When Does A Partner’s Joke Go Too Far?

Summary

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U Up? – "When Does A Partner’s Joke Go Too Far?"

Hosts: Jordana Abraham & Jared Freid
Episode Date: February 19, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode explores where to draw the line when humor in relationships turns hurtful. Jordana and Jared, with their signature candid banter, discuss deciphering playful ribbing from comments that strike a nerve. They break down listener emails about “roasts” in relationships gone too far, awkward encounters stemming from misjudged jokes, and the crucial role of honest communication about feelings. Plus, they navigate red flag or deal breaker games and field audience dilemmas about mismatched intimacy and boundary-pushing dating behavior.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. Catching Up & Recent Travels

[01:22–14:44]

• Jared’s Montreal-LA Trip: Jared recounts his travels from freezing Montreal to cosmopolitan LA and back, including food, culture, changing dating app locations, and the social scenes in each city.
• LA Vibes & Insecurity: Both hosts reflect on LA’s pressure to look good and its broader effect on self-esteem. Jordana jokes, “Everything about the vibe there just makes me want to lose 10 pounds.” (13:19)
• Changing Your App Location: Jared shares how changing his dating app location while traveling brought a sudden surge in attention, joking, “I’m an old hag in New York and I’m fresh face in LA.” (11:55)

2. Real-Life Encounters at Bars

[08:30–11:47]

• Meeting Random Strangers: The duo discusses how meeting people IRL is unpredictable–sometimes interesting, sometimes exhausting, and occasionally icky.
  • Jared: “That’s the gamble… your energy is going to be sopped up by someone and it is a total randomized thing.” (10:00)
• Why App Dates Feel Safer: Jordana points out, “That’s why people love going on dates with someone they’ve already met in person…” (11:21)
• Dating App Refresh: Jared changes app locations for fun when traveling, highlighting the “new face” phenomenon.

3. The Joke That Goes Too Far

[25:13–38:55]
Listener Email #1: “Did My Boyfriend’s Joke Cross the Line?”

• Scenario: Listener's boyfriend tells her she'd “never make it” on a reality TV dating show, after she jokes her hobbies would be TV and flashcards. She laughs but then feels hurt.
• Breakdown:
  • Is it ever “just a joke” if it stings?
  • When is a “roast” playful, and when is it unnecessarily mean?
  • Importance of intent vs. impact.
  • Notable Quotes:
    • Jordana: “Here’s the thing about this comment: it’s not funny at all… If you’re going to make a joke about me… it’s got to be funny. And that wasn’t funny.” (29:06)
    • Jared: “There’s this weird thing of, like, ‘can’t take a joke’. No, no. You had a bad shot. You hurt my feelings.” (30:26)
    • Jordana: “You have to feel like the person is your fan—not like you’re two people in a comedy troupe making fun of each other all the time.” (34:55)
• Advice:
  • Communicate directly (“That really hurt my feelings” is always valid).
  • Partners sometimes “miss” with humor; it’s important to calibrate boundaries.
  • Don’t let resentment build by hiding your reaction.
  • A healthy relationship balances playful ribbing with genuine support and compliments.

4. Personal Anecdotes: Bombed Jokes in Relationships

[37:00–39:13]

• Jordana and Jared share stories of jokes/“bits” that unintentionally hurt their partners.
  • Jordana: “He’s like, 'you’re taking something I really enjoy, and you’re kind of shitting on it.'”
  • Jared: “I thought it was the funniest thing… Not so funny to the other person.”
• Key takeaway: Every joke contains some truth, and it’s common for partners to misjudge when a joke might cross a line.

5. Awkward Encounter: When “Funny” Becomes Cringe

[41:50–47:50]

• Listener Story: Woman agrees to a hockey game date with a stranger (after her friends’ vetting); as the night unfolds, he gets drunk, makes crass jokes about sex and abortion, and says wildly inappropriate things—including publicly embarrassing remarks at a military salute.
  • Jared: “There’s a thin line between trying to be funny and being funny. You shouldn’t always go for the joke.” (52:44)
  • Both hosts agree: sometimes, one bad joke is forgivable, but a pattern means it’s their whole personality.

6. Emotional vs. Physical Chemistry

[53:19–61:49] Listener Email #2: “What If the Physical Spark Isn’t There?”

• Scenario: Man finds emotional connection with a woman who has little dating experience, but their physical intimacy is “like kissing a cardboard cutout.”
• Discussion:
  • Is it hopeless, fixable, or a question of compatibility?
  • Potential causes: inexperience, possible trauma, or just not that into him.
  • Importance of communicating outside of physical settings.
  • How to raise the issue gently: “It feels like physically maybe we’re a little bit on different pages… I’m sensing hesitancy with you.” (57:54)
  • Recognizes possible deeper issues (e.g. past trauma) and the need for empathy and openness.

7. Red Flag or Deal Breaker Game

[62:52–77:32] A lightning round of relationship-dilemma scenarios:

• “He forgot he’d had a vasectomy mid-hookup.”

  • Both hosts: Total deal breaker. Jared: “Anytime they say you don’t need a condom, I’m like, I need two condoms.” (66:15)
  • The “I forgot” story is manipulative—he didn’t forget.

• “He quotes a mean comment from your RateMyProfessor profile on a first date.”

  • Jordana: “If you say it like that… tacky. There’s a way to get to this conversation.”
  • Jared suspects it’s a clumsy attempt to be flirty, but they both call it a red flag/deal breaker if said without tact.

• “Divorced dad wants to have a son via surrogate ASAP—deal breaker?”

  • Both are bewildered. Jordana: “[It’s] the lengths he would go to just to have a boy that are a little icky to me.” (74:07)
  • Raises practical and character questions, not just about wanting more kids, but about priorities and decision-making.

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• “Jokes in relationships aren’t a free pass. If it feels mean, it’s just mean.”
  — Jordana, (29:16)

• “You can’t tell someone how to feel… There’s no such thing as ‘too big a deal’—he said the line, you hated it, you have a right to hate it.”
  — Jared, (30:01)

• “If both people aren’t laughing, it’s not a good joke.”
  — Jordana, (33:18)

• On communication in relationships:
  “That’s why people say communication is so important. When you said you’d never make it on there, it made me think you don’t think I’m attractive. That’s a conversation that, if you work through it, you’d feel closer to someone.” (36:24)

• On misreading humor:
  “He might have meant, like—none of these dating show people could read, you’re smart! But he misread the line.”
  — Jared, (35:00)

• On awkward dates:
  “There’s a thin line between trying to be funny and being funny. Sometimes you bomb. Sometimes, it’s just who they are.”
  — Jared, (52:44)

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Key Takeaways

• The Line in Relationship Humor:
  Joking is a sign of comfort, but everyone’s sensitivities are different. If a partner’s “joke” upsets you, say so—it’s how couples learn each other’s boundaries.

• Balance “Roasting” With Genuine Support:
  Playful ribbing should never drown out sincere praise and real compliments. If nitpicking is the only dynamic, it erodes trust.

• Speak Up Early:
  Hiding feelings about crossed boundaries leads to resentment. Addressing issues quickly prevents blowups and solidifies intimacy.

• Uncomfortable Behavior Is a Non-Starter:
  Repeated “wrong” jokes or off-color comments, especially in public, reveal more about character than compatibility.

• Chemistry Includes Both Friendship and Physical:
  If emotional connection outpaces attraction, discuss it compassionately. Incompatibility isn’t anyone’s fault, but sometimes it can’t be overcome.

• Red Flags Don’t Disappear:
  From forgotten vasectomies to odd dating ambitions, address inconsistencies or pressuring behavior directly.

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• 01:22–14:44 — Travel catch-ups, dating app stories
• 25:13–38:55 — Main email: "Did my boyfriend's joke go too far?"
• 41:50–52:51 — Awkward encounter: The hockey date gone wrong
• 53:19–61:49 — Emotional vs. physical chemistry
• 62:52–77:32 — Red flag/deal breaker games (vasectomy, RateMyProfessor, surrogacy)

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Final Thoughts

The core of this episode is that even good relationships require careful calibration of humor, empathy, and honesty. Jordana and Jared reaffirm that it’s never silly to be hurt by a partner’s words—intent doesn’t erase impact. Their advice? Speak up when boundaries are crossed, balance fun with affirming your partner, and listen as much as you joke.

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For more on this theme, check out their bonus content via @u.up.podcast and send your own dating dilemmas to [e-mail].

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Transcript

[Jordana Abraham]

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[Jared Freed]

He's just sleeping.

[Jordana Abraham]

No idea what's coming. Hello and welcome back to the UF podcast.

[Jared Freed]

I'm Jordan Abraham and I am Jared Freed. It is so good to be back here with you, Jordana. How are you? How you feeling?

[Jordana Abraham]

I'm all right. I'm right. It's. You're. You're coming in hot today. I love it hot.

[Jared Freed]

I'm ready to go.

[Jordana Abraham]

You are. No bullshit, Jared.

[Jared Freed]

No bullshit. I. I did a lot of thinking.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

On this flight.

[Jordana Abraham]

How long have you spent on airplanes in the last 48, 72 hours?

[Jared Freed]

Well, I did, I went. So I went Montreal and then did the show. Thank you to everyone who came to the show. Montreal, the coldest place on earth. That is like, it hits you in the face and you're like, that stings.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

And I know it's not that all the time something be like, oh, you got to come in the summer. I don't know. I felt your winter. Your winter is brutal. Also. Awesome city. I think that is like on my.

[Jordana Abraham]

List for like say your first time there. You've been there.

[Jared Freed]

I've been there before, but I was there during, like, the just for Last festival, which is like a very Americanized.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay. You're not getting the real experience.

[Jared Freed]

It is such a French place.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

To the point where it's a little weird.

[Jordana Abraham]

Do you speak French now?

[Jared Freed]

No, we, We.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

I.

[Jordana Abraham]

Better than Fraud. Did you like it?

[Jared Freed]

It's. It's Frau Light. Yeah, it is. You know, if I was like, a young group of women in my 20s, and I wanted to do, like, a fun French type of weekend, go.

[Jordana Abraham]

I told you, my friends and I in college used to road trip there from Long island every summer.

[Jared Freed]

Love it. And summertime. I can imagine. It's great. It feels very College vibes. It's very much like Providence or Boston. I say across between the two.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

The French things weird, because there's no reason for them to be that French.

[Jordana Abraham]

Saying that the other day, like, there's absolutely there doesn't make any sense.

[Jared Freed]

It makes no sense. And it is something that on the dating scene, you see a lot where people grab onto this, like, personality trait that makes them unique and make them feel like an individual. And, like, that's kind of what the French stuff feels like there. And it's even gotten to like politics. Like, they make you. When you walk in, you have to say, bonjour. Hello. They're like, that's the law. Like, you.

[Jordana Abraham]

What happens if you don't do it?

[Jared Freed]

Hello. Bonjour. You get right. Marie Antoinette.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

Chop her head off. I loved Montreal, though. This place. I went to a restaurant. I'm just saying, like, guys, weekend. Mont Blanc is like an hour away. Where?

[Jordana Abraham]

Montre Blanc.

[Jared Freed]

Montre Blanc, whatever the. But it's, like, sexy. The people there, like, can you see.

