The Channel Dash: Out The Frying Pan (Part 4)

Summary

Podcast Summary: WW2 Pod – We Have Ways of Making You Talk

Episode: The Channel Dash: Out The Frying Pan (Part 4)

Release Date: March 12, 2026
Hosts: Al Murray (A), James Holland (B)

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Episode Overview

This episode is the concluding part (Part 4) of the “Channel Dash” series, examining the dramatic escape of German warships (Scharnhorst, Gneisenau, and Prinz Eugen) from Brest through the English Channel to German ports in February 1942 — Operation Cerberus (German) and the failed British response, Operation Fuller. Al and James dissect the chaos, miscommunication, and tactical blunders that plagued the British defence, revealing how a humiliating tactical defeat in the Channel masked long-term Allied strategic advantages. As always, the discussion is rich in military detail, historical context, and the hosts’ signature blend of expertise and wry humour.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Setting the Stage: Legacy and Stakes

• Review of prior episodes: why Germans left Brest, their objective to reach Wilhelmshaven, and the Royal Navy’s historical dominance of the Channel.
• The significance: “Clash of the titans occurs in the prestigious sea space that the Royal Navy has not allowed a single intruder into for 300 years…” (A, 01:21)

2. Swordfish Sacrifice and British Futility

• Recap of the failed Swordfish attack led by Eugene Esmond — deemed a tragic waste:
  • “It actually makes me feel quite angry just thinking about it. I mean, I just feel that's just so such a terrible, terrible decision.” (B, 02:33)
  • Debates over moral courage and leadership blunders.

3. Motor Torpedo Boats – Outmatched and Outpaced

• Hopes pinned on Fairmile D motor torpedo boats, though under-armed and underpowered:
  • “They could do 20 knots. So they're not the like absolute like hot rods… So catching these battleships doing 30 knots is going to be very, very difficult.” (A, 06:21–06:28)
• Command had no contingency for the Germans racing through the Channel in daylight, forcing hasty and uncoordinated British attacks.

Key Actions and Outcomes:

• Lieutenant Commander Pumphrey’s Flotilla:
  • Five MTBs attack, firing ten torpedoes: “Of the 10 torpedoes so far, six have missed and two have misfired.” (A, 10:11)
• Secondary Force under Lt. Long:
  • Poor weather and confusion lead to missed opportunities, but they rescue downed Swordfish airmen.

4. Bomber and Coastal Command – Confusion in the Skies

• Chronic miscommunication between Beaufort torpedo bombers, Hudsons, and their fighter escort:
  • “How many cock ups can there be in this operation?” (B, 13:36)
  • “In the confusion, the Hudsons try to form up on the Beauforts and the Beauforts try to form up on the Hudsons.” (A, 15:16)
• Repeated lack of appropriate armament (torpedoes in the wrong place, aircraft wrongly briefed).
• “Cliff thinks sod this and disobeys his orders… He's not been told and he's later criticized afterwards for saying, 'no one told me I had to go look for bloody bad, bloody great battleships.'” (A, 15:51)

5. Bomber Command’s Ineffectual Sorties

• Over 398 sorties flown, 17 aircraft lost, and almost no damage done to German ships due to poor visibility, missed targets, and confusion:
  • “Bomber command have flown 398 sorties for the loss of 17 with 38 damaged.” (A, 25:08)
  • “They don't see the bombers at all. And the bombers don’t see them.” (A, 24:13)
• Many bombers lacked the armor-piercing ordnance necessary to harm capital ships.

6. NOR Command Destroyers: A Last Gamble

• Captain Charles Pysey’s flotilla risks all, even sailing through a minefield to intercept:
  • “He's another man with Nelson on his shoulder. What's Pisces decided to do in order to save time and catch the Germans? Is sail through a minefield.” (A, 28:24)
• Scharnhorst is temporarily crippled by a mine: “If you're on the Scharnhorst, you're absolutely cacking yourself.” (B, 29:37)
• Despite British heroics, lack of coordination means no effective strike on damaged German ships.

7. Climactic Engagement and Ignominious End

• The destroyers’ attack achieves little except receiving heavy fire:
  • “The Royal Navy's last effort proves to be a costly failure… it's total ignominy. Pisy is knighted for his efforts that day. But it's scant consolation and frankly it's more of the same cloth as the VCs being dished out when… there's a failure.” (A, 32:12)
• Gneisenau and Scharnhorst both strike additional mines but are repaired due to inspired engineering under pressure.

