← WW2 Pod: We Have Ways of Making You Talk
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- [00:02]
James Holland
Thank you for listening to we have ways of making you talk. Sign up to our Patreon to receive bonus content, live streams and our weekly newsletter with money off books and museum visits as well. Plus early access to all live show tickets. That's patreon.com we haveways.
- [00:24]
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- [02:59]
James Holland
Attack with volleys of grenades from three sides by men who knew their lives depended upon getting the beach. The Germans broke and the beach was ours in no time at all. A semicircle of determined men were guarding the beach approaches while the signals started tapping out the come in call to the Navy. German fire increased and a few shells started whistling over. It was an anxious time. That's Second Lieutenant Young of C Company 2 Para.
- [03:23]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
My family knew I was a radar mechanic and they also knew from my letters that I was with the parachuters. For some reason they weren't fools and could put two and two together. In London, I sent a telegram. All's well, arriving tonight. When I arrived around midnight, they all sat waiting. My wife, father, mother and my baby daughter of six months. Hello, family, I said, I'm a bloody hero. And that, of course, is Flight Sergeant Charles Cox. Mm. Also known as Coxie.
- [03:49]
James Holland
Coxie, who's our radar expert, projectionist turned radar expert.
- [03:55]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Hello, family.
- [03:56]
James Holland
He's no longer tearing tickets at the Ritzy before he has to put King Kong on.
- [03:59]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No. Or Bambi.
- [04:00]
James Holland
Or Bambi. He's gone to Bruneval. Welcome to. We have ways of making you talk with me. I'm worried. James Holland for part four.
- [04:07]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
More drama than any film, I can tell you.
- [04:09]
James Holland
More drama than any film that I've ever seen, mate. Operation Biting. The Bruneval raid. The one unequivocally successful British airborne operation of the Second World War.
- [04:20]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
But there's still some hiccups.
- [04:22]
James Holland
Well, I mean, there would then be no story here if there weren't. The hiccups is the thing.
- [04:26]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
If there weren't no hiccups.
- [04:27]
James Holland
If there weren't no hiccups. So we left the Bruneval raid on a literal cliffhanger.
- [04:32]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Literal.
- [04:33]
James Holland
And thanks for those of you who subscribed, in order to scramble down those cliffs quicker, it's the 27th of February. Well, actually it's the 28th now. Yeah, about two in the morning. To summarize, C company, Jock company of Two Power, under Major John Frost, they've been dropped on the French coast near Le Havre to capture a Wurzburg, a radar set that's a big dish so that Robert Watson, Watts Boffins, R.V. jones, F.C. frank and the other clever people can have a proper look at German radio. Location technology, as they call it. And Frost and his men have a couple of hours from when they land at about quarter past midnight before the Royal Navy is supposed to arrive to rescue them. And the race is on. And the Germans have been caught by surprise to start with. But they've started to wake up. And as all airborne ops go, there's confusion. And this is exacerbated by half of the party, dubbed Nelson by planners who are supposed to secure the beach. Being dropped in the wrong place.
- [05:29]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yep. So they've got a tab through the
- [05:31]
James Holland
village as hard as they can.
- [05:32]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They've taken out a single German he's got a bit confused and tapped onto the back of them. Sad tragedy, isn't it?
- [05:38]
James Holland
It's a tragic business. Now, this. This group under Second Lieutenant Ewan Charteris, they've tabbed hard through the village of Pruneval and they arrive at the cliff top in the nick of time with cries of Kappa Fei. As. And I went on the Internet to find out how to pronounce it, which is the Seaforth Highlanders war cry, because this is a battalion made up of Scott's men and a few officers. Kappa fai. Kappa fai. Right. Now, Frost orders him to attack immediately.
- [06:06]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
What, towards?
- [06:07]
James Holland
Down towards the. Relieve the rest of Nelson. Who in a fight.
- [06:10]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Oh, right, yeah. Down on the beach.
- [06:11]
James Holland
Down on the beach.
- [06:12]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Where are the bunkers? Down the top or at the bottom?
- [06:14]
James Holland
There's a couple overlooking. And then there's emplacements and stuff. Lots and lots of wire. No minefields. As Remy and Paul. Roger and Charlemagne.
- [06:24]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Also known as Roger.
- [06:25]
James Holland
Also known as Roger. So the idea is that this half of Nelson should join up with the other half of Nelson, which is under The Sea Company's 2IC. Captain John Ross.
- [06:36]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Two halves to make a complete Nelson.
- [06:38]
James Holland
Precisely. Yeah. We've no longer on a half Nelson here. And they clear the house. Then the idea is to clear the house that dominates the beach itself.
- [06:46]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
What about the people from the Germans, from Presbyter?
- [06:49]
James Holland
Well, they're being held by Rodney. It's the idea.
- [06:51]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Okay.
- [06:51]
James Holland
Rodney is holding them. Yeah, but they. It doesn't matter. You've got to get off the beach and the beach isn't secure.
- [06:58]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Have you got any brands?
- [06:59]
James Holland
They're Bren guns. They've Sten guns, they've some rifles, but they're nothing heavier than that. They have no mortars.
- [07:04]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No.
- [07:05]
James Holland
Which would be, I think, kind of useful in a situation.
- [07:08]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [07:09]
James Holland
Anyway, Charteris, he leads his men down the. Down the. Down the cliff and there's a road that runs down to the cliff as a sun contract to the beach. And he says he feels as naked as a baby.
- [07:19]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, you can imagine.
- [07:20]
James Holland
Yeah. In his report just after the. After the operation. And they are about 70 yards from the house and with a volley of grades grenades, they storm what, the villa, the house at the bottom. There's a house on the beach right at the bottom that dominates the beach over at the beach, sat up from the sand.
- [07:36]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [07:37]
James Holland
And that. And if you go there now, it's changed. It's been. It's been to. It's a beach resort now. You. It's a bit different.
- [07:42]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [07:43]
James Holland
The space above is roughly the same. But anyway, they get into the house and they find there's one man with a machine gun called Schmidt, of course he is. Who promptly surrenders, who does his handy
- [07:54]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
nice and hot and hot.
