MtoM #280: How a Millionaire Doctor Changed Specialties

Summary

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White Coat Investor Podcast: Milestones to Millionaire #280

How a Millionaire Doctor Changed Specialties
Release Date: June 22, 2026
Host: Dr. Jim Dahle
Guest: Anonymous Physician

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Episode Overview

This episode features the compelling journey of a mid-career physician who achieved millionaire status, overcame substantial educational debt, and then made the bold decision to switch specialties. Dr. Jim Dahle discusses financial philosophy, career fulfillment, student loan paydown strategies, and overcoming common pitfalls with an anonymous guest. The episode offers inspiration for medical professionals considering similar transitions, emphasizing that financial independence can enable personal and career freedom.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Guest Introduction & Background

[01:35 - 02:04]

• Current role: Palliative care fellow, previously a hospitalist for 15 years.
• Location: Southwest U.S.
• Out of training: 16-17 years.

2. Milestones Reached

[02:08 - 02:40]

• Achieved $1 million in investment accounts.
• Returned to medical training (palliative care fellowship) after reaching financial security.
• Successfully exchanged a whole life insurance policy into a variable annuity and plans to transfer to a brokerage account.

3. Family & Influential Mindsets

[02:50 - 03:17]

• Married; wife is a second-generation immigrant with a “scarcity mindset”—very debt-averse.
• Wife’s approach led to early adherence to White Coat Investor (WCI) principles before officially discovering WCI in 2018.

“Because of her scarcity mindset being very debt adverse, she had us following some of the White Coat Investor principles even before I knew what the White Coat Investor was.”
— Anonymous Guest Physician [02:50]

4. Early Career Financial Decisions

[03:26 - 03:52]

• Drove a used Scion as a new attending.
• Bought a house 1.5x initial salary—deliberately modest relative to income.
• Aggressively paid down student loans rather than immediately upgrading lifestyle.

5. Paying Down Educational Debt

[04:02 - 04:39]

• Started with a net worth of -$350,000 in 2009 (combination of his and spouse’s loans).
• Paid off all student loans within approximately 9 years through the “debt snowball” method, first clearing spouse’s higher-interest loans.
• Spouse contributed via part-time work to match private school tuition needs.

6. Financial Awakening via White Coat Investor

[05:33 - 06:29]

• Introduced to WCI by sister-in-law (a realtor) but initially ignored the suggestion.
• Became motivated upon discovering WCI podcasts (“I’m really a podcast listener”).
• First WCI article read: “A Hundred Portfolios Better Than Yours.”
• Financial literacy and confidence “snowballed” after initial awakening.

7. The Decision to Change Specialties

[06:29 - 07:20]

• Hospitalist “burnout” led to exploration of other areas; found fulfillment in hospice side work.
• Waited until financial independence (~$1M invested) to make a safe career switch.
• Deliberately chose fellowship over luxury purchases (“Instead of buying my Tesla, I wanted to go back to fellowship.”) [07:10]

Quote Highlight:

“Once I realized we had a million dollars in investable assets, instead of buying my Tesla, I wanted to go back to fellowship.”
— Anonymous Guest Physician [06:56]

8. Financial Impact of Specialty Change

[07:23 - 08:26]

• Anticipated pay cut: Initially 10–15%, ballooned to 20% after COVID-related hospitalist raises.
• Motivation: Regaining time and autonomy for family and personal life.
• Meaning > Money: Values time with children and fulfillment over maximizing income.

Quote Highlight:

“The more love and time I pour into my family, I get that back tenfold. Unfortunately, my hobbies don’t generate money. I like being a coach, not just a doctor.”
— Anonymous Guest Physician [07:52]

9. Lifestyle Philosophy & Decisions

[08:26 - 09:15]

• Despite financial growth, spouse’s scarcity mindset endures (“balances our checkbook on a daily basis”).
• Maintains modest household spending despite millionaire status.
• Chose private school for children due to concerns about public education quality, prioritizing values within their financial means.

10. Mistakes & Course Corrections

[09:36 - 11:16]

• Purchased whole life insurance due to misinformation; exchanged for lower-fee vehicle after education.
• Regrets putting student loans into forbearance during residency—principal and interest ballooned ($350k to $418k).
• Emphasizes learning from early financial mistakes.

Quote Highlight:

“If I could go back, man, I wouldn’t do that over again.”
— Anonymous Guest Physician [11:07]

11. Next Milestone: Part-Time & Life Balance

[11:28 - 12:05]

• Not planning another 20 years of full-time work due to a medical issue and renewed perspective from palliative care.
• Aims to transition to part-time hospice work, emphasizing life enjoyment and work-life balance.