8. German Success, Allied Strategic Perspective

• Ciliax signals successful completion, Germans celebrate, but hosts stress it is only a tactical victory:
  • “It's an immediate and obvious, obvious victory for the Kriegsmarine. A colossal blow to British prestige.” (A, 33:16)
  • “But they know it's strategic loss. They know it when they embark on it, because they know they've lost the surface war in the Atlantic.” (A, 35:44)
• Long-term effect: Germans never again pose a strategic threat in the Atlantic with their surface raiders, and the experience prompts much-needed Allied operational reforms.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Quote | Speaker | |-----------|-------|---------| | 02:33 | “It actually makes me feel quite angry just thinking about it. I mean, I just feel that's just so such a terrible, terrible decision.” | James Holland (B) | | 05:53 | “The only thing that's sinking is your feelings. Not the Scharnhorst, the Prinz Eugen.” | Al Murray (A) | | 13:36 | “How many cock ups can there be in this operation?” | James Holland (B) | | 15:51 | “Cliff thinks sod this and disobeys his orders... he’s later criticized afterwards for saying, ‘no one told me I had to go look for bloody bad, bloody great battleships.’” | Al Murray (A) | | 25:08 | “Bomber command have flown 398 sorties for the loss of 17 with 38 damaged.” | Al Murray (A) | | 28:24 | “...another man with Nelson on his shoulder. What's Pisces decided to do in order to save time and catch the Germans? Is sail through a minefield.” | Al Murray (A) | | 29:37 | “If you're on the Scharnhorst, you're absolutely cacking yourself.” | James Holland (B) | | 32:12 | “The Royal Navy's last effort proves to be a costly failure... it's total ignominy. Pisy is knighted for his efforts that day. But it's scant consolation and frankly it's more of the same cloth as the VCs being dished out when… there's a failure.” | Al Murray (A) | | 33:16 | “It's an immediate and obvious, obvious victory for the Kriegsmarine. A colossal blow to British prestige.” | Al Murray (A) | | 35:44 | “But they know it's strategic loss. They know it when they embark on it, because they know they've lost the surface war in the Atlantic.” | Al Murray (A) |

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• [00:34–02:33] – Recap of prior episodes, Swordfish tragedy, and British misfortune
• [03:24–06:42] – Technical rundown of motor torpedo boats and the challenges they face
• [07:55–11:52] – MTB attacks: confusion, torpedo failings, partial rescue of Swordfish crews
• [12:24–16:20] – Coastal Command attempts and organizational chaos, Cliff’s defiance
• [21:04–25:51] – Bomber Command: three major wave attacks, bad weather, and mutual invisibility
• [25:51–29:44] – NOR Command destroyers: risky dash, minefield, Scharnhorst hit
• [31:11–32:52] – Final British surface attack, more German mines, and British failure
• [32:52–36:10] – Germans complete the dash, assessment of tactical vs. strategic impact
• [36:10–End] – Aftermath: German fleet’s neutering, Allied strategic and operational gain, British soul-searching

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Conclusion and Final Interpretations

Al and James close with broader reflections:

• Despite the humiliating tactical blunders and loss of prestige for the Royal Navy and RAF, the strategic situation for the Allies improves as the German surface fleet is effectively neutralized for the rest of the war.
• The operation exposes grave flaws in British inter-service coordination and planning, catalyzing reforms that will improve future combined operations.
• As Holland wryly notes, “Nobody does beating ourselves up like we do.”

Closing Thought (B, 38:25):
“I feel we've ended on a good note... After what's come before. I'm still smarting about the whole Esmond order... but you know…"

Next Up for Patreons:
A bonus “wash-up” episode on public and political reaction, inquiries (Bucknell Report), and the legacy of the Channel Dash will be available to club members.

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For listeners who want a rich, honest, at times exasperated account of one of the Second World War’s most controversial naval moments, this episode delivers insight, colour, and context in equal measure.

Transcript

[A]

Thank you for listening to we have ways of making you talk. Sign up to our Patreon to receive bonus content, live streams and our weekly newsletter with money off books and museum visits as well. Plus early access to all live show tickets. That's patreon.com we haveways.

[B]

At 3,500 yards, I felt that our luck could not hold much longer. Ships were being well straddled and we were closing fast, gradually losing our bearing. At 3,300 yards, I saw a large shell, which failed to explode or ricochet, dive under the ship like a porpoise. And I felt this was time to turn and fire our torpedoes. Vivacious on my starboard quarter, turned and fired at the same time. And that, of course, was Captain Charles Pysey. He's commander of HMS Campbell as he took his destroyer flotilla into action against the mass of German vessels now swarming in the Channel. Goodness me.

[A]

Yes. Well, in the North Sea, actually, at this point, because we're no longer in the English Channel, Jim. The Channel Dash has found its way.

[B]

They've dashed through it.

[A]

They've dashed through the Channel. Welcome to we have Ways of Making youg Talk for Part four of the Channel Dash as we examine the second portion of the fighting in Operation Cerberus, Operation Fuller, as the clash of the titans occurs in the prestigious sea space that the Royal Navy has not allowed a single intruder into for 300 years or so, with the Germans trying to achieve the impossible. And so far we've looked at why the Germans have had to leave Brest, why they're heading for Wilhelmshaven in the first place, the rotten luck of the efforts to spot the Germans because it's been anticipated by the Admiralty, the fact that the Germans have decided to flip it and rather than leave at day and arrive at the Straits of Dover at night, they've left at night and they're arriving at daytime, at noon. Noon at the strets Dover. And how the first attempts with the guns at the Straits of Dover, the Royal Artillery and then the Fleet air arm with 825 Naval Air Squadron. These efforts have failed with the futile sacrifice of 825 Naval Air Squadron under Eugene Esmond, which I think we had to stop, didn't we, Jim? We got to the end of the last episode. We had to stop.

[B]

Had to stop. Just couldn't cope with it any longer.

[A]

Couldn't cope with it any longer.

[B]

It actually makes me feel quite angry just thinking about it. I mean, I just feel that's just so such a terrible, terrible decision.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And to Say to Esmond, well, it's up to you. You don't have to go. That to me lacks moral courage.

