Finding Friends Who Help Me Follow Jesus | Sadie Robertson Huff | Grace Hackett

Summary

Episode Overview

Title: Finding Friends Who Help Me Follow Jesus
Host: Sadie Robertson Huff
Guest: Grace Hackett
Release Date: July 8, 2026

This heartfelt episode of the WHOA That's Good Podcast dives deep into the power of Christ-centered friendships, the importance of community, and navigating seasons of faith—especially in young adulthood and college. Sadie welcomes her longtime friend Grace Hackett to share her journey of growing up in a big, blended family, her role at the non-profit Love One, and the pivotal moments God used to draw her (and Sadie) into more life-giving communities. Together, they answer listener questions about making and keeping godly friends, discerning God's direction, overcoming insecurity, and developing a daily walk with Jesus—even in environments where faith isn’t the norm.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Grace’s Story: Family, Love One, and Friendship

• Grace’s Background (02:27–07:11)

  • Grew up outside of Nashville in a family of 8 siblings—half biological, half adopted, from both domestic and international backgrounds.
  • Her sister Josie Love’s adoption from Uganda led Grace’s mom to start Love One, a non-profit supporting malnourished infants and families in Uganda.
  • A powerful personal moment: realizing as a mother what it meant that her 3-year-old sister weighed as little as her own healthy 3-month-old son.
    Quote: “To really realize, wow, a three-month-old weighs 12 pounds, and this is how big she was... it was such a profound moment for me.” (05:00 — Grace Hackett)
  • Grace now works full-time for Love One, returning to Uganda nearly every year since she was 12.

• How Sadie & Grace Met (07:40–10:45)

  • Their unique friendship began through mutual friend Lauren Akins, who wanted to connect with someone “stewarding a platform for God.”
  • Divine timing and mutual friends led to an unexpected coffee date and quickly realizing God was orchestrating lasting friendships. Quote: “When you're looking for community, prayers matter so much, because the Lord will just connect you to the right people at the right time.” (09:49 — Sadie Robertson)

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2. Friendship, Influence, and Finding Your People

• On Faith and College Friendships (12:35–21:54)
  • Grace describes drifting from “head knowledge” of Christianity into college party culture, then feeling drained and empty. Meeting Lauren Akins provided a real-life example of someone joyfully walking with Jesus. Quote: “I just realized, like, you are the type of friend that I’ve been longing for... you just are walking with Jesus, but you’re real and relatable.” (16:00 — Grace Hackett)
  • Sadie highlights the importance of changing patterns and seeking new community when old ones drain your soul. Quote: “There’s a life with Jesus and it is full and life-giving and it is possible for you. But you do have to change some things up.” (19:20 — Sadie Robertson)
  • The friends you keep play a fundamental role in your walk; sometimes, you may need to step away to grow stronger in faith.

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3. Listener Voicemails & Practical Faith Q&A

First Listener Q: Navigating Old Friendships After Faith Changes (27:20–31:45)

• Grace:

  • Different friendships play different roles; not all friends need to be your “go-to” for spiritual guidance.
  • Stay connected to non-Christian friends, acting as a light, but get spiritual filling from those who walk closely with Jesus.
  • Know your boundaries—if you’re still easily tempted, it’s okay to create needed distance. Quote: “You’re not called to withdraw from all the people in your life that don’t know [Jesus]. In fact, it’s the opposite... You get to share that with your friends.” (28:00 — Grace Hackett)

• Sadie:

  • Sometimes you need to “go cold turkey" like her husband, Christian, did, to break bad patterns.
  • But when stable, witnessing to old friends is powerful. Set expectations for those friendships to shift as your life priorities change.

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Second Listener Q: Staying Close to God in College & Starting Bible Reading (31:47–39:27)

• Grace:

  • Entered college still searching, despite a foundation in faith—leading her to seek validation and love in unhealthy places.
  • Only when she met friends truly living for Jesus did her walk change.

• Sadie:

  • True contentment is only found “in the Messiah”—not in relationships, performance, or external validation.
  • Referenced John 1:35 (“What are you seeking?”) to illustrate the need to intentionally define what you’re searching for in life and to find your identity in Christ. Quote: “If you do this little—what am I looking for, find it in Jesus—it really will change the way that you walk and go into places...” (38:31 — Sadie Robertson)

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Third Listener Q: Trusting God with the Future and Decision-Making (42:59–47:16)

• Grace:

  • God gives us meaningful choices; “it might not be that there’s one right and one wrong."
  • Uses John Eldredge’s technique of “trying on” possible decisions in prayer, asking which brings peace or anxiety, and consulting Scripture for guidance.

• Sadie:

  • Sometimes God answers through open/closed doors and wise counsel from those closest to you (family, spouse, small group). Quote: “God gives us free will ... and just to go, ‘Okay, God, I think I want to do this, I want to pursue it,’ and then knowing that if I walk through this door and that fails, that’s not that I did it wrong...” (47:16 — Sadie Robertson)

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Fourth Listener Q: The Fear of the Lord & Overcoming Distraction (esp. Phone Addiction) (51:17–59:56)

• Grace:

  • The “fear of the Lord” is not terror, but “a deep, deep reverence for who God is and His power.”
  • Cites The Ruthless Elimination of Hurry by John Mark Comer’s insight about our phone addiction: the average person touches their phone 2,600 times a day—and this steals our sense of awe of God.

• Sadie:

  • When the Holy Spirit convicts you that something (like your phone) has become an idol or addiction, true reverence means you obey that nudge, even if the action (like deleting an app) is hard.
  • You can’t experience the fear of the Lord (awe and respect) if you’re always distracted. Quote: “The fear of the Lord helps you with your decision-making, helps you stay confident in who you are and where you are ... if I didn’t fear the Lord, I would crumble to the opinion of man every single day.” (57:56 — Sadie Robertson)
  • Proverbs 24:12: “Once our eyes have been open, we can’t pretend we don’t know what to do. For God, who weighs our hearts and keeps our souls, knows that we know and holds us responsible to act.” (58:56 — Grace Hackett)

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4. “WHOA, That’s Good” Moment (Best Advice Question) (60:07–63:05)

• Best Advice Received – Grace Hackett:
  • “Clear is kind, and you can be clear and kind.”
    • Being direct (but gentle) in communication avoids misunderstandings and resentment—whether in friendships, marriage, or ministry.
    • Example: Sadie kindly but directly explained to someone why they couldn’t join a lunch, rather than making an empty offer. Quote: “If you’re not clear, it leads to resentment. If you’re not kind, it leads to friction... clear is kind, and you can be clear and kind.” (63:00 — Grace Hackett)
  • Runner-up advice: “Don’t take criticism from someone you wouldn’t take advice from.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On God’s Orchestration:
  “The Lord will just connect you to the right people at the right time.” (09:49 — Sadie Robertson)

• On Transformational Friendships:
  “You are the type of friend that I’ve been longing for... walking with Jesus, but you’re real and relatable.” (16:00 — Grace Hackett)

• On Breaking Old Patterns:
  “There’s a life with Jesus and it is full and life-giving and it is possible for you. But you do have to change some things up.” (19:20 — Sadie Robertson)

• On Decision-Making:
  “God gives us choice because he loves us... and a lot of times, both can be right if you’re honoring God in whichever choice you make.” (44:28 — Grace Hackett)

• On ‘Fear of the Lord’:
  “It’s not anxiety or quaking in your boots over God. It’s just a deep, deep reverence for who God is and His power and awe of Him.” (52:06 — Grace Hackett)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:27–07:11] – Grace’s background, family, and Love One story
• [07:40–10:45] – How Grace and Sadie became friends; God’s orchestration of relationships
• [12:35–21:54] – Grace’s college testimony and finding faith-fueled friendships
• [27:20–31:45] – How to approach shifting old friendships as faith deepens
• [31:47–39:27] – Staying close to God in college, Bible reading, and wrestling with insecurity
• [42:59–47:16] – Discernment in uncertain seasons and trusting God with decisions
• [51:17–59:56] – “Fear of the Lord,” distraction, and practical steps for digital self-control
• [60:07–63:05] – “WHOA, That’s Good” best advice: Clear is kind

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Tone and Takeaways

Warm, vulnerable, practical, and full of encouragement, this episode is both a friendship story and a faith guide for young adults struggling to find and keep godly community. Grace and Sadie blend scripture, humor, and hard-won wisdom, urging listeners to seek out friends who call out their best, walk in reverence for God, and have the courage to change their environments for the better.

