Glenn Howerton

Summary

Podcast Summary: "You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes"

Guest: Glenn Howerton

Date: December 6, 2023

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Episode Overview

This episode of "You Made It Weird" features comedian, actor, and writer Glenn Howerton (It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, BlackBerry). Pete Holmes and Glenn dive deep into secret weirdness, neurodivergence, creative catharsis, and the essential role of satire and venting in art. The conversation is rich, candid, and winding, blending personal anecdotes, discussions about the creative process, and philosophical musings, all punctuated by Holmes’ signature humor and warmth.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Neurodivergence, ADHD, and Creativity

Timestamps: 20:00–31:00; 124:50–126:55

• Glenn reveals he was recently diagnosed with ADHD, discussing both its challenges (difficulty changing gears, reading, managing distraction) and potential as a "superpower."
• Pete relates with shared struggles in focus, reading, and how neurodivergence feeds into their creative energy.
• Both observe how their need for stimulation (hectic movies, loud music for Glenn) is tied to a restless and overactive mind.
• They discuss the exhaustion that comes with ADHD and the importance of finding healthy outlets (comedy, snowboarding, acting).

“I think I’m burning more calories than the average person because I’m just fucking exhausted, man.”
— Glenn Howerton (125:01)

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2. Catharsis through Comedy & Satire

Timestamps: 41:00–49:00

• The comedians discuss how venting frustrations through comedy is a form of personal sanity—transforming rage, irritation, and everyday annoyances into laughter.
• Glenn describes channeling his pet peeves and "worst impulses" into characters like Dennis Reynolds and Jim Balsillie, making them simultaneously repulsive and relatable, thus cathartically exorcising those parts of himself.

“I would also be an absolutely insufferable person had I not found comedy.”
— Glenn Howerton (135:42)

• Pete points out the societal necessity of satire: "It’s not just a theory that the human animal needs satire. It’s a fact. Your brain satires... in your mind..."

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3. Social Contracts, Inconsiderate Behavior, and Personal Boundaries

Timestamps: 33:08–41:01; 54:00–59:00

• A poignant section explores misophonia and the deep anger triggered by inconsiderate behaviors (loud gum chewing, playing music in quiet spaces, etc.).
• Pete narrates a story about craving peace at a luxury resort, only for another guest to shatter it with loud music—spawning a fantasy of passive-aggressive retribution.
• Glenn shares the story of confronting a couple for sloughing dead skin into the resort pool and the group discusses the satisfaction and risk of standing up for etiquette.

“What if we all did what you’re doing? That’s what a society is.”
— Pete Holmes (39:30)

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4. The Role of Satire, Artistic Vulnerability & Pushing Limits

Timestamps: 44:51–48:50; 57:54–77:00

• Glenn and Pete reflect on why audiences crave "grotesque" satire and dreamlike exaggeration in art, especially to process life's complexity and their own intrusive impulses.
• They find catharsis in watching and making "awful people behaving in awful ways and getting their comeuppance" (It's Always Sunny).
• Both agree artistic vulnerability—leaning into shame, awkwardness, and even anger—is essential for creative authenticity and emotional health.
• They discuss "playing out" negative impulses through art as an act of emotional hygiene, arguing suppression is unhealthy.

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5. BlackBerry, Acting Process & The Force of Brutal Honesty

Timestamps: 59:31–77:00; 88:13–91:53

• Pete lauds Glenn’s role as Jim Balsillie in "BlackBerry," gushing over the energy of decisive, sometimes harsh honesty—"Dad energy"—and how it's sometimes the only cure.
• Glenn discusses channeling wish fulfillment into Balsillie: "There are times in my life where I wish I could be more like Jim."
• They discuss iconic scenes (the “Waterloo, where the vampires hang out” line and smashing a payphone) and the process of trusting initial creative instincts.

“A lot of people are watching that character and going, yeah, finally somebody fucking saying something.”
— Glenn Howerton (64:44)

• They explore the cathartic nature of acting (and literally breaking things on set), linking it back to the need to discharge emotional intensity healthily.

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6. Art, Authorship, and Creative Hustle

Timestamps: 80:06–84:50

• Discussing career paths, they emphasize the necessity of self-generating creative opportunities rather than waiting for permission or roles—"building your own gate."
• Glenn admits he doesn't overtly identify as a writer, even after years of writing, because his compulsion to act is far stronger, but recognizes the necessity-driven hustle in the industry.

“If somebody else could write it, I would love that. ...I just don’t identify as a writer because I don’t have this desire to write.”
— Glenn Howerton (77:54)

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7. Mind, Spirituality, and the Mystery of Consciousness

Timestamps: 110:00–124:30

• The conversation shifts to philosophical reflections on dreams, the mind, and spirituality, including lucid dreams/possible visitations (Glenn’s sleep paralysis entity).
• Pete explores non-dual philosophy and the “witness” or “watcher,” referencing Rupert Spira and Eckhart Tolle, and discussing how presence can provide rare peace in a distracted, overstimulated world.

“I think I’m burning more calories than the average person because I’m just fucking exhausted, man.”
— Glenn Howerton (125:01)

• Glenn expresses his agnosticism and humility in the face of the unknown, rejecting both atheistic and religious certainties.

“The certainty of [atheism] is just as ridiculous as the certainty of actually believing that your religion is the right one... I don’t know, and I’m okay with that.”
— Glenn Howerton (117:02)

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8. Relationships, Acceptance, & Healthy Partnership

Timestamps: 128:16–134:47

• Both recount the value of long-term, accepting romantic relationships and how being loved (and loving) in the face of their own intensity and flaws is transformative.
• They emphasize the importance of not reenacting past trauma in relationships, and how true partnership is not based on fear or pain.

“The majority of the time that we are together, we are happy to be in each other’s presence... she is definitely my best friend.”
— Glenn Howerton (132:29)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On ADHD & Focus:
  “Every single sentence I read makes me think of something else. Then I start researching that thing, and then that makes me think of something else.”
  — Glenn Howerton (21:56)

• On Artistic Catharsis:
  "Comedy is like taking five Xanax."
  — Pete Holmes (40:09)

• On Satire and Society:
  "It’s the only way I can stay sane is to satirize it."
  — Glenn Howerton (41:53)

• On Fantasy Confrontations & Social Contracts:
  "My fantasy is always to go out, put out a bigger speaker... Do you see? What if we all do it?"
  — Pete Holmes (39:00)

• On Role of Brutally Honest Characters:
  “Now we are entering into Ed Harris Glenn... dramatic, fierce, kick ass, steely blue.”
  — Pete Holmes (60:55)

• On Artistic Instincts:
  “Why would I ignore that first feeling that the script gave me? That’s the bible for the thing.”
  — Glenn Howerton (97:24)

• On Misophonia:
  "I have dog hearing. Once I hear it, I can’t unhear it. And if it continues, I can’t do anything else well until it goes away."
  — Glenn Howerton (30:05)

• On Relationships:
  "She is definitely my best friend... She brings me comfort and joy, and I like to think that I bring her those same things."
  — Glenn Howerton (132:29)

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Segment Timestamps

• [05:59] Show begins (post-advertisements, entering content)
• [20:00–31:00] Deep dive into ADHD, focus, stimulants, and creative energy
• [33:08–41:01] Social contracts, misophonia, and etiquette fantasies
• [41:00–49:00] Catharsis, comedy, and the vital role of satire
• [54:00–59:00] The “pumice stone in the pool” story
• [59:31–77:00] BlackBerry, honesty, acting, and catharsis
• [80:06–84:50] Creative hustle, authorship, and self-made opportunities
• [110:00–124:30] Dream experiences, philosophy, and spirituality
• [128:16–134:47] Relationships, partnership, and genuine connection

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a masterclass in how comedy, personal eccentricities, and creative obsessions intermingle to create both art and wellness. Holmes and Howerton navigate the blurred lines between annoyance and inspiration, suffering and performance, offering real talk about their weirdness, coping mechanisms, and the high-wire act of modern focus. There’s vulnerable honesty, plenty of laughs, and unvarnished wisdom about art, the mind, and how to "keep it crispy" when life gets weird.

"Well, everybody, keep it crispy." — Glenn Howerton (143:10)

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Transcript

[A]

You made it weird.

[B]

You made it weird. You made it weird.

[A]

Oh, yeah, you made it weird. Yes, you made it weird.

[B]

You made it weird with Pete Holmes.

[A]

What's happening, weirdos? I am in Canada and I'm freezing. It's very, very cold here. But also the heat is in. My apartment is not working. So I'm recording this fully clothed and in bed with all the blankets on me. Little update. It's also why I had to move, reschedule my Chicago dates, which was a bummer. Those shows sold out, which meant so much to me. Thank you to everybody that got tickets. We're looking to announce the date later today, so we'll have the new date today. But I do apologize that I had to move, that the schedule here on the movie shifted around and there was nothing I could do. And I'm also very cold, if that makes makes you feel any sympathy for me. I also have other dates coming up. Not too many, but I'll be in Tempe, Arizona for New Year's. If you're in Arizona, come hang out with me on December 30th and 31st, and then January 5th and 6th. I'll be in Brea, California, at the Brea Improv. This episode. Boy, I just started blabbing about myself. What episode is this? This is Glenn Howerton, always Sunny BlackBerry, which we talk a lot about. If you haven't seen the movie BlackBerry, I gush about it in this episode. And that is all completely legit. I've seen it two or three times now. I'm blown away by him. By Jay Jay Bearshaw. The performances in the movie are incredible. The director is incredible. We talk a lot about him as well. But check that movie out. It's awesome. Really, really, really love that movie. And obviously love Sonny and love everything that he does. So this is one of those did we just become Best Friends episodes. I love it. I'm so glad you're here. Just a couple things to plug up. Top my Netflix special I Am not for Everyone is is on right now. My YouTube channel is going to be shifting, so if you want to keep watching this podcast on YouTube and seeing that I Cut My Hair a movie, for example, it's going to be you Made it weird on YouTube. We're slowly shifting that over. I think this one will still be on Pete Holmes, but in the new year we're going to shift over. So you Made it Weird will be its own channel, so be sure to subscribe to that. We're going to start uploading some old episodes to that so you can find it. And please subscribe to that. And if you like the show, why not try. You know this by now. Why not try a Pete's Pick. This show is brought to us by one of our oldest Pete's picks, which is Alpha Brain from our friends at On It. Obviously I'm doing this movie right now. Alpha Brain. Alpha Brain. Alpha Brain. I have it in my pockets. I tell cast members about it because I need to learn lines, I need to stay sharp, I need to stay focused, I need to be able to concentrate. I also need need to be able to just as I can't talk, talk to people, talk, relate, connect, access my vocabulary, access my verbal centers. Alpha Brain is like fish food for your ideas, for your cognition, for your brain function. It is not a stimulant. It's not like caffeine. It doesn't get you all jacked up, just gives you earth grown ingredients that you need to function at your optimum. It's. It's brain stuff. It's a nootropic. It's like a brain. It's like a brain. It helps with memory, focus, concentration. I wish I knew about it in college. I'm so glad I know about it now. Absolute game changer. I haven't done a podcast, a standup show, acted in anything, or just gone out to dinner without taking a couple Alpha brain 15, 20 minutes prior and you absolutely notice the difference. Go to onit.com weird for 10% off and support the show. Support your brain. On It. O N N I T.com weird we're also brought to us by our friends at Blueland. Did you know we're eating and drinking roughly a credit card's worth of plastic a week? That's correct. The products we're using every day are ultimately contaminating our water supply, generating hundreds of microplastics that we end up ingesting. Luckily, our friends at Blueland set out to do something about it to eliminate the need for single use plastics in the products we use the most, like hand soap. Did you know that an estimated 5 billion plastic, hand soap and cleaning bottles are thrown away each year? If that's not bad enough, most cleaning formulas are 90% water, which is heavy to ship, leading to excessive carbon emissions, not to mention the nasty ingredients in them like chlorine and ammonia. But Blue Land is reinventing cleaning essentials for a better you and a better planet by offering endlessly refillable cleaning products with a beautiful cohesive design that looks great on your counter. I can Attest to that. We have their hand soaps in all of our bathrooms. It looks great and you put the tab in and you add the water and it fizzes up and turns into a foaming hand soap. Looks great, works great, and you're doing something good for your body, for the planet. It's awesome. Help. Just fill the bottles with water. As I mentioned, dropping the tablets and the hand soap, toilet bowl cleaner, laundry tablets, all with clean ingredients you can feel good about and you subscribe so you don't run out. I'm always running out and forgetting. Before I had Blue Land. So I recommend their clean essentials kit, which has everything you need to get started and comes in beautiful light scents like iris agave, fresh lemon, and eucalyptus mint. Blue. Blueland has an offer just for weirdos. Get 15% off your first purchase of any product and get cleaning products that I love the look of and love that they're good for you. And the plan for 15% off your first order, go to blueland.com ym you won't want to miss this. Bland.com ymiw that's blueland.com ymiw all right, everybody. Enjoy Glenn Howerton. I'll be here. Very cold. Get into it.

