274: Can't Think Straight Ft. Hayley Kiyoko & Crew

Summary

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Two Hot Takes, Episode 274: "Can't Think Straight" Ft. Hayley Kiyoko & Crew

Host: Morgan Absher
Special Guest: Hayley Kiyoko
Date: June 18, 2026

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Episode Overview

In honor of Pride Month, Morgan and the TH2 Crew welcome superstar Hayley Kiyoko—singer, actor, director, author, and LGBTQ+ icon—for a rousing episode focused on real-life stories about sexuality, relationships, and self-acceptance. The discussion highlights Hayley’s debut film "Girls Like Girls" and dives into a series of viral Reddit/AITA posts and listener write-ins, sparking candid and empathetic conversation about coming out, queer representation, boundaries, and self-love.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Hayley Kiyoko’s Creative Journey & "Girls Like Girls"

• (02:09) Morgan celebrates Hayley’s multi-faceted career: Disney channel, touring with Taylor Swift, music, authorship, and now directing.
• (02:17, 02:50) The film "Girls Like Girls" is based on Hayley’s own teenage experience falling for another girl. Hayley and Morgan discuss how the story speaks to universal coming-of-age moments, regardless of sexual orientation.
  • Hayley (02:50): “Whether you’re queer or not, everyone has had that one person where they had to confront them to be like, do you like me or not?... When you go see this movie, it unlocks that for sure.”
• (03:39–04:46) Hayley describes the making of "Girls Like Girls" as a 10-year journey, starting with fans' calls for a movie after her 2015 song and video, then writing a bestselling book before finally getting the greenlight for the film.
  • Hayley (04:24): “Opening weekend is vital for the gays, the allies, everyone, to show up... We’ve been needing a story like this for so long.”
• (06:27–07:06) On the evolution of self and story: Hayley has grown in confidence and hopes fans see the progression in both the book and the film.

2. Reddit Stories & Relationship Hot Takes

A. Confusion About Sexuality in Adulthood

Story: 29M never questioned sexuality until befriending a male coworker; shares tension, touches, rides home, and growing feelings.

• (11:13–13:52) Hayley and Morgan reflect on late-blooming realizations and queer experiences:
  • Hayley (12:39): “I’ve done lots of lingering in cars... Normally the straight ones are very—there’s not the awkward silences, the touch of the hand... The ones that are a little confused are the ones that were giving me that space.”
  • Morgan (13:05): “Isn’t that crazy? This guy is 29. People are in their 30s and 40s and still figuring out who they love and who they are... Representation is so important.”
• (15:13–16:49) Hayley draws on her own experience navigating relationships with women who weren’t fully out: "You’re kind of testing the waters... caressing a little more... and then you have to be like, ‘Hey, do you like me?’”

B. Heartbreak Over a Secret Relationship

Story: 22F breaks up with her girlfriend of 7 years who stays closeted, avoids public affection, and doesn't defend her during homophobic jokes.

• (20:44–22:50) Hayley empathizes deeply, sharing past trauma from being kept secret and explaining the difference between privacy and secrecy.
  • Hayley (21:09): “My girlfriend took me on a date with a man and brought me as the third wheel. That crosses a line.”
  • Morgan (23:28): “21 is still young. And that’s okay... but the bare minimum is to not let other people shit on me.”
  • Hayley (25:15): “She is not the one... It comes down to self love. This girl doesn’t love herself enough to therefore turn on the person that she does love.”
• Takeaway: It’s okay to leave when your timelines for coming out and self-love no longer align.

C. Parental Homophobia and Wedding Boundaries

Story: Daughter (with trans boyfriend) denies her father's wedding invite after he refuses to extend a "plus one" only to her.

• (33:10–34:17) Hayley applauds the writer’s boundary-setting:
  • Hayley (34:17): “That’s homophobic... She has every right to use this as a boundary: ‘You have to accept me for who I am, otherwise, I’m not showing up for your fifth wedding.’”
  • Morgan (34:22): “That’s the best response: We’ll catch the next one.”
• (37:37) Silence from the “nice” fiancée also called out: “One voice does matter. You could show someone, ‘Hey, actually we don’t condone this behavior.’”

D. Making Pro/Con Lists about a Partner

Story: Writer, after three years with her girlfriend, finds her pro/con list “con-forward”—no affection, rude behavior, lack of intimacy.

• (39:34–42:43) Hayley and Morgan both agree: the cons so overwhelmingly outweigh the pros, therapy won’t fix it.
  • Hayley (42:09): “You can love somebody and be like, no, thank you.”
  • Morgan (46:15): “When you find someone that loves you and you feel it, there’s nothing else like it.”

3. Queer Representation & Self-Worth

• The need for greater representation is a recurring theme. Hayley emphasizes that seeing your story on screen or page validates and unlocks self-acceptance.
• Raising the bar in relationships—don’t settle for the bare minimum; demand affection, respect, and support.

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Additional Notable Segments & Quotes

Sports & Hypocrisy in LGBT Support (50:34)

• Discussion of a story where an uncle is upset about his gay child, despite supporting a soccer team with pro-LGBT stances.
• Mikayla (52:02): “Let people do their thing... in all sports there’s going to be people who don’t support.”

Ethics of Staying Closeted for Inheritance (54:55)

• Writer advises her 17-year-old niece to remain closeted until her wealthy, homophobic grandfather passes, to avoid losing a $7M inheritance.
• Mikayla (57:06): “I would stay in the closet to be a millionaire.”
• Morgan (59:02): “I would probably be celibate for 10 years for $7 million.”
• Balancing ethics and safety: Most agree the advice was pragmatic, given the very near timeline and financial impact.

Losing a Friend to Religious Homophobia (65:19)

• Writer’s lifelong best friend declines to be a bridesmaid, refusing to “support” a same-sex wedding "against her beliefs".
• Discussion (68:55–73:00): Deep sadness over surprise, the wound of losing hidden homophobes in one’s circle, and how religion should not be weaponized.

Teacher Fired After Homophobic Incident (77:22)

• Kindergarten teacher tells a child with two moms their family is “not real,” is reported/fired.
• Jenna (80:59): “If you are in positions of teacher, counselor, power with children… you need to set aside your beliefs in order to treat them with respect.”

Biphobia & Bi-Erasure in Relationships (89:56)

• Bi woman’s boyfriend asks her to stop identifying as bi, falsely believing it implies she's interested in everyone.
• Jenna (91:25): “That’s the most classic biphobia in the books.”
• Morgan (98:34): “If you have to lie about who you are to have someone love you or want to be with you, that’s not the right person.”

A Dad’s Perspective on His Son Coming Out as Gay (102:24)

• A loving but scared father worries for his gay son’s safety in a small homophobic town.
• Morgan’s Dad (107:12): “All of being a parent is simply protecting our kids... The thing that you really have to do is have the honesty talk of why you reacted [with shock]—not because of his choice, but because of fear for his safety.”

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Memorable Quotes

• Hayley Kiyoko (06:27): “I wasn’t comfortable with who I was. Now I’m here on stage waving a rainbow flag. And so this story also evolves.”
• Jenna (91:25): “That’s the most classic biphobia in the books. Assuming you want everybody… It works the same way as it does with everyone else.”
• Morgan (25:15): “She is not the one. And maybe she’ll get to a place where she loves herself... this girl doesn’t love herself enough to therefore turn on the person that she does love.”
• Hayley Kiyoko (44:55): “People who are dating men need to literally come together and raise the bar.”
• Morgan’s Dad (107:12): “All of being a parent is simply protecting our kids... You only want happiness for your children.”

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Highlighted Timestamps

• [02:17–04:46] — Hayley’s journey turning “Girls Like Girls” into a film and book
• [11:13–13:52] — Lingering, confusion, and queer adult awakenings
• [20:44–22:50] — Secret relationships, self-love, breaking up when timelines don’t match
• [33:10–34:22] — Setting boundaries with homophobic parents
• [39:34–42:43] — Pro/con lists and relationship standards
• [54:55–59:47] — The "stay in the closet for $7M" moral debate
• [65:19–73:00] — Faith, friendship, and dealing with religious homophobia
• [77:22–87:47] — Teacher fired for homophobia; supporting queer families in schools
• [89:56–98:34] — Biphobia, bi-erasure, and relationship respect
• [102:24–113:24] — A loving dad reacts to his son coming out at 17

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Final Thoughts

The episode moves fluidly from celebratory (the release of a groundbreaking queer coming-of-age film) to deeply personal—bringing empathy, sharp reflection, and lots of laughter. The themes of pride, self-discovery, and not settling in relationships resonate throughout. Hayley Kiyoko and Morgan drive home the message that everyone deserves to be seen, loved, and respected for who they are, and that boundaries and self-worth are crucial—even when it means losing people you care about. Listeners are left with the call to "raise the bar," refuse to settle for conditional love, and keep pushing for representation and inclusion.

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Transcript

[Morgan]

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[Hailey Kiyoko]

I'm so excited to be here.

[Morgan]

We've been.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Nice to meet you finally.

[Morgan]

Hayley, Kiyoko in the house.

[Jenna]

Woo.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

The crowd goes wild there.

[Morgan]

We'll put sound effects in for you.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Okay, great, Great.

[Morgan]

You'll feel the love.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

You have such a crazy story. I feel like the lore, like, do you get told you're like, gosh, your lore is so good?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

No, but thank you so much, really. Well, I mean, people call me like not an underdog, but like I do have an. I guess I do have an interesting lore. Like I've been around for a while.

[Morgan]

Disney star Lemonade Mouth.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I don't call myself Disney star.

[Morgan]

Okay. So sweet of you, Lemonade Mouth. Jenna was like, thank you. Great movie. It's so good.

[Jenna]

Thank you.

[Morgan]

Wizards of Waverly plays. Then you ended up going on tour with Taylor Swift.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Well, I performed with her, but not tour.

[Morgan]

But yeah, same thing.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

That was still epic.

[Morgan]

I mean, it's Swift. And then you are just this amazing, successful music artist.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Thank you.

[Morgan]

Turned author now director.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Listen, we gotta catch em all. We're trying over here.

[Morgan]

I love it. I absolutely love it. I'm so excited you're joining me. On this episode, it's Pride Month, and your movie Girls Like Girls really just encapsulates so many. I feel, like, real struggles that people go through. And I watched it last night and this morning, and I'm like, oh, my God, it's so good.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Thank you.

[Morgan]

And it's so cute and relatable, and it just. It's something that I think so many people can relate to of, like, finding yourself and dealing with, you know, adversity and struggles. And it's just. It's such a good movie.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Thank you. I, like, I. I've been saying, like, even though this movie is called Girls Like Girls, and it does capture this moment in time where I fell in love with this girl, you know, back in high school. It is such a relatable story, because whether you're queer or not, everyone has had that moment or that one person where they had to confront them to be like, do you like me or not? Is this going somewhere?

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Or do we have a future? Like, every single person has that one person. And when you go see this movie, it unlocks that for sure.

[Morgan]

I could feel the tension.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I literally like, oh, that reminds me

[Mikayla]

of that one person.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I could feel it.

[Morgan]

And I'm like. I put myself right back in those shoes. And I go, oh, my God. I was like, I do not miss high school.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. When you're 16, 17, falling in love, it feels like life or death.

[Morgan]

It does.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

So, you know, it's important to me, with my directorial debut to, like, approach it with a mature lens. It's like, they are, like, our lead. She was 18 when we shot them. This. But it has this mature lens because they think they're, like, 35. They think, like, when you meet your crush, you're like, this is the person I'm getting married to.

[Morgan]

Yeah. No, that was me. I was 16 going on 40.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And it was just like, you feel. You do feel like it's life or death and the weight of the world and everything's on you. And, I mean, her struggles, too. Coley struggles just to being like, I hate myself. And I'm like, oh, my God. Been there, done that, too. Like, it's just. It's. You capture so much, and you really do feel it.

[Jenna]

It's.

[Morgan]

It's an amazing movie.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I'm so exc.

[Morgan]

Excited for people to see it. It's going to be so good. June 19th, you guys. So put it on your list already.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Opening weekend is vital for the gays, the allies, everyone, to show up in theaters. This has been a 10 year journey. Which is wild. It is. I don't Recommend Putting in 10 years of energy into something because that. It's so intense. Like, it feels like a lot of pressure. But it's also so exciting for my community. And we've been needing a story like this for so long.

[Morgan]

Did you know that you wanted to make it a movie when you put the song out initially?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Not initially. When we released the music video and I saw the comments and people being like, this needs to be a feature film. I was like, oh my gosh, I've never gotten to buy a ticket and go to a theater and get to see a movie like this. Like, oh my gosh, we do need this into a movie.

[Morgan]

And then you did the book first

[Hailey Kiyoko]

and then I did the book because the movie thing wasn't panning out. It was kind of like my Hail Mary of like, well, if I die tomorrow, at least the story will exist and live on. And then that became a number one New York Times bestseller, which then catapulted. We're skipping a lot of trauma, you guys.

