Ep 1233 | John Luke Reveals His Growing Enemies List & Christian Huffs Potty Training Crisis

Summary

Podcast Summary: Unashamed with the Robertson Family

Episode 1233 | John Luke Reveals His Growing Enemies List & Christian Huff’s Potty Training Crisis
Release Date: December 19, 2025
Hosts: John Luke, Zach, Christian, Al

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Overview

This episode blends humor and honest storytelling about family life—highlighting Christian Huff’s potty training struggles with his daughter—with an in-depth, Bible-based discussion on the tumultuous relationship between Saul and David in 1 Samuel, analyzing Saul’s psychological decline, the intricacies of biblical narratives, and the powerful themes of repentance, restraint, and respect for God’s anointed. Special attention is given to the differences between Saul and David, the nature of agency in scripture, and the dangers of unchecked jealousy and paranoia.

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1. Family Life & Cold Open (00:00–05:14)

Potty Training Woes and Parenting Realities

• Christian shares a comic yet relatable story about potty training his two-year-old daughter Haven. She’s proud of using the potty and insists on flushing herself—leading to a crisis when Christian flushes for her:

  • “She was so mad at me. She was like, ‘I’m mad at you!’... So then she gets back on the toilet… just because she wants to flush. She’s like, red face, and she’s like grunting. And then there’s like the tiniest little turd comes out. Then I wipe her again. Then she flushes the toilet, and she’s so happy.” (01:46–02:34)

• John Luke relates, joking he’s done something similar; this sparks a series of laughs and confessions about who flushes (or forgets to flush) in their households, and the realities dads face with kids and lost tools.

• Zach: “I spend probably 30% of my time at my house flushing toilets. Like nobody else does it but me. …But the thing I don’t like is the toilet situation. And the fact that they get into my tools and…can’t find out where it’s at.” (04:10–04:40)

• The conversation transitions with humor into biblical stories, acknowledging that even the Bible addresses everyday topics—“The Bible doesn’t shy away from any subject. So it’s all in there.” (05:39)

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2. Bible Study: Saul & David’s Downfall (05:44–49:01)

The Tragedy & Decline of Saul (05:44–09:28)

• Main Focus: The ongoing study through 1 Samuel, emphasizing Saul’s paranoia and tragic unraveling while contrasting David’s rise.

• Zach summarizes Saul’s psychological and spiritual issues:

  • “There’s so many similarities between Saul and David. But…the one thing that’s different, it makes all the difference in the world, is that David is quick to repent and turn back to the living God. Saul’s not. Saul reminds me of Pharaoh…there seems to be a lot of that kind of belligerence.” (13:48–15:12)

• Discussion centers on why Saul made David a captain—whether out of political expediency or to endanger him—mirrored later by David’s actions with Uriah (07:18–08:30).

• Unique insights:

  • Michael’s Agency: “This is the only time in the Hebrew Bible where a woman loves first… She has agency.” (08:30–08:31)
  • The grotesque “bridal gift” of Philistine foreskins, illustrating both ancient customs and Saul’s manipulation (09:04–10:33).

Respect, Repentance, and the Cave Incidents (16:00–24:53)

• Christian: Calls attention to David’s restraint and respect for Saul, even as Saul repeatedly tried to kill him:
  • “For us, I don’t think I would have any respect or admiration or even maybe love for someone who was trying to throw spears at me.” (16:23–17:18)
• David’s remorse after cutting Saul’s cloak is juxtaposed with Saul previously tearing Samuel’s cloak—a symbolic handoff of the kingdom (17:18–18:26).

The Progressive Nature of Evil (18:26–26:54)

• Zach: Points out Saul’s moral spiral:
  • “How far Saul goes into the abyss of evil that he ends up killing or having killed the priest of God…that, to me, is such a shocking turn of events.” (18:26–19:06)
• Saul’s sins are compounded: his refusal to obey God (incomplete destruction of the Amalekites); stepping into the role of a priest; murdering actual priests; and relying on an Edomite to do what even his own people wouldn’t (24:53–26:54).
• Notable literary and biblical connections—Edomites as long-standing rivals, appearing even in Paul’s explication in Romans (26:54).

Consulting the Witch of Endor (28:03–33:13)

• The episode spends significant time on Saul’s desperation in consulting a necromancer (ghost-wife/witch of Endor) to summon Samuel.

  • Al: “Then he does [find a witch], and then how shocked they all are. Every one of them. Even the ghost wife.” (29:56–30:16)
  • John Luke: Compares it to the Hollywood version of a scam medium, but reality intrudes when it actually works.

• Discussion on the unsettling reality that the Bible depicts these supernatural events as real—not just scam artistry (31:10–32:05).

• Christian: “He’s wearing the cloak!”—a detail showing Samuel’s continuity in authority even in death (32:11–33:13).

David’s Reconciliation, Respect, and Lament (34:11–48:59)

• Discussion shifts to the personal and political implications of Saul’s and David’s final meetings:

  • Zach: “Think about the person in your life that has done the most wrong to you and tried to destroy you. That’s who Saul is to David. And yet at the end…David’s lament…I found just so wild that he actually honors the one who was trying to kill him…It’s mind blowing.” (34:17–36:23)

• John Luke reads David’s poetic lament, highlighting David’s capacity for honor—even for his enemy:

  • “Saul and Jonathan, beloved and dear, in their life and in death they were not parted…more wondrous your love to me than the love of women.” (46:52–47:29)

• Key theme: David exemplifies respect for God’s anointed (Saul) even as Saul pursued David’s destruction, contrasting righteous repentance versus hardened pride.

• Lament is both personal (“my brother Jonathan”) and public (mourning “beloved and dear” leaders for Israel’s sake).

The Prophet Samuel’s Perspective (38:40–42:54)

• Al spotlights Samuel’s role—forlorn and resigned—that after anointing both Saul and David, he didn’t live to see David ascend.
  • “Samuel thought he failed because they wanted the king…Then his king fails. After all the warning…he sees this whole tragedy of Saul, but doesn’t get to see the rising of David…” (38:40–41:05)
• Samuel’s withdrawal from the story shows the loneliness prophets sometimes face—prophesying outcomes they don’t witness, often misunderstood and isolated.