Transcript

[Sadie Robertson]

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[Grace Hackett]

What's up?

[Sadie Robertson]

Everybody happy? Well, that's good. Wednesday. I hope you're having a great week, but per usual, it is about to get so much better because today we have such a special guest on the podcast. This girl has been a friend to me for a long time. How long have we been friends, Grace?

[Grace Hackett]

Davey always tells me not to talk about years because I always mess him up. Maybe like, when did you get married?

[Sadie Robertson]

I feel like, okay, wait, I got married almost seven years ago. Okay, so it was before then.

[Grace Hackett]

Like eight, maybe eight years.

[Sadie Robertson]

Eight years. Okay, y', all, we have eight year friendship happening right now. We have Grace Hackett on the podcast. Grace is an incredible mom, an incredible wife, an incredible friend. She also is a part of running Love One with her family, which is a podcast sponsor that many of you have signed to be a part of the Love Club. If you don't know what I'm talking about, we'll talk about it in a second. But I have my sweatshirt on and they're just doing incredible work in Uganda, around the world. Your family's so amazing. So thanks for coming on the podcast.

[Grace Hackett]

This is so fun.

[Sadie Robertson]

This is fun and kind of long overdue.

[Grace Hackett]

I know.

[Sadie Robertson]

So we had your sister, Miller Ann.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

And Parker, because, you know, one of the things that people love when we talk about the most is dating. And I was thinking about who's like a couple that said it well. And I just love how honest they've been on social media. So we asked them and then I was like, wait, I cannot believe I haven't had Grace on. This is so weird. So thanks for making the trip down.

[Grace Hackett]

No, it's perfect timing. It's been so fun and I'm just happy to be here.

[Sadie Robertson]

So sweet. Okay, tell us a little bit about loved one, what you do on a day to day, and a little bit about your fam.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah. So I'll start with me in my life. I'm married to Davey. I mentioned him a minute ago. I really am so bad with years and timelines and stuff. I always mess him up and he always picks on me for that. But I'm married to Davey. He's the best. We've been married for eight years and we have three kids. We have two boys and a girl. Crew Baron Haven. We live in Franklin right outside of Nashville. I'm born and raised there. Davey's lived there for a long time. I'm one of eight kids, so a lot of y' all listening. Met Miller Ann Parker on the podcast. One of my sisters. Like Sadie said, there's five girls, three boys. Four of my siblings are adopted, four are biological. And we've always said, like, I've always told Sadie, like, I don't really have anyone else in my life who has so many parallels in our family. Like, legit, even down to like. Sadie has two brothers that are adopted domestically. I have two brothers that are adopted domestically. Rebecca joined Yalls family later in life. She's from Taiwan. Tuta joined our family later in life. She's from Honduras. Like, it's pretty wild. I was telling her on her birthday, like, I don't really have another friend who can Relate to the dynamics of my family because that's their lived experience, you know, but that's our family. And then I have a sister, Josie love, who is adopted from Uganda. And she was really what who the Lord used to put love one on my mom's heart. So when she was. We adopted her when she was 3 years old and she weighed 12 pounds when she was 3 when we met her. And it's so crazy because, like, I grew up knowing that, like, I grew up knowing that she weighed 12 pounds at 3. But it wasn't until I became a mom. I have like, one of the most vivid memories of my life is weighing crew, my firstborn on the scale at three months and seeing 12 pounds. And I just remember weeping, being like, I was there. I was 13 when she came home. I was in seventh grade or eighth grade. But, like, to really realize, wow, a three month old weighs 12 pounds. And this is how big she was. And like, then flashing back to holding her, being the same size. It was such a profound moment for me and really cool because I work for loved one and so just to like, connect all the pieces in my brain and in my heart. But basically when we met her, my parents genuinely didn't know if she was gonna make it. And so they were sitting in these hospitals and my mom's like holding this limp body because she was just so sick. And they found out at a routine medical exam that she had tuberculosis, malaria, and was HIV positive. And so they were like, what does this look like for us? And still just like they prayed about it and still felt like she was supposed to be a part of our family. Continued to pursue the adoption, ended up getting her home. And then with proper medical care, just watched how she blossomed into this beautiful, amazing, joyful young girl, young woman. You know her, she's so sweet. 20 now, I think she just turned 20.

[Sadie Robertson]

Just got her dream job.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah, I just got her dream job as a teacher's aide at the school that we grew up at, which crew is at now too. So I'm like, she could be crew's teacher's aide, which is so sweet in a few years. But yeah, my mom just saw the difference that quality medical care made for her and I think got everybody got her home and was like, our family's full, but was still having flashbacks to sitting in hospitals in Uganda with these other moms and meeting these other moms who had in rural communities who had extremely malnourished babies and like, were pretty hopeless. And so she started Loved one. We have A rehabilitation center in Uganda for malnourished babies. And so, yeah, I work for Loved one full time. And it's such a gift. And, like, has always. I mean, I've grown up going to Uganda. I've gone almost every year since I was 12.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Grace Hackett]

So just a big part of my heart and really purposeful work to get to do outside of my home and my kids.

[Sadie Robertson]

It's amazing. I cannot wait to go with y'. All.

[Grace Hackett]

I know.

[Sadie Robertson]

I cannot wait. I've been to Uganda, but not with you guys. And I'm so excited. And it really is so crazy. Like you said, our lives, we've, like, related on so much, and it's so rare that you have a friend where you have so much in common with. From our families to now. We've been married around the same time, have three kids. We both have a haven. Like, there's just, like, so many things.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

But it was really sweet. So how we met was actually mutual friend who's also been on the podcast, Lauren Akins. And we went to coffee together because we literally passed each other in the church parking lot. And then we saw, like, she DM'd me. Yes. And she DM'd me. But I didn't know you had told her to reach out to me or something.

[Grace Hackett]

Well, I was telling your team before this.

[Caller]

I.