Quote Highlight:

“Tomorrow is not promised…my plan is to try to get part time as soon as possible and just work part time forever.”
— Anonymous Guest Physician [11:32]

12. Advice to Others

[12:30 - 13:23]

• Core advice: Live below your means, aggressively pay down debt, and enjoy life within reason.
• “We didn’t live completely like residents…used the rest to pay down debt… compound interest does the heavy lifting.”
• Emphasizes it’s possible to build wealth and happiness without excessive deprivation.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Scarcity vs. Abundance:
  “It hasn't changed. Have a spending problem. Like you say, it's really hard for her to let go of the dollar. She doesn’t buy expensive handbags, she doesn’t spend a bunch on clothes. She balances our checkbook on a daily basis and she cares where every cent is.”
  — Anonymous Guest Physician [08:35]

• On Living Below Your Means:
  “We did sacrifice not buying the Dr. House and having the Dr. Cars, but we still went on vacations. We still had a really nice life on more than a resident. And we used that to really kick start off everything.”
  — Anonymous Guest Physician [12:40]

• On Legacy & Family:
  “The more love and time I pour into my family, I get that back tenfold... I want more time to do that while I have the kids young because I know once this time passes, I'll never get it back.”
  — Anonymous Guest Physician [07:52]

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Important Segment Timestamps

• Guest Intro & Background: 01:35 – 02:04
• Milestones Reached: 02:08 – 02:40
• Family & Financial Mindset: 02:50 – 03:17
• Early Career Decisions: 03:26 – 03:52
• Debt Paydown Details: 04:02 – 04:39
• Financial Awakening: 05:33 – 06:29
• Switching Specialties: 06:29 – 07:20
• Impact of Career Change: 07:23 – 08:26
• Mistakes & Lessons: 09:36 – 11:16
• Next Goals: 11:28 – 12:05
• Advice to Others: 12:30 – 13:23

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Key Takeaways for Listeners

• Building wealth as a physician is possible even after financial missteps.
• Financial independence enables career freedom—changing specialties or working less becomes an option, not a risk.
• Living below your means, aggressive debt paydown, and simple investing are time-tested paths to financial security.
• Mindsets and family dynamics play a crucial role in both financial and personal fulfillment.
• Career satisfaction and family time are valid reasons to shift focus even after reaching a milestone—not every decision is about more money.

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If this story resonates, or you’re considering a similar leap, remember: “If he can do it, you can do it.” — Dr. Jim Dahle [14:05]

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Transcript

[Podcast Host Intro]

This is the White Coat Investor Podcast, Milestones to Millionaire, celebrating stories of success along the journey to financial freedom.

[Dr. Dalley]

Welcome back to the Milestones to Millionaire podcast. This episode is sponsored by Bob Baiani at Protuity, an independent provider of disability insurance planning solutions to the medical community in every state and a longtime White Coat Investor sponsor.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

He specializes in working with residents and

[Dr. Dalley]

fellows early in their careers to set up sound financial and insurance strategies. If you need to review your disability insurance coverage or just get this critical insurance in place, you can contact Bob by emailing infoprotuity.com by calling 973-771-9100 or by just going to whitecoatinvestor.com Protuity all

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

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[Dr. Dalley]

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[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

to go on a cool trip or

[Dr. Dalley]

to pay off loans or to advance your way toward financial independence.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

This is a great way to do it.

[Dr. Dalley]

All right, let's get our interviewee on the line. I think you're gonna enjoy this episode. Our guest today on the Milestones to Millionaire podcast is gonna remain anonymous, but introduce yourself a little bit to our audience. Tell us what you do for a living and how far you are out of training, what part of the country you're in.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Okay. I am a currently a palliative care fellow, but previously I was a hospitalist for 15 years. We're in the Southwest and I'm about 16, 17 years out of training.

[Dr. Dalley]

Okay, very cool. And tell us what milestones we're celebrating today with you.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

There's a couple of milestones. The first one is a million in investment accounts, which only led me to my second one is I went back to be a palliative care fellow after I had enough in investment accounts, hopefully trying to build a better life. I made some mistakes initially. I had a whole life policy. I exchanged it into a variable Annuity and I just realized that my variable annuity is up to basis. So now I can surrender that policy and bring it over into a brokerage account.

