Ben Sasse’s Dying Regrets + Todd Exposes The AI Pastor Problem

Summary

Wretched Radio with Todd Friel

Episode: Ben Sasse’s Dying Regrets + Todd Exposes the AI Pastor Problem
Date: May 19, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Wretched Radio centers on reflections about dying well with former Senator Ben Sasse, who discusses his terminal cancer diagnosis and deep, practical theology regarding death, suffering, and priorities. Todd Friel dissects lessons gleaned from Sasse’s recent high-profile interviews, tying them to Christian doctrines about God’s sovereignty, family, and priorities in life. The episode pivots sharply in the second half to examine challenges in contemporary Christianity, especially the misuse of AI in pastoral work and shifts in ministry focus, illustrated by various viral clips and controversies.

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Major Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dying with Dignity: Ben Sasse’s Reflections

(Main segment: 00:44 - 13:35, 15:03 - 26:01)

• Scott Pelley’s 60 Minutes Interview (01:17, 03:31)

  • Ben Sasse addresses death with theology, not despair.
    • Ben Sasse [03:31]:
      “Death is wicked. Death is evil. Death is not how it’s supposed to be. And me getting a cancer diagnosis, again, is pretty small on the grand scheme of things.”
    • Sasse demonstrates assurance and tranquility, rooted in his Christian understanding of God’s sovereignty even in suffering.
  • Todd Friel [04:49]:
    “I’m just staggered by this... I’m not the center of everything. I’m not even close to the center. Jesus is.”
  • Sasse recounts the humbling pain and how it “forces me to tell the truth,” shattering his illusion of self-sufficiency.
    • Sasse [04:35]:
      “It’s a touch of grace because it forces me to tell the truth. And the lie I want to tell myself is that I’m the center of everything.”

• On Gratitude in Suffering (06:26, 07:32)

  • Describes the physical suffering, being brought closer to God through recognized dependence.
    • Sasse [07:32]:
      “Because I can acknowledge my dependence in a new way.”

• Regrets and True Priorities (07:47, 10:12, 11:05)

  • If he had more time: more children and closer family connections.
    • Sasse [07:47]:
      “I wish we’d had more babies. We have three great kids. I wish we had four or five.”
    • Sasse [07:59]:
      “How do you build something where you can have different generations come and go from it and have a thickness and a support system?”
  • Career regrets: too much time traveling for work, not enough at home.
    • Sasse [10:43]:
      “I never really threw away any of my hotel keys… There are thousands… Sometimes I just look at it and feel a heaviness of regret.”

• Todd’s Takeaway for Listeners (10:26, 15:03)

  • Encouragements, especially to younger generations: trust those with perspective—marriage, children, and presence are the sweetest gifts; don’t believe the culture’s lies.
    • Friel [10:26]:
      “Sure, he made a lot of money… but now he’s looking back and going, I wouldn’t trade that now for family time. I wouldn’t trade it for money…”

• Expanding on “Dying Well” (15:03)

  • Christian history’s emphasis on dying well—not with fear but with hope and anticipation of eternity.
    • Friel [15:03]:
      “For the Christian, it is the best day of our lives because we pass from this sinful side of eternity into the side where there is no more sin, no more sorrow, no more tears, no more cancer…”

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2. Sasse on Digital Dangers and the Coming Divide

(20:01 - 23:26)

• Predicts a societal split between those who harness digital tools and those who outsource their attention and identity to them—a crisis for human flourishing.

  • Sasse [20:01]:
    “…the great coming divide is gonna be between people who figure out how to use these tools and people who outsource their attention and their affections and their habits to these tools. And it’s gonna be disastrous for the latter category.”

• Todd Friel links this insight to an article about AI relationships, warning of their emptiness and artificiality.

• Sasse’s Solution:

  • Sasse [23:27]:
    “We need a communal conversation about how you use the technology instead of letting the technology use us.”
  • Todd is skeptical this will happen on a societal level, emphasizing churches and families must take the lead.

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3. Viral Clips: Critiques & Analysis

(29:31 - 40:10)

a. Modern Ministry Drift – Vanderbilt Divinity Graduates

• Focus on ministries centered on self-actualization, identity, and even “equine spiritual care,” highlighting the absence of the Gospel and biblical priorities.
• Todd skewers these trends as indicators of deep confusion and worldliness in seminary education.

b. AI in Pastoral Contexts: Exposing the Danger

(43:52 - 53:15)

• Todd demonstrates using AI to generate a homily on suffering from 1 Peter 1, acknowledging the content is solid but lacks spiritual power, personal learning, and true shepherding.
  • Friel [44:06]:
    “I asked the AI machine to write a one minute radio introduction … There is nothing in here that I would see a need to change. Now I know that this is really framed well because I’ve been buried in First Peter one now for a couple of months. Nothing is wrong. In fact, it’s done really well. But how would you feel if all I did was read AI?”
  • Warns: If pastors leave entire sermon prep and counseling to AI, they stunt their own sanctification, become mere actors, and the flock gets mere performance rather than shepherding.
    • Friel [51:11]:
      “It means nothing to me because I haven’t wrestled with the text. And the pastor that does nothing but get trained to train AI is not going to wrestle with the text, and that text, therefore, is not going to have the impact on him. The text is going to be dead letter.”
  • Laments the loss of genuine, Spirit-driven care.
    • Friel [53:15]:
      “But I do fear that if pastors become nothing but programmers and presenters, we’re going to lose the warm, shepherding nature of being a pastor.”

c. Abortion, “Inclusivity,” and Confused Preaching

• Todd reacts to a viral video of someone treating abortion as a “gender reveal party,” noting the explicit admission of guilt.
• Critiques “pastrix” (female pastor) for misrepresenting John 14:6 and the exclusive claims of Christ.
  • Pastor or Theologian [37:59]:
    “Jesus did not come into this world to preach and to teach a my way or the highway kind of religion.”
  • Friel [38:49]:
    “Except for the verse that you just cited.”