[Jenna]

We're.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

We're doing the victory lap right now. But then that led to the green light of the film and end of 2023. Shot the movie in 2024 and here we are in 2026.

[Morgan]

Here we are. It's incredible. I read your storygraph reviews for the book too. Oh, and it's so good.

[Mikayla]

Oh, thanks.

[Morgan]

People are just blown away. They're like, hailey can write. Like, okay. And so if you're a reader too, like, start with the book, then go see the movie.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Really proud of the book.

[Morgan]

Really good.

[Jenna]

So good.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Go read the book, go see the movie. They're both. And listen, now I understand. Like, you know, you read the book Twilight, you go see the movie, it's a different experience. They're, you know, girls, like girls. The book and the movie are like sisters. But, you know, you can't. A book is a book and a movie is a movie. And so the movie is the most authentic version of this story. But, you know, like, in a book you can talk about someone's jacket for three pages and then in a movie, it's like a glance.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And so what's been unique about this universe is I've been able to be a part of every step of every way. And it's been like challenging for me to have to almost like taught myself every time. Whereas, like, how do I tell this story with a different perspective? And I think because this journey has been 10 years long, I've changed. You know, when I released Girls like girls in 2015, I wasn't confident in who I was. I wasn't comfortable with who I was. And now I'm here on stage waving a rainbow flag. And so this story also evolves. And even from the book experience, seeing the movie, my fans will see that evolution as well.

[Morgan]

I love it. Well, let's get into these stories. I know you're gonna have some good takes on them.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I'm excited.

[Morgan]

Let's dive in.

[Jenna]

So cur.

[Morgan]

This episode of Two Hot Takes is presented by Credit Karma. You're on your phone constantly. Shouldn't those bills count towards your credit? With Credit Spark by Intuit Credit Karma, they do build credit history using payments like phone bills or utilities. No debt, totally free, and missed payments aren't recorded. Not all lenders use transunion credit reports or scores impacted by Credit Spark. But if you're at or below 660 and looking to build credit history, download Credit Karma today and get the credit you deserve. Up first for us here, this is coming from R True off my Chest, a subreddit where people just go and share. So it's titled I've 29 male, never questioned my sexuality until I met this coworker. I don't really know who to talk to about this, so I guess I'm asking Reddit. I, 29 male, have been working with my coworker, 32 male, for about seven months now. Let's call him John. We work as junior chefs in a commercial kitchen. The kitchen environment is constant pressure and extremely fast paced. That means that most of the time you can avoid getting heated with your teammates, and John and I have definitely fought a few times. However, we eventually get over it at the end of every service by having drinks with the whole team before heading home. Since I don't have my own vehicle and I use public transport, John sometimes offers me a ride.

[Morgan's Dad]

Cute.

[Morgan]

He drops me off at the end of my street near my house because he heads the same route just a little bit further out. During the time we spend together at work and in his car, we've really gotten to know each other. He went through a divorce last August and was completely heartbroken. Though he still gets to see his child, so that keeps him going. As we opened up about our lives, we got so close that our teammates started calling us best buddies. Now I want to be clear and say that I've never been attracted to guys ever. I've only ever had girlfriends and I assume John is the same. We banter all the time and we'll playfully caress each other. You know, the typical straight guys acting gay thing. But lately I feel like I just love being around him. It's hard to admit, but I've started liking his touch and the way he smiles at me. I actually look forward to the shifts where we work together. I don't know if I'm overthinking, but whenever we're bantering, it takes him a long time to break eye contact. When he's smiling, that's a sign. It's like we talk shit, laugh, and then just pause in time staring at each other. It's been like this for a while. Two nights ago, I was on my way home with him because he had offered me a ride again. We talked about how shitty the service was that night. The silence in the car felt different when he dropped me off. He didn't just pull away like usual. He kept the engine running and just looked at me for a second. That felt too long. That same lingering smile on his face. I reached for the door handle, but my heart was pounding so loud I was sure he could hear it. We both just sat there for a moment before we caught each other's eyes and let out this really forced, awkward laugh. We mumbled a quick see you tomorrow and I got out of the car. Now I'm laying in bed staring at the ceiling, wondering if I'm losing my mind or if that awkwardness was actually him feeling the exact same pull that I am again. I've never been attracted to men before and I don't know what's happening. I'm confused and scared at the same time.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You've got a lovely reading voice. I just felt like I was about to like take a rest listening to this beautiful gay story.

[Morgan]

That's why I provide blankets. But like I. You can almost put yourself in his shoes where you're like, it's feeling very

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Girls like Girls like girls coded.

[Morgan]

Yep.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

It's sounding homosexual. It's sounding a little gay. The thing is, is the other guy John could be also confused as well. And maybe it's tough cuz like sometimes you're like, oh, is John just lonely and needing connection? And they have this like best buddy connection. But on the other side of the coin, he could totally be feeling the same way as the other guy. It's sounding gay to me. I've done lots of lingering in cars. The eye contact, the like, ha. Like when we all don't really know what to say. Like I feel like people who are comfortable with their sexuality are very Like, I guess, like, comfortable. I guess when I look back at, like, my moments in high school and in my early 20s, when girls were, you know, had never dated a girl, but they're hanging out with me and I'm like, do they like me or not? Normally the straight ones are very. There's not the awkward silences, the awkward lingers, the touch of the hand. Like, they're normally pretty confident in who they are. And the ones that are a little confused are the ones that were giving me that space. So that's given me a little gay.

[Morgan]

Well, especially the caressing. When he said that, I was kind

[Hailey Kiyoko]

of like, wait, that's not normal.

[Morgan]

I was like, I don't. I don't know if that's straight guys. I'm not caressing my best friend. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I'm gay.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

So if I'm caressing you, there's a reason for that.

[Morgan]

There's a reason. There's a reason. You're touching and you're seeking out that touch.

[Mikayla]

Totally.

[Morgan]

And then he's like, I kind of like the touching. It's like that's your body's telling you, I know what your mind maybe isn't,

[Hailey Kiyoko]

but isn't that crazy? Like, this guy is 29 years old. You know, he's not 15. And when I was getting girls, like, girls made, like, people would be like, oh, like, do we need a story like this? And I was like, what do you mean? Like, people are in their 30s and 40s and still figuring out who they love and who they are and who they're becoming. And it's like, representation where you can go, you know, this guy might go see a movie or go see girls, like, girls and be like, oh, my gosh, he's being a Sonja on me. You know, like, it unlocks these. It identifies and validates these feelings, and it just goes back to, like, representation. Because when you've never been through something, you don't know until you see something or you meet someone who's also experienced the same thing.

[Morgan]

I think that's something that's coming up quite a bit on Reddit, especially right now, is people that have gotten married, and now they're like, you know, I. I waited to have sex until marriage. I thought that my feelings and these thoughts would. Would kind of go away with that. And now that I'm married and I've been with my wife for three years, like, I'm realizing this is wrong. But, like, I was so ashamed, and I. I didn't know what this meant. And so I Think I'm on board with you, like, having a movie where it's like, no, it's not shameful to be yourself.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. And it's okay to be confused and wanting to explore. And, like, obviously you don't want to, like, hurt people, you know, at someone else's expense. But I think that, like, you know, if this chef guy watched a movie like Girls Like Girls, and literally was like, oh, that is John, then, like, he'd be like, oh, okay, I know what's going on. Or maybe he'll watch and be like, oh, that's not what we do.

[Morgan]

Okay, cool.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Like, cool, cool, cool, cool, cool.

[Morgan]

You know, the top comment on this one basically says, quote, we banter all the time and playfully caress each other. You know, the typical straight guys acting gay thing. They're quoting op.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And they go, yeah, no, that's not typical.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

But I love that for him, and I hope he goes for it.

[Morgan]

Yeah. A lot of people are, like, rooting

[Hailey Kiyoko]

him on a lot.

[Morgan]

Yes, a lot.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

There's what can happen. It again, goes back to what we were talking about, the universal things. Like, all he has to do is ask John, hey, do you have feelings for. Do you feel what I feel like? And. But that's terrifying for people.

[Morgan]

How do you go about that? Because you are engaged to Becca. Becca famously on the Bachelor franchise. And it was kind of like, you talk about it how, like, you met at your release party and, like, you kind of were immediately interested. But how do you gauge someone who hasn't been clearly out or how do you proceed with that?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

With Becca, it was very different because I'm actually. I present confident, but I'm actually very shy.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And the only reason why I'm engaged is because Becca made the first move. So, like, when Becca was very different because we had a connection, she didn't know we had a connection, but I knew we had a connection. And then Becca actually made the first move.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And so it became crystal clear. Oh, okay. We both feel the same way.

[Morgan]

Okay.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

But before Becca era and life, it would be confusing, and I'd go on dates, or I not even dates. I just, like, meet someone and hit it off. And then I. I would have to do this whole, like, does. Do they like me or not? And, like, you're kind of testing the waters and getting. Caressing a little more and bantering, you know, all this stuff to the point where then you have to be like, hey, do you like me? Hey, you know, are you gonna kiss me? Like, where are we at? And it's Funny. One of the scenes in Girls Like Girls is actually you watched it last night is from when she goes to the girl's house to get her jacket.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And she's like, are you gonna. You know, do you like me or not? And that was a real scene that I lived where I went to go get this. This jacket that I left at this girl's house. And I was like, are you gonna kiss me or what? And she just, like, stared at me. Because you get to this point where you're like, I have to use my words. Like, the gazing is not. The gazing is not enough. It's not enough.

[Morgan]

No.

[Mikayla]

So.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

But it's really great when you meet someone who is comfortable with who they are. And, like, when I met Becca, she was like, I haven't been with girls before, but I can't deny this connection that we have. So we need to explore this. And I'm really grateful for that. And obviously it worked out.

[Morgan]

Yeah, absolutely. I know. How long have you guys been together now?

[Guest Speaker]

Total.

[Morgan]

Oh, my gosh. I love it. Years this year. That's so exciting. So exciting. Something you guys talk about that I love is you say that you weren't secret. You were just private.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yes.

[Morgan]

And I think there's a big distinction between that and this next story is definitely secret, not just private.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Okay, let's. Let's see if this triggers me.

[Morgan]

So it might. It really might. So this is coming from our own Too Hot Takes subreddit. It's titled Am I the asshole? I, 22, female, broke up with my girlfriend, 21, female, of seven years, for staying silent. I, 22, female, had the shittiest breakup I could ever go through. I broke up with my girlfriend of seven years. Even though she was in the closet, I respected her decision to stay in. I truly didn't want to rush her out or put pressure onto her for coming out. The only people who knew were a select group of close friends, and she wasn't comfortable being together slash looking like a couple in public. So she would often introduce me as her best friend to other people and would always say that she's single. This made me uncomfortable, but I didn't think to reach out to her about it because it might put pressure on her to then come out. But things took a different turn when she started to hang out with this all boys friend group this year in college. She would often invite me to hang out with them. The group of boys would openly hit on her, and she would be eating it up while I was in the room with Them. She didn't reciprocate it, but she didn't shut it down either. I tried to communicate to her how this bothered me, but she would still dismiss it, saying that I'm overreacting and that it's just boys being boys. Things took a bad turn when she accidentally dropped that I'm a lesbian and the entire group proceeded to make jokes about my sexuality. At that point, I was too shocked to speak because they did not give any signs that they were homophobic up until this point. Maybe it's because I'm not conventionally attractive as her, so that's why they said what they said. But even then she didn't even defend me and ended up just staying silent. It took her three days to reach out to me while I was literally trying to speak to her about the situation. We got into a huge fight over this and I couldn't take it and I broke up with her. She got upset with me because, quote, she wasn't the one to say all that crap. But I told her that her silence was enough and I broke up with her. She cursed me out, told me why it was a chore to be with me and blocked me everywhere. It took a while to open up to our friends and most have sided with me. But some said I should have been more understanding of her and that she wasn't the only one truly at fault and it was just one mistake. She also did mention that it was a mistake, that she stayed quiet but will learn her lesson now. But I don't want to listen to her. And I just decided to break it off. This made me overthink and now I don't know. Did I throw away a 7 year relationship over one mistake? Am I the asshole?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

No, no. That brings up a lot of feelings.

[Morgan]

Oh, this would send me.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Let me take you down memory lane a little bit. I one time was in a relationship in secret, okay? Not private, in secret. And my girlfriend took me on a date with a man. She went on a date with a man and brought me as the third wheel.

[Morgan]

Stop.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

That crosses a line. And so I think, like, listen, you might fall in love with someone and they might be on a different timeline and that's okay. And that might mean that your timelines just don't work out. I think it's fair that this person decided, you know, enough is enough. I was okay with being, you know, in secret to a degree for seven years is a very long time. And that doesn't mean that the other girl needs to be comfortable. It just means like, in those scenarios, like, there could have been situations of, like, hey, don't say that. Like, that's. She's my friend. I love her.

