A (4:06)

Thank you, Jack. And before I get there, I would just let you stay. Acknowledged that Fisher has been a huge supporter of my father and I and that without his support, what Killed Michael Brown? And even the upcoming White Guilt would not be possible. So just want to acknowledge, especially in time of recuperation, that he is one of the most generous person people I've ever met. So it's honest.

B (4:43)

You know him, he loves all steals yeah. Family steel. And you know that.

A (4:51)

Yeah.

B (4:52)

So anyway, go ahead.

A (4:53)

We're praying for him. So to your question. Well, we know who killed Michael Brown. Officer Darren Wilson. But his name was not important. The officer was not important. It was the color of his skin that mattered the most and his whiteness. And as far as many who were concerned, from activists to the media, this was a racial killing. For some even called it a state stanchion execution. That was the language that would be used back then. A white cop killed a black teen. Okay, so then the question become, then what created this situation? What were the ingredients, this Latin American umpire on that August 9th of 2014, what was it that brought America to this point and divided her to this day? We believe that that moment in American history was what led to the divide that we have to today. There were things percolated before, but that shooting divided us. And eventually that led us to the question of what was it that killed Michael Brown? And the title was my father's idea. And I remember when I heard it for the first time, it was like, oh, man. Oh, okay, you're playing with Fire now, because you're actually asking what killed Michael Brown? And back then, this was about maybe 2018, we were in the height of Black Lives Matter. People were not talking. Everybody was literally bowing down and going along with the blow. So today we have a little bit more freedom, but back then it's more 10. And I knew that this title was the perfect title because it really framed what we were doing with the film. And it turned the film into an investigation of what killed Michael Brown. And it allowed us to travel back in time to, you know, and use Dane Lewitt at the. At the lab to explore the questions, what killed him? And so we were able to kind of chronicle how blacks had moved up to St. Louis during the Great Migration, how they were moving up. I mean, poverty levels were dropping, they were buying home, they were having gracious shit. Then that leads this really nice ditchy to my father's idea of post Dixie liberalism. And they all of a sudden ship from home ownership to living in government housing, to shift from, you know, working, stay married to gave me the system to have, you know, which led to manning the house rules, which led to single parent households, which led to all of this. Most of all, this really allowed us to explore the idea of bad beat and how that changed and how post disease liberalism was different than the segregation and slavery. Because it really, as my father says, it really got injured in the mind of people. It really took over the mind and said, no, you cannot do this without the white man. No, you cannot do that on your own. You need outside bullshit. So it took an issue sheet away from black people. Sure. I mean, I can't go into all the details in the film, but when you start shooting August Night, Bob Wilson, who is in the film, says, well, would Michael Brown have charged the cop if Michael Brown valued his life? And so what we were saying is there was the whole apparatus of the postdoccious liberalism, the bad faith, the lack of equity in America. The contributors to Michael Brown's faithful charge, you know, because if he valued his own life, he would not charge the cop. The cop had a bullet and he knew that, but he charged the cop anyway. So that tells you a lot about that mindset.

B (9:12)

Howard Husock. I don't know if you know Howard. His book come out recently on the projects. And as you read these, and you see this in. You did much of this in the documentary. Go back and see the wholesale destruction of vibrant black neighborhoods that were maybe a little rough around the edges. But to turn these communities and civil society to Flatten them and put up projects is such one of the great traumas of American history. And it's still bearing terrible fruit. I'm going to ask you another question here, but first, Eli, this is a show. We have to read commercials. You know that. So we're only a few weeks into winter. I'm here in Connecticut. Eli's at sunny California. So these snow doesn't matter, I don't think. But it's already. We're already experiencing brutal cold, huge snowstorms, and of course, power outages. And think about it. If the power goes out when it's really cold, do you have a way to keep yourself and your family warm? This is a real problem. Winter power outages can even be life threatening. Like in Texas a few years ago with that terrible ice storm. That's why so many Americans are getting a Vesta off grid heater from my Patriot Supply. It's a space heater that doesn't use electricity or propane. It runs on something called canned heat, which is an indoor safe fuel. With a Vesta stashed in your closet, you know you can keep warm no matter what. It even doubles as a stove to cook your food. And that's pretty cool, even though the stove is pretty hot. So the best part is right now, you can get the Vesta and a bunch of additional preparedness gear as free gifts. Free. When you order the winter survival kit from my Patriot Supply, just go to mypatriotsupply.com VDH to see everything included. This offer won't last long, so go to my patriotsupply.com VDH today. That's mypatriotsupply.com VDH we thank the very good people from my Patriot Supply for sponsoring Victor Davis Hansen in his own words. Second question to Eli Steele, the president of man of Steel Productions, the great documentarian and filmmaker. Eli. Timing is everything. The documentary also was released. This is what killed Michael Brown as Cancel Culture was thrilling to its mission. Amazon canceled you for a while. It blocked the sale and access to the documentary. I'm going to call you an artist, which is what you are. You're going to have to deal with that, too. So tell us, Eli, what is it like to have a work of art and a work of truth put off limits because. Because of what? Because it told the truth. Tell us about that experience, please.