[A]

It does, doesn't it? But then also say they've got to go anyway, even though they're all going to die. Lacks, you know, they're not. They've been training for night. It isn't night. The thing you've been preparing for hasn't happened. So you've really got to think very carefully about whether you're going to do the daytime attack. And of course, had they crippled one of those ships in the style of the Bismarck, then you'd get a result here, wouldn't you? Possibly. But the truth is is that happens by fraction anyway. The successful strike on the Bismarck's steering gear is a fluke. I mean, if you want to call it that. You know, all other torpedoes don't strike and there's no air cover.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Swordfish do well when the Fleet Air Arm have local air superiorities, as you see when they attack the Dunkirk, it's

[B]

the same as Stukas.

[A]

Exactly. If there's no bogeys about, you're all right. But the problem is, is the sky is full of bogies.

[B]

Yeah. So where, where, where? Leigh Mallory. Honestly.

[A]

The Royal Navy have other plans. Right. So the fuller plan is also for motor torpedo boats to strike, but again under cover of darkness. The idea is that they will be lying in wait for the German battle fleet because the anticipation is. You see them leave Brest during the daylight, which means that by the time they get to the Straits of Dover,

[B]

position yourself in the right place, everything's

[A]

teed up and ready to rock and roll.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And they'll get in amongst them, torpedo the capital ships. Although of course there is the issue of the big ships having an armored belt.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

But the idea is to delay, hold up, cripple the enemy ships and then you bring the guns to bear in the English Channel when the ships aren't moving anymore because they've been crippled or are going at 5 knots. And bomber Command can attack because they can deal with static ships rather than things powering on at 30 knots. But that plan's gone out the window. Operation Fuller, for all of its planning, just isn't. That's not what they're doing here. They're making up and they don't have a contingency. So basically the motor torpedo boats are going to have to scramble and chase the flotilla which is steaming hard up the channel 30 knots and it's also doing it two miles from the French coast. So as Far away as possible, obviously as close as it can to the French coast without running the risk of running aground. And any possible fighter cover for these motor torpedo boats is trying to organize itself. Right. And I think, I think the idea of fighter cover, I mean we talked about this in the last episode. Why not just attack the German fighters? Why worry about tangling up as an escort on mass?

[B]

You've, you've now got, I mean your big wing, you know, 12,000 Spitfires have been built in this time, you know, since between November 1940 and December 1941. Why don't you have a thousand Spitfires flying against them?

[A]

Well, you know the answer, Jim.

[B]

What the heck.

[A]

Anyway, the motor torpedo boats are going to have to go anyway. Good luck, chum. And the thing is, the German flotilla with all its destroyers as well is much heavier metal than say half a dozen, well, no, five wooden motor torpedo boats. So this is not, I think a dissimilar prospect to the one faced by the Swordfish crews. Actually.

[B]

No, there's a time and place for MGBs.

[A]

Exactly. And MTBs. Yeah. And these are Fairmile class D motor torpedo boats. The British built a total of 650 during the war and they're supposed to be sub chasers. They displace 85 tons. They're 112ft long, beam of 18ft, they draw or 4 foot 10 inches. They have two 650 horsepower Hall Scott Defender petrol engines. So they could do 20 knots. So they're not the like absolute like hot rods.

[B]

They're not like the super fast.

[A]

No. So catching these battleships doing 30 knots is going to be very, very difficult.

[B]

Nigh on impossible.

[A]

Yeah. They're armed with a quick fire three pounder Hotchkiss, two 20 milliliter Oerlikons, some Lewis guns and they have two torpedoes, Jim.

[B]

Just two.

[A]

Not quite a one shot deal. But it's near enough. So you're sending five. So that's 10 torpedoes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So at 1130 hours, Lieutenant Commander Pumphrey,

[B]

can I just say I've got another sinking feeling coming on here.

[A]

Well not, not a sinking feeling. I think nothing's going to get. Nothing's going to end up sinking.

[B]

Well, no, not that, just. But nothing's going to. It's not going to be success, is it? Let's face it.

[A]

No, no, the only thing that's sinking is your feelings. Not the Scharnhorst, the Prinz Eugen. Yes, the guys now. So he gets a signal from Ramsey's headquarters. Get out now. Out immediately. You know they're opposite us now in the Straits of Dover. Go, go, go, go, go. So 25 minutes later, Pumphrey in MTB 221, which is built by William King Bernam on Crouch Essex, launched on 24 February 1941. It's been going about a year. He leads his force of five boats out to intercept and take on the enemy. And these five boats set off without their escort because the motor gunboat escort, they can't. Which is two boats. They can't find their commanders at this precise moment. They're going to have to steam across the channel as quick as possible, 20 knots. So that's, you know, that's an hour to get across the Channel and attack the 60 German ships from the rear, port flank through the screen of E boats.

[B]

And Pomfrey says, we saw the enemy heavy ships coming out of the smoke laid by the E boats. And I made an enemy report timed at 12:23 hours. When the range was down to about 1,000 yards between us and the E boats, we started firing at one another. By that time, my five boats were very much straggled.

[A]

Yeah. And he thinks at this point he's about 5,000 yards from the German capital ships and they're going up absolutely flat out.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

As hard and fast as you can go. And they've all been disconnected from one another. He has one of his engines pack in his engineers straight back down, fixing it like, we've got to keep going. And on they go. And he signals to the rest of the boats, you know, with his lamp like, carry on, go on. And he fires his two torpedoes at what he thinks is the Scharnhorst, and they're no strikes recorded. Nilpois under intense fire from these E boats, which are zipping about and obviously

[B]

free to interdict, which can do twice as fast, by the way, because they have three Daimler Benz engines, not two Scott Hardy ones or whatever they're called.

