If I Ruled the World: Creating Chaos with Anele and Sizwe [VIDEO]

Summary

Episode Summary: "If I Ruled the World: Creating Chaos with Anele and Sizwe"

In this thought-provoking episode of "What Now? with Trevor Noah," host Trevor Noah engages in a dynamic conversation with guests Cecil and Anele Mdoda as they explore imaginative scenarios under the premise, "If I Ruled the World." The trio delves into various hypothetical policies, examining their feasibility, potential benefits, and inherent challenges. Here's a comprehensive breakdown of their discussions, enriched with notable quotes and key insights.

---

1. Secret Spouses: Control vs. Being Controlled

The episode kicks off with a light-hearted yet intriguing debate about the complexities of secret relationships.

• Trevor Noah poses a thought-provoking question: "What do you think is worse? Finding out the person you're with has a secret husband or wife? Or being the secret husband or wife." ([00:00])

• Cecil responds passionately, emphasizing the sense of control: "Finding out that they're the secret? Because if you are the secret, you've got control. You're in on it." ([01:01])

• The conversation unfolds to highlight the emotional turmoil involved in deceit versus having agency in the situation.

---

2. Sizwe’s Proposal: Synchronizing Global Elections

The trio transitions to their main theme, exploring what policies they would implement if they ruled the world.

• Sizwe introduces a bold idea: "If I ruled the world, all elections would be at the same time. All countries like, yo, man, elections on this day, same limit terms." ([11:59])

• Trevor Noah draws parallels to sports, illustrating the benefits of synchronized events: "So they realize, no, every game must play at exactly the same time so that you can't play your game based on another game." ([25:52])

• Cecil raises critical concerns about global chaos: "How do you know that everything is going to stabilize at the same time as well? Because each different region is going to come up, come against different resistance." ([16:58])

• Anele Mdoda counters by arguing that synchronized elections could mitigate global inequalities and prevent overburdened prosperous nations: "If we all failing, nobody's going to leave their country because where you going?" ([14:50])

• The discussion touches on historical examples and the potential for simultaneous political shifts to either stabilize or destabilize global relations.

• Ultimately, Trevor and Cecil express skepticism, leading to a no vote on Sizwe’s amendment due to concerns over feasibility and potential for widespread instability.

---

3. Cecil’s Proposal: The 10-Minute Commute Rule

Shifting gears, Cecil presents his vision aimed at revolutionizing urban living and reducing commuting burdens.

• Cecil advocates: "If I ruled the world, everyone would have to live 10 minutes from where they work. Max." ([33:35])

• Trevor Noah probes the practicality: "What are you going to do when your cities and systems grow to the point where it can't sustain?" ([36:37])

• Anele Mdoda highlights logistical challenges, including urban sprawl and transportation capacity: "At some point, the city has to expand. It just cannot go up. So people are now outside of the distance that you've set." ([37:56])

• The trio debates the sustainability of such a policy, considering factors like population growth, economic disparities, and infrastructure limitations.

• Cecil modifies his proposal to focus on eliminating commute costs: "No one should be spending any money to get to work." ([34:56])

• Trevor expresses conditional support for the amended idea, appreciating the sentiment but cautious about implementation: "I vote yes for that. I vote yes for that." ([50:48])

• The episode reaches a consensus where Cecil's adjusted proposal receives tentative approval, highlighting the balance between idealism and practicality.

---

4. Trevor’s Vision: Ministry of Life and Controlled Parenthood

In a daring twist, Trevor Noah unveils his own controversial policy centered around population control and structured parenthood.

• Trevor describes: "We come to the Ministry of Life, and we inseminate you in that process." ([67:17])

• Cecil and Anele vehemently oppose the idea, citing emotional disconnection and ethical dilemmas: "This is horrible... It means well, but this would never work." ([75:04])

• The discussion delves into the moral implications of removing parental choice and the potential psychological impact on both parents and children.

• Anele warns about the erosion of the traditional parent-child bond: _"There's no other reason except the selfish reason. So people speak of legacy...”

• Cecil shares personal insights on the joys and challenges of parenting, emphasizing the irreplaceable emotional bonds: "Parenting is just not fun. It's a lot of stress. It's a lot of anxiety." ([63:02])

• Trevor attempts to defend his stance by arguing for societal benefits, but the majority remains unconvinced, leading to a no vote on his proposal.

---

5. Feasibility and Human Nature: The Crux of Governance

Throughout the episode, the trio grapples with the tension between utopian ideals and the inherent complexities of human nature.

• Trevor acknowledges the challenges: "I worry that if you create a hard rule of 10 minutes from work very quickly, we reach capacity very quickly." ([50:25])

• Anele and Cecil emphasize the unpredictable aspects of human behavior, power dynamics, and societal structures that can undermine well-intentioned policies.

• The conversation underscores the importance of practicality, adaptability, and understanding human motivations in governance.

---

Conclusion: Balancing Ideals with Reality

The episode concludes with a reflection on the delicate balance between visionary policies and their real-world applicability. While ambitious ideas like synchronized elections and optimal commuting are lauded for their intentions, the discussion reveals the intricate challenges involved in their execution. Parenting policies, in particular, highlight the deeply personal and emotional aspects of governance that are difficult to standardize or control.

Notable Quotes:

• Cecil ([01:01]): "Don't ever be the one who gets blindsided."

• Trevor Noah ([16:17]): "This is like speed hiring. After you post your job...you could be talking to people the very next day."

• Anele Mdoda ([14:56]): "There's nothing fun about finding."

• Cecil ([63:12]): "Parenting is just not fun. It's a lot of stress. It's a lot of anxiety."

• Trevor Noah ([65:03]): "I'm saying people will still want to have kids because having children and raising children brings so much meaning and purpose to life."

---

This episode of "What Now? with Trevor Noah" masterfully navigates the realms of hypothetical governance, challenging both guests and listeners to ponder the complexities of implementing idealistic policies in a nuanced and imperfect world. The engaging dialogue, enriched with humor and critical analysis, offers valuable insights into the interplay between visionary ideas and practical realities.

Transcript

[Trevor Noah]

This message is a paid partnership with Apple Card. Here's one reason I think Apple Card is good for your wallet. It's designed to support your financial well being. It's a no fee credit card that offers smart payment suggestions to help you pay off your balance faster. Plus, you can get daily cash back on every purchase every day so you can stress less about money and focus more on enjoying life. Apply for Apple Card in the Wallet app on your iPhone today subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City Branch. Variable APRs for Apple Card range from 18.24% to 28.49% based on creditworthiness rates as of January 1, 2025. Terms and [e-mail] okay, what do you think is worse? Finding out the person you're with has a secret husband or wife? Or being the secret husband or wife.

[Cecil]

Finding out that they're the secret? Because if you are the secret, you've got control. You're in on it. You're in control, huh? Yeah. Don't ever be the one who gets blindsided. Now you think, wait, you'd rather be the secret? Yeah, there's power in that. The one that's the secret has got the choice. Has got the choice to not be the secret.

[Trevor Noah]

But they don't.

[Cecil]

The one that is, that is none the wiser. All of their choices have been taken away.

[Trevor Noah]

You might never know. I would. I always think to myself, it would be nice to be at a funeral and find things out. You know, you hear these stories of people where they're at a funeral and they found the person they've been married with to forever, right? And then at the funeral they meet another family and they're like, oh, who are you? We've never met you. And they go, we're the family. And they're like, no, no, we're the family. And then it becomes. I think that's nice because it's nice to like. Because think about a funeral, you feel like it's the end of your journey. But now it's nice to be like, there's like a spin of seriousness.

[Cecil]

There's nothing fun. There's nothing fun about finding.

[Trevor Noah]

It's better than a person just dying.

[Anele Mdoda]

Guys, no, no, I'd rather my dad dies. And then we go. And then we all. The one family going there and also one family coming back. That's it.

[Trevor Noah]

Wouldn't you rather have like, new siblings now? New everything?

[Cecil]

Because, guys, the one that was the secret, you're selfish.

[Trevor Noah]

That's your problem. You're selfish.

[Cecil]

The one that's the secret I want.

[Trevor Noah]

To spin off Series this is what now with Trevor Noah this episode is brought to you by US Bank. They don't just cheer you on, they help every move count. With U.S. bank's smartly checking and savings account to help you track your spending and grow your savings, your finances can go further. Because when you have the right partner on your side, there's no limit to what you can achieve. That's the power of us. Visit usbank.com today to learn more. Member FDIC Copyright 2025 U.S. bank this episode is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. Speed is key when it comes to a lot of different things. Sports, transit, scoring big deals on your summer vacation plans before they expire. When it comes to hiring for your business, you also want to move fast. And luckily for you, I know exactly how to make that Happen. Just use Zip Intro. It's ZipRecruiter's newest tool that helps speed up the hiring process, connecting you with top talent sooner. Try it for free right [e-mail] Trevor Zip intro is kind of like speed dating. After you post your job and what you're looking for, it'll find and schedule candidates for you to speak to. You could be talking to people the very next day. Just pick a time and. And Zip Intro will take care of the rest. Enjoy the benefits of speed hiring with the new Zip Intro tool only from ZipRecruiter rated the number one hiring site based on G2. Try Zip Intro for free at ZipRecruiter.com Trevor again, that's. Ziprecruiter.com Trevor Zip Intro post jobs today. Talk to qualified candidates tomorrow.

[Cecil]

Check how good this thing smells.

[Anele Mdoda]

What is it?

[Cecil]

It's.

[Anele Mdoda]

Oh, the thing.

[Trevor Noah]

What's that? My hand lotion.

[Cecil]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, I'm doing it.

[Cecil]

Jesus, this is amazing.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm doing it.

[Cecil]

I smell like.

[Trevor Noah]

Is this just an excuse for you just trying to show us your ring?

[Anele Mdoda]

That is funny.

[Cecil]

I don't need any excuse.

[Trevor Noah]

I've noticed since marriage you've taken like the amount of hand gestures you do.

[Cecil]

Rubbish. Rubbish. I always spoke with my hands.

[Trevor Noah]

No, you see, you spoke like that with your hands. You've been with me for how many years. You've never complimented my hand cream. And then now you're like, oh, the hand cream. Smell it.

[Anele Mdoda]

Move like you've just scrubbed in.

[Trevor Noah]

Smell it. Smell it, please.

[Cecil]

It's a good day to save lives, people.

[Trevor Noah]

Congratulations. Thank.

[Cecil]

Do you know how to Say, you.

[Trevor Noah]

Know, we haven't been on the podcast since you've been married.

[Cecil]

Oh, yes. No. What I was thinking when I was on my way here is that you basically have a podcast all around me. Because the first time was when I was turning 40.

[Trevor Noah]

That's true.

[Cecil]

And then the second time was when my movie was nominated for an Oscar.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

And now I'm engaged. This is the what now? Podcast. Thanks to Anel. Write me my check.

[Trevor Noah]

So how does it feel to be a wife?

[Cecil]

I'm like spoiled, I'm pampered. It's nice. I do nothing, which is great.

[Trevor Noah]

Cuz I'll be the other way around.

[Cecil]

No, yeah, that's what they, that's what they try to sell us women. That yeah, you must cook, you must clean. Uhuh, none of that. The real marriage is it's the man that does everything.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, so you don't cook anymore?

