Nothing Like a New MacBook!

Summary

Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast

Episode: "Nothing Like a New MacBook!"

Date: March 6, 2026
Host: Marques Brownlee (MKBHD)
Co-hosts: Andrew Manganelli, David Imel, (with appearances from Adam Molina and Ellis River)

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Episode Overview

This week, the Waveform squad reconvenes during a jam-packed “Tech Timber” (jokingly rebranded as "Tarch" for March) after a flood of major tech announcements from Apple and Nothing. The team delivers deep-dive commentary on a broad array of new Apple hardware, Nothing’s latest phones and headphones, and discusses the shifting landscape for reviewers in the age of AI. They dissect product strategy, pricing, design trends, and the broader implications for the tech ecosystem.

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Key Topics & Detailed Breakdown

1. Apple Event Recap: MacBooks, Displays, iPhone 17e & More

(06:00 – 18:30)

MacBook Air & Pro Updates

• New M5 MacBook Air: Now starts with 512GB storage (doubling the previous base model), up to 4TB, Wi-Fi 7, Bluetooth 6, and slightly higher price (+$100 compared to base M4 Air) but $100 cheaper for the 512GB storage tier.
  • "It's the MacBook Air, but with M5. And Wi-Fi 7." – Marques (06:33)
• M5 Pro & M5 Max MacBook Pros: Announced as more powerful for AI tasks and video editing.
  • "Way better GPU, 4x peak GPU compared to M4 Max." – David (07:13)
• Missing M5 Ultra: The team notes Apple’s pattern with Ultra chips.
  • "Only three Ultra so far." – Marques (08:00)

Studio Display & XDR

• New Studio Display: Minor upgrade, new Thunderbolt port, otherwise similar for $1,600.
  • "The new studio display is a little underwhelming..." – Marques (09:07)
• Studio Display XDR: Replaces Pro Display XDR, now $3,200 (down from $5,000+stand), 5K 27”, 2000 nits, miniLED, 120Hz, daisy-chaining enabled.
  • "Way cheaper and a better display in just about every way." – Marques (09:42)
  • "120 Hz is pretty crazy to be able to do that on these displays." – David (10:30)

iPhone 17e: Redefining the ‘Value’ iPhone

• "Last year’s 16e was a $600 iPhone with a 60Hz display, no MagSafe, one camera – the worst of all worlds." – Marques (13:57)
• This year: Now has MagSafe, new color (pink), latest chip, 256GB storage, Ceramic Shield 2, but still single camera and 60Hz display for $599.
  • "They stuck with a single camera and the 60 Hz display..." – Marques (15:16)
• Discussion around whether consumers actually want 120Hz/screens, multiple cameras, or just the iPhone “ecosystem.”
  • "Lots of people will just buy this phone. ...If you cross-shop a little bit, you can get 120Hz OLED, probably triple cameras.” – Marques (15:31)
  • "For a lot of these, the better one from last year is a better deal. People should get in the habit of looking at used and refurbished." – David (16:03)

MacBook Neo: A New Kind of Entry MacBook

• $599, 13” display, A18 Pro chip from the iPhone, 8GB RAM, 256GB, 4 colors, metal build, cost-cutting features (non-backlit keyboard, 2 USB-C ports – one USB3, one USB2), side-firing speakers, white/tinted keyboards.
  • "It’s a web browser. It’s spreadsheets, word processing, texting... It’s going to kill it at all that." – Marques (24:46)
  • "This is the Safari Book." – Adam (26:29)
  • "I have to get these ..." (regarding Studio Display XDR) – Marques (10:26)
• Prioritizing students, schools, and budget-conscious buyers.
  • "If a parent walks into Best Buy and sees three laptops and an iPad that are all $600, they’re buying the Neo..." – Ellis (36:39)
  • Education pricing brings Neo down to $499.
• Discussion of performance envelope, battery efficiency, and intended use-case.
  • "You can run Mac OS on these phone chips? They just choose not to for sure..." – Ellis (28:07)

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2. Nothing’s New Devices: Phones & Headphones

(48:37 – 83:53)

Nothing Phone 4A and 4A Pro

• 4A: Snapdragon 7S Gen 4, 5080mAh, 50W charging, IP64, 120Hz, four colors, “arguably best-looking Nothing phone” so far, focus on value/performance.
  • "It's got triple cameras. ...A pretty good looking set of specs for a phone that is this cheap." – Marques (50:49)
• 4A Pro: Surprise launch, Snapdragon 7 Gen 4, 6.83" AMOLED 120-144Hz, metal body, larger glyph interface, all-new camera bump design.
  • "The silver version of this phone is the best looking..." – Marques (58:39)
  • "Metal body is pretty awesome." – David (58:41)
• Pricing and market strategy:
  • 4A Pro is $499 (US), competitive with Pixel 10a.
  • "I think it looks pretty good. The Nothing design team has been really cooking recently." – Marques (61:04)
• Ongoing jokes about product naming confusion and nerdy market segmentation.

Headphones A

• “Nothing” also introduces Headphones A ($199), with distinctive design, ANC, long battery claims (up to 135 hours, but context-dependent as always).
  • "These, in my opinion, look significantly worse than the regular headphones." – David (65:14)
• Panel hosts hotly debate over-ear headphone design, aesthetics, battery, and sound quality.
  • "I find myself recommending the Nothing headphones more than most other things … and no one wants the Nothing." – Adam (73:43)
• Debate on the state of the headphone market, value vs. style, and whether Sony’s flagship headphones have lost their way.
  • "The Sony’s are so mid-forward and they have so much distortion in the mids … it's the equivalent of rubbing Vaseline on a lens." – Adam (72:14)
• On audio preferences:
  • "The best headphones are the ones that you like." – Adam (79:53)

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3. The AI Era: Website Monetization & the Death of SEO

(86:10 – 104:11)

• Ratings.com paywall: Ratings (RTings) moves formerly-free, in-depth testing behind a $10/month or $45/year paywall due to AI scraping and collapsing Google search referrals.
  • "AI actively scrapes and reuses our test results, often without attribution and without the context needed to interpret them correctly." – Andrew reading from Ratings' announcement (87:41)
• Broader industry point: Tech traffic is collapsing everywhere after AI overviews.
  • "This is part of the inevitable death of SEO and the web..." – David (88:34)
  • "The incentive to make good stuff is gone now. Why would you make any more stuff?" – Marques (90:00)
  • "The entire corpus of human knowledge is complete. We need nothing new. We'll just be trained on the old stuff." – Marques, on AI’s mistaken premise (91:05)
• Trend to subscription models, value of support, and ripple effects on journalism, news, and reviewing culture.
  • "If you’re willing to subscribe to Netflix ... think about the quality of your content consumption and what actually matters to you." – David (104:05)

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4. Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Apple’s storage upgrades:
  • "Now you have to start at a terabyte. That's wild to me." – Marques (08:35)
• On minimal changes to Studio Display:
  • "The new studio display is a little underwhelming ... just added a Thunderbolt port." – Marques (09:07)
• On the iPhone 17e target audience:
  • "If you’re subscribed to tech channels, this isn't for you. ... This is for people who walk in and say, 'Give me the cheap one, I don’t care.'" – Ellis (16:31)
• Color debates:
  • "Regular people will buy a color, schools will buy a thousand of the silver ones." – Ellis (23:37)
• On AI disruption:
  • "It so fundamentally removes the incentives to make good stuff." – Marques (90:00)
• On headphones A’s look:
  • "The yellow and pink ones... I like the colors, but I do not like the headphones. They look so bad." – Ellis (67:32)

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5. Engaging Moments & In-Jokes

• Lengthy, impassioned (and sometimes heated) debate over over-ear headphones – especially Sony’s latest.
• Running jokes about MacBook Neo colors, specifically over "piss yellow" and lemon-lime Gatorade.
• Deep-dive on how educational discounts work, nostalgia about old-school classroom tech (overhead projectors, “smart” boards).
• Fun trivia segment: How many tech products feature "Neo" in the name? And the team's struggle to recall various obscure products.

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6. Notable Timestamps

• Apple event reactions: 06:00 – 18:30
• iPhone 17e analysis: 13:45 – 18:30
• MacBook Neo panel debate: 18:22 – 36:56
• Nothing phones & headphones, design talk: 48:37 – 83:53
• Ratings.com and AI impact: 86:10 – 104:11
• Headphone ranking debate: 64:10 – 79:20
• Trivia question (Neo products): 104:55 – 108:59

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Conclusion & Takeaways

This episode is a snapshot of a rapidly-evolving tech landscape:

• Apple and Nothing are both iterating quickly, shifting the baseline of what’s expected in both premium and value segments.
• There’s an increasing separation between device value-adds for the mainstream market (e.g., MacBook Neo, iPhone 17e) and “enthusiast” expectations.
• The tech creator ecosystem is fundamentally challenged by the rise of AI, with publishers and reviewers reevaluating their business models amidst declining referral traffic.
• The crew’s in-depth, candid, and sometimes irreverent discussions continue to offer genuine insight—for both diehards and casual listeners navigating product choices.

Listen if you want:

• Analysis of Apple’s 2026 spring hardware launches from a user and reviewer perspective
• Real talk on buying tech in the age of AI, with practical advice on value, longevity, and resale
• Lively, funny, sometimes spicy debates on headphones, display tech, and product naming
• Thoughtful commentary on what’s at stake for trustworthy product reviews in an AI-summarized world

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Final Words:
"It's Tech Timber / March, so there's probably gonna be a bunch of stuff next week, too. Get subscribed if you haven't already. Iceberg lettuce if you made it this far in the episode." – Marques (110:14)

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(Skip all the ads, banter about Gatorade flavors, and sign off chatter—unless you're here for the vibes!)

Transcript

[Marques Brownlee]

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[Andrew]

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[Marques Brownlee]

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[Andrew]

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[Marques Brownlee]

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[Andrew]

So go build your dream team today with Indeed. Get a $75 sponsored job credit@ Indeed.com podcast. Terms and conditions apply. 460. 4 60.

[Marques Brownlee]

The mark. 6.

[David]

Yeah. Remember they went up.

[Adam Molina]

Do you see what I'm saying?

[David]

They went up in price this year like 4, 6. Yeah, they're hella expensive for headphones that

[Adam Molina]

sound like the music is coming out of a bee's hole.

[Marques Brownlee]

I remember when they were like 330,

[Andrew]

then they were like the folly for that. That is not what they sound like.

[Adam Molina]

That's like that.

[Marques Brownlee]

I'm six feet from.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yo, what is up, people of the Internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marques.

[Andrew]

I'm Andrew.

[David]

I'm David.

[Marques Brownlee]

And welcome to Tech Timber. Everything is happening. Wait a second, hold on.

[Adam Molina]

Oh, it's Tarch.

[David]

Hold on.

[Marques Brownlee]

It's March. It's not.

[Andrew]

It's Tarchano's been trying to get Tarch going.

[Marques Brownlee]

Tech.

[David]

It's the start of Tarch.

[Ellis River]

We don't claim Tarch. I don't know what you're talking about.

[Marques Brownlee]

Neck. No,

[Andrew]

it's like Christmas in July. But Tech Timber and March.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, it's a lot. We've got. So we're working on the S26 Ultra review and then Apple drops six new products. Nothing. Drops three new products and suddenly we just have a lot on our plate. And also we gotta talk a little bit more about AI and how it's affecting reviews. So this might be a six hour episode is what I'M trying to say.

[Andrew]

And we're shooting it because it's Thursday.

[Marques Brownlee]

We're shooting it on Thursday.

[David]

Don't threaten me with a good time. Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

Make sure you get subscribed, because we have a lot to talk about. So if we don't get to all of it this week, we'll probably get to more of it next week. Yeah.

[Andrew]

But first, I'm waiting.

[Adam Molina]

I was going to take it in.

[Andrew]

Did they even test this? Apparently this has already gone outside of this room and Olivia has something she wanted to add. So Adam will be her surrogate. Surrogate, right. Yeah.

[Ellis River]

Olivia and Michael were doing graphics for us because we asked for specific graphics for the channel. You might actually be seeing them on this episode. So YouTube viewers, let me know how.

[David]

How you like them.

[Adam Molina]

Is this the thing that happened yesterday?

[Ellis River]

Yes, it's. So they've been working with an app called Apple Motion, which is their version of After Effects, because they were like, you know, the team kind of works in Final Cut, yet Marques is like,

[Andrew]

you could call it that. That's what they want.

[Ellis River]

They're doing this for our benefit because we work in Final Cut mostly, and they're like, you know what? All our graphics we make in After Effects. Let's see if we can, like, learn this other program. It'll be easy to drop, drag and drop into Final Cut. Like, it' simple. Olivia ran into this weird problem where she had this template that it was popping like a spec up on the screen, and then she would go do other things, come back, and it would just be like, slightly off to the right. And she's like, this is so weird. And she's, like, working on this for, like, the past week. And every time she has to keep moving it back, she's like, why does this keep happening? Then she, like, talks to Michael about it, and Michael's like, I figured out what happens is every time she hits save, it increments the X position by one.

[Andrew]

What?

[Ellis River]

Yeah. So she has it set at zero

[Marques Brownlee]

in a graphics app.

[Andrew]

No.

[Adam Molina]

And so the solution they came up with is she just has to remember every time she hits command S to move that asset to negative one on the X axis. And then when it saves, it reverts to zero.

[David]

What the heck?

[Marques Brownlee]

That's real.

[Andrew]

That's not so funny.

[Adam Molina]

It's so funny. That makes me not trust computers.

[Marques Brownlee]

That would be like if in Microsoft Word, every time you hit save, it added a dash to wherever your cursor is.

[Adam Molina]

It makes me afraid to save, which is the one thing I should not be afraid to do.

[Marques Brownlee]

Does motion have not autosave like Final Cut?

[Ellis River]

I do not know.

[Marques Brownlee]

I should because that might be a habit you can drop by switching to motion. I remember when I was in premiere, I would automatically save every time I could because if it crashed, it would just forget everything I did for the last 12 minutes. But when I switched to Final Cut Pro, it could crash and I would bring it back and it would remember it. It would actually start trying to do the thing that made it crash again. Like it was that recent of a memory. So I wonder if the move is to stop command s ing and stop saving.

[Ellis River]

Maybe I'll ask her. I'll see if that's a little life hack.

[Marques Brownlee]

Super weird, bro.

[David]

Just tell Claude to One Shot this

[Adam Molina]

app to One Shot Apple Motion.

[David]

We don't need Apple's software. We can just make it.

[Andrew]

I wonder if it's a weird shortcut thing that's happening. I don't know that maybe. That's so weird. I can't believe Michael found it out. That's really impressive.

[Marques Brownlee]

But yeah, well, he's an after effects guy, so he's command s all.

[Andrew]

Now when she does want to move it one, she'll just be like command S S s s s s. It's like 10 spaces over.

[David]

least she's saving it, making sure it doesn't crash.

[Marques Brownlee]

I have a great segue because the. The video that Apple played for the beginning of their event and that's now on their YouTube channel, was really, really good. Which is why I'm so sure they didn't use motion.

[David]

So good.

[Marques Brownlee]

It's really good.

[David]

It's really good.

[Marques Brownlee]

So Apple dropped a little. We. We'd had a week long. We haven't talked about any of this. So we had Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. Yeah, Monday we got iPhone 17e, if I'm remembering correctly. Tuesday we got MacBook Pro M5 Pro M5 Max.

