Love Is Blind’s Ali & Madison: Season 9 Girl Chat

Summary

What’s the Reality? — Love Is Blind’s Ali & Madison: Season 9 Girl Chat

Podcast: What’s the Reality?
Host: Amber Desiree (AD)
Guests: Ally & Madison (Love Is Blind Season 9)
Date: November 5, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this candid, laughter-filled "girl chat," Amber Desiree sits down with Ally and Madison from Love Is Blind Season 9. The trio dish on life post-filming, behind-the-scenes experiences, love found (and lost), unfounded rumors, the realities of dating on TV, and personal growth. Both women are deeply reflective and unfiltered, discussing everything from being edited on reality TV, to the challenges of sharing personal health battles, to holding fast to self-worth after heartbreak.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Life After Love Is Blind

Timestamps: 01:06 – 02:42

• Ally is pursuing her degree, working in dermatology, and embracing a healthier lifestyle and routine. She mentions feeling “different” and credits her new job, sleep schedule, and self-care.
• Madison is president of the Colorado Foundation Fighting Blindness chapter, still a UX/UI designer, and “happily single.” She humorously invites others to “set me up with your brothers” (02:44).

“It kind of feels like a chapter is kind of closing, and I’m feeling a lot of clarity... just peace.” — Madison (01:15)

“It’s nice to actually be able to, like, talk openly about everything now... instead of just our own little group.” — Ally (01:24)

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2. The Casting Process

Timestamps: 02:50 – 04:00

• Ally: Both applied and was approached by casting managers; friends encouraged her.
• Madison: Learned about casting from a guy she was talking to—ironically, after she messaged casting, they never spoke again.

“He’s probably... like, ‘I sent her the DMs’—sharing that story to be honest.” — AD/Ally (04:03)

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3. Watching Themselves on TV & Editing

Timestamps: 04:15 – 07:00

• Both describe surreal feelings seeing themselves on screen; Ally skips some scenes.
• They acknowledge editing but agree Love Is Blind captured the “essence” of their experiences, even if context was sometimes missing.

“There was never a point that I was watching and being like ‘I got a bad edit.’ … Ultimately, you got exactly what was coming from that situation.” — Madison (06:15)

“Blame it on the edit, huh? Babe, you almost said it and it only goes so far.” — Ally (06:55)

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4. Connections In the Pods

Timestamps: 07:10 – 08:53

• Ally wished viewers saw more of her and Anton’s serious conversations on values and lifestyles (ethics, money, etc.).
• She also had an un-aired connection with Patrick, as did Madison, leading to some behind-the-scenes tension.

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5. The Reveal & Cultural Traditions

Timestamps: 08:58 – 11:16

• Ally was happy with Anton at the reveal. She explains the engagement ring moment (placed on her right hand, following Brazilian customs), which may have confused viewers.
• Discusses a memorable “head tilt” moment where Anton, after the reveal, didn’t look back as she expected.

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6. Finances & Lifestyle Disagreements

Timestamps: 11:32 – 14:50

• Though finances were discussed in the pods, Ally clarifies Anton didn’t buy her $5K engagement ring—it was provided by Netflix.
• Ally explains her comments about wanting a bigger ring were lighthearted, part of trying to connect and joke.
• She candidly addresses concerns about Anton’s drinking habits and unhealthy lifestyle, which became a sticking point for her.

“It wasn’t a negotiable for me… absolutely not. Like, that wasn’t a negotiable for me. And he obviously found that out.” — Ally (14:23)

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7. Wedding Day & Decision at the Altar

Timestamps: 15:06 – 17:21

• Ally’s sisters’ support was critical (“If she wouldn’t have been there, I probably wouldn’t have gone through with the wedding.” — 15:21).
• She told Anton a week prior she didn’t see herself saying yes; the lack of comfort at the altar made her final decision.

“That altar moment should have been, like, a comfort and, like, a wave of just... calmness, and it wasn’t. And that really was, like, my no.” — Ally (16:00)

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8. Family Reactions & The “Cold-Hearted” Moment

Timestamps: 17:21 – 19:28

• Ally recounts a hurtful moment where an Anton family friend called her "a cold-hearted [bleep]" and Anton’s group cheered with champagne as she left the altar in tears.

“For Anton to allow that to happen too… seeing how distraught I was leaving the altar… that was just vile.” — Ally (18:54)

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9. On Anton’s “Icks”

Timestamps: 21:58 – 22:47

• Ally lightheartedly discusses some “icks”—flip-flops, Anton’s walk, and leaving his glasses atop his head at the reveal. Both agree nervousness was likely the cause.

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10. Madison’s Journey With Retinitis Pigmentosa

Timestamps: 23:15 – 27:58

• Madison opens up about sharing her vision-loss diagnosis on national TV, describing initial shame, fear, and later receiving hundreds of messages of support after her story aired.
• She explains how her sight issues have impacted her dating life, including being mistaken for drunk and navigating dimly-lit venues.

“Monsters are scarier in the dark. As soon as you can learn about it, shed light on it, it gets a lot less scary.” — Madison (23:38)

“It’s an invisible disability... people are like, ‘you’re not blind?’ I’m like, no, I’m not, but I’m blinding.” — Madison (27:43)

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11. Madison & Joe: In the Pods, Revel, and Mexico

Timestamps: 28:02 – 36:12

• In the pods, Joe “climbed the ranks” due to his consistency and pursuit.
• At the reveal, their connection felt off; Joe acted awkward and distant.
• After hurtful comments by Joe about Madison’s body surfaced, she struggled deeply and developed an eating disorder during filming (“I accept his apology just so that it no longer poisons me.” — 30:31).

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12. Mexico Pool Party & the Aftermath

Timestamps: 33:22 – 36:12

• Madison describes being ignored and rejected bids for affection at the pool party.
• Details her own side of the infamous post-nap argument, citing Joe’s preoccupation with how he was being filmed.

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13. Joe’s Tux Fitting Breakdown & Breakup

Timestamps: 36:28 – 38:50

• Madison was shocked and disturbed by Joe’s meltdown at the tux fitting, both in the way he treated friends and strangers.
• Joe never offered clear reasons for ending things. Madison believes the real issue wasn’t her body but deeper commitment and personal issues.
• Madison reflects on her own part in the dynamic, and whether Joe was ever ready for marriage.

“I dodged a bullet.” — Madison (37:17)

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14. Reunion Reflections & Closure

Timestamps: 39:02 – 41:13

• Both women describe the reunion as “intense” but ultimately cathartic. Madison details her panic attack and eventual decision that she won’t get answers from Joe, but accepts her own closure.

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15. Post-Show Drama: Casey, Rumors, Makeout, and More

Timestamps: 44:21 – 49:45

• Madison discusses learning of Joe and Casey’s post-show involvement, emphasizing that Casey owed her nothing but Joe did.
• Recounts the confrontation with Casey at a pool party, her reactions, and aftermath, including an awkward post-breakup makeout with Joe.
• Madison is candid about wanting clarity but ultimately following her gut in letting go.

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16. Addressing Anton’s Drinking and Strip Club Rumors

Timestamps: 51:13 – 54:44

• Ally reflects on why she and Anton never fully discussed strip-club rumors.
• She feels that Anton’s drinking was a lifestyle issue, not just TV stress.
• Anton’s lack of deep conversations and passivity ultimately made Ally realize he wasn’t the right partner for her.

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17. Growth, Takeaways, and Moving Forward

Timestamps: 57:08 – 60:34

• Madison would listen to her intuition sooner, not get “pulled out of character.”
• Ally wishes more serious conversations had happened on camera for context.
• Both now feel at peace and look forward to the future, with Madison embracing self-love and Ally embracing decisiveness.

"Being able to love myself in my entirety... I found love for myself." — Madison (59:39)

"Being comfortable with knowing what you want. Sometimes it's just not your match." — Ally (60:09)

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18. On Love Is Blind Season 9’s Legacy

• Both acknowledge that while no marriages resulted, Denver isn’t to blame—every city has its own “mess.”

