Do You Actually Understand The Gospel?

Summary

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Wretched Radio with Todd Friel

Episode: Do You Actually Understand the Gospel?

Date: July 22, 2026
Theme: Street-level conversations with university students exploring their beliefs about God, goodness, justice, repentance, and a clear explanation of the Christian gospel.

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Episode Overview

In this Witness Wednesday edition, Todd Friel interacts with students at Georgia Tech, using open-air interviews to probe their beliefs about life, morality, religion, and the gospel. The heart of the episode revolves around the central question: Do you actually understand the gospel? Through a series of candid, sometimes humorous, often probing conversations, Todd contrasts misunderstanding and cultural assumptions about Christianity (such as karma or generic goodness) with a biblical explanation of human sin, judgment, and the saving work of Jesus Christ.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Student Beliefs About Origins and God

• NASA, Science, and Creation: Todd opens with a student passionate about material science, using questions about scientific laws and the search for origins as a bridge to talk about the existence of God.
  • Creation vs. Evolution:
    • Mohawk Student: “I can't just accept that we're here...I just feel like it's really a combination of the two.” (03:16)
    • Todd: “So you're kind of a creationist?”
• Philosophy of Law & Design:
  • Todd uses analogy of building letters on a wall appearing by chance to question the logic of a purposeless universe.
  • Student Lewis: “I think it's the way we discover things... I would say that it's actually all science based.” (15:31-16:16)

2. Common Moral Assumptions

• Karma vs. Christianity:

  • Mohawk Student: “Just be a good person, do good unto others, and good stuff happen to you. It's kind of like karma almost…” (04:37)
  • Todd: “It is not. I've read the Bible. It doesn't say that.” (04:44-04:47)
  • Todd repeatedly clarifies that Christianity is not about earning favor with God via good deeds.

• “Being Good” – Self-Assessment:

  • Todd walks students through questions from the Ten Commandments (lying, lust, honoring parents) to demonstrate that everyone falls short by God’s standard.

3. Biblical View of Sin and Judgment

• Guilty Before God:

  • Todd: “If you break a law, then you are guilty, period.” (07:17)
  • On justice: “It doesn't matter what the criminal thinks. The question is, what does the judge think?” (08:03)
  • For both Mohawk Student and Machiavellian Student, Todd drives home the point that breaking God's law results in guilt under divine justice.

• Student Pushback:

  • “Overall innocent, but I do make some guilty. There's some guilt in there.” (07:13, Mohawk Student)
  • Todd rebuts, “Sure you are. Like, for instance, if a guy rapes somebody, he's a rapist, he's a criminal... If you tell a lie, you're a liar.” (07:30-07:35)

4. Clarity on the Gospel

• What is the Gospel?

  • Multiple students incorrectly identify it as “loving others,” “doing good,” or not understanding at all.
  • Todd: “It's not doing good. We've done bad. We should get punished by God, but he died to save us... Your badness. You're the criminal. It got put on the innocent man [Jesus]. He got punished on your behalf, and all of his goodness can be credited to your account so that you can be seen as perfect by God because of what Jesus did for you. That's what Christianity is about, not karma.” (08:41-09:15)

• Repentance and Faith:

  • Todd: “You don't become perfect, but you turn from your sins with a new attitude and you put your trust in Jesus and in him alone.” (08:55)
  • “The Bible says you do that because he was punished on a cross on your behalf...” (08:57)

• The Response:

  • Todd consistently challenges: “Have you repented and put your trust in Jesus?” (09:29, repeated through episode)

5. Philosophical and Theological Variations

• Machiavellian Student:

  • Strong focus on self-government, morality as pursuing goals, and a majority-good view of human nature.
  • Todd: “If you lust 5,000 times, you've broken the law 5,000 times...You are a bad criminal. You got to go to jail.” (34:22-34:53)
  • Gospel re-explained: “…the good guy dying for you, the bad guy.” (36:03-36:16)

• Roman Catholic Student (Brazilian):

  • Candidly admits he’s Catholic by upbringing, not by conviction.
  • Todd presses for specific beliefs: “I don't really know the beliefs and everything...” (46:07)
  • When asked how to get to heaven: “Doing good.” (46:59)
  • Todd leads to gospel: “But if somebody steps into the courtroom and says, judge, I love that man and I will take the punishment that he deserves... that's the gospel, dude.” (49:49-50:23)

• Theme of “Cultural Christianity”:

  • Several students believe they are Christian or religious because of family background, but lack a personal conviction or understanding.

6. Examining Your Faith and Response

• Todd’s Closing Exhortation:
  • “You need to believe in Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the fully God, fully man, Savior of the world... You need to believe the right gospel, and you need to see your life and your heart have been changed by it.” (52:23 and closing monologue)
  • “Repent and put your trust in him today. And until tomorrow, go serve your King.” (Final words)

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Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes

• On the difference between karma and Christianity:
  • “That's kind of like Buddhism and Hinduism stuff. And there's some rules that, you know, typically if you behave, life goes better, but that's not karma because God's in control of everything.” (09:18, Todd)
• On justice and guilt:
  • “It doesn't matter what the criminal thinks. The question is, what does the judge think, right?” (08:02, Todd)
• On faith and evidence:
  • “Science also leans on a few things it can't prove: that the universe stays orderly and that our minds can actually grasp truth. Both make the most sense if a rational God made it all.” (41:55, Todd/narration)
• On the necessity of personal response:
  • “It's not enough to just get it, read the story or hear the story and go, that's interesting. I find that fascinating. You've got to respond to it in childlike humility and repentance and faith.” (39:25, Todd)
• On gospel assurance:
  • “Do you need to know the moment, the second that this happened—when you got born again? No, not the moment or the second, but you should be able to look back in your life sometime and say, ‘I remember that season. I used to be living like that. Then God changed my heart. And now I'm living like this.’” (52:22, Todd)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:33: Show theme and location—Georgia Tech, Witness Wednesday.
• 03:35-05:05: Mohawk Student: “Loose creationism,” belief in karma, misconceptions about Christianity.
• 05:15-08:20: Todd walks student through Ten Commandments and guilt before God.
• 08:39-10:25: Todd clearly explains the gospel and the need for a personal response.
• 15:00-18:35: Todd uses building/design analogy to discuss evidence for God with Lewis.
• 20:03-25:30: Gospel quiz with Lewis—belief in “being good” vs. gospel of forgiveness.
• 29:48-38:17: “Machiavellian” student: Purpose of life, morality, confronting human depravity, judgment, and the cross.
• 44:06-52:21: Todd and the Brazilian Catholic student: Upbringing versus genuine belief, the mechanics of forgiveness, true meaning of repentance, and faith.
• 52:23-end: Todd’s closing exhortation on authentic faith, assurance, and the necessity of both heart and doctrinal change.

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Final Reflections

Todd Friel’s Witness Wednesday at Georgia Tech exposes both the diversity of young people’s beliefs and the prevalent confusion about what the gospel is—often replaced by moralism, karma, or cultural identity. With warmth, persistence, and sometimes playful banter, Todd presses students to confront difficult truths about human nature, justice, and the real gospel: that guilty people can be declared righteous, not by their deeds, but by trusting Jesus, who paid the penalty for them. Each conversation ends with a call to self-examination and genuine response—leaving both participants and listeners with the essential challenge: Do you actually understand the gospel, and have you truly responded to it?

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Transcript

[Todd Friel]

Wretched radio begins in 3, 2, 1.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I started giving on that level so

[Interviewer Todd]

that God would owe me. Whatever you do right now, don't you stop tithing. Harvest responds only to seed, not to prayer.