[B]

You know what I would love is water.

[A]

You got it, dude.

[B]

If you got that.

[A]

I thought thirst was a sign of weakness. Oh.

[B]

Boys. Dehydrated.

[A]

We only have Bury It Alive by Liquid Death.

[B]

What is that?

[A]

Sparkling? And it has a light. It's like lacroix.

[B]

Great.

[A]

Is that okay?

[B]

Yeah. If you don't mind me burping throughout the podcast.

[A]

You know, I was just in a. Like, I was just in San Francisco. Yeah, Yeah, I said, like, you don't like.

[B]

I mean, what.

[A]

I'm with you. I'm actually with you. Liquid Death was a sponsor. They're not a sponsor anymore. So, like, I can speak freely and say I don't like their. Their flavors. You know what else I don't like is that, like, I do fasting and this is 20 calories in it.

[B]

Yeah, that's no good. You can't.

[A]

What the fuck are you doing? Yeah, like, why are you ruining. We know you can do it with no calories.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

So why are you making this a 20 calorie nightmare?

[B]

Well, maybe they don't want to. Maybe they don't want to put, like, the fake flavorings in it or the fake, like, sweeteners.

[A]

I hear you, but Spindrift, Also not a sponsor.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

Like, five out, like, 1 ounces of raspberry juice is exact. Why did we bring science into it?

[B]

Why? I don't. We shouldn't.

[A]

You know what I'm saying?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Let's recreate raspberries. You know what's an easy way to recreate a raspberry? Grow a raspberry.

[B]

That's right. Yeah.

[A]

And squish it.

[B]

I was so. When Spindrift came out, I was so happy about it because that's exactly what I would want.

[A]

Me too.

[B]

In a flavored carbonated beverage.

[A]

And it's weird that. I have very strong feelings about this as well.

[B]

I have very strong feelings.

[A]

I just want you to know you're in a safe space.

[B]

Okay, good. Good.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Well then why do you even have this?

[A]

Because they gave it to us for free.

[B]

Oh, because you have.

[A]

And I feel embarrassed. We're running low and we're going into the non sponsor. If you want to support the show, don't buy a liquid death. Buy some modern mammals, some magic miners, some first person. Don't buy liquid death.

[B]

Now, does this stuff work? Yeah, yeah, yeah, it does.

[A]

I love it.

[B]

It makes your brain on fire.

[A]

Shake it up and take it. We'll have a better chat.

[B]

Well, now, wait a minute.

[A]

You want me for shake it.

[B]

I've already had some nootropics.

[A]

Oh, you did.

[B]

This might be nootropics on top of nootropics.

[A]

Because I take nootropics on top of nootropics. I take alpha brain and I take magic mind. Oh, you do different kinds.

[B]

I've tried. I've tried them all.

[A]

You keep letting me interrupt you. It's really. I love.

[B]

It's your show.

[A]

No, I know, but you're the guest. But I'm noticing already heightened empathy. Heightened. I'm just complimenting. It's like I. I feel an authority and I feel like you're. You're present and you're here and you're powerful. But I also see like what. What do you. New trophy. Like, it's very cool already.

[B]

I would much prefer to listen to you talk than talk myself. I mean, I. I am definitely of that. Like, I hate talking. I don't want to talk about myself. I want to hear more about you.

[A]

You're only gonna get in not trouble, but like, you're only gonna find yourself in a story with no ending.

[B]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

Like looking for the bathroom in a restaurant.

[B]

Also, like, I know about me. I don't know about you. So you want to know about me and I want to know about you.

[A]

Yeah, I like that. I this is gonna sound kind of whatever. However it sounds, I want to know about us. This is a recording of us, okay? So don't feel. We don't have to plumb the depths, but this will be us. Here we are, great. In outer space. Jesus Christ. Yeah, we're floating in outer space.

[B]

Now, if I don't. If I don't hold.

[A]

You can hold it like an ice cream cone.

[B]

Okay. So I don't have to, like, do this.

[A]

Our last guess. I'm doing this.

[B]

And that was fine.

[A]

I didn't love it. Yeah, but you can do it.

[B]

But I can rest it here.

[A]

You can rest it there, like.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Just making sure.

[A]

But we're temporary beings in the cosmos on this rock. But we're here together.

[B]

It's.

[A]

It's already. I'm gonna say it. It's already art. It just is. It is as if we decided it. You know what I mean? Like a pineapple. If you give enough meaning to a pineapple, it becomes art. And this is just a little slice of 2023.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Although I do want to say I spent five minutes yesterday trying to remember what year it was.

[B]

I had that issue the other day, too. Yeah. I was convinced that it was 2024.

[A]

I was, too. And I was going because I remembered seeing a meme that. About the Ramones. 2020, 24 hours to go. That's when it was. 2020, on New Year's Eve. It was 2020, 24 hours to go.

[B]

That's what the song's about.

[A]

No, it's just a funny coincidence.

[B]

I was gonna say.

[A]

Yeah, they were prophets.

[B]

Well, I was gonna say.

[A]

Well, you know, with that hair, they should be prophets.

[B]

Yeah, sure. I mean, 2020, back then, when they made that song.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It was like we were definitely gonna have flying cars. We would definitely be on Mars already.

[A]

Blade Runner already happened.

[B]

Right?

[A]

The year that they said Blade Runner was is in the past.

[B]

Wait, what year does Blade Runner take place?

[A]

Can you give that a. Jamie, would you pull that up?

[B]

I don't remember.

[A]

It's a Joe Rogan ref. Katie, would you please look that up?

[B]

It's important to have somebody here to back up whatever we say.

[A]

No, Katie, is essential. 2019 was the year Blade Runner took place.

[B]

Oh, my goodness.

[A]

But we're not that far off. You know, it goes both ways.

[B]

Well, if you go to Tokyo.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Where you were born, you certainly feel as though. Yeah, yeah. Weirdly.

[A]

Isn't that weird?

[B]

Yeah, that is weird.

[A]

But if you went to Tokyo, there's a lot happening. I Was just in San Francisco yesterday and there was a car, you know, with this. It's not just a Tesla. It's a man personless car.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I knew it was because it had a thing on. It's taking pictures. 360.

[B]

But are they. They're not actually using them yet to transport people, are they?

[A]

Or they are.

[B]

Oh, they are. That's.

[A]

Yeah. So this is a. So I'm in an Uber. Cause I'm from the olden days and I'm driving past this car and I'm like, I know no one's in this car. I just know it. And I looked and it was driving down the street and there was no one in the. Which you know what brings back to the table?

[B]

What's that?

[A]

Loud farting. You're in a car with no driver. That's your own little hot box driving down the road.

[B]

Yeah. Wow. You could leave behind all kinds of farts in that thing.

[A]

But they're definitely filming you. I give this a lot of thought. So you gotta do a spread and release.

[B]

Okay. Meaning you gotta. You gotta pull your butt cheeks apart. So. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a thing. It is.

[A]

That's a thing. It's a crazy thing.

[B]

And by the way, that's a new thing that I learned. I didn't. I didn't know that was a thing until very recently. Like, really? That's a 2023 thing that I learned.

[A]

It might be 2024.

[B]

It could be.

[A]

But. Yeah, you just figured it out. But you're a slender guy. You got that McConaughey bod. You got McConnell. You got a macan bod.

[B]

I'll take that. Yeah, that sounds good.

[A]

I'm trying to complime I'm.

[B]

Less hair. I've got more hair than him, though. I've got.

[A]

You're a hairy guy.

[B]

Yeah, I got a very hairy chest.

[A]

People like that because it's kind of like you're pixelated. See, you look very fit. But like, if I had chest hair, I'd love it because it's like you're always wearing a shirt, right?

[B]

Yeah. You're like a bear. You just, you know. But always warm.

[A]

Always warm and always, you know, is he. Is he soft or is he just kind of massive?

[B]

Right, right.

[A]

Like the old timey barrel chested guys. But McConaughey, I'm going to say it for the record, not just clickbait. McConaughey's never had a loud fart. Those are. I think maybe one cracks every once in a while. But he's never had, like, a Brendan Fraser and the whale. There's no doubt that's gonna be a loud. A louder, more robust. That's the philharmonic.

[B]

Right.

[A]

There's just more mass. This isn't body shaming. It's just a fact.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

The instrument is the instrument.

[B]

His butt. His butt being the instrument that is going to produce more sound. Yeah, no, for sure.

[A]

If you are folds and.

[B]

Yes, yeah. Ripples. Yeah.

[A]

If you're an ins. If you're a musician and you play the fart, you're gonna buy the Brendan Fraser and the wheel. Nobody's me. Like, you know what McConaughey is in the fart musician world? He's an alto sax.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

And. And.

[B]

And Brendan Fraser is the tuba. Or the. Or the. Or the.

[A]

And you know what? I want to get a parade going or a quinceanera.

[B]

Yeah, you want to. You need a goddamn tuba. Right, Right.

[A]

Nobody's turning heads when an alto saxer. That's why the jazz. It's a quartet. You need three other guys.

[B]

Does it. Is there ever been, like, a tuba solo, though? Do people do tuba solos? That's not really a solo instrument. Right.

[A]

So funny, because there are bass solos.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Which are so boring. And I'm a bass player. I used to love it. I used to love a bass solo in the jazz group. I'd be like, it's my time.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Everyone hates.

[B]

There's a little bit of a letdown, isn't it?

[A]

If everyone has to hush up for your solo. It's not a solo.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

You shouldn't. The stairs don't get to be the curtains. You're the stairs. But I've never heard a tube.

[B]

Now, what I have heard are great. Some great baritone sax solos. Are you familiar with the band Morphine?

[A]

Of course.

[B]

Oh, man.

[A]

That's the tube of saxophones.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And they can do like a. Yeah, Morphine's great.

[B]

That shit's bad. I love that band.

