Podcast Summary: What Your Therapist Thinks

Episode: Talking in Therapy Isn’t Enough? Reprocessing Trauma with EMDR

Date: March 25, 2026
Hosts: Felicia Keller Boyle & Kristie Plantinga
Guest: Erica Bottom, LPC, Certified EMDR Clinician and Trainer

Overview

This episode demystifies EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) therapy. Hosts Felicia and Kristie talk with EMDR expert Erica Bottom about what EMDR is, how it works, its effectiveness for trauma and other mental health concerns, the somatic (body-focused) aspects of healing, and how real people experience EMDR’s intensity and aftermath. The episode offers practical advice for both those seeking EMDR and therapists practicing it, with candid reflections, memorable metaphors, and honest Q&A, including responses to Reddit posts about difficult post-EMDR experiences.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. What Is EMDR?

• Definition and Origins [02:40-04:53]
  • EMDR stands for Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing.
  • It uses bilateral stimulation (right-left-right-left movement), originally with the eyes, now often with handheld paddles, tapping, or light bars.
  • Bilateral stimulation mimics REM sleep and helps the right and left hemispheres of the brain communicate and process trauma.
  • Erica: “What we think happens is that...that right, left, right, left movement helps to get the right and the left brain to communicate with each other. It kind of mimics REM sleep.” [03:15]
  • Everyday bilateral movements (dancing, drumming, walking) have similar integrative effects, but EMDR pairs this with intentional recall of memories for deep reprocessing.

2. EMDR Versus “Talk” Therapy: Bottom-Up vs. Top-Down Approaches

• Conceptual Differences [07:35-10:43]
  • “Top-down” therapies (like CBT) work from thoughts downward, helping reframe beliefs.
  • EMDR is a “bottom-up” process, starting with body sensations, emotions, and somatic memories.
  • Erica: “EMDR is going to go, okay, let's go toward the part of you that holds ‘I'm not enough’... Where is the memory? Where's the root source of that? And that actually goes down and in and toward and through the pain...” [09:00]
  • Integration between body and mind is key to real, lasting change—insight alone isn’t enough.

3. How EMDR Works on the Brain and Nervous System

• Research Insights [06:04-07:35]
  • PET scans show EMDR quiets the overactivation of the amygdala and right hemisphere, integrating trauma into the whole brain.
  • Trauma is largely stored in the “emotional” (right hemisphere) and lower (limbic, body) systems, not just in thoughts.
  • Erica: “The ability to logic your way through it doesn’t really work... parts are stored in the deeper levels of the brain, in the nervous system…” [06:29]

4. When EMDR Works Best—and Its Limits

• Applicability [19:01-24:13]
  • EMDR is effective for both “big T” (obvious, acute events) and “little t” (persistent, relational or developmental) traumas.
  • Erica: “A lot of anxiety and depression are related to unprocessed trauma, even if we don’t come from big T trauma backgrounds...” [19:24]
  • With single-incident trauma, EMDR can show rapid results. Relational or attachment trauma requires a more nuanced, artful approach, often blended with parts work and somatic therapy.
  • Trauma is subjective—what’s traumatic for one body may not be for another.

5. The Process of EMDR: Preparation, Processing, Integration

• Therapist Preparation and Consent [24:13-26:58]
  • Good EMDR therapists don’t rush. Preparation involves history taking, identifying strengths, preparing somatic and containment resources.
  • “Your therapist is only going to take you as far as they’ve gone themselves.” [13:28]
  • Clients are encouraged to ask therapists if they’ve done their own EMDR work.

6. Common Experiences: Identity, Parts, and Post-EMDR Fallout

• Reddit Q&A

  • Clearing Core Trauma & The Aftermath [28:01-33:30]

    • A user reports clearing a major trauma but feeling lost, anxious, and disoriented after.
    • Erica: “Our whole identities can be organized around traumas... the first step… is psychoeducation… the fourth step is like, who the hell am I without this trauma?” [29:40]
    • There may be deeper, attachment-based wounds as well.
    • Felicia and Erica cite Gabor Maté: personalities can be rigid trauma responses; with healing comes more flexible, present-moment responsiveness.