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3. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Christian on family life: “Sometimes it is a bad feeling when you do forget to flush…if you ever do forget…your wife walks in, it’s not a fun conversation.” (03:17)
• John Luke on respect: “I think you see some of that with David. It’s like, God appointed this guy…who am I to come in and sneak in when he’s going to the bathroom and try to denigrate what he’s doing?” (20:00)
• Zach on evil’s progression: “The thing that he does accomplish is what he should have accomplished against his enemies…he actually accomplishes [evil] against his friends, against his own kind.” (25:00)
• Al about the witch of Endor: “That’s exactly what it is, this story…That whole part. But then also…we have to do something with this passage that’s just taking it the next level—of what do we do with this? That this is possible.” (31:10)
• Christian on reconciliation: “The last thing that Saul told David was, ‘you shall surely win out.’” (23:44)
• John Luke on David’s lament: “I grieve for you, my brother Jonathan, very dear to you were me, more wondrous your love to me than the love of women.” (47:19)

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4. Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|-------------------------------------------------| | 00:00–01:39 | Cold Open: Potty Training Crisis, Family Jokes | | 05:44–09:28 | Study Setup: Saul’s Downfall, David’s Rise | | 13:48–15:12 | David vs. Saul: Repentance vs. Paranoia | | 20:00–22:43 | Respect for God’s Anointed & Public Leadership | | 24:53–26:54 | Saul’s Moral Spiral and the Edomite | | 28:03–33:13 | Witch of Endor: Saul’s Last Resort | | 34:17–36:23 | Enemies List: David’s Forgiveness, Lament | | 38:40–42:54 | Samuel’s View: Prophet Without Closure | | 46:52–47:29 | David’s Lament for Saul and Jonathan |

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5. Tone and Language

The episode is conversational, light-hearted when discussing family, and earnest and reverent during Bible study. The hosts aren’t afraid to joke about bodily functions but treat biblical themes of jealousy, anointing, and repentance with sincere respect and curiosity.

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6. Conclusion

This episode offers a robust balance between humorous family anecdotes and profound, multi-dimensional biblical analysis. By relating the stories of Saul and David to modern leadership, respect, and spiritual humility, the hosts invite listeners to reflect on the dangers of pride and the redemptive power of repentance. The raw, relatable tone—mixing laughter, confession, and scriptural depth—makes it engaging for both Bible students and everyday listeners.

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Next Steps

• Follow the hosts’ Bible course via unashamedforhillsdale.com
• Next episode: Continue with 2 Samuel Chapter 2 and examine David’s later challenges.

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End of summary.

Transcript

[Zach]

I am unashamed. What about you?

[John Luke]

Oh, welcome, welcome. That was a different 3, 2, 1. But you got a little. You got some little. Some jazz in yours. I like that. Okay, that's really good.

[Christian]

There was, like, a little patties out.

[John Luke]

Of town, and so we've had down.

[Zach]

Actually never hurt nobody.

[John Luke]

We've had a team effort here, Zach, for the Unashamed for Hillsdale podcast that we do weekly, which we're excited about doing, aren't we?

[Zach]

Yeah, we're excited.

[John Luke]

There was a little bit of a.

[Zach]

Delay there because I'm. I'm coming in from Black Mountain, but. Yeah. And we're taking the course. You can take it free with us. We're in the Story of David. And so if you want to sign up, go to unashamed for hillsdale.com and you can sign up for the course with us, which we highly recommend, because with the way we're. We're just talking about what.

[John Luke]

We're.

[Zach]

What we're listening to on Dr. Jackson's lecture. So if you don't listen to the course with us, you may not know what we're talking about.

[John Luke]

It makes a lot more sense if you join us. But, you know, those of you that listen to the regular Unashamed podcast, you know that we have something called the Cold Open, which dad refused to call it that because he said that sounded like a downer, so he called it the Hot take. But whatever. But we always do a little something up front about what's going on in our lives. Of course, with Jason, the podcast, it's typically what's going on in his life. And then Zach and I react and respond to that. But I just thought you guys got young kids, you know, any young kids story. I mean, kids do funny things, right? And hilarious things. Is there anything y' all have to. To get us started with with our code open?

[Christian]

Yeah, I have a quick. It's a haven. We. She's. She's actually almost fully potty trained now. She's been the past two weeks. She's just been.

[John Luke]

And she's the. Your middle.

[Christian]

She's the middle one. Yeah. So she's about two and a half, and she's walking around the house in her panties and doing all this stuff. And today she had to go to the bathroom. She said she had to go pooper. So she went pooping when she went pooping the potty, and it was great and everything, so I wiped her.

[John Luke]

Does anybody cheer and like, y.

[Christian]

Well, she's. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's very excited about It. So she went to the bathroom, I wiped her, and then I flushed the toilet. And she was not. She likes. I forget that she likes to flush the toilet. She was so mad at me. She was like, I'm mad at you. And she. I'm so mad. And she was, like, doing her fist down and, like, making an angry face. And I was like, I'm sorry. You know, I'll put a piece of toilet paper in there. You can flush it. So then she gets back on the toilet and she's like, red face. Like she's trying to go to the bathroom again just because she wants to flush the toilet. So she's like, red face, and she's like, grunting. And then there's like the tiniest little turd comes out. And then I wipe her again. Then she flushes the toilet, and she's so happy. But it was just a funny moment of. Of she somehow forces herself to have another little turd.

[John Luke]

What's funny about that story is that except for the be a mad part, I did the exact same thing two weeks ago myself. It was just. I had to guess. I was so excited. And then I just thought, oh, maybe just a little. Did Lisa flush? No. I get the complaints or. And. And give the complaints at my house because my grandkids won't flush. I'm just like you. Were you raised in a barn? I mean, come on. Like, you know, it is a.

[Christian]

Sometimes it is a bad feeling when you do forget to flush. It's a rare thing, but if you ever do forget to flush the toilet and your wife walks in, it's a very. It's not a fun conversation.

[John Luke]

I don't know, really.

[Zach]

I mean, I don't understand it.

[Christian]

If you live life, if you go multiple times a day, I mean, it's not. Sometimes you just might. You've never. Are you serious?

[Al]

Never?

[Zach]

Never. Not fleshed. It's really nev. Not one time in my entire life.

[Christian]

Well, I mean, in seven years of marriage, it's happened to me a couple times.

[Al]

I just.

[Christian]

I get. Well, I mean, I don't know. I don't not forget to wipe. I mean, I wip.

[John Luke]

Just.

[Zach]

I'm on my phone.

[Christian]

I get a phone.

[Zach]

Like, what about you?

[John Luke]

Maybe just Mary Kay just lets it go. And Sadie's like, no, let me tell.

[Al]

You, Mary Kay would not let it go. That's how I know I've never done it Would let it go.