[Jordana Abraham]

The people, or are they all in, like, seven layers of clothing?

[Jared Freed]

Those layers off. I saw a couple titties, and then I just, like, enjoyed the food. My friend Sophia, she took me around and it was just like, Sophia sounds.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like your friend from Montreal.

[Jared Freed]

That is my friend from Montreal. And she speaks French and, like, Right. You know, she's telling me that, like, the French in Montreal is, like, not really French French. It's like garbage French. Or as I call it, garbage garbage. And I went to this place called Joe Beef. Let me shout out.

[Jordana Abraham]

Let's hear.

[Jared Freed]

They say it's hard to get in. I know this is no secret, but, like, that place was, like, an experience. It was like French food done well.

[Jordana Abraham]

And do you like French food?

[Jared Freed]

No, I, I, I don't like the French.

[Jordana Abraham]

French onion soup. French onion soup.

[Jared Freed]

I didn't have any French onion.

[Jordana Abraham]

I don't know if that's French food or like.

[Jared Freed]

You know what my problem with the French onion soup is? The top is so hard to get. I love the top, but it's such a battle that you lose.

[Jordana Abraham]

You have to earn it. You have to earn it, really.

[Jared Freed]

And I don't want to earn anything.

[Jordana Abraham]

I'm not trying to work for anything.

[Jared Freed]

No, I want to eat as fast as possible and as much as possible.

[Jordana Abraham]

I always call French food wedding food because when I was. When we were in. When I was in Paris and like we were in. I was in France two times last summer with one of them. It's like every. Every meal is like, kind of looks like what you would get as like your entree choice at a wedding. It's like the. The flat, like filet mignon, the beef, the mashed potatoes then. And like the sides of. Of everything. I'm just kind of like. It does feel like a wedding right. Entree option.

[Jared Freed]

It's funny you said it because I was like, my issue with French food isn't that it isn't delicious. It's that there's not a lot of options that I'm like, confident in ordering. It'll be like. Like the six appetizers be like frog legs, snails, or French fries. I'm like, I guess I'm going American French fries, you know, like big fat, stupid me.

[Jordana Abraham]

Escargot is actually really good.

[Jared Freed]

It's all good and it's depthy. Like, it's like really flavorful. It's why they're thin, I think like. I think like the food is satiate.

[Jordana Abraham]

Are they thin in Montreal also?

[Jared Freed]

I know I always notice the thin people. I'm always watching.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, you think they're thin there? I thought they were pret in LA.

[Jared Freed]

So then. So did the show. Woke up at 4am to catch a 6am flight from Montreal to Minneapolis. Then when ran. Did The Kevin the McAllister run to the other plane to go from Minneapolis to LA? Got there at 11:30 and we did an LA experience.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yes, we taped our. I mean, it's out right now. You're a subscriber. It's out today. If you are a regular listener, it was. It's been out since yesterday. We did a special Love is Blind from the Pods episode.

[Jared Freed]

What did you think of taping from the pods? I know we talk about it a lot in that episode, so we won't get too far into it. But like, top line, like, what did you think of like, Being at the.

[Jordana Abraham]

Pods, it was really cool. I mean, yeah, it's cool to see how like tightly run of a ship they've got there. And like, I mean now Love is blinds now. Five years as we know, we just did a five year anniversary episode. Yeah, they really have the. And there's so many countries now. Have you ever seen a different country's Love is Blind?

[Jared Freed]

No, I, I'm, I, I try to keep things American. I go as far as Montreal.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah, you're like a typical. You're like, you're, you're an American. American.

[Jared Freed]

Make America great.

[Jordana Abraham]

My bro. I would normally not have seen the other countries, but last year when I was in Park City with like my siblings for my sister's birthday, my brother was like, you got to watch Sweden.

[Jared Freed]

But the Sweden one was. They were, they like.

[Jordana Abraham]

It was really good, just beautiful. And you kind of have to. Some. I mean like, yes, but also like, you know, they're every day. Yeah, there's, there's, there's. They run the gamut but there's a big thing like with. Or the guy kind of like sees. There's one where the guy sees the woman. He's like not really into her physically but he kind of like really, really likes her personality. And they like it winds up working out, but it's like a little bit of a. It's. I don't know.

[Jared Freed]

And you like read the subtitles. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, that's another thing. You kind of really have to pay attention because you can't just kind of like watch with it in the background.

[Jared Freed]

So you really get that Swedish accent. Like her. Sorry. Like, wow.

[Jordana Abraham]

I feel like I'm in Stockholm.

[Jared Freed]

The other thing about la, so then was I was like curious to what the vibe was gonna be there and because of the fires and what's been going on and it was weird that. It wasn't weird.

[Jordana Abraham]

It didn't seem, it didn't seem. I mean, at least not where we were. I asked our. Because we were at the same hotel and I had asked, you know, when I checked in, I was like, is it. Should I be wearing a mask? Like, what's. She said we were staying in Beverly Hills. She was like, this is actually like. And again, I don't know if this is true, but she told me, she said like, this is actually like one of the safest, like cleanest part of the city.

[Jared Freed]

Okay.

[Jordana Abraham]

If you went to like the Valley, you. It would be like a little bit more interesting, you know, air pollution or like issues. So I don't know Maybe it was where we, we were. We weren't there that long, obviously.

[Jared Freed]

So to one thing happened. We. So you and I, we did our stuff with Love is Blind, and then we went to the bar, had some drinks, met a weird guy. This guy started talking to us. And you know what's funny? Like, it shows how easy it is to talk to someone at a bar and how horribly it can go right.

[Jordana Abraham]

Away and how hard it is to stop talking to them.

[Jared Freed]

Right. And that's the problem with, you know, everyone wants in real life. Like, this podcast is about being like, real about dating. Like, we're trying to like, talk about something in an honest way. If this guy was an older man who was fine, and he interrupted us, but he really wanted to talk to us.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

And then we're like, so what's your name? He's like, I can't. I can't tell you. What do you do?

[Jordana Abraham]

I don't wanna. I. I don't wanna talk about it.

[Jared Freed]

I don't wanna talk about it. Okay. Yeah, but I'm going through it. My, you know, I just got a divorce. What happened in your marriage? Don't want to talk about. And it's like. But he still kept trying to talk to us. And it's like, it is interesting, like, because him talking to us, like, we were open to it. We were looking to hear about his life. We were looking to hear his weird tale about how his divorce happened. Like, Right. Because honestly, I was like, interested. He was out down in his luck.

[Jordana Abraham]

When I was, When. Yeah, when I was, when we were there, I was thinking, because I don't like, sit at the bar that often, really. Just talking to. I was like, is this what it's like to be you every night? Like, is this what you just do every night?

[Jared Freed]

Every night by myself. This is kind of why I brought it up is like, that's the rub of it. Like, that's the gamble. You know your energy is going to be sopped up by someone and it is a total randomized thing. So it's like if you sit at the wrong place, you could ruin your whole night. You know, if someone comes up to you and they're just like. And we do have an email that kind of like deals in this today. Like, someone comes up to you and they're like, you don't know how much they've drank. You don't know where they're coming from. You don't know their mindset. So you do have to. To be single at a bar, to be alone. In a bar.

[Jordana Abraham]

You also don't know if they're like a predator.

[Jared Freed]

Predator. All these things.

[Jordana Abraham]

You and I both did go back to our rooms and just vomit that night. So I was like, the joke was like, did he slee. Did this weird man sitting next to us like slip something in both part.

[Jared Freed]

We were fine, everyone's good.

[Jordana Abraham]

And it was just very funny. Cuz I was like the next morning I was like, I threw up last night. It was so weird. Like I had one, I had one drink and you were like, yeah, I threw up too. I was like, are you joking?

[Jared Freed]

I had three. So. So I was like, I had more of a.

[Jordana Abraham]

But you have a much higher tolerance than I do.

[Jared Freed]

But I was, I didn't feel right. I. I came back and I was like ultra full and just all the day of travel. I think that was it. But I don't know, I was just thinking about like with dating, like that is like when you're sitting alone in a bar, you got to feel what it's like. It's like when it goes wrong, it kind of makes you stick away from talking to people because you're like, do I have the energy for this? You have to have the energy for it to go well, but really you're setting up yourself for it to go bad.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, it's also true of any kind of app date, right? That's why people love going on dates with someone they've already met in person. Like if they, like if I was a single woman, I met this guy next to us at the bar and it was like a good vibe. I would be so excited for a date. If I'm going out with someone on the app, then you can tell a little from a conversation if like they would be more normal than him. But you don't really. You're kind of like, you have to amp yourself up to be like, if this person sucks, I have to go and sit next to them.

[Jared Freed]

I'm stuck.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

It's over. That's my night. That's the date. You know I also change my location.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yes.

[Jared Freed]

You were showing me change my location. The apps, it, it is this to la. To la. It was a weird refresh. You're the new kid in town, you get a lot more likes than you would having the app opened over the last month in New York. Like I'm an old hag in New York and I'm fresh face in la. I got, I got a few matches and you start chit chatting with people. It is funny. Like, where does this Go.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

You know, I mean, do not do.

[Jordana Abraham]

That usually when you travel.

[Jared Freed]

Not normally. I changed the last few times, a few weekends, I've been changing it just to, like, do it right. It's kind of boredom. And I changed it in LA and it was like, I did have some nice conversations where I'm like, this would have been a date.

[Jordana Abraham]

And you kind of just go, how did it end?

[Jared Freed]

Well, I was. I was up. I was up front with most of the people. Most of the people. As much as I could be, you know, if it got to that point. I was like, I'm just traveling from New York, but New York and LA kind of share this thing where it's, like, far away, but, like, there's this, like, undercurrent of, like, you'll be here at some point. I'll be there at some point.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Because there's like this, like, oh, we're big city people. We, like. We, you know, we're bi. Coastal. We. We have things to do in both cities because we're. That. Anyone who feels. I feel like there's a sense of importance of, like, you know, we come here all the time because we're like a. We're a person who has things to do in LA and New York.

[Jared Freed]

Right. If you work in one, you got to go to the other at some point. With my big girl, big boy job. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. But it is funny how you get off the plane and I was saying this to you. Like, I get off the plane in. In L. A and I'm like, Everything about the vibe there just makes me want to lose 10 pounds.

[Jared Freed]

It is.

[Jordana Abraham]

And I don't feel that way generally. Everyone is so hot.

[Jared Freed]

Hot.

[Jordana Abraham]

I felt like a gremlin swamp person from New York. Just like, hamper girl, like, you would just. I got up, obviously, at 5am Because I'm on New York time, and I'm, like, walking down the street and you just see. I see women who are, like 20 years older than me that look and that look so much better and are so fit. And I'm like, I've got to get out of here. Back to, like, my. Back to my uglies in New York.

[Jared Freed]

Get me back to the uglies.

[Jordana Abraham]

I can feel.

[Jared Freed]

I can feel better about myself around my face.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. I need more layers.

[Jared Freed]

Right? No, it is a. Even just the atmosphere, it's brighter. It's. You know, you can wear sweat. You're not putting on the heavy cleaner. Clear. It's. I mean, and we stayed in Beverly Hills. We were at, like, Pretty Woman territory. You know, we're, we're looking at, like, the spot. It's like. But I, I, I'm with you. And then I took the red eye back, which I'm here from a red ey flight. That's how dedicated I am to this show. I was like. And I.

