← Voices of Search // A Search Engine Optimization (SEO) & Content Marketing Podcast
Voices of Search // A Search Engine Optimization (SEO) & Content Marketing Podcast
Leading When Success No Longer Fits and Creating New Paths
00:41:13
Loading summary
Transcript45 lines
- [00:00]
A
The Voices of Search Podcast is a proud member of the I Hear Everything Podcast Network. Looking to launch or scale your podcast, I Hear Everything delivers podcast production, growth and monetization solutions that transform your words into profit. Ready to give your brand a voice? Then visit iheareverything.com welcome to the Voices of Search Podcast. A member of the I Hear Everything Podcast network, ready to expedite your company's organic growth efforts. Sit back, relax, and get ready for your daily dose of search engine optimization wisdom. Here's today's host of the Voices of Search podcast, Jordan Cooney.
- [00:53]
B
Across the SEO and digital marketing industry, there's a growing sense of uncertainty. AI is changing how people discover information, how organizations think and search, and even how teams are structured. A lot of incredibly talented professionals are asking themselves difficult questions. Are my skills still relevant? Today's guest is Jennifer Doty, a speaker, executive mentor, and former Fortune 100 VP who has spent her career helping leaders navigate change, uncertainty, and transformation. After more than two decades leading customer success and partnerships inside large organizations, Jennifer has made the leap into building her own independent advisory practice focused on leadership, mindset, executive presence, and career re innovation. In this episode, we're going to dive into the mindset shifts that have happened in your career path and what you need to do to fully fit in a world around you where AI is taking control. Navigating these career transitions and industry trends is reshaping our time. Jennifer, welcome to the Voices of Search podcast.
- [01:58]
C
Thanks so much, Jordan. So happy to be here.
- [02:01]
B
I'm really pumped to have you on the show. We don't get this opportunity often to have leaders who've just been through various transitions and have seen so much in our space. Tell our listeners a little bit more about your background, what you've done accomplished in your career, and then maybe we'll dive into some of the the ways that we can face the current trends.
- [02:24]
C
Absolutely. Thanks so much. Yeah. So my career started when I chose to go to college with a major in accounting. And I didn't do that because I was passionate about it. I did it because it got me a job and qualified to be gainfully employed after college. I was the oldest of four daughters. My parents said, can you do us a favor, go get a job and don't come back because we have three more of you to figure out after this. Right. And so I started in public accounting. I did everything I needed to do, did my time to get my CPA license, which I still have to this day. And then I started, you know, moving, moving around I. I started with a couple different startups out in California where. Where I was with Deloitte, and then eventually got myself to MetLife. And I don't think anybody grows up as a young child and says, I want to go into group insurance. But that's sort of what happened to me. It was a way to get from Boston at the time to New Jersey. I thought I'd do it. I don't know, a year, 18 months. I'm like, this is a good move. It gets me physically moved. Let's see what happens. And then, Jordan, almost 20 years went by, right? So I had almost nine different roles in 20 years of varying, you know, different, different lines of business. I started in finance and the individual side. I then did some chief of staff work for some executives, for an executive in two different lines of business as the company. And what we used to say is, when you fly that close to the flame and you work with the C suite of a Fortune 100 company, boy, you learn a lot. You learn a lot about how you want to lead as a leader when you grow up and how you don't. And so that, for me, was incredible experience. And I also did some M and A work. I worked on divestitures and acquisitions. And I always note one of the biggest milestones in my career was when I took my first role, where I led with zero expertise. And that was when they asked me to take a significant leadership role in the acquisition of a large piece of aig, which was called Alico. And they asked me, of all things Jordan, to lead the IT integration. And I remember telling the senior leader who called me that day, I was in this room. I remember it was snowy. It was February. I was sitting here in this room, and I remember saying to him, steve, you do know I can turn on my laptop and call the help desk. Like, that is my. That is, like, how knowledgeable I am around technology. And he's like, you don't understand. We really need you to kind of guide the people and bring people together. And lo and behold, I learned fairly quickly that my role in that team was to bridge the gaps, bridge the gaps of people across business mindsets and technology mindsets, and how do we get people all to run in the same direction? And so once I completed that role and moved on to the next part of my career, which was in group benefits, I was much more confident to do anything that someone threw my way. And there were a lot of things, a lot of new things I had never done before. So I had many, many More times of leading with zero expertise. Right. And I think almost every role after that fell into that, into that bucket. And then I ultimately ended my career at MetLife leading all of group benefits in the US for MetLife and so had a significant job, 1400 people reporting to me. And then I got the phone call in 2021 that I had delivered so many times which was we appreciate you, thank you so much. But there's no longer a role here for you. As they eliminated my job and a bunch of other roles and I really had some soul searching to do about what my next step was going to be. Because up until that point, if you asked me who Jennifer Doty was, I would have started with my job title. I wouldn't have talked about that. I am a single mom to two kids. I wouldn't have talked about who I am as a human and a person. I would have answered with my job description. And so for me it was an amazing time to like really think about like what I wanted to do differently and how I wanted to show up, what was important to me, what my values were. And through that process I did a lot of self development, a lot of discovery and ultimately decided I wanted to do great work with great people. I also didn't want to schlep to Manhattan five days a week. Right. There were certain things that were on my non negotiable.
