeah, what do you have? What do you. What beef do you have?

[Jenna]

Like, my baby now, why is the baby in it?

[Morgan]

Like, keep my baby's name out of your mouth.

[Jenna]

But, like, I don't know. I would be interested. I mean, I think the thing is, I tend to agree with, like, the person getting married on if there are certain people they don't want at the wedding. Like, that's sort of. Or at, like, a certain party. That's a smaller group of people. Like, that can be really hard. I tend to think, like, they should be able to do whatever they want. And I think, you know, if that's a friend group, you're probably fine going without your husband. And it is a pretty big statement to, like, just not go. But I don't know. Like, I. I don't know what, like, what the reasoning was about the husband. Like, is there some secret beef? Is there, like, behavior that he does when he's drunk? Like, or is it just a personal vendetta? I'm. I'm confused by it. What do you think?

[Morgan]

I'm curious. It doesn't seem like there's any behavior, but, like, you know, it's Reddit. OP could be an unreliable narrator to me, though, given, like, here's all the good things I did for you, but I forget I ever existed.

[Jenna]

It.

[Morgan]

It just seems like such an insane hurt reaction. Like, she seems really hurt, and I don't know why my mind goes here. I don't. Dude, I don't know what shows. I've been watching heated rivalries about it.

[Jenna]

You think this is toxic, Yuri?

[Morgan]

Or, like, I don't know, like, tell me lies or, like, I don't know. I'm like, is she in love with her friend? And it's like, don't bring your baby because I don't want you to pay attention to your baby. I want you to pay attention to me. And don't bring your husband because you should be paying attention to me because you're my friend and I love you and you love me, so you can't have anyone else.

[Jenna]

Like, you should just be.

[Morgan]

Just be focusing on me.

[Jenna]

Interesting.

[Morgan]

I don't know why I'm going there.

[Jenna]

You should write fan fiction. Like, maybe, like, honestly, that'd be a great story and it would. I hope that that is what it is because, like, maybe they'll end up together and it'll be great. But I do.

[Morgan]

I get that. I think I kind of came to that conclusion because of the voicemail. Like, she calls and leaves her a voicemail. Like, I was waiting for you to Come to my party. That almost you told her to forget you ever existed.

[Jenna]

That almost to me sounds more like manipulation of, like, trying to make someone feel bad.

[Morgan]

Oh, it's. But emotional warfare, for sure.

[Jenna]

Like, there are things like, she wrote a list of every good thing she's ever done for me. That's a certain thing where it sounds really bad. But then I could also see from her the other girl's side that she just wrote, like, you know, I showed up for your party even though blah, blah, blah, or I did, and, like, I did this and that, and it could have actually been more normal than the way that it was written by OP So that's one of those things where I try to, like, I try to think from the other person's perspective of, like, is there a way that this could be, like, turned into more of a negative than it actually was intended to be? But, yeah, I'm curious about, like. I just wish that they would give us some look into, like, what the reasons could be. And maybe there's no reason because it's because they're in love.

[Morgan]

My one, like, info question would be info, is this only a girlfriend's engagement party, or is her fiance and all of his friends gonna be there as well?

[Jenna]

Right.

[Morgan]

Because if that's the case, then it's kind of weird. But I understand if it's like, oh, no, this is just like an engagement party for her, and so it's only her girlfriend.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And then it's like, I can't go anywhere without my husband. Like, people have those types of friends too, where they're like, damn, can't we just have a girl's night and you don't bring your boyfriend?

[Jenna]

Yeah, I. Yeah. My first question would be like, so why could so and so and so and so and so and so's baby come? But that wasn't, like, what you were comfortable with for me?

[Morgan]

What's wrong with my baby?

[Jenna]

Yeah, what's wrong with my baby? It always comes back to the baby. Like, what's going on? Like, why wasn't the baby invited?

[Morgan]

So OP does have an edit on the original post. People seem to think she only invited me and not my husband. That's not true. She invited him from the start.

[Jenna]

Oh.

[Morgan]

She discussed the party with us, telling us where, when, and who she was going to invite, and even said, quote, I want you guys to be there. My favorite couple. Then a week before the event, she suddenly asked me to uninvite him without even telling him herself.

[Jenna]

What is the Dr. Like, what happened? Like, what's the drama?

[Morgan]

Did he send her a nude?

[Jenna]

Did he send her a topless photo saying, first Christmas alone?

[Morgan]

What happened?

[Jenna]

What happened?

[Morgan]

Top comment on the post. Sometimes relationships don't end. They are just complete. Sorry this happened to you, but this relationship is complete. I actually really like looking at it that way. Versus, like, a friendship ended. Like, no, no, no. Like, like the relationship just finished its cycle.

[Jenna]

Yeah, no, that is. That is a nice way of looking at it.

[Morgan]

No bad blood. We're just. We're complete.

[Jenna]

We're good. I just. I would love more context on this. I hate it when they don't tell us, like, this happened. And maybe it's about this or, like, this is the reason they gave or. I don't know. I'm so. Give me more.

[Morgan]

I know. Someone comments and OP actually responds to it. Someone goes, I'm curious, were there other single guys around she might think fit better with you? Weird. And OP responds, no, that wouldn't be appropriate since I'm married and just had a baby.

[Jenna]

Yeah, I do think sometimes comments are on something and other times they're projecting a very specific situation that happened to them. You know what I mean?

