What It Was Like – Episode Summary

Podcast: What It Was Like
Host: Julian Morgans (Superreal)
Episode: What Happened at Skeleton Lake?
Date: November 15, 2025

Overview

In this episode, host Julian Morgans explores the enduring mystery of Roopkund Lake—also known as "Skeleton Lake"—high in the Indian Himalayas, where hundreds of human skeletons have been discovered. The episode features interviews with anthropologist Dr. William Sachs and geneticist Dr. Aideen Harney, providing contrasting perspectives on the origins of these remains. The conversation weaves through local folklore, scientific studies, unexpected genetic discoveries, and the broader implications for how we understand history and chance.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Setting the Scene: The Mystery of Skeleton Lake

• Roopkund Lake is a remote, high-altitude pond (over 5,000m), surrounded by hundreds of skeletons dating back centuries.
• Earliest Western awareness came in 1942 when a British forest ranger stumbled upon it (04:30).
• Initial theories ranged from ancient massacres to epidemic victims and failed armies.
• Early carbon dating put the bones at roughly 500–1,000 years old.

Quote:

"This is the story of a tiny lake... high up in the Indian Himalayas where between 300 and 700 skeletons have been found... and nobody knows why they're there."
— Julian Morgans [05:04]

2. Dr. William Sachs: The Trek, The Tragedy, and Local Lore

• First Trek to Roopkund (1970s): William Sachs recounts his dangerous, high-altitude journey and first impressions of the lake with bones and personal belongings scattered everywhere (08:11–12:00).
• The Lake’s Description:
  -"It's a shallow pond... surrounded by cliffs on about on three sides... You couldn't take a step without walking on bones."
  [11:06–12:15]
• Diversity of Victims: Paleopathologists identified men, women, children—disproving the "war party" theory (12:58).
  • No weapons or trauma consistent with warfare.
• Preservation & Ethics:
  • Bones persist due to cold, low oxygen, and ice. Sachs questions tourist behavior—taking bones as souvenirs without ritual or respect (13:53–15:10).
• Atmosphere:
  • The site is described as “kind of horrible... because of so much death,” yet lies along a holy pilgrimage route (15:14).

Local Folklore and Myth

• Nanda Devi Pilgrimage:
  • The goddess Nanda Devi curses a royal party who breaks taboos—resulting in their deaths by “a storm of iron-like hail” at Roopkund.
  • This myth closely mirrors both oral and, as Sachs argues, scientific findings (16:03–21:00).

Scientific Expeditions

• Radiocarbon Dating (1950s, 2003):
  • Confirmed the timeline as 9th–10th century for most bones.
  • Two groups detected: one likely royal/elite, one local porter/guide—consistent with the pilgrimage story.
  • Causes of death: Many skulls had indents consistent with lethal hail strikes.
• Ethical & Regulatory Thoughts:
  • Sachs laments lack of preservation and rituals for remains, recognizes the site’s cultural sensitivity.

Quote:

"These were obviously people who had a more safe and secure life... children and women were along with the people... it invalidated the theory that they might have been a party of warriors."
— Dr. William Sachs [12:58]

3. The 2019 DNA Twist: A Mediterranean Mystery

• Modern Genetic Findings: A 2019 study discovered at least one group of bones at Roopkund belongs to people of Mediterranean (specifically Cretan) ancestry dating to the 1800s—centuries after the "pilgrimage" group (07:40–08:01, 30:46).
  • This challenged prior assumptions and lacked any supporting local oral tradition or historical record.
• Sachs' Skepticism:
  • Believes there was likely a mix-up at the bone archive—"I think somebody got the box."
    [23:50–26:18]
  • Cites the logistical and historical implausibility of Cretans dying in a remote Indian lake unnoticed.

Quote:

"Where did this other group come from? Nobody has a clue... I'm very skeptical about that stuff."
— Dr. William Sachs [23:50]

4. Dr. Aideen Harney Responds: The Geneticist’s Perspective

• On the DNA Results:
  • Harney refutes the idea of a "bone mix-up":
    "We keep meticulous records at the Reich lab. There was definitely no mix up on that end. Also, there was really no reason why there would be a collection of Greek bones at the Anthropological Survey of India." [33:17]
  • Notes that, based on osteological evidence, Sachs's own team described two distinct populations—tall/foreign vs. short/local—supporting their conclusions (33:17–35:56).
• On the Lack of a Historical Record:
  • Agrees this is strange but not definitive proof against their findings, given gaps in documentation and oral memory (36:35–37:52).
  • Points out that radiocarbon dating is not precise within the last few centuries, complicating direct historical research.
• The Power and Limits of Genetics:
  • Reflects on how DNA can both illuminate the past and leave us with new, deeper mysteries (38:01–39:13).

Quote:

"I thought we were going to be able to tie up this mystery with a neat little bow. And instead, we kind of opened the doors to so many more questions."
— Dr. Aideen Harney [39:13]

5. The Verdict: Unlikely Stories and Open Questions

• Julian Morgans sums up (40:00):
  • Both hypotheses are “right”—most skeletons likely belong to a tragic pilgrimage, but there is strong evidence a smaller, later, Mediterranean group died there as well.
  • The improbability of the lake itself—and its bizarre story—suggests only unlikely explanations fit.
  • The mystery endures.

Quote:

"We're dealing in things that are probably unlikely to have happened, and I think you just got to choose which unlikely things were more likely, if that makes sense."
— Julian Morgans [40:41]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Dr. Sachs:
  • “Hundreds of people died, presumably thousands of kilometers away from their place of origin. Nobody heard of them again, nobody knew how they died.” [12:29]
• Dr. Harney:
  • “I think what this story always tells shows me is how much we're able to learn about people, about the past, using just DNA.” [38:01]
• Julian Morgans:
  • “It didn't come to be via something that was probable. Otherwise the whole thing would have been probable and therefore unremarkable, and we wouldn't be talking about it.” [40:30]

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [04:30]: Discovery & Introduction to Roopkund
• [08:11]: Dr. William Sachs recounts first expedition to the lake
• [12:58]: Analysis of the demographic makeup and preservation of the remains
• [16:03]: The local legend and its anthropological context
• [21:00]: Scientific confirmation of folklore via carbon dating
• [23:50]: Sachs’s skepticism about the “Greek bones”
• [30:46]: Introduction to Dr. Aideen Harney and the 2019 study
• [33:17]: Harney responds to the mix-up claim, explains genetic findings
• [36:35]: Historical silence about Mediterranean presence
• [38:01]: Harney reflects on the power and frustration of genetics
• [40:30]: Julian’s concluding thoughts on the improbability and mystery of Skeleton Lake

Summary

This episode masterfully balances anthropology, folklore, genetic science, and the allure of unsolved mysteries. Through interviews with two leading authorities, it captures the depth of the Skeleton Lake enigma—and the enduring tension between evidence and legend. Scientific advances have only deepened the puzzle, leaving listeners with an unsolved but tantalizing story about unlikely journeys, tragic ends, and the stubborn resilience of the unknown.