[David]

Oh, Tuesday.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. Yeah. And studio display. And Studio Display XDR.

[David]

Monday we also got iPad Air with M4.

[Marques Brownlee]

Oh, I forgot about those. Yeah.

[David]

I mean, it's been a week.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

And there's new crossbody strap colors.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, two of them.

[David]

Cool. Yeah. And then we also got the Seuss. And then Wednesday we got the.

[Marques Brownlee]

And then Wednesday we got MacBook.

[David]

Oh, wait. Tuesday we also got the M5 MacBook Air.

[Marques Brownlee]

Oh, did we?

[David]

Yes. I know. Yeah. The things that just got spec bumps are obviously less interesting.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, I feel like we can skip those pretty quick. M5 MacBook Air. It's the MacBook Air, but with M5.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

And Wi Fi 7.

[Andrew]

Okay, wait, let me touch this.

[David]

There's other things.

[Andrew]

Oh, okay, nevermind.

[David]

I mean, it's mostly just like they started at 512 gigs of base storage. Now sure, that's pretty awesome. And it goes up to 4 TB instead of 2.2x faster read and write speeds, which is pretty awesome. Supports Wi Fi 7 and Bluetooth 6. $100 more expensive than the base M4 Air. So that's not great, but at least it starts at double the storage.

[Andrew]

Can I. Well, sorry, and you may have kind of answered that, but I missed it.

[Marques Brownlee]

Okay.

[Andrew]

It's 512 base storage, but the price has gone up.

[David]

Yes.

[Andrew]

Is it the same price as the old 512?

[David]

It's 100%. So it is more expensive than the baseline M4, but for the same storage tier, it's actually a hundred dollars cheaper than you would have gotten on the M4 MacBook Air.

[Andrew]

Good.

[David]

So it is like a better deal. And for a lot of people the MacBook Air is going to be the better option anyway. Which we will get to the. The Neo in a bit. Um, but yeah, and then like you said M5 Pro and M5 Max MacBook Pros, that's kind of a big deal. Cuz we didn't have M5 Pro or M5 Max of anything yet. Right. So those are going to be way better for AI tasks, et cetera. They also have video editing. Video editing. They have way better GPU 4x peak GPU compared to M4 Max, which is pretty insane.

[Marques Brownlee]

Where's the M5 Ultra, man?

[David]

I know, even M4. Yeah, they don't love the ultras. They've only released a couple of those.

[Marques Brownlee]

Only three ultra so far.

[David]

Yeah. Up to 614 gigabytes per second. Up to 128 gigabytes of unified memory in the M5 Max. Pretty crazy stuff. It's ironic that they're releasing these now because people again were saying that in November or so they're gonna release the M6 series because of the touchscreen MacBooks that are gonna come out. Yeah, but it was funny how everyone was speculating that these were gonna be the touchscreen MacBooks because of the animation that they released, which was like the pinching of the Apple logo.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, that was funny. Yeah.

[David]

And I just went on a tirade on Twitter being like, no, it's the cheap one.

[Andrew]

It's the cheap one.

[Marques Brownlee]

Also, they started a terabyte now, which makes me feel kind of old because a laptop starting at a terabyte storage.

[David]

That used to be the top tier model.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. That used to be like you could get a terabyte. Now it's. You have to start at a terabyte. That's wild to me.

[David]

Do you wanna talk about the displays on the M5S? No.

[Marques Brownlee]

MacBook Pros. Oh, the studio displays. Studio displays, yeah. Okay, so two new displays. They have a new studio display and a new studio display. Xdr, which is fancy and has sparkles around,

[David]

is a new technology.

[Marques Brownlee]

The new studio display is a little underwhelming. It's still like $1,600. It's still 60 hertz. I think essentially what they did was add a Thunderbolt port and it's. Yeah, they didn't really do a whole lot else to it. But the Studio display XDR replaces the Pro display. Xdr.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

And it's significantly cheaper. And here's the difference.

[David]

So I.

[Andrew]

That's a really nice way of putting. It's $3,200.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, yeah.

[David]

Instead of 5,000.

[Marques Brownlee]

No, this is a. Well, okay, so this is a thing that happens with Apple a lot, which is we go look how much better it is than last time. Because last time was like horribly overpriced

[David]

what we're doing with the 17e as well.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, exactly. So it's like the Pro display was $5,000 plus $1,000 stand and $1,000 nano texture. So yeah, this is significantly cheaper. But this is also a better display in just about every single way. The only thing that I will miss when I inevitably get two of these is 6k and 32 inch because these are both now 5k 27 inch displays, but they are I think now 2000 nits peak brightness. They're mini LED instead of the backlight in the Pro displays, which I think is just a bunch of backlight zones instead of mini LED. So yeah, 5K 27 inch, 120Hz and very exciting. And also you can daisy chain them because they have a Thunderbolt extra Thunderbolt port, which is sick.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

So I think I have to get these.

[David]

I'm excited for what the mini LED ends up looking like. There's 2,304 dimming zones which are supposed to have even better contrast levels, which is very nice. And 120 hertz is pretty crazy to be able to do that on these displays. Now obviously we've had gaming displays for a long time and there's like pro art, there's like all these high end displays. But the reason people always end up buying these even Though that they're a bad deal is just because of the seamless integration where you can just plug it in and it just works and all that stuff.

[Marques Brownlee]

That is probably the top of the list. The second thing on the list is probably color accuracy and being able to depend. There's a ton of reference modes in here. Like this is actually still going to be a very good display. I kind of wonder how it'll look next to a Pro display or how comparable they will be. Ideally they're very, very similar. But yeah, I think, I think these are actually a really good display. And the fact that they're $2,000 cheaper makes it look good compared to a Pro display, which is obviously why you should never buy a Pro display again and they're discontinued.

[Andrew]

That's gonna be a pretty significant lack of real estate you're going to lose when you're 2xing this now, putting them next to each other, you're losing a lot of space. It would be way easier to have made your replica desk if I could have done 27 inch 5K monitors.

[David]

Well, maybe now on the replica desk you can just buy used Pro Display XDRs because those are going to be cheaper.

[Marques Brownlee]

You don't have to buy the xdr, you should just buy the Studio display.

[David]

Well, but the Pro display XDR might be like the same price than they use now, you know.

[Marques Brownlee]

Oh, you think use the price?

[Andrew]

You don't think it goes up?

[David]

I mean it won't be that low, but I don't know.

[Andrew]

You don't think they go up for people who want still 6K?

[Marques Brownlee]

The 6K Apple display is now going to be like no more production, it's limited edition.

[David]

I think people are interested in the mini led.

[Andrew]

I totally agree with that. And the refresh rate. Now the only 6K 32 inch cheese grater monitor you can get is that weirdo knockoff that we got for the replica video. If you have on the studio video.

[David]

Yeah. Also the xdr model, the 27 inch does charge at 140 watts. So you can plug in the full 16 inch MacBook Pro. The other one that is not. The xdr model charges at 96, which is I believe the charging speed of the 14 inch MacBook Pro.

[Marques Brownlee]

Right?

[David]

Yeah, or something like that. And so that, I mean that kind of shows what Apple like who Apple thinks is going to buy these? They think the mini LED ones, they're gonna be the hardcore workstation MacBook Pros. Whereas the smaller, well, not smaller, the cheaper one is going to be the lighter MacBook Pro.

[Marques Brownlee]

But, you know, my summary is the regular studio display is not that great of a deal. Please crush up a bunch of stuff. The Pro display, the Studio display XDR is kind of one of one again.

[David]

Yeah, it's.

[Andrew]

I feel like it's not going to be adding much to people who are like the people who bought Pro Display XDR previously. Now this is just what you buy instead. And it's not going to be like just because it's cheaper. I don't think it's going to gain that many more users.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, I think it's. If you today were thinking about buying a protest play XDR and then this comes out, it's like, oh, thank God I don't have to buy a pro display because that was going to be way more expensive for essentially 2 extra inches of screen or 5 or whatever. But this is way cheaper and a better display.

[David]

120Hz is pretty nice though.

[Marques Brownlee]

That's really what I'm most excited about, to be honest.

[David]

Yeah. Yeah, that's pretty good.

[Andrew]

You're going to rock and see us too.

[Marques Brownlee]

I'm going to edit three videos and it's going to be great.

[David]

Yeah. Okay, we got to talk about the iPhone 17e.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

So obviously last year review was called like who is this for? Or something like that. Because it just didn't make any sense at all.

[Marques Brownlee]

It was a $600 iPhone with a 60Hz display with no MagSafe.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

One camera. And with a single camera, which is

[David]

the worst of all worlds.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

And also last year was the year that they started making the base iPhone like really good. So it just made even less sense.

[Marques Brownlee]

I reviewed a $900 iPhone 16e.

[David]

Why would they give you the top model $900? Nobody is going to buy the top model.

[Marques Brownlee]

You can get all of the phone for $900.

[David]

That's insane.

[Marques Brownlee]

So, okay, now we. One year later and what did they change?

[Andrew]

There's like two ways this could have gone. Either it stays exactly the same or is horrible, or its best is we get what the 16E should have been.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think that's what we got.

[Andrew]

And I think that's what we got.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think that's what we got. It has MagSafe now. Yeah, it has one more color. So it was black and white. Now there's black, white and pink. I don't know if anyone's asking for

[David]

pink, but everyone's doing pink this year, I swear.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. And it has the newest chip and it doubles up to 256 gigs of storage again. And it's still the same 599 price.

[David]

And ceramic shield 2.

[Marques Brownlee]

And ceramic shield 2, which a lot of people are very excited about.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

So C1X chip may be underrated, but it's in there too. It's their newest, highest end modem cellular wireless chip. Yeah. So that may end up being like the most high end thing in here alongside the processor.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

But I think what's really interesting is they stuck with a single camera and they stuck with the same exact Design and the 60Hz display on the front. Yeah. So now the question is just how much do you care about a single camera and a 60Hz display? Lots of people don't, clearly.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

And lots of people will just buy this phone. I find it still a little crazy that if you cross shop a little bit for 600 bucks, you can get 120Hz OLED. You could get dual, probably triple cameras. But a lot of people don't want the Android thing.

[David]

I'd rather buy a standard 16 refurbished for probably cheaper than this, than the 17E.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. I wonder if there's refurbished 17s already that are cheaper, that are like 600 bucks.

[David]

Probably not that. Probably not that cheap yet, but 16s definitely.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

Yeah. I think, I mean, a lot of these things that we're going to talk about today, it's like if you're willing to buy used or refurbished, the. The better one from last year is a better deal. And I think that people should get into the habit of looking at used and refurbished things before they buy the new thing. Especially because we're getting such incremental upgrades every year.

[Andrew]

I was gonna say not even everything we talk about today, every phone almost

[David]

when we talk about it. Because a lot of people are talking about the refurbished MacBook Air from last year.

[Ellis River]

Well, I was going to say that going off of how Marquez started his video is like, if you're listening to this, if you're like one of our. Like if you're subscribed to tech channels, you just. This isn't for you. Just like get the regular iPhone 17 or an old like air or like refurbished, like do. Do that. Because this is not for the people that are aware of. Of this.

[David]

Yeah.

[Ellis River]

This is like you walk into a store and you're like, give me the cheap one. I don't care.

[Marques Brownlee]

Whatever.

[Ellis River]

Like those people, they're going to get.

[Marques Brownlee]

But it's got to have imessage because my nieces and nephews have imessage.

[Ellis River]

Like I don't the same Thing with the, with the new computer, like, I don't care what's the cheap one. Like, that's, that's who this is for.

[Andrew]

At least this year they get a decent phone. Like a phone that makes sense in the lineup where last year it felt like they were getting scammed.

[David]

Not having MagSafe was like a big L. And then like they're kind of mogging Google with the storage right now.

[Ellis River]

I'm going to.

[Andrew]

I don't know what mo but get mogged Pixel.

[David]

Alyssa Lu said it so I can see it.

[Marques Brownlee]

They are storage mogging. Yes.

[Adam Molina]

Apple frame mogs.

[David]

Google in Miami Club Google with a massive cortisol spike.

[Adam Molina]

Google launched after being frame mogged by chad Apple.

[Marques Brownlee]

Google's 10a has 128 gigs of storage again. So, yeah. So, yeah, if the 11 comes out, I'm assuming that'll be 256 base.

[David]

It's got to be.

[Andrew]

This just has to be. You're right, because now they did the. It's got to be, dude, 17 over the pixel 10 doubled storage, same price, and now they did it for the cheap versions on both. This just feels like they're picking on Google at this point. Yeah, they deserve to get Google.

[David]

Well, yeah, Apple's getting to the point where they're like not releasing anything with 128gigs of storage anymore. Because when we get to the Neo starts at 256 as well. Like there's not a lot of 128 left in the Apple ecosystem. Google's got to catch up, otherwise they're going to have a lot of cortisol this summer.

[Andrew]

I know you're watching. I know you are. I know you've heard us.

[Marques Brownlee]

You can delete that comment and just get to work on the phone. All right. There's one more thing that Apple announced and it was the final thing that they saved for Wednesday, which is a MacBook Neo. New name, cool name. We've never heard that word from Apple before. We thought it would just be the MacBook. So MacBook Neo is a flat $599 MacBook. It's a 13 inch display. It's powered by an A18 Pro chip. So not quite APO Silicon M series chip, but that was the chip that was in the iPhone 16 Pro and it seems to be right around the level of performance of M1. Probably a little better in single core, a little worse in multi core. But anyway, a 18 Pro inside 8 gigs of RAM, 256 gigs of storage and 4 colors. It's incredibly inexpensive. And so they've done all the things they have to do to get a MacBook, which is still made of metal all the way down. Like, the keyboard's not backlit anymore. It's only two ports. Both are USB type C. One of them is USB 3, one of them is USB 2.

[David]

And they're not labeled.

[Marques Brownlee]

And they're not labeled. The back one is USB 3. The front one's USB 2. You probably figure that out sooner or later.

[Andrew]

I don't know if people will, bro. I don't think they.

[Adam Molina]

I don't think they.

[Marques Brownlee]

Or you just don't care if you

[Andrew]

figured it out, you shouldn't be buying this.

[David]

I think most people are just using these ports to charge and not using

[Marques Brownlee]

them for one to charge. One to plug something in, a mouse, a keyboard, some random factory.

[David]

But I don't know. Everything is wireless now.

[Marques Brownlee]

It's true.

[David]

Because this is for people that are doing every. It's the. Like you said. You guys both said this. The Safari book, Right. So, like, people are using online services almost exclusively with this computer. So, like, why plug anything in except for charging it?

[Marques Brownlee]

That's totally true. Yeah. What else is true? Oh, so the keyboard. Yeah. Not backlit. And the trackpad is not a force touch trackpad. It's an actual clicking trackpad and it's a little bit smaller.

[David]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

You said it felt good, though.

[Marques Brownlee]

It felt good. Felt totally fine. No issues with that at all. And the last thing I noticed is the keyboards were white and they had. So on the side, they had, like, moved the speakers to the side of the laptop.

[David]

Side firing.

[Marques Brownlee]

Like, side firing. I got a couple demos to listen to them. They do not sound good. That's okay. They're just baseline at laptop speakers at this point.

