Eugene Mirman Returns

Summary

You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes – Eugene Mirman Returns

Release Date: May 7, 2026
Host: Pete Holmes
Guest: Eugene Mirman
Summary by PodcastSummarizerGPT

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Episode Overview

This episode welcomes back comedian Eugene Mirman, known for his offbeat stand-up, his role as Gene on "Bob's Burgers," and for being both a pioneer and an enduring figure in alternative comedy. The central theme revolves around secret weirdness, vulnerability, survival, the evolution of comedy careers, and the life lessons picked up through laughter, hardship, and family. Eugene discusses his recent car accident, the fallout and gratitude in its wake, designing his unique comedic path, and the shifting nature of comedy and meaning in the present day.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Warm Reunion & Setting the Tone

• Pete greets Eugene as an old friend, highlighting the warmth and history between them.
• Eugene’s new comedy special "Here Comes the Whimsy" is plugged (available on YouTube and vinyl).

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2. Eugene’s Car Accident and Recovery

Timestamps: 04:59–14:59

• Eugene describes being in a car accident, dealing with a concussion, broken wrist, and the surreal aftermath.
  • “I don't remember what happened, so I don't remember the accident. ...I basically have a concussion, though. What I don't remember as a result, is the thing itself.” (05:17)
• He recalls the strange moment of receiving a call from TMZ in his hospital room:
  • “Is this Eugene? And I was like, yeah. And they're like, hi, it's TMZ. And I was like, oh, my God.” (06:04)
• Expresses gratitude for those who pulled him to safety and the outpouring of love he received.
  • “I'm also like...the only call I got in my hospital room...I was like, oh, did you want three chicken fingers or four?...it was TMZ.” (06:11)
  • “I was pulled out, I think, before the car was completely engulfed in flames.” (06:21)
• He talks about amnesia around the event and the challenge of not knowing exactly what happened:
  • “I haven't watched the videos of, like, the car, and I don’t, you know, I don’t know exactly what happened.” (07:38)
• Pete relates this to the show "Severance", making a parallel to not wanting to revisit traumatic events.
• Eugene's approach is not “dwell on what could have happened,” but rather to return to normalcy and feel gratitude.

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3. Process of Returning to Normal Life

Timestamps: 09:26–13:23

• Eugene shares his practical steps to driving again and getting back to routines with family.
  • “Moved our car from...down the street to our parking spot...the next day, maybe took our son to school...” (08:48)
• The importance of normal, everyday actions—making a sandwich, cooking a meal—are discussed as restorative.
  • Pete: “Making a sandwich probably feels pretty good.” (11:00)
• The "look for the helpers" philosophy (from Mr. Rogers) is invoked:
  • “Memorize at least one number so that the person that loves you in your life can get a panic call from a stranger.” (12:12)
• Eugene describes newly induced phone/social media detox due to his accident—being off his phone in the hospital for a week.

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4. Gratitude & Life Perspective After Trauma

Timestamps: 13:23–16:18

• Eugene discusses the aftermath, gratitude, and the urge to re-align priorities post-accident.
  • “I think I’m more—as opposed to dwelling on, like, well, I could have...like, this could have happened or that could have happened—a lot of obviously terrible things could have happened...” (13:27)
• How his wife’s passing (in 2020) already taught him much of the “life is precious” lesson:
  • “My first wife died of cancer in...2020...so I already knew life was special. I did not need this.” (15:08)
• Shift from "chasing every opportunity" to valuing stability and relationships: “…as you sort of get older and you have some stability, you don’t necessarily chase every opportunity.” (16:18)

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5. Evolving Approach to Comedy and Lifestyle

Timestamps: 17:06–18:35, 21:47–26:35

• Both discuss moving out of showbiz cities and loving the decentralization of the entertainment industry.
  • “You can also do things remotely. And a lot of things have also become decentralized.” (17:15)
• Eugene prioritizes time with family; the grind of constant touring has given way to a more balanced, intentional approach.
  • “I like spending time at home with my family...the grind of touring, which I adored, for decades and still enjoy going places and doing shows...now it’s...not every week.” (17:38)
• Discusses the upper limits of hustle culture in comedy: “We could be kind of insatiable pirate-like entities, even though we're in the arts.” (17:06)

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6. Family Life and Comedy at Home

Timestamps: 26:35–29:47

• Both comedians share how their children perceive their comedy, often joking around in daily life.
  • Eugene: “My son, I think, knows that I'm a comedian and will tease me and my wife will, too...” (26:35)
• The joy of “being the silly dad”:
  • Pete: “The thing my daughter says most to her little friends is, 'he’s joking.' ...I have this weird compulsion, I have meaning. I don't really make a choice to do it...” (27:37)
• Both value humor as a love language and means for authentic connection.

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7. Eugene’s Comedy Philosophy—Silliness, Justice, and Embodying Emotion

Timestamps: 30:22–41:17

• Pete pinpoints the core of Eugene's comedy: “I hear when I watch your comedy...you just...share that perspective of, like, why are we taking this all so seriously?” (30:22)
• Mirman describes his style as anecdotal, almost confessional, but filtered through absurdity:
  • "My comedy is like, everything is, like, from something that happens and it's some sort of weirdish take or version of, like...it's not exactly personal, but it is anecdotal..." (30:39)
• Unpacks a theory on comedians’ emotional transparency, with “horniness” as a playful index of authenticity.
  • Pete: “Can a comedian be horny?...There are people who are one-liner comics. There's people who are anecdotal..." (34:04)
• Eugene’s sense of “justice seeking” as an emotional engine for his humor:
  • "A lot of my bits are—I am very mad at this small indiscretion. But, like, if you pursue its logic, you'll be with me." (41:07)
• Example: His bit about Venmo and sending money to celebrities to highlight privacy issues, contrasted with contesting unfair car rental charges (42:19).

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8. On Innovation, Comedy Scenes, and Fearlessness

Timestamps: 49:04–58:04

• Eugene shares the story behind touring alternative venues ("there's an East Village everywhere"), independently producing and marketing himself, and trusting there are weirdos everywhere who want the comedy experience.
  • “There are these microclimate...alternative scenes. You just need to get to the East Village that's in Delaware.” (49:19)
• Fearlessness and willingness to take risks—a defining trait:
  • “The worst thing that could happen is it would be okay.” (51:49)
• Creation of the Eugene Merman Comedy Festival as an “anti-festival"; willingness to fail as a core value.
  • “I was brainstorming other comics I could rope into being like, how about it's not the Eugene Merman…” (53:45)
• Adapting to new comedic forms, e.g., showing videos at standup shows before it was common.

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9. Lessons from Family, Immigrant Roots, and Finding Possibility

Timestamps: 58:04–66:15

• Growing up with immigrant parents (from the former Soviet Union) shaped Eugene’s sense of possibility and risk-taking.
  • Eugene: “...I was like, well, if they can learn a new language and get jobs and, like, live in a town...I really did believe in the American dream. ...anything’s possible.” (58:14)
• Pete reflects on how witnessing parental or familial resilience plants seeds for creative courage.

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10. Breaking Into Comedy—Then and Now

Timestamps: 66:15–73:20

• The path to becoming a working comic: “If you can get on stage and make people laugh for 45 minutes, ...the chances are pretty high that you would be some version of a working comic.” (60:41)
• Eugene’s first Conan set, being plucked from Boston, and the joy for bookers in “discovering” a new comic.
  • Frank Smiley to Eugene: “We’re just as excited to find you as you are to be found.” (62:12)
• The value of “business imagination” – finding alternative paths, e.g., starting your own show or festival, touring with friends, not following the standard club trajectory.
• Reflections on how success metrics in comedy have changed from TV credits to social media clout.

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11. Changing Landscape of Comedy Distribution

Timestamps: 73:20–77:07

• The move from traditional media to the boom and chaos of internet content; TikTok, YouTube, Twitter.
  • “When you were doing videos, it was novel. And now everyone’s doing videos, and that to me makes that less appealing.” (71:39)
• Both agree that comedy is always built in weird, shapeless times.

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12. Spirituality, Meaning, & Kindness

Timestamps: 77:07–85:39

• Eugene’s spiritual stance: “I would probably put myself in some sort of agnostic-ish. I don’t think I would categorically just deny whatever possibility...I have similarly no proof of whatever things.” (77:25)
• Pete brings up the importance of mystery and finding meaning in what is happening now, not solely in old stories.
• Eugene reflects on ceremonies (like bar mitzvahs) as sources of new meaning and community.
  • “I thought it was really neat...to have something...that feels warm and ceremonial and thoughtful and reflective and hopeful.” (80:52)
• Both note a positive cultural shift towards kindness, empathy, and emotional attunement with children and peers.

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13. Parenting & Passing on Possibility

Timestamps: 85:39–88:45

• Both comedians discuss not pushing their kids into show business, but supporting whatever interests they develop.
  • Pete: “It’s more like gardening...but I’m not gonna, like, tell you to be a comedian...” (85:48)
• Eugene’s son’s “Italian Darth Vader” impression as an example of childlike creativity.
• Gratefulness for parents who let him take the “no-blueprint” path of comedy.

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14. Reflections On the Nature of Comedy Careers

Timestamps: 88:45–92:44

• The landscape continually shifts, but the path is always unpredictable; self-made opportunities and benchmarks become central.
  • “You make their milestones where, like, if you get on TV once, somebody’s like, oh, he maybe is good...” (89:08)
• Indie albums, homemade videos, and DIY marketing as early stepping stones.

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15. Final Memorable Moments and Favorite Jokes

Timestamps: 96:50–99:10

• Eugene re-tells Pete’s favorite bit from his special: a wedding cake shop in upstate NY with a sign “refugees welcome.”
  • Eugene: “...for the first year that my family was in America, we mostly lived off of $700 wedding cakes. ...as someone who is a refugee, I promise...no one is buying insanely expensive desserts with the only money.” (97:13, 97:55)
• Eugene’s love of trying bits experimentally, sometimes with elaborate props (e.g., being covered in tap shoes on stage).

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16. Laughing the Hardest – Comedy’s Joy

Timestamps: 99:17–101:48

• Pete’s closing ritual: asks Eugene about the hardest he’s ever laughed.
• Eugene picks memories involving fellow comic and Bob’s Burgers voice actor H. Jon Benjamin, especially his commitment to surreal bits and pranks.
  • “Once at some party, [Jon Benjamin] spent hours pretending to be someone's agent...and then telling them they would take their career to the next level...” (99:49)
• “It's life...it's Robin Williams in 'Good Will Hunting.' It's the little things. Those are the precious moments.” (101:32)

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “I already knew life was special. I did not need this.” — Eugene Mirman on surviving both personal loss and a car accident (15:08)
• “The worst thing that could happen is it would be okay.” — Eugene Mirman on taking creative risks (51:49)
• “If you can get on stage and make people laugh for 45 minutes...the chances are pretty high that you would be some version of a working comic.” (60:41)
• “It's more like gardening...I'll get the weeds out, I'll water you, sunlight, all that sort of stuff, but I'm not gonna, like, tell you to be a comedian...” — Pete Holmes on parenting (85:48)
• On sending money to celebrities via Venmo: “To me, it’s the principle.” — Eugene Mirman (43:31)

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Where to Watch/Listen and Follow Up

• Eugene Mirman’s Special: Here Comes the Whimsy – on YouTube May 5, also available on vinyl.
• Pretty Good Friends Records for physical media.
• Pete Holmes’s tour dates and children’s book at peteholmes.com

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The Takeaways

• Survival brings perspective, not always transformation: Having gone through immense personal tragedy before his recent accident, Eugene remains pragmatic and grateful, not overly sentimental or upended by “being spared.”
• Comedy as connection, not confession: Sharing oddities, mini-crusades, and the warm weirdness of life can foster bonds as tight as raw confession.
• Cultural landscapes shift, but creative resilience persists: The avenues change (from albums to TikTok), but building your micro-community and carving out a unique creative identity remains central.
• Kindness is (finally) trending: Both comedians express relief and pride in a cultural turn toward greater empathy, both for children and among adults.
• “Try the bit!” — Fumble and experiment, because the worst thing that could happen might just be okay.

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“Keep it crispy.” — Eugene Mirman, as himself and (sort of) as Gene (101:48–101:59)

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End of summary.

Transcript

[Eugene Mirman]

Lemonade. You made it weird with Pete Holmes.