[Mikayla]

Like.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Like, I think it crossed a line in many different ways, you know, and with Becca and I's relationship, again, we weren't in secret. We were just in private. But, like, if, you know, we were out, like, she would still hold my hand. Or, like, you know, if someone said something to me, she would definitely speak up for me. You know what I mean? Like, it's just very different. She's not taking me on dates with other people. No. You know, like, there's, like. There's crazy that is, like, not love, in my opinion. And I think it's. It's, like, okay to be in a relationship with someone and be like, I'm ready to be out. They're not ready to be out. You do that relationship for a while, and then there might be a point where you're. You can't wait anymore. And that doesn't mean that you don't love them. It doesn't mean that you're putting pressure on. You don't want to put pressure on them. But, like, the reality is you guys are on two different timelines, and maybe that person will be ready in five years. And if you're not. If you don't want to wait five years, like, that doesn't make you an asshole.

[Morgan]

No.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You know, act with love and be like, listen, I don't want to rush you. You're on your own journey, and I'm gonna respect that. And I'm also on my own journey. So I think it's. It's a very, like. It's a fine line of, like, also respecting yourself. And I think growing up in the closet as a queer person, for myself and my experience, I did unfortunately get in those situations all the time where I didn't respect myself and I didn't go, wait a second, this is not fair to me, Reg, of what you're navigating and where you're at. Like, this is actually not kind.

[Morgan]

21 is still young.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

So young. And that's okay, though.

[Morgan]

It is okay. And I think, you know, based on what I know about your experience, like, you came out initially to your parents in, like, sixth grade, right?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I came out, like, so many different times.

[Morgan]

Yeah. So it's like you kind of knew, like, more, like, younger.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah, I knew. I was, like, gay since I was, like, seven. I was like, I am different. Yeah, 100%.

[Morgan]

And so I'm like, okay, maybe she needs more time, and that's, again, totally fine. And I'm so with you. But, like, the bare minimum is to not let other people shit on me.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Or bully you. Or bully. Yeah. Like your girlfriend.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

But also in the same breath, they're saying those things about you because you are dating this person.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

They just don't know. And those are the people you want to be friends with.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. It's not cool. I think she needs to feel confident in her decision and also know that that person that her ex girlfriend is not, is. Is maybe not a bad person, but she's going through stuff and she's not able to be a good partner or friend to her. And, like, I think that that's fair to acknowledge, you know? And like, in my movie, Girls Like Girls with Sonya like her, she says hurtful things. She's navigating something that she has never experienced before. And so Coley becomes the victim of her inexperience. But that also, there's a fine line of being a bad person and just a person who's never experienced this before and then be able to acknowledge that and take accountability for those actions and try to be better.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You know, like, I think there's a fine line.

[Morgan]

I know I'm like, sitting with everything you said. I'm like, there's just so much to unpack here. And totally fine where she's at. But, like, you're not there. Like, you're out.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

She is not the one.

[Morgan]

She's not the one.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And maybe she'll get to a place where she loves herself. Because it's really. It comes down to self love. You know, she. This girl doesn't love herself enough to therefore turn on the person that she does love because she turns on herself.

[Morgan]

Yeah, that's it. You know, it's a tough position to be in, especially, like, depending on where you are.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I mean, social pressure is. I grew up in Los Angeles, California, and people live in way less liberal areas than I do. And I still had such a hard time navigating my queerness because of what people would think, what people will say. It's like you're just raised to care about what people think of you. And it's really hard to break through that. You know, you have to put a lot of energy into that.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

To get through.

[Morgan]

Well, something you said in an interview that I watched too. You're like. Cause I think they were. You were talking about, like, your wedding and planning and getting engaged and all these things. It's like, you didn't even, like, really think about.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Never thought I was gonna. Yeah.

[Morgan]

Because until 2015, it wasn't even legal. And, like, I remember being in college and being able to go and vote towards that. And it's just. It's crazy that, like, even in today's times, like, that was 10 years ago, 11 years ago, it's just like. So there's a lot of change that needs to happen still. But you hope that she gets to a place where she can be comfortable being herself and not damage amazing relationships because of it.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. And again, not to sound like a broken record, but it goes back to representation. Right. Like, if she were to see herself reflected on screen or her experience reflected on screen, you know, she'd be like, oh, people support gay people. Like, maybe I don't have to be so hard on myself and hard on the people that I love. Maybe I will be okay. It's a defense mechanism. Right. Like when you're scared, when you're fearful, you aren't kind to yourself and to others, and it just is like a rebel effect.

[Morgan]

Absolutely. And 21, trying to fit in, trying to fly under the radar.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

It's that crowd mentality. But again, like, this is your partner of seven years, and she's giving you so much grace and letting you sort things on your own timeline.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

So I think she did the right thing.

[Morgan]

I think so, too. I think so, too. Top comment. I would not let anyone speak that way about my partner. I don't care how many friends I lose.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah, that's right. That's the energy.

[Morgan]

Yeah. Next comment, down2 says, I wouldn't let anyone rag on my bestie or my partner.

[Mikayla]

There's.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

There is a lot to unpack with that person.

[Morgan]

Like, even if that's your friend, you're going to, like, these are just some random dudes you became friends with this year in college versus your friend that you've been friends with for a decade.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah, but how. It's also, like, how can you have expectations that she's gonna stand up for someone else when she can't even stand up for herself? Like, if her. The bar is so low for herself, why would she do that for other people? And that's. That's a lot of this world.

[Morgan]

Op does respond to the person that says, I wouldn't let anyone speak to my partner that way. And she says, I've actually defended her behavior so much to my other friends, saying, I just didn't want to put pressure on her and gave her time to come to terms with her Sexuality. Who knew a group of boys were enough for her to throw me away like that?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Just like we send you hugs.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Things are gonna get better.

[Morgan]

I know. I think they will. And again, this is in the Too Hot Takes subreddit, so this is likely one of our listeners. Hopefully they. They hear your thoughts on it and yeah, just makes them feel a little more reassured.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And go see girls like girls with a bunch of strangers and know that there's a huge community out there that feel the way you feel and have your back. And I think you should be proud of what you did. Like, I think she really chose herself in this moment, and I think that that's important to value yourself and hold the standard high. So we're proud of you.

[Morgan]

Absolutely.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

This episode is brought to you by Skims. I'm off to Europe for a little hot girl summer, and I want to look and feel my best. And that is where skims comes in. Whether it's the cotton pieces, my shapewear, my bodysuits, I know I'm gonna look good and feel my best thanks to all of my skims intimates. Let's talk about the cotton. I've got my scoop bralette and my thongs. I'm gonna walk around, I'm gonna be hot and I'm not gonna feel gross. I'm not gonna have painful underwire digging into me and still be supported. Then I've got my shapewear, especially my bodysuits. They go with everything. They make me feel confident, empowered, comfortable still. Because comfort is key when you're out and having fun. And then I've got my loungewear for any downtime. I mean, why put up with undergarments that don't fit properly any longer? Not with skims. You can tackle anything and feel your best with skims intimates. Shop everyday cotton and all of my favorite bras and [e-mail] after you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you select podcast in the survey and be sure to select our show in the dropdown menu that follows.

[Jenna]

Thank you.

[Morgan]

Okay, this next one for us. This is coming from Am I the Asshole? It's titled Am I the Asshole for telling my father will catch the next one when he invited me to his wedding. He's been married four times now, and this wedding will be his fifth in the span of 30 years. I don't know how he has such a high turnover rate, but I'm guessing it's to do with him being both rich and a raging narcissist. He invited me to get coffee and introduced me to his new fiance. I knew he was going to do this because two of my brothers. There are seven of us total. None have the same. Mom said that they had just gone coffee with dad and met the fiance. Then they were invited to the wedding and both had been given a plus one for their girlfriends of eight and 10 months respectively. Dad told me to bring my partner when I came for coffee and I brought my trans boyfriend along. We have been together for three years. The fiance seemed nice, wanting to know about me and my boyfriend and asking questions that sounded like she actually gave a shit. Dad gets all the details of the engagement and wedding out of the way and then asks me, only me, if I'll be there. I noticed that he was talking to just me, not my boyfriend, so I say we will check if we're free. Nice. Dad replies that quote. This is family only. I reply. I just assumed, seeing as how the other siblings got a plus one. Dad says, that's different. Are you coming? I say, we'll catch the next one. Dad's fiance becomes visibly upset and they leave. Dad texts me after that, if I can be civil on the day, then I can still come alone. I felt like I had to stick up for my boyfriend because this was definitely due to him being transgender. And he thanked me at the time but told me that I should probably still go. But after reporting back to my siblings to say what happened, I got mixed responses. The overall opinion was that while I absolutely should stick up for my boyfriend, this was some hill to die on. And I managed to catch the actually nice fiance in the crossfire and upset dad too. Info I am a woman. My boyfriend is trans female to male. Despite both of us being straight, dad thinks of us as lesbians. Due to my boyfriend's biology, one of me and my siblings, three were in the wedlock and the other four, including me, were extramarital affairs. The fiance knows she's number five and dad gives the same story about how he was tricked into marrying gold diggers by accident and didn't know until it was too late. And the affairs all happened as the relationships were breaking down. So am I the asshole?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, honey, you are not the asshole.

[Morgan]

I am so proud.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

It's so. I don't know why it's so hard, but it's so hard to communicate with parents that don't also know how to communicate.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And like, we're just so wired to please them. Good for her. Like, even in that conversation, of being like, we will, like, talk about boundaries. Like, we come as a unit or I don't come. It's not fair. I think if all the siblings weren't allowed to bring their partners. Yeah, okay, but if all the siblings are allowed to bring their partners, but she's not allowed to bring her partner, then that's homophobic. And I think she has every right to use this as a boundary of, like, hey, you have to accept me for who I am. Otherwise, like, I'm not showing up for your fifth wedding.

[Morgan]

That's also, like, the best response. We'll catch the next one.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Oh, my gosh. Good for her.

[Morgan]

Just clocked him.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I mean, that takes a lot of therapy and, like, you know, unpacking.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

To get there.

[Morgan]

I wish I was that quick too. Just, like, we'll catch the next one.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Oh, my God, that was so cool.

[Morgan]

I need to take. I've been saying full snack. Yeah. So I'm like, I want to take improv classes to get a little quicker. I'm like, I need to just in life. Just in life. I'm like, just having that, like, response like that. Because it is true. And there's such a bigger picture here about, does your dad support you? Is he even worth having in your life? Because by him saying, oh, yeah, no, your. Your boyfriend can't come, only family, he's essentially not respecting your relationship, not respecting you. What does life look like? What happens if you and your boyfriend get married? Is he gonna come to the wedding? Like, what does that look like for your life? So if you're not, you know, setting those boundaries now and standing your ground now, I mean, what. At what point do you, like, you give him an inch, he's gonna take a mile, and it's just not worth it. And your partner being like, you should go, I admire that. Like, that I can put myself in those hurt shoes. And that's amazing. They're saying that, but, like, I think, like, you're making the right call.

[Guest Speaker]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And I also think there's probably a lot of history prior to this response to her dad. Like, you know, there probably were times where, like, it was like, you know what? I will make you happy, or, I will do this. I will sacrifice myself for X. But, like, there comes a point where this is your life, and, like, the people in your life that love you should value your decisions in life. The people that you love, they should respect you, and it shouldn't be conditional. And so many people. I think, unfortunately, it's extremely relatable to Grow up in a household where love is conditional even when you don't even realize it.

[Morgan]

Those like hidden expectations and if you don't meet them, then it's like, like

[Hailey Kiyoko]

this is who you have to be. And it's like, well, you chose to have me, so why do I owe you anything? And that, I don't think that that's like rude. I think there's a loving way to be. Like, hey, you should be proud of who I am. I, I, I speak up for myself. I, I respect myself, I love myself. And these are the things I want in life. And it's so scary for people to navigate that it's because they're just cowards.

[Morgan]

I mean, oh, it's crazy. It's so nuts and like to be this open and honest with yourself and be able to set boundaries. Oh my God. Like there's no mention of how old our writer is, but I'm like, I'm 32 and I can still have a hard time setting boundaries with my mom. And I'm like, to do it in

[Hailey Kiyoko]

this scale, it was loving, it was respectful. It was, I mean, I'm very impressed with her.

[Morgan]

I know, I know. And the comments are too, There you go, girl. Comments are too. Top comment has 21,000 upvotes. Not the asshole. You stood up for your boyfriend. As unfortunate as it is that the fiance was caught in the crossfire, she didn't oppose her soon to be husband's view.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Nope. So silent says a lot.

[Morgan]

Uh huh. She easily could have taken that moment to be like, honey, no, no, no.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. And then that would have changed his mind. It's like people go, oh, my voice doesn't matter. Like one voice does matter. You could show someone, hey, actually we don't condone this behavior and we need to like rethink this.

[Morgan]

It could really shift the tide. Next. Top comment, not the asshole. I think it was best that you did this in the situation, especially with the way your dad is. It's a shame that his fiance may got her feelings hurt, but she'll have bigger problems to worry about in a few months when she's sorting through a divorce. I'm sorry that your dad can't be more accepting.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. And unfortunately that's the reality. Like whether you're queer or like whatever your background is, like it is. I think parental relationships are really challenging and really hard to navigate because you, you do want peace. But where does peace come if you don't have peace with yourself and this person doesn't respect you or show love they say they love you, but they don't show love. And that's important.