- [06:39]
B
Yeah.
- [06:40]
C
And for me, I found my way through a network of a network to 3 Flow, which is a startup technology platform. We work in the group insurance space for group insurance carriers and brokers to exchange data in a much more efficient way for quoting and rating. And today I lead our customer operations team. And so I say normally that's where my story would have stopped. And I would say yay, I got a job and here I am. But what's different about my story now is I've really begun to build a portfolio career. And that started last year when I had leaned into a new business on the side of my desk. It's a company called LivePure. It is nutrition and supplementation. I've consumed these products for nine years. It's all about cleansing, balancing and building your gut health from the inside out. And it really dramatically helped change my health and that of my children. And I thought, wouldn't it be cool if I got these products paid for? How hard could this be? And lo and behold, in that first month, not only were my products paid for, but I paid my monthly mortgage payment on my home in northern New Jersey of all places. And I've done it every single month since. And so now I'm super passionate about building that business, leveraging my corporate experience, experience and knowledge and skills to apply it there, and how I enjoy speaking, how I enjoy sharing experiences, how I enjoy coaching, and also leaning into speaking engagements and workshops for people and individuals to help share my experience along the way. I've written two books, this whole process, and really just help people to get unstuck and really know that if you believe your life and your career can be different, it can be different, and it can be more than one thing.
- [08:29]
B
So let's go back to part of this story, because I think there's something really valuable here for all of our listeners. And spending time at a Fortune 100 brings a collection of different challenges and experiences. But one of the things that really stood out to me about your story is this moment in time where you took over a department that you knew nothing about. Right. You're coming into a whole role where everybody who's looking at you is essentially saying, you don't know anything about what we do, and we're actually in one of those moments in time. Some people might lie to themselves and lie to everyone else and say, I know everything about AI. But very few people on this planet know exactly what's going on with AI. And most of us are going through that experience right now. What were some of the key takeaways when you transitioned into that role? What are some of the ways that you overcame that doubt of your ability to lead an IT department for a Fortune 100 company?
- [09:37]
C
Yeah, and it's so funny. It's very much like how it feels to learn how to leverage AI in this new environment. So it's a great analogy. And so in that role, what I learned to do quickly was listen a lot, be vulnerable a lot. The more vulnerable I could be, the more humble I could be about what I knew and what I didn't know. And I would often say to people, talk to me like you're explaining to your grandmother what you're doing with this project, because if I can understand it, she can understand it. Right? And so really asking people to step back and use words that I could better understand. And a process. Right. And so I did a lot of listening. I often would reach out to people and say, I need your help, because those are the most powerful words. And you're very right. Many people didn't even want me in that job because they're like, she's not a technologist. She doesn't know anything about Us. Why is she here? And I remember there were moments where I would, like, I'd get aggravated and I'd say, you know what? If you didn't need me, I wouldn't be here because I was getting more and more confident in like, what I have to bring. None of you have, otherwise I wouldn't be in this role. Right. And so helping explain that there were 25 other business teams in the integration, because the integration was run like a ship. I mean, there was a very organized program management office for the entire corporation. I mean, they ran this like it was the military. I mean, it was very process oriented. And There was one IT team and 25 business teams and no one in the business team spoke it and the IT team didn't speak business. And so I was really there to help translate like it was another foreign language. Right? Like, just translate for people. Like, this is what we're trying to do and this is what it means to you. So, yeah, those were a lot of the steps I took early on.