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• Ben Sasse on death and perspective:
  • [03:31] “Death is wicked. Death is evil. Death is not how it's supposed to be...”
  • [04:35] “It’s a touch of grace because it forces me to tell the truth. And the lie I want to tell myself is that I’m the center of everything.”
  • [07:47] “I wish we’d had more babies. We have three great kids. I wish we had four or five.”
• Todd Friel’s challenge:
  • [10:26] “He made a lot of money, but… he wouldn’t trade that now for family time. I wouldn’t trade it for money.”
• AI and the future of ministry:
  • [44:06] “Have you ever noticed how quickly we label suffering as a problem to be solved rather than a gift to be understood?... I asked the AI machine to write… There is nothing in here I would need to change.”
  • [51:11] “I made it my own. Means nothing to me because I haven’t wrestled with the text...”
• Pastoral warning:
  • [53:15] “…if pastors become nothing but programmers and presenters, we’re going to lose the warm, shepherding nature of being a pastor.”

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & God’s unconditional love debate: 00:07 – 00:44
• Ben Sasse on dying and living well: 00:44 – 13:35, continues at 15:03 – 19:31
• Priorities and family, regrets about work: 10:12 – 11:05
• Sasse on AI and digital distraction: 20:01 – 23:54
• Death, marriage, the culture’s lies: 15:03 – 20:01 (threaded throughout with Sasse’s reflections)
• Vanderbilt Divinity, ministry drift: 30:23 – 32:27
• Abortion, apostate ministry clips: 32:29 – 40:10
• Todd’s AI sermon and pastor warning: 43:52 – 53:15

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Notable “Judge the Clip” Segments (29:31 – 40:10)

• Vanderbilt Divinity self-focused ministry:
  • “My ministry is visual arts… My ministry is equine-facilitated spiritual care…”
• Abortion TikTok:
  • “Thank you, Jesus. We got one dry killing… Yeah, I killed my baby.”
• Pastrix on Jesus being “the way”:
  • “Jesus did not come into this world to preach and to teach a my way or the highway kind of religion.”

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Tone and Language

• Throughout, Todd Friel maintains a direct, sometimes satirical, sometimes deeply serious tone. Language is accessible, but pointed, often punctuated with rhetorical questions and asides meant to challenge listeners (especially younger Christians).
• Ben Sasse’s segments are sober, philosophical, nuanced, and theologically rich, speaking frankly about mortality, regret, grace, and the joy that persists through suffering.

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Summary for Listeners

This episode delivers a thoughtful, theologically robust meditation on death, life, suffering, and priorities in a culture obsessed with self-fulfillment and technology. Ben Sasse models “Bible Christianity” by honestly facing terminal illness while pointing to the sufficiency of Christ and the importance of family. Todd warns of creeping spiritual dangers—both from secular culture (abortion, diluted ministry) and inside the church (AI-generated pastoral work)—urging Christians to hold onto rich, historic, and scripturally grounded faith in all seasons.

If you missed this episode, you missed:

• A moving Christian meditation on dying well.
• A critique of tech culture’s threats to discipleship.
• A prophetic warning against AI-driven, impersonal ministry.
• Real talk about what matters in life and eternity—from someone facing the end.
• Satirical, pointed commentary on modern ministry confusion and culture’s deep lostness.

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Ending challenge (Todd Friel [53:15]):
“If pastors become nothing but programmers and presenters, we’re going to lose the warm, shepherding nature of being a pastor.”

Transcript

[Todd Friel]

Wretched radio begins in 3, 2, 1.

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[Caller or Listener]

That's great because I love me, too.

[Pastor or Theologian]

Live in the freedom that God loves you unconditionally and he loves you unconditionally.

[Todd Friel]

God's love for you is unconditional. Preaching that God loves you unconditionally is the wrong message. God has a good will towards everybody, believers and non believers. But there is another love reserved only for those who embrace the Gospel and put their trust in Jesus as Lord and Savior.

It's time for Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

This is normally a very good question, considering it was asked by 60 Minutes makes it an amazing question.

[Interviewer or Host]

You are completely devoted to your faith, what's known as Reformed Christianity or Calvinism. And one of the tenets of that faith is that God ordains everything. And I wonder why you think God has put you to this test.

[Todd Friel]

This is Wretched Radio. That was Scott Pelley of 60 Minutes interviewing former Senator Ben Sasse, who is dying thanks to a miracle drug. The miracle, of course, is God behind the drug. His life is being extended and yet he has terminal cancer. And this brave believer has been making the rounds to demonstrate how one can die with dignity. In Canada, the Netherlands, they call it death with dignity, where you take your own life. No, Mensas isn't doing that. Instead, he is letting the cancer ultimately take its course and demonstrating how how one can die with dignity, as unpleasant as it might be. Don't know if you saw the 60 Minutes interview. His face, it looks like he had some goggles on and he was in the suntan booth way too long. His face is burned from the medication. Has it been easy? No, of course it hasn't. Is it going to likely become more difficult? Most likely it is. Is he going to have death with dignity? No, he's going to die with dignity. And he has been giving speeches and interviews demonstrating he has a very robust theology regarding sovereignty, that God is good, he is able, he is faithful, and he is totally in control. There is nothing that catches him by surprise, even when a former US Senator gets cancer. Now. Don't know if you've seen the 60 Minutes interview. It's fascinating body language going on. Ben is very confidently relaxed. Can those two words go together? He's quite like settled and he's kind of almost slouched back a little bit. Not casually, but assuredly. Scott Peli, I don't know if you could hear it in his voice, kind of quavering. He seems to be rather emotional about this aspect of the interview because it's dealing with the subject of death. Listen carefully as we receive a masterclass from Ben Sasse on dying with dignity.

[Ben Sasse]

Death is wicked. Death is evil. Death is not how it's supposed to be. And me getting a cancer diagnosis, again is pretty small on the grand scheme of things.