[Narrator/Announcer]

This is not about material wealth. This is about God in his providence, orchestrating all of history in order to bring about that which we need more than anything else, and that is to be rescued from God.

[Todd Friel]

It's time for Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

[Interviewer Todd]

This is Wretched Radio. It's Witness Wednesday. We are here at Georgia Tech. Okay, Friel, get out of the mud. Okay, Just. Todd, come in from out of the rain. It's like, oh, good, this dude is walking this way. Oh, I was watching you before. Yo, man, can I talk to you while you're walking that way?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

You know what? While I'm talking. You can talk while I'm walking?

[Lewis]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right. Dude, the haircut. What's up with the Mohawk?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Well, not the Mohawk.

[Interviewer Todd]

Why?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

It's freaking awesome.

[Interviewer Todd]

You think it's awesome?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yeah, it's.

[Interviewer Todd]

Aw, you kind of got curly hair.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I do got curly hair. That's why it's more awesome, because I can have to put gel in or anything. I just kind of can feather it, and it's good to go.

[Interviewer Todd]

Is it? Is it? So you. This is the do that you're. That you're styling with?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm styling it for now. I put it in. I got it for homecoming.

[Interviewer Todd]

I figured as much.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

And I'm keeping it through my fraternity's chartering date, which is in mid November.

[Interviewer Todd]

Aha. So what's the fraternity?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Sigma PI.

[Interviewer Todd]

And what type of fraternity is it?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

It's a social fraternity.

[Interviewer Todd]

It's a what?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Social.

[Interviewer Todd]

What does that mean?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

It's like. It's not like honorary professional. It's just guys who have common interests, hang out together.

[Brazilian Student]

Is it.

[Interviewer Todd]

Is it a party fraternity?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Not so much. We do have parties. It's not like that emphasis so much.

[Interviewer Todd]

But it's not like Animal House.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

It's not like Animal House at all.

[Interviewer Todd]

You know Animal House? I.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Who doesn't know Animal House?

[Interviewer Todd]

Well, I don't know what they're teaching the kids these days.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Good for you.

[Interviewer Todd]

You understand history.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I don't want to. I'm a film buff. I like films.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's different. Okay. So what are you studying here at Georgia Tech?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Material science and engineering.

[Interviewer Todd]

Ah, material science meaning materials and how,

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

like, react when put in certain situations.

[Interviewer Todd]

Keep going. Help me out with that.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm only a freshman.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's all right. Well, you've got to step up. What do you want to do with material science?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Hope something with NASA helping develop materials are going to like building the new space shuttles and all that.

[Interviewer Todd]

Is that right? Who's Werner Brun Braun?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Beats me, dude.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, I got a movie for you to watch. October Sky.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

October Sky. And you'll learn.

[Interviewer Todd]

It's a movie. You'll like it. Real clean, real sweet family film if you're into that type of thing.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I am.

[Interviewer Todd]

And you'll learn about Warner Von Braun, all right. He's like one of the famous guys who really helped this get into outer space.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

Why do you want to go there? What do you want to do there?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

In outer space? Yeah, experiments. Mess around. I mean, zero gravity has got to be awesome.

[Interviewer Todd]

So you want to go out there?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, dude. So here's what. Here's what I'm noticing with NASA. You tell me if you think I'm right. I think they keep. Where are you going, by the way?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm going way down there.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right, so here's what.

[Brazilian Student]

It looks good.

[Interviewer Todd]

Can we go this way? You mind the. The NASA program, this day, these days, seems to. To try to get out there to figure out how we evolved. Have you noticed that?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I had noticed that. And it's kind of weird. I mean, I can't just accept that we're here. I'm not a person. Evolution or creationism? I just feel like it's really a combination of the two. But NASA being scientists, probably more bent on figuring out that it is evolution than creationism.

[Interviewer Todd]

So you're kind of a creationist?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I am, but as a loose creationism.

[Interviewer Todd]

Who do you think the creator is?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

God.

[Interviewer Todd]

Who do you think God is?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I don't know. He's. He's like an entity almost. It's. I do believe there's a physical God out there. I mean, someone in the universe. I believe there is actually a physical God who can gather materials like ions and all that and send them to places. And with that they can form life forms.

[Interviewer Todd]

So does this God of yours have a name? Are you a religious guy?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Not particularly, but I just saw him.

[Brazilian Student]

God?

[Interviewer Todd]

Just God?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

So where could I learn about this God? Is there a book? Are you a Christian? Bible, Koran, any of that stuff?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Combination. I also like to read religious doctrines.

[Interviewer Todd]

But you're not a Christian?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

No.

[Interviewer Todd]

How come?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I don't know. Just. My mom's Jewish, my dad's Christian. They never really forced religion upon me. I just read the doctrines and I find the old stories interesting.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, so what Is the. What is the story of Christianity? What does that teach based on what you've researched?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Just be a good person, do good unto others, and good stuff happen to you. It's kind of like karma almost, if you will.

[Interviewer Todd]

It is not.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I think so. I do believe.

[Interviewer Todd]

I've read the Bible. It doesn't say that.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

That's good. No, it's like interpretation. Almost like you do good stuff to other people and they're going to want to return the favor, and then you're going to have good things coming your way, which is karma.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's not what it teaches, young man. I beg to differ. Okay.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I haven't read it that closely, apparently.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right, let me. Let me. Let me tell you what I think it's about. Okay, here we go. You ready for this? It's gonna be a little tricky. Are you ready?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm ready.

[Interviewer Todd]

This is worse than a hazing, potentially. Would you consider yourself to be a good person?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Sometimes. Sometimes I admit that sometimes I don't make the right decisions.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right. Have you ever told lies in your life?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

How many do you think?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Too many to count.

[Interviewer Todd]

A lot of them.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm a compulsive liar.

[Interviewer Todd]

Really? Are you lying to me now?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Nope.

[Interviewer Todd]

About being a compulsive liar? How would somebody know, you know? Think about that for a second.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Oh, believe me, it's interesting, because when I tell people that, they're like, are you lying about that right now?

[Interviewer Todd]

I'm like, no, I'm not the first. How many things have you stolen in your life?

[Brazilian Student]

None.

[Interviewer Todd]

Don't lie to me.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm not stealing. I've never stolen a thing in my life.

[Interviewer Todd]

Let's try this one. Lusting. How's about that?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Not really, dude. I mean, we're at Georgia Tech. Where's. Where's my chance to lust around here?

[Interviewer Todd]

I don't know. Have you? Is the question.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

No, dude, I'm serious.

[Interviewer Todd]

You're a guy, right?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

I was telling me you have never had an impure thought. Now I know you're lying to me.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

An impure thought that I've had.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yeah.

[Lewis]

Huh.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. And I want to ask about anything else further, like maybe pornography, looking at dirty pictures, any of that stuff. Okay, so what, do we have, two strikes right now?

[Todd Friel]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Toward being a not good person.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. How's about honoring your parents? You always do everything you were told as a kid?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Cut it out.

[Brazilian Student]

I am.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm serious. They would.

[Interviewer Todd]

They were. They were what?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

They threatened to beat me before.

[Interviewer Todd]

Why would they threaten to beat You. Because you were naughty.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I wasn't naughty.

[Interviewer Todd]

I just didn't do what you were told.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I was bending the rules a little bit.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. So, hey, how are you? Pretty good.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

How about yourself?

