Double Date with Megan Rapinoe & Sue Bird! (Best Of)

Summary

We Can Do Hard Things: Double Date with Megan Rapinoe & Sue Bird! (Best Of)
Release Date: January 15, 2025
Hosts: Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, and Amanda Doyle
Guests: Megan Rapinoe & Sue Bird

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Introduction

In this special "Best Of" episode of We Can Do Hard Things, hosts Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, and Amanda Doyle invite two of the most influential female athletes, Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird, for a heartfelt and candid double date discussion. The episode delves deep into their personal friendships, professional journeys, social activism, and the challenges they face as aging athletes.

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Friendship Dynamics

Abby Wambach sets the stage by introducing the concept of a double date podcast where genuine friendships are explored without the usual pretenses. She states, “Our first double date. And we can do hard things” (04:05).

Amanda Doyle shares her excitement and nervousness about the double date, emphasizing the authenticity they aim to bring to the conversation.

Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird express their initial reactions, highlighting the casual and supportive nature of their friendship. Megan recalls their first meeting at an Olympic event, mentioning how they were “introduced” by their agent and quickly formed a platonic bond (05:00).

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Experiences During the Olympics

The conversation shifts to their Olympic experiences, with Megan recounting the challenges they faced, including logistical issues like staying on a cruise ship due to booking constraints. Sue reflects on the different Olympic experiences they've had, noting the contrast between relaxed environments and the intense pressure athletes face (17:06).

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Social Justice Activism

Megan elaborates on the WNBA's role in social justice, particularly during the summer of 2016. She credits the league's collective action in response to tragic events in Minnesota as a pivotal moment that influenced broader movements like Black Lives Matter (26:50). Sue adds that the collective power of the WNBA teams was instrumental in amplifying their voices and causes.

Abby Wambach probes into how these actions influenced Megan and Sue's activism, with Megan acknowledging the significant impact the WNBA had on her awareness and involvement in social justice issues (24:48).

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Aging and Retirement as Athletes

A substantial portion of the discussion focuses on the realities of aging in professional sports. Sue Bird, at 41, shares her strategies for maintaining peak physical condition, such as altering her workout regimen and hiring specialized trainers to extend her athletic career (12:25).

Megan Rapinoe discusses the emotional and physical toll of aging in sports, expressing concerns about balancing current performance with future financial security. She grapples with the identity crisis that accompanies retirement, questioning, “Who are you without this?” (65:57).

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Relationship Dynamics and Boundaries

The hosts and guests explore the intricacies of maintaining strong friendships amidst demanding careers. They discuss common conflicts, such as interruptions during Zoom calls, and the importance of setting boundaries to ensure supportive interactions without exacerbating stress (36:32).

Abby Wambach humorously admits her challenge in keeping her volume down, while Sue Bird appreciates Megan’s ability to hear and process her concerns effectively (39:10).

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Balancing Personal and Professional Lives

Sue Bird and Megan Rapinoe highlight the difficulty of maintaining friendships outside their professional spheres. Sue laments the distance from her WNBA teammates and the deep, yet geographically scattered, relationships formed during their careers (60:15). Megan echoes this sentiment, emphasizing the scarcity of time to nurture existing friendships or form new ones due to their busy schedules (60:30).

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Conflict Resolution and Boundaries

The duo candidly discusses how they handle disagreements. Megan emphasizes the importance of honesty and transparency, stating, “There can be absolutely no bullshit” (62:18). Sue appreciates Megan’s ability to listen and process complaints without escalating conflicts, fostering a balanced and understanding friendship.

They also touch upon the necessity of accepting each other’s inherent traits and finding a middle ground where both can thrive without forcing changes that undermine their core identities (42:10).

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Reflections on Retirement and Future

As Sue contemplates retirement, she expresses fears about losing her athletic identity and the uncertainty of life beyond sports. Megan shares her aspiration to move beyond soccer while grappling with the systemic challenges faced by female athletes, such as inadequate support and recognition (65:57).

Amanda Doyle offers encouragement by sharing her positive retirement experience, emphasizing personal growth and the importance of pursuing passions outside of professional obligations (68:32).

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Conclusion

The episode concludes with heartfelt acknowledgments of each other’s strengths and the importance of enduring friendships. Megan and Sue reflect on their journey together, celebrating the unwavering support and shared experiences that have fortified their bond.

Abby Wambach encapsulates the essence of the conversation by encouraging listeners to remember, “When things get hard this week, don't forget, we can do hard things” (77:43).

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Notable Quotes

• Abby Wambach: “Our first double date. And we can do hard things.” (04:05)
• Megan Rapinoe: “There can be absolutely no bullshit.” (62:18)
• Sue Bird: “I am just trying to tie him [Father Time].” (12:30)
• Megan Rapinoe: “I'm not doing this as a way of manipulation.” (40:22)
• Sue Bird: “I think it's how hard to get to be done.” (76:27)
• Abby Wambach: “I'm never gonna put things back in the right place.” (43:37)

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Key Insights and Takeaways

1. Authentic Friendships: Genuine relationships thrive on honesty, mutual respect, and understanding, especially amidst high-pressure careers.
2. Collective Activism: The WNBA’s unified stance on social justice issues demonstrates the power of collective action in driving meaningful societal change.
3. Aging in Sports: Maintaining athletic performance while grappling with the emotional aspects of aging and retirement is a significant challenge for professional athletes.
4. Balancing Act: Successfully balancing personal relationships and professional responsibilities requires clear boundaries and effective communication.
5. Identity Beyond Sports: Transitioning from a sports-centric identity to a multifaceted personal identity is crucial for long-term well-being and fulfillment.

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Conclusion

This episode of We Can Do Hard Things offers an intimate glimpse into the lives of Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird, exploring the depth of their friendship, their shared struggles, and their unwavering resilience. Through laughter, vulnerability, and insightful discussions, listeners gain a profound understanding of the complexities faced by female athletes both on and off the field.

For those seeking inspiration and solidarity in navigating life’s challenges, this episode embodies the podcast’s mission: to drop the fake and talk honestly about the hard things, helping each other live lighter and braver lives.

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Timestamp Guide:

• [04:05] – Introduction of the double date concept
• [05:00] – Megan and Sue’s first meeting
• [12:25] – Sue discusses maintaining athletic performance
• [16:07] – Transition from ads to main content
• [24:48] – Influence of WNBA on social justice activism
• [36:32] – Discussing friendship conflicts and boundaries
• [42:10] – Accepting inherent traits in friendships
• [60:15] – Challenges of maintaining long-distance friendships
• [62:18] – Megan on honesty in friendships
• [65:57] – Sue’s fears about retirement
• [68:32] – Amanda on positive retirement experiences
• [70:39] – Discussing institutional challenges for female athletes
• [77:43] – Closing encouragement to listeners

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For more episodes and discussions on navigating life’s challenges with authenticity and support, follow We Can Do Hard Things on your preferred podcast platform.

Transcript

[Glennon Doyle]

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[Abby Wambach]

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[Glennon Doyle]

We're getting through, aren't we? That's what we're doing. One foot in front of the other. 2025 is looking like it might be a real doozy and we are in it with you and we're here for you and with you. Recently, our show was selected by Apple as One of their 10 shows we love, and they called it a comforting support system for braving the everyday. And that is what we hope. We hope that we can help you brave the everyday. That's what you help us do. And so, on Sundays, we are publishing an episode for you, one of our favorite episodes of the past four years that we've selected to be a comforting support system for all of us as we brave this new year. So in addition to our new Tuesday Thursday episodes and the ones that we're posting on Wednesday as well, please come on Sunday for some togetherness, some support, some soothing Sunday Togetherness for 2025. Thank you. We will see you there.

[Abby Wambach]

Hello, hello, hello. Welcome back to We Can Do Hard Things. Today we are inviting you to a double date.

[Amanda Doyle]

It's so exciting.

[Abby Wambach]

It is exciting.

[Amanda Doyle]

I feel nervous and excited a little bit. Like, and we. For the past few minutes, we've been talking about our own personal rules for our double date. Like, you would imagine you and your partner driving to this said double date. And, like, you're kind of talking about, like, what's gonna happen? What do you wanna talk about?

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. So our first double date. And we can do hard things.

[Amanda Doyle]

Who is it?

[Abby Wambach]

Me, Rapinoe and Sue Bird.

[Megan Rapinoe]

What?

[Amanda Doyle]

I mean, legends.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. All right, let's do this. Okay, Megan and Sue, here we are. And I just want to explain to you what the hell we're doing here. Okay. Abby and I decided a while back that we were going to try to have friends. Okay.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Like, new friends?

[Abby Wambach]

No, just.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Okay. Just existing friends that reboot.

[Abby Wambach]

Like, we were just gonna actually talk to the people that we call our friends.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

But we don't wanna go anywhere or really do anything about it. So what we decided was that we were gonna have double dates on the podcast. So then we made a list of all of the people that we wanted to have a double date with, and it kept just saying Megan and Sue.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Sue.