[Todd Friel]

Wow. Wow. Is there anything more precious to you than your life? And yet, even as his has been given an expiration date, his recognition that we are, what, but a vapor? We're a blip. We're here today, we're gone tomorrow. And in the grand scheme of things, our lives, they are very insignificant to possess that knowledge, especially when you are facing your own death. That only comes from years of studying the attributes of God, who he is, what he is, doing, the great things that God is doing, and that we are so puny, we are so finite.

[Ben Sasse]

But it's a touch of grace because it forces me to tell the truth. And the lie I want to tell myself is that I'm the center of everything.

[Todd Friel]

I'm just staggered by this. I think he knew this before he was diagnosed with cancer. I'm not the center of everything. I'm not even close to the center. Jesus is.

[Ben Sasse]

And I'm going to be around forever. And I can work harder and store up enough that I can atone for my own brokenness. I can't. And so I hate cancer. But I'm also grateful for it. I tell a lot more truth to myself than I used to do it when I thought I was super omni competent and interesting. Tim Keller was a pastor in New York City. He's in my denomination, and he died of pancreatic cancer a couple years ago. And he had a line. He said, I hate pancreatic cancer. I would never wish it on anybody. But I also would never want to go back to a time in life where I didn't know the prayer of pancreatic cancer. And I feel that to be true. I started being symptomatic the last couple weeks of October.

[Todd Friel]

Sorry to interrupt. I'm looking at Scott Pelly. He's gripped by this. He's gripped by this. This is an encouragement to you, dear Pastor. People can be profoundly interested in theology. What Ben is describing, this isn't baby Christianity. This is Bible Christianity. And I'm telling you, Scott Pelley, he's on the edge of his seat.

[Ben Sasse]

I wasn't diagnosed until mid December. We had trouble figuring out what was going on because I was training for some sprint triathlons and I was doing some stupid stuff in my training and so I thought I'd pulled a bunch of muscles in my abdomen. I was in really bad pain for a number of weeks. I'm now on a lot of morphine and I've also got the benefit of this drug which is, you know, scare quotes. But miraculously reduced my tumor volume enough that I have a lot less tumor pressure on my spine. So the combination of a great drug and morphine, another useful drug. I'm in so much less pain now than I was Halloween to Thanksgiving. But at that point I was on the floor in the shower running the water, trying to remove a valve on my shower to make it hotter. I'd be five times a night up in the middle of the night in the shower trying to scald my back to try to make the throbbing of what turned out to be tumors pushing on my spine cease. It was horrible. I'm super grateful that I had that pain.

[Interviewer or Host]

Cancer has made you closer to God, definitely.

[Ben Sasse]

Because I can acknowledge my dependence in a new way.

[Todd Friel]

He doesn't know what to say. He just does not know how to deal with this.

[Interviewer or Host]

Had another 30 years, what would your priority be?

[Ben Sasse]

I wish we'd had more babies. We have three great kids. I wish we had four or five.

[Todd Friel]

Young person. Did you hear that? Take heed.

[Ben Sasse]

If I had 30 years left from now, I'd be working hard to take my zealous achiever daughters and try to figure out how you build something that's a little bit like a family compound. How do you build something where you can have different generations come and go from it and have a thickness and a support system? How could you spend more time around your cousins or build the opportunity for your kids and your grandkids to spend more time around their cousins?

[Todd Friel]

Fascinating. What's a priority when you're facing death? Family. Making more babies, those are the big things, the rich things of life. If you're in the generation that has been informed, marriage is terrible. Babies are terrifying. You've been lied to. Trust a man who is. And got less sand on the top of his hourglass than he has on the bottom. And what is important to him? He was trying to figure out, oh, I wish that we could have all. We'd just live together, stay close to one another, be a part of each other's lives. With how many people can you say that? If you're Gen Z, Gen X, how many people would you like to live in a compound with? And yet this man, who is clearly not a dumb, dumb, a university president, former U.S. senator. He's not stupid. He's looking back and going, that would have made life even sweeter. Trust him. He understands the sweet things of life. It's family, it's children, it's being together. He wants that with his kids. Who would you like to. You can choose anybody that you get to really lock up with by living close to. Who would you name? And do you think that you'd want to be living next to him in five months? Five years, 15 years? It's family. It's only family. It's always family. That's who you want to be closest with. Trust this man. His priorities are better than the world's.

[Ben Sasse]

I would travel a little bit less for work. I have kind of three different work histories, but one of them was, I was a road warrior as a strategy consultant and private equity guy for a while, and I spent way too many nights in hotel rooms.

[Todd Friel]

Take it from this man, priority. Sure, he made a lot of money, but he did. Now he's looking back and going, I wouldn't trade that now for family time. I wouldn't trade it for money. I'd like more family time.

[Ben Sasse]

I don't know if my family even knows this, but I never really threw away any of my hotel keys. I'd come back from every trip and I threw them in a boat box in a closet in my office. And there are thousands and thousands of hotel room keys. And sometimes I just look at it and feel a heaviness of regret.

[Todd Friel]

Lessons from a man who is dying. Well, sir, in light of the fact you do have to provide for your family, having heard about the number of hotel keys that Ben Sasse currently possesses and regrets owning, do you need to make any priority changes in your life? We'll continue dying with dignity. Courtesy of Ben Sasse. Next on Wretched Radio.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

No Retreat. That's the name of Fortis Institute's Spring Match campaign, and here's why. The culture we live in right now has made it pretty clear it has very little interest in the true gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. We're being told to keep our faith quiet in public or to soften what we believe so it goes down easier. Fortis Institute has no intention of doing either one. We exist to advance the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, and this spring, we're doing it as loudly and as boldly as we know how. Your gift will help launch two new podcasts. It puts Todd Friel's new book, Go Serve youe King, into print through HarperCollins, and it puts the gospel back onto college campuses where it's least welcome and most needed. Our goal is $250,000, and we're asking if you would prayerfully consider helping us get there. You can find out more right [e-mail] donate

