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Hello, delicious friends, and welcome to who did what now, the history podcast. That is not your history class. With me, your host, Katy Charlewood, history harlot and reader of books. If you got a wee bit of deja vu from reading the title, you're not wrong with it being Pride Month. We are pulling some of my favourite LGBTQ people from history from the vault and bringing them back for another go around. We're also going to see the return of the Betty Sods this month just because there are so many things I want to talk about, but they just don't fit into a full hour long episode, so. So the Bittisodes are going to return for Pride Month. At least I don't know if they're going to be next month, but definitely for Pride. On top of that news, housekeeping news, I guess. So the tour will be starting later this year and if you want your country, State, city, if you want me to show up in your town, go over to the Hooded what Now? Pod website. If you go there, there is a sort of a page where you can go into Google form and fill out your details and there's also an option to be notified when tickets go on
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sale in your area.
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Okay. So if you want to do that and vote for me to be places, that would be amazing. And it also helps me organize my tour so it is split into three separate categories. We have usa, we have Canada, and we have Europe. I don't know, I don't have out with that at the minute. I haven't got Asia planned. I haven't got that far yet because that's even more complicated for me to organize. So we are not there yet. If you want to hear more of me and you want to hear me talk about one of my favorite things ever, which is Poison. Every Wednesday, my new podcast with my dear, dear friend Jay is being released. Day and Nightshade. Yes, that is the name.
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Yes.
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I'm very proud of it. No, I did not come up with the name myself. I asked my. My other dear friend Paul. I was like, I need a name for this. And it's about this. And he was like, what about A,
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B, C, D, E?
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And I was like, yes, sold 10 out of 10. So that means if you're listening to this on day of release, you'll have this episode to listen to. And then to tomorrow on day of release, you will have more to listen to. I am very excited to bring Day and Nightshade to y'.
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All.
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I don't think you understand just how excited this has been, like, several years in the making. Like, we've been trying to do this, and Jay has been flying over from Germany so that we can record together in the same room. And it's. It's literally keeping our friendship alive, I think, at this point, since.
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So don't let our friendship die.
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But what else? I have more. I know I have more news.
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I feel like I have more news.
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Goodness, there is.
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Oh, I can't tell you that yet, actually.
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But anyway, with that.
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I know what you're thinking.
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You're thinking, katie, quit your jibber jabber and fact me. In fact you.
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I will. But first we've got to get our source on Marlena Dietrich. Lynn Life and Legend by Stephen Buck, Melina Dietrich by Maria Riva, Famous Impostors by Bram Stoker, Blackmail, Scandal and Revolution by Simon Burroughs, the Sword of the Chevalier by Guy Adams. The Strange Case of the Chevalier, Dion de Beaumont by John Buchan Telfer Mercier Dion Is a Woman, A tale of political intrigue and sexual masquerade by Gary Cates. And we have basically, unfinished memoirs. We've got Unfinished Memoirs of Le Chevalier d'. Eon. So we've got memoirs, letters, correspondence, a bunch of stuff that got translated. And nevertheless, our favorites. History.com and biography.com. are you sitting comfortably? Good. Then let's begin. So you may be thinking to yourself, katie, I know it's Pride Month, but are you seriously working through the lgbtqia? In no particular order. It appeals. So it wasn't my intention to, like, go through everybody, but there are so many interesting people from history that we don't discuss. And I had a list, and then I noticed that people on my list happened to, you know, correlate with particular letters in the Alphabet. Mafia. And I thought, well, why not? So last week we had Isaac Newton, Sir Isaac Newton, who shows you, you know, you really can do a lot and achieve so many things when you're not too busy thinking about shagging. So that was, like, the most famous asexual in history, to my knowledge. I'd have to look it up, but I think so. And so this week, I wanted to talk about the Chevalier Dion. I would like to apologize for the horrific butchering of French that's going to happen throughout this episode. But Dion was a trans spy. It's very complicated, which I will tell you, but they don't transition till much later in life, and it becomes very much a complicated situation. But I am going to refer to them as they throughout this story, for the most part, just because. Because they Took so long to transition in life. If I were to use he instead of she. And it just feels not only incorrect, but like, very misgendering and very rude. So I'm not going to do that. I'm going to use they them because it just feels more respectful. And again, want to apologize for my absolute, just awful French. You're going to hear. So let's start from the beginning, shall we? Dion was born Charles, Genevieve, Louis, Auguste, Andre, Timothy, Dion de