[Morgan]

Yeah. Or there's, like, conditions to it. 100%. It's just like if there's all these conditions and strings attached, it's like, that's not how it's supposed to be.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

No.

[Morgan]

Should just be unconditional.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Okay, I have one last one for you here. This one is coming from r actual lesbians. It's titled pro cons list. I've been with my girlfriend for three years next week, and it's come to the point where I'm having to make pro and con list about her. Oh, I love her. But some things are getting harder to ignore. And it's tearing me apart inside trying to decide if I want to break up. I think the only thing keeping me around is my love for her. But can love always be enough? And then this person shares a picture of their pro and con list.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Their con list is very long. Have you guys not seen the Friends episode with Ross and Rachel?

[Jenna]

Oh, my God.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You don't make a pro and con list.

[Morgan]

No.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Or if you do, you burn it.

[Morgan]

Along came Paulie. I just rewatched that the other day.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I haven't seen that in so long. Is there a pro in con list?

[Morgan]

He does that like risk analysis software.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Okay.

[Morgan]

And compares Paulie, who's kind of this risky out there woman, to his wife that cheated on him on their honeymoon. And Paulie finds it.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Oh, no, it was bad. It's not good.

[Morgan]

The pro list. Okay.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Okay.

[Morgan]

I love her. Funny. Helps when asked baseball. Are kids financially stable? Pays attention to little things. I say con, not Facebook friends. Won't let.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I don't even know my Facebook friends with. I don't even be on Facebook. I don't even know. I don't think that counts.

[Morgan]

Won't let me tag her in pictures. No hand holding. No compliments.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

What?

[Morgan]

No cuddling.

[Morgan's Dad]

No.

[Morgan]

Can be rude.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

This sounds like a co worker.

[Morgan]

Stone top vanilla sex. Haven't met the fam.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Okay, this is not good. They should probably break up.

[Morgan]

Doesn't share feelings. Helps when asked, but acts like it's inconvenient. Expects me to keep house and my car clean, but hers is a mess. Said she doesn't find me attractive anymore. Expects me to tell her my every move, but can't do the same in return. Acts like she doesn't care about things in my life. Have said I need affection, but I still don't get it. Pros, cons.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I think that it's not working. Out for them. No, I think if the pros list was longer. I think if they were. Yeah, no, like you guys, it's literally like, I think if. I think that the pro list was way longer and there was only like a handful of cons, I would suggest couples therapy and be like, you know what? Give this person a chance. You love them. Let them know, like, these are the things that are bothering. And then they might have some things that are also bothering them and try to work through it. But it is so con forward that my suggestion would be that maybe that person is not the person for them and that's okay. Like, I think you can love somebody and be like, no, thank you.

[Morgan]

No hand holding, no compliments, no cuddling.

[Mikayla]

This is.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

This is. Yeah.

[Morgan]

What do you have?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah, like eye contact.

[Morgan]

Eye contact. That's it. That's all I'm getting. Eye contact. And maybe they share a meal every now and again.

[Mikayla]

It's.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I think you deserve more. And it sounds like the other person is equally as unhappy if they're telling you that they're not attracted to you. That like, I'm sorry, but that's like, again, if that was the only con that could be worked on through couples therapy and conversation.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You know, sometimes. Sometimes things aren't perfect, but that is feeling.

[Morgan]

Yeah, it's pretty bad, I think. It seems like to me that this person doesn't want to be with our writer anymore, but is just.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And showing it through action. But they're not getting the hint that

[Morgan]

it's like, please break up with me, let me be horrible.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I don't want to be with Non confrontational.

[Morgan]

Yeah, that's what I'm getting. Because otherwise it's like, if this is your whole relationship, I mean, there's not much there. Like, I can't imagine, like not having good sex, not having that intimacy, but even just like the simple things like having your partner come home and like, I don't know, you made them a meal or you got your hair done. It's like, oh, you look so good today.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

No comprehension, really strict.

[Jenna]

I'm.

[Morgan]

I need a compliment.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I need compliments.

[Morgan]

I need to feel the love.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You look great, by the way.

[Morgan]

Thank you.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah. You did something different with your hair.

[Morgan]

No.

[Jenna]

Oh, looks so good.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

No.

[Morgan]

The top comment on this one, I'm not going to lie to you with the first three cons. I fully thought you were joking. But continuing to read on, there is some pretty big double standards on your con list. Obviously don't know them, but it seems like you give and they just take.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Someone responds. To be honest. No. Hand holding is a deal breaker.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Well, yeah. I mean, I'm not gonna judge people who don't like hand holding, but if you're not gonna do hand holding, then they should get a lot of extra stuff.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I remember dating this person in college and I like, went to hold their hand at a bar and I literally got, like, swatted away.

[Jenna]

Oof.

[Morgan]

And I was like, who. Who is around that you're trying to, like, not let them see, like, what is going on?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And I'm just like, I'm just getting bad vibes from this one.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

You should feel proud to have the person, you know by your hand or, you know, in your hand.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

And like, growing up, unfortunately, I was with a lot of people where I had to, like, hand hold under the table or, like, the quick pinky touch, you know, you'll see a lot of those in girls.

[Morgan]

Like girls.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

But. But now I can openly just, like, hold hands.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And that, like, finding that love, that genuine, reciprocated love.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

We need to raise the bar. You guys.

[Morgan]

Like, it's in hell.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Crazy people who are dating men need to literally come together and raise the bar.

[Morgan]

It was rough.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

When I hear about my good out there, heterosexual friends experiences, I'm like, so you just want someone nice? And that's. That's the standard.

[Morgan]

I literally.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

This is crazy. Like, being with a woman, like, it's like. It's like on another planet. So we need to raise the bar.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

We gotta raise the bar.

[Morgan]

I went through it and I talked about it in my vows where I was like, he is the first person to make me feel beautiful. And it's like, that is great. Ugh. But it was just like, it took so long to find him.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

But you have to want that for yourself. And I think that's where it comes down to, like, what you believe you deserve. And, like, everyone listening to this. You guys deserve more than kindness. You deserve consideration, respect, love, laughter, all the things. That doesn't mean that there aren't going to be some, like, bumps in the road that you guys are gonna have to work through. But, like, let's raise the bar.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And when you find someone that loves you and you feel it, there's nothing else like it. Like, I remember initially dating him, and I was like, is this what it feels when someone actually likes you?

[Jenna]

Wow.

[Morgan]

This is cool.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah, I know. And like, when I met Becca, there was no. Even though she hadn't dated women before, there was no confusion. Like, it just was like we want to be together. How do we make this work? I was leaving for tour, we did like long distance for a while and you just, you make it work. But you, you have two people who are equally putting in effort and energy.

[Morgan]

It's nice when you find that.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

When you find that, you go, oh, it clicks.

[Morgan]

Oh, it clicks.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Now is your time to shine, you guys. I mean, don't settle. Find your person.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Don't settle.

[Morgan]

Be yourself. All good things.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yes.

[Morgan]

Hailey, you did amazing. Thank you so much for coming on.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Oh my gosh. I had a blast.

[Morgan]

Where can people find you? How can they watch your movie?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Please go see girls like girls. It's been a 10 year journey of me getting this movie made. It is my life's work. It's a movie I'm so proud of and I hope people feel seen and loved and supported. Go opening weekend with your community. It should be in almost every major city nationwide. And the two young leads, Maya Dacosta and Mayra Malloy, are incredible.

[Jenna]

They're so good.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Go get your popcorn. Make your watch party plans. We don't get movies like this for Sapphics and coming of age very often in theaters. So your support would mean the absolute world.

[Morgan]

Absolutely, you guys. I'll make sure I link the movies page in the description. Go and watch. Okay, thanks. This episode is brought to you by. Sonic Summer is heating up. So it's a good thing. Sonic Refreshers now come frozen, blended, icy cold with real fruit and green tea. Sonic Frozen Refreshers are the perfect way to cool it down when it gets hot. And they come in four delicious flavors. Strawberry, passion fruit, watermelon, peach, mango, peach and berry. Citrus. And they're the perfect way to reward yourself. Whether that's finding the last parking spot in the shade or getting a compliment on your form from a workout instructor. Maybe it's remembering to put on sunscreen before you leave the house. Whatever it is this summer for all of life's little achievements, sip to that with new Frozen Sonic Refreshers. Live free. Eat Sonic. Try the new Frozen Sonic Refreshers today. Order in the Sonic app for pickup or delivery, or visit your nearest Sonic. This episode is brought to you by Credit Karma. When it comes to your money, Credit Karma keeps you ahead of the game. You can count on Credit Karma to keep up with your financial needs. As they evolve, they'll help you monitor your progress and give personalized recommendations so you can make strides towards your goals and find your way to money. Make sure you're on the right track. No matter where you are on your financial journey. Intuit Credit. Karma. Karma. You can count on you guys.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Thank you, Morgan. So fun.

[Morgan]

You ready?

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And scene.

[Mikayla]

Okay.

[Morgan]

How you hanging over there?

[Mikayla]

Oh, I'm good.

[Morgan]

It's been a minute. It hasn't been that long I've been locking you up behind the Patreon doors.

[Mikayla]

It's true.

[Jenna]

But I like it.

[Mikayla]

It's fun.

[Morgan]

We've got Jenna coming in for a couple stories. Up first, since you're a big sports fanatic.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Yeah. You like sports?

[Mikayla]

Baseball.

[Morgan]

Baseball. Dodgers. If we've got any Dodgers fan in the house, let us know.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Okay. This one is coming from Am I the Asshole? It's titled Am I the Asshole? For pointing out that the football club my uncle supports is LGBT friendly.

[Mikayla]

Okay.

[Morgan]

My 16 uncle became upset when my cousin, 18, came out as gay. He vented to me and my mom saying that my cousin must be confused and should try dating a girl first. My mom didn't say anything at first. I didn't either. But then he saw it in my expression that I wanted to say something, so he asked me what it is. I just told him it's kind of ironic that he supports Bayern Munich but doesn't like LGBT people. He got even more upset when I said that. My mom later told me I should not have said it since I knew his club's stance is a sore spot for him. Am I the asshole?

[Mikayla]

Well, no. I just think it's weird that he's associated with something that he doesn't support.

[Morgan]

It's so dumb.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

This was like a big thing when heated rivalry started blowing up and the NHL was like, really starting to try to capitalize on it. And it's like, no, no, no, NHL, let's back it up. What did we get rid of Pride Night because some of your players didn't want to put rainbow colored tape on their sticks and now they got rid of it.

[Mikayla]

I heard about the stick, like you weren't allowed to put. And then I know a player put tape on their stick. Yeah.

[Morgan]

A lot of teams got rid of it because players were. Yeah, it's like, you can't then, like, say, oh, we're not going to do this and support this group. And then because that group is popping off, then be like, oh, wait, wait, no, we're going to capitalize on this, right?

[Mikayla]

I mean, I think in all sports there's going to be people who don't support. Like, I'm going to Dodgers Pride Night. And I'm like, are The Dodgers excited for the gays to be there? Probably not.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

What?

[Morgan]

It's la.

[Mikayla]

Well, well the. I mean he retired now but like last pride night you had Clayton Kershaw. I don't know if you know who that he's a pitcher. But like he's writing Bible verses on his hat during pride nights in like non support of us.

[Morgan]

A very pointed.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Thing to do.

[Mikayla]

So it's like you're always gonna have players that don't support it. I mean there's so many in especially men's sports. It's just like everyone's a little.

[Morgan]

I don't know, it's so weird.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

Let people do their thing. I love that. I think it's Charles Barkley came out recently and was doing an interview and he's like, you don't think there's more gay players on these teams?

[Mikayla]

Statistically there has to be.

[Morgan]

You would think.

[Jenna]

I.

[Mikayla]

And then, I don't know, people are doing gay stuff and men are doing gay stuff in sports all the time.

[Morgan]

We talked about the baseball celebration video. We'll insert a clip for you guys here. I think like bottom line, he's gonna have to do some big mental shifts because his child is gay.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And so you pointed it out that it's ironic. No, not the asshole. Like he needs to sort through whatever small minded bullshit is in his head and if you pointing that out is one way to kind of get him on board and start doing it, then whatever. Top comment on this one, not the asshole. Has your uncle tried dating a man first?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Oh, got him.

[Morgan]

Next comment. Exactly. How do you know you're heterosexual if you haven't tried a same sex relationship?

[Mikayla]

That's a good argument.

[Morgan]

I really do like it. How do you know for sure?

[Mikayla]

Well, it's hard because you're told like from the beginning you're told that you're straight and you just have to figure out that you're not straight.