[Abby Wambach]

So here we are on our double date. Thank you.

[Sue Bird]

I love a 9:00am A 9:00am double date. Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

That's actually typical for us, isn't it?

[Amanda Doyle]

Well, in the sober world, when you don't drink at night, like, you don't go get dinner and drinks if you're not drinking. So we do coffee.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. It's like. Because it gets very arbitrary. It's like the Goodwill hunting. It's like, do you want to get together and have some caramels?

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

It's like, what the hell else do you do?

[Amanda Doyle]

So what are you guys doing, like, what in the hell are you doing? Where are you right now? Are you in Seattle?

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, we're in Seattle.

[Megan Rapinoe]

We're in Seattle. We're both kind of. Abby, I feel like, you know, this stress and anxiety and life questioning feeling as well as we do. We're in our January. Sort of like it's just every year it comes. The anxiety comes. All of the questions about my life come, and it's like, I know what's happening still just happens, but we're working out and doing the things and what are the questions?

[Abby Wambach]

Because I feel this way. I want you to understand that this is not a Sporty Spice thing. I think you're alluding to that because you just only called out Abby. But January is just a pit of existential dread all the time for them.

[Sue Bird]

It's in the form of like a beep test. Yeah, that's where their fitness test.

[Amanda Doyle]

The beep test.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, that's where they're. I don't have that experience. Thank God. We don't do that fitness testing stuff.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's just like the feeling of, you know, you can't wait to get to your vacation at the end of your season. It's all you think about all year long. You can't wait. Of course, you take your, you know, seven days off, like your really long break, seven days, and then you have to get going again. Somehow in seven days, you forgot how to do everything and everything hurts and everything's like 20,000 times harder than it ever was before. And you're like, should we just hang it up? Should I be done? Why is it so hard? Is everyone else doing it this hard? No, it looks easy for them. It's just so dumb to, like, get ready for us, you know, the sports.

[Abby Wambach]

Is it like the Sunday scaries but, like times a million?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Is it like on Sunday when everything feels terrifying and you forgot how to be out in the world and do whatever it is you do and you don't think you'll ever figure it out again? Is it like that but harder?

[Amanda Doyle]

Well, I think that Megan and I were very similar in this way, that when it was off season, we were off, we took those seven and might I say maybe 14, we might have extended those days off so that coming back into shape is just miserable. And also when you get older, it's harder. It's just. It's just physiologically more difficult. Some people just, like, stay in shape during that time, but I just never did. But how's your body holding up, Megan? Like, are You. Are you feeling healthy at least?

[Megan Rapinoe]

I am feeling good. Yeah. I had a little longer break, actually, this time than I normally do. I obviously didn't go to the camp in Australia, so I feel like I was really able to kind of phase out. Like, okay, you're doing a little bit of rehab in the beginning, and now we're doing strength. And now I'm kind of back on the field getting ready for preseason, so I actually feel pretty good, like, knock on wood. And I've been able to kind of slow roll it, which has been nice. And I haven't felt a ton of pressure. There's always, like, a little bit of, like, I'm not going into this camp or whatever, but it's actually been nice to not have that pressure. And I just get to, like, roll into my club preseason, which will be really nice. So I feel pretty good.

[Abby Wambach]

Do you two feel. So we were just talking to a good friend, Sarah Paulson, and she was talking about how she's just gotten to this point in her life where she's finally figured out that she knows how to do what she does. Like, it's not just one long fluke. It's not like she's tricking the world. Every time she shows up, she actually tells herself, wait, you know how to act like you can do this? It's not luck. Do you guys feel like you can do sports yet? Or do you still feel like just tricking the world every time? And when you get a trophy or whatever you get, you're like, oh, thank God. I tricked him again.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Got em.

[Sue Bird]

I think it's a dance. I think you're doing a dance. I think there are days when you feel that way, and then there are days when you're like, man, I hope I score today. You know, I think like Abby said, or she talked about getting older. What happens when you get older is you definitely start to realize what you're good at. You start to. When you're out there playing, you start to stick to what you're good at. And then. But what happens is you're getting older. You're realizing you're really good at it, right? Like, you've proven it. And then your body starts to go a little bit. So then it's like this shift to like, well, is my body gonna let me do it? I know I can do it now, but is my body gonna let me do it? And then all of a sudden, for me anyway, the focus shifts to that where I'm in my workouts the minute I feel any Pain. I'm like, oh, this could be it. This could be. That's. You know. And the rest of my week is spent in retirement, and then I show up the next week, and it feels pretty good. And I'm like, all right, I can play forever. So it's just this constant, like, dance.

[Abby Wambach]

That's horseshit, though, that the second you figure out how to do it, it's like, that reminds me of. Of. I think I'm in perimenopause right now. That reminds me of that. It's like, okay, I'm crushing it. I'm a badass. I am like, I don't give a shit what anyone thinks about me. I am out there doing my thing, and it's like, oh, but I'm gonna have hot flashes every four minutes. Like, what the fuck?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, but it's like your body's gonna remind you and, like, knock you down 9pe time you start to get comfortable. It's not like I feel like at this stage in both of our careers, it's like, if all things were equal physically, it's like, we'd be busting these kids asses. It's like, I know what to do and exactly how to do it and where my advantages are and all that. It's just about bringing this body along to get it to the point where it can halfway do what my mind is asking.

[Amanda Doyle]

Well, and as pro athletes, y'all never are actually at. Especially as we get older, you're never at a hundred percent, so you're always. You're always dealing with something. And, like, that just plays a massive role into the confidence that you could take as an athlete on the pitch or on the court. So it's like. I don't know. I just think it's so fucking amazing that y'all are still playing. I mean, sue, how old are you right now?

[Sue Bird]

41.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Fa.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's how old I am.

[Sue Bird]

You couldn't pay me.

[Abby Wambach]

You're such a slacker. You could still. I can't understand what you're saying right now because I haven't listened, because I keep going back to the fact that Megan Rapinoe just called a bunch of people on the team. The kids. Yeah, that. I feel like a great grandmother right now. If Megan is referring to. Wow. So you're like the old person now.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. Wow.

[Amanda Doyle]

Are you the oldest on the team.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Now that Carly's gone and Becky. Becky, I think, is like a month older, but no, it's also.

[Sue Bird]

I've been the oldest for, like, five years.

[Amanda Doyle]

I just Agreed to play for another year, which is amazing and wild to me. I mean, have you treated your body perfectly forever?

[Sue Bird]

No, no, no.

[Amanda Doyle]

How are you still moving?

[Sue Bird]

I'm like, good genetics.

[Amanda Doyle]

I'm 41.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

No, but I sw. I didn't do this forever, but I switched. I switched, like, my workout regimen. I hired somebody, all this stuff probably six years ago now. And that was like. I was plateauing. And then it kind of. It wasn't even that. Like, I. I took off. It was just like. Oh. It didn't. It didn't do the decline. It kind of just stayed. And then I was able to. Like, you guys talked about when you get older, you are just smarter. You're more experienced than these players, so you can use that as long as your body's there. So I just found a way to keep my body, like, hovering. And that's how, like, I always say, like, people talk about Father Time. I'm like, I'm just trying to tie him.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

I'm not trying to win.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's good.

[Sue Bird]

I'm not. I'm not trying to win. I just need to tie.

[Abby Wambach]

Just keep up. You guys should become. Well, you already are. But if you're a writer, you don't have to give a shit about your modi. I don't even have to, like, make it up the stairs.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I'll be at the bottom of the stairs writing.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes, that's right. So how did you guys meet?

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Go ahead. Oh, gosh. Yeah. The quick sort of version is Abby, you know, the, like, Olympic NBC media day. It's usually in LA all day. You go from, like, uniform to this outfit.

[Sue Bird]

Casual Saturday date night. You know, those are the outfits you have to bring. They tell you they're, like, putting a date night Saturday night, a casual Sunday night, and then a workout outfit, and then you have, like, your proper uniform, and you're gonna, like, change these outfits constantly.

[Amanda Doyle]

And this is NBC pre Olympics, so that NBC can get footage to use.

[Megan Rapinoe]

While the Olympics are playing, which you.

[Sue Bird]

Maybe see, like, 10 seconds of it ever. Yeah, yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's like Entertainment Tonight, the sports, some news, like, go into this social thing. Like, all of these different, like, stakeholders, media stakeholders are in the same thing. So this was2016.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, 16.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So Dan Levy, obviously my agent, you know Dan and Glenn very well. Yeah. So it was like, sort of in passing. I also was not single at the time. I was actually engaged at the time. So this was just kind of like a funny interaction. Dan basically, like, introduced me and we. It's like, we had been in Seattle for whatever a number of years. Like, I obviously knew who she was, but, like, you know, I'd gone to a couple WNBA games but didn't, like, know each other. So Dan was like, oh, my gosh. You guys should, like, you know, sort of know each other. And it was what I was saying. She had her uniform on, but then she had, like, the hair down, and I'm sure, like, more makeup than you wanted.