[Todd Friel]

perhaps you've been wondering, is there a Christian university that isn't woke or that hasn't compromised on important biblical doctrines like, you know, the Age of the Earth? There is. It's the Master's University in Southern California. Beautiful campus. All of the athletics and activities that you've come to expect from universities. But it's more than that. The academic programs are most excellent. Preparing students for the future. The Washington Post just said number six for preparing students for the real world. All that plus the Master's University isn't woke and it is thoroughly biblical. Would you like to learn more? I encourage you to visit the Master's university at masters.edu wretched masters edu Wretched

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

There's a lot of Christian content out there that sounds deep, but it actually isn't. It's inspirational. It's nice, but it doesn't actually help you when life gets hard. Fortis forums are completely different. We're talking about how to comfort someone who's grieving and what scripture actually says, not just what sounds nice. We're talking about marriage when things aren't easy, and mental health and whether the Bible has real answers. Biblical manhood for a generation that's never been really given a model to follow. These are in depth conversations with people like Dr. Jason Lyle, Libby Gloss and Dr. Adam Tyson and Dr. Jon Kratz, teachers who take the Bible seriously and don't shy away from the hard topics. These Fortis forums are all on Fortis for you to watch right now for free, and they're ready when you are. Just download the app wherever you download apps on your smartphone, your smart TV. Or just simply go to fortisplus.org and see what biblical depth actually looks like.

[Todd Friel]

Important Dates in Christian history 1545 the Council of Trent opens, called by the Roman Catholic Church in response to the Reformation. It addressed abuses in the Catholic Church and further entrenched dogmas concerning the authority of the Pope, the need for works in salvation and and the saving nature of the Mass. This is Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

Are you prepared to die with dignity? This is Wretched Radio. You don't have to search very high in the tomes of the Puritans to discover a phrase dying well. They spoke of the subject often that A Christian can prepare him or herself to die well, to not be terrified, kicking and screaming, panicking and sobbing because of everything that you're leaving behind. Oh, sure, they acknowledge there is some sadness in death, but for the Christian, it is the best day of our lives because we pass from this sinful side of eternity into the side where there is no more sin, no more sorrow, no more tears, no more cancer, no more backaches, no more pain, no more acrimony. It's our eternal rest. And who of us doesn't like rest? If you like naps, you should love the day you're gonna die because you begin your eternal rest. Ben Sasse is about to do that. Now. It appears that the drug that he is taking to fight off the cancer, it is having a good effect on him. His life is being extended, and yet it's still imminent. It's not going to last forever. Now, unless they find something else that could certainly happen, and we hope it is. He admitted in his interview on 60 Minutes he's still praying for a miracle. And that is right to do. You can certainly do that. And yet this is a man who did not arrive at this moment unprepared. You don't talk the way that he does without having spent time in your life being ready to die. Now, that doesn't mean that you have some sort of maudlin obsession with just death. Death? I'm thinking about death. No, but you're preparing for that death. Every time you study the Bible, you're preparing for that death. Every time you go to church, you're preparing for that death date. Every time that you pray, you're preparing for that death date. Now, that's when you're not thinking about it. There are times when you can think about it. What is the prayer of the psalmist? Teach us, Lord, to number our days. That's a part of dying. Well, how do I use these days before I have none left? And how will I do when I am surrounded by loved ones? I hope you will be. When you're surrounded by loved ones, what is that going to look like? Will you be at peace? Like a river attending your way? Will you be calm? Will you be expectant? Will you be looking forward to it as you know it is eminent, if you will? It's the last great adventure. Dying and being greeted by your savior and welcomed into his presence for forever. Are you preparing to die with dignity? Ben Sasse on 60 Minutes Again, I'm looking at Scott Pelley here who did the interview. He's smitten with Ben Sasse. I'm not sure he's ever met a Ben Sasse before, nor perhaps he's been interested in Christian things as of late. But he is gripped by what Ben Sasse is saying regarding his priorities. Oh, if I could go back and do it again, I'd travel less, I'd be with my family more. Oh, if I could do it again, we'd make more babies. And he's married happily. This is a shout out to the younger generations who have been lied to about marriage and childbearing. It is magnificent. And he regrets the times that he missed with his wife and children because they are better than money. They're better than money. They're better than any possession. They're sweeter, they're richer, they're deeper, more profound, more intimate than anything you can ever obtain in the world. Ben Sasse giving us a lesson in dying with dignity.

[Ben Sasse]

I would make better decisions about that. If I had another act at a work level. I think I might pursue my long term dream of being a football coach. Dad was a football coach and he was dang good at it. What a chance to mold young men.

[Todd Friel]

Isn't that interesting? That's his desire. Football can be used. That was the original reason football was invented, to mold young men. So he'd like to do that. I'm sure he'd enjoy the coaching, but it's to impact the lives of others. That's now on his priority list. That should be noted. Doing things for others is richer than doing things for self. Hey, I think the Bible talks about

[Ben Sasse]

that, but I mean, I would continue to think and write about the digital revolution that we're entering and going to pass through because I think we come out on the other side richer and more textured. But it's going to be a big bifurcation. We talk a lot in our politics about socioeconomic difference. I think the great coming divide is gonna be between people who figure out how to use these tools and people who outsource their attention and their affections and their habits to these tools. And it's gonna be disastrous for the latter category. And I want that ladder category to be small.

[Todd Friel]

I hold in my never before nicotine stain fingers. Best self magazine. Don't ask how I got it. A friend gave it to me. It's called your best self and the ads are everything you'd expect. Well, here I'm opening it up. This looks sweet. This is Happy New Year's. Be filled with wellness, peace and prosperity from a It's a spa and then the next full page ad is from Atlanta. Smiles, turn the page. Say hello to thicker, fuller hair. Here's the next article or the next ad. Dermatology specialist. And of course you've got Atlanta Divorce Law Group. Oh, another full page ad for a salon. I wonder how they define your best life now. It's an entire article dedicated to AI and those people who are using it for relationships. Ben Sasse is onto something here. He realizes that people are using AI for relationships. And inside of the article, it actually tries to defend the benefits of having a real emotional relationship with AI. That's me. Like me. This bottle of water right here. Oh, wait, that's not the crinkly one. It's not open. I have a relationship with this bottle of water. It agitates me. That's a relationship. And you go, well, you can't have a relationship with something that's inanimate. Exactly. With the AI machine. And it talks about how to go about the business of using it really well because it offers a low risk of rejection, low risk of being misrepresented, low risk of someone completely disappearing in a dating culture shamed by ghosting and emotional whiplash. Yeah, safer. Fine. We'll grant you safety, depth, hate, profoundness. Not a chance. Real. Not even close. And yet, as this article points out, millions are already having a relationship with their AI machine. Ben Sasse. He's concerned.

