The New Era: LOVE, FURY, FREEDOM (Watch on YouTube!)

Summary

WE CAN DO HARD THINGS
Episode: The New Era: LOVE, FURY, FREEDOM
Date: September 16, 2025
Hosts: Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, Amanda Doyle

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Episode Overview

In this pivotal episode, the “We Can Do Hard Things” trio—Glennon, Abby, and Amanda—usher in a new era for their beloved podcast, marked by intimate video recordings and a renewed sense of embodied presence. Framed by a backdrop of personal upheaval and societal crisis—fascism, menopause, empty nesting, and a nation in turmoil—they reflect on activism, joy, embodiment, and the responsibilities (and opportunities) facing their community, the “Pod Squad.” The conversation is rich with vulnerability, humor, metaphor, and practical wisdom for braving hard times and staying human together.

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1. Moving to Video: Why Embodiment?

Timestamps: 01:47 – 06:16

• The show now features a video component, responding to overwhelming Pod Squad requests and Glennon’s therapist’s encouragement.
• Glennon muses on the tension between being a writer (sharing ideas without her body being judged) and being visible:
  • “Even though I became a writer so that I could get you my thoughts without my body being involved, we can do new things.” (03:05)
  • “It might be something we’re overdoing... I would like to make a small case for disembodiment.” (07:02)
• Insightful discussion about how public perception, especially for women, often prioritizes bodies over ideas, and the political act of showing up physically.
  • Amanda: “…the fact that women show up in their bodies… and they are immediately judged and policed based on their bodies…” (08:49)
• Lighthearted banter weaves throughout:
  • “Smash that subscribe button… and ding dong the bell!” (Amanda and Glennon, 03:49)

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2. A New Season: From Planned Episodes to Real Conversations

Timestamps: 06:16 – 14:41

• The hosts commit to a more unfiltered, conversational format—less performance, more genuine “just being together.”
• Glennon: “One of the things I’d like to do more of this season… is just talk to you, just have conversations about what we’re really feeling and going through and seeing in the world…” (11:06)
• Abby shares, “Sometimes our pre call meetings about the episodes… are often my most favorite.” (12:45)

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3. Glennon’s Triple Threat: Fascism, Menopause, and Empty Nesting

Timestamps: 14:41 – 21:15

• Glennon reveals personal struggles at the crossroads of political upheaval, menopause, and children leaving home:
  • “If you, like, looked at a Venn diagram, you would see me at the intersection of fascism and menopause… and also there’s a third one, which is empty nesting.” (14:51)
  • “I have lost whoever the hell I was before all this happened.” (21:15)
• Glennon humorously paraphrases Bruce Springsteen to describe menopause symptoms:
  • “Was Bruce Springsteen in perimenopause?... ‘I wake up with my sheets soaking wet and a freight train running through the middle of my head.’” (22:16)
• Music as medicine: Florence & The Machine’s “Free,” especially the lyric:
  • “Is this how it is, to exist in the face of suffering and death and somehow still keep singing?” (23:03, paraphrased by Glennon)
• The genesis of their tour: an instinct to “open up our arms and give it all to you.” (23:39)

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4. The Tour—Activation, Hope, and the Power of Community

Timestamps: 25:31 – 30:09

• Abby: “It’s the best time I’ve had in a long time.” (25:34)
• Amanda expands on the collective energy: “Hopelessness is a result of most people believing that most people don’t care. And being in those rooms was like, oh, no, we… all… care deeply.” (26:18)
• The idea that connection and mobilization are our generational call:
  • “You can also just say, am I going to step up into my place in this? This is who I am. … What is my role in this?” (Amanda, 28:53)
  • “Here we are. What’s our plan and what’s our posture?” (Amanda, 29:38)

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5. Metaphors for Activism: The Candle and the River/Fleet

Timestamps: 30:09 – 43:54

• Glennon shares two powerful organizing metaphors:

  • The One-Candle Vigil: “I come here every night with my little candle so that they don’t change me.” (32:35)
  • The River and the Freedom Fleet:
    • Inspired by Michelle Alexander’s essay, Glennon reclaims “resistance” narratives: “We… are not the resistance. We are the river.” (36:37)
    • “The fleet is made up of so many different ships… all working together towards one goal, to get humanity further.” (38:23)
    • “Our job is to make life in the boat, in the fleet so irresistible that we are loving each other so hard… that the people from the shore cannot help but want to jump aboard.” (38:55)
    • Guidelines for welcoming “shore standers” onto ships without ego or gatekeeping.