[A]

How could they be called anything but Morphine? They sound like, like. I imagine what morphine feels like. Kind of like it's chill. You're cool.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It sounds like you're smoking a cigarette laying down. You know what I mean?

[B]

Right. Which actually feels. Seems like it would be very uncomfortable. I mean, as. As someone who doesn't smoke anymore.

[A]

No. Oh, you did.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, when I was younger.

[A]

I know what you mean.

[B]

You know, I.

[A]

That memory came from a Christmas at this house, actually, where I took mushrooms, and I really felt like I Was not in a supernatural or literal way, but I felt like I was living in another time. Like, I felt like it was 1973.

[B]

Oh, really?

[A]

I felt like a groovy guy in 1973. And I laid on. It's actually still in there. There's. We had this little Tibetan daybed that came with the house. And they were like, this is a thousand years old. So I'm laying on this Tibetan daybed and I realized that we had cigarettes in the house from who knows why. And I got one and I just laid down and smoked it and felt like the band Morphin. Like, I felt like the coolest. It's disgusting. I'm. You know, I'm 44 now. I'm like, I have clarity.

[B]

That's.

[A]

That's really gross. Well, I mean, yeah, it's gross in every way.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I don't know, but it felt awesome.

[B]

It's also kind of sexy.

[A]

Of course it is.

[B]

Like, I don't. I. I like the smell of cigarettes. I still do. I.

[A]

But I can't.

[B]

I don't know. I can't get through a whole cigarette anymore.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I can only take a couple puffs and then I'm just like. My body just won't do it anymore.

[A]

I wish a pipe tasted how a pipe smells. You ever smoke a pipe?

[B]

It's been a long time.

[A]

Doesn't taste like how it smells.

[B]

No.

[A]

Secondhand pipe is the way to smoke a pipe. You want to be next to a guy smoking a pipe.

[B]

Yeah, I like that cherry flavored tobacco kind of.

[A]

What am I, British? It's incredible. I'm saying that as a good thing. It's like I'm suddenly British.

[B]

Why don't we do that anymore?

[A]

Why don't.

[B]

Why don't. Why doesn't anyone? I mean, I'm sure there are some people, but. What?

[A]

Yeah, it's. The tamping ruins it. The. The badassness of this is ruined by a dainty like. Oh, gotta keep it going. You would think, though, goes out on a boat.

[B]

What part of town is this?

[A]

Like, this is Los Feliz.

[B]

Okay. This is Los Feliz. All right. So you would think that in Los Feliz or Silver Lake there'd be people smoking pipes everywhere.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Big Gandalf pipes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The kind you just r. It just.

[B]

Seems like it'd be a very kind of hipstery kind of thing to bring back.

[A]

I think it was really in. I remember growing up in Boston, seeing what were hipsters then, which were just cool dudes with tude in the 80s, every once in a while you'd see a guy rocking a pipe.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Mitch Hedberg smoked a pipe.

[B]

Did he?

[A]

The comedian? Yeah. He'd smoke a pipe on stage. No, that would be awesome. He could have. You know what else makes a pipe not cool? The sound it goes. Oh, it makes. It's like very like hollow sounding. A cigarette. That, that cushiony. I'm going to make someone who just quit smoking go nuts. But that feeling of the cotton and you just go. And they color it and it's so throwback in 70s with the fake specs. You know, when they probably first made cigarettes, there was something in the paper that actually was specked. And now they're just like how our cell phones go to sound like a camera.

[B]

Oh, you're saying that they may have put something in it to make it make a certain noise?

[A]

No, no, not a noise. Although I wouldn't put it past them. I bet they're like, they're all about that mouth feel and.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the drag. Like Parliament's very firm filter. Do you ever smoke a Parliament?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

They used to say it's because George Clinton used to put a bump of cocaine in it. And you certainly could because it's.

[B]

Oh, that little hollow.

[A]

It's deviating. Yeah.

[B]

Is that was, that was so you.

[A]

Could do a bump of cocaine in that Parliament, the cocaine administering cigarette. And you can put cocaine in a cigarette and then you're. Then I think it's crack. I think it's just become.

[B]

Yeah. You. Yeah, yeah. Pretty much.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

Well, I don't know. But I, I, it sounds wonderful.

[A]

You're excited to find out.

[B]

Well, again, I think I'm, I think I'm just past that. Like the. I, I'm just. My drug days. I'm like the thought of doing drugs now, it just gives me anxiety.

[A]

Sure. No, I get it.

[B]

You know, even the, even the nootropics that I took this morning.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Are giving me anxiety.

[A]

You're a little like, what's this gonna be?

[B]

Yeah, I get it.

[A]

Is that why. And that' to drink your magic mind. Because you don't want to be on camera if I. First of all, it won't disagree with you. In fact, it'll calm you down.

[B]

Oh, really?

[A]

I don't mean to do an ad for magic Mind, but it has adaptogens in it, which people are like. Adaptogens are nonsense. They're not everything I take that has adaptogens in it just kind of cools me Out. Which I think at our age.

[B]

Do you. So here's something I struggle with.

[A]

Do you do cocaine? No.

[B]

No, no, no.

[A]

That was you asking me. We all know you do cocaine. You famously do cocaine.

[B]

I like, I feel. And I. Maybe this is, like, because I recently found out that I have adhd, which explains a lot.

[A]

Don't you kind of love it, though?

[B]

It's. It can be a superpower. It can be.

[A]

I like that you're being honest. Maybe you don't love it.

[B]

Tell me I can be. It can. When? If I can get into a good zone with it.

[A]

Because if you can focus on something. Can I ask you this?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Hard to change gears.

[B]

Very hard.

[A]

That's me.

[B]

I hate being. I hate, like, being in the middle of something. I. I can't multitask. I need to do one thing at a time, buddy.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I love this conversation. I just told Katie before you got here, I was like, Monday is podcast day. That's when we do the podcast.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then I'll go and do someone else's podcast, and then I'll go home. That's Monday. It's such a gift to an ADD brain, by the way. They were like, you don't have add, but you have symptoms of add. And I was like, what's the difference? I don't understand. I don't know what. I don't know what they meant.

[B]

So you got a diagnosis.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And they said, you have certain symptoms of people who have adhd, but you do not have it.

[A]

Yeah. I don't know what.

[B]

Now, by the way, it's my understanding that ADD is no longer a thing. It's now all adhd.

[A]

I don't know why it ruins my joke. Because you can't spell dad without add, because my dad definitely had it, and I sympathize with him because when I think of something, oh, I did it today. Just this morning, I go, I forgot to reply to an important email. I just do it. My dad had to write it in a notepad and then maybe never do it. Of course he was stressed out. Oh, you know what I mean?

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

He probably had a brain like mine.

[B]

Yeah. I think my dad. I think I maybe got it from my dad. He and I struggle with the same thing. So I can't read. It takes me to read 20 pages of a book to sit down and be like, I'm going to read 20 pages, and I'm not leaving this couch until I've read 20 pages.

[A]

Yeah. Too long.

[B]

Can take me now. If I really get into a zone. I could maybe do it in 40 minutes. Yeah, okay. But really, it's gonna take me at least an hour and probably an hour and a half because every single sentence I read makes me think of something else. Then I start researching that thing, and then that makes me think of something else. And then suddenly I realize I haven't had enough to eat. And then I go get something to eat, and then I realize, like, have I hydrated? And then I realized, like, oh, wait, there was that supplement I needed to take.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Then I go back to the book, I read one more sentence, I start something else that I forget. I remember something else that I had forgotten, and the next thing I know, it's been an hour and a half, and I've read 10 pages.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm the same. I have to listen to books. Do you listen to books? Because it's the treadmill better for me. It's treadmill. You can't stop.

[B]

That's a good idea.

[A]

It's treadmill. You can't stop. You go. I do have to hit 10 back a lot.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You start thinking about something, but it trains you. It. I think you can kind of practice that groove. But I. I.

[B]

Here's.

[A]

You want to get real nuts? You want to get nuts?

[B]

Yeah, sure.

[A]

Let's get nuts. Buy the book and the audiobook and have them race. Because when you're reading, it sounds insane, but this is for books that I really, really want to absorb.

[B]

Have them race. What do you mean?

[A]

Meaning I'm listening to it on audio in the car.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And I'm reading it because there's something calming and nice about reading a book. But I've already read it. I've already kind of had it read to me. Oh, it's like you never read a book. Like, if I read BlackBerry, the book, like, based on the movie, I would love it because I'd picture you. And there's Jay. You know what I mean? It takes his effort out.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

As opposed to when I read a novel, which I don't often, but if I read a novel and I don't know, I'm like, okay, it'll be Matt Damon for now. And then later, it's like, Tim scratched his gruff red beard. And I'm like, oh, he's got a red beard.

[B]

Picturing the wrong guy. Yeah.

[A]

I don't like redhead Matt Damon.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You'll never see redhead Matt Damon. That ru. Damon. Dye that guy's hair red. Is he a star? He's. He's Done.

[B]

Well, he's Jesse Plemons, isn't he? If you dye his hair red, you.

[A]

You know, have won the day with that observation.

[B]

I mean, I feel like that that is what Jesse Plemons is.

[A]

Jesse Plemons is redhead Damon.

[B]

He's redhead character actor Matt Damon.

[A]

Holy. Same ski slope nose. I say that with full respect. There's a little, like, I'd like to slide down that face. That sounds sexual. I just mean I'm a tiny. I'm a tiny skier, and I want to go down.

[B]

Yeah, you want to.

[A]

And then have sex with them.

[B]

Yeah. And then do a little jump and then. And then bang. His face.

[A]

Of course. I mean, the only reason I'm skiing. His face.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's for the black knights. Doesn't make any sense.

[B]

He's a. He is a phenomenal actor.

[A]

Plemons.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What were we doing before Plemons? You know what I like about Plemis? We didn't know we needed them.

[B]

He's also one of those guys that can do drama and comedy equally well, and I just. I always love those people that. That can do both. And. And it. And it seems everything he does also seems effortless.

[A]

Agree.

[B]

Yet extremely effective. It never feels like he's underplaying it, yet it never feels like he's trying.

[A]

There are actors. Look, I actually like Jared Leto. I'm not shitting on Jared Leto, but when Jared Leto is being restrained, I can sort of sense that he's being like. Like in Blade Runner. Speaking of Blade Runner, he's like, we make angels out of flesh, you know? Like, I can kind of feel him choosing. Just 0.01% feel him choosing to be cool with Clemens. I never get the sense that he's making any choice. You know who else plumbings is?

[B]

Who?

[A]

He's Phil Hoffman. He's our new Hoffman. I'm not. I wish we still had Phil Hoffman, obviously. But here comes the guy. Sexy. Sexy, big. You know what I mean? He's not. Plemons isn't in the gym.

[B]

He. He fluctuates. I feel like.

[A]

Yeah, he goes all over, but, like. I prefer. I don't know how to say it. Soft lemons, like in what I just see him in. But I love him and I'm thinking of ending things, and he's very.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

Normal.

[B]

That movie was.

[A]

I actually found it quite relaxing to care.

[B]

Was that. That was the Charles Kaufman. Yeah. Right, right, right, right, right. Yeah, I struggled with that one a little bit.

[A]

If I'm being whale Glenn do you like restaurants? I know you do. It's from Glengarry Glen Ross. There's a type of movie, you watch it and you immediately go on YouTube, type in the name of the movie, and then the word analysis.

[B]

Yeah, explain.