[A]

Yeah, exactly, yeah. So between 1231 and 1235 hours, MTBs 48 and 219, they fire their torpedoes through the E boat screen, but they're four and a half thousand yards from the big ships, so unlikely, like Pumphrey before them, they miss, they bug out back to the agreed RV MTB 45, which has worked its way around the back of the E boats, fires one torpedo, but then that torpedo misfires. She is then engaged by Narvik class destroyer and the fleet's rearguard, which makes smoke as well. Because the other thing is the Germans, the Germans are not interested in stopping and fighting.

[B]

No, they just want to get through.

[A]

They just want to get through. Right. So that E boats are involved in like skirmishing to see them off. And the destroyers are also prepared to do a bit of. But they're not going to stop and fire a set piece battle. MTB 45. He then fires his one remaining torpedo at the destroyer which also misfires and then he turns for home. So of the 10 torpedoes so far, six have missed and two have misfired.

[B]

That leaves two left.

[A]

Yeah. Then the MGBs turn up, the motor gunboats turn up. Jim.

[B]

Right, you fantastic.

[A]

And the German destroyers we've seen has come out of line to attack MTB44 now which has had engine trouble. So these they're able to in this confusion, MTB44 then he's able to get into the German fleet right in amongst it, two miles from the big ships, fires a torpedo at 12:35, misses, gets out. But it's not over for the motor torpedo boats. For fans of this kind of action, there's three stood by at Ramsgate just around the corner under Lt. Long. They set off at 12:25 hours, but they don't know where the Germans actually are and because the weather's so bad and the visibility is so poor, they can't find them. Then Long then mistakes what he sees for the approaching fleet rather than elements of its rear. Because he's confused, he sets himself up to attack in anticipation. The Germans are coming onto his position, but in fact they've passed him. And so at 1312 hours he sacks it off. Right. And bear in mind this is at the same time as the Swordfish sortie roughly. And they see the Swordfish go in. The good that comes of this is that they're able to rescue some of the crews of the Swordfish. You've gone into the drink and so that the Swordfish survivors that we'll hear about in our bonus a little bit. And who were the witnesses to the Swordfish attack In our last episode they're rescued by these MTB coats picking up people in their dinghies. So you know, it's not entirely pointless.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

But I mean that's not why they set out.

[B]

I also want to go back to that decision to keep the home fleet at Scapa Flow. So you remember when the Bismarck was out in the Atlantic, everyone was kind of hurtling across vast great distances to try and intercept. And here you have a series of ships which you can massively outgun. And had you ventured forth from Scapa Flow you'd be into. You could, you could block them from going into Wilhelmshaven. Yeah, no problem at all. Yeah, yeah.

[A]

The other thing is, if, if they'd spotted the Germans leaving Brest when they did, the Home Fleet would be at the exit to the Straits Dover in the same amount of time. If it steamed hard, it amounts to the kind of, the same prospect.

[B]

How do you think they're going to get through that screen?

[A]

But they're worried about German air assault, they're worried about bombers and I think this might be the loss of the Hood somewhere in the picture.

[B]

And the Prince of Wales and Renown.

[A]

Should we send Coastal Command in, Jim?

[B]

Yeah, definitely, let's.

[A]

Let's.

[B]

The latest in the Arsenal Coastal Commander,

[A]

also part of the Fuller order.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And of course, as we've seen so far, that's all falling apart. But there's still hope, Jim.

[B]

There's still hope, as always. Always. Home springs eternal now.

[A]

Exactly. And at Thorney island is 217 Squadron and they're ordered to meet with their fighter escort at Manston at 1330 hours. Now they're under strength, they're not armed with torpedoes. Only four of the seven aircraft are actually stood by. Right. The other three aren't ready, but the four that can go, do go. And their escort is flying round and round at Manston, waiting.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Then they're ordered, the escort is ordered to meet the Beauforts. So they're sent away from Manston to meet the Beauforts. The Beauforts from 217 are not told this and go to Manston, right?

[B]

How many cock ups can there be in this operation?

[A]

Well, we've only just got started, if I'm honest with you. I mean, rendezvousing aircraft. Oh no, is difficult, obviously. 217 Squadron, they set off, right? They find nothing, they're 50 miles. They arrive, basically go to an area 50 miles behind the German fleet. The news, just news, is just not up to date. So the long story short is they then go back to Manston, refuel, they're told where to go, they make for the Germans, but there's heavy flak, heavy Luftwaffe presence, poor visibility, torpedoes have got away, but with no success. And that may be a refrain we return to at 1450 hours. That's also another appointed hour for another set of Coastal Command aircraft to muster over Manston. Now, as we said in previous episodes, 12th February, this day, the day of Op Cerberus is the allotted day for, for Coastal Command to reorganize its Beauforts. So 42 Squadron have flown down from Leucas to Coltishall to be readily on hand, and they're led by Squadron Leader Cliff and they've been ordered to go as soon as they get there to attack the Germans, but they haven't got any torpedoes, or rather there are some, but they're in Grimsby. And Cliff is told that there will be Hudsons and a fighter escort. Right, we've heard that story before. Yes, we have the RV at Manston and the RV at Manston, I'm afraid, descends into another farce. So Cliff's nine Beauforts arrive over Manston at 14:53 hours, pretty much on time. They're three minutes late. However, when they get there, they try to form up behind the hudsons, which are 407 Royal Canadian Air Force Demon Squadron. And in the confusion, the Hudsons try to form up on the Beauforts and the Beauforts try to form up on the Hudsons.