[Interviewer Todd]

Boy, I wish we could chat. I'll see you again. Okay. I remember that dude. Nice young man. Okay, so you were like every other kid.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

And you didn't do everything you were told, Johnny.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

On the spot.

[Interviewer Todd]

Right. All right, so here's the question. Christianity, remember? That's what we're talking about. Let's say you die. God judges you. Every thought, every word, every deed. Innocent or guilty?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Overall innocent. But I do make some guilty. There's some guilt in there.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. But it's not an overall kind of guilt. It's not overall guilt, but if you break a law, then you are guilty, period.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

If you break a law, like numerous times, you break a law. Once, you're guilty per se, you're guilty of that law. But I don't think overall, in the grand scheme of things.

[Interviewer Todd]

Sure you are. Like, for instance, if a guy rapes somebody, he's a rapist, he's a criminal.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

If you tell a lie, you're a liar.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Steal something, you're a thief. Lust you're an adulterer at heart.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, so you'd be guilty.

[Brazilian Student]

All right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. Heaven or hell. What would God do with you?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

With me?

[Brazilian Student]

Yeah.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I don't know. It's a good thing to think about. I'd probably say heaven right now because I'm not that awful of a person. I mean, it's little things, but they add up. So it might be hell. I don't know.

[Interviewer Todd]

But if the judge disagreed and he thought they were big things.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

You'd be in big trouble.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Because that's what matters. It doesn't matter what the criminal thinks. The question is, what does the judge think? Right.

[Brazilian Student]

Yep.

[Interviewer Todd]

So the Bible says, all liars will have their part in a lake of fire for lying. Because it's a big deal to God.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yep.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right, so. Dude, it doesn't matter. It doesn't sound good for you.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

No, it doesn't.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right. We were talking about what Christianity is. Right. You kind of said it's kind of a karma. Do good and it'll come back to you. And I was saying I don't think that's what it is. All right, before you go into your building real quick, you've heard this somewhere along the line, God should give you hell. What has he done so that you can have your sins forgiven? Because this is what Christianity is about.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Jesus died for the sins, about grace.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's what Christianity is about. It's not doing good. We've done bad. We should get punished by God, but he died to save us. And if we'll repent, do you know what that means? Yeah, what?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

If you feel bad about it, be sorry.

[Interviewer Todd]

It's a part of it. Yeah. And turn from your sins.

[Brazilian Student]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

You don't become perfect, but you turn from your sins with a new attitude and you put your trust in Jesus and in him alone. Bible says you do that because he was punished on a cross on your behalf. It's like your badness. You're the criminal. It got put on the innocent man. He got punished on your behalf, and all of his goodness can be credited to your account so that you can be seen as perfect by God because of what Jesus did for you. That's what Christianity is about, not karma. That's kind of like Buddhism and Hinduism stuff. And there's some rules that, you know, typically if you behave, life goes better, but that's not karma because God's in control of everything. Okay, so my question for you is, have you done that? Have you repented and put your trust in Jesus?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Now that I can remember, I was like 2 years old when it happened.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah. But if you ever have been, you remember it because it's like, whoa, that was like a big deal. Same thing is true with getting saved by God. It's kind of a big deal when you die to yourself and he makes you alive and he changes your attitude and your heart, your desire. And all of a sudden you start liking the things that you never used to like before. Like other CR Christians reading the Bible and the sins that you used to love. Suddenly I don't want those anymore because he died to save me. It's the nicest thing anybody's ever done for me. So I don't. Dude, I don't know if you're, like, right with God or not, but something to ponder. Because 18, you're a young man and you're thinking these things through them. What am I believing? Because you don't believe what your parents believe, it doesn't make you that. You have to think it through yourself. So what you just heard is the gospel. I can't club you and make you one. And I'm not going to chase you into your dorm here. Just think about it, okay?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Okay, I.

[Interviewer Todd]

Because, dude, I don't want you to go to hell.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Neither do I.

[Interviewer Todd]

And God doesn't want that either. The Bible Says, for God so loved the world, he gave his only begotten son, that whoever believes in him will not perish but have everlasting life. So the offer is open to you. Repentance and faith. You got a Bible?

[Lewis]

No.

[Interviewer Todd]

You got one online, though.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

My roommate has a Bible, though.

[Interviewer Todd]

Rock on. Grab that bad boy, open it up and read the Gospel of John.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Okay. Remember that?

[Lewis]

Yeah.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

All right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Hey, dude, I'm glad you had a mohawk so we can chat. All right, man. So are you going to get into your little fraternity deal? Is it going to happen?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yeah, it's already happened.

[Interviewer Todd]

But you live in a dorm. This isn't a frat.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

I'm a freshman. I'm not allowed to live in the house yet. We don't have one anyway, so they're not.

[Interviewer Todd]

They don't let you live in the house yet till you're one year.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

We don't have a house. We're chartering. We're becoming an official fraternity.

[Interviewer Todd]

Ah, you're doing it yourselves. All right, man. All right, Father, thanks for the chat. Thanks, man. See you. Goodbye. So that's witnessing. Sometimes you're gonna get some crabby guys, sometimes you're gonna get some old guys. We'll see what kind of guys we get next. We're at Georgia Tech. It's Witness Wednesday, and this is wretched ra.

[Narrator/Promoter]

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[Interviewer Todd]

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[Narrator/Promoter]

You know, you can love the Lord with absolutely everything in you and still go mute. When somebody asks you, how do you even know the Bible is true? You feel the answer deep down. You just can't put it into words. The reasons go deeper than most of us were ever even shown. Skeptics know that, too. That's why they start in Genesis and then they work backward, because if you crack the foundation, then everything built on top of it will start to wobble. But when you trace the logic and the morality and the science all the way down, you find the very same thing every single time. Reality only makes sense if the Bible is true. And Dr. Jason Lyle has spent his entire career studying the universe. And in his new series, Irrefutable Proof of Creation, he asks the hard questions about God and turns doubt into confidence. Irrefutable Proof of Creation is streaming right now on Fortis, with new episodes dropping every week. Download the Fortis app on your smartphone, your smart TV, or you can go to fortisplus.org.

[Todd Friel]

Know your church fathers. Polycarp was a disciple of the apostle John and the Bishop of Smyrna. He was a staunch defender of orthodoxy, combating the Gnostic heresies. Before his death as a martyr, Polycarp proclaimed, 86 years I have served Christ and he has done me no evil. How could I curse my king? King who saved me? This is Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

[Interviewer Todd]

Getting some exercise, dude. What's your name?

[Lewis]

Lewis.

[Interviewer Todd]

Lewis, thanks for joining me on the radio.

[Lewis]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

We're gonna walk up the hill, so I'm gonna get a little winded.

[Brazilian Student]

All right.

[Lewis]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

So have a little. Little grace.

[Lewis]

Oh, so I should go a little slower.

[Interviewer Todd]

That'd be nice. Okay, so we can. Now we can. We can go fast down the hill. Okay. But up the hill, we'll go a little slower because, you know, I'm over 30 now.

[Lewis]

Oh, yeah, that's fine.

[Interviewer Todd]

Here's a question for you. Kind of a philosophical, maybe a religious question. Okay. Bernoulli's law or any other law of physics, are those laws put in place and written, or is that simply the way that we discover how things randomly happen?

[Lewis]

I think it's the way we discover things. How things randomly happen.

[Interviewer Todd]

So nobody wrote the laws and we're discovering them. We're writing the laws for what we observe.

[Lewis]

So is this like. This is a question of did someone, like, let's say a God put those laws in place?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yeah.