A (12:17)

Yeah. And yet it was not easy. It was. I think we released the film on August 9th. I'm sorry, October 19th of 2020. And so that was a Friday. And so on this Tuesday before I get a notice from Amazon, like 7 o' clock at night. By the way, Jason Riley of the World Truth Journal had published an op ed. Is Amazon going to platform to film? Because I had put the film on the platform almost two months before and usually it takes maybe two weeks to get the verification, so forth. And I was just. And it kept dragging on. I was getting no answer and I was trying to reach somebody there. And so I raised that question situation. He took that and ran with it. So I don't know if Amazon saw that article, but ironically at this time, he published that article. On 5 o' clock on Tuesday, I get an email from Amazon saying, your film has been rejected. It doesn't meet our criteria for submission and they cannot be appealed. And do not try. It's on the website. But do not even try because most of the time, you know, you don't give people one try. You know, if there's something wrong, they should fix it. So, you know, I looked up the criteria. It was mainly profanity, sexuality, stuff like that. Risked the film did not. Profanity. We did not have that. We didn't meet any of the offensive criteria. And so it was a. It was a. At that moment, I admit it was. I was kind of stunned. I was kind of. But she realized that they had that much power and that they could deny you. Because Amazon, whether we like you or not, is part of our habit. Mr. Yushua. You know how you just click, you know, even though they take 50% of every sale, which is very high, Most people take 10, 20%. They take 50%. But you're paying for the ease of use, you're paying for the asset. So I think it was. So I was able to pivot, but it was, I guess, surprise or a little shocky. She feel the power. She feel the power. She feel the rejection I'd be rejecting most of my life. But this was a powerful rejection and the banality of it. And so. And it was also scary because, you know, as a filmmaker, you spend so much time making a film, so much time and effort goes into it, and then you put your film on a platform. This is very different than a publisher. A publisher has the right to determine what goes on, what they publish. A platform is supposed to be open to all as long as they don't abandon the criteria, which we didn't do. So there's that kind of trust, you know, that violation of trust, that implicit trust that you would have. And Amazon, unfortunately, is just a huge corporation, so they control they have a monopoly, literally a monopoly on everything. No other platform compares. And so it was scary to do that. But thankfully, because of even people like Fitcher, you, Wall Street Journal, Fox, we were able to push back and Amazon backed off.

B (16:19)

I love that Amazon publishes or retails. You could buy a porn about Sasqu or Yeti fantasy porn, but they couldn't watch Kill Michael Brown or buy books on transsexual policy. It's just crazy. Well, anyway, I have a few more questions to ask you and one is about the relationship with your famous and rightly famous dad. And we're gonna get to that and about the very important documentary you have in the works right now on White Guilt. And we'll do that when we come back from these important mess. We are back with Victor Davis Hansen in His Own Words recording on Wednesday the 14th of January, and this episode will be up on the 17th of January. Question three for Eli Steele. Eli, I've known personally, I, Jack Fowler, have known a few accomplished sons of great men. Christopher Buckley, a great friend of mine, whose father of course was William F. Who happened to be my boss at National Review where I worked for 31 years. Then there's Ignat Souls of Nitsyn, who's just a super guy, I have to get him on the show someday. And his father of course is Alexander, who helped bring down the Soviet Union. No small task. And then there's you, Eli, and your father, Shelby, who spent much of his scholarly career exposing how white guilt is the foundation of so much of modern American progressivism. I'd like to know, and I'm sure our viewers and listeners would like to know, what is it like for you to work with your father who serves as the voice and the star of some of your documentaries?