[B]

No.

[A]

So they go round and round in circles while their fighter escort goes round and round in circles above them. On the ground, Gleeve is trying to coordinate the chaos.

[B]

Tom Gleave, aforementioned Tom Gleeve? Yeah. We talked to him in the last episode, didn't we?

[A]

Yeah. He hasn't got a phone to talk to in a radio telephone, so he's Morse code. He's trying to tell them.

[B]

Oh, no.

[A]

To stop forming up on each other, even though he doesn't know actually who these aircraft are, because he's not been told or what's going on. Because the intercommand communications between Fighter Command and Coastal Command is essentially non existent.

[B]

Of course it is, yeah.

[A]

Cliff thinks sod this and disobeys his orders. He's been told to wait up the former and sets out and find the ships. But he's been told to look for a convoy, not a battle fleet. He's not been told and he's later criticized afterwards for saying, no one told me. I had to go look for bloody bad, bloody great battleships. And he's accused of being extremely rude after the event. I've never heard such a rude conversation in my life from a fellow officer and all this sort of stuff.

[B]

Well, well, well, well, you know, you can't have people being rude on the airways, can you?

[A]

I mean, once they get there, heavy flak, Luftwaffe presence, poor visibility, which means they have no luck. And Cliff and his guys, they give up at about 1600 hours. And again, we're going to be saying that again. It's torturous progress elsewhere. RAF St Evil, which is where the Hudson patrols The stopper patrol that went to look for the fleet.

[B]

Yes, it's right down the turf. It's Cornwall.

[A]

Yeah, this is 86 and 217 Squadron. We mentioned 217 Squadron earlier.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

So there's 18 Beauforts on paper, but three of those are out on anti submarine patrol in the bay of Biscay. 12 leave for Thorney island to refuel. They get to Thorney Island, 1415 fly hour onto Coltishall because the Germans are up the Dutch coast now.

[B]

They're almost home and dry.

[A]

They're almost home and dry and the plan is to meet the fighter escort and go on to Walcheren and attack there.

[B]

What could possibly go wrong?

[A]

Yeah, exactly. There are no fighters. They don't turn up. Wing Commander Flood decides to go after the ships anyway. All he sees is three enemy minesweepers and he turns for home.

[B]

I wonder what Wing Commander Flood's nickname is. Presumably Noah or something.

[A]

He's flying two by two all the way to find the. But anyway, that's the motor torpedo boats. The motor gun boats. That's Coastal Command. After the break, we shall unleash Bomber Command. We'll see you in a tick.

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[A]

Welcome back to. We have ways of making you talk with me. I'm Ari and James Holland, and we've been looking at the next phases of the Channel Dash and Operation Fuller as it falls apart in its full, spectacular glory. I mean, the thing is, at night, you're not looking at all this fighter escort stuff to coordinate, are you? But I just think as we. I think we keep coming back to why escort? Why not just attack the German fighter cover, drive it off, you know where it is, it's over the ships.

[B]

I can give you two reasons why that doesn't happen. One of them is called Leigh Mallory and the other one's called Shoalford Douglas. I mean, it's just. Oh, goodness, it's just. It's so depressing.

[A]

But we promised Bomber Command and Bomber Command, after all, are the reason that the Germans have left Brest. There's no two ways about it. The reason they've given up on unsafe haven in Brest Port, as we called it in the first episode, is because Bomber Command's relentless efforts and costly. But it's been worth it. If you're doing big war, big picture war, keep the surface raiders out of the Atlantic, even though if they do go into the Atlantic, they're going to get smashed up. It's been the RAF that's made sure. And of course, this is before Bomber Harris time. This is before everything's a distraction from the main effort. The main effort being the destruction of the Ruhr and of German industry, the German war economy. This has been a major division of effort for Bomber Command and I think arguably successful. And I know there is this view that Bomber Command can't string a raid together before Harris and after the Buck Report and after the proper shakedown and the introduction of navigational aids and all this stuff. But they're using Oboe on Brest, they're using the navigation aids that famously make the Ruhr campaign much more successful. So, you know, Bomber Command are probably in with a shout here, Jim. Right.

[B]

And they've got some decent numbers as well, haven't they?

[A]

In theory, yes. And they're under the temporary command of Air Vice Marshal Baldwin, who's sitting in while Harris comes in to replace Pearce, because Harris is in the States. Pearce has been moved on because there's a bad raid in November where things go horribly wrong and there's bad weather and terrible losses. And so there's a feeling that you need a new broom. Harris, after all, is one of the coming men in Bomber Command. Did you know Keith park was the second choice for Dowding's number two? When Dowding was at the Air Ministry building the fighter defence system, who was the first choice? Harris.

[B]

So Harris could have ended up in Fighter Command?

[A]

Yeah, could have ended up doing Park's job.

[B]

Tell you what, he'd have done a lot better than Sholto Douglas and Leigh Mallory.