[Morgan]

This is a rabbit hole. I want to go down on like society and how we got to this strict, like it's a rabbit hole. I'm going to go down. If you know or have good resources to point me in my rabbit hole direction, please let me know. Michaela sitting off camera and I know she knows she has a resource. This is just a Michaela tidbit that she would absolutely know. History is crazy. Humans have been around for so long.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

So long.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And yet we're just a blip. And it's like, why are we making our blip so brutal?

[Mikayla]

It's just Weird how we went from that timeline to this timeline.

[Morgan]

I wish the dinosaurs were still around. Honestly, I wish the dinosaurs were still here.

[Jenna]

Sure.

[Mikayla]

I don't.

[Morgan]

Can the dinosaurs come back?

[Mikayla]

I don't know if that's gonna help support LGBTQ rights, but I don't know.

[Morgan]

It depends on if they re. If they take over, you know, go Jurassic park on the White House.

[Mikayla]

Oh, I'd love to ride one, dude.

[Morgan]

Saber toothed tigers. So cute. A woolly mammoth. Adorable.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I'd like to fly on one of those. You know what I'm talking about?

[Morgan]

God, what is that? Flying one trot. What's the flying dinosaur called?

[Mikayla]

It starts with a T, I think.

[Morgan]

Petrosaur.

[Mikayla]

No. Oh, I had it.

[Morgan]

Pterodactyl.

[Mikayla]

Yep. Yeah, it did start with a T.

[Morgan]

It's not on here, but it. It came to my brain.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, I'd like to ride one.

[Morgan]

Okay, cool. Okay, this next story. This is gonna be a bit of a moral dilemma.

[Jenna]

1.

[Morgan]

I'm very curious what you all have to say in the comments. Okay, this is coming from Am I the asshole? Titled Am I the asshole? For telling my niece to stay in the closet until she gets her inheritance. My 42 male niece, 17 female, recently confided in me that she's a lesbian. I supported her, let her know I would be there, et cetera. Usual Ally stuff. However, she told me she was going to come out to the whole world this week. I let her know she should absolutely wait for her grandparents, my parents, to pass. My father is incredibly wealthy and has tens of millions of dollars in assets that he will be passing down once he is gone. My father is a raging homophobe who has flat out stated any gay individual in our family would be written out of the will. And to make sure the rest of us don't just split more money with said gay relative, they will instead have that portion of the inheritance put aside for that family member donated to a charitable cause. That money will be erased from the inheritance since both my father and mother are in incredibly poor health. Stage 4 cancer and debilitating dementia. I told my niece that she should stay in the closet for a while longer. If she comes out as lesbian and they find out she will quite literally lose out on $7 million. She was a little sad, but was also appreciative since that is obviously a life changing amount of money that will allow her to live luxuriously until she dies. My wife, however, said that I'm being an asshole. I'm telling this poor girl to hide who she is. Just to appease old bigots. That is true. I am asking her to appease old bigots. But I feel like her life quality will be much better with $7 million at the cost of one to two years in the closet, tops. I've also seen my father's will and I know who is getting what. So my niece is definitely going to receive 7 million as long as my father doesn't rewrite or edit his will. Am I the asshole for telling my niece to stay in the closet so she can be a millionaire?

[Mikayla]

I mean, I would stay in the closet to be a millionaire.

[Morgan]

$7 million is fucking crazy.

[Mikayla]

If they weren't in such poor hell. I mean, I'm trying to think of how long I'd be willing to stay in the closet. That's a good point.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

If they're in that poor of health, eh, just stay in a little bit longer.

[Morgan]

Well, I think too there's something to be said. Like kind of thinking about Hailey and Becca and their relationship where they were private, not secret.

[Mikayla]

Well, I was about to say, like, how are they gonna find out also. Yeah. Like what are you doing? You're announcing it to the world, Whatever that means. Like you just posting it on social media. I guess it depends if it's gonna get back to them via like family members. Like are family members gonna go and report back so she doesn't get the money?

[Morgan]

Yeah, I guess. Like who else would be on her side or who is a potential threat?

[Jenna]

Right.

[Mikayla]

And then in that case, it's like, if they're gonna go relay that message to them to an unsafe person, maybe it's not safe for her to come out right now in the first place.

[Morgan]

That's a good point. I also just, I wonder, you know, what would life look like differently? Like, is she not gonna be able to go to the movies with her girlfriend? Like, what would it really look like? Because I do think there's a world where it's just like, just live your life.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

I feel like they're. Your grandpa's not gonna be out at the club.

[Mikayla]

No, they're in the. Sounds like they're in the hospital dying.

[Morgan]

I don't know.

[Mikayla]

Sure. I don't know. I'd say just start coming out to people that you know is safe.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Mikayla]

And you know, maybe don't announce it on social media right now. That's what it kind of sounds like she's telling her to do is just like maybe keep it between the people you know and trust. Yeah. And I don't think you need to do a whole announcement. Especially if 7 million is on the line.

[Morgan]

7 million.

[Mikayla]

And then wait a. Let's just say it's a year.

[Morgan]

I would honestly long.

[Mikayla]

And it seems like it's not even going to take a year.

[Morgan]

I, like, I tried to put myself in this shoes and like, okay, like, shut off like a part of yourself and turn down love. I would probably be celibate for 10 years for 7 million.

[Mikayla]

Yeah. Also, it's tough out there. You don't need to. It's okay.

[Morgan]

It's tough out there.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, dating's hard. Just like, take the money.

[Morgan]

The top comment on this one. Oh, God, I'm torn. This is honestly an excellent case study for an ethics class. My gut instinct is to say that you should never encourage someone to stay in the closet longer than they want to, but yeesh, that's a life changing amount of money. No assholes here. Besides your parents for being raging homophobes.

[Mikayla]

I agree.

[Morgan]

I think at the end of the day, our writer here is just trying to protect his niece. Like, I know the road to hell is paved with good intentions, but this really does feel like it's coming from a good place of just like, hey, maybe reconsider. You have 7 million on the line. And maybe she didn't even know that. Like, she really didn't.

[Mikayla]

She probably hadn't. I would have no idea.

[Morgan]

How would you know? You've never seen as well.

[Mikayla]

Right?

[Morgan]

And then so in your head where you're like, okay, I'm going to come out. It's going to be this great thing, which it is. And that's so exciting for you. But now you have this other piece of info that it's like, okay, well, you know, you could potentially lose out on 7 million because this guy's a crazy, homophobic, spiteful asshole.

[Mikayla]

Right?

[Morgan]

And it's like, okay, yeah, I'd go to charity, but like, yeah, but I

[Mikayla]

don't think they're picking the charity. It's going to go to a homophobic charity.

[Morgan]

That's also true. That's very true.

[Mikayla]

Like, oh, you're a lesbian. Given that 7 million to church,

[Morgan]

A megachurch that has those people that go in the rafters and sing.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, just.

[Morgan]

Have you seen those mega church vids?

[Mikayla]

I'm sorry, Scared. I don't, I don't. I don't look at churches.

[Morgan]

You know, some of those mega churches,

[Mikayla]

I'm scared of them.

[Morgan]

They're crazy. There's another comment here. Not the asshole. 7 million changes anyone's life. And it's not like she'll have to hide it forever. Info. Are you and your wife the only ones who know? OP responds, yes, my wife, myself and my niece. My father trusts me immensely and is willing to discuss these matters with me. My mother knows as well, but her dementia is so bad that it doesn't matter.

[Mikayla]

Then like, I don't know, in my mind, like, you have come out, you've already started telling people. You are in the process of coming out. I feel like you just. Yeah, you just keep telling the people that are closer, closest to you. Like when you say you're telling the world, is that. That feels like just a social media announcement to me.

[Morgan]

I would say social media. I don't think a 17 year old would rent one of those planes with a billboard behind it or a banner, I'm gay. Yeah, I don't think that's happening.

[Mikayla]

So in my mind I feel like they're not even. It's really not even telling you not to come out. It's just, don't tell your grandparents.

[Morgan]

I am so curious what everyone thinks.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, regardless, I would still. If I couldn't tell anybody, I'd still do it for 7 million.

[Morgan]

I mean, 7 million is like, I can't even fathom that. Like, it's just so much. And there is another comment here where someone says, not the asshole. You're just advising her, not forcing her. She still gets to choose. It's true. So that's a really good point.

[Jenna]

I think OP is great.

[Mikayla]

Big fan.

[Jenna]

Ally.

[Morgan]

Ally. There are quite a few comments from OP I basically told her, I know it sucks, but I'm sure you would regret not getting that inheritance. You should take the money. Maybe I should have just laid out the facts for her and said, I'll support your decision regardless. But I thought you should know the situation. She wants to travel the world so badly. I told her that when we can get the inheritance, I'll quit my job and travel the world with her as well. My wife included. We're all so close, so it'd be a whole lot of fun. I am reminding her how much more easily this globetrotting goal will be with the inheritance.

[Mikayla]

And think of all the ladies she can get with $7 million.

[Morgan]

No, she doesn't want. She wants to find love and someone with good intentions.

[Mikayla]

Oh, okay. She doesn't want to be sugar mama

[Morgan]

maybe, you know, she could, she could, she would, she would have that option.

[Mikayla]

At least that's what I'm saying.

[Morgan]

Yeah, OP says, I guess I don't see what's wrong with deceiving homophobes in a situation like this. He's going to be dead, and he's making a very poor decision. I don't see how it will hurt him.

[Mikayla]

I take his money. Take his money.

[Morgan]

Do you look a gift horse in the mouth, huh? Yeah, I don't know. Okay, Opie says, for those saying you're the. Because deceiving my dad is wrong. If you were in my niece's position, can you honestly say that you would give up $7 million because deceiving a homophobic grandpa is wrong? Can you genuinely say that you wouldn't keep your beliefs hidden for a year for the sake of a comfortable life? I highly doubt any of you could practice what you preach in the same situation, especially if you have debt and other life difficulties. Just kind of live your life, do you? Private. Not secret.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Exactly.

[Morgan]

And you know, Grandpa's gonna be gone soon by the sounds of it.

[Mikayla]

Grandpa's never gonna know. I think she'll be just fine.

[Morgan]

No, but again, put your thoughts in the comments, y'. All. As the top comment said, crazy moral dilemma.

[Mikayla]

I'm not torn. But,

[Morgan]

Jenna, you basically are just, like, singing that. That song from Jerry Maguire. Show me the money. That's you right now.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

Thank you for your poppin.

[Mikayla]

Yeah, anytime.

[Morgan]

One, two, three.

[Jenna]

Voila. Oh, my God, my hair grew.

[Morgan]

Look who it is. Yay. Let's go.

[Jenna]

I'm ready.

[Morgan]

Okay, I've got one for you. Coming from our very own Too Hot Takes subreddit.

[Jenna]

I love it when that happens.

[Morgan]

If you can't recognize who's hopping in, it's Mikayla.

[Jenna]

Oh, so true.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan's Dad]

Hello.

[Jenna]

Hello, gay people.

[Morgan]

This one is titled best friend of 15 years tells me she Can't Attend My Wedding. I need to vent for a second. I'm getting married next April to the love of my life, and I couldn't be more excited. I asked my three best friends to be my bridesmaids. Longest friend, College roommate. Post college roommate. My longest friend since we were around 11 years old. Lives in another state, so I mailed her invitation to her as a surprise. She sent me this text last night letting me know that she doesn't support the fact that I'm marrying a woman and will not be in attendance in my wedding. I'm incredibly hurt by this on multiple levels. This love the sinner, hate the sin mindset is extremely hurtful and does not constitute unconditional love. These are the same beliefs my dad and stepmom have had since I came out. And it's already been painful enough to deal with their judgment. I didn't realize one of my closest, most trusted people secretly felt that same way. Even after having met my partner and knowing I was gay for over three years and after I confided in her about my parents reaction to me being gay, I feel lied to and honestly have felt sick to my stomach since reading this. I've already responded to let her know how hurtful this is and that I appreciate her being honest and telling me now, but that our friendship will not be able to continue if this is what she believes and I wished her the best. I'm trying to focus on the fact that I'm glad she told me so that I don't have to keep people like this in my life, but I feel incredibly blindsided and betrayed. Thanks all for letting me vent. And then OP does include pictures of the screenshots Whoa, wait.

[Jenna]

I want to hear so this text

[Morgan]

message says hi Blank. I've had a really hard time trying to decide if I can be a part of your wedding day. I don't want to hurt you. I should have been honest with you from the get go and expressed my thoughts to you when you first came out to me about being gay. I've never once judged you for it or loved you less. I just do not want to support you marrying another woman. I should have told you that a long time ago, but I didn't because I was worried it would affect our relationship. I've been walking the fence with God for a long time, but this past year my relationship with him has grown more and more because of that. I can't with good conscience support a same sex marriage when it goes completely against my beliefs. I've prayed a lot about it and tried justifying it, but I can't attend your wedding. What the hell. Me going would show other Christians that I support it and I can't be a stumbling block for others, my children or even myself. I love you and I care for you and your salvation. I pray that this won't ruin our friendship. I understand if you're upset with me in any way. I'm absolutely heartbroken that I can't be there for your special day like you were for mine. Please know this was an extremely hard decision for me. I just want you to know I love you no matter what. I would have much rather have done this in person, but I just got the package Thursday and I owed you an answer. If you want to get together and talk more about it, we can. I will come to you I'm so sorry.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

I mean, having a homophobic friend is not the craziest thing to happen in the world. But I feel what's so different about this story is that it took so long to even realize that she felt that way. Like, I can't imagine, you know, having been out to someone for three years. Like, you've talked about your relationship with them. Finally one day you invite them to your wedding, and all of a sudden you discover that they don't support you and aren't okay with it and think it's a sin. Like, that just feels so blindsiding.