- [11:37]
B
And when you think about where we're at today with AI, right, it's reaching this point of inflection where it's become in many ways a universally utilized tool. Right. You're starting to see all generations use it. This isn't just some product that sits in Silicon Valley and never sees the light of day. This is being used by everyone from college students, high school students. We hear about that in the news all the time and how it's impacting education through working professionals to. You know, my parents came and visited me here in Silicon Valley and were like, hey, what is this thing? And I've been trying to use it and I really don't understand it. Why is it giving me these lies? And so, like, everyone is using AI to some extent. When, when you see transformation like this happening in an industry, when you see just a complete, you know, shift in how things are going, what's the importance of leadership in those moments of time? What were some of the things that you've seen from leaders? And what are some of the leadership traits you've adopted to help create a path forward for organizations?
- [12:50]
C
Yeah, I think in moments like this, like, I equate it to. Somebody said to me a couple months back, it's sort of probably what happened when the Internet rolled out. I mean, I was in college when that happened. Right. I mean, I remember going to a computer center to get on the Internet to, to use my AOL.com account. Right. And so think of it, you know, whatever happened, I wasn't in business in those days. But whatever happened in business when the Internet came to be is really probably very much like what's happening now with AI, right? And so the types of ways that you need to lead as a leader, it's a momentous time for a couple of reasons. One, you need to figure out how to use it by yourself, right? You need to get a team to figure out how to use it every day. And then you have to figure out how you're gonna embed it as a strategy in your business. And those are three different things. And there's a lot of feelings and emotions that go with all three of them for a variety of reasons. And I think one of the biggest things you can do as a leader is be vulnerable, is be humble. I mean, I tell my team all the time, like, I don't know how to clawed my way through this, but can somebody help? Or I will go to my Boss who's the COO of 3 Flow and be like, what do I do next? Tell me my next step. I'm sort of lost. Right? And also at the same time, encouraging people to change the way they work. Right. To create more efficiencies and to give people space for the emotions that come up with that. Things like, I don't know if my job's going to be here. Things like, I'm really frustrated. Things like, no, I didn't think to start in Claude. I thought start in a word doc, like I would have done a year ago, right? And giving people the space for. It's okay, it's not wrong, it's not bad. It's just where you are on the change curve. And it's sort of like brushing your teeth every day until it becomes routine and you don't think about it. It's sort of like, we don't think about it when we pick up our phone and check our email or check our messages, like, until it becomes routine to leverage AI, it's okay where you are. And you need to, as a leader, be supportive of people as they work through that change.
- [15:14]
B
No question. I think that's one of the fundamental things that is missing today is that humanity in the concept of AI, right? We've. We've raced so fast to think that this is a replacement technology when, in. When in practice, it is a. It is a utility technology for humans, right? We, we've gone from just the screwdriver to the drill. You know, the screwdriver still exists. It still is a used tool. The drill didn't replace it entirely. The drill can do also a lot more things than the screwdriver, but we've just evolved to being able to do that function so much better with AI. And as you're seeing this unfold, how are the leaders addressing this human need? Right. Are you seeing any behavioral changes? Are you seeing any functional changes? I mean what we hear right now in the press is cut your staff by 20%. We need to hack a whole bunch of jobs because the reality is that AI is, is more efficient at doing X, Y and Z. The word AI and efficient in the same sentence in earnings calls is about probably more popular than anything else today. And I'm wondering like that has to create a behavioral change because the impact on the day to day employees is tremendous in terms of that mind stress of like, is my job safe to your points earlier, so what are the behavioral shifts that you think we, we should be mindful of?
- [16:46]
C
Yeah. What I've coached a lot of my team and our associates around, especially at three Flow, right. Is you know, I usually level with people and I say, so here's the deal, we're probably not going to all retire from this job. You probably have many, many different stops on your career ahead of you. And why wouldn't you leverage such a beautiful moment where we have a company that has given every single person a Claude seat has asked every person to figure out how to play with Claude. How do you leverage it in your job? Where can you share best practices with your colleagues? And why wouldn't you use this opportunity to help you create a new skill? Because in your analogy with the screwdriver and the drill, before you get to the drill solves everything. People have to figure out how to use the drill. You have to figure out where you're going to point the drill. Are you going to use it on this or are you going to use it on that? Right. And so working through those opportunities with associates to say let's get you, let's help build your skill set in a resume builder way to say that you've been able to successfully leverage this type of automation in this, this and this, in what you've done and what has it resulted in, what are the outcomes that it has driven. Right. Because those are the types of things that make you more valuable as an associate, more valuable as a team player in an organization. So that's where I've tried to lean the conversation before. You're worried about if you're going to be here in, I don't know, two years, why don't we learn Something on the way, because I'm more apt to retain people who can help me figure out how to leverage AI than the people who are going to say to me, well, my job's just going to go away, so why do I bother and. And try to hold on to the old way of doing things.