[Ben Sasse]

I want all Americans to benefit from some of the glories that we're going to get out of the digital revolution. But the idea that you could outsource your attention and your affections and your habits to these things is disastrous. A casino might be a fun place to go for March Madness weekend, but it would be a hellacious place to live. And we're all walking around with casinos in our pockets right now and they want to steal our attention and reduce our humanity. And I think we need to have a big shared project where we lock arms.

[Todd Friel]

Not gonna happen.

[Ben Sasse]

Governmental or regulatory problem. Project chiefly. But we need a communal conversation about how you use the technology instead of letting the technology use us.

[Todd Friel]

Doubt that's going to happen. Like the idea. Doubt it. But nevertheless, we should heed the warning from Ben Sasse. If the world isn't going to talk about it, we're not going to have a social conversation. We should be having it in the church and we should be having it in our homes.

[Interviewer or Host]

I make no comparison to what you're going through, but there was a moment on 911 at the World Trade center that I knew I was dead. And in that lightning flash of an instant, the only thing that crossed my

[Ben Sasse]

mind

[Interviewer or Host]

was leaving my family behind. And I wonder how you reconcile that.

[Ben Sasse]

Yeah, I'm incredibly blessed. My wife Melissa has. We've been married 31 years. I. We're gonna be apart for a time, but she's tough and gritty and theologically rooted and she's gonna be fine. My daughters are 24 and 22 and they're extraordinary. I want to walk them down the aisle when they get married. That's not likely to be. That's not the math of my time card. My son, we have a providential surprise. He's a decade younger than big sisters. He's 14 and he's going to be fine. He'll have other, other wise men and women to put a hand on his shoulder. But I'm super bummed to not be there. At 16 and 18 and 20 years old in his life, I want to give him more advice than he wants and I want to put my arm on his shoulder. Dude, I want his shoulders to get taller. But it's not a surprise to God.

[Interviewer or Host]

And God you believe has a plan?

[Ben Sasse]

Absolutely. There are no maverick molecules in the

[Todd Friel]

universe dying with dignity. This is Wretched Radio.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

And it's now time for your daily

[Jimmy Hicks]

Fortis news break, a production of Fortis Institute. Former Kansas senator and religious freedom ambassador Sam Brownback has a pretty stark message about China. He says if you believe in God, the Chinese Communist Party wants you dead. In his new book, Brownback documents how Beijing's war on faith has escalated. Under director Xi Jinping, Christians are being forced to replace pictures of Jesus with portraits of Xi. Brownback notes that the CCP has killed more of its own people than Hitler or Stalin by far. Louisiana Senator Bill Cassidy is asking some questions Rhode island would prefer he not ask. The Senate health committee chairman fired off letters recently to Thundermist Health center and Hasbro Children's Hospital demanding to know whether federal dollars paid for puberty blockers, cross sex hormones and surgical referrals on kids under 19. The kicker, under the federal Tort Claims act, when those kids grow up and sue, the Justice Department steps in and defends the clinics so taxpayers fund them mutilation and then taxpayers fund the legal defense when the victims fight back. One of the centers reportedly only requires parental consent for intake appointment. After that, mom and dad are out of the loop. Cassidy says healthcare providers exist to protect kids, not subject them to ideology driven sex change procedures. You'd think that wouldn't be so controversial. Over at American Faith the headline the dam is breaking on School Choice and the swing states are next. The teachers union spent decades building a fortress of dues, money, lobbyists, and bought and paid for politicians. The whole arrangement rested on the idea that your child belongs to the system. Sit down. Be quiet.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Take what we give you.

[Jimmy Hicks]

Parents who watched what happened to their kids during the lockdowns are no longer in a sitting down kind of mood. Speaking of politicians sensing a wind change, Tennessee Congressman Steve Cohen has bowed out of his reelection bid after the state withdrew his Memphis district. Cohen, the lone Democrat in Tennessee's congressional delegation, says the new map looks nothing like the district he's represented. On his way out, he called President Trump the greatest threat to democracy, decorum and grace this country has ever seen. And Virginia Governor Abigail Spanberger may have just handed Second Amendment lawyers their opening argument. She signed a sweeping ban on so called assault weapons, including the AR15, the most popular rifle in America, and in her signing statement admitted the law covers firearms commonly used for hunting. She's now promising to work with lawmakers to fix that part later. Lawyers have a word for admissions like that.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

They call it evidence.

[Jimmy Hicks]

The Supreme Court has already turned away her gerrymandering attempt this month without a single justice in her corner. And that wraps up today's Fortis news break. I'm Jimmy Hicks. If you want more, you can download Fortis or sign up to become a Fortis insider for exclusive daily content. Both can be [e-mail] and don't forget, you can subscribe to Fortis News on your favorite podcast app in order to

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

get these updates daily.

[Jimmy Hicks]

And until tomorrow, go serve your king.

[Todd Friel]

God has given the church many gifts for the building up of the body. One gift is the ability to discern between true and false spirits. Satan masquerades as an angel of light, and many false teachers present their lies as God's truth. But God has given us his truth and he has equipped us to tell true from false in accordance with his word. This is Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

You'll be the judge.

[Ben Sasse]

You want answers?

[Todd Friel]

I think I'm entitled. You want answers?

[Caller or Listener]

I want the truth.