[Zach]

I got a bunch of kids, though, and I feel like that I spend probably 30% of my time at My house flushing toilets. Yeah. Like nobody else does it but me. But I, that's why I'm always. Because it makes me so mad. There's I, I mean I love like a house with kids running through. I love that, that. But the thing I don't like is the, the toilet situation. And then the fact that they get into my tools and like anytime I like I need to get something, I can't find out where it's at because they've got it.

[John Luke]

They.

[Zach]

They treat things that are not disposable as disposable.

[John Luke]

Well, that's my rule. My rule is you can use any of my son in law's in particular, not necessarily the grandkids, but you can use anything. I have always. It's always open to you to use. But put it back like because you go to find, you know, you go where your stuff is and it's not there. It's maddening. I can't take. That's one of my rules. If you're going to use it, put it back. But you know, half the time they don't. So we have to deal with that.

[Zach]

Well, you may think that this is a really kind of an awkward opening, which kind of is awkward.

[John Luke]

But Christian took us there.

[Al]

Yeah.

[Christian]

Hey.

[Zach]

I mean he did like.

[John Luke]

Okay.

[Zach]

Kind of inappropriate but I mean could it be appropriate?

[John Luke]

Some of the stuff we're reading in.

[Zach]

This text, some of the stuff we're.

[Christian]

Going to get into potty training my two year old right now.

[John Luke]

That's real life story. Thank you. Thank you.

[Zach]

That's real.

[Al]

We're about to get into four skates. That's just a little prelude. That's it.

[John Luke]

That's a prelude because we're continuing it.

[Zach]

Go ahead.

[John Luke]

I was just going to say the Bible doesn't shy away from any subject. So it's all in there. Go ahead.

[Zach]

Yeah, we're continuing in the tragedy and the downfall of Saul leading in really to David becoming the king. But yeah, we, we went through some of it last week. But yeah, this is, this is a, this is a further decline of Saul. We saw a lot of it in the last episode where we talked about, you know, his jealousy towards David and, and just the, you know, a lot of the things that, that he was dealing with with his own melancholy as the, as the spirit enters David, as he's anointed, the, you know, the spirit leaves sauce and then he goes into this period of melancholy and, and, and just really kind of like, I think you said like maybe like schizophrenia, paranoia. There's A lot going on psychologically with Saul.

[John Luke]

Well, and then the. One of the first things he does now that he's introduced to David, you know, in these first couple of chapters, whether it's the musician side or what he saw at the. In the Valley there with Goliath, and he makes him the captain in the garden. And I thought Dr. Jackson made a really good point that, you know, does he do that out of political expediency, which could be, you know. You know, you see that a lot within our system where somebody will pick a running mate or somebody, and it may be somebody that just represents something that they want to be part of their team. In other words, I want. Team Saul needs to have, you know, David on it, or was it more sinister? And then he proves that this second one is more likely. Does he want maybe him to get Koi's out there, you know, the ideas, you know, which later, of course, is a little bellwether for what David does to you. Right.

[Christian]

I thought that was a crazy connection.

[John Luke]

Yeah, I thought it was pretty good about that. Yeah. And it's funny is I. I wrote it down in my notes and then he said it right after, because I was thinking, oh, that's pretty good, because that's exactly what David did later. And maybe that's Davy. David knew that and thought, oh, we'll try the old Saul trick, you know, with his situation with Uriah. But either way, I think it shows you that Saul is manipulating the David situation for him to hold on to power. Which kind of becomes, I think, the underlying theme of this entire section that he gets into, including the daughter. Because, remember, the daughter was promised. But it wasn't. This daughter was another daughter. Right. Wasn't it the first daughter? It wasn't Michael originally, but Michael loved David and he said something I had never known before. I don't know if this surprised you guys, that this is the only time in the Hebrew Bible where a woman loves first. Yeah, what about that? That's pretty wild when you think about it. The only time she's like the first one to say, you know what? The way he put it. How did he put it? Is a phrase. He said it. She has agency. Was the way it was the only time in Hebrew where the female has.

[Christian]

Female had agency.

[John Luke]

Right. Which was pretty good.

[Christian]

Yeah. Which his point to that was, was kind of more tongue in cheek of. Well, of course, it's King David, you know, so of course, the only time in Scripture that. That we mentioned because everybody loved David, which is interesting, because, you know, later on in the story, it talks about how she ended up despising David when he's dancing in the temple. And then it just ends with, and she had no children. Yeah, which I thought it was interesting of why she would be the only character in the Bible mentioned about him, about her loving a man. And then just a couple chapters later, she ends up despising him. I thought that was interesting.

[John Luke]

Well, and part of that is probably, I mean, I can't imagine ancient history with so many arranged marriages. In fact, John Luke kind of teased about the foreskin. So the, you know, you had to like, present a bridal gift to a father in this culture. And it had to be something pretty substantial even to marry someone's daughter. In this case, it's the king. So what are you going to give him?

[Christian]

But.

[John Luke]

And so Dave is like, well, I don't, I'm a shepherd. You know, I'm out here, you know, doing my thing. I don't have anything. And he says back to his point about putting him at harm. So I'll tell you what, if you'll just go down and get me a hundred philistine foreskins. And if you're not sure what that is, audience, just look it up.

[Al]

Careful Googling.

[John Luke]

Yeah, definitely don't, don't do the images.

[Al]

Don't do image search that.

[John Luke]

So he tells them to hunter foreskins, pretty much knowing that a typical philistine is probably not going to willingly give up the foreskin. So this is going to be a scrap, right, for you to be able to do this. And so David, who's ever the overachiever, brings back 200 foreskin.

[Christian]

So, and today, yeah, if, so if, if, if, if Zach had asked you to do that, what would you, what would you have placed that in to bring it back to Zach?

[John Luke]

What's that like?

[Christian]

Like, what would you have placed the foreskins in? Like a Ziploc bag? Or would you have. Like, what would you. But if I'm David, like, how would I present these foreskins to Saul? Like on a platter in a backpack.

[Al]

I have a thought on that. If you want to take this course with us, you can sign up for free at hillsdale. Unashamedforhillsdale.com do you do that again?

[Zach]

Yeah, yeah, I got this. I'm a totally butcher and say it wrong.

[John Luke]

Yeah, you should step up here.

[Zach]

Just show your boys Delta airlines.com and sign up for free. That's a different ahead. Try to get, sign up to take.

[Al]

This course for free with us. @unashamed for hillsdale.com.

[Zach]

That'S right. That's unashamed for hillsdale.Com. you got it. Good job.