Beaumont, because French people have to have all of the names, too many names, some might say names that will not fit on a little box on a birth certificate, but it doesn't matter because they probably didn't have one anyway. So they were born on the 5th of October, 1728, in Tonnerre, Burgundy, in France, to Louis Dion de Beaumont, who was a lawyer, later a mayor, and Francoise de Charenton. So Francoise, she was the daughter of the commissioner general to the armies of Warsaw to Spain and Italy. So, you know, they're minor rural nobility. So here's the thing. Wealth is relative. So they're rich to, like, regular people. So, like, we would see them as rich, but to the nobility they would be seen as poor. So being noble, they have a fairly decent sort of way of life. And Dion manages to get a pretty good education. They end up studying in Paris. They're pretty good at languages, and it's noted that they're good at memorizing stuff, which seems appropriate because that's what study is most of the time, it's just memorizing stuff. And so Dion graduates from the college Mazarin and law. So they've got a law degree in both civil law and canon law. And they do this at the age of 21. So they know about church law and they know about just like regular laws, like both separation of church and state and ish. So Dion gets a job in public service at the Elite, Catherine Feron's Lanai Literature, and writes a book on French government finance, which is all very exciting. So they become secretary to the Intendant of Paris. See, I've done it already. I'm still slipping into French now. The Intendant of Paris, Berthier de Sauvign, and they work in the fiscal department and becomes a royal censor at the age of 30. Basically, they got a job as a censor, which is really nothing to do with law technically. So the French government, they're like, super particular about what books can be published, and they're very intense about it. They have very stringent views about what can and cannot be published. So there's a lot of censoring going on. So Dion gets his really pushy job working for the French government. They're living in Paris and they're basically reading books for a living. But because of the nature of the job, they're reading books. But they also get like loads of time off to kind of pursue what they want. Like, they're, they're having, they're having a pretty good time of it, to be honest. You see, France is currently ruled by Louis xv, who was not by any definition a super great king. So before him you had Louis xiv. There's a lot of Louis, right, but just too many. Some might say the Sun King. And so he had France as the major leading European power. See, there's a reason that for most of history, I say most of the history, most of modern history, French was the international language of business. It might still be, but like it was traditionally like the language of business because of how prominent France was and sort of expansion and rule and everything else. So the Sun King reigned and ruled. He was loved by the people. France was prosperous. And under Louis xv, it was not. I mean, in his defense, Louis the 15th became king at like 5 years old. So I'm not going to blame them for any original issues because, you know, I believe if you don't have the emotional maturity for losing a crayon, you really shouldn't be blamed for government decisions in your name. Just, you know, that that's no reason to elect people who have the emotional maturity or don't have the emotional maturity to losing a crayon. I'm looking at the British government right now.
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Really?
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What are you doing? Like, seriously, like, seriously, stop putting these Egypts in charge. Like, what's wrong with you? Anyway, spoiler alert. By the end of Louis XV's reign, sort of 1770s, France has lost its power, its territories, its military is weak to say the least, and the treasury is considerably drained. Effectively, there's a cost of living crisis going on and the country is prime revolution. Now if. Let's get back to the 1750s for a wee bit. So France is trying to expand and regain its glory and power and Louis XV has his grubby wee hands reaching out for Poland. You see, Polish nobles would vote in a king and have been doing this for a long time. But it had been taken by the Saxons in the late 17th century. Napoleon at this point is absolutely massive and all the neighboring states are eyeing up and a bunch of nobles, they want Louis cousin, Prince de Conti to be king. That being said, Louis cannot support this officially in any capacity because France is allied with Saxony and so they kind of rely on each other a wee bit. And so officially he's like supporting Saxony, but unofficially the King wants his cousin in, so he wants to eat his cake and have it too. Lol. So he sets up the secret, which is the King's secret, a spy network that answers directly to him. So the spies that he ends up collecting, they already have sort of positions or high ranking positions like within government. So they're going to basically work for him but use their official cover as well, their official job as a cover. So it starts small and then by the time Louis actually dies, there's like 20 fellas in this, you know, 20 people all together. So as I said, these spies are already in like relatively prominent positions. So a lot of the time they would receive orders from like the government or from like the ministers and this would directly contradict orders from the King. So it, it's kind of, it's kind of complicated. So you're kind of walking a very fine line. And, and this is going to cause issues because like you've got these spies who are in these positions of power and they are undermining government authority. So for them the rules don't really apply. And it kind of also shows that the King doesn't really have as much power or authority as he did or he should have or wants to have. So basically in order to make the Polish plan happen, they had to strengthen their bonds with Russia. And so the King sends Chevalier Andrew Peter Mackenzie Douglas. You might be thinking