[Grace Hackett]

It was so funny because it was, like, right when Thomas Rhett's career was really taking off and her platform was growing so much. And I have a really vivid memory. It was interesting talking to your team, because I had so many memories come back from, like, just throughout our friendship that I'd kind of forgotten about. But this is before I met you. And we were sitting on her couch, and she was like, I. I just want to talk to someone who God's given a platform to. That's, like, stewarding it really well. But I don't know who that person is. And I remember, like, brainstorming, being like, who is in the public eye that's a believer. And at the time, I was watching this is Us, and I'm like, I think, like, Chrissy Metz is a believer. I don't know her. That's sweet. I was throwing out names, and she said, what about Sadie? And I had heard your name, obviously, over the years, just, like, from Doug Dynasty, but didn't know you, and I didn't follow you, so I hadn't kept up with your life and what you were doing. And when we looked at your page, I was like, wow, she seems amazing. So she dm'd you that night, and y' all got connected. But then what's crazy is so she. And you can. You can say this aside if you want to, but she came back to me being like, sadie's roommates remind me so much of the way she talks about her roommates remind me of how I talk about you and your mom. And at the same time, like, around the same time that this was happening, you were living with Sarah, Gracie, and Lainey. I met Sarah at Imago Day, and she knew Davey from the Belonging, and there was just, like, all this crazy overlap. I ended up hanging out with them, and then they invited me to Gracie's birthday dinner. So it was like this weird thing because Lauren was telling me, you would love Sadie, y' all would be great friends. Y' all need to meet and get together. And then I got invited to Gracie's birthday dinner, not knowing y' all were

[Sadie Robertson]

roommates at our house.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah. So when I showed up, I was like, we both knew that Lauren had been trying to get us together. Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

So that was. Yeah, the timing was crazy. And so the Lord. And I just think this serves as a reminder to people listening. Like, when you're looking for community, prayers matter so much, because the Lord will just connect you to the right people at the right time. And I remember. So Lauren had sent me that dm, but I didn't see it. And then when I passed her in the church parking lot, it, like, sparked me to go message her. And I was like, oh. She messaged me. Like, it was like, that was the time.

[Grace Hackett]

That's crazy.

[Sadie Robertson]

Then we went to coffee, and it was so cute because I think she had three kids or two kids or something. Like, she.

[Grace Hackett]

She just had Willa grand, maybe was pregnant with Ada James or just had Ada James.

[Sadie Robertson]

And she was like, you're. She's like, this has been awesome. But, like, I'm like, such a mom right now. I'm so busy. She's like, but you know who you would be best friends with? She's like, grace. She's like, y' all the same person. Y' all are so similar, all this stuff. And so then I was like, oh, I gotta meet Grace. And then you show up at our house. And I'm like, what are the odds of this?

[Grace Hackett]

So crazy.

[Sadie Robertson]

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[Grace Hackett]

Yeah. So I was raised in a Christian household. Like, parents are the absolute best. I went to a Christian school growing up, and I always believed in God. And, like, I've never gone through a season where I didn't believe in God. But when I was in college, I went to the University of Tennessee. I rushed because that's what everybody does in the south, especially at the SEC schools, and was just kind of doing the college sorority thing. And I had never, like, my parents didn't drink when I was growing up. I'd never really been exposed to alcohol much at all, much less like a healthy relationship with alcohol. It just wasn't really around. And so I think when I got to college I just, that's what everybody was doing. Like everyone was going out, they were partying. That was like the social thing to do. And I just fell into like this lifestyle that everybody around me was doing and. And it left me feeling really drained and depleted. And for my first two years of college, I just looking back, like I was so insecure. I was just looking for validation and to feel loved and for my identity in all the wrong places. And I know that's a story, so many people's stories. And it's so interesting because you see people go off and go to college and join a sorority and post the cute bid day pictures and do all the things and it looks like this dream that you too can go live and then you get there. And I'm not saying that you can't join a sorority and find godly community and do it right. I think it's harder than it is to fall into whatever because the majority of people in that world are living this lifestyle. And so yeah, by my sophomore year I was like looking back, kind of depressed, like not diagnosed depression, but I just was, it was so dark. Like looking back on it, it just feels so dark. And I remember around Christmas of my sophomore year, like going back, back, I was also in nursing school at the time. I thought that's what I wanted to do. I saw this medical need overseas and I was like, I'm going to be a nurse so I can go fill this medical need. And then kind of realized once I got into nursing school, like, yes, I can use that degree overseas, but unless I'm going to go move somewhere, like my day to day reality as a nurse looks pretty different than that. And when I realized my day to day reality, I was like, I don't know if this is what, what I'm called to. And so yeah, I remember driving back to Knoxville on after Christmas break and being like, something has to change this semester or like I'm transferring to Belmont. And I think it was whatever the break is, it's in February, like President's Day weekend or something. We had a long weekend and I went on a trip to Haiti with my mom. Had been becoming friends with Lauren and I had met her a few times, but that was like really the first time that I spent an extended amount of time with her was in Haiti. And it was a few of us that went down. We built a medical clinic in Haiti years ago. Like before loved one was even loved one. And so we, we go down to Haiti. We have this trip together, and I'm, like, really grappling with them. I'm supposed to be in nursing school, and I'm talking to Lauren about it because she graduated from UT Nursing, and so she really, like, counseled me through that. Ultimately, I ended up leaving nursing school, but when I went, as I got to know her, I just realized, like, you are the type of friend that I've been longing for. Like, I have great friends that I met in college, but none of us were healthy. I just wasn't around anybody who was living a healthy lifestyle. And I'm not blaming anybody else. Like, that's on me for putting myself in those scenarios, but that just was my reality. And I wish, looking back, if there's someone listening that's in that, like, move to a different friend group. Like, seek out community in your church. Seek out community in places that will give you life. Because I just stayed stuck, I feel like, you know, so it wasn't until I met her, and I was like, man, she is. I look. Looked up to her in so many ways and was like, you just are walking with Jesus, but you're real and you're relatable. And, like, this is what I've been longing for. And also on top of that, we got to do, like, travel and serve together, which is such an amazing aspect of friendship. When you get to have that with someone, you know, it's just, like, so deep and meaningful. And so I went back to school, but then my junior year and senior year, I was home a lot. Like, my senior year, I was dating and engaged to Davey, who I actually met through her ntr. But it was just a big pivot for me being like, man, this is what I'm longing for. This is the kind of community I'm longing for. And it was then that I really started walking with Jesus and letting him convict me and change things in me that I think I'd kind of been pushing away and ignoring the conviction because, you know, when you grow up knowing Jesus, like, that conviction's there. But I just went through a season where I was like, I know this is wrong, but I'm kind of ignoring it. And then it wasn't until I was legit at rock bottom, and I was like, I'm so miserable and empty that I made a change. So anyways, married Davey after college. We dated all my senior year and got married. And then now we're in a small group that we've been in. So we got married in August after I graduated, or I Graduated in August. Sorry. We got married in September of 2018. We joined our small group in December of 2018. And Lauren and TR are in our small group. And we've been doing life in that community since. And she was just such a, like a seed that. And a person that God planted in my life that led to, like, ma', am. A big pivot, you know? Yeah, yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

It's amazing whenever someone's like walking the walk and you're like, okay, it is possible.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

You know, because it's like, you know, like you said, like, if you have known Jesus your whole life, it's like, okay, I know this is the way I want to live. But then you get so far away from it that then you feel like, okay, is anyone actually doing that?

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

And then you see someone doing it and you're like, oh, you can do it. And there actually is like the fruit of the spirit on their life and they are, like, genuinely joyful and they actually have peace and they actually are content in who they are. And it's like, I really want that. And so it's so cool because sometimes you get so in the mundane of like, life and being around people and watching the same shows everybody's watching, listen to same music everybody's watching, just doing the thing and you're like, this is not life giving. You know, I don't actually want my life to look like this. So sometimes it takes that example to go like, oh, okay, I actually can't do something better. And then to be plugged in and like a group like that, to be surrounded by such like minded people. It's funny because then you go the whole opposite way and you're like so into, you know, and you're like, I can't believe I used to think this was normal. Or I can't believe I used to think, like, depression was just the way I was going to feel, you know? And so just to encourage people listening, like, I hope maybe today serves as a reminder from like two people who've walked each road. It's like, man, there's a life with Jesus and it is full and it is life giving and it is possible for, for you. But you do have to change some things up. Don't just stay in the same routine. It's like, don't conform to the pattern of the world. Be transformed by the renewal of your mind. And then like, get a new friend group. Do something different. Walk into a new place. And even like with your friend group, I feel like there's so many opportunities too Within a friend group that's living that way to say, like, hey, are we actually happy? Like, you can be the. That you don't have to, like, leave your friends high and dry. They might be wanting to change too, you know, so having those conversations is important. But it's so cool to hear your story because I know so many people can relate. So many people go to college and it's like, the first year is so hard. And of course, like, you're tempted in so many ways. You conform in so many ways. And then I think what happens is people think, well, I already. I'm already in it. Like, I've already done this or I've already gotten to this point. And so you just, like, keep going on that path. But it's like, no, don't keep going on that path. That's what I love about Christian's story. His first year of college was like, like, bad. Like, his first semester was like, terrible as far as choices, choices, you know, and he just went all in down the wrong way.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

But then it had such a pivot, you know, and it wasn't like a one day thing, it was an overtime thing. But by the end of his college years, he was so on fire for the Lord. We got married. Like, it was like totally different from year one to year four. And I think that's so inspiring. That's a life with Jesus. Jesus, like, that's the transformational power of Christ who resurrected from the grave. Like, you can change at any time. And so super encouraging to hear.