- [07:55]
James Holland
And Schmidt says, I wondered whether I should fire, but it could not bring myself to shoot into a man's body at a range of few yards.
- [08:01]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I therefore surrendered the good German. Yeah.
- [08:04]
James Holland
But also a wise thing to do given the fact that they have been.
- [08:07]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They've been butchering people. Gay abandoned.
- [08:13]
James Holland
And the thing is is that the truth is that Germans have not manned their defensive positions adequately because I think
- [08:20]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
they're not gonna be top drawer, are they?
- [08:21]
James Holland
Let's face it. Well, yeah, but I also think the Germans probably think it's coming, going to come from the sea and they'll have due warning.
- [08:28]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
But even in 1942, these aren't going to be top trumps.
- [08:30]
James Holland
No, they aren't. No, no, no, no.
- [08:32]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Eastern front.
- [08:32]
James Holland
No, no, exactly. And Charterist says if Jerry had had the wit or guts to put up a good resistance, he must have done us great damage, for all he had to do was lob a grenade into us when we're in the Sunken Road. He did not, however, do so.
- [08:45]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
The fool.
- [08:46]
James Holland
The full. Jerry's a fool. He had neither the wit nor the guts, Jim. No, but what this shows is that margins on airborne operations like biting and like all those to come, is that they're fine. Fine, fine margins. Yes.
- [09:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I mean, I suppose in mitigation of the Germans, unlike the British, you know, there's around 100. They haven't got the faintest idea what's going on. And they've got people coming through the village from south of the village, from all over that seems to be shooting everywhere. It's a dark night, the snow on the ground.
- [09:17]
James Holland
Exactly. An enemy reaction is the difference between success and failure is what I think. You could tell this now about airborne ops. What the enemy choose elects to do is the difference between whether it works out or not. You can be as full of vim and vigor as anybody else and be the sharpest soldiers on the mat. But enemy reaction is the key, because bullets will kill good soldiers the same way they'll kill bad ones. Yeah, you still only flesh and blood. And because they have no heavy weapons, if they are mortared, there's no counter battery fire off their shell. There's no counter battery fire option at all. They just have to surrender. If that starts right. Anyway, as the sappers withdrew, they. They blow up.
- [10:00]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
As they.
- [10:00]
James Holland
As they withdraw, they blow up what's left of the. Of the Wurzburg emplacement. So Charlie Cox says, we began to
- [10:06]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
descend when there was a large explosion from behind us. There was one less Wurzburg. The res have blown it up.
- [10:12]
James Holland
That's right. So Cox gets to the beach with. With the Wurzburg and the other sappers, despite the kit they've been given, is the way he sees it. So he says.
- [10:21]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
We found that the equipment could be carried much better on our shoulders than by trolley. So the trolleys were abandoned. We made our way down to the beach and found we had to wait. So we stowed the equipment in a safe position under the cliff and as there was nothing else we could do, we just sat down and waited.
- [10:38]
James Holland
You, you know. Yeah.
- [10:40]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Give us a smoke, mate.
- [10:42]
James Holland
Yeah, that's exactly what's going on. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I mean, I don't know if they brew up at this point.
- [10:48]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Bold sweets.
- [10:49]
James Holland
I think it's boiled sweets at this point. Boiled sweets for your dry mouth. So with the beach secure, Charterist then gets his men into defensive positions, ready to hold the Germans off. And then Frost moves the rest. Because that's the idea is Nelson holds.
- [11:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So you have a little kind of.
- [11:03]
James Holland
Yeah, crust.
- [11:04]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Perimeter.
- [11:04]
James Holland
Perimeter. And the idea is that Nelson the last party off, so that's their job. They hold and then everyone else filters out the radar first, then everyone.
- [11:13]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's a bit like Dunkirk in miniature.
- [11:15]
James Holland
It's a mini collab. Yeah, exactly. Collapsing balloon, mini Dunkirk. So Frost moves his men actually onto the beach, onto the water's edge, ready to be rescued. But one question hangs heavy.
- [11:26]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Where's the navy?
- [11:28]
James Holland
Right, so at around 024, five hours, so quarter to three.
- [11:34]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So I've been there two and a half hours.
- [11:35]
James Holland
Two and a half hours. Right. Frost thinks his options are running out, so Charteris at this point lends the cricket jumper he's brought with him to keep warm. In the aircraft to keep Strawn warm.
- [11:48]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [11:49]
James Holland
Company side. Major Strachan Strawn is now deep in shock. Yeah. And he often. I never did see that jumper again.
- [11:56]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No.
- [11:56]
James Holland
Well, but a cricket jumper, Jim.
- [11:58]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I know, but these are. These are the sacrifices. One has to.
- [12:01]
James Holland
But this is. This is. I mean, I think what we have here is the perfect James Holland adventure.
- [12:05]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [12:05]
James Holland
It's got an app. It's got a cliff.
- [12:06]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's got an actual cricket sweater in it and an actual cliffhanger and a stripe.
- [12:13]
James Holland
Strawn has had to. Strawn has had to slither down the. The track on his bum with his stomach wounds to get down to the beach full of morphine. So I.
- [12:24]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
How did he do it?
- [12:25]
James Holland
Well, it's not good. And what. And what Frost. What Frost is worried about is if the Germans are given too much time, they'll be able to bring up more
- [12:32]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
and organize themselves a bit.
- [12:33]
James Holland
And organize themselves. And they'll get on the phone to, you know that the Presbyterian garrison is one thing. They'll get on the phone to whoever's local and bring up, bring up.
- [12:41]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. There's going to be a point where they're going to have to surrender. For them, the war will be over.
- [12:44]
James Holland
Exactly. And Charters recalls a few shells coming in. So tension is mounting on the beach like an imagine. Right. And there's Commander Cook. Ran. His ships are not responding to the signals being sent.
- [12:57]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
What the hell are they doing? Well, we know they're there.