• Abby: “One of the frustrations that I see a lot is… a new person comes aboard and because they might not have the language down yet… [The left] is very exclusive at times in our ships. And I think we need to become much more inclusive.” (45:04)

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6. Engagement as the Antidote to Despair

Timestamps: 46:24 – 49:14

• Amanda reflects on the correlation between happiness, engagement, and activism:
  • “…people who are in that position who get activated—who get involved—then their life is actually better.” (47:47)
  • “If you are sitting there feeling like everything sucks, life is shit… that doesn’t mean stop there. That means keep pushing.” (48:16)
  • “The actual place where you are going to be happy and contented is when you get on a boat.” (48:26)

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7. Holding On To Humanity—In All Its Messiness

Timestamps: 49:14 – 54:34

• Amanda slams self-shame around what matters or brings joy:
  • “There’s this sort of shame… between what are our things that we’re like ‘that’s stupid and petty’ and… these unpetty and unstupid and important things. But I actually think it’s all the same thing.” (49:15)
    • “The whole ball game is to remain so human that certain things don’t fail to break your heart, and remain so human that certain things don’t fail to delight and bring you such joy…” (51:03)
• Glennon: “The only way to save each other and ourselves right now is to hold on dearly to the preciousness of life, of life everywhere… and the only way to hold on to the preciousness of every life is to hold dear to the preciousness of your own.” (52:25)
• The revolution includes snuggling up with “Love Island”:
  • “I mean when you were talking, I was thinking about the last time Lillian was at my house, and …organizing, and then… we got in our pajamas and had huge bags of candy…and watched Love Island.” (53:52)
  • “That felt like the irresistible revolution to me.” (54:11)

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8. Rage, Gentleness, and the Pursuit of Joy

Timestamps: 54:34 – 59:09

• Compassion for those struggling to feel loving or hopeful:
  • Glennon: “I have deep compassion for everyone who is not feeling loving right now… What is going on is so barbaric… Some people who are most angry… are staying the most human, too.” (54:35)
• The tension between wellness culture and collective liberation:
  • “As white women… giving up the idea of wellness as… an individual project… and instead surrendering to these collective liberation movements as deckhands…” (55:23)
• Glennon on menopause: “I’ve already requested an entire episode where all I do is bitch about this menopause thing with no solutions. I’m not ready for solutions yet.” (57:29)
• The silver lining: “There’s a shift shedding of all the horseshit during perimenopause that somehow leaves you with all that matters.” (58:22)
• “I was made for such a time as this. That’s all I’m saying. God bless the menopausers. This is our time.” (58:31)

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9. Pod Squad Invitations: Community Calls-to-Action

Timestamps: 59:09 – 60:23

• The hosts invite listeners to share in the comments:
  • What ship you are on and who your captain is.
  • Your daily vigil—your personal act of maintaining hope/humanity.
  • “Tell us also what you’re doing to stay human. What you’re doing to feed yourself, to delight yourself, to fuel your humanity.” (Amanda, 59:09)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “The flow is love. …the side that wishes to stop that and builds the dam against it… They are the resistance.” (Glennon, 36:37)
• “The whole ball game is to remain so human that certain things don’t fail to break your heart, and remain so human that certain things don’t fail to delight and bring you such joy and make you laugh like crazy.” (Amanda, 51:03)
• “We might be like on the dock going, everybody get your asses in the boats. That’s what we are.” (Glennon, 38:55)
• “You must double down [on joy]. …the whole enterprise is trying to unhuman us.” (Amanda, 51:54)
• “I think I was made for such a time as this. That’s all I’m saying. God bless the menopausers. This is our time.” (Glennon, 58:31)

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In Summary

This episode marks a creative and emotional leap for “We Can Do Hard Things.” With vulnerability, wit, and urgency, Glennon, Abby, and Amanda invite listeners to embrace both the fight for justice and the pursuit of joy as equally human endeavors. Through powerful metaphors and shared stories, they call on their community to stay fiercely connected, inclusive, and “human as hell”—lighting small candles in the darkness, finding their ships, fueling the fleet, and refusing to let these hard times harden their hearts.

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Join the conversation:

• What is your activism “ship” and who is your “captain”?
• What’s your daily vigil, big or small, that keeps you human and hopeful?
  Comment on YouTube or Instagram to be part of the ongoing Pod Squad dialogue.

Transcript

[Amanda]

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[Abby]

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[Glennon]

Because you have asked us so many times for this and because my therapist has asked me to practice being more embodied, we are here in video now. Our podcast is in video, which means even though I became a writer so that I could get you my thoughts without my body being involved, we can do new things. You can still listen to us everywhere. You always do. Do not panic. You can still listen to us on audio, but you can also join us on YouTube. Now we are like the kids. We are on something called YouTube, like Gen Z, maybe, something like that. So you can actually see our conversations and we can all like be in a room together hashing all this out on YouTube. We are in person, in video starting today.

[Amanda]

Like, if you're listening to this, if you're watching it, surprise, you already know because on account of you're watching it right now. But if you're listening to it, you can do it on Spotify, Apple, Podcasts. Wherever you do podcast, you can keep doing what you do or you can head over to YouTube and we have a channel there and it's called the we can do hard channel.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

And it.

[Amanda]

The channel is called we can do Hard Things Show. So you go to the YouTubes and you type in we can do Hard Things show. And then you press enter and the YouTubes will give you the channel. And when you get to the channel, ta da. There's where you watch us and two things to do. You press subscribe so you'll get them all. And there's a little bell. It tolls for the and you click it and that's how you'll know to get notifications when we put new videos up there.

[Abby]

Also.

[Amanda]

Yes, this is how the love bugs.

[Glennon]

In the Gen Z they go. Smash that subscribe button. Is that what we're doing here?

[Amanda]

Yeah, we're gonna smash it and we're gonna ding dong the bell.

[Abby]

And also while you are subscribing and clicking and following us on Instagram, We Can Do Hard things. And on TikTok at we can Do Hard Things show, you can find the links to our YouTube and social pages in the description of this episode.

