WORLD CUP Bonus Episode: Quarterfinals

Summary

What Now? with Trevor Noah

WORLD CUP Bonus Episode: Quarterfinals – July 14, 2026

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Overview

In this lively World Cup quarterfinals bonus episode, Trevor Noah and guest Ismail (likely football journalist and frequent collaborator Ismail Einashe) bring their signature wit and insight to dissect the highs, lows, and controversies of the 2026 tournament’s final stages. The discussion covers the emotional “World Cup blues” as the event nears its end, dives deep into debates about the expanded format, analyzes pivotal quarterfinal matches (notably England vs. Norway), unpacks VAR and officiating drama (the now infamous “cable of God”), and philosophizes on the nature of greatness in football—with an extended, heated consideration of Harry Kane’s international legacy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The World Cup Blues and Addiction

• Opening Mood: The emotional aftermath of the World Cup's looming end is compared to the end of a joyful vacation.
  • “The final week of the World Cup and what feels like the final week of our lives. I have to say this is probably my least favorite part of the World Cup.” (Trevor, 00:25)
  • “You know when you go on vacation and then it's about to end...I already, I don't know that you're feeling the same thing, but I'm having the blues.” (Ismail, 00:53)
• Expansion as a Fix: Joking about FIFA president Gianni Infantino’s ambition to expand the tournament infinitely as a solution for post-World Cup withdrawal.

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The Expanded World Cup: Good or Evil?

• Infantino's Legacy: Trevor and Ismail playfully debate Infantino’s motives (“cartoon villain” vs. “visionary”), discussing if expansion is a cynical cash grab or a true move towards inclusivity.
  • “I feel like Infantino, his end goal...is to expand the World Cup to the point where it's just the whole year.” (Trevor, 02:25)
  • “He knows he has us in a chokehold. He knows once the ball is kicked, like, you can complain and mourn, and once the ball is kicked...all is forgiven.” (Ismail, 02:47)
• Access and Economics: Trevor draws a parallel between broader access to tournaments and societal calls for equality (“football deserts”), with both agreeing on the upside of including more nations—both for footballing romance and for economic reasons:
  • “They’ll always say, by neglecting these markets...by not providing them the services they need...you’re losing money.” (Trevor, 05:17)
• Dilution of Quality?: Both hosts reject the anxiety that expanding “dilutes” the tournament: underdog teams create the drama and storylines fans crave.
  • “The smallest teams give us the greatest games...they give us the moments that make you fall back in love with football.” (Ismail, 06:43)

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New Seeding System – Fair or Flawed?

• Draw Mechanisms: They break down how the new seeding ensures elite teams avoid each other until the semifinals, but acknowledge arguments both ways about fairness and the underdog pathway.
  • “Some people can argue...it’s created a World Cup where the big teams bump into the small teams more frequently, which creates better games for small teams. On the other hand, people say it’s ensured their path to the final because they don’t have to eliminate each other.” (Trevor, 08:10)
  • “In tennis...the top two seeds don’t get to meet until the final. That’s how they make it.” (Ismail, 08:47)
  • Example: If small teams overperform and big teams underperform, upsets are still possible.

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VAR, Technology, and the “Cable of God” Controversy

The Incident

• England–Norway Analysis
  • Ismail laments his game predictions, shifting to a detailed review of key moments, notably the “cable incident” (“the cable of God”): a potential VAR-era scandal where a cable may have altered the ball’s trajectory, contributing to England’s decisive goal. (13:17–21:30)
  • FIFA claimed the sensor in the new “snicker” ball wasn’t triggered, leading to heated debate about new technology not being adequately tested.
• Philosophy of Fairness
  • Trevor emphasizes that football’s drama comes from its imperfections; total accuracy isn’t the point—“fairness” and transparency matter more.
  • “The point of sport is not to be 100% accurate. It is to be fair.” (Trevor, 26:57)
• FIFA and Cover-Ups
  • Trevor argues FIFA’s denial is worse than admitting a mistake: “The cover-up is always worse than the crime.” (Trevor, 24:51)

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Individual Greatness vs. System Players

• Jude Bellingham’s Coming-of-Age
  • Ismail praises Jude Bellingham’s “personality” and ability to seize the moment for England, relating it to how the greatest players put their stamp on every World Cup.
    • “Great players always impose their personality on the World Cup. Great players always bend the World Cup to their will.” (Ismail, 29:41)
• Redefining Footballing Greatness
  • Extended, playful argument over whether Harry Kane is merely a great striker or also a great “clutch” or “architect” player in international football.
  • Ismail’s “Fraud Watch” on Harry Kane: catalogues Kane’s history of underwhelming on the biggest international occasions despite club-level excellence.
    • “Harry Kane has disappeared way too many times in big moments. That’s why I have him on fraud watch.” (Ismail, 36:28 and extended through 39:46)
  • Trevor pushes for a nuanced view, arguing for different “greatness” archetypes: greatest at your position versus greatest at big moments (“the catalyst”).
  • “Maybe sometimes we need to define a player's greatness for their position, and then sometimes...for their ability to be a clutch player, more than just a clutch player, but an architect.” (Trevor, 33:18)

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Analysis of Key Matches

England vs. Norway

• Main Talking Points:
  • “Cable of God” incident (20:08–23:00)
  • Soloth’s missed opportunity on a 2v1 with Haaland, arguably the real cause of Norway’s defeat. (17:34–18:39)
    • “The moment where Norway loses their game is the moment where Soloth is on a break ... Soloth not only stumbles and doesn't look up and doesn't pass to Haaland, he also just doesn't make a decision himself. Like, it's one of the strangest moments I've ever seen.” (Trevor, 17:34–18:12)
  • Bellingham’s late impact (“when the pressure is on…” Ismail, 31:21)

Egypt vs. Argentina

• Refereeing and Missed Opportunities:
  • Trevor highlights fans’ tendency to focus on controversial calls rather than the team’s own errors, e.g., a crucial moment during Egypt’s last-ditch break against Argentina where Salah is wrongly dispossessed by his own teammate. (14:39–16:11)

Looking Ahead: Predictions

• Argentina vs. England: Ismail confidently predicts a 3-0 win for Argentina.
  • “That’s my prediction, yes. I’m taking down my balls, slapping them on this table. 3-nil.” (Ismail, 45:35)
• Spain vs. France: Predicts Spain win 2-1, citing a stylistic advantage.
  • “I think Spain is going to win it 2-1, because I think Spain is a team built to actually beat France...for the first time they're going to be forced to defend.” (Ismail, 47:33)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Infantino and Expansion:
  • “Infantino is both, you could say, corrupt and evil in a very cartoonish way, like Dr. Evil. But he knows he has us in a chokehold!” (Ismail, 02:36)
• World Cup Format Parallels to Society:
  • “These are like food deserts. But football. These are football deserts. Yes. And Infantino is like, I'm trying to bring...” (Ismail, 04:38)
• On the Cable of God:
  • “You called it the cable of God. I called it the cable of God. That’s what it is.” (Trevor, 13:21)
• On Jude Bellingham:
  • “Great players always impose their personality on the World Cup. They don’t just show up, they decorate the tournament of the world.” (Ismail, 29:41)
• On Harry Kane:
  • “Great nines don’t open up space, they are not Walmart greeters. My striker shouldn’t be defending. I judge my striker purely—is he putting the ball in the net?” (Ismail, 38:06)
• On Sports and Society:
  • “Football is the ultimate reflection of life...I can learn all my lessons on a football pitch for life.” (Trevor, 25:05)