  • The Trauma/Drama Triangle & Parts Work [15:00-18:32]

    • Roles: Victim, Rescuer/Martyr, Perpetrator; we all shift between parts, often for adaptation/protection.
    • Healing involves recognizing these roles (parts), meeting them with compassion, and integrating rather than shaming or pushing them away.
    • “The way that [protective parts] soften… is through compassion... criticism is not an effective change agent.” [39:04]

7. Handling the Intensity of EMDR

• Reddit Q&A: How Do You Deal With the Aftershocks? [43:19-48:53]
  • Intense processing can surface for days or weeks post-session: nightmares, fear, somatic anxiety.
  • Erica urges proactive, co-created somatic resource planning. Examples:
    • “Calm safe place” visualizations
    • The container exercise
    • Polyvagal exercises, movement, dancing, or shaking to move out of a freeze response
    • Building an “attachment team” of mental allies for support
  • “Integration is actually the most important part... can we incorporate some somatic practices? Anything that is going to help move that freeze response.” [43:19]

8. Polyvagal Theory and Somatic Tools

• Basics and Relevance [46:45-48:53]
  • The vagus nerve connects the brain to the gut and underpins nervous system regulation.
  • Practices that tone the vagus nerve (right-left movements, twists, yoga, “butterfly hug”) help widen the “window of tolerance,” a metaphor for your capacity to process stress without losing your sense of safety or choice.
  • Felicia: “When we talk about going outside of your window of tolerance, what we’re saying is... you are no longer feeling safe, present, and able to connect with others…” [48:53]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On EMDR’s Power
  • “EMDR is trying to get at the memories that are most related to the deepest wounded parts.” [17:53 – Erica]
• On Therapy’s Limits
  • “You can go to therapy for years and years and years and just swim around on the cognitive...but your shit is going to leak out somewhere.” [12:13 – Erica]
• On Healing
  • “Your true nature is that you are always and already enough, lovable, worthy, and inextricably connected...And actually not even lovable. You just are love.” [33:35 – Erica]
• On Parts Work
  • “If we come at these parts like, ‘ugh, I gotta start setting boundaries, oh there’s that old pattern again,’...the way that they soften...is through compassion. Criticism is not an effective change agent.” [39:04 – Erica]
• On Polyvagal Practice
  • “Trauma doesn’t give a what you know. Right? So you have to work with the vagus nerve.” [46:45 – Erica]
• On Therapist Honesty
  • “Clients are looking for honesty. It is part of our skill set...to be able to deliver honesty, but in a way that maintains the connection and safety of the relationship.” [53:55 – Erica]
• On Systemic Issues in Therapy
  • “A lot of the way that [EMDR] is trained...is over-focused on over-pathologizing individuals and not incorporating systems lenses—racism, patriarchy, religious abuse—and not folding their understanding of those things in.” [54:30 – Erica]

Timestamps: Important Segments

• Introduction & Guest Intro: [02:03–02:40]
• What Is EMDR & Bilateral Stimulation: [02:40–06:06]
• Research on EMDR & Brain Integration: [06:10–07:35]
• Bottom-Up vs Top-Down Therapy: [07:35–10:43]
• Who Should Try EMDR: [19:01–24:13]
• Therapist’s Own EMDR Work & Client-Therapist Questions: [13:45–15:00]
• Explaining the Trauma Triangle/Parts Work: [15:00–18:32]
• Reddit Q: Clearing Core Trauma & Identity Loss: [28:01–33:30]
• Reddit Q: Handling Intensity (Integration & Polyvagal Exercises): [43:19–48:53]
• Window of Tolerance, Choice, and Adaptation: [48:53–53:08]
• What Therapists Really Think/Limitations of EMDR: [53:20–54:58]

Language & Tone

The conversation is candid, compassionate, and at times playfully irreverent (“EMDR...it’s like remodeling your kitchen. Shit’s gonna get messy but at the end you have a nice remodeled brain.” [00:00; 29:40 – Erica]). The hosts and guest speak frankly about both the promise and the raw struggle of deep trauma work, blending technical expertise with accessible metaphors and encouragement.

Resources & Further Learning

• Erica Bottom’s Website & Book: avoscounseling.com
• Free Somatic & Polyvagal Resources: Linked on Erica’s site; includes video guides and meditations
• Podcast Back Episodes: Recommended ep. on trauma with John Lee

For Listeners: Takeaways

• EMDR goes beyond talk therapy; it’s a powerful, somatic intervention that can catalyze lasting change when practiced safely with skilled preparation and integration.
• Healing is messy, non-linear, and sometimes creates an identity crisis—be gentle, seek support, and resource yourself.
• Therapists and clients should embrace honest, reciprocal dialogue—including asking therapists about their own experience doing EMDR.
• Compassion, slow progress, and adaptability (not criticism or “brute force positivity”) foster transformation.

For more on EMDR, somatic healing, and trauma-informed therapy, visit avoscounseling.com or review the show notes for further recommended resources.