A (18:06)

Horrible. No, no, I think he's been amazed and I think he's been a blessed. I mean it's not something that we planned, it was just something that, you know, we planned it all. But first I should have to say that, you know, I'm very lucky to have him as a father. I mean, I would not be the man I am without having him as a father. I was born profoundly deaf and it was him and my mother who did everything. The power. It took them almost four years to get me to learn how to ear hear and speak. So that kind of tells you a lot about what kind of man here did. He wanted me to have full access to the world. Iranian means you have the chance of being American, being a bunchini adult. And even if he wasn't my father, when he began to publish, because of my background being multiracial, his work would have had a huge influence on me. Never really had any doubt or question about his idea. It just made sense to me. A lot of what he writes is very common sense, very pro American, all about the. So I always agreed with this work, never had any issues with it. And so I had done the film before what killed Michael Brown, How Jack Became Black. And I did this one by myself. And he's in the film after interview Dubship. And then we were just kind of thinking. I was just kind of like, well, what am I going to do next? And we just kind of started talking and then we said, well, let's do one Michael Brown. Because for us, in 2017 was the one moment that bothered us, because it was like that one moment where America did not come together. When the back represented, when the autocracy came out, is that he'd be shot in the back, not in the front. He was not executed normally. He would have them sort of like, oh, okay, that's what happened. No, America divided. And so for us, it was like, let's do something on this. The process have been, I think, because it's a great process because we have father and son, we have that bond, we have that trust. So sometimes there's no filter. So sometimes it's all at war, I mean, over the ideas or over what I need or something. But it has always resulted in an amazing insight in somebody better and showed us to rehab that faith in the process and even carried over to the new film White Guild. I mean, we still had our own issues, but we both are committed to the best idea. The best was the best next line. What's the next shot that we put in? So it's been a blessing working with him and to have him. I mean, I don't see myself as him. I see myself as the filmmaker. My job is to tell the story, and his job is to give me the idea, to give me the insight and to take the film to a new level.

B (21:35)

He performs pretty well, too, in the. Hey, we'll get to white guilt in a second. First, for our listeners and our viewers, if you've studied enough history, you start to see a pattern. Nations don't lose their way overnight. They drift through debt and division until one day you realize the foundations you thought were permanent were never permanent at all. Today, America is spending at levels once reserved for wartime. We've normalized deficits that would have stunned earlier generations. And policymakers now debate whether the only path forward is more intervention, more printing, more distortion. But here's the historical truth. Every society that pushed its currency beyond discipline eventually paid a price. The wise never waited for the collapse. They prepared for the correction. And that's why so many thoughtful Americans, especially those nearing retirement or in retirement, are reallocating part of their wealth into something that has outlasted every paper experiment in history, talking about physical gold not as speculation but as insulation. Reputation matters, which is why we're partnering with Allegiance Gold, a company distinguished by integrity, reliability and an A rating from the Better Business Bureau. For years, Allegiance Gold has guided Americans through transparent education and long standing relationships built on trust. And right now, they're offering, they're extending, I should say, a special liberty offer to our listeners, listeners of Victor Davis Hanson, in his own words, to help you get started with real gold, whether your funds are in a retirement account or sitting in a bank or under your mattress, even if you believe that the best time to reinforce your position is before the storm becomes obvious. Call 8447-9091-9184-4790-9191 or visit protectwithvictor.com One more time, 8447-9091-9184-4790-9191 or visit ProtectWithVictor.com History rewards those who take the long view. And we thank the good people from Allegiant Skull for sponsoring Victor Davis Hansen in his own words. We're going to take a break in a little bit, but before that, an important question. I think the key question here for our discussion with Eli Steele about his next documentary, which is, as we've mentioned, white guilt. Eli, tell us about this documentary. First, what's your gut about when it is actually going to come out? But much more importantly, what has the role of white guilt been in America the last 50 years or the last last 75 years? I mean, who's benefiting? Who's white guilt serving? Is it serving the minority community of America or is it serving white America?