- [13:00]
James Holland
Yeah. Yeah. Well. Well, this is the thing. So Frost then start. He says, all right, we'll fire the very lights. We'll fire the flares.
- [13:06]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [13:07]
James Holland
Which is the last resort. But the problem with that, of course is you light yourself up for the Germans to look at two evils, you've got to make a decision, haven't you?
- [13:17]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [13:17]
James Holland
So with his heart sinking, Frost begins to organize for a last ditch defense of the beach. Take his men back up onto the cliffs and dig in. Because they've never. They've not dug in at any point in this. They've not had time. So then Newman, Private Newman. Nagel. Nagel. Quizzes the prisoners again about possible German reaction strength. You know, but that Schmidt and Toyver and the other one Toyverse. That they're tors. They're too. They're too scared to be of any use.
- [13:48]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yes. I know nothing.
- [13:51]
James Holland
I know nothing.
- [13:52]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
We don't.
- [13:52]
James Holland
Please don't hit me again, Sergeant McGregor. Right. And Frost says it looked as though we be going to be left high and dry. And the thought was hard to bear. Just as we'd finished tidying up the perimeter, there came a joyful shout from one of the signalers. Sir, the boats are coming in. The boats are here. God bless the ruddy navy, sir. And I think that may have been tidied up. Yes.
- [14:14]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Recollections may vary exactly, but it.
- [14:17]
James Holland
This is the thing is, Cook's flotilla has not. It's not. They haven't just sailed across the Channel and come back. They've been fortunate to miss a schnell boot patrol.
- [14:25]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And we all know what schnell boots are like.
- [14:27]
James Holland
Yeah, well, and. And LCA and the motor gunboats. It just needs to be just that part of the plan. Just needs to be disrupted at all.
- [14:36]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And you're screwed.
- [14:37]
James Holland
And you're screwed. And the navy. The navy will go. Not worth it. We're out of here. And the assault ship, the Prince Albert, has already. Is already gone back to loiter off. Portsmouth is not there for the LCAs to liaise with. They're going to tow the. Tow the assault craft back. The radar having been put on one of the motor gunboats, though.
- [14:57]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, that's the important bit. The man are expendable. The radar is infantry.
- [15:00]
James Holland
The infantry, yes. Are consumable in this.
- [15:04]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So how much drama do you want?
- [15:05]
James Holland
Well, it's all here, isn't it? So the LCAs are supposed to come in two by two. This is what they practice. They all come in all at once.
- [15:11]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Of course they do.
- [15:12]
James Holland
Of course they do. And as arranged, the wounded had taken off first with the Wurzburg. Right. Then all hell breaks loose. Complete collapse of order. The men rushing on to embark all the practices they'd done at Loch Fine out the window. And of course, the last exercise they did with the navy, which was on one of the nights the operation was cancelled, or postponed, rather, had been a complete cock up, complete disaster. So they're training with the navy. Yeah.
- [15:40]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So confidence has been undermined in that final practice.
- [15:42]
James Holland
Absolutely. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So wading out to the boats, distressed at the chaotic.
- [15:47]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I'm looking after number one, pal.
- [15:49]
James Holland
Exactly. Yeah, well, exactly. I'm getting here, pal. And Frost is. Frost is one of the last to leave. He does the right thing.
- [15:56]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
He's ic.
- [15:57]
James Holland
Left behind are some of Charteris's defensive party and two signalers. What?
- [16:03]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Left behind. Left behind.
- [16:04]
James Holland
Left behind. They aren't. They. They don't make it. They don't get on board because it's dark, it's confusing.
- [16:10]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
How many are we talking about here?
- [16:12]
James Holland
So it's about Six guys are left behind.
- [16:13]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Okay. It's not too many.
- [16:14]
James Holland
It's not too many on board the LCAs, though. There are Welsh commandos with a load of Bren guns. So when they pull up, they just
- [16:22]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
open up and just let rip. Yeah, yeah. And they.
- [16:24]
James Holland
They're firing at the Germans on the cliff tops. The noise blasting over the evacuation. Frost says the noise is like complete. It's absolutely definitely unbelievable.
- [16:33]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [16:35]
James Holland
Frost goes to Commander Cook and says, can we go back and get the missing blokes, please? And Cook, of course, refuses, point blank.
- [16:43]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No.
- [16:43]
James Holland
It work? No, mate.
- [16:45]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Absolutely not. Well, of course. He's an Aussie.
- [16:47]
James Holland
Exactly. You Frosty?
- [16:49]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [16:51]
James Holland
That ain't happening. Fitting.
- [16:53]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I'm doing FS and palms.
- [16:54]
James Holland
Exactly. Because they need to go before the Kriegsmarine, putting a proper, proper appearance.
- [16:58]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, fair enough.
- [16:58]
James Holland
Because after all the, you know. Yeah.
- [17:00]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They've already dodged one Chanel boot.
- [17:02]
James Holland
Exactly. You know. And as they're leaving, Frost is. He's really, really anxious for the men left behind.
- [17:10]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, well, he would be, wouldn't he?
- [17:11]
James Holland
And has to be told the raid's a success. You've done it. You've got the Wurzburg.
- [17:17]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Well, you haven't got home yet, but.
- [17:18]
James Holland
But, yeah, but you've got the Wurzburg. You've got an operator, they're on the way home. You've done your bit. Right. It's the navy now and the raf. Fighter escort in the morning. They've got to deliver. You have pulled it off completely. And again we come back to the thing Frost cares about is his blokes. And he's. He's so anxious that people have been left behind that he can't see that this is. This thing is like a. He's completely knocked out the park. Particularly as the plan went wrong. It wasn't the command structure he wanted. His men, his officers have absolutely delivered. It's. It's a bit. It couldn't be any better. Right, so for the cost of 2 killed, 6 wounded, who are the 2 killed? One has been one tyre and another. Another. Yeah, yeah. Six wounded, six missing or capt.
- [18:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [18:02]
James Holland
German losses are talked up by the British office. Boy Browning says we killed 40 Germans. And of course, probably not. Right. Probably those. The people who are killed are the guy in the villa and the radar operators who were rather enthusiastically bumped off.