- [18:49]
B
So when we were prepping for this, this podcast, right? Like, I mean, I had this whole idea and script of asking you millions of questions about group insurance and health insurance in America. These are really important things on people's minds these days, especially with the cost of everything, right? I mean, insurance is one of those that. That hasn't gone down. But in all seriousness, as you think about this need for us to be in a more functional mindset about how to transform our skills, what are the skills that you want young professionals to be thinking about? What are the traits that you've seen in this company? You've been now transitioned from a Fortune 100 into more of a startup environment. Like, what are the characteristics that you're looking in people?
- [19:46]
C
It's a great question and one we talk about all the time at our leadership team meetings, right? So one of the first one that comes to mind is, are you a driver or are you a passenger? Are you someone who has a driver mentality? Do you push forward? Do you figure out how to get things done? Are the you the person who is good at, you know, we call it, you know, are you the figure it out, able person? Can you just figure out what needs to happen and go mine your way through people and connections and data to get answers or get more questions answered, those types of things? Do you have a positive mindset? Right? And so I'm a big believer in, you know, things are going to happen every single day. But if you can put a lens on the fact that, you know, the majority of time things work out, you know, it's always happening for you. It's not happening to you, right? Can you be positive? Can you ask for help in the right moments versus put your head down and like, in the mire and be miserable about something? What else? You know, it's really about the people who can lean in to the unknown, right? And it's sort of those people where before you lead with zero expertise, there's a lot of steps along the way for somebody to take a shot and a chance on you to lead with zero expertise. You have to demonstrate that you're able to just work through the unknown and get the questions answered. Right. And that's usually what I look for. In associates. As we're looking at new roles, as we're changing roles, it's really about people's attitude and aptitude.
- [21:30]
A
Time for a one minute break to hear from our sponsor, Pre Visible. So you're looking for SEO help and you got a couple of options. You could start replying to spam from agencies that claim they can get you to rank number one on Google. You could pay an hourly rate for a consultant who will inevitably nickel and dime you with hourly charges. Or you could work with a cookie cutter agency to quickly launch a strategyless project with low success rate. None of those sound very good now do they? Well, that's where Pre Visible's integrated consulting model comes in. Pre Visible draws From a collective 40 years of SEO and digital marketing experience to unlock your organic growth opportunities. They build custom solutions that combine strategy, technical expertise, content and reporting to effectively operationalize SEO for your business. Pre Visible's four stage approach ensures that your SEO programs thrive by starting off with a strategy first approach. Then they support you in your efforts to create quality content, help you identify technical issues, and most importantly, they'll work with your cross functional teams to integrate your SEO strategies to make sure that your SEO budget actually drives results, not just your agency's bottom line. So join brands like Yelp, eBay, Canva, Atlassian Square, all who rely on the SEO consultants at Pre Visible. For more information, go to Pre Visible IO. That's Pre Visible. P R E V I S I B L E IO
- [22:58]
B
Right, Right. And this is exactly it, right? Like this concept of getting unstuck, right? Because the thing is, when there's all this change going on, there isn't that playbook, there isn't that formula. You know, you talked about the IT team that you took over and it was just like regimented like the military. And that's one of the things the military gives everybody, if you join the military is a tremendous amount of discipline and consistency in what you do every single day. And right now when it comes to doing your day to day job, there isn't that. So you need to have that forgiveness, that humility of like, hey, maybe you should have tried this differently because it was five times faster to execute this task using AI than it was to do it the old manual way in a word processing document. So this concept of getting unstuck is really one of those key areas of differentiation. And one of the things you told me that stuck with me, pun intended, is that people need to tell themselves stories that keep them going. Tell us more about that. Tell us about that technique and that strategy of telling yourself these stories to overcome that moment in time.