[Pete Holmes]

What's happening weirdos? Eugene Mirman returns to the program today. I am sorry. So glad. One of my oldest friends, I've known him for so, so long and he's so funny. He has a new special called Here Comes the Whimsy which is incredible. It is on YouTube. You can check it out today. Here comes the whimsy and here comes Eugene Mirman. Apologies that this episode dropped later in the day than it normally does, but I've been traveling. But I'm so glad you you are here now to enjoy this wonderful chat with my friend Eugene Mirman, who you may know as Gene on Bob's Burgers. You might know him from Flight of the Concords. You might know him from just being an incredible stand up comedian and you will know him from Here Comes the whimsy on YouTube now. Not too much for me to plug up top. I have my own tour dates. We have, let's see, May 27th at Largo in Los Angeles, followed by the Wheeler Opera House in Aspen, followed by Comedy Works in Denver. We just added a second show on that Thursday. North Carolina, South Carolina, Sacramento, Vancouver, St. Louis, Obispo, Madison, Wisconsin, Seattle, Portland, San Diego. All of those are available now on peteholmes.com and you can also get my children's book spells to cast on your parents. My for yourself or for your favorite child, wherever or whomever you get your books. It's available for pre order now. That's it. In the meantime, enjoy my chat with my dear friend Eugene Mirman. So glad you're here. Get into it. Amazon Health AI presents painful thoughts.

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[Pete Holmes]

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[Eugene Mirman]

Oh boy.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh boy is right. Are we going okay?

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, we're already recording.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, but we can cut that out if you want. No, it's a little nude moment.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

No nakedness.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes, Yes. I hope this was my water.

[Pete Holmes]

That was your.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Only the finest for you. Sprouts.

[Eugene Mirman]

Purified. I can't tell if. Is this a sponsor?

[Pete Holmes]

No, you can on them all you want.

[Eugene Mirman]

This is great purified water. I can't wait to put it in my vaporizer.

[Pete Holmes]

Vape it.

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't. I don't vape Water, I'm sure. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's the best way to get. I love your tampon joke about. What is it called? Chugging. Butt chugging.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Butt chugging.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. Thank you. Thank you. That is a thing. There's an incredible video. This is how I learned about, I think, butt chugging, which is. There's a video of a lawyer in the south talking on behalf of a frat he represents.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, no.

[Eugene Mirman]

Repeatedly explaining that his client did not butt chug. That they do not know what butt chugging is. And he says he's like a 60 something, 70 something lawyer. He has to keep saying it and they all have to be very serious. And it is very clear that, yes, somebody was probably butt chugging.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

But I was like.

[Pete Holmes]

But tell the people what butt chugging is, because I didn't.

[Eugene Mirman]

It is where you soak a tampon in alcohol.

[Pete Holmes]

We're not endorsing this.

[Eugene Mirman]

No. I think it's probably very bad for you. I think it goes around your liver. Don't do that. Oh, oh.

[Pete Holmes]

Because it's going below.

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know. I don't know. Like, the way it avoid. I don't think it's like, oh, if you inject it in your foot, it goes below.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, that's still in your bloodstream. But this is your butt stream.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, but that's a stream. So I believe that's. Yeah, I believe. But I learned about it through this lawyer insisting.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Passionately. Like, I don't even know what that is. You know who really didn't know what that is? Someone who doesn't know the term.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, that's right. That's exactly right. That really seems like.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't know why that feels like the dumbest thing in the world. Where we've headed is that you get drunk faster if you put it in your butt.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And guess. Yeah. Yeah, I'm sure. But it feels like sipping's fine, too.

[Pete Holmes]

Sipping also works.

[Eugene Mirman]

So it feels like I've never like. Oh, I wish I hadn't taken the time to sip.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

It was such a waste of all that time.

[Pete Holmes]

When was that? I listened to your record on the way down just to get in the mood for nude.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I loved it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Thank you.

[Pete Holmes]

And it made me miss you very much.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I'm glad.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm glad you're here. And I'm glad you're okay.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm sure you're getting that a lot.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes, yes.

[Pete Holmes]

And I hope that's all right. But it's sincere.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah. No, it's funny. I was like, I wish people wouldn't tell me that they care for me, and. No, they. Yeah, it's. It was very sweet. A lot of. A lot of sweet out there.

[Pete Holmes]

Did you get that. That bright side. I mean, where are you at? Or is it ptsd? Are you, like. Where are you?

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, I don't remember what happened, so I don't remember the accident. I mean, I'm aware that it happened. I was in the hospital. I basically have a concussion, though. I'm like, what I don't remember, as a result, is the thing itself. I don't know what caused it.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh.

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know, like, why it happened, like, whether it was something to do with me or what happened.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And. But in terms of. So I'm like. Oh. Like, I'm also like. You know, the only call I got in my hospital room, which was also, like, I had just. I had, like. Basically I broke my wrist and had wrist surgery. And then the day before, I could only eat jello or something, because. Yeah, exactly. It was more like. Not because there's anything wrong with you. Had to do with whatever.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And. And like, I.

[Pete Holmes]

You know, something internal, I guess.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, no, it was more like. It was just more like before surgery. Do this or something. I don't know. And then I couldn't eat for, like, 12 hours or drink water, and then I had the surgery. But then after the surgery, I could order food. And then my phone rang in the hospital room, and I assumed it was something to do with, like, oh, did you want three chicken fingers or four? Like, I didn't know. And then it was like, is this Eugene? And I was like, yeah. And they're like, hi, it's tmz. And I was like, oh, my God. Disoriented? And I hung up. Oh, no. But that was enough to sort of let the world know that I had been in a car accident. But, you know, I was. I'm not. Like, I was pulled out, I think, before the car was. Was completely engulfed in flames.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, Katie just showed me the picture, and based on your video that I saw, I was like, he had to have been out. And this isn't a news podcast. I was talking to a friend, and it seems like you were pulled before. It was really.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. And I. So. And I have not. So I haven't really, like, watched the news. I. You know, I. I'm not that interested in the horror part of it. I heard it a little bit because the. You know, in the hospital, the Person next to me would watch the news. So I periodically Hear your own story. Yeah, except for they didn't know it was me. They, like, maybe knew that, you know, like, the governor's detail and some other people helped me. And so there was, like, this sort of first cycle, then after it was confirmed that, like, Eugene Merman and, like, in my legal name, which is Evgeny Merman, are, like, one person. Then they were, like. Then it was sort of, like, good news. The person in the car is also well known. And then, like, that started cycling around, and then. And so I would periodically hear that. And as we were, like, signing my discharge papers, like, that story came on again.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God.

[Eugene Mirman]

And it was. But I didn't, like. I haven't watched the videos of, like, the car, and I don't, you know, I don't know exactly what happened. And I.

[Pete Holmes]

This is very, like, Severance. I'm not trying to. Did you watch Severance?

[Eugene Mirman]

I haven't, no.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, it's just the feeling. And I'm not trying to make light of your situation. I'm actually relating to it. That feeling when you're like, I know there's stuff, and I don't really want to look at it. You really have this thing, like, people. Other people know about it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Other people, and they saw, like, you know, I mean, in a sense, like, I'm, you know, largely all right. Like, I, you know, I crack ribs and whatever. It's not like I. It's not my favorite accident. But, like. And I've never been at anything, like, anywhere near this scale.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But I'm largely all right. And so I know that basically the world was informed of a thing that seemed so much more horrifying. And then I had to sort of be like, yeah, I'm. I didn't like it, but I sort of. Okay. And no one else was hurt. And, you know, I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

We are, like, a result. We want to know the result. Like, how are you now?

[Eugene Mirman]

I am. I am largely, you know, all right.

[Pete Holmes]

But then, like, the. The more nuanced the story is, like, I'm curious if. When have you. You've driven since.

[Eugene Mirman]

I have. But it, like, you know, it took me a while. Like, it took me week or so. And what I actually did is I moved our car from, like, down the street to our, like, parking spot, and I was like, oh, that was fine.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And then I, like. And then. And then I, like, the next day, maybe took our son to school, and I was like, oh, that was fine. And Then, like, I ran an errand that was maybe like 40 minutes one way and 40. And I was like, okay, so this is fine. And this is my son's April break, so. And we didn't know if we were still coming or what was gonna happen, but we kind of did want to, like, get out of town and, like, rest and, you know, and see friends and stuff. So, like, we. We ended up still following, like, we went to.

[Pete Holmes]

Because we had this book.

[Eugene Mirman]

We had this book beforehand.

[Pete Holmes]

I wasn't surprised that you kept it because of what you're saying.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Sometimes when things get all so crazy and upside down, maybe you do want to.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. You just want to kind of be like, I don't know, anything I could do that is sort of a little normal.

[Pete Holmes]

Normal is what I'm saying.

[Eugene Mirman]

So, like, we still went on our trip, and then actually I drove, you know, like, from Sedona and then to, like, Palm Springs and then to hear some of the way. But, like, I drove a lot and. And it was good. It feels normal. I mean, I don't know if I'll at some point remember. You know, I essentially have amnesia of the thing itself. So, like, I don't know if something will happen. And, you know, I'm open to some feeling some terrible trauma at some point down the road. I am glad. I currently am.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. You know, well, your body's protecting you.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But then you can slowly seep it out if you choose.

[Eugene Mirman]

Maybe. Maybe we'll figure out.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't want to be California, but that is, like, so much of my therapy these days is, like, trying to get into a feeling and then releasing it. I know that's very California to say release it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But it's not just, like, looking at it to be brave. It's like honoring it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Integrating it.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, I think, like, to a certain degree, you know, I'm not dwelling as much on, like, what happened as much as, like, I'm so thankful to be okay and thankful to the people who rescued me. And, like, the truth is I want to sort of return to as much normalcy and sort of, I don't know, I guess, like, promote a comedy album. I don't know. It's so, like, funny to be like, I guess I have a show coming up, like, completely get it.

[Pete Holmes]

Making a sandwich probably feels pretty good.

[Eugene Mirman]

The first time I cooked a meal and I was like, you know, this is the risk that I heard. But look at this. Woo. Not to brag. I mean, how many people can do this?

[Pete Holmes]

Just you and some Victorian minis.

[Eugene Mirman]

The heaviest thing I can hold with this.

[Pete Holmes]

I feel like if you don't acknowledge me calling you a Victorian Mini, it feels mean.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, sorry.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, no, no, no, no.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You don't even have to like it. I just. If it goes unheard, I feel like a bully. Like, Victorian ninny.

[Eugene Mirman]

We're both. We're both.

[Pete Holmes]

We're both waving at the garden boy, you know, Now I have to apologize for garden boy. Look, comedy's dead. Have you done.

[Eugene Mirman]

I'm just kidding. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are you afraid to do stand up knowing you only want to say Victorian ninny. You got a lot of. Is it so hard to get on stage? Because that's what you want to say and you can't in California.

[Pete Holmes]

All my garden boy material is done.

[Eugene Mirman]

You got to go to Montana. Done. You can do all your garden stuff.

[Pete Holmes]

That is so funny. You just caught me representing a viewpoint that I don't really have. And I'm glad that you called me out on it because I'm like, I don't feel that way.

[Eugene Mirman]

No.

[Pete Holmes]

So thank you. So, yeah, making a sandwich. What was I gonna. Oh, I'm curious. I keep thinking of Mr. Rogers saying, look for the helpers. So the story of, like, the people

[Eugene Mirman]

pulling you out, that was really, like, you know, it's amazing. They. It's amazing, you know, And I know I was pulled out and disoriented. Like, I didn't know where I was going. And then eventually I remembered, but I did remember my wife's phone number. So it was like. Had a concussion and they were like. So just memorize one number. That's the takeaway is memorize at least one number so that the person that loves you in your life can get a panic call from a stranger.

[Pete Holmes]

That's what you. Some weird guy. Jean's phone.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. No, not my phone. My phone's in the car. So that's the other thing I had. Eventually my wife brought me my iPad so I could text friends, but I didn't have my phone for like a week. And now I'm not addicted to social media. And that's Cheers. Yeah, that's how you get off. That's how you get off.

[Pete Holmes]

How to break up with your phone Chapter. The bonus chapter. Get in a life threatening accident.

[Eugene Mirman]

Exactly, exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

Looking for the helper. So these are just like people with. I'm not trying to be funny. They were wearing shoes, they had lunch. They. They were on their way somewhere and they stopped and helped. That really is beautiful. And then. This is a leading question, but you did kind of hint at it, the positive feeling. I don't want to lead you into some sort of fake gratitude, but I have to imagine you see your son.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm. I'm extraordinarily thankful.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

To be here. And. And that's the thing. It's like. I think I'm more. As opposed to, like, dwelling on, like, well, I could have. Like, this could have happened or that could have happened. A lot of obviously terrible things could have happened if you were pulled out at any point during a thing from a flaming car. So even if it was like, just a little flame to. Engulfed in flame. So, like, obviously it could have been horrifying. And the fact that I am, you know, largely okay is, you know, I do feel obviously, like, insanely fortunate. And.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

It's beautiful. I mean, but when you was. It's emotion. This is again, a leading question, but, like, when you saw your. Your family again, your wife and child, I mean, was that like a big.

[Eugene Mirman]

It was. I think these.

[Pete Holmes]

Gets right.

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, so the funny part is when I saw it, I think. I think the thing about it is that. That when you see me, you're sort of like, it doesn't totally. If you. What you saw was news reports and just simply images. You're like. Like, a lot of people are like, huh? I really thought it'd be a little worse.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And so there is this funny part of I have to be like, I'm okay. And, like, it's not like, I'm not injured, but I think so. So I think, like, when my son saw me. Yeah. He was like, oh, wow. I really. And not like he was watching the news, but like, he was just like, oh, I thought it'd be worse. And I'm glad you're okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, exactly. Both of those.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I'm wondering, like, this, like, do you have that kind of stereotypical or classic, like, oh, my God, you wake up and you're like, life's a gift? Or is that not really the experience?