[Dr. Dalley]

Very cool. Very cool. So three milestones really. And you are a we. You're married currently. And tell us about the family situation.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Married to my wife for about 17 years. She is a second generation immigrant. Very scarcity mindset. I did not discover the white coat investor truly until 2018. That's when I had my financial awakening. But because of her scarcity mindset being very debt adverse, she had us following some of the white coat investor principles even before I knew what the white code investor was.

[Dr. Dalley]

Very cool. So tell us what you drove. As a new attending hospitalist, a scion,

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

we did not buy new cars. Our house was about 1.5 times my initial salary. And we had a lot of school loans that we really were throwing all of our money at at first. And that's why I say her being so debt averse helped us initially because, you know, she was adamant. Not buying the doctor house, not buying new cars until we had all of our school debt out of the way.

[Dr. Dalley]

Yeah, very cool. So you came out of training the first time in like what, 2010, something like that?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

2009.

[Dr. Dalley]

Okay. And approximately what was your net worth then?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Negative $350,000.

[Dr. Dalley]

Negative $350,000. You had $350,000 in student loans and you had nothing else?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Nothing else, yeah.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

Okay.

[Dr. Dalley]

And you paid off the student loans win by about 2018. So over the course of the next eight years or so.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Yeah, it took about nine years to pay it all off. My wife had 90,000 in school loans too, so her interest rate was about 8%. So we tackled hers in about five years and then sort of did a snowball method where we were paying for her. We just started paying for mine and then, you know, got it done in about 9ish years.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

Okay.

[Dr. Dalley]

Was she working for pay at that point or what does she do?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Well, she's a pa. That her? She was initially a dietitian when we first met. She went back to PA school. That's where the bulk of her student loans were from. And once we had children, we sort of got together and, you know, a little background for myself. My dad really wasn't around and having a parent around was something very important for me, for my kids. And so we talked it over. She agreed to really drop back to PRN and stay home with the kids mainly. So she's been contributing a little bit. It's been, you know, One or two shifts a month. Her goal is always to try to make as much as private school tuition costs, so she's been helping out a little bit with that.

[Dr. Dalley]

And you came in contact with WCI about eight years ago. Do you remember how or why?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Matter of fact, yes. My sister in law is a, a, a real estate agent and she mentioned, I, I swear she mentioned 2017. A year before I actually listened to her, she mentioned about the white coat investor. And, and I had the initial reaction like, man, I, you know, I don't know anything about this. I don't want to know anything about it. And I just put my head in the sand. But once I started sort of listening to your podcast, that's what really got me started. I guess I'm really a podcast listener. I've listened to all of your podcasts and that's what really got me going. Then I checked out the website. The first article I read was it was a hundred portfolios better than yours. Uh, so it, and, and then it's just snowballed after that, you know, slowly. Every month, every year, you get more and more literate as time goes on.

[Dr. Dalley]

Yeah. So at some point you made a decision to go back to fellowship.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Yes.

[Dr. Dalley]

Tell us about that decision and why and that, what's that going to mean for your family financially?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

I realized after 10 years of being a hospitalist, my time as a hospitalist was running out and I had to do something. And so about five years I was looking for different ways. I started working hospice on the side and it was way more fulfilling than I ever thought it could be. It's just hospice couldn't pay the bills, you know, pay the loans and save for retirement. So once I realized we had a million dollars in investable assets, instead of buying my Tesla, I wanted to go back to fellowship and try to get a better life for me and my kids.

[Dr. Dalley]

You want to do what you want to do for the rest of your career?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Dr. Dalley]

How big of a pay cut do you think you're looking at going from being a hospitalist to being a palliative care doctor?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Well, it's changed recently. After Covid, the hospitalist group here, and I'm doing fellowship in the same place that I was a hospitalist. They were getting, they're getting raises every year. So initially I was looking at maybe a 10 to 15% pay cut, but now that that gap has gotten even larger, it's about 20%. But the why motivated me to learn about financial independence? Because getting my freedom back. So that I have more autonomy over my time so I can spend it with my wife and kids. Because there's definitely one thing I've learned. The more love and time I pour into my family, I get that back tenfold. And unfortunately my hobbies don't generate money. I like being coach, not just doctor. And I want more time to do that while I have the kids young because I know once this time passes, I'll never get it back.