- [24:08]
C
Yeah. I am a big believer in 99% of the things that challenge people in the way they operate on a daily basis is the beliefs that go on between these two ears and the stories and the things that you make up. Right. And so the beautiful thing about your brain is it doesn't know if a story is true or not. It doesn't know the difference. So you could tell it. Today's gonna be a miserable day and your brain will believe it and you will see more and more things that you know make you unhappy and validate that. Or you can choose today to say, today is going to be fabulous and there is going to be wins every time I look around. And you will see more of that. Right. And so one of the things that I practice, and I say practice because it is a practice, it is not something you do once. I do this every single day and a lot more of it these days for me, right. As I'm doing more than one thing in my life and I'm building out this portfolio career, I am reframing those stories that either someone told me or I believe to be true. Things like, you really only can be successful at one thing at a time. Right. Things like you don't deserve to be able to lean into parts of your career that light you on fire and you're super passionate about. You don't deserve to make money at things you love. Right. And none of that is true. Absolutely none of that is true. And I practiced this time and time again for the last five years, personally and professionally, to create the life I want to build, the existence I want to be in, the day to day life that I want to be in. And another thing that's really important along the way is practicing gratitude. So the way, in my experience, the universe works, the more grateful you are, the more you see of the things you have. Right. And so, yes, more, please is a big statement that usually comes out of my mouth. Like, that was great. Yes, more, please. More of that. Right. And so, and then it's about taking inspired action when it shows up in your life. Because a lot of the time people have like such, you know, blinders on. They can't see these great things that are happening because they're not looking for it. And so if you can open your mind and be available and open to seeing what's possible, it will show up in your life.
- [26:29]
B
Absolutely. I think that's some super valuable lessons there for anybody who's trying to grow their career and advance in this current era. One of the concepts around gratitude and just looking at what is real versus what is these falsehoods that are often played out right now in our economy, in our. In our current ways of working in organizations, is that a lot of people feel like they've never either grown into or have outgrown their company. Right. And this is something that's very tricky because if I think about, like, three to four years ago, the whole quiet quitting moment happened, and no one ever actually grew into those companies or roles. Right. You were at a company for like a maybe a year or two, and you were off to the next role. So you never really grew into the role or the expectation. And then others have feel like they've outgrown their roles. And now we're in a moment where job transition is very hard. There's a job market that makes it difficult for you to move on, but you may feel like you've outgrown the role or the company that you're in. With your experience of nine different roles at MetLife, transitioning basically, like, into new careers in some instances through those roles, what are some of the lessons that you've gathered throughout your career around either growing into or outgrowing your company and role?
- [28:04]
C
Yeah, so the interesting part, I've outgrown roles often, and usually what has happened for me is it's happened before. I noticed it. I just said this to somebody yesterday. The shifts, it doesn't just dramatically shift overnight. And all of a sudden you wake up and you're like, this isn't for me. It happens gradually, and you don't see it because it's happening so slowly. And then all of a sudden, you wake up and you're like, for some reason, this doesn't fit anymore. And I don't know what to do about that. Right. And many times we try to convince ourselves to go back and be like, no, no, no, but I'm happy. No, no, I'm happy. I mean, it did this so many times in my career. I'm happy enough. I justify why I should stay. The salary's so good. Economically, it's great. But, like, you have to really get honest about at what cost. Right. And so I had a therapist years ago who said to me, every things are good until they're not, and when they're not, you know, you really do know. And God bless Dr. McGregor. And she. She really instilled that in me to know if it's a relationship, if it's a job. If it. Whatever it is, if it's a project, if it's a consulting arrangement, it's good until it's not. And you will know when you've had enough and it's not. You will know the moment when you're like, I am now ready to take a different step. And along the way, I think it's important to, like, get ready to be ready. Right. And so in so many roles in my life, it wasn't exactly the right time to move, Jordan. But you know what? I could spend some time to get ready. And that is a lot of what I do now. Right. And help other people think about, well, what else could you do in the meantime? How can you help? Leverage. You know, maybe you're in a job where you're like, I don't love it. I'm bored. Okay, well, good. Why don't you use that time to help create the next thing? Why wouldn't you? Right? And then when it's the moment to rip the band aid off, you will know. You will know when that time comes. And you have to trust. You have to trust your heart a lot more than your head, because your head's going to rationalize things away and say, oh, but this is fine. Just stay where you are. It's safe and stable, all those things, Right? But you have to really get quiet and listen to your soul. And your soul will tell you and will also create the. Also the environment will be created for you to make that move, meaning all the circumstances will come together. And so I like leaving that life. Like, that's one of the biggest blessings in my life. I mean, I don't know if they had not eliminated my job, Jordan, I might still be there. And so I don't know if I had the guts to move on. Right? And so one of the biggest blessings was somewhere, somehow, somebody thought I was ready to move. And it was time, and it allowed me to build the next part of my life.