[Morgan]

Someone goes, if other babies were. There were other spouses, try to understand why you were targeted. I would go nuclear. In a friend group that you didn't attend because she excluded both you and your baby and spouse. Have her explain herself to the group.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

OP responds, yes, there were other spouses. She just excluded my husband.

[Jenna]

And like, on its surface, I'm saying that's fucked up, but I'd love to know if there's a reason. Like, you're telling me it's completely out of nowhere, like, what's.

[Morgan]

What is the cause? I know. Someone goes, wait, so other babies and other spouses were invited? Girl, it sounds like she's just jealous of you and where you're at in life, if she's choosing to only single your husband and baby out, move on and never acknowledge her again, it isn't worth it. Not the asshole.

[Jenna]

I mean, sure, yeah. I think you could end any situation that you have negatively with someone by saying, you know what? I think they were just jealous of me.

[Morgan]

I mean, a lot of cases, like, it's been quite true in a few of our stories today.

[Jenna]

Yeah. Yeah, actually. But yeah, there's been a lot of jealousy.

[Morgan]

Update. What?

[Jenna]

Okay, I want. I need to know more. I need to know more. Tell me that. I'll know more.

[Morgan]

I have no idea what we're about to encounter.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

A lot has happened since my original post. So this is a real update rather than a clarification. After taking some space, I reached out to address the situation directly. I explained my perspective and the reason behind my decision, particularly being put in a position where I was expected to attend an event while my husband was deliberately excluded. My intention was to be clear and honest, not confrontational. The conversation made it clear that there was no willingness to acknowledge how her actions affected me or or to take responsibility for the situation. At that point, I chose to block her and cut contact completely. It was not an impulsive decision or done out of anger. It was a boundary. What happened next is what truly solidified my choice. I found out that within our shared friend group, a very different narrative had been circulating. Several people believed I did not want to attend because I was jealous, which felt both inaccurate and insulting. My decision had nothing to do with envy and everything to do with principle and self respect. Because of that, I explained the situation clearly to our friend group so there would be no confusion. I was not trying to turn anyone against her. I simply refused to let a false narrative define my actions with some distance. I can now see that this friendship had unhealthy patterns long before this incident, including emotional pressure and a lack of respect for boundaries. The situation was not the cause of the breakdown. It was the breaking point. I have accepted that this friendship is over. I stood by my partner, I protected my family, and I chose to walk away rather than continue a dynamic that no longer felt healthy or respectful. Thank you to everyone who offered perspective on my original post. The feedback helped me understand that choosing distance is not cruelty, it is self respect.

[Jenna]

Okay, all right. A little dramatic. I protected my family. Okay.

[Morgan]

You come for my baby, we're done.

[Jenna]

Right? Okay.

[Morgan]

Get it. I'd be pissed.

[Jenna]

Yeah. No.

[Morgan]

And it's weird that she's now going around being like, she's jealous of me.

[Jenna]

I know. I also just so funny, like off the back of the Reddit comments, it's like they're telling her she's jealous of her now in this one, they're like, she's jealous of her. Who's jealous of who? Are they just jealous of each other because they're in love? Kiss each other already. I'm on board. I'm on board. I'm on board.

[Morgan]

Unhealthy emotional boundaries.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Or whatever got said like, yep.

[Jenna]

Sounds like a very intense homoerotic friendship to me.

[Morgan]

I don't know why I came to that, but it's still.

[Jenna]

I'm like, I. Yeah, I don't Know, I just, like, I'm confused. I'm confused. That, like, the friend's way of excusing it was just saying she was jealous of her instead of like saying, oh, I didn't want her husband there because he's XYZ or he's creepy, he's annoying. Oh, we hit capacity. I don't know, it's just like, confusing to me. It feels like there was something that happened between them.

[Morgan]

I honestly feel like this is just a situation where the one girl who's now engaged and about to be married is just kind of competing with her friend. And even if it's like a one sided competition, like, have you. I don't know. I've had a friendship where I felt like I was just trying to be a good friend and be her friend. And I loved her and like, I looked at her like a sister, but we had like a big fight and she was like, I feel like you're always competing with me. And I was like, I'm not competing with you at all. Like, we're friends. And hearing that, it felt like a projection. It felt like she always had to compete with me. And I didn't get it. Like, I. I didn't understand it. And so I feel like that's this. Like, it feels like they're almost frenemies.

[Jenna]

Yeah. I had. I didn't have, like this. I had, like, friends in college, like, makeup mean, embarrassing things about me to the guys they were dating. But it never bothered me because I was like, that's so weird because I was like, if you want that man to see me as less, like, desirable, that's your provocative girl.

[Morgan]

But that's weird.

[Jenna]

I know in hindsight, security too. In hindsight, I'm like, all right, it was probably wasn't good, but I just.

[Morgan]

You don't want to cheat on me with my friend Michaela because she's. She's disgusting.

[Jenna]

And like, what?

[Morgan]

What is, dude?

[Jenna]

I was like, I don't really care what he thinks about me, so if that's what they gotta do to keep send.

[Morgan]

Can some. Oh, my God, I can't talk. I'm so flustered. Can some psychologists chime in? Like, how do you make sure that you just raise, like, strong, secure kids? Like, how do you, like, you know what I mean? Because, like, being insecure sucks. Like, how do we.

