Christiana Gave Birth (Again)! [VIDEO]

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Christiana Gave Birth (Again)!" on What Now? with Trevor Noah

Release Date: March 13, 2025

In the episode titled "Christiana Gave Birth (Again)!" from Trevor Noah's Spotify original podcast What Now? with Trevor Noah, host Trevor engages in a profound and candid conversation with his guests, Christiana and Josh Johnson. The episode delves into a myriad of contemporary topics, including political dynamics, societal expectations, parenting challenges, and the importance of community support. Below is a detailed summary capturing the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode.

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1. Political Commentary: America’s Global Perception

Analogy of America as the "Man United of the World" Trevor Noah introduces a compelling analogy comparing the United States to the Manchester United football club, symbolizing America's dominant yet complex role on the global stage.

Trevor Noah [04:18]: "I was thinking that sports in that way is in some ways, like, the perfect analogy for nation states. You know, like, if you think about it right now, America is the Manchester United of the world."

Impact of Leadership: Obama vs. Trump The conversation transitions to discussing how different presidential administrations have reshaped America's image internationally. Christiana highlights Obama's charismatic and unifying presence, likening him to a beloved football manager, while Josh critiques Trump's polarizing influence.

Trevor Noah [05:43]: "I think Trump has changed one thing fundamentally about America. Before Trump, most places saw America as America—either liking or hating it. Now, Trump has exported American politics worldwide."

Christiana [12:02]: "Trump is America's id, but Obama is who America likes to think they are. They’re the darkness and the light."

The guests explore how Trump altered the monolithic perception of America, introducing a dichotomy that mirrors internal political divisions.

2. Parenting in Contemporary Society

Challenges of Modern Parenting Christiana brings a personal perspective on the complexities of raising children in today's society, emphasizing the lack of support systems and the overwhelming pressures faced by parents.

Christiana [15:25]: "Most women don't work in environments that support them. Having a child is the worst thing you can do for your career, having a baby, but no one says that."

Postpartum Experiences and Mental Health The discussion delves into postpartum experiences, with Christiana sharing her own journey through multiple pregnancies and the associated emotional and physical challenges.

Christiana [36:09]: "I've had losses, done IVF, all of this stuff, and now it's landing me at three kids."

She highlights the often-overlooked aspects of postpartum life, including hormonal changes, physical recovery, and the societal stigma surrounding maternal mental health.

Christiana [73:07]: "Postpartum looks different for everyone, but there's this huge hormonal crash because your body is making all these hormones to grow the baby."

3. The Decline of Community and the Rise of Isolation

Erosion of the Village System Trevor and Christiana discuss how modernization and individualism have eroded traditional community support structures, leaving parents isolated and overburdened.

Trevor Noah [56:12]: "As a country becomes more developed, the one thing that gets eroded is community. The village disappears. You have to buy the village back."

Rebuilding Community Support Christiana emphasizes the importance of rebuilding communal ties and supporting one another to alleviate the burdens of parenting.

Christiana [61:30]: "Sometimes we complain about not having community, but are we trying to be good community and village members? We're in a selfish society. We've forgotten how to be village members."

She shares her experiences of creating a supportive environment by involving extended family and friends, illustrating how communal efforts can significantly reduce individual stress.

4. Societal Expectations and Gender Roles

Balancing Career and Parenthood The conversation addresses the societal pressures on ambitious women to limit family size for career advancement, juxtaposed with the challenges men face in supporting their partners.

Christiana [37:23]: "Ambitious women either have no kids or have a maximum of two. With three kids, it's chaos in my house."

Redefining Masculinity in Parenting Josh and Christiana explore the evolving role of men in parenting, highlighting the misconceptions and challenges men face in being active and supportive parents.

Josh Johnson [81:27]: "I am doing my best. I am only so involved because it is not my child."

Trevor Noah [82:12]: "Dad bods are celebrated, while the absence of children is not."

5. Community Solutions and Cultural Practices

Traditional Practices as a Support System Christiana introduces traditional cultural practices, such as the Igbo Omogu, which facilitate postpartum support through extended family involvement.

Christiana [78:58]: "We did Omogu, the 40 days after you have a baby. My mum and dad joined in, preparing pepper soups and binding my belly."

Trevor Noah [78:57]: "Women are supposed to do it, but my dad participated, enhancing the support structure."

Innovative Parenting Solutions The guests propose modern solutions to replicate traditional support systems, such as cooperative childcare and active community involvement.

Christiana [68:07]: "Our pediatrician does home visits, which was a big part of supporting my postpartum experience."

Trevor Noah [65:56]: "Imagine everyone hosting a mini-kindergarten to support multiple families. It scales exponentially."

6. Future of Parenting and Societal Health

Impact of Declining Birth Rates The discussion touches on the economic implications of declining birth rates in developed countries, referencing Japan's experience where adult diaper sales exceeded baby diaper sales due to an aging population.

Christiana [60:10]: "Japan sold more adult diapers than baby diapers for the first time."

Trevor Noah [59:59]: "The birth rate decline is viewed through the lens of labor supply and economic stability."

Encouraging Balanced Family Growth Christiana advocates for policies that support family growth, such as maternity and paternity leave, to encourage higher birth rates and sustain economic health.

Josh Johnson [61:30]: "Businesses should institute maternity and paternity leave to support employees who want to have kids."

7. Personal Reflections and Future Aspirations

Reflections on Parenthood In a heartfelt exchange, Christiana shares her experiences with multiple pregnancies and the emotional toll of balancing motherhood with personal well-being.

Trevor Noah [84:38]: "Do I want kids? I don't want kids, but I don't not want kids."

Vision for a Supportive Future The conversation concludes with a vision for a more supportive and communal approach to parenting, emphasizing intentional and collective responsibility.

Christiana [68:36]: "We have a great village through friends, family, and community support, which is invaluable."

Trevor Noah [85:56]: "Kids should be born out of excess love, not obligation, ensuring intentional and supportive parenthood."

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Trevor Noah [04:18]: "I was thinking that sports in that way is in some ways, like, the perfect analogy for nation states... America is the Manchester United of the world."

• Christiana [15:25]: "Having a child is the worst thing you can do for your career, but no one says that."

• Trevor Noah [56:12]: "As a country becomes more developed, the one thing that gets eroded is community. The village disappears. You have to buy the village back."

• Christiana [37:23]: "Ambitious women either have no kids or have a maximum of two. With three kids, it's chaos in my house."

• Christiana [78:58]: "We did Omogu, the 40 days after you have a baby. My mum and dad joined in, preparing pepper soups and binding my belly."

• Trevor Noah [85:56]: "Kids should be born out of excess love, not obligation, ensuring intentional and supportive parenthood."

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Conclusion

In this episode, Trevor Noah masterfully navigates complex and deeply personal topics, inviting listeners to reflect on the intersection of politics, societal norms, and personal experiences. Through the candid exchanges with Christiana and Josh, the conversation underscores the pressing need for stronger community support systems, reevaluation of societal expectations, and the fostering of intentional relationships to navigate the challenges of modern parenthood. The episode not only highlights individual struggles but also calls for collective action to rebuild the communal fabric essential for a thriving society.

Transcript

[Trevor Noah]

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[Trevor Noah]

This is what now with Trevor Noah.

[Christiana]

I need to get into mma. I need to. I want more hobbies. Mma.

[Trevor Noah]

A hobby.

[Christiana]

No to what? Because I've been watching. Football's different. The Premiership is depressing for United. The Premiership is not depressing for a United fan.

[Trevor Noah]

There we go. Say it with your chest. Say it with your chest.

[Christiana]

It's a hard time I've been introducing. So I have all these manu kits for the. For the kids because one of my good friends sent them Femi and he's Nigerian so he's like, there was a time when this meant excellence and he was like, I feel ashamed that I'm sending you your Kids, this thing that means they're losers.

[Josh Johnson]

I mean, it's the same as when you get the outfit of a fighter and they get popped for steroids that week and you're like, ah, I just. I already ordered the.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Josh Johnson]

Fighters have kits, kind of. You can get like the whatchamacallit, like the outfit that their team wears in the walkout. You can get this zip up and the pants and everything, and you can get. And then you can get their personal merch, too. But because they can't have all independent, like, Puma, Nike, whatever.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

They can have the UFC official thing, and then everything else is from their site. So then some people make, like, their own kit that you can buy. And you'll, like, buy. You'll buy the kit and then it'll be like the fight is off due to a high volume of HGH found in the system. And now you're wearing the kit and.

[Trevor Noah]

You'Re like, I feel like, you know, I was thinking that. So I. I'm a Liverpool fan, and not just because it's going well now. We've had some tough times. That's why I feel for you.

[Christiana]

I mean, it was good under Klopp as well.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. But I was around before that. I was around when we were still, like, scrounging around. Do you know what I mean? I haven't been the longest Liverpool fan, but I've been a fan for long enough that I don't remember, like, winning things.

[Christiana]

Okay.

[Trevor Noah]

Do you know what I mean? I remember your.

[Christiana]

Your glory days even before.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, Like. Well, not before Gerard, but I mean, like. Because there was like, the peak Gerard, where he was crushing it and then he had the slip, which, you know, ended it for us very painfully. But, yeah, but I was, like, around. You know what I was actually thinking, funny enough is I was going like. I found myself thinking that sports in that way is in some ways, like, the perfect analogy for nation states.

[Christiana]

Okay.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, like, if you think about it right now, America is the man united of the world.

[Christiana]

Oh, God, that's hard to hear as a united.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, I didn't know which way you.

[Christiana]

Were gonna take that.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but it's true. It's true.

[Christiana]

It's true.

[Trevor Noah]

Think about it.

[Christiana]

I hope my dads are not listening.

[Trevor Noah]

Think about this. Think about this, right? Whether you like America or not, you have to admit there was a point where America was champion of. Of the world without, like, no hesit. You name it, you know, music, sport, culture, politics, diplomacy. The, like, it was just Like America is the country of the world. No one doubted it. You went anywhere in the world and you said, where do you want to go? America. You know what I mean? Didn't matter what country you went to. America. That was like the thing. And then I don't know, I don't know when I would say the first.

[Christiana]

Like little slip maybe when Obama left.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, I think it was, I think before then. I think like, I think okay for me personally around like 911 I was Bush. Like when Bush started bombing the world was the first time where I noticed.

[Christiana]

People go, oh, you mean that?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, that was the first. Like huh?

[Christiana]

Oh. I was thinking about when like. Cause this is so dark because I moved to America after Bush started bombing the world, right?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

So I'm saying as an outsider, when did you consider like maybe I don't want to live there anymore. Obama was. You're like, oh, I want to move to a place Obama can become president. Obama in this case is like Alex Ferguson. And then when Obama ends and you know, if you follow the American story, you assumed it would be Hillary.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

And then Trump comes in as an outsider. You're like, maybe I want to reconsider.

[Trevor Noah]

I don't know.

[Christiana]

That's what I feel from. Because like it's kind of dark. But like the war in Iraq, European countries were involved in that. Like as a Brit.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, that's true.

[Christiana]

But you, I think you could be right, Trevor. Maybe I was just very selfish and blinkered. I was like this still. I still want to go to a.

[Trevor Noah]

Place where as the American he had Josh. What do you, what do you think?

[Josh Johnson]

I'm not a well traveled person.

[Trevor Noah]

That's not true.

[Josh Johnson]

No, no. At the time of 9 11.

[Christiana]

Oh okay.

[Josh Johnson]

At the time of 911 I was 11. I was not a well traveled individual. You know what I mean?