- [31:19]
B
One of the things that we discussed and I think is really unique is this idea of being a Swiss army knife. And you've proclaimed that as one of your skills and as you're sharing that, it really reminds me of that concept because so many of us, we've grown up in environments, whether it's school, sports, even in sometimes, in many cases in our own homes, about becoming great at one thing. You must be really good at baseball. You must become. You're going to go and major in business or you're going to become a lawyer. And so it's such a dedication to expertise in one track. But you call yourself a Swiss army knife. And in these moments of change, why is it so important to adopt that mindset?
- [32:11]
C
And. And you know what? You know, it's so funny. It reminds me of growing up in school and I was part of the era where being well rounded mattered, right. I went to Boston College, where a well rounded individual is what they were, really was most important in making sure that graduated from their university, right? And so it's interesting because as we look at, to answer your question, as we look at where we are in this era, right? And what tools do you have in your toolkits that can help you move forward, right? Is it relationship skills? Is it negotiation skills? I leverage them every day. I mean, one of the things that I pride myself in in my current 9 to 5 job is I can call any broker or carrier and say, I see you, I see your problem. I lived your life. I sat in those seats for 20 years, and I am here to help you move it forward, right? Like, I'm here to help meet you where you are, right? And so figuring out what are those things that are part of just who you are as a human, who you are as an individual that can help you navigate that. And so for me, some of the things are, I can be a humble leader. I can be vulnerable in front of people and say when I'm wrong and say when I don't know something. I recognize people when things are hard. I name the thing that nobody wants to say in the room. I do it all the time on a zoom. People are not talking, people are miffed. This one's mad. This one, like, all right, what is it like if you don't tell me I can't fix it? And then they all get off mute and they're like this and this. And I don't like this. And I'm like, okay, well, thank you. Because now I can figure out how to move it forward for you and how to make it less frustrating, right? And so in these times of change, I think honing in to the humanity of it and making sure people know that you see them right, and really feel, like, validated. I think we all wear a sign around our neck every day that says, make me feel important today. And so if you can help someone feel like they're important in their role, their feelings are important, their concern is important, it goes a long way in gaining trust and alignment to, like, move towards the next thing.
- [34:38]
B
One of those concepts is this confidence gap. And I Want to connect two themes here. One of them is you and I both spent a majority of our careers where hallway conversations, coffee conversations, were the backbone of our career and the backbone of many of these transitions and the way in which we grew into new skills, new departments, new roles. It was that conversation that was not in a meeting room. It was not on a zoom call. And today that's very complicated. It's very complicated to figure out how do you have that hallway conversation when everybody's on a zoom call? People are all remote. And there's even hybrid scenarios where some people come in two days, in their two days, or Monday, Tuesday, and other people come in two days and their two days are Wednesday, Thursday. So you never see that coworker. You never have that opportunity. How do you build the confidence to lead in this digital footprint era where so much of our interaction, so much of our people perspective is through digital formats?
- [35:55]
C
Yeah, it's a really great question and it's really important. I also think to something you said, it's not that hard. You just have to be intentional about it. Okay. And there's this thing, it's called a cell phone and you can text on it and you can actually call people. And there's this thing called audio text, which is awesome, where somebody can hear your voice. Jordan. And so I am a huge fan of both personally and professionally. Check on people. I have probably, I don't know, 10, 12 people at 3 Flow where I'm like, there's not a week that goes by where I'm like, how you doing? You okay? And I don't do it in Slack, where it's always in a company thing. And like, sometimes it's an audio message or I send a funny picture I saw over the weekend, or I'm sending them a link to something on. In some reel on Instagram. Like, can you connect? You can use technology to connect with people differently. I mean, some of the back and forth I have with people on Instagram, like, is comical in my 9 to 5 job, right? It's like, did you see this one? That was that meeting. Did you see that? Right? You can use technology to do it, but you have to be intentional about it because it will not happen. To your point, I am on a zoom all day long. I travel for my 9 to 5 job. I don't know once a quarter where I see people irl in real life, we'd say we joke about it all the time, right? Don't really prioritize it as much. And I think in this digital Age. This is how people do work most of the time. And so making those things a priority and using this special thing called a cell phone is a very easy way to do it. I also sometimes will do audio messages via Slack so somebody can hear my voice. You know, they can hear your concern, they can hear your excitement, they can, you know, emotion matters in a lot of things and you're not going to get across as well in written words sometimes. Right. And so when you can't be face to face, that is a good way to bridge the gap.