- [18:20]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [18:21]
James Holland
But it doesn't matter. They've got the Versburg. It's been captured. Biting had bit. And we're going to take a break and we'll look at the return and then the aftermath.
- [18:38]
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- [19:38]
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- [20:42]
James Holland
Welcome back to we have ways to make you talk with me. I'm Orion James Holland for the our final part of our final part of the Operation Biting Bruneval raid. And we close the last part with C company having lost two men killed, six wounded, six missing. They're on the lcas.
- [20:59]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yes, they are.
- [20:59]
James Holland
They have the Versberg A. Wow. They're on their way home.
- [21:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [21:03]
James Holland
We'll get to what this raid amounts to, what it leads to in a bit. But I think what's really interesting is there's lots of footage of these five
- [21:11]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
knots or so I mean.
- [21:12]
James Holland
I know, I know.
- [21:13]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So the motor, painfully slow. That's like. That's like the Ohio coming into Grand Harbor.
- [21:17]
James Holland
There's footage of this. There's the motor gunboats towing the LCAs in three in threes. So they're towing three.
- [21:24]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's very unmecessive for Sea Lion. The German plan to tow everyone across.
- [21:27]
James Holland
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So. So at dawn, fighter escort overhead appears from 11 group.
- [21:32]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. Because, of course, dawn's late.
- [21:33]
James Holland
It's.
- [21:34]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, it's February, double summertime as well.
- [21:35]
James Holland
Exactly, yeah, yeah. And the clocks haven't gone forward. And the third component of the RAF's, which is the third component of the RAF's contribution to fighting because they've done diversionary raids. They put the parachuted the lads in 51 Squadron under Percy Pickard's pipe. And then they're also providing fighter escort. And word is already out, right, they know what they're escorting and they fly down and waggle their wings to salute the lads coming home.
- [21:59]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Look out for that wolf.
- [22:01]
James Holland
Exactly.
- [22:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Look out for those, I say.
- [22:04]
James Holland
And in the footage, one of the things you'll notice is that the men are wearing their bonnets because they're Scott, from Scottish regiments. They're not wearing maroon berets.
- [22:15]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Not yet.
- [22:15]
James Holland
Not yet.
- [22:16]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And the mythos of Frost is still wearing his helmet.
- [22:19]
James Holland
Yeah. The mythos of the maroon beret is not. Is not yet upon us. Right. They're not red devils yet because that's North Africa. And even then. Is that to do with the clay, the red clay on there? Anyway, in addition to the Luftwaffe don't put in an appearance, they never show up.
- [22:34]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yep.
- [22:35]
James Holland
The powers are all exhausted and exhilarated. It's all gone. Well, in addition to this, Free French chasseurs, which are the Bayonne.
- [22:43]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
But what is a chasseur?
- [22:45]
James Holland
Is it a destroyer?
- [22:46]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No, is it? Yes, it is. It's a destroyer, isn't it?
- [22:50]
James Holland
Yeah. The Bayonne, the Calais, the Lamore, Le Lamore and the Lavande show up to escort the LCAs.
- [22:57]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And who are you serving with? I'm serving with.
- [23:02]
James Holland
And the raw navy then turn up with some destroyers, HMS Blen Cathra and HMS Fernie, offering to escort the conquering heroes back to base. Yeah.
- [23:12]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
In the days when we had a navy. Yeah.
- [23:13]
James Holland
And they blair ruled Britannia from their speakers.
- [23:16]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Of course they do. Yeah.
- [23:19]
James Holland
I mean, everyone. This is just shows how desperate everyone is for some good news. Right. And the good news travels fast. Yeah.
- [23:28]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
We've won the war.
- [23:29]
James Holland
We've won the war.
- [23:30]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
We've got the.
- [23:31]
James Holland
These guys have. They've gone ashore and they've destroyed a German Wurzburg. They've destroyed the radar. And I. I often think about this. If you're someone in the know who knows half of what's going on here, you know that from the newspapers, you know they've stolen it. If you. If you're a tall savvy, you don't think for a minute they've just popped in and destroyed a radar. So you know they've pinched it. Right.
- [23:50]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [23:51]
James Holland
For all the secrecy. It's obvious, isn't it?
- [23:53]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Obvious.
- [23:54]
James Holland
Right. I mean, because what's the point in just destroying one?
- [23:57]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. Anyway, no, but. But you're denying it. You're seeded out.
- [24:01]
James Holland
It's plausible. Right. So Cox is with the Wurzburg gear and he's debriefed immediately on the MGB by a scientist from the technical research establishment at Swanage, a man called Donald Priest. And Priest, if things had gone better, was supposed to come ashore and have a look, but he doesn't. So Cox describes this encounter. It's fantastic.
- [24:19]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. So Cox, he says, saying the words of Donald Preez, he goes, now, Flight Sergeant, I want a description of everything you saw before memory becomes clouded. He said, permission to be sick, sir? I retorted, never having been to sea before, you can be sick later. He replied, at the moment, greater issues than your physical comfort are at stake. Oh, why don't. Why are we like that now? Oh, we are fantastic. I told him all I knew about a German radar. Also the impressions I gathered of the construction. At the end, I was released and was sick, made an immediate recovery and drank a mug of sweet, strong tea, then fell asleep in the captain's bunk.
- [24:59]
James Holland
How about that? Yeah. One of the interesting things is in another account when he says, I think it's really well made. Priest says, I think you better keep that on your hat.
- [25:11]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
- [25:12]
James Holland
That's not.
- [25:12]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Let's not brag about that.
- [25:13]
James Holland
Let's not talk about that. Tell anyone about that.
- [25:15]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
You can be sick later.
- [25:17]
James Holland
It's just brilliant, isn't it? Greater issues than your physical comfort.
- [25:22]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I just. I want to.
- [25:23]
James Holland
That's a.
- [25:24]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
That's a line, isn't it?
- [25:26]
James Holland
It certainly is.