[Glennon]

Okay, you guys, so here we go. We're doing this. We are in video. We are embodied. We're gonna all hang out together. I think what you do is you just like turn on your computer, go to YouTube and. And then put us on your counter.

[Abby]

They also have it on the.

[Glennon]

And we can all just hang out together. So two new video episodes every week. It's a new chapter. We'd love for you to join us. We'll see you on YouTube.

[Abby]

Yeah, yeah.

[Glennon]

Are we going?

[Amanda]

We're going.

[Glennon]

Is it happening?

[Amanda]

No, it's all happening.

[Glennon]

Okay, well, hi everybody. Welcome to We Can Do Hard Things. For some of you, this will feel the same. And for some of you, you will be seeing our faces. Yes, we are on video now, which is the single most requested thing from the pod squad is that we record this in a way that we can all be together sort of in person, which is what is happening now. So we're on your screen. Hi.

[Abby]

How do we look?

[Amanda]

Look, you're right there and we're right here.

[Abby]

Amanda, your background. I'm just obsessed with your background.

[Glennon]

It's beautiful.

[Abby]

Ours is wanting.

[Glennon]

We're gonna fix it eventually.

[Abby]

Maybe. Yeah.

[Amanda]

This is all about growing together. Always has been. This little nook over here, I feel like when you do a behind the scenes, this little window Nook is where I did the last 450 episodes just sitting crisscross applesauce in my son's nook in his bedroom. And then this behind me used to have a bunch of baseball trophies until like 6 hours ago when I was like, sorry, Bobby, this is the only space in the house that will work. And so now it has my thing. So I feel like I have like a space, even though it's inside his space, which feels like an analogy for life. So this is where I am.

[Glennon]

A studio of one's own. Sister is what you are.

[Amanda]

A studio of one's own in a small corner of your 13 year old's bedroom.

[Glennon]

Yes. And we have graduated from Chase's room to the basement.

[Abby]

Yes.

[Glennon]

So that feels like something.

[Abby]

It does. It does feel like something. He is home. And so we were out of there.

[Glennon]

Yeah. So we're trying this thing, which feels. Well, for some people. This will just feel like another episode for us. It kind of feels like the beginning of a new season. We are in video. We are in the basement. We are trying this, as I said, because the Pod squad requested it so much. And it feels kind of exciting, like a little bit more maybe embodied. Because you're not just hearing our voices. Our bodies are here. And there's good things about that and there's challenging things about that. I was thinking about this morning.

[Abby]

Like what?

[Glennon]

Well, I know that embodiment is all the rage.

[Amanda]

Having a body, it's like a new trend. Hashtag bodies for humans.

[Glennon]

Yeah. Everyone thinks we should do it. Like, we should be in our bodies and show up in our bodies and bodies. Bodies, sure. Great. It might be something we're overdoing. I mean, you know, we were all about boundaries, and then we overdid that. We could be overdoing embodiment. And I would like to make a small case for disembodiment, which is that.

[Abby]

Said, no therapist ever.

[Glennon]

Well, I think maybe artists have. Think about that. Because you know, the thing I loved about. Love. All loved about writing, is that I know. I know about writing, is that, you know, you don't have to bring your body. Your. Your thoughts just go out to people without your physical self. It's like your ideas go in and then out into the world.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Glennon]

And then in podcasting, you just send your voice out to people.

[Abby]

Yeah, but your body's making the art. Your body is making the podcast in the books.

[Glennon]

Correct. But your body is not being perceived by the world. Like, you're not being perceived in any way.

[Abby]

Okay. Your body is not the object. It's the words, the ideas, and the ideas.

[Glennon]

It's like the way of getting your insides to other people without your physical presence getting in the way is how I feel about it. And I think that's funny and weird, but also for women, it is a thing.

[Abby]

No.

[Glennon]

React to bodily things first and don't even get to the insides.

[Abby]

Wow. I've never thought of it like that.

[Glennon]

Right, so there is a case for it actually in some ways being a more pure form of communication. To me, when you get your body out of the way and it's just like mind to mind, heart to heart, spirit to spirit.

[Abby]

Wow.

[Glennon]

Does that. Is that sound ridiculous to you, Amanda?

[Amanda]

No, I'm just thinking about all the pieces of that. Because in some ways, then does it make it. If the body is necessarily. Which it is a political structure. Right. Because even the fact that women show up in their bodies, presenting themselves and their art and their ideas, and they are immediately judged and policed based on their bodies, then doing it outside of your body, what does that mean for the political act of writing or showing up?

[Glennon]

Yeah, I hear that too. So really, the important thing about women don't show up in our bodies, and we also don't show up not in our bodies, and then everything will be fine.

[Abby]

So is that why a lot of women, like, is this another reason why a lot of women would, like, hyphenate their names to pretend not to be a woman?

[Glennon]

Oh, you mean. You mean create a different name?

[Abby]

Yeah, like an alias or like, they, like, hyphenate.

[Glennon]

Sure. Like, okay, if. If anyone has not seen Jinx and the Jinx and Zway interview, where Jinx, who is a freaking genius, explains how J.K. rowling actually changed her name so that she'd present to the world as a man because she wanted to be perceived as a different gender, so that. So she's basically trans. Okay, that's not what Jinx said. Jinx said it better. But just go to the interview. Yeah, with Jinx and Zway. Okay.