[A]

All these episodes are all coulda, woulda, shoulda and we can't get bogged down in that. Anyway, the other thing Baldwin's doing is he's thinking, I'm not going to spoil loads of assets because it got the other guy fired, even though I'm only in command temporarily. So he doesn't make actually as many aircraft available. He's got about 300 on paper available to him, but he's kind of like he's husbanding his resources so he sends out the order at 1330 hours that his guys have got to get into it. He decides to hold his heavies back. He doesn't want to use the heavies when there's fighter cover around and he wants to save them up for something for a bigger show. He's going to use them later in the day if it comes to it, when there's less prospect of this, because he knows about this sort of organized swirl of fighter cover now. So in the first wave you've 73 planes, bombers, 46 Wellingtons, 25 Blenheims, two Manchesters from 1, 2, 4 and 5 group.

[B]

Well, Wellington's are quite suited to this,

[A]

I'd say they're the best bit of kit. They're the best first phase of the war bomber that the bomber Command have, aren't they? I think it's fair to say, yeah. You know, they've got long legs, they've got decent enough payload, they're crew are pretty well protected. It's survivable.

[B]

Take punishment.

[A]

Yeah, and all that. They set off at 1430 hours and the thing is these are short trips, aren't they? You know, it's not. They've not got far to go. They're in place over where the fleet is supposed to be. Yep, there's 10 10th cloud with a 600 foot ceiling. They can't find the ships. The instruments are icing up too. They don't see the enemy at all. Those that return for the lost of five aircraft, it's not known how they, they were lost. Maybe they went into the sea, you know, Trying to fly low to look for something. Maybe the collisions, we just, they're just gone.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So that's the first wave. The second wave is 100 aircraft, 76 Wellingtons, 13 Manchesters, 2 Sterlings. So he's deploying a couple of his heavies and four Bostons and they are over the target at 1630 hours or where they think it supposed to be. They carry on looking for the next 90 minutes.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

They don't find the Germans. It's a loss of nine planes and

[B]

their crews, where they all gone.

[A]

Conditions, you know, flak as well. The Germans are, you know, they're dishing out a ton of flak. So. And the thing is in, in the, in the battle fleet, there's this constant throb of aircraft. They know there's people overhead the whole time. They hear it, they hear it on

[B]

and off all day and none of them even see that.

[A]

But they, they don't see the bombers at all. And the bombers don' see them. The third wave, there's a third one. Yeah. So the Stirlings and Halifaxes as well as some Wellingtons. And at this point the fighters that have rendezvoused with these bombers are turning for home because they've run out of fuel, because they're late. And this wave also arrives at the same time that the second wave is trying to bomb what it thinks is the target. So it's chaos, confusion, poor visibility. I mean, and this is the weather. The Germans are also gambling on that. The weather will make this more difficult. They only lose one plane, so, you know, just the one that's in itself a result. And it's a relentless flak effort by the ships below. But they are none the wisest to the nature and the extent of the attacks being made. And they can't see. All they've got is just a throbbing drone of engines basically all afternoon. So Bomber command have flown 398 sorties for the loss of 17 with 38 damaged. Yeah.

[B]

And just, let's just remind everyone that a sortie, that a sortie is a single end aircraft's operational flight.

[A]

Yeah. So some people have gone a couple of times for nothing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And had they been able to hit the ships, would they have had the effect? They hoped that, you know, maybe, but a lot of them aren't armed with armor piercing, which is what you need to take out a battleship.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So dropping conventional high explosives. So actually what damage were they going to do anyway? Anyway, because this bit of Bomber Command isn't geared for this. They aren't flying that kind of sortie because they were dropping armour piercing on breast. That was part of the package, which is how they damage all three of the big ships across those months. Anyway, now we come to the NOR Command destroyers.

[B]

It's still not over.

[A]

Let's not forget the Swordfish sortie we talked about. Esmond sortie happened in a fraction of one of these episodes. It basically happens in kind of 10 minutes. You know, we are taking longer of these episodes we've done about the Channel dash over the time will take longer than all of the British efforts to strike at the German battlefleet because these are all very fragmented and quick actions spread really from kind of half past 12 until sort of 4 or 4:30 on the afternoon of February 12th. So, you know, we're taking longer over this than the Royal Navy, the Royal Air Force and the army do. Anyway. The NOR command destroyers, so the Nor command is the command that stretches from where Dover hands over to the North Sea, basically, and runs up to the Humber, I think. So it's a great big stretch. And in Harwich we have the 21st Destroyer for flotilla under Captain Charles Pysey, who goes on to be the last commander in chief Royal Navy before the Admiralty gets reorganized in the 1960s and the Navy's basically gobbled up by Whitehall and subsumed into the Ministry of Defence, in effect, and some say marks the end of our strategic thinking beyond being part of NATO rather than as a global power. At Campbell's disposal at Pisces disposal are the two ships, the Campbell, HMS Campbell and Vivacious got it from his flotilla and he also has the 16th destroyed flotilla under Captain Wright with the MacKay, HMS MacKay, HMS Worcester, Whitsted and the Walpole. And when word reaches them of Fuller, when the Fuller code word gets to them at 11:56, they're out on exercise, training, all doing their own thing, pootling about, running their crews up. So Pisy orders an immediate rendezvous at the number 53 boy southeast of Harwich. I mean, I know it well, Jim, I'm sure you're familiar with the number 53 boy.

[B]

Everyone knows the number 53 boy.