[Sue Bird]

Tragic.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. And I just, like, you know, because I'm so cool and so smooth with everything. I was just Made some dumb joke that I immediately walked past her and rolled my eyes, and I was like, I can't fucking believe you just did that. But I, like, walked. We kind of got introduced, and it was one of those things, you know, when it's, like, quick and, like. It's just one of these, like. It's just a weird thing. And I was like, oh, like, you're ready for your game. And just like. I was like, yeah, okay, so there's that. So we can't even be friends now because she's like. She's a loser.

[Abby Wambach]

So she's dead to me.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. Like, obviously, we. He's like, oh, I heard she was cool. Yeah. Like, everything that you've heard is a total lie.

[Sue Bird]

Not.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Anyway, so that was kind of like our first.

[Sue Bird]

That was like, the proper first meeting.

[Megan Rapinoe]

A little interaction. Yeah. And then what was the next? Basically, at the Olympics. At the Olympics, we famously, you know, bonked out in a massive way. I was coming back from my acl, so it was just. The whole Olympics for us was really kind of terrible. But we got out so early, and we never actually even made it to Rio. So I was like, oh, I'm going to Rio. There was, like, five or six of us. We went to a few games. We ended up. You guys had. You were staying on a cruise ship.

[Sue Bird]

So it was like, different Olympic experiences, Right?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Different budget experience. Different budgets, different budget.

[Sue Bird]

Wildly different. I mean, she said, wildly different. What is it called? Manaus.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Manaus. That.

[Sue Bird]

That then appeared on 90 Day Fiance.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yes, the hotel.

[Sue Bird]

The hotel did.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And I was like, oh.

[Sue Bird]

I started watching that one season. I don't regret it. I don't regret it. It's not something I'm proud of, but I don't regret it. And I was like, oh, they're in this, like, crazy Brazil. She's like, that's where we stayed. That's where we stayed.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I was like, what? My clothes are still damp. It's like.

[Sue Bird]

It was different experiences and yeah, just.

[Glennon Doyle]

Anyways, just real quick.

[Abby Wambach]

Can you explain to us why.

[Sue Bird]

Why? So it's actually very simple. USA Basketball, the umbrella is both men's and women's. There's a lot of like, how do I explain this? The NBA is very much involved in our USA Basketball experience. It's. It's kind of all one big umbrella.

[Abby Wambach]

Actually.

[Sue Bird]

Like the NBA kind of owns the USA Basketball rights. And it gets kind of. There's a lot of detail to it. But with that there's a certain standard in which the men are treated and we get treated the same as. As we should, as we deserve. That's basically what happens. Yeah, so it's like they charter, we charter. They actually cannot stay in the Village. They're just entirely too famous. The times we do go in there with them, it's wild. So we always have to get something outside of the Village. We, unlike you guys, we stay in the city the whole time. We play the whole time. We stay in the city, whatever city it is, the whole time. And our traveling party's huge. We can bring guests. So they get us a hotel. Or in this case they couldn't find a hotel. Like logistically that made sense. So we stayed on a cruise ship. It was like below deck vibes.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's a much more like enjoyable. It is relaxed, you're not grinding environment where we're like, you have one hour a day of family time.

[Sue Bird]

You're like, okay.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. It's like, okay, like visitation. Yeah. Everyone being miserable. That's going to help us. Our performance on the field. You guys just have more. But it's weird. It's like they're not on contract like we are. We haven't. It's like these events.

[Abby Wambach]

Do you get paid more like than the soccer. Like, do you actually the women. Right. So it doesn't translate to.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, they don't even get like paid really. It's like kind of.

[Sue Bird]

We get bonuses for winning.

[Abby Wambach]

No, but I mean like in the wnba.

[Amanda Doyle]

So we're talking two separate things. USA Basketball is different than the wnba.

[Sue Bird]

Right. So like for them and I'm sure you hear. And by the way, I'm like you, Glenn. Like, I had to learn all their lives, like how it went. Their national team is like the priority. It's where the money is. It's like where their contracts are. For us, it's the WNBA and overseas and then national team is second. And for them it's like national team's first.

[Abby Wambach]

Got it.

[Sue Bird]

Nwsl second. Like it's a flipped.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, got It. Okay, cool. So you're in the Olympics. Megan's out of the Olympics, but visiting the Olympics.

[Sue Bird]

Yes.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Basically, sue is on below deck.

[Sue Bird]

Yes, Susan.

[Abby Wambach]

And so then how does this happen?

[Megan Rapinoe]

So I had been going. Yeah, I had been going to a couple of games. Obviously, we all. It's like we didn't know each other, but, like, we're in the exact same world in life. We know the same people, like the agents, all. All the sort of things.

[Sue Bird]

You're just gonna skip the DM part?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Oh, yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Well, it actually sounds like way more scandalous than.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So, obviously, the summer of 16, it was like, from a social justice perspective. I mean, we just come off, like, 14. Ferguson, Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown, like, going into 50. I feel like I was educating myself more. The WNBA obviously, is always the leader in the forefront of social justice work and protests and all of that. So summer of 16, the players from Minnesota had refused to speak to the media and wore in the black shirts. And kind of going into the Olympics, I slid into Sue's DMs. I do love the DMs.

[Sue Bird]

And, like, she does. She's not in.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I just. Like, the blue truck gets you far.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

No, I'm like, hi.

[Sue Bird]

It's like, that's how you met Carla, her stylist.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, like, the guy who's.

[Sue Bird]

The guy who's doing our apartment right now.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Designing in New York. Like, I just slide into everyone's writing. I'm like, hi. Like, you didn't ask for me, but here I am. Anyway, so I had hit her, like, hey, just amazing about social justice. Yeah. Like, what you guys are doing. If there's any way for our teams to partner or whatever. This was pre kneeling. That happened sort of after we got back from the Olympics. Just kind of. Is there any way to connect or help amplify whatever that. It didn't really kind of lead anywhere, but we sort of were, like, talking.

[Sue Bird]

If I had to, like, round this.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Out, it was platonic.

[Sue Bird]

There's like. Yeah, there's all these, like, connecting points. We met here and then we. Oh, we saw each other at the USA house, which is this. That at the Olympics, there's always, like, a USA House where every athlete can go and they have, like, food and different kind of entertainment things. Whatever they do there. I saw you there. And then she lost. So then she was coming to my games at that point. We had connected on the dm and it was kind of like, oh, you know, good to see you, blah, blah, blah, that kind of thing. And then they came to our after party. So we had one.

[Megan Rapinoe]

My fiance was there at the time. Sarah was there.

[Sue Bird]

Sarah was there.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So it was like.

[Sue Bird]

So this is really like totally platonic.

[Abby Wambach]

Mm.

[Amanda Doyle]

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[Glennon Doyle]

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[Megan Rapinoe]

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[Abby Wambach]

Okay, so you dmed sue about social justice before the kneeling. Before you're kneeling. So would you say that because I secretly believe that the WNBA is in charge of the world?

[Amanda Doyle]

Yes.

[Glennon Doyle]

I really do.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Certainly should be.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yes.

[Abby Wambach]

Holy shit. So would you say that that influenced you?

[Sue Bird]

Oh, yeah. Good question.

[Abby Wambach]

The WNBA influenced you and the way that you decided to take on the kneeling, do you think there's any way that that was influential to you?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, definitely, because I think that they were the first ones doing anything publicly protesting as an athlete kind of during that time. They were talking before Colin was talking. They had already done the protest in that summer and in their season. And it wasn't just with the Minnesota team. It then kind of went league wide. You guys wore black T shirts and, you know, refused to speak to the media about. I mean, if you remember that summer, it was like, there was like five really high profile murders of black men and there was the shooting of the police officers. I think it was in Dallas. It was a very violent and tragic summer, sort of leading into Colin kneeling, which was like September or something. So I think I was already kind of like opening my eyes to what was happening and, you know, going through, like I said, like, Trayvon Martin and then the protests in Ferguson and Michael Brown. And that obviously extended really far, the formation of Black Lives Matter. Like, I was just, like, learning about it. I didn't really. I mean, I don't think I was really thinking about it all that much before then. And then you guys, you know, and it was just much more is like, I feel like that summer, every time he turned around, like articles or in the Atlantic or the New York Times or Sports Illustrated, it was all just kind of like in the sort of zeitgeist of the moment. So, yeah, like, you guys were the first ones to really speak out. And I think even. It's like, even in my sort of like, implicit bias, I think back then, I would say Colin was probably a bigger influence because obviously when he spoke out, he got so much more media attention. It's the NFL, but, like, really, they were saying the exact. They were doing the exact same things, you know, in the best way that they could or in the most impactful way that they could, sort of prior to Colin even kneeling for the first time.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. So amazing. And sue, that was mostly black women led, Right? Is that the way that it. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, it was. Minnesota Lynx is really the team. And you would say Maya Moore, Simone Augustus, Rebecca Brunson on that team. Lindsey WHELAN. Those four. Like, I can picture the image. There's a picture of them standing kind of at like a press conference with. They had made shirts. I forget the man's name who died in Minnesota, who was murdered. Castile Philando.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. Yes.