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Most Memorable Quotes

• "Monsters are scarier in the dark. As soon as you can learn about it, shed light on it, it gets a lot less scary." — Madison (23:38)
• “I accept his apology just so that it no longer poisons me.” — Madison (30:31)
• "For Anton to allow that to happen too… seeing how distraught I was leaving the altar… that was just vile." — Ally (18:54)
• "Being able to love myself in my entirety... I found love for myself." — Madison (59:39)
• "Blame it on the edit, huh? Babe, you almost said it and it only goes so far." — Ally (06:55)

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Highlighted Segments with Timestamps

• [01:06] — Life after filming & newfound routines
• [04:15] — Watching yourself on reality TV, editing, and “bad edits”
• [07:10] — Missing context in on-air relationships
• [09:03] — The reveal, Brazilian engagement customs, and what viewers missed
• [14:23] — Ally on Anton’s drinking as a dealbreaker
• [23:15] — Madison on sharing her vision loss diagnosis publicly
• [30:31] — Managing the fallout of Joe’s comments and finally accepting apology
• [36:28] — Madison on Joe’s tux fitting meltdown: “deeply disturbing on a character level”
• [44:29] — Madison’s reaction to Joe/Casey post-show
• [57:17] — Both women’s lessons learned: intuition and speaking up

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Tone & Dynamic

The episode is candid, raw, heartfelt, and peppered with humor (especially from Madison). The women balance serious reflections on trauma, disability, and heartbreak with classic reality TV shade and relatable “girl chat” energy, offering a wealth of tea for fans and thoughtful perspective for anyone navigating life in the spotlight.

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In Summary

This episode is a deeply personal and honest look at what happens when reality TV meets real life. Ally and Madison bring warmth, laughter, and wisdom, turning the drama of Love Is Blind Season 9 into lessons about self-trust, boundaries, and the power of sharing your story. A must-listen for fans and anyone interested in the unfiltered human side of reality dating shows.

Transcript

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[Ally]

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[Host (AD)]

What's the Reality?

[Ally]

What's the reality?

[Host (AD)]

Hey, you guys, and welcome back to another episode of what's the Reality? It's me, AD and today I have two lovely guests from Love is Blind season nine joining me. I have Ally.

[Ally]

Hi. Hello.

[Host (AD)]

And I have Madison. Hi, A.D. welcome to what's the Reality? Thank you. That looks so cute.

[Madison]

Thanks for having us.

[Host (AD)]

I'm happy to have you guys. Okay, so how are y' all feeling now that the whole season is finally out? I think best way.

[Madison]

It kind of, you know, feels like a chapter is kind of closing, and I'm feeling a lot of clarity and just kind of closure and just peace.

[Host (AD)]

I feel that.

[Ally]

Yeah, I think I'm right there with her. It's nice to actually be able to, like, talk openly about everything now and, like, have the world know all the things instead of just like our own little group of friends.

[Host (AD)]

So, yeah. Okay, so catch me up. What is the past year been like for each of you?

[Ally]

I have been in pursuit of my degree, so that's really taken up a lot of my time. I'm still in Denver. However, I'm not working nights anymore, so that's a big shift. I am a real human. Yes. So, yeah, back on a normal sleep schedule, and I'm actually working with aesthetic dermatology, and one of the big comments I've gotten is like, oh, my gosh, Allie, you're so different. You look so different. It's like. Yeah, it's. It's the job doing its job, you know? So it's been nice.

[Host (AD)]

I love it. You do look amazing.

[Ally]

Thank you.

[Host (AD)]

And what. What have you been up to?

[Madison]

You know, the last year has been incredible. I got really involved with foundation Fighting Blindness, you know, my nonprofit that I Volunteer with. I just became the president of the Colorado chapter, which is really exciting. Thank you so much. Thank you. I'm still a UX UI designer and living in Denver. Ish. So still.

[Host (AD)]

So what does that mean?

[Madison]

I'm just south, so. Okay.

[Ally]

I'm like.

[Host (AD)]

I thought there was some tea in there. I'm like, you're in and out.

[Ally]

Okay, we'll get.

[Host (AD)]

We'll get there. Don't worry.

[Madison]

And I'm single still, but happily single.

[Ally]

Like.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. Letting us know early.

[Madison]

Yep.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

In case anybody wants to know. Oh, set me up with your brothers.

[Host (AD)]

You heard it here first. Okay. So I'm always, like, excited to hear how people end up on the show. Did either of you apply or were either of you, like, scouted? How did your stories.

[Ally]

Mine was a little bit of both. Initially, it was like, friends telling me to do it when they thought I was coming to Denver. And then I had a few different. What are they called, people that reach.

[Host (AD)]

Out to you on Instagram Casting.

[Ally]

Casting managers or whatever. Yeah, a couple of them reached out and I was, like, actually already applied, but, like, thanks so much. It was, like, validation that, like, okay, maybe this is something I should do. And that's where it started.

[Host (AD)]

Cute. What about you?

[Madison]

I've always been a Love is Blind fan, but I actually did not know that they were coming to Denver. And I was talking to this guy, and he messaged me on Instagram. And he's like, lol, look at this DM I just got. And it was about Love is Blind. And he's like, I would never do this. And I was like, I would, right? So I messaged the girl on Instagram because I was on super Private, so, like, nobody, unless you were following me, could, like, message me. So I just messaged her and I was like, hey. Like, I don't know if I'm the kind of person you'd want for this, but I'd love to talk to you. And the rest is history.

[Host (AD)]

That's so funny. Do you ever talk to that guy that sent you that?

[Ally]

No.

[Madison]

Ironically, that was, like, the last time we talked.

[Ally]

Yeah, exactly.

[Host (AD)]

That's so funny. He's probably. That's probably his claim to fame. Like, I sent her the DMs sharing.

[Ally]

That story, to be honest.

[Host (AD)]

Well, now look at you.

[Madison]

Look at me now.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. Thank you, friend.

[Madison]

Yes.

[Host (AD)]

So what has it been like for each of you watching yourselves back on tv?

[Madison]

It's been a little surreal. Yeah, it's been a little weird. Definitely eye opening. You know, I think there's parts of. Of this in my story that I can learn from and really kind of reflect on. It's just like so surreal, you know, like going on TikTok and like opening it and just seeing people like, reacting to me is very strange. I even found myself like, watching the show and like, almost dissociating, not thinking about it being me. So it's been a really bizarre experience, but really cool.

[Host (AD)]

Did you watch the whole show? I have, yeah.

[Madison]

Yes.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. I know a lot of people go on and they're like, can't even bear to watch.

[Ally]

That's me right now.

[Host (AD)]

You haven't watched the whole thing yet.

[Ally]

I'm like skipping scenes, certain scenes. I'm just like, I'm sorry, guys.

[Host (AD)]

Like, I know what happened here.

[Ally]

Yeah. Yeah. Cuz we have like the insight from, you know, knowing each other. But watching it, I started to realize, oh my gosh, like these. Some of these girls are really going through it, like, including obviously Madison, you know.

[Madison]

Um.

[Ally]

But yeah, I think for me at times it's felt like a distant version of myself. Um, I've gotten a lot of comments on, like, my voice and I'm like, purposely trying to talk lower. You have the sweetest voice. I was like, I'm so sorry, guys. I was just nervous. Like, it's just the cameras and the lights and all the things, you know. But yeah, it. Part of it doesn't feel like you. And a part of you is like.

[Madison]

Agreed, what the heck? Or like just watching a conversation where I'm like, well, you should have seen the first 20 minutes of that and you'd understand where I got there, you know? Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Is it hard to know that it's been edited and chopped up and then presented in a way that maybe wasn't how it happened?

[Ally]

I think we knew what we signed up for. It's weird to see how it finally played out and to like, sometimes have to answer questions in the past about like, episodes that we hadn't seen, that was hard. But I think now that, you know, we have had a chance to watch everything, the narrative makes sense, you know, like the parts that were shown, it makes sense. And I think all the storylines did what they were like, meant to do, which was entertain, you know.