[Andrew]

Wait, before you move on, this is something I want to clarify on here because I asked you this question I was reading in the review before you even got back or what you were writing, and you say all the keyboards are white, but like, on the picture, they look tinted. They're tinted. But like, on apple.com, they look, like, colorful. Very colorful. And then I did see some of your footage. You said the lighting wasn't great, but, like, it seems like they're closer to white.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. So they're. They're. Yeah. To. To be fair, I think apple.com pumps the color a little bit. I think they look light and tinted. So on the indigo laptop, for example, the keyboard looks light, light, light, light, light, light blue. Close to white, not quite white.

[Andrew]

On the website Looks like dark purple almost.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, it looks dark purple. Yeah. It's not quite that tint.

[David]

So it's like La Croix Blue.

[Marques Brownlee]

A breath of exactly.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

Just a tiny bit.

[David]

A truck passed by with a blue in it.

[Marques Brownlee]

Somebody whispered blue at the factory.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. So slightly matching keyboards and even, like, matching wallpapers and UI elements by default, out of box. So, like, on the yellow laptop, the menu items are yellow, and the keyboard's slightly yellow. And it's like. Okay, you got the citrus theme.

[Andrew]

I love the citrus.

[Marques Brownlee]

Are you into citrus? I was thinking about that. They asked me, what's your favorite color? There's citrus. There's. That's the yellow one. There's indigo, which is the blue. Dark blue one. Then there's the pink one, which I think is called blush. And then there's silver.

[Ellis River]

Andrew, what's with you in piss Colored tech?

[Andrew]

Whoa. Yellow. I do like yellow a lot.

[David]

It's pissed.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, they got them on the.

[Andrew]

It looks good also. I just thought, where's Project Red?

[David]

Oh, yeah, that would cool. The red would be sick. Yeah, Red.

[Marques Brownlee]

I don't know.

[Adam Molina]

In product red.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

In all the videos. I know the lighting was kind of. Yeah, the piss one looks like. Kind of. It looks like neon green.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. Because the lighting, it's so tough in person. It's giving lemon. Lime.

[David]

It's giving lemon.

[Andrew]

Like the Gatorade. Yeah, it's like the best Gatorade flavor.

[Marques Brownlee]

So, like, a tiny bit of green, but not really. It's mostly yellow.

[Andrew]

Haters.

[Marques Brownlee]

It's mostly yellow. It's my favorite flavor. Gatorade. I don't want to hear that.

[Andrew]

You probably should not say my favorite flavor while he's saying.

[David]

Wait, lemon lime is your favorite Gatorade flavor?

[Marques Brownlee]

I like orange and yellow. Yeah.

[Andrew]

It's such a boring pick, but I think I agree with yellow. It's so good. A Gatorade. And then glacier cherry.

[Ellis River]

What.

[Adam Molina]

What's your white flavor?

[Marques Brownlee]

Gatorade.

[David]

Like the red one.

[Andrew]

That's okay. You can't call it boring and then go fruit punch. I agree.

[David]

Punch is delicious.

[Andrew]

That's the default good.

[Marques Brownlee]

That's the npc.

[Ellis River]

No, the blue one.

[David]

Yeah, but which blue one? Oh, God, I hate that one.

[Marques Brownlee]

Light blue.

[David]

No. The problem with the blue one and the yellow one is that they make my cell, like, saliva glands fire.

[Marques Brownlee]

They all do that.

[David]

The red one does.

[Marques Brownlee]

So full of sugar. Really well.

[Andrew]

Are you a zero?

[David]

I'm talking. Because they're a little bit sour

[Marques Brownlee]

background. Anyway, I'm just a Flavors of Gatorade. Here with this MacBook Neo.

[David]

The silver is the absolute best color because it looks just like the old 12 inch MacBook. It looks very clean.

[Andrew]

Everyone buying the silver is why we don't get fun colors on things anymore. Because they're giving us fun colors and y' all are like, oh, that's actually

[Marques Brownlee]

I want to see this distribution here because there's a silver one, you can get the boring one or a colorful one. And I want to know what the spread ends up being for different colors.

[Ellis River]

Regular people will buy a color, schools will buy a thousand of the silver ones.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, that's it.

[David]

Everyone. I know that pre ordered one pre ordered the piss color. But I think it's just because they

[Andrew]

like how it tastes.

[Adam Molina]

Who do you know that Pre ordered a MacBook Neo?

[David]

Three people.

[Marques Brownlee]

It's.

[David]

Do they know they're all piece of. Well, it's really. I mean it's Project Linda.

[Andrew]

It's a phone.

[David]

No, think about this. The A18 Pro is about the M4 single thread performance. Multi thread it's not. But for single threaded tasks it's about the M4.

[Marques Brownlee]

We should talk about what this computer is gonna be capable of. Right? Okay. Everyone sees it's the smartphone chip and to be fair, it will be not as good, especially with the 8 gigs of memory. I think that's actually the real bottleneck. But it will not be good for video editing, it won't be good for gaming. They were bold enough to do a gaming demo for me on this on a 60 Hz display.

[David]

Was it an iPhone game though?

[Marques Brownlee]

It was basically an iPhone game. It didn't look that great. This is not for that. But if you think about who's going to be buying this, it's a lot of schools, it's a lot of students, it's a lot of young people's first computer who you're getting them a Mac instead of a tablet or something or like a cheap random HP or a Chromebook?

[Andrew]

Yes.

[Marques Brownlee]

This for those people is a web browser and it's spreadsheets, word processing, texting, basic stuff like that, email. It's going to kill it all that it's super good. And most of these things are single core tasks that this chip is going to be totally fine for. When you ask more of it, that's when you're going to feel like the edges of performance of like oh wow, I can't play Fortnite on this laptop.

[Andrew]

Or you can play Fortnite. It's optimized. Great.

[Marques Brownlee]

I mean you can play it on A phone. So you can do a lot of stuff at 60 hertz on this laptop. But I think us looking at it thinking, oh no, it's not Thunderbolt. Oh no, it's not higher fresh rate. This isn't going to be for that anyway. So I think it's actually a perfectly reasonable performance envelope. I think the 8 gigs of memory is going to be like a time thing. Like how long before apps are just using too much memory for this 8 gigabyte.

[David]

I had an 8 gigabyte M1 MacBook Air when it came out.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

And it's great up until your storage starts filling up. Because it uses the swap memory.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

And the memory is very fast. So it's like it's generally fine, but as soon as your storage starts filling up, it starts getting slow.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

So I don't know. I go back to the story with my sister, how she bought the. She bought the Mac mini and the next day the double storage model was the same price. So I told her to return it. She was like, why would I do that?

[Marques Brownlee]

I don't use storage. I just browse the web.

[David]

That's exactly what she said. What am I going to do with storage?

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

And I was like, as regular people, like we have so many things on our desktops and like locally on our computer because it's video files and it's big photos and it's all this stuff. Regular people just do everything on the web browser.

[Adam Molina]

I know, but that web browser is usually Google chrome which demands 64 gigabytes of RAM.

[Andrew]

That's why this is Safari Book.

[David]

This is why this is the Safari Book.

[Marques Brownlee]

Safari Book, which.

[Adam Molina]

You know how I feel about Safari. I'm like the biggest Safari evangelist of all time. But like, I don't know, man. Yeah, I love Safari.

[David]

I didn't know that.

[Adam Molina]

I'll never use anything else.

[Marques Brownlee]

Here's an interesting spec about like what might make this a Safari book. The battery size on this laptop is significantly smaller than a MacBook Air. MacBook Air has something like a 55 watt hour battery. This has a 36 and a half watt hour battery. But they are almost the same battery Life as a MacBook Air. I guarantee that's mostly like video playback and using Safari because the second you throw Chrome on this thing, it's going to tank through that half size battery. So this is specifically like you're using Apple's apps, you're using Safari, you're using iMessage, you're using Apple Music. And that's gonna be great.

[David]

It's also lower tde cause it's literally the phone processor. But like an M processor is just a big phone processor. They're pretty much the same architecture.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think it also comes with like a 20 watt charger because it's such a small battery. It doesn't really big charger. And that's total lower power envelope.

[David]

Wow.

[Adam Molina]

It is so crazy that you can run Mac os on an A18.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, man. What's also crazy is we've been running iPad OS on an M4.

[Adam Molina]

That is also crazy.

[Andrew]

You know now an M5, right?

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, sorry, M4 iPad. Yeah.

[Adam Molina]

Like what else could we be doing? You know? So can I run Linux on a toaster? Like are we.

[Andrew]

Yes, absolutely.

[Marques Brownlee]

Isn't there an A19 Pro in the studio? Display XDR. Like they just print these chips.

[David]

Yeah. They put the iPhone in that display just for the camera.

[Marques Brownlee]

This chip is so cheap for them to make. It's unbelievable. Yeah.

[Ellis River]

Ellis's point though, that was the one takeaway that I had from this MacBook Neo thing was like, oh, so you can run Mac OS on these phone chips? They just choose not to for sure. So you think I can plug in the iPhone fold and have a Mac OS experience? Cause it's possible.

[David]

Clearly they might do that. I don't know. Especially if Google's doing it.

[Ellis River]

That would be freaking awesome.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think that's a philosophical thing. Cause what you're saying makes perfect logical sense and we are the consumer and so we're thinking logically about this. But if you're Apple and I've thought a lot about this recently, like the super super powerful iPad is still not good enough to be your full time. That's a $2,000 M4 powered iPad and it's still not your full time laptop for some people.

[David]

It could be for a lot of

[Marques Brownlee]

people if you poke on an iPad

[Ellis River]

and have Mac os, really there it is.

[David]

I think it depends on what you do.

[Marques Brownlee]

There's some evangelists and there's a small fraction of people who are like iPad sickos that are like, yes, I got rid of my laptop. Yes, this is the thing. And you can do that if you're really dedicated. But I think for most people, they're specifically designing these products to live alongside each other. Apple's like, please buy a MacBook and an iPad. Buy everything. Use Sidecar. Use continuity. Use the sync across the devices. They are perfect for each other. Michael, our graphics guy, he uses an iPad, he said just for the pencil and to draw things. And then for Sidecar.

[David]

Yeah. He has a. Heck yeah.

[Ellis River]

But he also uses a magic mouse.

[Marques Brownlee]

So like, I mean if you buy

[David]

like a used iPad air for pretty cheap, having an external display that you can just have at any time is pretty awesome too.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. For your Mac. For your Mac. So they're like, please buy both.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

And so for as powerful as they're willing to make the iPad pro, they are not willing to make it powerful enough philosophically to be your full time computer. But I want you to use it alongside that.

[David]

It's an artificial limitation.

[Marques Brownlee]

It is 100%.

[David]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Apple specializes in it.

[Marques Brownlee]

I know it's their specialty.

[David]

But they also let you plug it into the display and they talk about how with the new displays.

[Andrew]

I loved that.

[David]

Yeah, they talk about how with the new displays, like you can plug the new iPad Pro into the 120Hz display and it'll like run at 120Hz and you can do all the things. And I think if they're letting you plug the iPad into that display with the Thunderbolt cable and like run ipados on the display, they will probably let you do that with the fold. That's my guess.

[Marques Brownlee]

Have you ever noticed the demos though that they run whenever they do that? I pay very close attention to the demos that Apple constructs to demo their products. Right. And when they ever do, whenever they do the iPad plugged into the studio display, they immediately open procreate and they just start like doing the artist thing. They never do file management, they never do multitasking. They're doing the very simple like oh, here's the big display so you can view your work thing. That's on purpose. I think if they wanted you to do all that like computer stuff.

[Ellis River]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

They'd be selling you a computer.

[David]

I will say really quick with the new display, the really good one, the XDR one, they have the camera in it now so they could just get rid. You guys should just get rid of continuity camera. Because every. There's many times when I get on a video call and my feed is just black and I don't understand why. And then I realize it automatically connected to my phone and it's just in my pocket and I'm like, oh, is this is.

[Adam Molina]

That's true. But please don't actually.

[David]

Because you don't have to get rid of it.

[Adam Molina]

I'm just saying it's like when I'm in the audio room, I need to take a call. There's no webcam in that room. Right. And I, I am so peripheraled up in that setup, like I really don't want to add another one.

[David]

Yeah.

[Adam Molina]

But I recently added my iPad as a third monitor with sidecar.

[David]

You can use that camera.

[Adam Molina]

No, but I just close the the sidecar window and take the call on the iPad.

[Ellis River]

Oh yeah.

[David]

That's cool. It is cool.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[Adam Molina]

So yeah, I guess you could get rid of it.

[David]

Marques, I wanna know. Cause you actually played with these laptops. People were talking about the thickness.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

Can you talk about that?

[Marques Brownlee]

Sure.

[Adam Molina]

Down with the thickness.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think a lot of people will be totally fine with it. So technically it is a little bit smaller than the MacBook Air. It is a 13 inch display instead of 13.6. Right. But it is basically the exact same weight and it is actually slightly thicker because of the lack of wedge shape. And that's not to hold more battery. It's not even like a bigger battery. It's just like this is a not engineered for maximum thinness air. So it feels like an air to me when I'm holding it.

[David]

It does.

[Marques Brownlee]

I didn't worry about like extra weight or thickness. It's I think technically on paper a tenth of an inch thicker than the MacBook Air.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

So like not a big deal.

[David]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Is it? I'm assuming it's not wedge shaped because now the speakers are down here. Right. Which all the way down to there. You can't have the speakers in the bottom corner. And also the headphone jack there looks really strange.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. It is weird.

[Andrew]

It is really low.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

It makes more sense. To be honest, I was trying to

[Marques Brownlee]

figure out why it's more sense.

[Andrew]

Because it's just closer to you and when you have actual headphones you're plugging in the further. I mean it's like three inches closer, eight inches. It would probably be the difference. But yeah.

[David]

I will say the refurbished 13 inch MacBook Air right now on Apple's website is $750.

[Marques Brownlee]

This is how I think I need to review this computer. Yeah. Is if you are thinking about buying a MacBook Neo and you want to be a little bit like, you want to like look into it a little bit. There's actually two other things you could do for $600 is you could get an M1 MacBook Air.

[David]

M1.

[Marques Brownlee]

Right.

[David]

That'd be really cheap.

[Marques Brownlee]

That would be a potentially just as good computer for you. But it's an M chip. You get more software support from buying a Neo today because you're starting today at day zero and have years of software. But you maybe you think an M1 Air will have a better display, more multi threaded, whatever. That's a choice you could make. And the other is you could still buy like a $500, $600 Windows computer or a Chromebook for that price. And I think it's. We all have this reaction because we're like, well, why would you do that if you could get macOS? But I think that's the comparison that I need to put it all. I need to put these things all online and see like what's the advantage? What's the best Windows laptop I can get for 599 for students. 499. That's going to be tough. But I want to actually figure that out.

[Andrew]

I think it's like if you are watching or listening to this podcast right now, that might be something you look into. Most people buying this and those people might find your regular channel review going to buy it. They just like to me, the MacBook Neo is, it's a laptop. All of us don't have laptops anymore. We have full blown workstations that happen to be in a laptop now. Because we got to that point maybe workstation is not the right word, but like these are insanely powerful for this. But when you think about what we just used to do with laptops, we never sat at a desk with them and like plugged it into something. We would sit on the couch or a chair or a coffee shop and like that's what the Neo is. It's just a laptop.