[Abby]

Anyway, when we. We watched that interview, Glennon stood up and ran around the living room like, why hasn't anybody ever said that? That's it.

[Glennon]

Jinxing.

[Amanda]

I know, but people have been doing that for hundreds of years, you know, the pen names that are not in order to even be published. So it's a very interesting.

[Glennon]

Yeah, but Amanda, then those people maybe who change their names to more masculine names so that the world will accept them and celebrate them as they do, men don't spend the rest of their lives on a crusade against trans people. And that's what J.K. rowling has done. So that's why it's so delicious that Jes framed.

[Amanda]

It is. Yes, it is.

[Glennon]

Okay, sorry, I got us off track there. No, I liked it. I love when you get us off track. Off track is often where we need to be. All who wander are not lost here. We are embodied at the beginning of what we are. Considering this new season. And I was thinking this morning and a lot over the last weeks that one of the things I'd like to do more of this season with the two of you is just talk to you, just have conversations about what we're really feeling and going through and seeing in the world and trying to make things a little bit less episodes and more just like us being together and conversational.

[Abby]

Oh, boy.

[Glennon]

What do you guys think about that?

[Amanda]

I mean, I think that fits with this whole embodied thing. Like if you were just going to plop on a couch with the people in your life who are the ones who are like, I really need some of them right now. You know, that's what friends who are either the ones that you have to go to to be like, you're gonna tell me the truth about what's going on in your life. And that makes me feel brave enough to tell me to tell you the truth about what's going on in my life. It's just there's something really therapeut just sitting down and doing that as opposed to always, you know, presenting and performing and intellectualizing everything. I think that's probably what we need now to stay a little more human.

[Abby]

Yeah, I love it. I think that, I mean, we've done almost 500 episodes and they've been so beautiful. And I've often said that sometimes our pre call meetings about the episodes where we're kind of mulling through it, where we're just like kind of free and we're not like thinking about, what's that, what are we going to say here? You know, like those free conversations are often my most favorite.

[Glennon]

Yeah.

[Abby]

Because we're like really kind of wrestling with something and it takes us wherever it takes us. So I love this. This is basically the way I want to live my life.

[Glennon]

Right.

[Abby]

Where there's just like not really a plan necessarily that we're just living minute and second to second.

[Glennon]

Yeah. I was just thinking about how, you know, I. One of the great joys and shocks of my life is that we've had this community of people that we're doing life with that is now. You know, over the last 20 years, it's been called a bunch of different things, and it will continue to change. And it's been called the Pod Squad the last few years. And it sometimes feels like we're meant to just walk each other through these times. And when we are having the conversations that we have, the three of us off the pod, about the moment we're in and about the pain and the anger and the feeling and all of it, and then we get on the pod and we're like, and now the episode is about blah, blah, blah. It's like, no, no. What. What everybody needs is to have those messy conversations just on this. Yeah. And not switch to a different mode. And then I just think that that might help all of us feel a little less alone during this really difficult time. So we'll just try that and see how that goes.

[Abby]

That's exciting.

[Glennon]

Yeah.

[Abby]

I mean, you said we're scrapping the plan today, and so just go with me. Go with it. And I was like, holy shit, this is exciting.

[Glennon]

Yeah, we had a whole different plan this morning, actually, like 20 minutes ago. And then I was like, that doesn't feel right. So, you know, speaking of tricky times, what I would like to launch this new season with is just that I would love some grace from the Pod Squad during this time. I have, as I've mentioned on the social media and on tour, been living at an interesting intersection of life, which, if you, like, looked at a Venn diagram, you would see me at the intersection of fascism and menopause. And then. And then also there's a third one, which is empty nesting. So I'm just going to say that again. Fascism, menopause, and empty nesting.

[Amanda]

That's what we call a triple threat.

[Glennon]

Yeah, it has made me a threat. And I. I will talk about this. I'm. I want to talk about this over the season. I cannot begin in this short time to tell you how much this has rocked me to the cor.

[Abby]

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[Amanda]

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[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Abby]

Okay, y'.

[Glennon]

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[Abby]

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[Glennon]

I spend all the days, just. All the days just cycling between rage and fear and hopelessness and euphoria for one second and exhaustion and it's just an absolute. I have lost whoever the hell I was before all this happened. And it's been going on for a very long time. And you have been incredibly patient. And you know, a while back I was. I was actually in the bathroom. This was months ago, before, before Tor, before everything. And I was brushing my teeth or something, just exhausted because I hadn't slept the night before because, well, because. Okay, so I was listening to this Bruce Springsteen song the other day. And the lyric is, sometimes it's like someone's taken a knife baby edgy and dull and run a six something through the middle of my skull.

[Abby]

Valley through the middle of my skull.

[Glennon]

At night I wake up with my sheets soaking wet and a freight train running through the middle of my head. No. And I'm like, was Bruce Springsteen in perimenopause? Like this is I'm on fire. That's about right, yeah. I'm on fire. The boss knows. Knows it all. He covers it all. Anyway, that's how I just felt all the time. And then what has tended to get me through is art, actually. It's cheesy, but true.

[Abby]

And it's not cheesy.

[Glennon]

I was in the background. There was this Florence and the Machine song on called Free. And Abby knows, like, this has become my something touchstone during this time.