[Trevor Noah]

Most people would say I was a child, sure. But Josh is still just judges himself as an 11 year old.

[Josh Johnson]

But I was like when 911 happened, I remember being scared and then what I started to understand when I was in college. So we're talking in 2012. I was like, I guess I only saw it through media. So in American media you see other countries wishing they could come here, wishing that they could or even saying American propaganda out loud in their home country of like, but we're not America though, right?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

And then when I got older and I was in college and I would take in more media, that was when I was like, the perception is changing. And I had friends who, who did travel who Told people they were Canadian and, like, when they went to certain places. And I was like, oh, okay. Like. Because that wouldn't have even occurred to me because I hadn't traveled much yet. And so I would say, though, to Christiana's point, when you really look at the worldview of America, after Obama entering Trump, Trump had this weird way of, like. I don't know if I have the words for it exactly, but he had this weird way of bringing things to fruition, but it was him that did it. So then he would be like, america's looking at us as a joke, but we became a joke. Do you have any.

[Trevor Noah]

He was a prophet who made his own prophecies come true. That's what Trump does.

[Josh Johnson]

Like, he literally. I don't know if you remember that clip. He's like, the American dream is dead. Sir, sir, what are you doing?

[Trevor Noah]

But you know. You know what? You know, what has been illuminating for me is how Trump has changed one thing. In my experience when I travel, he's changed one thing fundamentally about America. And that is before Trump, most places in the world I went to saw America as America. They hated America or they liked America, but that's how they spoke about America. Now Trump has sort of. Has sort of exported American politics to the world. So I go to countries where some people like Trump and then some people don't like Trump, but they no longer have, like, a singular view of America. Does that make sense?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

So even in South Africa the other day, I was. I got pulled over by a policeman. It's very common there. This is like. It's not like in. In America where your life starts flashing.

[Josh Johnson]

Before your eyes and.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, like, in South Africa, you get pulled over almost just for, like, a conversation. Sometimes they just want to look at your car, to be honest with you.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, they'll just pull you over and be like, ah, brother, what. What is this? And you're like, oh, yeah. You're like, ah, it's nice. It's nice. I like it. Okay, so I got pulled over the other day, and the cops, straight up guy rolled down the window, he's like, licensed. Then he sees me, and then he's like, ah, Trevor. He's like, hey, my man, what are you doing here? I'm like, what do you mean? I'm. I'm home. He's like, aye, my man, you should be there. In America, Elon Musk. What is he doing to us? Why is he doing these things to South Africans? No, Trevor. Hi. Aye, but Trump. But Trump, guys, There is no time in my life where a South African man in my entire recollection was speaking about the individuals in American politics. You know what I mean? Even when Bush was like bombing the Middle east, we said America.

[Christiana]

Oh, that's interesting.

[Trevor Noah]

It wasn't like Bush. People were like, man, what America's doing? America's going up against the United Nations. America's ignoring this. America's waging a fake war. America. Now I find everywhere in the world there's a break. There's Trump and there's not Trump.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Christiana]

I think Obama did that, but in a different way. Obama made America look so cool and like it could like remake itself in a certain way.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

Cause I remember there was like years ago when he was. The first time he ran and they did like a poll in Europe about If Obama ran versus I think it was McCain or we had the first. Whoever it was, the first time. What would. The voice. It was like 95% Obama, like the rest of the world. It was a no brainer. Like, this guy is great. His wife is beautiful.

[Trevor Noah]

I love that. Europe, like, who has never had like a black person?

[Christiana]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They don't want their own one. They want the American one.

[Trevor Noah]

They were like, yeah, yeah. Well, of course it makes sense. It's time to have some change, you know, how can America not have? And then you're like, what about you guys? Oh, yeah, let's calm down.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah. No, it feels like dating at high school where you're. Where there's always that one person that's like, oh, you're so sweet. And you'll find someone. What about you? Oh, no, you'll find. I said someone.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes. I didn't mean it like that, Josh.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, no, I didn't mean it like.

[Josh Johnson]

No, no.

[Christiana]

It's basically that, I think so.

[Josh Johnson]

Funny.

[Christiana]

Yeah. Feels like Obama did that and then Trump's done it the other way. But that's why I think they're twin flames. You know, I have this whole theory.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, you do?

[Christiana]

I impasse. Yeah. They came together. There's something about them.

[Josh Johnson]

Okay, you're talking about a different thing.

[Christiana]

No, but I think we're talking about the same thing. But I'm talking about the witchy version.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

About the sensible version. Trump is America's id, but like Obama. Obama is who America likes to think they are. Because it's like the performance of goodness.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

The good side, because I think Obama performs as a good person as well. And okay. He probably is a bit of an. I would Be too, in private, but, like, he is, like, humble in public. And then Trump is the dark side. So they're like the darkness and the light. And, you know, there's an overlap in their voters, right?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

The same people that voted for Obama.

[Josh Johnson]

No, it's very true.

[Christiana]

Also about. Voted for Trump in these swing states. He's appealing to the same parts of themselves, but just the dark and the light.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Christiana]

That's my.

[Trevor Noah]

Maybe America should only just have two presidents, then forever, and you're switching back. Switch back and forth.

[Christiana]

That would make it simpler.

[Josh Johnson]

It would make it.

[Trevor Noah]

No, basically, you just ask America, just go like, guys, what are we feeling? Like we're feeling dark times.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Or we're feeling what are we feeling?

[Josh Johnson]

Like, hopefully feeling hopeful president. Because I do, and people always take it the wrong way when I say it, but maybe y'all will at least get it, that Trump is white Obama. He's Obama for white people who hated the idea of Obama. And it's like that, to me, is why I think people keep underestimating him. Because I'm like, you guys aren't ready for, like, okay, you may need to cut this whole thing. Who knows? But I think that there is a thing that is baked into America's understanding of the experience of a black person. So whether it's true or not, or whether it applies to every person or not, there's a story that people are told about you before they meet you as, like, a black American. It's like your ancestors were slaves. You have to struggle, but you always make it through. And you had to avoid crime and drugs and getting somebody pregnant just to be where I am right now as a white person. So just to be my coworker, you had to overcome all this stuff. It's like every one of your stories is like an Oscar movie. That's why we keep giving you the Oscar every time. It's sad, right? And now you're living in a world where there's so many cracks in that thing. Not just because there are black people who are like, no, I grew up in the suburbs all my life, and my dad's a doctor. But now you have white people who literally are that story. But no one tells it in that way. They're like, okay, my great great grandparents were these Irish immigrants that got spit on when they came here and everything. And I have a lot of drugs and crime where I'm from. Like, people always make it Appalachia, but it's like, guys, it's everywhere.

[Trevor Noah]

It is everywhere.

[Josh Johnson]

It's everywhere. And so it's like, my family was on food stamps, my family, all this stuff like that as a white person, which is, like, never really talked about. And so then this person had to overcome a lot just to be next to this other white person, right?

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Josh Johnson]

And Trump speaks to that the way that Obama spoke to black people who may or may have not been having that, like, stereotypical experience. And that is so powerful. It feels weird to tell white people that they don't understand white people, but white people who are, like, the living embodiment of everything we've been told black people go through. I understand better than, like, white people who have always had it, if that makes sense.

[Trevor Noah]

It makes sense because I. America, more than most countries in the world, has told people what their life should be and what it could be. Yeah, right. There's no other country that goes, like, the pursuit of happiness, which is an insane.

[Christiana]

Like, it's a crazy culture. Most cultures, they don't even believe in happiness.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Like, if I told my dad I wanted to be like, I think I told my dad that once was my mom. I said, I want to be happy. And my mom was like, is that it?

[Josh Johnson]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Like, is that all you want for yourself?

[Trevor Noah]

That is a wild concept. If you said that to your parents, most African parents, you like, I want to be happy. Then, like, happy, happy. Go and study something. Are you going to be successful? You know what is happy? You leave me happy. Are you married? Do you have children? You know what I mean? Like. Like, what is happy is a moment.

[Christiana]

My friend's sister said, was Jesus happy?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, but, like, that is one of the wildest things I've ever heard in my entire life.

[Christiana]

That, wow, she was making a big life choice. She was, like, happy. She's like, was Jesus happy? Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, but think of it this way, right? Most cultures in the world will believe that happiness is a state of mind, and it's a moment. You're not. You are. You are happy. You're not, like, permanently in a state of happiness. Does that make sense?

[Christiana]

And you shouldn't pursue it. It's like pursuing pleasure. It's kind of decadent, right? It is.

[Trevor Noah]

Right. But America is the only country that did that. And so in many ways, you have a country where they've told you what is supposed to happen to you, what you're supposed to experience. And so if you're not experiencing that, you're butting up against the. So it's like, it's. It's. It's the, you know, 14 day, money back guarantee. Think about how many people in America are going, but this is not what I was promised. And to your point, exactly what you're saying, Trump is going, you haven't gotten your. Your delivery, you haven't gotten the service. You know what I mean? You're supposed to get this thing. Yeah, but you haven't gotten it. And then those people are standing up, and then other white people are like, but why don't they just. Why don't they just. And it's like, yeah, you say that, but these white people are going, why has it not happened for me?

[Christiana]

And Obama did the same thing.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

He said, America has failed on its promise, but yes, we can.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, we can.

[Christiana]

He was very in it. It's the same. And it's like, the dark or the light.

[Josh Johnson]

Yes, but. Yeah, but the people. Whenever I say white Obama, everyone's mad. Everybody. Everybody's like, what do you mean? What are you talking about? I'm like, yeah. And then I explain the whole thing. They're like, no. And I'm like, I understand why.

[Trevor Noah]

No, because you lead, Josh. If you start with white Obama, I can see people immediately, viscerally. It's. Look, in the world of stand up, it's brilliant as a premise, as like a concept, but obviously, most of the time, a great premise in stand up is terrible for regular conversation.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, no, that's fair.

[Trevor Noah]

Because imagine if you came to somebody and you're like, yep. In many ways, he's like, muslim Jesus. People like, I'm sorry, what did you say?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You can't take someone who people love and revere and then compare them immediately to somebody they hate and not expect them to be a little bit reactive.

[Josh Johnson]

I guess I'm. I'm surprised how much everybody hates it in that I still have friends from Louisiana who voted for Trump and stuff like that. And then when I say he's wild Bob, they're like, what?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but that's what I mean.

[Josh Johnson]

And I'm like, that's what I'm saying. I'm like, I could understand my liberal friends getting mad, but then everyone's much.

[Trevor Noah]

Worse the other way around.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. How dare you?

[Trevor Noah]

You gonna call this man white Obama.

[Josh Johnson]

But can I tell you, he is doing everything. Trump is doing everything that they told us a black president would do.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Josh Johnson]

This man has his own coin. Two days before and then fleecing everybody. And then it dips and he don't even mention it. They asked him in the press conference when he already is like, is. I won't Say, promising, but when he's. When he's already jump starting this, like, $500 billion project for all of these AI CEOs before deep seat comes out, and they're like, what about your coin? And he's like, I don't know. How much did it make? And then they. And then they tell me. It's like, oh, that's peanuts to these guys. I'm like, why you let this do.

[Christiana]

Deflect in real time?

[Josh Johnson]

That's. That's a pimp move. To just be like, I don't know who stole from you while holding the bag? That's crazy.

[Trevor Noah]

I have been surprised might be the wrong word, but it's the only one I can think of right now. I've been surprised at how just, like, the lack of robustness in America's systems. You know what I mean?

[Christiana]

Like the institution.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. You take for granted how much of America is run, like, the game of golf. Mm. It's just an agreement.