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Timestamps for Noteworthy Segments

• 00:25 – World Cup blues and Infantino’s expansion as a “solution”
• 06:40 – Debate: expansion “diluting” the Cup vs. adding magic
• 08:10 – New seeding system, “easy runs,” and fairness
• 13:17 – England-Norway: key incidents—Soloth’s miss, cable controversy breakdown
• 20:08 – Discussion: “Cable of God,” VAR, FIFA technology
• 26:57 – Sport as about fairness, not perfection
• 29:19 – Jude Bellingham’s impact and what makes a player “World Cup great”
• 36:28 – The Harry Kane debate: role vs. ‘clutch’ greatness, “fraud watch” origins
• 45:34 – Ismail’s bold predictions: Argentina 3-0 England; Spain to upset France

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Tone & Flow

• The conversation is witty, quick-paced, and often jocular, with tangents comparing football culture to broader economics, politics, and even cinema.
• Trevor frequently pulls football out of its own context for fresh analogies, while Ismail is the more impassioned purist, especially about “legacy” and sporting myth.
• Both speakers mix punditry, banter, and deep fandom, making the episode highly engaging for both serious followers and casual listeners.

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Conclusion

This episode encapsulates everything lively and contentious about World Cup football: celebration of its global diversity, frustration and humor about its governance, forensic analysis of defining matches and moments, and enduring debates about what real greatness means on the world's stage. Whether you missed the games or want to relive their emotional drama, Trevor and Ismail serve up a rich, unfiltered recap that brings the tournament—and all its messy magic—to life.

Transcript

[A]

This episode is brought to you by Verizon. As an official sponsor of the FIFA World Cup 2026, Verizon is bringing once in a lifetime experiences to their customers. Free tickets to matches, pitch side access during gameplay, and meet and greets with soccer legends. If you're not with Verizon, no sweat. Stop by a Verizon store to get in on the action and learn about their offers for new customers. No one gets you closer to the FIFA World Cup 2026 than Verizon. This is what now with Trevor Noah. Well, welcome to it. The final week of the World cup and what feels like the final week of our lives. I have to say this is probably my least favorite part of the World Cup.

[B]

Ismail. Yeah. You know when you're tending towards the end, I already, I don't know that you're feeling the same thing, but I'm having the blues. Like, you know when you go on vacation.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then it's about to end like two days away and you're like, now I have to go back to my normal work day. I have to go back to the plantation.

[A]

It's just like a, it's just like fading away from, from all the joy. Fading away. I almost wish they had a, like a come down routine from the World Cup. They should have the World cup and then what they should do is they should replay or reinvent some of the matches that we didn't get to see just to let us. You know what I mean?

[B]

You don't want to quit. Called Turkey.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

But for the World Cup, I mean,

[A]

when you put it that way, yeah, I'll accept it because I am addicted. But yeah, like, I wish, I wish they just had like a, you know, let's, let's have a few other games. Could we see Brazil versus Spain maybe?

[B]

Oh, oh, okay.

[A]

Could we see Argentina? Yeah, just like, just like, you know, you know, for, for fun. For fun. They can play for Haaland's raccoon.

[B]

No, I'll tell you one thing, that Monday, next Monday is going to be rough.

[A]

Yeah, it will be, man.

[B]

Next Monday is going to be rough because you're going to be looking back like, oh, my God. There are people who are going like, who can't wait for next Monday. There are probably spouses who are like, we can't wait for next month.

[A]

Spouses, family members. Everyone in the house who didn't have access to the tv.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Is now excited.

[B]

Who doesn't have access to their own family member who is addicted, who has been thinking, Harland Messi. Ken. Now they can finally give the kids attention. They can finally. Yeah.

[A]

I mean, this is why. This is why infantino is proposing 64, expanding the World Cup.

[B]

I feel like.

[A]

I feel like Infantino, his end goal. His end goal is to expand the World cup to the point where it's just the whole year.

[B]

No, I think to expand it to the point where it's the World cup

[A]

where every nation competes.

[B]

Yes. Like, literally, because he. He knows, and I think I told you this before, Infantino is both, you could say, corrupt and evil in a very cartoonish way, like In a very Dr. Evil kind of way. But he knows he has us in a chokehold. He knows once the ball is kicked, like, you can complain and mourn, and once the ball is kicked.

[A]

Yeah. But I think to call him a villain is to simplify it too much. I don't think Infantino's a villain. I think he's just in charge of a thing that we love more than anything.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And just like any organization, especially like a multinational organization, there's elements of it that we'll disagree with. Okay, but who of us can deny the expanded format was better for the fans, was better for the World cup, and was better for the world?

[B]

I'll give it up to him. We'll give it up. The reason I call him a villain is because he's using this thing that we love, like Dr. Evo. He's using it to achieve his dreams of global domination. That's what Infantinos is doing. And the thing is, every once in a while, he gets proven right. Like, he can't argue. We. We complained bitterly about the expansion, remember? Africans. Maybe not as much, maybe smaller nations, not as much because we're like, oh, this is our chance to actually get in. But the bigger countries rewind, and then look what happened. He has been proven right again.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Has gone and done it again.

[A]

If it's. If it's expanded to 64 nations, I think it would be. There would be no third place. It would just be. We just go straight into Knockouts would be more efficient, actually, but they would just, like, be more.

[B]

There would also be more money. That's what. But that's the thing. That's why. That's why I'm calling him evil.

[A]

Okay, but isn't this. Isn't this. Okay, but wait. Let's. Let's. Let's. Let's talk about this for a second.

[B]

Okay?

[A]

Isn't this what we always argue about? Let's take it out of football.

[B]

Okay?

[A]

Right the thing we'll often argue about in society is we'll say we want to try and make things more accessible. We're like, you know, why aren't there more grocery stores in poor neighborhoods? And why don't we give poor children access and blah, blah, blah. Now, right? This is the thing that we.

[B]

That we say, no, something has just come in my mind. Go, go. No, because we talked about more access to food in poor neighborhoods. I started thinking of Uganda and Kenya and Tanzania, and I'm like, oh, my God, these are like food deserts. But football. These are football deserts. Yes. And in patina is like, I'm trying to bring.

[A]

No, and what we. What we'll always argue in society is we'll say, we've got to bring it.

[B]

Now.

[A]

A lot of people will say, that's charity. That's. Well, come on, let them. But economists who often step into the fray will say the same thing. We are neglecting X amount of dollars or euros or whatever currency you want to use. They'll always say, by neglecting these markets. Yes. By underserving them.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

By not providing them the services they need, by not making sure that they have trees and parks and all that. They will show you a dollar amount that you're losing.

[B]

I like how you've taken it completely out of football, but think about it.

[A]

They'll show you a dollar amount. So they'll show you how much money traffic is costing you. They'll show you how much money bad health care is costing you. They'll show you how much money not having maternity leave is costing you. They'll show. Do you get what I'm saying?

[B]

Yes. No, I hear you.