[Cecil]

I do cook, but that's all I need to do.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, okay.

[Cecil]

Like absolutely all I need to do.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Cuz I was going to be like you. Not cooking is a, a bit of.

[Cecil]

Bit of punishment for me especially.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but for everyone. No, but for everyone. Just as like a concept now. Now I have like a vested interest in destroying your marriage.

[Cecil]

No, don't do that.

[Trevor Noah]

No, I'm saying if you didn't cook. I'm saying if you didn't cook.

[Cecil]

Okay. No, I promise you, it's so nice to find a partner. Like I've literally found an equal. Like he's my partner. He's like, he's my dude. He's my guy.

[Trevor Noah]

That's amazing.

[Cecil]

Yeah. I feel so protected and safe and it's just the entire thing also because he's the one person in the world that I don't have to convince to be on my side. Oh, he's automatically, he's automatically, automatically on my side. But. Well, in public. But if we get home.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no. That's the whole point of a relationship.

[Cecil]

And then he feels like, ah, babe.

[Trevor Noah]

In public you say, yeah, I'm with you, I'm with you, I'm with you. And then when you go, yes. It's the opposite of Elon Musk and Donald Trump.

[Cecil]

Oh yeah, no, totally.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. They were supposed to do it if they were married. They'd do it the other way around.

[Cecil]

They just went together too many places. That's another thing that I've realized.

[Trevor Noah]

That's how every relationship ends.

[Cecil]

Exactly. There's no ways that you guys can beat. I mean, every time we saw Donald Trump, Elon Musk was there. That relationship. That's gon.

[Trevor Noah]

How have you been, Cesar? Are you married?

[Anele Mdoda]

Maybe.

[Cecil]

And you know what? It's so plausible that Cecil would get married and tell none of us.

[Trevor Noah]

He would do that.

[Cecil]

And. And he does this every now and then on social media where people. He's like, yeah, I was sitting with my wife and kids. And then people have a meltdown. Cause every, every woman in the country is hoping to be Cesar's wife and kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, have you actually done this?

[Anele Mdoda]

What? Marriage.

[Trevor Noah]

Say like I'm sitting with my wife and kids and then.

[Anele Mdoda]

Oh, sometimes, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Huh. Why do you do that?

[Anele Mdoda]

Because maybe I'm married. What is this? Sometimes I'll be chilling with my wife and she'll be like, yo, teat that. And then one day I want to show my kids the tea to be like when they're old enough.

[Cecil]

Look at these guys.

[Trevor Noah]

Your wedding's gonna be the first wedding I've ever attended.

[Cecil]

I know that.

[Trevor Noah]

Ever in my life.

[Cecil]

I know that. And this is.

[Trevor Noah]

Are there any tips?

[Anele Mdoda]

I should get a wedding, though?

[Trevor Noah]

Say again?

[Anele Mdoda]

You've worked at a wedding.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but that's not attending a wedding. A lot of people work at weddings, bruh. Okay, imagine if people serving food are like, oh, this is my fourth wedding I've attended. No, bruh, you work at the wedding.

[Cecil]

And my mashed potatoes cold.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes. You don't work. You don't attend a wedding if you're working at a wedding. I've never attended a wedding ever in my life. Is there anything I should know beforehand? Are there things I should or shouldn't do?

[Cecil]

No, you, you. I mean, you'll be fine, Trevor. You've been to the Oscars and the Grammys, I think.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but that's not the same.

[Cecil]

Are you sure?

[Trevor Noah]

Oh goodness, here we go.

[Anele Mdoda]

Oh boy.

[Cecil]

Do you panic when you have to go to events like that? Because a little bit of me is panicked for you.

[Trevor Noah]

Why?

[Cecil]

Because of people. And I. And I know my people and I love my people. But you must realize something else about a wedding is that those are not all.

[Trevor Noah]

They're not all your people.

[Cecil]

My people?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. So, you know, it's funny you say that. So part of the reason I've never been to weddings is because I work too much. The other reason is people don't invite me to their weddings or people uninvite me because I are me. So multiple brides have said we don't want Trevor at our wedding.

[Cecil]

Cuz you can't have two brides.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, there you have it.

[Cecil]

Look he's already. He's already out here wearing the bridal gala. I mean, come on.

[Trevor Noah]

No, literally. People have said to me, they go, so then the husband will have to come and tell me, hey, man, we're getting married. I'm. Oh, congrats. When's the. And they're like, yeah, that's why I'm here, to tell you. She asked that you don't come and I'll be friends with both of them. And she's like, yeah, I just don't want Trevor there.

[Cecil]

And you know what? People don't understand? I have a hard rule that I do not take photos at weddings with people. Right. Because it's all about the couple. Please leave me out.

[Trevor Noah]

No selfies.

[Cecil]

No selfies.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Cecil]

Would you.

[Trevor Noah]

Would you be offended if I came in a disguise?

[Cecil]

No, I'd actually be quite entertained because.

[Trevor Noah]

I was thinking about this the other day. Michael Jackson used to go out.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

In full prosthetic makeup. And I was like, maybe I'll come as, like, an old man from somewhere. Just, like, make it interesting.

[Cecil]

And then when people say, where's Trevor? He's here.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. You just go like, he's here. You didn't see him. He's here.

[Cecil]

I'll just put you at my dad's table.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. And I'll just be like. I can just be like some old man from. I've known her for many years. So exciting.

[Cecil]

What a wife. What a wonderful time.

[Trevor Noah]

And they're like, who is this guy? I'll just be like, the life of the party.

[Anele Mdoda]

That's a good idea.

[Trevor Noah]

I'll be the life of the party.

[Cecil]

And then watch as the evening progresses.

[Anele Mdoda]

No reveal.

[Cecil]

No reveal.

[Trevor Noah]

No reveal. I just rolled through your party actually. Jean Manuel. Oh, yes. I've known Anle for many years, but.

[Cecil]

Do you not want to be seated around your friends? I do, but then people are going to be like, who's the random guy with kayak?

[Trevor Noah]

Jean Manuel. We've known him for years. That's all you got to say. You are one of those people where no one will wonder why you know a random French person.

[Cecil]

This is true.

[Trevor Noah]

You've traveled the world.

[Cecil]

This is very true.

[Trevor Noah]

You're close friends.

[Anele Mdoda]

There's shame. There's a poor French person who's going to get accosted at the wedding. Now even I'm gonna be taking pictures of this guy, and he's gonna be like, guys. Oh, no.

[Cecil]

And then.

[Anele Mdoda]

Trevor. Trevor.

[Trevor Noah]

Ah, Trevor. Let's have a picture. Trevor. Ah, Trevor. Don't be like that.

[Cecil]

Sean Manuel. Oh, boy.

[Anele Mdoda]

Man, it's gonna be crazy.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, the reason I invited you here, my friends, is I realized the other day we've never played a game of if I ruled the world together.

[Cecil]

If I rule the world, how does it work?

[Trevor Noah]

Yes. You know what? I knew you're going to want, like, the rules, and I'm going to have to break them down for you. Anele will just play the game because you're a normal human being. Sizwe is a robot. So I have to explain this to you. It's if I ruled the world. But don't think of it as like a. It's not like a. It's magic, but it's not magic, okay? It's a thought exercise.

[Anele Mdoda]

So it does need to make sense.

[Trevor Noah]

It's the whole. It's better if it doesn't make sense. But your motives need to make sense. And what you're trying to do is convince the other two people that your idea of the world should be implemented because you justify it. Do you get what I'm saying?

[Anele Mdoda]

100%. Sizwe go, if I rule the world, all elections would be at the same time. All countries like, yo, man, elections on this day, same limit terms. And we all go to elections and we vote and then we roll.

[Trevor Noah]

Huh?

[Anele Mdoda]

There's more to this. I can add to it as we progress, but that's a starting point.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so if you ruled the world, everyone in the world would have their elections on the exact same day. Yes, exact same time. Basically, you'd be.

[Anele Mdoda]

Terms would be aligned.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Cecil]

My question then, even countries that don't have elections, you would say.

[Anele Mdoda]

Well, so, you know, you laugh. But she raises a very good point. Random question.

[Trevor Noah]

That was so great.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, no, no, you raise a very good point. So when everybody else has elections.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

Countries like North Korea, Faso, you just load your gun. That's the day you load your guns. Okay, so if your. Your exchange of power happens via violence, you're getting popping off that day.

[Cecil]

Judging how they elect their leader, but you just want it to happen at the same time.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, but wait, why?

[Anele Mdoda]

So that the person who comes into power comes to power with every other person and then you guys lead in unison.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, I like the idea, but I'm worried about a few things. Okay, first of all, do you not worry that if we do this, you could create a world where everything goes wrong at the same time? Cause think, okay, let's look at the world right now.

[Anele Mdoda]

Right?

[Trevor Noah]

So Donald Trump won the election before Donald Trump won most or many countries in the World were swinging. Right? Right. So in Canada, they were leaning right. The right wing party was gonna win all over Europe. Right wing parties were gonna, like, this was everywhere. It was, you know, people were leaning right. Donald Trump wins, starts playing with the economy.

[Anele Mdoda]

He's playing right into my trap.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, okay. No, why are you setting traps?

[Anele Mdoda]

What kind of friendship trapping is not a trap?

[Trevor Noah]

So anyway, but no, no, no. But now. So everyone. And then what happened was people went, actually, wait, we don't want that. Yes, we don't want that. So we're not gonna vote that way. And then Canada flipped the other way. Right. So the Liberal Party won. And then around the world, this started happening in other places. I think Australia had a similar outcome. So aren't you worried that if everyone votes at the same time, everything can go wrong at the same time?

[Anele Mdoda]

So you're 100% correct. That would happen, or that does have a potential to happen. Right. But that's actually not a bad thing. That's a good thing. In fact, it's one of the mitigating factors of disaster because the greatest risk is inequality. Some of the greatest countries actually fail because they do so well while other countries are doing so poorly that people flock to these great countries. Then these countries get burdened. Health care. Everything really starts to fail because everybody's going there. If we all failing, nobody's going to leave their country because where you going?

[Cecil]

Every zone must be a war zone. Right.

[Anele Mdoda]

And then that doesn't necessarily have to be war, but if the economy is tanking, it's tanking everywhere. I'm telling you, there's gonna be no 46 refugees going to us.

[Trevor Noah]

Because everyone's a refugee.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, everybody's gonna stay at home and pull their own weight. Where are we going? Let's just speak.

[Cecil]

No, I don't think that argument holds water because then I'd still go, want to go somewhere else for better weather?

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay, yeah, you can go for better weather.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. But refugees don't travel for better weather. I don't know. Okay, I understand.

[Cecil]

Africans have changed.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

Let's take the definition of refugees.

[Trevor Noah]

South Africans really have changed the definition of refugees because before this, refugees only went to another country because, like, they had to and they had no life.

[Cecil]

And their bags didn't have wheels. Our refugees, they were dragging their luggage.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, normally refugees have baggage, not luggage. This is very different. So, yes, I hear what you're saying, but I, I, I don't think people will travel for weather. But I do think Anila is right about places still being Better than other places.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah. So places will inherently be better than others.

[Trevor Noah]

But you want to tank it all at once or win all at once.