[Sue Bird]

And that was the instigator for them because this was like, this happened in our state. And when they did that, the security guards, who are generally like off duty police officers, they walked out. And then the rest of our league was like, wait a minute, we need to support this, be a part of this, make it bigger. And that's actually the first time we really started to learn the power of the collective. Like, yes, it was big when Minnesota did it. Cause then I think New York Liberty followed. I think maybe Phoenix Mercury followed. Then the whole league followed. And it was like, oh, when we're all doing this, then it's like a big boom versus just one team here, one team there. So that was actually, in terms of our journey as a league, that was the starting point of realizing the collective power.

[Abby Wambach]

Then the rest of us don't even understand, I don't think consciously, the power of what you all do first. Because I remember seeing the whole Loeffler situation, the Kelly Loeffler thing.

[Amanda Doyle]

This is a 2020 election.

[Abby Wambach]

Right? That terrible woman.

[Amanda Doyle]

Or in 2018.

[Abby Wambach]

Right. And then I don't know. I don't know.

[Sue Bird]

Number 20. Yeah, but already a senator.

[Abby Wambach]

She didn't vote Warnock T shirts. And I remember being like, who's that?

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

So how weird is that? That like, you know, a year later we were all like, this was my idea. But that team was the first. And that was so brave and amazing. Like, wasn't that the owner of Loeffler was the owner of the team. And these women all walked out with Vote Wornock T shirts on. So badass.

[Amanda Doyle]

Of the Atlanta Dream Dream, right?

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, the Atlanta Dream. The whole league did it. Our entire league. And that was like the beauty of the wubble. Obviously, we're in a bubble because shit's crazy. Covid. So much George Floyd. Like, there's so much happening and we're. But the beauty of the bubble was we were all together. So you can. And you know how it is. I mean, how hard is it to get on a zoom with two other people? You know, finding time, it's impossible. So for 144 women to be in one place at the same time, you could just strategize because we were like, I know you're not doing shit. Get on this thing. Come meet me.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, you guys were really the sort of the snap or the whatever firecracker, obviously, shout out Stacey Abrams and Fair Fight and the activists on the ground. I mean, they were setting the groundwork speed dial. It did feel like the moment where it became more of a national thing or more thing that the casual person was thinking about. And then you guys saved the Republic by getting us two more senators at least. Even though we haven't really done enough with the advantage that we don't have. Anyways, we don't need to get into that.

[Abby Wambach]

And then you think about how much attention and credit women's soccer gets for things.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yes.

[Abby Wambach]

It's so fascinating and. Well, Megan and Sue, why would you say that women's soccer tends to be more celebrated in this country than the WNBA is?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Well, and I mean really, just very bluntly, in our country, that is white supremacist founded, heteronormative, cisgendered, patriarchal, the straight assumed, generally white cisgendered women. Of course, it's like, we're cute and white, right? We talk about this all the time. It's like we're cute and white and more palatable and we get to represent America, you know, with. With the playing for the US as our primary thing. I mean, I just, it's like I. I just can't get to any other conclusion other than the WNBA is like tall and black and everyone thinks everyone's gay and think about the society that, that we live in. And they're always compared to the counterparts, which is the NBA. And I think people in America have a much better knowledge of basketball than soccer traditionally. And so, I mean, even when people say like, oh, you guys are so much better than the men, I'm like, yeah, it's really not like the goal, first of all. And also, it's just like, it just leaves out so much nuance where I think, like, you know, every LA Fitness, YMCA basketball guy, like, thinks that he could be the best player in the WNBA and he just can't. So I think it's really simple. I think that's why.

[Abby Wambach]

Yep, I think so too, from my massive sports background. So you had all these meetings and run ins, sue, when did you know? Oh, shit, I'm in love with Megan.

[Amanda Doyle]

Or I like Megan even.

[Abby Wambach]

No, I want to know, like, we're get there.

[Amanda Doyle]

We're like on a timeline.

[Abby Wambach]

I mean, obviously she liked Meghan when she was so nerdy and tried to like be cool at the, at the Olympic thing. Right? But like, when were you like, oh, and by the way, I want everyone to know who's listening, that they just had, like, a little sidebar.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Which is what we always.

[Sue Bird]

Are we gonna share that?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. Or we share. I think the one part that's always just a little, like, I was with someone, so I never want to, like, disrespect that person.

[Abby Wambach]

And, you know, we have the same.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Scenario, so it's like, there was emotional overlap, which is overlap. And that's, you know what it is. And not. Not. I. I wish it didn't happen that way, but it did. So. That's.

[Sue Bird]

Right.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So preface with that.

[Sue Bird]

What we were side chatting about was. So there's. Okay, so this is one of those experiences where I feel like a lot of people have this experience. Okay. Had Megan and I never ended up together, I never would have even remembered some of these little moments. They just would have been these, like, little bloops in your mind that come and go, and it just. It just never would have been, like, a big, huge factor. But because we did, we can look back on it and be like, oh, actually. So one of them is at that Olympics. Oh, yeah. So she was at the after party. We're all having fun, and she was standing over, and I was, like, bringing her a drink and, like, making sure she was all set. That kind of a thing. She's being a good host, you know.

[Megan Rapinoe]

She was just kind of chilling. It was like, you know, me and Sarah at the time. And then I think, like, Jess and Mary were.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Around. Like, we didn't really know anyone, so we were just kind of, like, posted up at this, like, you know, tall table, just kind of standing and chilling and listening. Being a good host. Just. Just being like, I don't know what we're doing here, but we're here. And we got on the boat and it took us three days because you had to give your passport. And it was like a whole scene. So we're like, we're here.

[Sue Bird]

Top security.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, top security.

[Sue Bird]

So, yeah, so I kept, like, checking in on them, I guess, to be like, hey, blah, blah, blah, you know? And at one point, one of my close friends is Diana Tarazi. We obviously know each other very well. So I had just left the table for probably the fifth time or something, walked away, and she comes out to me. She goes, and get the fuck away from that table.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And I was like, what?

[Sue Bird]

She was like, I know what's happening. Get away from that table.

[Megan Rapinoe]

You two know each other? Yeah. And I was like, shut up.

[Sue Bird]

You know, like, whatever, Whatever. So Again, had, you know, we never end up together, that wouldn't even be. I mean, I guess I would remember it. Cause it's just funny. But it just was like, whatever. But now looking back, I clearly was, like, caring for her in a scared way. Like, I was, like, wanting to be near, but not in a disrespectful way. That's I guess what I'm getting at.

[Megan Rapinoe]

No, you weren't, like, prowling. You just legitimately.

[Sue Bird]

Like, Diana saw, like, de saw it and was like, get the fuck away from that table.

[Megan Rapinoe]

That's so interesting.

[Sue Bird]

So that's like the.

[Abby Wambach]

She's never cared about being a host this much as she does right now.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's sweet. She was trying to protect you, you know, Those are the kind of friends you have.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And now looking back, I think that Dee was also trying to bring this to Sue's attention on a more conscious level. Because Dee wanted it to happen for you.

[Sue Bird]

Is that your take?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Oh, that's my take.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I think so. But also, it's like this funny thing where, like, it was like, we all know each other. Because of course I know who Diana Taurosi is. Of course I know who Sue Bird is. Like, we all sort of, like, know each other, but we don't really know. I feel like women's sports is getting better at that. Or like, women in. In sports or even just, like, entertainment or whatever. Like, I feel like we get a little more self conscious, whereas the guys are out there like, yo, what's up? Like, of course I know who you are. And, like, I feel like it was a little. Dee's kind of funny and the same. She's like, I don't want any new friends. But, like, that one seems that I could do it. One new friend.

[Sue Bird]

So she think.

[Megan Rapinoe]

You think.

[Sue Bird]

But I think she was like, oh, I hope sue ends up with Megan, because Megan seems cool and I want to be her friend.

[Megan Rapinoe]

No. Well, a little bit of both.

[Abby Wambach]

A little bit.

[Megan Rapinoe]

But I think also she's, like, wanted. So this is about you? No, no.

[Sue Bird]

Just kidding.

[Megan Rapinoe]

No. A little bit. No, not at all. Wanted you to find someone she recognized.

[Sue Bird]

She recognized how amazing you are and was like, my friendship.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I mean, I kind of walk myself into that. But yeah, basically.

[Amanda Doyle]

What. What is just going to switch gears real quick. What do y'all fight about the most?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Oh, God.

[Sue Bird]

I mean, presently, zoom calls. Like, one is on one and the other one is making noise. This is a. This is a huge, big issue in this household.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's a big issue. Big It's. It's just. I couldn't share the fighting story, be more hypocritical about the way that I operate on Zoom for myself. And then, like, the way that I operate when Sue's on Zoom. It's just. I'm like death eyeing her if she makes one. Oh, if I make.