[Jordana Abraham]

A single mom. What's that? Tik Tok. A single mom who loves her kids. You know that, that Reba song that they, they have on the thing?

[Jared Freed]

Yeah, I do know that song. I got Delta Premium Select.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, wow.

[Jared Freed]

So they go, I go, I'm gonna do the Red Eye. They go, I go, is there anything open in Delta 1? They go, there's one seat. I go, how much is it?

[Jordana Abraham]

How much was it?

[Jared Freed]

$2,300. I said, that's a little. I, I literally on the phone, I.

[Jordana Abraham]

Go, what would you do it for?

[Jared Freed]

Well, at that point, I say, do, do I. Is there an upgrade certificate allowed? Because I have these certificates and they're like, no. And I'm like, okay, well, how much is it with just miles? And this is additional to what I've already spent on the ticket. And they're like, not allowed. No, you can't use miles.

[Jordana Abraham]

Wow. Who determines these rules?

[Jared Freed]

Well, they got one seat in Delta 1. LA to New York. Big, right? You know, money bags. Who's like, who do you have to.

[Jordana Abraham]

Sleep with to get this?

[Jared Freed]

Who do I sleep with to sleep?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

So then I get in Premiums. I go, how much for the Premium select? They're like 500 bucks. And I was like, all right, I'm in for that. And I'll pray that I'm the biggest dog and Premium select to get the upgrade. Didn't get it. And then you're just like a four hour, you know, you kind of, you just go, yeah, that long. Once you, once you're pot committed, once you're in, you're in, right? And. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

So how do you feel right now? Fresh off the plane.

[Jared Freed]

I'm on tilt. Like, I'm on, like, I'm on a. I'm, you know, I'm on that. Like, I think I'm like, like I'm just, like, in it.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're ready to write.

[Jared Freed]

Let's, let's just bang it out on the adrenaline. So what are we talking about today? I. And if you're out there, I'm gonna be in Alpharetta, Georgia this weekend, I think. No, I'm already gone from Alpharetta.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh. Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

I'm gonna be on to New Zealand in two days.

[Jordana Abraham]

Two days and the worst day of the year. Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

Worst day of the year. My birthday.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. I wonder. I mean, it's two weeks from now, right? So we'll see how you're feeling, how you think you're feeling.

[Jared Freed]

I'm. I. Well, because of all the travel. It's so distracting. Like, it's. That's.

[Jordana Abraham]

Did it sneak up on you?

[Jared Freed]

It's sneaking. Yeah, it's definitely sneaking.

[Jordana Abraham]

What are you most excited about?

[Jared Freed]

What am I. I haven't thought about it. I really haven't. I. I was so caught up with, like, the trip.

[Jordana Abraham]

Nothing about the trip is exciting.

[Jared Freed]

Well, I. So shout out plug city. Over the moon vacations.

[Jordana Abraham]

Plan my wedding.

[Jared Freed]

Plan your wedding.

[Jordana Abraham]

My honeymoon, whatever honeymoon.

[Jared Freed]

My trip to Europe. The last time I went to Europe. They are the travel agent to the stars.

[Jordana Abraham]

To the batches.

[Jared Freed]

To the batches. So go follow over the moon on Instagram. Allison was so helpful, but I'm kind of, like, letting it surprise me a little bit.

[Jordana Abraham]

So she's got an itinerary.

[Jared Freed]

She's whole itinerary.

[Jordana Abraham]

It's so funny that you're using her as, like your. As like your stand in wife.

[Jared Freed]

She's my wife. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Because, like, when we.

[Jared Freed]

My wife.

[Jordana Abraham]

No. Is that. She might. Maybe you need a travel agent as well. No, but it is funny because, like, when we go. When I play, when. When Mike and I go away, we usually go to, like, Europe for a week in the summer or something, and he shows up exactly like you, only like, I'm Allison.

[Jared Freed]

Well, it's funny you say that.

[Jordana Abraham]

He's no idea what we're doing.

[Jared Freed]

Women are. Women are very judgy of a travel agent.

[Jordana Abraham]

Really?

[Jared Freed]

Oh, because. Because we're doing it because it's like, you take my job. That's what I do. A women are like my mom with a new girlfriend.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

Women with a travel agent are like my mom with a new girlfriend. Like, they're like, oh, who is she?

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, that's why I don't use a travel agent, because I'm like, you think you could do this better than me?

[Jared Freed]

Yes. That is their job. That is literally what they're paid to do. No. Well, they're gonna get you the hotels that they only know. It's like. It is so hilarious the amount of women that get so immediately judgy. I. I was talking to this shoes on the street. This woman on the street came up to me. She's very nice. She's like, you go to Australia? I said, yeah. She goes, where are you gonna Go. I go, I gotta travel. And that's doing it. And she's like, those exist anymore? I was like, the career. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

The woman on the street needs to.

[Jared Freed]

She was. She came in hot. She was like, that was it. She got very judgy. But this was reminiscent.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, I.

[Jared Freed]

This tone is a tone I've heard from other women whenever you mention you have a travel agent, because, again, I get it. You. You want to be the one that curates. You want to find the interesting things. You want to find the places that no one knows about. And it's like, I'm gonna trust the person whose job it is to do that.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. No, of course she'll plan a better trip than, like, I would. And.

[Jared Freed]

No, no, I know you believe that.

[Jordana Abraham]

You don't need. You don't need a wife.

[Jared Freed]

No.

[Jordana Abraham]

You have Allison.

[Jared Freed]

Wives have gone the way of the dodo bird. I got my phone and I got my travel agent. That's all I need.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

And I can go to the nail salon and have the woman there give me a little massage in my head.

[Jordana Abraham]

Is there anything that you can't purchase.

[Jared Freed]

That a wife would do a blow job legally? I mean, you know, I don't know where I am.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

That's like the last frontier.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? Well, you don't need to marry someone.

[Jared Freed]

No. I could buy a. What are those called? The. The. The pocket or whatever.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, my.

[Jared Freed]

I. Listen, they're. They're out there, so. Yeah. I don't say it to a vibrator.

[Jordana Abraham]

Then. Did you mean a flashlight?

[Jared Freed]

A flashlight, yes. The former version was a pocket.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay.

[Jared Freed]

And now it's called the Flashlight. Is the more famous.

[Jordana Abraham]

We should do a, like, Lars and the Real Girl thing before we do a review.

[Jared Freed]

No, no.

[Jordana Abraham]

Did you see that movie?

[Jared Freed]

No.

[Jordana Abraham]

It's like, Ryan Gosling basically has a doll is his girlfriend that he's, like, introducing to everyone. As his girlfriend, he has, like, a mental breakdown.

[Jared Freed]

That's hilarious. I'm familiar with that movie. Her is the other example, Right?

[Jordana Abraham]

Scarlett Johansson. Joaquin Phoenix.

[Jared Freed]

Yes.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. Great movie.

[Jared Freed]

So no need for a wife. I got a travel agent, and so I'm basically.

[Jordana Abraham]

So you're gonna be surprised.

[Jared Freed]

I won't be as surprised as I'm saying now. I'm like, in two weeks, I'm. I'll probably know more when she plans this, though.

[Jordana Abraham]

Whenever you go on these trips, are you ever like. Yeah, that's not like she. This is on my itinerary. It's not really my thing.

[Jared Freed]

Here's what I asked for. I want to do all the koala kangaroo stuff. I want the animals.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yes. My picture was cute, wasn't it?

[Jared Freed]

You had a great picture. You got to get the picture. So I go, I need that. I need. I like a boutique hotel. I like a nice, I like a five star boutique.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay.

[Jared Freed]

I like, you know, I don't want to be in a Marriott.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. You want to feel the culture.

[Jared Freed]

I want to feel the, yeah, the Australian. And then I want some beach because it's summer.

[Jordana Abraham]

Of course.

[Jared Freed]

And I want to be, I want to do food tours. I really liked going on food tours because it was like a fun way to learn about the city while in a way that I would never do.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay.

[Jared Freed]

Like, I'm not gonna go.

[Jordana Abraham]

Is it a private food tour?

[Jared Freed]

Yeah. You do? Well, no, it would be me. What happened in Europe was like, it was me and a bunch of, like, boomers on their, like, cruise that they're taking after retirement.

[Jordana Abraham]

Did you make friends?

[Jared Freed]

Yeah. And they'd be like, what are you doing here? And I'm like, I'm here for work. And they're like, what are you doing?

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, you're that guy on the tour.

[Jared Freed]

I'm the weirdo. Yeah. So I, I do these food tours, and it's always led by this, like, theater kid who's a little bit too energetic. And they do like a history tour, but with food. I'm like a kid that's like, I'm like the magic school bus. Like, my learning has to entertain me.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. You should take a surf lesson. Sammy and I did that when we went.

[Jared Freed]

I'm too fat for surfing. I can't see those. It's fine. I can't be around the hot surf guy and me rolling around.

[Jordana Abraham]

You do fall.

[Jared Freed]

You do.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like the waves do just knock you right off.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah. Chubby guys serving. Not a good look. I, I.

[Jordana Abraham]

All right, so you're not doing that. Okay.

[Jared Freed]

I'm a water guy. I'm a Pisces, so I have a big water.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. Oh, I think you're gonna like it there.

[Jared Freed]

I'm very excited. I've gotten, like, dms from people wanting to show me around.

[Jordana Abraham]

Awesome.

[Jared Freed]

I got a very nice dm. Yeah. People are like, let me show and listen. That's fine and dandy, but how about we buy tickets to the shows? So that would be even better.

[Jordana Abraham]

That's the best way to show you around. So you can afford to do the stuff in Australia.

[Jared Freed]

That's right. I take all recommendations after the show. You know that rush you get when you find something Cute. And it's on sale. That's the thrill of the deal. And Rakuten takes it to another level. We love Rakuten.

[Jordana Abraham]

I am a huge Rakuten user.

[Jared Freed]

You're a user.

[Jordana Abraham]

I have the widgets, I have the app. I don't buy anything without checking if the store is on Rakuten first. And I'm making sure I'm getting my cash back. You know, I love a deal.

[Jared Freed]

You do love a deal. Way more than me. You're. You're a deal hunter.

[Jordana Abraham]

Bargain hunter.

[Jared Freed]

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[Jordana Abraham]

Some of that's mine.

[Jared Freed]

Stack those sales, get that cash back and enjoy being the person in the group chat who always knows the best deal. Download the free Rakuten app or go to rakuten.com to start saving today. That's R A K u t e n rakuten.com.

[Jordana Abraham]

You know, I love a good pair of underwear, but it is hard to find. If it's flattering, then usually pretty uncomfortable. It's like riding up, it's digging in and if it's really comfortable, it's usually makes you look like a grandma and you kind of feel a little self conscious about it. It's really hard to find the medium and skims has mastered that art. They have some of the most comfortable underwear that I have ever worn in my entire life.

[Jared Freed]

It is funny that whenever I hear women talk about the skims product line, they do kind of like glow a little bit about it.

[Jordana Abraham]

It. It's just really hard for women to find stuff that looks good on you and also like is really comfortable. I think that's just a universal struggle by many women.

