The Problem with Men, with Scott Galloway [VIDEO]

Summary

Podcast Summary: "The Problem with Men" with Scott Galloway on What Now? with Trevor Noah

Release Date: April 3, 2025

In this compelling episode of What Now? with Trevor Noah, host Trevor Noah engages in an in-depth conversation with renowned professor and entrepreneur Scott Galloway. The discussion delves into the multifaceted issues surrounding masculinity, economic disparities, and societal shifts impacting men, particularly young men, in contemporary America.

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1. Introduction to Guest and Background

Scott Galloway shares insights into his personal life, residing in Marylebone, London, and his multicultural family background. He touches upon his early political endeavors, mentioning his unsuccessful runs for class president during his school years, which instilled in him resilience against rejection.

Scott Galloway [00:58]: "Recognizing 'no' is not the worst thing in the world is the key skill."

2. Economic Opportunities: United States vs. Europe

Galloway presents a stark comparison between the economic landscapes of the U.S. and Europe. He posits that while the U.S. remains the premier destination for wealth generation due to abundant risk capital and entrepreneurial opportunities, Europe excels in providing a high quality of life once economic security is achieved.

Scott Galloway [05:10]: "The US is still the best place to make money and Europe's the best place to spend it."

He further explains that the U.S. offers unparalleled opportunities for economic advancement, whereas Europe provides a more stable and civilized environment conducive to raising families.

3. The Erosion of Post-WWII Alliances and U.S. Leadership

Galloway critiques the deterioration of longstanding U.S. alliances established post-World War II, emphasizing the decline in mutual trust and reciprocity. He highlights the exceptional friendship between the U.S. and Canada as a benchmark of genuine alliance but laments the current lack of understanding and cooperation in international relations.

Scott Galloway [07:36]: "Ultimately, I think what's going on is mostly bad. ... The post World War II order that America has been sort of the leader in is being ripped up."

4. Military Spending and Aid to Ukraine

The conversation shifts to U.S. military spending and the aid extended to Ukraine. Galloway defends the allocation of $60 billion annually to support Ukraine, arguing that it effectively counters Russian military aggression and reinforces Western solidarity without direct U.S. troop involvement.

Scott Galloway [12:27]: "I would argue that the decision to allocate $60 billion a year to Ukraine is one of the best investments that has ever been made in the modern world."

He contrasts this with the impending $800 billion deficit increase due to proposed tax cuts, asserting that the latter poses a more significant threat to America's economic stability.

5. Wealth Inequality and the Intersection of Race and Class

A critical portion of the discussion centers on the growing wealth disparity in the U.S., where policies increasingly favor the top 1%, exacerbating economic inequities. Galloway underscores how race and class are inextricably linked, with people of color disproportionately represented among the impoverished.

Scott Galloway [21:55]: "America has become an operating system for transferring rights and money and democracy to the 1% at the cost of the bottom 99."

He advocates for a shift from race-based affirmative action to policies focused on economic adversity, highlighting the University of California's adoption of an adversity score in 1997 as a progressive model.

6. The Crisis of Masculinity: Challenges Faced by Young Men

Galloway passionately addresses the deteriorating state of masculinity in America. He points out alarming statistics such as high suicide rates among men, especially men of color, and the lack of male role models leading to increased incarceration and mental health issues.

Scott Galloway [57:18]: "If you go into a morgue in the United States and there's five people who died by suicide, four are men."

He attributes these issues to factors like single-parent households, societal stigmas around male vulnerability, and the absence of supportive male networks. Galloway emphasizes the necessity of male involvement in nurturing environments to prevent the emergence of a generation of disconnected and vulnerable men.

7. The Impact of Technology and Addiction

The discussion touches upon the detrimental effects of technology and addiction on young men. Galloway critiques how video games and gambling apps perpetuate addiction, reducing face-to-face interactions and contributing to social isolation.

Scott Galloway [78:03]: "We have what I would argue is a loneliness crisis."

He highlights the role of the "addiction industrial complex" in fostering dependencies that further alienate young men from meaningful social engagements.

8. Solutions: Individual and Community Approaches

For Individuals: Galloway offers practical steps for young men to regain purpose and build fulfilling lives:

1. Physical Fitness: Engaging in regular exercise to build strength and confidence.

2. Economic Activity: Initiating employment, even in modest jobs, to cultivate financial independence and work ethic.

3. Social Engagement: Actively seeking social interactions outside of digital platforms to develop friendships and romantic relationships.

Scott Galloway [80:29]: "The key to success is 'no', because you're going to realize ... eventually you're gonna get a yes."

For Communities and Society: Galloway advocates for systemic changes, including:

• Political Reforms: Adopting a Singaporean model for campaign finance to reduce corruption and enhance political integrity.

• Male Role Models: Encouraging men to step into supportive roles within their communities to provide guidance and mentorship to young men.

• Educational and Vocational Programs: Creating opportunities for young men to develop skills and engage in meaningful activities that foster personal growth and social responsibility.

Scott Galloway [90:08]: "Another thing we're starting to acknowledge is that women cannot continue to flourish and our country cannot continue to flourish if young men are floundering."

9. Parenting Strategies for Raising Resilient Boys

Christiana and Galloway discuss effective parenting techniques to support young boys:

• Allowing Failure: Letting children experience setbacks to build resilience.

• Engaging in Physical Activities: Encouraging participation in sports to promote discipline and teamwork.

• Fostering Social Connections: Supporting boys in forming strong friendships and peer networks.

Scott Galloway [86:23]: "The key for parents is what I call garbage time ... there's no replacement for just a lot of time."

10. Concluding Thoughts

The episode concludes with a mutual acknowledgment of the deep-seated issues facing men in modern society. Galloway reiterates the urgency of addressing economic and social factors to prevent the further decline of male well-being, emphasizing that the prosperity of a nation is intertwined with the health and happiness of its male population.

Scott Galloway [90:08]: "We have to figure out a way to have honest conversations with men around... how to find purpose, kindness, and a space to show their brilliance."

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Notable Quotes:

• Scott Galloway [05:10]: "The US is still the best place to make money and Europe's the best place to spend it."

• Scott Galloway [21:55]: "America has become an operating system for transferring rights and money and democracy to the 1% at the cost of the bottom 99."

• Scott Galloway [57:18]: "If you go into a morgue in the United States and there's five people who died by suicide, four are men."

• Scott Galloway [80:29]: "The key to success is 'no', because you're going to realize ... eventually you're gonna get a yes."

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This episode provides a thorough exploration of the systemic challenges facing men today, particularly in the realms of economic opportunity, mental health, and social connectivity. Scott Galloway's insights, combined with Christiana's perspectives, offer a nuanced analysis of how societal structures and policies contribute to the struggles of young men and propose actionable solutions to foster a more equitable and supportive environment.

Transcript

[Trevor Noah]

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[Scott Galloway]

I realized that if someone wasn't interested in me, someone didn't want to hire me, someone didn't want to invest in my company. I was going to be just fine. It didn't get in the way. I ran for sophomore, junior and senior class president. I lost all three times based on my track record. I decided to run for student body president where I went on to wait for it lose. But recognizing no is not the worst thing in the world is the key skill. And young men because of a low entry, low risk entry into relationships with bots or AI sex dolls or you porn have decided they no longer want to tolerate no. That is the key.

[Trevor Noah]

But I would suggest if you do get the no, don't say you're fine. You can say I felt rejected. You can say I felt like a loser. You can say I felt like I can't get a woman. You can say all these things but I think it's important with anti fragility to say but I know I will be fine. I'm still here. There's still gonna be tomorrow. It's not the end of the world. It should end. You're embarrassed and you feel stupid and all these things, but I love what you say like you will be fine. This is what now with Trevor Noah.

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[Trevor Noah]

Brought to you by Amazon. Have you ever gotten sick on a very expensive, very non refundable family trip? Amazon One Medical has 24, 7 virtual care so you can get help no matter where you are. And with Amazon pharmacy, your meds can get delivered right to your hotel fast. It's kind of like the room service of medical care. Thanks to Amazon Healthcare just got less painful. Where are you coming in from by the way?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, I'm. I have a place. I live in London, but I have a place.

[Christiana]

You live in London?

[Scott Galloway]

I do.

[Christiana]

What part of London?

[Scott Galloway]

Marylebone. Oh.

[Christiana]

What made you choose? I'm from. I grew up there.

[Scott Galloway]

I mean around this stuff. I'm an influencer, not a decision maker. My wife told me we were moving five years.

[Christiana]

Sound like a great husband.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, well, I'm on the road a lot, so she says I don't get a vote.

[Christiana]

Is your wife British?

[Scott Galloway]

No, she's actually born in Poland, raised in Germany and both my parents are initially from the uk, so.

[Christiana]

Oh, nice. So you have the citizenship?

[Scott Galloway]

I have dual.

[Christiana]

Okay.

[Scott Galloway]

I was almost drafted when the Falkland Islands crisis broke out, which my mom was not anticipating. Wow. Yeah.

[Christiana]

So your parents are British but you were born in America?

[Scott Galloway]

Born in America, yeah.

[Christiana]

And did your parents, are your parents still in America?

[Scott Galloway]

My mom's passed. My mom passed. My dad is in San Diego.

[Christiana]

Oh, so they stayed at State?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, yeah.

[Christiana]

Does he still have his accent?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, it's a Scottish accent.

[Christiana]

Oh, he's a Scotsman.

[Scott Galloway]

I love that. Yeah. If I could give my sons anything, it would be a Scottish accent.

[Christiana]

And what made your parents leave the uk?

[Scott Galloway]

You know, they just wanted a better life, I think. Why? A lot of people came here, they came here when they were 19 and 22 respectively, on a steamship from Glasgow, London, respectively.

[Christiana]

And man, your dad's from Glasgow? Yeah, well, Glasgow was a.

[Scott Galloway]

Where are you from?

[Christiana]

I'm from London, South London.

[Scott Galloway]

Okay.

[Christiana]

I came out to in 2014. So yeah, I was. Came out when I was like 26, just about to turn 27. Yeah, I've been here 10 years now. But I'm thinking about what my exit is and when I talk to Trevor about it all the time.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, really? We should talk about that.

[Christiana]

Yeah, I'm just like, I'd like to have a foot in each world, like, how can I build my career? So I'm like partially in la, partially in London because I don't know how you feel, but I find London very, like, grounding and, like, grounded in a way that I haven't found in the U.S. yeah. As much as U.S. has lots of opportunity and all of that, I'm just like.

[Scott Galloway]

I think about that a lot. We should talk about it.

[Christiana]

Yeah, we're talking about it.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, We. Are we recording?