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, it's. It's a mix. I think it's like, I. I mean, here's the thing. My first wife died of cancer in 20. In 20. In 20. 20.

[Pete Holmes]

20.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. So I. I already knew life was special. I did not need this. So it's like, I.

[Pete Holmes]

You already got myself.

[Eugene Mirman]

I already look like I get it. I don't. I live in a place near family and friends. I, you know, work. But I Prioritize. I don't prioritize it over that. Like, I try to balance it. I already do a lot of the things you would do to go, like, wait a second.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Life's precious.

[Pete Holmes]

Doctor. Going to Bunker Hill Community College, like, for, like, a pickup course. You know what I mean? Like, you already got this.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. So I sort of, like, I already was like, try to do things where I prize and look, I love performing and I love doing things, and I'm fortunate to have a job, so I do feel quite fortunate in the ways that things have worked. But I also very much am not. Like, where at one point where if somebody offered you go to Vancouver for two months, do this thing, like, you would have dropped everything to do it or.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Every opportunity you just take and you take and you take. And I certainly live that way for decades. And then as you sort of get older and you have some stability, you don't necessarily chase every opportunity. Yeah. And so I'm not trying to lead

[Pete Holmes]

you there, but I think we're similar. My wife and I talk about this, like, good life. When that. That was like a mantra for us is like, wait, when are you supposed to do this? And you kind of see, see, even in comedians in the arts, they're still kind of like, I'm being funny, but like a rise and grind kind of mentality.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Do it. Make it. Pile it up. Pile it up. Never say no. It's not even enough that you succeed. Your enemies must fail. Like, you have. Like, if you don't take it, someone else is going to take it. It's like, we could be kind of insatiable pirate like entities, even though we're in the arts.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then I think when we were walking in here, you and I both kind of left showbiz cities proper. Like, we don't live in showbiz centers anymore.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And I was like, you can also do things remotely. And a lot of things have also become decentralized.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, I will would, you know, send an audition from home.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, it's not so, you know, but. But, yes, but I'm not. But I'm also not tempted to do a thing every single night. And then in, like, I lit, like, in, you know, the Boston area. Like, friends come through, like.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, they do shows, so I get to see people still. And then also, like, when you have child and stuff, like, you know, I'm really. I like spending time at home with my family. Like, you know, the. The grind of touring, which I adored. For decades and still enjoy going places and doing shows. But not like I don't fly like every weekend or every week to a place to do shows.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, now it's. And again, partially because I'm fortunate enough to have a steady enough job where I can sort of, you know, you're in general and you'll always, I feel like in the like entertainment, you always have this freelance mindset.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, so certain things you could do more, you could do less. And obviously if I had to travel, I would travel. Like that would just be what it was, you know, But I feel. Feel lucky in that. Yeah. Obviously one that I'm alive and that like I can do more of certain things or less of certain things.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But it is true that my wife having, you know, cancer for, you know, a decade essentially and then that and like I had already sort of re aligned things to be what is sort of more personally important. So though I. So it's like, yeah, you have this car accident where you almost die and you're like, okay, but I'll add to that these three little things, like memorize a phone number. Like, I don't know, like. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Now the profound lesson is it's good you knew a phone number.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah. Yes. So that. Yeah. And whatever, you know, and obviously like, you know, be mindful. I, you know, I won't really know the things that caused it. So I can try to change the possible factors. Yeah. You know, and be like if there was something with me medically, like, let's try to figure it out. If it was distraction, don't be distracted. If it's something else. You know, I know the funding exists, I think already to remove that toll

[Pete Holmes]

booth because it's a notoriously dangerous, I

[Eugene Mirman]

guess, but like many more people clearly pass through it than drive into it. So like you sound like the owner

[Pete Holmes]

of the toll booth.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Like I'm sort of like, I get it. It's not a great toll booth that I bet it's bad. And I don't really remember and I don't necessarily want to go and visit it and be like, yeah, what a terrible toll booth. I don't think it lunged at me.

[Pete Holmes]

Are you scared of it? Like a phantom tollbooth?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's what. Yeah. My one man show will be also phantom tollbooth. No. I don't know. I'm a little like, I don't know how much I know the different possibilities vaguely of what could be. And I don't know how much I want to go to that toll booth and be like, aha, this turn is a little faster. But I don't know. I just sort of want, to a degree, move on.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, it's not time for that.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. I don't want to be like, oh, America's toll booth detective.

[Pete Holmes]

We're gonna go to the travel network while you.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah. I'd be like, I visited everything that's killed people to find out exactly why most people drive past it and a few into it.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a very boring show, but.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And there could have been.

[Pete Holmes]

He's a good host.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yes, exactly. Exactly. I interview the ghost of toll booth Phantom Tolbooth.

[Pete Holmes]

Perfect.

[Eugene Mirman]

Exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

But going back to, like, how did you recalibrate your life while your wife was sick and then after she passed. Because it sounds like you learned you got some richness out of that.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, what's important, I think, in general, like, we had moved already to sort of Massachusetts, where we were both from. We could be around. You were in New York, meaning I was in New York City.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And we moved at first to Cape Cod, and then that's a huge shift.

[Pete Holmes]

Right. I mean, we have.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Though when you also have a child, like.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So much of your life really, is still at home. Like, like, so. So, yeah, you could be at home in Hollywood, I guess, or at home in Brooklyn.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, where did you do Covid, basically.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah. And so that's the thing. I had all these sort of big ideas of, like, you know, at some point, you know, because she had terminal cancer. So, like, you know, I didn't know. I knew, like, vaguely a life expectancy, but we didn't know when. And I was sort of like, whenever that happens, like, we'll do these things or whatever. And really, she died, like, two months before COVID So what actually happened was we just went to our. To a house in Cape Cod.

[Pete Holmes]

The longest chivalry of all time.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, exactly. Where instead of, like, I was like, oh, we'll go do this, and we'll have sleepovers, and we'll, you know, we'll try to fill our life with friends. And then it was like. Or we'll be isolated during a. I take it back.

[Pete Holmes]

That's the opposite of a Shiva, that.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, right, right. No, nobody could gather around you. We had a very small house.

[Pete Holmes]

Is. Is with people coming through, but pandemic is sort of.

[Eugene Mirman]

I rented a porta potty. I rented a porta potty for my yard. Well, because at the time, you didn't know, like, how like, you get like, like, is it dangerous to walk through someone's house? I think this was also a little before masks were totally common. And so I like, a friend came and visited in my yard and like we had like a little fire and we sat and hung out. And I remember being like, oh, if there was like a bathroom, it'd be that much easier. And I was like, oh, I could probably just rent a Porta Potty. Guess what? Porta Potties, pretty affordable.

[Pete Holmes]

Somebody like Trey Merman. Yeah, I've always, I probably said this when you were on in 2012. I think we looked it up. Katie's on Bumble.

[Eugene Mirman]

I'm just kidding.

[Pete Holmes]

She's like, bro, I'm always here. I'm always here for you. I happen to be looking down and she gets a Bumble joke. That's so cheap. I just remember you've always been in my life. And I probably mentioned this last time, like the guy that just goes like, what's the big deal? You too can get a porta Potty. You too can get a suite. Remember you would get the suite in Montreal?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

$75 more. And now you're having little parties in your suite. You always had like a fearlessness of

[Eugene Mirman]

a thing that was. And sometimes you get it for free if you just go like, hey, can I have that? And they're like, sure, yeah, totally. But a Porta Potty is legitimately like, it's like $100 a month for like, for, for friends being able to visit you and to have human contact. That's pretty good, you know, Was pretty valuable.

[Pete Holmes]

Was it an Andy Gump?

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know. It was another.

[Pete Holmes]

And a Gump.

[Eugene Mirman]

I can't remember the.

[Pete Holmes]

But are you sponsored by this Porta Potty?

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know their name, so I couldn't be that sponsored. Not well. But yeah, I did that. And then friends could visit and then eventually they came up with a vaccine.

[Pete Holmes]

We're all here and now we poop inside.

[Eugene Mirman]

Now we poop inside. But I have a plan for pooping outside.

[Pete Holmes]

You're ready. And you know it's very affordable.

[Eugene Mirman]

There's another.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like $3 a day.

[Eugene Mirman]

It's pretty good for friendship.

[Pete Holmes]

That's for friendship.

[Eugene Mirman]

For open ended friendship. It was very, it was a very, it was, it was a great, great expense.

[Pete Holmes]

But after your son was a little bit older and you were outside of the city. Yeah, I mean, I think place is interesting. I loved being in New York, especially in my 20s. Yeah, it made so much sense Yes. I have a joke about it where I'm like, people are like, I love living in New York. You can eat pizza at 3 in the morning. And when you're 47, as I am now, I'm like, I don't want to eat. I couldn't eat pizza.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, if I did that.

[Eugene Mirman]

No. I'd go to, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'd Into a sweat.

[Eugene Mirman]

I go to sleep. Like, I. Yeah. Like, I, like, I really did transition from, like, wanting to be out. And it's true. In New York, like, 20s and 30s, like, you're out forever and you're doing endless things and you're going to stuff. And also, you're sort of. You don't have the same kinds of responsibilities, but in a sense, it's to your career. Yeah. And it's sort of to like. And I always thought of it as like, you know, if every day just brings you closer to, like, sort of some, you know, interconnected freelance web of. I have enough work now, you know, where like, some things come and go and different things arise. And you're constantly, like, trying to do nine things. And if two work out, okay, maybe that's work.

[Pete Holmes]

You're describing it perfectly.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And so that was both, in a sense, the responsibility and the. And also the joy. Like, you're working with people you admire and you're meeting people and it's so neat. But then at some point you're like 50 and a little sleepy. You're like, I just want to. Some of the work. And then I'm like, I like cooking. And now I, you know, I'll make

[Pete Holmes]

it a little sexier. You, you, you had the courage to go. What else do I like to do other than securing some sort of status or, or just place in show business? Just a place. It's a wonderful thing.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Or a career meaning. Yeah. Like. Yeah. A job that I very much enjoy and a thing that I've. That I always. That. Yeah. That I. That I've always loved.

[Pete Holmes]

But I'll say just to invite you to, I don't know, take. Take from this what you will. You and I both know people. You and I both have to concede a level of privilege. I tour once a month. I live outside the city. I'm mostly with my, like, my daughter has very little sense that I'm a comedian, which I really enjoy. I'm mostly just some boring dad.

[Eugene Mirman]

My son, I think, knows that I'm a comedian and will tease me and my wife will, too. Where, like, I mean, the best version of it Is when. So she started at some point, like, if I go, like, whatever. We're checking into a hotel or some random joke.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Or. Yeah. Like, we're at tsa. And someone will be like, check again. And somebody will be like, is this your family? And I think I went like, yeah, what do you think of him? Or something like that. My wife goes, he's a comedian. And then my son, we were, like, walking somewhere. We were staying somewhere. And then, like, this woman was walking her dog. And, like, the dog, I think, like, peed there or something. And I can't remember what the woman said to me, but I. I think I was like, yeah, I. I went there, too, or some random thing. And then my son. Yeah, I can't remember. I was probably broader, but in any way. I can't. She said something that made me say that.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And then my son says to this woman, he's a comedian.

[Pete Holmes]

Got.

[Eugene Mirman]

And it was like. I mean, it made me laugh a lot.

[Pete Holmes]

I get that a lot. The thing my daughter says most to her little friends is, he's joking.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh.

[Pete Holmes]

Cuz I love being. It's a weird compulsion I have meaning. I don't really make a choice to do it. Like, we were. My daughter was in the bathroom, and her little friend was like, where's Leela? And I was like, do you know President Ronald Reagan? Or is that somebody you're from? Do you know that name? She needs to get a passport to go to South America where President Ronald Reagan is buried. But she wants to be right on the equipment. Like, just, like, nonsense. No one benefits from this bit. The kid doesn't laugh. No one around me is laughing.

[Eugene Mirman]

But you enjoy it and also must do it.

[Pete Holmes]

I. I'm telling you, it's a true compulsion.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I can't just be like, she's in the bathroom.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I think it's funny that someone so small is here and looking at me.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And asking something. And I kind of craved growing up. I just loved the silly billies. And I know. And now I know what it's like to be the ham dad.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I'm like, I'm my own version of a ham dad. I know that's not that funny, but, like, why are we all wearing, you know, khakis and keys and wallets? It's so fucking boring. I want to be the guy that my daughter has to be like, he's joking.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Just to not take the world so seriously. And that seems important to you. Is that, like, a value of yours?

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, Yeah, I don't know if I. Yeah, I think it's more just like. It's my like default demeanor and I'm a little silly at times, but like. But also like love the sort of warmth of joking around.