[A]

They're on their route to the number 53 buoy right now. For our American listeners, that's about. That's our concession in this episode to our American friends. I mean, this is quite the phase to be an American looking at. Looking at your newly acquired ally and how well it's dealing with things on today all day. Yes, but I mean, we'll talk about that too. So the idea is that they're going to gather and then they've got time to intervene because they want to arrive in force. But the Germans are going faster than this plan allows. Right. So they steam as hard as they can from 13, 18 hours and they're doing about 28 knots, so they're aiming to intercept two hours later. Then Walpole's engine starts to pack in. So HMS Walpole is a problem.

[B]

Oh, goodness.

[A]

And critically. And here's another man with Nelson on his shoulder. What's Pisces decided to do in order to save time and catch the Germans? Is sail through a minefield. Yeah, he knows there's a minefield charted. Minefield weighs the risk. Right. We'll sail on whatever.

[B]

Yep. Calculator risk.

[A]

They're spotted by the Luftwaffe, so they're buzzed by a lone ju 88. So the Germans can find British ships. Don't want to dwell on that, you

[B]

know, they're not supposed to be so good at this.

[A]

At 1432 hours, what happens?

[B]

Jim Scharnhorst strikes a mine. So smoke pours from the battlecruiser. There's a hole on the starboard side. Water is gushing in. The Gneisenau and the Prinz Eugen continue as ordered to, as they're supposed to should there be an emergency. And Ciliax transfers his flag to Z29, which is its destroyer, and four torpedo boats stay behind and the fleet steams on. So this is it. It's stationary in the water. It's denuded of its covering flotilla. This is far, far easier meat for British planes. It should be. It's a sitting duck. And if you're on the Scharnhorst, you're absolutely cacking yourself.

[A]

The crew on the Scharnhorst and the Admiral's buggered off. So you've probably got quite a low view of the Admiral at this point. But what happens?

[B]

Niente.

[A]

We've already covered half past two and we didn't say that Bomber Command or Coastal Command strike the Scharnhorst. The stationary Scharnhorst. They don't find her, says nothing. Yeah. And Chief Engineer Kretschmer, who comes out of this story very well, works his magic, you know, his coastal commander blundering around trying to find fix and finish the main fleet. Half an hour later, he's got her going and she's steaming on at 27 knots to try and catch the rest of the fleet.

[B]

And it's only then that Pisy gets his fix on the fleet and this is his moment. They're nine miles away and they're closing fast. And sailing through the minefields paid off. It's a calculated risk and it's worked. So Campbell, Vivacious and Worcester will attack together. And Mackay and Whitshed next. As they arrive, the planes overhead from Coastal and Bomber Command as well as from the defending Luftwaffe. So, you know, an air battle is on the cards. Planes from both sides misidentify Pisa's ships. Okay, so that's good from one point of view.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And with all that follows, attacks from both sides, that is 42nd squadrons, Beauforts, who had been going around and around in circles at Manston earlier, they almost put an attack on Pisy's flagship, the HMS Campbell.

[A]

Oh well. And a Heinkel drops identifying marks at the to say hello to the British ships as well. Drops his flares going, I'm German, don't shoot me down. So, you know, total confusion.

[B]

And then, Jim, 1542 hours at 4 miles range, the enemy engages. Shells are hurling down towards Pisces ships. Torpedoes are fired off. In the melee, guns are pounding German heavy shelling. Worcester is hit so hard by German fire that she stops dead in the water. And on board, Lieutenant Commander Coates prepares to abandon ship. So they're being hit, but not the Germans. Anyway, the Germans aren't going to stop and fight. They're nearly home and they've been told, come what mate, just keep, keep pushing on, yeah. So rather than stopping to finish off the destroyers, they then steam on hard and Coates limps home in the Worcester. And so the Royal Navy's last effort proves to be a costly failure because the destroyers have failed where everyone else has failed as well. It's total ignominy. Pisy is knighted for his efforts that day. But it's scant consolation and frankly it's more of the same cloth as the VCs being dished out when, when there's

[A]

a failure and it's, it's now, they're now clear. The Germans are clear of any apparent threat. They can congratulate themselves on their luck. Although Z29 has to stop, she's got a problem as well. And Cilliax then has to switch to the Hermann Sherman, which is I think my favorite name German destroyer. Then the Scharnhorst reappears and nearly crashes into everybody. Right out of the fog, the Scharnhorst reappears and nearly runs into the battlecruisers. But it ain't over. Gneisenau strikes a mine.

[B]

Phew.

[A]

Hole in the starboard side, a 30 minute fix. And you know, actually these are results for Bomber Command and for the Navy that are perhaps underestimated that the gardening has paid off.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

21, 35 hours, the Sharnhorst strikes another mine. What a big hole. Tons of water entering the ship, full electrical failure, so she's dead in the water. All her weapon systems are offline, her guns are all impotent. And another miracle fixed by Kretschmer and she sails on shortly. So after midnight, they sail into German waters, steam into German waters. It's a triumph. It's an immediate and obvious, obvious victory for the Kriegsmarine. A colossal blow to British prestige. Although they get home, there are no tugs waiting for them. So Scharnhorst's crew have to bring her in under her own power into Willemshaven, edging through the sluice gates, which is no joke given that she's, she's been patched up. And then Ciliax signals Admiral Salvechter in Paris, who's his immediate boss and says it is my duty to inform you that Operation Severs has been successfully completed. List of damage and casualties to follow. Yes, and you know, the Germans are high fiving themselves, but Ciliax has done

[B]

pretty well as we've, We've been a bit damning about Lutchin's, weren't we, in our previous episodes, and saying he was a bit of a, you know, made some very odd decisions. But Celiac seems to be cut from a altogether different cloth.