[Grace Hackett]

You know, a verse I've been thinking about lately is. I can't remember the reference, but the one that says, train up a child in the way he should go, and when he's old, he will not depart from it. And it's interesting because I was thinking, like, I think about my own kids, and my prayer for them is not like, God, never let them depart from the straight and narrow. I always pray, like, let them walk with you, let them encounter you, let them know you. But at the end of the day, it's like, everyone is gonna have times that they're drawn away by the world and what the prayer is like, that you as a parent have established the foundation as a child in the seasons that they depart from it, that they hit those feelings of emptiness, of anxiety, of depression, and then they remember, oh, but I've walked with Jesus before, and I know that's where I found peace and I felt loved and I was at rest. And so when they depart, it's like just that they'll come back because that's their foundation of their childhood, you know, so great.

[Sadie Robertson]

Literally at church this past Sunday, it was Father's Day and the pastor was talking about how we have such an anxious generation because fathers have not been like the protector. Like one of the reasons, obviously there's a lot of reasons. One of the reasons is fathers have not been the strong protector that they're called to be in. Like the present protector they're called to be in a lot of people's lives. And they said, he said, but God is that. But the reason why people are so anxious is like they don't. They've forgotten where to go when they're scared. And I was like, that's really a good point because like God is a ever present help in times of trouble. And it's like when you're conditioned to know that and like to turn to God. But like there's a generation who doesn't know like God's someone I'm supposed to turn to whenever I'm scared.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

And maybe that's from a lack of fatherhood, maybe that's from a lack of knowing or understanding the Bible or the Word. But that's something like I'm really trying to, to teach our kids now is like being quick to go to God, like when they're hurt, when they're scared, when they're this. And it's like so that they always know, like that's been a prayer over their life since the day they were born. Like, would you always know how loved you are by God? Would you always know that God's with you? Just so. Like there's not a day that you can go by that you could truly think you're not loved or that you're alone, you know? And I think so many people think like I'm not loved or I'm alone or I don't know where to go or I feel so anxious and it's like just knowing, like a deep knowing that no matter how bad it is, no matter what it looks like, that God is with me. Yeah, it was so sweet last night. Cuz I don't know if you experienced this in Hotel Monroe, but the storm was crazy. Yeah, it was so crazy. Lightning was crazy, thunder was crazy and honey was really scared. And so I turned on David the movie or the TV show because it was like if the TV wasn't on, like the lightning was like lighting up the room so much and the thunder was so loud. So I was like, I'm just going to turn on the tv. And I had no idea we had never seen this one. It was the Minnow extended version of the David TV show. I didn't even know they had that. And it was David in a storm. And there was lightning and thunder and everything. And then honey goes, how can David not be scared in that lightning? And I said, because he. He knew God was with him. And honey said, I wish I was David. And then I was like, but you know what's so cool, honey? Like, the same God that David trusted is the same God you trust. And the same God that was in David is the same God that's in you. And it was such a sweet moment to be like, oh, like, I want to be David because I want to be fearless. I want to be David because I want to be brave like that. I want to be David because I want to not be scared in the storm. It's like, oh, I can be David. And it's kind of a point to you, looking at Lauren and being like, I kind of want to be that. You know, it's like, oh, I can be that. Because the, the fact is, is like, she has Jesus in her. Such a cool illustration. You know how there are just certain things that guys in your life end up weari the time? Well, that would be Poncho outdoors for the men in our family. My dad loves his poncho shirts. Christian wears them pretty much every day. And I love finding something for them that looks nice, but it's still just practical for them to live in. Poncho makes men's outdoor performance shirts that don't look like your average shirt. They're lightweight, breathable, quick drying, and they have UPF 50 plus built in, so they're great for being outside, especially in summer. And the fit is a big deal. Poncho shirts come in regular, slim and tall, short sleeves or long sleeves, and from sizes small all the way the way to 3xL. So whether you're shopping for your husband, your dad, your brother, whoever, you can find something that fits him just right. Poncho really thought through all of the little details too, that guys love. They have a hidden zipper pocket, a sunglasses holder, and even a built in lens cloth. It is the kind of shirt that they can wear fishing, working outside, traveling, or just go to dinner and still look all pulled together. We love this. Christian loves anything extra like that. It's like that. Those are just the things that guys geek out about. Plus they love the fit. And I have to say, for a brand to like fit a wide spectrum when My dad loves it and Christian loves it who don't always have the same style. That's pretty impressive. So go to ponchooutdoors.com Whoa. And enter your email to get $10 off and free shipping on your first order. That's Poncho. P O N C H O outdoors.com. head there, drop in your email and get $10 off and free shipping. And once you try it, you'll get why all the guys in our family have a closet full of poncho.

[Caller]

You.

[Sadie Robertson]

I wanted to answer some voicemails with you because we've been doing this and it's so fun for the listeners to call in. For those who haven't been tracking, we have a woe line. You can call into the wo line. Share your heart, ask questions, whatever you want to share. And these episodes have been so special because sometimes whenever you're podcasting, it's like, you know, you're. We're. We're in this room. We're not seeing who we're talking to, but to, like, hear the voices of the girls who are listening to this, the guys who are listening to this, is just so cool. I just want to tell y' all the who line number, cuz it threw it up. It's 331-858-21749. So you can always call that number, ask any questions, and it might be featured. But specifically, when we have a guest come in like Grace, we'll dive through the different voicemails that you left and anything that, like, resonates where I'm like, oh, she would be awesome to speak into this. So I want y' all to hear a little bit about her story and how she can relate to your life. And now we're going to listen to a couple of voicemails.

[Caller]

Let's go have a question on how

[Sadie Robertson]

to approach old friendship when you're acting actively developing your faith.

[Caller]

Just kind of when I feel like I have a friend that I no longer resonate with in a lot of the areas that I used to. And sometimes I feel like she can hold me back from living my life for God. And I just kind of want to know how you're supposed to approach friendships like that, because I think that it can be hard thinking too much by.

[Sadie Robertson]

This is great.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah. Like, I feel like in some ways we kind of answer it. I think in my head, I kind of have buckets of friendship and I have, like, my people who, when I'm low, when I'm empty, when I need encouragement, like, I know that they walk with Jesus, and I look to them to fill my cup, to encourage me, to point me back to Jesus. And then I have friends who I love dearly who don't really walk with Jesus. And they might not be the people that I'm, like, going to go to advice for, but I love them. And. And at the end of the day, like, when you start walking with Jesus, you're not called to withdraw from all the people in your life that don't know Him. In fact, it's the opposite. And like you said, Sadie, it's such an amazing opportunity for you to actually look at them and say, I have found peace here. And also, people will notice a difference in you. If you've been so empty and anxious and depressed. And then you find Jesus and you meet him and you experience the peace and the joy that he offers you. You get to share that with your friends. And so I think. I think it's having an awareness of what roles different friendships play in your life and what your expectations of your friends are, but definitely staying in that space and bringing what you found into those spaces and being a light in. In your friendships and to your friends, that is great.