[Christian]

For free.

[Zach]

John Lake.

[John Luke]

For free.

[Zach]

Take the course for free.

[Al]

I saw this meme of this guy, and he was like, what about the guy who just happened to look in David's bag in the middle of it? Like.

[John Luke]

David's got any snacks in it?

[Zach]

They kept that right next to the head of Goliath. I mean, this guy's carrying.

[John Luke]

But what I'm saying is, when you read these things like this, and there's a lot of stuff like this in the text, because it's real. I mean, it was culture. It was what was going on. It was like, of course we know where circumcision came from, right? Genesis 17. We know the reason why it did with Abraham and the sign of the covenant. And so it became part Israel, Understood. But the rest of the world has no idea what that's about. And by the way, that's still true today. I think I told the story years ago on the podcast, but when I was in Dominican Republic with Ben, he was translating, and I was teaching the book of Galatians. And of course, in that book, there's a lot about, you know, the gospel plus, you know, and circumcision was one of the things they were trying to add to the gospel. And so I'm teaching this text, going through it, and binge, you know, he's pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, you know, Spanish. And then we do a Q and A at the end. And so there's a bunch of young people in there. And one of the young guys raises his hand and asks, what is this circumcision I keep talking about? And I don't know what the Spanish word for that that Ben's been saying the whole time. And so as soon as he said it, all the old guys that were kind of sitting off to the left, all the old preachers and missionaries, they all kind of chuckled, thought, oh, let's see how the gringo answers this. And I looked at Ben and I was like, I don't think you need me for this one, Ben. Maybe you just need to tell what it. And so here goes Ben. Like in Spanish, he's up, up, up, up, up, up, up, up. And the more he's talking, the kids are, like, moving to the edge of their seat, you know, and there's. There's young women and young men in this audience. They've never heard of this before, so they don't. And they're leaning forward and he. He's talking, talking and talking. Of course, I don't understand the language. So I'm like, is he going to get to the money line here? And as soon I knew when he hit the money line because as soon as he did it, the girls all giggled and the guys all went. I mean, they all just like, ooh. Like, that's electric. Ooh. It's like, that's a thing. And so it's really funny. But what it told me was, is that culturally, something like this, if you've never experienced it, you wouldn't even know what it was about. And so obviously this was a way for him to put David in harm's way, was the purpose of it.

[Zach]

That's why I did it. Exactly, yeah. And this is. Well, I mean, immediately when you hear this story, you know, this is like, Dave is going to do something very similar later on in his life with Uriah. He's going to put him out in the front lines to be killed because he knows that he's a threat to him now to a threat to basically exposing his own sin. And so again, I think that contrast continues to play out. There's so many similarities between Saul and David. But yet, man, the one thing that's different, it makes all the difference in the world, is that David is quick to repent and turn back to the living God. Saul's not. Saul reminds me of Pharaoh a lot because it's like the. Even the text talks about him being sent. God sent him a tormenting spirit. And so there seems to be a lot of that kind of belligerence. You know, Pharaoh, the story of Pharaoh, you know, before God even hardened Pharaoh's heart, Pharaoh had hardened his own heart several times already. And so you see that same kind of belligerent spirit in Saul that I'm not going to turn. I'm going to keep doubling down on, and I may relent for a little bit, but I'm not going to really yield my heart to God in this because I'm going to preserve my own power because I'm blinded by my own jealousy and by my own paranoia. And that really was the main point of Saul's downfall, was his own paranoia and jealousy.

[John Luke]

I tell you, another biblical story, Zach, that fits that same narrative is in the book of Daniel with Nebuchadnezzar, who was the Babylonian. Can you see the exact same thing? He's very powerful, knew he was powerful, had taken Israel into captivity, so obviously was completely in charge. But God had used him to do this. And, you know, God's using him for a purpose. And then. Then he gets defined even to God. And God said, oh, I think you need about seven years to go out and become a little farm animal to really teach you about who's in charge. And so that's exactly. He goes crazy. He has the spirit of. He goes out and runs with the wild animals for seven years, and then he comes to his senses and comes back. So I think you see that all along, there's always these people, whether they're Hebrews or not, that get the idea that they're bigger than God and they're not, you know, which comes back every time.

[Christian]

He talks about this a lot, and I think because he talks a lot about, you know, how much David truly loves Saul when, you know, the moment in the cave, then the moment with the water jug. And he kind of talks about how those, you know, seem like maybe a similar story or two separate stories, but how when David calls that to Saul, he calls him Lord and king and father.

[John Luke]

But I think to me, one of.

[Christian]

The most fascinating things about David is how, like, how he remained so much respect and he still had so much restraint for. For. For his respect for Saul. If you just think continually, this man's hurling spears at you. He's repeatedly trying to kill you. And, you know, you have. You have your band of brothers behind you telling you this. This is the opportunity that the Lord is handing them over to you. And he does cut the cloak, and he has remorse for it. Which kind of talked about what you mentioned, Zach, about the difference between David's repentance and Saul's. But I think just for some reason that is just so fascinated to me about David is how he still maintained so much respect for Saul, even after all the things that Saul had put him through. Because for us, I mean, I don't think I would have any respect or admiration or even maybe love for someone who was trying to throw spears at me and repeatedly trying to kill me.

[Zach]

So I thought, well, because. Yeah, because Saul. Yeah, that's a good point. That Dr. Jackson brought up, that Saul. We brought it that. We talked about this in the last episode. But he was clinging to the cloak of Samuel and tore it. And that was the moment when Samuel was like, okay, the kingdom is going to be torn away from you. And now David is tearing the cloak away from Saul, signifying, yep, the kingdom of God. I'm tearing it away from you. But he doesn't relish in that. Even though he, like, he. He had to have known that this was. This is what his calling was. But he's like, oh, I probably shouldn't have done that. And so David actually repents. He actually feels bad for what he did. So when he approach. When he ends up approaching Saul in this manner, he's like, later on, you will see this. He's like, he repents for this.

[John Luke]

And not only that does he repent to God, but he confesses to Saul in the moment on his knees in front of him, and Saul's trying to kill him. So think about it. I mean, what David is doing is saying, here I am, panini. I mean, if you want to take my life, now's the time to do it. But Saul instead is moved by his confession.

[Zach]

David doesn't accept the implications of what's happening here. And Saul is trying to manifest his own power structures. And one of the stories, that part of this story that just is so shocking to me, and it really is shocking, is how Saul's paranoia and how far Saul goes into the abyss of evil that he ends up killing or having killed the priest of God. Like that, to me, is such a shocking turn of events. If you're reading this as a narrative and you think, how far can a person go?