[Sue Bird]

If I, like, literally. Meanwhile, I'm, like, down on the thing and stuff.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. She goes, yeah, I did have a little zoom.

[Sue Bird]

This is classic.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I did have a zoom incident. I. It's. I am loud off Zoom. I don't know why we were in our place in New York.

[Sue Bird]

We've just bought a place.

[Abby Wambach]

Oh, cool.

[Megan Rapinoe]

There's nothing really in it. Yeah. You guys will definitely have to come visit.

[Sue Bird]

Obviously, you're invited anytime.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So it's really empty. So it's very echoey already. Things are loud. I feel like you need to tell.

[Sue Bird]

But no, I mean, I just love every time we've. We've told this. We've shared this story just, like, a couple times now.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's going out to the masses. Number one podcast.

[Sue Bird]

I know. I've heard. So she always loves to, at the start, say it was very echoey, and it's like, yes, that's true, because we didn't have furniture. But also, it was loud enough. And I was on a Zoom call that was actually casual. It wasn't, like, a podcast or a recording. It was. I was talking to, like.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It was our accountant.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, well, yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And our financial advisor, but that's fine.

[Sue Bird]

Well, I wasn't gonna put a name on it because now if they listen, they're gonna know. Well, it's gonna confirm what they probably thought. So we're on the call, and out of nowhere, I hear, I'll be off camera for a second. I hear. Well, I can't, because the mic's far. I hear. And I was like, oh, this bitch just farted.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I didn't mean it. I did not mean it. This actually farted. I'm almost impossible to embarrass. I actually was, like, a little embarrassed. I texted her intended. I was like.

[Sue Bird]

I texted. I was like, they just heard you fart.

[Abby Wambach]

Oh, my God.

[Sue Bird]

We all just heard you fart.

[Amanda Doyle]

Well, it actually probably sounds like sue farted, and she's like, excuse me, but.

[Abby Wambach]

You don't want to stop and say, actually, that was Megan.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Actually, you know what, Abby?

[Sue Bird]

I never thought that they thought it.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Was me, so I feel like they.

[Sue Bird]

Knew it kind of hitting me hard right now.

[Megan Rapinoe]

They knew it wasn't you. It didn't sound. It was further away. I was. I was 15ft away, minimum. I was in the hall.

[Sue Bird]

It was really funny.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Anyway, so we fight about the zoom stuff.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, we fight about the Z.

[Megan Rapinoe]

That was really funny.

[Abby Wambach]

And how do you all fight? Yeah, like, who. Who's more controlling in your relationship?

[Megan Rapinoe]

I feel like we communicate pretty well.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So we're not ever, like, yeah, like, fighting. I'm definitely not a big fighter.

[Sue Bird]

Like, that's not.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I don't like to do that.

[Sue Bird]

I actually will say to her, sometimes I'm like, you remind me of when. Okay, so in sports, referees are a big pain in the ass, right? So sometimes you'll, like, look at them and be like, what the hell was that? And the referees that go, you're right, my bad. You can't argue. They just, like, nip you and they, like, neuter you almost. And you're just like, and you want to have this. Cause a lot of referees will be like, I didn't see it that way. And then that's your chance to be like, well, you didn't just see that girl hit. You didn't see this. You didn't see that. And then when they argue back with you, it's like this back and forth. But when a referee says, you're right, it just ends it. And sometimes I'll be like, you're acting like that referee right now. Because. But this is a compliment, actually. What Megan is really good at is she hears you. She's understanding and processing your. For lack of a better complaint, and she goes, okay, yeah, I see that you're right. But then when you're kind of upset about something, just kind of like, Right.

[Megan Rapinoe]

The thing is, like, I'm not doing this as a way of manipulation.

[Sue Bird]

Like, but at first, I didn't realize that I had to get to a.

[Abby Wambach]

Place I'm actually passive aggressive, right?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yes.

[Sue Bird]

And I was like, argue with me, please.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And I'm like, I actually. What you just said barely hit the nail on the head, and that's not cool of me, and I am apologizing. The problem is that some of these things are character traits where I would love to say that I'm going to remember about the light bulbs. I'm probably not ever in my life gonna remember all the time about the light bulbs.

[Sue Bird]

I'm like a psycho light cast shutting the lights off when we leave the house. I just think, isn't that kind of commonplace?

[Megan Rapinoe]

You also, I mean, to steal something from your guys podcast with the ticker. I think Amanda was talking about it. Of the daily tasks. And sue also lives in 3022 for everything. And I would love to say that my.

[Sue Bird]

It's called efficiency.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Super efficient, super smart, Way ahead on things. She's already. It's already shown up at the door, and I'm like, wow, we should probably think about getting paper towels. And she's like, I have it on subscription to the exact amount that we need. No, you're not psycho at all. It's actually amazing. But you carry a lot of the. The household daily ticker tasks. And so of course that gets old. I think you like doing it, but also, like, it gets old and, well.

[Sue Bird]

You want your partner to, like.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. And so then when I say sorry about stuff, knowing, you know, we both kind of know full well at this point, like, is it gonna change a lot? I don't know. So then it feels sorry about. I'm saying sorry and then not changing my behavior. So that's what we talk about. I think that's something that we fight about probably with both of us.

[Sue Bird]

Like, the theme of that.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I feel like we're both very self aware. We're both like, you know, looking in. We're both understanding. We both have that. But then it's like, sometimes I just feel like you have to accept shit about your partner because it's not changing. They are who they are. And it's like, we can always be better, but you're not going to change the core of who your partner is. I very much believe that. And when we spend so much time together, I was in a pandemic. The same themes keep coming up and up and up. And I feel like the more we can just accept that some of these things your partner's gonna drive you nuts about all the time. And I have found that some things that I've let go of, it's just better for me because ultimately it's not gonna change. So I'm either mad about it all the time, or I'm just like, that's her and that's okay.

[Abby Wambach]

I mean, Megan, since you've known Abby for so long, I want you to know that I spent the first four years of our relationship trying to quiet her down. Like, I thought maybe I could just. If we keep talking about it, I could just.

[Amanda Doyle]

This is the volume.

[Abby Wambach]

Lower her volume. Like, that's never gonna fucking happen. No, I. My responsibility is just to go dead inside.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Just to listen. Right?

[Sue Bird]

Just.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah, Just.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, that's never just dead inside. And like.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. Yes.

[Abby Wambach]

That's my job as a Lover is.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Slowly die to that wish. And like, for you, I'm never gonna put things back in the right place. I'm never it.

[Amanda Doyle]

I think we've gotten to a place where we're starting to accept that.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. Because what Megan's saying, if I say to you I'm sorry, that implies that I'm gonna do it differently, and I am never, ever gonna do it differently.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Ever.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's right.

[Megan Rapinoe]

That's the thing. Ever. No, like, it's just not going now. We can become better at things, more aware. We can do this, we can do that. But, like, the volume of Abby's voice is the volume of Abby's voice.

[Abby Wambach]

Right.

[Megan Rapinoe]

That's like a natural. That's like asking, you know, her to change who she is on the inside. It's just, like, hard. Not gonna happen.

[Sue Bird]

No.

[Abby Wambach]

And it doesn't go well, Megan. Although when I try, it doesn't go well.

[Amanda Doyle]

I will say I do think that I have gotten less loud.

[Abby Wambach]

Really? Do you. Do you think that? Do you think someone tell you that, or you just.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Is that your opinion? Who told you that? Because they lied.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. Who told you that? Right. So there's just.

[Amanda Doyle]

I love things she said, you know, I want a partner that partners. I love that. It's so good.

[Sue Bird]

But she does. I mean, I'm sure. Same. It's like.

[Megan Rapinoe]

You do? Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

It's just there's these certain areas that are more like my wheelhouse, and I want her to participate in what I'm good at to, like, help. But then to her point, you have to realize that's not their thing. They're not gonna think of these things.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

This has been, like, the ongoing.

[Abby Wambach]

The ticker's fascinating.

[Amanda Doyle]

That thing has changed my life. Like, now I have to actually, like, write it down, like, ticker. So she'll walk into the room, she's like, what are you doing? And I'm like, I'm tickering right now. And it's just like, I'm literally sitting there by myself thinking of all the things that needs to get done.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. It's awesome.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. You guys gave me a real word about that. I had to look in the mirror about that, because I think it was Amanda who said, like, when her husband comes in and he's like, how can I help? That further proves you have no idea what is going on in our life. And I would ask sue, how can I help? Like an idiot. And I got it. I was like, oh, my God. I'm doing this, like, awful thing that just then I say, oh, how can I help? Which further proves how much I'm totally out of the loop. So I was like, you know what? Figure it out. Figure out a way that I can help figure. Figure it out. Megan, I don't know.

[Abby Wambach]

That's awesome.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So thank you guys for that.

[Amanda Doyle]

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[Abby Wambach]

We talk a lot on this podcast about boundaries. Have you all had to during this weird time establish any challenging boundaries with each other or with anybody else in the world that you can think of, like family of origin stuff, the world. You guys have to deal with the world often and its feelings or each other?