[A]

Really helps.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm shocked at how good they are.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

These people doing people are amazing at.

[B]

Breaking down those things. Yeah.

[A]

Incredible. And I'm like, oh, that's correct. I've never watched one. You have to find one that has a lot of views. If it's some guy being like, okay, this is what it is. But that movie is. From the perspective of. This isn't a spoiler. This helps us enjoy it. Of Jesse Plemons, his character as the old man who's the janitor at the end of the movie, who never pursued the woman. It's very interesting, but it's very clear when someone points that out, I need.

[B]

To watch it again. I don't remember it.

[A]

It's worth watching again. And those movies when you're sad or you like this. If I'm feeling a certain way, I, like, need a movie to, like, slide it on that shelf and reflect back to me what I'm feeling.

[B]

Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah, totally.

[A]

Are you that way?

[B]

It depends. Yeah, I'm. I don't know. Like, I'm. I'm. Most of the time with movies, I struggle to get myself to watch something challenging anymore. And I don't like that about myself. Like, I want to watch. I think it's just because. Do you have kids?

[A]

I was gonna say. I almost said in that gap. Play back the tape. I'm just kidding. I was about to say, well, you're a dad.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I want things to be easier now, and.

[A]

Oh, Val. And I can't.

[B]

Movies can very easily.

[A]

Watching the Office, it's like a problem.

[B]

Which one, The American one or the British one?

[A]

I've seen the British many times that we now rewatch. Meaning that's. That's. That's me trying to be cool. It's the American one, which I think is excellent. And she likes that one, and I like that one. And we watch that. It's also more relaxing. The British one isn't relaxing in the sense.

[B]

Right. It's. It's very anxiety inducing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I see. I actually do like.

[A]

I love it too.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But what are you watching? What is this? What is your relaxing?

[B]

I go, my. You know, I think I've. I've become a little bit of an adrenaline junkie when it comes to Movies. So I find myself. Yeah. Like, watching, like, he's in Crank and Crank too. The crazier the movie is, the more. The more I'm interested.

[A]

That's an add thing too.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's so stimulating. It's unstimulating.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, do you calm down in Times Square? You know what I mean?

[B]

No, that's too stimulating. But what does calm me down, actually, is really hectic. Music.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like really loud metal. Yeah. You watch atonal. Like, you know, my wife cannot understand my music choices at all because I like things that are complicated and strange.

[A]

Get her on the phone. Let me talk to her. I'm just kidding. In the movie, the Big Short, Christian Bale.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Plays that genius figured out the housing crash and he's listening to death metal. And I'm like, I totally understand.

[B]

It, like, focuses him.

[A]

It's so much that it becomes nothing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

We push the past too much. But, like, a cab driver snapping his gum will drive me crazy because I'll fixate on it.

[B]

Okay, so do you have misophonia?

[A]

I think I know what that means, and I do. Okay, tell me what it means.

[B]

Though we should look up the actual definition of it. It can be anything. It's.

[A]

It's.

[B]

It's an unhealthy fixation on any particular noise that causes you to go into a state of fight or flight.

[A]

Basically, that's me. Yeah.

[B]

Chewing, snapping gum. Repetitive noises like pencil tapping. Stuff like that. Yes.

[A]

Dogs barking.

[B]

Yeah. Anything.

[A]

Anything. Yeah, no, I definitely have.

[B]

I have dog. I have dog hearing. Once I. And then once I. Once I find. Once I hear it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I can't unhear it. And if it continues, I can't do anything else. Well, I have said until it goes away.

[A]

Just to join you in that. If my. You know what I hate about leaf blowers? Everybody hates leaf blowers. What I hate about them. Don't hate them, is I hate about leaf blowers because everybody hates them. Nobody's like, oh, good, the leaf blower is here. You know?

[B]

That's true.

[A]

Oh, good. Right. But some people like us, I'm assuming, are. Can be troubled by them. And I'm all about, like, get the pain to talk and, like, so you can catch yourself believing something absurd. We can get into that in a second. But it's like, I think about their finger on the trigger and it's going. And I think about the car. I project onto that the irregularity of the press to a carelessness that then becomes a voice. This man doesn't care about. Me.

[B]

That is exactly, exactly my problem.

[A]

Yeah, he doesn't care.

[B]

He doesn't care that he's doing a.

[A]

Steady stream and then stop. He's just going. There's a disinterest that I find threatening. It's like, sorry, I just. I rewatched BlackBerry last night. I loved it. I watched it months ago, but I rewatched it pleasurably. But when they say, you know, good enough is the enemy of humanity, it's like, good enough. There's like a farting kind of laissez faire, you know, it's just like, whatever that I hate. And if it were intentional and focused. I know this sounds insane, but I like outing.

[B]

It sounds insane to people that are not us.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

To me, it's exactly how I feel about people chewing loudly.

[A]

What are you doing?

[B]

You're not feeling the same with your stupid ass fucking noise? And I can't have my own thing going on because you. You need it to be about you like it. Like it. You know, like somebody on the subway.

[A]

You know, playing a switch at full volume. A Nintendo Switch?

[B]

Well, yeah. Yeah, that. That's. That's. I was gonna say. I feel like people, like smacking and popping their gum on the subway. I would just be like, fuck off. There's 50 of us on here. Why does this need to be about you?

[A]

And I'll trace that all the way back to. I wonder if where you live is being inconsiderate to you, whether it's your family or your neighborhood. Like the broken window theory. You live in a neighborhood where the windows are broken. You behave accordingly. So it's like, how have you been failed? That's how I'll extend it to a failure, a systemic failure of humanity that you have never been afforded silence. So then you therefore walk around, like, because you were failed.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And now I feel bad and I hate you. It's a very weird. It's a weird thing. Here's the one that I can't wait. Val and I went on our honeymoon to Bora Bora. Okay. Ever been? So.

[B]

Did we.

[A]

Not. Yep. Shut the up.

[B]

Please cut this out of the podcast. We sound like such douchebags. No, this is going to the Four Seasons.

[A]

Well, look, we went to the same.

[B]

Yeah, we went to the Four Seasons.

[A]

You can't cut that out. It's too weird. Of a synchronicity.

[B]

It's so beautiful.

[A]

It's incredible. And it's a honeymoon, and it's great.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And you're gonna appreciate this. Then it's the Quiet. I, I, you know, the greatest amenity of a nice hotel. Now I sound like a douche. Let's just own it. Is the. Is the con, the agreement that everyone's like. It's like going to Disneyland. Everyone's friendly at Disneyland. Four Seasons grown up kind of Disneyland. Everyone is like, we will be civil and we will be quiet. You love this.

[B]

Wait.

[A]

You love this.

[B]

No, I'm laughing because I want you to finish. But something so outrageously against what you're saying happened to us at the Four Seasons.

[A]

Can't wait.

[B]

But go ahead, please, please. Because you're absolutely right. That is.

[A]

That's what you're paying for.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

At dinner, we don't know each other. And I'm. We're on our honeymoons and I'm at the table next to you. Am I gonna get drunk and come up to you and be like, no.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because we're fucking evening attire, gentlemen. We're just pretending, right? But it's bullshit. But it's a delightful bullshit in the same way that not everyone's kind. But at Disneyland, you're kind. Hello, Jim.

[B]

So you like that everyone is behaving themselves, basically. There's a decorum.

[A]

There's a decorum. I suppose you could say that really sounds snobby. Pretench. But whatever. So day three. I grew up with sound trauma, meaning quiet was safe. Any noise, A car pulling in the driveway. The gravel driveway. Oh, Glenn. The gravel driveway gives my brother and I PTSD if we hear, like, a car pulling. Because it just meant here comes the boom. Basically. It's like, it's not going to be chill in about 35. So there was.

[B]

There was chaos in your household.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. In a controlled, weird way. Yeah. So I associate sound with I am not safe. That's why I want to get the Voice to talk to me. This guy doesn't care about me. The guy. But it also means I'm not safe. If he'll. If he won't care about me in this way, how else will he not care about.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

That is my physical safety. I would encourage you to get curious about what the Voice is saying, and you'd be shocked. You said fight flight. What's fight flight? Fight flight is I'm not safe. I'm gonna be attacked. I'm gonna.

[B]

Yeah, well, I. I went to therapy for this. I went to a hip. I went to a hypnotherapist. Is that what they're called? Hypnotherapist? Because my problem with people smacking Their gum was so bad. And, and Rob and Caitlin on Sunny are both like, they chew gum or they don't do it as much anymore, but they used to chew gum non stop all the time, forever.

[A]

And if they were here, Glenn, what would you say to them?

[B]

They know this. I've had this conversation with them. They know. They know. They know. And they couldn't understand. They, they. And I. Because I finally had to say. I was like, guys, I'm so sorry. I don't. I don't want to be somebody who tells you you can't chew gum, but just so you know, it drives me crazy. Yeah, it drives me crazy. And it's not your fault.

[A]

To them.

[B]

It's not your fault. You don't, you don. Not doing it on purpose. I realize it's my thing, but I just need you to know that so that you can maybe, maybe take that into consideration.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, as you're, and I hope, going nuts on your gum.

[A]

I was that way. On. On crashing. We had a co ed bathroom that there was two stalls in it. And I just, I had the showrunner say it because I couldn't say it, but I was like, can everybody just lock the bathroom? Let's treat that like a one seater. I don't need to go in there and hear ladies going potty. And I don't want them coming. You can tell I'm a dad.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I don't want them coming in while I'm going potty. But you know what I mean? It's a sensitivity of like, can we just. But I had Judah Miller. I was like, you say it like it's you, Please. Because I can't lose face. Same with, you know, it's all caring, it's all attention. I really think, like the snapping of the gum is like, don't you know I'm here? And if you don't know I'm here, you can take it existentially. Do I exist? Like, do we agree that I'm also here? That uncaring can make you feel unsafe. But I think it goes back to that mammal Arian kind of level of like, okay, then are you a person that will push me if there's a fire? Like, do you only give a fuck about yourself? Like, I hate that.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So anyway, going back to the Four Seasons, day three or something is so quiet and I'm. I love just sitting in the quiet and contributing to it, being part of it. And you hear the ocean and you hear a bird and the wind. You're just like, God damn it, this is so nice. Then some people check into the little hut next door. They go out on their little dock. It's a shared lagoon. It's our lagoon. It's not your lagoon. Put a Bluetooth speaker out there and just start playing fucking music that echoes throughout the whole thing. And my response to it internally is as if Shredder and the Foot Clan just walked in and they. And they're gonna take me down. And there's like 50 of them.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I have, like, a danger death and anger. And here's the voice I wanted to put to you as I. And I know you're gonna relate.

[B]

I.

[A]

My fantasy is, you know, I suppose you could call the front desk. My fantasy is always to go out on the lagoon, put out a bigger speaker.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Play my music and go. Do you see? What if we all do it?

[B]

Yeah. What if we all did this?

[A]

What if we all did what you're doing?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Because you're King Ralph. You f. Is that.

[B]

That's exactly what it is for me. It's that feeling of like, what if we all did what you're doing? You know, that's unfair.

[A]

That's what a society is.

[B]

What if none of us used our blinker ever?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

What if everybody, when they wanted to get into the left turn lane, stuck the ass end of their car out and blocked the lane of people going straight? What if everybody did that? What if everybody took up three parking spaces when they only need one? What if everybody did that? And so. No. That is exactly what pisses me. I knew you would like it. It is. That lack of. I knew you would like it drives me nuts. But that's why you're a comedian, too.

