We Can Do Hard Things: Episode Summary

Title: FUN: What the Hell Is It and Why Do We Need It? (Best Of)
Hosts: Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, Amanda Doyle
Release Date: April 5, 2025

Introduction

In this heartfelt and introspective episode of We Can Do Hard Things, host Glennon Doyle, alongside her wife Abby Wambach and sister Amanda Doyle, delve into the concept of fun. The discussion explores the elusive nature of fun, its significance in our lives, and the societal and personal barriers that hinder our ability to experience genuine joy.

Defining Fun

Glennon Doyle opens the conversation admitting her struggle with understanding fun, stating at [03:50], "I know nothing about fun. I am unfun." This vulnerability sets the stage for a deep exploration of what fun truly means.

Abby Wambach defines fun as "the experience of joy" and distinguishes it from activities with a predetermined outcome. At [18:45], she explains, "For me, fun is the experience of joy. And sometimes that means you don't know what the outcome is."

Personal Experiences with Fun

The hosts share personal anecdotes to illustrate their relationship with fun:

• Abby’s Competitive Nature: Abby discusses how she integrates competition into mundane tasks to make them enjoyable. At [19:16], she shares, "Sometimes when I have to do a chore of some sort, I weave in some semblance of fun, some sort of competition."

• Glennon’s Struggle: Glennon admits her difficulty in associating fun with purposeless activities, contrasting it with her understanding of rest and work. At [20:05], she states, "I understand what rest is. I understand what work is. I kind of understand what self-care is. But this idea of fun... I don't understand it."

• Amanda’s Role: Amanda highlights the strength and organizational skills she brings to the family, emphasizing the mutual reliance among the trio. At [06:55], she notes, "She's the strength. She is the person who makes everything less confusing because she's smarter than all of us."

Gender and Cultural Conditioning on Fun

A significant portion of the discussion addresses how societal norms and gender roles impact the ability to experience fun:

• Cultural Expectations: Glennon reflects on how women are often conditioned to prioritize productivity and caretaking over personal joy. At [24:11], she muses, "Does fun require some kind of being unselfconscious? Does fun require losing yourself and like not worrying about how you appear?"

• Internalized Misogyny: The hosts explore how successful and happy women may face backlash due to internalized societal expectations. At [60:46], Glennon asserts, "The happier, the more joyful, the more successful, the more bold a man is, the more the world likes and trusts him. And the more successful, confident, bold and happy and free a woman is, the less we like and trust her."

• Impact on Relationships: Abby discusses the jealousy that can arise when one person in a trio feels their bond is less obligatory compared to others. At [10:07], she shares, "I feel sometimes jealous of sister because she can't not be your sister."

Strategies to Rediscover Fun

The hosts propose actionable steps to reclaim fun in their lives:

• Incorporating Music: Both Glennon and Abby emphasize the transformative power of music in evoking joy and breaking free from mental loops. At [52:15], Abby shares, "It's taking us out of the trap of our heads."

• Creating Joyful Moments: Glennon suggests integrating fun into daily routines without the pressure of productivity. At [64:41], she recommends, "We're gonna listen to music this week... to awaken this fun self inside of us."

• Challenging Societal Norms: They encourage listeners to redefine fun on their own terms rather than conforming to societal expectations. At [65:47], Glennon states, "Make a list of jams for yourself. Of fun jams."

Listener Questions

Question from Sarah ([44:00]):
“I'm a wife, sister, daughter, mother, and healthcare worker. When I think about my life, it strikes me that I've never known how to have fun... What do you think?”

Hosts' Response:

• Glennon Doyle empathizes with Sarah’s struggle, suggesting that fun isn’t lost but rather hibernating due to neglect. At [48:10], she theorizes, "My theory is not that our fun self is completely dead... she just decided to go dormant when we stopped feeding her."

• Abby Wambach encourages active participation in joyful activities, referencing her own experience with music as a catalyst for fun. At [52:44], she shares, "These interstitial, like, joy moments that otherwise would have not been the joy moments."

Conclusion

The episode wraps up with a challenge to listeners to actively incorporate fun into their daily lives, primarily through music, to reconnect with their authentic selves. The hosts reiterate the importance of embracing joy as a counterbalance to life’s hardships, emphasizing that fun is not a luxury but a necessary component of a fulfilling life.

Key Takeaways:

• Fun is a personal and experiential form of joy that doesn't require a specific outcome.
• Societal and gendered expectations often suppress women’s ability to experience and express fun.
• Rediscovering fun involves intentional actions, such as integrating music and redefining joy on one’s own terms.
• Embracing fun is essential for mental well-being and combating feelings of depression and malaise.

Notable Quotes:

• Abby Wambach ([18:45]): "For me, fun is the experience of joy. And sometimes that means you don't know what the outcome is."
• Glennon Doyle ([60:10]): "I think the truth is, the happier, the more joyful, the more successful, the more bold a man is, the more the world likes and trusts him. And the more successful, confident, bold and happy and free a woman is, the less we like and trust her."
• Abby Wambach ([52:16]): "It's like it takes us out of the interior and enlivens some part of us."

Final Thoughts:

We Can Do Hard Things effectively navigates the complex terrain of understanding and embracing fun, particularly from a female perspective shaped by societal expectations. Through honest dialogue and personal reflections, the hosts provide valuable insights and encouragement for listeners seeking to infuse more joy into their lives.