[Anele Mdoda]

Well, the idea is not to tank anything. The idea is actually to progress all at once. Because now, here's my idea of the leadership. Right.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, go.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's essentially the avengers of each region. Let's speak about Africa. Maybe to start off with, when you look at the liberation of Africa from colonialism, obviously get staggered, but majority of the good times happen between 1955 to, like, maybe 1965. Right.

[Trevor Noah]

This is the good times for Africans or for the colonial powers?

[Anele Mdoda]

No, for Africans.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Anele Mdoda]

That's when most. But if you look at the people that were at the helm of leadership at the time, you had the Kwame Nkrumahs, for example, in Ghana, you had Julius Nyerere in Tanzania, you had Kenneth Kaund in Zambia, you had all those people, I mean, Otambo even, who wasn't in South Africa, but working for the ANC stationed in Lusaka. Right. You need people to think in a similar fashion and then to help each other along the way, like, yo, man, let's do this, let's do that. Because it doesn't help for a Trevor to be like, okay, I'm holding down South Africa. Things are maybe going okay here. And then Anele is busy messing things up in Kenya.

[Cecil]

But how do you know that everything is going to stabilize at the same time as well? Because each different region is going to come up, come against different resistance.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, 100%. It won't stabilize at the same time, but you will start working towards the goal at round about the same time.

[Trevor Noah]

And I do think there is some merit to this, because if you think about every conflict and every negotiation that happens around the world, many of them are thrown off by a regime change at the wrong time. Right. So Israel, Palestine's a good example. Some of the most progress they ever made was thrown off by an Israeli election. That all of a sudden there was a new leader who was like, actually, everything you were agreeing to, I don't care about it. And we're starting again. Trump is a great example, as America was, you know, Joe Biden was like, I'm doing this, I'm doing. And then even the other way, by the way, you know, when Joe Biden came in after Trump, it throws everything off.

[Cecil]

But what's to say that every. It doesn't matter about the timing, that we're all getting a new leader at the same time? Maybe I come in and I don't agree with what has been happening in this country.

[Trevor Noah]

But what Caesar's saying is that you don't agree, but Caesar's saying you don't agree at the same time, at least.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

We all.

[Anele Mdoda]

And also we just have elections. It's not to say that just because we had elections, we're going to change. We may have elections that decide we're keeping Anele for another five years or however long the term is. Right. Also, your people get to decide. So the majority wins, but winner takes all, like the electoral college. Right. So even if you win by 51, now you've got to be a dictator. The other 49 can.

[Trevor Noah]

This is what you're adding to your thing.

[Cecil]

Yeah, that I agree with.

[Anele Mdoda]

Wow. Yeah.

[Cecil]

Now. Now you've got my attention.

[Anele Mdoda]

So if you win by 51. Yeah, now everybody's got to roll with you. There's none of this. Every time you got to put this thing to a referendum. You lost, bro. So now take your. L swallow these stones. Let's go.

[Trevor Noah]

Hmm.

[Cecil]

Sometimes, and I think this is South Africa, at times, that we just do need a little bit of a dictatorship goal. Just a little one. Not a big one. Not a big one.

[Anele Mdoda]

It works exactly that way.

[Cecil]

Not a big one.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm watching this picture of the true of you being like, come on, Trevor. Just a little dictatorship. Come on. Just a tip. So you are all in on an election on one day, and the winners take it all.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

I just want to throw one thing here just to confirm before I vote on your measure, do the winners in your system have the right to say that there's no more elections going forward?

[Anele Mdoda]

No.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, okay, okay, okay. No. What's the main thing that you think this will fix, though?

[Anele Mdoda]

The progress will move a lot quicker and it'll fix the idea of progress. Well, not necessarily progress, but the timing issue. A lot of what we have is also just the timing issue, which you've already mentioned.

[Trevor Noah]

Countries starting at the. At a different time. Wrong time.

[Anele Mdoda]

100%.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Yeah. We don't get to start our negotiations at the same time.

[Anele Mdoda]

And also, here's one very important factor that people don't consider. Each era requires a different type of leadership.

[Cecil]

But then who decides that it is now time for a different type of leadership?

[Anele Mdoda]

So I can only give you the opportunity. The people actually decide. So what will happen is, on aggregates, the people who elect the people that they think they need the most, then I'll say, okay, this country has decided this country can go left, that country can go right, but they're all gonna go wherever they need to go at that time.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm not. You know, when you started, I. I was a solid. No, but you are. No, no. I mean, look, sense is the one thing you always make. The thing I worry most about is, like, feasibility, but sense. Yes.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, no, it's not feasible.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, you're going to be the first person who's ever argued against themselves. Let's go on myself out of the W. Let's go. Let's go.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay. So if you look at game theory.

[Cecil]

Game theory.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes. Basically, there are certain models that help us determine what human behavior is likely to tell us and do. Right. So I'll use the stack theory for one. If us three decide that we're going to go hunting and we can either go hunting for a stag, if we get a stag, we are all going to eat.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

So much so that we're going to be full and there's going to be meat left over. But the tools for us to be able to hunt a stag are very particular tools. When we leave the house, we need to decide we take stag tools or we can all go hunt for rabbits. Now, we, all three of us need to contribute to be able to get the stag. But if you want to go hunt a rabbit, you can do it by.

[Cecil]

Yourself and you eat it by yourself.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah. You almost guarantee that you will catch a rabbit if you go hunt for a rabbit.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Anele Mdoda]

But a rabbit will just feed you for maybe half a day. Then you go catch another rabbit. But if we decide we get a stag and we catch a stag. Wow. We going to be chilling.

[Trevor Noah]

It's bountiful.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

And so what does game theory suggest? What happens?

[Anele Mdoda]

We all. We all start from different houses and. And we can't communicate which tools we're going to take. We agree.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

That we're going to go hunt for a stag. Then you go sleep at home. While you're sleeping, Trevor goes, I don't know Caesar's really going to hunt for a stag with me because if I just go and hunt for a rabbit, I'm guaranteed I'm going to eat. However, if I think we're hunting for a stag and Caesar doesn't play with me, we all going to starve.

[Cecil]

We're all going to starve.

[Anele Mdoda]

Humans, because they act in their own best interest, will most likely all go for a rabbit.

[Trevor Noah]

But is that true, though? Is that how society, if you think about it, right, think of tribes, think of cultures, think of everything that goes against game theory in a way.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, we hopeful. So again, between us three, you may take it for a given that we'll all go hunt for a stag.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

But obviously there's emotions involved with us. We're all friends. If I say I'm gonna bring another guy, we don't know he's a part of us now.

[Cecil]

Now you, now there's a problem, you see.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

Cause it's a trust thing.

[Trevor Noah]

It is a trust thing. It's a trust. But this is what I'm saying.

[Anele Mdoda]

That's how society works.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but now let's bring it back to. So why do you think that'll hurt your voting system?

[Anele Mdoda]

Because inevitably it means that this system will break down at some point.

[Trevor Noah]

And what do you think will break down in it?

[Anele Mdoda]

As the monarch may give an instruction and these prime ministers or presidents may go against my instruction.

[Trevor Noah]

No, you rule the world.

[Anele Mdoda]

Is.

[Trevor Noah]

You're thinking too hard.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, but they may go actually.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no, no.

[Cecil]

You rule the world.

[Trevor Noah]

You can't doubt yourself, bro.

[Cecil]

Look at Royal.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, no, I'm not doubting myself. I'm doubting humans actually. I know it's not convinced yet.

[Cecil]

I'm not, I'm absolutely not convinced. You are starting to make sense now about humans acting in self interest.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Cecil]

And this is why I don't think your theory would work is because sooner or later people like power. No one's going to want to let go of power regardless of what other countries are doing. And actually that's when we will start fighting with other countries. That's how world wars happen. Because we just start fighting other countries because we don't agree on how we should all be doing things.

[Anele Mdoda]

So tell me, how do you think you can work with this? Because I've also got another way to mitigate this idea.

[Cecil]

I can't work with it. It doesn't work at all.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay, to say it doesn't work at all. Come on.

[Cecil]

No, it doesn't work.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but wait, but wait, wait, wait.

[Cecil]

Even the broadcaster in me is like, CNN can't keep up with all these elections at the same time.

[Trevor Noah]

C But that's a good thing.

[Cecil]

What do you mean that's a good thing?

[Trevor Noah]

We don't care about the broadcasters. This is about democracy. We're like, I, I can't believe that you literally just went, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Anele Mdoda]

And if anything, I know that the.

[Trevor Noah]

World is at stake. But guys, what about cnn?

[Cecil]

Yes, you literally brought cnn.

[Trevor Noah]

You brought CNN up. I'm talking about the fate of the.

[Cecil]

World yes, because somebody has to report on it. Guys.

[Trevor Noah]

No. Why?

[Cecil]

Because somebody has to know what's happening.

[Trevor Noah]

Why?

[Cecil]

How are these countries?

[Trevor Noah]

Nobody will get it.

[Anele Mdoda]

Let me get it. No, but you know who covered these elections? Who? They'll be covered locally.

[Cecil]

Yes, by who?

[Anele Mdoda]

But by the 947 of the world.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but guys. But guys, also, we are people.

[Cecil]

You have to know what's happening in the other countries these way.

[Trevor Noah]

No, you don't. Actually. You can just text each other.

[Anele Mdoda]

This is a beauty. This is the beauty of the system. Every country takes care of its own.

[Trevor Noah]

You know what Cesar is doing.

[Cecil]

Yes, but how would you know if the other countries are sticking to the rules?

[Trevor Noah]

So, Anele, can I tell you what Cesar is doing? As you both know, I'm a big fan of football, as Americans say, soccer. And on the final day of the Premier League in England, a lot of leagues do this around the world. What they started doing is they started saying that every game on the final day is played at the exact same time. So every other week, games are staggered so that you can watch all the games and you can see who won who. Oh, and then you play the next game. But what they realized at some point was on the final day, there are teams who will play a certain way because they already know a result has gone in a direction that suits them. Oh, you see? So they will go. If we win this game, our rivals who are playing another game actually benefit. So we should lose this game to hurt our rivals because they're in a lower position on the table than we are. So then they realize, no, every game must play at exactly the same time so that you don't know how your fate is gonna affect the other or be affected by the other.

[Cecil]

Bookies must hate that.

[Trevor Noah]

I mean, I think they love it, actually, because it's chaos. Bookies love chaos. Right. But the thing it's done to Cesar's point is it's made it that everyone just has to focus on their game. You can't play your game based on another game. And so what Cesar's basically saying is you shouldn't have your election in your country based on another country. And in fact, let's be honest, let's think about it. America has an outsized influence on other countries elections, but they don't really have an outsized influence on the effect inside your country. Do you get what I'm saying? There are many countries in the world who will vote a certain way because of the vibe that America's putting out. And that may not be in the best interests of the country. If they voted blindly, an example, you won't be able to like, oh, we saw what happened with Brexit. What do we think in Amer? No, it's like it's all happening at once. We all walk out of our doors the next day and we're like, how you did that? And now we're in. Okay, so that's what he's saying.

[Anele Mdoda]

Any more questions? No, because I've got so many more answers.

[Trevor Noah]

I mean, I don't know.

[Cecil]

How long have you been thinking about this?