[Josh Johnson]

Mm.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You're gonna keep your score, right?

[Josh Johnson]

Mm.

[Christiana]

You.

[Trevor Noah]

You. You'll tell us where your ball landed, right? Yeah, of course. Of course.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

And you. You're not gonna move the ball when you get there, right? No, no, no, no, no. All right. And you. But you all. You keep your own score. Think about how crazy golf is as a game.

[Josh Johnson]

Mm.

[Trevor Noah]

Everyone is out there competing against each other. Everyone keeps their own sc.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You hit the ball, it goes somewhere. You then tell people where your ball was. If you move it, nobody knows. Which, by the way, fun fact, Trump does all the time.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

Yeah, of course he does.

[Trevor Noah]

In actual golf.

[Christiana]

Of course he does.

[Trevor Noah]

In actual golf, you don't move the ball. If you do. But all of this, and people keep their own scores, and the game is basically run. There's all the rules, but a lot of the game is just a handshake. It's a gentleman's agreement. And I've been surprised to see how much of America is just a gentleman's agreement also.

[Christiana]

I mean, I'm saying this as a British. How much is just ultimately resolved in court? And then there's a different court. So then it goes to a court in, like, this district says, no, America just sues itself. Yeah. It just keeps. And then it's always judges who are.

[Trevor Noah]

Like, I'll take you to court. Yeah, I'll take you to court.

[Christiana]

So Trump does a thing. And then now I've realized, just wait to see what happens in court.

[Trevor Noah]

You have to wait for the final court, though. It's like, which court does it go to.

[Christiana]

And then it's frozen because of something that happens in court. So I'm like, I'm not saying not being a president is powerful because we've seen how much it can shape the world. But now I'm like, oh, everything happens in court in this country.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

It's like the judges.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. I think also for your. For your analogy of, like, the gentleman's agreement thing, it's like, that's also how our corruption is supposed to work. So when you're playing golf and you're keeping your own score and you're not going to move the ball, everybody moves it a little bit. Trump moves it out of the water.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

Actually, we all watched it go in the water. And then he dove in. He didn't dive, but he got someone to dive in, hand him the ball, and then he threw it in the green, and then he goes, that's where my ball was the whole time. And then, because we don't really understand how to, like, combat that, we're like, I guess that's where his ball was the whole. Maybe I'm crazy.

[Trevor Noah]

That's a great addition.

[Josh Johnson]

I thought it went to the water. And so then, because admittedly, with Dems and Republicans, there's always been the understanding, the gentleman's agreement of like, I'll move my ball a little bit. We'll both say, I won't move my ball at all.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

But I'll move it a little bit.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. I'm going to move to the bank after I've been running banks. I'm going to move to the defense contract after running. Yeah. Yeah, but you're right, it's been. It has been subtle.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. And it's like, that's what that. Even. Even, like, under people that we like, there was that level of corruption going on, but it felt like enough corruption to keep everything stable. So we're still playing golf.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, you know, there is the theory. I forget the official, like, name for it or the title for it, but there's this theory that says that there's no society that functions without corruption, and corruption is a necessary part of society for it to succeed. It's counterintuitive.

[Christiana]

I love this because I love corruption.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but you're Nigerian. I mean, this is.

[Christiana]

You said it, not me. It could have been my British side.

[Trevor Noah]

The British have corruption. Come on. Let me tell you something. One thing I've learned about Nigerians is.

[Christiana]

It could be my British side.

[Trevor Noah]

Can I tell you what I've learned about Nigeria? Now you're gonna Bring out your British side, please.

[Christiana]

Brits are incredibly corrupt.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but. No, but they don't love the corrupt. There's a difference.

[Christiana]

But we're embarrassed about.

[Trevor Noah]

That's what I mean. That's the difference. I think that's what it really is, is with Trump is like, it's the gentleman's agreement. Like, when he sat down with Zelensky, he broke the gentleman's agreement. I'm sure many presidents have cussed each other out over world issues, but the gentleman's agreement is that you don't do it in front of the press.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Do you get what I'm saying? It's the same way adults, you know, like, with kids, you'd be like, yo, we'll talk about this. Let's let the kids go away. We're gonna go to another room and we'll discuss. Cause you don't want the kids to see this, because there's a certain level of decorum.

[Christiana]

Yeah, he's got no decorum.

[Trevor Noah]

That's what it is.

[Josh Johnson]

It's not decent.

[Trevor Noah]

What Trump did there is you don't do that amongst world leaders, because it's not for the. Like, it's not for us as the public. In a weird way, go into a room, fight about it, and then come out and shake hands and be like, yeah, you know, we had a good discussion, and we're gonna figure this out. And, you know, But I also feel.

[Christiana]

Like, forget world leaders. I would not invite someone to my house to cuss them out. Like, if I want to cuss you out, you're not coming to my house. That was the thing that kind of blew my mind about the interaction. Like, forget.

[Trevor Noah]

But he didn't think he was going to cuss him out.

[Christiana]

Oh, he knew he was going to cuss him out.

[Trevor Noah]

No, he didn't.

[Christiana]

You don't think so?

[Trevor Noah]

I don't think so.

[Christiana]

Well, he thought Zelensky would kind of bow.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so here's how I play out the timeline. Trump goes, Zelensky's coming. Now, Trump. Remember who Trump believes Trump is. Trump believes he's the greatest negotiator, the greatest deal maker, the greatest businessman, the greatest peacemaker that has ever. Remember, this is the man who said, on day one, he's like, on day one, I will reduce the price of eggs. I will bring them down. Day one, eggs have only gone up.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Day one, Israel, Palestine. I'm gonna end it. We're tired of the war. We gotta end it. It's not over. You get what I'm saying? He's the person who believes. He genuinely believes. I don't even think he's, like, lying about this. He thinks, I'm gonna go in and I'm just gonna tell them what it is. And it's gonna be, same thing with tariffs. I'm gonna do the tariffs. Then the thing backfires. Then he's like, okay, I'm undo the tariffs, then I'm gonna do the tariffs again, then I'm gonna undo the tariffs. But he believes it. So he goes, you know what? I'll call Zelensky. He's like, I'm gonna call Zelensky and I'm gonna tell him this war needs to stop. And then Zelenskyy will stop the war. What happens? Zelenskyy shows up. Zelensky shows up in his outfit. That's the first thing Trump is angry about. Cause he's like, why is this guy. Everyone shows up here in a suit and tie. What is this man doing? Do you know what I mean? And that was the first comment, if you remember.

[Josh Johnson]

No, no. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

He points at him and he's like, oh, he got all dressed up. Look at him. So that's the first thing, the first slight for Trump. They go in, they're having the conversation. It's a normal press conference until the end. And that's the moment where Zelenskyy says a thing that Trump feels is something that goes against, like, him and is like a threat. You know, where Zelenskyy, like, you're going to feel the pressure. You're going to feel Russia's influence. You go, he's like, don't tell us what we're gonna feel. Don't you threaten me. And that's when it goes off the rails. But he. I don't think he brought the man in to cuss him out. I think he brought him in to solve it. And then this little man didn't come in, scrounging in front of him.

[Christiana]

I think some of the reaction to it, though, is just like, people are surprised to see someone cuss someone out in their house. Forget them being pregnant. It's a group of men.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Someone came to your house and you cussed them out. That is like, just on a purely human level. Yeah. Decorum.

[Josh Johnson]

And he's going on, I'll pitch you both this. I think that none of this would have happened if Zelenskyy had shown up maybe two weeks to a month earlier. Because you gotta remember that Macron was just in there correcting that man in front of his face and touching his knee. And so it's like, if you all talk about, as a man, I will curse somebody in my house before I let a man correct me and touch my knee while he does it. That's, oh, you must be out your mind. Correct me or touch my knee. But if you do both at the same time, we fighting. And so he already had to take the L on Macron, right? And so then he took the L Macron. And then. Cause to Trevor's point, that thing that Trump does, he got to do very well with the. I think it was the president of Egypt, right? When Egypt basically says, hey, when it comes to Gaza, we'll take the sick kids, right? Which for Trump is not a contradiction. Cuz he's like, we're gonna send some of the people to Jordan, we're gonna send some people to Egypt. So then sick kids are still people. So then Trump is like, I didn't even know that. See, isn't that, isn't that nice that he's willing to take the sick kids? And that, that's really great. And you can even see in the moments, like, maybe Trump is trying to continue to do the salesman thing, but maybe he's also like, it's working. Like, it's working. No, he likes me.

[Trevor Noah]

It's working.

[Josh Johnson]

And so then when Zelensky, who's just making a pretty rational point, he's like, guys, y'all think Putin's gonna stop? Y'all think China's just like playing games in the background. Like, Zelenskyy's one of the only people you can tell, even from him not showing up with a suit and tie. That's like living in the real world. Do you know what I mean? I don't know if you've ever been to like a, like, and I'm, I'm not trying to put anyone on blast, but I don't know if you've ever been to the party of someone who is about to not have money, but like, they're still dressed and still putting out the hors d'oeuvres. Like they have money.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

But you know that they always don't have money.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, things.

[Josh Johnson]

So then you show up in your hoodie and they're like, well, well, well, it's like, well, well, well, you about to live next to me.

[Trevor Noah]

I love the idea that Josh. You should know this. If you invite Josh to your house, how he's dressed is a precursor to.

[Christiana]

Your moments in life, how much money he thinks you have.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Like, if Josh shows up in a hoodie to your party. You should go check your bank account. Go check your investments. Go check everything. We're gonna continue this conversation right after this short break. This episode is brought to you by Brooklinen. If you know anything about me, you'll know that I travel a lot. I'm always on the road in a different country, in a different city, and most importantly, in a different bed. That's probably the one thing I miss most about coming home, is that I get to sleep in my bed. Because, let's be honest, there's nothing quite like it. Right? The bed is really what makes it a home. It's the space where all the good things in life happen. You're reading, you're sleeping, you're late night, scrolling, relaxing, snuggling with your pets, snuggling with your loved ones. And yeah, you know, that's. That's it. That's the list of fun things that happen in a bed. But truly, when you elevate your bedding, oh, I mean, you're elevating your entire existence. And there's no better way to do that than with Brooklinen. Sheets, blankets, pillows, throws. The layers and designs and possibilities are endless, turning your bedroom into the sanctuary that you deserve. So shop award winners and fan faves in store or online at brooklinen.com that's B R-O-O-K-L-I N E N.com and check out their sleep week sale happening right now for a limited time. This episode is brought to you by Atlassian. Atlassian team collaboration software like jira, Confluence and Loom help power collaboration for enterprise companies around the globe with products that enable AI powered teamwork. Doing the impossible just became possible. So join the 83% of the Fortune 500 that trust Atlassian to help transform their enterprise. Learn how to unleash the potential of your [e-mail] the most important news in the world right now, across every country, is that Christiana had another baby before we get into it, because I want to know all the details and I have many questions for you, by the way, which I've been saving. Oh, many questions.

[Christiana]

Okay.

[Trevor Noah]

Do you know how many people will talk to me about the podcast and the thing they'll say, they'll go like, Josh.

[Christiana]

Oh, Josh.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, he's very funny. Oh, man. Love this thing. Oh, YouTube. Oh, Josh. You know what I mean by the way? Like, people think you're like different people. It's very strange for me, but people will tell me about you. But then tell me about you. Doing something else as a different person.

[Josh Johnson]

Oh, yeah. People don't know I'm the same person.

[Trevor Noah]

They don't know you're the same person. You've noticed them.