[Madison]

Well, honestly, to that point, like, I think that Love is Blind really does do a good job of capturing the essence of what a conversation was like. That's something that I noticed where I'm like, ultimately you got exactly what was coming from that situation, you know, Like, I. There was never a point that I Was watching it being like, I got a bad edit on that. Like, it was like, no, like, in general, that was kind of the essence of what I was feeling, what he was feeling. Would I have liked there to be maybe some more context? Yeah. But in general, I do think that this show does a good job of capturing the essence of both the people in the scenes. So when people are like, oh, I got a bad edit, I'm like, blame it on the edit, huh? Babe, you almost said it and it.

[Ally]

Only goes so far. I agree.

[Host (AD)]

I understand that all too much. Allie, let's go back to the beginning with you. So I feel like your connection with Anton wasn't really showcased as much during the pods. Are you upset that the viewers didn't get to see more?

[Ally]

In a way, yes. I think as, like, the story develops, you got a little bit more of a glimpse into, like, our. Our connection and what we both wanted. But, yeah, it definitely would have been helpful to have people know, like, hey, we did discuss ethics and values engaged.

[Host (AD)]

On the first day.

[Ally]

Right. Like, we did discuss, you know, like, what our lifestyle would be like. We talked about money. We had all those very serious conversations and they weren't showed. So then, like Madison said, it's. It's the context that lacks sometime. But in general, you know, I think our story developed in, like, a really story, like, way, and I think, yeah, context would have been helpful, but I'm not upset at how it plays out.

[Host (AD)]

Did you have any other connections that we didn't get to see?

[Ally]

I did. Yeah. So that was actually a question that I asked when things were, like, pre airing, they were about to announce cast, I asked them, you know, what connections were going to be shown. I really only had one other that I was upset about for, like, a certain period of time, and that was with Patrick, which another wrench in, like, that story, you know.

[Host (AD)]

Interesting.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Okay.

[Madison]

I too, spoke with Patrick and I let Patrick have a piece of my mind.

[Ally]

Yeah, no, same, same.

[Host (AD)]

Is there, like, what do you mean you let him have a piece of.

[Madison]

Oh, like, it was just some communication stuff and, like, the way he was talking to me and it's like I was exhausted and then he said something and I was like, you know what? Do better. And I left. So it's not like anything crazy. It's just kind of like, you know, it's messy, like lots of tangled webs.

[Host (AD)]

So I've been hearing. So we have to talk about your reveal.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

What was going through your head when you saw Anton for the first time?

[Ally]

I thought he was very attractive when I first saw him. Obviously, I said yes to, you know, being engaged to him and felt like I loved him at that point. But that moment really kind of solidified to me or for me when I met him. And when I saw him in person, I was like, holy. Like, holy. Like, that's actually my husband. Like, I'm actually getting married. And so I was. I was very happy at the reveal.

[Host (AD)]

Did you ever realize in the moment that he actually never proposed to you at the reveal?

[Ally]

He did, though.

[Host (AD)]

He did, yeah. What happened?

[Ally]

I guess I was caught.

[Host (AD)]

Really? Yeah.

[Ally]

And that has been a comment, actually.

[Host (AD)]

Did you get your ring?

[Ally]

I did, yeah.

[Host (AD)]

That day at the reveal?

[Ally]

Yes. He. He got down, and we did the whole thing. And when he got down on a knee, he froze. And I was like, oh, come on, honey. And so he was kind of just, like, staring into, like, you know, me up for a little bit. And then I just, like, put my hand out, and I was like, okay, come on. Like, let's put the ring on. But I think the reason you don't see it in the reveal so much is because we did do my right hand, which is custom in Brazilian culture to get engaged on the right hand. Move it to the left when you're actually married. And so I don't know if that was cut because it kind of would have been confusing for viewers to see the ring on the right hand. But, yeah, he did propose.

[Host (AD)]

Okay, so you did have your moment. Aw. How did you feel when you were waiting for him to look back and he just poured himself another glass of champagne? Did you notice that?

[Ally]

Yeah, I did. I think there was, like, a very little glimpse of, like, head tilt at that scene. And I think you can see a little bit in my eyes that I was like, anton, what the heck, man? Like, because we were at my side of the wall. And so I was just standing there watching him walk back, and I was, like, fully expecting. Because all the other reveals, in every other season, you're catching, like, every last glimpse that you can. And I'm like, hello. I just felt really dumb. I was like, why? I feel like I felt manly. I was like, why am I the one looking at.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

And he's, like, not turning back to look back at me.

[Host (AD)]

And I was like, so he never turned around? That's all real?

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. Did he ever say anything about that after, like, after watching it? Was he like, No, I.

[Ally]

Honestly, me and him have, like, not really communicated. He said, sends, like, a really nice. Just, like, how Are you feeling with everything text and like, it was very short and that was all we've had.

[Host (AD)]

So in the real world it started to become clear that you two had different views on money. For example, you were surprised to learn that he spent 5k on your engagement ring. Were finances something that you guys discussed in the pods?

[Ally]

Yes, we definitely talked about finances. But to clarify, he did not spend his own money on the ring. That was all Netflix provided.

[Madison]

I was very surprised by that comment. I was like, yes.

[Ally]

And again, I, I talked about this at the union a little bit. So many of the conversations we had were so, so light hearted. It wasn't actually like, spend more money on me, you know, like, get me a bigger ring. Obviously I would have loved a bigger ring. I don't know any woman that wouldn't have, you know, and to, to have him like pick a ring out of just a set of displayed rings. It, it wasn't my ideal ring, you know, and I think that's fair. I don't, I don't think like necessarily the price point is something that I would have been super concerned about. But you know, in that light hearted conversation definitely like came off that way. And so many of our conversations were like, I want a private chef, I want this and I want that. Yeah. Where again, I was like trying to keep things light and get him talking and like get him to connect and open up and be at ease. That I guess it kind of goes in that sense a lot of the time.

[Host (AD)]

So yeah, it seemed to be a lot of you guys is like discussions. When we did get to see you guys, it was about how to like morph your life together almost like financially.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

But we saw you guys argue about his drinking as well. Were there any issues that the two of you guys had about his drinking that were not on camera?

[Ally]

I don't remember anything specific. I think that was really our big discussion was the one that was on camera.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

In regards to the drinking. We had other discussions off camera, but regarding drinking, that was really the main one.

[Host (AD)]

So. Okay, I have a question then. Like, how was what we saw with the like mimosas for breakfast?

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Was that a regular thing or was that just like, did he really often come home at like that early in the morning and have beers and.

[Ally]

Yeah, his typical. Which, you know, aside from like the drinking health is important to me. And that was very much explained in the pods to him regards to exercise and healthy eating and everything surrounding that. He was having fast food almost every day. He was coming home from his Night shift and drinking two or three beers every morning. And when he's working, you know, five nights a week, and that's kind of your norm. You're drinking five days a week, and then you're drinking potentially on the weekends when you go out with your friends.

[Host (AD)]

Like, that's an issue into it as well.

[Ally]

Right? Like, that's a problem. Like, if you're drinking every day, that's a problem. It doesn't matter if it's one drink, two drinks, like, it's an issue. It's not healthy, it's not good for you long term. It affects the quality of sperm. So if that's something that, like, I'm considering to be a life partner and be the father of my kids, absolutely not. Like, that wasn't a negotiable for me. And he obviously found that out.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, yeah. Quick, fast, In a hurry.

[Madison]

Yes.

[Host (AD)]

Okay, let's talk about the wedding day. It was really sweet to see all of your sisters come and support you on your wedding day. Even the one that didn't approve too much. How'd that make you feel?

[Ally]

I was very aware that she didn't approve. It was. There were a lot of conversations that were had on and off camera to get her there. Ultimately, I was just happy that she was able to show up for me.

[Madison]

I.

[Ally]

If she wouldn't have been there, I probably wouldn't have gone through with the wedding. I don't think I could have. But she did, you know, decide to come and, like, you saw, it was like, a really sweet moment. It was the first time I had seen her in a little bit. So that's really all I could have asked for from her, is just the support of being there.

[Host (AD)]

I had my sisters there too, so I know that feeling. At what point did you know you were going to say no at the altar?