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, recording. Oh, welcome to the podcast.

[Scott Galloway]

I'll be infinitely more charming and insightful then. So the way I would distill the difference between the US and Europe is the US Is still the best place to make money and Europe's the best place to spend it. So my crude, reductive analysis on someone at your age is you're probably still in the making money part of your face. There's more opportunities that will bump off of you in the US than will in triple the time in Europe. But once you get to a point of economic security and you start thinking about lifestyle, Europe's a much more civilized, sane place. It's great for kids.

[Christiana]

Yeah, I've got three kids.

[Scott Galloway]

You can get a much better bottle of wine for 10 bucks in Spain than you can anywhere in the U.S. the people are friendly, but the reality is the opportunities and the risk capital just isn't there. For every company in the US, there's 5 million in venture capital. For every company In Europe, there's 1 million. So there's just not nearly the risk, aggressiveness and the opportunities to make money in Europe as there are here. So I would say if you're. As I was when I was your age, I was very economically focused. I wasn't trying to be a better person or find a family or change the world. I was trying to be rich. And America is absolutely the best place to establish economic trajectory. Once you have money, peace out to Europe.

[Trevor Noah]

So this is actually a question I had for you. You know, I think when you say the name Scott Galloway, depending on who you say it to, depending on where they've seen it, they have a completely different idea of you, which. Which I actually love. Like, I know some people. I said, scott Galloway is going to be on immediately. Some of my friends were like, man, finally talk about masculinity. We've got to talk about being men. We've got to talk about. Then I say to some of my friends, scott Galloway's on. They're like, yes, talk to the man about capitalism. Talk to him about tax the business work. We gotta talk about. I'm on with Scott Galloway. They're like, oh, man, please talk about what's going on in America and what's happening in the world. And the conversation organically started in where you are, where you see the world, where you see America. Do you think that what's happening in America is bad? Or do you think there almost needs to be a new, I don't wanna call it a new world order, but like if we think of a world without like borders, the way we've drawn them, right. There used to be this general trajectory of people. They would work in a small town or live in a small town, grow up somewhere, move to the big city to make money and then generally they'd migrate back to the small town at some point. Now, if you think about generations that came to America before then, they left the small town, but on another continent. They've come to the big town that is America. They've made the money, but now there's no moving back. Do you think like America's always just going to be about making money? And where do you think that, where do you think that leads us?

[Scott Galloway]

Ultimately, I think what's going on is mostly bad. I think that there's a series of 80 year alliances. The post World War II order that was based on trust, reciprocity of free trade, a general notion that America might get it wrong, but our heart was in the right place and that we believed in rights, women's rights, civil rights, democracy. We would push back on autocrats, we would push back on war criminals. And those alliances feel like, or that playbook feels like maybe we're taking it for granted has been ripped up and just distinct of the morality of what I think is unforgivable. Surrendering to a murderous autocrat. Put the morals aside and just talk about it. Economically, we have some of the best trading relationships and mutual reciprocity agreements with the largest economies in the world. We trade, we get along, we trust each other, we're willing to go arm in arm with each other. Let's look at Canada, largest undefended border in the world. That says something about our friendship. Open trade. They led us into World War I. We followed them. They were in World War II before us, training Allied pilots. I love the test of that wonderful, very emotional test of friendship that the Holocaust survivor said to Buffett when she was saying, who are your real friends? She said, my test is, I think, would they hide me? That is a very puncturing question, right? And the reality is the 1979 hostage crisis, the Canadian embassy, they hit us, they hid six American diplomats taking enormous personal risk to get them out of the country. And then they stayed behind. And if they'd been caught, there's a good chance they would have been hanged by cranes. So the Canadians are willing to hide. Americans, they are really true friends. And right now we're in a situation where they don't even understand why we're trying to levy so much damage on their economy. So this post World War II order that America has been sort of the leader in is being ripped up. And I don't think it's a good idea. The silver lining, I like to think, what could go right? I struggle with anger and depression, so I consistently ask myself, what could go right? What could go right is that possibly Europe is finally a union. And that is they realize their rich uncle has lost his shit.

[Christiana]

Yeah, there's no more trust fund.

[Scott Galloway]

We cannot count on the $800 billion military umbrella and the economic, what I'll call consistency and rational thinking of America. And they are talking about increasing their defense budget from 1.9% of GDP to 3%. And I think that's stimulus. I think Europe actually coordinating because of the crisis around a lack of American leadership. The EU economy is $19 trillion. Russia is 2 trillion. Russia's actually smaller than Canada. So there's no reason that if the EU gets its shit together and starts coordinating and increasing their military budgets, they shouldn't be able to push back on Russia all on their own. And I think that stimulus and also the spillover of technology might actually create an upward spiral of economic growth in Europe. So I'd like to think the silver lining here is that some of the most advanced civilized, democratic economies in the world and some of the most robust economies are quite frankly getting their shit together. That Europe is a union for the first time in a long time.

[Trevor Noah]

Some would argue that that stimulus is part of the reason that we're in the problem we're in today, building our economies around the military, spending our money, and really getting things going by sort of getting wars going. And we've seen the effect that it has on an economy. You go to war, things start moving, you know, people start getting paid, things start getting made.

[Christiana]

But it's also war.

[Trevor Noah]

But it's also war. And like scholars who know far more about this than I would, when I sit with them, they'll say to me, you know, the US has always been very bad at actually understanding where Russia is versus where Russia says it is. You know, and like, one of the more salient examples was when Russia invaded Ukraine and the tanks were falling apart in the mud. You remember that? And I remember analysts were shocked. They were like, well, these tanks are trash. And we didn't know that Russia. It doesn't look like Russia's infrastructure is as robust as we thought it was. The military infrastructure. Right. And I couldn't help but think back to, like, the days of Gorbachev and all of these. Like, not that I was there, but like, when I watch documentaries and I read and I go, russia's bluffed for so long, and America has responded to that bluff for so long that some people argue that it's just a war of bluff that never ends. And some would say, and I wouldn't be the one who says it, but I always like to consider these crazy ideas. Some would say, although Trump may be doing it in the wrong way, he's the person who's breaking this thing, and it may lead to the right conclusion. How do you, you know? Cause I know you're always thinking about the pros and the cons of everything. Do you think in a weird way, Trump might be doing the right thing in the wrong way that gets the world to a better place, or do you think it was better for it to continue the way it was?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, I think on the whole, this is not good for America and the West. And I would just want to acknowledge that Eisenhower, a general, warned of the military industrial complex. He said, if you build privatized shareholder gains based on a war machine, you're going to invent reasons to need the war machine. Having said that, I would argue that we on the left are sometimes naive about the fact that the moment some bad actors believe they can come for us and take our Netflix and our Nespresso away, they will. And that I actually am a bit of a warhawk and believe in a very strong defense. I would also argue that just economically, two points. If you look at the most valuable companies in the world, whether it's Apple or Google, they're built on the backs of. Of middle class investments vis a vis the Defense Department. So gps, which is what all mobile technology is based on, was initially a technology developed for ICBMs to put them in the pocket of Gorbachev. DARPA, which is what the Internet is built on, was made by an extraordinary investment meant to create a hubless communications network so we could communicate with each other after the Russians nuked us. So I would argue that military spending, for the most part in the US has been, I would argue, a net. Now, that's not to say that it should anyway rationalize entry into Southeast Asia or into Iraq. These are disastrous positions. Now as it relates to let me go to Ukraine. I think of a manager, as somebody who's just supposed to allocate capital to a greater return than your peer group. That's their job as managers, the job of the president. He sees the biggest capital allocator in history. I would argue that the decision to allocate $60 billion a year to Ukraine is one of the best investments that has ever been made in the modern world. In exchange for that $60 billion, to your point, we've kind of defanged the reputation of this supposedly ferocious army of Russia. It was five days and Kyiv's fallen. Right. That did not happen. We've taken out a third of their kinetic power, a third of their tanks, and much of their navy has been taken out. Also, Russia is not a good actor towards us. Their intervention or introduction to our economy is to steal our IP and attack us from a cybersecurity. So them being focused on a failed war, a defenestration of their quote, unquote, ferociousness, and also sending a signal to the world that when the west binds together, we are a formidable fighting force. And all of this was without a single boot on the ground from America. In addition, that $60 billion a year, somewhere between 70 and 90% of it, has come back to the US to manufacture weapons, mostly in red states. So for about 8% of our military budget, we are keeping a bad actor occupied, reducing their military kinetic power and sending a message to the world that the west is a formidable backer of even a small, motivated army. I think this is the best money we have spent in a long time.

[Christiana]

Well, the thing is, Scott, I think the reason why what Trump is doing, from a geopolitical perspective, it's like a bad decision if we think about the real politics.

[Scott Galloway]

Yep.

[Christiana]

But to the regular American who's worried about the price of eggs, Right. Who is just like, I'm worried about my employment. I'm worried about the schools my kids go to. I'm worried about the housing crisis that's ongoing. And they hear you sent how much to Ukraine. So how do we kind of speak to those people and get them to see the other perspective?

[Scott Galloway]

I think it's through numbers and data. In terms of the very real, justifiable argument of, like, there's a lot of problems here, we should be focusing all our capital here. The $75 billion in USA, the $60 billion in Ukraine, I would argue, is nothing but a weapon of mass distraction to get you to look away from the fact that the tax cuts that Trump is about to implement will increase our deficit by $800 billion. And the problem is Democrats don't speak in language that people can understand. This is what a deficit is. A deficit is a tax on you and your children in 10 to 30 years. It crowds out investment in technology and education that create more growth. It crowds out our ability to have programs for younger people. Basically our debt, our entire federal budget is moving towards senior citizens. 40% of everything goes to people over the age of 65. Interest on our debt and the military. So we can't make these forward leaning investments that benefit you and you're gonna have to pay it back. Not me. I'll be dead by the time we run out of credibility and the treasury market fails. So all of this nonsense around, let's not Invest in Ukraine. USAID, bring the money home. The dojo. $2.6 billion in savings so far according to the Wall Street Journal. If you want to 6x the savings from Doja stop all subsidies to Tesla. So your job is to allocate capital. So I think the helicopter crash was DEI doja. Only male and female. The gulf of cheaper eggs. It's all a misdirect from the most irresponsible spending that we're about to incur. And that is you are about to incur A future $800 billion tax every year such that I can make more money. Essentially America has become about our fiscal policies have become the following. Give me your credit card so I can be in the club doing Rails and champagne and all you get to do is pay for it in the form of deficit. 60 billion is a decent amount of money, but it's Nothing like the $800 billion a year we're going to lose in deficit spending. I think USAID is an amazing investment for people around the world to feel good about America. I think pushing back on Russia for $60 billion a year and setting a signal that we are willing to sacrifice for democracies and repel murderous autocrats. I think that's an outstanding investment. $800 billion a year to give me a tax cut. Bad idea. And all this other shit is just a misdirect to get you to look away from what is about to happen. And that is the biggest tax increase in history on you and your children.