[Josh Johnson]

I got DMs, like, angry DMs that are like, you stole the joke from the guy on what now? Cause I'll do the. I'll say the thing here, and then I'll say it on stage, and they'll be like, I've heard that before. And you think you're slick.

[Trevor Noah]

Yo. People say that to me. They'll go like, oh, man, I love the. Love the. Oh, man. By the way, there's this comedian you should have on your show. His name's Josh Johnson. He's. Then I go, you just told me you like Josh on the podcast.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

And they go, yeah, but have you heard Josh Johnson?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, it's nice that no matter what they want to take up for me sometimes it's against me, though.

[Trevor Noah]

It is against you.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You are the white Josh Johnson.

[Christiana]

Yeah, that's right.

[Trevor Noah]

You are. But the other thing people say, they'll be like, oh, I love Joshua. Then be like, oh, Christiana is so funny. She's this. She's smart. But then they'll be like, is she always pregnant? How many children does Christiana have? That. Yo, everyone. Men, women, old, young people just be.

[Christiana]

Like, oh, my God.

[Trevor Noah]

Like, there's a comedian in South Africa, his name is Ntosh. He was just chatting randomly, and he's like. He's like, yeah, Trevor. He's like, aye, chap that. He's like, that. Christiana. She's always pregnant. How is she always pregnant? I was like, what is she always. And I was like, actually, she is always pregnant.

[Christiana]

It's kind of crazy. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

First of all, congratulations.

[Christiana]

Thank you.

[Trevor Noah]

You are now the mother of a.

[Christiana]

How old she is? Eight weeks tomorrow.

[Trevor Noah]

Eight weeks tomorrow.

[Christiana]

So she's brand new. Still got that placenta perm.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, look at that placenta perm.

[Christiana]

You know how the hair comes out? It's not how it is. Like. So she still got her placenta perm. I know. I'm a mother of three kids, five and under. I've had. I've had more than three pregnancies. You guys know, like.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

My womb is a strange place, so I've had losses, done ivf, all of this stuff, and now it's landing me at three kids. Cora wasn't ivf, though.

[Trevor Noah]

So. Wait, so are you. How many. What's the number you're going for?

[Christiana]

I'm stopping It. Can I tell you guys something?

[Trevor Noah]

No. Don't lie. Don't lie.

[Christiana]

I hate it that he does.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't lie. Let me tell you why.

[Christiana]

Choice, Trevor.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Christiana]

But he's going to say, above all. You say this all the time.

[Trevor Noah]

Above all else.

[Christiana]

Every time you say, it's your last baby.

[Trevor Noah]

Above all else. To thine own self be true. Yeah, that's a quote that I love to live by. I'm not saying this out of judgment. I'm asking if there is, like, an end goal, because the. You are with children the way dangerous leaders are with land and, like, territory. They'll be like, I'm done. Remember when Putin said Crimea?

[Josh Johnson]

That's it.

[Trevor Noah]

He said, that's it. He said, now that we have. You are. You're the Putin of children.

[Christiana]

Okay?

[Trevor Noah]

Because every time I think you're done, there's another incursion. And then you're gonna tell me about why you had to. So you said after the first one, you were like, trevor, I will. You're like, don't ever have kids. I'll never have kids. Then second one, then you're like, I don't know who tricked me into this. I can't believe I'm doing it again. I'll never. Trevor, I'm done after this. I'm done. I'm done. I'm. We are now the third one.

[Christiana]

Okay, Can I tell you the difference? Now?

[Trevor Noah]

Tell me.

[Christiana]

So, unfortunately, I live in a very godless city, so it's a long time to get a vasectomy in LA. I sent my husband. My husband. February 14th, he had an appointment for consultation for a vasectomy on.

[Trevor Noah]

On Valentine's Day.

[Christiana]

Yes. I said, go.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay?

[Christiana]

He got there, and the guy says, there's a waiting list, but what happens every Friday? They open up the portal for cancellations. This is the vasectomy doctor in la, by the way. Everyone goes to him because he does the job.

[Trevor Noah]

How hard is it to do a vasectomy? Forgive my agency.

[Christiana]

Oh, it's so easy.

[Josh Johnson]

I thought it was quick.

[Christiana]

It's quick, but it's a godless city. People don't want kids. So there's so many.

[Trevor Noah]

There's so many people in LA getting vasectomies.

[Christiana]

If you want it quicker, go to, like, Utah. Like, in Utah.

[Trevor Noah]

The next person will be like, I've never done this before, but let's see what happens.

[Josh Johnson]

So it's just snip, snap.

[Christiana]

So this is. I don't even want to go on too many tangents, but no, go on all the tangents.

[Trevor Noah]

I want to know all the tangents.

[Christiana]

Because I've got people telling me, why don't you get an iud? Why don't you do that? I'm like, no, let him do something. Because I've. My body's been through.

[Trevor Noah]

No, I don't. I don't.

[Christiana]

So my husband is getting a vasectomy, and we have two embryos in boarding school. In case I ever want to get to five. I know they're just there. I don't know what to do with them. You see, this is. I'm pro choice, but then I have all these woo woo things. I'm like, do I donate them to science? I don't like embryo adoption.

[Trevor Noah]

No. You see, this is slick.

[Christiana]

Wait, wait, wait.

[Trevor Noah]

She left herself a little.

[Christiana]

No, no, no, no, no. It's not the. Out. It's just like, I'm like, I can't keep having children when I have, like, these two. Not souls, but things frozen in time. So they're there. I have to make a decision about what we do with them. They're in Texas.

[Trevor Noah]

You have children in Texas?

[Christiana]

Not children, please. The Republicans here, they're not children. They're cells. Me and my husband, cells.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Christiana]

Day five.

[Trevor Noah]

It was only a matter of time before, like, you remember when we were on the road, I used to have this joke that I almost believe is going to become true. They're just gonna keep moving it further and further back.

[Christiana]

Yeah. You know, that's why we want to take them out of Texas. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

They go like. But they're gonna keep moving it further and further back. You know, they go like, oh, no, the heartbeat or this. Or blip and this and inception. And it's gonna get to the point where they'll just be like, your sperm is a child. Look at how they swim.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Look at how they swim.

[Christiana]

I'm afraid it's gonna get to that. So anyway.

[Josh Johnson]

Okay.

[Christiana]

So even having Cora the Ethical, I was like, how can we do this when it was obviously she's not planned.

[Trevor Noah]

Right.

[Christiana]

By the way, my thing about having three kids, I think it makes me look like I lack sexual discipline in this eight day.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no. Wait, wait. Why? Why would you.

[Christiana]

Because, like, who has three kids in this day and age?

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no, no, no. But why would you need sexual discipline? I. Whoever says that? Bring them here.

[Christiana]

No, People are very like people. Women with careers.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Like, ambitious women. You either have no kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Or you have maximum two.

[Trevor Noah]

No kids or maximum two.

[Christiana]

This is what I found. I'VE looked at it.

[Trevor Noah]

Why do you think that is?

[Christiana]

Because no kids. You have freedom.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Two kids. You have balance. And it's what you can. At 3Kids, we're like, at capacity. Like, it's. It's chaos in my house. But, like, imagine a woman shows up for a job interview. I'm just talking about, like, a woman that maybe doesn't have as much privilege, and she's like, I have three kids. The person on the other side is like, this bitch is gonna have another baby soon. I don't know if I can give her the job. You know, I mean, that's how I would feel. That's how I would feel. But I'm saying that's a very raw. But then you'd have to cause your interaction.

[Trevor Noah]

Can I tell you, I'm glad you brought that up. Can I tell you something? This is something I feel like people don't speak enough about because we, you know, the problem with almost every single conversation people have, not just in America, but in most places, but I feel like America does it, you know, in the most extreme way, is that you can't have a conversation about a thing because it's overlapped with so many other issues that then people think you're talking about when you're not talking about it. Right. I'm glad you brought that up because even with us doing this, you being pregnant is the worst thing for the podcast.

[Christiana]

When I told them, I walked in, obviously, I was like. They were like, eh. Like. Cause my belly was showing at that point. I was past 12 weeks. And then Derek, shout out to Derek, who works with Trevor. He was just sitting there ansonazing. They're doing the sums.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, everyone has to do the.

[Christiana]

And they were like. They were like, congratulations. Oh, yeah, we can make the pot. When do you do? It was so funny. It was just a relief. And then they were like, no, but.

[Trevor Noah]

But, but it makes. Do you get what I'm saying? Like, with Josh, I never. With you, I go, okay, when is Josh on the road? When is Josh touring? When is Josh. Okay, cool, whatever.

[Christiana]

But you're not worried about Josh getting pregnant.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but when? No, but I'm not even worried about. What I'm saying is you being pregnant is the worst thing for our work schedule. Right? Because you have to go see the doctor. Anything can happen at any time during the pregnancy.

[Christiana]

And I had a high risk pregnancy.

[Trevor Noah]

There you go. You've got a high risk pregnancy. So your body is this fragile thing that is doing this amazing thing that you have to Watch out for on all these levels. So if Christiana's not well, I'm never going to put a podcast over your pregnancy. You know what I mean? I'll never, ever be like, but the podcast. And you know this from me, I'm the person who's like, yeah, cancel.

[Christiana]

And by the way, like, so I feel very fortunate that I do this, the work I do and where I am in my career, that I have, like, partners. Like, you guys were like, okay, how can we make this work?

[Trevor Noah]

Right?

[Christiana]

That was like, okay, what are your dates? What do you want to take time off? When are your appointments? You know, they're the queen. The kings and queens of you. Don't you seem tired? Go. Go sleep or whatever. But most women don't work in environments. But this is not like that. Yeah, but it's like, you know, you're getting fired, you're getting demoted, you're taking time off, you're coming back at a lower level. You're already like postpartum. It's. It's the worst thing you can do for your career, having a baby. That's the truth. But no one says that.

[Trevor Noah]

That's what I mean. We don't talk about these things because people feel like you're conceding something that they don't want to concede. Right. Having a child is terrible for your career. Having a child is also terrible for the work environment. Like, for the actual. For your company, your office. It's not great for them.

[Christiana]

It's bad for the dads, too, by the way, because a dad is like, I want to spend more time with my kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes. It's just bad. It's bad.

[Josh Johnson]

A good dad.

[Christiana]

A good dad. A good dad.

[Josh Johnson]

Can I tell you, the men that you would not know had children, you'll be in a fantasy league with them and not know they have a child. You will know their number one seed and not know that they have a child.

[Christiana]

Okay. For someone who wants to be an active and presence.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

Father. In the current, like, capitalist framework, we have.

[Trevor Noah]

Thank you.

[Christiana]

Where your work is on your phone, like your email. You can't escape it. It's very tough after work, drinks, socializing. Now they, like, return to the office. They don't want us to work from home. Right. So you're away from your family all day. If you're a man that wants to see your kids and be present, it's bad for you as well. But I think with. And it's an argument conversation. Me and Lewis have a lot. The woman you take on the actual physical brunt of the pregnancy, the emotional, physical labor, the hormones, it's. It's filled up. You're being invaded. I find pregnancy very disembodying. I'm not one of these women. Like the most beautiful time in my life. I was. I feel like shit. Like, I. I don't enjoy it. And I've had really. I've had rough pregnancies. I've had. My last birth was my favorite birth. I felt really powerful. I knew what I wanted. Like, I felt very confident. Yeah. And it was just like, I'd done it enough times before to be like, listened to and postpartum was. I couldn't even really dwell on it because I had two. I have the two other children. But for a lot of women, it's this earthquake and you're constantly feeling aftershocks. And whatever decision you make, right, whether you decide to stay at home with your children or also work as well, you don't have the support for the most part. Like, I find my friends that are stay at home moms, they live really isolating existences and they do work that's not respected.