[Pete Holmes]

That too. It's a little connection. If people speak it. It's a connection. It's a way if that's. I guess in a way if that kid was like, oh, Ronald Reagan. Like, that is kind of the quickest way to my heart.

[Eugene Mirman]

Is sort of.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. And it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes, yes. If a kid knew to do that. But like, I love, like when my wife teases me and I do really. So like, to me that's like I feel seen to me being teased by people you love. It like, feels like, oh, you really get me. You get all my like, sort of weirdnesses and so I genuinely adore it. Not from like strangers sort of. You have to be on the street, you weirdos. But. But from. From my loved ones.

[Pete Holmes]

I can be pretty roasty to specifically Mike Birbiglia and that doesn't mean I want to be roasted by somebody at the airport. I. I love joking and I love it to be an excuse to like play. What were you saying? I had something before that Birbiglia thing. Oh, joking, love, language.

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

I guess it went away.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, we can all. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or yeah, put this part in auto tune.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh my God.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

People love anything in auto tune.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, they'll watch for hours.

[Pete Holmes]

I think. I think there's like a. What I hear when I watch your comedy is there is sort of like a. And correct me if I'm wrong, but you just. I think it seems to me that you share that perspective of like, why are we taking this all so seriously?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. I mean, I think that my comedy is like, everything is like from something that happens and it's some sort of weird ish take or version of like. It's like, like it's not like exactly personal, but it is like anecdotal and all from a strange thing.

[Pete Holmes]

You reduce a story down to like it's not quite one liners, but they're very short mostly.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Or these long sort of strange bits that are then like, here's an idea you understand and then here's like 28 jokes about that idea.

[Pete Holmes]

Right, Exactly. Your first joke is Your son is 8 years old and his favorite movie is no country for Old Men.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Before I had kind of gotten into your rhythm, I was like, is that true? No, I know, but like it was your first joke.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I know I hadn't heard you

[Pete Holmes]

in a minute, so it's kind of like, I know some kids, like, I just talked to a mom and her son is 8 and they just watched Hail Satan, the documentary about the satanic trick. And I was like, pardon? Like, I just.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, no, no. Yeah. And I feel like also it's like he's now older. The joke's probably written when he's six.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But it's like, I feel like until he's probably 13 or 14, that joke, I'm not going to keep doing it. Yeah, but. But it's like. Yeah, no, it's the idea of it being someone who's, you know. Yeah. Very, very young.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, that was just your way of saying I'm a dad.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And also it's funny, I tried different movies, but like, they were like movies that I thought like, I think the, the first one I thought of for that was in the Heat of the Night, but it was like, just too much old, like too long ago for people who were 29 to laugh at.

[Pete Holmes]

Right, right, right.

[Eugene Mirman]

I just wanted to think of a serious drama that was like, not like inappropriate from its like violence or something, but just sort of like, why would a child like something quite so stern?

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, I mean, that movie has no soundtrack. It's like the most grown up movie of all time.

[Eugene Mirman]

So that is like, I like being like, oh, what's a movie? That. And then it turns out that's the one.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, when I listen to you, I think of like Emo. Like, yeah, I get some feelings of Emo Phillips, which is obviously a compliment, but Emo is lying to you. You know what I mean?

[Eugene Mirman]

He's.

[Pete Holmes]

He's joking with you.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You are a dad.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. And I am largely. Yes. Sometimes the joke is like, yes. My favorite. My son's favorite movie is not some adult murder mystery.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

But. But a lot of other things are actually true or really did happen or that is the thing.

[Pete Holmes]

I have a feeling they did happen.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Most of it is in fact the case.

[Pete Holmes]

I think I know when you're joking, but like, it's like a new. It's another compliment. It's a unique way of doing it. You are doing something absurd, but it's grounded in something real.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Steven Wright, for example, isn't sharing much about his life.

[Eugene Mirman]

No.

[Pete Holmes]

He's just trying to think of a

[Eugene Mirman]

joke to make you laugh.

[Pete Holmes]

You are sharing something and then you'll go, you'll take a crazy turn and.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah, yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Telling you what you do? Can I.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, I know. It's. I'm just like, well, good. It comes across.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. It's true. But there's something warm about it. We are going like, this is Eugene.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah. Yes. I do think that through the tone and thing, you get to know me. Even though it's true that it's not like confessional.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, I'm not like, last night I woke up weeping.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

Even though sometimes I wake up, I don't wake up weeping. I just am regular weeping on occasion. Right?

[Pete Holmes]

There's weeping.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah, but like, you don't need. Like that. Yeah, but I'm not. Yeah, so I don't. I'm not like confessional.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, in that sort of. Like, we all know that everyone is sad and happy at different times of their lives.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. But I think your Persona is real enough that I'm like, this person weeps. Like, I used to think, like, can a comedian be horny? Like, that was just like a mark for me. Like, for example, like Jim Gaffigan. For some reason I was like, I could see this guy being horny. Like, he was enough of a. Yeah, no, great. You know what I mean? Like Dimitri, our dear friend, not horny. That's not like I'm saying. He doesn't. He's not bringing enough of his. Literally his body into it. It's more of a play on if Superman.

[Eugene Mirman]

That is. It never occurred to me to be like, okay, so there's one liner comics. There's people who are like anecdotal. There's people who you could imagine being horny. And there's people. And then it's like. And a lot of the one liner ones, you can't imagine being horny, but some of the.

[Pete Holmes]

Steven Wright is horny.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. So I guess it's true. It's more of like one of. It's like one of those charts which is like, I don't know, like, are you social or like that?

[Pete Holmes]

Or like for like avoidant.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. So it's like that. So it's like one liner horn. But like, actually, no one liner.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm not even going to back away from my theory because I think I'm onto something. Bobby Tisdale is horny.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sure. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what I mean? He's. He's in his body enough to the point where you're like, this is a sexual Persona. You could say hungry too. You could say angry.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like how emotional.

[Pete Holmes]

How emotional are. Yeah, that's.

[Eugene Mirman]

I like that. You're like the only emotion you're focusing on is horny. But then you're like. Or it could be any feeling. But the only one I'll give to Jim Gaffigan is horny.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, Jim can also. I can see him being angry too. That's good.

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, I think because he, he also though, though he like maintains a tone. Yeah, it is like very like here's my feelings about these things and here like, yes, like a bunch of jokes about it.

[Pete Holmes]

I agree. But like Birbiglia is also horny.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sure. That's I believe, the name of his new show. Also horny.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm so horny. Like he could open any show by just being like, it's been a while. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. As you may know, May is Mental Health Awareness Month, and I do think it makes a good reminder that everybody in the world, everybody is carrying something. Sometimes it's big stuff, sometimes it's just those 3am brain thoughts. Like, hey, remember that awkward thing you said back in 2017? Thanks a lot brain. Super helpful. But really, life can be overwhelming for all of us and work, family, the future. This can overwhelm trying to be present while also looking at your phone 30,000 times a day. This can be a bit much. But the good news, you don't have to carry this alone. Therapy has been such a game changer For Me and BetterHelp has over 30,000 licensed therapists and has helped more than 6 million people worldwide. They will match you with a therapist based on a short questionnaire and if you want to switch therapists, you can do that at any time. People really love BetterHelp. They have an average rating of 4.9 based on 5 based on over 1.7 million client reviews. So it is incredibly well reviewed. You don't have to be on this journey alone. Find support and have someone with you in therapy. Sign up and get 10% off at betterhelp.com weird that's better. H-E-L-P.com weird. I order everything online so why would blinds be different? Why am I going to a store under fluorescent lighting to look at blinds all day? There's a better way to buy blinds, shades, shutters and drapery and it is called three Day Blinds. They are the leading manufacturer of high quality custom window treatments in the US and right now you can use my URL three day blinds.com weird. They're running a buy one get one half off deal, 50% off the second one. They bring the showroom to you. It's so easy. A professionally Trained design consultant with like 10 plus years of experience comes to your home, helps you choose what actually works in your space and gives you a free no obligation quote the same day. And then they handle everything, which is great for me. Design, measure, install, no guessing, no stress. Plus you can choose from thousands of options including light filtering, blackout and even motorized blinds that work with Alexa, which is honestly amazing. We are doing this for our game room. We're putting blackout curtains or shades up in there. Black it out. Zelda big screen. Amazing Right now get quality window treatments that fit your budget with three day blinds. Head to three day blinds.com weird for their buy one get one 50% off deal on custom blind shade shutters and drapery blinds for a free no charge, no obligation consultation. Head to three day blinds.com weird one last time. That's buy one get one 50% off when you head to the number three D a Y blinds.com weird.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yep.

[Pete Holmes]

Pete and Val AD really throwing her in here. Hey. This episode is brought to us by article which Val ordered for us and loved it so much. I was like, you have to do the ad with us. We love when something shows up at your house and you immediately go, this is legit. And that is how we feel about our amazing article furniture. Val, what did we get?

[Eugene Mirman]

We got two gorgeous, gorgeous lounge chairs.

[Pete Holmes]

Lounge chairs tossed the old rickety broken moldy wooden ones. Gone.

[Eugene Mirman]

Gone.

[Pete Holmes]

These ones you can wipe clean.

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[Pete Holmes]

They look amazing. They look amazing. They up leveled the house. It's like John Wick's house.

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[Pete Holmes]

We live in John Wick's house.

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[Eugene Mirman]

We also got a new rug that

[Pete Holmes]

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[Pete Holmes]

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[Eugene Mirman]

But you, You.

[Pete Holmes]

You have. It's not. Let's not gauge each other's horniness, but there is depth of emotion, even in your silliness.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sure. Thank you for. Yeah, I'm gonna leave your horniness. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't want to make you uncomfortable.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, no, no.

[Pete Holmes]

You just wearing a serious accent. Let's not bring up your horniness.

[Eugene Mirman]

But, but, but, but you could see me having emotional.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Emotions and being a mix of empathic to disappointed.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. Well, for real. And there are those feelings. There's a little bit of justice seeking.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

That's something that.

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, I have always. Yes. A lot of my bits are. I am very mad at this small indiscretion. But, like, if you pursue its logic,

[Pete Holmes]

you'll be with me.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Like, it's like.

[Pete Holmes]

Has anyone pointed out.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sorry, yeah, no, that's it.

[Pete Holmes]

Has anyone pointed out that you would spend. I love the bit. I love both bits. Hundreds, almost a thousand dollars of examples of people you send money to on Venmo.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. Has someone.

[Pete Holmes]

And this is the point out. But then you will contest €100 from Hertz. Like, you'll spend hours on the phone looking for your money back for unfair insurance.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, it's because. It's because, like. And I get it. But you know what's interesting is I rented from another car company here, and here they do cover roadside things, so some of it might be, like, international. International. And so I might have assumed, to

[Pete Holmes]

give context, you rented a car in Dublin or Ireland.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, I rented a car in Ireland and we got a flat tire. And I assumed that the coverage we got, because they sell coverage that is for the whole car and then separately tire insurance. So I got the tire insurance, and what it is is that it actually insures just the tire, not like the experience of getting a flat tire.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Which is only strange because for the d of time we got it, it is essentially the same cost as not getting it. So then I was just, like, it didn't occur to me that someone would sell a thing that is the. Essentially the same cost. If we had it for one or more days, the insurance would have been more expensive than just a flat tire. So. So it. So I guess, like, I don't know if I didn't read enough fine print, but it just felt like ludicrous.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

To sell what then I Then. And if you're talking about, like, what you're going to get two flat tires to make it worth it. So that's an accident. And then that's covered by the regular insurance. So, like, none of it fully. So it's true. I will. So I. So I was, like, indignant. And then really, what made me indignant is that the. The person I talked to insisted I called, like, the car manufacturer and never called them. And then I was like, well, I did call you. You never called me back. Yeah, we fixed that. We got out of the situation. It was okay. But I was annoyed at International Hurts. And so I did do a bit where I came up with a lot of, I think, great slogans for them.

[Pete Holmes]

They are great.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So it led to a great bit.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. So that. Yeah. So, yes, it's true. I will send money. It's not. It's. To me, it's the principle. And so to me, the principle of Venmo is, why the hell can you see people's friends? I know. Like, I found so many people, and here's the thing.

[Pete Holmes]

Can you give them some kind of. You found, like, Ted Cruz's wife and sent her some money?

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, yeah. And I found, like, Nikki Sixx from Motley Crue. And, like, I found a lot of great people. But here's the thing. If you want to send a message to any of these people, yeah, you can do it on Venmo. You can just. For a dollar fifty cents. I don't know what the lowest amount is. You can say. I mean, Tara, like, I occasionally get stuff. So this is. That's what this is come back to you. I mean. Yeah. Where like, someone's like, hi. And then I have requests.

[Pete Holmes]

You ever get requests?

[Eugene Mirman]

I know. And I'm. And I.