[Adam Molina]

That's a world I've never known. Like my first laptop was like a plug into a, a workstation desk and like, and do it. And I remember being like, yo, why are laptops not as powerful as computers until the M series came out? And it's just like, why would we go back?

[Andrew]

Claire has a laptop. It's never, she's never sat at a desk with it. She uses it on the couch or maybe at the dining room table or like in the like. And she uses it at work sometimes. I guess that's at a desk. But like those are laptop things to just do laptop things or we need

[Adam Molina]

to do like a studio video. That's like a competition between a MacBook Air, a Neo, a Windows PC and an iPad. Because I'm so curious where the edge cases that one category, one of those cannot do.

[Andrew]

I think this is that point though where if you're watching a video of a competition between a NEO and something else, you're out of the Neo range already.

[Adam Molina]

No, but even for genuinely just one here what can you not do on an iPad that you can do on a Neo? You can get a keyboard, you can Bluetooth any keyboard to an iPad.

[Marques Brownlee]

So that might be one thing to add to my discussion because the base iPads. $329.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

The keyboard and trackpad they make for it are $250. So that's 600 right there.

[Adam Molina]

Sure.

[Marques Brownlee]

3681 you could get that. And you can do file management and multi window and most stuff it's modular

[Adam Molina]

at that point too.

[Marques Brownlee]

And you have a touchscreen if you want it.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

And you could pop it off. Yeah. So that's maybe that's one more option.

[Andrew]

Can't put it on your lap.

[Adam Molina]

And I would also do this.

[Marques Brownlee]

That's true. That's very true.

[Adam Molina]

I would also argue that the people the market for the Neo is more likely to use cloud storage.

[David]

Yes.

[Adam Molina]

Almost all file management doesn't matter really on like the iPad. I don't know man.

[David]

I think I just like integrated laptops more than two in one touchscreens with detachable keyboards.

[Ellis River]

I also think we're overthinking this.

[Andrew]

Yep.

[Ellis River]

I think if a parent walks into Best buy and sees three laptops and an iPad that are all $600, they're buying the Neo because they're familiar with Apple.

[Andrew]

It looks like it's going to sell.

[David]

Yeah. Also education discount is a hundred dollars off so it's 500 with education discount.

[Andrew]

Can I ask a question if any of you guys might know? I asked this to Marquez and I wasn't like when I always think of getting an educational discount it's usually with a Edu email address which is college. But like very clearly this is great for high school and it might work

[David]

if you have like a high school id. I'm not sure.

[Andrew]

Yeah, I guess a high school id but it's harder to prove you are a student and if you don't have to then I'm just going to walk into an Apple store with a kid and be like look at this student over here.

[Adam Molina]

It's been a long time since I was in that world. But I believe Apple partners with a company called Unidays to do educational status verification. Like for the past ever since I was in college, like even my freshman year of college. To get any Apple Edu discounts you needed to first go through the Uniday's verification process.

[Andrew]

And that's like high school students.

[Adam Molina]

No, that's why I'm saying like I don't know how you would do it. As a high school student, because you need to, like, you need to give them a bunch of documents, like your. Your transcripts and, like, your eating, I guess. And like. But also, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of high schoolers are getting edu. Emails now.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Yeah, possibly. I feel like. Also a lot of middle schools, high schools are the ones supplying the computers for the classrooms, at least in the US from what I've seen. But I'm sure there's plenty of.

[David]

How do schools work in 2026? I don't really know how.

[Adam Molina]

You're open claw teacher tells you some lies about George Washington, and then you go home and, like, play Fortnite and drink caffeine all night. Right.

[Andrew]

I remember in, like, eighth grade when we got a smart board and the thing just never worked, so they just used the whiteboard instead, and we were like, damn, look at this technology.

[Marques Brownlee]

In eighth grade, it was called a smart. It never worked.

[Andrew]

It never worked.

[Marques Brownlee]

Never worked.

[David]

We just watched movies on the crt, baby. That's what we did.

[Andrew]

The smart board wound up just being the projector. White screen, essentially. And they never used the fake markers on it.

[David]

£ TV.

[Andrew]

The overhead projector.

[Marques Brownlee]

Am I old? This might be the. I might be at the end of people who have these transparencies. This is like, maybe the end of high school I have.

[Adam Molina]

Transparency is in middle school.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. Like the projector with the transparent thing.

[Andrew]

The overhead projector. That's what I just said. Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

Overhead projector. Overhead.

[Andrew]

It's called.

[Marques Brownlee]

No, overhead. It's on a cart.

[Andrew]

Yeah, but it's. For some reason it's called the overhead projector because I think the mirror or whatever that's above it is overhead into. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That thing that was always funny when they erased and it just wiped stuff all over the place.

[David]

That is an evolution of slide film, by the way, which was used specifically for slides like that, so they could draw on it.

[Marques Brownlee]

Anyway, stay tuned for the NEO review. Yeah, I do think this is. Yeah, I do think this is potentially one of the most disruptive products of the last couple of years. I think a lot of Chromebook sellers and Windows laptop OEMs who have been feasting in that price segment are very worried about that one. Yeah, but we'll see.

[Andrew]

Catherine, one other, like, pro of this out here, which is the pro to all Apple products in the US at least, is, like, not a pro.

[David]

It's a NEO that's gonna make the joke. And then I thought it was.

[Andrew]

No, it's just like when we're looking at cheaper products that are specifically not for tech people. The biggest pro of me suggesting this is when it breaks on you. I can tell you to go to an Apple store and get it fixed. And I don't have to diagnose everything over the phone. Like, so much easier to just be like, hey, you can get the help.

[David]

I was thinking that because I've bought my mom computers before. Like, I bought her like a Chromebook before. I think, oh, it's Chrome. It's just Chrome. She can't mess it up. I was wrong. Like, there are just infinite ways. And, you know, she could just go to a store and I don't have to be her son. Then I guess that, you know, that's great. Anyway, I want to make one more thing. The closest like, analogy to this is the Surface Go. Do you guys remember that computer?

[Marques Brownlee]

Oh, they tried a Snapdragon one.

[David]

It was not Snapdragon. It was Intel Pentium Gold 4415Y.

[Ellis River]

Bless you.

[David]

Yeah, thanks. And if you remember, Dave2D just shat all over this computer because it was so bad. And it started at 400 bucks just for the tablet. And then you still had to buy the keyboard and the pen, which were more expensive, I believe altogether it was probably about the same price as the. As this Neo device. And it sucked. It really did. It was seven years. It's seven years old now, obviously, and they made a better one that made it better, but it was still expensive and bad. So I'm just saying, look, all the. All the tech PC channels. That's Linus Tech tips. Linus is slowly. Has been making videos, being like, oh, no. Oh, no. Mac is better value than Windows in almost every way now. Like, there is no. It's very hard unless you're a gamer at this point, to recommend yourself a Windows computer.

[Ellis River]

Also, like, also, everyone's mad at Windows, so that helps.

[David]

Yeah, because Microsoft is a legacy corporation that doesn't. Anyway, I'm gonna get so yelled at. But I'm just saying. I'm just saying.

[Andrew]

The Surface Go, if you look at it from the side, just looks like a bad math problem. There's so many angles going on. The keyboard is, like, slightly flipped up

[David]

and it's got a stand.

[Andrew]

And like, everything about this, I don't know.

[David]

Again, it was set. It's seven years old. I get that. But there just hasn't really been anything except for like, a Chromebook that is this price and can do this many things. And a lot of people, especially in the United States, Own iPhones and the integration and all that stuff. Yeah, I mean, this is a pretty. This is a pretty serious computer from Apple. I'm still. I'm very interested to get it in and have us like test it and play with it and see what it ends up being like.

[Marques Brownlee]

But.

[David]

But being M4 single thread performance, when that's what everyone wants most of the time, single thread performance is like, you

[Andrew]

know, it's just yellow too. It's sick.

[David]

It's piss.

[Marques Brownlee]

Andrew. So good.

[David]

Silver is the best.

[Andrew]

I want the yellow keyboard so bad.

[David]

I'm happy for you. I think we have to take it to trivia.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. Stay tuned.

[Adam Molina]

But first, I messed up. I was so diligently researching when the galaxy buds actually came out because it was a more difficult thing to research than you would expect.

[David]

You mean the Galaxy Gear icon X?

[Andrew]

No, try AI Overview.

[Adam Molina]

I would never try AI Overview, dude. Okay. AI Overview almost messed me up for this week too. I spent way too much of. If you saw me on my phone and on my computer. On the computer on. Anyway, Marquez, you stated yesterday that the buds came out before the fold or I don't know what you stated yesterday. Last week, Last week, last week. But you said the opposite of the other two boys and you were actually correct and I was wrong.

[Andrew]

Who.

[Ellis River]

Shut up.

[Andrew]

I just want whoever put the comment correcting them, please unsubscribe. That was the first point David and I got in what, what felt like weeks.

[David]

Hey, man, I got another point last week.

[Marques Brownlee]

Wow, that's a huge sum. One point up and y' all are both one point down. That's huge.

[David]

No, I'm not. I'm huge for the program. I got the other question correct though, so it's okay.

[Marques Brownlee]

I know, but you both have minus one point and I have plus that point now. So, I mean, I'm a two point spread.

[Ellis River]

I just want to say shout.

[Andrew]

Am I going to make the Alex

[Ellis River]

Waddell who sent us that on Blue sky appreciate that?

[Andrew]

I'm Blue Sky. So you can admit we need to nuke Blue sky. You can admit that there's value to blue Sky.

[David]

Make a way for my.

[Andrew]

Taken away.

[David]

Make a way for my.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[Adam Molina]

Okay, so the trivia question for this week is one that I hopefully cannot get wrong. So I wrote a crazy question that honestly. Let's go for it. I will give each of you one point for every tech product that you can name that has the word Neo in it.

[David]

Okay.

[Andrew]

Assuming MacBook Neo does not count.

[Adam Molina]

MacBook Neo does not count. And the word it doesn't need to have the word like a space between the Neo and another thing.

[Andrew]

Just have N E O somewhere.

[Adam Molina]

Okay, yeah, sure. Honestly, I don't. Yeah, it just has the letters N E O consecutively in the product name. The reason I was going to say A over mess me up is because I was just making sure that there were enough tech products with the word Neo in the name to even have product.

[David]

Yeah, has to be a tech product.

[Adam Molina]

And tech product can be really broad. Like uses electricity broad.

[Marques Brownlee]

Oh, I need one. I don't even. Oh Nero. Nevermind. I don't even know.

[Adam Molina]

No, that doesn't count.

[Marques Brownlee]

There's an R. Damn.

[Adam Molina]

But what was really funny is that when the MacBook Neo got announced, a bunch of AI slot videos came out that were fake. Samsung product announcements for a phone called the Samsung S26 Ultra Neo that doesn't exist. Just because as People would Google MacBook Neo this would also get served.

[Andrew]

See back in my day, of course

[Adam Molina]

AI overview does not know that that's AI slot videos. So when you Google Samsung Neo to see if that ever existed, you get this really in depth overview with specs of the Samsung S26 Ultra Neo. A phone that does not exist.

[Andrew]

It slopped. Now back in our day it was just small channels making the Pixel Ultra instead.

[Marques Brownlee]

All right, well we will learn or we will know the answers. They'll be at the end like usual. We'll be right back. Support for the show comes from Shopify. The early days of starting a business are equal parts exciting and terrifying. It's a big risk, but it's one worth taking as long as you have the right tools. And if e commerce is part of your new business, here's a tip. Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform used by millions of businesses around the world. They say they can help you tackle all those important tasks in one place. From your inventory to payments to analytics and more. No need to save multiple websites or try to figure out what platform is hosting the tool that you need. Everything is all in one place, making your life easier and your business operations smoother. Let Shopify be your commerce expert. With world class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond, you can get started with your own design studio. With hundreds of ready to use templates, Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that matches your brand's style. It's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify. Today, you can sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com waveform go to shopify.com waveform that's shopify.com waveform Yo, Harvey, Zoe group selfie.

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Ooh, nice.

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[Marques Brownlee]

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[Marques Brownlee]

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[Adam Molina]

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I'm grabbing my phone and switching to

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[Marques Brownlee]

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[Marques Brownlee]

All right, welcome back. Let's talk about nothing. Damn, I make a pun every time I talk about that company. Nothing came out with not say anything for a while. Sorry, I had to. Nothing's coming out with three things. Nothing phone 4A, nothing phone 4A Pro and nothing phone headphones Nothing phone Nothing headphones a Nothing a Headphones Headphones a

[Andrew]

Headphones a Headphones a Headphones parentheses A. Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

God, their naming is still kind of tough. Not gonna lie. Nothing's a weird name for a company.

[David]

It is.

[Marques Brownlee]

Anyway, so the 4A is the one that most of us are interested in. It's a 350 pound AKA that's really heavy phone.

[David]

I know. That was a joke.

[Marques Brownlee]

$350 ish phone coming out in a bunch of markets. I think this is the one that's going global. New design.

[Andrew]

Wait, which one? The 4A is UK, Europe, India.

[Marques Brownlee]

Okay. So the 4A Pro is a global one. Got it. 4A is in those markets I guess. Blue and black. Yes. It's a slight spec bump. It's got a couple new interesting things. I think people in this room have called it the best looking nothing phone ever.

[Andrew]

We talked a lot about today.

[David]

It's got pink.

[Marques Brownlee]

Do you still feel that way?

[David]

I need to look at it again.

[Andrew]

It's hard to say compared to the Pro. The Pro looks really nice, but not in the colors. Just the regular silver. Pro looks really nice. Okay. I think 4A is still nicer looking.

[David]

4A I think is a more general nice looking phone. The 4A Pro is really like cool and kind of almost gamery but in like a, a subtle way.

[Andrew]

Well, I don't. We can get to that soon.

[David]

Yeah, I think. Yeah, true.

[Marques Brownlee]

So I guess I'll just jump into

[Andrew]

the specs real quick though. But last week we only talked about the pink and the white. There's also a blue and a black one. So there's four colors for it.

[David]

The blue looks good too.

[Andrew]

The blue looks really nice.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. So this is running a Snapdragon 7S Gen 4. It has a 5080 milliamp hour battery with 50 watt charging. IP64, a pretty bright display. It says 4500 nits peak brightness. I almost never know what to make of that. I kind of want to know just

[David]

what the regular 4500.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. Like the peak HDR like one pixel will be at 4500 nits and then

[David]

you can put that number on the spec sheet.

[Marques Brownlee]

But I don't know.

[Andrew]

One of the glyph LEDs on the back.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, yeah. Gorilla Glass 7i. It's got triple cameras. It's got a pretty good looking set of specs for a phone that is this cheap.

[David]

I have a question for the audience that maybe you guys can answer. People still seem to care about processors.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yes.

[David]

Hard stop. And I, I understand the gaming aspect of it I suppose. Although I'm not really sure what. Mobile optimized games don't run at high frame rates anymore. Maybe like Genshin Impact or something. That seems to be the, the benchmark. But I still see people caring about the processors and I'm like if the processor is lower tier but it enables things like super bright 120Hz 50 watt charging, like all this stuff. Why do you care? This is my question.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, great question. I think this is another thing where in the bubble that we're in of people over analyzing every little detail about a phone, like the enthusiasts, they care about getting the most for their money and so when a slightly better available part is out there, they want that one instead of the one they got. But I think for most people, a lot of people especially even sometimes watching these but who are just more casually shopping, they are not thinking about the difference between the Snapdragon 8 Elite or the Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 5 or the Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 5 for Galaxy. Like they're all a good chip and the phone performs well. Therefore I'm not getting ripped off.