[A]

Yeah. And the plan, it's well planned and well executed and their determination to wrong foot the British by going at the precise time they're not expected as well as a great big silver side of luck with things going wrong for the British, you know, it's all worked in his favor and he credits the shipborne flak with seeing off the Swordfish, which he thought was by far the most dangerous moment for the battle fleet.

[B]

That's interesting, isn't it?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And he, in the afternoon he addresses the exhausted crew and they're also visited by Admiral Schneevind, who makes a speech on the quarter deck.

[B]

Oh, well, that's all right then. So 11 German air crew, 13 German ratings are killed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Two battleships damaged, warships. Well, yeah, because the Shan Horse isn't a battleship, is its cruiser. 22 aircraft destroyed. Seven fighters on the British side, 42 aircraft destroyed. Between 230 and 250 killed and wounded. £ Dudley £ the first sea lord calls Churchill Prime Minister, about 1am and he goes, I'm afraid, sir, I must report that the enemy battlecruisers should by now have reached the safety of their home waters. And Churchill says, not unreasonably, why? And I don't blame him. I'm with Winston on this. And Hitler says our stock has risen

[A]

considerably while Zaza's the British has fallen correspondingly.

[B]

Yeah, but it's not going to last, don't worry.

[A]

Yeah. And look at the strategic picture. The Home Fleet now only has to look east to Norway and Germany and can carry out submarine anti submarine operations in the North Atlantic. You know, it's one less thing to worry about. The RAF can relax without having to return to Brest all the time. And indeed a bit. They have been successful in shutting down the Atlantic raiding threat. That's a win. Those are two big fat wins.

[B]

Massive.

[A]

And the Germans know this too. They know it's a tactical victory and from their point of view, an extraordinary deliver deliverance. But they know it's strategic loss. They know it when they embark on it. That's why they embark on it, because they know they've lost the surface war in the Atlantic.

[B]

I mean it's a bit like Vitman shooting up a few tanks at Villa Bocage. I mean, you know, it's a nice little tactical moment on a morning of. In early June, in mid June, but. But you know, in the big scheme of things, doesn't add up to a hill of beans.

[A]

And what we've looked at here is 24 hours. Sometimes 24 hours can offer you a picture of what's going on, but pull out and look at what then follows. Right. And if you place this in the context of the first quarter of the year or this couple of months a week after Cerberus, Prince Eugen is ordered to sail to Norway and is attacked by the submarine trident torpedo kills 50 of the crew and she then has to be steered with manual capstans, which is blokes. Yeah, blokes heaving on the rudder. Left a bit, right a bit, all the way back to Germany. She's attacked by Blenheim's and Beauforts relentlessly. On her way home, she never deploys again as a raider and ends up offering gunnery support to ever ends up offering gunnery support to German land forces as the Soviets push the Germans back into Germany. So she's basically it's over and ends

[B]

up being part of American nuclear testing in the Pacific.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

So. So that's that. Presumably the Charlenhorst has got to be

[A]

repaired and not even a fortnight later, on the 25th and 27th of February, Neiseau is at anchor and relentlessly bombed. Stationary, you see, relentlessly bombed by Bomber Command and knocked out by. For the duration of the war. And of course that didn't happen on February 12th, the day of the channel, but whatever happened two weeks later.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Cry into your cornflakes. Abril Celiax. She's a goner.

[B]

And as we've already recounted in an earlier series, Shanhorst comes across it when it does venture forth again and that's that.

[A]

So, yes, this has been torture and anguish, every second of it, talking about the Channel dash and the. The cock up upon cock up that follows. But in the end you can say that the naval strategic picture for the Allies, for the British, for the Royal Navy particularly, is actually going their way. The dramas that occur on February 12th then also serve for a big, big shakedown and a big rethink about how things are going to work, particularly when it comes to combined operations. Operations and everyone working together. So maybe what we have here is a fantastic wake up call rather than necessarily. Look, I'm just trying to find some crumbs of comfort, all right? Give me a. Give me, give me a break.

[B]

No, I feel, I feel we've ended on a good note. I actually feel a whole lot better about myself. I'm quite happy with this conclusion, you know, after what's come before. I'm still smarting about the whole Esmond order. I thought that was. I was poor, but you know.

[A]

Well, and I'll tell you what we'll do for our, for our Patreons. We hope you've enjoyed this. If you are a Patreon member, then we're going to do a wash up about the Channel dash. We're going to talk about basically the public response, the newspapers.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

The impact that it has in that form, the inquiry that follows the Bucknell Report. And we're going to look at Eugene Esmond's a little bit more of the Esmond story and that's available for Patreons. That'll be up for you to feast upon if you want more gnashing and wailing of teeth and British self recrimination because let's be honest now, nobody does like. I mean people say nobody does pomp like us, but nobody does beating ourselves up like we do. So we will be offering an episode of that and a little. And a little bit of British pomp and circumstance too. Good on our Patreon. Thanks so much for listening. We hope you've enjoyed the Channel dash as much as James has been tortured by it. And we'll see you very soon. Cheerio.

[B]

Cheerio.