[Trevor Noah]

About ruling the world? Wakes up every day thinking this. Every single day. Cesar asked himself, he goes like, why don't I rule the world? That's what he asks himself every day when he wakes up.

[Cecil]

That's what he's asking ChatGPT.

[Trevor Noah]

That's every day.

[Cecil]

Why don't I rule the world?

[Anele Mdoda]

You know, I still don't have ChatGPT.

[Cecil]

Really?

[Trevor Noah]

I believe that because you are ChatGPT. Why would an AI use an AI?

[Anele Mdoda]

I've always felt like it's cheating.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, because you're an AI.

[Anele Mdoda]

Just. Yo, man, what happens to intrinsic knowledge? Just work with what you got, bro. No, bro, but people are doping now.

[Cecil]

Where did you get it, this knowledge?

[Trevor Noah]

From a book. Yeah, but this is like a book.

[Cecil]

So that's ChatGPT.

[Anele Mdoda]

But it's not an open book test.

[Trevor Noah]

See this guy?

[Cecil]

That's life, bro.

[Anele Mdoda]

Study before the test.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't get distracted by this guy. Are you ready to vote?

[Cecil]

No.

[Trevor Noah]

So we're voting. I vote for Sizwe's amendment.

[Anele Mdoda]

Do I get to vote?

[Trevor Noah]

No, you.

[Cecil]

You.

[Trevor Noah]

You can't vote.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm gonna be a stalemate then.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, then you lose. That's how it works on this show.

[Anele Mdoda]

You didn't say that. Is that your I rule the world?

[Trevor Noah]

No, that's how it works.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, man.

[Trevor Noah]

No, that is exactly.

[Cecil]

How can I tell you? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm. I'm pretty. I just need more explanations. Maybe just like on a granular.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay, explain to me how this idea is worse than what we currently have.

[Trevor Noah]

She wants CNN to be able to cover. You lost Anele. When you said CNN can't cover elections, the broadcaster in her got so hurt.

[Cecil]

It's cause you. You make it seem like it's going to be so easy. Things are gonna happen and then it's gonna be smooth sailing. But as we've seen with countries and elections, it is really the most tumultuous time of any country.

[Trevor Noah]

McJ wants it. Tumultuous all at once.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm not saying everything is gonna be solved by this. I'm just saying it's just a better system than what we currently have. That's all it is. I'm not saying we're not gonna solve every problem with this. Dude, there are plenty of problems. But it definitely is an improvement from what we have.

[Trevor Noah]

Caesar's basically saying, you know, sometimes you go to a party and then people get drunk at different times in the night. She's just like, everyone's getting drunk at the same time. Okay, you're all getting wasted at the. If there's a fight, everyone's fighting.

[Cecil]

I hate that I'm now convinced, using.

[Anele Mdoda]

A drunk theory, because she knows there's gonna be. There's gonna be a moment where there's peak enjoyment for everybody.

[Trevor Noah]

Or peak chaos. Yeah, because you see, the other argument is if you go to a party and people get staggered, it is nice to have a few sober people to be like, hey, man, you've had too much. And then other people to be drunk and make the party move. That's where Anele is.

[Anele Mdoda]

But hold on. So let me explain that. Right? So let's go. Let's say it goes peak chaos.

[Cecil]

Yeah, right.

[Anele Mdoda]

You know what's worse than peak chaos? Staggered chaos.

[Trevor Noah]

You think so?

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes. Try to break up a fight here, and then as soon as you're done breaking up this fight, then another one breaks out. Then another one breaks out. Rather, there's one huge fight, then when the guys are done, you go, okay, now let's go clean the blood.

[Cecil]

So when. When everyone has killed each other.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, essentially, because that's each other. That is peak chaos.

[Anele Mdoda]

Guys, it's not possible for everybody to kill each other.

[Cecil]

Okay, One, if anything, this theory just.

[Anele Mdoda]

Gets better and better.

[Trevor Noah]

I might want to go back and change it.

[Cecil]

I'm voting against it. I'm voting against it.

[Trevor Noah]

All right.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, sorry, but why are you voting against it?

[Cecil]

No, exactly. That the weak die.

[Anele Mdoda]

Oh, you've got an allegiance to weakness now? Is that what you're saying?

[Cecil]

No, but I'm just saying that you cannot have a chaotic system everywhere in the world. So everywhere there's, it's like there's war everywhere, there's fighting.

[Anele Mdoda]

But you. That's a worst case scenario. It will never happen like that.

[Cecil]

No, but that's not how the game works. You can't be like, well, you know, on the best case scenario, it's unlikely.

[Anele Mdoda]

To happen like that. Because this theory is based on majority ruling. Generally, people are scared of the majority, yes.

[Cecil]

But once again, the majority themselves can also fight amongst each other. So you thinking that just because the majority rules and it's going to be fine, nothing's going to happen, but now, once we're done winning, and now we are the 51% that then becomes 100% in charge of everything, we're going to start fighting inside that 51% because inherently, humans want power.

[Trevor Noah]

Sounds like you're still a no.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, wait, forget. You still haven't explained to me how the status quo is better at mitigating that than my system though.

[Cecil]

As in what's currently happening now?

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Cecil]

No, that wasn't my job to explain that. I know, I know things are not going well, but your system is definitely not better.

[Trevor Noah]

Sorry.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's way better.

[Trevor Noah]

Sorry, siswe. This is how it works.

[Anele Mdoda]

You're a hater. But it's fine.

[Trevor Noah]

All that matters.

[Anele Mdoda]

Single anele would have voted for this.

[Cecil]

No.

[Trevor Noah]

Wow.

[Cecil]

Just changed. It's changed. Okay. Shit's changed.

[Trevor Noah]

All right. Okay, well. Cesar, I'm sorry. I'm familiar with the feeling you have right now. I. I've never won. And if I ruled the world.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, because your ideas were just horrible.

[Trevor Noah]

Who's the hater now?

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm just saying.

[Cecil]

Wow, my ideas are great.

[Trevor Noah]

We're gonna continue this conversation right after this short break. This episode is brought to you by Uber. You know that feeling when someone shows up for you just when you need it most? That's what Uber is all about. It's not just a ride or dinner at your door. It's how Uber helps you show up for the moments that matter. Because showing up can turn a tough day around or make a good one even better. Like running late, breakup, ice cream, ex, texting, intervention, cram session, snacks, job firing, commiserations, birthday, surprise squad, concert buddy duty, granny's birthday, or just Taco Tuesdays. Whatever it is, big or small, Uber is on the way. So you can be on your own way to what matters most to you. Uber on our way. This message is a paid partnership with Apple Card. Here's one reason I think Apple Card is good for your wallet. It's designed to support your financial well being. It's a no fee credit card that offers smart payment suggestions to help you pay off your balance faster. Plus, you can get daily cash back on every purchase every day. So you can stress less about money and focus more on enjoying life. Apply for Apple Card in the Wallet app on your iPhone today. Subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City Branch Variable APRs for Apple Card range from 18.24% to 28 point based on creditworthiness rates as of January 1, 2025 terms and [e-mail].

[Anele Mdoda]

Let'S hear yours.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Cecil]

If I ruled the world, I have to actually have two and I always have two. So the upper.

[Trevor Noah]

I'll just pick your best one.

[Cecil]

Okay. My best one. If I ruled the world, everyone, and I mean everyone would have to live 10 minutes from where they work. Max. Max.

[Trevor Noah]

10 minutes. By car, by train, by bus, by walking by.

[Cecil]

By everything. So I find that every single country has to have such a great public service transport system.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Cecil]

That it doesn't matter where you. Where you work, but you have to live 10 minutes away.

[Trevor Noah]

Have to live 10 minutes. So no one can live more than 21 2.

[Cecil]

That's. That's really up to you. But I just feel that life would be easier if. If everyone's commute to work was shorter.

[Anele Mdoda]

I mean, I'm with you.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but now you're giving us like a system.

[Cecil]

Oh much so theory makes sense, but.

[Anele Mdoda]

It'S not practical at all.

[Cecil]

Oh really?

[Trevor Noah]

But I want to know. Wait, wait, wait. I want to know more. The whys. Let's, let's go to the wise before we, before we. So why.

[Cecil]

Because I find that most people and, and this is obviously not the high echelon that can take helicopters to work.

[Trevor Noah]

Right.

[Cecil]

Well done to them. But I find that most people who are just working. Middle class people who are just working, which is most of the world, they spending so much on getting to work that it literally then cuts. Cuts your budget in terms of things that you could do for your family.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

No 100. Correct.

[Cecil]

If ideally is that no one should be spending any money to get to work.

[Anele Mdoda]

Not even money. Just the time.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, wait, wait. Are you saying time or money?

[Cecil]

Both. Time is money. Have you never worked the streets?

[Anele Mdoda]

That is funny.

[Trevor Noah]

Have I never worked the streets? Yes. Time is a jigalo. Of course.

[Cecil]

Time is money. I don't think time matters to me as much as the money. The money where you should not have to pay anything to get to work.

[Trevor Noah]

So which one are you going for? Are you charging? Are you, are you amending your 10 minute rule to a money thing?

[Cecil]

I'm, I'm not, I'm not putting it in the front line.

[Trevor Noah]

No. But I need to know what your rule is so I can.

[Cecil]

You said I can't have two rules.

[Trevor Noah]

No, I can't have two rules here. I just need to know what? The rule is.

[Anele Mdoda]

You rule the world.

[Trevor Noah]

You rule the world.

[Cecil]

So I need to know what the rule is, okay?

[Anele Mdoda]

Please, can I help her fix her world?

[Trevor Noah]

No, wait. Don't mansplain her world.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, I'm not mesplaining her world.

[Trevor Noah]

No, you're mensplaining her world. I want to hear what Ariella's world.

[Cecil]

Is that you should not have to pay. Pay.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, to go to.

[Anele Mdoda]

And then just make a rule. A world where people teleport.

[Trevor Noah]

This guy's mansplaining a world.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, no, I'm not mansplaining it. Just have a teleport to work and.

[Trevor Noah]

Then don't let him pressure you.

[Anele Mdoda]

Doesn't matter.

[Trevor Noah]

I want to know what your world.

[Cecil]

Is like the stuff that only happens in the movies at work.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's your world.

[Cecil]

No, that's. No, I don't want that. Okay, so you must have some sort of commute.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so you want people to commute. Okay, I'm drilling down on this. So I like this. So you don't want to eliminate the commutes.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, but you don't want people to spend more than a certain amount. So does the time.

[Cecil]

No, they must have any money.

[Trevor Noah]

No money.

[Cecil]

Yeah, no time. 10 minutes max.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so 10 minutes and no cost.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay, that's fine. That works. This is as good as teleporting.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, now here's what I worry about. What are you going to do when your cities and systems grow to the point where it can't sustain? Cause like you can only you can only do.

[Anele Mdoda]

I just said that.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm asking it as a question. It's a question.

[Cecil]

Then you transferred to another company, guys, where you're doing the same thing.

[Anele Mdoda]

So I've got to move now. You know how much I like my house. You see? Now you're falling apart.

[Cecil]

No, I'm not falling apart.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but SISU has raised a good question. Yeah, what? You're moving us now to another place where we're 10 minutes away?