[Dr. Dalley]

You mentioned that your wife in particular grew up with a little bit of a scarcity mindset. How has that changed now that the two of you are millionaires?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

It hasn't changed. Have a spending problem. Like you say, it's really hard for her to let go of the dollar. She doesn't buy expensive handbags, she doesn't spend a bunch on clothes. She balances our checkbook on a daily basis and she cares where every cent is. So I'm more the big picture guy. She definitely into details and make sure that every penny is used very wisely, which has really helped us over this whole financial independence journey.

[Dr. Dalley]

Now somebody out there is going well, they say they pinch pennies, but their kids are in private school. Tell us about that decision and why you decided that.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Well, we're in a place where the public schools are not great. My wife and I both, we wouldn't feel great about sending our kids to public school. Private school is a much better education, better learning environment and preparing for college. Much more so than say, public school.

[Dr. Dalley]

Now tell us about. You mentioned you'd made some mistakes and you mentioned you bought a whole life policy once that it sounds like you're just about done with. You had a big enough loss that it was worth exchanging into a low cost variable annuity and letting it grow back to basis tax free it sounds like. Tell us a little bit about that and any other quote unquote mistakes you feel like you made.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Okay. Or the whole life. I was referred to it by one of the other residents that I got my disability through them. I got my whole life through them. And it wasn't until after I had my financial awakening that I realized that that was just not something I wanted to keep. And going back to fellowship and taking a huge pay cut, only making 6,8000 this year. I couldn't see myself paying those premiums whenever now we had to tighten up our belts a little bit. So that really made me exchan it even before I started fellowship because I knew this pay cut was coming. Some of the other mistakes I've made is mainly with my Loans whenever I, I finished school. In 2006, I had $350,000 in debt. I, I put everything in forbearance during residency. I, I did not make a payment, which I now I realize was a huge mistake. And in 2009, after residency, I remember the highest my balance ever got was $418,000. It really ballooned a lot over those three years, which was a huge mistake. I was able to pay everything off, but if I could go back, man, I wouldn't do that over again.

[Dr. Dalley]

Very cool. Well, congratulations on your success. It's pretty awesome what you've accomplished. Obviously, the next thing you have in front of you is completing this fellowship. But financially speaking, what's your next milestone

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

you're going to be on?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

My next milestone is I don't think I have another 20 years of full time work in me. You know, I've got a medical issue that is really shooting up my risk of cancer, especially as I get into my later years. And this palliative care fellowship makes you realize more than anything, tomorrow is not promised. You know, enjoy the journey. And so my plan is to try to get part time as soon as possible and just work part time forever. You know, I can see myself working part time hospice until I'm no longer able to work.

[Dr. Dalley]

Yeah, well, I like part time work so much that I have two part time jobs. So I'm, I'm a big fan. I'm right there with you. Very cool. Okay. There's somebody out there like you that's, you know, maybe they're, you know, a hospital is staring at $400,000 plus in student loans. Maybe there's somebody that's like, I want to do a different specialty, I want to go back to fellowship or I want to do a different residency. What advice do you have for them?

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

The advice is very easy. I mean, following the white coat investor philosophy, the bulkhead philosophy. Live below your means, use extra to pay down your debt. We didn't live completely like a resident. We live better than a resident. We survived off 120,000 and we had a really good life and used the rest to pay down debt. It didn't feel like we sacrificed a whole lot. We did sacrifice not buying the Dr. House and having the Dr. Cars, but we still went on vacations. We still had a really nice life on more than a resident. And we used that to really kick start off everything. And the compounding interest is just amazing. When that really starts working in your favor, it's doing more than what I'm, you know the heavy lifting I'm putting into the retirement accounts for sure.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

Yeah. Very cool.

[Dr. Dalley]

Well, congratulations on your success. Thank you so much for being willing to come on the Milestones podcast to share it with the rest of the white coat investors.

[Anonymous Guest Physician]

Yeah. Thank you, Dr. Dalley. With you, I wouldn't even be in this fellowship, I wouldn't have my investable assets and I wouldn't be looking at coming up to part time work here soon. So thank you so much for what you've done for this community. I really appreciate it.

[Dr. Dalley]

It's our pleasure. All right. I hope that was fun. A lot of people ask us, we want to hear more from lower paid specialties. We want to hear from the deck of millionaires, etc.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

Well, here we go.

[Dr. Dalley]

Somebody that's been out there in practice for 16 years now, $1 million in investable assets.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

Right.

[Dr. Dalley]

He can do it. You can do it. Yeah. He didn't make any student loan payments during residency.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

Right.