[Andrew]

I agree with you. I use a Tensor chip so clearly I don't give a about performance. But I think like what Marques said in like this more range of things when you're probably cross shopping, if I'm looking at two phones at the same price and one chip is better then I'm probably gonna go that for the longevity route. That's when I, I'm hoping that's when people care about it more so here. But I also, as much as I love speaking for the audience, I'm probably wrong when I do it.

[Marques Brownlee]

But there's two audiences.

[Ellis River]

I think it's less like the people that care about the frame rates on the newest game. It's more so how long would this phone last? Me, I'm spending like 500, $600 after taxes. Like I want it to last a while.

[David]

Well, Apple would say that running at a lower speed actually makes the phone last longer, which is why they force lower clock speeds but they can't really do it anymore.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think that's a perfect example of the two different audiences. There's one audience who's like how dare you. I want the highest clock speed so I have every single frame with the maximum performance. And then there's the other audience, then there's the other audience who wants just the phone. Hey, it works. So make it last as long as possible. So if you were in the first bucket who's like I want to maximize and get the best possible performance. Especially when you're buying a higher end phone, I think it makes way more sense to pixel peep and to really want the most out of your phone then that makes sense. But if you're buying a $350 phone and it just works, and especially with I think nothing software is pretty good. Like it's smooth Enough. I don't think it would even feel that different on a Snapdragon 8 Elite versus a 7S Gen 4.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

So it's like, yeah, as long as it lasts me a couple years and doesn't fall apart. Seems like it's a good enough chip.

[David]

Yeah. Yeah, seem that way to me. So that's the regular 3, the 4A. And we also got the 4A Pro, which I have to say got announced this morning.

[Andrew]

Surprise.

[David]

You probably got some early stuff about it, but I did not know anything about it. It didn't leak online. This has got to be one of the first tech launches that hasn't leaked.

[Andrew]

They played us a very long time. I feel like they. The design video last week was to be like, look over here. Yeah.

[Adam Molina]

They literally like, slide event.

[David]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

And they did a good job at it. Yeah. This morning I came in, I was like, we have a lot to talk about the pod. I have a lot to write this morning because we also had to shoot S26 review. And then I sit down and there's two new. Nothing. I didn't know, but I was like, oh, my God, we did know about it.

[Ellis River]

Technically. Marquez told us last week.

[Andrew]

Marquez did not tell me about. I asked earlier.

[Ellis River]

The podcast. I left it in the edit.

[Marques Brownlee]

He did ask, is there a foray pro? And I was like, yeah, probably. Yeah.

[David]

He said, yeah, but I thought you were just speculating.

[Marques Brownlee]

Me too.

[David]

Why are you hiding from us, Mar?

[Marques Brownlee]

I only say what I'm allowed to say.

[Andrew]

Earlier this week, I said, hey, I need to. I'm writing podcasts. Can you send me the. The 4A specs so I can write it down? And you're like, sure. And didn't send the Pro or the headphones?

[Marques Brownlee]

Well, I didn't get the 4A Pro info. That was the thing. So the event was in London, the literal hours after the Apple event in New York. So I couldn't physically be at both. So I made the decision to see the six Apple devices in New York, and I wasn't able to teleport to London fast enough to also see the 4A Pro? Bummer.

[Adam Molina]

Dude, what's wrong with you?

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, I couldn't. I actually looked. I was like, is there a flight that takes off and gets me there at like 3 o' clock in the morning so I can just show up and make a video? But no, there were no flights. I could make that happen.

[Adam Molina]

Do not invoke that. We're cutting that.

[David]

Why?

[Adam Molina]

Because that's not real.

[David]

We talked about it, though.

[Adam Molina]

It's true that not coming out. Are you kidding?

[Marques Brownlee]

That's why we couldn't take it. That's why we couldn't fly on it.

[David]

That's true.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah. No, that.

[Marques Brownlee]

But yeah. So anyway, this stuff was sort of held in London for us to see from those who are actually there with cameras. And it looks pretty good. The specs also look pretty good. So the 4A Pro, again, it's a 4A Pro, not a full flagship. It's not a 4. So because it's a 4A Pro, it's got a Snapdragon 7 gen 4 chip.

[David]

Gonna kill myself.

[Marques Brownlee]

I think this is just them coping that it's like, hey, if you want to put a mid range chip in this, you can't call it a flagship. If this was a Snapdragon 8 Elite, then they could call it a flagship. But since it's not, all right, we have to call it the A Pro instead of the flagship ship.

[David]

Fine.

[Marques Brownlee]

So Snapdragon 7 gen 4.6.83 inch AMOLED. It's 120Hz display, but it will sometimes get to 144Hz depending on the app. Kind of similar to some other gaming phones have okay. 5000 nit peak brightness, which means nothing to me. 5000 milliamp hour battery, 50 watt charging, triple cameras. Again, better cameras though than the 4A. So. Yeah, and better looking. It's got the glyph on the back. It's got a.

[David]

It's got the nothing fun iPhone3 like little display thing.

[Andrew]

Yeah. In a better way. So like it. If you haven't seen it yet, it is an all metal body which is awesome.

[Ellis River]

Beautiful.

[David]

Except for wireless charging. Because it doesn't have that. Because it can't.

[Andrew]

Oh, I didn't even think of that. Yeah, poo poo. It has like a large camera bump, similar to an iPhone in terms of footprint. But this is proof that you can do that like everyone else and make it unique because this is actually sweet. Essentially one main camera, top left corner, dual camera. What are we calling them again? Pills. The pill.

[Adam Molina]

The bean.

[Andrew]

The bean. We got a bean. A double camera bean under that horizontally. Then to the right of that a large circle glyph interface, which I believe has 137 mini LEDs, is 57% larger and twice as bright compared to the phone 3 glyph interface.

[Marques Brownlee]

Wow.

[Ellis River]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

And we still have the red recording LED on it it. Because that should be on every single phone ever.

[David]

Yes.

[Andrew]

But then encased in that is a full metal, silver, pink or Black body. Yeah, it looks great.

[Ellis River]

It also has the like hooking over there.

[Andrew]

It looks like the little circular like indent on the bottom that matches the new Pixel Buds or sorry, not Pixel Buds, nothing buds. Feels like that.

[David]

It just like spin thing.

[Andrew]

Yeah, it matches all together really well.

[David]

Although the pink I will say. Okay, so like in the camera bar it is color matched on the silver and it's color matched on the black but the pink is still silver so it looks really weird actually Wait, I kind of wish that they made that pink.

[Andrew]

Here's my problem is look at this picture on the verge that looks. This is the black phone but it looks like a silver camera bump and the black metal looks like it got like plasti dipped instead of like the

[Marques Brownlee]

silver version of this phone is the

[Andrew]

best looking is 100.

[David]

It looks great.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[David]

I will say like I'm miss the HTC full metal body phones and if you're not going to have wireless charging, which I still really love, wireless charging, all metal is pretty awesome. I'm curious about heat and how that ends up working out. Maybe because this chipset is, you know, a little bit lower performance. It's not going to get as hot. There a vapor chamber in there probably.

[Marques Brownlee]

I don't actually know.

[David]

I don't know. I don't know. The renders might look better than these in person. I'm very curious to see them in person. It's definitely more gamery than their other devices.

[Marques Brownlee]

It's a little more. I don't know. I'm not getting gamery as much as I'm getting like R2D2.

[David]

Yeah.

[Marques Brownlee]

Like little playful pill morphing.

[Andrew]

It feels like a phone that they took the nothing buds and just put it in the camera bump. Like that's where all the nothing design aesthetic is. The clear and kind of like red accent and whatever. And then there is a little bit at the bottom but. But I kind of dig it because it's not trying too hard while also trying too hard.

[David]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Which is a hard thing to do.

[Marques Brownlee]

Do you see the price yet?

[David]

499.

[Marques Brownlee]

499. So not flagship price. I think pretty good price actually.

[David]

It's cheaper than the Pixel.

[Andrew]

It is interesting though because it's 499 USD.499 and 479 Euros which if you do the. They've done this before where like they match the price but when you do conversion rates on that, it's is wildly different.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah, it's a better.

[David]

It's the same price as the Pixel 10a, right?

[Marques Brownlee]

499. Yeah.

[Andrew]

While you guys are looking, my favorite thing about the video was it says, world's first 140x zoom *, and then says claims are based on publicly available data at launch, which I think is the claim that it's the world's first 140x zoom, which, again, which is going

[Marques Brownlee]

to look really bad if you zoom into 140x. What are you

[Andrew]

doing? Have you watched the

[Marques Brownlee]

video?

[Andrew]

No. Know, even when it zooms in on the, like, perfectly rendered video of everything. This looks

[Marques Brownlee]

terrible.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah.

[David]

Yeah. I mean,

[Marques Brownlee]

yeah. Hey, at least they're honest

[Ellis River]

here. Real quick, it's 499 for the 8 gigs of RAM, 128

[Andrew]

storage.

[Ellis River]

Yes. Another $100 for the 12 gigs of RAM, 256 storage. Those are the only two

[David]

options. Just do a thousand X and just make it look really

[Adam Molina]

bad.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. What's stopping you from going to

[David]

2000? Yeah, exactly. You could just brand it that way. 2000 x

[Marques Brownlee]

zoom. World's

[David]

first. World's first. Yeah. I think it looks pretty good. I think the nothing design team has been really cooking

[Marques Brownlee]

recently. I think they also did the thing where they kind of made the previous stuff worse so that we'd go, wow, they cooked this time. Look at the improvement. Probably

[David]

not. What do you mean made it

[Marques Brownlee]

worse? Like how the iPhone 16e was so bad that when the 17e was what it should have been, we were like, wow, they really cooked. Is that. Can you do that with design or is it just. They

[David]

try. It depends how quickly you. You have

[Marques Brownlee]

turnaround. Like, we hated the

[Andrew]

3. We hated the 3, but not the 3A. So I guess that depends on

[David]

theirs. Like, I mean, the analogy I'm making for the 17e is to. To the 16e is the iPhone 12 mini to the 13 mini. Because the primary problem was the battery, and that's the primary thing they addressed in the next

[Marques Brownlee]

one.

[David]

Yeah. And with this one, the primary problem was the lack of wireless charging and the storage.

[Marques Brownlee]

Right. For the price versus the 3A

[David]

Pro. I was talking about the

[Marques Brownlee]

16E. Oh, the iPhone. Yeah,

[David]

Magc. But so now with this, I think this is more analogous to the 3 than the. Yeah, the 3 than the 3A because it uses the same kind of glyph interface, even though it's bigger and better now. Apparently the three still had a chipset that people were not that happy

[Marques Brownlee]

with. It was also super

[David]

expensive. It was also super. Yeah. Like, I don't see a reason anyone would buy the 3 when the 3A Pro exists, which is kind of funny. I feel like maybe they should have just called this the 3 Pro, but I guess they couldn't because the chipset is technically not as good. I just hate. This is the thing. This is my thing. Why does everything rotate around the freaking

[Marques Brownlee]

chipset? It's just because of the super. Super. Like, the nerds among us would be like, are you seriously making a new flagship with a worse

[Andrew]

chip? Yeah, but like, we've all said it and we've all done it

[Marques Brownlee]

also. So it's like, they cannot name this a flagship because everyone will say that about. So they have to leverage this naming scheme of like, okay, it's not the A because the a was the 4A, but it is better than the 4A, but it's not a flagship chip, so we'll call it the 4A Pro. That's how they get away with this specific set of specs and this price. And when they inevitably try a flagship sometime later, all of us nerds will go, well, you better put a flagship chip in it, otherwise I'll spend my money on something else with a flagship

[David]

chip. Can't wait for the CMF phone. 3 Pro Lite. That is better than a nothing Pro 4A. Yeah, that would be tough.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. Yeah. I think they did a. A great design

[Andrew]

job. This phone. I didn't know. I didn't even think of no wireless charging, though. That makes me

[David]

sad. It makes me sad. But I don't know if you're not going to. I mean, I want it for sure. I always want it, but if you. If you're not going to do it. Metal body is

[Marques Brownlee]

sick.

[David]

True. Because I missed my HTC Thunderbolt even though it burned my

[Marques Brownlee]

hand. What about. There's so many better metal phones. You

[David]

could. The HTC

[Marques Brownlee]

Thunderbolt. The Thunderbolt was the worst

[David]

one. What are you talking

[Marques Brownlee]

about? Thunderbolt was the worst battery life of any phone I've ever

[Andrew]

used. Yes, I

[Marques Brownlee]

agree. They were like, let's do 4G and then burn it to the ground. What about the HTC One? Or the HTC One M7

[David]

M8? I guess. Yeah, those are more

[Marques Brownlee]

legendary. Play Edition. I know. Those phones were Nexus 6P. Yeah. Yeah, we had good Nexus 6P. Good metal phones did

[David]

exist. Yeah, I guess. Yeah, I only made that. It was my first smartphone. So I guess that's why you didn't know better. Yeah, I didn't. Well, they didn't have anything better at the

[Marques Brownlee]

time. Yeah. So they also made headphones. Nothing. Headphones A. Yeah. So now they have two tiers of headphones. Again, we can assume based on the name that the headphones a. Again, I haven't tested them. I'm seeing the design and the $100 lower price. We assume that this is a slightly lower end set of headphones, but it still has all the nothing design philosophy. There's some colors as well. They still have some of those clever buttons too, that the original nothing headphones had. I think a lot of people forgot how. How interesting the nothing headphones

[David]

were. They had like a. I use them every

[Marques Brownlee]

day. Yeah. Okay. So you know, they have the paddle, they have the roller as well, and the software that talks to them. So these headphones still have a lot of that stuff. And they have. Seems like a pretty decent. Well, eight hours of playback. Oh, in five minutes of

[Andrew]

charging.