that doesn't sound like the Frenchiest of names. And you would be correct because he is a Scottish Jacobite working in France. It's not that complicated. Loads of Scottish people ended up working in France. Like they all just kind of went off there and they all learned French because why not? They were already multilingual at this point. May as well add another one to the list. So he goes off and Dion accompanies him. Now the official excuse, slash reason is to convince Russia not to ally with England and the war that's on the horizon, the unofficial is to promote Conte. So the plan is to go in and sort of bribe a bunch of officials to effectively work together to get Conte promoted. And that's the plan. So effectively there's this war that's on the horizon and Prussia, because like this is before Germany is Germany, it's got all these different states. So you've got the hanover, Prussia, Saxony, etc. So Prussia ends up allying with England and it invades Saxony, who is allied with France, and it basically starts the Seven Years War. So on one side, context, you have England, Hanover, Prussia, Portugal, Hesse, Castle, Brunswick, and. Yeah, that's one side. And on the other side, you have France, Austria, Saxony, Hesse, Darmstadt, Spain and Sweden. So Russia is on the side of France, like, initially, and then. And then it's not. It. I'll explain. So Dale ends up being, like, an official secretary to the Embassy in St Petersburg, and, you know, they have to travel, like, between St Petersburg and Versailles quite regularly on horseback because, you know, you've got no Ryanair deals there. It's not a quick hopscop and a jump. No. So Empress Elizabeth of Russia and Louis XV are basically pen pals and they're trying to build relations and so they'll send in these letters back and forth, and they're hidden in a secret compartment in Montesquieu's Spirit of the Laws, which is just like we're sneakily hiding in a secret compartment in his book, like, spy stuff. And this works because this gets the Empress to sign a treaty with France, supporting it and its allies against Prussia. So when the Empress, like, signs this treaty, Dion rushes back to France, like, so fast. Like, they are just hell for leather that they end up breaking their leg. Don't ask me how exactly they break their leg. Did they fall off a horse? Did they trip out of a carriage? Were they attacked by some angry geese? We don't know. All we know is they broke their leg. So De Jong is recognized as an expert on Russian politics, which is handy when the empress dies in 1762 and the king literally goes to them and asks, like, what to do politically. Like, that shows you how revered Dion is in this position at this point. Now, this is. This is also handy because after the Empress Elizabeth's death, Russia ends up switching sides and joins and allies with England in Prussia instead of France. Dion does end up fighting in the Seven Years War as a captain of the dragoons, which are basically like the fancy soldiers. And the thing about being a dragoon is you are dragoon for life. Like, that is. That's just a thing. And luckily, Dion wasn't at it for very long. And because, you see, Prussia was doing very well for itself. However, France was not. It was losing battles, it was losing territory. And this leads to a few good prominent people being exiled and banished. Banished. There's a movie where someone goes banished. And that's in my head every time I say vanished. So Dion, like, their superiors, are exiled. Dion somehow keeps on landing in shit and coming out smelling her roses. They end up with a promotion. They're appointed the secretary to the Duke De Niver, who just happens to be brokering peace with England. Now, the Duke points out, like, how hard of a worker Dale is. Like, they start writing about how they are working from, like, morning to night. They're seriously. They're taking the job. They're basically not fucking around, right? They land in England in September, and by November, they have this treaty knocked out. And this basically ends the Seven Years War because, like, they've got this treaty. However, the Duke himself bloody hates England, and so they recommend that Dale is left in charge until a new ambassador can be put there. So they're like, let me get the heck out of dodge. I don't want to be here. And let's leave Dale in charge because they. They know the people, they know what they're doing, and let's get to it. And so they end up being put in as this interim ambassador. And they have effectively unlimited ambassadorial power for a year. Like, it takes a year to get in an ambassador sent there. And so they have all this power, and it's kind of unchecked. Like, they kind of have a carte blanche to do whatever the fuck they like. Meanwhile, Conti, the prince who, you know, Louis was trying to make king of Poland, attempts a coup, which was a terrible, terrible idea. And Louis is like, no, pal, you're right. So the king's secret, they don't do what they all set out to do, which was put Conti on the Polish throne. Instead, the king's secret get moved to a new plan, which is I shit you not, invade England. They've just signed a damn peace treaty, and already they're like, this is a good idea. So they end up sending a military officer to go work under Dion and, like, map out the coast and figure out the best points to invade from. And the idea is Dion will write back in, like, super secret spy code and bribe a bunch of people like they did in Russia to basically do all this. And Louis the 15th literally writes this down. I feel like they're misunderstanding the concept of cloak and dagger here. It's not. It's not the smartest of choices to write down, you know, your super secret invasion plans to the country that you've signed a treaty with. So Dion has an actual document from Louis xv, like, you can spy for me, the King of France, so that France can invade England, the country with which we have signed a treaty and you are staying in. So, again, at this point, there's two contradictory orders. Like, Dion is supposed to be building alliances and sort of bonds with England as a French ambassador. Ish. And so there's no ambassador, so