[Pete Holmes]

You can turn off requests.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, I didn't know that.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, no. I thought that's what you were saying.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, you. I don't know that you can turn off requests. No, I haven't. I more insisted on sending people money. And, you know, I considered, like, what's funnier? Requesting or sending? And I was like, it is just funnier to send people money. It's just that for random reasons.

[Pete Holmes]

That's such a clean example. If I was getting out of an elevator and they said, who's Eugene Mirman? I'd be like, well. And I'd tell them the Venmo thing. That really brings me back to, like, your essence of, like, wait, everyone's on there. Like, everybody's trying to reach out on Instagram. And stuff. Everybody's on Venmo. We're all using it. It's Nikki 6 is on Venmo.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Because he pays friend for pizza, of course.

[Pete Holmes]

And you can even see the pizza emoji in his history.

[Eugene Mirman]

Some people, like, you can make it private and then. But sometimes you just see, like, everything they bought before, like, 20, 22 or, like, before they realize, and they're like, okay, so this person seems to constantly give their son $100 for food.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. You know, so you got to keep it vague.

[Eugene Mirman]

Keep it vague.

[Pete Holmes]

Keep it vague on there.

[Eugene Mirman]

And yeah, don't write too silly of a thing. If it's public.

[Pete Holmes]

And why is it public? What is gay and Venmo?

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know. I don't want to see this. I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

People are going to want to see this.

[Eugene Mirman]

I think I have, like, three or four friends, and I don't know how it happened, because that's not like I ever approved a thing.

[Pete Holmes]

I know. I one time was trying to find someone who edited something for me, and I added them as a friend on Venmo, and that's my only friend, pretty sure. And also, I thought I had a pretty covert name, but somebody found it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, well, a lot of people are just their name. It's.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm. Not just my name, but. Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, yeah, Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I. I thought I was. I don't care. They asked for 300 bucks for their wedding.

[Eugene Mirman]

Did you? Did you?

[Pete Holmes]

I was this. I thought about doing it, but then I was like, if I knew that's what it was. I think that would be kind of

[Eugene Mirman]

fun if you thought the 300 bucks would cover the whole wedding.

[Pete Holmes]

That's a great wedding. Domino's and pictures of root beer.

[Eugene Mirman]

And then you could be like, I paid for a fan's wedding. The wedding was all chicken wings.

[Pete Holmes]

Have you officiated fan weddings?

[Eugene Mirman]

No.

[Pete Holmes]

Great ask.

[Eugene Mirman]

I had a bit in my. The previous. The last special I did, and it was to bury people on stage, so I would get a lot of requests. The thing about it is.

[Pete Holmes]

Wait, are you ordained?

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, ordained in, like, 40 of the 50 states. Like, I don't know how it works. And I have. Like, I did Kurt and Lauren's wedding. I have officiated a few weddings.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

For friends, but I don't want to officiate weddings for people. And the amount I don't want to do it means I could never name a price, because the amount I don't want to do it would be like. I'd be like, yeah. I'll do it for hundreds of thousands of dollars. But that's clearly so insane that I would never say to a real person, like, the amount. I don't want to do this.

[Pete Holmes]

This is why I'm not on cameo.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

$75,000.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Like, I'll make a. Yeah, I'll make a cameo for. Yeah. Like, are you on cameo? No, but. No, but, no, not because I find it upsetting or anything, but I just don't want to.

[Pete Holmes]

I understand.

[Eugene Mirman]

Do it. I liked the. What.

[Pete Holmes]

What I felt when you said that. No, I liked it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Like, I. And I would. If, like, it was.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Needed and it was part of my career and if I enjoyed it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, a lot of it to me is like, if I had fun doing it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And if that also just became, like, you know, that's your job. Your job is you make these fun videos for people.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And they enjoy it. I think what a great thing.

[Pete Holmes]

I understand why you're being careful.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We're not putting down anybody that does it. I understand.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I would imagine just from Bobby's Bees. Do you do signings and stuff? Do you go to cons?

[Eugene Mirman]

I do, like, the Bob's one and I have friends who have done signings like, where, like, you know, there's some guarantee or however it works who really enjoy it. And I, like. Though I haven't done it, I would totally consider it. I think before I thought maybe it's odd, but. But I think the amount of people I know who like it and who. And it's true that I enjoy, like, meeting people to. For whom, like, Bob's Burgers was me is meaningful or whatever it is. Like, I do, like, really appreciate that. So, though I haven't gone to cons other than, like, the San Diego one with the whole cast.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I haven't done the thing where, like, people pay for, like, an autograph of the thing. But I know that there's a whole world of it and people enjoy it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So I would again, consider it, especially if, like, I was going with friends. It's the same thing as, like, touring. Like, I like touring with a friend or with, like, friends. Like, I don't do a ton of the, like.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, and even, you know, when I was doing more and more stand up, like, I wouldn't, like, go to a city as often alone with, like, somebody opening and they're doing two shows a night for however many. I would do much more of, like, like, you're touring with a friend and going from one city to another and it's sort of like a more communal experience.

[Pete Holmes]

I know. That's another great thing. You know, you gave me a lot of key advice early on and one of them. I know I said this last time you were on, but you were kind of pre Internet aware. This was your quote. There's an East Village everywhere. Do you remember telling me?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Or maybe me telling you that. You told me.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah, No, I do. Yeah. And I do think that's essentially the case.

[Pete Holmes]

There are these micro climate and micro doesn't mean small, but there are these fringe scenes. And we were in one. We were in the alternative comedy scene. And I was like, but you tour. Like, I would look and you would go around and do rock venues. Todd Berry was doing this. And I was like, how are you doing that? And you're like, you just need to get the East Village. That's in Delaware.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I was like, I didn't know there was one. And you're like, they're everywhere.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And now we know that because I guess because social media or whatever, people can find you and you can make your beacon that much brighter, louder. But you were doing. You were kind of a. Not just kind of, you were a forerunner of that whole idea.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Because people, I mean, and everybody, like, how many people are fans of whatever, indie bands in random towns of America and that is.

[Pete Holmes]

Did you learn it from indie bands? Did you kind of figure out.

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, I think I also was like my own sort of weirdo in our hometown. Yeah. So like. Yeah, so like.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, that's right. So you were like, wait, I'm in Lexington.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, exactly. And like. And I know that I liked whatever, like oddball things. I liked in oddball comics. And I know Stand up was pretty popular when we were kid, like in the 80s and 90s and stuff. So like. But, but with that said, yeah, I think I was like, of course, like I was in a small college town and everybody there liked a bunch of oddball things. Right. So I was like, if you can let them know and there's a reason to come see you. And you know. Yeah, that's super fun. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Again, it speaks to this sort of fearlessness that I, That I admire about you is you're like. And I know this is going to sound stupid, but like you go, why can't I get a Porta Potty? I really think a lot of people have an anxiety block when it comes to like getting a Porta Potty. I would add, like driving in Manhattan or asking for the suite. And then, and then this going like I. I was the weirdo or the outcast in my high school. I would have gone had Emo Phillips come through our town or whoever it might have been. We would go and see them. So the. Why not risk it? Like, but there is like a sort of humiliation on the line. You go and you don't sell any tickets or whatever. But you didn't seem to have that fear.

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, yeah, I mean, but also I wasn't. It's not like, I mean, the meaning, like we're 40 people, are 150 going to come. The humiliation was very low risk. Yeah. Like, meaning. And then there was sometimes like.

[Pete Holmes]

Is that what you meant? It wasn't.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, it was, it was low. Like in terms of doing shows. Like, you know, the worst thing that could happen is it would be okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, but see, that I think deserves to be stepped out. That quality that you have, which is like, I don't know if we call it a Steady Eddy or something, but you don't seem to be plagued by anxiety.

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, I am in that I'm an anxious person.

[Pete Holmes]

You would say you're an anxious person, but not like 40 people.

[Eugene Mirman]

I have like. You would like a general, like a. No, I have a broad constant anxiety. Okay, but. But I guess, but that doesn't necessarily mean I don't do things also, like, you know, if you go and you play whatever a hundred or two hundred seat club, maybe you have a small guarantee. Maybe you have no guarantee. But you know what? You make X amount. Like, the truth is work was work. So if all you're doing is like paying for the cost of a car and maybe. And like certainly the first tour I did around the US like where I went to someplace in Connecticut where I could rent a car with unlimited miles and then drove it in a circle around the United States and then returned it there. Wait, what? Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You found a place in Connecticut?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, and they, and I'm sure they assume that you're like local. Local. So like, what is unlimited miles? But I returned it with like eight miles. I think that I. Oh my God. But like. And then we all stayed in one hotel room. You know, it was.

[Pete Holmes]

Who was this?

[Eugene Mirman]

Me. It was some different comics. Like Leo did it.

[Pete Holmes]

Leo.

[Eugene Mirman]

Leo Allen and Andy Blitz was on some of it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sarah Egan was a friend who was. Who. Who sort of drove the van, was a tour manager. Langhorne Slim opened that whole tour. This is like around 2004 for, like, my first album.

[Pete Holmes]

But you see how this isn't. This doesn't really line. Whatever anxiety you have, which I believe you.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Doesn't seem to be in the third dimension. Like, you seem to be like a reality. Like, okay with facing reality. You had the Eugene Merman Comedy Fest, right?

[Eugene Mirman]

As a joke.

[Pete Holmes]

I know it's a joke, but there's a certain.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I. I at first wanted to, like, I was brainstorming other comics I could rope into being like, how about, it's not the Eugene Merman. Yeah, it's the Eugene Merman and John Bedrick. Like, I was like. And then, like, we were all like, oh. But the funniest version is that it's just this guy who's not that well known, but, like, a little. And like, it's. It's just like, I was sort of like, yeah, it's so dumb. I can't not do the. The dumb version.

[Pete Holmes]

But I think you'll agree again, there's. I just think there's a. Most people go, as a joke, I'm going to have the Pete Holmes Comedy Festival. That's funny. But then they go, like, what will people think? Or, what if it stinks? Or like, you just seem to have, like a. You remind me of Tig in a way. There's like, Tig has a certain.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, okay, it's true that, like, it can fail, but every time you get on stage, you can fail. Like, I. Like, that doesn't escape me.

[Pete Holmes]

I still think it's remarkable. I think there's something fun. Even when you were making your videos back at Invite Them Up. Yeah, people weren't doing that. It was. Again, it was a pre trend. Like, you were doing these YouTube videos.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I eventually started doing them before YouTube. Yeah. And so did Aziz. And people started getting the idea, you can show these things live. I really do think if you did. So hopefully, I hope you feel these compliments. There's like, you were changing the scene. This is something. Oh, you can play a video now. It's like, of course you can play a video. That's what reality is. It's like, videos, but like, you were doing it. And then there were a lot of people, myself included, that were like, oh, I could film something, edit it, manipulate it, show it, get real laughs. And that's another way to entertain people

[Eugene Mirman]

as part of a show.

[Pete Holmes]

As part of a show. But even that seems to benefit from this. Tig Notaro, Eugene Mermany. Sort of like, anything can fail, but like.

[Eugene Mirman]

But anything can Also succeed. And again, we were coming, like, you know, when I started stand up in the basically early 90s throughout college or whatever.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, it had crashed so much that, like, the idea that you'd make money from it was not like. It was like, maybe, but the. But all you. We really had to do was just get laughs on stage.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So if you made. So if I read a weird thing or did a bit or like, sent people money and people would laugh, that was my bit. If they didn't, I'd try to fix it or get rid of it or, you know. So, yeah, so a lot of it is trial and error.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But same with video. Like, I play a thing and I'd be like, okay, that got a laugh. Or, like, change this out or whatever. Tighten it, like. And so I would just do things on stage, and if it got laughs, it would become my act.

[Pete Holmes]

Forgive this. Sort of James Lipton, Although I love James Lipton. Sort of like, where do you think you got that? Who modeled that for you?

[Eugene Mirman]

So I think some of that was my college experience where I went to Hampshire College, which very sadly is now, I think is closing.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, really?

[Eugene Mirman]

But, you know, I had to, like,

[Pete Holmes]

it's going to be the Eugene Merman, Hampshire College. Like, you're going to do it as a bid.

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't think I have, like, the, like, whatever it is.

[Pete Holmes]

8 million.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, like 100 something million. Like, I think I know. I don't know how much it would

[Pete Holmes]

cost the Gene Belcher dorm. Like, this is a very pricey bit.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes, yes, exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

And no one's laughing. People are just having their lives.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I just need 100,000 people to give me 100,000. No, I don't know how. It's like some unattainable. I need the GDP, but you could

[Pete Holmes]

get 500,000 people to give you $500.

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't think I could. I guess. I guess I think this is where it starts. I can't wait to. This is in the documentary GoFundMe. And it's like, goal is $58 million.

[Pete Holmes]

And GoFundMe is thrilled because they make 5% or something.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And then, like. But then, like, all the comments are like, you could have just, like, ended hunger in Tennessee. And I'm like, I don't know. I. I love my alma mater. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

What can I say?