[Jenna]

I just feel like it's so unavoidable. Like, at least in certain parts of your life, especially.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

And it's like comparing your pit against each other and, like, why I Don't. It's.

[Morgan]

I just want to be friends with everyone.

[Jenna]

And hopefully that's not like, a lifelong thing for most people, and it's just like, you know, a teenage thing or like a. This phase of your life thing. But. Oh, my God. Like, I don't know. I. And, you know, we've said this before. Weddings really do bring out, like, these extreme versions of emotions towards people. I think whether that's like. I mean, I think competing would be probably, like, the biggest one that it would, like, really magnify. It's just hard to know when it's like, it doesn't feel finished. It doesn't feel like, oh, we had this falling out and that's why she feels this way, or this thing happened between us and things have been awkward since then, or it's just confusing. It's like all of a sudden, like, she's the one who. She doesn't want her husband and baby there at, like, a week before the wedding when seemingly all the way up until the wedding, it was fine and.

[Morgan]

She was talking about it to them. Well, engage.

[Jenna]

Yes. Party. Yeah.

[Morgan]

But, yeah, like, why now?

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I don't know. She was happy. She's got ring clarity. And now she's like, I really want you to love me. Choose me. Pick me.

[Jenna]

Right. We have to go back to that. I don't know.

[Morgan]

Other. I literally don't understand another reason. I don't know.

[Jenna]

No, it doesn't make. Makes sense.

[Morgan]

And even just her response where she's like, yeah, she didn't come because she's jealous of me. Why would she be jealous of you? She has everything seemingly that. Yeah, like, she's got her marriage, she's got a baby. Like, what. What do you have that she would want?

[Jenna]

Surely it's so much easier to just say we were at capacity and I couldn't extend the invite to her husband, unfortunately. But no, she did invite. Yeah. Anyway, I kind of want a friendship like that.

[Morgan]

What is wrong with you?

[Jenna]

No, and then, like, at the end. And then, like, at the end, we fall in love.

[Morgan]

Oh, well.

[Jenna]

And he's like, oh, that's why we've, like, that's why we've always had this.

[Morgan]

Have you watched Cheetah Rivalry yet?

[Jenna]

No, we're done. I'm so playing video games.

[Morgan]

Get off the game. I'm sorry. I'm playing episode one tonight. Remember how long I talked to you about watching K Pop Demon Hunters and it took you forever, and then you watched and you were like, you're right.

[Jenna]

But I'm not not watching it because I like. I know that I'm gonna love it. Have you seen Yuri on Ice? That's also gay. Figure skaters and it's been around much longer and it's great.

[Morgan]

What? Can I watch it on Crunchyroll? Don't know what that is.

[Jenna]

Anime streaming service.

[Morgan]

Okay. Yeah. You watch Heat Rivalries and I'll give Yuri a chance. There we go. Okay, moving along. We got one last one for us here.

[Jenna]

Give me something. Give me something up. Give me something disgusting. Just kidding. Don't do that. Give me something messy.

[Morgan]

Boyfriend says my cooking proves I'm not a gold digger. Oh well that's specific. We have that. What does that mean? Am I the asshole for refusing to promise my best friend 100% that I won't sleep with a mutual friend?

[Jenna]

Oh well, I kind of like the both of those. I'm kind of interested. Should we roll a die?

[Morgan]

Flip a coin?

[Jenna]

Flip a coin.

[Morgan]

We haven't brought out the coin flip in a while. Okay, what do you want? Heads to be heads.

[Jenna]

Gold digger and tails.

[Morgan]

Sleeping with mutual Dun dun dun Heads.

[Jenna]

I kind of want the other one.

[Morgan]

That's how you know.

[Jenna]

But I initially was really interested in the gold digging one. But I think I need to know about not.

[Morgan]

They'll still get it. Yeah, eventually. Okay, so here we go. This is coming from Am I the again? It's titled Am I the for refusing to promise my best friend 100 that I wouldn't sleep with a mutual friend.

[Jenna]

I'm on her side. Like what if they have an amazing sexual tension?

[Morgan]

I, 30 female, have a best friend, 29 female of 13 years. She is in a long term committed relationship. 7 plus years and lives with her partner. We also share a mutual friend. Aaron, 30 male. About eight years ago, my friend and Aaron had a brief situationship.

[Jenna]

Oh different. This isn't what I thought. Okay.

[Morgan]

They slept together once and then tried to date very briefly long distance. But it ended because he did not want to pursue anything further. She was upset at the time and it never became a mutual relationship after that. They stayed friendly for a while, then lost touch for several years and reconnected as friends about a year ago. There has been nothing romantic between them since recently. Aaron broke up with his long term girlfriend. Before that happened, my friend and I had already planned a trip to visit him together, which we have done before. This time we were planning to stay at his place instead of a hotel. After his breakup, my friend started making comments like haha, just please don't sleep with each Other, it was framed as a joke, but it was clear that she was anxious. I asked her directly if something was bothering her. I told her two things clearly. One, I was not planning to sleep with him, and two, I was not comfortable promising 100% that I would not because I do not like my potential or hypothetical relationships being policed. And I did not feel okay making absolute promises about future situations just to manage someone else's anxiety. I was not trying to be evasive. I was trying to be honest while also setting a boundary. The next day, I reiterated that I was still not planning to sleep with him. Her response was essentially that she was canceling the trip. She said she was canceling because of the uncertainty and it made her anxious and she needed to take care of herself. From my perspective, this felt like my word was not trusted unless I gave a 100% guarantee. And when I did not, the entire plan was shut down. I understand that anxiety is real, but it also feels unfair to expect me to give up autonomy or make absolute promises about hypothetical scenarios, especially when nothing inappropriate had happened and the history in question was many years ago. She did not clearly say what she expected me to do differently. She canceled the trip without further discussion. I feel like I was honest, respectful, and that my boundary was reasonable. Am I the asshole for refusing to promise 100% that I wouldn't sleep with him even though I said I wasn't planning to?