[Sue Bird]

I actually can't think of anything. The only thing literally just happened yesterday. There's like sometimes where, because we're always like gaming things out together, right? Whether it's like saving the world or what's going on, you know, in each of our teams or what's going on with our families. Like there's Always, like, we're gaming. We're talking. We're gaming things out. And I think one boundary we're starting to realize we need to set is we can't. Okay. So as somebody. As one of us is explaining something that's frustrating, that's happening, the other one, in their attempt to be supportive, can actually whip the other one up. So some. It's like.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And because we.

[Sue Bird]

No, it's not always. It's not just you.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Mostly me.

[Sue Bird]

But it's like. So let's say, you know.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Cause I get fired up on your behalf.

[Sue Bird]

Yes. But vice versa. And it's like. So one of us is like, can you believe this? This and that is happening. And I'm already, you know, I'm already whipped up. And she'll, like, come in and whip me up even more. And it just happened yesterday where I was like, okay, this is actually not helpful now. Like, I'm too whipped up, and I think I can do it for. I do it to you as well. And so it's like, that's, like, one thing I think we're starting to realize.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I want to be whipped up.

[Abby Wambach]

Yes.

[Sue Bird]

Whipped is my.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I want to whip up for, like, five hours in a row. Meanwhile, we get to the five hours we haven't accomplished anything.

[Abby Wambach]

That's right.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So I feel like you're trying to boundary.

[Sue Bird]

That's like.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Sometimes you just need the person to. Yes. Like, be there and, like, listen and be supportive and. Or show you another side if that you're not seeing. Whatever the case is. But yeah. Okay. Maybe it is a me thing for me then.

[Abby Wambach]

I've never heard about that. That is such a huge situation. My sister and I. I mean, I can get on the phone with her and say, I don't. Like, I don't. That person looked at me weird. In 20 minutes, we're both homicidal. We're both plotting the death of that person and how we can get away with it and remove the body. But I will tell you, I believe there's an appropriate level of whippedness that everyone needs to get to. Because I also don't like. I think our dynamic is, I'm whipped, and then you try to unwhip me.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yep.

[Abby Wambach]

Telling me everything's okay.

[Sue Bird]

That's frustrating, too.

[Abby Wambach]

You know, when you're whipped up about something and somebody's like, well, I mean, let's look at it from their perspective, and you're like, okay, no.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah. There's like, a happy level.

[Abby Wambach]

What's helpful?

[Sue Bird]

Right. Like, not. Yeah. By the way, this is all very like situation dependent, topic dependent. Sometimes you do want to be. You want somebody to be like right there whipped up with you. But I think for me, it's a scenario where it's like my. One of my work environments. And I was finding that it like, wasn't helping me to like, go from. I was like 0 to 50 and she sent me to 100. And that was like, this is my work environment. I can't be at 100. That was kind of sort of what was happening. So I think that it's like a good somebody to meet your whippedness, but maybe not exceed, but not bring you down either to your point. It is frustrating for someone to try to like, calm you when you're not ready to be calmed. And that's actually what I do sometimes I go to. She'll be talking about something and I immediately jump into solutions. And then I realize what happened. I'm like, yep, not yet. I get it. That was too soon.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Too soon on the solution. Looks like I'm ready for a solution. I'm in the middle of my bullshit. Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Too soon on the solution. Yeah, well, yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And you are very solution oriented and very solution oriented. I'm more like, not emotional because you are emotional, but I'm more like, get in the mix and like, you're an organizer and I'm like a fuck shit up in front of the microphone sort of thing. And like, we have to. Which we both get so much from each other, but it's like a balance of where those are the boundaries where we need to sort of do that.

[Abby Wambach]

And that's the thing. It's so beautiful when Glennon comes to.

[Amanda Doyle]

Me, she's coming to me with real problems that are like life and death for people, you know? And so I don't want to like, live in that space 24 hours a day. And so sometimes she'll just be like, can you please just not brightside? This, like, this is not a bright side able moment. This is horrible. Like, this is bad. Like, let's just sit and feel bad for a little bit. And when that is kind of the consistent conversation, I'm like, fuck, I'm.

[Abby Wambach]

She doesn't.

[Amanda Doyle]

I'm sad now.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I'm actually sad.

[Amanda Doyle]

I like being sad.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, that's true. Because I can like, get to the thing and then get to the. What we're going to do and then be done. Because that's what my work requires of me.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

And you're like, oh, but for the rest of the day, for the Rest.

[Amanda Doyle]

Of the day I'm like, but is the world ending? I think that you just told me it is. And now I'm supposed to deal with that? I don't know.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. Okay. I want to ask you guys some quick questions, like just a little rapid fire type thing. But it doesn't have to be rapid because I've never actually.

[Megan Rapinoe]

We'll do our best, but something never ended.

[Abby Wambach]

It's not. I've never done a rapid thing in my damn life.

[Megan Rapinoe]

So I try to do rapid. I'm like, well, I need to give context.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah, don't worry about your rapidity. Okay. Which one of you is the more jealous one? And do you ever get jealous?

[Megan Rapinoe]

I am not generally a jealous person. I don't get like too whipped up about that. But also, it hasn't really happened with you. And I feel like what I could be.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, she's not.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I'm not.

[Sue Bird]

She's not. I think it's more me because she's literally not.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Do you feel like you're jealous? I don't feel like you're.

[Sue Bird]

I'm more jealous. I don't know that I'm like a. I guess you're not super jealous person. I'm more jealous. I'm more jealous contextually than you or conceptually than you.

[Abby Wambach]

I feel like, for sure jealous. Do you?

[Amanda Doyle]

No, you're definitely more jealous than me. And also, if somebody comes into our situation where I get a weird vibe with. I'm like, cut all ties.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yes.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, cut em off.

[Amanda Doyle]

Cut all ties. Cause I've been, you know, traumatized in my past. And so when I feel the feeling, I like, tell you, I'm like, that person crossed a boundary. I don't know what it is. Maybe nothing has happened.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Like, literally.

[Amanda Doyle]

They're probably wonderful people.

[Abby Wambach]

That's always a fun conversation. I've had it a few times. I can't interrupt you again. Nor can I explain to you why.

[Sue Bird]

Why?

[Abby Wambach]

Godspeed.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And then sometimes I feel like it's like, sometimes it's like I know that people are vibing like you or, you know, whatever. And sometimes I just like, don't feel threatened. And I'm like, well, they want to. You do understand what's happening right now? Like, they like you. But it's fine because I don't feel threatened by it. But don't ever give me anything. Feel threatened by.

[Abby Wambach]

That's so interesting. That's amazing to me. So is the fact that I feel jealous of certain people and I haven't been jealous for years, but that's also because we haven't seen any other human beings. Probably.

[Megan Rapinoe]

That's right.

[Sue Bird]

Direct correlation.

[Abby Wambach]

Yeah. Covid has made me a more mature person. But is it because I feel actually threatened? That's so embarrassing.

[Amanda Doyle]

I don't know.

[Abby Wambach]

I don't either. Well, think about it. Okay. What do you guys do for fun? Yeah, this is a theme for us. We try to figure out what is the thing that you do that isn't related to your productivity or that you get nothing out of except for enjoyment.

[Amanda Doyle]

I keep trying to bring up things that we can do for fun together. Like, I just brought up the other day, like, I think we should get into pickleball, like, activities.

[Abby Wambach]

She wants me to play a fucking sport with her.

[Amanda Doyle]

You'll learn when you get retired, Megan. You'll learn that.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Like, you're like, you gotta get it out.

[Amanda Doyle]

I don't know what I'm gonna do. What am I gonna do to work out and have fun? Cause you gotta do it at the same time. Well, we do. Just cause we have children and that takes up all of our day.

[Abby Wambach]

Mm.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I mean, I know you answer. Listen. Okay, you go first and then I'll give mine.

[Sue Bird]

I think what we do together really well is understand that we need other people. So, like, we have a great friend group that we'll make sure we get dinners in with or, like, plan a weekend and go, like, hang out at their house. We've done vacations. I think the dinners part is a big part of our life. Like finding a cool new restaurant or one that has been around forever that we've never been to. Kind of checking those boxes. Those to me are like, are outlets and things to do. I try to get her to do. I'm like, I love board games. And I've tried to get her into, like, backgammon or something like that.

[Megan Rapinoe]

This is also.

[Sue Bird]

Even when I was teaching you Domino's the other day, you were just like, not. I was like, wait, did you? I'm like, did you like it?