[Sadie Robertson]

I totally agree. I think there is a time and a place for needing to remove yourself when you're still trying to, you know, shift in your own life, like, if you're still tempted by it. I mean, I think Christian had to go, like, cold turkey. He had to be like, I am walking away from this for a little while while I, you know, get stronger in. In my faith. Because Christian knew himself. He was like, I'm going to go back. Like, and he did, like, so many times until he finally was like, I'm walking away. And so sometimes there's a call to, like, okay, I actually have to walk away in order to, like, for me to change and not be in this same pattern, same cycle. But then also there's that other element of, like, witnessing to them of, like, what God's doing in your life and being willing to talk about it. And so I think you kind of have to know yourself and boundaries in that space. And when it's time to, like, fully walk away and when it's time to just stay and be honest and have good conversations, and maybe it's a little bit of both. But I love what you said. I think that's so, so helpful.

[Grace Hackett]

Also, before. Or do you. Before you. We move on. I was also just going to say, I remember my senior year, I was engaged to Davey. I was dating him the first semester and then engaged the second semester. And to Sadie's point, like, I came home every weekend. And so for me, because every. I would. I would say to my friends, like, if y' all want to go do something fun, I'll stay in town. But most weekends it was like, well, this Darty is happening on Saturday, and we're gonna go to this frat house. And so true. Like, I knew if I'm here and I'm going to those places, like, it's just not gonna be good for me. And so I did remove myself on the weekends, but it was great because my weeks were spent in Knoxville, and, like, it's a lot easier to draw a lot of those boundaries. For me, me, it was during the week when it's like, well, we'll go get dinner and we'll study together and we'll do all these things. But on the weekend when everyone's, like, really out partying, I'm gonna go home.

[Sadie Robertson]

That's so good. Cuz sometimes, yeah, it's like, I can. We can be friends in this capacity, but I'm not gonna, like, go to the bar with you. I'm not gonna do the things and put myself in the position that I've constantly failed in. You know, it's like, don't do the same thing over and over again. But I think that's such good advice. And I think friendships like that are different than you are so valuable, though. So I do think, like you said, it's not like you just need to ditch all your friends that aren't walking with the Lord. Like, no, it's so valuable. Like, you're the light in that space also, like, they mean so much to you. Like, it's good to keep those friendships. It's good for those to remain. It's just that your expectation on what that friendship looks like has to shift a little bit.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah, totally.

[Sadie Robertson]

It's great.

[Caller]

Hi, Sadie, My question is, do you have any advice for me as a Christian girl in college? Any tips on how to. To stay close to God and stay close to him throughout, you know, day to day life? And also if you have any tips for getting in and starting to read the Bible. Thanks. Bye.

[Sadie Robertson]

It's great. It's so funny because, like I said, we, like, already got these voicemails, and then whenever you share with our team your testimony, they're like, these are perfect. And I think that just goes to show to so many people listening, like, these are such common things that girls are going through. I get asked all the Time. How do I say, you know, how do I remain faithful in college? Because the truth is, like, what we've talked about. You're going in and you're tempted all around. It's like, are you gonna conform if you're, you know, if you're not, are you really gonna be a part? Are you gonna be accepted? Are you gonna be loved? Are you gonna be weird? Are you gonna be, are you gonna have friends? It's like all those things come at you. And I didn't go to college, so I didn't experienced that. But of course, I've heard so many times from so many friends, like, the same story. When you went into college, like, having the foundation of faith your whole life, did you go in thinking, like, I'm gonna stay strong and then wavered, or were you like, this is my time to like, actually live it up a little bit?

[Grace Hackett]

I think I just went, I went into college with a lot of insecurity. I, I. And I think it came from a few different things. Like, I look back and I'm like, I never really, like, I think, number one, I always longed to date someone. And like, it's natural to think about your life and think, like, I want to date someone. I want to get married, I want to be a mom. Like, you have all these goals for yourself. And I look back and I'm like, I think I just wanted, I wanted to date someone. I wanted to have a boyfriend. I wanted all these things in my head I was like, were going to get me closer to this life that I knew I eventually wanted, but I didn't have. I think I was just insecure in that and I was looking for validation. And also, like, over the years, my weight fluctuated a lot. And I do feel like that was tied to my confidence in different seasons, like throughout high school and college. And I do feel like I have, I mean, I have a really healthy relationship with, like food now. I feel healthy and I'm so grateful for that. But when I look back, I think I just went into college. All of that to say, like, with a. I knew in my head all the things about Jesus and God and I was a Christian, but I think I just went in, still searching.

[Sadie Robertson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Grace Hackett]

And it led me into that lifestyle.

[Sadie Robertson]

That's so helpful, like what you said, still searching. Because I think that that's, that that's it. Like, you can go in a Christian, you can go in a believer. And this is not just for college. This is anything but. If you are not content with who you are in Christ. Like, and you. You will continue to search for what you can find in the world and how it can holes that you don't have. And that is what leads you other places. And I actually did a message on. I think it's in John 2. It's whenever John the Baptist sees Jesus and he's like, behold, like, this is the Messiah. Like, this is the one we've been waiting for. And then, you know, the disciples, like, start following Jesus in that moment.

[Caller]

I'm.

[Sadie Robertson]

I wish I had my Bible. Do I have my Bible? So somewhere. Okay. I can't botch this story. This is too good. Okay. Oh, wait, I think it's John 2. So it says, the next day, again, John was standing with two of his disciples, and he looked at Jesus as he walked by and said, behold the Lamb of God. The two disciples heard him say this, and they followed Jesus. Jesus turned, saw them following, and said to them, what are you seeking? And they said to him, rabbi, which means, teacher, where are you staying? And he said, come and you will see. And it says, one of the two who heard John speaking and followed Jesus was Andrew, Simon, Peter's brother. He found his own brother Simon and said, we have found the Messiah. And then it says, he brought him to Jesus. Jesus looked at him and said, you are Simon, son of John, and you will be called Peter. And I love this story so much because they see Jesus, they're like, this is the Lamb of God. They start following him. Jesus stops them and is like, what are you seeking? So it's like, let's establish, like, what are you looking for?

[Caller]

For?