A (24:23)

To the documentary we've been working on, this film for three years is probably the hardest film I've ever had to work on because white guilt, as you know it is very abstract idea how you bring the ideas to life. How do you bring the idea, the invisible concept of race? I mean, people have a hard time understanding what white guilt is. And I'll briefly give you my dad's definition, which is I'll show you one thing. A lot of people come to me and they say, I Don't feel any white guilt. I don't have white guilt. Of course you don't. You can feel guilty about what you didn't do, but white guilt is not that. White guilt is the fallout of centuries of oppression in America. You cannot have all of that oppression and then have a reckoning in the 1960s where you come face to face with the evil, with the racial evil, and not have them fall out. And to fall out with the white people who are on the top lost the moral authority. They lost it. They lost everything. They had been spoiled. And so what they've been trying to do, especially on the left, is regain that moral authority. And that is what has been driving America. And black, you know, the black grievance monger, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and then all the way to today have been exploited. That need for innocent, and my father calls it innocent, that need for innocent moral authority. So white guilt and black power are these two sides of the same coin. And so white guilt, we're starting off as very small. Like, you know, our smaller exploitation has only grown in power. And in 2006, my father published his book White Guild, which is Mummy's best book. Well, that was done. It was 20 years ago. If you read that book, White Guild has exploded. And so when we were making this film, we were like, wait a minute, it had actually increased in evil. It's actually become even more evil than we rely. Than we rely. It's actually far more insidious than where we rely on. And so we said, we have to make a film on this. And what really woke us up was October 7th. And I mean, I'm trying to tell you a long story, but, yeah, I should tell you. All my life I've heard stories about my father, his daughter, becoming a black panther going through Algiers, basically, black panther. And so I'm thinking, like, okay, I'm hearing these stories. But then I realized, wait a minute, these stories are completely relevant because what drives white girl today is the liberation ideology, the division of people into oppressed and oppression. So when my father went to Algiers, he was literally going to the place where the ideology was taking hold. I mean, Algiers had just gone through the revolution, so the Palestinians were coming there, the Black Panthers were coming there, North Korea, everything, China, Vietnam, they were all coming there to talk about this new ideology. And so that's the October stomach happened. That really took, I think, open many people's eyes to the fact that this ideology, which had been sort of behind the scenes, had now stepped forward. And so that's what this film is largely about is how we got here and how powerful this ideology is. And not only that, how anti Western ill. His only goal is to destroy Russian civilization. And that's what we see from Iran to Hamas to what's happening on the college campuses. And so it should be believed that white guilt as a force is like the most invisible force. But it is degrees. They allow liberation ideologies to come in. It allows Marxism to come in. And people talk about empathy. You don't have empathy. That follows empathy. Without white guilt, we really don't feel empathy. We are not feeling empathy. You fear white guilt. You feel the accusation of being racial, of being on the wrong side of history. That's not empathy. That's white girl. And so people still don't quite understand that. So hopefully with this film it become more apparent.

B (29:12)

Do you have a target date?

A (29:14)

Yeah. So we should literally finish the final cut, which means we lost pictures. Right now it's the mute stamp, color graphics, all of that. I am hoping she maybe have them early. Shown reading in April, Ambition and then A Writer released in May.

B (29:39)

I have a fifth question to ask you, but before we get to that in a break, man of Steel Productions. Is the website correct?

A (29:47)

Actually, you should go to whiteguildfilm.com I need to update it, but if you go there and leave your email address, you'll be on the list.

B (30:00)

Okay. You can also find, by the way, Eli has a substack where he writes somewhat regularly. You should check that out. That's man of. Well, you should tell us. That's man of Steel.

A (30:14)

Man of Steel, F Stepdeck. Or you should go to manofsteelproduction.com great.

B (30:23)

Well, we have one more question for Eli and we'll get to that when we return from these important messages. We are back with Victor Davis Hansen in his own words. This episode is appearing on coincidentally on Martin Luther King Day weekend. I do want to alert our viewers and listeners that if you go to Philanthropy Daily and I'm now the editor of Philanthropy Daily, everybody else took a step backwards. But that's for the the Home also of Civil Thoughts, which I newsletter I write every week. We have published on Friday the 16th. That would be yesterday from when this is airing a transcript of a podcast that Victor and I did in 2021 where he recounted as a young boy, he was about 10 or 11, meeting Martin Luther King at the San Francisco Grace cathedral reconsecration in 1965. And Victor talks about meeting Dr. King and what Dr. King said at that pretty Historic event. And I want to encourage folks to check that out. So anyway, now the question, which I may be repeating some of the things I said here this Monday, Eli, will be Martin Luther King Day. Our friend Victor has discussed how as a young boy, he heard King speak at the consecration. If folks, okay, I tell you where to go to read that. So King's speech and sermon that day had a theme somewhat stolen or sounds familiar from something that the U.S. army had a few years later. Be all you can be, right? Essentially, King said, if you're going to be a gardener, be the best gardener you can be. And he said plenty more in that talk sermon. His was not a message, though, of victimhood. So as someone, Eli, who has written and filmed about the state of black America and the state of all America, how it embraced or rejected America's left and its right. How embraced, I should say how embraced or rejected by America's left and its right is King's message from that 1965 sermon and his related messages that America's obligation was to live up to its promises, including that the Declaration of Independence was a promissory note. What are your thoughts on that?