[A]

Of course. And it's the only way to get it out.

[B]

You. You. Those observations, it's. You have to turn it into comedy, because if you didn't, you'd be an insufferable human being.

[A]

Buddy. Comedy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I want to put this to you, is like taking 5 Xanax. Val. My wife will diagnose. You need to go do a show. Oh. And it's because I'm starting to get a little like a Paul Giamatti character. And she's like, go do a show. And I do get it out. I'm good for, like, it used to be when I started, I'd have to do a show every night. Now I do a show, I'm good for two weeks.

[B]

That's good.

[A]

Xanax stays in my blood for. Not always, but sometimes two weeks. I'm like clean and I'm less concerned and that's best. Pete, it's the same mdma. Pete is very similar. If I, if somebody was playing music and I was on mdma, I'd be like, wow. Sail away. It's a beautiful song.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like I would. Because I wouldn't see a separation between me and them. I'd be happy that they were happy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I, I sort comedy actually, believe it or not, helps me get in a more open hearted place, in a calm place.

[B]

Yeah. I, I, I've never thought about it that way. For me it's, it's, I wonder if, I wonder if it has that effect on me and I'm just not aware of it. But yeah, for me it's just, it's a, it's like, it's like when you see in movies the person like hitting the punching bag.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know what I mean? And they're, they're angry and they're just, they had a shitty day at work and they let it all out on the.

[A]

Well, that's what's great about Dennis on the show.

[B]

Yes, it is.

[A]

Is you can be a narcissist and buddy, it's.

[B]

So I'm playing all the people that I hate as that character. That's what I'm doing. I'm Larry David. I'm getting into that, that mindset of like, I don't give a fuck about anybody else, it's all about me and, and just satirizing it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

It's the only way I can stay sane is to satirize it.

[A]

And do you ever. My heart sometimes breaks that I'm like, my God. I hope other people have some way. Whether it's a Japanese break room and you destroy a piano with a crowbar. I hope you have something, some sort of. Without this jerking off to Internet porn is not good enough. In fact, I would say that's hurting you. I don't mean to be that guy. I could be like drugs and cigarettes and porn. I just don't think it's as helpful as it seems. But like blowing off steam. We need something three dimensional and creative. Like your angst and your anxiety and your depression. Your anger is, is like lava and, and we can't funnel it through a straw like Internet porn or just jerking off in general or any simple eating. It's too simple. You need like a playground for that lava to go. Does this analogy fall apart?

[B]

You need a place to explode like a volcano. Like you need to let it out like space. Right, Right.

[A]

And Collaboration, I have to imagine on Sunny, isn't it? Let me just put it to you this way. It's more leading. I always ask leading questions, but it's like you're with your cohort. You're co. Conspiring to ridicule what bothers you. Could you imagine a better therapeutic exercise if I was like, you hate gum snapping. Hey, Glenn, write a scene where. And it is funny to come in. I'm chewing gum, right? I have gum in my mouth. Be like, loudly chewing. I'm like, what's up, fuckers? You get to do that. That's role playing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's role playing.

[B]

That's great.

[A]

And then you get to script what they say, and then you script what you say back. No wonder we all feel like we slept for 12 hours after, like, a good scene. You know what I mean?

[B]

Well, and also, I think some people's outlet is what is observing comedy. Right. And seeing someone like you on stage, that's.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Talking about all the things that piss them off, that irritate them about other people, the observations that they have that they don't have an outlet for. You are their outlet for that.

[A]

Right. That's.

[B]

We are their outlet for that. And I do think that that is a tremendous contributing factor to the success of It's Always Sunny. Definitely is. I think people are desperate for satire and they're desperate to actually see awful people behaving in awful ways and getting their comeuppance.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, that's why, you know, it's. We're. We're living in a time right now where satire and comedy in general is a very dodgy. It's a very difficult thing to navigate because people are so easily offended. Or we just. We love to cancel people. We love to assume the worst of people.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, it's a difficult time, I think maybe less so for standups. I think, like you guys, it doesn't seem. It seems like they're still. That's still a safe place for people to do it.

[A]

But. Yeah.

[B]

And I think the only reason we're still getting away with this because we're grandfathered in and you are. But I do think that people can sense that the people behind the show are actually good people and they're not the people that are on the show. We're having a go at all of the people that all of us despise.

[A]

I love all this. I could stay on this for the rest of the conversation. It's like when you have a dream. It's not Polite. It's not correct. It's not clean. But, like, as humans, we're built in to process the complexity and the overwhelm of reality. With dreams. And everyone does this.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And your dreams are so fucking weird and inappropriate. And it stands to reason that things that are grotesque belong in art. That's why Sonny is going like, no, let's be grotesque. You know what I mean by grotesque? Gross.

[B]

No, no, no. You mean exaggerated, awful.

[A]

Satire. And awful almost writ large. All these fancy ways of saying, like, let's do it loud. Because, buddy, it's not a theory that the human animal needs satire. It's a fact. Your brain satires your mom and your dad and that dog and your boss and your dentist and that guy who gave you a bad haircut in your mind. And sometimes you're beheading him with that thing you use to cut clay. And that's what our fucking. That's what the fucking Pope does. The Pope goes to bed and sometimes dreams. And this is no disrespect to the Pope. I'm saying it's built into the human psyche that you sometimes have a dream that you wouldn't share. And the artist. The money, I would say, for an artist is to deal with the complicated feeling of, like, is this all right? Because you're putting it on a stage under lights, instead of in the. The safest private theater of our minds, awake or sleep. But the. I feel that the money is for. I come back to my hotel room after a show and I'm like, wow. I really. You get a vulnerability hangover, or you get kind of like a. But what else are we doing? Like, talk about narcissism. Like, I like telling stories where I'm the idiot, or I was selfish or I was crude or rude or whatever. Because using the stage or using your show as a way of being, like, a politician and going like. And the guy who's named Glenn, who's played by Glenn, does the beautiful thing like highway to Heaven. You know what I mean? What. What is accomplished? What is cathartic, catharsized? What is. What is dropped off in watching that dream?

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I do think. Yeah. And I think that. I think it's also that the grotesqueness that you're talking about, too, is an important part of it, because it's taking something as simple as a slightly inconsiderate thing that someone might do and saying, okay, but what's the. Take that to its natural conclusion? Like, what is the most extreme version of that? That. Right. And, you know Just because you are doing what you're doing. It's like a smaller version of what we're satirizing. It's the same thing. It's maybe not quite as bad, but we're trying to show you the most extreme version of what it is that you're doing when you're being inconsiderate and awful.

[A]

Yes. And then the response to inconsiderate and.

[B]

And we, and, and us too. Like, I mean, you know, we're not, we're not, not perfect. Like, I, I, I've been inconsiderate at times. I've, I've. Of course, you know what I mean, I've done dumb.

[A]

You wouldn't be able to write the show if you couldn't see yourself.

[B]

Yeah. All those impulses are in me too.

[A]

Of course.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But that I actually think this is something else I'm deeply passionate about is like, play it out. Like, play out. Get your pain to talk, but you can also get your anger to talk. And if you get your anger to talk to you, honestly, it's murder. It's like we're murderous. Horrible. The guy who's got his butt sticking out and blocking the lane, you. I'm not saying you want to actually murder them, but the feeling is very similar. And you don't play it out.

[B]

I think that they're, I think that they're.

[A]

The way to get rid of it is to look at it, not to deny it. That's what I'm saying.

[B]

Definitely.

[A]

It's to say, oh, no, you wanted to kill that person.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

When we hear about road rage, we go, can you believe it? Yeah, I can believe it. Because we're all nuts. Yeah, we're all nuts.

[B]

Well, maybe you can relate to this too. Like, I spend, I've spent a lot of my time analyzing my own behavior and trying to make improvements on it so that I'm not being inconsiderate in the world. And I fail at it all the time, but I burn a lot of calories trying to not be the guy who doesn't, who sticks his ass out like that. I go, I pull all the way in the lane. You know, when I park my car, even if there's like a space and a half, like, to the next, to the place where the parking, parking spots end. I'll park all the way on the end so that when that person leaves that whole place, I'm thinking about all that stuff all the time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And, and that's a little bit like, you know, crazy, but it's also why I get so angry when people don't think about those things, is I'm like, why am I spending all of my time thinking about how to make the world better for all of you guys when you don't give a fuck?

[A]

Right?

[B]

Right. You don't give a. About us.

[A]

What you're saying is like, the narcissist only wins when we let them win. You know what I mean?

[B]

Well, they're definitely winning in terms of, like, they're. They're having. They're causing me to react in a way that, you know, I wish I didn't overreact, you know, to. To other people's behavior.

[A]

Yeah. But I don't think it's crazy. I think it's alchemy. It's like you're taking. This is what we. It's hard to say this is what we should all be doing. All I'll say is it's a beautiful thing you're doing with your pain because you're taking it and getting curious about it and then going, what's something? And you're not even being this deliberate about it. It can be ugly and complicated and even fueled by spite. I'll take it. I'll take kindness. However, if you're going to park that way, so this all becomes parking spots. I'll take it however it comes. I don't care if it's for you. Hoping beyond hope that the guy comes to. But like, here's. Here's what's interesting to me. I'll go so far as to say everything what we're doing in this world to a large extent is yes and no. Win and loss, life and death. Right? Meaning even you and I going like. And we don't snap our gum. Like, my Uber driver is me sort of murdering my Uber driver so that I can stand victorious and go, I found the problem. So even that is a meaning. There's no escaping it. This thing that we're doing, even right now I'm talking and you're not talking, so I'm in a very micro way, sort of dominating. You know what I mean? I don't mean to introduce that energy to this. It's just kind of what's happening. Two people can't be talking. Two people can't sit in the same spot. Two people can't drive the same car. You know what I'm saying? So, like, acknowledging that we're limited by the way our brains work and the way that we perceive reality and just going, okay, what's the best we can do in this game, meaning if I do a kind thing and it's really motivated by murder and spite. Fucking fine. You know what I mean?

[B]

Because it's still a thing. It's still a good thing.

[A]

Yeah. Beethoven wrote, blah, blah, blah, because he wanted fucking. I don't want him to be too crude and say he wanted to get laid, but, you know, he did a beautiful thing. And at the end of the day, he probably wanted to be famous and be revered, but he was also channeling, like, the divine. And he wanted. When he went into a restaurant, people were like, ludwig. And that's okay. It's all okay. It's all fine. You just have to kind of like loosen your grip on it and go like. Like I felt weird saying I'm dominating, but, like, that's because I started to judge myself. Like, am I? But then you can just go, like, it's just the game we're playing. How. What is the most beautiful way we can play it? And I would say getting together with your friends and making something, even if it is, you do get to be a known person and you get to get paid and you get all this stuff, but you also get to do something that people watch and go, do you know how fucking I could cry? Someone watches and goes like, thank you. Knew what I meant about the music at the Four Seasons.

[B]

Yeah. Yes, yes. You feel. Seen you. You were like, okay, I'm not crazy like this. There are other people who struggle with these same things, and you feel less alone in that sense.

[A]

And how valuable is that?

[B]

So now I want to tell you the story of what happened.

[A]

Let's start recording.

[B]

So this speaking of the social contract that you enter into when you go to a lovely place, like the Four Season.

[A]

Oh, yeah. What happened?