[Ally]

So I had a conversation with Anton about a week prior to the weddings, and I told him. I was like, I don't see myself saying yes at this point. Like. And I explained to him, like, we went through the whole conversation. Unfortunately, this was off camera. We went through the whole conversation of, like, I don't feel like you're yourself. I don't feel like you're the person I met in the pods and kind of laid everything out right. He's like, yeah, that's fair. I understand. And actually, something that you don't see at the wedding is at the altar. When I was, like, explaining myself to him, he goes, that's fair. When I said, like, you're not the Man I met in the pods, he literally said, that's fair. And I'm like, yes, we discussed this. This isn't news. Yeah. But I think to me, really what I wanted to do with the wedding and with having everybody there was trying to feel like at ease. I felt like in the moment of like you're at the altar with, you know, your spouse or your future spouse and who's meant to be like your partner, I felt like that altar moment should have been like a comfort and like a wave of just like refreshing and calmness, and it wasn't. And that really was like my. No. You know, because up until then, like, I was in the bridal scene. I was like, you know. Yeah. I was like, it's probably a no, but like, what if.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

You know?

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

You never know until you get to the end, right? Yeah.

[Ally]

And I think that's like really encouraged too, is like, see it through. You know, like you had a connection with this person, you fell in love with them. You went through all this experience. See it through. And that's, that's really what I tried to do.

[Host (AD)]

After you said no, we saw that one of Anton's family members called you a cold hearted.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

How'd that make you feel?

[Ally]

I don't know who that was, but like, she can DM me. Like, let me know your thoughts, girl. But actually I do know who that was. Do you?

[Madison]

I met her on Anton's pontoon last summer. It's one of his, like, good girlfriends. Okay.

[Ally]

Oh, I didn't know who this person was, but whatever, you know, like, did.

[Host (AD)]

You say anything to her? Wait, how did you know it was her that said that?

[Madison]

Because I recognized her on the show. Like when I saw the show back. No, I didn't have pictures together with her, but just when we were there because we talked a lot. There was a lot of us. Like on the pontoon.

[Ally]

Is that when you met Daria?

[Madison]

Yes, on the fourth. No, that was a different time. The pontoon was a different day. And then I went out with friends. But yes, that was so random too.

[Ally]

My roommates.

[Host (AD)]

She calls you a cold hearted.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

And you see that for the first time on tv.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

How are we feeling?

[Ally]

Yeah, I mean, it wasn't pleasant, you know, Like I. I don't feel like I am a cold hearted. I don't think any person around me that's in my group thinks that it is what it is, you know, like, she obviously cares for Anton and that's fair. Like if that's how she felt Then she just expressed that. Yeah. But I was very hurt, too. At the wedding or, you know, post altar, they, like, they popped champagne when I left the altar. They didn't show that, which, you know, I'm walking away. I'm, like, crying my eyes out. I'm, like, hardly able to walk straight.

[Madison]

My.

[Ally]

My mom is guiding me. My friends and sisters are all around me, and they're, like, popping champagne and, like, cheering in the background. And I was like, that is so disrespectful. And for Anton to allow that to happen, too, like, immediately after that, seeing how distract I was leaving the altar, I felt like that was just vile. Yeah. And I think hearing that cheering and all that stuff going on really kind of made me be like, I don't care to have a conversation with him, you know, in the setting. And then it just kind of dragged, and we never had anything after.

[Host (AD)]

Do you think there's anything that could have been done differently to make it work between you two?

[Ally]

I think if he would have been able to be his pod self in real life, our chances would have been a lot better. Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. There's been a lot of commentary about him wearing his seeing glasses on the top of his head as sunglasses. Do you want to make a comment on that?

[Ally]

Honestly, it was never something that I really like when he paid attention, when.

[Host (AD)]

The doors open, and he was like.

[Ally]

He, like, squinted.

[Madison]

Oh, poor it.

[Ally]

I mean, the man needs to see, so he should have had his glasses on.

[Madison]

I actually talked to him about that the other day.

[Ally]

Did you? What'd you say?

[Madison]

Yeah, he was like, I'm gonna be so real, Madison. I got so nervous, I forgot they were even on my head. Oh, my God. And he was like, go, Sam. Why can't I see? And then we were also talking. He's like, I think I also wanted to put my best foot forward, and I felt a little insecure in my glasses.

[Ally]

Yeah. That's very fair.

[Madison]

Honestly.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

He had, like, the very thick rimmed glasses, too. I'm like, hi, A. So I get it. I get wanting to not wear them in that moment.

[Madison]

I think he really just forgot, if I'm honest. I really think he was so nervous.

[Host (AD)]

It seems to be a part of his personality to, like, put them up there. Yeah.

[Ally]

And I do. Yeah. He was extremely nervous during the entire reveal.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

Which is part of.

[Host (AD)]

It's not an easy thing.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

At all. For anyone.

[Ally]

Right. Like, we get used to the cameras and everything in the pods, but in the. In the reveal, it's like, cameras swishing up ahead, and, like, there's so many people there. The lights are so much brighter, and it's like this whole different TUDS thing. So.

[Host (AD)]

Okay, so we're not holding that against them?

[Ally]

No.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. All right. I guess I'll move on.

[Ally]

There were other things that, like, were a little bit icky to me, but. Yeah, the glasses weren't necessarily what was icky.

[Host (AD)]

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[Madison]

Select plans.

[Host (AD)]

Only restrictions apply.

[Commercial Voiceover]

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[Ally]

Well, the flip flops to show up in Baja was a thing. I didn't love that.

[Madison]

I don't think men have toes.

[Ally]

Yeah, I don't think Mentos conversations put the dogs away.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. So the toes out.

[Ally]

Oh, my gosh. It's dogs. That's the. I said pigs. Piggies. Piggies.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

You could say piggies. Or, like, dogs. Yeah. Okay.

[Ally]

I thought I said it wrong last night. Okay, good. Okay. Yeah. So flip flops. Not it for guys. And then, I don't know, he has, like, this strange walk. Like, not to nitpick him, but, like, he walks with his booty kind of tucked in.

[Madison]

I can picture the Anton walk.

[Ally]

Yeah. It's almost like his upper body doesn't move enough to match. Like his gate. I don't know.

[Host (AD)]

Okay.

[Ally]

Yeah, but obviously, it's just like, we all have those little quirks. Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

And if you're gonna marry somebody, you gotta be able to at least take how they walk. At the very least, you have to be okay with that, right?

[Madison]

Oh, gosh.

[Host (AD)]

Understandable. Listen. To each their own. Ick.

[Madison]

I'm not gonna judge you.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, I feel you. Because if you're walking right around me. Get away. Right? Yeah. Yeah, I feel you. Okay. Madison. Hey, girl.

[Ally]

How are you?

[Madison]

I'm good.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah?

[Ally]

I am good.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. You look good.

[Ally]

Thank you.

[Host (AD)]

You're gonna have to help me with the name of your eye condition, but you bravely opened up about how personal your experience has been with. And it's called retinitis pigmentosa. Pigmentosa. Okay. Which could eventually cause you to go completely blind. What was it like sharing that publicly? And did you have any hesitation about bringing that up in the pods with the men?

[Madison]

Sharing it publicly was very scary. You know, it's. Honestly, when I was diagnosed, it was something that I held close to my chest for a long time. I felt a lot of shame around it because it's kind of this feeling of, like, all of a sudden, I'm not normal in my mind. And I was in denial for a good, like, three years before I started digging into it, getting support, and started learning that monsters are scarier in the dark. So as soon as you can learn about it, shed light on it, it gets a lot less scary. So really, that was the first time that I had spoken my truth in such a public setting with so many people around. At that point in time, the only people in my life that knew were my friends and family and then the organization that I'm involved with. So it was really an intense moment. It was really scary to come forward with that. I was nervous about bringing it up in the pods, too. I didn't really know how to go about it. And it's interesting because you see, in that conversation with Joe and I, when I do bring it up, I wasn't anticipating to say that. Like, he's like, yeah, like, what's wrong with you? And, like, the fact that my brain goes, I know what's wrong with me. Like, I have this eye condition, you know, and it was just. It was hard. Another one of my pod dates, actually, we were playing, like, would you rather. And one of the questions was, would you rather go deaf or go blind? And that was like, a moment that I was like, well, actually, you know, so in general, it's historically been hard for me to talk about, but now it's been so amazing to see so many people's stories resonate with mine. And I've had over 500 DMs of people saying that they have it or their family member has it. And seeing my story really inspired them. And it's like, that means so much, and it goes so much deeper than just being on a show.

