We Can Do Hard Things with Cynthia Erivo — Wicked, Wild & Wise — is here!!!

Podcast: We Can Do Hard Things
Hosts: Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, Amanda Doyle
Guest: Cynthia Erivo
Date: November 18, 2025

Episode Overview

In this heartfelt and revealing episode, the Pod Squad welcomes Cynthia Erivo—Grammy, Emmy, and Tony Award-winning actress, singer, and producer. Cynthia opens up about her creative process, the release of "Wicked Part 2," and her new book, "Simply More." The hosts and Cynthia explore themes of self-respect, trust, vulnerability, personal boundaries, belonging, and the necessity of being “too much.” Their conversation is filled with laughter, raw emotion, and actionable wisdom for braving life’s challenges while staying true to yourself.

Major Discussion Points & Insights

Setting the Tone: Self-Respect & Daily Rituals

Matching Pajamas & Self-Respect

• Cynthia has a “through line” of fashion in her life, even when going to bed ([02:42]).
• “If I feel really good before bed, I know the evening just feels better. So I have like matching pajamas and sometimes it’s like loungewear... there’s always an outfit. There might be a robe... there’s always a slipper that matches.” — Cynthia ([02:42])
• For her, bedtime rituals signify returning to herself and setting personal boundaries at the end of the day ([04:09]).
• The idea: Every day is important, because she's spending it with herself ([06:16]).

Vulnerability & Honesty in Writing

• Cynthia’s new book, "Simply More," is described as “very honest” and unexpectedly raw ([06:43]).
  • “I haven’t really, like, held anything back necessarily... as I started, as the words came out... it just became really raw and honest.” — Cynthia ([06:43])
• She shares lessons learned about the world and herself in her journey.

Companionship and Animal Connection

• Talks about her dogs, Gigi and Caleb, and their pivotal role during tough times ([07:46]–[09:03]).
  • “On days when I’ve been alone and I felt very lonely, these two little spirits have been very, very helpful.” — Cynthia ([09:03])
• Discusses how stillness and simply being are what pets cherish most ([09:31]).

Trust, Friendship, and Boundaries

• Cynthia reflects on building a support system before fame struck. She keeps friends who are candid and grounding ([10:51]).
• On trust: “It’s a feeling... Sometimes I’m not necessarily in the place to trust anyone... People reveal themselves unknowingly.” — Cynthia ([12:21])

Wicked, Storytelling, and Cultural Resonance

• Hosts and Cynthia discuss the global influence of Wicked, especially the symbolism in Elphaba and Glinda’s relationship ([13:01]).
  • Cynthia manages the “immensity” of the role by engaging with individual fan stories over the broader phenomenon ([13:51]).
  • Glennon shares her interpretation of Wicked through a lens of patriarchy and societal power ([15:22]).
  • Cynthia’s take: Different people see the story in radically different ways, and journeys toward awareness or action can be staggered among friends ([16:38]):
    “Sometimes it takes a long time for a person to go, ‘Actually, I think it’s time for me to get on the broom.’"

The Power of Asking for Help and Unlearning Independence

Cynthia’s Relationship with Her Father

• Shares a formative story about her father's absence and how it fueled a sense of needing to prove herself and avoid asking for help ([22:20]).

  • “I was trying to prove that I was worthy of being loved... but that doesn’t sustain.” — Cynthia ([25:21])
  • Years later, therapy helped her unpick this thread and become more open to trusting and accepting support ([25:21]–[28:30]).

• Links this experience to how she understands the Elphaba/Glinda dynamic—recognizing when separations are about individual journeys rather than betrayals ([28:30]).

Authenticity & Being Seen

Revealing Self, On and Off Stage

• Commitment to authenticity: “I never want to feel invisible again. I never wanted to walk into a room and have someone see somebody else.” — Cynthia ([29:57])
• Even in auditions and public appearances, she refuses to hide behind props or makeup, wanting to be truly seen ([28:57], [31:46]).
• This approach carries into relationships: she forms genuine, deep connections rather than using surface-level affection ([33:51]).