[Todd Friel]

You can't handle the truth. Order in the court. Choose your favorite pain medication. This is Wretched Radio. It might be Tylenol, Naproxium, sodium, maybe a little Advil. But you're going to need it for the splitting headache you're about to receive, courtesy of the world and the YouTube machine. Jimmy, are you prepared to represent the tens and tens of people listening to this year. Wretched radio program. To be the federal head making the decision which one of these clips is most painful.

[Jimmy Hicks]

I'm ready.

[Todd Friel]

Here we go. Jimmy, this would be. Let's start with. Okay, let's go to Vanderbilt Divinity School. Did I mention it's a divinity school?

[Pastor or Theologian]

My ministry is visual arts. My ministry is to bring joy to

[Todd Friel]

spaces that lack it. Helping facilitate moral development and space. Students and people. These are graduates from Vanderbilt Divinity School. In short order, you're going to notice something that is lacking.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Serving the community in a way that

[Ben Sasse]

allows for them to understand theologically, both

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

physically and spiritually, that they are loved.

[Todd Friel]

My ministry is loving others as God has loved me. Spreading love to everyone and especially members of the LGBT community.

[Pastor or Theologian]

My ministry is getting students to think.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

My ministry is for women. I'm dedicated to making sure we all know that we are made in the image of God.

[Todd Friel]

I thought, there's no difference between men and women, and everybody's the same. And there's no special classes. I'm getting a different vibe from the Vanderbilt Divinity School graduates.

[Pastor or Theologian]

My ministry is connecting people to their value and worth preserving and teaching the

[Todd Friel]

history of Christianity in the Middle East. Navy chaplain. Currently recruiting other pastors and ministers to become Navy chaplains.

[Pastor or Theologian]

For my project, I developed equine facilitated spiritual care. So I do.

[Todd Friel]

I'm sorry, Equine.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

That's horses, right?

[Todd Friel]

Facilitated spiritual care. That's horses.

[Pastor or Theologian]

Spiritual care with horses and humans. Helping to walk with students. Helping to equip them and guide them

[Todd Friel]

so that they can do the work

[Pastor or Theologian]

that God has called them to do. The work that only they can do in the world.

[Todd Friel]

I'm sure, for the pride people or something like that. Can you imagine that individual saying that? It's a, like, I don't know, Master seminary, Southern Seminary. Yes. My ministry, it's to the spiritual care of horses. Study Greek and Hebrew. Uh, I speak equine, Jimmy. That's clip number one.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

I don't think you need to keep going.

[Todd Friel]

Oh. Oh. Now, don't underestimate the power of the YouTube machine. All right. Oh, this one is. Painful. Nope, that doesn't come close. This is a woman in Tennessee. Now, it's kind of horrible quality, and I debated actually playing it. And you might not understand everything that you're about to hear, but this is a woman who has in her hand abortifaciens. She is going to take pills to terminate the life of her child, and you're going to hear that celebration. You do need to know, and I'll point this out to You. They've got a little child that's dancing around celebrating with mom as she's about to execute her own child. This brings up some interesting questions that need to be asked. But first, sorry for this. Pop them. Pop them. Did you catch that? And thank you, Jesus. We're thanking Jesus for this.

[Caller or Listener]

Thank you, jesus. Thank you, jesus.

[Todd Friel]

Hey, Jimmy, was it you who said about a minute ago we could stop right there. It can't get any worse. You think you're rethinking that, aren't you?

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Yeah, I am.

[Caller or Listener]

I'm need four more so I can sell them. So I'm gonna put them back in. No, you only take four. You only take four. You want to take all the people. That's money. You dropping the money. How many?

[Todd Friel]

She dropped one.

[Caller or Listener]

Just take the big one, then the post the small one. Just take two for right now. Drake, you can take two and get her. Take the big one, then wait to take the rest. Okay. That ain't no girl. Woo y. That's the best deal. That's the gender. Yay. No gender. No gender.

[Todd Friel]

It's a gender reveal party.

[Caller or Listener]

We got one dry killing.

[Todd Friel]

Kill it. Her friend or relative is encouraging her to kill it. Interestingly, on the description, this is some sort of TikTok video or something. It's. It's the woman writing a description of the video that she posted. She posted this. It says, bleep. Yeah, I killed my baby. The woman, the friend, the relative is also yelling, kill it. Kill it. Seems to me they know full well what they're doing. When you have an admission, yeah, I killed my baby, I think we call that murder. And it does raise a question about women's knowledge about what they are doing when it comes to an abortion. I don't think we're close yet to having this national conversation, but it needs to come someday. It needs to happen at some point. When can we say that women are not innocent when it comes to taking the life of their child? When they scream, kill it. And you write, yeah, I killed my baby. That to me sounds like an admission of guilt because it is an admission of guilt with knowledge. And that's always been the defense of those who say, well, we can't possibly penalize or criminalize the women. We can't send them to jail, can we? Because they're innocent in this act. Doesn't appear they are not. This woman anyway. We need to have a national conversation. If abortion is going to be illegal because it is the taking of an innocent human life, should abortion doctors, should they Receive a a penalty for committing murder. Yeah, I think they should. Bible's pretty clear on what the penalty should be for taking a life. But when are we going to have that conversation about women too? Now, I still believe that there are women who do believe that it is nothing but a blob of tissue. And I fully understand that there are women who are indeed pressured by bad men. I get that. But when you're having a gender reveal party with the sole intent of murdering your own child by taking an abortifacient pill, that sure sounds like guilt with knowledge to me, Jimmy. That's number two.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Yeah.

[Todd Friel]

You think we're going to follow up with anything worse than that?

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

I'm hard pressed to believe while this

[Todd Friel]

particular video isn't as wicked in its treatment of another human being, it's wicked in its own special way. This is a pastrix talking about our Savior who made it clear with definite articles he's the way, the truth, the life.

[Pastor or Theologian]

I am the way and the truth and the life. And here's the kicker. No one comes to the Father except through me.

[Todd Friel]

If she had stopped right there, she'd have been fine.

[Caller or Listener]

Now.