[Host (AD)]

That's beautiful. So in your previous dating, like, history, before Love is Blind, were you open about that, about your condition with people that you were dating casually? Or did you kind of wait till it was a bit more serious to drop Your news?

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Madison]

You know, I would say I don't date casually. Like, I usually am. Like, I'm looking for my man, you.

[Host (AD)]

Know, so it's kind of.

[Ally]

Yeah, it's kind of thing that I.

[Madison]

Really just come out with, like. And honestly, it kind of shows for itself. Like, oftentimes if I'm meeting somebody at a bar or a restaurant and it's like, dimly lit, they'll see me run into things and. Or concert. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I've literally been kicked out of a concert because I fell downstairs and they thought I was drunk and I wasn't. I just couldn't see the stairs.

[Ally]

I know.

[Madison]

Truly. So, you know, if it doesn't show for itself, I try to bring it up early because oftentimes I actually need help navigating certain spaces.

[Host (AD)]

Okay, interesting.

[Ally]

We were constantly backstage, like, Madison. Somebody grabbed Madison.

[Madison]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Ally]

Oh, yeah.

[Madison]

When we come in from outside and it's dark in there, I had to have somebody hold my hand because I will run into things. My eyes take a lot longer to adjust, going from bright light to low light. And then when they do adjust in low light, peripherally, I don't see very well at all. It's kind of like tunnel vision.

[Host (AD)]

Wow.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

And it's only going to progressively get worse.

[Madison]

Yeah, yeah, it's. It's gonna. It is degenerative, so it should kind of keep progressing. Um, it has seemed that I've been semi stable, slight decrease year over year, not quite as accelerated as it was from, I think, 14 to 25 when I really saw intense decrease. But it's so hard with RP because every case is so different. So, you know, I know people that are 70 and they still have some vision. I know people that are 18 and have never driven. So it's such a spectrum. Lightness is such a spectrum.

[Host (AD)]

Girl, you are a warrior for real.

[Ally]

Thank you.

[Host (AD)]

Because you, like, you literally, like, if you don't share your story, you don't know, and you're just walking around like a. Like a ray of light, smiling through everything, and we would have never known. So it's really one brave of you to come out on national global TV and discuss that and then be like a kind of soundboard for people that are going through that. So it's really beautiful.

[Madison]

Thank you so much. Yeah, it is. I mean, it's an invisible disability, you know, and it is something that people are like, you're not blind? Or I'm like, no, I'm not, but I'm blinding.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

So it's it's so amazing to be this much needed representation for this community.

[Host (AD)]

Well, you're doing great.

[Ally]

Thank you.

[Host (AD)]

So let's talk Joe a little bit.

[Madison]

Oh, favorite topic.

[Host (AD)]

Fun. So what was it about Joe that made you fall in love with him in the pods and did you have any other connections that the show did not show?

[Madison]

I did have other connections that the show did not show. I actually went, yeah, well, that ended early. I actually went to proposal day with two people. Oh, yeah. The other person is not shown, and that is what that is. But ultimately, me and that other connection both had a stronger connection outside of each other. So it was kind of like a mutual, like, we'll be friends. Thank you for being part of this kind of farewell. What attracted me to Joe in the pods, honestly, he was actually my number five on day one. He slowly climbed how it happened.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, right. They said the first day you're like.

[Madison]

Waiting in the wings.

[Ally]

It is a lot. Yeah, it is.

[Madison]

But he kind of climbed the ranks for me. What it was was he was so consistent in the pots. I want to make sure that's very, very clear. Consistent in the pots. And he was very adamant about showing up for me. Like, he was very clear. Like, you're it for me in here. I'm ending my other connections. I want to see this through with you. So, you know, just feeling that kind of being chosen, feeling like it's something we all want. Right. And hearing that and feeling that made me feel like, wow, like I really found my person. Like, this person's so pursuing me. I want to feel this through.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. How did it feel seeing him at the reveal?

[Madison]

I'll never get the deered headlights look out of my face. You know, the door's open. It's just like bug eye, the reveal itself. You know, I felt in that moment it was. Something was a little weird. I was still trying to pull the connection and the warmth and the depth from the pod to that moment. And I felt like I was like, I don't know, like trying to like wrangle a tiger. Like, it was like he's just kind of bug eyed and like, kind of like darting. Yeah, like darting. Darting eyes. You know, it is a little weird. So I think I was trying to bring the grounding energy and I just was not feeling that back. Watching back. His interview obviously tells me a lot more. Very disheartening.

[Host (AD)]

But yeah, even like when you guys got to Mexico, Joe made some very hurtful comments about your body in an interview. He did apologize to you about this at the reunion. Do you really accept his apology?

[Madison]

I accept his apology just so that it no longer poisons me. I feel he has had a year and a half. He has my phone number. He knows.

[Host (AD)]

That was your first apology.

[Madison]

That was the first apology. So we hadn't talked literally since. Well, really, we hadn't talked about filming since filming, except for one little interaction. And then I saw. I've seen him at various, you know, events, but it's not like we got into anything. So do I accept it? Yes. Just because I no longer need to carry the weight of his words.

[Ally]

But.

[Madison]

It'S a little too late. Like, you know that scene in Home Alone when Kevin's going upstairs? He's like, I'm sorry. And the mom's like, too late. Kind of same vibe.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

How did it feel? Watching.

[Madison]

Was more disturbing than I anticipated. You know, I talk about how behind the scenes he had kind of said to me, like, oh, like my type is a little bit more petite. And that triggered something in me that ultimately kind of led to me having an eating disorder for a period of time during filming and then for a time after. I'm healthy now, but watching it back and seeing just how careless he was with his words, it was really hurtful. And, you know, it kind of restirred that in me a little bit. And I kind of had to settle back in and be like, nope, like, we are healed past this. We are beyond this. It was really hard to watch. You know, it's worst case scenario. Like, the person that you fall in love with isn't attracted to you. And it's like.

[Host (AD)]

And then is mean about it.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

My thing is, like, you don't have to be attracted. You don't have to, like, the person behind the, like, what you see. You don't have to. But don't be mean about it. And I felt like, like you said it was very, like, careless. And like, it was mean.

[Madison]

It was mean. And he, like, kind of made it into a joke. Like, he's like, oh, golly. Even that sounds bad. And it's like. Like I'm a real person, you know, like this. This was deep. And the thing that's so hard for me is that and confusing is that he's saying these things, yet we're intimate. And it's funny. Cause the show has me talking about that a lot. And I think they were trying to drive home the fact that he was saying one thing and doing another. And I felt so confused throughout the whole experience.

[Host (AD)]

I think that was confusing. For us as well.

[Madison]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

That was very.

[Madison]

Yeah, very interesting.

[Ally]

He just comes across like a boy. Like, everything that I see is like, boy, like, there's no man in there yet. And maybe that man has developed in the last, like, however long.

[Madison]

I can't speak to that.

[Ally]

I haven't had it, you know, in your actions with him either. But, yeah, everything that came across was just like. Like, that's a boy. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host (AD)]

So let's talk about the infamous fight in Mexico. Can you walk me through what happened from your perspective? Like, was there anything we just did not see? Because there's a lot of.

[Ally]

A lot of. Yeah.

[Madison]

To answer that, let me go back to the pool party.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Madison]

So going to the pool party, you know, it's our first time as a couple in a group setting. I was excited to kind of show up and be like, you know, this is my man. Have him be like, this is my girl. You know, see the other couples. Like, I think that we want to show up with our partners and feel a sense of, like, pride.

[Host (AD)]

Proud.