[Lewis]

Well, either way, I mean, we're discovering them. I mean, we didn't make them, that's for sure. Yeah, so they were created either by some higher being, or they were just created by some scientific explanation, like the Big Bang theory.

[Interviewer Todd]

What do you think? God or no God?

[Lewis]

Well, I don't know.

[Interviewer Todd]

You're getting winded, aren't you?

[Lewis]

Well, I mean, this is a whippersnapper. Well, you know, I mean. Yeah, but I would. I would say that it's actually all science based.

[Interviewer Todd]

No God.

[Lewis]

Yeah. I mean, if that doesn't necessarily mean I don't believe in God, that just means I feel like there's evidence enough to support, you know, all sorts of things.

[Brazilian Student]

Hold on.

[Interviewer Todd]

I'm gonna do a scientific experiment with you. All right? All right. Louis, right?

[Lewis]

Yes. Are you Italian, Spanish, or half Spanish?

[Interviewer Todd]

There you go. That makes sense. All right, I'm reading this side. Old Sibyl Engineering building. Yes. You know those letters, how they got there?

[Lewis]

Someone wrote them.

[Interviewer Todd]

Were you here to witness that person writing those letters?

[Lewis]

No, I was not.

[Interviewer Todd]

Are you sure somebody wrote those letters and put them there?

[Lewis]

That's a good argument. I see where you're going with that.

[Interviewer Todd]

Because if I tried to convince you it just happened over millions of years, you'd go, no way, dude. Because it happens to not only make sense, but it's standing outside of the building that happens to be the old civil engineering building.

[Lewis]

But someone would look at that and say, boing. Huh?

[Interviewer Todd]

It's designed by somebody. Yeah, it's almost kind of like a. We just have this automatic response. We see something designed and we go, well, clearly somebody put it there. Just like somebody made the old civil engineering building. Didn't seem to make them, but somebody made that thing because there it is. I got the proof. Would that be a fair argument for saying, okay, I didn't see God make the place, but look at that tree here in front of the engineering building, and this amazing globe and the universe the clouds. And look at that hand. The way that those phalanges work.

[Lewis]

It all works so well.

[Interviewer Todd]

Somebody made this. Would that be fair?

[Lewis]

That's a tough one. I mean, that argument makes sense, but for some reason, I just. I wouldn't accept that argument.

[Interviewer Todd]

I mean, why not?

[Lewis]

Just because. I mean, I just know that a person built this. I mean, I know it wasn't placed there. And it's just that knowledge, I guess, contradicts that, I suppose.

[Interviewer Todd]

Wait a second, hold on. You know for sure that somebody designed it. But if I came along and said to you, no, no, no, no. I've got scientific proof. There was a stack of bricks that blew up and it became that building.

[Lewis]

Well, if you showed me that evidence, then I would believe that. But then that's supporting my point, that something scientific.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, so then I guess it boils down to this. Do you think that putting dynamite underneath a pile of bricks and blowing it off with just power going every place would ever make that building?

[Lewis]

I think you'd have to have several different explosions because they would all go apart. You know, all the bricks would go apart. I don't think they'd randomly do that.

[Interviewer Todd]

Have you ever seen an explosion?

[Lewis]

No, but I mean, I'm pretty sure,

[Interviewer Todd]

like in a movie, you know, when stuff blows up, it's like it just goes crazy everywhere.

[Lewis]

Well, I mean, there's. There's like. That's the whole thing. Like, you say if you had a thousand monkeys and you gave them all typewriters, one of them would type the Encyclopedia Britannica.

[Interviewer Todd]

Somebody actually did the statistics on that. And you know what? They actually did that study and they think they put like a dozen monkeys in a room for a while, and they never came up with even, like, the word it.

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Really.

[Interviewer Todd]

Nothing. Because they're monkeys and they don't have intelligence to design stuff.

[Lewis]

Well, so can I ask you a question? So why did you come to a tech campus to ask these questions? I mean, these seem more like a philosophical, religious right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, yeah. Because we like this subject. Subject.

[Lewis]

You like the subject, and so you'll ask it anywhere. Not really. Particularly at a tech school.

[Interviewer Todd]

Any place, to anybody. Yeah, so we have.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

We also.

[Interviewer Todd]

We happen to be a Christian radio show, too.

[Brazilian Student]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

So we like to talk to. We love talking about this subject, actually.

[Lewis]

Well, so I guess my views kind of differ from those of your radio station.

[Interviewer Todd]

I'm not gonna beat you up. I don't think I could, anyway.

[Lewis]

Well, I mean, I'm kind of smart.

[Interviewer Todd]

Look at me, though. One of us would win the spindly award. Okay, so you're not a Christian, right?

[Lewis]

Well, I'm not sure about that, actually. I'm kind of in a phase of my life where I'm not sure what I am.

[Interviewer Todd]

Did you grow up in the church?

[Lewis]

No. But during high school, I went with a friend to church occasionally, and it was a non denominational group, and I actually liked it and it was kind of interesting. And then at some point, I just decided I actually didn't like it. So now I'm in a point in my life where I don't. I don't know what I think.

[Interviewer Todd]

Tell me, what is the gospel, Louis? Do you know what it is?

[Lewis]

Isn't that the New Testament?

[Interviewer Todd]

Good for you? Yeah, that's right, it is. Sorry. The gospel, specifically the good news. Like, what's the good news of the Gospel of Jesus Christ?

[Lewis]

I believe it's, we're all saved if we, you know, love each other and love, you know, God.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's warm. That's pretty close.

[Lewis]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. Saved from what?

[Lewis]

Eternal damnation and hell.

[Interviewer Todd]

Why would God eternally damn a guy like you and me?

[Lewis]

I'm not sure about that, to be honest. I mean, he could be disgusted at the way we acted. But I mean, if. Let's say you acted totally normally and as a nice guy, but you didn't follow God, I still believe he would put you in damnation. And I'm actually not sure about that.

[Interviewer Todd]

Are you familiar with the Ten Commandments?

[Lewis]

Yes. I couldn't name all of them.

[Interviewer Todd]

They're basically God's laws, the rules that he has. Okay, so you die, Lewis, your books get opened up. God knows everything that you've ever done and all the stuff that you failed to do. Thanking him for food and for education, for your past nice experiences and everything that you've enjoyed. He hasn't been first in your life. Plus, you've broken all of his laws. Would you be innocent or guilty before that? God?

[Lewis]

I would say I'd probably be guilty, to be totally honest. For sure, yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, so if you're a guilty guy and God's holy and perfect and righteous and just what should he do with Lewis? Send him to heaven or send him to hell?

[Lewis]

Well, I mean, I guess the correct answer there is hell. But, I mean, this is where my question comes up. If I've never ever done anything, let's. Like in a purely malevolent sense, if I at least try to do the right thing, I don't understand necessarily why that is. Do you see where I'm Coming from.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, I understand. Yeah. And what it requires is. The question isn't how do I see it? The question is, how does God see it? That's really the big thing. Because the criminal can say, well, this is how I see it, Judge. But the judge says, it doesn't matter. This is how I see it.

[Lewis]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

And things like lust, for instance. Okay. We tend to say, guys will be guys. But we could stop it. We don't have to. We don't have to lie. We don't have to get angry at somebody, but we do. So we are basically living our lives the way that we want to in rebellion.

[Lewis]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

So God should give you hell for what you've earned.

[Lewis]

Yes, according. I mean, according to your.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's right. The Ten Commandments in the Bible. Right, right.

[Lewis]

But I mean, that again, goes back to the whole philosophical question about what is.