[Trevor Noah]

You know, listening to you speak sometimes I think to myself, it's often easy for us to focus on a problem in the moment and not ask ourself who played what role in helping us get there. Right. I like that you brought up like the Democrats or progressives or left leaning people. You know that old saying, a system isn't what it says, it is what it does. First part of it, when we talk about like what people could be doing and should be doing, when the Democrats had the power and they were able to do the things, you can't help but look at the disparity between what Trump does even illegally, let's call it, with executive orders or you know, beyond his power. He does the thing, forget whether you like the man or not, he does the thing that he said he's gonna do. The Democrats, when they've had the power that they had, didn't do the things that they say they're gonna do.

[Christiana]

I mean, Biden was pretty significant about climate change and infrastructure.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, this is in the term that they had with the power that they had. And that's true. He has been one of the more significant presidents, funny enough. But like, what do you think they have missed there? Or what do you think we are missing in that side of the equation where there's even that meme that I think captures it perfectly, where it's like Democrats in power, we don't have enough power. Democrats out of power, we don't have enough power. You know what I mean? It's like, is that a system that's broken or is it two sides that are playing a game very differently?

[Scott Galloway]

That's a really thoughtful question. So when you hear Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren rail about billionaires and then we need a progressive tax structure, which I think is accurate, there's some nuance there in the sense that. So I'll take you as an example, Trevor. I imagine you make an extraordinary living, but it's current income, meaning if you live, is your home here, are you a New York resident, you're probably paying 50 or 52% tax because the majority of your income is current income. And you're, you make enough money to be in the highest tax bracket. Now I've made my living starting and selling businesses and now I make my living buying and selling stock. My tax rate, I'm a Florida resident now, has been 17% for the last 10 years.

[Trevor Noah]

Damn, I'm doing things wrong.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, here's the thing. The people that get screwed are the super earners. And then your tax rate plummets when you become a super owner. So when I was in my 30s and 40s making an extraordinary living as a consultant or as a writer, I was paying 30, 35, 45%. Once I became a super owner, my tax rate plummeted. And this has been a conspiracy that both the Democrats and the Republicans of Foam ed. And where they come together is the following. And that is democracy over the last 30 or 40 years in terms of rights has become solely a function of how rich you are. Any woman in my life will have access to mesoposterone. I could be in the deepest, reddest part of America. And if someone I know has an unwanted pregnancy, we're going to have no problem if they start rounding up people. And people say that could never happen in America. Bullshit. It happened 80 years ago. We started rounding up the Japanese despite the fact many of their children, we're serving in the European market, fighting in our uniform. It could absolutely happen here. I think we're one economic shock away from. And who knows who the group will be. It might be Muslims, I don't know, or immigrants. I think it could get very ugly very fast. It's not a threat to me. I'm rich. I can piece out to Dubai.

[Christiana]

You male.

[Scott Galloway]

Some of that. Some of that. Although just to comment on that, I actually think in America, and this is a collective victory and we should celebrate it, I think you would rather be more non white or gay in America right now than poor. I think it's.

[Christiana]

I mean they intersect the group, most likely.

[Scott Galloway]

There's a huge ban over.

[Christiana]

Yeah, the group, most likely.

[Trevor Noah]

But you would rather say that line again though.

[Scott Galloway]

But you would rather be born in today's America. And this is a sign of our collective victory, but should also inform how we allocate resources and lift people up. Affirmative action should be based on color and that color should be green.

[Christiana]

And then you're gonna help a lot of people of color.

[Scott Galloway]

Yes, 70% overlap. But here's the bottom line.

[Christiana]

70% is significant.

[Scott Galloway]

Trevor knows kids. You don't need any help.

[Trevor Noah]

Right.

[Scott Galloway]

Your kids in America today. And we should celebrate this. You'd rather be born non white or gay than poor. The academic gap between black and white 60 years ago was double between rich and poor. It has flipped.

[Christiana]

But Scott, don't you think it's still concerning that 70% of the people who are poor are people of color?

[Scott Galloway]

But then the question is how do we help them? Letting in the Taiwanese daughter of a billionaire is not diversity or affirmative action.

[Christiana]

I mean, I've never felt that's diverse.

[Scott Galloway]

60 years ago there were 12 blacks at Harvard, Princeton and Yale combined. That's a problem. Race based affirmative action made Sense. This year, 60% of Harvard's freshman class identify as non white. But here's the thing. 70% of those kids come from upper income homes. So where should we go? I think most Republicans and almost all Democrats agree that some people are born with winds in their face that deserve a little bit of help. By the way, I'm talking my own book. I got Pell Grants. My mother lived and died a secretary. We were generously upper lower middle class. Well, I got unfair advantage in the form of Pell Grants because I came from a household that was considered in the bottom quartile. I think that's where it should be now. But what we have in the US is a conspiracy between the 1% and, and any administration that says you don't need to worry, you don't need to speak up, you're the most powerful. But bitch about it to your friends and wring your hands about what's going on, but you're not going to come out and speak about it. You're not going to refuse to go to his inauguration. You're not going to refuse to give him a million bucks. Because this is the bottom line. The rich right are protected by the law, but they're not bound by it. And the poor in this country are bound by the law but not protected by it. Your rights and your democracy have never been better if you're in the 1%. But the whole point of American constitutionality and democracy is that it's meant to protect the bottom 50. Rich people don't need democracy. They don't need rights because they have money. I have more rights than any individual in history because I'm rich. And that's what America has become. It's become an operating system for transferring rights and money and democracy to the 1% at the cost of the bottom 99. It is total bullshit. It is un American. And is the conspiracy emerging? And the reason why so many rich people are being quiet is because they're like me. They upload their W2s to ChatGPT. I'm gonna save 930 grand this year if the Trump tax cuts go through. So stop, stop. It hurts so good. That was a mouthful.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but I love it because everything you're saying for me, you know, speaks. It's funny, you and I had this conversation. A lot of what you're saying now is what Chairman Fred Hampton of the Black Panthers said at some point when he mobilized a coalition of poor people, right?

[Christiana]

The Rainbow Coalition.

[Trevor Noah]

The Rainbow Coalition.

[Scott Galloway]

Martin Luther King, don't forget the white poor.

[Trevor Noah]

He said. He said, when they tell us black and when they tell us white and they're Forgetting the thing that connects all of us poor. And he said to that group of people in that church that he gathered, he said, hey, listen, you may call me the N word and you may say these things, but he said, but look at your bank balance and look at our bank balance. We have something in common. So I'm not your enemy 100%. We're going to continue this conversation right after this short break.

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[Trevor Noah]

Episode is brought to you by Brooklinen. Your bedroom is not just the place where you sleep. Let's be honest, it's your sanctuary. And as we head into spring, it's time to freshen things up and level up. Think about the you that you want to be this spring. Breezier, lighter, with a little bounce in your step. Well, believe it or not, that can all start with a bedroom refresh. Yeah, leave the bulky, drab winter days behind and make you a better space for lighter textures and warmer vibes. Before you know it, spring will be here and you'll be easing into the new season. Shop award winners and fan faves in store or [e-mail] that's B R O OK L I N E N dot com and use the code Trevor for 15% off your online order of $100 or more. That's Brooklinen.com use promo code Trevor for 15% off. So like when, when we, when we think about that, like when we think about politics through that lens, did it fall apart when America said that, you know, companies or money is speech, you know, like Citizens United. Is that when it fell apart or was this like a gradual creep? Was this the inevitable conclusion of a place that was built on the idea of just money and the most money wins?

[Christiana]

And I do want to say something. It's actually shown that when black people do acquire some wealth or high income because of the communities we're connected to, a disproportionate amount of that income goes to other family members or friends. So black rich is actually very different from white rich.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, yeah, for sure.

[Christiana]

If we talk about that black kid at Harvard or Princeton, maybe they are like one or two generations away from having someone who wasn't a college graduate. So I think we should be careful when we do talk about, like, the black affluent class who's apparently getting all these handouts.

[Trevor Noah]

Right. But. But if I'm hearing what Scott's saying, and you'll correct me if I'm wrong, it's similar to. There was an author that I spoke to once from the UK and she had this brilliant dissertation where she. She essentially said, I cannot wait for America to get over its race war, to then realize that it's been a class war all along. But in America, specifically in America, you cannot separate the race from the class. But even when you get past it, let's say tomorrow we wipe away color, Then the real game begins. Then you'll be like, oh, wait a minute. Now we see what was peeled away. And to your point, class has become a signifier of race, and race has become a signifier of race.

[Christiana]

They're intertwined.

[Trevor Noah]

They're intertwined. But even when you dismantle them, you will then realize that they're not actually. They just happen to be intertwined in the same way.

[Christiana]

Because, I mean, I don't think the solve for all of this is black people, Asian people, whatever group, to become rich, or even the solve that we have for the white male crisis.

[Trevor Noah]

Is that what you're saying, though? I don't think that's what you're saying.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, so if you. To be fair to acknowledge the point, so if you look at. There is still an economic apartheid in the United States. Latino and black households have an average wealth of $20,000. White households 150. So it's hard not to acknowledge.

[Christiana]

And it's going to deepen with the great wealth transfer that's going to happen with the boomers. I think we have to acknowledge that when the boomer generation pass on their wealth, they're calling it the great wealth transfer. And that is going to deepen the inequity between black minority groups and white millennials as well, in ways that is unprecedented.

[Scott Galloway]

There's some nuance, though, when you normalize it. And when you compare black and Latino households with a college education to white households with a college education, things get normalized or evened out.

[Christiana]

They don't. They're also more likely to live in a poorer neighborhood. The New York Times did a great story on affluent black people who had the same income.

[Scott Galloway]

I think we're falling into the trap of the following. I think that the algorithms and the incumbents want us to be thinking it's black versus white and it's the old, quite frankly, old people figured out they could vote themselves more money. And an average 7 year old is 72% wealthier than they were 40 years ago. And the average person your age is 24% less wealthy than they were 40 years ago. Every economic policy in America is meant to transfer wealth from the lower 99 to the top 1 and specifically from the young to the old. And who it impacts most is people of color and poor people.

[Christiana]

I agree.

[Scott Galloway]

And the question is, how do we move to a solution when the Democrats got.