[Abby]

She's coming out with a new album soon.

[Glennon]

I know. I saw that.

[Abby]

So exciting.

[Glennon]

And it was the song Free. The first lines are, sometimes I wonder if I should be medicated. If I would feel better just slightly sedated, which I think about every four minutes. My life was better when I was sedated.

[Abby]

Was it?

[Glennon]

Yes.

[Amanda]

There are a few things in life that are black and white. Life sedated. Incontrovertibly, yes. That's why we did it for so long. It was better.

[Glennon]

Apologist for disembodiment and sedation. But there's this part where she. She says, is this how it is? Is this how it's always been to exist in the face of suffering and death and somehow still keep singing? And then a little bit later, she says, there's nothing else that I know how to do but to open up my arms and give it all to you and in that moment, brushing my teeth. But there's nothing else that I know how to do but to open up my arms and give it all to you. I thought of the tour. It was like the first hopeful, creative vision, moment of vision that I had had in the midst of this onslaught of just horror in this country. And I ran upstairs to Abby and was like, we have to do a tour. We're gonna do a tour. We have to do a tour. It was just that moment of thinking about all of these beautiful people that we have done, done life with for so long and saying, I don't have a clue. Like, I have no answers. I have no wisdom. All I know is that we have to find a way in the face of all of this suffering and death to still keep singing. And that I have no idea what we're going to do except open up our arms and give it all to each other. And I just had this vision of us just like this, with all of the Pod Squad in the audience and us just together. And so we planned the tour. A lot of you came and saw us, and we came and saw you in all of your cities.

[Abby]

It's the best time I've had in a long time.

[Glennon]

Yeah, it was so special.

[Amanda]

Really.

[Abby]

It's the best time I've had in a long time.

[Glennon]

What did you love about it?

[Abby]

I don't know. Well, first of all, it was nice to get a different scenery. Like, I love you guys. And this. This is great, but, like, it was nice to know you in a different place other than this, and to experience, like, going to dinner and having conversations and then to be in those theaters around this country. Like, it's the same way I feel when I'm watching women's sports and going to a women's sports event. There's just this. I'm not alone. A true sense of belonging that I have not felt in a long time since maybe the last time I played sports.

[Glennon]

What about you?

[Amanda]

I felt really energized. I felt very invigorated. I felt like, you know, there's that quote that hopelessness is a result of most people believing that most people don't care. And being in those rooms was like, oh, no, we look at this, all of us care deeply. And if all of us knew that all of us cared deeply, all of us would not think of hopelessness. We would be thinking of other things. And so I think that that is part of the struggle right now, is that it's. It's that most people believe that most people don't care. And I think that that's horseshit. I think most people do care, and I think we're not seeing the images of that. And when you're all in that space, you just have incontrovertible proof that. That we exist and that we are a fearsome bunch when we're together, and that there is so much possibility. And I just kept thinking of that, that quote of, you know, every generation has to decide, like, what its purpose is, what its mission is. And I spent a really long time being, like, I remember even before. This is a weird thing, but, like, growing up, I just remember being so confused how some people just live their whole lives during the Great Depression and being like, what a kick in the shorts, man. Of all the places and times to be born, and you just drew the short straw and you're a great Depression. Life, like, that sucks. And then. And just thinking of all the eras in which that would be, like, a real hard draw. And then being here in this moment of fascism, of genocide, of a real tipping, turning point of our nation, and. And thinking, oh, no, wait, this is. This is our thing, you know, and you can feel real bad about it. You can feel like, oh, I wish this weren't the case, and I certainly wish it weren't. But also, you can also just say, am I going to step up into my place in this? This is who I am. I'm an American born in this time. What do I have to say about this? And what is my role in this? And am I going to take on what is clearly my generational invitation to be part of this? And it just felt like in those moments, in those groups, it's like, okay, this is what this time is calling for, is for us to decide who we are. And, like, there's a real kind of activation in that because there's a lot of pers. There's a lot of ways you could look at this as a time of pression and a time of things happening to us. And then when you switch your perspective and you're like, no, we are in this time. Yes, we are actors in this time. If we are doing nothing, we are also actors in this time that are facilitating this continuing. And so it just felt like, all right, here we are. What's our plan and what's our posture? And look at these beautiful people that we can do this with.

[Glennon]

Yeah.

[Abby]

Wow.

[Glennon]

Yeah, it felt very.

[Abby]

That was good.

[Glennon]