[Pastor or Theologian]

For centuries, for millennia, Christians have used those words as a proof text to be do kind all kinds of awful things in the world. Name one to punish people for not being Christian or not being their version of Christian. To punish or condemn people for all kinds of beautiful diversity that we see in the world. Not to bless the world, but to condemn it. All kind of awful things have come from those little words.

[Todd Friel]

This is such horrid rhetoric.

[Pastor or Theologian]

Now here's the thing. Before we even dive in, we have to get one thing straight. Jesus did not come into this world to preach and to teach a my way or the highway kind of religion.

[Todd Friel]

Except for the verse that you just cited.

[Pastor or Theologian]

Absolutely not.

[Todd Friel]

Absolutely. He claimed to be God. He died for sinners that we might be reconciled to God. There is no other name under heaven whereby we must be saved.

[Pastor or Theologian]

And in every other one of the Gospels, people come to Jesus and they ask him point blank, teacher.

[Todd Friel]

By the way, in the Gospel of Matthew, when anybody says teacher, they're skeptical. It's when they say Lord that they are actually interested. Teacher tends to be more of a mm.

[Pastor or Theologian]

So teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?

[Todd Friel]

Well, he answered that question. First words in the Gospel of Mark, repent and believe the Gospel. Jimmy, you've got your work cut out for you. Pastorix Hussein, We've been all confused about that definite article that he's the way the Truth, the life. Because some things have happened once where there were things going on, where some things took place that happened, and I'm telling you they were bad. Or you've got yourself the horrible abortion, murdering mommy. And finally, you've got Vanderbilt Divinity School equine ministry, who is the winner of which one's given us the biggest headache?

[Jimmy Hicks]

Yeah, that's gonna be number two.

[Todd Friel]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'll tell you, though, when you're twisting scripture that violently, this is wretched radio.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

No Retreat. That's the name of Fortis Institute's Spring Match campaign. And we chose that name for a reason. The church has been quietly backing up for years. A doctrine gets a little uncomfortable, a truth sounds a little too exclusive. So we set it aside and before long, the gospel sounds more like an

[Jimmy Hicks]

apology than an announcement.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Fortis Institute is determined to push the other direction, to encourage churches to hold fast to hard truth and to proclaim the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, rightly and loudly. That's why we're inviting you to join us on the no Retreat Spring Match campaign. Right now through the end of May, every dollar you give is matched dollar for dollar. And your gift will help launch two new podcasts, publish Todd Friel's new book, Go Serve youe King through HarperCollins, and fun gospel Proclamation on college campuses. The gospel doesn't move backward, and neither should we. You can find out more right [e-mail] donate. Here's something fun to know about Fortis.

[Jimmy Hicks]

It's not the same.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

12 videos on repeat. We're constantly adding new content. Our fellows are putting out hot takes on what everyone's talking about. This week we've got Gary Varvell drawing cultural cartoons that are funnier than your dad jokes. Not my dad jokes, but yours for sure. There's always something new on Fortis. Plus there's so much depth. Hundreds, maybe even thousands of hours of content is sitting there right now. Stuff on theology and marriage and parenting and manhood and cultural issues. Stuff you can dig into for months and you can watch it all on your tv, on your Roku, your Fire tv, your Apple tv, your Android. Not just your phone, your actual tv.

[Jimmy Hicks]

The Fortis app.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

It's free. Download it, throw it on your smart tv and see what Christ centered content actually looks like.

[Jimmy Hicks]

Fortis,

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

thanks for listening to Wretched Radio today. You know, there's no shortage of voices telling women how to handle anxiety, how to navigate relationships, how to find their identity. Honestly, most of it sounds pretty good until you realize it's just self help slapped with Bible verses. That's not the same thing as Biblical wisdom. And that's why we at Fortis Institute present to you the Better Way with Libby Glossin. Libby is an ACBC Certified Biblical Counselor and she's not just interested in giving you coping strategies. Libby's desire is to take you to Scripture and show you what God actually says about the things you're actually walking through. And this is the kind of content our gospel partners are making possible. If the content we're producing at Fortis Institute has been meaningful to you, I want to ask you to prayerfully consider becoming an ongoing monthly gospel partner. Just go to fortisinstitute.org right now and find out what it would look like for you to be a part of getting content like the Better Way into the hands of women who need it. Wretched Amazing Grace Amazing Gospel.

[Todd Friel]

Hermeneutics Hermeneutics is the art and science of interpreting scripture. When reading the Bible, begin with these three what does it say? What does it mean? What difference does it make? Many common mistakes can be avoided with basic hermeneutics. This is Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

Have you ever noticed how quickly we label suffering as a problem to be solved rather than a gift to be understood? Yeah. Jimmy, are you reading?

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Why?

[Todd Friel]