[Morgan]

I'm just like, wh. Why? Like, why? And I just like, I'm so glad you found this out now, before you were wedding planning down the road. And, you know, this is so shitty. Losing a friend that you've been friends with for 15 years, since you were 11, like, that is ye. A huge part of your life. But on the bright side, you are being your most true, authentic, happy self. You are about to marry your person, the love of your life, and anyone that's not going to support you and your love, good riddance. Get out of here.

[Jenna]

Yeah. It's just so crazy. I mean, it's. I guess, a good thing that this friend hasn't been actively trying to get her to not be gay all this time or, like, been trying to convert her or been, like, putting her down about it forever. I'm kind of confused about why the wedding is where she draws the line. Like, why is that all of a sudden not okay? And everything else was never a problem. But I wonder if that, like, one of the last statements in one of the last texts you read is part of it of, like, other Christians seeing it and, like, publicly being a part of a gay event as opposed to just, like, you know, kind of more quietly having a friend who is gay.

[Morgan]

That quiet support versus no, I'm in wedding photos. I'm standing up at the altar supporting them. Yeah, like, the messaging and the message she would be sending would be very

[Jenna]

loud, which is different than, like, a personal. I'm not okay with this thing. That's more of like a. You're. That you're worried about your public image amongst the Christian community.

[Morgan]

I guess the thing is, like, religion should not be weaponized. It can be such a beautiful thing and just let people live their life. Like, there's no. I mean, I'm not gonna go down the theology side of it. There's people out there, though, that explain the translation and how different translations have made People interpret things in certain way, but at the bottom line, at the end of the day, this was your friend.

[Jenna]

Yeah. Like

[Morgan]

I'm never gonna be able to mental gymnastic myself and even have any empathy for this friend that's doing this. Because I don't understand how you just can't love people and let them love who they want to love and be supportive.

[Jenna]

Yeah. Actually back to the, the. The gayness in Greece and Rome thing you were talking about earlier. You're talking about, like people having different translations and stuff. It's funny because the line about you should never lie with a man as a woman does. Like, some people think that that just means if you're on bottom instead of like being a man and a man, it means like, being the one.

[Morgan]

What?

[Jenna]

Yeah, because that is like kind of what they believed at the time.

[Morgan]

Like, so powerful it made me sneeze.

[Jenna]

Like, it's okay to have sex with a man as long as you're the one. Penetrating is kind of how they felt. Like, it doesn't affect your masculinity unless you're the one who's.

[Morgan]

Would you look at that?

[Jenna]

Like the woman.

[Morgan]

You learn something new every day.

[Jenna]

That's one interpretation by some archaeologists. It's so funny.

[Morgan]

That's so crazy. Oh, my God.

[Jenna]

But it's hard to.

[Morgan]

So women didn't go on top in ancient Greece.

[Jenna]

I'm sure they did. I'm. I mean, come on.

[Morgan]

There's quite a few comments on this one. Top comment. She already ended the friendship. Congrats on your wedding. May you live long and prosperity. Next comment. That's not a friend. Don't give her another thought. Don't reply. Put your energy towards your wedding with people who don't judge how others love one another. And be grateful that she won't be in the photos. Best to find out now, then Photoshop later.

[Jenna]

Yeah, that is true. And it sounds like she gave her a decent heads up about it, but I don't know. I'm like, does she have a new pastor? Is there a new group at church that she's become friends with that's like a little bit more like conservative about homosexuality? Because it sounds like she was saying, I've been walking the line with my faith until the last year and now.

[Morgan]

I don't know.

[Mikayla]

I don't know.

[Morgan]

It's very confusing. And a lot of people do point out what blows my mind is the but I still love you. Like, rejecting a huge part of their identity is no biggie. Love is accepting someone for who they are. Not just the parts your imaginary friends, gatekeepers told you you're allowed to accept.

[Jenna]

Yeah. I hope you find salvation. I pray for your salvation. If someone said that to me, I'd be pissed as I'm saved.

[Morgan]

I know.

[Jenna]

Great.

[Morgan]

Someone points this out. It's fucked up that many Christians have decided that homosexuality is the main thing they have a problem with. They legit have a list of the top 10 sins and homosexuality is definitely not on there.

[Jenna]

We went into this yesterday, do you remember? I was like, I know you bitches are experiencing coveting. I know you bitches are lustful. I know you're greedy.

[Morgan]

I don't even know the ten Commandments. Is that what is. Those are the is coveting on there?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yes.

[Jenna]

Yes. That's what that is. Yes. Being gluttonous is one of them.

[Mikayla]

Sloth.

[Jenna]

Sloth is one of them.

[Morgan]

I know you bitch.

[Jenna]

I know you bitches are slothing and you're worried about gay.

[Morgan]

What is slothing?

[Jenna]

Like being lazy. What?

[Morgan]

This feels fake.

[Jenna]

Do you want to read the 10?

[Morgan]

Well, I'm trying to find them, but like, there's a lot of 10 deadly sins, fake versions. Thou shall not covet 10 yet.

[Jenna]

That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. And I know we're coveting. You're on TikTok Shop. You are coveting.

[Morgan]

Thou shalt not bear false witness. Thou shalt not commit adultery. There's a lot of other ones way before. Yeah, that's a very good point that that person makes.

[Jenna]

Although all the sins are equal, apparently.

[Morgan]

Are they though?

[Jenna]

Yeah. Which always, like, flew my mind as a child. Killing. Yes. Murder.

[Morgan]

Yes. Are they though?

[Jenna]

Murder and lying are like, it's all equal.

[Morgan]

I don't believe that.

[Jenna]

That's what I was told.

[Mikayla]

I don't.

[Morgan]

I don't.

[Jenna]

And I always thought to myself, I

[Morgan]

don't co sign that. Okay. Op. Congratulations on your wedding. One of our very listeners. I would love to see pictures.

[Jenna]

Oh, yeah, I forgot about that. That's so exciting. Oh, wait. Congratulations. I'm so sorry that you're going through this.

[Morgan]

This is. You're gonna have the most amazing, magical day. And the people that are meant to be there are gonna show up for you and make it so special. And that is what it's about. Like, this is a great time to weed out people that aren't real ones. They're not ride or dies. Like, I. I really did hold my wedding as a standard of like, are you gonna show up for me? And the way I show up for you. And if not, bye.

[Jenna]

She probably would've brought weird energy. There would have been like a weird

[Morgan]

this episode is brought to you by Billie I don't know about you guys, but I get a little lazy in the winter. I'm in hibernation mode and I grow out my leg hair a little bit, but it's getting warmer and now I'm excited for that first shave of the season. And if you are, then you gotta get the Billy Razor into your life. It's designed for how women actually shave. Legs, pits, toes, happy trail wherever prickles decide to show up. It has five sharp blades and a pivoting head so you can actually get everywhere without doing shower gymnastics. And it comes with a magnetic holder so your razor stays dry on the wall. Instead of sitting in a shower puddle, grab a Billy Razor in your favorite color in store [e-mail] for adults with

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[Morgan]

I would love to see pictures of your wedding. Yes, so please send them to me. This next one is coming from Am I the Asshole? Titled Am I the Asshole for getting my child's teacher fired after she called my marriage fake. I, 30 female, have been married to my wife, 31 female, for seven years and five years ago we had a daughter who I'll call Gracie through ivf. We are both religious and part of an LGBT affirming section. We think it's important to our daughter to have a religious education. Our local place of worship doesn't have a kindergarten, so Gracie is at a school by a different church that is more Conservative. But we were told our marriage would not be an issue and that other same sex couples had kids enrolled. My daughter's teacher, who we'll call Mrs. B. Seemed nice enough. We chatted when I volunteered and Gracie enjoyed her class. Early last week, the kids were told to do a family tree. My wife and I helped Gracie and she turned it in with me labeled as mama and my wife as Mom. After the family tree presentations, I got a call from Mrs. B. Saying my daughter acted out in class and needed a parent teacher meeting to discuss her behavior. When I get my daughter that day at pickup, she's sobbing. Gracie tells me when she presented, Mrs. B. Asked if the two moms were a mistake. But when my daughter said she has two moms, Mrs. B told my daughter that it isn't a real marriage and that it's never too late for me to enter a proper marriage with one man and one woman. Gracie starts crying saying we are a real family. Mrs. B snapped at my daughter and told her to sit down and shut up. She gave her a zero and did not discipline some kids who were then mocking her. I immediately called my wife who left work early. When we got home, my wife and I explained how not everyone is accepting, but that we are a real family, our God loves us very much and how brave she was for standing up for herself. The next day, my wife called off work and we took Gracie to my grandmother's. We went to the principal's office and we were seen ASAP. The principal was deeply apologetic that one, Gracie had been told that by Mrs. B and two she didn't intervene when she was bullied. He affirmed the school's commitment to a safe environment for all families regardless of opinions on same sex marriage. He said to bring Gracie in the next day because this would be taken care of. The next day I took Gracie to class and Mrs. B was gone, replaced by a sub. The principal informed my wife and I that Mrs. B was fired. However, word got around the school quick. While some parents were supportive, others told us we should be ashamed of ourselves and we ruined Mrs. B's life by demanding she be fired. We didn't ask her to be fired, just that it was dealt with and that we could have talked to Mrs. B first or asked to go to the other kindergarten class. A few are even saying Mrs. B is right and our family doesn't belong at this school and we need to transfer so their children don't think this sinful union is okay. Obviously I don't think my marriage is wrong, but should I have talked to Mrs. B. First or just asked to transfer classes. Am I the asshole for getting my child's teacher fired after she called my marriage fake?

[Jenna]

No, op, you did not do anything wrong. I think what sucks about this is that you did everything right. But then still now you're left in a situation where everyone at school is blaming you and talking about you and your child and saying how like this sucks for them because this gay couple has ruined our, our kids classroom. And it's like there was nothing you could do in that situation just because you're yourselves for things to go in a way that didn't harm you and your child. And that really sucks. Also, Mrs. B's life isn't ruined. She can get a job in Florida. Sorry, to Florida. She can get a job in Florida. I'm sure they love that shit.

[Morgan]

I mean, she'll find another job. Teachers are very in demand right now. I know there's a shortage of teachers. I think regardless of what you believe in, to yell at a five year old in your kindergarten class and tell them to shut up. This child is five. They literally just learned how to talk. I know, like I'm being hyperbolic here, but you know what I mean, like this is a little baby is like coming to you and making this family tree and you're like, actually Gracie, you're fucking dumb. Shut up. Your parents marriage isn't real. Yeah, get the fuck out. Like I know she didn't say that aggressively, but that's what you're basically implying and how you're treating this five year old child. If you are in positions of teacher, counselor, a position of power in regards to children, regardless of what your beliefs are, you need to set them aside in order to treat them with respect. And like if you can't do that, you shouldn't be in that position.

[Jenna]

Yeah, have some self control. And also like, to what end? To what end is saying this gonna do some like saying this to a five year old, what's that gonna do? Like what's the five year old gonna do about it? Like there's not even a scenario in which this leads to something that could make you happy if this is your belief, like, except feel crappy.

[Morgan]

That's a really good point that other

[Jenna]

people don't believe in. And I think what also is sad about this is that like it just shows that this is a conversation that at some point gay couples have to have with their children of like, by the way, there are people out there who are gonna say bad things about your Your mom and I or your dad. Like there are people who are going to judge you and like look down on you because of this and say you're going to hell and XYZ all the. And like that's a conversation that has to happen with every gay couple with kids.

[Morgan]

And that's so sad.

[Jenna]

I know.

[Morgan]

That's so sad that that could be a reality for a lot of kids out there. Or like you can't have sleepovers if parents are into that because of people being weird or homophobic. And it's like, ah, it's very frustrating. Like I again like I just don't understand why people and all over like this episode might not be able to be played in certain countries. Like that is the reality of certain places in the world. And it's like, it's so gross.

[Jenna]

Yeah. And things have been getting worse.

[Morgan]

I know, I know. And that's like we need, we need to have these stories get out there because like it could change people's minds and like it could cause a shift and people could see the era of their ways and like I hope they're is more progress. And there's, there has been progress. If you look back, you know, you look at the 80s and all the discrimination and like all of these big things and it's like we have had some progress. 2015, same sex marriage became legal. Like there's been progress but it's like okay.

[Jenna]

Not really the last few years though, I would say.

[Morgan]

No.

[Jenna]

Gone backwards for sure. The last few years.