[Madison]

Yeah, exactly. And when we got to the pool party, as soon as the boys showed up, it was like, madison who? And, you know, throughout that whole pool party, I'm feeling really dejected. I think that in relationship, there's kind of bids for connection, and you see me consistently trying to have a bit of connection with him and it be kind of denied. And so from that whole thing, I'm already just so frustrated. I'm hurt, I'm confused. I'm like, is this how you operate? This is the way you move about the world? Because I'm not the girl that's gonna sit back while you have frat boy joke moment. That's just not me.

[Host (AD)]

All day long.

[Ally]

All day.

[Madison]

Right. So he goes back to take a nap. I was given the option to either go get my own room or to go film as we'd already planned. We had had a discussion with Joe that morning that we were filming that night. So he knew it was coming. I, of course, decided to go back. I'm like, oh, he's probably awake. I've been gone. He's been gone for four or five hours at this point. Like, I was there for a subsequent amount of time before I went back.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Madison]

So I went back to check. He wakes up. You see that whole thing. There's actually a moment in there that you don't see. And he pops up and he's like, why are the cameras here? And he starts getting mad at me, actually. And to the point that My producer had to step in and be like, joe, you knew we were filming tonight. And so then that goes down. And in between the whole fight, he's talking to production, so they're having to splice this in a really weird way. You even see him at one point when I'm sitting on the. The bathtub, and I'm like, you're up. He's like, stop saying that. And he's, like, looking around for the camera. And it was like he was so concerned with how he was going to be perceived that he couldn't even just be in the moment with me. You know, I've handled drunk people before. Like, I know how to deal with people.

[Host (AD)]

That was unusual.

[Madison]

That was unusual, to say the least.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. So how we kind of see it end. But how did it end in, like, real life? How did that wrap up?

[Madison]

Yeah. Okay. So you see us have that fight. I'm laying on the bed. He pops up to ask for dinner. It's like, oh, now you can get up after you've seen me cry out on the patio. Which was whatever. What ended up happening is I grab my stuff, I walk out, and as they're getting me onto the golf cart to go to the other room, I'm like, wait a second. We're filming in the morning. Like, I'm a girl. I need my hair, my makeup, my clothes. Like, he's a guy. He can literally, like, roll out of bed. So I actually went back in. I was like, you get your own room. I'm staying in, period. Yeah, you go get your own room.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. Okay.

[Madison]

So that's how that went down.

[Host (AD)]

Okay.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

I love that for you.

[Madison]

It was rough.

[Host (AD)]

I mean, I hate this story, but I love that you.

[Madison]

I could.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Keep a little bit of.

[Host (AD)]

Got that little power. So what went through your mind watching Joe's breakdown at the tux fitting?

[Madison]

I mean, mind you, I just watched that yesterday, and I'm still processing that. That was deeply disturbing on a character level. The way that he treated his friends, the way that he treated the woman in the store.

[Ally]

That was crazy.

[Madison]

It was really. Yeah, it was just. It was so disturbing to watch, and it's so hurtful to know that I had just had this beautiful moment with my family, with the girls. I'm feeling excited.

[Host (AD)]

And that's what's happening.

[Madison]

And that's what's happening. And the fact that much more went down that night and nobody told me about it is crazy to me. So to actually see it back and to see some true character flaws come out I dodged a bullet.

[Host (AD)]

Dodged a bullet, yeah. During your breakup, Joe couldn't give you specific reasons as to why, as to what was missing in your relationship, and he still couldn't at the reunion. If you had to guess, what would you say the reasoning was?

[Madison]

Because my larger physique. No, I'm just kidding. I'm totally joking. Because I know, actually, truly, I know that's not the case because we were intimate, because he's still having these moments of telling me, you're so beautiful, you're. That it just. I don't know, maybe that was part of it. Maybe in some sense I'm not his typical type. That's fine. I think that it goes much deeper to his own brokenness, you know, I think. Sure. Do I have culpability in that? I could have been more patient at times? Absolutely. Was I acting out of character because this is such a crazy experience and I was in a very insecure space. Absolutely. I can't speak for him, you know, Truly. I guess it's just we are very different people. You know, I think he needed to work on his EQ a little bit because we could not have any kind of conversation.

[Host (AD)]

Do you think he was ready for marriage?

[Madison]

I don't.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

I don't think that he was ready for marriage. You know, you see me say, this is for marriage minded people. Like, you know what we signed up for. You know, I know he has commitment issues from his previous relationship. And you see my mom speak to that, where she's like, okay, you just said that you backed out last minute. Like, are you going to blindside her? And that is ultimately what happens.

[Host (AD)]

Right. It's like everything needs, like a big exhale.

[Madison]

I know it's a lot, but we're here, we're here.

[Host (AD)]

It's over.

[Madison]

We're grounded.

[Ally]

Let's all take a deep exhale.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. And now let's bring you back. So we had the reunion. Yes. And I don't know, tell me how it was for you guys. What was? The. The emotions, the feels? How was that for you guys?

[Ally]

Oh, I thought it was beautiful. First of all, like, being outside was so different than what's typical.

[Madison]

It was a beautiful venue.

[Ally]

Yeah. So I loved that. But I think overall it was just. It was intense. Like, there was a lot going on. Even things that weren't mine felt intense to me. So I know everybody was going through it.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Yeah. You know, all day yesterday was an emotional roller coaster because there was this kind of anticipation in the air for me because I hadn't seen Joe. I hadn't talked to him. There was no back and forth about this. Like, this was truly, like, raw emotion for me and for him, like, coming on to that because we hadn't talked at all. I had a panic attack yesterday. Pulled it back together. You know, I kind of am like, okay, like, I'm gonna go speak my truth and leave it all out there. Try to get the answers that I need and move on. It was hard. It was definitely hard. I was very nervous. Ultimately, though, I feel like I got the closure that I needed because I can just accept, like, I'm not gonna get a full sentence from him and I can release that at this point. We did have a conversation. I don't know if you guys actually will see it, but we had a conversation. We were all standing up and the ice cream had come out and I went up to him because he had tried to talk to me. By the bathrooms.

[Host (AD)]

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[Commercial Voiceover]

Here we have the Limu Emu in.

[Ally]

Its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug Limu.

[Madison]

Is that guy with the binoculars watching us?

[Ally]

Cut the camera. They see us.

[Madison]

Only pay for what you [e-mail] Liberty Liberty.

[Host (AD)]

Liberty Savings Fairy Unwritten by Liberty Mutual.

[Madison]

Insurance Co. Affiliates excludes Massachusetts. And I just told him that, you know, I'm sorry that I wasn't more patient, like, watching it back. I see some of my own flaws, and I'm sorry that I didn't show up for you. And he did ultimately apologize again for, you know, the eating disorder and just the comments on my body, and I think that's as good it's gonna get. You know, I can say that I'm moving forward without animosity, but. But I don't necessarily want him in my orbit.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, understood. And had you seen Anton prior to last night?

[Ally]

I hadn't.

[Host (AD)]

Did you guys speak at all?

[Ally]

No.

[Host (AD)]

Really?

[Ally]

I said hi to him when he was standing behind me before we got on stage, but that was really the extent of it.

[Host (AD)]

Interesting. And was there any, like, moments that was, like, shocking to you guys at the reunion? Like, did anything happen where you're like.

[Ally]

I think Megan's, like, pregnancy or, like, child announcement was my biggest, like, I.

[Madison]

Actually did know about it. Yeah.

[Ally]

But it's so crazy because, like, Megan and I were pretty, like, decently close after everything, but I think Julie was just trying to keep it so tight and, like, keep it under wraps, you know?

[Host (AD)]

Did she tell you, or did you find out via dm?

[Madison]

No, I just found out, like, through the Denver rumor mill. And it was literally, like, somebody came to me and was like, oh, I met Megan's nanny. And I was like, what? I actually was like, there's no way.

[Ally]

That's not right.

[Host (AD)]

Did you reach out to her about it or you just kind of let it go?

[Madison]

That's her business, you know? Like, I'm not gonna. It's not mine to share or talk about unless she wants to.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

So disconnected from, like, the room, Remo. I'm just, like, in my own little corner.

[Host (AD)]

That's the best way to be.

[Madison]

I swear to God. Everybody comes to me with a T. I'm like, that's so funny. I did not ask.