The Challenge of "Too Muchness" and Asking “Why”

• Cynthia often asks “why” in professional and personal settings, which can unsettle people ([34:31]).
  • “I ask ‘why’ a lot. I question things. And I think people aren’t used to a person going, ‘Why? I don’t understand. Can you explain that to me?’” — Cynthia ([34:31])
• This tendency is part of her “too muchness,” and she urges the pursuit of knowledge—even about one’s own motivations.
  • “The too muchness is how I show up in my body, the way I dress, the way I do my nails—all of those things” ([38:27]).
  • “I dress for me... There are no clothes that I save for going out... They're all special. I wear them all the time.” — Cynthia ([39:43])

Acting, Truth, and Technique

• Cynthia rejects method acting, considering it potentially harmful—especially for women ([42:42]).
  • “To act is actually to tell the truth. ...I don’t believe in method acting because I think it’s dangerous. And I actually think that really only men can do it.” ([42:42])
• Talks about using her own experiences and emotions, rather than “staying in character,” especially when roles involve trauma ([43:03]–[44:38]).

Courage and Transformation: Playing Jesus

• Discusses the daunting task and inner transformation involved in portraying Jesus in "Jesus Christ Superstar" ([45:24]).
  • “I was terrified immediately… And that is the reason I said ‘okay, fine, let’s do it.’ Because I knew I would have to learn something about myself.” — Cynthia ([45:34])
• Describes the energy of performing and her spiritual approach: “You’re the vessel, so the characters come through you, and you make the room for them. You sort of sit yourself to the back.” ([51:04])

Reflections on Limitations Others Place on Us

• Cynthia’s response to criticism that a woman shouldn’t play Jesus is one of compassion:
  • “When other women put those kinds of limitations on other women, I don’t think it’s really about the other woman... They have so little to give.” ([52:28]–[53:22])
• Sees her life (and her pajamas ritual!) as a boundary—reminding herself and others that there’s a human being underneath the public persona ([54:06]).

Personal Anecdotes & Memorable Moments

• Glennon’s story of social anxiety at Sarah Paulson’s birthday party, where she dressed as Elphaba and “dove behind Abby” after seeing Cynthia ([55:21]).
  • Cynthia: “I wish I would have given you the biggest hug in the world. Oh my gosh.” ([56:11])

Notable Quotes by Cynthia Erivo (with Timestamps)

• “If I feel really good before bed, I know the evening just feels better... It’s a way of recentering, I think, making a decision that’s just for me.” (03:13)
• “It's very honest. I haven't really, like, held anything back necessarily... it just became really raw and honest.” (06:43)
• “On days when I’ve been alone and I felt very lonely, these two little spirits have been very, very helpful.” (09:03)
• “I think if everything was to have happened now, it would be really difficult... but those who are with me on the journey are still with me on the journey.” (10:51)
• “Sometimes it takes a long time for a person to go, ‘Actually, I think it’s time for me to get on the broom.’... We don’t always reach the same place at the same time.” (16:38)
• “I was trying to prove that I was worthy of being loved... but that doesn’t sustain.” (25:21)
• “I never wanted to feel invisible again. That meant in any way, shape, or form.” (29:57)
• “I ask ‘why’ a lot. I question things... but I actually genuinely am okay with not knowing the answer.” (34:31)
• “Too muchness is how I show up in my body, the way I dress, the way I do my nails—all of those things.” (38:27)
• “To act is actually to tell the truth... I don’t believe in method acting because I think it’s dangerous.” (42:42)
• “When other women put those kinds of limitations on other women, I don’t think it’s really about the other woman... They have so little to give.” (52:28)
• "I wrote this as a gift. I kept saying, I really want this to be a gift for people." (59:00)

Key Timestamps for Segments

• Self-Respect, Bedtime Rituals: 02:42–06:16
• Book Honesty & Vulnerability: 06:43–08:14
• Supporting Animals: 07:46–09:31
• Trust & Friendship: 10:51–12:21
• Wicked’s Impact: 13:01–18:18
• Father, Independence, & Asking for Help: 22:20–29:08
• Being Seen, Drama School Story: 29:08–31:46
• Authenticity in Life & Performance: 31:46–34:26
• The Challenge of Asking “Why”: 34:31–39:43
• Too Muchness & Owning Self: 38:27–40:50
• On Acting & Truth: 42:42–45:20
• Playing Jesus, Identity & Faith: 45:24–52:04
• Women’s Limitations & Kindness: 52:28–54:06
• Cynthia/Elphaba at a Party — Fun Moment: 55:21–56:11
• Book as an Offering: 59:00

Episode Takeaway

Cynthia Erivo’s presence offers the ultimate permission to be both “too much” and entirely oneself. Through stories of heartbreak, triumph, and daily ritual, she reaffirms that self-respect, truth telling, and even the smallest acts of honoring yourself are revolutionary. This conversation is, in her words, an offering—a reminder that from the dark, we can always bring light.