- [25:26]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I want to use it more often in conversation.
- [25:29]
James Holland
But Cox is awarded the military medal, which is really unusual for an airman.
- [25:33]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Good.
- [25:33]
James Holland
And in later life, he'd wear an RAF beret with a Parachute regiment badge on it. Beautiful little para reg badge, because if anyone's earned it, he's him. Yeah. So 08.15 hours. Commander Cook, Royal Australian Navy Signals Commander in Chief, Portsmouth. Bubbles.
- [25:50]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yes, bubbles.
- [25:52]
James Holland
Bubbles. That the raid has been a triumph and all CR craft a present and returning to port. And so news then spreads quickly in the dockyard and the press rush to Portsmouth. A crowd shows as the flotilla returns.
- [26:07]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Amazing.
- [26:08]
James Holland
And the first to arrive off spithead is MGB312, which has the.
- [26:11]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I mean, how many great naval moments have happened off Spithead?
- [26:14]
James Holland
It's incredible, isn't it? Right, and this arrives with the catch of Wurzburg Cox Priest Frost is on board. She pulls alongside the Prince Albert. Ten hundred hours. Then the rest will toddle into the Solent at around half past four that afternoon.
- [26:27]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's been a long day.
- [26:28]
James Holland
I know, but they drunk a lot of tea. They drank a lot of tea.
- [26:31]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Well, I.
- [26:31]
James Holland
Well, I think there may be some rum on offer for the price or two. Yeah, exactly. And. And they're all Crambleau, Dexter Paris. They're not having a good time on the MGB, actually, no. But by 1800 they're transferred onto the Prince Albert. That then sails into Portsmouth and. And drops them off, arriving at about 10 o' clock that night.
- [26:49]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Loving it.
- [26:49]
James Holland
And you think they implaned 24 hours earlier. And again, Rule Britannia as a crime.
- [26:56]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Let's make the most of it.
- [26:57]
James Holland
Press and photographers. Wing Commander Pickard shows up. Percy Pickard shows up and there's a great picture of him with some powers examining a German helmet that. Yes, Someone brought home with him. Yeah. And there's also a picture.
- [27:10]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And you've seen that?
- [27:10]
James Holland
I've seen that. I've seen that. How much we'll talk about in a war waffle episode sometime. And Toyvers, the raid. The he captured. He's brought home. He's brought home with them with the versible. Talk about him in a minute.
- [27:22]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I bet he hadn't expected that 24 hours earlier.
- [27:24]
James Holland
Of course not. And there's a picture of him being searched on one of the boats by a para who has his number four rifle and Mauser that he's taken as a trophy over his shoulder.
- [27:36]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Love it.
- [27:37]
James Holland
And he doesn't have his Luftwaffe badges on tyres because he's had them torn off by Private Nagel Hash Slash newman. So it's 120 Raiders.
- [27:48]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yep.
- [27:48]
James Holland
12 sticks of 10 men, two dead, eight wounded or six wounded. Again, the figures vary justly. Six missing. The Wurzburg captured. German loss is something similar. As we said. Major General Browning said that Frost boys had killed 40 Germans. They did not kill 40 Germans. But the thing is, of the rest of C Company and what happens to them? Many then go on to lose their lives in North Africa. And you're in charters. For instance, his account is from just after Bruno Valn. He's killed in. In North Africa when. When two power has sent in some really harebrained operations. I think we will get around to on the podcast at some time because.
- [28:23]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Oh well, we're going to do thing on Tunisia.
- [28:25]
James Holland
We have to. But I think, I mean even just. Just what the three parachute battalions find themselves doing, where they're. Where they're sent on these hair braid airborne operations and then they're kept in the line because their value of as shock troops.
- [28:37]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Well, maybe we should do. We should do Tunisia as one thing and that the airborne ops in North Africa is another.
- [28:42]
James Holland
I mean, you know, Frost stands at the door to choose where he's going to parachute.
- [28:46]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
You know, we probably could do a detailed series on Paris in Sicily. Can we?
- [28:52]
James Holland
We could. We could do all of this, Jim, because after all it's a bottomless pit. So the following morning, Frost longs for a warm bed, fresh clothing. But he says. But before that there was some serious drinking to do. I. And I. I do not doubt it that he got thoroughly. I mean when he arrived in Bruneville, he went for a slash. Now he's back in Portsmouth, he's going on the lash.
- [29:15]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yes. From slash to lash.
- [29:17]
James Holland
Slash the lash, the John Frost story.
- [29:20]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And then slash again, slash again, I imagine.
- [29:22]
James Holland
So the following morning at Till's Head, the glider pilot regiment officers where that. Which. Which is where they see company billeted at breakfast. They're reading the papers saying to Frost, good God, I wonder who these chaps could have been.
- [29:35]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Modesty, thank you for bed.
- [29:39]
James Holland
But what then happens? And we. We started the previous episode with Frost's I had to go to Westminster. Yes, we did because I was there.
- [29:48]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [29:49]
James Holland
And he's a. I think his account is an extraordinary snapshot of the War cabinet in late February 1942. The personalities. So he summoned before his debrief premises to the.
- [30:00]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
The Turtle War Rooms. Yeah, yeah. As they're now called. Very own.
- [30:04]
James Holland
Yeah. With Brown, with. With Boyd Browning. So he's. He's rushed to Birdcage Walk to take the Cabinet through what's happened and Church is there, siren suit, cigar.
- [30:13]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [30:13]
James Holland
Yeah. So your image of Winston Churchill in the sort of.
- [30:16]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
He's on message dark phase of the war.
- [30:18]
James Holland
He's in his siren suit. And so they're all gathered together, the War Cabinet and various others and combined operations Headquarters supremo Lord Manbatten tells the story of the raid and. And Frost is really impressed at how well he's across it. He knows all the details, of course, the papers have told the story, but not the reason for the raid. And I love this. As Mountbatten starts. Archibald Sinclair is a minister who's a Liberal minister, and Anthony Eden the Foreign Secretary start talking amongst themselves and Churchill stops Mountbatten and says, come over here, you two, and listen to this for then you might learn something for once in your lives. Yeah, you're right there.