they're supposed to be doing all of this sneaky, sneaky spy shit in order to aid the French invasion of England. So at this point, Dion goes back to Paris to receive the Cross of St. Louis. It's a medal given by the King to those who showed unusual or exemplary heroism in war. So effectively they get, you know, a medal for being involved in the Seven Years War, like, on the side, it's secretly for being, like, doing the spy shit, but, like, officially it's out there for doing general, like, dragoon stuff. And this is where they are named the Chevalier Dion. Chevalier basically means knight, but yeah. So Dion goes back to London with their shiny new medal and they're negotiating with England while working against England and writing about French and British political affairs. They're also socialising a lot in England, doling out wine, gifting lots and lots of wine. Which is. Which is. Which is an interesting thing to do considering France is not doing well financially and Dion is just spending money on wine. The French Foreign Minister ends up criticizing Dion, saying they're just spending too much money. And Dion's just like, how rude of you to treat me like this. Finally, an ambassador is being sent to England and Dion finds out that they're getting demoted back down to secretary, which results in Dion sending some very angry letters back to France. And they're just, like, causing such a stink that members of the Secret, like, they're like, comrades, are going, just, like, don't cause a scene, you know, like, don't make a big fuss about this. And Dion is like, fuck this for a game of soldiers. And they double down, they're demoted. They are members of the King's Secret, but they are very important people. Like, they're. The rules don't apply, remember? So they're so used to having honor and power and then to have this taken from them, they're just simply not happy about the situation. So Dion is stirring the pot and very much causing a scene. But yet, like, again, members of the Secret, the King's Secret, like, they go against the foreign minister so much that this is very much part of the par for them. So when the new ambassador, Gershe, when he arrives, Dion just refuses to leave, going, only the King appointed me. Only the King can remove me. And then the King goes, you're removed. You're like, he agrees with his ministers and he's publicly being like, dion, get the out of there, mate. What you doing? So the government sides with the King. The king say to the government, and they try to recall deal. And Dion is like, no, you see, Dion is really mad because Gershy is notoriously mediocre. So they don't understand why this mediocre, incompetent person is being put in charge. And so Louis, under, like, advised from the head of the secret, is planning to, like, officially strip Dion of titles, but, like, continue paying them on the sly to stay in London as a spy. But Dion doesn't know this, isn't aware of this plan, and basically wants to, like, show them their hand. And so in 1764, they publish secrets. Like, not the King's secret, but it's like a 200 page document with correspondence and other info. And it's basically this map, massive scandal. So the French government charge Dion with libel and they try to, like, extradite them. Like, they try and, and like, get them. But England, England just goes, no, he hasn't broken any laws. He hasn't done anything. So, like, we're not getting rid of them. Like, that's not happening. Because remember, Dion still has the documents, the official documents signed by the King of France, basically saying, spy for me in England so we can invade them. And the King wants that back. Now, Dion hasn't, like, produced that yet, but they know that they can. So while Dion is charged with libel, there is straight up a plan to kidnap him. And this guy comes forward and says that one of Gershe's men, that he is one of Gershe's men, and that he's part of this plot to kill Dion by the foreign Minister, Anne Gershi. So the plan is to jog them, kidnap them, and then murder them. Like, that is the plan. It is very messy because this comes forward and everybody is just shamed. So basically, Dion gets this pretty sweet deal where they get a pension from the King of France, where they also get to, like, secretly spy for France in England. But the deal is they cannot return to France. And so they're kind of banished, but with pity. And so they stay in England, they stay in London, and it's not the most exciting of times for them. Meanwhile, in paid exile, The Deon publishes 13 volumes. 13. 13 volumes on government finance, policy and taxation. Clearly, they had a lot of time on their hands. They also amassed a collection of, like, over 6,000 books. Like, I like reading too. But I feel like 6,000 feels a bit excessive. Like, could I read 6,000 books? Maybe it does feel like a bit much. I mean, I. Could I. Could I. No, I don't have time, so. Not right now, anyway. So by the time 1770 rolls around, the new sort of ambassador, French ambassador in England, he is convinced that Dion is a lady. And they bring this, like, to the King. So you've got Horace Walpole, who's England's notorious gossip, who has hung out with Dion a couple times. They've drank wine and whatever. Like, they and their associates are like, yeah, Dion's a chick. What are you talking about? So how this rumor started, we're not entirely sure. However, there is a theory that Deon started it themselves. That being said, it's not easy for Dion once this rumour goes around, because it swirls and churns out so much that bankers and businessmen and, like, everyone in between are literally betting on which gender Dion is. And it gets so dangerous that Dion is, like, mobbed in the street with people trying to figure out, like, grab their clothes and figure out, like, you know, what genitals they have that they are not safe in London. And one day they just disappear. And their friends are convinced they've been kidnapped or killed. They do return six week later, they're just like, oh, I was in Germany. I went to Germany for a bit because I was worried for my safety. And then I heard that y' all thought I was missing, so I came back. And