[Jenna]

I don't know if this is going to be a hot take. I am not on OP's side. First of all, like, it made me feel like she didn't trust my word. You just said the whole thing is that you wouldn't give your word that you wouldn't.

[Morgan]

And I feel like I got a little whiplash there.

[Jenna]

I also just have to say, like, if you don't have any feelings for this person and like, this is your friend of 13 years and they have a history and sure, it was a long time ago. I don't think you can police how they feel about someone that they actually have history with and just like, not sleep with this guy. And honestly, if someone to me was like, well, I'm not planning on it, but. But no promises, like that sounds like you want to.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Jenna]

I'm not saying it's like the end of the world to, like, sleep with someone. I don't know. I wouldn't. I wouldn't hook up with someone that has had a previous relationship with one of my friends. Personally, I think it causes, like, a negative dynamic between you and that friend? I, like, I had this happen with one of my close friends. I had, like, not even had a relationship with the guy, but, like, had been talking to him for a while. Many years later, she started seeing him. And during the time she was seeing him, she was very weird to me. Like, she acted very different to me during that time. And, like, just knowing how it can affect a friendship, I'm like, I don't think it's worth it to just, like, sleep with a guy and, like, put the stress on it. You know, like, she feels strongly about this. Whether you think it's reasonable or logical or not, that's your friend. And I would just not do it.

[Morgan]

Yeah. I just promise I'm. Well, I'm usually in the boat of, like, you shouldn't sleep with your friends. Exes.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And it seems like OP is kind of trying to brush this off as, like, oh, well, it never became a mutual relationship.

[Jenna]

But that doesn't change her feelings. No.

[Morgan]

And they did have a situationship.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

They tried to date very briefly, long distance. Those are OP's words.

[Jenna]

So.

[Morgan]

So they did try to do something. And I think a lot of times women are just like, people get put into a box. And, like, especially with situationships. Right. Like, I'm thinking about myself and, like, I was in love with this guy. Loved him. If he would have asked me to be his girlfriend, I would have been like, yep, yep, down, down.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But it was just a situationship. And we slept together and, like, we never officially dated.

[Jenna]

Absolutely.

[Morgan]

But my head was in it. Yeah. And so even though it's been, you know, a couple years, I couldn't imagine being like, oh, well, he wants to date my friend now. Like, why wasn't I enough?

[Jenna]

Like, yeah.

[Morgan]

And I don't. I don't know if I would think that way now because it would still be weird. It would still be weird. Like, regardless of how I feel now, it's just like, there's so many people out there. Why do you have to go after, like, my ex?

[Jenna]

Especially when she's visibly uncomfortable about it? And I do think OP is kind of like, shading her friend a few times throughout the way she's writing this. Like, oh, and she wanted more, but he didn't and he ended it. And, like, I don't know. I'm just like, okay, clearly for her, this was like a. She didn't want it to end. This is very emotionally divisive for her. She's got maybe some of, like, insecurities caught up in this again. Maybe, like, feelings caught up in this, whatever it is. Like, just leave it alone. You don't have a history with this guy. You have no reason or need to. To push it.

[Morgan]

And also don't even know if he's interested in you.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

You don't even know if you like him in that way. Unless you know you like him in that way.

[Jenna]

Right.

[Morgan]

Want something to happen. That's why you won't. Promise. I don't know. It is weird. Like, I. I think it is interesting. Like, she has a long term committed relationship. Seven years.

[Jenna]

Right.

[Morgan]

And is still kind of feeling this way. Like, to me, I'd be like, is there something that your relationship is lacking or is this just a normal feeling? It's just like, hey, please don't eat where I like.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

It's just like, can we not. Like, there's other people out there.

[Jenna]

But even then, that's like her business with her partner. Not really with her friend who she's telling, like, this will upset me. Yeah. And I think OP's being dramatic to be like, she's trying to take my autonomy away. And like, like, I just don't.

[Morgan]

She's just asking, please don't sleep with this guy I really liked and tried to have a relationship with.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And I think that's a very respectful conversation for her to have. Like, especially before the trip. They weren't on the trip. Like, it's before the trip. And now she's like, it doesn't even seem like OP is that close with Aaron. It really does seem like the friend is close with Aaron.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And it's kind of facilitated through the friend because otherwise, op, you could just go visit Aaron still, even if the trip was canceled.

[Jenna]

Yeah, totally. And if the friend does have these, like, unresolved feelings for Aaron and is now Aaron's single and is kind of wanting for something to happen with him again. Like, that's her business with her partner. It's really, like, not up to you to be like, well, she's dating someone. Like, you're the friend in this situation.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

You can, like, try to get her to talk about it and, like, see how she feels and be like, is there something more to this? But I don't know. I'm sure there are people out there listening who are like, this is a dramatic response. This happened so long ago. You should be able to sleep with this. It shouldn't matter if you've moved on. I just. I just don't think it matters enough to, like, like, put the dynamic of my 13 year friendship at risk just to sleep with someone.