[B]

So my wife and I, we were also on our honeymoon, and we're sitting in like a cabana, you know, by the pool, having some cocktails, reading our books, whatever, just having a lovely time. And, you know, there was this older gentleman.

[A]

I tell the story and it ends up. It was me. What if at the end of the story, kind of like a soft baby ass? Yeah.

[B]

And then I'm like, wait, that was. It was everything you said you weren't. It was this older gentleman, very tan, you know, looked. He was. He what?

[A]

I just have to interject. No place. Katie, go to a four season. Go to like an. Like an elite place or whatever you want to call it. An expensive place. You see, all you see are Jabba the Hudson slave layers. That's all you See Jabba the Hudson slave layers. You see these tan, disgusting men who made millions and millions of dollars and found a slave layer. I know what I'm saying. That's pretty horrible. That is kind of. I'm just labeling it. I'm just saying it.

[B]

So I see it. This guy found his slave Leia. But I think. But I think maybe he found her, like, 20 years ago because she was. She was. She wasn't like a. She was probably, like, I don't know, in her 50s.

[A]

Yeah. Okay.

[B]

And he was, like, in his 70s. Or maybe she was in her 40s. I don't know. I can't. This is a while ago, so I don't know Know. I just remember he was a little bit older. You know, not to stereotype, but yeah, she looked a little bit like a trophy wife. Ish.

[A]

Which is, by the way, why Jabba the Hutt and slave Leia resonates. When you see that, you go, oh, it's a big, powerful, disgusting slob and a beautiful woman who's chained to them. And you go like, oh, Irene and Dan.

[B]

Except the difference there is that. Is that she's chained herself to him as opposed to.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

But anyway. Anyway, she was sitting on the edge of the pool like this with her feet in the pool, and he was in the pool. So she's sitting on the edge with her feet in the pool. He's in the pool. He's got her foot in his hand, and he is using a pumice stone on the bottom of her foot and pumicing. Now, for those who are familiar, this is a rough stone that you use to slough off the hard, dead skin. Dead skin. And he was pumising her foot into the pool.

[A]

I'm dead.

[B]

And Jill and I were just like, I'm dead. We have to say something. I was like, I can't. And I get so upset that. And I've gotten better about this. Like, I'm still not. I still struggle sometimes when I get that upset to say something, she'll say something. And I love this about her. And she was like, I have to say something. I was like, yes, please do, because.

[A]

I can't do it. What do you say? Could you please not exfoliate your wife's foot dead skin cells into the shared water?

[B]

That's basically what she said. She was like, I'm sorry. Can you not. Like, you're. Can you not. I don't know what she said, but it was something like that. Can you not not. What was their Dead skin into calm. And they were just like. And they looked at us like, oh, these Karens. You know what I mean? Like, they. They were like, really? And then they said, she. I can't remember it was either. She. I think it was her. She goes, they have a filter. And we were like, yeah, but that's disgusting.

[A]

And before it's filtered, you ever swallow a mouthful of pool water? I don't want to be able to prove we know each other through my DNA. You know what I'm saying?

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

That is fucking rancid.

[B]

It was the most outrageous thing. Definitely the most outrageous thing I've ever seen at a nice resort like this. And the fact that, like.

[A]

Did they stop?

[B]

They did stop. They did stop. Yes. But very begrudgingly. And as if. Like, as if we were being extremely difficult.

[A]

That you were being callous.

[B]

That we were. Yes, yes. Yeah, it was.

[A]

I might have got the staff in on that one. You know what I mean? You just go, could you please. Like, I was shooting a show and there was.

[B]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but there's a woman and a man pumising their skin into the pool. Would you mind so much? Would you mind terribly?

[A]

Yeah, they could do it.

[B]

So nice you're executing them this evening in front of all of us as part of the show. Yeah, yeah. Would you mind terribly?

[A]

They cut the heads off of the. Yeah, that was the best.

[B]

Everybody who was by that pool would have been like, yes, yes. And I have no problem with this.

[A]

Can I say that that is also a part of these fantasies that we're neglecting is. It's almost like you are like a political figure. You get them to stop. They do. Often in the aftermath of these situations, people go, thank you. Meaning people need an advocate, Which I'm not trying to force this BlackBerry, which I'm obsessed with. I think it's a fantastic film, and I think you're fantastic in it.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Is addressing something that you and I must love. We're watching it. We're watching it. And you play. What's his first name?

[B]

Jim.

[A]

Jim Bosley. Jim Balsley. And when I was telling Val she was in. She wanted to watch it. She loves Sunny, she loves you, she loves Jay. We're in. We want to watch it. But I was like, look, it is. You were kind of giving me a. Throwing me a bone because I love movies about American corporations. I love them. I think they're great allegories for a human life. Like how you have to be careful how you manage your own interior business. So, Jim, as a character, but also as something that we all have in our psyche, it's such a necessary energy. And this is what I said to her. I was like, you know, it's a bunch of nerds that get, like, kicked into gear by like a fierce guy. And what a fantasy it is and what a joy. I just want to give you this compliment. You're like, you're, you're. Now I look. Sonny may run like the fur a thousand years, but, like, there will always be that. Glenn. But now we are entering into Ed Harris. Glenn. Where you know what I'm saying, we're dramatic, fierce, kick ass, steely blue, and let's be real, bald. You were bald. I'm talking like Trump. And let's be real, you were bald. He was beautiful bald. Cut his hair off. Or was it a cap? We were still debating.

[B]

No, I shaved it. I knew you shaved it. Yeah, looked too perfect.

[A]

Sorry, Katie, but Val also thought it was a cap. I was like, that's shaved it. I have a lot of questions about that. But real quick, Val and I were having a conversation about somebody and there's this like, soft, open hearted where you're like, my friend is dating somebody and you know, they've been married, married four times. And you know, they. I'm making this up. And you know, they do a lot of cocaine, but they also really love her. And there's something beautiful and necessary, like sling blade. Sometimes you just hit it with a sling blade. It's not, it's not beautiful, it's not nuanced. But sometimes. And I do this with Val, I go, yeah, he's been married four times and he does coke. Like, you going in the movies? Like, yeah, they took you for a ride. That's fucking done. Give me the phone. Give me the phone. I fucking love it. And you do it to perfection. Not just the character, but the energy of, like, we all sometimes have to go. I was talking to an Uber driver in Utah and she was going on and on about. All I said was, are you from Utah? And she talked for 20 minutes, guilt ridden about how she's never left and how she wants to leave. I never. All I said was, I love it here. Do you love it here? Are you from here? 20 minute monologue about how she feels bad that she's never in. She's like, maybe I'll leave. But you know, there's four. This is what she said. There's four Seasons here. I'm like, come on. And then she Goes, and I know where to take my car when it's broken. I'm like, you're yelping four seasons away from any other place. You're clearly stuck. Stuck. And she's like, but I, you know, I want to leave, and my Jim Balsley wants to go. You're never going to leave. I just want to tell you, you're.

[B]

Never going to leave. Right?

[A]

You're never going to leave. He's been married four times, and he has cocaine. You're never going to leave. And love it. Because I need it. I have people like that in my life. I had a therapist like that. They would just name it it and go. They're you. They're you. Stop it. Would you just talk about that energy? I mean, whatever that made you think of.

[B]

Well, yeah, I mean, it's. It's wish fulfillment on my part, certainly.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because that there are times in my life where I wish I could be more like Jim.

[A]

Jim Bosley in the. In the Four Seasons pool would be like, are you kidding me?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Are you kidding me?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

Do you mind if I shave my armpits? There's a filter. Filter. I'll shave my armpits. What if I just take a. Will the filter get that?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you're just going, like. Like, someone's cooking cookies. It's amazing.

[B]

That is. No, I think. I think that's maybe part of what makes that character work in terms of his rootability, I think, you know, for as. As brash and authoritarian and, you know, tyrannical as he can be. I think a lot of people are watching that character and going, yeah, finally somebody fucking saying something like, you know what I mean? And he's a little out of control, and he overdoes it at times. But I think it's the reason you're rooting for him is because you understand the rationale. And I think a lot of us do wish we could be more assertive in the ways that he's assertive. You know, I admire him for that. There are other things that I don't admire about that character. I think there's a petulance that. Honestly, like, I even have trouble watching my.

[A]

When you're like, I'll buy. I'll buy the whole NHL.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. It's. It's funny because people love that scene and. And it's become one of the most iconic scenes in the. In the movie, you know, me screaming.

[A]

I, you know, think I won't do it.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You think I won't do it. But also me yelling, you know, I'm from Waterloo, where the vampires hang out.

[A]

Out. Oh, yeah, buddy, here's your Oscar. Because try to say I'm from Waterloo, where the vampires hang out and make it work and not have people go, yikes.

[B]

Well, I have. I have.

[A]

And it's a little out of focus. Shout out to the dp. There's like a moment of. It goes out of focus just looking for you. And it works. It helps.

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah. I think you're right. I think somebody else mentioned that to me. Yeah.

[A]

It makes it like, oh, we just caught this moment.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Which was part of the aesthetic of the thing. I'm not sure that they meant to do that there, but maybe that was the best take.

[A]

Hardest job on set.

[B]

Focus puller. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that one in particular, too, because the way they shot, the way Matt shot that movie, we. A lot of times didn't even know where the camera was. He would have it. He would find a place where he could shoot through 15 panes of glass and he'd be. He'd have the camera 50 yards away.

[A]

What a genius movie. On a.

[B]

On a long. Like on a long National Geographic style lens.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And on this, you know, little. I forget what they call it. Like the. It's like, you know, a little ball like this little. It makes it look like you're. You're doing a handheld.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But because you're so far away, it can't be handheld because everything would just be like that when you're that far away. So it's on, like a gimbal. A gimbal.

[A]

A Gimli. Son of Gloy.

[B]

Yes, sure. Holy shit. That sounds like a real thing. Is that a Lord of the Rings reference?

[A]

Yeah, it's the Dwarf.

[B]

Okay. Is he really the son of.

[A]

Yeah, Gloy is a great guy.

[B]

Gloy.

[A]

You'd love Gloi.

[B]

I can almost guarantee you I wouldn't.

[A]

You never see Gloi.

[B]

I'm not. I'm not.

[A]

This riff is not even on the maps. And Tolkien drew a lot of maps. This one's not even on the map.

[B]

Well, Gloi must have been in the.

[A]

Didn't they.

[B]

Wasn't that Amazon? Wasn't that a prequel? Or was it a. I don't consider it, like, a bunch of years later. Vader.

[A]

I'm just kidding.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I. I don't.

[B]

I'm not into those. I'm not into the Lord of the Rings, but yeah. Anyway, he shot. It was On a gimbal and. And, you know. So, yeah, I think the focus puller had. Had a. Had a difficult.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[B]

Yeah, for sure. But.

[A]

But that must have helped the performance. They did that in the movie once as well. Another. Glenn. Oh, they.

[B]

They. What do you mean? They shot super long lens.

[A]

Well, neither of them were. Well, Glenn had acted a little bit, but Marketa hadn't really acted very much. So they would shoot them on a long lens like half a block away now, where the camera was and. And all the people are real people. Real. You can tell. He gets recognized a couple times, but it was how they naturalized the performance.

[B]

So good isn't great. That movie blew us away. Like, my wife and I went and saw it. We went to go see a different movie, and it had sold out. So we're like, oh, what's this once movie? Well, we just ended up in that movie, and we were like, that's one of the best movies I've ever seen.