[Jared Freed]

I just love when we have a sponsor that helps our audience. It's nice to know skims is like helping people feel better about themselves.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. And I am. I am a believer. I'm a convert. I'm a skims gal. Recently I got the fits everybody full brief which is like their regular underwear, which I am wearing all the time now. It's my favorite pair. I get annoyed when I wear it because then I have to wait until I wash all my underwear to wear it again. Just don't think about it. Which is the number one thing for underwear for me. I also have the Bralette. It's a game changer. It lifts, it looks great. Super flattering, super cute, just the right amount of support. And also incredibly comfortable. I haven't always loved bras. Who has? But with skims, they are changing me into a bra lover. Shop my favorite bras and [e-mail] after you place your order, make sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcast in the survey and be sure to select our show in the dropdown menu that follows. All right, let's get into our Our first our email. We got great emails today.

[Jared Freed]

I like these emails.

[Jordana Abraham]

So do I. Great emails. All right. Hi, J and J. My boyfriend and I were just starting a new reality TV dating show. In the first episode, all of the female contestants are being introduced, sharing a bit about themselves and their hobbies and interests. I was half studying, I'm a med student and half watching. And I joked if I were there, my hobby would be watching TV and flashcards. My boyfriend replied, you'd never make it on there. In the moment, I laughed it off because I know it's just a joke. We poke fun at each other a lot. But then I realized, oh, that's kind of hurtful. But then he proceeded to fall asleep for a nap. I'm writing to you as he's still sleeping and I can't decide if I want to start an argument or not. I have been there.

[Jared Freed]

He's just sleeping.

[Jordana Abraham]

No idea what's coming.

[Jared Freed]

Just happily sleeping. There's an angry woman in the apartment.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're like. You're like, which route am I going to take to start this fight? Am I just going to be bitchy all day until he asks what's wrong? Should I say should I wait that I hate you?

[Jared Freed]

I hate opening the box of what's wrong?

[Jordana Abraham]

Should I wake him up?

[Jared Freed]

Should I wait until that's jarring?

[Jordana Abraham]

Should I wait until he.

[Jared Freed]

Is everything okay? Well, no, no.

[Jordana Abraham]

Should I wait until he wakes up and then tell him immediately while he's right as soon as his eyes pop open?

[Jared Freed]

All of those options make me, like, cringe.

[Jordana Abraham]

Should I draft a text? Am I being sensitive or was that joke hurtful? I've gotten to a point now where I'm pretty confident in myself. But when my partner says things like that, I can't deny that it hurts and brings out insecurities. How do you distinguish moments when someone does something hurtful versus acting out on your own insecurities? When has a roast gone too far? How do you tell them when it does upset you, even if it seems silly at the time? Love you all and everything you do. Thanks in advance.

[Jared Freed]

I love this email. Love this email. It's hilarious to me that they're, like, watching, like, Love island and she's like, if I were on the show and he's like, with those titties? Nah. Like, I mean, it does get into looks because reality. She says reality dating show.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. I would be analyzing that comment also.

[Jared Freed]

If I were her, because there's not. I don't know. It's not like I'm trying to think of a reality dating show where, hey, what if I were on the show and then someone's like, you like, Survivor.

[Jordana Abraham]

Survivor would almost be better.

[Jared Freed]

I think Survivor would be better because I guess that would insult your intelligence.

[Jordana Abraham]

I think it would insult your, like, mate, your high maintenanceness. Like, Mike loves Survivor, and I'd be like, I don't know.

[Jared Freed]

Said to him he wouldn't do well.

[Jordana Abraham]

I didn't say he wouldn't do well. I think he would do well in some aspects. But he, like, you know, another. He's always also complaining about his back. I'm like, I don't know if that would fly there.

[Jared Freed]

It's funny. I mean, like, you know, it is people.

[Jordana Abraham]

The hotness thing seems, like, mean.

[Jared Freed]

Again, I don't know what dating show it was like, it's like, you know, it could have been like, Love on the Spectrum. Him and he's like, you. I don't think you'd go right? And you'd be like, I doubt it.

[Jordana Abraham]

Was Love on the Spectrum. I think she.

[Jared Freed]

I'm just saying. I'm saying, like, there's so many different dating shows. The assumption my head went to is, it's Love island. And he does. And Love island is like, you know, I. They're. They're like models on that show. Like, you know, yeah, if I was on Love island, someone's like, you. I'd be like, especially your girlfriend. Right? But she says they joke around with each other a lot.

[Jordana Abraham]

Here's my thing. And this is also for, like. Like, this is a good note to like, us or anyone creating content. Like, and I've said this. Mike and I also, we kind of, like, rib each other a lot. Like, and here's the thing about this comment is it's not funny at all, right? There's nothing funny or there's nothing. And I've actually said to him, he doesn't like. But occasionally he'll be, like, doing it when I'm not in the mood, or I'll think he's. It's like a comment that's kind of, like, insulting for no reason, right? And what I've said to him is like. Like, that's not funny. I was like, if you're gonna make a joke about me, right, that's just, like, kind of, like, rude. Like, it's got to be funny. And that wasn't funny.

[Jared Freed]

So I'm like, audience of one. No, no.

[Jordana Abraham]

But he knows it wasn't. You know what I mean? It's like, this comment is like, pretty objectively. You're a comedian. Is this comment, like, a funny comment?

[Jared Freed]

It feels mean. It feels.

[Jordana Abraham]

That's what I'm saying.

[Jared Freed]

It feels.

[Jordana Abraham]

It can't be mean for me. And, like, it can't just be mean. This is just mean to me. This is. There's something funny about what he said. There's nothing clever. There's something that relates to her being, like, studying all the time.

[Jared Freed]

I'm with you. It's a badly placed rip at someone. I wouldn't call it even a joke. It's a. It's. It's a. It's a.

[Jordana Abraham]

It doesn't seem that playful. Doesn't seem that.

[Jared Freed]

It's. It's a. It's. It's a shot to the heart. I guess my interpretation of this email is like, she's asking, like, am I allowed? How do I. And it's like, listen, as my dad has always said to me, you can't tell someone how to feel, right? So, like, this whole thing of, like, should I make a. Am I making too big a deal? No, there's no such thing as too big a deal. You got. He said the line.

[Jordana Abraham]

You fell asleep.

[Jared Freed]

He then took a nap. You hated the line. You have a right to hate the line. Some people miss and some people, you know, it is a. You are taking a chance when you say something like that to your partner. And I think, you know, he wakes up and you say, that really hurt my feelings.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

You know, like, I think that's okay to say. I don't. There's this weird thing of, like, can't take a joke. No, no. You had a bad.

[Jordana Abraham]

That hurt my feelings.

[Jared Freed]

You hurt my feeling. I didn't. I didn't like, it.

[Jordana Abraham]

And worst of all, it wasn't funny.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

If you're gonna hurt my feelings, be. At least be clever in my mind.

[Jared Freed]

Personally, I. I think, like, I appreciate.

[Jordana Abraham]

I appreciate a good joke if it's. Even if it's at my expense sense.

[Jared Freed]

I think for this guy, if you're in that relationship where you make fun of each other, you're gonna miss. Like, Right. Well, I'm saying.

[Jordana Abraham]

But here's the other part of it.

[Jared Freed]

There's no chance that this. Go, you're gonna hit 100. Like, he made a mistake. And I think if he was pushed to it, he would go, I made a mistake.

[Jordana Abraham]

I'm sorry.

[Jared Freed]

I'm sorry. Like, I think if you say a good relationship, he goes, yeah, yeah. In retrospect, that was, like, a really mean thing to say. And I, I, I really, really didn't mean it that way. Or. And then you go, how else could you have meant it? And it's like, Like, I just. You're. Yeah, there's no doctors on the show. That's what I meant. And it's like, okay, now we're out of Looksville. And he has an explanation of where his brain shot that.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. I mean, he's dating her, right?

[Jared Freed]

So, like. Because she's like, I would do note cards. And, and it's like, this ain't. This is Love Island. None of these people can read, you know? Like, he's more making fun of the show. Like, I could see how.

[Jordana Abraham]

But here's the other part of that, of the jokey, like, relationship kind of vibe. And again, I have experience in this mentality or in this thing that's sort of like how you communicate with each other a lot. It has to be balanced out by, like, that can't be the only way you speak to each other.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

There has to be moments where he's like, you look really beautiful tonight. It can't be, like, that's the only feedback he's getting. She's getting from him. Is this, like, ribbing? Is this, like, sarcastic?

[Jared Freed]

All jokes and there's no real talking.

[Jordana Abraham]

I think it's okay to have, like, like, ribbing, making fun of each other, roasting, having, like, fun. I think that's, like. It can be flirty also, if it's like, you can make fun of someone in, like, a flirty way. This doesn't seem flirty. It just seems mean. And again, it's okay if you miss. But also, like, there should be. On the other side of it, there should be moments of, like, vulnerability and Sincerity and like, actual compliments, like, real compliments.

[Jared Freed]

And here's the thing about saying nothing. Like, she's asking if she should. You have to say something.

[Jordana Abraham]

Of course. Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

Because that's how you learn, like, where the jokes lie with the relationship. Like, when you go on stage and do jokes, you don't know if they're gonna land right away. You don't know how you sound until it comes out of your mouth. So, like, the audience kind of directs you. Like, you know, when someone's like, doesn't like someone's material that they've worked on for a long time, I'm like, yeah, but they tested that. Like, they crowdsourced that. Like, you know, that's like saying you don't like mustard. Everyone's decided mustard's pretty good.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

You know, that's why it's on the table, you know, so, like, if you say nothing, this guy just goes along thinking, like, that's where your jokes lie. They don't.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

You know, so this is instructive. This is to get you guys better, to be able to make better jokes, you know, like, if you guys do rip each other, a good joke is.

[Jordana Abraham]

Where we both laugh.

[Jared Freed]

Right. And you know, this is like a one off. Like, it feels off the cuff. Mistakes are made. I. I also think if you put off a fight, it leads to the next fight being bigger, Right?

[Jordana Abraham]

Of course.

[Jared Freed]

Like, whatever.

[Jordana Abraham]

Because then you're resentful and it builds up and then you, like, then you start screaming at him and you're like, right. How did I become this person?

[Jared Freed]

Right? And it's like you now have the next fight being about having the fire of this jokey fight, which could be done in like half a minute.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. And that's why it's important to constantly let people know what you're. What you're thinking. That's why come. You know that there's a reason people say communication is so important.

[Jared Freed]

Right. But also that's why we put it off. You know, we put. It's. It's also hard. Yeah, you put it off, you go, it wasn't that big a deal. I'm over it. Well, I did feel that.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

You know, I did walk away going, you don't think I could be on Love is Blind, Right? You know, like, what separates me from the Love is blind people, you know?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

They're pretty normal looking.

[Jordana Abraham]

Totally. And again, like, I think there has to be this feeling even if you're in a jokey relationship. And I don't think there's Anything wrong with like having fun? You know, like making fun of each other way in a relationship as like a form of communication sometimes. But you have to feel like the person is your fan, right? Not like you guys are kind of like a making fun of each other comedy troupe. Like that doesn't actually, I think make for a feeling of like safety and support. Like you can have some of that. But at the end of the day, it does have to feel like, is this person like, like me? Is this person like a fan of mine? Like, are they.