[Sadie Robertson]

Then they, you know, say, rabbi, teacher, where are you saying, so it's like, we want to follow you. And then he says, one of the two heard and it says, they said, we have found the Messiah. So it proves, like, what they were looking for, because they said, we found him. Like, we found what we're looking for. And so then they're like, we were dropping everything and following him. Then as they start following him, he turns around and he tells them who he is, you're Peter. And, like, gives him his identity. And I think, like, that. That is such a pivotal moment in your life when you ask yourself, like, what am I looking for? And you identify, what am I actually searching for? Am I actually searching for love? Okay, am I really gonna find it in sleeping with this guy? Am I really gonna find it by getting this person's attention? Am I really gonna find it? No. So I'm gonna stop following that direction. Okay, what Am I seeking. Am I seeking peace? Am I really gonna find it by listening to true crime podcasts all day? No. Okay. That I should stop following that direction. It's like, okay, I found the Messiah. I found the one I'm looking for, the One who gives me love, the One who gives me joy, the One who gives me peace. So search is over. I'm following him, and then in following him, I know who I am. Like, he identifies you. You're Peter. This is who you are. This is what you're called to do. And then, of course, you see Peter's life completely change. He goes from being a fisherman to a fisherman of man. And he has purpose now in all that he does. And I'm like this. I love this passage. It's John 1, actually. Bless you, John 1:35. And I just think if you go read that and go follow Peter's story, it's like, such a good example of, like, what it looks like to go all in with Jesus, what it looks like to identify what you're searching for. And I think it's really important. I think intention, like, intentional questions to yourself, are really important to stop and go, like, what am I doing? Because I think we so often don't stop and, like, check in with ourselves. And that's when things spiral. Because, like, you look up and you don't even know why you did what you did. You're like, I don't even know why. I didn't actually even want that, you know? So it's like being intentional and asking yourself, like, why am I doing this? Why am I going here? Why are my friends with these people? Why am I continuing to go down this path? And am I really actually going to find it at the end of it? Or do I need to pivot in my relationship with Jesus? Because that's where I'm actually going to find it.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

So when you said that about the identity thing, I was like, and what you're searching for. I'm like, man, that reminds me, I did this message. I think it was my first message at Passion seven years ago, but it just was like, that's so it right there. That's so it. If you do this little, what am I looking for? Find it in Jesus. It. It really will change the way that you walk and you go into places. And, of course, that's not just college. That's life. You could be listening to this podcast, and you're 50 years old. That's life. It's just finding contentment in the Messiah.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah. And I think you can know truth. Like, I knew truth going to college. I just didn't put my confidence in it.

[Sadie Robertson]

Yep.

[Grace Hackett]

It's like. And so even if you believe in God and you know the truth, like, is your confidence in body image and how you look, is it in your relationship status and how much attention you're getting from boys and your friendships, like, there's so many other places you can put your identity. And I think that's where I was. Like, I knew truth, but my confidence, confidence wasn't in the truth of who God made me to be.

[Sadie Robertson]

That's really good. That's where a lot of people are. I mean, that's where I was for a long time. And I think that's when you ask yourself that question of like, is this ever going to satisfy me? Is it ever going to give me what I want? I did the same thing with body image and with eating and all that. And it's like, what am I doing that for? Is it for compliments from people? And it's like you get so in your head about, like, if people are going to comment on your body or if people are going to comment on your looks and then they do and it's so fleeting. Like, it's like, like, that doesn't change me. Yeah, it doesn't make me go, oh, now I'm loved, now I'm chosen. Now I, now I'm look great. It actually just feeds it more to like, want to do more, produce more, look better, all this stuff. And so it's so important that you stop and go, like, what am I, am I really going to find it in this? You know, tomorrow morning is knocking.

[Grace Hackett]

Stock your fridge now. How about a creamy mocha Frappuccino drink drink. Or a sweet vanilla smooth caramel maybe?

[Sadie Robertson]

Or white chocolate mocha. Whichever you choose. Delicious coffee awaits. Find Starbucks Frappuccino drinks wherever you buy your groceries. I think celebrity, like culture is a really good example of this in fame. Dr. Amen speaks to this a lot. He's been on the podcast several times. But he's like, he's been my personal doctor, has really helped me a lot. But he's also been the doctor to a lot of very well known celebrities and he helps people who got famous at a young age become. Because something happens to your brain where it's like, you know, you get dopamine hits by all these things, but then it's like that part of your brain becomes completely numb to it because it's like you've gotten so much of it that you actually stopped. Like, you don't feel it anymore. So then that leads people to like, drugs and alcohol is like, anything that they just want to, like, feel and experience. And that's like a really good example of, like, it's. It will never be enough. Like, there's never going to be enough followers for you to feel like, oh, I'm actually loved because this many people like me. Or there's never going to be, like, enough compliments or enough things. It's like, that just never can satisfy you, you know? And so that's why it's so important to stop and be like, what am I doing in this train of thinking with my body or this train of thinking with these people or whatever it is. Because I think you've seen in celebrities, how could they feel that way? They have all these things, things. But that just goes to show the things of the world can't satisfy the things of the soul. Like, we were created to be satisfied in the Lord alone, in the glory of God. So, man, so, so good. I just feel like so many people are listening to this. It's like if I heard this at 18, I wouldn't even know what to do with it because that was so where I was. But I think if you are 18 and you're listening to this and you're going, that's so where I am. It really is as simple as stopping right now, listening to this podcast, just stopping and just connecting with the Lord God. I don't want to continue to search for the things that I can only find in you. Help me to be satisfied in you alone and then call somebody. Don't just experience this alone. Like, Grace found Lauren and different friends and mentors and her mom. I know it was so close. Like, call your mom, call. Call your friend, call a mentor, call a pastor, a youth pastor, and like, talk this out. And don't let it just be done alone, because this is the start of walking with the Lord in a really beautiful way. This is such a good conversation. Shall we go to the next.

[Caller]

Hey, Cindy, I am a recent college graduate. I listened to you throughout college, watched all Duck Dynasty and I love that your episode sort of tailor to everyone, no matter what guests you have on. But I wanted to know a little bit about feeling lost about the season I'm in. I don't know exactly where God's leading me. I have a lot of dreams and goals and some opportunities in front of me, but I struggle with trusting the outcome in this. I feel like it's in Some ways embarrassing. I know it's not. But I just can't figure out how to surrender my future fully to God when I can't see what's ahead. So my question to you is, how do you. You know when to keep pushing towards something versus waiting and trusting? And how can you really feel discernment and know that versus anxiety? Thank you.

[Sadie Robertson]

That's a good question. I wish she was sitting right here because I want to be. Like, what part makes you feel embarrassed? Like, do you feel embarrassed that you're not where you wish you were? Do you feel embarrassed that you don't trust the Lord? Because I feel like that's such a common. Common. Like, I can relate to that feeling of feeling embarrassed. And a lot of times for me, it's like, maybe I feel embarrassed because I thought it was going to be better than it looks, you know, or whatnot. So I'm so intrigued by that aspect of the question, but also that idea of, like, when do you discern when it's just not working, you're supposed to give up? Or when do you keep plowing the ground? It's a great question.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah.

[Sadie Robertson]

What are your thoughts?

[Grace Hackett]

I said this to you the other night, but I think sometimes, like, if you. If you're trying to make an initial decision, it's easy to think, like, there is a right choice and there's a wrong choice, and God has a right choice for me and a wrong one, and it's up to me to figure out which one is which. And if I make the wrong choice, it's going to take me down a terrible path. And I was telling Sadie, our friend Sarah, we were at a women's conference that you spoke at in Franklin years and years ago, and there was a girl in our small group who was trying to figure out where God wanted her to go to college and what her next step was. And she was just like, I don't know which college God wants me to go to. And Sarah said something to the effect of, God gives us choice because he loves us. Like, he wants us to have choices. And he's not sitting up there saying, one choice is right and one choice is wrong. Like, a lot of times, both can be right if you're honoring God in whichever choice you make. And so that if you're making an initial decision would be, like, it might not be that there's one right and one wrong. It's just like, am I honoring God and am I seeking him in whichever direction I'm going to? And then I think for when to continue to pursue something. And like, how do you know? Discernment and peace? I think, to me, well, two things I'll say. One, one of the best books I've ever read is Walking with How to Hear His Voice by John Eldredge. Have you read that great book? And it's just really practical about, like, how. How to hear from the Lord and how to discern. And one of the things that he talks about, like an ex. That he does is that when he's trying to make a decision, he tries on different answers because he asked God about everything, like, should I go on this trip? He consults the Lord on every decision that he makes. And he talks about how when he's making decisions, he'll sit with one of the paths that he could take. Let's say, should I go on this trip? Yes, I'm going to go on this trip. And as he lets that play out, he thinks, am I getting worked up? Am I feeling anxious about it? Or do I feel complete peace? And then he tries on the other answer and, like, sits in that and sits with God and asks him, is this. What is this what I'm supposed to do? And then do. Do I feel anxious about it? Do I feel peace? And he said, a lot of times, like, one path, as I'm praying into it, will give me complete peace. And it's like, that's what the Lord says also. I think a lot of times people want to hear from the Lord, and so they're looking for him to tell them something or give them a sign. And it's like, we have a book, you know, like, he might not ride it in the sky in an airplane or, like, show you a bumblebee or whatever the thing is that you're looking for. But it's like, is the decision that I'm making gonna lead me to things that are life? And do they line up with what he tells me to do in scripture? And just using that kind of as your. Your compass, it's good.