- [38:05]
B
It's amazing. Love that advice, love the direction there. We're going to move to my favorite part of the podcast. We're going to move to what we call the lightning round. I'm going to ask you five different questions and you're going to give me a quick 30 second, maybe 60 second response to these, these questions. So are you ready?
- [38:25]
C
Ready.
- [38:27]
B
All right, let's dive in. What's the biggest mistake leaders are making as their companies start to take on AI?
- [38:36]
C
Not stepping back and thinking about how to leverage AI as a strategy in the business. Awesome.
- [38:42]
B
Okay, how about one sentence you'd tell a mid level career professional about jumping into a senior leader role?
- [38:52]
C
If you weren't qualified, they wouldn't have offered it to you.
- [38:55]
B
Tell me more about that. What is it about? What is it about the courage to take something on even though you might not think you're ready for it?
- [39:02]
C
I think it kind of goes back to like that moment for me where I led with zero expertise. Right. And I've coached a bunch of people through it in the last couple of years, right. Where there's this sense of overwhelm, right. When you don't know everything. And so when you move into a senior leadership role, you are expected to be less of a doer and more of a leader. And as a leader, that means you have the people on the team who, who know all the gory details. It's no longer your job anymore to like do it all. And that can be very anxiety producing for many people because they don't know it themselves. And it is a new muscle. You need to learn to be confident in a meeting with your executive team peers and say, yeah, I have no idea, I gotta go ask somebody. All right, cool. And not like have a heart attack about that being your answer. Right. Kind of thing. So I think that's having the confidence to know, you know, people wouldn't ask for you to be put into a job or wouldn't, wouldn't hire you into A role if they thought you weren't qualified to do it. And nobody expects you at a senior leadership role to know everything.
- [40:12]
B
What is the essential digital trait to connecting with your coworkers in 2026?
- [40:21]
C
Say more. When you mean digital trait, what do you mean by digital trait?
- [40:24]
B
Like, we talked a lot about, like using voice memos and like kind of finding all those ways to connect with people that isn't just like the hallway conversation, but that's now digital. Right. So that's, that's where I was going with that question.
- [40:36]
C
So, yeah, it's be human when you write, like, be human in how you text.
- [40:42]
B
Yes.
- [40:42]
C
Throw a joke in once in a while. Self deprecate once in a while. It's okay.
- [40:46]
B
Yeah, right? Yeah, I find it funny. I appreciate emails today that have typos in them. Just like, you know what, this person definitely wrote this email.
- [40:58]
C
And I love that, you know, that was an AI.
- [41:01]
B
Yeah, exactly, exactly, exactly. All right, so what is the best way to tell someone that they need to either grow into or have outgrown their role?
- [41:13]
C
I often start by asking them questions. And so instead of it being words that feelings and thoughts, in my opinion, I ask them questions about how they're feeling in this role. What do they aspire to do? How does this align to what their goals are? Because usually if you start asking questions, they answer it for themselves.
- [41:40]
B
We talked about listening to yourself. What's the best approach to listening to yourself when there's so much noise in this world?
- [41:50]
C
Yeah, I have to practice this every day. You have to get really quiet. And that means no phone, no technology, no music. Go outside if you can, go for a 10 minute walk if you can, and be really quiet because meditate if you can. You know, I figured I figured out years ago how to teach myself to meditate and be quiet. You can meditate. You will hear your own answers quickly.
- [42:17]
B
Okay, that wraps this episode of the Voices search podcast. Thanks to Jennifer Doty, speaker, author and executive mentor. If you'd like to contact Jennifer, you can find a link to her LinkedIn profile in our show notes or on the voicesofsearch.com. you can also visit her personal website, jenniferdody.com if you haven't subscribed yet. Want a daily stream of SEO and content marketing knowledge in your podcast feed? Hit the subscribe button in your podcast app or on YouTube and we'll be back in your feed every week. Okay, that's all for today, but until next time, remember, the answers are always in the data.