We were talking during that tour. There was a moment after we decided it, and we got that little human spark back in us. Well, it reminds me of that story I love to tell about the Vietnam War. During the Vietnam War, there was a man who every single night stood outside the White House with one single candle, just by himself, like a little alone vigil. And he did it every night, show up, like, at sunset and just stand there with this little candle. And eventually the media caught on and somebody came to him and said, sir, what are you doing here every night with your one candle? Do you actually think that your one little candle is going to change this war, is going to change this administration? And he said, oh, I don't do this to change them. I come here every night with my little candle so that they don't change me. And I think it was. I think about that all the time. And then I. It was shortly after that, that Lillian from Florence, the Florence Project, the immigration incredible immigration group that has been working so hard. And if you've been listening to this podcast, you know that we have been working with them to make sure that the little ones who are representing themselves right now in court because the Trump administration has removed even their. The funding to have representation for them during their. They're not even deportation hearings anymore. They're just disappearing them. She reached out and asked for our involvement. And then we just immediately knew that the whole tour should be for these babies, that we were going to make sure that every penny that we made through tickets, through March, all of it, all the profit, would go to Lillian and her network of groups that were showing up for these kids, which is what we've. It just felt so correct that in a moment of extreme greed, of extreme division, of extreme fear that there has to be an equal and opposite, like, either we cave to that or we come with the opposite of that, which is just boundless open heartedness and solidarity and love and sharing. I mean, that feels like a simple word, but. And then we were feeling. So everybody can be forgiven for feeling like they don't know where to start, because the onslaught has been so every day you wake up and it's a million different things and it feels like the whole world's on fire. You don't know where to put your water. You don't know. And so it's sometimes easier just to shut down because you think, how are we going to resist this? How are we going to resist this onslaught? And then while we were on tour, I reread this essay that Michelle Alexander had written. And if you went to the tour, you know this moment, because we started every night with this story, which is that Michelle Alexander, during the first Trump administration, wrote an essay about how since the beginning of time, there has been a pull and a way of things and energy, which she calls the river. And the way of things is sort of love and justice and equality. And that is the order, right? That is God, that is energy, that is source. That is what the greatest flow that we are meant to surrender to is. That's what, you know, the moral arc of the universe that bends towards justice. That is what everyone is talking about when they are saying there is an ordering, that that is the river, okay? That there is a force that seeks to stop that. There is always a force that seeks to stop freedom and stop justice and stop love. And that is the dam. That is the resistance. We, those of us who wish for progress in the form of love and unity and mutual care are not the resistance. We are the river, the side that wishes to stop that and builds the dam against it. They are the resistance. That is the resistance. If you have to continuously make all of these laws and separate people and blah, blah, blah, that's the damage, Right? Right. The flow is love. And yet, I think I thought about all of that essay. And I think, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. But also, there is something. There is a human. It's like faith without works is dead. And the river without human beings getting in the river, building boats and getting in the river is dead, right? Like God, that flow, that river needs our involvement. And so I started thinking about, like, what if we thought about this time as all of us who are working towards justice, love, community, freedom are. We are on the river. We are in a fleet of ships, okay? We are in a fleet of ships. We're going to call this the Freedom Fleet, okay? This Freedom Fleet are people who have felt the river but knew it wasn't enough just to look at it, started building boats, right? To harness the power of the river to move human humanity forward through this fleet. And the. The fleet is made up of so many different ships. There's, you know, there's a black Liberation ship, there's a queer Rights ship, there's a Protect Higher Education ship, There's a Free Palestine ship. There's a on and on and on. There's so many different ships. There's an immigration ship. There's. All of you, I hope, right now are thinking of 700 more ships that are all part of this Freedom Fleet, right? And the point of the fleet is that it is either it is one fleet, many ships, one fleet, that all the different ships are working together towards one goal, to get humanity further. And so the rules of engagement on the fleet is that everybody in the fleet's job is to get as many people as humanly possible from the shore into the fleet, okay? Because every American right now is either a freedom fleeter, a shore stander, or a dam builder. And I doubt that there's many dam builders listening to this podcast anymore. God help you if you are. This is not a safe space for you, okay? We are not trying to make disclaimer. Our job in whatever ship we're in is not just to strategize and to organize and to protest and to boycott, although, of course, we are doing those things. But our other job is to. In these boats, to make life in the boat, in the fleet so irresistible that we are loving each other so hard that we are dancing, that we are singing that we are so irresistible. What Tony Cade Bambara used to call the irresistible revolution that we are or the beloved community during the civil rights era, that we are so irresistible that the people from the shore cannot help but want to jump aboard. And the way that we do that is that we make sure that every time another ship comes by us in the distance or up close, that we are not yelling at them for not being in our ship because we need them in their ship and we need to be in our ship. And so the only thing we're yelling at them is go, go, go. We are with you one fleet, many ships. And when we get into the ship, all we have to do is say permission to come aboard because every ship already has a bunch of captains. These are the people, these are the democracy defenders that have been building these ships, womaning these ships, leading these ships forever in all times, not just these dumpster fire years, but all times. And so when we get aboard, we are just humble deckhands. We say, you tell me what to do. Right? People like us, we are not the captains. They're captains of these. We might be like on the dock going, everybody get your asses in the boats. That's what we are. We're those people.

[Amanda]

We're like, hey, book club, we're getting in a boat.

[Glennon]

Yes. Book club is over.

[Amanda]

Always with your book clubs. We're taking the books aboard. Okay.

[Glennon]

Yes, yes. Okay.

[Amanda]

So.

[Glennon]

So we're the humble duck hens, right? And then when the shore standers do, when they, when they find us so irresistible and they finally jump on board and they don't know what the hell they're doing because they are new here, we do not yell at them for not knowing something that we just learned seven minutes ago.

[Abby]

Yes.

[Glennon]

Okay. Because we do not prioritize our self righteousness or our egos above the mission of the fleet, which is as many of us as possible. Right? So even when it annoys us, we like sublimate that ego thing and we, we honor the mission above personality.