[A]

I had just gotten divorced.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

And I watched that movie. So you can imagine the table was set. I was like, I am a sinking boat.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it was incredible.

[B]

So.

[A]

Incredible.

[B]

So good. Anyway, but that. That. That moment, I, you know, I had conversations with Matt about that line, because that line was in the script, and we both knew what it was from. It's a. It's a reference to a. Do you know this?

[A]

No. All right, so in Dune, you can.

[B]

No, no, it's. It's a real interview that this woman was doing. Just.

[A]

He said it.

[B]

No, no, no, not Jim. Also not Jim Bossley. This. This woman, I don't even know who she is, was doing a random, like, talking to people on the streets thing. And she starts interviewing this random guy, and he. When he. He looks normal, and when he starts talking, you're like, oh, he's a normal guy. And then. And then he. And then after he gets about his second or third sentence out, you're like, oh, this guy's not well. He's not well. And instead of cutting it off, she just let him keep going. And at one point, he rips his shirt off and says something like. Like he doesn't say, I'm from Waterloo, where the vampires hang out. But. But he says, like, something like that. He says something like. He says something about being from Waterloo and where the vampires are or something like that. And so Matt loved it so much and he loved the randomness of it that he just put it in the movie. And I was like, matt, I don't know what this line Means I don't. What the am I talking about? Like, what does that mean? And he's like. And he was like. Like, it.

[A]

I think it means what we've been talking about. You know what I say when I have road rage is I go, you're king of the road. I go, you're king of the road.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

And my daughter, you know nobody else but you. The cliche is your kid repeats back what you say. So sometimes now, somebody will speed past, cut over three lanes. My daughter, who's only five, will go, you're king of the road. And I'm like, good. I'm glad you have that. That's a fun. It's not.

[B]

My wife would look at me and go. And go.

[A]

Go.

[B]

See what you're teaching.

[A]

I think you're king of the road is a great tool to give my daughter, to be like. You can let out your frustration, but you don't have to be like you.

[B]

You fight.

[A]

You know, that's definitely the 80s alternative. You're king of the road. It's fine. It's acknowledging, like, it's actually bowing. You're king of the road. And I think in American business, when you say, I'm from Waterloo, which is where BlackBerry was. I'm from Waterloo, where the vampires hang out, you're saying you're doing what we've been talking about or what I've been saying over and over, which is like, let your anger speak. Get Interview it. What do you mean? I'll buy all of NHL means you're trying to kill me. I'll kill you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's what the whole business. That's what the American corporation is. That's what the ego is. It's like, kill or be killed. I'm a vampire is the most honest thing. You think fucking Elon Musk doesn't sometimes hang up the phone and go, like, I'm a vampire. I'm a vampire. I know he looks like he's allergic to what he just had for dinner, but he's also a vampire. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's honest. Yeah, it's. It's primordial.

[B]

Yeah, it is primordial.

[A]

That's why.

[B]

And that is why people are responding to it, and that is why. And that's why it's in there. And that's why I did eventually.

[A]

I want to see take 1.

[B]

That might have been take 1.

[A]

Shut up.

[B]

That might have been take 1. Actually, I would love to ask Matt.

[A]

That's the Oscar.

[B]

That's The Oscar. I should. I want to ask Matt that, actually. I'm curious. Yeah. Because I remember the whole time I was like, matt, I don't know if I can deliver this line because I don't know what it means. And then we got there on the day, and I'd been rehearsing the scene, just, like, going over the lines or whatever, and I was like, well. Well, I've been. I haven't had an. I've had enough experience to where I've said to Rob and Charlie, I don't want to do this. I don't get it. It's weird and it's a little too far.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

In my opinion. And they're like, just try one. And then I do it. And it becomes an iconic moment from the show. That has happened 15 fucking times.

[A]

Can I interject that there's a. Phil Rosenthal did the pod. And there was a moment where Rhea hugs his dad, and he didn't want to do it, needed one take. And it's like the moment from the series. And he still holds that over his head. He's like, you gotta hug your dad.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He's like, but I wouldn't. I wouldn't hug my dad. It's like, hug your dad. Hug your dad.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So you have to hug your dad sometimes.

[B]

Yeah. And I knew that. And I knew that once I got to it and I was there on the day, I was like, well, I mean, if it doesn't work. And I. And I had also, like. I trusted Matt at this point. I was like, he. He knows what he's doing. He knows. He knows what's working, what's not. He's not gonna put it in the movie if it doesn't work. Work, so why not do it? Like, I'll just do it, and I'm gonna do it, and I. I'm gonna go for it. You know what I mean? And I. And I. And. And I was like, if there is any meaning behind this, it's exactly what you said. It's just a. A primordial.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Scream.

[A]

No, it's perfect. It goes back to what we were saying about dreams.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

We dream about vampires. We dream about werewolves because we are vampires, and we are werewolves. And what is more vampiric than an American corporation? Your behavior is very vampiric. And sometimes you want a vampire. That's the moment that's so fascinating is. Is Jay Baruchell's character knowing he should let this shark in. And he says, you know, who are. They're talking about how the Other corporations are like pirates.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And he goes, you know, who's afraid of sharks? Pirates. Right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So we know that. We. It's a necessary energy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's like. I'm saying, it's like they've had four ex husbands or wives or whatever. Sometimes you need that, like, the sling blade.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Approach. So. But I like the moment. Matt is the writer. Director. But he also plays.

[B]

Yeah, he plays Doug, which is like, just.

[A]

I. I didn't know that. Katie told me that before we started rolling. And I was like, I'm so impressed having written. And you don't direct, but, you know, it's very hard to be incredible in a thing that you're also writing and directing.

[B]

He has so much experience with it. Most of his. His other things, he's, you know, he actually doesn't consider himself an actor at all because he's. He's like, I just play myself. He's like, I play myself. I'm not. I'm not acting. He did.

[A]

And it's.

[B]

In a way, it's true. Like, I'd say he is an actor because he's a he, because there's always, like, a deep truth behind what he does. And I think that's why his performance in the film works, because I always buy it. It always feels like he's telling the truth and being honest. It never seems like he's going for a laugh, even when it's super funny. And I. I admire that.

[A]

And I have such issue with him thinking he's not.

[B]

That he's not an actor.

[A]

Well, because I've heard Louis say the same thing. Scandal noted. But Louis CK Is like, people say I'm not acting because I'm playing myself, but, like, okay, someone's putting makeup on your face and they're micing you and they're asking you where you're going to be standing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How you're going to be turning and all that sort of stuff. And then you have to pretend that you're anxious about a pitch meeting. What do you think acting is? Only if I'm like, hello, Glenn.

[B]

Well, I can relate to it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I can relate to it in the sense that I've written or rewritten over 200. Was that right? No, not quite. Over 150 episodes of television. I still don't consider myself a writer at all.

[A]

Yeah, that's because. Well, I don't know what it's. Because I think it's.

[B]

I spent a lot of time typing dialogue into final draft.

[A]

But you don't think you're a writer. No, that's mojo protection. That's Radiohead going, like, we don't want to leave. I think they're in Oxford or something. It's like. It's not superstition, but it's like, I don't want to change how I think of myself. Because if you start going, I'm a writer, you might write like a writer, and you want to write like a guy who's breaking into television, and that's your mojo. So you can't concede it. Just a theory.

[B]

I don't know that that's what it is, if I'm being honest. I. It's that every time I write, I feel like I'm writing out of necessity, not because I want to. And that's how Matt feels. That's how Matt feels about acting. He didn't want to be in the movie. Jay Baruchell said, no, you have to play Doug. Like, that's you. You. Yeah. No, you. You gotta play.

[A]

That was good. That was good. It's like, you gotta do it.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

Ye.

[B]

Posture. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You. Yeah.

[A]

No, Jay.

[B]

Jay was the one that talked him into it. He did not want to play the role, but he was like, no, but you. You. He's like, that's the only way I want to do the movie is if you're playing Doug, you know? And so I think. I think Matt recognized, and so he kind of rewrote the character to basically just be him. Because the real Doug was not like that. Yeah, he was a little bit like that. The. The character of Doug in the movie is an amalgamation of the real Doug, and I think this other guy that used to work there, and I think he was almost more the other guy than it was the real Doug. But so he basically rewrote the character to cater to his own thing. And again, I can understand why he doesn't consider himself an actor, even though I would argue that he is. Because he's like, I'm only doing this because Jay wants me to do it, and because the way the character's written now, I'm the only person who can do it. And I know I can do this. And it's the same reason why I write Sonny, because I'm like. Cause nobody else can do it but us. It's our core group of people. And when you remove any ingredients, all of a sudden it's not Grandma's meatballs anymore. It's something else. And I know that. So I'm writing out of necessity. It's not that I Don't enj. It's not, it's not even that I don't think I'm good at it. I do think I'm pretty good at it. I just don't. I just don't identify as a writer because I don't have this desire to write. I'm writing because I have. I told FX that I was going to make a show and I have to make it now, but I don't want to. If somebody else could write it, I would love that. I would love that.

[A]

Everything you're saying describes a writer to me.

[B]

Well, yeah, yeah, but like, whereas. But I do identify as an actor because I want to act.

[A]

I don't know about that. I. I see writer. All three cameras. Get a mug. Yeah, okay. Cuz you want to act and I want to act things. But you don't want to write other things. Not really.

[B]

I mean, I have at times wanted to. I like the idea.

[A]

You read the Sci Fi thing.

[B]

We wrote this. Yeah, we, we had that Sci Fi pilot. I also wrote a script. I wrote, wrote a feature recently with a friend of mine. Needs. Need some rewrites. But it's good. It's really good, actually. I think it's one of the best things I've ever written. Yeah, Very proud of it. And it was actually after we finished, like the first draft of that was the first time I actually thought, oh, maybe I am a writer. This is good. Yeah, I was very proud of it.

[A]

Interesting. Well, Seinfeld, he says he has an image of what a comedian is and he's always falling short of it. Again, this is another theory. Theory. It's similar to my first theory, though. It's like you want the engine to keep working and the engine of aspiring to be the ideal of what you consider a writer, if that's Paul Thomas Anderson or somebody.

[B]

It's not that. It's not. I promise it's not. It's just that it's like, I think in order to identify as a writer, I need to have some internal engine that gives me the desire to write and the need to write. Like I have to.

[A]

It has to be compulsive.

[B]

Yes, I think so. That, I mean, that's how I would define it. Like I. I have to be.

[A]

I think you helped me understand.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Like if I never wrote. This is what I mean. If my, if I had a wonderful acting career ahead of me and hopefully I do and never had to.

[A]

Entering into the Ed Harris decade.

[B]

That's right. I'm going into my Ed Harris decade and never had to write anything ever again. If somebody was, if somebody were to say to me, don't worry, you never have to write again, I be like, oh, great.

[A]

Yeah, great.

[B]

And that's what I mean.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm writing something right now, and I, I, I really love it. So I, yeah, I get what you're saying.

[B]

But you wrote your show too, right?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. And I, I, I'm sure you get this all the time, but I am interested in the, like, Always Sunny is always. I said, Charlie Day did the podcast as well, and I'm sure we talked about this, but the idea of, like, and we can just talk about it briefly, but like the gatekeepers, right? And then it's like, well, let's just build our own gate. Let's just talk about it briefly, because you and I are both products of that. No. 1. In fact, when Crashing got picked up, I said to Val, I'm trying to get in touch with the excitement because you know how it is. Everything takes a really long time. You write it six months later, you pitch it six months later. They say, yeah, so sometimes you lose the feeling. And I'm like, if I had auditioned for the part of Pete in Crashing and got would have been so much closer. Like, and it goes into production next month, and we would have gone out and popped champagne and eat an ice cream sundae and dance and all that stuff. We did do that stuff, but I had to get in touch with it. And the way that I got in touch with it was like, imagine if you got this part. Like, you would have freaked out. But the truth is, and Jason Siegel's this way. They weren't writing movies for Jason Siegel. Maybe they were. Maybe I should take him out. But I'm just saying I think he would agree.