[Ally]

Yeah, no. I'm the last to find out.

[Host (AD)]

Always. I'm kind of like that, too. I'm like, what? I'm like, always, always so oblivious.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Madison, it was revealed that Joe and Casey dated after your split. When did you first learn about this, and what was your reaction?

[Madison]

Well, I don't know if we can call it dating.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. First of all, what was Going on.

[Madison]

I think they were mutually using each other's bodies. That's what I think was going on, but. Okay, how did I find out? I heard you're a comedian, by the.

[Host (AD)]

Way, just so we're clear. You're fucking hilarious.

[Madison]

Thank you. It doesn't always land.

[Host (AD)]

No, it's gonna land here every time you're funny. Okay.

[Madison]

I. I first found out, honestly, I guess, last summer, but I knew that it started probably a month after our engagement ended.

[Host (AD)]

A month?

[Madison]

Probably a month through, like, the rumor.

[Host (AD)]

Mill, or you just.

[Madison]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's. It's alleged. I don't know exactly the timeline. I can't totally speak to it, but I do know that the night of Tuck's fittings, we had gone to one up, and it was, like, me, a few other couples, and then a bunch of singles showed up. I don't even know how they knew where we were. Casey was one of them. And as I'm standing there talking to his friends that were at the tux fitting, I'm telling them, like, I got my dress. I'm showing pictures of my dress. I'm telling them, like, I love him. I'm so excited. Like, I really want to see this through. And as I'm standing there with a ring on my finger, I look over and Casey has both hands on Joe's chest, talking to him. In Joe's words, he said, she was giving me googly eyes. That is what he said that night. And we ended up going to Jensen's house. We hung out there, and then we went back to the hotel. All the while, they're letting me talk like this, knowing full well that he had stormed out. He knows full well that he stormed out. He should have said, hey, production, we need to film tonight.

[Host (AD)]

Point.

[Madison]

We're not going out. We're not delaying this. Let's have this conversation now. You know, I want to make it very clear that Joe is the one that was at fault for this. He was the one that had a responsibility to me. While I think Casey's actions were disrespectful, she's not the one that owed loyalty to me. You know, woman to woman. Not a great look, but yeah. So I don't know if it started actually then or if it started later.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. You and Casey seem to disagree on how your conversation went at Mike's pool party. What really happened at the pool party?

[Ally]

It seemed messy. Gosh, that pool party.

[Host (AD)]

For many different reasons.

[Madison]

For the damn pool party, what happened? I will tell you. So I was standing In a group. Casey came to the party. You know, she's making her around saying hello to people. She came up to a group of us girls, and I was asking her, like, how's wedding season going? You know, I already know about the her and Joe thing. I said, how's dating going? And she's like, oh, you know, good. And I was like, yeah, how's Joe? And she was like, oh, I've been meaning to talk to you about that. I'm like, all right, like, let's talk. Like, you know, truly, like, I. I really do want to hear you out. So we go sit down. There is no recognition of the fact that you're talking to his ex fiance.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

She immediately starts talking to me about how he treated her poorly. She went so far to say, oh, we're Eskimo sisters to me. And I said her. You know, I'm gonna say to you what. I'm gonna say to your face what I've been saying.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

I don't respect your choice. The way that you've gone about this has been classless, and it does hurt me. So to me, it was kind of like, I'm not sure how she's gauging that to be a good conversation. It wasn't bad. It's like we were yelling at each other, but it was kind of just like, okay, well, I said my piece. You said your piece? You know, she's like, telling me, like, all the things that he's doing, and I'm like, girl, like, too bad we weren't friends. I could have.

[Host (AD)]

I could have spared you. Right.

[Madison]

Like, so. I don't know. It was just the whole interaction, to me, just felt really tasteless.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. When you and Joe broke up on the show, you asked him if it had anything to do with other cast members. Were you referring to Casey in that moment?

[Madison]

I was, yeah. I was referring to the story of the night of the dress and tux fittings.

[Host (AD)]

We also learned that you and Joe connected after your breakup and had a makeout session.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

What was that about? With tears.

[Madison]

With tears, yeah. Well, so, you know, about two weeks after filming, I was like, I want to clear the air here. I want to maybe get some clarity. I'm thinking, okay, cameras aren't around. Maybe he'll actually, like, open up and, like, give me some answers. So we go to get drinks. It wasn't even dinner. We just go to get drinks. We talked about. There's no answers. I'm not really. Same kind of thing that you see in all of our Conversations. Like, there's not any substance.

[Host (AD)]

There's not a complete sentence. Thank you.

[Madison]

Yes. So we're leaving. We go into the parking garage. Like, he walks me my car. We're saying goodbye. We give each other hugs, we kiss, we kind of start making out. And then, like, he stops. Like, sorry, I shouldn't have done that. And he starts, like, tearing up. And I just am like, why are you crying?

[Host (AD)]

Like, you ended this. Like, what?

[Madison]

So I texted him after I left, and I was like, you know, part of me almost wanted you to, like, come back here so we could, like, talk. And he's like, I totally would have. And then I was like, why did you start crying? Literally, the text said, I don't know. That was weird. And so I responded, let's play a game. Name that emotion. No response. And that was the last text that we sent.

[Host (AD)]

Really? Did you want more?

[Madison]

No. No, I didn't. You know, I think at that point, my gut knew and my gut knew the whole time, and I should have listened to it. I should have listened to my intuition, but I. I definitely did not want more. Would I, like, answers and clarity? Yeah, maybe. But I've accepted that. Like, I'm not gonna get that. And that's okay.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. I mean, how much more could you want after that? Honestly, it's a little scary.

[Madison]

Yeah, the whole thing was scary.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, it was.

[Madison]

It was really confusing. The entire relationship.

[Host (AD)]

No, I can imagine.

[Madison]

I felt crazy.

[Host (AD)]

Like, even, like, beyond the editing. Do you feel like we got a good gist of what was happening? Or was it overly edited?

[Madison]

No, I wouldn't say it's overly edited. I would say you don't get to see why I kept staying. People are asking me, like, girl, why didn't you leave after the pool party? I'm like, what you don't see is, like, I was being what I now know to be breadcrumbed through this whole thing.

[Ally]

You know?

[Madison]

It was like, I wouldn't have stayed just to stay. I was getting moments of connection where he's like, I wanna marry you. I mean, like, I even say, like, he was saying to me, I wanna get you pregnant. Like, how confusing for me when I'm like, wow, like, you're really in this, then like, you really do wanna do this. And then all of a sudden, you act like this, and it's like, whoa, wait, what? Like, I was constantly kind of on eggshells and being surprised by his. His behavior.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, I feel that. So, Ally, at the reunion, we learned that you never confronted Anton about what his friend's girlfriend told you in the bathroom about strip clubs and his partying and stuff? Why do you think you never brought that up?

[Ally]

I don't know. I really. I don't know how we could have not had that conversation, but I really don't remember having it.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

So I. I don't know if it was just, like, the exhaustion.

[Host (AD)]

You don't remember having what. What conversation?

[Ally]

The.

[Host (AD)]

The bathroom conversation?

[Ally]

No, like, discussing it after, like, having that actual talk of, like, what's this strip club situation actually look like? I have, like, faint memory at some point in person talking to him. Like, yeah, he. I used to go to strip clubs. I don't anymore kind of situation, you know, But I. I really don't remember, like, after that scenario being like, hey, let's talk about this. I think it was, like, our schedules. I think it was just being so overwhelmed with everything that I kind of just like, slipped through the cracks.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. If that is, like, such a. Like, if that is, like, a deal breaker.

[Ally]

Yeah, no, I'm with you. Like, I totally get it. I'm like, I don't know how we avoided that conversation.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. Do you think had you had the conversation and he had time to clear things up, things would be different? Different, or you just kind of went off observed behavior?

[Ally]

I think I was really just observing.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Ally]

I mean, there was so much more than just the strip clubs. And in my eyes, truthfully, even if it would have been, you know, we were at strip clubs four months ago. To me, in my faith, a man who's going to strip clubs just isn't all ready to be married.