A (32:47)

Yeah, I think I heard that story. Fisher told that story, like over dinner, maybe like 10, 15 years ago. And I remember, you know, thinking, okay, what a powerful testament to what King did. I mean, here's Fisher, a barn boy, you know, 10, 11, a white boy. And King is, you know, speaky across the color line. He makes Fisher aware of the injustice, but he giving a message of greater unity. But not only that, but Fisher makes the point that King was not shamy. He was not. In other words, he was not playing off of white guilt. He was not doing that. He was not shaming. He was saying, your ancestors, the wife was still great. But we all need to live up to the principle in the Constitution. We all need to have that same shot. So that's a very unifying message. And I think on the left, you know, to kind of sum it up, I mean, they moved away from King message of be all you can be by embracing, you know, policies of dependency, by, you know, disbelieving that the black can uplift themselves by continuing to lower standard. I mean, we're taking away the fdc. I mean, what more, I mean, we literally have just been doing a steady dismantling of standards, all that. And then you have some people on the right who are now trying to deconstruct, kind of doing a very leftist thing, deconstruct the legacy of King, linking him to Communism, making him the father of dei, dei, all that stuff. But, you know, I'm not going to go into all of that. But that ignores, I think, the impact the King had on America and the world. I mean, there's a reason why he is distant. He was not a perfect man. But you cannot deny the power of that message. I mean, when my father. And my father talks about this in White Guild, when you heard King, it was like, oh, life, this 90 should be this way. Oh, this segregation that I thought would just be here for the rest of my life may actually die. And Fisher hearing a very similar message. I mean, that's a message to point us towards the white America, the America that we need to move toward. And I think, you know, we can agree that whether you're on the white or. Or on the left, we have all betrayed that message. We have betrayed it. And I think that's why my father and Fisher are very close friends. And I think. I think that's the power of King. Fisher and my father never betrayed the Best of Kings message. They never. They King. And it was all about the American principle. Are the greatest principles in the world. I mean, they come out of, you know, 3,000 years, from the Jews to the Christian to the Enlightenment to Asia region. And then we have America. And so we need to live up to that. And so I did that. The message that I got from Bishop Story and one that my father shared, one that I believe in, too.

B (36:20)

Well, Lincoln did say we were the last great hope on earth. And I think he was right when he said that. So again, I want to. Folks, go to Philanthropy Daily if you want to read Victor's account. It's just terrific. Eli, I got to tell you, what you've done in your previous documentaries and what you're doing with White Guilt, I think is so important. You're so consequential. And I really appreciate you coming on here. I know Victor appreciated it too. I'm very much looking forward to the completed work. And I think when that happens, we will reconnect with you and the old man. If he's not taking a nap at that time, we would have him on the show and also both of you and talk about the completed production. So I wish you best of luck as you finish it. I want to thank you again for coming on. ManOfSteelProductions, White.com, whiteGuiltFilm.com check that out and PhilanthropyDaily.com to read Victor's article. Thanks, Eli, for being here.

A (37:24)

Thank you, Jeff. Thanks to the good people really appreciate it.

B (37:26)

Oh. Oh. It's an honor, man. It's an honor. Thanks to the Daily Signal, our great friends Rob Bluey and Tim Kennedy, and we will be back soon with another episode of Victor Davis Hanson. In his own words. Thank you and bye bye. Thank you for tuning in to the Daily Signal. Please, like, share and subscribe to be notified for more content like this.

A (37:48)

You can also check out my own.

B (37:49)

Website@Victorhansen.Com and subscribe for exclusive features in addition.