[Interviewer Todd]

What's true.

[Lewis]

Right.

[Interviewer Todd]

I agree.

[Lewis]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

You shouldn't believe me, that's for sure.

[Lewis]

Well, I mean, I just. I mean, I'm not saying that, but I'm just saying.

[Interviewer Todd]

No, no, it's okay. I'm not offended.

[Lewis]

I mean, I'm just saying that. I mean, it's all in a point of view, too. I mean, according to your point of view. Well, I'm in.

[Interviewer Todd]

But it does make sense, though, doesn't it? There's something that says, you know, kind of know God exists, and I know that I've done bad things, and if there's any justice, and I think there is. I've got a bad feeling about dying. I think that's why we're scared to die.

[Lewis]

Well, because you're guilty of.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, it could just be something bad. Okay. Louis.

[Lewis]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

I asked you before what the gospel is. Yes. Okay, now I'll ask you again.

[Lewis]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Let's say the Bible is right. Not me. The Bible is right. God judges you. He should send you to hell.

[Lewis]

Right.

[Interviewer Todd]

What is the gospel?

[Lewis]

The gospel would be saved. Saving myself from that. Being saved from that.

[Interviewer Todd]

No, no, no. Here's the problem. You can't save yourself. It's too late. You're the guilty criminal.

[Lewis]

Oh, I guess it'd be like mercy. Is that like his mercy towards me specifically?

[Interviewer Todd]

His mercy and his kindness. Here's the tension. We got Louis.

[Lewis]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

God's holy and he's just. And he's got to punish guys like you because you've done bad. And he can't just go, well, boys will be boys. I'm gonna let him go. He's got to get. But he's loving and he's kind, he's just rich in mercy. But he can't just let you go. He's got to punish you. But he loves you and he doesn't want you to go to hell, Right? So his plan to save you was to send his son, whose name is Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ, to take the punishment you deserve. Two thousand years ago, God poured out his wrath on his son on your behalf. It's like your badness was put on the innocent man and he took the punishment for you so that his goodness, his perfect life and suffering could be credited to your account. So that you can be seen as perfect before God because of what Jesus did on your behalf. That's the goodness of the Gospel. You're a guilty criminal and Jesus paid your fine for you so that you can be reconciled to your God. That's the good news of the Gospel. Guilty criminals being forgiven.

[Lewis]

Right?

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, but. But you have got to respond to that good news. You can't just walk away now and go, oh, okay, good. I'm clear and good to go. Because you're not. The Bible says you've got to repent, which means agree with God. You exist. I have sinned against you. I've been selfish. I've lived for myself. I've been the king of my own world. And I've sinned against you in countless ways, and I'm sorry. And you turn from your sins. You don't just magically become perfect, but you just have a new attitude toward the stuff you used to love. And you put your trust in Jesus, who died for you. The Bible says when you repent and trust the Savior, he'll completely forgive your sins. He'll adopt you as his child, and he'll grant you everlasting life because of what Jesus did on your behalf. That's the gospel.

[Lewis]

That sounds pretty good.

[Interviewer Todd]

Now, you're a young man. You gotta figure out if it's true or not, right?

[Lewis]

Well, I mean, that's really the biggest question.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yes, sure is.

[Lewis]

I mean, once you know it's true, then it'd be silly not to do it. It. But it's really a question of figuring out in your life, you know, what exactly is true and.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yep, I agree. All right, we stopped. We're going to keep walking. I'm taking a break. We're walking. This is Wretched Radio,

[Narrator/Announcer]

And it's now time for your daily Fortis News Breaker production of Fortis Institute. A Catholic priest in Canada checked into the hospital with a fractured hip. And twice, twice the staff offered to help him die instead. Father Larry Holland says a doctor raised Canada's assisted death program shortly after he was admitted, and a nurse brought it up again later, both fully aware he was a priest and that the church rejects euthanasia outright. Canada, of course, legalized assisted death in 2016 for people whose death was reasonably foreseeable. And that standard has gotten awfully flexible. A disabled veteran was offered a suicide kit when all she wanted was a wheelchair ramp. An activist. Scientists now want it open to children as young as 12. Scripture says God is the one that numbers our days. But Canada, I guess it figures it could do the math a whole lot better than God. And speaking of Canada, it's exporting more than grim ideas about death. President Trump says that America is being unnecessarily invaded by filthy, polluted air drifting down from nearly 900,000 Canadian wildfires. The smoke triggered air quality warnings for more than 100 million Americans across 18 states and even postponed a big league baseball game. Trump blames willful negligence and years of refused forest management and says the cost should be added to the tariffs Canada already pays. Ontario's premier shot back that America should send help instead of complaints. Fair enough, though it's a little rich coming from the country whose forests are the ones that are on fire. And speaking of bad things crossing, crossing the border, a British writer warns the American left is using Britain as an offshore laboratory, testing ideas too toxic to pass Congress and selling them back to us as proven. And the list it's long, like windfall taxes that gutted British energy, congestion charges that jump from London to New York, soda taxes and speech laws that send police to your door over a tweet. Now progressive American money is funding massive class action lawsuits in British courts dressed up in climate justice. And this British writer's warning was blunt. The free world will hang together or it'll hang separately. British prosecutors have hit online influencer Andrew Tate and his brother Tristan with 38 new charges, bringing their total to 59. The pair were arrested in Miami over the weekend on a sealed British warrant, setting up a likely extradition flight. The charges include include rape, human trafficking and, for Andrew, 19 counts tied to illegal images of children. The brothers deny everything, of course they do, and call the whole thing a political hit. The women at the center of the case? Well, it seems like they're finally going to get their day in court. That wraps up today's Fortis news break. I'm Jimmy Hicks. If you want more, you can download Fortis plus or sign up to become a Fortis insider for exclusive daily content. Both of those things you can [e-mail] and don't forget, you can subscribe to Fortis News on your favorite podcast app in order to to get these updates daily. And until tomorrow, go serve your king.

[Todd Friel]

Books of the Bible. The apostle Peter wrote to the elect exiles who were facing persecution for the sake of Christ. Peter exhorted them to trust God and to continue living godly lives. He reminds them of their hope in Christ and their high calling. When you want to learn joyful obedience, no matter what your circumstances, look to first Peter. This is Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

[Interviewer Todd]

We have ourselves a black and yellow bumblebee. This is Wretched Radio. It's Witness Wednesday here at Georgia Tech asking young people the question, if you could ask God one question, what would it be?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

What would be the ultimate plan for the universe?

[Interviewer Todd]

Really?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Like what's the point?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

What do you think it is currently?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

I think it's for everybody to continue to better themselves, to see what people can build of what we have with us today and improve what we're given.

[Interviewer Todd]

So are you kind of an Indian or an Eastern philosopher?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

No, I read various philosophies. I've described myself more of a Machiavellian in terms of philosophy.

[Interviewer Todd]

Machiavellian?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

So in other words, you want to be in charge of everything?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Well, not necessarily. By a view that a strong, strong series of policies is necessary and that self government will be one of our ultimate goals. Uh huh.

[Interviewer Todd]

And who would you like to have enforcing those policies?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

I don't think any single person is capable of enforcing those policies.

[Interviewer Todd]

You're supposed to say you. That's the Machiavellian answer.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes. You would work if view was ever perfect. Which Machiavellian relies on laws garnering what you can do?

[Interviewer Todd]

It was so that he's the one who's in charge.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes. In that situation he felt that he

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

should ultimately be in danger.