[John Luke]

It's actually staggering, which is the natural, progressive nature of sin and evil anyway, right, Zach? I mean, people will do things they never thought themselves capable. If you just do it long enough, it just progresses on itself, which is powerful. So, by the way, those of you and I know there's a few of you out there that were offended by how we opened the podcast talking about poop. But Saul went into the cave to poop, by the way. Said to relieve himself was the nice way to look at it. But you search that word out, which I did, I pulled a jace. I literally went down a rabbit hole. And, you know, that's what he was in there for. And so that's another thing about the moment, too, that I think it does the text and do this, but I think David felt bad about it. Here's somebody in an ultimate vulnerable position. You know, they're in the cave to relieve themselves, and he sneaks up there in the most private of moments, where, let's face it, none of us want anybody in there with us. And he cuts this cloak as a way to. And takes a piece of it. It's going to embarrass him later. And then thought, oh, man, that's. I mean, but what I love about it is he honors the position more than anything because he kept Saying the Lord's anointed, remember? Because he had been anointed. He was anointed king over Israel. And I feel the same way about when I hear people, like, trashing a president that they didn't vote for or don't agree with or any of any off, you know, a person in government. And once a person is in that position, I think we should always treat it respectfully. You can disagree with them. You can not like their personality. And I'm saying you would never say bad thing. But I'm saying to denigrate somebody, especially if you did it to their face, to me, would be like the ultimate disrespect. If I were to meet a president that was the party I don't agree with, I would be respectful. This is our president. You know, he is our leader. And I think you see some of that with David. It's like, God appointed this guy, you know, he anointed him. And so who am I to come in and sneak in when he's going to the bathroom and, you know, try to denigrate what he's doing? So I love that. I think it shows you the stark difference. And Zach's a great point to show the difference in the two men and what it looks like to have a heart of God versus whatever Saul's heart became. And I don't even know how you describe it at this point, because we are heading toward this cliff of evil that he's about to go over. Man, it was such a strong point that silence is fine.

[Al]

Everyone's just thinking on that one. Just pontificated, just to add on to the idea of the Lord's anointed and how respectful David was of that role. Going off your president analogy, I think when we vote someone as president or not, or someone gets voted in to any office, it's our president in the sense that all of us collectively had a choice in it, even if it. Whether it is or who isn't, we voted for.

[Christian]

Right.

[Al]

And that creates a sense of, like, you want to be respectful for that position, even if it's not the one you voted for. Because when you have your guy in, you want them to be respected.

[John Luke]

Exactly.

[Al]

Right.

[John Luke]

Yeah.

[Al]

And I think that's part of what's going on.

[John Luke]

And he wanted to be successful. Right. Because we're all successful.

[Al]

Right. Because if David is saying, like, I disrespecting Saul, trying to get him out, what David is saying is that, oh, the anointing doesn't matter. Like, it's my power to take Saul Out. Instead, David is saying, no, God put Saul in for as long as God wants Saul in. And I'm going to be next whenever God decides it's my time. David's not trying to take anything for himself.

[John Luke]

And Christian brought up the. And Dr. Jackson deals with it some. That's chapter 24 of First Samuel. In chapter 26, there's a very similar story that has all the same elements. It's in the cave, it's all. And he takes a spear and a water jug away from Saul. And the point making, maybe they're the same story that's just told in two different ways, which makes sense that he would maybe take those two items with him. One represented member the idea of his power. He tried to kill him, he got the spear. The other one, the sustenance, you know, which. You know, whether it happened on two separate instances, I don't think it matters. But it does represent the idea that David had respect for him and sought repentance, even to Saul himself. And it was given. I mean, because he said, let's go back to the palace, you know, it's over.

[Christian]

When he was talking about that story, do y' all remember what Saul's last words to David were?

[John Luke]

You shall surely win out.

[Christian]

Bingo.

[John Luke]

Good job, Al. I had that written down.

[Christian]

Good job.

[John Luke]

You shall surely win out.

[Christian]

Yeah, I thought that was interesting. That was the last thing that Saul told David was, you shall surely win out.

[John Luke]

Yeah.

[Zach]

Going back to this killing of the priest, I mean, I thought this was one of the most incredible points probably of the whole. The whole lecture. And the reason why I like this point I'm about to tell you that Dr. Jackson made is because I think you can. Anytime you look at what, like what God's called you to do, which a lot of that is like have dominion over the creation, things like that. Anytime you abdicate that. It's weird how the inverse is always what you end up encountering is the inverse of the thing that God told you to do. So if you go back, you remember the reason. What was the reason for Saul's downfall was that he couldn't see beyond his paranoia or his jealousy. But the reason why Saul lost his kingdom was because he didn't slaughter the Amalekites whenever he was told to. We talked about that in the previous episode. And he didn't kill. What's his name again?

[John Luke]

King Hagar. Hagag.

[Zach]

Yeah, Hagag. Who is that? Yeah, scratch that. He didn't kill King Agog.

[John Luke]

And he.

[Zach]

And he kept all the extra cattle and stuff. He didn't kill them. He didn't do what God told him to do. That's why he ultimately lost the kingdom. But then what does he do to Israel? He does to Israel what he should have done to his enemy. He actually slaughters all of the priests because he thought that they were in some kind of, like, conspiracy against him with David. And he thought, I've got to kill all the priests or they're going to. They're going to shut me out and take me down. So it's interesting. The thing that he does accomplish is what he should have accomplished against his enemies. He actually. The inverse that he actually accomplishes against his friends, against his people, against his own kind. And he employs no one in his own kingdom would do it. So he has to employ the Edomite to do it. Which is just so fascinating to me of the nature of how evil works. I don't know if you guys caught that or not. Whenever Dr. Jack was talking about it.

[John Luke]

Well, so you can sign up to take the course for free with [e-mail] and the first component, Zach, that you left out of that, which even bolsters your point even stronger because what you mentioned was the second big mistake. The first one, remember, was him being impatient and taking the role of a priest. Remember, he stepped in when Sabbath. So not only did he not do what God told him to do in wiping out these people, but he took on the role of a priest. So now we get down to this final stage. And to your point, Zach, he not only he kills the very people that once he was trying to imitate, and he wipes out his own people. I mean, in that process, that shows you. You talk about a mistake compounded on a mistake compounded on a mistake. I mean, that's exactly what you say. Which was his. What'd you call do?

[Zach]

The Edomite.