[Cecil]

Ask your question again because I interrupted you as you.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, at some point, yeah, just. You're gonna reach capacity. It's inevitable. Right, because at some point, a city has to expand. It just. It cannot go up for. Even if it did, your elevators would. Now, you know what I mean? Your elevator would be your commute. Okay? So at some point, the city has to expand. There's going to be some sort of sprawl. Once that happens, people are now outside of the. The distance that you've set or the pricing that you've set. So you then said, people must now do what?

[Cecil]

So what, people are going to move out?

[Trevor Noah]

Because I'm asking you. I don't make the rules in your world. I just want to know what you're doing.

[Cecil]

No.

[Trevor Noah]

Because now. Because now.

[Cecil]

Okay, no, but now you guys are asking things that. That doesn't make sense.

[Trevor Noah]

You've been to Brazil?

[Cecil]

Yes, I have. Sao Paulo? Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

Have you seen the traffic in Sao Paulo?

[Cecil]

No, I didn't. It was an F1 weekend. So I didn't get to experience any of the. The hardships of the traffic. Oh, I've experienced Lagos traffic, though.

[Trevor Noah]

Lagos, Sao Paulo, even Kenya, Delhi. Let me tell you something. No, forget there's. You see, like Kenya in the afternoon. There's places I've been to where there's only traffic. Like, it's just perpetual. Perpetual. And most of those places are densely populated, and there's just no way for there to not be any type of LA even. Yeah.

[Cecil]

Then you should be allowed to say, okay, guys, no one's allowed to move to LA anymore. Okay? Now somebody else, they move somewhere else.

[Trevor Noah]

So you're shutting down?

[Cecil]

Yes, we're done here. We've. We've reached maximum capacity.

[Trevor Noah]

So my family can't move here now because.

[Cecil]

Well, if your family wasn't in from the beginning, that's it. Because we also have to factor in the fact that people in here are going to have families.

[Anele Mdoda]

What happens if you get married, Miss Wife.

[Cecil]

Yes. Kalung Didi. When you are inside here, this is it. So you're done.

[Trevor Noah]

So your marriage, your partner, you could only meet people from your city then.

[Cecil]

There we go.

[Anele Mdoda]

Highly incestuous.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, Once we're in, we're in.

[Cecil]

Once you're in here, you're in here. Okay. And Mr. Economist over here, you must do that thing where there's like a little bit of fat. You. You have room for fat. Okay. You have room for fat. And then it's like, okay, if there are 5 million people in here, let's allow that.

[Trevor Noah]

It can grow.

[Cecil]

It can grow too.

[Trevor Noah]

You know? You know what's funny is, and I mean, this is something I love about, like, all policies and ideas in the world. This started as a very liberal, beautiful idea.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes. And then reality sets in, and then.

[Trevor Noah]

It slowly moved into like a nationalist dictatorship. Yeah.

[Cecil]

Like which I'm not. Not a fan of.

[Anele Mdoda]

That's how cities are formed generally. Really?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. But they don't say, you can't move in and you can't move. No, no, they don't say, I Mean, that's an extreme.

[Cecil]

Yes. You can definitely move out to where.

[Trevor Noah]

The other citizens are full.

[Cecil]

No. Well, they. Not all of them are full.

[Anele Mdoda]

Why are they not.

[Trevor Noah]

Why are they not full?

[Anele Mdoda]

Job is a job.

[Cecil]

Yes. So we go there, and y' all people must start developing, making some.

[Trevor Noah]

So you're gonna.

[Anele Mdoda]

So you're placing a huge burden on us right now.

[Cecil]

Oh, how much? Less than the burden that we're placing on one city.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm sorry. I think I'd rather be in traffic for an hour than to have to.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, wait, wait, wait, wait. So, okay, here's a question. What if you're, like, a taxi driver or an Uber driver? You're. You work in transportation, so now you're limiting how much people can earn from that. That. That drive or that distance.

[Cecil]

For the distance, yeah. Yes. But that means you guys are always going to be busy.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, but just doing a lot of.

[Cecil]

Yeah, just instead of doing 10 trips. No, instead of doing 10 trips that are 50Ks and 80Ks, you're going to do 110K trips. Guys. You guarantee payments free? Yes.

[Anele Mdoda]

Who's paying?

[Trevor Noah]

Us? So the government is paying.

[Cecil]

I. I'm in charge. I'm paying for it.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so you government pays for transport.

[Anele Mdoda]

It doesn't matter enough money to do this?

[Cecil]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay. No.

[Anele Mdoda]

Why don't you just give people money?

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no, no, no, Cesar, that's not how it works. If I rule the world, you can't say, why don't they do another rule?

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so I have a question for you. Your government is paying everyone for transport. What if people. Then. So I'll. I'll tell you a little fun story that hap. This happened in Nigeria. Uber, the company we're all familiar with, went from country to country trying to grow its operations. One of the things it did that was particularly ingenious and sinister at the same time was they gave incentives to drivers in all of these countries to drive for Uber by giving them bonuses. So they said, if you take. If you agree to drive for Uber and you pick somebody up from, let's say, an airport where we really need drivers, we'll give you a bonus. So we'll give you, like, double the amount of the fair that it would normally be. And they went and they did this in almost every country.

[Cecil]

Is that sustainable?

[Trevor Noah]

It's not supposed to be. The only thing they were trying to do is establish themselves in the markets and get a stranglehold on it so that, like, taxis and all these other industries wouldn't get Exactly. So they get crowded out right now. It worked in most places in Nigeria. However, Nigerian taxi drivers and Uber, like people who were had cars, they did the calculation and realized that they could make money but not really have to drive anybody. So what Uber drivers in Nigeria did was they signed up to be Uber drivers. They then called themselves from the airport, picked up nobody from the airport, drove themselves back into the city and then got the bonus amount which was. Which paid for the gas.

[Cecil]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

And then they, then they took themselves back to the airport to get another fare. That was a bonus.

[Cecil]

Because if it's a bonus, then you're just living off the bonus.

[Trevor Noah]

And they were making so much money doing this that Uber canceled the scheme for the whole world, man.

[Anele Mdoda]

Basically, Nigerians are so genius, bro.

[Trevor Noah]

Kudos to Nigeria because Uber was scamming and then Nigeria was like, you want to scam? You want to scam?

[Cecil]

You came to the head office, we're.

[Trevor Noah]

Going to show you something. And Nigeria taught Uber a lesson. Now I'm not saying that will or won't happen, but what I worry about in your system is you're saying transport is free. How are you gonna ensure that like the people who are doing transport don't just transport for, for the sake of.

[Cecil]

Transport now because you working with people who are working. Right? So it is, it is. The onus is also on the person that's being transported to show where they're working. It's like it's school bus.

[Trevor Noah]

You have to prove.

[Cecil]

Yes, yes. Remember when you have to prove to.

[Trevor Noah]

Your taxi driver that you're going to.

[Cecil]

A job, but all of that will be factored in by companies. It's much like companies will subsidize things. You know how companies subsidize things? Or you have a company car or company petrol card and you must write how far you went. That's fine. That's all admin file that all under admin.

[Trevor Noah]

It seems like a very admin heavy system you've created.

[Cecil]

What world isn't?

[Trevor Noah]

No, but like yours is like particularly.

[Cecil]

Yes, but you're getting free transport. I don't think you should mind clogging in when you're getting free transport. I'm doing you a favor here.

[Trevor Noah]

When you started. Yeah, like most ideas, it was really beautiful. As we've gone down this journey, I'm picturing living in Anile's world. You get out of your house and then you get into your transport. You clock in. Transport. Transport has proof of work, please. Yes, proof of work. What if you're just going like Fun places.

[Cecil]

Then pay for yourself.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, this is interesting that you've said this.

[Cecil]

That's your recreational things.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so now I don't know that this is true, but what might happen, and our AI colleague over here will confirm or deny, I think what might happen is if your system pays for people to go to work, but people have to pay for themselves to go to like entertainment. First of all, you'll have to prove that the people for work are going there not for entertainment. But also the market for entertainment could become more valuable than the work market. And then people would go, I only want to drive for the entertainment market, not for the work market. Like if I'm a taxi driver and I get paid by the government to drive people to work. But then Cesar wants to go to the club. Now I go, cesare, I already have a fare. It's taking this person to work. Cesar goes, I'll pay you double. Cause I'm paying.

[Anele Mdoda]

In all fairness though, to defend Anele's system, you live 10 minutes away from work, even if there are no cars to take you to work. Walk to work.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but that can't be a 10 minute walk. Guys, I don't know if you know how transportation works.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, she's just. 10 minutes. She didn't say seven is walking or driving.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, but it can't. It can't be the same. It can't be 10 walk. 10 have. Do you use Google Maps? Every time you change them, it's going to change.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay, 10 walking.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't change it. Cuz if you say 10, don't let him trap you.

[Cecil]

No, no, this was never asked of me. This would be the first time I'm giving. That's my answer. Exactly. So it's 10 walking.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, it's 10 walking. So the whole city's 10 walking. Your whole city's 10 walking.

[Cecil]

Yeah, okay, but don't get distracted from the entertainment point that you.

[Trevor Noah]

I want to go back now to 10 walking.

[Anele Mdoda]

So now we walk to work, everyone and we drive to party.

[Trevor Noah]

Everyone works 10 minutes from. Yeah, what if I don't want to live where my work is in that way? That's fine.

[Cecil]

That's up to you. If you want to move forward. You opted out. So for instance, once again, let's say you have a company car allowance of $30,000, right? And you're just like, no, I don't want to drive a Prius. I want to drive an X5. That's great. You're still going to get your 30,000 from us. But everything else you can then top yourself up. Right.

[Trevor Noah]

So we're saying here, there's something we're missing here. Everyone works 10 minutes.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'll be a business person in this world and I'm gonna make gazillions.

[Trevor Noah]

How are you gonna do it?

[Anele Mdoda]

I've just thought of so many loopholes, but carry on.

[Trevor Noah]

No, this is why, this is why.

[Cecil]

Kalugi must poke balls.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, it's not a wrong thing. Keep your world. I'm just making money in your world.

[Trevor Noah]

I've never, you know, I've never encountered somebody like this. This guy's not even trying to, like, help.

[Cecil]

He's going, he's gonna actually vote for me.

[Trevor Noah]

He's gonna vote for you so that he can make money in a theoretical world. There's something truly wrong with you. So. Okay. All I worry about, Anele, is I, I, I can see the system crumbling somehow. Because 10 minutes for everyone means somebody's not where they want to be 10 minutes from. Because not everyone can be 10 minutes from. No, no, no. I'm saying they can't be even if they want to be. You're going to. You reach capacity at some point.

[Cecil]

Yes, but I told you. Then it goes. Goes to another place. Then we build there and then. So that we can create 100. Then you make friends. Excuse me? You left us in South Africa.

[Trevor Noah]

I didn't leave you. I didn't leave you. I didn't leave you.

[Cecil]

Yes. Don't be like, your friends are here. We were your friends.

[Trevor Noah]

I didn't leave you. No, that's.

[Cecil]

I didn't leave you guys.

[Trevor Noah]

There was a white genocide in this country. I'm half white. I'm half white, guys. I had to choose. I wasn't sure what you guys were gonna do with me. What I'm saying is.