[Trevor Noah]

So I've been experiencing this through different lenses and in different ways. So I've gotten to experience the professional side of it with you. You know, pregnancy and a woman having children in the work environment, which I've loved. Like, it's, it's it. Because anything that gives me insight, I. I love.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You know what I mean? Like, if I was in that plane that flipped over, I would love it because I'd be. I've always wanted to be in a plane that crashes, but I would like to experience it and then come out on the other side. Does that make sense? So if I don't live, I have.

[Christiana]

It's concerning, but it makes sense.

[Trevor Noah]

No, what I mean is, like, I love things that give me insights.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

So what is it like? Oh, I now know what it's like.

[Christiana]

You've seen it up close multiple times now.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, exactly. Right. So. But then one of my best friends and his wife, they just had twins, right?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Oof. Indeed. And like, there've been some days where there's nobody to look after the twins. I don't know how many months old they're. But they're like tiny. They don't walk, they don't do anything. They're still in, like that. You know what I mean?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

They're just, they're like, they're like blobby. They can hold their. No, they can. They can hold their necks up.

[Christiana]

They can.

[Trevor Noah]

Then their necks are. Now they're able to hold their necks up?

[Christiana]

Definitely, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

They're infants, and some days it'll be like me and him looking after them. Right. For hours on end. Hours on end. And the other day, we were sitting together, and we're just, like, rotating the babies, and he, like, broke his back many years ago, and then now carrying the babies and the stroller, the back injury came back, so for, like, a week, he couldn't carry babies.

[Christiana]

Oh, my God.

[Trevor Noah]

So now I'm helping him with both of the babies, and I'm running around. But there was a point where we were sitting together, and you know what this is like, you know? But the babies start, like, crying in a rotation.

[Christiana]

I call it witching hour.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. So just as one baby starts crying, it cries, it cries, it cries, it cries, it cries. You finally figure out what it is. Maybe it wanted to be rocked. Maybe it wanted to be fed. Maybe it wanted to be burped. Maybe it just wanted to move. Sometimes they just want to stand up. Sometimes babies just don't like you to sit down. This is what I've learned. Like, babies are like, why are you sitting? Like, babies should be bosses in every. Every office in the world. They do not tolerate sedentary lifestyles. Babies are just like, why are you sitting? You're like, what do you mean? I'm chilling. Baby's like, nah, nah.

[Christiana]

Then you stand.

[Trevor Noah]

Then the baby's like, yeah, this is good. I like this. I like this. That's all the baby's doing.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You finally get the baby to chill or sleep, and then the other baby's like, all right, my turn. Let's see what we can do with this. So we're in this spiral. We're in this thing. We're in this. I'm rocking, singing, burping, bumping, jumping, doing everything with these babies. And I think, like, two hours in, I looked at him and I said, yo, how much longer do we have? And he said, what do you mean? We're the whole day? And then I looked at him, and I said, how. How do women. How do they exist? And what I mean by how, like, how do women exist? Is I don't understand how we've created a system where we act like that is not happening to everyone.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Most people, especially in America, cannot afford childcare. They don't have support. They don't have systems. They don't have. So they leaving their kids at home at a young age. If they get to that Age where they can. Or some people are, like, bringing the kid with them where they can and how they. But I don't understand how we're gonna live in a world where we, on the one hand, tell people, hey, the birth rate is dropping, we need to have more kids. Why aren't we having kids? This is not sustainable. But then, on the other hand, not support the very same people who need to have the kids to sustain a population.

[Christiana]

And let's not even talk about. And I think this is around the Western world. The housing crisis is so expensive.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, yeah. No, it's all of it.

[Christiana]

Schools aren't good. Private, but private schools are super expensive. So it's just like everything is working against you. And then I'd say, like, on a really. Maybe it's like, I don't think it's vain for a long time. You don't feel like yourself in your body. You have this baby, you're lumpy, you're soft, you don't feel sexy. Do you know what I mean? It's like you're scrolling Instagram and you're like, you know, Zenpic, everyone's very hot and thin right now, and you're just like. I feel like.

[Trevor Noah]

Can I tell you, just as an aside, two things. One, I still think GLP1, that whole world is unlocking something deep in humanity that we haven't even, like, we haven't tapped into. I think it's unhacking a lot of the hacking that has happened to us. Right?

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

And if you're listening to this, I'm not saying, like, go and take Ozempic, all of these things, but I genuinely believe that almost everyone in society in some way should be on it, because I feel like in the same way that microplastics are everywhere now. I think we've all been, like, poisoned by foods that have hacked our systems. And I think these drugs are the first things that are undoing a lot of that hacking.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

I don't know how long, like, how long, you know, it'll last and how people will feel.

[Christiana]

Good.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm not endorsing it in any way, but I just think GLP1 in particular. But have you seen. Have you seen how now, like, big food companies, you know, for lack of a better term, fast food companies, and then chips and snacks and all of that. Have you seen that they're working on GLP1 blockers in their food so they.

[Christiana]

Will basically become ozempic resistant.

[Trevor Noah]

They are trying to make food now that can resist ozempic and mounjaro and all of these drugs. Because the people who take this aren't eating junk food and aren't becoming overweight and aren't getting sick and are becoming more fertile and are becoming like, they gamble less, they buy less, they smoke less, they drink less, they shop less, they do everything less of the unhealthy. And because of that, they're actually gonna make food that is gonna block the block so that they can get you back into that.

[Josh Johnson]

Sorry, that's just like, I wonder what that's gonna do to people who really weren't in this at all. Like, if you like. If you just like regular Doritos and you aren't going anywhere near Ozempic, are you gonna be like, look, I'll do anything for this? Yeah, you might be like, are you gonna lose your mind or are you.

[Trevor Noah]

Might be crack hungry? Actually, no, you actually might be crack hungry. Cause GLP1 is produced naturally, as I understand it, Right. So it's something that your gut is supposed to produce when you are full. Most food hacks that feeling, but if you have a healthy gut, your stomach tells you, okay, you're full. So now to your point, if it blocks that. Yeah, we might get like, crack Doritos now.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. This is what makes me feel crazy.

[Trevor Noah]

You brought children into this world.

[Christiana]

Well, how could you? Well, the worst thing is being, like, postpartum in the age of Ozempic, because, like, I think I've been through, like, the entire life cycle. So when I had OB in 2020, then it was Covid, but it was a wave of body positivity. And everyone was saying, you're not your body. Thank your body for just keeping you alive. Because, you know, the states were different. It was like viruses. So you were just like, oh, I've got this thing that keeps me alive. Good for you. It didn't matter how it looked. And now the algorithm is just feeding me, oh, you're postpartum. How to get your body back? Basically eating disorder.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

Content like lean is law. It's like, but. And every. The timeline does look different because so many people are on GLP1s, and you look at the red carpet from the Oscars or the Grammys, and you're like, people look really different.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

And like, everyone.

[Trevor Noah]

Everyone is honest.

[Christiana]

So there's also being a woman that's just had a baby in a very different cultural space where a maternal body is like, no. No one wants to see evidence that you've had babies. We hate those bodies. It's a mum bod. It's so rude, right?

[Trevor Noah]

You know what's funny is that there's a dad bod, but we don't even have the baby. I mean, Trevor. It's true, though. It's pretty funny.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Like, dads just get. You know what I mean? Men are really. We really have finessed the game in a good way because, like, they'll go like our mum bod. Yeah, you. She's had kids. Dad bod. You never had kids. You've never physically had the children. Why are you using this as an excuse?

[Josh Johnson]

I have not had to support someone all the way through a pregnancy. I've had friends who have been pregnant and I've had, you know, I mean, like, I've just never been in a relationship with someone who was pregnant and then seeing the whole thing through. So I'm not acting like.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, wait. What? Okay.

[Christiana]

You know Josh, very supportive. You were.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no.

[Christiana]

When I was pregnant with Obi.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no.

[Christiana]

Bring me stuff.

[Trevor Noah]

This is a thing.

[Josh Johnson]

I do my best.

[Christiana]

This is a thing.

[Trevor Noah]

This is a thing I have with Josh. Just generally. I don't know if it's because you're Southern or I don't know if it's because of just like your vibe. Sometimes you'll say a thing. And I love this about you, but I think it leaves people thinking you said something you didn't say. Because what you just said. Now, I think for some people, what they might have heard is I have not stayed around for full pregnancy. I have never supported someone fully.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's the way I worded it. But I just. I'm not trying to have any stolen valor of like, oh, yeah, I helped this person all the time.

[Trevor Noah]

No, I know, I know. I know you. I know what you.

[Christiana]

This is over wokeness.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, I know. Joke.

[Christiana]

By the way. I'm an ally for people who have been pregnant, however, I myself. But now you sound like a bit.

[Trevor Noah]

The way you said it sounds like Josh was like. So I want you to know that I've never stayed around to see an entire pregnancy through. I've been there when they told me and I've been there when they were done, but I've never. No, Josh, you're not saying.

[Josh Johnson]

I've never got anyone pregnant.

[Christiana]

Cool. Okay.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. And so I can only imagine what it's like to actually be like Louis or in that situation. But the closest thing I can guess from the dudes I know who have, you know, had kids and everything. It's not just gaming the system in a Way of, like, there's very little that a dad has to do. There's also, you want to do something, there's nothing for you to do. So I equate it to, like, how it feels when you've hired movers because now you've hired the movers and they're in your house and they're doing all the work and you're like, oh, I could. And they're like, you would literally be in the way. If you help me right now and you hurt yourself, I can't help you. So, like, just be over here. And so now you're standing in the corner while somebody moves all your stuff and you're like, but I think I could have. You can't.

[Trevor Noah]

Trust me.

[Josh Johnson]

We work out all day and we move all day. We don't need you coming down the step. Woo woo. And then now all of a sudden your neck is broken and we don't get paid.

[Christiana]

I feel, I feel so bad I'm such a mean pregnant woman. Because that's not true. Not too.

[Trevor Noah]

Or maybe in the house.

[Christiana]

In the house, Trevor, you'd be like, oh, bye. I think my character flaw is that when I'm frustrated with things, there's always like the target of my frustration, even if it's not that person themselves. So I think Lewis had to absorb a lot of my complaints about. But also, I've had three kids for this man, so I feel like I.

[Trevor Noah]

Like how quickly it went from. I was like, man, this poor guy's. I had these kids for him.

[Josh Johnson]

It is.

[Christiana]

He's like your favorite, your favorite line. That's what he calls it.

[Josh Johnson]

We must be seeing what Lewis sees in the moment. Like a little bit of rationalizing, a little bit of like, nah, you did this to me.

[Christiana]

But you know, he's very active, supportive. He's a great parent. Like, I'm always like, if any. I say to him, like, if you died and left me a widow, I'd go and get you back because I can't do this without you. No, just don't die.

[Trevor Noah]

But that's beautiful though.

[Christiana]

No, but like, he's just.

[Josh Johnson]

It's beautiful as a threat, I mean, but it's beautiful.

[Christiana]

Stay healthy, go to the doctor.

[Trevor Noah]

But like, how big is your community? Like, how do you.

[Christiana]

Oh, my God.

[Trevor Noah]

Is it just the two of you raising the kids? For the most part. So because your parents are in the uk.