- [31:03]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. Or else you can go on the naughty step.
- [31:05]
James Holland
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Mountbatten proceeds again. The PM stops him and asks Frost to verify Mountbatten's version of events. Major Frost, please tell us.
- [31:16]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [31:17]
James Holland
Frost is able to confirm that, yes, that's what's happened, even down to the name of the sergeant. Everything. When, when the account of the raid's done, Portal is asked to explain exactly what seizing the Wurzburg radar means for the war. Eff. And Portal starts up with, well, you know, the frequency wavelength that the Germans are operating on, blah, blah, blah. And Churchill says, now I'll just stop all that nonsense, Portal, and put it into language that ordinary normal mortals can understand.
- [31:45]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And Portal replies, we now have every hope of not only being able to improve our own radar, but that at some future date of our own choosing, will. Will be able to jam the whole of the enemy radar Advanced Warning System.
- [32:01]
James Holland
That is what it's all about. Yes. This is why Portal's there, because this is. This is all about the bomber offensive. No two ways about it. So then Churchill asks Frost to take him through the. The raid using the model. Yes, that they've got because they brought the model from. From Til's head for them to look at.
- [32:20]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [32:20]
James Holland
And. And Churchill does this whole thing.
- [32:22]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They.
- [32:22]
James Holland
They really.
- [32:23]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I mean, Frost has got an opportunity to win in a VC there and then.
- [32:27]
James Holland
Well, we'll come to that. We'll come to that. And. And Browning starts pestering Portal for planes, saying, you never give me any aircraft for my airborne forces. Here's your proof of concept. And Portal literally raised. He raises his fist in a play fight style.
- [32:47]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's all good japes.
- [32:48]
James Holland
It's all good japes. Frost is dismissed. And he's been. He was in the bath when he was summoned. So he then goes to his London club and has a bath that was interrupted at Till's head.
- [32:57]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [32:57]
James Holland
So Frost then becomes a bit of a celebrity. He meets the King and the Queen. He's Awarded a Military Cross. He goes up and down the country telling the story of the Bruneval raid, which is possibly why the story is well rehearsed in his memoir.
- [33:09]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [33:10]
James Holland
And obviously Singapore's just fallen, the war in the desert is curdling.
- [33:15]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
He could have got a DSO for
- [33:16]
James Holland
that, to be fair. Well, again, we'll get to. We'll get to the question of what he's awarded with and how and why that a bit later. Because there is a conversation that Victor Dover has with Louis Manbatten where anyway, well, I'll eat my sandwich now. Basically, Louis Manbatten says to Victor stover in like 1978, before he's. Before he's killed, he's. Dover says, why didn't Frost get a vc? And he said if he'd taken more casualties, he would have got a Victoria Cross. But the fact that he pretty much brought everyone home wasn't a bloodbath means he gets an mc. He said, I tried, I tried, but the War Office weren't having it. And you think that's your calculus.
- [33:53]
Peyronie's Disease Advertiser
Yeah.
- [33:53]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It sounds about right though, doesn't it?
- [33:54]
James Holland
Does sound about right. But Frost is a glimmer of hope, you know.
- [33:58]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [33:59]
James Holland
Good news. He's a. It's a fresh martial spirit couched in his hunting horn. It's success.
- [34:04]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [34:05]
James Holland
And when the King comes to visit Frost, they meant to do a parachute demo, but on arrival at Tilzet, the King decides to visit the guard room and say hello to the chaps. The guard room. As they're stood at the door, their parachuting. So he misses the first half of the parachute demo because he's going, and
- [34:25]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
what do you do?
- [34:27]
James Holland
Someone's going, well, your majesty, I answer the phone or whatever. Right. And so they've managed to get a message up to the.
- [34:34]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's a frightfully important job.
- [34:36]
James Holland
Frightfully important job. They managed to get the second pair of planes to wait. So when the King comes out of the guard room, they.
- [34:42]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They down come, they're from Ayrshire, I've been there. Very nice.
- [34:48]
James Holland
But Frost says that the King made a great impression on me, on him. He says I must admit to being captivated and found it easy thereafter to say with heart and voice, God save the King. Indeed. This could be very useful at times, even though not said aloud. Different times, Jim.
- [35:05]
Gary from Goal Hangers (Sponsor)
I don't know.
- [35:05]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I mean,
- [35:09]
James Holland
anyway. But I mean, aside from the sort of this extraordinary debt of daring, doing all this is. What do we get? What did. What do the British.
- [35:19]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Let's get cut to the Quick on this.
- [35:20]
James Holland
Right. So is it worth it? The Wurzburg A radar in the raid in technological terms is a plain success.
- [35:27]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yes.
- [35:27]
James Holland
No two ways about it. Getting our hands on the Wurzburg A the TRA Technical Research Establishment is able to see the state of the standard art in Germany. Not the most advanced thing, but what they're using for everything. Mass produced radar. 4,000 of these sets have been built. Right. So Flight Sergeant Cox's initial judgment, the Verseberg is very well manufactured, is born out, everyone agrees. Yeah, it's really beautifully put together but it's not surprising in itself as a piece of kit. The switching in unit that comes with it is of great interest. But the rest of it, they actually go. Well, they haven't, they haven't caught up with us. Our stuff is actually as good as or better than theirs. They aren't innovating particularly well. And the capture of the Wurzburg eight leads directly to development of Window, the foil strips that you know, the most famously used on a Hamburg raid that caused. So this raid leads directly and the
- [36:25]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
adoption of the bomber stream.
- [36:27]
James Holland
Yeah, the bomber stream idea that you
- [36:29]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
just, you go in a mass and flood.
- [36:31]
James Holland
Well, if you go over one, you go over one radar location point rather than lots. Yeah. Then you're through and the bomber stream comes directly from this and window and you know the Bruneval raid leads directly to the destruction of Hamburg. Yeah. In your balance sheet, Private McIntyre and the other power killed on the, on the raid lead directly to the, to the, to the Hamburg raid.