[Jared Freed]

But that's.

[Jordana Abraham]

They think I'm great.

[Jared Freed]

That's why saying something like, you'll hear where his mind was at.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

And I do think she writes like, I mean, when she says like, I would be note cards and you know, studying, like if I'm watching like whatever, you know, Joe Millionaire, I'm like, well, you wouldn't be. You're smart, you know, like, that's where he may have misdone the line, you know, like, so I'm just saying, like, like then you hear that. Back you go, oh, I see where you were coming from. But also off, you know, like, you can have that. It's a little bit more loved, you know?

[Jordana Abraham]

No, that's totally possible. She misconstrued what he was saying.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

And think that's like. And again, that's why it's important to just say, right. What you're is bothering you.

[Jared Freed]

Like, and she didn't misconstrue. You received it the way you received it he up.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? And that's why when a couple says that they never fight, that's weird because it's like if. To me, if I hear never fight, it means takes all these things that. Things that they. That are annoying them or little things that they heard and they're just sweeping them under the rug.

[Jared Freed]

Right? Never.

[Jordana Abraham]

And they're just lately there.

[Jared Freed]

I mean, I'm a. I'm not. I'm a pacifist. I'm not a fighter. And I would say that that's true. Like, whenever I not fight, I'm like, I'm kind of like lodging it away as like.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Just banking it here.

[Jared Freed]

Like, you know, it's like we're not negotiating. You know, like, I go, okay, maybe I'm not in this relationship, maybe I shouldn't be. But that's when you start working on it, right? Well, that's how you're avoiding it. So I'm like, I'm letting people know, like, as someone who's an avoider of fighting.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

That is my way of, like, not.

[Jordana Abraham]

Really avoiding intimacy also, too, a little bit. Because to say to someone, you hurt my feelings, and to work through that, you do come out a little stronger. It's a more intimate conversation of. When you said you'd never make it on there, it made me think, you don't think I'm attractive, right? Like, that's, like, a conversation that if you work through that, you would feel closer to someone.

[Jared Freed]

What's a joke that you've made about Mike? That was like. You were like, I screwed up some of the Christmas.

[Jordana Abraham]

He usually. He's like. He'll usually take a lot of them, I don't think. He's like, he's not. I'm. I get more, like, irritated. I think about them, and maybe I. I should be, like, kinder.

[Jared Freed]

Okay.

[Jordana Abraham]

But when I have my, like, Christmas bit, my Christmas presents bit, right? I think he was like, no, you're actually, like, really annoying. Like, I actually, like, this holiday was like, that.

[Jared Freed]

You're making fun of, like, all these gifts. You're like, look at all these stupid gifts. And he's like, no, I. I, like, really like this. You're making me.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. He's like, you're actually, like, taking something that I, like, really enjoy, and you're kind of on it, like. And he's like, one time. He's like, I could take it, like, one, like, one time, but I don't really, like, enjoy the bit.

[Jared Freed]

And the gifts have to be really bad. Like, you have to, like, point at one gift. It can't be like, look at all this gift giving. It's like, well, that's what we do, right?

[Jordana Abraham]

Or even, like, again, I think he's kind of like, I don't really like the joke. Those jokes, like, they're not. To me, they're not. They're kind of like, again, they, like, make me feel bad, like, about something that I like. So I think that. And I totally. And when someone. He said that to me, I was like, okay, like, totally get that. Like, I. You know what I mean? You have. You have your perspective on this, which makes sense to me. And I have, like. Like, I don't hate these gifts enough to, like, insist on doing them. Like, I love you and your feelings more than I. I need to do this bit.

[Jared Freed]

Right? I, like, made a whole video about, like. And it looked like I was, like, had this big surprise, and the big surprise was gonna be this romantic thing. And it, like, kind of, like, hinted at, like, you know, maybe we're getting engaged. They're gonna, you know, like, whatever. And then it ended with me in first class getting an upgrade to first class and them not. And I thought it was, like, the funniest thing. Not so funny to the other person.

[Jordana Abraham]

It would only be funny if you were about to get engaged.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

That I would be really mad, too.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're making fun of something that's like. And again with the Christmas thing. It's almost the same thing. It's like, that's actually meaningful to the person. That's actually what they want. They're like. Until it almost feels like you're, you know, trivializing something that is important to them.

[Jared Freed]

Right. And you. And you really think that something important. That was the dumbest thing. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

Or like, oh, what, are you crazy? Us get engaged.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

I mean, listen, I. I regret it.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, that's why every. Every. Well, I mean, there's also the phrase that every joke has some truth to it. Right.

[Jared Freed]

Right. Well, that's.

[Jordana Abraham]

So.

[Jared Freed]

That's the tough part. Well, I mean, you're not.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're not here engaged and married, so.

[Jared Freed]

Ring on my finger. Going out New Zealand alone.

[Jordana Abraham]

This episode is sponsored by Instacart. We've all been there. You finally get to your vacation spot after a long travel day. You're tired. You're ready to wind down and realize you forgot something important. Maybe a toothbrush, maybe a skincare product, or even a pair of shoes. Instead of wasting your precious vacation time running errands, you can have Instacart help deliver whatever you need right to you. And when the vacation's over and you're heading back to reality, set yourself up with a full fridge of groceries so you can ease back into your routine. From meal prepping to restocking pantry staples, Instacart helps you get all the essentials you need, no matter where you are. Truly, the convenience cannot be beat. With just a few taps, you can shop your favorite stores and get fresh groceries or household essentials delivered in as fast as 30 minutes. Or if you're out and about, you can have them ready for pickup. Instacart helps to deliver, so you can handle everything else. Just order online or via the easy to use app. Instacart brings convenience, quality and ease right to your door so you can focus on what matters most. Download the Instacart app and use code UAP Pod20 to get $20 off order of $80 or more. That's code UUP P O D20 to get $20 off your first order of $80 or more offer valid for a limited time. Excludes restaurants. Additional terms apply. You know those moments when your hands are full or your eyes need a break, but you still want to escape into a great story? That's why I'm such a fan of Audible. I listen all the time, whether I'm on a walk, commuting to the office, doing chores, or even just relaxing before bed. Audible's app makes it super easy to jump right into thousands of audiobooks anytime, anywhere. I've mentioned before that one of my favorite movies is Pride and Prejudice, and I'm excited that Audible is releasing a brand new audiobook version of the Jane Austen novel on September 9th. Narrated by Marissa Abela, Harris Dickinson, Glenn Close and other stars you know and love, Audible gives me the best of both worlds. I can enjoy a story I love while actually getting stuff done. They have thousands of titles, everything from romance to thrillers to memoirs, comedy and even self improvement. So whatever mood you're in, there's always something fresh and exciting waiting for you. And the app is super user friendly. You can download audiobooks to listen offline, adjust the narration speed and pick up right where you left off across all your devices. If you've never tried Audible before, I can't recommend it enough. It's the easiest way to bring incredible stories into your everyday life. Trust me, once you start listening, you'll wonder how you ever went without it. Your first great love story is free when you sign up for a free 30 day trial at audible.com UUP let's do it.

[Jared Freed]

We love them. Please send more to UUP betches.com we love an awkward encounter. This one is fantastic. JJ I've been listeners since the beginning and you two have seen me through countless dating highs and lows. I'm married now, still an avid listener. I have an awkward encounter for you. I've been meaning to submit for years. I live in Nashville and I'm a die hard Nashville Predators hockey fan. A few years ago the Preds were making a playoff run and I had a game scheduled to get the Detroit Red Wings. I was getting ready to meet some friends out at a bar to watch the game when I got a facetime from them. They said there was a random good looking guy there who was hoping to find someone to go to with him to the game that night. His buddy Red Flag. You think that's a red flag?

[Jordana Abraham]

He's looking for anyone to go to the game with.

[Jared Freed]

Some women, they kind of like vet him. They're like we have a friend maybe single. I Like, that the friends met him.

[Jordana Abraham]

I don't know. Would you ever take a stranger to a. To a game?

[Jared Freed]

Here's where I actually read this and I was like, this is a vote for the B cities out there. Like, Nashville is a great city, but it's not New York, it's not la, it's not Chicago. I'm just saying, size wise, like these. Insular, intimate, a little more intimate. Like the, you know, the teams matter to everyone in town. Like, there's no transplants. Really. Nashville has more transplants now. But I'm just saying, like, this is kind of like a. Like when people are like, there's not enough people. My. But this is like one of those things that happens in a town like that.

[Jordana Abraham]

Would you do this, though?

[Jared Freed]

I think I would.

[Jordana Abraham]

You would?

[Jared Freed]

You'd be like, if I just like, like, I'm. I'm just saying, like, I don't have season tickets for any teams. I know people have like, season tickets. They go to the Predators game every. You know, and. And like. Or have like a package of like 30 games.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Maybe I'm just antisocial.

[Jared Freed]

I. I've been in the situations like this where someone's like, you know, I don't know, you meet the friends and the friends are all fun, and you're at a bar and like, I'm going to the game. My friend backed out. I got this extra. I. I saw this and I was like, it made me happy for like the Clevelands of the world, the Cincinnati's, the Nashvilles.

[Jordana Abraham]

This is something they could pull off.

[Jared Freed]

Absolutely. Like, and, and the idea that like, like daytime at a bar, we. Oh, we can vet him because who do you know? Where are you from? Where'd you go to high school? You know, like, like, I think these are lived in areas. So his buddy had backed out last minute, and since I was the biggest fan, they nominated me to go with him. My friends gave the phone to him and we chatted for a bit. He was cute and had lower bowl tickets for this playoff game. It's also the playoffs, which are not easy to come by. He was a Detroit fan, but seemed good spirited about the competition. What could go wrong?

[Jordana Abraham]

Let's find out.

[Jared Freed]

Okay. I think there's been proper vetting. You go to a public venue, friends in common. It's not like they're like going back to his apartment to watch a movie now. Like, that's fair. When I arrived at the bar about 30 minutes later, he had somehow gone from fun tipsy to blatantly drunk. That is a quick.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? That's not the same person you were texting with.

[Jared Freed]

No.

[Jordana Abraham]

20 minutes ago.

[Jared Freed]

Totally different person. This happens at comedy shows. People walk in, they've had a couple drinks. Drinks before they got there. Then the openers on there, like, oh, they're a good crowd. You get on stage like, what the heck is this? And you're like, what the. How did this happen? Whatever these people. And when I walked in, his opening line was, you're way hotter than any girl I could have picked up without these tickets.

[Jordana Abraham]

Very Nashville.

[Jared Freed]

Very. I mean, weird compliment, but I rolled with it. I mean, it is a compliment. I mean, I would.

[Jordana Abraham]

It would be like I would feel icked out a little bit as soon as I. As I walked in.

[Jared Freed]

It is a little bit like he's scanning your body, right? Like, oh, you. Oh, look at this.

[Jordana Abraham]

It's so objectified.

[Jared Freed]

It is really.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

I asked if he was ready to call an Uber, and he said, oh, no, we'll just take my golf cart.

[Jordana Abraham]

Very good at the drunk slur.

[Jared Freed]

I can do a. I'm hammered. Now we go. We go outside. And sure enough, he has a fully decked out Dukes of Hazard golf cart, complete with a horn that plays the theme song, which he immediately played multiple times while onlookers cheered. This guy's the mayor.