[Morgan]

And that's the thing. And like my dad would have a very different take. Like if you listen to my dad's show, father knows something, he's like, eh, who cares? You're done. It didn't work out for you. Why should you stop your friend from being happy? And I've had to like ask myself this because it's come up so much on his show. But like I'm married, I've been with Justin seven years. I'm happy, I'm healed from all of the situationships. And it's not that I'm not healed or like jealous or I'm not any of like anything. I don't have any feelings towards those people. Like the one person like I'm good friends with, we chat, we connect. Like me and Justin ran in him at the airport and we said hi, I saw his fiance.

[Jenna]

Like we're good.

[Morgan]

But I still wouldn't want my friends to date anyone that like I've previously dated because it's like I also don't want to be around them all the time. Yeah, you're my best friend.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And then I have to see him all the time again.

[Jenna]

No, it's one of my friends now, now slept with one of my exes. I would just be so confused and uncomfortable about it. And it's like, right, you only.

[Morgan]

Am I weird? I don't know, I don't think it's.

[Jenna]

Weird to feel that way. Like I don't think that that's indicative of any like deeper feelings about anything. I think it's just like that there is just like a line being cr. Like it's like things touching, like foods touching that shouldn't be touching. And also like, like I think it's a different situation if you all went to high school together and have all known each other and you dated this person at one point and then dated someone else at another point or whatever that might be. Like if you've all met at the same time, but if you're only like knowing of someone through them having something with your friend, like there's no pre existing relationship that you can look back to and be like, well I also kind of had feelings at this time and even though you did, that didn't stop me. You know, it can get more complicated in other situations. I think when there's high school or college or that kind of overlap involved. But in sort of adult relationships and situationships and whatever that might be, you really only know of that person. Through your friend. There's no time that you would have been developing your own feelings before knowing that they slept together.

[Morgan]

That's true. We do get a lot more context from op.

[Jenna]

No way. Oh my God.

[Morgan]

OP is just dishing it out.

[Jenna]

Okay, let's see if OP can swing me to her side.

[Morgan]

Clarifications one. This was not limited to this specific trip. My friend told me she did not want me to hook up with Aaron at all. Not now and not in the future. And she also said she would be uncomfortable with me having any kind of romantic relationship with him, not just sex. 2. Many people asked why I couldn't just say sure, no problem, I won't do it.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

The reason is that this was not framed as a one time reassurance about the trip, but as a blanket expectation about my relationships going forward. I was being asked to promise that I would not pursue anything with Aaron at all indefinitely. My response I'm not planning to, but I'm not comfortable with my relationships being policed was intentional. There is prior context where my friend has tried to restrict my relationships based on her feelings even when nothing was actively happening, which is why agreeing to a blanket promise felt important to push back on.

[Jenna]

That sounds like OP has slept with her exes before.

[Morgan]

In one case during university, I was starting to talk to a guy we both knew. She asked me not to pursue anything because she wanted to keep him, quote as an option. I agreed and stepped back. She later started dating him about two years after that and they are still together. In another case, she stopped speaking to me for about two months over a guy she had liked years earlier in school even though nothing had happened between them and I explicitly asked if she wanted me to stay away. I was told do whatever you want and then ignored. After over a week of no communication, I eventually dated him. That relationship later became my long term relationship and engagement. Because of this history, I do not feel comfortable agreeing to a pre promise that would restrict my relationships in general, even though I was clear that I was not planning to pursue anything. 3. My friend's partner is aware that she and Aaron had a brief situationship many years ago. He is under the impression that this is long over and not an issue. Because of that, he has been okay with her staying in touch with Aaron and us traveling to his city. These visits have never involved the two of them alone. Every time she visited Aaron, I was also there except for one occasion when his girlfriend was present the entire time. There has been no one on one time between them since they reconnected this is why the request for a 100% promise felt like an escalation rather than a simple reassurance. Someone goes deep diving again. Op's commenting everywhere. And they go, you were dating her high school crush, which you did not discuss beforehand and led to a two month break. Doesn't sound like a very considerate friend to me. OP responds, her crush from the 8th grade while on the 3rd year of uni. So it was her crush from 8th grade and they were already juniors in college.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

And I did proactively come to her after he showed interest and I noticed that she might have a problem with it. I asked her to talk to me and went as far as promising I won't date him if she tells me to, which, by the way, right now I won't do. That was crazy, considering the timeline, the level of the relationship, or albeit its absence. But she was upset about the fact he liked me overall and said, do whatever you want. Which was followed up by weeks of silence. I'm sorry. But again, at that point I was convinced that the friendship is over and only then did I go out with him. And again, I would understand if it was a one off, but it's a pattern that repeats itself.

[Jenna]

This didn't swing me over to op's side. I'm still, I think, okay, so the friend is overreacting if it were a one off. But even Op herself is listing three instances where she's been the one doing this to her friend. So, like, I understand why she's like, please just don't sleep with him. It'll make me feel weird. Like you've done it twice.

[Morgan]

I'm kind of swayed.

[Jenna]

Okay, good. I think disagree. I.

