Victor Davis Hanson: In His Own Words
Episode: When Schooling Became Utilitarian: The Quiet Shift That Changed Everything | Guests: Andrew Zwerneman
Release Date: February 26, 2026
Host: Jack Fowler (sitting in for Victor Davis Hanson)
Guest: Andrew Zwerneman, President of Cana Academy

Episode Overview

This episode explores the dramatic shift in American education from its classical, liberal roots toward a predominantly utilitarian model. Guest Andrew Zwerneman—an expert in classical education and founder of Cana Academy—joins host Jack Fowler to analyze the historical forces behind this transformation, the consequences of “forgetting” history, and the cultural project of renewing American education. The conversation also covers Cana Academy’s role in training teachers, the classical approach to pedagogy, and Zwerneman’s initiative tied to America’s 250th anniversary: history250.org, a resource of free short films to teach American history.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Historical Shift in American Education ([00:09]–[06:11])

• Transmission of Culture: Zwerneman defines education as “the transmission of culture from one generation to the next. So it's inherently an historical project … pulling up from the past the best of what we know and love, and passing it on.” ([00:09])
• Erosion of Liberal Education: Over the last century, two “major assaults” have eroded liberal education (meant as education for intellectual, moral, and spiritual freedom):
  • First Assault—Progressivism: Divorce from religion and rise of utility—“students weren't learning what they had inherited, they were learning for the immediate problem before them…” ([06:11])
  • Second Assault—The New Left: Sweeping critique of American institutions (family, markets, constitution, history), leading to a “tear the house down and start over” mentality ([06:11])
• Contemporary Relevance: Current movements like DEI initiatives and the 1619 Project are seen as extensions of New Left ideology, enabled by the vulnerability left by progressivism.

“Culture is an adult enterprise. It's not a child's enterprise.” —Andrew Zwerneman ([06:11])

2. Decline of Teaching Quality and Classical Pedagogy ([12:40]–[29:13])

• Teacher Preparation: Fowler points out that most education degrees don’t correlate with effective teaching; Zwerneman agrees and emphasizes deep content knowledge over education degrees ([14:39]).
• Cana Academy’s Approach: Focuses on “training humanities teachers” to lead seminars on classic texts, cultivating careful reading, intelligent discussion, and clear writing ([14:39], [22:52]).
• Teaching the Teachers:
  • Offers detailed guides (e.g., on Dante’s Inferno) breaking down context, key questions, and glossaries ([22:52]).
  • Seminars allow teachers to experience classic texts under master educators before leading their own classes.
  • Practical advice includes grading discussions, addressing non-participants, and teaching writing.
• Teaching by Example: Great teachers at classical institutions are described as mountain guides—“A great teacher is a great leader…like a mountain guide” who knows both the route and how to equip travelers ([29:13]).

“There’s no correlation between outstanding schools and professional education degrees.” —Andrew Zwerneman ([14:39])

• Early Reading’s Impact: Early reading fluency is a powerful life indicator; priming students with knowledge, grammar, and memory work lays strong foundations for later classical studies ([27:10]).

3. Qualities of a Great Classical Teacher ([29:13]–[34:38])

• Leadership: Knows the desired outcome for students and how to lead them there.
• Three Core Roles:
  1. Didactic Instructor: Clearly introduces new skills and concepts.
  2. Socratic Questioner: Asks probing, generative questions.
  3. Coach: Helps students navigate confusion, drawing them into the text, modeling problem solving, and guiding them when they're stuck.

“Instruct didactically, ask Socratically good questions… then coach the student. That's what a great teacher does.” —Andrew Zwerneman ([33:30])

4. National Memory, Historical Amnesia, and America’s 250th ([35:59]–[43:49])

• Forgetting or Vilification: National history is either “forgotten out of neglect” (bad teaching) or “assailed on purpose” (ideological conviction) ([37:40]).
• Consequences:
  • Identity Loss: “By losing our story we’re losing our identity as a people.” Drawing on David McCullough, Bill McClay, and Lincoln at Gettysburg ([37:40]).
  • Loss of Responsibility: Without history, citizens abdicate responsibility required for self-government (citing Victor Davis Hanson’s The Dying Citizen).
• American Founders as a Recollective Generation: The Founders intensely studied history (especially the Romans) to “live under history” and build a republic mindful of both failings and triumphs of the past ([43:49]).
• Cultural Renewal Through Remembrance: Zwerneman ties the recovery of memory and civic responsibility to educational renewal—“the loss of history is a loss of the heart of the matter.”