[Amanda]

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[Abby]

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[Glennon]

There are so many different ways to think about this time. All I'm telling you is the way that I'm thinking about this time, right? Which is that I am so incredibly grateful to every single person who has taken their place in the Freedom fleet. I am so grateful for the captains, right? I sometimes find myself spending a lot more time in a certain boat or another when I feel very committed to the immigration ship, Immigration justice ship. I feel extremely committed right now to the Free Palestine ship. I have so many beautiful captains. I will. However we do things, I'll tag them in. The thing I would love for the pod squad to tell us, who is your captain? What ship are you in? Who is your captain? Let's start calling them out so that other people who are shore standers who want to come aboard know who the captains are and. And can ask permission to come aboard. I'm going to stop right now because I feel like I've been talking for 17 minutes. What do you guys think?

[Abby]

I just love it so much. I just think that, first of all, you're just incredible. No, I just think, you know, I feel very lucky to be able to, like, witness you feeling all of these feelings and to come to this understanding whilst going through all of the stuff that you're going through in your body, in the world. Like, I don't know, I just, I feel. I feel extraordinarily lucky. And you're right. I think that one of the frustrations that I see a lot is, you know, this idea where a new person comes aboard and because they might not have the language down yet or they might be new and they don't understand. I think something that the left really does a terrible job at is we are actually very exclusive at times in our ships. And I think we need to become much more inclusive. And if people get things wrong, lovingly help them through that. If people say something wrong, lovingly help them through that. Because we need numbers. We need as many people on these ships as possible.

[Glennon]

What are you thinking, sister?

[Amanda]

So many things. I mean, I'm thinking of.

[Glennon]

How this.

[Amanda]

Can feel like the thing we have to do. And. And incidentally, we do have to do It, I mean if we want a democracy and these types of things, we do have to do it. But also I feel like it's the wrong idea of it because in terms of like I have to. I'm thinking of this meme that I see that is like I just keep thinking how exponentially happier I'd be if I was stupid. Like, like, like that these things going around that are like oh, the beautiful, you know, blissful ignorance that appears to exist in many. Seems like a very covetous thing to have right now. And, and studies show that some extent that is true left people in this time are actually sadder. Their life is not as good right now. Except people who are in that position who get activated.

[Glennon]

Yeah.

[Amanda]

Who get involved and then their life is actually better. Self reported feelings of engagement and empowerment and joy are happier engaged. So if you are sitting there feeling like everything sucks, life is shit. Yes. And yes. And that doesn't mean stop there. That means keep pushing. Because the actual place where you are going to be happy and contented is when you get on a boat. And that doesn't take away that heartbreak and sadness. It actually gives a funnel through which to communicate what is your heartbreak and humanity that is being distorted and confused and gaslit right now. So, so like that is if you're, if you're. Keep going. Because that is the studies show the key to happiness. And I think it's also just like there's this weird kind of cognitive dissonance right now that happens where I'm like, I'm worried about genocide and democracy and due process and disappearances of my neighbors. And also I like really want to redo my kitchen.

[Abby]

Yes.

[Amanda]

There's this weird thing where there's this sort of shame that comes between what is our things that we're like that's stupid and petty and not important. And then there's these unpetty and unstupid and important things. And I feel like there's this kind of, of self shame that we do where we try to pretend like we're not human and we try to pretend like we don't care about petty things and we try to pretend like we're not mad about things that we know in the light of global events shouldn't make us mad. But I actually think it's all the same thing. I think the same part, the same like engine that is trying to tell us that we should see pictures of genocide and not freak out and not have our bodies just crumble with despair. The same thing that is trying to deny that is also trying to say you're not a person who should care about dumb stuff, because we do. And whenever we're trying to, like, patch up and hide and only present what is palatable or acceptable or morally upright, it's like. It's like those are two sides of the same coin. So I think we. We can just admit that we are who we are, and we commit that we care about what we care about. And we can admit that we're as, like, weird and inconsistent as humans are weird and inconsistent, because what is happening right now in the whole of things is we're. The whole ball game is to hold on to our humanity.

[Glennon]

Yeah.

[Amanda]

The whole ball game is to remain so human that certain things don't fail to break your heart and remain so human that certain things don't fail to delight and bring you such joy and make you laugh like crazy. And I feel like it's all part of this same project that is trying to be dismantled right now. So I think it's just as important that we care about what we care about, whether it's on the list or not, of what we should care about, and that we find joy in wherever the hell we find joy, whether it's on the list or not. And it's not that you should have any guilt about having joy when these horrible things are happening. In fact, you must double down.

[Abby]

Yes.

[Amanda]

Like, we actually need to do that, and we need to do that here. We need to, like, we need to laugh and we need to find joy, and we need to. Because the whole enterprise is trying to unhuman us.

[Glennon]

Yes.

[Abby]

Yep.

[Amanda]

And all of those things are of equal import. So it's not, like, care about these things and pretend you don't care about the other things.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Amanda]

It's like, care about all of it, and there's room for all of it. And all of it is deeply human. And anything that is deeply human right now is vital to maintain.