[A]

So if you can, if you can boil access, equitable access, down to money as well. The upside. There should be an upside, like.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And don't get me wrong, I know I'm playing devil's advocate here, but I go. Shouldn't the reward for including.

[B]

And you know, when you say devil's advocate, you're literally playing devil's advocate with Infantino. Because. No, but. No, but. Go. I'm sorry for interrupting.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

About it.

[A]

Shouldn't. Shouldn't there be a reward for inclusion, inclusivity?

[B]

There should be a reward. No, there should be. And the thing is. And again, I hate being on your side and I hate being on Infantino's side. But people said the World cup would be diluted.

[A]

Join us.

[B]

Embrace the dark side. Embrace the dark side. Accept that. No, here's the thing. People complained and I was among them. But because I Come from a small country. I also saw where Infantino was, how it would benefit me. But people complained about how this would dilute the World cup, how this would devalue the greatest tournament in world football. And look, the smallest teams give us the greatest games.

[A]

Yeah. The greatest storylines as well, kept like

[B]

Kurasa scoring that goal against Germany. It gave us. They give us the moments that make you fall back in love.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

With football. The romance of it all.

[A]

Yes. The only, the only thing I might disagree with. Look, I don't know how I feel about it yet because I'm, I'm, you know, recency bias is obviously in effect right now. A lot of people have been confused as to why Argentina had a quote, unquote, easy run. A lot of people have confused as to, like, why England had a quote, unquote easier run. France, etc. They're going like, ah, but how are these teams meeting? And so a lot of people don't remember that FIFA changed the way they created their draw before this World cup seeding.

[B]

They ceded them the way they seed.

[A]

Yeah. And so what they said was, we're going to change the format. And so for this World cup, For World Cup 2026, the top seeds cannot. The top four seeds cannot meet each other before the semi finals. Now, they could get knocked out.

[B]

Yes, yes, yes.

[A]

You know what I mean? They could get knocked out. Like Norway could have knocked out England. Yes.

[B]

Egypt could have knocked out Egypt could

[A]

have knocked out Argentina, etc. So it's not about making sure they get to the semi final, but their goal was that the top four seeds wouldn't meet before the semi final. Now, on one hand, some people can argue what it's done is it's created a World cup where the big teams bump into the small teams more frequently, which creates better games for small teams.

[B]

Dreams for the small teams. Yeah.

[A]

As, as you've seen, like the team from Cape Verde all said, this was our dream. We never, we never imagine this. Right. On the other hand, people say it's ensured their path to the final because they don't have to eliminate each other. I think both arguments have merit, you know, because I like how you are

[B]

literally like the evil angel on Infantino is one shoulder and then you're the good angel on the other shoulder. You're like giving him props. But you're also going to.

[A]

Yeah, but I mean, both, both things are true.

[B]

No, I'll say this because in tennis, and again, I know people struggle with the seeding system. So in tennis, Alcaraz and Cena.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Will either meet in the final or they won't meet at all. That's how they make it. They go like, the top two seeds don't get to meet till the final because it's.

[A]

Because it'll spoil the game.

[B]

No, no, it's. They're trying to go, like, if they. If everything happens the way it's. If in our dream scenario, the top. The final should be the top two. But then, remember, the top two have to meet the top three and top four.

[A]

So they have to meet.

[B]

They go meet, like, slightly stronger opposition as they go on, and that's how it should be. And so for me, I understand people, because people will go like, oh, but Spain topped their group, but then they end up facing. FIFA is not rewarding you for just last year's performance. It's rewarding you for over five years of performance. That's how they see. So Argentina has almost won every competition they have been in. Two Copa Americas, the World Cup. They're the top seed in South America. They shouldn't be meeting France at any point. France has been playing so well in Europe for the past five years, they shouldn't be meeting Argentina. So you're being rewarded.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

For the good work you've put in over a considerable number of years. And for me, I'm all for it,

[A]

but don't you think it robs us as the fans, maybe, and it robs the smaller teams of the opportunity to pull a Croatia in the semi final. To pull a. Who else? Morocco in the semi final.

[B]

No, it doesn't.

[A]

To pull a. You know what I mean?

[B]

No, it doesn't.

[A]

You don't think it does?

[B]

No. Because for me, if the small teams overperform and one or two of the big teams underperform, then the top seeds will meet somewhere. Does that make sense? They'll meet before. For me, the way I look at it, because you're talking about the top four, but remember, England, Brazil, Portugal, those teams will meet at some point. They're not the top four person, but they're top heavyweights.

[A]

I hear what you're saying.

[B]

So Argentina.

[A]

No, no, I hear what you're saying.

[B]

I don't even think they needed this because Argentina in 2018, remember, they messed up and they lost their game against Croatia.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And what was their reward? Instead of taking the easier path that Croatia ended up taking, they ended up meeting France in the next round and Mbappe knocked them out. So for me, it works. For me, I like the seeding. It works in basketball, the number, the top seed in basketball in the playoffs meets number eight. The Golden State warriors are not going to meet the Lakers in the first game.

[A]

Well, yeah, I guess, I guess it also sets up. The idea behind it is, and I think we forget this sometimes, the idea is also that we don't end up with a lopsided end of a tournament.

[B]

Yes. Thank you. Yes. Where Kurasaw is playing Cape Vibe.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You don't. Not even Curacao, Cape Kurusa, Cape Wood would actually be a great game.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

I think you actually. What they don't want is it to be quite Curacao versus Germany somehow or Kurasa versus France versus.

[B]

Yes. When everyone comes in going like, oh, this is. Yes. Yeah.

[A]

You know, where that, where that final game doesn't seem like people go. You know, we always say this, even in football. We'll be like, that was the real final.

[B]

Yes, yes. The final before the final.

[A]

It was the final before the final.

[B]

You don't want, you don't want that. In the round of 16, the big

[A]

teams in the Champions League will meet in the quarters or the semis and then on the other side there's like a random team that's coming in from, you know, Border Glim. Yeah, exactly. Good for them. But I would argue on a business side, and that's respectable.

[B]

Yes. Yeah.

[A]

People are less inclined to watch because everyone expects one team to win and if they don't, people are just like, ah, what happened?

[B]

People hate to admit it. Not sports fans because we are very, we tend to be very realistic. People want George Foreman, Muhammad Ali.

[A]

Yeah. That's what they're trying to make.

[B]

Heavyweights just throwing haymakers at each other. Yeah. They don't want like George Foreman just as versus Joe P. Oh, and then Jopi is knocked out in the first place. What a fight. How long do you think you could last? I think I would last five seconds by running around the ring, running as fast as possible. And then I would last a bit longer if I just ran out of the ring and then out of the stadium and then just continued on my way home. Back, back home to Uganda.

[A]

Let's talk about some of the big games that we saw leading up to this. England, Norway.

[B]

Your.

[A]

You know, I, I. Can I tell you why I feel bad for you? You predicted Norway would win to one. Yeah. Yes. And I sometimes think predictions can be undone by random acts of God.

[B]

Yes, you're right.

[A]

Do you know what I mean?

[B]

I was on a good run as well, by the way.

[A]

You Were on a good run.

[B]

I was on a good run. Just predicting scorelines. Brazil went to one.

[A]

You're on a good run.

[B]

Yeah, just going on Brazil, Norway, two. One.

[A]

Yeah. England, Norway. So Morocco, France, two.