You can tell this is Ratchet Radio. I asked the AI machine to write a one minute radio introduction for a segment that teaches about the blessings of suffering based on 1st Peter 1. Guess what? It killed. Really did. There is nothing in here that I would see a need to change. Now I know that this is really framed well because I've been buried in First Peter one now for a couple of months. Nothing is wrong. In fact, it's done really well. But how would you feel if all I did was read AI? Because we could do this all day. In fact, here I'm going to do this. Turn that into 10 minutes. Boink. There it goes. Now let's just see what it does. Three, four. Okay, it's done. Absolutely. Here's a 10 minute radio teaching built from that intro paste for spoken delivery and warm pastoral radio tone. I can't do that. You can trim or pause for music as needed. Here we go. And it. It's still going. It's writing it. Have you ever noticed how quickly we label suffering as a problem to be solved rather than a gift to be understood? When something hurts, our instinct is to escape it, explain it away, ask God to remove it as fast as possible. And to be clear, Scripture never tells us that pain is pleasant or that hardship should be ignored, but it does tell us something surprising. Suffering can be meaningful. It can even be a blessing. I gotta tell you, I basically wrote something like that, but not as well. It was really just a talking point to show the blessings of suffering. That instead of going, oh, this is not to be stoic, but this is just to demonstrate how we should be reframing suffering instead of going, oh, suffering bad. I don't want any of it. If we understand God's use of suffering rightly, we should be able to. I'm not saying that it's, like, right to do it, but we should be able to say, lord, I'd like some more suffering so that I can be more refined into the image of your son, so that I can be holy like you're holy. So please, refiner's fire, bring it, because I want to be purified as fast as possible. Now, it's simply to make a point. Suffering persecution is good for us. It's always good for us. Do I think that we should be begging God for more suffering? No, that's silly. Because there is an alternative. Purify yourself. Don't make God turn up the blast furnace to ref. Bind you as pure gold. Do it yourself. Stop sinning, dude. Do the things that he commands you to do, knowing it is always a joy to do. So you don't have to go through the refiner's fire. And then. So I wouldn't ever say that, but that point is accurate. And it actually just said it with AI now I'm just scrolling down, turns it into 10 minutes. This is just a human. This is better than what most humans would do. And I'm telling you, pastors are already doing this. So my question for you is, let's advance the conversation. If you knew that your pastor were doing nothing but what I just did with AI, how would he feel about that? That's what he does on Sunday. He just gets up there and delivers that. Now, I'm not a good reader, so I struggle to make this sound like it's natural. But is it possible that if we don't say particular things about the limits of AI, there will be pastors who are really good at taking an AI manuscript and delivering it, like, whoa, that was amazing. And it becomes a new seminary class on homiletics. It doesn't teach you how to divide the word. It doesn't teach you anything about expositional preaching because you don't need it. All the homiletics class will be about is how you can read it well. Or maybe there'll be an ancillary class that teaches you how to program AI well, to make the best sermon possible. That's a skill set. It is a skill set. If you've never played with AI before, you get better at telling it what to do to get the outcome that you're looking for. If I wanted to, I could put instructions in here. No, I want you to make this less pastoral and more authoritative and rebuking. Boink. Done just like that. Because that pastor knows in his congregation that he's got people that are whingeing a lot. And so he's really got to. He's got to bring some heat and tell them to just knock off the complaining and whining and see suffering differently. Boom, there it is. Now that's a skill set to do that. Granted, I'm not sure how long it takes to learn that, but nevertheless, less time than studying Hebrew and Greek. I know that. But then what needs to happen for the pastor to be an effective pastor in the 21st century? He needs to be able to deliver it. And so homiletics classes will turn in nothing but drama classes. Your pastor is going to become an actor. Here's what. Your pastor isn't going to become more godly. That's because he's not doing this. He's not in one Peter. He's letting AI do everything for him. And you know what? If I weren't immersed in one Peter at the moment, I would read this. And do you know what it would actually mean to me? Very little. Very little. Because I'm just reading something. It's good stuff. I'll take you back to the one minute introduction. Today's segment invites us to slow down and listen to a surprising truth from First Peter, chapter one. Okay, see, this is. This is why I'm terrible at this. But I guess this could be another homiletics class. How to turn AI content into your very own. All right, so I'm going to do that. Jimmy, ready? I'll see if I possess that skill.

[Caller or Listener]

Okay.

[Todd Friel]

Hey, hey, hey. I know you're zooming everywhere. Just slow down. This is. This might shock you a little bit. But first Peter 1, get ready for this. As hard as life might be right now, they're actually disguised blessings. How'd I do that? Pretty good. I thought that was pretty good.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Yeah, it was great.

[Todd Friel]

I made it my own. Means nothing to me because I haven't wrestled with the text. And the pastor that does nothing but get trained to train. AI is not going to wrestle with the text, and that text, therefore, is not going to have the impact on him. The text is going to be dead letter. So your pastor isn't going to be growing in holiness. But I'm telling you, if we let this thing just take over the pulpit, pastoral ministry is going to change. Furthermore, you're in the hospital and I come visit you. Is this what you want from your pastor? Hey, tell me how you're feeling exactly about the upcoming operation. Hold on, hold on. I'm just booting up here. A little bad signal. Hold on. Okay, go ahead. You're kind of scared. Hold on. You read some things online that indicate the odds aren't as good as you want them to. Okay, question. Do you like Bible verses being quoted directly or just kind of paraphrased? Okay, just like that. All right. Psalms. Do you have a feeling about the psalms? Okay. Or do you prefer more didactic, like from the epistles? Okay, got it. So I'll just say Romans. Okay. All right, here we go. My beloved friend, there is no need to fear. The Psalms tell us that we should fear God. Therefore, we do not need to fear anything in the future. We do not need to be like the pagans, which, by the way, Peter alluded to in First Peter 1. Your empty life, your pagan life, your uneducated life, where you had no knowledge about what was wicked, just a total vapid nature of our existence. That's gone. That's gone. You're in Christ. You've got a new life. You've got a new mind. Sorry. That was me.

[Fortis Institute Announcer]

Yeah, you became human.

[Todd Friel]

Stop.

[Ben Sasse]

You can't.

[Todd Friel]

Yeah, sorry about that. Let me get back to my script as you're lying in your bed. Okay, here comes the nurse. You know what? That's okay, because I can tighten this up. Too many sentences, bring it down. I think that I'm losing their attention. Is that what we want? No, of course not. But I do fear that if pastors become nothing but programmers and presenters, we're going to lose the warm, shepherding nature of being a pastor. This content is actually really good. Listen to this writing. To believers facing real pressure and persecution, Peter doesn't minimize their pain. Instead, he reframes it. That's really. Actually very good. Okay. It's just not mine. And it's not natural. And I learned nothing. And I'm not being sanctified by it. And now the only thing that I need to do is deceive you into thinking that it came from me, because I don't think humans are ever going to be content going. You know what? AI really killed it this morning. I'm telling you, that AI sermon just crushed it. And my pastor's acting skills are getting better and better all the time. Is AI going to take over Christianity? No. No, it's not. This is. Wait a second. This is wretched. This is. This is wretched. This is wretched radio. This is wretched. And until tomorrow, go serve your king.