[Glennon]

The only way to save each other and ourselves right now is to hold on dearly to the preciousness of life, of life everywhere, of life here, of immigrant families, of queer families, of families in Palestine, of families in Sudan, of children everywhere. The only way to hold on to the preciousness of every life is to hold dear to the preciousness of your own. Those two are so inextricable. And the. The goal of. Of fascism is to make us, to wear us down until we actually don't care about life anymore, until it just all goes gray. And so there is something about holding on to like the neon of life. Right? I mean, when you were talking, I was thinking about the last time Lillian was at my house, and we had spent all day organizing, organizing, organizing. And then what we did that night is we got in our pajamas and had huge bags of. Of candy and chocolate, and Abby made us tea, and we watched. I think we watched Love Island.

[Abby]

Yeah. Like, I'm not ashamed of Love Island.

[Glennon]

To me, that is the irresistible revolution. Like, we were snuggly.

[Amanda]

Is Freedom Fleet just circling Love Island?

[Abby]

Is that what's happening?

[Amanda]

Cuz I feel like with you two, all roads lead to Love Island. And I'm just wondering if this looks like an interesting pairing.

[Abby]

All rivers.

[Glennon]

I don't know. I don't know, Amanda. It's just absurd. And there's something about absurdity, and there was something about being in pajamas with Lillian after a long day of organizing and just shoving sugar and just being like, now it's time to rest and gawk at these people. That felt like the irresistible revolution to me, is all I'm saying.

[Abby]

That's so funny.

[Glennon]

So I think that's what we're gonna do here. And I also. I just want to say I have a deep compassion for everyone who is not feeling loving right now. There's something about me when I see everybody just lashing out each other on social media, when everybody's just that, I'm like, yeah, I get it. I don't feel any shaming of that at all right now. What is going on is so barbaric, and it's. It's almost like some of the people who are most angry, I feel like, are staying the most human, too. There's a double thing here for me, too. I think we have to be gentle with each other, and I also respect the rage. So I just want to say that, like, there's no part of me that.

[Abby]

Thinks you should be nicer.

[Glennon]

Like, I. I just. I know for me to survive this, and what I want to try to is, like, the harder the world gets, I just want to be as soft as humanly possible and make space for people to join. And I also just want to say that it doesn't feel to me like hard or extra or another thing to do. It feels like the way life was always meant to be. Like, there's something about truly, like, surrendering, especially as white women, like, giving up the idea of wellness as, like. Like we're ever going to juice or red red light or individual project our way to any sort of joy or peace, and instead surrendering to These collective liberation movements as deckhands, it's like, you see what community in life is supposed to feel like. And all the promises from whatever bullshit we were doing just look absurd compared to, like, the purpose and meaning and joy that. That you experience and like, on these ships. So I just think we should stop there and pick this up the next time. And I just want to say to the pod squad, we're going to be freedom fleeting. We're going to be absurding. We're gonna shamelessly be holding on to joy and love and nonsense while we do the work on the deck, and it's a hard time to be alive. We're gonna dig in together. We're gonna get through this like we've always have. And. I don't know. It is truly an absolute honor to be doing life with you in this particular moment. And I love both of you.

[Abby]

I'm sorry this is such a hard time.

[Glennon]

You know, it's just there's part of it that I want to unwind this season that's like. I feel like it's the exact. Right. As ridiculous as it is, this menopause thing. And as it must. As it pisses me off. And I'm going to. I. I've already requested an entire episode where all I do is bitch about this menopause thing with no solutions. I'm not ready for solutions yet. It also feels like the right time for it. When you. The. The one lucky thing for me is when you said the word kitchen countertops, I was like, oh, for the first time in my life, I don't give a fuck about any of that. Like, I don't know what that means, but it's like there is a shift shedding of all the horseshit during perimenopause that somehow leaves you with all that matters. So while I spend most of my days wishing I was sedated, I'm deeply grateful to not be. I think that my rage and inner homicidal self, whether it's due to the fallen estrogen or the fall of democracy or some sort of combination, I think I was made for such a time as this. That's all I'm saying. God bless the menopausers. This is our time. Okay. All right, Pod squad, would you please, if you are on a ship, would you tell us, where do they do this? How do we do this with video? Now, where does this happen? Are we on, like, in the cloud? Are we.

[Amanda]

So we're gonna be in the cloud? You're in the cloud. We are in on the we can do hard things YouTube channel. Put a comment there because this is where this video will live and this conversation. And tell us who. What boatrin, who's your captain? What? Tell us also what you're doing to stay human. Like what? What you're doing to feed yourself, to delight yourself, to fuel your humanity. Tell us all the things. Because that is our mission, to feed our own humanity, and that includes defending everybody's humanity right now. So all of those things, tell us them.

[Glennon]

Okay, so we've got two metaphors. We've got two metaphors going on, people. What ship are you in? And who's your captain? Secondly, what is the thing you're doing each day that is equivalent to the little candle in front of the White House? Yeah, okay. What's your daily vigil that feeds your own humanity? And what ship are you in that's protecting all of humanity?

[Amanda]

Go on the Instagram. We can know her things Instagram. And leave your comment there under this episode so we can gather all that up and share it with everybody.

[Glennon]

We love you, Pod Squad. We'll see you next time. We'll see you. You'll see us.

[Abby]

You'll see us next time.

[Glennon]

Bye.

[Amanda]

We'll see you.

[Abby]

Bye.

[Glennon]

We can do Hard Things is an independent production brought to you by Treat Media. We make art for humans who want to stay human forever. Dog is our best production partner and you can follow us at we can do hard things on Instagram and at we can do hard things show on TikTok.