[Marques Brownlee]

Sorry. We don't know what the battery life

[Andrew]

is. Totally five days. Battery lasts for five

[Marques Brownlee]

days. That doesn't

[Andrew]

mean. Could mean a

[Marques Brownlee]

dealing. How many hours of playback. This is the one thing that

[Andrew]

the battery literally died after five days. And you cannot use it. Can't charge

[Marques Brownlee]

it. Yeah, you. I guess that's a mixed use stat. But like, with headphones, you can just be like, I turn them on, I hit play. When did they die? Yeah, that would be a useful

[David]

number. These, in my opinion, look significantly worse than the really

[Andrew]

headphones. I think I kind of like

[Marques Brownlee]

them more like these a lot more

[David]

than the regular nothing

[Andrew]

headphones. I think I just like the clear part on the outs. So it's. If you remember the other nothing headphones. Yeah, they're square and circle. Square outside, circle bump on the inside this time. Yeah, yeah. But the circle part on the nothing ones, the headphone ones, is where the clearness is. And then on this, the circle part on top of the square is where the color is. And the clear parts, the square, I just think it looks so it's like opposite. I think it's just trying to do

[David]

less. Yeah, but it looks way cheaper in my

[Andrew]

opinion. I mean, I think both of them look pretty cheap. I don't really love either of them. I love my nothing

[David]

earbuds. I will say I, I wear. I use the nothing headphone ones pretty much every day because I've been using them as

[Andrew]

earmuffs. Well, you just use them because those Stranger Things guys use

[Marques Brownlee]

them. Yes, they're

[David]

fashionable. No, But I get stopped by a lot of people asking me what they are, and people are like, oh, it's cool. It looks like a cassette tape

[Ellis River]

inside. What color do

[Andrew]

you. And then they put their AirPods back in and

[David]

walk. The black looks bad because it's

[Ellis River]

glossy. I disagree. The black is the way to go because they're so

[David]

minimal. You can see the fingerprints so much

[Ellis River]

more. Yeah, but no one knows you're wearing a crazy pair of headphones. The white ones are like, woo, I'm here the same way with all these colorful ones. It's like they're trying to pick me

[Andrew]

energy. The black ones are the ones you are all you. Just the color doesn't change the pick me energy on these

[Ellis River]

headphones. I disagree. I think it totally does,

[David]

bro. I don't know. I think we're all contributing to phone companies only releasing black and white at the

[Andrew]

moment. These are four different

[David]

colors. Look at. You're telling

[Ellis River]

me. No, it looks beautiful. I just would never wear them in public because it's like gonna get double takes. Like people are gonna look at you and then look away and then be like, wait, what are

[Marques Brownlee]

those? Because how bright

[Ellis River]

they're. The black ones are just headphones. People will look at you and be like, oh, he's wearing

[David]

headphones. But you really think that the A looks better? Yeah, it looked like

[Ellis River]

nothing.

[Andrew]

Nice. I kind of dig the yellow

[Marques Brownlee]

one.

[Andrew]

Fun. Oh my God. Their website is. Oh God.

[David]

Infuriating. Oh God. Okay, what I didn't even know was that there's four

[Andrew]

colors. Oh my

[David]

God. What is that? Holy moly show,

[Andrew]

Adam. Okay, you haven't

[David]

seen. The yellow and pink are just in

[Ellis River]

the. So that's what I'm

[David]

saying. They're just in the

[Ellis River]

center. The yellow and the pink ones. I think I like the colors, but I do not like the

[David]

headphones. They look so

[Ellis River]

bad. The white and black ones are

[David]

fine. They're unbelievably

[Marques Brownlee]

ugly. Also, I just want to say I just went to the PCMAG website where they have an article about these headphones and they're saying the five day battery life is 135 hours straight of

[David]

playtime. That's what it says on the Verge

[Marques Brownlee]

2. So just for context, die in five days. Just for context, a normal. Does this have ANC? Is the other

[David]

question. Yes, it

[Marques Brownlee]

does. So a normal ANC set of headphones flagships are getting 30, 40. The really good ones 50 and in some insane cases, 70 to 80. Like I think the Dyson headphones had a crazy big battery and did 80. 135 is unheard of for ANC headphones. That does seem like a lot I need to

[Adam Molina]

investigate. That's only with the AAC codec. Though as soon as you switch to LBAC or any other lossless thing that it has built in, you're going to cut

[David]

that.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. So they cherry picked 135 hours with the lesser CODEC and ANC off. That's how they got this

[David]

number. If you do LDAC and anc on, it's

[Ellis River]

62. Oh, that's

[Marques Brownlee]

right. Okay. That sees how the context.

[Ellis River]

Okay.

[Marques Brownlee]

That. Okay. Got it.

[David]

Yeah. So if you're willing to have it sound like ass, then you can

[Marques Brownlee]

get a lot of battery life. Hot

[Adam Molina]

take. You can't tell, David. I guarantee you you

[Andrew]

cannot. I

[David]

know.

[Marques Brownlee]

Okay. I've been pumping AAC into your headphones this whole time. You have no

[David]

clue. Yeah, and you sound like

[Adam Molina]

ass. You're listening to AAC in your headphones right now.

[David]

David. I almost brought this and I wish I

[Adam Molina]

did. I'm

[David]

kidding. Fender released a bunch of new stuff recently. They. I don't know if you remember this. A year and a half ago you had me take a Fender briefing for

[Marques Brownlee]

you. These

[David]

guys.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah.

[David]

Okay. And they

[Ellis River]

released. My cousin just did air guitar. Air

[Marques Brownlee]

guitar. I've heard

[David]

offender. They were announcing like new headphones and some new speakers, like wireless speakers that are also amps. And they got bought by a Chinese company or something and they decided to make the brand like way better. And they set a year and a half ago is when I had this briefing. And then yesterday on my front porch arrives in an enormous box.

[Adam Molina]

Enormous. Like

[David]

huge. And I was like, what the hell is this? And one of them was a pair of headphones, wireless headphones from Fender. And inside of the left ear cup, they have a dongle, a USB C dongle that you plug into any device and it allows you to do. It allows you to do lossless

[Marques Brownlee]

audio. When you say inside the ear cup, you mean like, like you take

[David]

the. You take the ear plush thing off and then there's a dongle inside that you can take out and you can put it in your laptop or in your

[Marques Brownlee]

phone.

[David]

Okay. And it allows you to listen to lossless audio. Oh, and there's three modes. There's like, there's like AAC, there's lossless, and then there's AuraCast, which allows you to basically transmit the same signal, like audio signal to multiple

[Marques Brownlee]

headphones. It's actually kind of

[David]

interesting. It's interesting. And then they're also insanely repairable. Like the other side has. You can take this off and replace the battery. Like they're sort of trying to be like the fairphone headphones. The Fairbuds XL in a lot of ways. Why did I bring this up? I brought this up related to these headphones for a

[Marques Brownlee]

reason. Is it because they're lossless and

[Andrew]

wireless? They're battery life because of the audio codec like is why you talked

[Marques Brownlee]

about it, I guess just wanted to flex on

[David]

us. No, I

[Andrew]

don't. Possible

[Ellis River]

embargo. Cuz he's wearing the white headphones all the

[David]

time. So I had a reason for this. Well, anyway, that it was interesting. I'll bring it in next week, I'll show

[Marques Brownlee]

you. Sure, that's cool. That's kind of like. Yeah, you can do bluetooth on the MX Master 4S or you can plug in the dongle and get like yeah,

[David]

connection. Right, right, right. So it was

[Adam Molina]

interesting. I got something to

[Andrew]

say. Say it. Say

[Adam Molina]

it. Last time we talked about the nothing headphones, like when they came out and I wore them on the podcast and I was just sort of like, come on guys, who cares? You know, I sort of gave it. I have revised that opinion because I personally feel that the wireless over ear ANC headphone space since that conversation has turned into such garbage that actually I find myself recommending the nothing over ear headphones more than most other things. They're 500 bucks, they're 300 bucks. Oh, and, and that's, that's the first reason is that most things in this space are like crazy overpriced. The headphones that I use every day, the Focal Batiste, I mean dummy

[David]

overpriced, sure, but that's like, like my

[Adam Molina]

Maserati, the Thousand, the Powers and Wilkins, like PX8,

[Marques Brownlee]

whatever. Those are like, yeah, way

[Adam Molina]

over. They do not sound significantly better than

[David]

these.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah. I think every single year the Sony, wh X whatever sound progressively worse and worse. And like the newest ones, whatever number we're on, I just think are like borderline unlistenable. They sound so

[Marques Brownlee]

bad. Whoa, that's a hotter

[David]

take. That's a hot

[Adam Molina]

take. I.

[Andrew]

They. He's been

[Marques Brownlee]

whining. I consistently choose them over AirPods Max, despite the worst connectivity. Because I think they sound, I

[Adam Molina]

think if you're looking, you think they sound better than AirPods, especially for flying. I think. Well, we gotta talk about that because that doesn't even to me the, the, the Sony's are so mid forward and they have so much distortion in the mids that if you're trying to use them for like any sort of clinical listening, they're like, it's, it's the equivalent of like rubbing Vaseline On a

[Andrew]

lens. Like, yeah, is that your

[David]

problem? Like a doctor

[Adam Molina]

podcast? No, no, no, no, no, no. Like, if you were trying to, like, if you were trying to, like, like, listen to something and be like, does this sound right? You know what I mean? For any sort of. Like, obviously, like, I'm coming at this from a different thing, but, like, I don't. I. I don't enjoy listening to

[Ellis River]

them. I think you enjoy listening to music differently than

[David]

people.

[Adam Molina]

Sure. I think the Sony's probably sound exciting anyway. What I'm trying to say is, like, for the

[Marques Brownlee]

money. Yeah. The expensive,

[Andrew]

too.

[Adam Molina]

For. For the money and the feature set. I think that nothing's actually like, some. One of the most competitive offerings. And you know something really funny, because I obviously get asked way too often, like, what headphones should I buy? And so I've been recommending the Nothings more and more and more, and I have not gotten a single person to buy

[David]

them. Oh,

[Adam Molina]

interesting. Because of the

[David]

aesthetic. They look every single

[Adam Molina]

person. I've been like, I think this is the best bang for you. Like, also because, like, Bose quality, like, the. Obviously the noise canceling Bose offers is still, like, really, really terrific. Like, sound quality. I can't really say that quietcomforts are super competitive anymore. So it's like, yeah, like, this is kind of. Kind of the jam, and no one wants the

[David]

nothing. The two thing I hate about the nothing headphones is that the ANC basically does not exist. Like, it's. It is a feature that I don't hear it almost at

[Marques Brownlee]

all.

[Adam Molina]

The. The bowers and Wilkins are the same way, and the focals are the same way, and those are both twice the

[Marques Brownlee]

price.

[Adam Molina]

Okay. So it's like

[David]

the. I don't love the audio quality on the Nothing headphones either. It kind of. It feels like everything is like a very. It's like. It feels like it's trying to force, like a spatial audio thing all the time.

[Adam Molina]

Time.

[Marques Brownlee]

Okay. And you can't turn it off if there is a. Sometimes they

[Andrew]

do. Do you have the nothing extra that's

[David]

on. Maybe it's in the

[Andrew]

nothing. It's

[Adam Molina]

probably. I feel like with the Nothings, it's like you get clear highs that are not piercing. You get clear mids that are not, like, blurring everything else in this. In the. The sound, the sonic field. And then you get good, decent enough lows, and the transient response is good. And music sounds like the way it mostly should on those

[Andrew]

things. So show me a graph where I don't believe

[Adam Molina]

you. No, no, no,

[Marques Brownlee]

no. All

[Adam Molina]

right. And

[David]

shoot. I wish I brought in these fence these. Yeah,

[Adam Molina]

these. I was gonna say the other headphones that I, I haven't tried, but I people I trust say are like pretty decent are the, the Marshall headphones, the monitor threes, which are about the same price as these. Anyway, this is all to say that I'm excited to try these headphone A's. Just because the longer I've like observed this space, the more I've been like, damn, I was really not fair to the original nothing headphones. They really are a cool

[David]

offering. Yeah, I'm going to bring in the Fender next week for you to try because they look very normal and they also cost $300 and they have lossless audio and aura cat. All this cool stuff and see is way better than the

[Adam Molina]

sonies. Yeah, the Sony's are sound so bad that, that when I, I finally confronted Rich and I was like, you have to stop editing on these because you're, you're. Because you're missing, you're missing so much like you're missing. You're not hearing so much stuff. And I gave them the Bowers and Wilkins, which are not that much better headphones. Like they sound pretty bad in my opinion too. And it was literally like, oh my God, like I can hear the room. I can hear these qualities in their voices. Like the Sony's literally are unable to recreate these sounds

[Marques Brownlee]

Interesting. Yeah, I would definitely not edit on them. I usually think of like the types of headphones. I think of like the music listening fun headphones, V shaped graph, all that fun stuff. And then like the more reference headphones and I firmly put the Sony ones in the like music listening fun

[Andrew]

headphones.

[Adam Molina]

Yeah. I guess my forefront only because like what like picture me telling you the video equivalent of this Marquez like picture me being like, dude, I have this display. The blacks are bright as hell, the whites are not bright. There's no color accuracy. But it's just so much fun to watch

[Marques Brownlee]

movies. But that's actually how TVs are touch movies. That's how I would never edit on a tv. I would never edit on a

[Adam Molina]

tv. No, we watch this, we all think this looks. Everyone thinks this looks bad. There's entire, entire subreddits that are like, here, here's how you turn off all the stuff on your

[Ellis River]

tv. But if you walk into a store and they all have all those settings turned on, you buy the one that has all them turned on because it looks

[Marques Brownlee]

better. Yeah, the punchy one. Yeah, they're like that's why they turn it

[David]

on. That's what people

[Marques Brownlee]

do. That's why it's turned

[Adam Molina]

on. Am I just like so off base here

[Marques Brownlee]

that. Listen, this is classic. No, you're too plugged

[David]

in. You care too

[Marques Brownlee]

much. When the, when you, you've listened to 30 pairs of headphones and you know the nuance differences between them, it's easy to like evaluate in that

[Adam Molina]

way. I know what I like. You know, there's that too. There's some

[Marques Brownlee]

personal. But I think there's a lot of people shopping for headphones that are just like, all right, I'm gonna fly with these. So I need step one, good build, step two, good battery, step three, good noise cancellation. And then as long as they sound pretty good, I'm

[Adam Molina]

happy. And that is kind of the

[Ellis River]

Sony's. You're

[Adam Molina]

right. But aren't the Sonys like 500 or 600

[Andrew]

bucks? Yeah, they're now they've gone up,

[Marques Brownlee]

but they're not that

[David]

high.

[Marques Brownlee]

400. I think they're under four still. I think they're under

[Ellis River]

four. I still think getting the older versions is a better deal, but I agree with

[Marques Brownlee]

that. But they, they stopped folding for some reason for the Last gen. And I 460 what the Mark 6

[David]

is. Yeah. Remember they went

[Andrew]

up. Do you see what I'm

[David]

saying? They went up in price this year, like four, six. Yeah, they're hella expensive for headphones

[Adam Molina]

that sound like the music is coming out of a

[Marques Brownlee]

bee's. I remember when they were like

[Andrew]

330, then they were 350 for

[Adam Molina]

that. This is what they're

[Andrew]

thinking. That is not what they sound

[Marques Brownlee]

like. I'm six feet

[David]

from.

[Andrew]

Yeah, that's what the Sony

[Adam Molina]

sound. No, they

[Andrew]

don't. They do not sound that

[Marques Brownlee]

bad. They sound pretty

[Adam Molina]

good. Someone, I guarantee someone is listening to this podcast on a pair of sonies. They'd be like, I can't hear the difference. That's just what. Wait, that just sounds like what it sounds like all the

[David]

time. Oh my God, you are so hard on

[Marques Brownlee]

these. I did forget that they were 460. I thought they were more. Cause yeah, they raised the price point. The AirPods Max are like 550 and they don't lose the price. And then all the others start to creep up in price cause they're all competing. And then Apple comes out and seems to enable $500 headphones. Now the 350 ones are 400 and 450. So it's all creeping up. Which is valid that the Nothing headphones are only 300. That's really nice. But yeah,

[Andrew]

well. And the headphones a are

[Adam Molina]

199. The headphones a are 199. And

[Marques Brownlee]

they. We gotta see how they

[Adam Molina]

sound. It's hard for me to tell exactly from the website, but. But it seems like you can bypass a bunch of the digital stuff with the 3.5 millimeter connection, which is something that a lot of headphones actually you can't do

[Marques Brownlee]

anymore. Not have

[Ellis River]

one. The best want to say if you want to yell at Ellis Roven

[Adam Molina]

on X. I'm so sorry, mkb. I'm like genuinely so sorry if I offended you and you like the Sony. It's like I do really believe like the best headphones are the ones that you like. They're the one that's so true for headphones and

[Andrew]

earbuds.