[Host (AD)]

So do you think she was telling the truth, or do you think Anton was right when he said. Said that she didn't know him and she was looking for a 15 minutes?

[Ally]

No, I. I feel like that would be a very hard 15 minutes for her to get. You know what I mean? Like, I don't think there's anything for her to grasp out there. I do believe her. I don't know why she would have, like, stirred the pot, you know, it felt like a genuine concern in her.

[Host (AD)]

Mind and, like, private in the bathroom.

[Ally]

Right, Exactly. And, like, normally our mics get turned off when we go to the bathroom. So, like, learning that they weren't off in that bathroom situation, I was kind of. Of like, what else do you guys hear?

[Madison]

Like, true, but me crying into towels every five seconds.

[Ally]

So it was kind of like, oh, okay, so, like, they heard me pee, but also, like, they heard that private conversation, you know? And we are told, like, yeah, your mic's off when you're in the bathroom. So I don't think she was grasping for fame. I do believe her and her concern. And I think through that, that dinner, you can kind of tell that, like, Joe is a party guy. You know, you can tell he wants the drinks and, like, he wants to out. And he even says, like, oh, she's gonna hate me. Like, I don't think that's a good outlook for, like, your fiance's friend to have.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

Like, you. That shouldn't be on your radar at all. Like, you should be trying to, like, have me like you as much as possible.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. Are they still together, do you know?

[Ally]

They're not.

[Host (AD)]

They're not interesting. Yeah.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Do you have any relationship with the girl at all?

[Ally]

I don't. I don't know what happened between them. I know they're no longer together, but that's the extent of my info.

[Host (AD)]

Okay. You also mentioned that you felt like you and Anton didn't have enough serious conversations outside of the pods, and he claimed that you did off camera, and you said the opposite. Can you tell me more about that?

[Ally]

I mean, we did have a little bit of, like, conversations off camera. We generally had our more serious conversations off camera, but anything that was discussed was always, like, me initiating any sort of discussion, and it was like. Like pulling teeth to get him to really say anything. Like, from my perspective, it almost felt like he was scared to say the wrong thing to not, like, deter me from, like, moving forward. Yeah. I just don't feel like he really had much of an opinion through any of our discussions.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

Which was hard.

[Host (AD)]

He admitted that he was feeling anxious and nervous in front of cameras and that he used drinking to help help with this during the process. What are your thoughts on that?

[Ally]

Yeah, I. I understand, you know, being nervous and in front of cameras and anxious. It's a lot, especially, you know, not being used to it. It's very new to all of us. I get it. I empathize. But also, like, what a horrible coping mechanism. Like, you have a partner to lean on, you have your friends, you have your family. Like, so many other different ways to cope. And, like, life is so stressful. Marriage is going to be so hard if that's what you're turning to. To cope every time something hard happens. Like, I don't know, like, we need to talk about that. That's a concern.

[Host (AD)]

Do you think it was coping, or do you think it was kind of a lifestyle that was already set and then the Cameras just kind of highlighted.

[Ally]

Yeah, I think it was a thousand percent lifestyle. And, like, some. Some of the public has shared too. Like. Well, Anton wasn't the only one that was drinking a lot. Like, obviously. Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

But you weren't engaged to everyone else, right?

[Ally]

Exactly. There was. There was a lot of drinks flowing everywhere. I was drunk through certain things. Like, I'm not saying I didn't have anything to drink, but in situations where, like, we're at an event, of course we're celebrating. Of course. But if you're coming home from work and drinking, like, that's where kind of my issues started.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah.

[Ally]

So that's.

[Host (AD)]

That's more like.

[Madison]

Right.

[Host (AD)]

That's intense.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Madison]

The thing that's hard, though, is that that's him getting off work. Like, it's like, you think about people getting off work and it's like they have a glass of wine. Wine. You know what I mean? And I think it's like.

[Ally]

But that's like a Friday thing. Yeah. Potentially. Like, maybe some days, if you're like, you've had a really bad day, of course, have a glass of wine on your Wednesday. But it was a habit. It wasn't like, I'm coming home to de stress. I just had a really hard day. It was like, this is my habit. This is my routine. I come home, I have a few beers, I go to bed. It's like, no.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, understandable.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

You know what you want. So this is for both of you guys. Looking back, is there anything you would have done differently?

[Madison]

I would have listened to my intuition. You know, looking back, I would have really leaned in on who I know of myself, leaned into my character and not allowed myself to get pulled out of character quite as much. You know, it's a. It's a hard thing to go through. I think no matter what, you're going to have moments that you're like, oh, like, why was I like that? But I think in general, just listening to my intuition a little bit more instead of following the hope.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah. I feel like I get that a lot. A lot of women are like, after these experiences, like, I should have listened to myself because it's what's got us this far. And then we get into these situations or with these men, and all of a sudden it's like the voice inside we muted a little bit. And I think I've heard that a lot and I've felt that personally, so I get it. What about you?

[Ally]

I think I would have just had more conversations on camera, honestly. It feels like lack of Context again, you know, like, we should have just discussed these things when it would have been heard.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, same with me.

[Madison]

There's, like, so many things. I'm like, damn, like, our actual breakup happened off camera, you know? But then, like, you see us kind of dragging. I know what you mean. Where it's just like, I wish there was a little bit more context.

[Ally]

Yeah.

[Host (AD)]

Do you guys feel closure? Do we feel okay? Are we happy? Like, where are we now? Post reunion show has aired. Where are we now?

[Madison]

Honestly, like, I woke up this morning post reunion, just feeling so at peace. Like, the anticipation of having to do the reunion, having to have that confrontation, has kind of been looming for a year and a half. And I think at this point, I'm just like, okay, you know, I said my piece. I took my accountability. That's the best I can do for my side of things. And. And I can release and forgive for the sake of not poisoning myself anymore.

[Host (AD)]

And you feel you got your closure?

[Madison]

I don't think I got my questions answered, but I think that I am able to create that closure for myself.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, I love that. What about you?

[Ally]

I agree. Yeah, I'm excited to just move on with life. I'm excited for the year ahead. I'm excited to graduate and have my nurse practitioner's degree complete and have that whole chapter behind me. So, yeah, things are looking up.

[Host (AD)]

Do you guys have any big takeaways that you would say happen for you this season or from watching or anything?

[Madison]

You know, I think a huge takeaway for me is being able to love myself in my entirety. Like, being able to share about my eye condition, being able to show the parts of me that maybe are a little bit messy and know that I can still be loved for that. You know, it's like I found love in the pods in ways I didn't expect, in my friendships, in the way that I found love for myself. You know, just overall, it was such an incredible experience, and, like, I'm just so thankful for having done it.

[Host (AD)]

What about you, Alex?

[Ally]

I think my biggest takeaway is just, like, being comfortable with knowing what you want. You know, it's okay to want different things than other people. And, like, sometimes it's just not your match.

[Host (AD)]

Beautiful. I really am happy to see you guys sitting here because I did love your season. How did I describe your season?

[Madison]

You said, oh, gosh. I'm like, it's messy.

[Ally]

Dumpster fire.

[Madison]

You said it really cute. You're like, that's one way to put it.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, it was just like. It was a lot. And especially compared to, like, other seasons, you just, you know, you never know what to expect. Would you guys say that is a good depiction of Denver, of what's happening?

[Ally]

It feels like a failure since we didn't have any marriages. That's, like, my thing on that as a whole.

[Madison]

Like, I don't want people to think that Denver and Colorado is just, like, terrible. Like, truly, like, it's such a great place. And, like, I think, I think any place has its own mess, you know, like, don't judge ours.

[Host (AD)]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Well, I just want to thank you guys again for coming and spending time with me. And again, you guys are stunning, beautiful ladies, and I'm sure wherever this path leads you, it'll be successful for each and every one of you. So thank you for joining. Of course. And thank you guys for joining me for another episode of what's the Reality? Be sure to follow us on all social platforms at what's the Reality? Pod and I will see you next Wednesday. What's the reality? What's the reality?

[Commercial Voiceover]

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[Madison]

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[Host (AD)]

Weeks.

[Madison]

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