[Eugene Mirman]

But, you know, I had to, like, you know, I, like, I would just do these sort of random open mics or, like, coffee houses, and I started a, you know, a show in the Basement of my dorm, that was once a week. And a lot of it would be the stuff of I would just try things. And again, if it got.

[Pete Holmes]

Laughs I see that that's the landscape where you started.

[Eugene Mirman]

But what made me try random things?

[Pete Holmes]

Did you have some friend growing up, like some uncle? I mean, is there anything in the immigrant kind of like, oh, my God, I can't believe we're here?

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, I do think that there's a certain amount from my parents simply bringing us to America that I was like, well, if they can, like, learn a new language and get jobs and, like, live in a town. Live in a town and live in a town. But Lexington, pretty good. Pretty good. Solid, solid town. And like. So I sort of was like, well, if I really. I mean, part of it was I really did believe in and do in the American dream. And I understand that, like, you know, things change and that this is like, 40 years later, 50 years later. And that it's hard and some things remain true. And, yes, some things are. Like, buying a house now is much, much harder than it was right. 35 years ago or whatever. So, like, I get that, but. But within the sort of the broad context of, like, possibility or point of view, I sort of. I think from my parents, and then also, like, our sort of immigrant community did kind of think, like, well, like, anything's possible. And you. If you think. You know, I do think that some of the limitations are probably. I mean, are what people think they maybe could do or not do. So. So I. So I think in terms of trying stuff on stage, you know, if I thought something was funny, I would try it. And often it didn't work. And sometimes it would work.

[Pete Holmes]

Because it's not like you're leaving Soviet Russia.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, it's certainly not as hard as, like, learning a new language. And then, like, I think I had

[Pete Holmes]

some of this, too. My mom left Lithuania when she was seven, so somewhat similar. I was. You were about that age, weren't you?

[Eugene Mirman]

I was 4 when I got here.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So you had. We had different experiences, but I also saw my mom.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Who.

[Pete Holmes]

You know, you're making me realize, like, that that's something you see. You go like, oh, what? Like, what? And my dad, too. He lost his parents, and he, like, started driving an oil truck and, like, put a business together. And I was just like, who taught you how to do this? So then you're like, again, I think

[Eugene Mirman]

it's believing in possibility.

[Pete Holmes]

And when you said American dream, I really grew up in a house where I Was like this. Both of my parents are like so hardcore. The American dream that were like all this hardship, all this, like, real pain. And they were like, ah, well, we might as well this. And then I grew up seeing these two lovely little nutty people. But I was like, oh, I can. I always think of this one open mic I went to in Flatbush where I was just like, oh, I was a brave little kid.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like there was something brave about me, about doing.

[Eugene Mirman]

And here's the thing. And you know, I don't know for sure, but like, I definitely think, like, certainly for our era and probably before, you know, if you can get on stage and you can make people laugh for 45 minutes, like really laugh, the chances are pretty high that you would be some version of a working comic.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, maybe you're playing clubs and people know who you are. They don't know who you are. You know, maybe you're blowing up on social media or maybe you're getting some TV spots. But like the very first time I ever did Conan, which is like, I think around 2000. Yes. Conan O', Brien, the TV show. And, and I, you know, I'd been auditioning for a year and a half or two in Boston and like four Conan, like, for Conan, like, they would, the producer would come and he would watch people and like, you know, and then I remember them at some point reaching out and being like, we might need you to come on Friday. And I, like, had never been on television for. I think I'd done like one voiceover thing, like for a cartoon and never done stand up. And I was sort of like, okay. They were like, find a place to practice or whatever. And so I found a spot and like did a set or whatever. And then they were like, you know, the next day or the day after they called and they were like, we need you. Yeah. To come, so we'll fly you in. And it's. It was incredible. And you know, I came and then we went. I was coming from Boston. I lived in Boston at the time. I didn't live in New York yet.

[Pete Holmes]

Wow.

[Eugene Mirman]

And so I, you know, came and I went to a few clubs and maybe we rearranged a few jokes or something. And then like I did Conan. I remember, like in this process, like asking, it was Frank Smiley. And I was like, why? Like, why am I here? Like, why aren't you just asking Todd Berry or Mark Merritt, like, why are you getting me from Boston when there's like a city full of stand up comedians? And he was sort of like, we're just as excited to find you as you are to be found. Like. Like. Like, we're. It's fun to be the people who found a guy who they think is funny.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

And put them on TV for the first time.

[Pete Holmes]

Which you get to do, too. Right. I mean, I get to occasionally do that. And somebody will be grateful that you pass their name along and you're like, no, I look cool.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That. I know who you are.

[Eugene Mirman]

That's the thing. Like, I mean, I remember when, like, Michael Che would do sets in New York when he was starting out and he would just destroy.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And so it was like, sort of, like, it's not surprising right away. Succeeded. Everyone wants a person who is very funny and killing on their show.

[Pete Holmes]

That's right. And you look cool if you passed Shay's name along. Cool is maybe wrong. I'm just saying, like, it's a privilege to be able to do that.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. Yeah. It's like. Yeah, I remember. You know. Yeah. But you're talking about Hannibal. Like. Like, all these people who were like, I told you. Sorry, you probably.

[Pete Holmes]

I told you about Kumail.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah. That was, you know, from.

[Pete Holmes]

That was a joy.

[Eugene Mirman]

Chicago.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah. I'm not looking for credit. It was so fun.

[Eugene Mirman]

You did it.

[Pete Holmes]

But it was fun. Kumail and I were touring or living in the same cities, and then when I got to New York before him.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I'm remembering that we could probably find that email.

[Eugene Mirman]

Probably.

[Pete Holmes]

Then Kumail goes up and murders.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And so then I'm like, booking him, and then we're touring.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, everybody wins. Everybody feels happy and involved.

[Eugene Mirman]

I do think if you are someone who can get on stage and you. This is what you were saying. Kill you. You probably will become some version of a professional comedian.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And obviously, you could blow up huge. Or you could just be a working, touring comic. Or maybe you are, like, live in a city and you do all the clubs in that city. Killing. And that's also a livelihood.

[Pete Holmes]

This is going back to you. I know I'm kind of obsessed about this quality of yours, but, like Yasmin, there are people that go up and kill. And then it does seem you need to have some sort of. I don't want to call it business imagination, but some sort of livelihood imagination. Meaning, like, oh, there's touring, there's touring with friends. There's a. There's a problem with touring. It's lonely. And I could tour with friends. There's festivals. Oh, I could start a festival as a joke or Whatever. Whatever it is.

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, that was not a profitable festival.

[Pete Holmes]

No, I know.

[Eugene Mirman]

Less profitable than if I just did shows at Bell House alone.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. That's right. It was more of a joke. I appreciate that. But there's a type of intelligence. I talk about this all the time on the pod. It hasn't come up in a while, though, so I'll allow it. I'll allow it. There was this different types of intelligence. One of the guys, Malcolm Gladwell thing, he had like the highest IQ of all time. He goes on game shows and just makes hundreds of thousands because he's, like, brilliant. But he dropped out of college. And when they interviewed him and said, why did you drop out of college? He said, my classes were too early. I couldn't get up early enough to get to class on time. And Malcolm Gladwell makes the point. He's like, why didn't he ask for afternoon classes? He was on a full scholarship. They wanted him at the school. But there was this mermany quality that was missing, which is a type of intelligence, like a. You could call it social intelligence or imagination that goes like, they want me here. I can't get to a 7am class. This class is also offered at 2pm I'm gonna ask them to move me. And then he makes this point, and I'm almost done with this regurgitation, which is only partial. There was another guy at the same college, didn't have a brilliant iq. In fact, he burned down the chem lab. He burned it down?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Obviously by accident, doing an experiment. He is now, like, you know, I'm gonna exaggerate here, but, like, he's won the Nobel Prize, like, he's thriving and he just had that sort of. That type of imagination that, to be honest, my father had in spades, which is just like. It's just a person. Yeah, it's just a person. It's not a college. It's just a person that you talk to.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Though I will say that the college. So, like, I, you know, ran an open micro college or whatever, but in general, my college was where you design your own major. Yeah, I designed comedy. But as a result, you had to, like, find professors to work with you. You had to pick sort of classes that would come together in this concentration of the thing you thought, you know. So I did, like acting, but also like Rise of Mass Culture and did like, writing and documentary film and, like, did a variety of things. And so it. The experience aside, along with like, sort of the difficulties of like, you know, kind of shaping your own education. Very much mimicked. Like, I had. I put on a one hour stand up act was my final project and I had to get people to come. So the truth is a lot of my experience. Say it again.

[Pete Holmes]

A little marketing there as well.

[Eugene Mirman]

Absolutely. I had to figure out how to do that. And so a lot of the things that I did in college were the same way. You would sort of create your own, you know, world in stand up, where, like, you know, often some people rise by becoming an opener at a club, then a middle, then a headline or whatever. And then I, you know, even like, though I. When I got to New York, you know, because I had maybe gotten into. Well, because I did, like, there were a few things I did. Aspen, wherever. There was like some clubs that like, passed me. But then I would, like, leave. I didn't know how it worked. I think I would leave Veils and they would never call back.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I was just like, I think I'll just start my own show. That just sounds so much easier than whatever this weird system is.

[Pete Holmes]

But this is moving your morning classes right there. You just moved your morning classes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, it was like, this will be a better way to do it.

[Pete Holmes]

Which it's.

[Eugene Mirman]

And it was like. And it was also. And then I was like, oh, my God. When you play a small rock club, you actually get like, more of the door than when you play a comedy club, which admittedly, like, brings in their own audience to a degree.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So you are. You have to figure out how to get 80 people to show up to a place in Detroit or whatever. Right. But. But it turns out you can do press or you can sort of pitch a story of like, this is like an interesting. Like three people from a scene in

[Pete Holmes]

New York City are trying to plant it here. Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

A little fun.

[Pete Holmes]

Yep. Yep. This sounds, by the way, like, when I moved to New York, maybe it was you. Who knows? It might have been you. I was like, I don't have a credit. I don't know how to get on shows. And you were like, I'm pretty sure it was you. You were like, well, didn't you just move here from Chicago? And I was like, yeah. And you were like, that's your credit.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

It sounds like something from this school of thought.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. Which is like, I don't know if I said that, but that does sound.

[Pete Holmes]

It sounds like.

[Eugene Mirman]

But again, all you would really have to do is just kill and do well and do well. And I say kill but like, yeah, you would have to. Well, I really have a good.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Said and be funny or. Or. And that's really more important laugh because. Well, you might need to be from Chicago the first time someone sees you.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Then you can just be fun. Yeah. And then, you know, and that's sort of New York, obviously. In other cities, you. You know, I don't know that people have credits that much or they, like, maybe open for somebody or something.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't know what it's like these days. They say, your followers, this guy's got 2 million followers. No, I don't think they do.

[Eugene Mirman]

I think it's true. And then some of those people are standups who have those followers for a reason. And then some of those people are just like, yeah, weird sensations. And then, like, I don't know, do they do 10 minutes of some odd thing and then a 30 minute Q.

[Pete Holmes]

And a lot of Q and A's out there. A lot of Q and A's selling out stadiums. And I'm not even that.

[Eugene Mirman]

If you started crowd work, Q and A's like, Q and A is like, I'll literally tell you about my favorite sandwich.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, I think so.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I think people are padding time all sorts of ways. And I get it. If you started now, if. If Eugene Merman was 19 years old today, there's a really good chance that you'd be breaking out through TikTok.

[Eugene Mirman]

I would be probably trying to make videos and like, you know, but it's so funny because I feel like I've made us. Like, I have a TikTok, but I've made such a small number of videos and some stuff that I've been like, that's like a silly, like, jokey thing, you know? You know, a few thousand, like, nobody watches it. And then I have a handful of things where I'm just in a hotel room or somewhere with a pot or a pan, and I go like, I'm Eugene Merman and I have this pan. And it's like 50,000 views, like 200,000. And I'm just like, I. I don't know that I have it in me to really, like, figure.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Eugene Mirman]

But if all I had was time to figure it out. Like, I remember. Yeah. Like, I remember sending. I think I had AOL at the time. This is like in the, like, early 2000s of doing invite them up and sending like, the weekly, like, email list about who's on the show to like 80 or 100 people maybe on it. And I remember somebody replying Being like, you know, I think they were like, a writer for some show, and they're being like, this is one of the funniest things I get, like, every week. And I was like, yeah, I had a lot of time to make a funny email. A funny email.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. So you would have the time to figure out TikTok.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And now I both don't. And it isn't like I really enjoyed Twitter at the time, before it sort of became bots and whatever. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Odd thing it is. And had, you know, however, like, several hundred thousand followers, and now it's just sort of like such a neutral cesspool.

[Pete Holmes]

I was gonna say open. Open sewer.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. It's like, it's so, like, it's not. What it also is, is not fun. It used to be very fun.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah, it was fun.

[Eugene Mirman]

It was simply enjoyable. And you could really interact people.

[Pete Holmes]

And he was texting people you didn't know.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And it was. And that was really fun. And it was fun. Less fun.