[Christiana]

What I wanted to say is I completely agree with you and I think what you have is a very fair reading. But I worry about us losing the nuance of the in of the collective experience that certain groups in this country have that are different.

[Trevor Noah]

That's why I say, to me it sounds like you're saying the same thing. That's what I'm saying. So when I look at it from two different places, it's almost like one is meditative and one is contemplative. Right?

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

What Scott is saying is if you blindfolded said we are going to help poor people in this country, more black people would be helped and more Latino groups would be helped because they are the people who are more poor. However, tons of white people will be helped because there are tons of poor white people as well. So he's going, what? The promise of America is being neglected right now to people who are being left behind because we're moving to a society where it's more like an oligarchy than it is an actual meritocracy. It's all about the compounding of the money versus where your rights are in relation to you. And now what you're saying is even when we're building these systems, we mustn't forget who's been left behind.

[Scott Galloway]

No, I just wanna use a model. The University of California, which saved my ass, I think, had the right approach. In 1997, they did away with race based affirmative action and they went to what's called an adversity score. What is your background? Do you come from a single parent household? Do you come from an economically strained household? Do you come from a household where someone is incarcerated? And by the way, the overlap, that's genius. The overlap is 70%. But what it also solves for is the fact that quite frankly, Trevor, your kids should not get affirmative action.

[Christiana]

Yeah, I agree.

[Trevor Noah]

I don't even have a Kid Cristiano, stop bullying.

[Scott Galloway]

This is what happens. The identity politics ends up enraging. How did we elect an insurrectionist as president? That's an honest question. And I think this is what happened. If you look at the groups that pivoted hardest from red, from blue to red, 2020 to 2024, it was three groups. It was Latinos who in my opinion, gagged on the notion that because of their identity, they were expected to vote some one way. Mexican Americans in LA are much different and have different priorities than Cuban Americans in Southern Florida. They pivoted the hardest. The second biggest pivot was people under the age of 30 who for the first time in the nation's history, aren't doing as well as their parents were at 30. That's never happened before. The third group that pivoted hardest to the right were women aged 45 to 64. And I believe, I believe that's the mothers of young men who are failing. This was supposed to be an election on or a referendum on women's rights. We thought that's what was going to save us for those of us who, who supported Vice President Harris, that women's rights were going to step into the fold. Women's rights did not show up. It was not a big swing vote in this election. What showed up, quite frankly, was struggling young people and their parents. Because if your kid is in the basement playing video games and vaping, you don't give a shit about territorial sovereignty in Ukraine. You don't care about transgender rights. That's a luxury rich, rich Democrats get to have, not us. My kids aren't doing well. And so they voted for chaos and change. And this guy is so coarse, so unconventional, so kind of non bullshit, quite frankly, that you saw people pivot hard from blue to red.

[Christiana]

Okay, and now this is where I bring in the race stuff, right? Black women overwhelmingly voted for Vice President Harris. Whose sons in this country are doing the worst. Who is going from the school to prison pipeline? Who was disproportionately impacted by the marijuana being illegal? Who's disproportionately interrupted by the carceral state, Whether it's being stop and frisk, it is black men in this country. So why didn't black mothers do that? Because we care about our sons too. I know, I care about my son. Well, okay, why didn't they make the same decision, but. And their sons are also in prison. If they're not in prison, they're downstairs playing video games as well.

[Scott Galloway]

But the data you're missing is the following black women overwhelmingly voted for Vice President Harris.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

But more of them voted for Trump than they did in 2020.

[Christiana]

Oh, yeah. I can tell you why that is. Why is that some of the immigration sentiment really resonated. Really resonated. And Tressy talks about it all the time. The idea of black jobs. A lot of people laughed at Trump when he said that thing about black jobs. But for a lot of black women, they're like, I know the jobs. He's talking about the jobs that my brother used to do and my uncle did or my father did. So I think the immigration sentiment also spoke to them and also VP Harris. They weren't. Some black women, weren't fans of hers, and they didn't feel like they should have to vote for her based on their identity. But I just. I kind of rub up against the idea that this cohort of white women voted because they're worried about their sons. I think perhaps they wanted to be protected under patriarchy, which is a very rational decision. And I don't. I mean, I may have feelings about it, but I Like, they're probably siding with their husbands.

[Scott Galloway]

That's a strange phenomena. And that is a lot of women will vote for what they perceive as best for their husbands and their sons. Yeah, but we all thought. At least, I thought. I thought Roe v. Wade being overturned. Roe v. Wade's another example.

[Christiana]

But those women don't. These women can't have babies. That shifted. They're not worried about getting an abortion. They're in menopause.

[Scott Galloway]

Fair enough. But, I mean, I'll give you another interesting stat where Trump was really brilliant. I'm fascinated by how he won. We're on a podcast, right? Trump flew into the manosphere. Crypto rockets, Joe Rogan, he flew right into the manosphere. He said, I am worried about young men. I relate to young men. I am coarse, aggressive. This wasn't the women's referendum election. This was the testosterone election. And he flew right into the manosphere. And quite frankly, it was brilliant by him going on Rogan. 40 million video views, 15 million audio downloads. He got more attention in 90 minutes than Kamala. If Kamala Harris wanted the same level of attention, exposure, she would have had to have gone on msnbc, cnn, and Fox every night for three hours, for two weeks. She absolutely should have flown down to Austin. He saw the opportunity to appeal to struggling young men and the people concerned about them. And by the way, the struggles I talk about, I talk about struggling young men a lot. They're even more acute for Young men of color. Yeah. A boy is twice as likely to be suspended as a girl. On a behavior adjusted basis, same exact infraction in school. A boy is twice as likely to be suspended. A black boy is five times as likely to be suspended. So we have an education system that is not only biased, in my opinion, against males, it's really biased against males. All these problems I talk about with men, whether it's suicide, opiate addiction, homelessness, it's especially acute among non white men. But this is something you going back to your question, when did this happen? I feel like America are lack and I'm an atheist, so I'm not suggesting that church is the answer. But as a nation becomes wealthier, its reliance on a super being and church attendance goes down. But into that void fall. We still need answers. So we try and find idols. And the new Jesus Christ of our economy are technology innovators, tech billionaires. Because this shit feels like magic and these people create trillions in wealth. So we're fascinated by them. And I think where we came off the tracks is this idolatry of money. When I was a kid, my dad's boss had a slightly bigger house, but we all went to the same country club, we all went to the same school. Money buys you everything from better health care to better schools to a much broader selection set of mates. So we have become obsessed, understandably, with money, the idolatry of the dollar. And these tech innovators has gone berserk. And so the pursuit of the dollar, in my opinion, has crowded out almost all traditional character. When the wealthiest man in the world, and probably the most admired man in the world is making Nazi salutes, we normalize that shit. Why? Because he's really fucking rich. Look what money has done to us. Look what it's done. If you had a friend who was making Nazi salutes at parent teachers conferences and was being sued by two women for sole custody, their kids and you had heard from credible sources that they were addicted to ketamine, wouldn't you move in and say, hey boss, something's wrong here. But not if you're rich. Not if you can put a rocket into space or make a shit ton of money with EVs. Money has perverted us. It has crowded out all sense of character, of decency, of what it means to be a real man. We have decided that you can get away with anything as long as you're rich. It's been a total, in my opinion, a lack of a moral failing. We used to admire cops. We Used to admire people who were had fidelity to their religion. We used to admire people who defended our country. We used to admire. The sexiest man I remember thinking that I looked up to was my principal. He drove a 240Z. He smelled like Aqua Velva. He wore these cool coats with an elbow patch. He can't get laid now. Do you think a vice principal has any game in any city?

[Christiana]

I mean, vice principal is a good job. I think some of my friends would.

[Trevor Noah]

Date one, I'm telling you.

[Scott Galloway]

Fair enough.

[Trevor Noah]

It's so funny how so many of the things you're speaking about tie into all the conversations we've been having on this season of the podcast. So you talk about the dismantling of a community. We talked to Robert Putnam and how you can directly correlate communities falling apart with distrust in the government and people now voting against their best interests. You, you talk about young men feeling isolated. We talked on the show about, you know, mass shooters and like, the psychology behind it and like, where these men are you, Cristiana, funny enough, you were the one who talked most about like, the women voting for their sons. You kept on saying in the lead up to election, you were like, you have kids?

[Christiana]

I have three kids.

[Scott Galloway]

You have three kids? How old are they?

[Christiana]

I have a five year old, I have a 19 month old and I have an eight week old.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, yeah, you're in the middle.

[Christiana]

I'm in the trench.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Christiana]

A son and two daughters. And I said, as I say on the show, I want my son to turn out great. I want my daughters to have great options for husbands. So I am actually invested.

[Trevor Noah]

But that's what I mean. And you know, but Christiana kept on saying it, no joke on the show. She kept on saying, I'm worried, guys, that these women are gonna vote for their sons and it's not gonna. And we were like, what do you mean? What do you. But I'm, I'm looking at all of these things that you're tying together and maybe, maybe there's two aspects of it I'd love to try and try and figure out with, with, with the help of your brain. First of all, I love that you talked about Trump and the paradox that he contains. Right. In that he is at the same time as being someone who lies more than most human beings we've ever seen. He's also strangely authentic. And no bullshit, right? It's a weird paradox. Do you think America, for the most part, has done a good job of being no bullshit with its people and itself? So that people make the right decision. I'll give you an example. Let's go back to Ukraine and maybe we can even talk about it through the lens of COVID a little bit. I would argue most Americans, when they're told why America should invest in Ukraine, they're told it's because of morality. They're told, we've got to help democracy. We've got to help countries stand tall. We've got to help. Why do you have U.S. aid? Because there's malaria in Africa. We've got to help fight these diseases. These poor Africans need our help. I think it would be a lot more honest and it would get to people more if you said, hey, hey, hey. You know why the things in America cost cheaper than most places in the world? Is because we have so much soft power that those countries have to give it to us. So you see, if you didn't live in America, this is how much you would pay for this. This is how much you would pay for that. This is how much you would pay for that. You know, when you travel and your dollar can buy you anything. Yeah. It's because we have the soft power. So you think we're helping Ukraine for nothing? Do you know who the largest exporter of grain is in the world? It's Ukraine. And I think sometimes America. There's been a lot of politicians who've made it like this morality argument, which in some ways is a little duplicitous. But I also understand it. Cause it can come with that. The two things can coexist, but they also don't tell the truth. For instance, if you help, I have friends who. Their programs have been cut by usaid. But a lot of people don't realize if you work in the business of tracking disease and you work in vaccines and you're around the world, not only are you helping, you're also doing two things. One, you're preventing mass migration. Where do people migrate to? When shit hits the fan, they're coming here.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