[Cecil]

It'S perhaps what I'm saying is you, you have to go and create.

[Trevor Noah]

I love the center.

[Cecil]

A lot of job, Johannesburgs, a lot of ladies making many New Yorks and all of that. You can't just bank on the fact that only one city is the one that's going to take all of the strain. Everybody's gonna flock to the city.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Cecil]

Develop other cities so that we can all be like that.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm ready to vote.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm also ready to vote. I'll be very lenient on you.

[Cecil]

No, don't be. No, I mean, I'm not your charity case.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'll drive you to work. Look, I know what you. You mean well, so I'll adopt it.

[Trevor Noah]

What this guy wants to make money in your. This guy's. He's being so transparent.

[Cecil]

You mean? Well, after we vote, I want to know how he's going to make money from my system. But after we vote. So you're voting for me?

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

I really can't believe this, guys.

[Cecil]

Thank you.

[Anele Mdoda]

What are you doing?

[Trevor Noah]

Genuinely can't.

[Anele Mdoda]

He's asking ChatGPT.

[Cecil]

I genuinely can't believe if my way of ruling the world is viable.

[Trevor Noah]

Trust me, it's not about viability. I just can't believe Cesar is going to vote yes because he wants to make business in a fictitious world. So I'm going to vote no.

[Cecil]

Why?

[Trevor Noah]

The reason I'm voting no, I love, I love the sentiment. I love the feeling behind your idea, by the way, because I. I agree with you. I think it's unfair that some people spend a disproportionate amount of their income on getting to work and getting back from work because then they're not reaping the benefits of work the same way somebody who lives close to work does. So the idea behind it.

[Cecil]

Benefits of their salary, bro.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, that's what I mean. That's what I mean. The benefits of it. Like we both earn a thousand, but I spend 500. Getting to and back from work means you have more of your thousand than I do. Your sentiment, I'm completely for, as is often the case on if I Ruled the World. It's not that we disagree with the sentiment, it's the, the rollout. The rollout that worries us. I worry that if you create a hard rule of 10 minutes from work very quickly, we reach capacity very quickly. People, as you said, get kicked out to go and have to build new cities somewhere else.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

I think this creates an imbalance.

[Cecil]

Now, if I remove the 10 minute.

[Trevor Noah]

Rule, are you saying you're willing to amend it and say in your world just no one would pay to go to work?

[Cecil]

Exactly. So if you have. If what you were saying is if you. If all get paid a thousand dollars. Right?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. No one gets. No one pays to go to work.

[Cecil]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

In your world.

[Cecil]

Yes. And it doesn't matter what type of work.

[Trevor Noah]

I can vote yes for that.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah. That's a yes. That's a clean years.

[Cecil]

Okay. Thank you.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's definitely a better world than what we have now.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no. I vote. I vote yes for that.

[Cecil]

Thank you.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, well done. Congratulations.

[Cecil]

Thank you. Oh, my word. Such a moment.

[Trevor Noah]

It really is. Well done.

[Cecil]

Why do I win?

[Trevor Noah]

No, you just. You've won.

[Cecil]

Oh.

[Trevor Noah]

What you've won is that you've won.

[Cecil]

I thought that was just like a tangible prize.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't go anywhere because we got more. What now? After this. This episode is brought to you by Tools and Weapons, the podcast hosted by Microsoft's Vice chair and president, Brad Smith. Across three exclusive conversations celebrating the company's 50th anniversary, Microsoft CEOs Bill Gates, Steve Ballmer, and Satya Nadella share the stories, dreams, and drive that fueled a digital revolution. And they explain why they think it may be at its most exciting point yet. For these and more conversations with government, business, and cultural leaders, search Tools and weapons wherever you listen to your podcasts, this episode is brought to you by Zendesk, Introducing the next generation of AI agents built to deliver resolutions for everyone. With an easy setup that can be completed in minutes, not months, Zendesk AI agents resolve 30% of interactions instantly, quickly giving your customers what they need. Loved by over 10,000 companies, Zendesk AI makes service teams more efficient, businesses run better, and your customers happier. That's the Zendesk AI effect. Find out [e-mail].

[Anele Mdoda]

Let'S hear your one. Okay, there he goes. All right, we're gonna be taking a poo and something.

[Trevor Noah]

Wow. This is how you see me?

[Anele Mdoda]

It's definitely something like, hey, your thoughts are this while you take a shower, because can.

[Cecil]

Can I just go back to your other. If I rule the world before you present.

[Trevor Noah]

I don't think that's necessary because I already lost.

[Cecil]

Okay.

[Trevor Noah]

I think this is painful. Okay, okay. So if I ruled the world, nobody would know who their child was?

[Anele Mdoda]

What?

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, wait. Let me. Let me explain. Wait. If I ruled the world. Listen, listen, listen, listen.

[Anele Mdoda]

I told you.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's worse than taking a poo.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, wait, wait.

[Cecil]

I'd rather our pooh speak to us.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, guys. You know what, Guys? So if I ruled the world.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

No one would know who their child is. So what I mean by this is we would develop a system where you could still have sex. Everyone would do their thing. Everyone would do their thing. In our world, what would happen is when you are ready to be pregnant, you would come to, like, the Ministry of Pregnancy, and there's no qualifications, no nothing, no money, no nothing. We'd even come to you. It's not a transport thing. You can apply online if you don't have Internet. We'll help, whatever. Don't worry about all those things. But you come to us, you say, like, we want to have a child. We approve you. There's no questions or anything. We approve you. And then we impregnate the woman, and then you have the child. But now the child can come from anywhere. So you could have a white baby. You could have Chinese baby. It doesn't matter. But it just comes from.

[Cecil]

Good at math.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Your baby just comes out swaba. And then that's. But nobody knows where the baby did or didn't come from. And there's no way to find out. In my world, there's no DNA testing. There's no. None of that.

[Anele Mdoda]

Do you have parents in your world?

[Trevor Noah]

No. No. Yeah. It's the same way we live now.

[Cecil]

It's the people who.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait.

[Cecil]

Nobody knows.

[Trevor Noah]

Nobody knows who their kid is, is what I'm saying. Like, nobody.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay.

[Trevor Noah]

Nobody.

[Cecil]

Not I.

[Anele Mdoda]

What is it that you're hoping to achieve with this one? I can see, obviously, the supply of kids would even be easily distributed, which is fine.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so there's a few things. Few things. Number one. Number one, the most important thing is, I think, while admirable in its. In its, you know, in its initial idea, I don't think bloodlines are as important as we think they are.

[Anele Mdoda]

I agree.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay. When we were starting off farming and all of this, that's. That's really where you can trace a lot of, like, the ideas of marriage that we have. Like now you can trace it back to that. People started farming, and then all of a sudden, it became more important to build out the people who are going to be farming with you and owning that farm with you. So then you went, well, who are my offspring? Before that, a lot of tribes just were like, yeah, man, babies are babies. They're the babies of the tribe. It's everyone's baby now. You're like, no, but it's my farm. Who gets my farm? Who works on it? My children. From my wife. Women were property. Children were property. Right. I think we've kept a lot of that. And I think what it's created is a world where people now think of what should or shouldn't be done in the world based on who is or isn't connected or related to them. Right now, I don't think people are evil. I just think this is a natural evolution of human beings. So white people will team up with white people. Black people might be forced to team up with black people because they haven't really been given an option. So we don't know what black people will or won't do, you know, for the most, we haven't really seen in the world. But what. What I would love to see is a World where it, it sort of disentangles your parents and your bloodline from your opportunities or not in life. And, and I think it could create a world where people are less tied to my kids. Cuz your kid could be like anywhere in a weird way. You might even bump into someone and be like, yo man, you look exactly like me.

[Cecil]

Okay, that's the weird part. But otherwise I agree with everybody.

[Trevor Noah]

So that's, that, that's like one part of it and then the other part. The reason I say like applications for being pregnant is because we'd be leading in science and stuff. I think a lot of people struggle to get pregnant and they fight. And then there's a lot of people who don't struggle at all. They just meet each other on one random night and now they have a kid. They didn't want to have the kid. Now the kid lives a life that it doesn't need to. So I'm trying to create a system where the ones who want get, the ones who don't want, don't have. And then we just like mix it up and we spin things around and it's random. Do you know what I mean?

[Cecil]

There was a tribe like that somewhere in Africa. So I'm not going to say where, but. And it kind of took away the pressure around when a couple cannot conceive. Right. It's like, oh, you know, I'm barren or you know, you're infertile and all of that. Whereas it would be hot in this big village like you were saying.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Cecil]

And just every night people, you, a man would go. And then on the door. No, this is kind of occupied type of thing. Right. And we just all, we have intercourse with each other because we're a tribe. And if people are pregnant, like you say, you give birth and the, the baby belongs to the tribe, the baby doesn't belong to the parents.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

And I think, I'm not sure, maybe the Zulu culture, if you are having issues to conceiving as a child, your brother must, must step in.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, really?

[Anele Mdoda]

Not must, not must.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no.

[Anele Mdoda]

I mean this is something called ungena. Right.

[Trevor Noah]

Which means to get in.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Cecil]

Yes.

[Anele Mdoda]

But essentially what it means is, let's say, for example, Anelia was married to my brother.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

Right. And my brother either passed away or wasn't able to have kids for whatever reason. Right. Then Anele can just come into my household.

[Trevor Noah]

Wow.

[Cecil]

Because the child would still be a family member. Right. So that, so there we go. So that's why I'm saying I Don't.

[Anele Mdoda]

Obviously not every family practices.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no. But, yeah, I think it's a great idea.

[Cecil]

This is why I'm saying I don't hate your idea, because it's exactly that. We've just gotten to a place where people are very individualistic. Like everything's about me.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

I mean, I'm an individual. It's my wife, my children, my cars, my house and all of that.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

But back then with this tribe, and I'll have to research it, because I did read up about it, is that what they knew is that this child is of the tribe. So this child just belongs here.

[Trevor Noah]

And what I also want is in my. In my dream world, I'm sure there would be a few problems that might be introduced. I don't know what they'd be. Sizue will tell me.

[Anele Mdoda]

But your dream world would be like Japan, but carry on.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no, no. I. What I'd love to do is it would be because culture would still be a thing, obviously, but tying race to outcomes I think would be greatly diminished. So there would be a Xhosa Chinese kid now. Cause it's like, yeah, you're just Xhosa. And the thing I like about culture in that way versus, like, race is that you can opt into culture in a way that you can't with race. You can marry into a Xhosa family, you can marry into a Zulu family. You can. You get what I'm saying? You can adopt a culture in a way that you can't with race because race is exclusionary. It's like, this is your race, buddy.

[Cecil]

This is how you feel. This is you.

[Trevor Noah]

Not only this is. We are saying that this is you forever. You know, you are Indian, you are Chinese, you are black. You are this. You are this, you are this. But with culture, you'd be able to be like, no, no, no, I am. I am whatever.

[Anele Mdoda]

I like what your idea aims to achieve, but I worry that human nature would just mean that more people opt out of being parents.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, interesting. Say more.