[Interviewer Todd]

So that's the problem with totalitarianism right there.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

It's just the corrupt nature of man.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Do you think that man is basically good or bad?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

I believe that man is generally good. However.

[Interviewer Todd]

Do we really?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes. Within the tariff being good, we do have a corrupt nature behind it.

[Interviewer Todd]

Oh, wow. Okay. I disagree completely.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah. I think I can prove it with you.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

All right.

[Interviewer Todd]

I think you've got a corrupt nature.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Okay, you ready? Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. I'm gonna ask you a series of questions. We'll see if we can prove that you've got a corrupt nature.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

How many lies in your young life do you think you've told?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Numerous.

[Interviewer Todd]

How many?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

I wouldn't be able to give you a firm number on them.

[Interviewer Todd]

A lot of them.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right, so if I told a lot of lies, what would you call? What name would you give to me?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Love. Corrupt, of course.

[Interviewer Todd]

Specifically, though, considering the issue. Rhymes with pants on fire. Liar, liar. Okay, all right, so you're a liar. Can we agree to that?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Sure.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. How many things do you think you've stolen in your life?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

None that I'm aware of.

[Interviewer Todd]

I'm not talking about like. Like credit card fraud, you know, from a sibling, from your mom or dad. Downloading music, checking into work, but not really working. Anything that would be stealing.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Wouldn't really say I've had any of those experiences.

[Interviewer Todd]

Nothing?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Nothing.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right. Only, you know. Okay, how's about. How's about being a perfect child? Were you always Johnny on the spot doing everything that you were told to do?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Well, not always, no. Generally, yes, of course. Times. You'll do what you want to do rather than.

[Interviewer Todd]

Don't make me call your mother. I'll ask her. Okay. Because you are not just like any other kid. You know, you go to McDonald's and you see that kids are just monsters, the way they behave and stuff. And you were probably pretty much the same, right? All right, a little more probing your thought, life in your heart, lusting X rated thoughts, lusting after women. Have you ever done that?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes. Yes, I have.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. How many times today?

[Brazilian Student]

Today?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Maybe a few times.

[Interviewer Todd]

A few times. And how old are you?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

I am 17.

[Interviewer Todd]

17. 17.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

You're going to school here?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes. In the early admissions program.

[Interviewer Todd]

So you're really smart.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Hopefully.

[Interviewer Todd]

Wow. Good for you. Well done. So how did you get out? How did you get out of high school that quick?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Well, Georgia Tech is a program where they accept people who rank high enough on paper from their junior year of high school directly without graduating.

[Interviewer Todd]

Wow.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

So I haven't graduated yet.

[Interviewer Todd]

Good for you. Well, that's terrific. Okay, so lusting. So you're 17. So let's say five years, a few times a day.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Okay.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right. You're the math guy. 365 times. Three would be about a thousand a year. So 5,000 times.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Inside of your heart, when nobody was looking, you had thoughts that would be. Well, mom and dad wouldn't be really thrilled to know that their son was thinking that.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

All right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. So that, to me sounds pretty corrupt.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Well, I'm told that's still a corrupt lining within it that general. The majority of the time, you're working to achieve whatever you view as your goal. However that goal may be.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, that's Machiavellian for sure, what you're describing, but that still isn't. That's kind of skirting around the issue of whether you are basically good or basically bad. I mean, if you've lusted 5,000 times, assuming of course that's a bad thing, and lied a lot of times, and dishonored to your parents when you were just being naughty, maybe coveting, desiring stuff that doesn't belong to you, maybe vulgarity out of your mouth, well, that would make you actually not good, wouldn't it?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Well, that would mean that part of you is not good. However, I would hold that the majority of you could still be good in that, Working to achieve what you're working on.

[Interviewer Todd]

Really. All right, let's see if we can reason together. All right, let's say I'm a copy criminal and I'm standing before the judge, and I've committed 5,000 crimes.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Give or take. Yes, 5,000 crimes. And I said to the judge, but, judge, that's just a part of me. He's gonna say, part of you. You've broken the law 5,000 times. You are a bad criminal. You got to go to jail.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

I mean. I mean, what if I even said, well, but judge, I've done 5,000 nice things? He'd say, I don't care, dude, you've broken the law. 5,000.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

You're still going to be punished for the negative things that have happened similarly in life, if you continue to do things that would be deemed corrupt.

[Interviewer Todd]

Let me drop something on you. You see what you think about this, okay? I think you said if you could ask God one question, it would be, what's the point? What are we doing here? Let's say you died and God judged you. Do you think that you'd be going to heaven or hell?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Really not sure on that one.

[Interviewer Todd]

You've broken his laws at least 5,000 times.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

And he knows everything you've done. Every deed in darkness, every thought that you've had, every time you fail to thank him for error. So he knows that you've broken his laws. What should he do if he's just. And if he's good, punishment. Exactly. So you would be going to hell. Dude, horrible thought. Okay, I happen to be a Christian. What does Christianity say is the good news of the Gospel? What is the way that God has provided so that you don't have to

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

go to Hell, essentially. Repenting for your sin.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's right. But the big component, though, the reason that we do that is because of Jesus, because he died on a cross. The unjust or the just for the unjust. In other words, the good guy dying for you. The bad guy.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

He lived the perfect life. He kept all the laws, all the rules that you've broken. He kept them. He was beaten by men, put on a cross, taking the wrath of the Father on your behalf, so that if you'll repent and put your trust in him, then all of your sins will be forgiven and God will grant you everlasting life. That's the good news of the gospel.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, now that fits into what are we doing here? Because I think the biblical answer is to glorify God and enjoy him forever. And here's how you glorify God one of two ways. You will glorify God by living the rest of your life for yourself and breaking his laws. And then he'll give you what you've earned. He'll pay you your wages for what you've done on earth, sinning, lying, lusting, porn, whatever it happens to be. He's going to give you exactly what you deserve and he'll send you to hell for that. And he'll be glorified because he's going to get the last laugh, if you will. He'll get the last word. You're in hell because you're the lawbreaker and he's still sitting on the throne.

[Todd Friel]

Exactly.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. There's another way that you can glorify God, and it's a much grander way. You can repent. Say you're sorry and turn from your sins and put your trust in His Son and He'll forgive you. So that for all of eternity everybody can point to you and say, that's how nice God is. He's that kind. He saved that dirty rotten sinner. That's how good he is. And that is how you can glorify God in this life is by repenting and trusting His Son, so that God can be glorified for being a good God and saving a bad guy like you and me. That would be the biblical answer to why are we here?

[Young Male Student with Mohawk]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

To glorify God and enjoy him forever. Yes. What do you do with that?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

I believe you have to take reasoned decision on that. You have to look what you're going to achieve within your life and how well you value that against eternity really, in terms of would you live your life as you're currently living now? Say you enjoy that and very much dislike your eternity versus live your life to that standard now and have a blissful eternity and glorify God in that manner.

[Interviewer Todd]

You actually just said something that Jesus asked. What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his very soul? Yes, you just kind of expanded that whole concept right there. So do you believe that, young man? Do you believe that Jesus died for you, a sinner?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes. Yes, I did.

[Interviewer Todd]

Have you repented and put your trust in him?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

No, I have not.

[Interviewer Todd]

So thinking time may be on the bench here at Georgia Tech today.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Of course.

[Interviewer Todd]

Something for you to ponder, isn't it?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Of course. Always time to reconsider things.

[Interviewer Todd]

Did you go to churches again?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

No, I didn't.

[Interviewer Todd]

But you've heard this before, haven't you?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes, I have.