[David]

Earbuds. It's like the best

[Adam Molina]

camera. Don't let anyone tell you that the ones that you like are

[Ellis River]

bad. You just

[Adam Molina]

did. I personally just feel like I was

[Marques Brownlee]

gonna. You're missing however. They sound like a

[Ellis River]

bees.

[Adam Molina]

What's. But if they sold them for a hundred dollars, I'd be like, that's

[Marques Brownlee]

amazing.

[Adam Molina]

They. You have to go buy these. These are the best

[Marques Brownlee]

ones. But it's like I go on. I will say I'm on a lot of flights and I tend to like look around and notice all the headphones people are wearing. And there's first of all, tons and tons of AirPods. And I know they're $500 headphones and I'm always amazed at how many AirPods there are. And maybe that's because I'm flying out of Newark. But then two, there's a ton of Bose in Sony and I know they're not the Bose especially. It's like I know they're not the best sounding, but they sell them in the airport vending machine and they're designed to be for flights and they have tons of anc. They have the adapter in the

[David]

box. Apparently the newest ones actually sound pretty

[Adam Molina]

good. Yeah, Bose. Bose is a historic. Like Bose is an R and D company first. I know, I mean like they put a lot of effort into this

[David]

but like the old quiet comforts had pretty ass audio quality with just really good

[Andrew]

anc. Yeah, but were they bees ass audio

[David]

quality? I

[Adam Molina]

don't. I don't know if I can co sign that. That

[David]

statement. You know there is

[Adam Molina]

normia. There's a funny thing in audio where like, you know the like the like Mimi Bell curve with like the angry dumb guy on one side and the angry genius guy on the other side. And

[David]

like. Like it's with

[Adam Molina]

everything. Well, no, but with. With headphones it's like the. I don't know anything About Audio use AirPods and then you have everyone arguing in the middle about what's best. And then like everyone I know who's like a super esteemed knowledgeable audio engineer, like super techy, really knows their stuff. It's AirPods. It's like. And they wouldn't even consider using anything

[David]

else. No, it's. It's the same in pretty much everything. And note taking apps. Same with can't. With photo photos. I'll have people that are like, oh, look at this awesome picture. And it's like the worst picture I've ever seen. Like the HDR is just

[Marques Brownlee]

like. Did you shoot this from a bees. What is

[Adam Molina]

this? Because it sounds like the sound is coming out of a really skinny tube. That's what I was trying

[Andrew]

to. I was just saying I can't

[David]

wait for the new merge berge. The. The area under the curve of people that really like. Like ass is high as it

[Marques Brownlee]

is. In fact, that should be a

[Andrew]

shit. I'm not gonna understand what you

[Adam Molina]

just said because it's getting bleeped entirely. I'm gonna leave

[Marques Brownlee]

whole. So people vote all of the most. But you're right. Every category, all the most mid products in the middle are all fighting each other. And then the just like thoughtless product on each end is probably the one most people should

[David]

get.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. And that's fine because you don't want to think about

[Ellis River]

it. Yes. Ellis is just saying though, that thoughtless product on each end should be the nothing

[Andrew]

headphones. No Carl pay will clip

[Adam Molina]

that. I'm saying, I'm saying, I'm saying Carl, you know I got on. I got over there right where Andrew's sitting and did not give you a fair

[Andrew]

shot.

[Adam Molina]

And. And I apologize. And I. And I have

[David]

sense. I still think they sound very

[Adam Molina]

good. But. But it's an. It's a

[David]

great.

[Adam Molina]

It. It fits in to the product lineup really well at a competitive price with competitive offerings. I don't know about all that. You gotta use the app

[David]

stuff. But the new nothing headphones a. It looks like you have a pair of AirPods that are glued to the side of a

[Andrew]

square. It would be sick if you could pull a pair of earbuds out of

[David]

that. That would be cool. That's what they look

[Marques Brownlee]

like. Except they're dog. All this to say we should get these here. We should listen to them. We should put them on Ellis's head and have him live react to

[David]

them. Yes. Should see if we can get 135 hours of

[Andrew]

listening. Yeah, I want to try them because I want to see how often people stare at me with them and then just take them off and don't want to be the person being stared at

[David]

anymore. Yeah, they're $100 cheaper. I don't know if we said

[Andrew]

that. Yeah, 200 bucks somewhere in. In there. We did mention it, but yeah, probably got

[David]

lost. All

[Marques Brownlee]

right. All right. Well, we do have a little bit more to talk about after the break. So before that break, trivia feel

[David]

like Nothing's Nothing's design team simultaneously cooked and like, like got

[Ellis River]

cooked. Okay, question two. Speaking of nothing, the first video ever uploaded to nothing's YouTube channel was uploaded when? Close this without going

[Andrew]

over. Wasn't it just like a

[David]

prank? It was a hype

[Andrew]

video. Yeah, it's definitely a like a ladybug and a

[David]

prank. It was like eight to 12 months before they launched their first

[Andrew]

product.

[Ellis River]

What? It was irrelevant when it was

[David]

relevant. Is this closest delta or

[Ellis River]

closest? No, closest without going

[Marques Brownlee]

over. We'll brainstorm that a little bit. We'll be right back. It's crunch time at work and you need to bring wings to your workday. Visit redbull.com gettingitdone and answer a couple questions about your work style to get a Spotify customized playlist tuned to your productivity. Plus, score a can of Red Bull on us while you go from to do to done. And remember, Red Bull gives you wings. Supplies are limited. Terms apply. Visit the website for more information. Your little one grew three inches

[Adam Molina]

overnight.

[Marques Brownlee]

Adorable. Also

[Andrew]

expensive. Sell their pint sized pieces on

[Adam Molina]

Depop and list them in minutes with

[Andrew]

no selling fees because somewhere a dad

[David]

refuses to pay full price for the

[Marques Brownlee]

clothes his kids will outgrow

[Andrew]

tomorrow. And he's ready to buy your

[David]

son's entire wardrobe right

[Adam Molina]

now. Consider your future growth Bird budget

[David]

secured. Start selling on Depop where taste recognizes

[Andrew]

taste. Payment processing fees and boosting fees still

[Adam Molina]

apply. See website for details. On December 12, Disney invites you

[Marques Brownlee]

to go behind the scenes with Taylor

[Adam Molina]

Swift in an exclusive, exclusive six episode docu

[David]

series. I wanted to give something to

[Marques Brownlee]

the fans that they didn't

[Andrew]

expect. The only thing left is to close the

[Adam Molina]

book. The end of an era. And don't miss Taylor Swift. The Eras Tour, the final show featuring for the first time the Tortured poets department. Streaming December 12th only on

[Andrew]

Disney. All right, welcome back. Really quick here because we spent a really long time talking about bees

[David]

there. I got

[Marques Brownlee]

bees.

[Andrew]

Yeah. We've talked multiple times about how like AI overviews and whatever are going to really screw up page views and journalists getting paid and reviewers getting paid. And we saw that happen this week with the Website ratings or RTings is how it's spelled out. But they had to kind of make a huge change to their website. They're, they're known for doing super in depth reviews on a lot of things. Tech included one of the

[Adam Molina]

largest. But like so in depth that when you're shopping for a printer, you can compare printers by cost, cost per page, or like pages per hour or cost per hour at max flow, you know, like, yeah, like they're the

[Andrew]

ones. Yeah, it's deep and it's like they're doing it with different equipment on a lot of different things to be able to test these. So that obviously costs money. But previously it was free and now they had to make a pretty large change to make the full in depth reviews of everything behind a paywall. Uh, it is now $10 a month or $45 a year. But the most interesting thing about this announcement was an a a section of their release saying why we're making this change. It says ratings.com has historically relied heavily on organic search traffic from Google and affiliate links. That model is becoming less reliable. Fewer people click through Google organic results than they used to. At the same time, AI actively scrapes and reuses our test results, often without attri attribution and without the context needed to interpret them correctly. That's like a huge thing by itself. Interpreting things

[David]

correctly.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Meanwhile, performing lab based and in depth testing is expensive. We buy every product ourselves like normal consumers, no paid or sponsored reviews, test them using standardized, repeatable methods and publish the full test results transparently. A membership supported model reduces our dependency on Google, limits unrestricted AI scraping for our test results and gives us incentives that are more sustainable and aligned with our customers. So this sucks, but is necessary, I guess is the easiest way of putting it. It stinks for all the people who want to just go to their website and support them. But also like, I don't know, not many people are gonna pay $10 to just go for a month or pay 45 a year for a reviewing website because you don't buy things that often. Lots of times you're just like in the pinch of comparing things and want to go check

[David]

it.

[Andrew]

Yeah. So this is a tough

[David]

look. This is part of the inevitable death of SEO and the web. I mean every website for the longest time Adam and I used to work at Android Authority and we were privy to a lot of the SEO bullshit that the people would have to talk about all the time. And it, it basically equated to Google makes all of these changes constantly that you have to adapt to. Oftentimes when you're adapting to it, making these changes makes your website worse. But if you don't, then Google will derank your website because you are optimizing the way that you show up in Google search and with the speed of which this stuff is changing, especially with AI overviews and all of this stuff. Now you have the additional factor of having to like adapt to what the AI overview shows, if it chooses your website to show in the AI overview, if it chooses you to show in Gemini, when Gemini gives, gives sources and stuff like that. And I mean, there's a reason a lot of websites are moving to paid. The Verge moved to paid about a year ago. That was a pretty major change. It made their web traffic traffic really sink a lot. But they are making a lot more money on subscriptions. I just think the entire Internet is moving more towards direct to creator payments because SEO is just kind of dying very

[Marques Brownlee]

rapidly. So I think I'm like thinking out loud here. This, I think this is my real beef with AI overviews. I know Ellis, like it's the accuracy and there's a bunch of other things that are wrong about it. But I think it's because it so fundamentally removes the incentives to make good

[David]

stuff.

[Marques Brownlee]

Right. So before and the ratings video kind of illustrates this perfectly. But like when you make good stuff and you optimize for people to find that good stuff, Google and all the search engines, when people are in the buying process, will funnel. You will funnel those people to find your stuff. And so you make this stuff because people find it and you get paid from the ads and the cycle continues. So you're incentivized to make good stuff so that more people find it. Now you make good stuff, that stuff gets scraped by AI overview. And when people start to go through that buying process, they find the AI overview and they never find your stuff. So the only incentive you have to make good stuff is to be the source for the AI overview to be good. And you don't get any credit for that and you don't get paid for that. So the incentive is effectively gone. Yeah, so, so think about that. The incentive to make good stuff is gone now. Why would you make any more stuff? It's almost like we've decided all Right. The entire corpus of human knowledge is complete. We need nothing more to be new. We will just be trained on the old stuff. That's a

[David]

bummer. This is a concern that we talked about at the very beginning of this. We literally said what happens when there is no incentive to go to a website because the answers are all on Google. And like, why would you make content if people are not going to go to your page and you can't get paid for it and then the AI has nothing to grab from like that? That is the question that we asked three years ago. And now it's actually hitting websites really

[Marques Brownlee]

hard. Yeah. So we're seeing like the Verge and Ratings and like adding membership programs because there are still enthusiasts willing to support the creation of good stuff. And, you know, the membership program is maybe the most ideal way to do that. I subscribe to the Verge. I read a lot of these things, but it's often like, like Wirecutter, for example, I brought up earlier or off camera. But like, when I am about to buy a blender and I'm doing my six hours of way too much research to buy the perfect blender, that's when I'm deep in the ratings and the Wirecutter and the Verge and reading blender

[David]

reviews.

[Marques Brownlee]

Yeah. And then once that's over, I'm not going to read another blender review for years. That stuff. I'm not going to do that. So it's hard to get people to support and to, you know, spend regularly on something thing when it seems like there's. The incentive is

[Andrew]

gone. This is specifically hard because I don't think a lot of people are. Yeah. Reading ratings for fun. Like, we don't. We are part entertainment. Right. So like, people see our reviews, but we're also entertainment, so that's not getting hit as hard. But like, this kind of stuff that is just like numbers and what prints per minute or Marques's smoothies per hour in his blender. Like, this is not the stuff you read for fun. This is the stuff you read for a purpose. And when you don't have that purpose, it's really hard to pay monthly or yearly on it. Even

[Marques Brownlee]

though.

[Andrew]

Yeah. I don't know, if you were like buying a new house and equipping it for the next year, maybe 45 bucks for the year wouldn't be bad. But that's not a great business model to be, like, cool. Every time someone buys a house, we'll get one year of a subscription. So this, I feel bad for ratings. This is for sure, absolutely. Probably

[David]

tanking. It's very tough for stuff like this. There's, there's an interesting graph and also a chart as market like to call

[Marques Brownlee]

out.

[David]

Yes. That shows the decline of peak traffic on tech websites year over year. And it's, it's pretty nasty. Like all of these numbers are really

[Marques Brownlee]

high. It's not that only a one

[Andrew]

year graph to 2024 yet to now I

[David]

guess. Yeah, year and a half. So March 2024, digital trends got 8.5 million peak traffic. January 26th they got 264,000. That's a decline of

[Marques Brownlee]

97%. That was a rounding error in their previous number. Now it's. Their entire traffic is

[Ellis River]

crazy. Yeah, I mean this is gonna decimate websites on the Internet because the same way that Facebook video when it decided to not be a thing anymore like ruined buzzfeed.

[Marques Brownlee]

Basically.

[Ellis River]

Yeah. This is what Google SEO is doing to all the Internets that have built businesses being the source of

[David]

information. Well what's crazy is like I think a lot of these websites like, well services like Google, they, they just sort of think social media is free information. And I think in their head if you take the average of all information about one topic, you get closer to a source of

[Marques Brownlee]

truth.

[David]

Right. Because there's signal to noise. Hopefully you have more signal than you have noise. And if you take a billion sources, hopefully you have the right data. And I think all of these services and websites are just kind of like why do we have to pay websites when you know we could. Social media is free like quote unquote journalism or information and you can just theoretically get closer to a source of truth. But that really just, it destroys the Internet as we know it currently. So it's not

[Ellis River]

good. We talk doesn't give good information for the most part. Yeah, I mean there's a reason why there are certain trusted sources because they have processes in place that will take away the

[David]

noise. I agree with you but I think that they just think that on a, on a numbers basis basis if you have 1 billion people talking about a thing, the average is always higher to truth. That that's exactly what poly markets like, you know, all of these guys, they say like oh, we can predict what's going to happen because people are putting their money towards this thing because they, this many people think it'll happen and that means it will probably happen. I don't know if that's true or not. There's a zillion problems with that. But either way the average number

[Marques Brownlee]

of arms per he human is less than 2. That's taking all the data about all humans ever. The average number of arms. Just saying sometimes that logic can be

[Andrew]

flawed. It's. I just don't think that was a fire example. They don't all just think hard enough about stuff like this because they just want to get their

[Ellis River]

product. I disagree. I think they

[Andrew]

know. I think they don't

[Marques Brownlee]

know. Dude,

[Andrew]

Google. I think at a certain point though this is going to screw themselves. When AI their. I can't scrape things anymore because no one's making. No one can get paid to make

[David]

the. Everyone is making stuff all the time for free on social media, I

[Andrew]

guess. But now that that level of what we get is worse and

[David]

then. Oh

[Andrew]

yeah. And then it just all turns into nothing. When the free stuff is. That's being made is. Doesn't mean

[Ellis River]

anything. Nothing was the last segment where our

[Andrew]

king. We've talked. I just remember we talked to somebody who made an AI product. I won't name them but we brought this up to him and he said, I don't think you guys should have any worries. You make really good stuff. And I was like, I'm not talking about

[David]

us.