[Pete Holmes]

No, it's not fun. The stakes. The stakes change.

[Eugene Mirman]

So I could see that if I was 19, I would simply find TikTok, figure out Instagram fun, and then I would do that.

[Pete Holmes]

Are you like me, though? There's something. When you were doing videos, it was novel.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And now everyone's doing videos, and that, to me, makes that less appealing. It's. It's fun to forge your own path.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. I think if I thought of a thing that I thought was funny or, I mean, again, like, I think, like, I. Yeah, I don't know. I. It's more that, like, my time is different or, like. Or, like, like, in my attention to things. Yeah. You know, so. Yeah, I still enjoy, but I don't make, like, the same kinds of videos I used to, though I sometimes think about it and, like, who knows, maybe in 10 years I'll sort of like, again, have more time and just be like, actually, I will start making, like, I'll buy a bunch of wigs.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And make a bunch of silly videos.

[Pete Holmes]

I always remember Showalter make. I thought it was the coolest thing in the world that Michael Showalter made a video making fun of your videos.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

And do you remember he's drinking whiskey, like, during it or something. That was a big laugh.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Was that like, he drinks. It's like, implying that you're getting lit and doing these videos or whatever. Whatever it was, we all laughed, and I was like, how cool is this dude that he's getting roasted by Show Walter?

[Eugene Mirman]

That was Such a funny video.

[Pete Holmes]

It was so, so fun.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I do want to get a little bit to the Meaning of Life. You know, I'm kind of like, whatever, who cares? I'm sure you're aware that I like talking about those things.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sure. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I do want to say though, one of my favorite. I quote it all the time is you go, the Bible is a lie. Do you remember this joke?

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't, but I'll find out.

[Pete Holmes]

You go, the Bible is a lie. If it makes you feel any better, it's a really old lie. You said that at Union Hall.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, that's so funny.

[Pete Holmes]

And I see still, I don't know, I thought it was a very clever, very funny joke.

[Eugene Mirman]

It's really funny. I don't remember it, but I believe you.

[Pete Holmes]

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[Pete Holmes]

So I always thought of you. I always. Category, that's where I categorize you when it comes to spirituality, which was like 20 years ago. So that's why I'd love an update. I'm just curious where.

[Eugene Mirman]

So I think so funny is the idea there, but I don't think I would be as like, meaning I'm sure some of the things happen like, you know what I mean?

[Pete Holmes]

What do you mean? The Bible?

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, like, like, I think, I think in terms of, I guess in a sense I would probably put myself in some sort of agnostic ish. I don't think I would categorically just deny whatever possibility. Like I don't know if we were, you know, if this is, you know, like if we think of video games now and we think of like how much better that technology would be in 1000 years. Like this could be It. This could be it. And I don't think, like, I have the, like, confidence to be like, absolutely not.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, I just survived an accident that felt very much like, you know, oh, somebody was like, reset.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But with that said, I think, like, I also have similarly no proof of whatever things. So, like, when, you know, to me, like, the Bible already or, you know, all of the, like, it's sort of like. It's so specific. It is where I think about when people describe, like, stuff from 50 years ago and how off they are.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, and even when your own memories, when you're like, you know, when you retell a story, it becomes slightly wrong each time.

[Pete Holmes]

Totally you narrative.

[Eugene Mirman]

So it's like, I don't know. So when I think of, like, the detail of some of these things, I'm sort of like, well, I find that unlikely for sure. So I find, like, some of that.

[Pete Holmes]

But Dwayne Kennedy had a great joke about that. He's like, the New Testament is filled with. I forget the first one is what it really is filled with. Let's say it's like stories and red wine. And he's like. And you know how when you're drinking red wine, sometimes the story kind of gets away from you? It's a great line.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I. I just. So I'm with you. It's very. Meister, I'm gonna work this in. It's one of my favorite quotes. Meister Eckhart, who's this mystic from, I believe, the 1100s.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sure.

[Pete Holmes]

I believe it's the.

[Eugene Mirman]

I say sure, but obviously I have no idea.

[Pete Holmes]

Who cares?

[Eugene Mirman]

I meant like, yeah. Or the 1200s. I bet your story will make just as much sense.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, I think about this all the time because I wish more. Well, he's one in a billion. He's amazing. But he said, what difference does it make if Jesus was born in a manger 2000 years ago, if that birth isn't happening in me right now, Meaning if it's not alive. These stories, we're missing the point if we're looking for. Or we're missing some of it if we're looking for architecture and proof and this happened and fundamentalism, basically. He's saying, like, whatever the mystery of reality is, this is how I feel is present right now. It's. It's the awareness with which we are aware.

[Eugene Mirman]

And many of these things have a lot of, like, you know, I'm partially in town because I went to. Or largely actually, because I went to a bar mitzvah two Days ago. That was wonderful. You know, it was like the. The things that, like, my friend's son like, said and the whole thing, like, it was just really, like, thoughtful and reflective. Yeah. And felt very present and tied to today in a way that, like, I feel like the ones of, you know, that I went to as a kid, like, felt probably more formal and less connected to and I don't know, like,

[Pete Holmes]

this was customized to the times.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. So I do think, like, certainly the things he said and the lessons imparted and the thoughtfulness of it I thought was really beautiful and I thought it was really neat. Cause also, like, most of the things we go to that are ceremonies or for me are like, weddings really, like, I guess in funerals.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Weddings.

[Pete Holmes]

Funerals. Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So they're like, there's this, but. But it's rare to have something in the. In the sort of middle to begin to the beginning of really someone's life that feels warm and ceremonial and thoughtful and reflective and hopeful.

[Pete Holmes]

There's something beautiful.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. So. So I really, really appreciated that. Yeah. So I think, like, in general, my, like, I don't know, like, I. I don't know if I reflect on the, like, exactly. The spirituality of. Of anything other than. I would neither, like, categorically deny or confirm, you know, various modes of.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, putting those aside.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Do you have. Is it something you engage with, like a. What is this ness. Of reality?

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, I mean, I don't know if I engage with the. Like, what is. Just Because I think it's like a little bit of. Anything's possible. Possible.

[Pete Holmes]

I see.

[Eugene Mirman]

So. So, like, I, I, you know, I. I think I engage more in, like, what is the best way to, like, what are like, the lessons you would impart or the way to live or the things.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

To enjoy. You know, I don't know if I like, think of, like, the. Like. Is the meaning like work or family or joy or like, you know, some sort of. It's probably like a balanced mesh of a lot of things.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So I think. I think more about, like. Like, what's important to me and like, what, you know, what's, you know, a way to be and prioritize, you know, more than, like, you know, I'm certainly not like, trying to get into a heaven or avoid a hell. Yeah. But that doesn't. But it's still, like, you're still like, functioning within a broad, kind morality.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah. Kindness. I love this.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. It's true that, like, I do think, like, for, you know, and also, like, when I think of, like, when we're growing up, you know, the sort of, like, meanness of people seems right to be not as much like, like, I will say, like, the amount that, like, the kid, like my son and my. The kids of my friends, like, seem to in general, like, though there is obviously, like, bullying and all this stuff, but, like, it's different. It's different. And I think the difference is, like, adults now take it as a problem. Like, meaning when we were kids, like, I don't know that people stole my lunch money, but certainly the idea that that's okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Somehow. Or like, it's okay to punch people because kids punch each other. And like now.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

I think you'd be like, oh, you can't actually. Well, defending make people cry or punch them in the face.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

That's not great.

[Pete Holmes]

Right. That's what, that's what is so beautiful about trans inclusiveness. And I think there's even like, an unspoken jealousy you ever get. It's hard to talk about this. Like, I'm so sensitive and present, or I try to be with my kids, with my daughter and her issues and her friends, even though I'm winding them up about Ronald Reagan. But you know what I mean? Like, we value their experience. Wouldn't you agree? In a way. And sexuality is often like a very extreme way to include and support. And sometimes I think people don't know it, but they're just so rippingly jealous that they grew up in a time where they were.

[Eugene Mirman]

That was not the case.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, to the great Gary Goleman, we grew up in Boston, where drinking sprite was considered effeminate.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yes. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So it's like, that's why Boston can be. I said this with love for our hometown, but, like, oh, you're gonna have a gender reveal party. It's like, yes, we are. You know what I mean? Like, it can be hard to update the file, but I'm agreeing with you that, like, I see improvement.

[Eugene Mirman]

I think there is a broader kindness or at least a reflexiveness and a thoughtfulness that exists seemingly now.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And that was probably less so when we were kids.

[Pete Holmes]

Even just like being present with your son, with your wife, like, that idea.

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, I think also, like, you know, for us, we. Our jobs are much more freelance based. So, like, you know, there was a part of my life where I was away a great deal, and now there's a part of my life where I'm largely home, where I imagine, like, my son's 9, but if he's like, 15, I wonder if he's gonna be like, hey, you should go on tour. Like, if he's gonna be like, let's wrap this. You got. Why you got so much time.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

There's quite a few cons recording voices for various cartoons and get back on the road.

[Pete Holmes]

Do you want to be the real, real dad? Yeah, I think about that, too.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Our kids aren't that far off.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, they're like. Yeah, it's, like, lovely. And it's also, you know, important to me. And so I'm. Yeah, you know, I. I'm home as much as I can, but.

[Pete Holmes]

Do you think your son has the bug? Like, I. I catch my daughter. This just happened. She rehearses accents.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm not trying to push her. Anyway, that's another thing we do, we honor. It's more like gardening. I'll get the weeds out, I'll water you, sunlight, all that sort of stuff. But I'm not gonna, like, tell you to be a comedian. I'm not going to tell you to not be a comedian. But my daughter lately has been going, mommy, I require more privacy. Which is something my wife heard a child, a British child say when she was a kid. So she won't. So I'm riding her on the bike. I got a plus one seat on the bike, and I just hear her going, mommy, I require more privilege. You know, the wind's going by, I can barely hear it. But I'm like, oh, she does have the. I'm gonna rehearse this. An accent is interesting. It's funny. It's like a little card trick. I know how to do a British accent, and I'm so 7. Does your son have any.

[Eugene Mirman]

He. He. He doesn't. I mean, he. He what? He does. He does. I mean. And he must have been, I don't know if, like six or seven when he first did this. He really does, like. He, I think, is much more into, like, building and stuff and, like, okay, Legos and construction, but he has this thing that he. And I don't know even where it came from, but he does. He's like. He has, like, one impression, and it's Italian Darth Vader. And it's so funny. He just goes like, luke, I am your father, or something like that. And it's, like, incredible. It's so funny. And it's not even deep.

[Pete Holmes]

It's just a different guy.

[Eugene Mirman]

It's just a different guy. Silly, simple. And he must have been, like, honestly, like, seven, like, whenever like, he couldn't have watched Star wars too long ago, so he's probably seven.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But it. And I don't even know where from. I don't know how it came about. He just did it one day, and it made me laugh so much. But. But actually, he's really into, like, building.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And, like, hand, you know, and stuff like that. So Legos. And, like, he started. He's. There's a thing called Eel Craft is similar, but, like, maybe on the school. Okay. So he's been doing that. But yes, he does some of that. He. He. But he, like, will now watch, like, videos on, like, how to make, like, a vending machine in Legos. And, like, we'll make, like. So he'll, like, sort of make his own kind of neat things that'll be like, you pull this, and then you put in a coin. You do this, and then, like, a skittle comes out and it's like. So I think, like, that stuff is really fun. But again, like, he's welcome to pursue.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Anything that he wants. And I will say that, like, one thing about my parents, like, they sort of did let me pursue comedy.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Which, like, I think a lot of their friends were like, please don't let your son make the terrible mistake of not becoming some sort of programmer or medical professional.

[Pete Holmes]

Right, right, right. You know, that's also a change.

[Eugene Mirman]

Such. Yeah. But I think they really were like, we, you know, are here for kids to sort of try to. To have freedom and pursue the American dream.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And. And also, like, they'll probably have to, like, he'll fall back on programming if he has to, like.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, I bet he'll be able to figure that out if. If needed.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

So I do sort of credit them a lot with, like, giving me the opportunity to try to do a thing that, like, you know, there was no blueprint.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And a job that is not. Like, you get this degree, you get this, and then you get a job. It's just sort of like, you keep trying to be funny, and then you. You make their milestones where, like, if you get on TV once, somebody's like, oh, he maybe is good. Like, somebody thought he was good.

[Pete Holmes]

Right, right, right.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, so there's, like, little things, but it's still, like, you get the check and you're like, oh, my God, I can only pay rent this month.

[Pete Holmes]

But isn't it crazy that the landscape that you and I started in, compared to which. Oh, this is helpful. When we were in that landscape it seemed deeply uncertain. Even though, looking back, we're like, look at all these milestones. We knew where the benchmarks are, and now people are. If they're starting comedy, it's like all of those benchmarks are gone. It's completely different. Which we know in 20 years, they'll look back and go, like, well, at least we had tick tock or whatever.