5. America 250 & history250.org: Public History as Cultural Project ([43:49]–[55:47])

• History as Art, Not Just Science: Film is chosen as the medium to create “a great cultural contribution to America, not only to celebrate our 250th birthday … but to remedy national amnesia.” ([43:49])
• Content Highlights:
  • 60+ free short films on American history for educators and citizens alike, aimed at recovering a “liberal discipline of history in a popular format.”
  • Balances “the culture of repudiation” on the left with historically rigorous storytelling—addressing both America’s failings (slavery, internment) and its virtues.
  • Films highlight how “exemplary Americans … found in our history a way forward that is a remedy to what ails us,” with MLK and Lincoln as prime examples ([50:42], [53:10]).
  • Upcoming episodes on slavery and Fort Sumter; upcoming trailer to premiere at the National Symposium on Classical Education ([50:42]).
• Pope John Paul II’s Charge: “You have a bulwark against moral skepticism that is in the Declaration, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights … Cherish and love and protect every human life.” ([54:55])

“There are all sorts of good things in the American past to look at.” —Andrew Zwerneman ([43:49])

“What we really love about America ... is that over the course of our history, there have been exemplary Americans who have found in our history a way forward that is a remedy to what ails us.” —Andrew Zwerneman ([53:10])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the true aim of education:
  “An education for freedom—to be free intellectually, spiritually, morally. That's the objective, that's the goal of a great education.” —Andrew Zwerneman ([06:11])

• On classical teaching method:
  “We look at the great text though, as authored by the greatest minds in our tradition. ... The books are read to liberate the students to know and to love what they ought to know.” ([14:39])

• On the danger of forgetting history:
  “It's a terrible thing to lose our history because we lose a sense of who we are. The second great loss has to do with the loss of responsibility.” ([37:40])

• On how the founders viewed history:
  “The founders read more history than they did philosophy. They were deeply, deeply attuned to the Roman Republic as their chief model for republicanism. They were also attuned to what failed in Rome…” ([43:49])

• On educational renewal:
  “The antidote has to be a recovery of what we mean by liberal education. ... Fundamentally, an act of remembrance—remember what we ought to remember and live under that history which gives us a vision for how we ought to live.” ([06:11])

• On reconciling America’s failings:
  “We're not uncritical of failings in the past, but we recognize that ... over the course of our history, there have been exemplary Americans who have found … a remedy to what ails us.” ([53:10])

Important Timestamps

• 00:09 – Zwerneman’s definition of education as cultural transmission.
• 06:11 – The two major historical assaults on liberal education.
• 14:39 – Discussion on the limitations of education degrees and effective teacher qualities.
• 22:52 – Outline of Cana Academy’s teacher training programs.
• 29:13 – The three-fold role of great teachers: leader, Socratic guide, and coach.
• 37:40 – The consequences of forgetting or misrepresenting national history.
• 43:49 – Launch and philosophy of history250.org: using film to teach America’s story.
• 50:42 – Upcoming films and resources at history250.org; importance of context in teaching about controversial topics.
• 53:10 – Reflection on America's capacity for self-renewal and reconciliation with its past.

Resources Mentioned

• Kana Academy
• history250.org — Free educational films for America’s 250th
• Books/Curricular texts: “Bonfire of the Humanities” (Hanson, Thornton, Heath), The Dying Citizen (VDH), Bill McClay’s Land of Hope
• Key classical works: Plato, Aristotle, Augustine, Locke, Federalist Papers, Shakespeare, Twain, Dostoevsky

Overall Tone:
Deeply reflective, historically anchored, and optimistic yet realistic—advocating for educational renewal rooted in the best of the classical tradition and an honest, constructive engagement with America’s past.