[B]

I was on a good run and then the cable happened. Yeah.

[A]

Well, okay. No, but let's talk about this. Okay. So let's break the game down. There are a few storylines from the England Norway game that I think have still got people talking. One is the. The cable. Yes, The. You know, the.

[B]

The sky.

[A]

Yeah. The mysterious cable that did or did not happen.

[B]

You called it the cable of God.

[A]

I called it the cable of God. That's what it is. You know, we've got the Harlan Soloth incident. I think those are like, the big ones in the game.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Right. And then my first instinct, I would say I don't think the penalty call was like a.

[B]

No, no, no. That was.

[A]

Can you think of any other. There weren't any issues.

[B]

I think the only other thing we could talk about was Neuland, who was incredible in their game against Brazil, actually not pushing that ball away and gifting Bellingham an easy winning goal. Oh, yeah.

[A]

But that's a tactical thing. So. Okay, let's start. Let's. Let's. Let's do it in sequence, then. Let's start by first talking about the sawn off incident, because that's the. You see, this is. So this is the thing that I. That I. I wish more fans would be honest about. Right. More fans would be honest about. When it's Egypt, Argentina. Right. It's easier to blame the refs for the results. And in my opinion, the refs made many decisions that I think could have gone another way on another day. Against Argentina, I think. No, just like. Just like yellow cards and like, harsher penalty. No, no, no.

[B]

There were.

[A]

There were a few. No, no. That's my opinion. As I'm saying, you can disagree.

[B]

I can't. I can't think of a single decision that they. Of course you can't.

[A]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[B]

That's okay. We want to litigate that.

[A]

We don't have to litigate.

[B]

It's easier for fans.

[A]

But I'm saying it's easier for fans to focus on those things than it is for them to focus on the moment where they fail to take a game. Okay? So for me, Egypt, Argentina, it's the moment when Egypt gets the ball. The score's 2 2. I think it's the 90th minute. You're going to talk in added time. Off Egypt goes on a break. Yes.

[B]

I think it was two.

[A]

The ball gets passed to Salah and very quickly it becomes 3 vs 2 or even 4 vs 2. And then Mamush out of nowhere comes running from behind Salah.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And takes the ball off of his feet.

[B]

And Salah, by the way, had led two in incredible breakaways which had ended in goals.

[A]

One of them, Salah's also these gu. The guy's got the record for goals and assists in one season in the Premier League. You've seen what he can do assist wise already in this game. He takes the ball off of Salah's feet, also compresses the field. And what I mean by that is, you know, you know this. When you're playing football, when you, when you're on a counterattack, the best thing you can do is spread out your players because now you the. The. The team.

[B]

Opponents. Yes.

[A]

Yeah. The team with inferior players have to think about who they're going to cover. Now what's happening is the attack is compressed because Mamush is literally on Salah. So one defender can mark both men. He takes the ball. I think it was Paredes who was. Who was running back on Argentina.

[B]

Incredible block by paradise as well. I don't think it's an incredible. No, no, I don't think it's an incredible block.

[A]

I think it's a bad pass and I think it's a pass from a player who doesn't pass regularly. And I go, why would you take the ball from Salah? He could have curved his run. He could have made. Created another outlet. And I'm telling you, Salah would have found him. So for me, I focus on that moment. I go, that's for me, that's. You know why? Because fans often go backwards in time as if, as if calls are cumulative, but they're not.

[B]

How do you then compare that? How do you compare that with Soloth?

[A]

No. So listen, do you get what I'm saying?

[B]

Yeah, I get the mamot.

[A]

No, no, but what I'm saying, fans will do in football, oftentimes they'll go, if we were awarded that penalty, then the score would have been 4 nil. Then I'm like, no, that. But that's not how games work. So Egypt was up 1 nil, right? They go 2 nil up, the goal gets taken away. Then they still come back immediately and score. Now it's two nil. Now some would go, then it would be three nil. That's not how games actually work.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It's like It's a linear timeline.

[B]

It's a butterfly effect. One thing can completely change its value.

[A]

So it's a linear thing.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So now when we come to the England Norway game, I know a lot of fans would love to look at the cable incident as the incident that robs Norway of their opportunity to go through to the semi finals. But for me, the. The moment where Norway loses their game is the moment where Soloth is on a break. 2v1 with Erling Haaland. 2v1.

[B]

And like stones. Yes. And.

[A]

And we've got to be clear about what kind of 2v1. There's a 2v1 where you have, like, men right behind you, someone on your

[B]

shoulder, touching you, pushing you.

[A]

And no, then there's a 2v1 where you are unencumbered, completely free to look up, to play the game, to make decisions.

[B]

The defender is backpedaling furiously.

[A]

Backpedaling, yeah. John Stones, who's not the fastest defender. And Soloth not only, like, stumbles and doesn't look up and doesn't pass to Haaland, he also just doesn't make a decision himself. Like, it's one of the strangest moments I've ever seen took.

[B]

He took his sweet time as well.

[A]

And everyone has a different opinion. Some people go, it's because he's jealous of Haaland. You know, they've played cliff clips of him saying, I've got more experience than him. Whatever. People are. People are saying like, oh, that's why you shouldn't have a striker up top. Because a striker doesn't look up because they think they are the person who has to finish it. Some people say, yes. Yeah. People have all, look, the bottom line is, for me, when that happened in the same way, you called it out. I remember. Yeah. In the same way. In the same way when Bruno Grimmereisch

[B]

doesn't score his goal and then Rick

[A]

misses the one and the same when Endrick misses. I blame those moments for the losing.

[B]

I'll say the funny thing about that moment is we watched it and you. Because sorth got murdered online, obviously, and he got murdered in the press. But the thing is, you immediately went like. This is why you don't. You went like, he has tunnel vision. He didn't even know that the pass was on.

[A]

I'll be honest with you.

[B]

The pass is really on for the show.

[A]

I'll be honest with you.

[B]

He's not at the receiving end of the pass.

[A]

I don't get the coach's decision. I don't understand why he's playing Soloth there and not Oscar Bob.

[B]

The worst thing is it went from potentially 2 nil. That's my point, though, going into halftime to 1 1. And that completely changes the tactical talk as a coach that you're going to give to your players.

[A]

It also changes the tactics of the team. Right. If we're up 1 nil, we're in a skittish back and forth. It's a skirmish, but like it, it's not comfortable because at any moment you can get back and you're in the game. When we're 2N up, we can sit back differently, we can counterattack differently. And you have more pressure on you as the opposing team because you need

[B]

to look for goals.

[A]

You need to look for two goals, not one goal. You know what I mean? So, so, so that. That pressure creates something and then the goal comes from a moment that I'm like, it's funny, I. So you must see, I have so many English friends who have completely blown up my phone hating me.

[B]

Oh, really?

[A]

Yeah. What a bad take, Trevor. There was no ball that hit a cable.

[B]

See, that's why I can talk. That's why I can talk trash about England. I have no English friends. So. No. You are very vocal, though, about it. You are very vocal. I'm very interested in why. Because you pointed it out. Even during the broadcast, after the live stream, I'm interested to hear what you really think should and could have happened. Because the Norwegian players went and told the ref, so what do you think could happen? Because he didn't. He didn't stop the game and the goal went in. So what do you think would have happened? Because normally you stop the game when the ball hits an external object.