[Dr. Dalley]

Maybe he's not in the ideal specialty for him to do for 30 years. Maybe he bought a whole life insurance policy he didn't really mean or wish he hadn't bought. Right. We all make mistakes. But here he is a millionaire at mid career. If he can do it, you can do it.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

There are two main types of retirement accounts. There are defined contribution accounts and defined benefit accounts. A defined contribution account is your typical 401 you put money in and depending on how well your investments do, that's how much money is in the account later for you to spend. The other type of account is a defined benefit plan. Defined benefit account, defined benefit, retirement plan, whatever you want to call it. But that is a plan where the employer is taking the risk rather than you taking the risk of how well the investments do. The employer has promised you everything. Rather than a defined contribution into the account, they have promised you a defined benefit from the account. So if the investments do really well, the employer gets to keep the extra. If the investments do not do really well, the employer has to make up the difference. This is a classic pension. You go work for the employer for 30 years or 20 years or whatever it might be, and they pay you a pension for the rest of your life. The nice thing about these pensions is they tend to have an inflation adjustment aspect to them. Not always, but often, which is difficult to get these days. You can't necessarily buy that from an insurance company. You can get it from Social Security. Especially if you delay your Social Security to age 70. Then you can get a comparable inflation index benefit. But typically you can only get that from a pension. Sometimes the pension also includes some sort of employer provided health care benefit as well, some type of health insurance that maybe is in addition to your Medicare or instead of Medicare or something like that. But that's what we're talking about when we're talking about a pension. The downside to a pension is it's not your money. You don't get to decide what to do with it. For example, if it was your 401, you could just take all the money out today and buy a sailboat if you want to. A pension is not that flexible. The other big risk with a pension is that something happens to the employer. And if that happens, your pension could go away. Now there are some semi government entities that often is just a bunch of different pension companies banding together, insurance companies banding together to guarantee these sorts of things. But they usually only guarantee a certain amount. So if your employer goes out of business, you're probably still losing something. And that becomes an issue when you're given the option to just take your pension as a lump sum and have the money that you now control. It's no longer subject to your employer going bankrupt versus the guarantees provided by the pension where the company is taking the risk on the investments. So that can be a challenging decision for sure. So the problem with pensions is they're mostly not available anymore. It used to be that you go work for a company, a corporation, you put in your time and you qualify for your pension. It was wonderful. And lots of people had pensions. They might have had some savings in addition to them, but they mostly, they lived on their pension and their Social Security. This is what my father had. My father worked for the state of Alaska for a long time and qualified for a pension. And literally that's what they live off of. They live off the pension, the Social Security. They don't even really touch their nest egg. That's not the case for most workers today. Their companies don't offer pensions. Typical places you can get a pension is usually a government employer, might be the military, might be another government entity or a state entity or something like that. There are still some companies that offer them, but for the most part you really don't see them as often as you used to. They really are disappearing. And the main reason why is because companies didn't want to have that risk on their books. And they thought they could get away with putting less toward the retirement of their employees. Because the truth is most employees don't care nearly as much about retirement benefits as they should. They will often prioritize getting a higher salary rather than getting a higher retirement benefit. And so that's the main reason they're disappearing. Okay, so every pension is different, and you have to read how your pension actually is calculated to understand it. But maybe a typical way it's done is they look at your last three years or so that you're working for that employer and look at what you were earned as salary and give you 50% of the average of what you earned those three years as your pension. So if you were earning $100,000 a year on average those last three years, and it paid 50% of that, you'd get a pension of $50,000 per year, just over $4,000 per month as a pension, and probably indexed to inflation, going up each year with those payments. Now, they can arrange it any way they like. They can start paying you a pension after five years. They could make you wait 20, they can make you wait 30. Whatever. That's up to them and how they define that pension. And usually the idea is to put some sort of golden handcuffs on the employees. They don't quit after a year. They don't quit after six years. They'll stay for their 15 or 20 or 30 years with the same employer because they want to qualify for that pension when you qualify for it. That's called being vested in the pension. So vesting means you now get the pension. You know, if you keep working for a few years, maybe the pension amount goes up, but until you hit that floor, minimum number of years to qualify to get it, you're not yet vested. And if you leave before then, you may not get the pension at all, or you may get some lower amount of it. But they're typically not portable, unless you're changing jobs with the same employer. If you go from one employer that offers a pension to another employer that offers a pension, you're probably not taking those years with you. You're probably starting all over and accumulating your 10 or 20 or 30 years to get the pension. Now, how should you think about this? If you have a pension in your overall financial plan, a lot of people like to somehow attach a value to it and use that as the bond portion of their portfolio. I would recommend against doing that. I would simply take all your guaranteed sources of income and subtract that total amount from the amount you need to spend. For example, if you figure you need to spend $120,000 a year during retirement, you've got pensions and Social Security that's going to pay a total of $60,000 a year. Well, now you only need $60,000 from your portfolio. That's the way I would think about it, rather than trying to somehow incorporate the pension and into your portfolio. But absolutely, having a pension does affect decisions like when you claim Social Security or whether you do Roth conversions, et cetera, because just like Social Security, that pension can fill up some of the lower brackets in taxable income and make it so your required minimum distributions from tax deferred retirement accounts will all be taken in higher brackets. So if you qualify for a pension, you may be more likely to make Roth contributions throughout your career. You may, you may be more likely to do Roth conversions. You may wish to delay your Social Security, which is generally a good idea anyway, at least for the higher earner, because that's one of the few inflation index guaranteed sources of income out there. But maybe if you have such a huge pension that you don't need Social Security as much, maybe you'll decide to do something different with your Social Security claiming decision. Now, I mentioned earlier that a lot of people are offered a lump sum by the employer. You can either have this pension or you can have $600,000 right now. And that's a difficult decision. Maybe the best way to evaluate it, though, is to go to an annuity company and price out what it would cost to buy your pension. Now, that's hard to do if the pension offers an inflation adjustment, because most of those single premium immediate annuities you can buy from an insurance company do not have any sort of inflation protection. They're not indexed to inflation. So that can make it a little bit hard to compare apples to apples. But basically, if you go there and you see that buying your pension would cost you $800,000 and they're only offering you $600,000 instead of your pension, well, that would suggest that you should keep the pension instead. You're not getting a good deal on what they're offering you as a lump sum for the pension. So that's basically the way to think about it, how to calculate whether you should take that benefit or whether you should take the lump sum. As a general rule, although I don't like the risk aspect that something could happen to your employer, I like the aspect of a pension for a couple of reasons. One, it puts a floor underneath your income like Social Security does. And that's nice to know in case something terrible happens with your investments, that at least you'll have enough money to put food on the table and keep a roof over your head in retirement. That guarantee has value. Even if you think you might be able to out invest the rate the pension offers, you may not be able to do that once you adjust your investments for risk. Right, because when we're talking about guaranteed income, you really need to be comparing to things like CDs and Treasury bonds and those sorts of things, not what you think you're going to earn from your investment portfolio of properties and stock index funds and that sort of thing where the outcome is not nearly as guaranteed. The other thing to think about is that people who buy annuities, meaning you know, something that'll pay them until the day they die, and presumably this applies to pensioners as well. They live longer. I don't know if they just want to stick it to the man. So the employer or the insurance company's got to pay you as long as possible. But that actually suggests that people who have these do actually live longer. And that might be that the people who go for them tend to be healthier people in general who are likely to live a long time and so see more value in a guaranteed payout until the day they die. But it is true. So you ought to keep that in mind as you consider whether or not to take these sorts of things. Hope that's helpful and helps you understand how pensions work.