[Morgan]

Okay, here's my thoughts. So Op responds to another comment here. Someone asks, like, has Op, have you slept with other guys besides your ex who was the guy from high school, started dating junior year? Op goes, no, I've only slept with my ex in our long term relationship. So it's like Opie is not even sleeping around. Opie's not even really into casual hookups. It seems like this girl is just like trying to dibs everyone that's hot, keep her options open. And if guys like her friends and don't find her to be the hottest, most attractive, desirable one, she then has a problem with it.

[Jenna]

But she's dibsing this guy that she's already slept with and had a relationship.

[Morgan]

With that I think just Aaron's like in a box over here. Like, Aaron, I get like, she's Just.

[Jenna]

Asking her not to sleep with him.

[Morgan]

But I think it comes down to, like, overall the policing of, like, other guys.

[Jenna]

I mean, I think the thing with, like, her having a crush on him in eighth grade, I think it probably started in eighth grade. I think she probably had a crush on him for a while.

[Morgan]

You can't have a crush on everyone. No, I know you don't get to dibs everyone, but.

[Jenna]

But then the ones that I do have a crush on, you've d too. Like, that's crazy.

[Morgan]

But literally, the guy that op was like, I like this guy. The friend was like, oh, well, can you not date him? Because I want to keep him as an option because I think two years later dates him.

[Jenna]

But that's from Opie's perspective, which is why I think that, like, the friend had already been, like, talking to that guy.

[Morgan]

I don't know, like, that one.

[Jenna]

It does sound sus from Opie's perspective. But I'm also just like, I think that that was a situation where she was talking to that guy and then was like, can you not? And cause she actually did date him. So I don't know. I think, I think maybe we can get more in the weeds about the earlier two situations, but I just, like, don't. I don't see the issue with story number three. Or like, I guess the original one, like story three in their timeline. I guess it would be because, like, I don't think she's.

[Morgan]

I don't think these two should be friends. I mean, maybe again, they're competing with each other.

[Jenna]

It's just like it's a 13 year friendship, though. I do, like, that's true. If you've known someone, like, through middle school, through high school, through college, through adult years, like, this is bound to happen. I feel like, because middle school and high school are such small, like, you hang out with the same people if you're friends.

[Morgan]

I don't think that's true.

[Jenna]

I don't think I ever had the same, like, I don't think anyone I was friends with ever had a crush on anyone I dated or like, I had a crush on any of my friends, partners or ex partners. But again, I'm just like, from this perspective of, like, knowing how weird it can make the dynamic between friends. I just, again, don't think it's worth it. And I don't think she's asking to police your relationships. I think she's asking about this specific one. And this happens, what, like, once every four years?

[Morgan]

Aw. But it's still every Five years. I don't know. We do get. We get an update. I will say, I just want to say, like, is really, really, really nice when you and like some of your best friends have totally different taste in like what you're looking for.

[Jenna]

Totally.

[Morgan]

Let me tell you, I have very unique. Yeah, we are like the best little wing girls when we were going out and like dating because like two very different tastes.

[Jenna]

Yeah, that's awesome.

[Morgan]

It's nice. Like, I can't imagine this competition and like my friend being like, dibs. Dibs.

[Jenna]

No, this does sort of seem like an ill fated I. But they're dibs on people in the sense of like she had a crush on the guy and she didn't. Yeah.

[Morgan]

But she was in college.

[Jenna]

They still remained friends. She just like, didn't talk to her for a few weeks because she was upset about it. Stonewalling.

[Morgan]

Very unhealthy communication style.

[Jenna]

Sure. But that's not really the same as stonewalling. Like I, I do feel like that was just a react like a sad reaction to it. And they did date. Like she was allowed to date him and they remained friends.

[Morgan]

I don't know. Let's see what we have in store for these updates.

[Jenna]

Yeah, I'm interested.

[Morgan]

Update. We talked again. She said she panicked because she interpreted our previous conversation as me preparing the ground I would too to hook up with and reacted to that fear rather than anything that had actually happened. She framed it as a misunderstanding. What's important for context is that by that point I had already said multiple times that I'm not planning to sleep with him. I reiterated this again very clearly during that conversation. Nothing has happened. I'm not being sneaky and this was never something I was actively pursuing. After that, the trip was back on.

[Jenna]

So she's not that crazy.

[Morgan]

That said, I'm still left feeling pretty uncomfortable about how this played out. Not because I want him, but because I don't understand why I had to repeatedly convince someone that nothing will ever happen when there was no concrete grounds to suspect that it would other than the fact that we are both single now. I am also still not okay with my relationships being policed. In principle. This is not about this specific person. It is about the expectation that I should provide guarantees or reassurance indefinitely to manage someone else's anxiety, which I do not think is normal or healthy between adults. We agreed to put the broader conversation about boundaries and control on hold for now and deal with it later. The trip is back on because many people asked. I'm not planning to go to her partner about it. At this point, nothing concrete has happened. And while I have my own thoughts about why she reacted the way she did, those are still subjective interpretations. I do not think it is my place to escalate things or put ideas in his head when no clear lines have been crossed. My plan is to see how things actually play out this weekend and then afterwards have an honest conversation with her as a friend about why this situation affected her so strongly. Especially given that their history was eight years ago and she is in a committed relationship now. Wish us all luck. I will update everyone after this weekend.

[Jenna]

I don't like her. I don't like her. I think she's mean.

[Morgan]

I like, I kind of like, I get it.