[A]

Yeah, and it's happened before, by the way. This is not the first time a ball has hit the sky cam or the cables. Okay, so it's happened before. You just stopped the game.

[B]

Okay, so. No, but they didn't stop it. And the Norwegian, rather the coach and shoulder up, ran up to him. Do you think there's still recourse for him to cancel the goal?

[A]

No, but this is.

[B]

Or is it too late?

[A]

Okay, but this is what I don't understand. All right, so there's a few things. FIFA comes out and says, the sensor in the bull was not triggered.

[B]

Yes. Yes.

[A]

Okay, now I'm going like, guys, okay,

[B]

that sensor has been having a moment.

[A]

Yo, man, here's the most important thing for me. Why are we bringing a new technology to a World Cup? If you look at every other technology Right. If you look at every other technology in football, when we're trialing a new rule or a new technology, they trial that for four years in other leagues,

[B]

smaller competitions, women's sports. Yes, exactly.

[A]

They go, let's take this to the low stakes, low level tournaments before we get to the highest levels of the men's and women's games. Before that, let's try it in like under 16s, under 20s. They try new offside rules, they try new, like VAR. They tested VAR for a long time in different leagues, in different ways, in different subsections of. Of a league, by the way, they'd say, like, okay, for this competition, we're going to be using var, but. But we won't expand it fully in

[B]

different formats as well.

[A]

Exactly, exactly. So my thing is, why, oh, why are we bringing a new chip that I don't know of being used in any major league? Why are we bringing that to a World cup where the stakes are so high and there are so few games for you to remedy the situation? That's. That's my first issue.

[B]

Okay, I guess my question then would be again, you've said a bowler see the sky come before, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But it was still unprecedented at this level. The ball hitting a skycam, like, you know, when the Croatian player.

[A]

I think it happened in the Premier League.

[B]

Yes, but I'm saying at this level. Yeah. So when you talk about, let's say the hair follicle, you know, the Croatian player, did the ball touch his hair? That you can understand.

[A]

Right, right. But it's not unprecedented.

[B]

So when the ball went up, I think what happened. And again, I might be wrong. When the, When Nolan kicks that ball high.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think the ref naturally didn't track the ball all the way.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

His eyes were focused on the players jostling for. Because the ball is.

[A]

Yes, yes.

[B]

So he didn't see.

[A]

Because the refs is. The refs job is not to look at the ball. The ref's job is to watch the players.

[B]

Even when they're taking corner kicks, refs are not watching the flight of the ball. They're watching the players. So I see why he missed it. But then as you're asking, why didn't. Why didn't VR is supposed to come in for clear and obvious errors. Yeah. When they come in. And if they come in, how come.

[A]

Yes, they relied apparently on the. What do they call it? Sneako.

[B]

Snicker. Snicker. Yes.

[A]

Okay. Sneako in the ball. Now, some people are saying there's a possibility that because the pitch has the four antennas around it for the ball. There's a possibility, just like microphones like we're using now, or you know, when you're on a TV show, you have a mic pack. Yes, there are, there are antennas situated around every single soundstage and those antennas are responsible for picking up. So here it's a wired mic. So it's not the same, but there's an antenna. And if that mic pack sometimes goes above.

[B]

Oh yes, yes, yes.

[A]

That's the thing that people forget above. Because when you're in line with the thing, you find your frequencies are fine. But sometimes when you go above, that's the issue. I don't know that they've tested that technology way up in the air.

[B]

Because it's unprecedented.

[A]

Because the antenna are down on the ground.

[B]

Yeah, because everything happens on the ground. Mostly unless you're playing Inglight.

[A]

Because remember, they do.

[B]

The body's always in the air. Yeah, they did it.

[A]

That's funny. But they did it because they did this for var, I mean, for, for offside. And offside is generally about a ball kicked on the ground and where a person is in relation to the kicking.

[B]

Okay, quick question. Do you think if FIFA had come out and gone like, guys, our bad, our mistake, instead of trying to gaslight the football loving public, do you think that would have been better?

[A]

Yes, I think it would be better.

[B]

Instead of going like, oh, there was

[A]

no, I think it would be better. So I, I, I think this, yeah,

[B]

but as, as we said, corrupt, evil, villains.

[A]

I think there's no, no, I think this for everything in life. I think. What's that old saying, the, the COVID up is always worse than the crime.

[B]

Worse than the crime. Yes.

[A]

Right. I think it's the same thing that happened with governments around Covid. If it, if governments were more honest.

[B]

I'm taking this thing out of football too many times.

[A]

But, but I think that's why I love football.

[B]

The reason I love football is for

[A]

me, football is the ultimate, you know, reflection of life. Yes, it's a reflection of life. It's like how we live it, how we experience. I can learn all my lessons on a football pitch for life. And so for me, it's the same thing that happened during COVID It's the same thing that happens during major disasters, during an economic crisis, whatever the government thinks that they are protecting a system by obscuring or lying to the people about. But then what happens is the people then go, there's something I noticed here.

[B]

There's something strange. My Eyes. Yes.

[A]

My eyes are not matching up with the reality. And then the government says to you, no, don't worry about that, don't worry about that. And that thing builds up steam. Builds up steam, Builds up steam. And then what happens?

[B]

At some point.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, but at some point, some. Some subsect of conspiracies are shown to be true.

[B]

Yes. And then.

[A]

And then what happens? You've now created.

[B]

Yes. You've lost all credibility.

[A]

For me, it's better if FIFA just says, hey, y', all, the sensor didn't go off. But upon further review, we've seen. It does look like the ball touched. The referee didn't see it. And in every game, if a referee doesn't see it, if no one catches it, sorry, guys, we play on. But that's the thing, because there's many matches where we can go. We, Joe, we can go back and literally re. Watch every micro moment of Messi. For instance, who are they playing recently? Messi.

[B]

They're playing. Which one? Cape Vad.

[A]

Egypt.

[B]

Switzerland.

[A]

Egypt. I think it was no Switzerland. Messi gets a foul by the box. No one touched him like. Or rather it wasn't. He didn't get fouled.

[B]

No, no, no, no. I think it was K fad. The player won the ball. Yes, the player won the ball.

[A]

Yeah, but Messi gets the foul by the box.

[B]

The player won the ball.

[A]

Now, we could go back and go, that wasn't a foul.

[B]

But.

[A]

But that's not the. The point of sport is not to be 100 accurate. It is to be fair.

[B]

Yes, yes.

[A]

You get what I'm saying.

[B]

No, I think even.

[A]

Even when it comes to, like, marking, who was holding, who. Whose shirt was being tugged?

[B]

Did Elliot dive? Was Hans push enough? I'll say this, it. I agree with you in a sense that it was very Owerian. Like when you, you know, when you talk about 1984, don't believe your. Your lying eyes. It was very Orwellian in that way because everyone was like, oh, but we can't see the ball unless you're English. Because the English became blind. Many English fans became like partially blind when it came to that.

[A]

Which I would argue is your job.

[B]

Yes, yes. As a fan. It is. As a fan, when the referee makes a decision that's on your side.

[A]

I mean, that was the right decision.

[B]

When the referee. Yeah, so I get where the English are coming from.