[Jordana Abraham]

Look at that.

[Jared Freed]

What is the Dukes of Hazard song? Do we have it?

[Jordana Abraham]

Is there a song?

[Jared Freed]

There's like a honk that it does. Yeah, it's like an annoying horny sound.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay.

[Jared Freed]

Which he immediately played multiple times while onlookers cheered. At this point, I can tell we're not going to be a long term match, but a free preds playoff game is on the line here, so I convinced myself to just go with it.

[Jordana Abraham]

I get that.

[Jared Freed]

I get everything going on here. Like, listen, this is marrying for money a little bit.

[Jordana Abraham]

She's here for the game.

[Jared Freed]

She's here for the game. He's a little bit wild, but we're gonna be in public. Okay. He made a comment about not going.

[Jordana Abraham]

Somewhere private with him.

[Jared Freed]

Right. He's got a golf cart, it plays the Dukes of Hazzard, maybe some chicken nuggets. Unfortunately, things took a turn from there. As soon as we got to the game, he started talking about how he wanted to be the mayor of Detroit. Oh, he is the mayor. And said, quote, if Trump could be president after bragging about grabbing women by the pussies, then I could definitely be mayor.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, my God, this guy is out there, out of control.

[Jared Freed]

He asked me. I Mean, how do you.

[Jordana Abraham]

At this point, I'm staying for the story.

[Jared Freed]

Right. I mean, there's a lot, I mean, there's a point with this story is gonna. He asked me if I would vote for him and I said I was unsure because I didn't know his politics. Like, to answer him honestly is very funny. Well, I'm not really sure where you land on the opposite.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, yeah, of course.

[Jared Freed]

Right, yeah. Voting for you. To which he responded, well, if I get you pregnant tonight, you can definitely abort it if that's what you're worried about.

[Jordana Abraham]

Is this guy like trying to be like a, you think?

[Jared Freed]

I think he's trying to be funny. 1. I think he's like drunk and this is how he would be, I think, at a game. Okay, you see, men, like, more can.

[Jordana Abraham]

Come out of this.

[Jared Freed]

Get out, just get to another place where it's like, they think like any amount of disgusting can be said. You know, you go to stadiums. Stadiums have some of like the most horrific people on earth. Yeah, like, I mean, I've been, that's.

[Jordana Abraham]

Why I don't go to stadiums.

[Jared Freed]

I don't suggest it. I, I, I remember we went to, my brother and I went to a football game and the, we like went to a Patriots jets game and we're wearing Patriots jerseys and like, we literally like, did like, we like got to go in the row. We're trying to get in the row. And like, people are like, I had a thing of popcorn. My hand. People were just taking their like gloved hands and taking your popcorn.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, wow.

[Jared Freed]

Like, and they're like yelling at you, like slurs and stuff like that. And you're just like, like, where do you guys even live? Like, where do you, what society are you a part of? Like, NFL games can get really bad. Hockey games can get really bad too.

[Jordana Abraham]

You can see that.

[Jared Freed]

During the military salute when the whole arena was standing to honor a 90 year old lifetime veteran, and the camera panned to the sweet old man and his little old wife beaming up at him. My quote unquote date exclaimed loudly, someone's getting a toothless blowjob tonight. Oh, man. Which was met with looks of horror by the people around us. This is the point where you're now with the guy who does this. So everything to this point was like, comments to you.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah, this would be my point where I'm like, I think it's time to go.

[Jared Freed]

How much is this game worth to.

[Jordana Abraham]

You at that point? Are you actually having fun?

[Jared Freed]

Right? And, and now with like videotaping right.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're next to who knows what. What other horrible atrocities he's gonna do. And then you're. You're. There's footage of you next to him.

[Jared Freed]

Good luck with your toes. Was that he puts his arm around you.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

Like you're his wife? Yeah, no, I would be. I think that's when I'd be out.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

That's the point.

[Jordana Abraham]

The toothless blowjob at the military veteran. I think so. Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

When you're interrupting, you know, a hero amongst us, you know, getting honored.

[Jordana Abraham]

But she doesn't leave yet.

[Jared Freed]

No. Finally, right when I was thinking of just leaving because this guy was so over the top, a buddy of his came and sat with us. His buddy asked if we had a bet going on the game and what would happen if each of our respective teams won. I mean, this is. This guy should know nothing good is going to come out of this.

[Jordana Abraham]

Did this guy get cast as the guy to come over and.

[Jared Freed]

And. And amp up the conversation? I said if the Preds win, he had to buy me, my friends, a round of drinks after the game. I mean, he. He ain't making it to after the game. My date didn't hesitate even for a second before saying, if the Wings win, she takes it in the ass tonight. Oh, my God.

[Jordana Abraham]

Time to go.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah. I don't think you're bringing this guy to Thanksgiving. At that point, I figured I'd see myself out. Okay. I told them I had friends waiting a few bars down from the arena and I was going to meet up with them. He proceeded to take to text me multiple times after the game to meet up with us, but I didn't respond. He also texted me the next morning, invited me to brunch.

[Jordana Abraham]

Brunch is so civil.

[Jared Freed]

So civil. To go from that to brunch. Hey, would you like eggs Benedict?

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, my God.

[Jared Freed]

Did you have fun last night? To which I finally just said we weren't the match, but all the best at them. To this day, my friends and I laugh about this being the worst random date ever, but I can check going to a Preds playoff game off my bucket list. And I got a hilarious story out of it. Sincerely, not my mayor.

[Jordana Abraham]

Great way to look at it. Again, very good story. There's. He's. Now there's not that many people that could get worse than him. Whenever you go on a date, I would just be like, it can't possibly be as bad as the guy from the Predators game.

[Jared Freed]

Right? And I, you know, I do like a story like this. Like, again, Alcohol is. Is a drug. And yes. Can go so many different directions. A story like this, I'm like, I do, like, what happened. I like the structure.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay. You know, they were two people who were down for something different.

[Jared Freed]

Something different out of your comfort zone. Your friends vetted them, you know, so.

[Jordana Abraham]

At one point, what does that say about them?

[Jared Freed]

You would hope it wasn't like, who wants to take in the ass? And, like, you're perfect for Rachel, you know, like, I. I.

[Jordana Abraham]

We have a guy for you.

[Jared Freed]

Oh, is that your golf cart out outside? Is that you with the grabbing the joke? Ow. You gotta meet our. Our friend. Yeah, it is.

[Jordana Abraham]

Sometimes the story sustains you for way longer than the night, you know?

[Jared Freed]

What do you mean?

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, if you have, like, a bad experience, that's like, a good story. Like, oh, yeah. That you can. That you can take with a souvenir that you can take with you for years to come.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah. The debrief of this one is also, like, going back to the friends and, like, what did you guys. Where did it go off with this guy? And they're like, like, because set me up right with. It is very possible that these friends had a very different view of him than she had.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Maybe when he's drunk, he becomes, like, a complete animal.

[Jared Freed]

I know people like that in my own life, you know? So, like, I. And so he might have a problem. He also. He also was maybe trying to impress her. This is the thin line between, like, trying to be funny and being funny.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

You know, like going for the joke. And it's like, you shouldn't always go for the joke.

[Jordana Abraham]

I mean.

[Jared Freed]

Or you learn. You bomb.

[Jordana Abraham]

And this seems like a. Here's the thing. It was one bad joke. I would get that. But this seems like this guy's personality.

[Jared Freed]

Oh, yeah. I mean, it's brutal. I mean, to go for. I mean, there's no excuse me for mayor after taking the ass.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. You know, it's like, no, no, out, out. Yeah. And I would, like, put out a warning for him against anyone else who might.

[Jared Freed]

Or.

[Jordana Abraham]

I mean, it was such a small town, I would be worried about it.

[Jared Freed]

Well, I'd find that friend and be like, hey, you need to do an intervention with your friend. I think he has got a drinking problem.

[Jordana Abraham]

All right, let's do another email.

[Jared Freed]

Let's do it.

[Jordana Abraham]

Hey, Jared. And a male listener here. Love the pod. You guys are the best.

[Jared Freed]

Thank you, sir.

[Jordana Abraham]

I met a girl at a kickball a few months ago, and we've been talking since then. I'm 33 and she's 27. We've probably hung out 10 times and we have a solid connection with a lot to talk about. The emotional connection has been steadily growing. The only issue is that she has never had a boyfriend and has no experience dating. The physical connection has moved slowly. When we kiss, it sometimes feels like kissing a cardboard cutout. And she really doesn't kiss me back. Even if I try to hold her hand, I get a dead fish back. I know she doesn't have any experience, and I am trying to be respectful of that and move at her pace. How can I advance the physical connection to match the emotional connection? Maybe I should give up because there's no spark. Have either of you ever experienced a situation where the physical connection didn't match the emotional connection? Thank you in advance for your advice. A blue bald batch.

[Jared Freed]

I love this email.

[Jordana Abraham]

Good email.

[Jared Freed]

Because this is very difficult if you have a problem. And I'm sure what he's dealing with is like, who am I to have an issue with, like, the physical stuff? Like, you kind of feel frivolous. You're like, I just think, how much should it matter? He's like, we get, we're friends, everything else. And I'm attracted to her.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Well, welcome to the world of being like a woman who's like, like, not that into a guy that she should really like.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

Has a good conversations with.

[Jared Freed]

And I think, yeah, women. A lot of times from this podcast, we. I just know that, like, we'll go.

[Jordana Abraham]

Out with you 17 times just to try and make it work.

[Jared Freed]

Right?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. Sometimes try and get there.

[Jared Freed]

You do.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

And then that's like, kind of scary as a guy.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, you know, usually you don't. Usually. If I. I vote always have this rule. If I don't want to sleep with you after the fourth date, I'm never going to want to sleep with you.

[Jared Freed]

Right. And four. Fair number, I think.

[Jordana Abraham]

I think so. It's like, I feel like I really gave it a shot.

[Jared Freed]

Some people want to know on day three.

[Jordana Abraham]

I wouldn't tell them. Yeah, yeah. I think like, there, there are people, guys who are like a slow burn where, like, you do feel like more attracted to them the more dates you go on them with them. But I think four to me is like, kind of my cut off.

[Jared Freed]

Well, I think the difference here is, like, I've been in the scenario where you are attracted to them, but then you get together and it's like, are we in sixth grade? You know, like, like, it feels. It just feels like you not sexual. Have different levels of experience and comfortabilities. And I hear what he's saying. Like, I've had that where you're like, kissing someone. You're like, I, I. And you're like, it's moving so slow to the point where you're like, if we, if I did push this, like, he might have to marry her, right?

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, she might be a virgin.

[Jared Freed]

You'd feel like you've kind of taken advantage, right? You know, like, hey, like, I have these needs, and it's okay that they don't have those needs.

[Jordana Abraham]

But that probably makes it less exciting to even do anything sexual, doesn't it? If the purse doesn't seem like the person's into it, isn't that, like, half of the excitement, right?

[Jared Freed]

Or has any knowledge of how to, like, Corey, you know, negotiate with you in that way? It's, it's really hard. I, I, I don't envy his position.

[Jordana Abraham]

I think it can be, I think it could be discussed.