So it's like, help them in their country before they come to your country. I don't see any politicians on the grand scale saying that. The other thing that I don't see them talking enough about is how it benefits America and its surveillance. You get the data. People forget this. When America's helping the world track malaria or AIDS or whatever, you're also getting data on people. And data is power. Data is information that you can use to help your markets. Do you think there's a world where that would help? Where people get A little more real saying to Americans, hey, actually, we're not just doing this because we're nice guys. We're doing this because it makes us powerful and rich.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, 100%. I think so. For example, think of the world as 159 NFL teams, 159 countries. Imagine you were the one team that got first round draft choices. Every year you get to pick any player in the world because you're that one team. Everyone wants to come play for that team. That's America. The best and brightest all have one thing in common. They want to come here. I mean, it's just. And that. So that soft power, that brand imagery, that, okay, we make mistakes, but our heart's in the right place, whether it's the Peace Corps or USAID or our incredible products. Trump came along and basically saw an opportunity where Democrats and Republicans had been lying to us and afraid to tell people the truth and saying one thing in front of one audience, saying one thing in front of another. And he just came along and came across as very authentic, was crude and was coarse. And we got so sick of this kind of starched vocabulary from our politicians and not doing anything. And also corruption on both sides. Speaker Emirates Pelosi has been trading stocks. That's just blatant corruption. Right. And they would argue on the right right now that this at least, yeah, this is corruption, but we're just more brazen and more. Less opaque about it. You've had the same corruption on the left for a long time, just through lobbyists. And, you know, how does.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, the revolving door.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. How do these people get so wealthy? So, look, I always like to offer a solution in terms of money in politics and some of the corruption. I believe we should go to a Singaporean model. I think every one of our representatives and senators should make one and $3 million, respectively. And there's absolutely zero tolerance for any special interest group. Any speaking fees, can't go to work for a lobbyist. Pay them a shit ton of money.

[Christiana]

Because after you leave office, you can't go to lobbyists.

[Scott Galloway]

Five years Singapore model. They pay them a lot of money, but they say zero tolerance for corruption. You cannot take campaign contributions from a military industrial complex. You cannot take speaking fees. You cannot go to work for Merck or Pfizer the day after you leave office. And they pay them a lot of money. Because the incentives right now are, if you're a senator and you're making what, $230,000 a year, you may not even be able to afford Your home in Los Angeles and D.C. so the incentives to do what everyone else is doing and find different ways to take money. The thing that's most disappointing about Washington is I have come into some level of economic security is not that they're whores. I knew that. It's what cheap whores they are.

[Christiana]

How cheap are they?

[Trevor Noah]

Well, look at the Menendez story. My mind. Can I tell you even, like I say this as a South African, with my South African friends, we would talk about this. We were shocked when we found out that Senator Menendez did the thing that he did for like a Mercedes Benz C Class.

[Scott Galloway]

No, no, no.

[Trevor Noah]

A C Class. Not an S Class, not an ems, not a Maybach. I'm shocked at how many times America's corruption or even like lobbying and whatever comes up. And I can't believe how cheap the price is to buy America's soul from these people.

[Scott Galloway]

It's the best ROI in the world. Give a million dollars to the Trump campaign. Pay 40 million for Melania Trump's shitty documentary. Fine, fine. Right. The fastest growing expense line across Big tech as an R and D, it is an AI. It's lobbying. If you were to give $25,000 to each of the hundred senators, two and a half million bucks, real money. I bet every time you go to Washington, one of 70 of the 100 would meet with you in person. And influence is a function of proximity. And it's not them, it's the system they're in. The person who raises the most money gets reelected. So we've created an incentive system where they're basically paid to be. Pay for play, for God's sakes. Pay them a lot of money. They're important, they work hard, they're mostly good people, but zero tolerance for corruption.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Anyways, I think that there's just no getting around it. Money has washed over Washington. It's been weaponized by money. And we have an incentive system that is the more rights, more democracy as you get richer. And the reason the bottom 99 put up with it is that America's superpowers are optimism. Most kids believe and are taught you're going to be in the top 1%. I can prove to every one of us that 99% of our children will not be in the top 1%. And so we put up with a level of income inequality and rights accruing to the 1%. Because God love us, most of us believe my lottery ticket. I know the lottery's dumb, but my baby, my ticket's a winner. My kid is in that 1%. And the whole idea of America is the majority of our laws, the majority of our economic programs are supposed to help the bottom 50. And we've creeped into the situation where it's really all about the top one. And then the bottom 99 get 210 notifications a day that they're not in the top one. I mean just think of what we're doing to the self esteem of young people who are not making as much money. Rent's gone up, education's gone up. When I applied to UCLA, the admissions rate was 76%. This year it's 9%. But if you don't get in, you get Instagrams from your friends all day showing the amazing parties they're experiencing at ucla. Not only denying opportunity to young people, we're throwing in their face all of this wealth porn all day. And what do you know, we have the most anxious, obese and depressed generation in history. 50% of people my age feel good about America. 1 in 10 Gen Z and millennials feel good about America. Something comes off the tracks with one of your kids, the whole world shrinks to that kid. And I'm again going to solutions here.

[Christiana]

Have you experienced that with your kids?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh yeah, and you will too. It's just, that's just, that's what it means to have kids. The receipts for love is anxiety and grief, right? That's it.

[Christiana]

You know, come on Scott, you gotta give me the good things. Coming ahead scare me like this. I'm ready young. I'm ready.

[Scott Galloway]

When I was Trevor, imagine a less handsome, less successful guy. All I wanted was more money, more experiences, more women, more money, more experiences, more women. But I never felt sated. I never, I just. More fucking more. The first time I have felt sated. And you will feel this way. There will be moments with your children where you think okay, this is enough.

[Christiana]

Oh my children already enough.

[Scott Galloway]

This is enough. But something happens to them. And I mean none of this other shit matters. It doesn't mean anything. And for me, the unifying theory of everything and where I would like to see every policy reverse engineer is to one goal and that is every person under the age of 40 should have a reasonable prospect of finding a mate. More third spaces, mandatory national service, more freshman classes, vocational programming, more bars, more alcohol. Quite frankly, I think young people need to drink more. Make a series of bad decisions that might pay off. Let's give young people a chance to hook up. Remote work, no tax companies that don't have in person work, fall in Love. Give men a chance to demonstrate excellence. He's funny, he's kind, he smells nice. I will have sex with him. And then you have children. And every economic policy should be the following. Two people who are working minimum wage, $25 an hour, Universal pre K get rid of long term capital gains tax deduction, mortgage interest rate. Who owns stocks and homes? Me and Trevor. Who makes their money from salary and pays rent? Young people every, every policy in America with this prosperity should have one table stakes, and that is two. Young people should have the ability to find each other, fall in love and should they decide to have kids, be able to afford it. 40 years ago, 60% of 30 year olds had at least one child. Now it's 27%. Is it because they don't want kids? No, it's because they can't afford them. If you decide, by the way, not to have kids and you want to spend all that income on brunch and St. Barts, more power to you. But every young person should have the option to find purpose in their life through family. And they may decide not to do it. You don't have to have kids to be happy. But for God's sakes, if the most prosperous nation in the world can't offer people the prospect of meeting, falling in love, mating and having a reasonable standard of living, then none of this is working.

[Christiana]

I mean, I love it. I'm a Nigerian woman. I love weddings. I love the idea of a society making people getting married. I've been trying to get this guy to get married for years.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, no, you have, you have. Don't go anywhere because we got more. What now? After this. This episode is brought to you by Audi. The all new fully electric Audi Q6E Tron is a huge leap forward featuring effortless power, serious acceleration and the most advanced tech of any Audi ever. Experience technology that puts you center stage with a panoramic digital stage. Plus you can add an optional screen for front seat passengers so they can stream my best work or anything you want to watch. It doesn't have to be mine. The Q6E Tron is not just a new EV. It's a new way to experience driving. Learn [e-mail] always pay careful attention to the road and do not drive while distracted. You know one of the, one of the first videos I saw of yours, a friend sent it to me and you were talking specifically about mates and mating and relationships and people and you said something about, and I think you captured a deep feeling that not many people were Speaking about. And funny enough, Christiana talks about it a lot. I think that's why she's such a fan of yours as well, is the idea of the purposelessness that can come with not having love or not having some sort of thrust in your life. And I saw this video of yours and I remember thinking, man. Cause someone was like, what, do you think this is crazy or not? And I was like, I think this is brilliant. And also, it's so easy to prove in the most extreme circumstances, go to any terror cell in the world. Like, I'm talking like, isis. What are they promising them as well?

[Christiana]

Wives, women and girlfriends.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

It's crazy that even on that level.

[Christiana]

In the afterlife, in paradise.

[Trevor Noah]

But I'm saying even. Even before the afterlife, they're saying we're gonna go there and we're gonna take women, we're gonna get wives. We're gonna get. In some parts of the world where life is a little simpler, unfortunately, because it's harsher. You see that reality slap people in the face. My life is not going well. I'm joining isis. Because ISIS didn't just tell me we're gonna fight. They said, we're gonna fight. 2 get a wife and a better life.

[Christiana]

Also a key ISIS pay.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, they pay some people, but the.

[Christiana]

Reason they got more. At point, they got more recruits than Al Qaeda is because they paid you a bit more. Oh, yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

Well, they were smart in the business.

[Christiana]

So it's just like they gave them jobs.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah. So let's talk about the man side of this whole thing, because I love that you talk about it. The manosphere and the. Before we even get into that, I'd love to know, what do you think it is about you that has connected with a group that people would have argued, wouldn't have connected with your views maybe like two years ago. Cause if you wrote down on paper, Scott Galloway, this is what he believes in. He believes in basic incomes being this. He believes in healthcare. He believes in pre K. He believes in. If somebody had drawn that up and then somebody had put the crypto bros. And whatever we wanna call people, if we're putting them in a box, they would've said, oh, this person will never agree with that person. And yet you've made massive inroads with a lot of these young men who people have said wouldn't agree with their views.

[Christiana]

There are some young women. I'm a fan.