[Christiana]

My parents are in the uk. His family's in New York. Yeah. We were very fortunate enough to have a nanny who focuses on two Luna. Now we just use numbers for the children because we get their names wrong.

[Trevor Noah]

Just do numbers.

[Christiana]

Focuses on two. Lewis currently does the heavy lifting with one. Okay, so he gets obi dressed for school, gives him breakfast, takes him to school, takes him to any activity he needs to have, and then brings him back, et cetera, et cetera. And I focus on three. Okay. But we have a. Like, a great village. Like, my parents come out to New York this week to record these episodes. My parents came out from London. They're currently in the hotel, like, 10 minutes away with Cora. 3. Lewis's parents have already come out. They came out shortly after Cora was born, and they spent two weeks with us, helping us out. So even though we don't have our village, always physically present people are very supportive. And I think, you know, it's great to have, like, the physical support, but so much of parenting is just, like, the psychological toll. And you guys are part of the village, like, friends, family. How you doing? Checking in three of my best friends from my childhood. Well, we're schoolgirls together. We're in a group chat, and we're always, like, encouraging each other.

[Trevor Noah]

Do they also have kids?

[Christiana]

They also have kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Christiana]

They also have kids. And we're all in different life phases with the kids and ages and all that. And even before, they were like, how are you? How are you feeling? You've got your pump. Like, you're texting me.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

Or if I came in to get day. So we have a village. We are incredibly supported, but we still most days feel like we're treading water. So I cannot imagine how. I think most parents in America or in the west are just drowning.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, I'm glad you said in the west, because that's something that I've found is the ultimate paradox of coming from a developed country versus a developing nation. You know, so first world, third world is the thing that you're sold in developed nations is that you have everything. Oh, it's great. The roads work and the schools are fantastic, and there's health care. And, you know, this is a great country to be in. The one thing that nobody seems to tell you is that as a country becomes more and more developed, the one thing that gets eroded is community. The village disappears. And what you have to do is you have to buy the village back.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, you have to buy somebody to look after your kid. You have to buy somebody to help you clean your house. You have to buy somebody to help you. You have to buy somebody to cook. You have to buy you're buying the same, the same village that they tricked you into not having. Like, I always, I always, I'm always amazed at the con of it all. This machine, this larger thing, told everyone, you should get your own house and you should live by yourselves. How can you still live with your parents in the same house? This is ridiculous. And so everyone goes off, they get their own house to live by themselves. They have a kid, and now you need somebody to come and look after the kid. But they can't just come a few. If you, you know what, you should get a bigger house. They could live with you. You could have a. Live in nanny. Where I'm from, they call that an aunt or a sister. They call that a grandmother. They call it a sister, they call it a. And in the west, that's one of the biggest things I've realized is every time people bring up statistics of how birth rates are declining in the West, I'm amazed at how people never seem to want to talk about the fact that the west doesn't encourage people to have kids. And what I mean by encourage is not telling people to do it, but encouraging is facilitating, I think, in many ways.

[Josh Johnson]

Yes. So I remember years ago when we had this conversation for the first time of like, being careful not to let people convince you you need to, like, buy the people you need and stuff like that. Because at the end of the day, this person, you pay, this person, you pay, this person you pay. None of them would, like, come and get you. Yeah, like, that's not who you call. I mean, it's like, no, no, I just want your kid. I'm not going to come get you from a bar.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

Because they're not your friends.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, they're not.

[Josh Johnson]

And, and so they can become, in.

[Trevor Noah]

Some ways, they can become over time, but.

[Josh Johnson]

And so then there's like that specific aspect which I've tried to apply to my life and I've tried to tell as many people as possible, like, hey, hey, this could be a friend. Because that's what we're doing with AI now. Like, there's literally like AI Friends in a way. I'm like, guys, come on, come on, try it with a person. You know what I mean? It won't be perfect. But then the other thing that you both have sort of help me contextualize for the first time is that it's amazing that business is able to do the things that people think are impossible in their own life. So your Doritos, your lay's, your whatever you see Ozempic everyone says that everybody's on it, but a lot of people can't even afford it.

[Trevor Noah]

Old people, essentially.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. And so it's like, this is just the first 2% of what we're gonna see from these drugs. And already they're like, okay, then we need blockers. We need blockers so that by the time the pores can afford it, it won't aff to work. Right. And that thing is like, seeing a need and addressing it immediately. Whereas, like, with people, they're telling us, you should have kids, there's a birth decline, everything. It's like, well, then as a business, don't you think that it would benefit you as quickly as possible to institute some sort of, like, maternity and paternity leave to, like, have these systems set up in your business so that way the next crop of people that you hire will be comfortable having a kid and now you have more employees for the future. But everyone is like, so compounded on. And because we were made to be cogs, not like people. Like, if you talk about the birth rate, and only some people care about the birth rate, the rest of people talking about the birth rate care about the supply.

[Trevor Noah]

No, they do. They completely care about it. That way they go, the market is going to collapse. That's what they mean by the birth rate. They're not saying it like people will disappear. They're saying, guys, if this happens, at some point, the economy's gonna collapse. There won't be a new labor force. You're not wrong. It is completely through the lens of labor.

[Christiana]

I think.

[Josh Johnson]

So that. That just blows my mind that we're there.

[Christiana]

I mean, they've seen, I think there was Japan a few years ago, experienced the first year where they sold more adult diapers than diapers for babies.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh.

[Christiana]

Because they had this huge geriatric population, but people aren't having kids. But. But to both of your points, maybe because of the way I was raised, and so my husband's Dominican, so very immigrant family, very family focused.

[Trevor Noah]

Dominicano.

[Christiana]

Dominicano. And I'm Nigerian. And you know what that means. We live in la, which some people say is a vapid place or whatever, but there are good people there and we focus a lot on building our community. We take our friend's kids. Even when I was pregnant, I'll take a friend's kid and people take our kids. And one thing I will say in this postpartum period, it being spending time with other people and being active in our trying to build that community. It paid dividends in small ways. There was a mum at OB school who sent me a text and she was like, I've dropped something at your door. Like, it was, it was like a very sweet. Yeah, yeah, yeah, big up lane. She dropped something at my door and I looked out, she brought me just some tea. I had another friend, my friend Chris, she was just like, I'm in the neighborhood and she bought food like that you can heat up and stuff like that. And then Cora's godparents, Dar and Emmy, they came by, just held the baby for a bit. So I think sometimes we complain about not having community, but are we trying to be good community and village members? And I think that we're in this like, me, me, me, selfish society. Whether it's about whether you're about your grind, your money, your holidays, whatever you're into. And we've actually forgot how to be village members. And we then we were shocked. We don't have a village. So for the last couple of years I was doing that myself. So I was just like, how can I be better to the people around me or just show up in the small ways that I can? And this is why I think this third time around, being in a country that's not my own, I felt more settled, more supportive, more checked in because I was always. I've been more present for other people. And I think that that's a hard thing to say to mothers or parents that, like, how many people are you there for? Because you're like, well, I'm drowning. But I think if you have that mentality of, like, what's the little thing I can do for, you know, is there a parent in my child's class that I can be like, oh, I'll drop them home sometimes? Or what's the little thing you can do? And that accumulates and that's how you build a village.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't go anywhere because we got more what now? After this.

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[Trevor Noah]

This episode is brought to you by Audi. The all new fully electric Audi Q6E Tron is a huge leap forward featuring effortless Power, serious acceleration, and the most advanced tech of any Audi ever. Experience technology that puts you center stage with a panoramic digital stage. Plus you can add an optional screen for front seat passengers so they can stream my best work or anything you want to watch. It doesn't have to be mine. The Q6E Tron is not just a new EV. It's a new way to experience driving. Learn [e-mail] always pay careful attention to the road and do not drive while distracted. So there's a. There's a paradoxical idea that is very difficult for people to accept, but it is almost unanimously agreed on as being true. And that is that over time load starts to like level off if it was a curve, you know what I mean? So if you're looking after a child, it's a lot of work. If you're looking after two children, it's more work, you know, three children, it's work. It's weird. But at some point the work doesn't actually increase, you know, at the same rate, you know what I mean? So it's not jumping.

[Christiana]

Are you pitching me to have more kids?

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no, no. But surprisingly it really isn't. It isn't jumping in the same way. Now costs might jump, and don't get me wrong on that side, but like, think of it this way. I love that you said that. We live in a world where everyone thinks, and I understand why people think this. Everyone thinks that they're doing it alone, right? So you're grinding alone, you're running alone, you're having a baby alone. Everything you think you're doing alone, you really do think you're doing it alone. And the world I think tells you you're doing it alone. And then part of the way it does it to you, I feel, is it tricks us into rewarding us alone. I think that's like a key thing as well.

[Christiana]

Personal bonuses.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, it's a personal bonus and it's like it's private thing and it's your money, you know. But if you, to your point, took on a little more load in your world for somebody else, you don't realize how you've given them a thousand times more space, right? So let's say a couple has their kids and they say to all the parents in their group, hey, send your kids on every Thursday. We'll look after everyone's kids if you want. Like we're gonna host like a little mini kindergarten type thing. Now don't get me wrong, you might hate your Thursdays, you Might be like, okay, this is war. Here we go. The invasion begins. 6:00pm it's on. We hate our lives. But the amount of space you've created for the other, let's say five families that have dropped off their kids, it scales exponentially, like, way beyond what you are receiving as load. Does that make sense?

[Christiana]

Yeah, for sure.

[Trevor Noah]

They get to go off, they get to have a couple's date, they get to go work more if they need to, they get to go sleep, they get to do something. But if everyone is doing that on every day, all of a sudden you're in a world where we. Which we should be trying to get back to, which is what we had when we were growing up. I know our parents had a tough time in South Africa. I know they did. But I can tell you they didn't have as tough a time, contrary to what people may believe. Because you might think coming from a third world country means you'll have a harder time raising kids. I actually think a lot of it was easier because the load was always shared. The Lord was always shared.

[Christiana]

It's so funny you say that about, like, community. Right now, I'd say one of the most invaluable members of my community is my God sister, Emily.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

She moved in with us in January. And when I told, like, just strangers that, oh, yeah, my God sister's gonna move in with her people, like, why would you want someone in the early 20s? That's so weird. I was like, yeah, you know, she's coming out to la, she's got a job. I'm like, you know, I love her to bits. I love her parents just, like, let her come live with us. And it's. So now I see the benefits of, like, intergenerational households.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

Because now Obi has someone to look to who's not as old as. Cause she was. He was like, what are you? You're not a grown up. Like, he doesn't even know what this thing is. He was like, well, I am a grown up, but I'm a young grownup. So he has this thing to look to that he can play with, is like a pressure release valve.

[Trevor Noah]

Right.

[Christiana]

I just have another sister in the house. Do you know what I mean? And then she has, like an older sister, older brother to kind of look up to, to ask questions to. And it's changed the rhythm of all of our lives. Like, she's up early in the morning because of the kids. I'm learning about Chapel Rowan and all these crazy people because of her.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

I'M like, what on earth is. No, but it's like, it's opening my mind. It's expanding my heart, and it's just like, we have a bigger family now. There's some cultures where you would never let someone live with you.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

That is not in your. But it's been one of the best, best things, I think, to happen to all of us.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

And then when we had Lewis's parents there, we had, like, the grandparents.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Parents.

[Trevor Noah]

And that's how.

[Christiana]

And then I was like, oh, the rhythm where we're living now where someone's alone, or you're having a 2.4 family with 2.5 kids. That is not how it's. We're actually all supposed to be communal.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

And have multiple generations in the same space. And not having that is really bad for us.