[Sadie Robertson]

And I think sometimes we're too in the sky, like, totally. We're so looking for the sign that we're actually just not being practical. And I think. Think a lot of decisions are made out of logistics sometimes, you know, And I think that doesn't mean that the Lord's not in it. I think sometimes the Lord uses that to help, you know? You know, okay, this door is closing. This door is opening. One prayer we always pray is God, give us green lights if this is right. Give us a red light if this is wrong. Please don't give me yellow. Like, I don't want the. Like, I'm not sure. Like, either it's like, this is just opening or this is closing. And God has done that. Now there are times where I'm like, I'm not sure. Lord, Lord, is this you? Is this not? And I think what you said is true. I think that God is. God gives us free will. God allows us to make decisions, which is such an honor and a gift that God would entrust us with our life, you know, which is his. And just to go, okay, God, I think I want to do this. I want to pursue it. And then knowing that, like, if I walk through this door and that fails, that's not that I did it wrong or that's not that God wasn't in it, or that's not to overthink it in that. It's that I tried and I learned. And now I'll take what I learned from this and I'll step into it in a new way. I currently have something where I. I've started like a dream with something so long ago, I mean, like 10 years ago. I have tried to fulfill this and, and followed the Lord and listened to the Lord and it's a godly thing and it's a ministry driven thing. So many times, failed so many times still plowing the ground for it. Because I really believe in what I, what, what's on my heart to do. Also find a lot of, like, joy in it. I feel like it's so like something that the Lord put in me sometimes I've been like, okay, why isn't this working, Lord? You know, if it feels like such a good thing, like, why isn't. It's like, okay, I don't know the why, but I also know that I'm supposed to keep doing it and so I'll keep doing it. But if, like, family was dependent on that and like it wasn't working and you know, like, I was losing a bunch of money or it didn't make sense for anybody and like, then that would be different. I think that's when you got to go, okay, this actually might be the time to stop because it's putting everyone else in a bad place. It's not putting anybody in a bad place. You know, we're doing exactly what we need to do in other areas. But it is a dream of my heart. I'm going to continue to plow the ground for it because I actually believe in it. And we kind of talk about something similar that you're, you're doing. And it's like, I don't really know if it makes sense completely. There are some aspects of it at all makes sense. But I feel so wholeheartedly I'm supposed to do it and my husband's for it and my family's for it and my small group's for it. Well, then do it. You know, if everyone around you is going, hey, this doesn't make sense. You're putting me out. I don't think that you're doing it right, then that might be like the sign to go, okay, I'm not supposed to do this, you know, So I think that's good discernment. And it's like, okay, people around me say this is good. People around me say this is bad. And it's not just like people around you like noise. It's like your parents, your husband, your family, your small group, ones who love you and are for you. And I think letting them speak in goes a long way. It's kind of hard to answer this question in a tight knit answer because there's so many complexities. I'm thinking about so many different people who are listening with different ears. I don't want them to hear me say, keep going. And it's like everyone around them is going, we're trying to tell her to stop. You know, and so you got to listen to the people in your life give you some solid advice. I think we have one more. Who cares about your poops? Ollie does. That's why Ollie's science backed gut health lineup helps support your family's regularity. From daily probiotics to fiber gummies your kiddos will love. Find it all on ollie.com that's o l l y dot com. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.

[Caller]

Hi Sadie, this is Ellie. I am a college student who just finished up her first year and I've been listening to your podcast all throughout high school and it has just been so formative in my faith journey. So thank you. My question today is about this verse. As a father has compassion on his children, so the Lord has compassion on those who fear him. And I feel like I can really accept that part about how the Lord shows us grace and compassion. But that second part, what it means to fear of the Lord is something that I struggle having clarity on. And recently I just have been turning to distractions like social media, staying up way too late to the point Where I feel like it's almost addiction or burden in my life. And I really want to surrender that to the Lord. And I think having clarity on that verse would really help me with that. Thank you.

[Sadie Robertson]

It's really good. You want to speak into it?

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah. A couple thoughts. One, I just feel like there's such a misconception of what fear is when you fear God. Because it's. It's not anxiety or like, quaking in your boots over God. It's just a deep, deep reverence for who God is and his power and like, an awe of Him. And so I think. So when you read fear, like, I substitute that with bad. Yeah. But when I read it, I try to substitute it with, like, a deep respect and reverence and awe of who God is and what he's capable of and all that he's done. It's really good. Versus, like, I'm terrified of you. The other thing I was going to say on the side of scrolling and turning to your phone. We were laughing the other night because I just started the ruthless elimination of Hurry by John Mark Comer literally on the flight here, and I'm like 10 pages in. But literally one of the first things the book says is that the average person, Person grabs their phone or turns their. Touches their phone 2,600 times a day, which is nuts. And it was so crazy because even as I was reading on an airplane, like in airplane mode, with only my text messages enabled the whole time, it was like while I was reading, and I'm like, yeah, that tracks. Because I've gotten 10 text messages while I've been reading these 10 pages, and my instinct is just to pause what I'm doing and touch it or pick it up. But I mean, I've heard great things about this book, so maybe reading that could be helpful. But to me, I was just like, man, how quick or we to numb with that. When we were talking earlier about, like, searching, I. I think an easy place for anybody, whether you're a mom or in college. Like, your phone is a place that people go to, like, numb out or escape. But in reality, it. It just adds more stimulation to your life. And so it's so interesting that the place that we go to escape and numb out is actually causing us more stress, anxiety stimulation. But I thought that 2,600 number was crazy. And already just reading it, I'm like, man, the whole premise of the book is cutting out hurry in your life and cutting out, like, having so much to do and always being stimulated. And that's something that I'm trying to apply in my own life right now.

[Sadie Robertson]

I was thinking about this verse because she was talking about her phone. Speaking of a million times. I took it off airplane to look that up. Um, she was talking about, like, it feels like it's becoming an addiction. And I felt that so many times in my life with, like, whether it's social media or just my phone in general. And I feel like in those times, I'm responsible to, like, delete the app or, like, change my screen time or be more disciplined. And it's on me to know whenever that is, like, teetering the line of almost like idolatry, you know, of, like, idolizing an app or being distracted or even an addiction. And I love this verse because it's so hard helpful in times like this. But it's James 4:17. It says, so whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it for him, it is a sin. And I. I go back to that a lot because people ask, like, okay, well, is this okay or is it not okay? Or this is a gray area in scripture. This is that. And it's like, yes, there are, like, gray areas at times in scripture, but the Holy Spirit is in you to convict. And if the Holy Spirit is convicting you and you are disobedient to the conviction of the spir Spirit, for you, that's a sin. Now I can stay up on my phone till midnight. It might not be a sin.

[Grace Hackett]

You.