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, I did.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I was like, did you? I don't know. Did I? I don't know. Also, I think that there is something about my insecurity. Like, you are so smart. And especially when we start playing games, sue has the ability to hold 25 different fully gamed out situations in her head at one time. And every single day I leave for my workout, I forget something. Like, I just can't hold it all in my head. I don't know it's somewhere, but like. So I think there's a Little bit of that. So you're like. And you grew up playing games. I didn't really, like, grow up playing games and stuff. I think that I just. The only thing I enjoy doing really outside of now I say that, like, outside of my sport, which is a lot, and outside of like, what I consider my work, which is the, you know, activism and however we want to say it. I don't even know if activist is the right word. I just only really care about going to dinner with friends and, like, having fun and seeing other people and like, you know, just that, like community and whatever and having conversation. Like, is. Is talking like a hobby? Because we love.

[Sue Bird]

We love it.

[Megan Rapinoe]

We love to, like, play out scenarios or do debates or talk about issues. I mean, we fl. Especially with our closest friends. Like, we flush a lot out of, like, what's our stance? How do we talk about it? What does this mean? Blah, blah, blah. And of course, I love shopping. We can't really do a lot of that now. But I. It's like, I think that would be fashion and everything is like a form of self expression for me. And now, like, for you, it's becoming. Yeah. And it's like, outside of that, like, I'm not hiking, I'm not doing other sports. I'm not doing other physical activities. I don't. I've started to get into cooking a little bit. We'll see how long that lasts. But, like, I'm also tired. Like, our lives are busy and we have a lot and I just want to go to dinner and eat great food and like.

[Sue Bird]

But do you remember.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Have good wine.

[Sue Bird]

Do you remember early, like, very early in our relationship? I had already. No, maybe that's not when it happened. But it was early in the relationship, within maybe a year. And we were like, trying to plan a vacation. And you said it first, but I was thinking it, and it was kind of like, well, we're gonna invite other people, right? Oh, and I think it's like. But like, that's.

[Megan Rapinoe]

We.

[Sue Bird]

We're together. Like, actually in the early part of our relationship, we were together a lot. But then it was like, yeah, we like other people coming into our space or us going into theirs and like, doing all the things we just said.

[Megan Rapinoe]

We spend a lot.

[Abby Wambach]

That's magical to me. So do you all like the same sorts of people? Like, is making friends hard for you? Are most of your friends queer couples? Do you ever have a couple where you're like, I don't like her, but you. The other one does. How is that? It Feels like it's so easy for you, the way you're talking about it.

[Megan Rapinoe]

You have.

[Sue Bird]

I have, yeah.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I'm not as good as, like, keeping touch. I feel like I have a lot of friends. They're just all over the place.

[Sue Bird]

That's, like, what sports does.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

It's really.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And you've done a better job of keeping in touch. And you have.

[Sue Bird]

I have some home towns in New York.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Like, not. Not. Not necessarily the ones I grew up with. There's a couple, but just kind of through the years. Who you became friends with from. From New York, where I'm from. And those are, like, the homies forever. And they've now adopted Megan. I think they like you better.

[Megan Rapinoe]

No. Yeah.

[Sue Bird]

Which is totally fine. But, like, they are now. Megan is, like, now in this group. Like, they have their own individual friendships and relationships, and that's. We've been lucky in that way that it's, like, kind of worked out like that.

[Megan Rapinoe]

But, no, we don't have a lot of new friends. No, no. It's kind of like we have such little time as it is. Making new friends is, like, hard and a lot. And then it's gonna, like, take away, like, it's hard to even schedule a dinner with the friends that. The existing friends that we have. So it's like, I think. Where do you meet new friends? I don't know.

[Abby Wambach]

I don't either.

[Sue Bird]

I have no idea. That, to me, is the saddest part. One of the sadder parts about being an athlete is you grow up with someone or a team or a certain amount of teammates. You have all these experiences, all these shared experiences, the highs, the lows. Like, these are, like, seriously deep relationships. Now, you may not know, like, their names of their siblings, but you're going to know a lot of other things about them. It's like this weird, unique thing, but at the same time, the ones you do become super close with, life goes on. You all live where you live. And then there, like, I spoke about Diana. She lives in Phoenix, in California. And outside of the WNBA season, if I see her once a year, I feel lucky. And I know it's the same for you and a lot of your friends. Like, I'm sure you got, like, you guys spent all this time together. When's the last time you saw each other? Like, it's just. And that, to me, is like, the saddest part, because those relationships would continue to thrive, and they just kind of get stunted because you're so far away from each other.

[Abby Wambach]

What's the most important thing to each of you and a friend. And what's a deal breaker?

[Sue Bird]

Ooh.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Oh. There can be absolutely no bullshit. No, no, I don't. It's like, no games, no bullshit, no dishonesty. No, we don't have time for this. Like I said, it's already difficult enough to find time. And I feel like we have to deal with bullshit in all other ways. It's like, I don't want that friction. It just feels like a waste of time. Why am I spending time with this person if they're even making me question anything? And sort of that trust. I feel like our friend group in New York and even friends that I have kind of scattered. There's just this trust that if I don't talk to you for three months, it's fine, we'll just pick up at dinner. Or we're always there to kind of support each other and like, have each other's back. It has to be that sort of easy feeling. Otherwise I would just rather, like, not in a mean way. I would just like, rather not hang out. It's totally fine. Like, we clearly don't vibe or something. But like, if it's not a hundred, it's kind of not worth it. Like, we'd rather just chill, you know, with ourselves or like with other friends that we have the kind of like forced situation. I'm just like. And I don't know if it comes from being in sports so long. Like, I can get along with anyone. Put me at any dinner table in the entire world. It's like, fine. I know the converse. I can like have conversation, whatever. But it's like I've been forced to spend so much time with so many people that I would never choose. Not in a bad way. They wouldn't choose me either. But I've had so much of that. I want zero of that.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's right.

[Megan Rapinoe]

That's moving forward.

[Abby Wambach]

The site we just did this whole thing about friendship and that's. The science of friendship is like, it should be 100% or nothing. That we all have this idea that relationships should be suffering. But actually friendships are the ones things we get to choose, right? Like, we don't get to choose our frickin family. Once we get married. We don't really get to choose our partner. That's like, done deal, right? That's like. But our Friendships are the one thing that we can be like, no 100 or 0.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's good.

[Abby Wambach]

No friction.

[Amanda Doyle]

And I think, you know, you guys are touching on a lot of Stuff that I've thought about, especially over the last five, six years of my retirement. Having these, like, friends that you. You go to camp, you're playing on your teams, and you have people around all the time. One thing that I think what will happen when you retire is you're going to get really picky about the people that you spend because you all are so busy and having those friendships that you do get, like, chosen family, you know, a lot of especially gay women. Not that you guys have bad family situations, but I just know that having other queer women in our lives is, like, really important to. To feel like you're having that sense of community in some way, and they're just better.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I mean, being gay is the best thing ever for, like, every reason under the sun.

[Abby Wambach]

Thank God. Okay, we kept you for too long already. This is called we can do hard things. What's the hardest thing you're dealing with right now before we leave in your life? What's the hardest?

[Sue Bird]

I mean, I think for me, I've said I was going to play another year. It's more than likely my last. So there's the whole retirement, which is really code word for, like, identity and, like, who are you without this? So that's, like, always just kind of swirling in the back, you know, because then I have, like I was saying earlier how some days I show up to the workout, I feel bad. Some days I feel good. On the good days, I'm like, maybe I just do this literally another couple years. And I know that's just me holding on to the identity, not the game itself or any of those things. So I think that's probably the hardest thing I'm dealing with right now.

[Abby Wambach]

That's so honest and beautiful.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. I mean, the. Yeah, the aging athlete is. Is tough because I can't. You know, my life has never been totally wrapped up in soccer either. I've always felt my identity firmly in other places, which sometimes is, like, worse because I'm like, do you want to do this? Do you want to keep doing it? And a lot of other things are wrapped up in it. So that's a little bit. And then I think trying to live in a. Like, trying to create a world that takes me fully into account. Sure you guys feel this way. I think you feel this way being in women's sports, like, every day. I'm like, this is insane. The world that we live in is completely insane. It doesn't take our full selves into account and so many other full selves into account. And so how do you? Because it's not like we can just go to another planet on a more evolved place. This is where we are. But how do I live outside of that while breaking that down, but not getting bogged. Bogged down by that? Like, almost like trying to live in the future and setting things up and doing things differently, I think is always, like, a challenge, because I just. It's like, we can't do things the same way that other. Whether it's successful, you know, male athletes or successful, you know, media people, whatever. Like, we can't do it the way that it was done. And it's a really difficult trap to not fall into because it's. It, like, makes you think that you can. And they're like, just do this and just do this and just do this and say this and blah, blah, blah. And then you get to the end where you've done everything, and they're like, yeah, it's still not.

[Sue Bird]

You're still not in. And listen.

[Amanda Doyle]

But there's. You have to keep doing that. Megan and sue, because y'all are trailblazers, and trailblazers are always questioning themselves, like, whether we want to believe that or not. Trailblazers are like, fuck, what am I doing, Sue? And I'm sure a lot of people tell you this, you know, just. Just really take in everything and enjoy your last year. And what I will tell you is that my life got so much better when I retired. It got so much better. The biggest fears that I had were where I was going to make money, how I was going to make money, and what I was going to do to get health care. And the truth is, I've made more money in my retirement much by just, like, actually giving more time to myself to, like, create things and do things that I want to do.