they do admit they had considered going to Ireland, the most tolerant of states, and they had considered going to Ireland because nobody knew them there, but they could have gotten away with it. So London is. Is just a bit much by the time they come back. And they are sort of. They're closeted at home. They say they're closeted at home because at this point, they're still wearing their Dragoon uniform. Like, that's what they wear, because that's, again, you're appointed for life if you're a Dragoon. So they're constantly walking around like this, and people are, like, manhandling them to try and find out, you know, is it a P or a V that's going on down there? And so most of the time, they just kind of shut in and don't leave the house. And then one of their pals offers to let them stay in their country estate for a couple months, and they accept because obviously it's safer for them. Now, the King's advisors send a secretary over to England to Find out Dion's gender. To which they say, yes, yes, Dion is definitely a woman. I assessed the situation, I inspected them and stay saw that they were women. And the King of France is like, okay. Meanwhile, with all this going on, Dion is asking for the exile to be lifted. But of course they want to keep Dion in England for spy work. And also because, like, being in France is going to cause some issues because everyone knows who they are. Luckily for Dion, though, in 1774, King Louis XV dies and the 20 year old Louis XVI is now King of France. So Louis XVI is told about the king's secret and he's like, what the fuck? Shut it down. What is this? Like, he's of the opinion that like, the king shouldn't be doing this weird cloak and dagger ship. And so he's like, no, no, no, no, no, no. Like, done. Now Louis is also informed that Dale is a woman. And Louis is like, cool, let's give them protection, a pension, remove the exile, but also in exchange for those documents for invading England. Because I feel like we shouldn't have those out and about, you know what I mean? Like, maybe let's not have that happening. And the negotiation, it takes a while. It takes a while because there are some very strong personalities in this and, and they have, they have again, very strong opinions. See, Daon wants it knowing that Gershe tried to kill them. And they also want to be fully recognized, like officially recognized as a woman. And the king is like, fine, I guess, but you have to live as a woman. So, like, you have to wear women's clothing, not men's clothing. Because, like, in France as well, at this point, it was illegal for women to wear trousers. So it was a whole situation. That being said, dressing as a man when you were a woman, it wasn't seen as unusual because it happened like quite a few times. Like, it was a known, like, thing that happened. So people weren't too surprised by it. So Dayon is like, okay, if I'm wearing women's clothing, then I should be allowed to wear like my Dragoon uniform, because, like, I've always worn it. And also women's clothing is really uncomfortable and they're just kind of going back and forth over this. And eventually Dylan's like, fine, but you're gonna pay for my new wardrobe. And the king's like, grand, let's do this. Meanwhile, in England, people are betting so much on gender, right? On the gender of Dale. And it gets to a point where like judges, a judge, an official judge declares it illegal. To bet on someone's gender. And I think it might still be illegal today, but like, they make it illegal so you can't do that. So by 1777, so like three years after Louis becomes king, Dion manages to leave England for France and they are still in uniform. And again, you've got these gender dressing laws. And so they're told they have to change or get arrested. So like, initially they end up in this convent and they're like, change into women's clothes and they're like, no. So they end up going to a monastery and staying in this sort of area where like the female relatives of the monks would stay if they were visiting. But again, they're still in their fucking uniform. Now there's this whole thing about women's clothing and Dion isn't super into this concept of femininity because, like, it's not just about the clothes. It's about control. It's about being a woman is not about the clothes you wear. Like, we always talk about breaking down gender roles. And then this is my thing about terfs, right? I fucking hate terfs. And I, I will shout it from the rooftops, right? Like women have fought for years to not be condition and forced into these predetermined gender roles. And then you get angry for trans women, not like falling within traditional gender roles, like for not adhering to these pretend made up rules like this for a game of soldiers. Like, what the fuck are you talking about? It's stupid. It's just stupid. You know what? I think now is a good time to go for a message from our sponsors. Good luck. And we are back. So where were we? That's right, ranting about women's clothing. So basically Dion is fully aware that it's not the clothing itself, but it's what the clothing represents. Because clothing represents, represents character. And in the eyes of the French law, the French government, and sort of the general populace, by forcing female regalia onto Dion, it would in a way subdue them. Like, that is the point. It's subdue the person. It is to make them less vocal. It's to reduce their power. And female clothing, especially typical female attire, like throughout history, is done in such a way to restrict movement. Like corset. I mean, corset was shapewear. So like that's it much. But like the giant hoop skirts or like wiggle skirts when they came in, like throughout history you have. There's not normal corsets. Corsets are underwear. Like, it's a support device. But like, there are so many Items of clothing that exist. Like, the reason the reticule became like that wee, tiny, teeny, tiny handbag situation was because pockets were removed from women's clothing. And one of the reasons pockets were removed from women's clothing is because of the French Revolution. So they were worried that people would have pamphlets because they would