[Trevor Noah]

I think it's the worst thing that we've done.

[Josh Johnson]

Well, I think about when I was little and staying at my grandparents, if my mom had to go to work or, like, visiting my aunt or, you know, whatever it was. And then my parents were separated for a little bit, so I go over to my dad's or whatever, and I was like, man, after what you just said and what you've been saying, I'm like, yeah, I spent just enough time with everyone that everyone liked me. Do you know what I mean? I didn't really have enough time to get on anybody's nerves in that way.

[Trevor Noah]

Which is true, by the way.

[Christiana]

Your mom was a single mom. Right. And that's. That's crazy. My son wasn't a burden. Because if you speak to most single mothers today, they're like, I'm overwhelmed.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

I'm drowning. And it actually impacts the relationship I have with this kid because I'm always strained and I'm tense, but just having that pressure relief valve, like, oh, I like my kid.

[Josh Johnson]

To be fair to my mom, it's like her breaks from me were work, but at the same time, sometimes it was just like going to my grandma's for no reason. So it's like sometimes it was like, yeah, her break for me was having to, like, do her job. But at the same time, there were some times where I was just at my grandparents for no reason, and not no reason, but to spend time with them. And so it's like, I was such a mama's boy as well, that, like, by the time she comes to pick me up, I'm so excited. And she can be excited because I'm like, ma.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

Whereas, ooh, I remember one Time. I don't know if my grandparents were sick or what it was, but I couldn't go over there. And it was just us. And I was like, mm, I do talk a lot. And my mom wasn't even yelling at me or anything. And I could see it on her face where I was like, mm, this story is going on. I had to be, like, 11 or something. I was like, oof. Ooh. It was like I was old enough to, like, recognize in her face your.

[Trevor Noah]

What do they call it again? Your self awareness.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, that's like the age of self awareness. I was just like, oh, oh. And I want to get to the end, but she. She keeps looking at the ground. Oh, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

This was your first bombing in front of an audience. Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

As a comic, you know that feeling where you're like, should I finish the bit? Should I? Oh, I've lost them. Oh, I've lost them.

[Josh Johnson]

Cause if I stop the story right now, I'm gonna seem like I have a head injury.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Josh Johnson]

She's gonna take me to the hospital. Cause I'm, like, gearing up, and it's like, I don't think the turn is enough. Yeah.

[Christiana]

Trevor, you were raised like that, right? Yeah, I was completely Village compound people. Your cousins.

[Trevor Noah]

Can I. Can I tell you, probably one of the biggest things that keeps me afraid of having a kid, especially in America, is I. I just. I'm like. It doesn't seem like what you'd want a childhood to be.

[Christiana]

No, it's not.

[Trevor Noah]

Also because of how they've robbed children of autonomy.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Like, when I was a child, you know what my job was 99% of the time? Go play. That was like, my job. That was like my official. If you said to me, like, what is your job? I'd be like, ah, I gotta go play. My mom, my grandmother, they would say, go outside and play. You go play with other children. You go to the park. You meet the other kids at the park, and you play. The park hierarchy figures itself out. There's a kid that swings the swing too hard, you might fall. You cry, then you stop crying, and then you. When I walk past playgrounds today, guys, it's a little prison yard.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Every parent is watching. Every kid. Like, every parent.

[Christiana]

Every parent, they're really surveilled. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

You could have two parents watching 30 Kids. I think you'd be fine. I genuinely think you could be fine. I don't know why people don't have contracts at the park and just be like, all right, guys, who are the two Parents of the day.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

You just need two people to just. We're all afraid of pedophiles.

[Trevor Noah]

Yep. But this is a. This is a overblown. It's a crazy. Do you know how. You know, I've been on this deep dive recently of. Of going down rabbit holes, seeing where our, like, fears and. And all these ideas came from. A few kids got kidnapped when the news thought it was the best story, and now everyone's like, every kid gets kidnapped. No, children don't get kidnapped.

[Christiana]

But also, who wants to take any kid? I'm not worried about my kids getting kidnapped. The kidnapper will bring them back the number.

[Trevor Noah]

And I know someone will be like, what about this kid? No, I'm not saying no kids get kidnapped, but I'm saying for the amount of stress that people have about it, trust me, you could have two parents at a park. It's already fenced in. Tell the rest of the parents, go hang out. Go have fun. Go talk to each other. Get to know each other. Build your community. Let your kids figure it out. Kids are not you. If you're. I can't imagine what it would be like watching my child slide down a slide every single time.

[Christiana]

It's miserable.

[Trevor Noah]

I would hate them, and I would hate myself. Daddy, look. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Daddy, look again. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Daddy, look again. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, at some point, and I'm not saying that I don't want to see the kids slide ever, but I also want the kid to slide for themselves. I don't want the kids to live in a world where they're only sliding when daddy or mommy's looking. And I also want them to know that, like, you can fall off a slide.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm not gonna catch you. There's gonna be moments where you're gonna fall and you're just gonna hit the ground and you're gonna bump something and you're gonna smack something, and you're gonna come back with, like, a bruise. Do you know how nice it was to go home to your parents? And they go, what happened? Would, like, imagine not having that?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. No, because then we have a story.

[Trevor Noah]

You come home with Christian. I wanted to know something. Like, you. You keep saying postpartum.

[Christiana]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

For everyone.

[Christiana]

Because, I mean, the fourth trimester.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Yeah. I'd love to know.

[Christiana]

For.

[Trevor Noah]

For everyone. You know, for men, but for people who haven't had kids. For. Please, can you break this down? Like, everyone just talks about postpartum, and then sometimes I'll hear people say, postpartum depression. What is postpartum? Like, what is it? Actually?

[Christiana]

It's the immediate period. Yeah. After you've had a child.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Christiana]

After you've given birth. It goes up until. Well, they say, the doctors say it takes two years for your body to be what it was before. And it's never going to be what it was before, but to like, kind of get back to it. And postpartum looks different for everyone, but there's this huge hormonal crash because your body is making all these hormones to grow the baby.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

And then there's this huge crash. And that can mean lots of different things. Your hair falls out. For a lot of women, I always. My hair falls out every time.

[Trevor Noah]

So you, you lose the like or not lose.

[Christiana]

Yeah. Your hair grows in pregnancy. Some of you glowing your nails. And then you have the baby and all of those hormones, like progesterone, everything comes down. And I get horrible night sweats. That's my really gross thing. So in the night, I always have to, I. I have night set so bad my fingers wrinkle and I get shivers, so that wakes me up. And I put on some new pajamas every time. So you get stuff like night sweats, hair falling out, you know, in the immediate period when you're breast. If you're breastfeeding, your breasts get really engorged and they like, breastfeeding can be quite rocky for some people. Your skin changes, obviously, your body changes. All your organs are moving back into position and your uterus is coming down again, you know, because pregnancy moves your, your organs out the way. And then for some women, that involves anxiety, depression coming with the hormones also because the stress, like a newborn is like a very fragile thing. And I think from a completely like evolutionary biology perspective, your job is like, to keep it alive. So it's just like some women get these things called phantom cries. You hear your baby crying even though they're not crying, which happens. Which. Yeah, you're just like, the baby's crying and your husband's like, no, it's not. But it's just like, it's. It's all of these things at once. And all the research shows that women in cultures who are more supportive, supported, have less postpartum anxiety. A big thing that actually helped me this time is our pediatrician. She's an amazing woman called Dr. Priest. She does home visits. So Dr. Priest would come over and weigh Cora and ask any questions at home. At home. Because before I would have to go to a different facility, go see the pediatrician somewhere else. So I think a big part of what helped my postpartum this time, that our pediatrician would come to the house, I'd be in my pajamas, she'd do the exam and then she'd ask me like, how are you doing? She'd just chat, check in, how's breastfeeding go? Oh, you're not sure about the latch. Have you thought about this? Have you thought about. Well, her weight's great. Oh, you know, it's just that having the person that was medically supervised to look after my child was a big part in and her coming to the home, that changed everything. So I didn't have the postpartum anxiety that I typically have had in the past. And I think I had some of the confidence of a third time mum. But you know, postpartum is also a big identity shift because every time you have a baby you do go through that shift. And now it's like a new identity as a mum of three or as the kid at my kids school said, obi's mom, why are you always having babies? Big up to her.

[Trevor Noah]

So like Obi's mom, why are you always having babies?

[Christiana]

And for a lot of women, you don't want to just be known as a mother. You still want to feel like yourself, but you, you have to find a new self every time. And that's very unsettling, you know. So like postpartum is a big thing and I think it's not necessarily recognized, it's not talked about. And there's a lot of shame around it because no one wants to feel like they're weak or they're inadequate, you know, And I still, I still think that's. Even in the most developed societies or more supportive society, we still haven't figured out how to help women in that next life phase.

[Trevor Noah]

And, and that's where I find in traditional cultures, I can speak specifically, like in, in South African ones, a lot of that load is just taken off your shoulders. So, so for instance, one of the big ones is elderly women sort of tell you that you don't know what you're doing. And they're like, it's fine. They don't even give you the whole, like, you're supposed to know what. No, no, no, no, no. They're just like, no, no, bring the kid, bring the baby. You don't know what you're doing. Go sleep, go rest. Yeah, go sleep. And they, then they look after the baby and someone cooks for you and another person does your clothes and they'll like make sure Your clothes are clean and they wash you and they help you and they comb your hair, then they bring the baby back. But the job of elderly women in a lot of, like, South African society and African society as a whole, they'll just be like, no, no, no. Your job was to have the baby. Our job as the village is to help you raise the baby now, but you relax, you go sleep, you almost. I would be. I would be intrigued to find out if anyone who grew up in a very traditional society, if they have phantom cries. Because I feel like if you know that there are other women looking after the baby, I wonder if your brain can, like, actually turn off and go, like, it's fine. They're not crying. And even if they were crying, somebody's there looking after them.

[Christiana]

Yeah. Well, I like for Obi and for Luna, I did a thing called Omogu, which is in igbo culture, the 40 days after you have a baby. My mum came, and my dad, being very modern, also joined my mum for this thing. The first time he did this, I can't believe I'm doing this.

[Trevor Noah]

Women are supposed to do it.

[Christiana]

But he came out and they did all of that. Like, they'd made, like, the pepper soups, and my mom was doing the belly binding and all of that stuff. This time we didn't do it. But, yeah, that whole thing of being really having people around you. There's a TikTok video that's gone super viral of. It's a group of black women. They drive up to their friend's house. They're playing Girl by Destiny's Child, and they're screaming it, and their friend closes the window and shuts the curtains, and they're like, girl, they singing the song. They're like, you need to come outside, and they break down the door. Basically, she was postpartum, and she'd been sending these texts about not feeling too good. And. And they were like, we were gonna. We broke down the door to see her. And I think, like, if you're in a culture where it's not like, South Africa or Nigeria or, like, developing countries where the system is in place, like, your friends need to be willing to, like, break down the door, like, just intrude, you know, like, because in the west, you're so afraid of intruding. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Your personal spaces are overly respectful.

[Christiana]

You know, there's cultures where people just show up to your house here, you.

[Trevor Noah]

Plan, you know, hey, Josh, are you home?