[Andrew]

Yeah. I'm talking about like these people, the people who are doing the in depth web text based reviews and like that. And it felt like he'd never heard that before. Yeah, it's gone. It's. This stuff is going to be

[Marques Brownlee]

gone.

[David]

This. Yeah, this feels similar. I went to Clockcon last

[Marques Brownlee]

night.

[David]

Who? You know Clodbot. We talked about

[Adam Molina]

claudebot. Open

[David]

Claw. Open Claw, Sorry, you remember Open Claw. We talked about Open Claw. I went

[Ellis River]

to. Is that the one where everyone dresses up as Santa and like goes around the

[Andrew]

city? I thought that was somehow

[David]

worse. Somehow worse. Everybody did have lobster hats

[Marques Brownlee]

on.

[David]

Okay. But the people I talked to primarily were like, oh yeah, well you can just like create your own apps

[Marques Brownlee]

and blah blah blah and

[David]

everything. And I was like, okay, but what happens when all the server people don't need to use any services anymore because they can just spin up their own services. Services. And they're like, well that's fine. It's like, okay, but then how do people make money? Like, well, you can sell your apps that you make. And I'm like, but no one will buy it because they can all make people get money so they can pay for housing and food. Those are the primary things. I think you're forgetting that people

[Marques Brownlee]

need.

[David]

Yeah. How similar to

[Andrew]

this. How often did you run into that the like meme of like, you should try Open Claw. It's

[Marques Brownlee]

awesome.

[Andrew]

Cool. What do you do? It's really cool. I use it every day. Oh yeah, but what do you mean thinking you're gonna get

[David]

behind. That's exactly why I went to the conference and I did find some pretty insane use cases that people were using for. I did have to actually talk to people because the actual event where they talked about everything that was going on, they had a bunch of speakers. All of them were just open claw rappers to try to sell you like an easier way to use it, which is very

[Marques Brownlee]

ironic.

[David]

Yeah. And they also did have a rapper there. They did have a rapper. It was very Silicon Valley, I tell you. Anyway, there were some use cases. Either way, I'm sort of just equating that to this because it's like I understand the revenue generation angle, but you're not thinking far enough into the future where it's like, why would people buy, use your service and buy your thing if you're taking away, if you're giving everyone the ability to have the service and the

[Marques Brownlee]

thing.

[David]

Yeah. You know what I mean? Mean, I don't know. Democratization in a way is like good, but also

[Adam Molina]

bad. Sometimes we, this is not, I guess it's sort of a unique situation. But I, I do have sort of like faith that God forbid, like we do lose things like ratings and the Verge and like these places that do give these like really important honest reviews. Tom Guide Mashable, that the pendulum will swing back in the other direction. I'm mostly thinking about Consumer Reports, which I think is a little bit more safe because they're a nonprofit and they get a lot of money through donations. And a big part of the founding of Consumer Reports in the late 20s, early 30s was this period of time where corporations could just were literally killing people with their products and there was not really any like consumer protection ability. And I'm not saying like we're going to go all the way back there where like you don't know if you're the product, if you, that this blender you're going to buy is going to end your life or not. But I, you know, we, we could get close to back there and, and it'll necessitate like we'll need some way to

[David]

know. I think Google would probably say enough people are truthful, but I

[Adam Molina]

don't. But they're not. Well, no, no, I'm saying what,

[David]

I'm saying what Google would say like

[Adam Molina]

if, you know, God forbid. Did you guys watch the Hank Green video the hour

[David]

long. Yeah, I

[Adam Molina]

did. Like the Thing that he said about how like there's a world where we, we lose access to like all of Google and all of, and all of our information is gained through some sort of like LLM interface. And at that point there's literally no way to know what's true because you'll have three sources of truth, you know, anthropic, OpenAI and Google. And whatever they want you to believe there's. You'll have literally no way to fact check it, you know, so when you're like, is this the best blender? You know, Google will decide what the best blender is and tell you

[David]

that and OpenAI will serve you an

[Adam Molina]

ad. Yeah, there was like a period of time, remember where like auto car companies were genuinely telling consumers like your car will be worse with seat belts in it. Like, remember like that was like, like we've been there before. There's nothing stopping us from going back there and stuff. I do have faith that eventually this is just the thing that we need in a developed society and somehow, some way we as a populace will hopefully figure it

[David]

out. People still do value quality. And this has been sort of the ultimate debate that people have been talking about. Like with AI slop, will that actually make quality more valuable and people will gravitate towards the quality? We don't really know yet. We're till too early in the stage. I think that obviously people will go towards the lowest friction generally, so there will be a lot of slop that will be consumed. But the big question is will people also seek out the quality stuff which will still find a way to exist? Either way, it seems like most of these websites really are going to start moving towards subscription models. I see the value in the Verge moving towards a subscription model. I think a lot of people like to read news is like the money maker for them. I don't know how Arting or Ratings has a subscription model and uses that to

[Adam Molina]

exist. Do you know how farm co ops work? I feel like this is the, this is how we should figure this out. We're like, like let's say I'm not a farmer, so please let me know if I get some of this wrong. But my understanding is like, if you live in like South Dakota, right, and you live in this place where like there's a bunch of independent farmers and you all grow corn, you know, you could try to set up business deals with corn distributors and people are going to use your corn or, or you could establish a co op and all the farmers drop their corn off at this mutually Owned place. And then the co op is the one that handles selling all the corn. And you just get paid off, you know, with the co op consortium decides on how much they're going to sell the corn for, and then you divide the things. That'd be a cool way to do these sort of reviews, right? Is like you have like one place, you go for all of these sites. Independent testing, you know, and you pay for that. That collectively we all pay for that. And then that money can get

[David]

distributed. There was a cool service that Twitter owned before it got

[Adam Molina]

bought.

[David]

Vine. No. Well, I don't. I would. I don't know if that was cool or not. It created. It created the Paul brothers. Regardless of that, they had this service where you could pay like a $5

[Adam Molina]

fee.

[David]

Yeah. And it would allow you to. If you clicked a link on Twitter for a website that had a paywall, it would let you, like, read it without the paywall or, like, it would remove all the banner ads or whatever. And it was a super cool idea. And I don't know if it was working or not. They had this scalable thing where it was like, the more websites that got on, the more it would distribute the money. So obviously, the more websites, the less

[Adam Molina]

money. Apple News is another

[David]

great. Yeah, Apple News is a good example of that

[Adam Molina]

too. I don't know if either of those services took advantage of these platforms, but to me, like, instead of being like, like, like with Marquez, it's like, dude, I don't. I don't need to pay for blender honesty 24 7, you know? But if I, I do need to pay for product honesty 24 7. And so if there was some sort of consortium

[David]

here. Yeah. Yeah. It's sad that we have to start thinking about these things. Like, this is what Sam Altman's always being like is like, in a world without money, how do we give people UBI or whatever? It's like, I don't like to do. Why are you forcing this world on us right now? Yeah, it's sad. Anyway, you should subscribe to. I. You should subscribe to news that you care about and websites that you care about. I think that's kind of the crux of it. If you're willing to subscribe to, like, Netflix or HBO Max, like, think about your con, like the. The quality of your content consumption and what actually matters to you in your regular life. And it's important to give news

[Adam Molina]

sources. We were a few days away from those being the same company we were. And yet something worse

[David]

happened. Oracle is Now Oracle's

[Adam Molina]

son.

[David]

Dad. Yeah, Sun.

[Andrew]

Dad. I'll throw one more sad thing in here in the sad part of

[Adam Molina]

this. Let's get

[Andrew]

it. But if you own meta Ray Bans, you should probably read the article that just came out about them and the video camera on it. We definitely don't have time to talk about it. In fact, the ratings thing I thought was going to be the least depressing thing we could have talked about. Definitely. Well, not

[David]

true.

[Andrew]

Yeah. But, yeah, if you have these, go read them. Maybe we'll talk about it next

[Adam Molina]

week. But you probably cover the cameras. Yeah,

[Andrew]

yeah. But we probably should get to trivia, because Adam and Ellis need to edit this very fast to come out by tomorrow. You need a marker.

[David]

Privy. Yeah, dude, I've got a

[Adam Molina]

marker. When the. When the death bots come for us, I'm going to do a trivia question. Like the band on the Titanic going down with the ship. That's going to be. That's going to be my final gift to humanity. Guys, the MacBook Neo is here. None of us knew it was coming until it came. And, you know. So how many other tech products can you guys name with the word Neo in it? You get one point per product. You guys got mad at me because I made the questions too hard and you weren't scoring. So this is literally a waterfall of points available for you guys. You could literally bathe in the points.

[Andrew]

Just. I only have one dude, and I'm gonna

[Adam Molina]

be. So that doesn't matter. I'm gonna be really lenient. Hardware software. If it uses electricity in any way and it has the letters N E O consecutively in it, I will be

[Marques Brownlee]

fine. Oh, my

[Andrew]

God. How many did you guys get? You guys were running pretty good. You definitely don't have the same thing I

[David]

have. All right, wanna

[Ellis River]

bet? Flip them and read. What do you

[Marques Brownlee]

got?

[Adam Molina]

Okay. All right, who wants to go first? Who wants to go

[Marques Brownlee]

first? First I'll go. I wrote

[Adam Molina]

Neopets. I'll accept that

[Andrew]

answer. I

[David]

wrote. I didn't think about

[Andrew]

that. The nothing. Headphone 1. N E, O, N, E. Dude,

[Adam Molina]

you know, at this point, whatever, it's yours,

[Marques Brownlee]

bro. Clever enough to deserve the

[David]

points. I wrote four

[Adam Molina]

things. Let's see

[David]

it. I wrote the surface

[Adam Molina]

Neo. The point's

[David]

yours. Thank

[Adam Molina]

you.

[David]

Great. All right, I put a Neo. That, like, phone company, ao, Neo, or whatever it

[Adam Molina]

is. A Y, A N, E, O Neo. They make portable gaming

[David]

consoles. Yeah, yeah,

[Adam Molina]

yeah. Okay. I'll give you that point, even though you spelled it

[David]

wrong. Neo win, which is the tech

[Marques Brownlee]

website. Oh, yep, that

[Adam Molina]

exists. You get

[David]

it? And neon, if you can tell

[Marques Brownlee]

me. If you can tell me

[Adam Molina]

what. No, it's a noble

[David]

gas. Yeah, it's a noble

[Adam Molina]

gas. No, I can't give you

[David]

what. God, they're gonna me.

[Adam Molina]

Really? It's a beautiful

[Ellis River]

gas. If you could tell me how many electrons are in its outer shell, I'll give you that point 47.

[David]

No. A need.

[Adam Molina]

No. Guys, do you want to hear some of the ones that you

[David]

missed?

[Adam Molina]

Sure. You missed the One X Neo robot that's coming out soon. You missed the LG Neo Chef, a microwave. The Samsung Neo, which is a QLED

[Marques Brownlee]

TV. I should have just written Samsung

[Andrew]

Neo. LG Neo, Samsung

[Adam Molina]

Neo. The DJI Neo, a pocket sized drone. The Realme GT Neo a budget phone or no smartphone. The Motorola Edge 5G Neo. That's a budget phone. The old Kyocera Neo, a flip phone. The Nubia Neo, a budget smartphone. The Xperia Neo from 2011, and the Vivo IQ Neo Neo

[Andrew]

10R. The Vivo

[Marques Brownlee]

Neo.

[Andrew]

Wow. I like

[David]

it. All right. So not neon, though. You're

[Ellis River]

sure? David, if you can tell me how many electrons are in its outer shell, I need to know that point. Because Ellis said it's a noble

[David]

gas. It is a noble gas, which means it has less than

[Ellis River]

10. Yeah, it does, but I'm not giving you that

[Adam Molina]

point. Anyway, if you can tell me what neon smells like, I'll give you the

[David]

point. Ooh,

[Adam Molina]

sulfur. No, it's

[Andrew]

odorless. Damn, that was

[Ellis River]

good. You had two chances. All right, Marquez gets 16 points. Well, he doesn't

[Marques Brownlee]

get. He has 16

[Ellis River]

points. Andrew with 18 and David now in the lead with 20. That was a free for all, baby. All right, next question. The first video ever uploaded to the Nothing YouTube channel was uploaded on what date closest without going over. Okay, Use your

[Marques Brownlee]

maths. Think,

[Adam Molina]

think. I guess this would be oldest without going

[Andrew]

newer. Wait,

[Adam Molina]

sorry. Right

[Andrew]

month. Just

[David]

year. I'll take

[Ellis River]

anything. Yeah, I'll just year all of

[Marques Brownlee]

it. Yeah, like pick a

[David]

date. All

[Ellis River]

right. All right. Flip them and read what do

[Andrew]

got? We

[Marques Brownlee]

got. Oh,

[Ellis River]

wow. Mark

[Marques Brownlee]

Heswin. So excellent. Mark

[Andrew]

Heswin. No, I definitely wrote down

[Marques Brownlee]

incorrectly. I wrote June 8, 2021 at 5:55am London

[Andrew]

time. Okay, Andrew, you did not write London. What I meant. I wrote March

[Marques Brownlee]

2023.

[David]

Okay. I wrote March 1,

[Ellis River]

2021. Damn. No one got the

[Marques Brownlee]

point. We all

[Ellis River]

went. You're all too

[Andrew]

new. It's funny. I accidentally wrote 2020 and then put three over it without have

[Ellis River]

been. Okay, it was February 18th, 2021. Oh,

[Marques Brownlee]

yeah. That was

[David]

close. Yeah, I was

[Ellis River]

close. I know you guys got close, but you went

[David]

over. Yeah, because it's, like, one day off. I started here February 1, 2021, and I remember it being soon after I started, but I didn't know it was, like, within

[Marques Brownlee]

two. Yeah. Well, good game,

[Ellis River]

gtam. All right, take us out, Marquez, so Ellis and I could start this at

[David]

it.

[Marques Brownlee]

Dang. Hey. Long week. It's tech timber slash march, which means there's probably gonna be a bunch of stuff next week, too. So get subscribed if you haven't already. Hit that, like, button down below. Leave us a comment and comment. Iceberg lettuce. If you made it this far in the

[David]

episode.

[Marques Brownlee]

Nice. Thanks for watching. Catch you later. Also, if you're at south by

[David]

Southwest, see you there next

[Adam Molina]

Friday. Merry

[Andrew]

Tart. Much Miss Peace Way from is produced by Adam Molina and Ellis River. We're partnered with Vox Media podcast network, and our trash music was created by Vane

[Marques Brownlee]

Sil.

[David]

Bingo. Bingo. Should we, Like, not a

[Marques Brownlee]

graph? It's a

[David]

chart. Okay. A chart is a moving

[Marques Brownlee]

graph. I would like to see a

[David]

graph. There's a graph near the