have these massive sort of pockets underneath their skirts, and they didn't want women carrying pamphlets, you know, and it's a whole situation anyway. The idea of feminine clothing is that it's going to make dale docile. And, like, not everyone is, like, happy with this idea of forcing them into women's clothing, even though they're identifying as a woman. So the dragoons are, well, mad about it, because as far as they're concerned, I mean, they're not pushing for female soldiers by any stretch of the imagination. But as far as they're concerned, dragoons are like, it's a lifetime appointment. You are a dragoon for life. And so they're well mad about it because you're basically saying that you can take that from them, even though it's supposed to be a lifetime thing, like, it's an issue. And then you've got women who are fighting for this because they're going, well, you shouldn't force them into this because just because women are, you know, whatever, they shouldn't be pushed into wearing skirts. And, like, there's this whole movement behind it. Eventually, Dion concedes, and Marie Antoinette's wardrobe director is charged with giving them their attire. And the king is paying for it, because, of course. Of course they do, because the king is paying for it, because Dion's like, you're paying me. And so they're getting the best dresser in the country. Like, Marie Antoinette's personal wardrobe, like, this is, like, all going to be handmade. It's going to be the best of stuff. And the government, I mean, effectively, they're trying to restrict Dion's access to the public sphere. They're trying to reduce their power, but Dion is not going to go away. Like, slowly, like, that's not happening. So at the age of 49, Dion starts wearing female attire. In 1777, they are presented to court and they, like. And they're, like, hanging out with Marie Antoinette. Like, they're very accepted by Louis. Like, they're. They're doing pretty well for themselves. They're kind of generally accepted in court and. And it sort of rebuilds their public standing because, remember, they were a disgraced spy and now they were French heroine. Like, they've moved through the Ranks, and they also change it from Chevalier to Chevalier. So Chevalier de Leon, sorry, Chevalier Dion, which is how to put this. It's basically, you could have been Chevalier. It was already a title, but it would be like, the wife of a Chevalier, you know? So the nobility's opinion of them, it raises. And they begin to become, like, you know, hot stuff. And they're getting invited to, like, parties. They're kind of going around. They're going to soirees. The newspapers are writing about them. Like, if there's a gossip column, they're in it. You know what I mean? The pamphlets. They're in the pamphlets. So what's interesting about them is, like, they don't change their mannerisms to conform to the concept of femininity and womanhood. So they're fencing at parties. They're, like, speaking openly, they're giving opinions, and they poured coffee for the ladies. Now, here's the thing. Men are supposed to pour their coffee. Women are not supposed to pour their own coffee. It's a rule in Rocco France. And don't judge me. I'm just telling you how it is. But they're like, I'm going to pour my coffee. I'm not going to, like, force myself into this traditional feminine role, regardless of whether I'm a woman or not. Like, it doesn't matter, because gender roles are bullshit. So Dion actually ends up meeting Benjamin Franklin, who's getting support for the American War of Independence. So they're, like, dining together, they're hanging out, and Dale wants to help out in the war. Like, they want to be like, I want to support you. I want to help you fight England. Like, Benny, buddy, like, let's get to this. And so they go to the government, and the government's like, no, can you join a nunnery instead? Like, because they're so openly out there and doing this, they really want to start pushing them under the rug. And so they are, like, trying to force them to go to a nunnery. And Dion does consider this. Like, they visit some convents, but they don't really vibe with the whole thing because there's not a lot to do in a nunnery. Like, it's boring. Like, they pray, maybe read a Bible or two. Like, and then that's it. So when they're, like, convincing, like, conventional, Dion writes to everybody they know to try and convince them to let them join and aid in the War of Independence. Like, they are trying. Eventually, everyone's like, just go back to Burgundy. The king's like, come on. Like, go back to Burgundy. Chill out a wee bit. Have some time to yourself. And I like to imagine that Dion, like, just puts a hand up to their forehead as if they're about to faint and is like, I am too ill if I'm being bored. Like, they're just. I am too sedentary. Basically, the ideas that they've been sitting about and doing nothing for so long that, like, they're just too sick to go. Like, I'm wasting away. Like, they just have nothing else to do. So they're too ill to, like, travel to Burgundy. And it gets to the point where Louis is just so pissed off, he has Dion arrested and imprisoned for 19 days. So Dion compares this to Joan of Arc. It's like, ah, I am so being treated like Joan of Arc, who was also punished for wanting to fight in a war and wearing men's clothing. Which is true. Which is actually. That's actually why Joan of Arc was arrested. She was arrested because she was wearing men's clothing, not for, like, witchcraft. Like, they were like, they caught her on it and they did it sneakily. It was a sneaky thing they did. But that's neither here nor there. So after 19 days, you know, Dion comes out and is like, fine, I will go to Burgundy and I won't wear trousers. And so they go and stay with their mum and they're there in Burgundy with their mum for the next six years. Now, I don't know how their mum felt about this scenario, but I feel like it was not a positive experience for anybody, to be honest. So they do try and leave for England. Dion's like, hey, let me get passage to England. Because, like, I'm just chilling here in Burgundy and I've got nothing to do. And, like, it