[Christiana]

Yeah. You go to a restaurant here, you don't even go to people's house. I think don't be afraid to intrude in those words like, you good, you good, you good. Because I think most women and men afraid to ask for help. So you have to just, like, do the thing. Don't say, what do you need? Just do a thing.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, we should do. We'll actually have an episode on. We should bring somebody on who, like, specializes on. I mean, the topic of maternity and the cause. I think. I think there's a lot in it that we could enjoy. Because one of the biggest things I've come to realize in having conversations about everything really is you'll be shocked at how many times the thing that you think doesn't affect you completely affects you, you know, so you think, oh, we're talking about pregnancy or postpartum. Most men will go, well, I guess I'm not part of this conversation. But even in the moments we've had here, I think about how many men out there are at an office now stressed out, out of their minds and not figuring out what to do, or emotionally drained because they don't feel like they're showing up for their kid or not understanding how to be supportive to their partner. You know, some men out there, like Josh, are not supporting pregnant women in their lives at all. They're not sticking around for the pregnancy.

[Josh Johnson]

I am doing my best. I am only so involved because it is not my child.

[Christiana]

No.

[Trevor Noah]

But I think we should do it. We should have, like, a full on, you know.

[Christiana]

Okay, I have a question for both of you.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay. Yeah, you had the Josh question. What's the Josh one?

[Christiana]

Do you want kids?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. It's tough because I don't think so. And it used to just be my shortcomings as a person that I felt like I needed to figure out. And then it became a little bit of, like, how the state of the world and everything, which I know is like, here and there, like, it's never gonna be a right time in the world to have a kid or anything. But. Yeah, I guess I still don't know, which is like, you know, like a privilege and a luxury. I definitely feel like I need to figure it out in the next few years because I don't want to be an old dad. You know what I mean? Like, I don't want to be one of those dads that becomes a dad at, like, 55 and then goes to pick up their kid. And other kids are like, what's wrong with your dad? But you know what?

[Christiana]

All the dads now are old dad by the way Josh.

[Josh Johnson]

So I guess it wouldn't be.

[Trevor Noah]

And I will say, you might say old dad. I would say wise dad.

[Christiana]

Wise dad.

[Trevor Noah]

Because I find, like, older parents just carry themselves a little different. They may not be able to run and jump as high.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, that's what I'm worried about is I can't play ball like a wise dad.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. But you know what? A wise dad is more patient with their kid who can't hit the ball.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah, that's what I thought. Yeah, that's fair. Because you also can't hit the ball.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, exactly. Whereas a young dad is still out there being like, well, come on, hit the. Come on. There's still a little too much testosterone. So I don't think. I don't think you've missed. And also, just to the point you said previously, the. The world has never really been in a better place. I'll also say that.

[Josh Johnson]

No, that's fair. And that that's why I.

[Trevor Noah]

We think of it through the lens of like, microplastics. Guys, there was a time when one flu killed your whole family.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Now imagine having a child during that time.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah. I think the reasons keep shifting, but I think when you're so unsure about something, it is a real sink or swim thing. If I'm making a decision that's career wise and I'm very unsure, I'm like, what am I really scared of? Maybe just do it and see what happens. But another person is not to see what happens. And if anything, I've been even more stressed out by my friends who kind of had that attitude where I was like, so when did you know? Or when did you feel? And they were like, oh, oh, what? And don't get me wrong, those people, I think, are actually perfectly good parents. Because I think that they didn't go into it with that. They're probably the ones most likely to go ahead and be like, oh, you'll watch my kid for the afternoon at a park. Oh, that's great. And then you'll find sometimes that the people who are, like, so well thought out and so overly helicopter make some of the most stressed out kids anyway. Cause they're so scared of making a mistake that now the kid is also. Because I don't know anything about having kids. But I imagine those first few years, it's gotta be a little bit like how when you have like a dog and you're clearly nervous, you're making the dog nervous. Because this kid doesn't know what anything is. So they just see you going and Then they're like, okay, is that life, then? Should life be like that? You know?

[Christiana]

So, Trevor, do you want kids?

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, my. Do I want kids? Okay, how would I put it? I don't want kids, but I don't not want kids. Right. I would hope that kids would be the byproduct of something that I'm experiencing. But to have kids.

[Josh Johnson]

Sex.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, man. Oh, But. But to have to. So. So here's. Okay, here's why I'll say this. I have the luxury in that I don't have a body clock like a woman does. So I start with that.

[Christiana]

The second thing is, we'll put a pin in that. That's for another episode.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but I don't. I don't have a body clock in that way. Right. The other thing for me is that when I think of having a kid and I go, like, why do you want a kid? It may be a little too esoteric, but I go, well, I don't want my kid to necessarily have the burden of me wanting them for that reason, to fulfill something in me or to not, you know, like, it's great. I think it's important to not put that on the kid.

[Christiana]

You have ego death already when it comes to.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Like, I don't like it when people do that with kids. You know, they go like, oh, I just want some people be like, they want something to be theirs. They want something to love them. And then the kid doesn't do that. And they. And then you get, like, parents who guilt their kids. Why don't you. Why don't you send your mom there? Oh, I can't believe. You know, I wanted a son who I'd be proud of and, like, what are you doing? What are you doing?

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

I think genuinely, and I know it's not perfect, but I think a kid should be something where you. You go, like, I have so much love to give that man. I just need another human being to pour this into. I just have too much love. I just gotta pour this love and pour this love and pour this love and pour this love out. So I'm neither for nor against kids. The only thing I know is I have never met a person who regrets having children.

[Christiana]

Oh, you haven't?

[Trevor Noah]

Never genuinely. I've never.

[Christiana]

I have.

[Trevor Noah]

But I've met many people who regret when they had a kid, and I've met many people who regret who they had the kid with, but I've never met somebody who regrets the kid themselves. Now, I'm sure there are outliers I'M.

[Christiana]

Sure I get what you mean.

[Trevor Noah]

I've met people who got with somebody, abusive, alcoholic, you. You name it, in every shape and every way, but they will go, ah, but this child. I've met people who had a child and they're struggling financially and their life has really been hard, and their family disowned them because of who they had the kid with. And maybe the person left, whatever it is, they will still go. But this child, oh, man, this child, the person they had it with, they might regret the circumstances. They might regret too young, too busy, too this to this, too that. So in that world, in that way, I just think to myself, I would love to be able to give somebody the greatest gift, which is not just being chosen, but which is being intentional. That's. That's all I'd want. You know, I want the kid. If they ask me like, hey, why am I here? I go like, oh, because I just. I had excess love to give. And so that's, that's why you're here. You know what I mean? I just wanted somebody to love.

[Christiana]

I think you two both make great fathers. And I think this is how she tricks people. No, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I think you make, make great fathers. And maybe one of the sad things about the world is that I have friends that are like child free by choice and they'd make the most brilliant mothers and fathers. And it's often the people that are making the real calculus, who've done that deep spiritual work, who like experience ego death, who make the decision not to be parents, who would make brilliant parents. I agree with Frank, but at the end of the day, I think, think I don't see. I came to a point where I don't see my children as possessions. Maybe this is very Christian mentality. I'm like, you know, a gift from God. God has given me them to kind of guide in this world and uncover who they're supposed to be. But they're not just mine. So I don't think you have to be have children yourself biologically to parent. And I feel like if we had a more expansive view of parenting, that the children around us are our collective responsibility. Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

This is literally.

[Christiana]

No, but it's. Then it's like, it's like, do you want biological children that live in your house? Yeah, that's all it is, the question. But then it's just like, you can have children via other means. And yes, then because I don't. My kids aren't my possessions. I'm just their custodians. I'm here to, like, yeah. Guide them.

[Trevor Noah]

My dream is. And I will also caveat this because I don't want to fall into a Josh Johnson here. But, like, Michael Jackson messed it up. I'll start with that. Cause my dream was always, like, I always wanted to create spaces in my house that would be great for kids that weren't mine. Because I thought it would be fun when my friend's kids come over and they go like, oh, Uncle Trevor's house, and he's got those video games and he's got an arcade machine. And I go like, yeah, this is great for them. You know what I mean? I like the fact that. And people go like, but you don't have kids. I'm like, yes, but there will be children in my life. And I think it is cool that I can facilitate this for them in some way, shape or form. Yeah. But now if you are a grown man with no kids, who has a kid's basement full of things.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

So, yeah.

[Josh Johnson]

What are problems? Yeah. Yeah. But I. I will say, though, one thing, last thing that I think could be helpful. And this is maybe gonna make you take back what you said about me being a good dad. Maybe it's possible. But this, this is, you know, in a co parenting situation, especially a situation where kind of like you said, Trevor, people are like, mm, it shouldn't have been this person, or something like that. I think that one. One, like, sort of olive branch. One thing that you could do is be like, all right, look, let's be honest with each other. As like mom and dad. Let's be honest with each other. You don't really want to be here. Right. But you could help me out. Every time you are here, it's gonna be like a big celebration. It's gonna be like, wow, Dad's here, Paul. Right. But because I'm with the kids almost all the time, you have to tell the kids, hey, if you act up, if you disrespect your mom in any way, I can't come in the house. There's just something. I don't know. It's like. It's like, I w. I wish I could be there. But you. You were mean to your mom.

[Trevor Noah]

Damn, Josh.

[Josh Johnson]

So dang. I can't.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't do that.

[Josh Johnson]

And then. Yeah, now do that.

[Christiana]

But you know what? You'd make like a magical woman.

[Josh Johnson]

No, I wouldn't do that because I would want to be there. But I'm saying, if you already know this person's a deadbeat, they're not going to be there anyway. At least game the system a little bit. Be like, ah, I have to move now. You were so mean to Kiera.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, my God.

[Josh Johnson]

Can you imagine?

[Trevor Noah]

Can you imagine the stress a kid is in?

[Christiana]

Damage, the therapy?

[Trevor Noah]

My dad didn't come because of me. I didn't do it. Yo, but this was fun. Okay, Christiana, congratulations.

[Christiana]

Thank you.

[Trevor Noah]

Congratulations on the third healthy child. This is. Can I say, that's the only thing I like, like, I, you know.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

I don't take for granted the health of a mother. The health of a black mother, by the way. Yeah, it's no joke. Yo, so I'm happy that your baby's healthy. I'm happy that you are healthy. We're here, huh?

[Josh Johnson]

Making more people.

[Christiana]

Like, we're still making the podcast.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. My favorite thing I learned when I was in Bhutan from a monk was he taught me. He said. He said one of the hardest things to learn in life is that there will always be storms, but you will never live a full life unless you realize when you are between storms. So he says, like, the greatest joy in life is just learning to know when you are between storms. Because when you're in a storm, you're in a storm. But when you're not in a storm and you don't realize you're not in a storm, then you're not enjoying the fact that you're not in a storm. And so I'm excited because now with Christiana, we're no longer in a storm. She's not pregnant for a while, and so we get to enjoy that for a minute.

[Christiana]

Not for a while. She's not going to be pregnant again.

[Trevor Noah]

You know what? I will take it as it comes. And if you get pregnant again, we will celebrate it. But for now, we will enjoy this. This was fun, y'all.

[Josh Johnson]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

What Now With Trevor. Trevor Noah is produced by Spotify Studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions. The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Sanaz Yamin and Jodi Avigan. Our senior producer is Jess Hackle. Claire Slaughter is our producer. Music, mixing and mastering by Hannis Brown. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next Thursday for another episode of what Now. This episode is brought to you by National Education Association. NEAs read across America campaign celebrates a nation of diverse readers with recommended books, authors and teaching resources that promote diversity and inclusion. However, certain politicians are banning books with characters representing diverse perspectives and experiences, including books about Martin Luther King and the Trail of Tears. But let's be honest, all students deserve access to diverse, age appropriate books. So help us celebrate and protect the joy of reading for all of America's students. Learn [e-mail].