[Christian]

Yeah, that was who he was.

[Zach]

Which is interesting when you get to. That's kind of a little different discussion. But the Edomites play an interesting role in the unfolding of God's people. And when you get to Romans, chapter 9, the apostle Paul actually mentions the Edomites, and he talks about Jacob I've loved, and Esau I've hated. He's talking about the Edomites, and he loves Israel. Israel is God's chosen people. And then he's explaining who Israel is. And it's this beautiful picture that Paul presents in the Gospel. But you kind of see that narrative running through here as well. He didn't Talk about any of that. But I just thought it was interesting. Why an Edomite. And these are descendants of Esau. And so these are really enemies of Israel. And if you look throughout history, that was a continual rivalry that started way back with Jacob and Esau. So the people that Saul, who he's going to. Basically, he's going to the enemy of Israel and bringing them into his camp and taking out his own people. I mean, you just cannot make this stuff up.

[John Luke]

And he shows this Zach, when you get to chapter 28, he again continues this behavior. So now he's done this and this terrible thing. And so Samuel has died. So you remember Samuel was the one. He always wanted to stay attached to Samuel because somehow he thought that was like a thread line to the Almighty for him, because they had always been so linked. Well, now Samuel's gone, so he doesn't know what to do. I mean, he knows it's not going well. He knows. So he's like, well, I've somehow got to talk to Samuel. So in chapter 28, he goes to the necromancer or the. The NIV. And some of the newer versions say the witch. But the ghost wife was what? The version that we're studying here with Dr. Jackson is what it calls. I'd never heard that before.

[Al]

I like that, though.

[John Luke]

Yeah, I do, too. Ghost wife. That sound very creepy, especially right after Halloween here. But. So he. He goes, but guess. Guess who had banned all necromancers and ghost wives or witches in Israel.

[Christian]

Him.

[John Luke]

Anybody want to guess? Yeah, Saul. Which rightly so. He did the right thing. He banned all this because it's like, why would we want to do that? We got the Almighty, right? Well, now that he wants to find Samuel, he goes and he says, you got to find me one of these necromasters. And they're like, are you kidding? Is this like an entrapment? Yeah, I mean, it's like you're gonna. Oh, yeah, I get this. You know, this is. I won two super bowl tickets. Yeah. Okay. I'm gonna show right up for that. And so. So they're like. He says, look, I'm gonna swear to you, I won't do anything to you. So here again is the guy who banned the behavior that's now stepping in and say, get me one of these people. What I find fascinating. And he doesn't go into this much in the lecture, but I'd love to know Yalls opinion about this whole subject is that he actually finds one and she actually does it.

[Al]

Yes. This is one of my favorite stories.

[John Luke]

It is to me too. I mean, what is it? Why is it so. Your favorite?

[Al]

I'll tell you why it's so interesting to me. Because the whole. First that they're banned and Saul has to find one.

[John Luke]

Exactly.

[Al]

Then he does, and then how shocked they all are. Every one of them. Even the ghost wife.

[John Luke]

Exactly.

[Al]

Whenever someone, you know, he's like incognito.

[Christian]

Going to do this.

[Al]

Oh, yeah.

[Christian]

He's not like, right? He's like, yeah, he's got the.

[John Luke]

He's got the. The hoodie on. He's like, you know, but if he.

[Christian]

Was the tallest in Israel, it's kind of like he's. Maybe he's like squat, you know, I'm.

[John Luke]

Sure he's got a full. A full costume.

[Al]

Oh, he's. He's got a full costume. And the woman's like, who do you want to me to summon for you? And he's like, Samuel. And the woman was like, okay, sure. Like, she's about to do her whole, like, I imagine her who fake, like, bit. Like she's got the candles and the.

[John Luke]

Did y' all ever see the movie Ghost?

[Al]

No.

[John Luke]

Patrick Sway and Whoopi Goldberg. This is that scene. Cuz like, she's got this fake scam running, right?

[Al]

She's about to do the scam and.

[John Luke]

All of a sudden Patrick Swayze shows up for real and. And talking to her and she's. She freaks out. That's exactly what it is, this story.

[Al]

That's exactly, exactly what it is. That whole part. But then also on a. On a reality level that we also have to do something with this passage that's just taking it the next level of what do we do with this? That this is possible.

[John Luke]

It happened.

[Al]

It happened.

[Christian]

Yeah.

[John Luke]

Yeah. And to me, this passage, the Mount of Transfiguration scene where Elijah and Moses show up with Jesus, I mean, that was wild. I mean, we can see it more there because Jesus is there and so God's doing it. But this one here, this one is a little bit of a freak out for me because I'm like, this person did it. Now, obviously God sent Samuel back. Look, with a message. And here's the thing. If you're going to get into a seance with the ghost wave, if anybody's out there into that thing, be careful what you wish for, because the message you get from the great beyond may not be the one you want to hear.

[Christian]

John, you're forgetting one important funny detail about it. He's wearing the cloak.

[Al]

Oh, yeah.

[John Luke]

I was going to Bring that up. Samuel and I had never thought about that before Jackson brought it up. Samuel's wearing the cloak in the appearance from the great beyond. So it's almost like. And I had never noticed that before this study that. That's showing you even beyond the pale, the faithfulness is still there to face down Saul. It's like one last reminder that, like, this is bad. So the prediction is this is the end for you. And I've always thought that was something people always want to, like, what if we could talk to the dead? And I was like, yeah, but it may not be. It's like every time you see an angel show up in the scriptures, almost every time people are mortified, they fall out like dead people when they see a real angel. So it's like, you know, it's not one of these TV people that just looks like, you know, Roma Downey. I mean, this is like, these are scary, frightening things from beyond, but it is real. I'm like, you. You still got to deal with it because it happened with it.

[Al]

Yeah, yeah.

[John Luke]

It was beyond the pale. What do you think, Zach?

[Zach]

Yeah, I mean, it's really a fearsome sight. But I think that what's interesting is the way that their relationship kind of ends. You know, you brought up earlier, Christian, the last words spoken to David from Saul were, you shall win out. Yeah. So you're going to win out. Like, you're going to, like. Yeah. And at the end, you really see. Kind of saw. I won't say come full circle, but, I mean, he does kind of accept the. The. This is where it's headed. This is where it's headed. And then it ends with his life ends basically, essentially by him falling on the sword in front of the Philistines and then they desecrate his body. But you remember what was the thing that when he was, like, talking with David and Dave was basically. You remember what. His negotiation. Like, what. What did he want?