would just be a fun little trip for me. And Franz is like, no, you did try and sell our secrets to them. And I feel like probably not the best idea, because they don't know if they've amassed extra spy stuff. Like, they don't know what's happening. They don't want to run that risk. And so 1785, though, they do end up going, and they go ahead. England under there for a couple of years, 4ish years, I think. And then Dion goes back to France, and when they get there, they are in full support of the French Revolution, even though they themselves are members of the aristocracy. I mean, I mean, in fairness, they had been dealt a shift hand by the government, and they just kind of really saw, like, power to the people as, like, this really good movement. And they Were like, super into it. And they end up writing a letter to the national assembly asking to be reinstated into the army and given a regiment of women to lead into battle for France. Now, the assembly are, like, laughing it off a little bit, but also, like, applauding. So they're kind of supporting it. But also they're not gonna do that. They think it's a silly idea, but, like, they appreciate, like, the idea of it. Like, you know what I mean? But it's one of those things where, like, yes, but no. So the government are just like, no, no, no, no, no. The national zone is like, this ain't happening. So Dion, originally super supporter of, like, the French Revolution, because they're like, I don't think they really understood where it was gonna go. So, Link, again, big supporter. And then, you know, the aristocracy started being guillotined. Like, Louis loses the head. And once Louis loses his head, Dion loses the pension. So, you know, not really good for them, like, fiscally. And also remembering that they are also a member of the aristocracy and they don't want to lose their head. Needless to say, they return to London and at this point, they're. They're not exactly a spring chicken at this point. Dionne is pretty. She's pretty old at this point. And so she returns to London and ends up signing a deal for like a 10 volume memoir. Like, this is the thing about, like, back in the day, people would pay by the volume. Like, it was just something you did. You paid by the volume. You didn't pay by, you know, the page, the word. It was by the volume. And so they're gonna get like a 10 volume memoir about their life. They're gonna, like, work with, like, their letters and correspondence. And so they start writing it. Now, they write. They don't finish it, but they do write. And the thing about it is, as well, is that a lot of this is, how to put this gently fictionalized. One, they had a reputation to uphold, and two, again, paid by the volume. So they start discussing their life in a sort of twisted way. So they see that they were, when they were born, that their dad demanded, you remember Louis. Louis de Beaumont? Louis de Beaumont demanded a son. And as such, when Dion was born, like, they, instead of dressing their daughter in girl's clothing, they dressed their son, their girl, in boy's clothing, and raised him as a boy. Like that. That's the story that Dion is going with. But here's the thing. We know that Dion was assigned male at birth because of genitalia. Like, that is, that is something that we, we know. So the way that they tell their life, they teach. They teach it. No, they don't teach it. They share it in such a way that, you know, they're describing as, oh, I was told that I was a boy and I was forced to live my life as a boy. I mean, technically they were told that. But the point is, the story is, the story goes, they were born, assigned female at birth, but were forced to dress as a boy and live as a boy their whole life in order to, like, get their dad's estate or whatever, enroll and get an education and, and be a, a man instead of, I don't know, their dad just shagging more and having more kids. I don't, I don't know. Anyway, like, just try for more. Like, it's. That's kind of what you do, isn't it? Yeah. No. Anyway, so. And that they had to have this, like, life as a man until they had the option to, like, live as a woman. And so that's the theory, that's the story. But we know that they were assigned male at birth and that they, you know, realized over time that they were a woman and, you know, put themselves into a position that almost like ended their life. Like, it made their life a very difficult one to live. And at any point, at any point, like, having the money they did and the skills that they did, the Chevalier deal could have easily just switched. Like, if they were not trans, like, if they were like a man, they could have easily just gone back to doing that and like, again, like living in Ireland or somewhere, they weren't known and they could have started a new life, but they chose not to do that. They chose to continue living the life Eli lived. Like, can we have portraits of them? And the portraits of them are in sort of the big wigs and the gowns and the, like the, you know, the cross, the medal and also the revolution ribbons. Like, they are doing all this stuff. So they're writing their memoirs, but they're not doing well financially. Like, at one point they end up in a debtor's prison, like, because they're just running out of money because again, they've lost their pension, which they were getting from France and no longer have. So they're in their 70s. Who is like, oh, you're in their 70s. Let's. Let's get you to write a 10 volume memoir that's gonna work out, like, chronologically. It's gonna work fine. So they end up selling off their like 6,000 book collection. I mean, it's fair, except they sell off their books and they're fencing until, like, physically they cannot fence anymore. Like, they're in their 70s and they're fencing. And it gets to the point where they just stop doing that because, you know, they're just physically not capable anymore. And at one point, she ends up falling down the stairs and becomes, like, paralyzed for about the last four years of her life. But for the last 14 years of life, so she'd been living with Mrs. McColl, who was the widow of a naval officer. So her and Mrs. McColl were sharing