[Anele Mdoda]

So for the same reason that you mentioned, there's actually no other reason to be a parent except the selfish reason.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Anele Mdoda]

There's no other reason. So people speak of legacy. People speak about, I want to carry on my bloodline.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

About. I want to see myself in this kid. And they'd have none of that in your world. And so what I think they'll eventually do is they'll just be like, hey, you guys can raise other people's kids if you want. I'd rather keep my money for myself and my wife, and I'm out.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but they're gonna die out at some point, and then the money goes somewhere.

[Anele Mdoda]

People will die anyway.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, but think about it. I hear you. Yeah, but my response to them would be, yes, then you're gonna die out, and who are you gonna leave the money to?

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, people don't care about it.

[Cecil]

It happens now anyway.

[Trevor Noah]

But that's fine, because that means that then they would die out as people and their money would end up coming to the children of everyone.

[Anele Mdoda]

But the issue is not the money, but the issue is about people not having kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't you think it would average out, though? Cause in any society, there are people who want. There are people who don't want, but the law of averages dictates that.

[Anele Mdoda]

I don't. I don't believe it would average out.

[Trevor Noah]

You don't think. So you don't think.

[Anele Mdoda]

Looking at human nature. And just look at. I use Japan for a reason.

[Trevor Noah]

Right. Yes, Go.

[Anele Mdoda]

Because in Japan, the birth rate has been decreasing.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

Steadily over the last 20 years.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Anele Mdoda]

Right. And that's not even because of anything, but just because the Japanese government told them not to have as much sex, don't procreate as much. And then people went so far there that it's at a point where the Japanese government's like, yo, yo, hold on, hold on. Maybe start having more. But now the behavioral patterns have changed.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, completely.

[Anele Mdoda]

So this is my. I'm not saying I don't know. I can't say for certain, but I do believe human nature would cause people not to want to raise other people's kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Now, my counter argument to you is, yes, Japan's population is declining. Africa's is increasing. So if we average it out over the whole world, Japan is going down, Africa's going up.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, but Africans are raising their own kids.

[Cecil]

No.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but everyone would be raising their own kids in my world. It's just. No, no, no. They come from inside you. They're your kids. Wow.

[Cecil]

As the only person here who has a child. Right.

[Trevor Noah]

That you know of me and could be.

[Anele Mdoda]

You don't know.

[Trevor Noah]

He's got a secret family.

[Cecil]

You don't know. No.

[Anele Mdoda]

Me and N are sitting on one side for a reason.

[Cecil]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay. Okay.

[Cecil]

There is something about raising a child and then they do something or they say something, and that for that split moment, you're just like, oh, my word, that is so me. Or that is so your dad. Right. And I don't think you'd be Able to have that. And that little 1% of that that happens makes the other 99% of parenting worth it. Because parenting isn't fun.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm glad you said that.

[Cecil]

Thank you. Parenting. Parenting is just not fun. It's a lot of stress. It's a lot of anxiety. And everybody who's a parent is acting like they're okay. But we're not okay.

[Trevor Noah]

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for this. This is a truthful moment, everyone.

[Cecil]

Is it beautiful? Yes. That one. It's almost like training for the comrades or training for marathons or training for whatever it is is that you're going to train for years and years. And then that moment of glory when you get that Olympic medal, that's 30 seconds on the podium, your flag's up, well done. Off you go and you go and.

[Trevor Noah]

Train for the rest of the time is torture.

[Cecil]

Yeah. For the rest of the time, it's absolute torture. It's absolute torture. And in. Under your ruling, in your world, you taking away the 1%, that makes the rest of it worth it.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, I hear you. But you wouldn't know the 1% in my world, because nobody. Yeah, you might. You don't know. Cause remember, it's a lottery.

[Anele Mdoda]

Let me ask you this. What's the incentive to have a child in your world?

[Trevor Noah]

People want children all the time.

[Cecil]

For what? They just eat your money? They. In your space.

[Trevor Noah]

No, for real.

[Anele Mdoda]

Because we started off by saying there's only selfish reasons to have kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes. But what I'm saying is you've taken.

[Anele Mdoda]

Away the selfish reason. People only have kids for selfless reasons.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, people. There are people all over the world right now.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Banging down the doors of clinics trying to get children.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes, Right. This is.

[Trevor Noah]

Throughout time, people have tried to get children. People want children. So the reason I think people would still want children is because to your point, children are terrible, but they're meaningful. You know what I mean? So. No, no, no. So listen, we've had the experience with you. You have given us the experience. Like before you had your son. I can unequivocally say I had zero interest in raising a young human being. These things were terrible, and there was no need for them to be in my life. Then you made one. I was introduced to him. We've spent time with him. Then I was like, wow, what a beautiful journey watching him evolve.

[Cecil]

Because your entire life is the 1%.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but. No, no, no, I get that. But my point is still. Because I've seen that I'm now more amenable to it. You get what I'm saying? So I'm saying people will still want to have kids because having children and raising children brings so much meaning and purpose to life that people would still want to do it.

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay? So look at it as it is now.

[Trevor Noah]

And I think, And I think maybe you can tell me if I'm wrong, because I. I've never been pregnant, nor do I ever plan to be. The experience of it for many women, I've been told, is some have a terrible one, but others will tell you it's the most empowering and beautiful and the feeling and the life inside of you and the. So I don't know. I think some women would be like, I do like being pregnant.

[Cecil]

I love being pregnant.

[Trevor Noah]

There you go.

[Cecil]

I really. So in my world, and my pregnancy was easy. That's another thing. When I liked it and you could eat what you want and no one judges you and. Yeah, you see, you know, and you can.

[Anele Mdoda]

But the statement is incomplete. Why would she like being pregnant if you're going to snatch the baby away from you afterwards for her never to see it again?

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, no, no. I'm not doing it that way. And I'm not taking anyone's babies away. I'll never do that to people.

[Anele Mdoda]

What do you mean? Nothing. She's not gonna get to raise the baby.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, you are.

[Cecil]

I mean, I get to raise your baby. What he's saying is that when it's time to get pregnant, you go to.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Cecil]

You come to us and then we impregnate you.

[Trevor Noah]

We impregnate you.

[Cecil]

Not necessarily your husband or your partner. Yes, yes.

[Trevor Noah]

No. But not. Not Anonymous sperm bank.

[Cecil]

It is.

[Trevor Noah]

No.

[Cecil]

Hey, so I would know who the dad is.

[Trevor Noah]

Don't undermine my. This is terrible branding.

[Cecil]

It's a sperm bank.

[Trevor Noah]

Hey, hey. It's not high end one. It's not a sperm bank. Because the embryos are also coming from somewhere else.

[Anele Mdoda]

Then the guys are gonna opt out.

[Cecil]

I'm just opting in as an oven. I. I had no.

[Anele Mdoda]

So she's raising her kid, I'm raising a random.

[Trevor Noah]

No, wait, wait, no, no.

[Cecil]

Even the embryo. So all I'm being used is the oven, but I had no say in what went into the recipe.

[Trevor Noah]

No, guys. Okay, so I'm gonna. You know whoever shouted that shit from the peanut gallery? Yeah. We were doing so well here. No, we were branding. This is why branding. This is why branding. This is why branding is so important. This is why branding is so important. Okay, in my world, we will. We'll make It. It's really going to be a beautiful experience. So you will come to the Ministry of Insemination. We're going to call it the Ministry of Life.

[Anele Mdoda]

Actually sound like a cult now, but carry on.

[Trevor Noah]

The Ministry of Life, you will come there and we will be part of celebrating this thing that you wish to achieve, which is creating life. And it'll be like a honeymoon, you know, we'll give you, you know, champagne and caviar. Everything that you want. You spend a wonderful night together on that night. You know what I mean? We're going to set the scene, create the vibes.

[Cecil]

Everyone in the world's getting caviar.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, forget that caviar.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait, she's on. She's listening right now. I'll handle you afterwards. Let me do one at a time. Yeah. So an you come there, everyone gets champagne, everyone gets caviar. Luther Vandross is playing Baby Face. Baby Face is playing. Everyone's enjoying themselves. Whatever you want that night to be, we will make it happen. And remember, the Ministry has departments all over the world. So we, we.

[Cecil]

We.

[Trevor Noah]

We're close to you, 10 minutes away. So you come there, you enjoy yourself, and then on that night, we inseminate you. Right? It's a very seamless process. Not going to be like IVF is now. We've worked on the technology, but we inseminate you in that process. Okay? And so devil's.

[Cecil]

The devil's advocates.

[Trevor Noah]

No. And so what happens is now, in that night, you have been inseminated. You are now going to be pregnant. And then you're going to go off, and you and your partner or husband or friend or whoever you chose to do this with, you've done that night.

[Cecil]

So this baby's not free. 50 anyone's.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's 50 you.

[Trevor Noah]

It's you and your partner. The same way another child is.

[Cecil]

No, no, no, no.

[Anele Mdoda]

It can't be the partner.

[Trevor Noah]

What do you mean?

[Cecil]

Because the spirit came from anyway.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, yeah, the sperm and the 50.

[Anele Mdoda]

Her.

[Trevor Noah]

The sperm.

[Cecil]

No, I'm just carrying it. And the embryo is not mine.

[Trevor Noah]

Come from anywhere. So you might bump into your own genes in the world. You never know.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah, bro.

[Trevor Noah]

What I'm saying though, is you will now walk away pregnant. And when your child is born, and they are your child.

[Anele Mdoda]

Stop saying your child. They're not.

[Trevor Noah]

You just told me your brother. You just told me your brother can come and inseminate you. That's your child.

[Anele Mdoda]

That's family, bro.

[Cecil]

That's family. We've got the same genes, but in my World.

[Trevor Noah]

Do you understand that over time, genetically, we will all have the same genes, but diverse.

[Cecil]

I have a 1 in 8 billion chance that I'm gonna run into my child.

[Trevor Noah]

It's not 1 in 8 billion, actually. Because of your family. No, no, no. But also think of how your bloodline, if you traced your family tree as far back, you'd find that it's not one in eight billion.

[Cecil]

Okay, yeah.

[Anele Mdoda]

With a little bit of incest, it could be more.

[Trevor Noah]

It's way more. So it's not.

[Cecil]

So I have less chance of running.

[Trevor Noah]

No, it's way higher. Way, way higher. Way higher.

[Cecil]

Oh, okay.

[Trevor Noah]

Way higher. You.

[Anele Mdoda]

But also, do you want to spend your life searching for your child?

[Cecil]

What nonsense is this?

[Trevor Noah]

But, guys, this is your child.

[Cecil]

No, no, this. Very separate.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm voting out of this.

[Trevor Noah]

So what. What's your concern here?

[Anele Mdoda]

Everything, bro. What is your.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm not talking.

[Cecil]

Taking everything away. That makes parenting worth it. Now we just all.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, okay, wait. I'm going to throw something at you.

[Cecil]

Conveyor belt.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, I'm going to throw something at you. And stop saying no for a second. Yeah, just be open for a second. Have you heard stories of families who left the hospital with the wrong baby?

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

Raised that baby.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

Loved that baby.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

There was nothing wrong.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

And then found out when there was like an organ transplant or something that involved deep blood work, that they weren't related to their own child.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

This is the first moment when families went, wait. And then they traced it back and they're like, ah, in the hospital, the babies were switched at birth, blah, blah.

[Anele Mdoda]

Blah, blah, blah, blah.