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, but this is the thing. Before we were kids, like, you could get onto one of three TV shows, and if you happen to get on it, you'd become a star.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

The next.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You were immediately, like, you could tour America.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

If in 1977, you were on the Tonight Show.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, so when we were like, you know, starting out, like, you could have a camcorder that you could film and put yourself not on YouTube because that was starting in 2005, but, like,

[Pete Holmes]

on a VHS tape.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And you could hand that tape to an agent. Be like, holly, what do you think? No. Oh, no. I mean, I.

[Pete Holmes]

Who booked to invite them up?

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, Holly Schlesinger, who was a writer for Bob's, one of the showrunners now.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, no way.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I handed my tape to Holly. Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And look, it worked out.

[Pete Holmes]

Here we are in my garage. No, I did it. Totally did.

[Eugene Mirman]

It. Totally did. And, you know, so, like, at the time, like, yeah, you know, if you didn't get onto one of these shows, who knows what you could do or how exactly you'd pursue it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

But, like, you know, you could put videos online. You know, I made an album before, like, I was in any, like, you know, my. Like, I had a booking agent that was wonderful, who gave my tape to, like, an indie record label. And I think, no, it was Suicide Squeeze and. And David Cross had put out something on Sub Pop. So the idea of there being comedy on an indie label, like. And they were also in Seattle, and I think he, like, the guy, David, who's great, like, loved the videos, like, my little weird videos that were on my website and was like, sure, let's record.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And I, you know, recorded. I think it. My. My first album, Pianos. I think I did, like, a show in Seattle that, like, didn't make sense to put out. It was like a sparsely attended, like, music event or something. And then I did, like, a normal show at pianos that, like, did make sense.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, again, you're sort of fumbling around trying stuff.

[Pete Holmes]

God, I can't believe.

[Eugene Mirman]

And keep going. Yeah. And then that. And then, like. And I remember actually the Person who's still my publicist now, meeting her in Brooklyn and being like, how does it work? Like, how do you, like, can you just publicize people? And she was like, well, you have to have, like, an album or a tour. Like, it has to be an event. Nobody sends a press release to go. This person exists. They have. You have to, like, make a record, or you have to have a show or you do a thing. And I was like, oh, okay, I will try to do one of those two things.

[Pete Holmes]

And then cut to you being like, oh, we're an East Village comedy show trying to make it work in Delaware. And that is the story.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And being from Chicago is my story. But I think there's something hopeful there, too, is like, when we were starting, it didn't seem like there was a clear path. I think Birbigli and I talk a lot, and we're like, oh, wow. At least we had a path. It's like, yeah, but we also didn't know what the fuck we were doing.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, we didn't.

[Pete Holmes]

And we were scared. We were nervous.

[Eugene Mirman]

You were just trying to make a thing and make it popular. And then, like, you know, Bobby and I made, I don't know, like, 80 bucks a week or whatever it was from Invite Them Up. It wasn't a ton, but it was like, you know, a quarter or a third of our rent. Like, it would be, like, enough to sort of, like, scrap it together. Scrap stuff together.

[Pete Holmes]

So what I'm saying is, like, the kids. The kids that are doing it now, it might seem so weird, but I'm like, it's always been weird. I've been taking a lot of comfort. This is how I know I'm 47, is I'm like, oh, yeah. When the printing press started, when we invented the printing press, everybody was like, this is the end of misinformation. Because there's going to be, like, official printed documents. It's actually the beginning of misinformation.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Because if anyone printed 50 copies of something, you could spread any story.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It was like, oh, my God, it's the Internet. Oh, my God, it's AI. We can't stop doing the same things over and over and over. There's this great YouTube channel, it's called Medieval Mindset, where they were making the argument between alchemy and AI where they're like, there's always this pursuit of the thing, the thing that does everything, and people profit from it and do it. And it's like, we're. I, I, this is 47 this is what it is. And I go, being human is always these things. I see a Tesla truck and you and I go, that's a Hummer. Do you remember in 1993 when we'd see a Hummer and we'd be like this fucking guy.

[Eugene Mirman]

Right, right.

[Pete Holmes]

Same shit over and over.

[Eugene Mirman]

At least in LA you have different colors. We only have silver here. I've seen a pink one, a black one.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, you got a nice body shop that'll put a N wrap on it. We'll put a wrap. What color is yours?

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't have a. My dash. No, it was. It wasn't a Tesla.

[Pete Holmes]

No, I know, I know. I. We looked it up because we were like, look at that car burn.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Apparently they burn pretty good.

[Eugene Mirman]

That's. Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I didn't know that.

[Eugene Mirman]

One of its advantages, a clean electric burn, though. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean, look, I don't think a gas car would burn less. I think it would have burned more. So. So I'm like, that's not. I'm not like. Yeah, like. Yeah. And I don't know. But, yes, I. I think. Look, I think any car is going

[Pete Holmes]

to be on fire.

[Eugene Mirman]

It could. Could be on fire. Yeah. I'm not gonna, like. I'm not trying to get, like some sort of. I'll get a fireproof car. I mean, I'll try to get a very, very safe car.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Car is a bike.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah. Yes. And even that, like, now I'm like, oh, but at all. Yeah. There's lots of things you could choose to be afraid of.

[Pete Holmes]

That's true.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. And I can't wait to make my full list. You're like, you don't have anxiety. Oh, but you haven't seen my anxious list.

[Pete Holmes]

Got to keep it working.

[Eugene Mirman]

Fear list.

[Pete Holmes]

Write it down.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Get it going. What are your fears?

[Eugene Mirman]

I don't know. I wanted to be like, too big of a sandwich.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm going to get this number one.

[Eugene Mirman]

Like, wow, that is real anxiety. If you're afraid of too large of a sub,

[Pete Holmes]

a footlong is the maximum.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Party Sub.

[Eugene Mirman]

Terror. Pure terror. Yeah. Yeah. No, I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, Eugene, thank you for doing the show. You're a delight.

[Eugene Mirman]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Pete Holmes]

I. What are we promoting?

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, yeah, I should probably.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, we'll mention it in the intro, though.

[Eugene Mirman]

Good, good. I have a comedy special. Here comes the whimsy.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. Which I just listened to.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, I have. I could show the record of it. Can I get up and show them?

[Pete Holmes]

So here Comes the whimsy is what I was listening to on the way in.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. And so the. The. The video special will. Will be on YouTube May 5th. And I'm gonna do. I'm gonna do live commentary or chatting, I guess. And here's the. The record album. Oh, here's a little record. You can order the record.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, that's you with the tap shoes.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Because I listened to it, and I was like, I actually kind of loved it because Steve Martin's records are some of my favorites. They're right there on the wall.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he does visual comedy that you don't see what happens.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So I really liked that. I had to imagine what the tattoos looked like.

[Eugene Mirman]

And there. And there's the photo.

[Pete Holmes]

Satisfying.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, good, good. Yes. Yes, it is me in a tub. I used to have, like, a little suitcase. So this is the. This is the bits you try. I had me in a tub. Not me in a tub. I had a suitcase, a clear suitcase with some tap shoes that I would, like, wheel out. Because when you're touring and trying to do that, and I was like, I just really need it to have, like, a bigger impact. And I was like, how about it's being a tub covered in tap shoes, and then we make a gigantic thing of it. And that gets the laugh I was looking for. So it's trial and error.

[Pete Holmes]

When you hear it, you know it. When you hear it, you know it. Can you. I would never pimp someone. Well, that's not true. But I rarely pimp someone to do a bit. Yeah, it's a light lift.

[Eugene Mirman]

Sure.

[Pete Holmes]

Please. I laughed so hard in my car. I'm going to do the setup. If you wouldn't mind taking it home. You saw a wedding cake store that had a sign in the window that said, refugees welcome.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes. It said, refugees welcome. Oh, my God. But now I'm like. And I. I can also do the end. It's so funny that I'm like, I.

[Pete Holmes]

And I thought that was very sweet.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, I thought it was very sweet because I'm a refugee. And actually, for the. You know, because I came from the former Soviet Union in 1979, and actually, for the first year that my family was in America, we mostly lived off of $700 wedding cakes. And it's true. I really did pass that store. And I. And again, I thought I had the same thought at once. I was like, this is so sweet. I love that. And, like, as someone who is a refugee, I promise that you. No one is buying insanely expensive desserts with the only money. Yes. Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, you said would feed for two days.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Just eat the cake. And you're. And the cake toppers were your only action figures. It's just a perfect bit.

[Eugene Mirman]

Thank you.

[Pete Holmes]

And I loved it so much. And it's on. Here comes the whimsy.

[Eugene Mirman]

Here comes the whimsy.

[Pete Holmes]

You can get in physical media, which I'm so happy.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

More and more people. Popular.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And.

[Eugene Mirman]

And the special premieres May 5th on YouTube.

[Pete Holmes]

Fantastic.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

On your channel.

[Eugene Mirman]

No, I think I'm pretty on Pretty Good Friends. Pretty Good Friends. Our record label. Our record label.

[Pete Holmes]

Max and Jenny.

[Eugene Mirman]

No. With Julie Smith and Adity Papa Zuglu.

[Pete Holmes]

But Max and Jenny and Gabe. Don't they have a podcast called Pretty Good Friends?

[Eugene Mirman]

I can't answer that. As well as I can say that I have a company called Pretty Good Friends Records and that we've been a thing called Pretty Good. But they might have. I don't know, it might be similarly named.

[Pete Holmes]

I might be.

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, they might be. They're friends. They are pretty good. It might be. I find it unlikely they would have the same name, but it could be similar.

[Pete Holmes]

Who knows?

[Eugene Mirman]

Who knows? But it'll be on our Pretty Good Friends.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

Your version of Pretty Good Friends YouTube channel.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, thank you, Eugene, so much. Sorry, one last question.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah, of course.

[Pete Holmes]

Can you tell me the time in your life you laughed harder than you've ever laughed in your life? And here's the get you off the hook part.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It doesn't have to be a good story. It's often helpful to remember who you were with. It's often in a situation where you're not allowed to laugh. School, church, library. Often somebody fell down. Often somebody farted. Sometimes it's a movie you watched. Sometimes drugs are involved. But, like, if you're. We can even just say, who are you with? How old are you? If tears are streaming down your face, laughing.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, I mean, it's. I. I don't. I mean, I feel like it's probably just something John Benjamin did.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

You know, like he.

[Pete Holmes]

Tina. Tina.

[Eugene Mirman]

But like, in, like, real life where he, you know, I feel like once at some party, he spent hours pretending to be someone's agent and, like, and then telling them that they would, like, take their career to the next level. And it was like, you know, like just some random, you know, And I was agent. Yeah. Or you're. You're like, to the person, like, I'm your agent. Like, and he looked it up like an agent. But I think the guy Was like, I'm fine. It's like, wait, he got the guy to believe that. No, I don't. I think. Well, you know, if you have, like. Yeah, exactly. It's like if. Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

If somebody had a party in a suit, said, I'm one of your agents, I wouldn't. I'd never in a million years be like, yeah, yeah.

[Eugene Mirman]

And then, like, talking about how they're going to take you to the next level. That's a very funny thing.

[Pete Holmes]

He did the jazz album.

[Eugene Mirman]

I mean, yes. His jazz album is. And I think he doesn't play piano.

[Pete Holmes]

And he plays piano.

[Eugene Mirman]

Three piano records. And I think the first time he actually recorded it, the people who were the musicians would like, I know you're trying to play wrong, but, like, I have to show you at least how to play it better wrong, because it's too. It's too, too difficult. So here's like, how you sort of fake play piano. I mean, it's still fake, but anyway, so. Yeah, that. I mean, I think, like, some of his stories make me laugh so hard, and then that's a fantastic character. I don't know. I. I feel like it's.

[Pete Holmes]

He's a deeply.

[Eugene Mirman]

Probably, like. Yeah. Things with, like, some random thing with, like, my wife or something where it's like, of course. A thing that makes me laugh so hard.

[Pete Holmes]

That's always.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I mean. And they often are farts, but I was trying to crack Val's back and she farted, and it was probably the funniest thing.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And they're. It's so stupid, but it's just like.

[Eugene Mirman]

But it's life.

[Pete Holmes]

It's life.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's Robin Williams and hunting. It's the little things. Oh, well, it's the little things. Those are the. Those are the precious moments. Well, thank you, Eugene. Now, for real. Would you say keep it crispy? Would you say it? Do you feel bad saying it as you. As Gene?

[Eugene Mirman]

Well, keep it crispy.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, it up a little bit.

[Eugene Mirman]

Oh, yeah. I mean, I. But it's basically. Yeah. Like an 8th of October. So really, it's me. Keep it crispy. Is that good? Is that the thing you're looking for?

[Pete Holmes]

I'd be lying. You know, I love Bob.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah. Yeah, I do. I do.

[Pete Holmes]

My wife loves it.

[Eugene Mirman]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So, yes, that was titillating for me. So if you want to know that you can give people joy very easily. Thank you and what a great show. And thank you for being on.

[Eugene Mirman]

Thank you very much for having me. Bye, everyone.

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