[Jenna]

I don't like her the way that she like words, everything. And I think part of this is me just trying to be more suspicious of OP and like the person writing in, in general, because it's like all we get is their perspective. And I think that that already gives bias in their favor. So if there's something like a little bit off in what they're saying, like I'm going to jump on it more, I think.

[Morgan]

And I'm the opposite. I'm like, this is all we have. Like you can kind of, you can kind of be like maybe an unreliable narrator. But like for me, I'm like, I believe her, her.

[Jenna]

I mean, I believe that the situation is what she's saying. I just don't think she's really right in this situation. Like, like I think her saying that she had no reason to believe I wouldn't. It's probably cuz you just kept not saying you wouldn't.

[Morgan]

I understand though. But, but like she is saying like, I don't have plans on sleeping with him.

[Jenna]

That to me sounds like you want to though, like leaving the, like setting the stage. Like I would also take it that way. That's how it read in my mind when I was hearing it.

[Morgan]

And I think for her she's just like, I'm tired of being told what to do. Like, I think based on that, like we, we are gonna have a conversation. It sounds like there's other things. Like we agreed to put the broader conversation about boundaries and control on hold for now.

[Jenna]

That's because she's calling this control. She's saying she's controlling her by saying, don't sleep with my ex.

[Morgan]

So I, I'm wondering if there's other instances that are maybe going into this.

[Jenna]

I don't know why I feel so strongly about this it down a not.

[Morgan]

I need to take it down. Because it does seem like. It seems like our writer is very triggered by this request of like, hey, please don't sleep with this guy that I had a situationship with. Which I think, yeah, I think it's fair. But it seems like OP is like responding based on her triggers. And it's like, I'm not planning on sleeping with him, but I also don't want to be controlled.

[Jenna]

Yeah. And I. It seems like I don't think that is controlling. I think that's a very normal request for a friend to make of another friend. And honestly, I don't think it should even have to be a request.

[Morgan]

It shouldn't. But like, it's nice that it got set up front. It's fine for OP to be like, yeah, I'm not planning on sleeping with him, but like, but I'm not gonna promise I won't.

[Jenna]

Like, how would you take that? I'm not planning on it, but I'm not gonna promise I won't.

[Morgan]

I, you know, it's. They're two adults. I. I do think it's kind of interesting she even said it based on having a seven year long relationship. Yeah, I go back and forth on this one. Like I'm. I'm honestly really, really torn. And there's one final update. We'll see if it lands us anywhere.

[Jenna]

Else that would shock me if I. If I switch sides.

[Morgan]

Final update, which is coming 11 days from that last post. I just read the weekend ended up going really well. Nothing happened between me and Aaron. There were no weird vibes, no tension, and honestly, everything felt very normal and relaxed. I also didn't sense any lingering or inappropriate energy from my friend towards him during the trip. After we got back, my friend and I talked again. She clarified that she would probably be okay if we were ever aiming at something serious. But what she was afraid of was us sleeping together casually and then creating awkwardness or damaging the group dynamic. I still feel like this was a bit of backtracking compared to how things were framed before the weekend, but at this point, I'm choosing not to dig further into that. In the end, I actually got what I needed from the situation. While we are both going through breakups, it isn't just about that. I realized we're quite similar as people, and talking to him felt easy and natural. It made me see that there's a potential for genuine friendship there. As a bonus, he helped me set up a Tinder profile and I already have a few dates Lined up. So that part worked out pretty well. One surprising detail was that my friend's boyfriend was aware of the whole situation and fully on her side, which honestly confused me a bit. I still have questions about that dynamic, but I'm not planning to get into that further. Sorry for the less than underwhelming update, and my apologies to everyone who was rooting for me to sleep with him.

[Jenna]

I am gonna throw down in these comments. I'm gonna find. I'm gonna find this Reddit post. I'm just like, I don't think it's crazy at all that the boyfriend was okay with it. I think this is a normal way to feel without having feelings for your ex. I think it's very normal to be.

[Morgan]

Like, I think so.

[Jenna]

I don't want one, like, maybe my best friend or any of my friends, but especially not my best friend, to sleep with my ex. Again. If one of my friends were to start seeing one of my exes, like, they met somewhere and. And they really had feelings for each other, and I was like, okay, I need to find a way to be okay with it. I guess that is different. I wouldn't want it to happen, though, and I would, you know, if I had a chance, I would request for it to not happen and be like, this is gonna make me feel weird. But, you know, if you're in love with this person, I'm not with them anymore. I'll find a way to be okay with it. I don't think it was weird for the boyfriend to be okay with it. I don't think it was ever, like, sneaky or suspicious for her to feel that way.

[Morgan]

I think it's. It could have been curious what she's telling the boyfriend. Like, I think there's again, you kind of question, like, the boyfriend in the T shirt story. Like, he didn't even tell the girlfriend what T shirt he was wearing.

[Jenna]

But what other way could she. It's such a simple thing. Like, I just don't want her to sleep with him. I feel like that'd be weird.

[Morgan]

I mean, if I told Justin, oh, I have this ex, and, like, someone's starting to date him. I just find it weird. Like, he would be on my side. Yeah. But I don't know this whole story. I'm just like, I actually kind of.

[Jenna]

Am back on board for their friendship. Can I say the last time?

