Episode Overview

Title: Does retrieval-based search make traditional keyword research obsolete?
Podcast: Voices of Search
Host: Tyson Stockton
Guest: Duane Forrester, Unbound Answers
Date: September 9, 2025

In this episode, Tyson Stockton and guest Duane Forrester tackle the question of whether the rise of retrieval-based search signals the end of traditional keyword research practices. The conversation moves through practical strategies, the evolving nature of SEO research, and how marketers should adapt their methods in a rapidly changing landscape shaped by new search technologies.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Core Question: Is Traditional Keyword Research Obsolete?

• [01:00] Tyson poses the central query: Are you buying or selling that retrieval based search makes traditional keyword research obsolete?
• Duane's Stance: He "sells" the notion that keyword research is now useless, explaining:
  • Traditional keyword research isn't obsolete, but its function is changing.
  • There's a shift from focusing solely on keywords to embracing wider topic research and understanding the relationships between different queries.

Expanding Beyond Keywords: The "Query Fan Out"

• [01:11–02:28] Duane introduces the concept of "query fan out":
  • Starting research from one keyword, then branching into all related topics a user might care about.
  • Example: If you're talking about "sleeping bags," you should also consider tents, pillows, and ground sheets—the entire universe of related camping equipment.
  • He advisors his team: “I am not telling them, go do traditional keyword research, go look up a word, and so on. I am telling them, go do topic research. Start with these keywords, go broader.” (Duane, [01:20])
• Duane clarifies: “I am selling this idea that it needs to expand. There we go.” (Duane, [02:14])
• Both agree that clinging to strict keyword lists is limiting, especially for inexperienced SEOs, as modern search involves more nuanced queries.

The Real-World Analogy: Conversations vs. Keywords

• [03:07] Duane offers an exercise:
  • Try observing real conversations at a party—are they strictly "keyword" exchanges, or do topics naturally branch out?
  • “As much as they want to start with a keyword, it's going to evolve like instantly… If we start talking about Star Trek, it's inevitable. We start talking about Star Wars. Yeah, inevitable. Like you get there, I mean it just happens.” (Duane, [03:22])

The Pace of Change in SEO & Search Behavior

• [04:12] Duane remarks:
  • Adoption of advanced query-based research (“query fan out”) will happen extremely quickly, overtaking traditional methods.
  • Predicts that in just a year, even the terminology will shift: people will talk in terms of "fan out" rather than "keyword research," as this perspective becomes a new norm.

“The evolution of where we started to where we now think the new normal is, is going to happen extremely fast because it's kind of being dragged along by the pace of everything else… when we start talking about keyword research a year from now, people will either understand it's fan out inclusive or will start using fan out as a replacement for keyword research.” (Duane, [04:15])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On shifting away from rigid keyword focus

  “I am not telling them, go do traditional keyword research, go look up a word, and so on. I am telling them, go do topic research. Start with these keywords, go broader.”
  — Duane Forrester, [01:20]

• On the conversational nature of search

  "Try… make note of how many conversations they have that are keyword based versus how many of them look more like people also asked. I guarantee you it's an eye opening exercise…"
  — Duane Forrester, [03:07]

• On the rapid pace of SEO evolution

  “That evolution… is going to happen extremely fast… when we start talking about keyword research a year from now, people will either understand it's fan out inclusive or will start using fan out as a replacement for keyword research…”
  — Duane Forrester, [04:15]

Important Segment Timestamps

• [01:00] — Core question on the future of keyword research
• [01:11–02:28] — Duane’s perspective: Topic research and query fan out
• [03:07] — Analogy to real conversation patterns
• [04:12] — Discussion on how rapidly SEO practices are evolving

Summary

Bottom Line:
Traditional keyword research is not obsolete, but its role is quickly changing as search engines become more sophisticated and user queries more varied. Effective SEO now requires a focus on broader topic coverage—embracing the "query fan out"—as opposed to just compiling static keyword lists. This holistic approach will soon become the standard as technology and search behaviors evolve rapidly.

Takeaway for SEO Professionals:
Don't just chase keywords—map the entire landscape of related user interests and be prepared to adapt as the pace of change increases.