- [36:56]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [36:57]
James Holland
And because they know this, it's harder for the Germans to read Bomber Command's intentions on a raid. Right. And you can spoof because you, you overwhelm one radar with a spoof raid, another with another, and the Germans never know which way to turn. And this is the thing they learn from getting their hands on the Versburg personnel is the other really interesting thing. So Toyviz, the operator who they've picked up, he doesn't know how the Wurzburg works, He doesn't know what it is.
- [37:21]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
He just does what he's told.
- [37:22]
James Holland
Does what he's told. He thought it could see the enemy somehow. He keeps talking about how it could see. He doesn't know it's a radio echolocation device. Device. Right. Wow. He doesn't work believe it works well in bad weather because the clouds obscure the.
- [37:35]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
But this is bollocks.
- [37:36]
James Holland
It's bollocks.
- [37:37]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [37:38]
James Holland
And the tre. Well read. Read this Jim, because this is fantastic.
- [37:42]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
The prisoner was rather childlike and extremely Unsoldierly in mentality. It is probable that with time he would have acquired considerable manual skill in following a target with his apparatus. But it is quite certain that he would never have understood his working. The slightest abnormal event would either cause him to declare his apparatus unserviceable or more probably, to continue cheerfully taking totally erroneous observations.
- [38:05]
James Holland
Isn't that interesting?
- [38:06]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They're not as good as us.
- [38:07]
James Holland
They're not as good as us. I mean, the fact is, maybe if Lieutenant.
- [38:10]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They're inferior.
- [38:11]
James Holland
Yeah, but maybe if Lieutenant Young hadn't killed all the others, there'd be a different assessment because they maybe would have found the brain.
- [38:18]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No, it was a heat at the moment and his brother's up.
- [38:20]
James Holland
But it's. But isn't that interesting? Yes, because they haven't got their best people on it and their training isn't the thing where you're told what the principles are before you get into work.
- [38:31]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Say that before. Say it again. German army's not as well trained as everyone thinks.
- [38:35]
James Holland
And the TRE conclude from this that no matter how good the German kit might be, their manpower problems mean they haven't got the sharpest minds working on radio location.
- [38:45]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Don't know what to do.
- [38:46]
James Holland
Isn't that interesting?
- [38:47]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, it's absolutely amazing.
- [38:49]
James Holland
And a subtle thing, Right? And this suggests a weakness the Germans might have no solution to.
- [38:54]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Right.
- [38:54]
James Holland
Regardless of technical innovation, you can make the the best kits.
- [38:58]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
We haven't got the men and we've got the people. And by the way, they're all being killed on the Eastern front.
- [39:01]
James Holland
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And the other thing, the TRE realize
- [39:05]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
all being sent to gas chambers, of course.
- [39:07]
James Holland
Yeah, yeah. The other thing the TRE realize from the Bruneville raid is that maybe being in Swanage on the coast isn't the best place for the radar research establishment because from aerial photography, it's blindingly obvious. They do their own aerial photography on. Stop. Swanger. Go. Oh, shit. It looks like a great big radar site. It's obvious what this is, right? And they go, it must be very difficult. It'd be very, very difficult to blame the Germans for pulling off a similar attack on Sponage. And we'd only have to blame ourselves, right? And there's a rumor that an airborne Falchio MJGI movement unit has moved to Northern France just after Bruneval. And so they're thinking, oh, crap, right? And within three months, tre's gone to Malvern. And then the other thing, though, the other thing is the Germans then start to defend their Wurzburgs more thoroughly with an unintended consequence. And again, this is from the TRE report.
- [40:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
There were several sites which were formerly suspected to contain Wurzburgs which were insufficiently distinct on existing photographs to be identified. The Germans have now obligingly surrounded these sites with wire and have confirmed our suspicions. These sites were well maintained with the grass cut around the barbed wire. This method of betrayal might well be noticed by those responsible for camouflaging our own stations.
- [40:25]
James Holland
Isn't that amazing?
- [40:26]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [40:27]
James Holland
So they're mowing the lawn around the barbed wire and marking out the Wurzburg.
- [40:32]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. I love it.
- [40:33]
James Holland
Because they need to defend the Wurzburg rather than just conceal the. In the first episode, we said put a canvas outhouse over the top.
- [40:39]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yes, we did. Right. That's amazing.
- [40:43]
James Holland
Isn't that interesting?
- [40:43]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
I mean, talk about schoolboy era, but
- [40:45]
James Holland
also talk about unintended consequences. Yes. And the. Very often you think you're doing well, obviously we need to defend it. Defends a site.
- [40:54]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [40:55]
James Holland
Hide the site, lads. Hide it. Then you don't need to defend it anyway.
- [40:58]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Go on. Airborne ops.
- [40:59]
James Holland
Well, airborne operations now. Things really couldn't have gone better for Major General Boyd Browning. No Windy gale. Brigadier Flavel and John Frost. Or Flavelle. Proof of concept as well as proof of what else he needed fixing aircraft. They need aircraft. They need planes to be able to sort.
- [41:16]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They got a lot of answers after the. Right.
- [41:17]
James Holland
They do. And. And they're. And. And the fact that Churchill is there with Frost and Browning at this debrief. At the debrief. Because Churchill. There's a memo he sends out at the end of 1940 going, why is no one acting on any of the stuff I've told you to do regarding airborne forces. What the hell is going on?
- [41:34]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [41:35]
James Holland
Because he. He thinks. He thinks sending a memo will make it happen. And he's. And he's. He's quite wrong.
- [41:40]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah. It sounds like me before the Short History Festival.
- [41:44]
James Holland
This is exactly it. Right.
- [41:45]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Why hasn't it happened?
- [41:46]
James Holland
Why hasn't it happened? But the. But the. So the shape of things to come seems to be what the raid offers. But it also. If you're looking. If you're looking closely, it shows what the vulnerabilities of airborne operations are, some of which unattended to. Right. As we go forward over complex plans, especially in terms of the dilution of concentration of force, remains the default in British airborne operations, unfortunately. Particularly Market Garden.