[Trevor Noah]

Oh, no, no.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

But I'm saying the men. But I'm saying the men in particular, where they've where people have just said no, you know, so what do you think it is that you are saying or what do you think it is that you are doing that is connecting you to them? And what are other people missing about connecting to them?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, first of all, thank you. Your comments are generous. Look, I started talking about struggling young men five years ago. And real insight is when you state something that's obvious, but people weren't thinking about and the data is just overwhelming. And that is no group has ascended faster globally than women. And by the way, we should do nothing to get in the way of this. More women are seeking tertiary education now globally than men. The number of women elected to parliament in a democracy has doubled in the last 30 years. In the United States, women in urban metros under the age of 30 are making more money than men. More single women own homes than men. Two in three women under the age of 30 are in a relationship. Only one in three men. And you think, well, that's mathematically impossible. It's not because women are dating older, because they want more economically and emotionally viable men. What you have in the US is no group has fallen further faster than young men. And it's for a variety of reasons. Biologically, their prefrontal cortex is 18 months behind a woman, so it doesn't catch up till 25. They just lack the executive function and the judgment. A big part is male abandonment. A lot of young men don't have the male involvement in their lives that is key. And even if you were to say that five years ago, the gag reflex was, well, what are you saying? Mothers can't raise sons? No, I'm not saying that at all. But the research is pretty striking. When there's a single parent household, and let's be honest, 92% of the time, it's the woman heading the household in a single parent home, as mine was, the girl in the household has the same outcomes, same rate of college attendance, same rates of self harm. In some, she's okay. The boy, the moment he loses a male role model, becomes much more likely to kill himself, much more likely to be incarcerated. What it ends up if you look at the data, is that while boys are physically stronger, they're emotionally and mentally much weaker. And we don't even want to acknowledge at one point, four or five years ago, you could get into trouble by even claiming there was a difference amongst genders in young people. And if you were advocating for men, you were seen as a misogynist because so many unproductive voices filled this void with Bullshit, thinly veiled misogyny. And what we have come to realize, and the dialogue has gotten a lot better and it's mostly been led by mothers, is that empathy is not a zero sum game. We can still acknowledge the immense challenges women face. The moment you had kids, your average salary went to 73 cents on the dollar. Corporate America has still not figured out a way to maintain a woman's professional trajectory when she decides to use her ovaries. At the same time, young men, if you go into a morgue in the United States and there's five people who died by suicide, four are men. If any other special interest group was killing themselves at four times the rate of the control group, we'd weigh in with programs. And finally, we're starting to acknowledge that women cannot continue to flourish and our country cannot continue to flourish if young men are floundering.

[Christiana]

But Scott, don't you think it points to the fact that a lot of men don't care about men? Because I think about the woman in my life, not just mothers, sisters, friends. We spend a lot of time worrying about the men and boys in our life. Whether it's give the example of a single mother is just with her son. Now, if a mother is absent from a friend's life, other women will step in and fill that woman's role. Why aren't men saying, well, there's a single mother down the street or I have a family member that's single. Why aren't men stepping in? Why don't men care about men and boys?

[Scott Galloway]

It's a great point. If you were to reverse engineer. When a boy comes off the tracks and becomes an unproductive man, the single point of failure is when he loses a male role model. We have the second most single parent homes in the world behind Sweden. And unfortunately there's a taboo. If you were to get involved in a 15 year old's life, if you were to look around the office and say single mother, say I'm Trevor, I'm going to a game. Do you have a son who'd like to hang out with me? Because you're immediately suspected. You're immediately, quite frankly, Michael Jackson and the Catholic Church have fucked it up for all of us. And that is if a man wants to be involved in a boy's life, there's a bit of trepidation. Is there something wrong with him? Is he up to something really mendacious or awful? Could he be possibly a pedophile? And this is such a tragedy because there are so many men with fraternal and paternal love to give them. Maybe don't have kids of their own or maybe just are concerned or see the problem, who are willing to weigh in and they're kind of told by society not to. And also, quite frankly, men are not stepping up. There are three times as many women applying to be Big Sisters in the New York Big Sisters program is there are men applying to be Big Brothers. In sum, if we want better men, we have to be better men. And you're exactly right. Men need to. There needs to be a zeitgeist in our society. Family court, neighbors. The moment a boy no longer has a male role model in his life, other men need to step into the void. My mom was really good at this. She made sure I'm still in contact with a couple of her ex boyfriends. There was a neighbor across the hall who used to come over with his girlfriend and take me horseback riding. I had men in my life and sometimes there are millions of young men right now, boys. The first male role model they have is a prison guard. Because men aren't stepping up. And I think of, I'm writing a book on masculinity. I think of concentric circles of masculinity. You take care of yourself. You're strong, you're economically viable, you're kind, you're a fucking monster. You have this unbelievable thing called superior bone structure, risk, aggressiveness, this amazing substance called testosterone. You protect others, you take care of yourself. Second circle out, you protect your family or a good provider. Next circle out, you take care of your community and your neighbors and you help other people. The ultimate expression of masculinity, in my view, is to take an irrational interest in the well being of a child that's not yours. And not enough men are doing this and it is so easy to find them.

[Christiana]

Can I tell you an idea I have? I wish more men made men who are bad fathers a pariah. Like if you have a friend that doesn't see his kid, he shouldn't be a friend.

[Trevor Noah]

So can I, can I say two things to this? Right, I agree with the premise completely. But I think it is important. Just as you do on, on all issues, I think it's, it's important to consider what the possible reasons can be. Okay, so on the one hand to what you're saying, I don't think like most men would not want to step in, et cetera, et cetera. I don't think so, honestly. But I do know from speaking to men everywhere around the world to what you're saying about, like, wealth, porn, et cetera. Man, men, maybe because they imagine it or maybe because they're experiencing it, a lot of men just feel like they've gotta, like, double grind to even get the basic. That first concentric circle to what you're saying has been crushed, right? And we've gotta consider all the ways it's been crushed. How have, like, the junk food companies crushed people's abilities to even, like, eat what they eat and stay healthy? You start with people's food, what they get access to. You start with, as you say, opportunities, income, being kicked out of school, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And I think you've also gotta consider what it's like to be a young man where the dreams that you are sold and told don't come true because the system hasn't been set up, as you said correctly, right? So I think, I think, I honestly believe that.

[Christiana]

I think I feel a lot of compassion for. I think any failed promise, whoever it's made to, I feel a lot of compassion for those people.

[Trevor Noah]

No, so I'm just saying in understanding that is like, I go, like, for me as Trevor, for instance, I have more time and I do make the time to be with friends or extended people's younger kids because they know me, so they can trust me, right? But it's like, all right, take him. Go karting. Take that one there. Do that thing there. But I have the disposable income and I have the time income as well to be like, yeah, I can do that and I will do that. You know what I mean? But I've seen for a lot of people, they go like, hey, man, I can't even get my shit together. Who am I to. You know, I think that's the first one, the second one to what you were saying. You said that you said the thing that you were, the proposal you had.

[Christiana]

Was, I think that you should become a social pariah if you don't look like. So, And I'll say this, and I've seen it in my community a lot. There are deadbeats and there is no consequence. Their friends still roll with them, their mothers still let them in their house, and they do not show up for their kids.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

And if a woman does not look after her child, if a woman even comes back to work early, I've had people DM me like, you had a baby eight weeks ago. Who's with the baby, right? Like, and I ostensibly think I'm doing a good thing. Do you know what I mean? And a woman who is not seen as a perfect mother is judged and vilified.

[Trevor Noah]

Completely.

[Scott Galloway]

I agree with you.

[Christiana]

Innocent fathers, there is no social consequence.

[Trevor Noah]

Completely.

[Christiana]

So I'm saying there should be a social consequence for not showing up for your son.

[Trevor Noah]

So now this is. I agree with you 100% on this. And because of that, I would like. I was so fervently in that mode that I would, like, fight with people on this. And then I came to realize something that maybe in this world we aren't addressing in the same way. There are many, many, many men who feel like they've been made a deadbeat dad. Do you get what I'm saying? There are many, many, many men who feel like they go, yo, this. And I. This is me now. Anecdotally, only anecdotally. I know some men personally who were good men, wanted to be with their kids, you name it. And the woman in their life was like, you see, we broke up. I'm going to make sure you never see these kids ever again. And I'm not saying this is all of them, so I'm not absolving it.

[Scott Galloway]

No.

[Christiana]

It's the inverse, I think. And it's. It's. It's evolutionary biology. They say that. What is. What's the saying? That it's a mother's baby's father's. Maybe a man is more likely to treat his. S. His sister's child with more love.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Than he is his mate's child or his wife. They've done studies on this. Because you know your sister's child is related to you.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

All that to say, I believe a man's relationship with his children. I don't. I. I know this is not going to be a popular thing to say. It's often connected to how he feels about the children's mother.

[Scott Galloway]

Yes.

[Trevor Noah]

No. But I agree with it.

[Christiana]

So for the most part, it's men being like, I split up with you. Yeah. I see you less. He gets a second wife and he's a really good dad to those second set of kids. I see that all the time. Less. So do I see women. And I'm not saying that these villainous women don't exist.

[Trevor Noah]

Yes.

[Christiana]

Who say, you can't see your kid. I think that's a cultural trope. We've.

[Trevor Noah]

No, no, I was just saying.

[Scott Galloway]

What.

[Trevor Noah]

Wait. I was just saying one. Please, please let me explain. I was giving you one. One that I know anecdotally. I'm not saying all of them. There's another one. And this Is again, the system that we've created in America in particular, and in many other countries, you get divorced, you get broken up with, whatever. Most of the time, the system says the mother keeps the child. The man has to pay for the child to be with the mother. And that money is calculated strangely in some places. Some places, Some people say it's very fair, some people say it's unfair, but it's strangely calculated. And now to what Scott was just saying, we live in a world where people already cannot afford the one house that they were promised. You know, in The American dream, 40 years ago, people could buy that house even on a meager salary. You know, someone was putting out the numbers recently and they showed that like 40 years ago in somewhere like Philadelphia, you could buy a house, you could put down the down payment for a house with like a month's salary. There's no way you can do that now in that same Philadelphia even, because houses have gone up way, way, way faster than salaries have gone up.

[Scott Galloway]

Right?

[Trevor Noah]

So. So from that perspective alone, I think it is important to look at a place like Sweden. I remember going to Sweden and talking to. It was like, basically they had like Dr. Fauci and I was asking him about, like, why Sweden has so many one parent household households, but so, so few of the problems. And he said, yes, but you're forgetting one thing, and that is here in Sweden, first of all, you are not a pariah if you are single. Right? That's the first thing. And secondly, you're protected by the state. It makes a big difference when your relationship with the other person is not determined by your money.

[Scott Galloway]

Just think.

[Trevor Noah]

Second.

[Christiana]

So I'm making a lot of excuses for men because mothers can't do the same thing.