[A]

The last thing you want to be as a fan is Ronaldo putting up their hand with their own teammates offside.

[B]

You never want to be here.

[A]

All right, let's take a quick break to thank our sponsor for today's episode. That's Verizon. Now, we all know the FIFA World cup is one of the biggest events on the planet, right? Everybody wants in, which means scoring tickets is hard. Like really, really hard. Well, there's good news. Verizon is providing their customers with unmatched access. They've given away thousands of free tickets and even given their customers pitch side access during matches. If you're not a Verizon customer, I've got good news. Right now, more people than ever can get a better deal at Verizon. If you have a bill with AT&T or T Mobile, all you gotta do is bring it in. And if you have a bill with Xfinity or Spectrum, bring that in too, and Verizon will give you a better deal. Plus, you could get bucket list experiences like free tickets to the FIFA World cup must provide a very recent postpaid consumer mobile bill in the name of the person redeeming the deal. Additional terms, conditions and restrictions apply. No one gets you closer to the FIFA World Cup 2026 than Verizon.

[B]

I would say for me, the thing, the biggest talking point from that game. And again, it's, it's. For me, it's, it's Jude betting a man. Yeah, man, it's. Hey, judge, I love big players who show up in big hypers.

[A]

You've always said this.

[B]

Yeah, I love. I'm such a huge love of the game. And when I see. So I'll say this for me, when I look at the World cup, great players always impose their personality on the World Cup. Great players always bend the World cup to their will. The greatest players actually don't just grace the World Cup. They don't just stand up, they decorate the tournament of the world.

[A]

Yes. Sudan 98, Ronaldo 2000, 2009.

[B]

You can go back as far. You can go back to 1934, 1930s, when, let's say fascist Italy hosted the World Cup, 1934. Obviously Bento Mussolin tried to hijack the World Cup. No one remembers Bento Mussolini. Everyone remembers Giuseppe Miyaza because he helped Italy win. That's why AC Milan and Inter Milan named their stadium after him.

[A]

No, I didn't know that.

[B]

Yeah, Giuseppe Miaza. When you go back to 1954, Frank Pushkas and that dazzling Hungarian team. That's why the Pushkas award for the best goal every football season is named after Ferenc Pushkas. 1958, 17 year old Pele scores two goals in a final and a legend is born. Every World Cup 62 Chile hosts. Pele gets injured. He's the hope for Brazil. Guess who stays up? Who steps up? Garrincha steps up. Every World Cup a great player. Every World cup must be defined by a great player. And I don't want to hear any excuses because I don't care. The football world doesn't care. We don't want to hear, oh, I got double marked and triple marked. All the upper maintenance were kicking the crap out of me. No. Great players always find a way to exploit their God given gifts to actually define the greatest tournament in the world. And if you look at what Jude has been doing, dragged England past Mexico single handedly. He has played high altitude. A few days later played against Norway, didn't show anything about altitude sickness.

[A]

No.

[B]

Again imposed his will. In Uganda we call it, we call it, you know, taking your balls out and slapping them on the table when the pressure is on.

[A]

Damn.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

What's happening in Uganda, that's what is happening in Ugandan boardrooms that this has

[B]

become a saying, stands up and goes. That's what great players do, Trevor. And for me that's the one thing

[A]

I'd love to be the person taking minutes at that meeting.

[B]

And then he took out his ball.

[A]

Ball slap occurred once again.

[B]

No, think 1986. Diego Armando Maradona.

[A]

Yeah, no, you're right.

[B]

He said the better for me. That's what I want. Look at Lionel Messi, this World Cup. Look at Lionel Messi the World cup before. Look at R9 and Zinedine Zidane in 1998. I want. Because you don't always remember the player. Roberto Baggio, 1994, you remember Roberto Baggio. You remember Romario. I want players showing up. And that's one thing you said you've loved about this World Cup. At least all the greats, all the greats have shown up to be showing up. And so for me, the way. Actually, let's say you love taking things out of football. Let's take it out of football. Think of cinema. You're not going to be considered a great on the big screen unless you have at least one career performance. Daniel Dale will show me something. Leo DiCaprio, show me something. Robert De Niro, Mary Strip, Al Pacino, show me something. There has to be a performance of yours that defines your legacy.

[A]

And funny enough to keep it in cinema, in many ways that's how we define the greats is that regardless of what movie they're in. Yes. To your Point. They bend it to their will.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know what I mean?

[B]

Make us dream.

[A]

They take a role or a moment, however small. However small, and they go, wow.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know, like you watching it and you're like, man, when they come on

[B]

screen, you know, that's what I want. And so for me, that's why. And I keep saying this, and we disagree on this. You think Harry Kane is a great striker. I think he's an okay striker. I think he's a good striker. I think he's okayish. And I'm not talking about club. Let, let, let.

[A]

So I've been.

[B]

I've been.

[A]

Actually, I've been thinking about this. I've been thinking about club. No, no. Here's a way.

[B]

Incredible. In club football, I've thought of a

[A]

way for us to bridge this gap. Maybe. Maybe there's a. There's a. There's an extra definition we need to think about in football. Maybe sometimes we need to define a player's greatness for their position, and then sometimes we need to define a player's greatness for their ability to be a clutch player. More than just a clutch player, but rather like a. Like an architect, somebody. Somebody who can design and create something. Somebody who can make things happen. They're. The catalyst. Is a good way to put it, right?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Because I can think of many players, you know, like Jude Bellingham. Is he the best midfielder?

[B]

No, not even close.

[A]

I don't think he is.

[B]

Pedri Vistinia. Yes.

[A]

Many people will come with many names, but in this World cup, there's no Pedri, there's no Vitino, there's no.

[B]

He has taken his balls and slapped them.

[A]

Yeah, but my. But my point.

[B]

They were capable.

[A]

But I would even argue he has not done that as a great midfielder, though.

[B]

No, no, no. He has done it in his role. I don't think of him as.

[A]

No, but what I'm saying is he's done it as a player. Because if you look at where Jude Bellingham's been on the pitch, if you look at how he's gotten his goals, if you. All of those moments are agnostic to the position he plays.

[B]

But that's true. But that's what I'm saying about.

[A]

No, no, no, that's what I'm agreeing with.

[B]

I'm saying you don't have to do it. When I said defining a World Cup, I'm saying that you do it as a player. So. 1982. But listen, is a goalkeeper.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is a goalkeeper who defined the 1982 World cup alongside Zico and Paul Rossi. You don't have to. We're saying you have to stand up as a player.

[A]

No, but, but listen to what I'm saying. So now do you understand? Come back to what I'm saying. I don't think it takes anything away from Harry Kane's greatness as a striker. Okay, Right. But then when we talk, like, I. I try and do this with my friends all the time. I do it with slbsa. When we chat is sometimes we try and, like, change our paradigms for how we think of the game, just so that we open up the possibility for more than just one, one category, you know, greatest. Who's the great? Oh, who's the best of. It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no. Sometimes you can say who is the best defender. And what we mean by that is who is the best player at defending a ball. When the opponents are attacking and they, okay, that's the best defender. Okay, but then you could go. When you are down one nil and it is the 90th minute and you need to get a goal, would you rather have Sergio Ramos or would you rather have Virgil van Djk? Now, I. In my world, there is no world where Sergio Ramos is a better defender than Virgil van Djk. For me, football fans can disagree. We always do. But if you're asking me for a moment for that thing, someone who's gonna grab the game and Virgil has had his mom, don't get me wrong, but I'm talking like the extremes.