[Cecil]

So you want all families to be like that?

[Anele Mdoda]

Wait, he's basically taking the deck of cars and he's shuffling, shuffling, shuffling. Every day. I'm shuffling.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Anele Mdoda]

And he's dealing with a bad head.

[Trevor Noah]

No, what I'm saying is those families will tell you there was not one moment where they went, this is not our child. They had the same experience of raising them, loving them, seeing them grow, feeling them. All of those.

[Anele Mdoda]

They believed that the child was theirs.

[Cecil]

Because the sense of protection you feel for a child, for a baby is because there is a familiarity between you and this baby. This is why mothers, some of you are lying when you say this. When they're like, oh, they placed the baby on my chest and, you know, I fell in love immediately because, you know, it was just. It's the greatest love I've ever known. What you're feeling is familiar. It's like I've seen this person before and. And Then you have a feeling of, this is me. I can, like, I can see me here. I can see my husband, yo, my baby daddy, whoever it is. It's the sense of familia that you have and not necessarily love. Yes. So now if I know that that's not my child, were you just like, oh, I'm looking forward to getting to know you better.

[Anele Mdoda]

And also, see, I nearly already alluded to this. Right? Part of the joys of parenthood is the things that you don't teach your child, but that they inherently just know. Then you just like, man, this is amazing.

[Trevor Noah]

Can I tell you something here? This is something that people take for granted. A lot of that is confirmation bias. So we take for granted that a lot of the behaviors that children get from parents are learned. They're in the environment with you. And we don't think we're teaching, but we are. Children laugh like their parents, not because they inherited the laugh necessarily, but because the laugh gets passed. You can even be like, oh, you did the exact same thing as my grandfather. Yes, but things are passed down, and kids are constantly, without knowing it, decoding what they take and how they take it.

[Anele Mdoda]

I can agree with learned behavior, but there's genetic stuff.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, I understand, but I'm saying we take for granted how much of what we recognize isn't genetic. We are seeing what we want to see. Just like, okay, let me. I'll even throw this at you. I've been in the streets with friends of mine who I act like. And then people go, you guys are related. And I'm like, no. They're like, no, you guys are related.

[Anele Mdoda]

Then they're like, that's not the same thing. I'm talking about things you can't teach.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, but I'm saying, haven't you ever.

[Anele Mdoda]

Looked at your dad's foots? And you're like, dude, I've got the exact same foot.

[Trevor Noah]

But I'm saying, you will find your.

[Anele Mdoda]

Foot to grow that way.

[Trevor Noah]

You will find that because there's everything else of me that's not like my dad. So you find the thing that is the same. No, but if I find out tomorrow.

[Cecil]

1% I was telling you about.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes, but if I found out tomorrow that Sisu and I were actually brothers, I'd be like, oh, that explains why we both like, blah, blah, blah. Now I would find all the things. Do you know what I mean? It's like when people fall in love, all of a sudden they.

[Anele Mdoda]

They look alike.

[Trevor Noah]

Have you seen star signs? People get star signs, and now all of a sudden, they're like, that explains it. I wondered why I got fired. Mercury was in retrograde. All right, guys, they just gave you an answer. What? So I'm saying a lot of what people do is giving themselves an answer as to why the child is or isn't like that, which is fine.

[Cecil]

Which is fine.

[Anele Mdoda]

In your world. We wouldn't even have the luxury of lying to ourselves like that. I'm out.

[Cecil]

The 1%. You're negating the 1%. Is that the. It's the 1% magic that children bring. That is like, oh, my word.

[Anele Mdoda]

And the final. The final nail in the coffin.

[Trevor Noah]

Guys, do you know how many dads in the world are raising a son or a daughter that is not theirs? And they have this experience fully, but they happy.

[Anele Mdoda]

They live because they don't believe that these are not their kids.

[Cecil]

If you amend your rule to open to amendments.

[Trevor Noah]

Go, go, go.

[Cecil]

If you amend your rule to what I was saying about the. You know, similar to the African villages where the father is here, the mother is here, and we are all just raising. So once again, we are a city of, say, 8 million people, and all of us are. Are mixing about. That's fine.

[Anele Mdoda]

I can make money in your world. I can make money in your world. Come on, son.

[Cecil]

Do you see what I'm saying? If you. I hear you, but my narrow it. They cannot.

[Trevor Noah]

My issue is still that now it will become a little too insular for my liking.

[Anele Mdoda]

You want to hear my business idea?

[Trevor Noah]

Let's hear your business idea.

[Anele Mdoda]

I would be the guy smuggling like, real kids like you. You'd be like, yo, you and you. Once you're a real baby, come visit me for nine months. You'll walk out with your real babies. That's my business. Guys be moving with real ones, selling authentic babies.

[Trevor Noah]

I mean, needless to say, there would be a crackdown of this. Of this black market here that's run by Sisu.

[Anele Mdoda]

But I wouldn't only be black markets.

[Cecil]

Chinese market, Asian market, Indian market.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm willing to accept your votes.

[Cecil]

Will you amend your rule, though?

[Trevor Noah]

Unfortunately, not. That one I can't amend.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm voting hard on this one.

[Trevor Noah]

I can't. I'm sorry.

[Cecil]

You were there, like, you really had me.

[Trevor Noah]

I know. But I can't amend it because it wouldn't fulfill what I'm trying to do. So I.

[Anele Mdoda]

You meant well, but, like, nah, I'm not voting for this world. So. Your world, yo. Your world would have cycles, bro. Yo, yo, yo, yo, yo, yo. There'll be Jokers moving around every day.

[Trevor Noah]

Why would my world have psychos? Come on. The trauma in your world, why would there be trauma?

[Anele Mdoda]

This is trauma. But also, why would it be trauma?

[Cecil]

Unlike Caesar's world, where the chaos comes every five years, yours is just a constant, uninterrupted.

[Trevor Noah]

Why is there chaos? Why is there chaos?

[Anele Mdoda]

Okay, let me tell you why. Right now, the world is messed up, mostly because of absent fathers. Your whole world is absent fathers, bro.

[Cecil]

No, no, no, no.

[Trevor Noah]

Why is it absent fathers? My world is chosen. In fact. In fact, in my world. In fact, in my world, it's even better.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Because nobody is being a dad by mistake. Think about it.

[Cecil]

So you're not allowed to impregnate anyone.

[Trevor Noah]

You can't. Not allowed. You can't. In my world.

[Cecil]

Impossible.

[Trevor Noah]

I didn't want. I didn't want to reveal the secrets because it's patented technology. It's not sterilization. So we have a patented technology that we use when children are born.

[Anele Mdoda]

You see, there's already a technology.

[Trevor Noah]

We have a technology when children are born. We have a way to turn off your reproduction so that, like, when you're living, you're living the same way.

[Cecil]

Like, people get, you know, mastectomies, and then they reverse.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, yeah, but we do that. Like, from the time you're born, it's done. So you don't even have to worry about it. And then when you're ready to have kids, you come. You come and we do a thing and we, like, make it happen.

[Cecil]

And then you. You shoot into something, and then that can then get distributed across the world.

[Trevor Noah]

Exactly. So my counter to you is actually, in my world, there would be fewer absentee fathers, so there would be less chaos. Because now the men who are choosing to be fathers are choosing. The women who are choosing to be mothers would be choosing. And I would rather be in a world where people who want kids have more kids because they want them. And the people who don't have fewer kids because they don't want them. And I think that would still average out. Cause people. It's entropy. It always happens.

[Anele Mdoda]

No, the idea. The idea is a noble one.

[Trevor Noah]

So I don't. So I think it would be fewer. I love that you said absentee fathers. In my world, there would be fewer absentee fathers.

[Cecil]

There would be no absentee fathers because.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, but you never know. People get divorced and stuff. You can't force things. I'm not gonna.

[Cecil]

Oh, really? You can't force things.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no. Remember, you're forcing one thing at A time. If I rule the world, you do one thing at a time. I can't do everything at once. Then it's not a fun game.

[Anele Mdoda]

I'm ready.

[Trevor Noah]

Just one thing. You said no long ago, bro. Yeah, you said no when I started.

[Anele Mdoda]

The sentence you were trying to convince me of. Like you haven't won me over.

[Cecil]

If I didn't have the experience of raising my son and the person that he isn't seeing myself so much in him. And you know I would have.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm gonna throw one thing at you.

[Cecil]

Go for it.

[Anele Mdoda]

Concise A corp for the originals, baby.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait.

[Anele Mdoda]

Selling originals?

[Trevor Noah]

You can't be a corporation doing crime. This guy's gonna be a corporation doing crime.

[Anele Mdoda]

No. Immobiliare.

[Trevor Noah]

So what if this is a genuine question? Theoretical. What if tomorrow you found out that somehow Alake wasn't of you? Do you think it would take away all those one percents?

[Anele Mdoda]

It wouldn't. But she'd still be disappointed.

[Cecil]

It wouldn't. But it would question the rest of the one percents for the rest of our lives. And he's only 10. That's a long time to be questioning.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Anele Mdoda]

Even him.

[Cecil]

I would definitely like to like.

[Trevor Noah]

I'm with you.

[Cecil]

This is a completely emotional decision where I'm just like, you know what?

[Trevor Noah]

I'm with you. So you. So you.

[Anele Mdoda]

You mean well though.

[Trevor Noah]

Like I said, yours is a no.

[Cecil]

And also because I see how much I can love my friend's kids and like my sisters.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Cecil]

So that's why I'm not saying that I am void of loving somebody who did. Wasn't birthed by me.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Cecil]

I'm not void of that.

[Trevor Noah]

But I'm selfishly. And I appreciate that.

[Cecil]

Selfishly. Selfishly, I'm going to say no.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay. And Sizui, what's your no based on everything.

[Anele Mdoda]

It's just a horrible idea. It means well. But this would never work. Just a no.

[Trevor Noah]

It's not about. You're saying no for you. Why?

[Anele Mdoda]

The only reason to have a kid are selfish reasons. Now people can go left, right, forward and back and try to explain to you that it's for something else. There's no other reason except that selfish reasons.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay.

[Anele Mdoda]

And what you're asking of people is to be selfless with the most, I guess the biggest sacrifice. Because children are also a sacrifice and a burden. Every day I use these words. I use these words and I know parents are gonna be like. Children are a blessing. They are. But a blessing can also be a burden.

[Trevor Noah]

Okay, so double no.

[Anele Mdoda]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, I'm used to it that I can see why at the end of. You know why? Because I swing for the fences, guys. That's why. Great ideas. Do you remember when the iPhone first came out what people said? Who would buy a phone without a keyboard? That's what people said. What a stupid idea. Me. Guys, I'm here to invent iPhones. I'm not here to come with small, small things. But I lost once again.

[Anele Mdoda]

Oh, boy.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, congratulations, Anele. Your first time at bats and you've won. So thank you very much for joining.

[Cecil]

Once again, if I rule the world.

[Trevor Noah]

What now with Trevor Noah is produced by Spotify Studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions. The show is executive executive produced by Trevor Noah, Sanaz Yamin and Jodi Avigan. Our senior producer is Jess Hackle. Claire Slaughter is our producer. Music, mixing and mastering by Hannis Brown. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next Thursday for another episode of what Now.

[Anele Mdoda]

Sam.