- [42:11]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [42:11]
James Holland
And. And at Sicily, where it's far too. It's far too ambitious. What they're trying to Achieve.
- [42:15]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Just land in one place.
- [42:16]
James Holland
Yeah. Laying one place. Well, land in one place and don't leave anyone behind. All of you then proceed to the thing that you need to be dealing with rather than guarding other extraneous items. Anyway, this remains the British airborne way of doing things and the attendant problems are. Follows. But. And as it gets bigger, as airborne shows get bigger. And Browning. Browning's intention has always been to be bigger. To the point you drop a division that's completely self sufficient, these problems are compounded and multiplied.
- [42:43]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Of course they are.
- [42:43]
James Holland
Yeah. And confusion and communication problems are part and parcel of airborne operations. Yeah. And. And, and the radios failed at Bruneval. And Frost gets bollocking for leaving the radios behind.
- [42:55]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Does it?
- [42:56]
James Holland
Because they're brand new. So there's a technological exchange here.
- [43:00]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [43:00]
James Holland
Germans get to get a proper look at a 38 and an 18 set. Yeah. Because Frost season behind you. It's a fact of life that the radios can't be relied on, especially in the narrow time frames that airborne operations work in. Because if you're a regular infantry unit, you come up to the line, you get your net keyed in. You've time. You don't have time if you've two and a half hours to make your radios work before you have your. You know. Anyway, so I think it's all quite obvious now. Aircraft. What's really interesting, they come in the form of the C47 Dakota DC3. Comes online later in the year. Frost remarks that later in the year. These are marvelous because you could sit, you had a seat to sit in, you could walk about, talk and even smoke. But it's a different world to the, to the Whitley and these planes. The important thing about the C47Is Bomber Command can't claim them.
- [43:47]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No.
- [43:48]
James Holland
They can't say, well, we need those for bombing ops.
- [43:50]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
They're sort of the Bomber Command proof.
- [43:54]
James Holland
Exactly. And they are. That's. That's what's revolutionary about the C47 in terms of airborne operations.
- [43:59]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It can only be used for that. You can chuck supplies out, but.
- [44:02]
James Holland
Yeah, but. Exactly. So. So it.
- [44:04]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So that it can only transport that
- [44:05]
James Holland
airframe changes the game and means that you aren't scrounging sterlings, although they do scrounge sterlings. You aren't scrounging obsolete types.
- [44:14]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
No, of course. Get it?
- [44:15]
James Holland
Yeah.
- [44:15]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
And you're not having to go in Whitley's anymore.
- [44:17]
James Holland
No, exactly. And for Lord Louis Mountbatten at Combined Operations Headquarters, this is the absolute ticket.
- [44:25]
Gary from Goal Hangers (Sponsor)
He's.
- [44:26]
James Holland
He's a new broom. He's pulled off a tactical triumph of strategic effect. All three services cooperating together, delivering technical advantage and a stack of lessons for the future conduct of the war. Particularly literal. Literal intervention. And they become Combined Operations Headquarters becomes so much more ambitious as 1942 proceeds. You know, San Jose op. Chariot, which is costly but incredibly consequential. Yeah. And we've seen here that the cost. There are VCs on Chariot because there's more casualties. Right. You've got. You've got the diet raid ironclad on Madagascar. Mine Operations Headquarters is now the direction of travel.
- [45:07]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [45:08]
James Holland
For what the. What the Allies are going to have to do to win the war. Yeah.
- [45:10]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah.
- [45:12]
James Holland
So, yeah. There we are. Good news from February 1942 and the shape of things to come.
- [45:17]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Oh, what a. What a story.
- [45:19]
James Holland
Yeah. It's good, isn't it?
- [45:20]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
It's absolutely brilliant.
- [45:22]
James Holland
And I will read Frost chapters for our patrons, which is another reason to subscribe. Yes. I know you've got to the end of this and that. We can't tempt you with a further cliffhanger, actually on a cliff. But if I'm going to read. I'm not going to do the. The brogue for the. The chapters. It will break my heart to try and read the whole thing in that terrible Scots accent. But I'll read Chop the relevant chapters of I Drop Too Many that which will go up on our Patreon for our subscribers.
- [45:45]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Fabulous.
- [45:46]
James Holland
Thanks, everyone for listening. Thanks, Jim. That was tons of fun.
- [45:48]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Brilliant fun.
- [45:49]
James Holland
Yeah.
- [45:50]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Thank you for doing all those nights. That's absolutely tip top.
- [45:52]
James Holland
Uchukwe Paratus ready for anything Parachute regiment. Although actually they're load jocks, really, or whatever it is. Thanks. Thanks for listening, everyone. We'll see you again very soon. Cheerio.
- [46:05]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Cheerio.
- [46:28]
James Holland
You know, Jim, brands often think they have to sort of march in perfect step, perfect formation with the subject of a podcast Second World War history show. Oh, it must all be tanks and documentaries or a man selling artisanal trench whistles.
- [46:41]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Yeah, but that's not what it's about, is it? You know, because what really matters is whether people trust the show. Carrying the message way of ways of
- [46:48]
James Holland
making you talk is part of Goal Hanger, the independent UK network. Behind the rest is politics. The rest is history and much, much more. And across the network, there are more than 75 million full episode streams every month.
- [47:02]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
So across the network, 68% of listeners act on the ads they hear, nearly double the industry average.
- [47:09]
James Holland
So if you're a brand, an agency or a platform, you don't need a tank division to belong on here. It's just something worth saying to an audience that's already fully mobilized and fully engaged.
- [47:19]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
For more information, email partnershipsoalhanger.com partnershipsalhanger.com Some follow the noise. Bloomberg follows the money. Whether it's the funds fueling AI or
- [47:33]
James Holland
crypto's trillion dollar swings, there's a money side to every story.
- [47:37]
Jim (Co-host or Guest)
Get the money side of the story. Subscribe now@bloomberg.com.