[Trevor Noah]

No, but I'm saying why. I'm not saying it's an excuse. You see, there's a difference between an excuse and an answer. I think an excuse is saying you've done it, but there was nothing we could have done. And you're not wrong. I'm not saying you're wrong or right. I'm just saying, like, what is the answer for this thing? And I think sometimes when we look at the socioeconomic impacts of how in America, specifically how it sets it up when you are a dad that leaves the house for many men, it is difficult to continue being the dad the way you wanna be. Now, how they deal with it is shitty. And also credit to women. I was also raised by a single mother and I've seen it. And in our programs in Africa, we still do the same thing. We know you give the money to women. Cause women know how to make that dollar. Go further.

[Scott Galloway]

I think you're both right. One in six men, three years post divorce, have no contact with their children. Some of that is male abandonment. Some of it is just a total lack of character. You don't hear a lot about female abandonment because it just doesn't happen that much at the same time. Family court is also, you would argue, biased against men. Sometimes it literally impoverishes them. Sometimes also the reality is in divorce there's a lot of emotion and my parents weaponized it and tried to convince me to hate the other. And you're just more inclined to believe the person you're living with that the other person is bad. So I think that we need to change society and say, okay, regardless of how you feel about each other, you need to be supportive of each other for the kids sake. Post divorce, it's a nuanced argument with a lot of factors. But in general, there needs to be a zeitgeist in our society that the moment a boy loses a male role model, the community has to rally around that kid, the mother, the brothers, the uncles and the men to say we have to get men involved in his life. And that's not happening. It's not, you know, these, think about it after school programs, not as many coaches anymore, right? They're not going into work. My first job was at Morgan Stanley. I got a lot of male mentorship. I was in a fraternity. I remember my quote unquote, big brother in the fraternity sitting me down my freshman year and saying, you need to stop getting high every night. And I needed a 22 year old male that I could look up to. I didn't have a lot of male involvement in my life to tell me that. My first boss was a great guardrail. For me, young men need guardrails more than young women, quite frankly. Where young women get them. When a young woman isn't in a relationship, she reinvests. Oftentimes a lot of that energy into her friend network, into her professional life. When a man's not in a relationship, he oftentimes reinvests it in video games and porn and he sequesters from society. And a tremendous guardrail for young men that they're not getting is a relationship.

[Christiana]

Okay, Scott. I think a relationship is one thing. My husband, interestingly enough, was raised by a single mother, but had great male role models in his grandfather and his uncle. So I actually get concerned about how little trauma he has that's my worry with him. But he has this incredible group of male friends. They're really tight and they've all become dads at the same time and they take their kids out together. And I'm really struck by how much he invests time in his friendship. And even in that group of men, there's about seven to eight of them. A couple of them aren't married yet, but they're still involved. So if there's a birthday, they'll fly in, et cetera, et cetera. I kind of rub up against the idea that having a mate is the only arena these men can find care. Because I see a lot of women marry men and they're like, now I have someone to babysit. Isn't there a way that we can encourage young men to invest in their friendships and in a brotherhood and in their communities in a way that means even if you don't have a romantic relationship, you still have a really rich and fulfilled life. Just this world where my daughters are going to grow up and okay, the man does have a job or whatever, but she's going to have to look after him all the time. And if she doesn't, he falls off the rails. I'd rather like it be a man who has a really rich interior life and social network. And if he's married or not, or if he has a girlfriend or not, it doesn't matter. It's not as socially devastating.

[Scott Galloway]

I think you're talking about the way the world should be, not the way it is.

[Christiana]

Or we can perhaps make it.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, that's very nice.

[Christiana]

So the reality is, I'm not an optimist. I'm just saying that we have a.

[Scott Galloway]

But we have that in common. Yeah, a 30 year old.

[Trevor Noah]

I see why you guys, why you're.

[Scott Galloway]

A 30 year old. A 30 year old male that hasn't lived with a woman or been Married has a 1 in 3 chance of becoming a substance abuser and a strong friend. Network is incredibly important. But without a romantic relationship, men have a tendency to not reinvest in their social network and their professional lives the way that women do. You clearly have figured out that male friendship is really important for men. They open up to other men. They can express. The people who have the most job prospects are the most social. They have an outlet with each other. Do you think in general though that women, once they get married, are really supportive of men spending more time with their friends?

[Christiana]

I think it depends on the friends. I like my husband's friends.

[Scott Galloway]

Okay. Most women circumstances a guy Spending more time with their mates as a threat to the relationship. In addition, corporations don't want men spending a lot of time with their friends. They want them making more money.

[Christiana]

This is the difference. I don't really like men. There's a boys club and they leave me alone. It's a treat.

[Scott Galloway]

But the larger point you bring up is the following. One in seven men in America doesn't have a single friend. One in four men can't name a best friend.

[Trevor Noah]

Damn, that's crazy.

[Scott Galloway]

And we have what I would argue is a loneliness crisis. And the most frightening thing for young men right now, in my view, is that the deepest pocketed, most talented companies in the world are trying to convince young men especially that they can have a reasonable facsimile of life on a screen with an algorithm. Why go through the effort of trying to have friends and figuring out the pecking order and your social currency when you can go on Reddit and discord? And why, for God's sakes, would you ever go through the humiliation, the rejection, working out, having a plan, being funny, smelling nice, enduring rejection, feeling humiliated, figuring out a way to feel confident, showing the perseverance such that you can establish a romantic or a sexual relationship when you have porn. So what we have is, I think, unfortunately, we're evolving a new species of asexual asocial males. And they're the most dangerous people in the world.

[Christiana]

Very dangerous.

[Scott Galloway]

Because, and I don't want to pathologize them, we have a tendency to say, oh, they're the school shooters. Actually, the people they're most dangerous towards is themselves. They're much more likely to harm themselves than harm other people. But the one thing the most unstable, violent societies have in common is a disproportionate amount of young men who have no economic or romantic prospects. And we don't like to have an ominous conversation around mating. The reality is women mate socioeconomically, horizontally and up, men horizontally and down. And when dating apps are now where 50 to 60% of all relationships begin, the reductive analysis is the can you signal resources and are you tall? Men have very few arenas to demonstrate excellence anymore. If you talk to people who've been married longer than 30 years, 80% of them say one was much more interested in the other, and it was almost always the man was much more interested. But when there's no places when men aren't going into work, when men don't have third spaces, when they're not serving in the military together, they have no place to demonstrate Kindness. He was funny. I liked his hands. He was great at what he did. And so as a result, we have this dating environment where the top 10% get literally all of the interest and the bottom 90% are just shut out. And then they become very prone to really ugly voices that say it's a woman's fault. They're much more prone to misogynistic content. They're much more prone to nationalist content. So figuring out environments where more people can meet and more men, quite frankly, can demonstrate excellence such that they can get through the finer filter of mating. That women have the greatest innovation in history. It's not the iPhone or the semiconductor. It's the American middle class. And fundamental to that innovation was that 7 million men returned from World War II. They had demonstrated excellence in uniform. We gave them enough money so they could afford a home. We gave them jobs, and they became very attractive to a lot of women. And we started the baby boom.

[Trevor Noah]

And.

[Scott Galloway]

And we had such wonderful prosperity that American liberal households said, let's bring women into this prosperity. I know. Let's bring non whites into this prosperity. And we got along because the majority of our leaders had served in the same uniform. So they saw themselves as Americans before they saw themselves as Republicans or Democrats. But unless we figure out a way to level up young people and find a place where they can meet and fall in love and mate and they have the economic wherewithal to do it, we're just going to continue to generate the most dangerous person in the world, and that is a young man with no economic or romantic prospects. I coach a lot of young men, and one of the first things they talk about is they really want a girlfriend. And the first question I ask is, would you have sex with you? Would you have sex with you? Do you have a plan? You don't need to be a baller. You don't need to be rich. But do you have a plan? Are you going to vocational school? Are you thinking about driving an Uber and saving up so you can get a second car to have a second Uber? Do you shower? Do you have good grooming? Are you funny? Are you willing to endure rejection? Are you willing to try really hard? You know, would you have sex with you? And there aren't enough men. How many times have we heard, I've got all these great women in my life. They're so attractive, they're so shit together, but they can't find a man. No, they just can't find a man they want to mate with. And women are getting taller every Year, they're becoming more economically viable. It's leading to a lot more divorce, because, quite frankly, men are not ascending in terms of picking up some of the slack logistically. So it's like, okay, you're no longer a provider. And by the way, it's not like you're really picking up the slack at home.

[Trevor Noah]

Right.

[Scott Galloway]

So what women are saying, you're out.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

So for a lot of reasons, I think we have to figure out a way to have honest conversations with men around. Okay, this is what women are attracted to, signaling resources. That's the hard truth. You need an economic plan. Two, intellect. Are you interesting? Are you funny? Do you have interest in current events? And then the third thing, the secret weapon for men in mating that we don't talk a lot about is kindness. Women actually want someone who's going to be kind because it means you're more likely to be good to her parents and good to your kids. Where do young people find mates in America right now?

[Trevor Noah]

So when I think about every aspect of this problem, I think about where some of that potential is being leached out. I love video games with all my heart. What I hate now is video games have been made perpetual. So when you start. When I started playing video games, they ended. Was great. You played a game and it ended game over. You know what I mean? You finished Mario Brothers and that was it. And games evolved and you played whatever it was, you know, Duke Nukem, you name it, you name it, you could finish the games don't finish now. And so, like, in a weird way, the first thing I think of is what you're saying is you cannot meet these people and you cannot go on to do these things if you're perpetually stuck in a game that's been designed, by the way. It's been designed to keep you there, to keep you spinning, to keep you going. You also aren't going to think of being kind or funny when you're not around other people. We've shown time and time again being with people makes you like those people. As in, like, it makes you be more like them. But if we don't have third spaces where people can go without money, for instance, how do we get that? Like, where. Where are you going? I even ask people this all the time in New York and Manhattan. Anyway, I go, where can you go without money, honestly? Yes, you can go to a park, but beyond that, like in the. In the doldrums of winter in New York, where can you go?

[Scott Galloway]

You're from London.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

40% of nightclubs in London have closed.

[Christiana]

Down since COVID I know, I know.

[Scott Galloway]

Young people don't have money and they're also drinking less. But you were talking about kind of. I think our economy has moved from an attention economy to unfortunately in an addiction economy. And I think it's especially hard on young men who are more prone to addiction because they're more risk aggressive. I think basically our economy now, the kind of axis of evil is get people addicted to shitty food, to gambling, to porn, and then hand them over to the addiction industrial complex. The most valuable company in Europe now is a GLP1 producer.

[Trevor Noah]

Right.