an apartment in London. And so for the first 10 years, you know, just general living together. And then for the last four years, Dion ends up bedridden because of this fall. And her health, it's not great. Like, they're not doing too well and sort of they're. They're suffering, really. Like, to be honest, they're suffering. They're sort of in their late 70s, early 80s. It's not an easy life in, you know, London. And so with the way their health is going, it's no surprise that on the 21st of May, 1810, the Chevalier Dion passes away at the age of 81 in her apartment in London. Now, Mrs. McColl, who lives with her, the widow, is like. She is like. This is her housemate. She wants to get everything ready for her. She wants to make sure she's sorted for burial. And so she wants to get the body ready. And so she's removing the chemise and she's unbuttoning all the stuff. And she gets a shock because as she's unbuttoned that, she's like, omg, that's a penis. And so she goes to get advice from her friends because as far as she's aware, she's been living with this woman for 14 years. Now, I'm thinking that, no, they say paralyzed, but I'm thinking the chevalier couldn't have been too bedridden because they didn't need help peeing. So they couldn't have been too bad. I mean, they're bad. Yeah, but I feel like they managed to hide that. You know what I mean? They weren't getting, like, chamber pot help, were they? No, they couldn't have been. They couldn't have been because Mrs. McCool would have noticed the penis by now then, wouldn't she? Yeah. So Mrs. McCool goes to get advice from her friends and they tell her to call on the professionals. And so she does. And approximately 10 to 12 men show up to assess the body, which, frankly, seems to me like too many men. So we've got a surgeon, a lawyer, a professor of anatomy, reporter, and apparently a bunch of other fellows who have the appropriate expertise for gandering at genitalia. Maybe some were there for fun, which I hope not, because that's creepy. And so one of them states, like, they write an official report, and the coroner is like, yes, that's definitely a penis. But also, the body has round limbs and remarkably full breasts. I feel like maybe they just gained weight in their old age. I mean, yeah, probably. Probably. Probably. Yeah.
A
Like,
B
I've dated men who have busts that are sometimes larger than mine. Like, it happens. You get over it. But I mean, sometimes they look better in my brows than I do. Like, I'm just saying. But anyway, but they're like, definitely a dude. Definitely a dude. Definitely a dude. That's a penis. So I'm going through that here, saying that the Chevalier de Leon, or Chevalier Dion, sorry, was a trans woman. And I think we just. How cool that person is, considering they had to transition so late in life as well. Like, major respect for Dion. So here's the thing. Dale is buried at the St. Pancras old Church in 1813. That means their body was not buried for three years. And I'm like, what were they doing with that body for three years? I don't appreciate what they were doing. I don't actually really want to know what they were doing, because I don't trust anybody with a corpse, to be honest. But so ends our story of the transgender spy for France and member of the King's Secret, the Chevalier Dion. If you liked my retelling of this story, feel free to rate and review five stars. If there's an echo, I did my best to get it out. So we're just gonna have to suck it up this week. Don't forget, you can follow me on all the socials. Sign up for my newsletter. It's gonna be a great time. There's gonna be updates. I have. I've got things I need to update to, like, Patreon as well. Like, I have them here ready to go. I just haven't uploaded them yet. Like, an absolute arse. But that's that. But of course we have recommendation time. So for reading, I am actually gonna suggest the tip in the Velvet. Tip of the Velvet by Sarah Waters. I just rebought a copy of it again. So did I recommend that last week? Did I? I don't care. I'm recommending it again for listening. I'M going to suggest. What am I going to recommend for listening? What have I been listening to this week? I haven't been listening to anything this week. Oh, God. What? I like. You know what? Let's go for some nostalgia then. I think everybody should listen to you. Spin Me Round by Dead or Alive It's a good, fun song. It is. It really pumps you up. You should go listen to it. And if you're not going to listen to it, at least watch the. The Paul Rudd version. It's very funny and for watching. Okay, we all know Bridgerton's coming out this week and I am gonna have a Bridgerton kind of themed special episode coming out later in the week. And I think you're gonna like it. It's got a bisexual mess. Because it's got our favorite bisexual mess, a very particular lord, a Lord Byron, who is just the definition of bisexual. Panic. I swear to God. Anyway, with that I shall bid you adieu. Adios. Au revoir. Au revoir, my friends. Bye. Bye.
In this lively Pride Month episode, host Katie Charlwood takes listeners on an insightful, irreverent, and deeply human journey through the life of Chevalier(e) d’Eon: French noble, spy, diplomat, soldier, and one of history’s most fascinating transgender figures. Charlwood’s signature wit and historical passion shine through as she highlights d’Eon's extraordinary adventures, the intersections of gender, power, and identity, and how their story resonates with both past and present discussions about gender and societal roles.
This episode is a masterful retelling of the Chevalier(e) d’Eon’s extraordinary life, highlighting their wit, defiance, and complexity—both as a spy in the service of competing masters and as a trans woman whose gender nonconformity shocked, scandalized, and fascinated 18th-century Europe. Katie Charlwood delivers an engaging, empowering, and historically grounded narrative that uplifts d’Eon's dignity and underlines the enduring struggles and triumphs of trans and queer individuals—past and present.
“So ends our story of the transgender spy for France and member of the King’s Secret, the Chevalier d’Eon.” — Katie Charlwood [1:01:15]