[John Luke]

What did.

[Zach]

What did Saul want?

[Christian]

Him to spare his family, right?

[John Luke]

Yeah.

[Christian]

Yeah.

[Zach]

He's like, like, spare my family.

[John Luke]

And.

[Zach]

And, you know, I would if I was in David's shoes and this person was coming after me. I've had. I have a few people in my life that I would call them, like, nemesis. Y' all have. Do you guys all have a nemesis?

[Al]

Tons of them.

[Zach]

You do. I mean, you got a few.

[John Luke]

John look has tons of them.

[Zach]

Yeah.

[John Luke]

Yeah.

[Christian]

Pretty decent amount.

[Zach]

Al. You probably don't have any.

[John Luke]

You have very few nemesis these days. But I've had some in my. My past I'm not quite like John Luke.

[Zach]

You have non John Luke.

[John Luke]

He said there's tons of tons, tons of Nemesis.

[Al]

I like to call. What do you say, Nesi?

[Zach]

But I mean, I've got there. I mean, I can. Right. Right off the top of my head, there's four people. I will say three of them have been prosecuted for something illegal. So that's good. Right. But there's about four people in my.

[Al]

You've got high level. I've got low.

[Zach]

When they were.

[Christian]

When they were being prosecuted in courts acted. They say, you are more in the right than I was that he made that callback. He made that call back to Judah and Tamar. He did. I thought that was cool. I would not have picked that up.

[Zach]

Okay, that was a good callback. That was a good callback.

[Christian]

Thank you.

[Zach]

But these are the people that I know would love to see my demise. I mean, there's a few of them, not there's not a whole. But those are the kind of people I have a hard time like, think I have a hard time with that, particularly if I've had a relationship with them in the past. And I feel like that they've, you know, violated me in some way. And so to think about David's posture here, for me, let's just think about the person in your life that has done the most wrong to you and tried to destroy you. That's who Saul is to David. And then yet at the end of this whole thing, he's like, he's trying to negotiate with David. And I just found it like David's lament. And in second Samuel, chapter one, I found just so wild that he actually honors the one who was trying to kill him and destroy him. It's just. It's mind blowing.

[John Luke]

Which again is back to his heart. I wanted to read this, this tail end of this, because we were talking about it earlier, exactly what was said by Samuel to Saul. And then I found this, this whole story so fascinating. It's one of my favorite chapters in the whole Bible. But he tells him, he says, the Lord shall give Israel too, together with you, into the hands of the Philistines. This was the bad news bears that came from this. And then he said, and tomorrow you and your sons are with me, meaning, like you're fixing to cross the pale, which. Think about that. That's the word you don't want to get the camp of Israel too. Shall the Lord give into the hands of the Philistines. So not only is it Saul's demise, but the whole Country's demise, you know, is what happens. And then it says, saul hastened and flung himself full length on the ground. Was very frightened by Samuel's words. He didn't have the strength, for he had not, for he'd eaten no food all day and night. Here he goes fasting at the worst possible time. And the woman came to Saul, And Saul's distraught, so then she makes a little heed for herself, and she said, why don't I give you a morsel of bread? And so the woman had a stall, fed calf in the house. She hastened and butchered it, took flour, kneaded it, baked it, and fed he and his servants. And I thought the last meal, your last supper, was at the hands of the ghost wife. That brought you the worst news ever. And it was just such a condemning moment for Saul. And I just thought it all culminated in that moment. Then he does die a bad death in the sense of how it all went down. But then, to your point, Zach, when it comes to the. So this. This guy who finds him in the moment, he's dead, and he comes back and he tells this tale, trying to ingratiate himself to David. Let you know, I. You know, I. He was down. David and I finished him off for you. You know, he's, like, holding himself up. But David is distraught by this because he's like, who are you to raise your hand against the anointed that you would do this? And then he looks over to somebody standing around, I guess, with a spear. It's like, stab this guy, you know?

[Christian]

Yeah.

[John Luke]

So that's what this guy that was.

[Christian]

Always cool with Dr. Jackson said. Yeah, Dr. Jackson was like, yeah, this guy didn't read chapter 24 and 26.

[John Luke]

He didn't read the room, right?

[Zach]

No, he did not.

[Al]

I want to make a point about Samuel before we get into. Really get into David. Way back in chapter 16, after Samuel does his final, kind of, like, warning to Saul and says, okay, you're gonna die. That opening verse of 16. And the Lord says, samuel, how long are you gonna grieve over Saul when I cast him aside? And Samuel then never saw David until he died, like, 10 chapters later or so. Samuel thought he failed this entire time, too. Like, Samuel thought his whole thing. Well, first Samuel thought he failed because they wanted the king, like Samuel. In his mind, he was supposed to be the prophet, like, he's the next judge in line. And then they don't want him, they want the king. So he anoints the king. Then his king fails. After all of the warning. And even though Samuel anoints David, he sees this whole tragedy of Saul, but doesn't get to see the rising of David. Like, he dies before the end. And I also think that Saul suspected that someone else was going to be king, but didn't know it was David. Because Saul knew Jonathan hadn't been anointed.

[John Luke]

Yeah.

[Al]

And Samuel refused to see him. So once Samuel dies, Saul's like, well, how can there be. There can't be another king, because there's not another prophet to anoint Jonathan, my son. So what's. That's. I think when he gets desperate enough to go to find. To talk to Samuel because he legitimately is like, I don't know what's about to happen here. And then when Samuel drops that the truth bomb of, oh, I've already anointed David, that's got to be just a huge light bulb moment in his mind. Like, oh, I get it. Like, I did not see this whole thing happening. Like, this is such a plot twist, probably such a plot twist, the entire Israelite community of seeing David rise up, but never thinking he was going to be king, and then finding out, oh, Samuel anointed him like he's king.

[Christian]

That's the interesting part about that story, too, because, you know, because God tells Samuel to go to, you know, to Jesse's house and to do this. And Samuel's like, well, if Saul finds out, he's going to kill me, you know, and then the Lord said, just tell him you're going to make a sacrifice. Just kind of humor.

[John Luke]

Yeah. Tell him he had to run some marriage, man.

[Christian]

Yeah, I thought that was funny.

[John Luke]

Now that's good. And that's. That's such a rich thought, Luke, because that's exactly. He. He tied himself.

[Al]

We.