[Jared Freed]

It can be. And also, someone can not have a boyfriend or not have a girlfriend and still know how to be sexual. Like, I think this is like, but a little bit of a mismatch.

[Jordana Abraham]

That's why I'm like, there's a couple things that are possible here. I think one is that she might actually be, like, a virgin.

[Jared Freed]

Okay.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, that's a possibility on the table. Or just like, like very, very limited sexual experience and feels very uncomfortable with sex. There's a lot of women that are like that. I think that's one possibility. The second possibility is that she doesn't really like him. And I think that those are, those are two options. I think she's the, with the amount of information he's given, it's very hard to tell which one it is.

[Jared Freed]

Right?

[Jordana Abraham]

But sometimes you are just not feeling it sexually. And so that's kind of why you're pulling back, trying, right?

[Jared Freed]

Turning into the cardboard.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're like, I am kissing you, but, like, I'm gonna kiss you. Because, like, like I feel like I should because we've been on six dates, right? But I don't, I'm not really feeling.

[Jared Freed]

How would you want. So the guy's writing to us. So, like, this is a little bit of a, these are treacherous roads, right? How would you want him to say to you that the physical chemistry isn't where you feel it should be?

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? I think in a non, I would want him to say it in a non, like, sexual situation. So I wouldn't be like, I wouldn't want him to say it, like, in the middle of making out on the couch or something.

[Jared Freed]

Right. This sucks, huh?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. I think over. Over. I think in person and over dinner, because you can tell tone that way, and it doesn't seem like, why aren't you fucking me? I think a conversation where you're kind of like. It feels like I have to say, like, I'm having a great time. Again, compliments, sandwich. Always having such a great time hanging out with you. And almost exactly what you just said, like. Like, it does feel, like, physically, like we might be a little bit on different pages. I'm sensing, like, a little bit of a hesitancy with you when it comes to, like, physical intimacy.

[Jared Freed]

Right. And I guess the bread on that sandwich, the top of that sandwich is to say, like, the reason I'm bringing this up is because, like, I do have this emotional, like, care for you.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

So that's why I'm even bringing it up, or I wouldn't be trying to figure this out.

[Jordana Abraham]

Out. Right.

[Jared Freed]

You know, you have to let them know, like, this is a step for you to try and figure this out. Like, I. I guess my.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. He's not just moving on.

[Jared Freed]

Right. My concern, I would. I mean, there's a piece of me that would be like, move on. Like, I. I.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

Like, if I was in this, I would go, do I want to be this person's teacher? But maybe.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, he might hear. He might hear back when he says that. Again, if he's saying it in a way that he does not feeling, like, angry or dacking or judgmental, he might feel back like, I've been trying to get there with you physically, and I just don't really feel like that would be, like, the tough thing to hear.

[Jared Freed]

Right. You might find out that your friends and, you know, honestly, the way he's writing in, he might not. Maybe he needs that to see them as a friend.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

Like. Or see that that's what it is, you know, like, he could be in this mode. I. I could understand, like, someone goes, I just. I'm trying to get there. And you're like, like, okay, good. Like, I'm actually happy to hear that I'm not crazy, because I can think that he feels crazy. He's probably been with other women, and it's, like, been easy. And he's like, wait, this person I like. And I don't. It could be that, what are we missing?

[Jordana Abraham]

And I think there's maybe, like, there's even a third option that I just thought of that could be Like a little darker and more serious is like sometimes people, sometimes women have only been like, sexually assaulted or had like really negative sexual experiences in the past. And that kind of does just give them like a little bit of a fear of.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Of intimacy or a fear of like anything sexual. Like sometimes people have been had like traumatic sexual experiences. So it could be, it could be a few different things as I laid out. And I think a conversation that feels non judgmental, non. Like this is what I need to get to the next level. Like, I think just an open conversation would.

[Jared Freed]

I'm feeling it. I want to see if you're feeling it.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

That's really the, the crux of it.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

Because, you know, I think everyone has been there once or twice where they're just like, it's almost like, what, Wait, what? I, why is this? Am I, you know, she might not.

[Jordana Abraham]

Even know also, she might be like, I'm really into you and I don't, I don't know what it is.

[Jared Freed]

That's actually like, to me, that's like the worst case scenario.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

I mean, obviously worst case scenarios that you have a trauma that you're dealing with, but I, well, the worst case.

[Jordana Abraham]

Scenario is that she does know and she just doesn't want it. She feels, feels bad saying it. So she says she doesn't know and.

[Jared Freed]

Then he's like, with someone where he feels crazy.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

Yeah, that'd be bad. I, I just think like, if she's like, no, this is great, then it's like, then it kind of, it's the balls hit back to him a little.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? Yeah. If he's, I mean, if he, if she thinks it's great. If she's like, I think that.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

This is like, it's going really well, then you might just be like sexually incompatible.

[Jared Freed]

Right. I guess that would turn me off, off to even more to hear, like, oh, if you think this is great, like, I, I, maybe we're not on the same level here.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. That we have different expectations.

[Jared Freed]

Right. But he has to decide if you go into that conversation you're having like a very, like you're getting deeper with something.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. If they're, if they're willing to go there with you, which I think is a good test for, you know, how intimate the relationship can be. If they're willing to go there with you, then you can get to a next level.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

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[Jared Freed]

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[Jordana Abraham]

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[Jared Freed]

All right, let's play some games.

[Jordana Abraham]

Let's do it.

[Jared Freed]

Red flag or deal breaker? We love red flag or deal breaker. Basically, here's the game. If you don't know it already, you're dating someone, it's going fantastic. One thing happens. Is it a red flag? You see it and move on. Or is it a deal breaker? You end it right away. Ready?

[Jordana Abraham]

Let's do it.

[Jared Freed]

J and J. Here's a red flag or deal breaker for you. I, 37, female, went on a couple dates with a a 51 year old male. The first two dates were good for date three. We had a casual hangout at my place over the holidays, which quickly turned physical. Mid hookup, I asked if he had a condom. He says no. We continue other stuff, then move to just cuddling and pillow talk. And then he gives a real performance. He smacks his forehead and goes, I'm such an idiot. I'm like, what? What? And he says, I totally forgot I had a vasectomy.

[Jordana Abraham]

I totally Forgot he is 51.

[Jared Freed]

I don't. I don't know if that's something you forget.

[Jordana Abraham]

I forgot to have breakfast.

[Jared Freed]

Wait, wait, what?

[Jordana Abraham]

And then I had a vasectomy and.

[Jared Freed]

I can't make babies anymore. That is a little bit wild.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah, that's lying.

[Jared Freed]

Anyway, we don't use. And then he says, okay, I totally forgot I had a vasectomy. We don't need to use condoms, sir. What? What? How do you forget you had a vasectomy? Also, that's not the only reason why one would use a condom. For context, we've both been married before and neither of us have kids. I've always been clear about wanting kids. Earlier that day, he did say he'd be open to starting a family with the right person. See, that's a big problem. This guy is full of Then following that night, he asked to go for dinner. I was hesitant and told him I didn't think it would work long term. He proceeded to tell me that he called the clinic about a vasectomy reversal and wanted to tell me at dinner. Yikes. Can't wait to hear your thoughts. So red flagger. Deal breaker. He forgot he had had of. Had gotten a vasectomy in the middle of us hooking up with love and unforgettable procedures. VAV vasectomy, amnesia victim.

[Jordana Abraham]

This guy did not forget that he had a vasectomy.

[Jared Freed]

Right? It's, it's.

[Jordana Abraham]

This guy had a vasectomy so that he could have sex without a condom.

[Jared Freed]

Seemingly, yes. That seems.

[Jordana Abraham]

But he doesn't have any kids, right? And he's saying he would have it reversed.

[Jared Freed]

Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

And so why else would someone have.

[Jared Freed]

A vasectomy and he's in the bed not acknowledging that, like, you can still give someone.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

You know, diseases and things like that. With a vasectomy being had, like, he's only centering on the kids portion.

[Jordana Abraham]

You're right.

[Jared Freed]

It's a, to me, this is an order of operations thing. This is a pemdas.

[Jordana Abraham]

He's trying to like, pull one over on her.

[Jared Freed]

Oh, what? Wait a minute. I, I'm missing a ball. I forgot I had my physical removed.

[Jordana Abraham]

I don't think that's how it was.

[Jared Freed]

Oh, is that how you do it?

[Jordana Abraham]

I don't think, I don't think they removed.

[Jared Freed]

No, there's like a snip. I, I, but like, to forget any procedure is crazy, Right?

[Jordana Abraham]

It just seemed like the way he brought it up, it felt like there was like a manipulative aspect of it. Like, who threw that thing away?

[Jared Freed]

Well, now that I think about it, I can come in. You?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. I think the, the secret weird. I think there would be a deal breaker. Just the whole thing. And then to tell me at dinner that, that you can get it reversed.

[Jared Freed]

Hey, I know you've been thinking about it. I know you want those kids. I know we've only been on three dates.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? But I can get it reversed. Can we have sex without a condom? Now? This guy seems very, like, very into having sex without a condom.

[Jared Freed]

Listen, from the male side, if a woman was like, you don't need a condom, anytime they say you don't need a condom, I'm like, I need two condoms. 50, like wrap me in rubber.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? Well, that's, that's would be my feeling about this guy.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

All right, let's do another.

[Jordana Abraham]

All right. Hi, Jared. And Joanna, I was listening to your recent pod how do I approach my gym crush from January 29th? And you inspired me to write in I'm writing with a Red flagger deal breaker on the Rate My professor theme.

[Jared Freed]

Okay. So we had someone write in about they went on a date with someone and they saw their rate their professor and saw reviews of them. Okay. And then they were like messy.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yes.

[Jared Freed]

Disorganized.

[Jordana Abraham]

They were disorganized and all like a mess. Basically. Yeah. You had a recent listener asking if a low rating on Rate My professor is a red flag or deal breaker. And I appreciated the way you approach this topic with nuance. It's true that it's often students with a beef that seek out the website with payback in mind. That's what all the professors tell themselves.

[Jared Freed]

Right? Right. You have to.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yes. I'm sure you two understand how commenter anonymity often brings out the worst in people.

[Jared Freed]

This is true.

[Jordana Abraham]

It does.

[Jared Freed]

All things are true. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

On to my Rate my professor red flagger deal breaker. I went out on a date with a man recently who seemed like a good prospect. Fact, he was intelligent, communicative, and planned a great date at a swanky bar. Swanky. Haven't heard that word in a while.

[Jared Freed]

Disco ball on.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. All good. In conversation though, he mentioned that he had looked me up on Rate My professor and he wondered if I was really a cold hearted as he had read in the comments. Says here cold hearted.

[Jared Freed]

Are you a piece of.

[Jordana Abraham]

I would, I would need to know how many people said cold used cold hearted bitch to describe her.

[Jared Freed]

Well, it would have to be more than 10 to bring it up this way.

[Jordana Abraham]

I would, I would feel If I saw 10 comments with that exact phrase that's maybe applicable. Yes.

[Jared Freed]

But to go to take one, it's.

[Jordana Abraham]

One thing to say, to say From.

[Jared Freed]

I hate Mrs. Stein.