[Morgan]

Everything has gone backwards the last few years. Like it's just not, it's not good. But definitely not the asshole you are entitled to. Your faith and your child should have a safe place to learn. Yeah, this is not a safe place. And honestly good on the principal for acting so swiftly. And any of those other families, if they're uncomfortable, they can get the fuck out of there too.

[Jenna]

And I can't imagine like being a teacher and having this five year old child in your class and not just being like, you know what, I want to protect them. I don't want to hurt this child. I don't want to. I don't want to make them sad or feel bad about their family. No, I just, I mean it's one thing to harass people kind of separate on the Internet. These people you don't know or like harass the concept of gay people like be this separate entity that's judging it from afar, but to like actually know this five year old child and to be so venomous that you want to make them feel bad. That's crazy to me.

[Morgan]

A 5 year old. Top comment, not the asshole. Your child was emotionally harmed and the teacher was clearly hostile and discriminatory towards your family. You didn't get her fired personally. You reported a serious issue to protect your child and the school made the decision. Talking to Mrs. B. First might not have changed anything and could have caused more stress for Gracie. Your priority was your child's safety and well being and you handled it responsibly. Yeah, and that's true. Like, going to the teacher first could cause retaliatory methods like Gracie's separated in class or ignored in class. Like, it could make it worse versus, hey, this was inappropriate. We're going to. Who should know about this situation.

[Jenna]

Right. And again, if you're just the person who has communicated what somebody else did and that gets them fired or punished in whatever way, that does not make you responsible. It is still the responsibility of the person who did the thing that could get them fired. You know, and I feel like that's in a lot of situations, victims of things feel like it's their fault when someone who actually did the thing gets punished for it.

[Morgan]

Yeah, a lot of people are like, not the asshole. There's probably something else going on here where, like, this isn't her first warning for it to go to 0 to 100. Like, there's probably other situations that have happened with Mrs. B. And this was just another strike. Either that or when the principal talked to her, she exploded and went back down. So regardless, like, she probably was given more chances or handled the situation very inappropriately and it was determined that she can no longer work here. She's ineffective.

[Jenna]

Yeah, well, that makes sense because they told this couple it won't be a problem at our school. So, like, this has to be conversations that were happening internally already.

[Morgan]

Crazy. We don't have an update from OP yet. It's three months old at this time, so maybe someday.

[Jenna]

Damn. I hope that everyone at their school gets a little nicer. I wonder if they stayed there or, you know, switched. I don't.

[Mikayla]

Sucks.

[Morgan]

I know. And you should.

[Jenna]

And then it's also sad because then it's disillusioning gay people from religion. And it's like, wouldn't you want to, like, welcome everybody and accept them and make them feel comfortable?

[Morgan]

Numbers are going down.

[Jenna]

That's the kind of thing that's going to make people not want to be a part of the church.

[Morgan]

I know. You got to be inclusive. Numbers are going down. Need all the little boost. All new Sundays at 9, exclusively on AMC and AMC.

[Morgan's Dad]

Plus I am the vampire Thought I'm a rock star.

[Morgan]

Now I'm a little killer.

[Mikayla]

I'm a moon.

[Morgan]

From Anne Rice's immortal universe comes what Vulture calls the most momentous event in fictional rock history.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Thousands of fans love you. I want millions.

[Morgan's Dad]

It's my era.

[Morgan]

Anne Rice is the vampireless dot. All new Sundays at 9, exclusively on AMC and AMC Stream now. This podcast is brought to you by Carvana.

[Guest Speaker]

Selling your car should feel like one

[Morgan]

less thing on your list. Not one more. With Carvana, it is just go to Carvana.com Enter your license plate or VIN

[Mikayla]

and get a real offer.

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Down to the penny.

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[Morgan]

Like your offer.

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Accept it, Schedule pickup and we'll come to you with a check in hand.

[Morgan]

Your car, your timeline, your terms. Visit Carvana.com to sell your car today. Carvana Pick up. Fees may apply. You can get Inclusivity might be one way to do it. Just Just a thought. This next one is coming from R Am I overreacting? Titled Am I overreacting that my boyfriend doesn't want me to identify as bi anymore? Forgive me. This is my first ever post and I'm not sure how good it will be.

[Mikayla]

Lol.

[Morgan]

So my female, 24, boyfriend, male 26, and I have been together for almost two years now and have been living together for about a year. Overall, our relationship is amazing. He takes such great care of me and all of our pets. Anyways, I don't know how this came up, but two nights ago it came up that I identify as bisexual. I thought he had already known that because it's not something I really hide. Needless to say, it caught him by surprise because now he's saying that he can't trust me alone with any of my friends because, quote, I'm choosing to identify as that and he believes it means basically that I'm always attracted to everyone around me. Essentially. I don't know, we started arguing and it just went nowhere. He identifies as a straight male and he's never been too exposed to the LGBT community, so I understand why things like sexuality can be confusing for him, but I'm pretty much the exact opposite where I've had many out and open family members and friends who all identify in many different ways. So basically, yeah, he told me that he doesn't like that I identify as bisexual and that if I'm truly committed to our relationship, which is a straight relationship, that I should be Identifying as straight. If I keep identifying as bi, that must mean I'm trying to attract ladies.

[Jenna]

I know.

[Morgan]

I could have just said, yeah, okay, you're right. I'm straight now, but it just feels like I'm having to shamefully hide a part of me. Question mark. I've just never been in a situation like this before, and I don't want to make him feel that kind of insecurity. I just kind of sort of feel lost right now, and I'm torn between a part of who I am and my relationship. Anyways, if you read all of this. Thank you and any advice is welcome.

[Jenna]

He sucks, first of all. Yeah, but that's also like, the most classic biphobia in the books. Just like, assuming you want everybody. I also just feel like for all gay people, not just bi people, it's like as soon as my certain, like, female friends know that I'm also into women, they, like, think I want them. And it's like, I don't.

[Morgan]

Like, I don't.

[Mikayla]

I don't want you.

[Jenna]

You know, it's just like, not like,

[Morgan]

even if you look at. Okay. Cis straight, like, not every guy wants you. Why would you think. Yeah, why would you think a bi woman is automatically going to be into you just because you're a woman?

[Jenna]

Yeah, it's like a weirdly strong sense that people have of like, oh, now that I know that you're into girls, it's like, I better watch out.

[Morgan]

I better watch.

[Jenna]

I better watch.

[Morgan]

That's so weird. You're Mark safe.

[Jenna]

You are Mark safe.

[Morgan]

That's so weird. It's not happening.

[Jenna]

But, yeah, I know. I was just telling you, which I can't believe you didn't know this. I've. I haven't had sex in five years with any. With anybody. So, like, this idea.

[Morgan]

I feel like I should get you a trophy.

[Jenna]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Morgan]

Like, that feels like such an accomplishment.

[Jenna]

The first year that I did it, I got myself a cake that said Happy virginiversary.

[Morgan]

What are you doing for this one? Have you hit five years?

[Guest Speaker]

I'm past.

[Jenna]

Yeah, I'm past five years.

[Morgan]

So when is six?

[Guest Speaker]

I don't know.

[Jenna]

It's like February sometime. February.

[Morgan]

I missed it.

[Jenna]

Well, at a certain point, five was a big one. At a certain point, you stop celebrating.

[Morgan]

Well, I think, honestly, seven years should be the big one, because as you said seven years, all of your cells

[Jenna]

have regenerated, and then you can be a virgin again.

[Morgan]

But.

[Mikayla]

Okay.

[Morgan]

Are you trying to get there now? Sorry, I'm, like, so fascinated by this,

[Jenna]

it'd be so funny. But I'm also not like, if love finds me, it's a no because I got to regenerate my cells. I'm like, no, it's not. But the point that I was trying to make is that, like, I am bisexual, but I'm clearly not. Like, oh, my God, I want everybody. I'm so into everybody. I need to have them all. So this idea of, like, because you can be interested in any gender doesn't mean that you want everybody. You can still be in a committed relationship and only want the person that you're with. It works the same way as it does with everybody else.

[Morgan]

I know. It's such a weird mentality too, because it's like, okay, you're worried about your partner being bi because they could be potentially attracted to women, but what about other guys?

[Jenna]

Yeah. Well, how Many is it? 8 billion people in the world?

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Jenna]

So it's like, before, you were worried about 4.5 billion people. Like, I mean, once you're at 4.5 billion people, can it really get any bigger than that? Am I right?

[Morgan]

I can't comprehend. I mean, after. After, like, 8 million, I'm like, what? I don't know.

[Jenna]

It's just like, yeah, like 8 billion, 4.5 billion.

[Morgan]

The million versus billion, when they do it in piles of rice, really freaks me out.

[Jenna]

It's insane.

[Morgan]

Like, that's. I'm just like, I know I can't compute. Like, and again, like, I really. I'm like, when you start seeing those piles of rice, a million versus a billion, you're like, a billion shouldn't exist and a trillion certainly shouldn't exist.

[Jenna]

People got to start dying.

[Morgan]

Or like, taxes, I mean, just taxes would be also okay than death.

[Jenna]

Okay.

[Morgan]

Protect queer art. But, yeah, no, this is a weird logic. And for him being like, well, you should just identify as straight now because you're with me. It's like, he's not respecting you. And, yeah, as OP said, like, you shouldn't have to be torn between a part of who you are and your relationship. Your relationship should respect who you are.

[Jenna]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Morgan]

It's also like, otherwise, you're with the wrong person.

[Jenna]

Yeah. Sexuality doesn't equate to availability. I don't.

[Guest Speaker]

It's just.

[Jenna]

It's a totally different. Like, we'll talk about the difference between sexuality and gender. Like, there's also a difference between sexuality and In a relationship or single Top comment.

[Morgan]

I don't understand. It's not like you're attracted to all men. Or women. It's not like you have to screw everything you're attracted to. I think it's kind of strange. He can't comprehend that.

[Jenna]

Yeah. But it's common. So not that shocked.

[Morgan]

It's so weird. There's a comment that does respond to that. That's a harmful bi stereotype, that people that are bi are all basically, like, super promiscuous, and that's not the case. I also think, like, some can be, though.

[Jenna]

Hey, if you're out there.

[Guest Speaker]

Whoa.

[Morgan]

Yeah, maybe message Michaela, because she might need a little inspo, apparently. I do think there's something, though, to be said about that with him, too. There's an aspect of bi erasure here where it's like, oh, well, you're with me. You're. You're not bi.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

And so I think that's important to keep in mind. Like, no. Just because you're with a guy, like, you can still be bi.

[Jenna]

So that's a big discourse on Pride Month by girls with girl, with boyfriends. We don't have to get into that.

[Morgan]

I mean, do you want to.

[Jenna]

No.

[Morgan]

I've seen a lot of posts about it. I have seen a lot of posts about it. Especially, like, can I bring my boyfriend to Pride if I'm bi?

[Jenna]

Does he need to be there?

[Morgan]

Is that his.

[Jenna]

I mean, it's fine, but doesn't, like. I don't know.

[Morgan]

It's a debate.

[Jenna]

It's like, does he need to be? I don't know.

[Morgan]

A lot of people said no. A lot of people said that's not his space. And the boyfriend didn't really want to go in one of the stories. So it's like. Well, then again, there are some things

[Jenna]

that, like, I just don't really have a strong opinion on, you know? But if. Yeah, if I saw some, like, boyfriends at Pride just kind of trailing behind, bringing the vibe down, I don't know,

[Morgan]

I'd be like, bringing the vibe down.

[Jenna]

All right, here's this guy. Here's this fucking guy.

[Morgan]

Yeah. I mean, if he's bringing the vibe down, he definitely shouldn't be there.

[Jenna]

But if everyone's friends with him, he's, like, integrated into the group. I don't know.

[Morgan]

I mean, is he an ally or not?

[Jenna]

Well, I think.

[Morgan]

What's his vibe?

[Mikayla]

I hope so.

[Morgan]

I mean, if he's with you, a bi person like you. Are we talking about me? No, no.

[Jenna]

Like the writer.

[Mikayla]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

It's been a day.

[Jenna]

Sorry, guys.

[Morgan]

No, but. No, but, like, if he's with this bi person, he should at least be an ally. Be with an ally.

[Jenna]

Like, totally. Totally. Yeah. This guy is really, like, he's got to compute some stuff.

[Morgan]

I know. Everyone's calling him names in the comments, right? They call him an insecure weirdo.

[Jenna]

Well, I also feel bad because I feel like OP is sort of letting him dictate it a little bit more than she should be. She was like, oh, I could have just told him I'm straight. I'm like, no. Like, why are you even. Why is that even a thing that you're putting in there?

[Morgan]

You shouldn't have to compromise on who you are to keep someone.

[Hailey Kiyoko]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

If you have to lie about who you are, hide parts of who you are to have someone like you or love you or want to be in a relationship with you, that is not the right person.

[Jenna]

Trying to see he can't come to Pride.

[Morgan]

No, he's absolutely not coming to Pride. OP is very active on Reddit, in Yellowjackets, Hive subreddits, in. Am I overreacting? Subreddits, Netflix subreddits. I mean, there's Verified Two Year Club, so this is giving real post.