[Brazilian Student]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Well, it's really important that you. You know, you can. You can sit and read a newspaper article and it really doesn't affect you, but something has to happen with the information I just gave to you. That's different than just reading a newspaper article. It's got to be real. First of all, the story itself has to be real. The newspaper article has to be true. But you have to respond to it. It's not enough to just get it, Read the story or hear the story and go, that's interesting. I find that fascinating. You've got to respond to it in childlike humility and repentance and faith. Because if you don't do that, God says that you'll show up for Judgment Day and he's going to say, depart from me. I never knew you.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

So think about it, because I would tell you it's true. And your reason for living is to glorify God and enjoy him forever. And he wants to do that primarily by saving you. He will send you to hell because he's just. And he must. But he would much rather demonstrate his kindness by saving a guy like you and me. So think about the Gospel. Do you have a Bible?

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Yes, I do.

[Interviewer Todd]

Good for you. Get home and read the Gospel of John and just read about it. And don't trust me. I'm a complete stranger. A guy on a bench with a microphone. Read the Bible and see if you agree that God is your Savior, that Jesus is your savior, and he died to save you. Repent and put your trust in him. Fair enough.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Fair enough.

[Interviewer Todd]

You're an interesting young man. Thanks for the chat. I enjoyed this very much. Thanks for the chat, dude. Thank you. All right. See you, man.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Goodbye.

[Interviewer Todd]

Enjoy the book. Pray for him, Would you? This is Wretched Radio.

[Narrator/Promoter]

Look, I'm gonna be straight with you. Every man knows what it's like to fight a battle. No one else can see. You wake up. You're determined that today is going to be different. This time, you're going to be stronger than the temptation. But then evening comes, there you are again, right back where you started. You're making promises to yourself that you already know deep down that you're not going to keep tomorrow. Here's what no one wants to admit. You can't win this fight with willpower. Trust me. If determination alone could break the chains of lust and sin, you would already be free. You've probably figured that out by now. The filters, the accountability apps, the promises to your wife or to yourself, they're just band aids on a wound that needs surgery. Real freedom, the kind that actually lasts. It only comes when Christ changes you from the inside out. Not just your habits, but your actual heart. That's what Todd Friel gets into very deeply with his resource Play the Man. It's available right now as an ebook, an audiobook and video series [e-mail] hey, thanks for listening to Wretched Radio today. You know, finding Bible teachers you can actually trust is not as easy as it used to be. There is a lot of content out there, but not all of it is faithful. That's what Fortis Institute is building. We've brought together a team of fellows. People like Tim Challis, Dr. Jason Lyle, Dr. Andrew Walker, Dr. Greg Gifford, Pastor Brad Bigny, Todd Friel, Dr. John Kratz, Libby Clawson, Dr. Adam Tyson. And they're all committed to teaching the word without apology. These aren't influencers. They're not chasing trends. These are ser teachers doing serious work. And the reason that we've been able to bring voices like this together in one place is because of our gospel partners. Men and women just like you, who find value in what we're doing at Fortis Institute. And if you appreciate what we're doing and you want to be a part of it, would you consider joining us as an ongoing monthly Gospel Partner? Help us to continue building something that matters. Just go to fortisinstitute.org right now. Wretched Amazing Grace Amazing Gospel Trust. The science. You've heard it a million times, usually right before someone uses it to shut a conversation down instead of opening one up. But science is a tool. It's not a judge. Like any tool, it depends on who's holding it and what they already believe. Two scientists can look at the exact same data and walk away with opposite conclusions because each one brought a different, different worldview to the table. Science also leans on a few things it can't prove that the universe stays orderly and that our minds can actually grasp truth. Both make the most sense of a rational God made it all. You take him out of the picture and you're left trusting that chaos somehow adds up. That's where in the beginning with Dr. Jason Lyle comes in. He's a PhD astrophysicist. He'll teach you to read the science headlines without getting played. New episodes of in the Beginning are dropped every single Wednesday on every single podcast platform in existence [e-mail].

[Todd Friel]

Attributes of God do you think God explodes with anger when you sin? Remember the word impassibility. It means that God is without passion. His affections, such as wrath, anger, and love, are always foreknown, voluntary, and controlled, and they are always consistent with God's unchanging nature. And his wrath has been settled on the cross. This is Wretched Radio with Todd Friel.

[Interviewer Todd]

Young man, hold on. While you're walking at your slow galloping pace, which is just my style, could I talk to you on the radio while you're walking?

[Lewis]

Uh, what for?

[Interviewer Todd]

I want to ask you some questions about you.

[Todd Friel]

Sure.

[Interviewer Todd]

And I got a big surprise for you. And if you don't like it, you can punch me in the nose and walk away.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

All right.

[Brazilian Student]

All right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Dude, how tall are you? Six' six. Six? No, you're not. Dude, no, because I think I'm taller than you, and I'm not six. Six. Now wait a second. Stand up straight. Oh, you. Maybe you are taller than me.

[Lewis]

I don't know.

[Brazilian Student]

Can't really tell.

[Interviewer Todd]

Maybe the spiky hair.

[Brazilian Student]

Might be the hair.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, could be. All right, what are you studying here at Georgia Tech?

[Lewis]

Mechanical engineering.

[Interviewer Todd]

So you want to be. Let me guess, a mechanical engineer?

[Brazilian Student]

Good. Good guess.

[Interviewer Todd]

How old are you?

[Brazilian Student]

19.

[Interviewer Todd]

19 years old. You come from where?

[Brazilian Student]

Brazil.

[Interviewer Todd]

Really?

[Brazilian Student]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

You speak English well?

[Brazilian Student]

Oh, I've been here for about five years now, so.

[Interviewer Todd]

But you grew up speaking Spanish or is it Brazilian? Is there a difference?

[Brazilian Student]

It's Portuguese, but grew up in a Spanish speaking country, so.

[Interviewer Todd]

So you are a Spanish speaking country? Yes, sir. You have no accent.

[Brazilian Student]

Thank you.

[Interviewer Todd]

Not that I would care if you did, but I'm just saying you've done well with that. Which language is easier by now?

[Brazilian Student]

I'd say English because missed out on Spanish for a long time. So I don't get to practice but

[Interviewer Todd]

technically, which one is easier to learn to speak?

[Brazilian Student]

Learn than speak? I would say English.

[Interviewer Todd]

Here's the rule that I've heard. English is the easiest language to learn. Learn. It's the hardest language to learn how to speak. Well, that could be true.

[Brazilian Student]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Because the grammar is not very Greek or Latin.

[Brazilian Student]

Too many variations to all the words. And it's a lot of memorizing a lot of things.

[Interviewer Todd]

Sure is a change. All right. Now, in Brazil, it is Roman Catholic, correct? Yeah. Are you Roman Catholic? Yes. Good. Tell me why I should be a Roman Catholic.

[Brazilian Student]

I don't know. Know. I mean, it's all your choice. I'm not gonna convince you.

[Interviewer Todd]

No, I want you to. Please.

[Brazilian Student]

I have no idea. I could not tell you. I mean, I haven't been to church in a while, but that's just how I was raised. I don't really know the beliefs and everything.

[Interviewer Todd]

So do you think you are really a Roman Catholic?

[Brazilian Student]

I am. Just by my parents. I'm not really.

[Interviewer Todd]

I mean, I'm not trying to be sarcastic. What's your dad do for a living?

[Brazilian Student]

He's a Spanish teacher.

[Interviewer Todd]

Are you a Spanish teacher?

[Brazilian Student]

No.