[Abby Wambach]

And that's the beauty of being a woman, Athlet. There's plenty of chances to make more when you stop.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I mean, literally.

[Sue Bird]

That's actually the wild part. I think that's what's hard to wrap your head around, like, being told. I think kind of what you're saying is you're not valued as maybe an athlete right in the moment. Like wnba, we get. I mean, the hate is, like, crazy. So you feel, like, lesser than. But then you walk off the court and, you know, a company wants to sponsor you or somebody wants to hear you speak, and then you're told you're valued because of. And so it's just like, what? Like, I don't. That's. To me, that's where it's like, yeah, banging my head against the wall.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah. I think that's actually the thing that is the hardest all the time, and particularly for me since 2019, is like, the balance between doing my job, which is playing soccer, at least it's one of my jobs, but it's kind of like the cornerstone job. Even though it's like the one where I get treated the worst, paid the worst, and all the conditions are the worst. Everything else kind of is not relying on it, but sort of predicated on it, whatever. And so what's the balance between doing my job and then securing my financial future? Because especially being older post 2019, like, I'm not an idiot, and I'm not gonna, like, be like, no, I'm gonna focus 100% on soccer so I can be the best player that I can be and, like, totally forego my financial security in the future, nor should I have to. But every minute that you go this way, it takes away from soccer and then just constantly feeling like you're at odds with yourself and with your career and all of that and how difficult it is to actually just be a women's professional player in any sort of league with. Coupling that with this weird world that's exploded for us kind of off the field. So it's just. It's constantly trying not to hate everyone all the time.

[Sue Bird]

Yes.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's like, yes, that's right. I hate to say this, and it's probably going to get, like, you know, clipped by Washington examiner, but sometimes I'm just like, I hate everyone for everything that you do to all of us. It's so frustrating. It's so frustrating.

[Amanda Doyle]

It's so infuriating. Because here's the thing.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Yeah.

[Amanda Doyle]

Like, you don't. Y'all should. Y'all should be able to, at this age, at this time in your life, be able to walk away completely fine and financially set for life. But, like, we're women athletes, so it's like, constantly fighting that battle and.

[Megan Rapinoe]

No, totally fighting the powers that be to break things down. But I would really love to just, quite frankly, never deal with U.S. soccer ever again. Yeah, that would be my. That would be my goal. That's gonna be the clip. I know that's gonna be the clip. And honestly, I've say that right to the board because it's just. They're just. Have they given us a platform? Yes. Like, have we been one of the best supported teams in the world? Better than awful doesn't mean good, but okay, yes, I understand that there is good with it but to feel like in so many other parts of my life, I'm moving on and being more open minded and progressive and working with people that are not just like minded in the sense of a feedback loop, but actually view me the way that I view myself and I want myself to be viewed as a whole human and I view them that way and we view each other that way. And then sometimes we get stuck back in these old antiquated ways that just. Yeah, go ahead.

[Sue Bird]

I like love to use whether it's movie quotes or things you saw somewhere and bring it all back around. And I don't know why this ever stuck in my head, but I feel like I say it pretty often. It's from the movie Selena and it's when her dad is like, we have to be more Mexican than the Mexicans and more American than the Americans. And I feel like that is the life of a female athlete. You have to be like, whatever it is, you're supposed to be over here, you have to be that times a thousand. And whatever it is, you're supposed to be over here that times a thousand. And you're just stuck in these places. And it's actually different for every athlete because everyone kind of has their own lane for lack of a better that it might show up in. But yeah, it's like Selena's dad said, that's how I feel all the time.

[Abby Wambach]

I don't know if we're gonna name this podcast I Hate Everybody or it's like Selena's dad said. Cause both I love.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah, it's.

[Abby Wambach]

Well, maybe we'll title it it's like Selena's dad said I Hate Everybody.

[Megan Rapinoe]

Right? But it's just constantly that this is.

[Abby Wambach]

All such big stuff and what you're talking about having evolved past an institution that you have to stay in. I have a friend who talks about a Zen Cohen, which is like, there's a goose that's growing inside of a glass bottle, right? How do you get the goose outside of the bottle without hurting the goose or shattering the bottle? And I see you, Megan, trying to do that so beautifully where you have this bottle that is so fucked up and so small, but is the only container for these younger women coming up. So, you know, you can't say burn it all down, even though that's what you do want to say, because then you have to come back 20 times and say, I didn't mean burn it down. I meant like put a fire a little bit.

[Megan Rapinoe]

It's totally. And it's like, really what I want to do being the goose inside the bottle, I'm just. I'll break the bottle. It's fine. I don't care. If I cut my foot on the way out, that's totally fine. But then don't look at me and be like, oh, my God, did you break the bottle? That's very destructive, right? And I'm like, okay, well, I'm sorry. I couldn't fit the lower half of my body through that tiny opening at the top. Like, it's like they. It's like people want to acknowledge for female athletes now or women who play, you know, female sports, like, we know it's not what it needs to be, but also, like, don't talk about that too much and don't push too much. And also, we'll be the ones that'll continue to, you know, set the benchmarks or make the rules or whatever, when actually we do have all the answers. I firmly believe that. I feel. Me and Jessica Clarendon, the woman that I work with full time now, Laysha Clarendon, is her wife's place on wma. So obviously, we have this whole fuck it up brain trust going on. At least we try to. We always talk about living in the future and just telling people, it's gonna be okay. You guys aren't gonna die. Come with us. It's like, everything is gonna be okay, but we do kind of know how to live in the future. And, like, I feel like if you gave us the keys, I'm sure you guys feel this way, like, to whatever institution, whether it's sports or media or this, like, I could do a good job. I just know that. And. But it's like, how many other people think that, you know, is it just us thinking that and, you know, having to try to convince everyone else, like, we know what's going on? But.

[Amanda Doyle]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Well, if we want to know how to do it, we can watch the wnba.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I mean, that is true.

[Abby Wambach]

That is a good.

[Amanda Doyle]

Right? Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

The T shirt the goose has on.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

Says, vote warm in the glass bottle of the WNBA will lead the way. Right. We adore both of you. Megan, I've adored you forever, But, Sue, I just knew you'd be as wonderful as you are.

[Sue Bird]

Thank you.

[Abby Wambach]

And thank you, sue, for your intense gentleness. I have noticed that every time you start to say something that is a sports metaphor, you start it with in sports. And I know you're talking to me and trying to help me through, and I know listeners. I see you, and I thank you.

[Sue Bird]

Thank you.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I love your take on Sports.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah, we love it.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I actually feel.

[Sue Bird]

Twitter feed.

[Megan Rapinoe]

I feel closer to you in the way that I feel about sports than anything else that I've ever read or whatever. I'm just. I always say the sports. I'm like, go, sports. Like what? And like. And it's just a wild.

[Sue Bird]

It is a wild.

[Megan Rapinoe]

And I'm like, this is so weird. Go, sports. So anytime you chime in, it's just the best. I'm like, what she said.

[Sue Bird]

Yeah.

[Amanda Doyle]

So good.

[Abby Wambach]

It's a beautiful thing to come to the sports with beginner's mind. Well, we're lucky.

[Amanda Doyle]

Y'all are just. You're all our icons. Not just sports icons, but really feminists and women in the world that are doing world changing things. And I can't wait for y'all to retire.

[Sue Bird]

The world actually kind of needs new friends. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Abby Wambach]

I'm excited for it too. I'm excited to see what happens when they're out of the bottle. We love you. Go do all the things. Try to be quiet when each other is on zoom meetings. Megan, stop being such a hypocrite.

[Megan Rapinoe]

True.

[Sue Bird]

Sue, share your feelings.

[Abby Wambach]

And to the rest of you. Oh, they're so cute.

[Amanda Doyle]

They are so cute.

[Abby Wambach]

So glad you have each other. All right, when things get hard this week, don't forget, we can do hard things.

[Amanda Doyle]

That's right.

[Abby Wambach]

See you back next week. If this podcast means something to you, it would mean so much to us if you'd be willing to take 30 seconds to do these three things. First, can you please follow or subscribe to We Can Do Hard Things? Following the pod helps you because you'll never miss an episode. And it helps us because you'll know. Never miss an episode. To do this, just go to the We Can Do Hard Things show page on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Odyssey, or wherever you listen to podcasts. And then just tap the plus sign in the upper right hand corner or click on follow. This is the most important thing for the pod. While you're there, if you'd be willing to give us a five star rating and review and share an episode you loved with a friend, we would be so grateful. We appreciate you very much. Much. We Can Do Hard Things is created and hosted by Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, and Amanda Doyle in partnership with Odyssey. Our executive producer is Jenna Wise Berman and the show is produced by Lauren Legrasso, Allison Schott, Dina Kleiner, and Bill Schultz.