[Scott Galloway]

And then if you think about young men, they're much more prone to addiction and especially gambling addiction. Six and seven gambling addicts are boys. 50% of college age men bet on the super bowl. And the net income of Las Vegas is down 40% this year because everyone now has a casino in their pocket. And the crazy thing about gambling addiction is that the addiction with the highest suicide rate is gambling. Because if you had a meth addiction, we would know it and someone would weigh in who cared about you. You can get out so far in front of your skis with a gambling addiction and no one knows.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, we talked about that on the podcast with Kya, my friend. His younger brother committed suicide because he was deep in gambling debt. No one knew until it was too late. Things spins and now this was even pre the apps in that way. And now it feels like, I mean, the apps run every sport now. The NBA, the NFL, they're almost sanctioned by the leagues now. They're the official betting partner of. Do you know what I mean? So let me ask you this then, Scott. Like, I like that you said you love offering solutions. Let's try think of a solution for the individual and a solution for the community. You know, as Christiana eloquently put, I think even when we're talking about race, it's important to think of who's most affected. And ironically, when men are disaffected, women become the most affected. You see it in like the rates of violence that women will experience.

[Christiana]

They become these dangerous men.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, yeah, no, definitely. So let's talk about it on the. On the individual side. There's a young man who's watching this right now.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah.

[Trevor Noah]

And they go, scott, I don't have connections. I don't see hope. I don't see anything. I'm watching this video on YouTube right now on my phone or on TikTok or wherever. Wherever I am. What are like three steps I can take that. Just get me on the path to moving forward, to purpose, kindness and a space where I can show my brilliance.

[Scott Galloway]

I love that. So I try to walk the walk. I try and coach two young men at a time. And the people I coach, quite frankly, are struggling. You know, I get a lot of people who send me emails and say, will you be my mentor? And I talk to them like, you don't, dude, you could mentor me. You know, I Talked to some 24 year old working at Google and he's like, I need a mentor. I'm like, you're just fine. The first thing I do, I try and do it in person, but oftentimes it's over. Zoom. The first thing I do is the following. I say, open your. Unlock your screen. I want to see your app time. And the first thing I do to put them at ease is I say to them, I gamble, I buy options. I'm not immune from gambling. I like porn. I try to modulate my use, but I like porn because I want to put them at ease. I'm not going to judge them. And I say, okay, everyone has an advantage. You want to lean into your advantage. Your advantage as a young person is you have a lot of capital, but you have human capital. Well, you have more time than money, but that's an advantage. We're going to find 8 to 12 hours of human capital of time in your phone. And it's so easy. Between TikTok, between X, between Coinbase, between YouPorn, in about three minutes I can get them agree to find eight to 12 hours a week of human capital. I'm like, all right, next week we're going to open your phone and you're going to show me that you took 8 to 12 hours of human capital out of your phone. And we're going to reallocate that precious human capital into three areas. One, you're going to start getting fit. You need to be strong. If you're under the age of 30 and you're a man, you're blessed with an unbelievable physiology. Any man under the age of 30 should be able to walk into any room and know if shit got real, they could either kill and eat everybody or outrun them. You'll be kinder. You'll feel better about yourself. Who breaks up fights at bars, Big strong guys. Who defends our country, Big strong men. You want to feel better about yourself. You want to be less prone to depression. You want to feel good about your mating prospects. You need to get strong. We're going to Work out three to four times a week. Two, we're going to start making some money. You got a smartphone. You can make money in this economy. I don't care if you're a Lyft driver. I don't care if you're a task rabbit. Go into a Panera. I was on the board of Panera. If you show up when you're supposed to show up three times in a row, you can be making 18 to 20 bucks an hour in about a month. Because you're going to get a taste for the flesh. You're going to find out that money is amazing. And when you start making money, you start getting good at it. You start figuring out what are the behaviors that get rewarded for money, where are the opportunities. And then when you find. When you buy shit, it gets your green glands going. And you start thinking about, I'd really like to go on another date. I'd really like to be able to buy my mom something. You get a taste for the flesh of money. The way you make a lot of money is by starting to make a little bit of money. No one starts off making 100 grand a year. Most of us have had jobs where we're making no money. And then the third thing we're gonna do is two times a week, we're gonna find ourselves in the company of strangers, in the agency of something bigger than ourselves. Church, nonprofit, a riding class, homeless shelter, anything kitchen, and the agency of something else. And here's what we're gonna do after a month of that, where the exercise. This is kind of 3A. I want you to approach a stranger and express interest in friendship. Or, this is a hard one. Express romantic interest while making that person feel safe. Right. Hey, do you want to watch the game this weekend? Let's go to the pub. Arsenal's playing liver.

[Trevor Noah]

Cool.

[Scott Galloway]

Do you want to go, hey, would you like to have coffee? An attractive woman or a woman you're attracted to. She's not dumb. She realizes, okay, you're probably interested in her. And that's not the goal. The goal is the following. The goal is no. You're probably going to get a no. They'll be nice, but they'll probably say no, right? And I'm going to call you the next day and I'm going to ask you if you're okay. And this is what you're going to say, yeah, I'm fine. And that's the key. The key to success is no, because you're going to realize. You're going to realize that the People who are successful, who have romantic partners, who have economic success, had a shit ton of no's to get to that point of success. This is the scariest stat I've read. 51% of 18 to 24 year old males have never asked a woman out in person. Think about that. They don't have the confidence or the skills to approach a woman and ask her out. That's it. The goal is the no. Because you get enough nos, eventually you're gonna get a yes. I can't tell you how much rejection I've endured from women. And the reason I am with a really high character, hot person is because I got comfortable with no.

[Christiana]

I have a question, Scott. I love the recommendations you get, you've given to men as a parent. There's parents at home listening to this. They're raising like preteen adolescents. What are the things that they can do to kind of push their sons along the right track? Is it delaying giving them a smartphone? Is it putting them in clubs? Not all boys are athletic. Do you know what I mean?

[Trevor Noah]

No. I'm laughing because my mom made me work at home.

[Christiana]

Oh, so you had like, no, no.

[Trevor Noah]

To what you're saying. And I just laughed thinking of it. Now because of what you asked and what you said, my mom, I think intuitively sort of figured it out. I couldn't get a job at a Panera. South Africa was different in that way. But she made me work at home. So she went, there are tasks and things that we need done and like, you know, some are physical, some are, yeah, but she paid me and she was like, this is your. And then she made me pay rent to live in the house.

[Scott Galloway]

Not really.

[Trevor Noah]

And she was like, this is your portion of groceries even. And it was this weird cycle, even though she was giving me them. And I remember asking her, I said, this is ridiculous.

[Christiana]

Money's going back.

[Trevor Noah]

You're giving me the money that I am then giving back to you to then have the thing. And she said, yes, honey, that's all money in the world. She said, that's literally what it's going to be. Your company's going to give you the money that you're then going to buy their product with and give it back to them and then you're going to give the government tax that they're going to then give you back with a road. She said, that's how money works. I want you to get used to the reality of it. But I'm sorry that it just made me think of that.

[Scott Galloway]

Do as I Say not as I do. I have not figured this out. I have. I have kids. My kids have done really well, but I.

[Christiana]

Well, then you have figured something out.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, but to be clear, they. They have, at different parts of their life, struggled with device addiction. You think if anyone would understand technology, it's me. I have kids who sneak into the bathroom and are on TikTok and have to bang on the door and say, start masturbating. Get off your phone. But look, the basics, right? I think the key for parents is what I call. I think quality time was something invented by executives who weren't spending a lot of time with their kids. I think the key is garbage time. I'll always take my kids, drive them somewhere, because what I find. The moments of real value and real emotional connection unfortunately happen totally randomly. You can't force them or predict them. You're taking your kid to school and he says, I asked this girl out. I'm like, what happened? And he talks to you about it, or. I don't think there's any replacement for just a lot of time. And then what? You were talking about chores. I've done a terrible job with that. I think sports and fitness is really important for kids. I think kids, especially boys, are like dogs. A tired boy is a better behaved boy. I think they just need to sweat and they need. I mean, I have boys, so I'm not as in touch with what girls need. And then the other thing that I've had trouble figuring out is letting them fail. My son was going to a party at the Westfield Mall. You know, kids are really into malls. 14, and it ends up there's two Westfields in London, and I got an Uber, and I sent him to the wrong one.

[Christiana]

So there's a Shepherd's Bush 1.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, I sent him to the wrong one's Bush 1.

[Christiana]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

So immediately it's like, his mom wants to call MI6. He's texting me, dad, you're an idiot. His mom calling me, I can't believe you did this. And finally, I blew up and by accident, did the right thing. I said to my kid, I'm like, you have an Uber app. You have Google Maps. You have an Oyster card. Figure it out. I'm done, Mom. He's gonna be just fine. When I was my kid's age, I used to leave my mom's house with a Schwinn bike and Abu zaba bar and 35 cents, and I would literally come home 14 hours later, and I had to navigate bullies. I had to Navigate stray dogs. And I failed a lot. And I realized this is absolutely the right thing to do. Jonathan Haidt, who's my colleague, he summarized it perfectly. We overprotect them offline and we under protect them online. I am trying to do a better job of letting my boys fail. All right, that's a bad idea. If you ask my advice, I'll tell you it's a bad idea. But okay, have at it. You think you can go to soccer practice without shoes? Just see how that works out. Have at it. I'm trying to do a better job of letting them fail. Because if you look at what happens at the freshman year at nyu, we have real issues now around depression and self harm. And it's for two reasons. One, and this is Jonathan's balliwick because they're on social media and they have a lack of self esteem, especially girls. And two, we have created so much bulldozer parenting and concierge parenting that we've use so many sanitary wipes on their lives that they don't develop their own immunities. And they show up to freshmen at college and they get their heart broken or they get their first seat and they literally freak out. So by the time I got to college, I don't know what it was like for you. I had failed a lot and I was, I had thick skin. Not thick skin, but I had calluses.

[Trevor Noah]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

So I'm trying to do chores, athletics, a ton of garbage time and letting them fail. But I want to be clear. I struggle. I have outsized emotional reactions. I get too angry at my kids. I say things I shouldn't, I overprotect. I under protect. I'm not. I am still trying to figure it out.

[Trevor Noah]

We're all trying to figure it out. And that's why we're here.

[Scott Galloway]

There you go.

[Trevor Noah]

Scott Galloway, thank you very much, man. Thank you for making the time. Thank you for braving the journey.

[Christiana]

That was fun.

[Trevor Noah]

This was really amazing.

[Scott Galloway]

Thank you.

[Trevor Noah]

Thanks very much. What now with Trevor Noah is produced by Spotify Studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions. The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Sanaz Yamin and Jodi Avigan. Our senior producer is Jess Hackel. Claire Slaughter is our producer. Music, mixing and mastering by Hannis Brown. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next Thursday for another episode of what Now Sa.