[Jenna]

Did they respond to any comments?

[Morgan]

They did respond to some. Just, you know, thanking people for genuine and thoughtful responses. They do say a lot of people are skipping over the fact that we come from two totally different households. And, yes, there's plenty of informational media out there, but really, it's not the same as having real life experiences. And I believe it is just a shock to realize that for him, he is very open to learning and understanding about the LGBT community. And I think we'll revisit this topic after letting our brains marinate on it for a while. Lol. Thank you.

[Jenna]

Okay, Mar.

[Morgan]

Okay, okay.

[Jenna]

Marinate on that bisexuality.

[Morgan]

Marinate, marinate. Thank you for not jumping to this straight. He's a horrible monster conclusion like everyone else. I think you're right. It definitely is ignorance over malice. And it's just another thing that we both have to be prepared for and ready to talk about. I would say sure. I mean, you've been together for two years, and if he's just now learning you're bi, like, I could. I can understand why he's like, well, wait, like, why didn't you tell me? That's, you know, part of you that I'd like to know and appreciate. Whatever. But if he continues to be like, you're straight, you're with me, you're straight. You're not bi anymore. You're straight, then you're Gonna have a problem.

[Jenna]

Yeah.

[Morgan]

That's not a problem of like, oh, he needs to marinate on it. That's just a problem in, like a

[Jenna]

sort of distant, far off way. I could understand this being a thing people experience, but if I try to, like, ever consider being in this situation at this point in my life and having a guy talk like that or respond that way, I can't imagine it. Like, that would be so crazy to me. I'd be like, no.

[Morgan]

If someone said that to you, would you stay with them?

[Jenna]

No.

[Morgan]

Even if you were together for five years?

[Hailey Kiyoko]

I.

[Jenna]

Well, I would. I wouldn't.

[Morgan]

You wouldn't get there.

[Jenna]

I would never be in that situation.

[Morgan]

Yeah, you wouldn't get there. Find people who are gonna match you in compassion, empathy, effort, love, respect. Regardless of who it is. Find someone who's meeting you on your level. Like, we. No one deserves to settle. Like, point blank mic drop. Don't settle. Yeah, raise the bar. Raise the bar. Raise the bar and buy.

[Jenna]

Girls are promiscuous.

[Morgan]

That is not a rumor we're gonna start on the show Michaela. They're clearly not. She's celibate for five years.

[Jenna]

There's, you know.

[Morgan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jenna]

It doesn't mean I'm not promiscuous.

[Morgan]

Next guest.

[Morgan's Dad]

Hey, guys. And yes, welcome to Two Hot Takes. I look a little different, but in case you guys don't know who I am, because for some reason I haven't been around for a while, I've been working on the other set, but I'm Morgan's dad from Father Knows Something. So, Morgan, thanks for letting me on your show today.

[Morgan]

Yeah, dad is not a part of the LGBTQ community. However, he is one of the best dads I know. The most open, supportive, kind dad out there. So you're here to respond to this next story. Our last story from a dad's perspective.

[Morgan's Dad]

Okay, I can do this.

[Morgan]

So this is coming from R. Am I overreacting? Titled, my son just told me he is gay. Am I overreacting? I, 52, male, am the father of a 17 year old son. We are really close. He's my whole world. We've always had a great relationship. He's a typical guy for his age. He plays football, has a good group of friends, and we talk about everything. Or at least I thought we did. Last night, he came into my room and told me he was gay. He looked like he was going to throw up. He said, please don't hate me for what I'm about to say. And then he told me I Just froze. I was just so shocked that I went totally silent for a few seconds. When he saw my reaction, he started crying. That snapped me out of it. And I immediately hugged him and told him I loved him over and over again. And he sobbed. He kept apologizing and I kept shushing him and telling him that he didn't need to be sorry. We both cried since last night. I can't stop spiraling. I love my son with everything I have. This hasn't changed and never, never will. But I'm scared. In our country, this thing is complicated. People in the city are starting to accept it more. But we live in a small town in which things are still very controversial. When I was in high school, there was a kid who was rumored to be gay. And he ended up getting beaten so badly he had to move away. That's all I can see when I think of my son now. And it's destroying me. I don't know how to protect him. I feel helpless. He told me he's not going to act different or wear makeup or anything like that. But honestly, that just made me feel worse. I don't want him to think he has to say that to make me feel more comfortable. I keep thinking about the stupid jokes I've made in the past, Stuff I thought was harmless. And now I hate myself. I think I might have hurt him without knowing it. I don't know anything about gay people. I've never had anyone close to me come out before. I don't know what I'm supposed to do or say. Should I talk to him about boys like I would have talked about girls? Should I ask him about crushes? Or would that make it weird? What happens when he starts dating? Do I treat it like I would if he brought home a girlfriend? I'm terrified I will say or do the wrong thing and push him away. I want to be a good dad. I want him to feel safe with me. But I'm overwhelmed and I can't stop thinking about all the things that could go wrong. I keep picturing people being cruel to him. I can't sleep. I feel like I'm failing him already by not knowing what to do to keep him safe. Am I overreacting? I don't have anyone in my life that I can talk to about this. I just want to do right by my son.

[Morgan's Dad]

You know? That is really the heart of all of our. Of being a parent is simply protecting our kids. And when we see something that can cause them a problem later in life, we are scared shitless and sometimes we, me can get really, in someone's opinion, nasty when I'm only trying to do things that protect my kids and we only act out of love. And I think the fact that what you just articulated here was so, so perfect and simple, that that's what you should share with him. Say, I'm happy. Whatever your preference is, it doesn't matter to me. The only thing that matters to me is that you're safe. And because I've seen such meanness with, as a parent's point of view, watching other people going through this, the meanness, what comes along with it, that's what makes me fear not the fact that you're gay. I'm totally comfortable. If you find someone that you can have a meeting of the minds with and love and will love you back with all their heart, what do I care? And that's really what it's about. I mean, you only want happiness for, well, and I'm speaking people that should be, you know, of, of normal, balanced love, you know, with their kids. I mean, there are people out there that are narcissistic and do have other. That have issues, you know, have their own issues. But, you know, I speak generally. You only want love for you, for your children. And I can definitely see that you have it for your son. And I'm sure he does feel it. And the fact that he was able to be open and talk to you shows you that he loves and he trusts you. But you have to be totally honest and tell him where your concern really is. Has nothing to do about his sexuality. It has to do with somebody else coming on board and, and hurting him. Because there's a lot of meanness in the world.

[Morgan]

Yeah, yeah. As long as he's got you being supportive and caring and being his dad, that's all that matters. I think, you know, a lot of people don't even feel comfortable coming out to their parents or it's not safe for them to come out to their parents because they'll be cut off and kicked out of the house. And so many people go through stuff like that. And we've, you know, we've had stories and write ins like that on father knows of like, I want to come out, but I don't think it's safe. What do I do?

[Morgan's Dad]

Yeah, I mean, you know, in my family, we do have people that are part of the LBGT Q LGBTQ LGBTQ community. And it is. Oh, it was absolutely accepted with no issue. I mean, I'm sure my dad was you know, was in disbelief when my sister came out, and only because his narrow mindedness with a lot of things in life, but. And I don't know what his deal was. I can't tell you. And he, he died soon after, so I, I can't answer. But we've, as a family, we've all accepted the love of her life. And, and, and in our, in our own and your family, we've always accepted the love of her, of, of his life. I mean it. In every family I, That I know, I. It's amazing how today's world is so different here in the United States than it may be in your country.

[Morgan]

Yeah.

[Morgan's Dad]

But it's, you know, it's every day. I mean, nobody. I don't, I don't. I, I certainly hope we don't have the hate that we did have when I was in high school, because we certainly had it when I was in high school.

[Morgan]

You know, I think unfortunately a lot of LGBTQ people do face mean treatment. Hatred, hate crimes, I mean, is scary still, I think, today. But I think when it comes to living your life, like, make sure you're opening up to the right people. And if your family is unwilling to accept you for who you are, then chosen family and the village that you build is more important.

[Morgan's Dad]

Absolutely.

[Morgan]

So I will say we've got some comments on this one. The top comment. Hi, lesbian here. First off, I think you did an amazing job in your reaction to your son telling you he's gay. I've had to come out to my mom three times now, and her reactions ranged from it's just a phase to you need to talk to God about it. So you showing love and support was definitely the correct response. In reading your post. I do think you could benefit from doing some research on the LGBTQ community. I mostly want to point out that sexuality and gender expression are two very different things. This is in regards to the makeup thing. Most people are used to the stereotype that gay men are flamboyant and feminine and gay women are super butch and masculine. But that does not describe all gay men and women. Who we sleep with does not dictate how we look. If your son wants to wear makeup, cool, but it's not like a requirement to be a gay man. The last thing I want to say is, in regards to when he starts dating, please acknowledge it, be excited for him, ask questions. Speaking from firsthand experience here, I've been dating my girlfriend for almost nine months, and every time I bring her up to my mom, I get zero acknowledgement and the conversation quickly changes to something else. After 30 years of hiding who I was, it sucks to feel like I still need to hide myself from my mom. Just keep doing what you're doing. You're on the right track so far. Be supportive, be curious, make jokes. I'm constantly making not straight jokes. Make a crooked line when cutting wrapping paper. I've never done a straight thing in my life. That squiggly line is as straight as I am. Lol. There are so many good dad jokes. But yeah, the most important thing is making sure your son feels accepted and loved. Best of luck to you.

[Morgan's Dad]

I agree. And I, and I also think you did an amazing job. But I, I think the, the thing that you really have to do to finish the frosting on the cake is have the honesty talk of what you of why you reacted so he understands you didn't react because of his choice. You reacted because of just your fear of him being safe.

[Morgan]

Yeah. And there's so many amazing comments here too. Just like again, people sharing their insights. Trans girl here. Completely agree with everything said me coming out destroyed my parents marriage. There were a lot of cracks, but ultimately it's what did it. My mom disowned me and then she divorced my dad when he refused to. My dad's a plumber. He's made off color jokes my whole life. But when I shared myself with him, he was so amazingly supportive. He was clear there was much he didn't understand and he asked me to be patient with him. But to know no matter what, he was always on my side. And he has been. Now he's the guy at the Elks Club trying to educate his boomer buddies about trans issues. He's wearing Pride shirts on job sites and doing everything he can to make sure this really scary place is safer for me. A good dad can change the world. Oh my God, why am I gonna cry? That's just so beautiful.

[Morgan's Dad]

It was.

[Morgan]

And I think like, I think parents like one thing parents could do that I wish my mom would have done a little better is when you're scared and your behavior might seem irrational, be overly honest. Don't be afraid to be vulnerable with your kids and tell them the truth about why you're acting the way you're acting. And so I think for this guy where he's like, I've made some offhand jokes before. I'm scared. I don't know what to do. Be honest with your son. Say, you know, I feel bad about those jokes I've made in the past. I'm sorry. You know, going forward, be open with me. I want to hear about who you're dating and talk about guys with you. Be honest. And that is going to go so much further with your kids because, yeah, you've lived life before and you've been a kid before, but it's your first time being a parent. So just be open and honest, and as long as you're supportive and loving, that's what matters.

[Morgan's Dad]

I agree.

[Morgan]

Ugh. I'm just on the verge of tears here. I hate it. Well, it's been an amazing, amazing Pride episode, you guys. We have had so many good guests, so many good stories, and I really do want to continue to highlight all issues, you know, that impact LGBTQ community. Hearing some of these stories could change someone's mind. I mean, it could open someone's eyes to being more accepting and inclusive and loving. So I hope that these stories reach someone that needs to hear it. Everyone deserves love. Everyone deserves happiness. Life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness and all that. So that's all I gotta say.

[Morgan's Dad]

And welcome to fatherhood for me.

[Morgan]

Yeah, I mean,

[Morgan's Dad]

I know that the last read, you'll figure it out real quick and you guys will be fine, really. Well, and thank you for having me on the show because I don't get to come on very often, guys. She kind of keeps me in the closet over there and locks the door.

[Morgan]

Of course.

[Morgan's Dad]

Excuse me.

[Morgan]

In the closet on our Pride episode.

[Morgan's Dad]

Not because of sexuality, just because she thinks I'm a beast and an animal.

[Morgan]

No, you're just. I don't know what to predict with you. So we keep him over on Father Knows Something. So if you want more dad, check out Father Knows Something. You're due for an episode. You'll be back sometime soon.

[Morgan's Dad]

Yeah, she really limits me.

[Morgan]

And that is all I got. If you want more of us, head over to Patreon. We've got some amazing episodes over there. And until next time, and if you

[Morgan's Dad]

haven't tried Father Knows Something, you can catch Justin, Morgan, myself and others as we are doing our thing over there. So. So until next time.

[Morgan]

Bye, guys.

[Morgan's Dad]

By.

[Morgan]

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[Jenna]

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[Morgan]

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[Morgan's Dad]

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[Morgan]

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