[Interviewer Todd]

So are you sure you're Roman Catholic?

[Brazilian Student]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, so. But you don't know why a guy like me should become a guy like you? I don't. Other than we could be on the Catholic volleyball team together and clean up.

[Brazilian Student]

If they have one.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, if they have one. All right. So you don't have an understanding of the basic beliefs of Roman Catholicism?

[Brazilian Student]

No.

[Interviewer Todd]

I mean, how does a guy like you get to heaven?

[Brazilian Student]

Doing good.

[Interviewer Todd]

Have you been doing good? I believe I have. Have you been doing bad?

[Brazilian Student]

Every once in a while.

[Interviewer Todd]

How often?

[Brazilian Student]

I don't know.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay. Should God reward you and send you to heaven or should he punish you and send you to hell? Reward you. Sure.

[Brazilian Student]

Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

What about the laws you've broken?

[Brazilian Student]

I mean, God always says forgiveness. He can forgive everyone if he forgives.

[Interviewer Todd]

That's right. There's something in there about forgiveness, but let's get to that in just a second. If you're guilty, what should he do with you? The right thing for a just judge to do with a guilty criminal is

[Brazilian Student]

send him to jail.

[Interviewer Todd]

Send him to jail. In this case, it would be to send him to hell.

[Lewis]

Right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, now, the forgiveness part, where does that fit into this picture here? How does that work?

[Brazilian Student]

It's just not the same as. You can't really consider it the same as a justice system because they don't really forgive. I mean, they go by the facts if you're guilty, you're guilty. You go to jail. If you're innocent, you don't. But by what you know, religion says, God will forgive you if you repent. I mean, it doesn't matter if you're innocent or guilty. I mean, if you have deep in your heart you really repent, he will forgive you.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah, okay, but here's. Here's in hearing you say that there's a problem, though. If God just says you're forgiven because you say you're really, really sorry, that isn't justice.

[Brazilian Student]

It's not just saying you're really, really sorry. You have to. It's from deep inside. You have to mean it. Not. Not just be like, oh, I'm sorry I did this. It's like you do bad your whole life and wait till the moment before you die and then just say you're sorry. That didn't work like that.

[Interviewer Todd]

But here's what I'm still confused about, though. The whole issue of justice. What about the bad stuff that you've done? How does that get compensated for?

[Brazilian Student]

I mean, just erase it.

[Interviewer Todd]

Just. It's gone.

[Brazilian Student]

The president has the power to do that. Erase everyone's record. I mean, the president, every. I don't know how many years he gets to forgive those people for everything, whatever they did. I'm pretty sure God has a good job.

[Interviewer Todd]

Let's try this one. All right? And we'll let you scoot. All right, let's try this one. Let's say you're a guilty guy. You're standing in the courtroom of God's justice, and he knows the books, okay? They're wide open. He knows everything you've done in secret, every deed done in darkness, every thought, everything you failed to do. The gavel's coming down, and you're guilty, and he should punish you. But if somebody steps into the courtroom and says, judge, I love that man and I will take the punishment that he deserves, the judge could commute your sentence to that man, and you could be set free because he took the punishment for you, and justice then could be satisfied. And the judge can show mercy to you based on what that man did for you.

[Brazilian Student]

I don't know. I don't think that would work out. I don't think that's fair.

[Interviewer Todd]

But that's. Well, it's not fair for that guy. But it's good news for you if you're the criminal, right? Yeah, that's the gospel, dude. That's what the Bible teaches, right? Isn't that the good news of the Gospel. I'm not sure you're the criminal. Jesus is the God man who loves you, who took the punishment, the wrath of the Father on your behalf by dying on a cross for you so that your court case can be dismissed. You've broken God's laws. But Jesus paid your fine so that you can go to heaven. Not because you're a good guy, because you're not. You're like the rest of us. You're a bad guy. But you can be forgiven by a very good God because of what he did. That's the gospel. That's the good news. Have you ever heard that before?

[Brazilian Student]

Makes sense. Yeah.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah. So here's the last question. If forgiveness is available for you so that you don't have to go to hell, you can have your slate wipe clean and be a dark. Adopted as God's child and brought into a right relationship with the God who is presently angry at you. You used the word repentance a minute or two ago. What does that mean?

[Brazilian Student]

Means deep inside, not just saying the words, you are really, truly sorry for everything. All the bad things, breaking the commandments, everything that you have done.

[Interviewer Todd]

Yeah. Basically turning from your sins, it's not that you become perfect, but you just. I don't want that stuff anymore. I want to go in his direction, not mine. There's one other thing you need to do to be saved. Repent and trust. It's repentance and faith. Kind of two sides of the same coin. You turn from your sins and you put your trust in Jesus, your fine payer. That's how you get your sins forgiven. You don't earn your way to heaven. It's been earned for you. And that way he gets the credit for being a good God, for saving a bad guy like you. That's the gospel. Okay, so I'm gonna scoot. Have you done that? Have you repented and put your trust in the Savior?

[Brazilian Student]

I have.

[Interviewer Todd]

Really? When did that happen?

[Brazilian Student]

I mean, when I was a young kid, when I was still, you know, going to church, all that and school. I went to a Catholic school. I was raised Catholic, so I went to a Catholic school. It's just. I mean, to tell you the truth, with school and everything, there's. You don't really get a chance, a chance to go back to the old ways and go to church and be, you know, do all the good things that you used to do. So.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Right.

[Interviewer Todd]

Okay, so I'm. Dude, I'm not your judge. I'm, you know, I'm not. I. I don't Send people to hell or send them to heaven. Okay, here's. Okay, my last, last question. Tricky, tricky word. I know. Is Jesus precious to you?

[Brazilian Student]

Yes.

[Interviewer Todd]

All right, dude, see ya.

[Young Male Student (Machiavellian)]

Thanks for your.

[Interviewer Todd]

Thanks for your chat. See you, man. Goodbye. If he is, then why isn't he living that way? Please do the same. Don't be deceived. It should fall right out of your mouth. If somebody says to you, what's going to happen to you when you die? Oh, it should just be so easy because it was so extraordinary when it happened. We've said it before, we'll say it again. Do you need to know the moment, the second that this happened? When you got born again? No, not the moment or the second, but you should be able to look back in your life sometime and say, you know, I remember that season. I used to be living like that. Then God changed my heart. And now I'm living like this. I have new affections, if you will. There's three components, three parts of salvation. Because people can outwardly reform themselves, they can make themselves look good. Well, that doesn't mean you're saved. Now, if you're saved, that will happen. An outward difference, you are living a different lifestyle. But there's more. Two parts, really. There needs to be a heart change. The inward affections. Not just behaving a certain way so that people will think a certain, certain thing, but because you want to. Because you love this God who saved you. But that's not all there is to it either. Because if you believe that Barney the Dinosaur is the God, then you are without hope because you don't believe in the true God. So your theology needs to be straight, too. You need to believe in Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the fully God, fully man, Savior of the world. Not a Jehovah's Witness version, not a Mormon version, only the Jesus of the Bible. Fully God, fully man. You've got to have a different lifestyle to prove you're a Christian, but that doesn't make you a Christian. You've got to have a different heart. That proves you're a Christian, but that doesn't make you a Christian either. If your theology isn't right, please examine yourself. Don't show up on Judgment Day and hear the final depart from me, worker of a I never knew you. It will chill you to the bones before you get thrown right into the flames. And there is no going back. So examine yourself today. Repent and put your trust in him today. And until tomorrow, go serve your King.