[Dr. Dalley]

This episode was sponsored by Bob Bayani at Protuity. One listener sent us this review. Bob has been absolutely terrific to work with, always quickly and clearly communicating with me by both email and or telephone, with responses to my inquiries usually coming the same day. I have somewhat of a unique situation and Bob has been able to help explain the implications and underwriting process in

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

a clear and professional manner.

[Dr. Dalley]

Contact Bob today at whitecoatinvestor.com Protuity or email infootuity.com or call 973-771-9100 to get

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

your disability insurance in place today.

[Dr. Dalley]

All right, that's a wrap for this episode. If you'd like to be on this podcast, we'd love to have you. I don't care what the milestone is. You can be a multi deca millionaire. You can be back to broke.

[Podcast Co-Host / Announcer]

We'll celebrate it with you.

[Dr. Dalley]

And in fact, lately people seem to be coming up with all kinds of unique milestones like this one going back to fellowship, right? But if you want to apply, go to whitecoatinvestor.com Milestones. All right, keep your head up, shoulders back. We'll see you next time on the podcast.

[Podcast Host Intro]

The White Coat Investor Podcast is for your entertainment and information only and should not be considered financial, legal, tax or investment advice. Investing involves risk, including the possible loss of principal. You should consult the appropriate professional for specific advice relating to your situation.