[Jordana Abraham]

One, I was, I googled you, I have to admit, before the date.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

And it came across and there were a lot of people who said maybe you were like a little, a little on the colder side.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah, this is, that, that's like a normal person to me. This is like a guy, they're at a swanky bar, the lights are low. I know this sounds crazy, but this is him flirting. Like it's a little bit of a nag. It's a little bit him trying to like use language to get them into a sexual way. I, I, I, There's a way this goes and I'm like, it feels a little.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah, it feels a little. Gotcha.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

I was taken aback by this and immediately got immediately defensive because. Just an awful thing to hear. Especially when I consider myself to be really supportive of my students.

[Jared Freed]

Not to one.

[Jordana Abraham]

I have to say also that most professors I know don't read the rate my professor rating unless they're totally masochistic.

[Jared Freed]

I'm with them.

[Jordana Abraham]

So I really resented him summarizing the comments of something I didn't want to engage with in the first place. Place he was interested in a second date. Maybe he is a mean teacher. Kink. But I was turned off.

[Jared Freed]

Well, the, the kink thing. I think he was trying to like.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah, I don't think he like was that mad or like worried about it.

[Jared Freed]

No, he just wants her to be like, no, that I hate those kids.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

And go themselves or be in the bathroom and me too. Yeah.

[Jordana Abraham]

Or maybe he's a little worried that she's mean.

[Jared Freed]

Well, there's a way I would be.

[Jordana Abraham]

A little worried if someone. If I read comments about someone that said like they are really, really tough, really mean.

[Jared Freed]

Well, that. But you just did you just said it though. Like the way you bring that up is like, hey, I actually googled you like the way and it's like I got to rate my professor. That's got to be rough to see those. And then she could say, right. I don't read them. You know, she could give the speech she gave to us.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

You know those.

[Jordana Abraham]

I agree.

[Jared Freed]

It's just not a hu. It's to me there's an angle when you bring it up the way.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. He didn't do it at all with any nuance. I can understand Googling someone before a date and maybe even reading the rate my professor if it came up in a search. But did he have to read it back to me on a first date? So red flag or deal breaker? He quotes a mean line to you from your rate my professor profile signed a cold hearted batch.

[Jared Freed]

Right. No, it's a deal breaker. Yeah, you're missing.

[Jordana Abraham]

Say it like that.

[Jared Freed]

If you say it like that, there's a way to get to this conversation. And I do think. I know this is crazy, but I think the. When you take a shortcut like he did, it's to sexualize the conversation.

[Jordana Abraham]

Oh, you think?

[Jared Freed]

Yeah, I think it's like, so are you really a cold hearted. You know, like you're in like.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Having a couple drinks like you missed the mark.

[Jared Freed]

Right. And you're not looking to get to know the person. Like the way to get to know someone's like, I Googled you and I. I think it's amazing that you're a professor, you know, like, right. There's.

[Jordana Abraham]

There's. Yeah, there's a classy. This is a tacky way to do it.

[Jared Freed]

It's tacky because he wants a tacky thing. He wants to.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. He took you to the swanky bar, Right? He knows what he's doing.

[Jared Freed]

This guy had moves.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay, let's do another one.

[Jared Freed]

Last one. Jordana and Jared. I was on a first date with a guy, 33. It's going really well. And then the topic of children came up. He is divorced with two daughters, one from his previous marriage and the other from a relationship before that. I, too, am divorced with a child. He asked if I wanted more children, and I explained that I had a terrible problem pregnancy and postpartum experience and would never do it again. And I'm quite content with my one child. I, of course, then asked him if he wants more. He goes on to explain that he really wants a son and plans on going through the surrogacy process in the next six months to a year to have a baby on his own. That is unheard of. Right.

[Jordana Abraham]

Of a single straight man with two kids already. I've never heard anything like this. I don't want to judge. I could. I feel like if it was a woman, it would be more understandable, but he'd have to.

[Jared Freed]

I mean, the only way I make any sense to me is that he's a billionaire and that he's like.

[Jordana Abraham]

I feel like Elon Musk is. Would do this.

[Jared Freed]

Right. Because the money aspect of it is.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, it's very expensive.

[Jared Freed]

Right?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah. And also, like, he wants to raise the child on his own.

[Jared Freed]

Right. No mother after being in the online.

[Jordana Abraham]

But I guess if a woman did that, you wouldn't be like, she wants to raise the child on her own.

[Jared Freed]

I would. I feel like you're asking for a third and.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah, the third. The third does. If it was. Even if you just had one and he wanted them to have a sibling, I could see it more even that.

[Jared Freed]

I'm just like, I don't know. Because there's other ways to go. Like, you know, the adoption route. If you're, like, really looking. I don't know. Like.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, he also wants a son. That's the other kind of annoying, icky part of it.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah. The bloodline. Is that what he's trying to do? Like, after being in the online dating world for a couple years now, very few things can shake me. So I just said that's very admirable that you are so dedicated to wanting a son that you would do it on your own.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, that's a very political answer. Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

Now I'm sitting with it, and I have endless questions, much like we do.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

You know, I do really like this guy, but I want a partner to travel and have fun with, not one who will have a newborn in 18 months. Red flagger, Deal breaker. We both have kids already, but he wants more, and I don't. A bet who loves her sleep. That is amazing production of what?

[Jordana Abraham]

Yes. I don't think I would simply. That's not how. That's not how AI would summarize this email.

[Jared Freed]

No, no. Right. And it's like, I want someone to travel with. This guy's got, like, a weird situation.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, I think this is gonna say a lot more about him than just he wants more kids. This is a different kind of guy than the guy who wants more kids.

[Jared Freed]

Yes. This is one of those emails I read where you want to, like, look at this woman and go, are you, like, on this planet with us? Like, right? And I. I appreciate her email. And she wrote in. But, like, to. To summarize, this is like, I just want to travel with someone. He's trying to have a third kid on his own. Where are you gonna travel?

[Jordana Abraham]

Really? He wants. He wants a son so badly that he's willing to. I think, first of all, the lengths that he would go to just to have a boy is, like, a little bit. Bit icky to me.

[Jared Freed]

Something's off.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right. Like, he really needs this to this point where, like, surrogacy is hundreds of thousands of dollars. Is his life set up to raise a child completely on his own? Like, why does he. Why does he want it so badly? What's the.

[Jared Freed]

It's. You know what it is? It's funny. I'm gonna make this relation, and I don't think people are gonna like it.

[Jordana Abraham]

Okay.

[Jared Freed]

But it's like when someone gets a dog ran randomly, I am wondering, are you okay? What's going on?

[Jordana Abraham]

This is, like, so much more work than getting a dog randomly.

[Jared Freed]

This is so much more. This is so much. Like, when I hear something like, they're like, I just need a dog. And I'm like, is everything okay?

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

What's going on?

[Jordana Abraham]

To me, this sounds like he's almost just trying to, like, impregnate her so that he can save some money.

[Jared Freed]

I got a proposition for you.

[Jordana Abraham]

Well, I mean, those are his options. He can date and, like, have a baby with Someone he's dating. And maybe he's like, women love guy who wants more kids.

[Jared Freed]

Right? It does feel. That's where my brain goes, is that this is a lie. You think like kids, but it's like.

[Jordana Abraham]

He wants her to think she want. But she doesn't even want more kids.

[Jared Freed]

It's all bizarre. It's. It's too strange to go, well, how will you travel? No, you have to ask. Ask that you have the right.

[Jordana Abraham]

And he has two kids with two different women, right?

[Jared Freed]

So like, is he really a planner? Is he really looking ahead? Is he just thinking like, of the next thing that will make him feel good? I gotta have a boy, you know, I gotta make sure someone has my last name. Like, I don't know.

[Jordana Abraham]

And this is what I'm willing to do to get there. Yeah, it's a lot of.

[Jared Freed]

I mean, she's like, I like him. I don't know how much you like this guy, but like, I'd ask if you really want to, like, go out again.

[Jordana Abraham]

Like, I would get into this question. I would. Right.

[Jared Freed]

A lot of questions. It's a deal breaker.

[Jordana Abraham]

I wouldn't, I wouldn't end the conversation. If I was really into some, Someone I wouldn't say, that's very admirable that you're so dedicated to wanting a son that you would do. I would have 700 more questions.

[Jared Freed]

Right. I don't know what the admirable part is that he's having kids. I don't, I don't find that he's.

[Jordana Abraham]

Willing to go to. He's willing to go to this level to get what he wants.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah, it just, it's too bizarre to go further. For me. I would be a deal breaker.

[Jordana Abraham]

Same. I want to know more, though, if this is real. I kind of would want to know just as like a, like I would on the date. I would ask a million questions and then probably not go out with them again. But part of me is like, are we being like, sexist? Cuz I'm like, if a woman said this, if she's like, I have two.

[Jared Freed]

Kids I want gone.

[Jordana Abraham]

But as an, as a woman, I would be like, all right, good for you. Like, you want, you want to like, build a family that you want. Don't wait for the right guy to come along.

[Jared Freed]

What do you. What? I don't know. There's just like, I'm sorry to be the. No, I, I can't. You got two other kids with two different people. There's a lot going on in your life. How, how do you work and date.

[Jordana Abraham]

And man, I called for money.

[Jared Freed]

You better be a billionaire.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right?

[Jared Freed]

Like, what if.

[Jordana Abraham]

What if he is?

[Jared Freed]

It doesn't make it me like the guy more. It just makes me go weird. Billionaire. I don't know.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right? Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

I don't know. I think a lot of billionaires act weirdly. Like, they do a lot of things I wouldn't do. Like, I wouldn't, you know, keep working.

[Jordana Abraham]

I think I'd be out.

[Jared Freed]

Margaritas.

[Jordana Abraham]

I think I'd be out. But I do want. I would judge a woman a lot less for this.

[Jared Freed]

That's f. I think personally, you want to feel.

[Jordana Abraham]

Deal.

[Jared Freed]

I would probably judge the same.

[Jordana Abraham]

Yeah.

[Jared Freed]

I'd just be like, what's going on? I'd have as many questions as I would have for the guy.

[Jordana Abraham]

Right.

[Jared Freed]

But this is why this podcast is so great. We have heard. You think you've heard it all. No, we haven't.

[Jordana Abraham]

Have not heard it all.

[Jared Freed]

Yeah, yeah. Some guys trying to tell some woman he's bringing to a predator's game that he wants to do her in the ass.

[Jordana Abraham]

This guy wants to have a baby via surrogate on his own so we could have a son.

[Jared Freed]

Well, we solved dating.

[Jordana Abraham]

Keep writing in.

[Jared Freed]

Keep writing in. Uupetches.com back on Friday. Boom.

[Jordana Abraham]

Bye. Kate McAuliffe is our senior producer. Our editor is Emily Freed. Candace Menega is our senior social producer. Our associate producer is Will Maxwell. Additional production help from Shannon Jimenez Sasson. Be sure to follow us at you up podcast and send us your emails to uupetches.com Olivia loves a challenge.

[Jared Freed]

It's why she lifts heavy weights and likes complicated recipes. But for booking her trip to Paris, Olivia chose the easy way with Expedia. She bundled her flight with a hotel to save more. Of course, she still climbed all 674 steps to the top of the Eiffel Tower. You were made to take the easy route. We were made to easily package your trip. Expedia made to travel flight inclusive packages are atoll protected betches.