[John Luke]

We only look at it from Saul's side of tying himself to Samuel. But it really did work both ways, you know, And I think of it like, you know, somebody, maybe that is someone's chief of staff or whatever in our current political climate, and they've worked hard to get this person elected, and then they turned out to be terrible. And all your fortunes are linked into this guy's political success. Or they do something really stupid and it's. The whole campaign falls apart or whatever. And then you're linked to this person because you were their biggest cheerleader. You're out for. You're doing all the TV shows, you're doing all the media hits for this guy or this gal, and then it turns out to be a complete bust. And so you're always going to be linked to that. And that's why you'll see them, they'll try to get latch on to somebody new, you know, so they'll have that. But I never really put that together. That's exactly probably from his perspective, he was probably wondering too how this thing was all going to play itself out. He didn't know any more than anybody else at that point.

[Al]

No. And he watched Saul try to kill David the whole time. He watched the whole of David being on the run situation. And Samuel never inserted himself back in. That's right, to say, no, David's going to be king or Saul, you need to stop. Like Samuel was like, I'm washing my hands of this, Saul, you're on your own here. Or really Samuel was like, God, you're on your own here. You got to figure this all out. Because Samuel kind of removes himself from the situation.

[Zach]

That's often the role of the prophet, right? He's speaking, seeks it out there, but maybe doesn't live to see the fruition of the thing that he's prophesying about. You know, although it is interesting, he did see it from afar. He saw it from obviously his, you know, that, that, that verse in Hebrews that we are surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses. And I always think these are the, these are the saints that have gone on before us, that are cheering us on. So you know, Samuel, he's, I mean, he's watching this unfold because we know he came back in this moment. But it was in that, it was in that interaction with Saul that you did see some kind of shift. Because coming out of that really was the reconciliation of Saul and David. Which, I mean, if you want to call it a reconciliation, I guess it was a reconciliation, although that would not have satisfied me. I don't know, you know, but for whatever reason, David seemed to kind of relish in it. What does he call him? He calls him.

[John Luke]

I wanted to mention that. So he, because when he submits to him in that moment, both in 24 and 26, when he says I wronged you, you know, and basically bows down before him in, in a position of if you're going to kill me, this is the time you'll do it. I mean, so he was literally offering up his life to him. And he says, he, he, he, it says that he considered him as a father, which, you think about it, he's married to his daughter, so he's his son in law. Saul's son Jonathan is his best friend and they're like brothers. So he really is like a father, father in law. My best friend is your son. And then Saul says to him, my son, David, and weeps. And so the point that Dr. Jackson made, the way he put it, was this went from political to personal in that moment. And I think there's a lot of truth to that. I mean, you know, you can do and say a lot of things that we'll even do it now and say, well, that's just political or political persecution, or we'll even say political crime, you know, as if somehow it was different from any other crime. But the idea is when it gets personal, then it's up in your kitchen. And that's the way it was with them here. And this really would be the final time before the demise of Saul, before he was doing all the rest of these things. And then David basically is left to step in and to be what God called him to be. So it is a moment. I'm like you, Zach. It would left me unsatisfied, especially the way it ended, you know, and nobody was more distraught to hear that Jonathan, his best friend and then Saul were killed the way they were killed. And it was bad for Israel as well, because then David, you know, he's at war for. With the Philistines for the whole first part of Second Samuel.

[Zach]

I mean, it is so like two things can be true at the same time. So it was personal. I'm sure there's some political motivation as well, which I was thankful Dr. Jackson pointed that out, because David's going to have to unite the kingdom.

[Christian]

Right?

[Zach]

Right. I mean, ultimately the kingdom doesn't stay united and it doesn't last long. I mean, the divided kingdom happens very rapidly after David's. After David's passing or actually after Solomon. But, but so the, the. There's only the united. But he's got to keep this thing together. And so I'm sure that's in his mind, but clearly there's. He's personally invested in his relationship and his love for Saul. And I think that's, you know, you see that when after Saul, Saul kills himself, David executes the Amalekite who claimed to have killed Saul. So he ends up killing him and avenging him. And then he also, in his lamentation, Dr. Jackson points out that he gives Saul that place of prominence when he. You remember the song I mentioned earlier, that. What was the song? That Saul has killed his thousands, David has ten thousands. Well, then David says, Jonathan's boat did not retreat. The sword of Saul never turned away Empty. So he's lifting up Saul's legacy because.

[John Luke]

The last is always more important than the first, which he's made that point in the literary. Yeah, that's a great point. And then he elevates them together in verse 23 by saying, Saul and Jonathan, beloved and dear, in their life and death they were not parted. They were swifter than eagles and stronger than lions. O daughters of Israel, weep over Saul, who clothed you in scarlet and bangles, who studded your garments with jewelries of gold. How have the warriors fallen in the midst of battle? Jonathan, upon your height slain, I grieve for you, my brother Jonathan, very dear to you were me more wondrous your love to me than the love of women. Which was a powerful statement. I mean, it just shows you the bond that was there. But I love it because in the words of a poet. But this also showed you how much he loved God's anointed leadership. And he's basically saying, nobody had more disagreements with Saul than me, but we're going to lift him up. I thought about that recently because we had a former vice president pass away this past week. And he's a person that I grew to disagree with a lot politically over the course of the end of his life. But I thought this man served honorably. He served in Congress. He served as a vice president, kind of we were talking about earlier. And I thought, I grieve his loss and his family. And even though I don't agree with them all politically at the same time, that's what we're supposed to do. That's kind of the higher, more honorable place. And David, I think, shows that in the lament. To your point, Zach, Zach, we're almost out of time. Tell folks about how to get this great course and also how to follow us along.

[Zach]

Yeah, you can sign up for free, for free at unashamedforhillsdale.com, take the course with us. We'll be in next will be in lecture number six. So again, that's unashamed for hillsdale.com if.

[John Luke]

You want to do a little bit of reading ahead. 2nd Samuel 2 is where we're going to be picking up and man, we're going to continue on some of the battles with David and then ultimately, unfortunately, David's demise as well, because he's going to have a major problem.

[Zach]

He has a meltdown, too, in the.

[John Luke]

Next couple of lectures.

[Zach]

Yeah, the pattern continues and hopefully maybe we'll get some more poop stories out of Christian.

[John Luke]

I have a feeling not going to run out anytime soon.

[Christian]

Maybe it'll be me next time.

[John Luke]

Maybe. See you next time on Unashamed for Hillsdale.

[Zach]

Join us every Friday for Unashamed Academy, powered by Hillsdale College. Make sure to go to unashamed for hillsdale.com and sign up. It's no cost to you. That's unashamed for hillsdale.com. and don't miss an episode of the Unashamed podcast by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.