[Morgan]

Whiplash. I'm just over it. I, like, I don't care about them. I. I think they are. They deserve. They all deserve each other. They should just Have a threesome.

[Jenna]

It the last story, the last update. I was sort of like, okay, so everything's fine. They were just sort of having like a brief friendship. Like, like the trip was back on after like one conversation. They went, they had a great time. Everything's fine.

[Morgan]

People crash out over like, I know that's when people crash out over like nothing. Especially. I don't know, I feel like these days everyone's like emotionally heightened and rightfully so.

[Jenna]

So I mean, maybe, maybe they do have to have a bigger conversation of like, I do have insecurities with you and people that I have feelings for and I. It made me feel weird 10 years ago when it happened and I don't want it to happen again. It's like a fear of mine. Like, maybe they just need to have a conversation about this clearly, like pre existing fear or insecurity with each other.

[Morgan]

But I think at a certain point though, you need to also grow up. Up. Like if you're upset that your friend, like you're in college and some boy you had a crush on in middle school and your friends start dating, like, I think at a certain point you do have to grow up.

[Jenna]

Absolutely. But this was, I think it adds on to like now it's someone that I had like an actual thing with and I'm scared of it. Scared of history repeating itself in like a, in a bigger way.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I, I don't know because I go back and forth because the friend is in a seven year long relationship with someone that op had a crush on initially and was close with and wanted to start dating.

[Jenna]

But it sounded like they just both had a crush on him as opposed to like there being a crush.

[Morgan]

Why did he take her two years to get around? Because she was Aaron. She was busy with Aaron, but she wanted to keep that guy as an option.

[Jenna]

I don't know. The timelines are really confusing to me.

[Morgan]

They're both competing with each other and it's just like, God, just develop different tastes than your friend or just like expand your circle.

[Jenna]

Very ill fated the way they have.

[Morgan]

The exact same taste in men. Circle, like go meet other people outside of your friend group and like, oh, just come on. Like there's. You don't have to compete with friends. You don't have to go, she's on Tinder now. Things are gonna happen. She's got dates lined up.

[Jenna]

We're good.

[Morgan]

Yeah, we're good here.

[Jenna]

Both of them are, I think, soon gonna be in long term relationships with no chance of overlap. And they're never Gonna have a problem again. I'm, I think they're great friends. I think I, I think these are kind of small disagreements in the grand scheme of it. Like, it seems like these things, like, haven't lasted that long, like three weeks. They had an issue 10 years ago and then like this lasted what, like one week, you know, and you've been friends for 13 years, you're fine.

[Morgan]

Well, there's a stat that's like if you've been friends with someone for seven years, you're likely to be friends with them the rest of your life or something like that.

[Jenna]

You have to get through like friendship breaking events. I think it's the same with romantic relationships. Like, just because there are issues, like you kind of have to face issues and like work past them for long lasting relationships. Now that doesn't mean if someone's like constantly awful to you, that that's the same thing.

[Morgan]

No, but I mean every relationship, romantic, friend, whatever, you do need to go through some tiffs. You do need to like, have hard conversations and disagreements to then further the strength of your communication and trust and love and whatever. Like, fighting is not inherently bad. It's how you fight.

[Jenna]

Yes.

[Morgan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jenna]

And get a colonoscopy.

[Morgan]

Get your colonoscopy. I'm pretty sure colon cancer awareness is in May, March, actually my birthday month. Colon cancer awareness is in March. So we're just getting a jump on it early. But eat your freaking fiber, my friends. Like, I just saw this new thing that it literally just, I think came out today or yesterday. Colon cancer is like the leading cancer, cause of death or something.

[Jenna]

Oh, wow.

[Morgan]

And it's most common in those under 50. But of course the colonoscopy recommendation isn't until 45, which, oh, by that point can be too late to catch it. And this is where we need to like really put pressure on insurance companies. So just like make sure you're looking out for yourself, knowing the symptoms of colon cancer, advocating for yourself. Like, unfortunately, healthcare in America and some other places like it is about, but.

[Jenna]

Hardly anywhere as bad as America. It's crazy.

[Morgan]

I don't even know. I don't know a lot about other healthcare systems. I had a lot of Canadians come to my hospital in Palm Springs to get their knees and hips replaced. But I don't know. I would take free versus 40k out of pocket. But it can be time consuming. You could live through pain. I don't know their healthcare system.

[Jenna]

But I mean the difference between like paying outright to get a colonoscopy versus not paying and then you just didn't get checked and now you don't know.

[Morgan]

I know. I think everyone needs to really keep an eye on that. And I know a lot of people are scared about doing the colonoscopy. There are other methods out there where you can just poop in a box. And if that's the only thing you're willing to do, please do it. But also be aware that everything can have false positives and false negatives.

[Jenna]

So.

[Morgan]

So look after yourself, okay? Friends, we need you here. We need you here. We're here for a good time and a long time, I hope.

[Jenna]

Why can't we have it all?

[Morgan]

Why can't we have our cake and eat it too? But thank you. See you over on Patreon. If you want any more content, we had three really good episodes for January.

[Jenna]

True.

[Morgan]

February is going to be rocking, too.

[Jenna]

I loved our Patreon episode.

[Morgan]

So good. So good. The comments on it have been amazing.

[Jenna]

Oh, I need to go look amazing. I have to subscribe.

[Morgan]

No, I'll give you a moderator thing. Okay, bye. Friends, until next time. Sat.