Title: How To Create A Holistic "Land And Expand" SEO Strategy

Podcast: Voices of Search
Host: Tyson Stockton
Guest: Elliot Tsai, Senior Growth Manager of SEO and ASO at TextNow
Release Date: May 12, 2025

Episode Summary

In this insightful episode of Voices of Search, host Tyson Stockton engages with Elliot Tsai, the Senior Growth Manager of SEO and ASO at TextNow. The discussion delves into creating a comprehensive "Land and Expand" SEO strategy by strategically aligning SEO with other marketing channels. Elliot shares his expertise on breaking down silos within marketing teams, leveraging data effectively, and utilizing various tools to enhance SEO performance.

1. Overcoming Marketing Silos

Elliot Tsai begins by addressing a common challenge in marketing: the tendency for different channels to operate in isolation, leading to competition rather than collaboration.

“Marketing channels often operate in silos. Teams rarely share valuable data, and more often than not, they end up competing against each other despite having a shared goal.” [00:43]

Elliot emphasizes that SEO cannot succeed in a vacuum and must be integrated with other channels like product, engineering, analytics, and content teams to create a unified strategy that benefits all facets of marketing.

2. SEO as a Foundation for Holistic Marketing

Tyson Stockton shares his perspective on the evolution of his career from paid and influencer marketing into SEO, highlighting the foundational role SEO plays in overall marketing strategies.

“SEO is really the foundation of everything... other marketing channels have what they're good at. So we should partner really closely together to create a holistic view.” [04:57]

Elliot concurs, suggesting that SEOs adopt a performance-driven mindset similar to paid channels by forecasting revenue and demonstrating SEO's value in tangible terms.

“Operate SEO like a paid channel. Everything should be revenue driven... turn into a revenue forecast.” [06:15]

3. Leveraging Social Media for SEO Insights

The conversation moves to the intersection of social media and SEO. Elliot Tsai recounts an experience where social listening tools helped identify emerging trends, allowing the SEO team to prioritize relevant content ahead of competitors.

“We should have created this page two months ago, but it was from social listening which was clearly on their radar far before it was on the SEO team's radar.” [12:07]

Tyson Stockton adds that social media platforms like Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube provide real-time insights into consumer behavior and trending content formats, which can inform and enhance SEO strategies.

“They already do the work for me. I copy what they post and create an article to hop on the trend at the same time.” [13:07]

4. Effective Collaboration with Data Teams

Understanding and utilizing data is crucial for SEO success. Elliot Tsai and Tyson Stockton discuss the importance of close collaboration with data teams to ensure accurate data interpretation and strategy formulation.

“Work with your data team. Make sure the data that you are sharing are come from the same source and build a logic behind it.” [13:32]

They also touch upon the challenges and opportunities presented by Google Analytics 4 (GA4), emphasizing the need to master its complexities to harness its full potential.

“GA4 is complicated, GA4 is messy... you need to understand the logic and bridge it together.” [15:05]

5. Essential Tools and Data Sources for SEO

Tyson Stockton outlines the key tools and data sources that are indispensable for effective SEO management:

• Google Search Console (GSC): A fundamental free tool for tracking search performance and indexing.
• Google Analytics 4 (GA4): Essential for understanding user behavior and website performance.
• Ahrefs and Semrush: Premium tools for comprehensive keyword research, competitive analysis, and tracking SEO metrics.
• Screaming Frog: A robust tool for technical SEO audits.
• Stat: Useful for tracking featured snippets and other advanced SEO elements.

“Google Search Console and GA4 are a must. Third-party tools like Ahrefs and Semrush provide crucial keyword research and competitive analysis.” [16:03]

Additionally, Elliot Tsai mentions the growing role of AI tools like ChatGPT and Gemini in aiding SEO tasks such as idea generation and content creation.

“I use ChatGPT or Gemini to explore ideas and generate content briefs.” [18:27]

6. The Future of AI in SEO and Search

The discussion explores the evolving relationship between AI and SEO, particularly how AI-driven search interfaces could reshape monetization and user engagement.

“Google is thinking about integrating ad in AI overviews... Maybe in the future you will see sponsor ads in PAA or chatbox ads in AI.” [20:50]

Tyson Stockton expresses a preference for Gemini over ChatGPT, citing Google's integration efforts and the potential feedback loop benefits for SEO strategies.

“I prefer Gemini over ChatGPT because Google is integrating it into their search, which can provide feedback to improve SEO strategies.” [19:28]

7. Building Effective Partnerships Across Teams

Elliot Tsai provides practical advice for SEOs looking to collaborate more effectively with other marketing channels. He recommends:

• Scheduling one-on-one meetings with different teams to understand their workflows and challenges.
• Approaching collaborations with curiosity and a willingness to learn rather than specific demands.
• Sharing ideas and seeking input to foster mutual growth.

“Schedule one-on-ones with different teams. Ask them to share what they do and interests for mutual benefit.” [25:03]

Tyson Stockton echoes the importance of informal interactions and continuous learning to stay aligned with other marketing efforts.

“Don't do it in a group way though, because when you're in a group, people are not willing to share more stuff. It's always do one on one.” [29:43]

Conclusion

This episode of Voices of Search underscores the necessity for SEOs to adopt a collaborative and data-driven approach. By integrating SEO efforts with other marketing channels and leveraging the right tools, SEOs can create robust strategies that not only improve search rankings but also drive overall organizational growth.

Notable Quotes

• Elliot Tsai [00:43]: “Marketing channels often operate in silos. Teams rarely share valuable data, and more often than not, they end up competing against each other despite having a shared goal.”

• Tyson Stockton [06:15]: “Operate SEO like a paid channel. Everything should be revenue driven.”

• Elliot Tsai [12:07]: “We should have created this page two months ago, but it was from social listening which was clearly on their radar far before it was on the SEO team's radar.”

• Tyson Stockton [13:07]: “They already do the work for me. I copy what they post and create an article to hop on the trend at the same time.”

• Elliot Tsai [25:03]: “Schedule one-on-ones with different teams. Ask them to share what they do and interests for mutual benefit.”

Final Thoughts

Elliot Tsai and Tyson Stockton provide a roadmap for SEOs aiming to transcend traditional boundaries and harness the full potential of integrated marketing strategies. By fostering collaboration, leveraging data effectively, and staying abreast of emerging tools and trends, SEOs can drive significant and sustained growth.