[B]

Who's going to show up?

[A]

Yes, I'm talking the extremes. That player you like, where did Sergio Ramos come from? Where did he do? How did he do this? How many times has he done this? For me, that's. That's what I'm talking about. And that, to me does not diminish another player's positional excellence in any way.

[B]

Okay, let me counterpoint, counterpoint. And I hear where you're coming from. For me, Harry Kane has disappeared way too many times in big moments. That's why I have him on fraud watch. He has disappeared. I've given him. I've given him leeway so many times and he keeps disappointing. I've given him so much leeway. That's the thing. Harry Kane and his fans will say, oh, but he won the Golden Boot in 2018. Yes, but why did he win the Golden Boot? He scored a hat trick against Panama, scored, I think, another two goals against Tunisia. And then he scored the one goal he had scored. I Think in the knockout stages against Colombia. Here's the thing. Here's where I struggle with Hurricane, and people make so many excuses for him. Remember when I said great players. I don't want to hear your excuses.

[A]

Okay, so you won. Okay, I'm with you.

[B]

Romario.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He didn't go like, oh, no one is serving me. Oh, my. No. Romario took the World cup by the scuff of the neck. Gadmola took the World cup by the

[A]

scuff of the neck.

[B]

Paolo Rossi took the World cup by the scuffle. Ara 9. El Fenomeno, the original, took the World cup by the square of the Miroslav Crossa. He didn't even have the most spectacular club career. Why do we think of him as one of the greats? He took the World cup by the scruff of the neck. They didn't make excuses. These are pure nines. Now Hurricane fans will go like, oh, but you see, he opens up space. Hogwash. I'm not interested. Great nines don't open up space. They are not Walmart street. Walmart greeters. Then they will say, oh, you know, Harry Kane defends. Extra. Hogwash. My striker shouldn't be defending. I judge my striker purely. Is he putting the ball in the net? And so for me, when I look at Hurricane, this is where I struggle. And I know English fans will go like, you're being harsh on him. Club football, he delivers week in, week out. Harry Kane delivers for his club. I'm talking just international football. Harry Kane, we were there in Russia. His first World Cup 2018. Hurricane scored six goals in the groups, one in the knockouts. Their biggest game against Croatia. What did he do? He went missing. Who scored the goal? Kieran Trippier. He went missing. Croatia came back in that game. I went like, okay, his first World Cup. I'll give him grace. Euro. The next Euros 20, 20, 21. Where was Hurricane in the final? Luke Shaw scores a goal against Italy. 3rd minute, Hurricane show us something. Hurricane disappears. Italy comes back, wins next World Cup 2022. Hurricane plays well in the group stages. He meets France, disappears the whole game gets a penalty. Towards the end. He scores it, gets another penalty to send the game to equalize. What does he do? High pressure moment. He skies it. I go like, okay, now this guy is on real fraud. Watch. €2024. That's when I broke. That's when. That's when I gave up on Hurricane because they play against Spain. Harry Kane disappears the whole game. Cole Palma scores the equalizer on 68 minutes. What does the English tactical setup do. What does the coach do? Hooks Hurricane, subs him out when they need a goal. That's when I went like, this guy only appears when the lights are brightest. He disappears.

[A]

So.

[B]

So question.

[A]

So, a question I have for you. So, from this World cup, have you put is Laminal on fraud?

[B]

Watch Laminal one. He's still young.

[A]

No, no, I'm just asking. I'm just asking. No, no, you don't have to give me. You don't have to give me. Just yes or no.

[B]

Okay, so no.

[A]

Just yes or no.

[B]

No.

[A]

Okay, then that's fine.

[B]

You know why? No, no, I'll tell you why.

[A]

No, you don't have to tell me why.

[B]

Saying you need to create moments of danger for me.

[A]

Joe, it's fine. I'm not saying yes or no. I just wanted to know.

[B]

So let me just finish this. So, for me, this is how I look at Harry Kane. Because I want people to understand. Harry Kane is a great club player. I look at Hurricane the way Trevor. I look at Hurricane. Listen, no one defends someone. No, no, no, no.

[A]

We're going to run out of time.

[B]

Joe, Joe.

[A]

I'm moving on.

[B]

Let me just finish this.

[A]

No, you can't. I'm moving on. I'm moving on. Let's talk about Thomas Tuchel and the team. Let's move on. Let's move on.

[B]

Yes. I think he's a great knockout.

[A]

Do you think? You know.

[B]

No. I should ask you. I think actually I should ask you about him first.

[A]

Why?

[B]

Because him and Bellingham came out with very defining accounts of the game against Norway. Tuco thought they got lucky, Tuko thought they didn't play well. And Birmingham went like. Clearly doesn't know what it means to play at this level.

[A]

So.

[B]

So what do you think about that?

[A]

Okay, so here's what I'll say. I think that the English media, and the media in particular, sometimes will portray themselves as being on the side of the people or its people at any given time. And oftentimes we forget that a lot of the media is on its own side.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And the side it's on is the side of clicks and views.

[B]

It's not the voice of the people. Okay? Yes. Okay. Okay. Okay.

[A]

So Thomas Tuchel, what he was coming out and saying.

[B]

I love that they keep calling him Tuchel.

[A]

Yeah, he's Tuco. Yeah, I know, but I'm saying it in English.

[B]

No, say it in German.

[A]

Why do you want me to say it in German?

[B]

You're the famous Black Hitler. No. Why We.

[A]

Why are we gonn. People who have no context for that are going to be like, what the hell are you talking about?

[B]

No. Yeah. Okay.

[A]

If you go. If you look at Thomas Tuchel, right, he's got. He's got his views on the game. If you listen to what he's saying when he's asked about England, he's saying, listen, man, I don't like what we did on the field.

[B]

And he's right.

[A]

Yes, I think we were sloppy. I think our pace wasn't good and

[B]

I think we were lucky.

[A]

I don't want to keep being lucky. I want to win games definitively because I also understand the team that I have. Right. If I look at the individuals on the field, we should be performing better than.

[B]

Yes, okay.

[A]

And then a commentator says to him, oh, do you think it's a mentality issue? He says, no. He says, all we have right now is mentality.

[B]

Yes, yes, yes, yes.

[A]

Which is him praising the team.

[B]

He's saying he's going to mentally go to him.

[A]

He's praising Jude Bellingham. He's praising. He's basically going, we're taking games and making, you know, something out of essentially.

[B]

But.

[A]

But you can't continue to thrive on mentality. Okay, Right. Mentality is something you use, you know, like Argentina. A lot of it has been mentality.

[B]

It has really been mentality.

[A]

But, man, a lot of it has been brilliant. And, like, there's many parts of the game where we're watching them going, oh, they've got this, they've got this. Then the mentality is when they're down or when they're even and it's extra time, and then you go, they can still do it. That's mentality. You need your mentality to help you when your tactics. When your tactics let you down. I think that's what he's saying. The journalist then goes to Jude Bellingham. Yes. And they phrase it as if Tuchel's only opinion and the game was disappointment and criticism. Jude is fresh out of, like, his

[B]

exhaustion, adrenaline still pumping.