[Sadie Robertson]

It might be because the Lord's convicting you with something saying, hey, you're addicted. You need to take time off. And if you're unwilling to, like, lay it aside and delete it. I think one that is a lack of fear of the Lord. Back to the question. Back to going to, like, okay, do I fear you enough, Lord? Not fear. And I'm afraid fear. And I respect you enough. I love you enough. I trust your voice to go, I'm going to delete this. It's something I love. It's something I cling to. But I trust you more than this thing. I fear you more out of respect and love and reverence than I do this thing. And then it's deleting it and taking time with the Lord to get your heart right, and then going back to it in a healthier place. And then if it becomes a pattern again, delete it. Same book in James. But it says. It says, then desire, when it has conceived, gives birth to sin, and sin, when it is fully grown, brings forth death. And I always think about that. Too. Because there's like a pattern to sin almost. It's like it starts small, it's conceived and then it brings like gives birth to death. And I was thinking about like as someone who's like been pregnant and it's like there's a nine month period and it's like some of those things start really small. It's like, oh, I'm just on my phone scrolling TikTok like everybody else is does. Well, then nine months later you're doing the same thing. And now you're anxious, you've seen things you shouldn't have seen, you're following people you shouldn't follow. You've compared yourself so much and all of a sudden what started as this little thing that was conceived now is producing out of me insecurity, it's producing out of me anxiety, it's producing out of me. I haven't prayed in nine months because I've just been watching Tik Tok. I haven't met with the Lord. That was a, a sermon Ben Stewart preached that I love so much about our phones. And he was talking about how we've lost our all because you can't be in awe of something when you're distracted. And it's like, if I'm constantly checking my phone, like, how can I be in like awe of the glory of God? Like, how can I be in the presence of the Lord? And in the presence of the Lord is where you gain the fear of the Lord, the reverence of the Lord, the respect of the Lord, because you, you see the Lord, you know. And so I think a lot of our lack of fear is our lack of reverence, our lack of, lack of knowing God. But fear of the Lord is so important because I think the fear of the Lord helps you with your decision making, helps you stay confident in where, who you are, where you're at. I mean, for me, if it's like fear the Lord, fear a man. If I didn't fear the Lord, I would crumble to the opinion of man every single day on social media, on through podcasting. I would not say the things I say. I would not lean into the things I lean into because I'd be like, oh, people are not going to like that, or that's not going to be very popular or whatever. But because I fear the Lord, I can walk in the path the Lord has laid for me. So I think this is a really important conversation because I think fear of the Lord is a essential part of a walk with the Lord. But I do think you're right that when we hear fear, we associate it with negative things and we go, what? I shouldn't be afraid? It's not fear and you're scared. Like the verse says, there's compassion and there's grace. It's fear. And that you just like the awe struck wonder of God. And that changes everything about your walk with God.

[Grace Hackett]

Yeah, there's a verse too, in Proverbs. It's Proverbs 24:12. And it says, once our eyes have been open, we can't pretend we don't know what to do. For God, who weighs our hearts and keeps our souls, knows that we know and holds us responsible to act. Literally. Been one of my favorite verses throughout my life.

[Sadie Robertson]

That is great. 24. That was so good. Say it again.

[Grace Hackett]

It says, once our eyes have been open, we can't pretend we don't know what to do. For God, who weighs our hearts and keeps our souls, knows that we know and holds us responsible to act. And that applies, I think, for things you're convicted to and convicted about and things you're called to, you know, like he could be convicting you to put your phone up. He knows, knows that you. He knows that you're convicted because he convicted you. And then he holds you responsible to act. Same as if he calls you to something. It's like he weighs your heart and keeps your soul. He knows that you know, and he holds you responsible to act.

[Sadie Robertson]

Great. Oh, that was so good. That's a good one to end on. This is a Bible study, and I love it. Thanks, Grace, for coming on the podcast, for answering great questions and being a great friend, of course.

[Caller]

Awesome.

[Sadie Robertson]

Okay, we're back. We are so back. We had to come back because I left out a crucial question. Grace, what's the best piece of advice you've ever been given?

[Grace Hackett]

Well, we were laughing because literally, when you asked Miller Ann to come on the podcast, I said, what are you gonna say for the best piece of advice you've been given? And she said, I'm gonna give the advice that you gave me, which is don't take criticism from someone you wouldn't take advice from. And as soon as she said it, I was like, ooh, that would have been mine. And I don't know who told me that, but, um, thankfully I've had a little bit of time to think about it, and the one that I've landed on, it's so hard to pick, like, a best piece, but something we say a lot is clear, is kind.

[Sadie Robertson]

Yes.

[Grace Hackett]

And I would add to that, like. And I think you can be clear and kind. And I was thinking. As I was thinking about it, I had this flashback. And you might not even remember this, but there was one Sunday when y'.

[Caller]

All.

[Grace Hackett]

I think it was when you were living in Nashville, or maybe it was you were back visiting, but we were at church at tbco, and y' all were there, and there was a girl that I think maybe y' all had hung out with that weekend who was also at church, and we had lunch plans afterwards, and this girl came up and was talking to us, and I was like. She said, what are y' all doing after this? And I was like, well, we're getting lunch. And kind of out of just, like, obligation, I was like, you're welcome to join. And in my heart of hearts, I was looking forward to just getting lunch, the four of us, like, me, you, Davey, and Christian. But I just felt kind of obligated in that moment to invite her, which. Not that inviting people to do things is bad, but you reached out to her after and said, like, hey, we have really been looking forward to just having time as couples with the Hacketts. We love you. We were so glad to see you this weekend, but we're just gonna go to lunch with them. We'll catch up next time I'm in town. And honestly, I was like, wow,

[Sadie Robertson]

What? But that is funny.

[Grace Hackett]

But it was so good because you said it in such a loving way that it really stuck out to me because. Because I'm like, why? I feel the same way. Like, I wanted to get lunch, the four of us, so why did I say you should come? I mean, obviously, you can do things like that to be kind, But I just loved the way that you handled it. And you were, like, so clear. But you were so kind in the way that you did it. And I just think that advice, like, clear is kind, and you can be clear and kind spans across all situations. Like in your marriage. I remember we went to dinner with some friends, and she was. She was like, if I like, it means a lot to me when my husband tells me that I look pretty. Like, my love language is words of affirmation, which is mine, too. She was like, but I can't always just expect him to say what I want him to hear. Like, I have to be clear and communicate so literally. Sometimes I'll even be like, if you think I look pretty, will you tell me that I look pretty tonight? And that stuck out to me. Or, like, in friendships, being clear, in your communication, in your workplace being Clear in your communication. Because if you're not clear and you don't. If you're not clear, it leads to resentment. It.

[Sadie Robertson]

Yeah.

[Grace Hackett]

And if you're not kind, it leads to friction in the conversation. So I'm like, clear is kind, and you can be clear and kind.

[Sadie Robertson]

That is so good. I actually. That's so funny that you reminded me of that story, because I don't necessarily remember that, but I. I do. I can see me doing that, but Because I always say that. I'll always say clear is kind, and kind is clear. And I think that it is so important to be clear with people, and it's the kindest thing you can do, because it is the worst to me when you find out someone was not clear to you, and then you find out, like, they said all this stuff behind your back, and I'm like, why don't just tell me? I would have just loved so much more if you just would have told me face to face. I stand by that. And sometimes that makes for hard conversations because it's like, to be clear, I have to be honest. But at the same time, like, I can do that, Lace, and, like, so much kindness and genuinely mean it. And I think, like, I've seen people do that for me in my life, and I'm, like, so grateful every time. You're like, thank you so much for just telling me. And that totally makes sense. Or that's cool. And so. So that's cool that you brought that up, because I stand by that. We say that in our office all the time. Like, there's kindness, clear. Me and Steph say that to each other all the time. So that's why I love that.