[A]

He goes, you see him shot also, remember, this is something that people forget, and this is a key thing. How long has Tuchel been the. The coach?

[B]

No, no, it's been a short time. It's been, what, a year? Two months? Yeah.

[A]

Thomas Tuchel doesn't have, like, a history with these guys. He doesn't have. He doesn't have a legacy that he's built. He doesn't have, like, a deep understanding. He does. You know what I mean? I think people shouldn't take that for granted. People shouldn't take for granted what it means when people trust the coach and know the coach. But then, because, because I'll tell you this, after a game, if Alex Ferguson said something like that about one of his Man United teams, if Pep Guardiola said something like that about not, not even if.

[B]

Let's go back, give him the benefit of this. Yes.

[A]

When Alex Ferguson criticized his team after winning a game, but not winning it the way they wanted, when Pep Guardiola criticized his team, when Jurgen Klopp criticized his team, when those coaches did it, when Mourinho criticized his team, when they did that, the players, when benefit of doubt, the players knew what the coach was saying, so they would say, yes, I hear. I, I'm also, I can see why the coach, Because Harry Kane came and said that, and maybe he has a different relationship with, with the German coach.

[B]

No one understands the word hurricane is

[A]

saying, but Harry Kane, Harry Kane came out and he said, he said, yeah, I agree with the coach. I don't think we played well. I don't. And, and maybe, like, maybe, like, maybe, maybe, maybe Jude was conflating from that question. He was conflating, putting your heart out there.

[B]

Yes, but you're very, always very good at timing and context. You're always going like, is it the right time to say something? Is it your place? Don't you think maybe it behooved, or maybe it should. Being the manager, he should have known better than to say that at that time. Say back in the dressing room instead of saying, yeah, look up.

[A]

No, no, you're not, you're not wrong. You're not wrong. But then I think there's also, like, there's also going to be a debate. People say, there's some coaches where people complain because it feels like they don't know what's going on. And then the fans, you're right, you're right. And then the fans, Alvara Beroa, the

[B]

whole time he was at Madrid, they kept going like, you keep blaming yourself. You never call the team. Are you right?

[A]

You see? So now when a coach blames themselves, fans go, why don't they blame the players? Yeah, why don't you blame the players? And then when a coach walks away from a game going like, yeah, all that matters is the result. The team go, the fans go, we don't want results, we want a game. And so I, I think, I think that's the thing. So, you know, it'll be interesting to see how they perform.

[B]

I think. I think. I think Argentina is winning that game. Three nil, easily.

[A]

That's your prediction?

[B]

That's my prediction, yes.

[A]

Three nil.

[B]

Yes. I'm pulling. I'm taking down my balls, slapping them on this table. 3 nil. I think Argentina. I think Argentina. People, People have been analyzing, you know,

[A]

who's, you know, who's perfect for you is the, you know. You want to talk about a world cup of controversies. Did you see the story that's just come out about the Senegal team?

[B]

Oh, yes, yes.

[A]

Where they said, apparently the team doctor who's meant to be like sports, science and all of that, apparently trained as a gynecologist. My favorite part of the story, my favorite part of the story was it said, the team found this out too late.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

But I went, like, the way it was phrased. It made it seem like one of the players came and said, I had a ham. I have a hamstring issue. And the doctor said, drop your pants.

[B]

He has only one solution.

[A]

Yes, drop your pants.

[B]

Let's.

[A]

Let's see what's happening. Drop your pants.

[B]

Let's. The hamstring. Yes, it's so.

[A]

But this is what you remember, what we were talking about, African football. Why does Morocco do well? Why is this doing. That's my thing.

[B]

That's a small thing. No, to go back to Argentina. The reason I think they're going to win that game is, I think, one. You talked about it. The team that has character, the team that is built to suffer. The team when the chips are down, they don't fold. And we've seen it in this World Cup. We saw it in 2022.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

They were, what, 45 minutes away from getting knocked out.

[A]

No, you've called it. Look, look. Every episode of the podcast is you going, this team is forged in fire. And that's what they made for.

[B]

And they have. It's a Spanish phrase. They have a thing called malaleche. It's when it says the English translation.

[A]

Is that milk?

[B]

Bad milk. Yes.

[A]

Oh, it's milk.

[B]

They have a competitive fire that few other teams have, and I think they've been a bit unlucky in their knockout games they've played. They've created enough chances to win by five goals. But Virginia Shobeir of Egypt, Gregor Kobo,

[A]

they've made some great goalkeepers.

[B]

The keepers have been playing out of.

[A]

No, they've made some great goalkeepers.

[B]

You're not wrong. I don't think Pickford is going to do that. And that's why Pickford's had some great performances with little tiny T Rex arms. No, it doesn't matter. Okay, my friend. Three nil. Yeah, three nil. Three nil.

[A]

Leave it there then. Let's leave it there. I want to leave it right there with your balls on the table. Yes.

[B]

I also want to call Spain because we're doing this before Spain. Before Spain. France call it. Yes. Everyone thinks that, oh, France is going to win. I think Spain is going to win it 2, 1. Because I think Spain is a team built to actually beat France because France normally beats teams because France is ball dominant and for the first time, they're going to be forced to defend. Well, this is.

[A]

Yeah, this is coming out.

[B]

Okay. We'll see if the production will. Mbappe, Dembele, Due and Olise are going to be forced to do something they hate doing. They're going to be forced to do something that all attacking players hate doing, which is chase the ball. And you know when in boxing we have the phrase styles make fights. Because normally you can be the great. Yeah, you can be the greatest fighter.

[A]

You think this is a style clash?

[B]

Yes. Floyd Mayweather always beat everyone till he met. What's his name? Marcos. Marcos, the Argentine. Marcos Maenado. I forget. Yeah. I don't remember Marcos Maidana. He always struggled against him. Manny Pacquiao would beat everyone till he met Juan Manuel Marquez. So every time you. There's always that one team that's almost built to fight and you think Spain is that team and Spain is that team when it comes to France. And I think they're going to struggle. Yes.

[A]

All right, let's see.

[B]

So, yeah, so for me, it's been good. Maybe before I go, I just want to say one thing. I would like great players standing up. And again, it feels like I'm emphasizing it, but I hate what we call in cricket, flat track bullies. I don't like players who put up big scorelines against small teams, who put up big scorelines against Afghanistan.

[A]

We have a game to watch.

[B]

I want half.

[A]

I'm going to watch the game. I'm going to go watch the game. I'm going to go watch the game.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Thank you again so much to the sponsor of today's episode, Verizon. They've given their customers unmatched access to the FIFA World Cup 2026, including thousands of free tickets. People meet and greets with soccer legends and the once in a lifetime opportunity to watch a portion of the FIFA World Cup. From the pitch. From the pitch. All just for being a Verizon customer. If you're not with Verizon, no sweats. Stop by a Verizon store to get in on the action and learn about their amazing offers for new customers. What Now? World Cup Bonus Episodes are produced by Dayzero Productions in partnership with Sirius xm, executive produced by Trevor Noah, Sanaz Yamin, Ryan Harduth and Rebecca Shane. Music, mixing and mastering by Hannis Brown. Thank you so much for listening. Join us every Monday during the World cup for bonus episodes of what Now With Trevor Noah.