[B]

You know, I think he was create. I think he was creating opportunities for himself.

[A]

And let's, let's just briefly, just because it's helpful. I think a lot of people are out there going, and a lot of actors are going, like, where's that thing? And Glenn on the show is the thing, and you wrote it, and, and then the sci fi thing and then this, this feature, like, the feature. I just finished the feature as well. It's for me. And if I auditioned for it, I wouldn't get it. And I, and you know what I'm saying? Because, you know, they'd call the 25 plemonses of the world, and it would go to Plemons. And I'd go, I, you're king. Of the road. You know what I mean? I'd have to concede the point, but you kind of trick it by going like, yeah, it's. It's what Stallone did. Did. I know you and I both have a lot in common with Sylvester Stallone.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But you know, the story that, like, people want.

[B]

Often compared to Sylvester Stallone.

[A]

Me too.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Just kind of like the way you talk.

[B]

The way I talk? My. My overall sort of like, masculinity.

[A]

Yeah. Your appeal.

[B]

My appeal? Just. Yeah.

[A]

Toughness. But he. Do you know this, that, like, people wanted to buy Rocky and make it.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

But he said no because he wanted to be in it.

[B]

Just.

[A]

Just. Just because I think it's helpful for. For people out there. And there are a lot of people out there, I think, that are probably listening, that are like, I have stuff, I want to do it. I don't know how to do it. And. And making it your own way seems to have been your path, and it continues to be your path. Yeah, to a certain extent.

[B]

I mean, the. The Hustle is real, for sure. Like, if I just sit back and wait for the phone to ring, it's not. Nothing's going to happen.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I have to be actively out there, if not actually writing, developing things and, you know, just putting things in motion, and maybe one out of ten of those things will ever actually come to fruition. But if I don't do any of it, I don't know. But I also can't just. I'm just not one to just sit and wait. I can't do it.

[A]

Compulsion.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I. I want to make stuff, but.

[B]

Also, like, I don't feel like. I think I've also come to terms with, like, I don't. And maybe I'll get to a point in my career where I've got so many things coming at me that I no longer have to spend all that time. But I think I'll still do it then because they'll. I'll still be unsatisfied with 80% of what I'm getting.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I'll want to be developing the things that I'm excited about, you know, So I think I'm always gonna. Going to do that, but I just think in this business, like, yeah, you have to be developing things for yourself. Otherwise it just. Nobody's gonna hand it to you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think I've gotten to a point where I think for a while, as an actor, I thought, oh, yeah, you do some stuff, you're seen as a great actor. And then eventually people will start giving you things. And I think I was maybe for a while there a little upset that people weren't giving me things. And then now I've gotten to a point where I'm like, well, why should I, should they. Yeah, there's, there's, there's, there's other people out there. Like, I mean, you know, right, McConaughey. Yeah, there's, there's McConaughey, for Christ's sakes. I mean, he's got, he and I have the same body and he's already a bigger star, so they're going to give it to him.

[A]

We'll take a break and I actually know what I'm going to ask when you get back. I was just. This doesn't always happen. But just this week I was talking to a couple friends about gut health and boosting your immunity system. Your immunity, your immune system immunity system. Is that right? Boy, it's early here, but we were talking about armor Colostrum. They were telling me about armor Colostrum and I'm like, no, I tell you about armor Colostrum. They're a Pete's pick and I'm on board. You guys know I'm always on the lookout for ways to strengthen my immunity and my gut health, improve my fitness metabolism and enhance my hair and skin radiance. Well, I recently discovered, discovered an incredible product which is Armor Colostrum. What is it? Colostrum is the first nutrition we as humans receive in life. It contains all the essential nutrients our bodies need in order to thrive. And Armor Colostrum has harnessed that. It's a proprietary concentrate that harnesses over 400 living bioactive nutrients that rebuild the barriers of your body and fuel cellular health health for a host of research backed health benefits. What does it, what are those benefits? Like I said, it reactivates hair growth and glowing skin. This is a benefit I noticed almost right away. I'm talking within weeks of taking it. I put it in my smoothie, don't even taste it gets in me. Hair and skin radiance fortifies gut health and ignites metabolism, which is always, you know, as I feel like as I'm getting older, my metabolism and starts slowing down like a train. I get it boosted and my gut health. Always about that. Gut health fuels fitness performance and recovery. Recovery is the key one for me. There again, I'm 44. After workout. Hurts more than it used to. It's wonderful to have a secret weapon in my corner that can help me bounce back after a workout or if after honestly just travel stuff takes it the out of of you. So I love it. We've worked with them on a special offer for weirdos. Receive 15 off your first order. Go to tryarmra.com weird or enter weird at checkout to get 15 off your first order. That's t r Y a R m r a.com weird it's talking about with my friends. I'm talking about it with you armor. Get into it. We're also brought to us by our friends at Ritual, one of our oldest and longest pizza picks and a total game changer for me. And I can attest people always say multivitamins or I feel like I've heard my whole life multivitamins. You just pm out. Ritual is different. First of all, it's different for a lot of reasons. It's got a minty taste, it's traceable, which means you know where all of your nutrients come from. It's vegan, it's gluten free. It has a delayed release. That's the key. So when, when I used to take regular crap vitamins, I felt like I, I could see it coming out of my system the first time I peed. Well, ritual has fixed that. It stop. It doesn't break down until it's in your low intestine, which is where vitamins and nutrients can actually be absorbed. It's also a wonderful life hack because I fast. I fast all the time and I still take my ritual. In fact, I'm not eating today and I just took my ritual and it doesn't upset your stomach. So. Zinc. Try taking zinc on an empty stomach. It makes some people throw up. Not with ritual because it's not breaking down until it's in your lower intestine, which is incredible. It's also got D3 for your immune system. It's got Omega D, Omega 3 DHA to normal muscle function. Heart health is D3 is muscle function. What I'm saying is I used to go to my doctor doctor. They were like there are all these gaps in your diet. This is anecdotal. This is just my story. Started taking ritual, no more problems. Filled in those gaps. It's incredible. Get this. Essential for men is a quality multivitamin from a company you can trust. Rituals offering weirdos 30% off your first month. No lie. You guys know from the intro I'm traveling. Ritual is one of those things I have to bring with me me. So get it in your routine and get 30% off. Visit ritual.com weird to start ritual today. Or add essential to men. Essential for men to your subscription. All right, back to Glenn. All right, here's what I was going to ask you. And it's completely random, but we'll see where it takes us. There's a scene in the wonderful BlackBerry where you smash a payphone. Here's my question. Look, it seems very obvious. It ends with a shot of the half of the payphone.

[B]

Mm.

[A]

So you eviscerate this payphone receiver. I know. I've been in show business a long time. It's got to be a pre broken phone. Like, it had to be rigged in a way that it would break with the wires and good for that last shot. But you also slam it quite a bit. Did you. Did you do the slam take and then they. They flew in the. The half phone, or did you actually break it?

[B]

It was not. It was not pre broken. It wasn't even in the script. Actually, the break wasn't even the script.

[A]

You just broke a Canadian payphone.

[B]

Well, so I. When we got there, I asked Matt. I was like, is that. Is that a real payphone or is that all our thing? Did we build this? And they were like, oh, no, we built that. And I was like, okay. And so I.

[A]

Why? You're like, don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Just roll. Just roll. Just roll.

[B]

No, I think I told him. I was like, on the last one, I might just. I might break it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And he was like, great. You know, but what happened was we did like two or three takes, and whatever take that was, I didn't tell him that I was gonna break it on that one. And I didn't know I was gonna break it on that one. It really, really, really legitimately was one of those moments where it just happened. Like, I knew. I knew I wanted to do it on the last take. I didn't know that was the last take. Nobody knew it was last take. It ended up being the last take because that was the only fun we had.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I was like, well, shit, I hope we got it, but. Because it just. It just was one of those things where when I was doing the take, I was get. I was getting legitimately worked up in that moment, and I was. And I. This does happen where I can go to that place. And I was just. I was genuinely pissed off in that moment, and I just started fucking doing it, and it wasn't breaking. And I was like, I'm not gonna stop until this fucking thing broke. Breaks, like. And so I just kept Hammering it. And then it finally broke. And when it did, a piece flew up and hit me right above my eye. I was like, fuck. That could have gone in my eye. I cut my hand. My hand was cut. I had a cut on my forehead. Because. Yeah, it wasn't. It wasn't scored. It was. It was like a. It was like a real thing, but. But also like really cathartic, you know, breaking things. Very cathartic.

[A]

We're back to the Japanese breaking room.

[B]

Totally. Yeah, totally. So it was. It was a lot of fun. I mean, it was great.

[A]

It's one of the great mysteries of life that, like screaming, you know, like prime. I'm. I'm surprised primal scream therapy isn't more popular. Yeah, truly, because that stuff. Really?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Like your body wants to be mad. We're just like, nah, the mind, we'll just kick it around up in our heads and yell in our heads. It's not the same.

[B]

You. This amazing thing. Like, I have a lot of respect for people who can sort of like really get their. Into actors who can get their internal engine going before the scene. Right. They. They do what they. Is that nicotine gum?

[A]

It is, yeah.

[B]

I knew it.

[A]

You want some?

[B]

No, no, I'm good, I'm good. Is it Lucy?

[A]

It's just good old fashioned Nicorette.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Why?

[B]

I just. I don't know, I'm noticing all these biohacky things. Things?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Now I've noticed that liquid death, the. The nootropics. You've got the aura ring and you've got the Apollo.

[A]

That's not an aura ring, but yeah, the. The Apollo is on social mode, keeping me kind of.

[B]

Okay. And then you've got the nicotine gum for stimulant cognitive enhancement.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

What do they say? It's like.

[B]

Sorry, I just.

[A]

No, it's like.

[B]

It's like I noticed you pocketing it, so. Yeah. No, he's not just chewing it.

[A]

Yeah. I wouldn't just chew gum. I don't love gum.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That much.

[B]

But you're not worried about it. It like having like. No, like having like a little like on camera or whatever.

[A]

Oh, I suppose. I guess not.

[B]

I hadn't noticed until I shot a.

[A]

Whole pilot with nicotine.

[B]

Come on.

[A]

Lodged in my.

[B]

Did you. Yeah, it's a wonderful thing. I had some on the way over.

[A]

Oh, you did?

[B]

I did.

[A]

Well, look, it's. I think it's interesting and worth stepping out just a little bit. We started, by the way.

[B]

Don't let me for. I do Want to get back to the point that I was trying to make before?

[A]

Of course, yeah. Then finish it and I won't forget nicotine.

[B]

Okay. Don't forget your thing.

[A]

Or if I do, who cares?

[B]

I've come to accept. So I, I, I, I think something that, that a lot of actors struggle with, I suspect, because it's weird, because in la, people don't really talk about acting. They don't really talk about their technique. They don't talk about that in New York, certainly when I was going to college, we did. And in theater, everyone talks about their process. Right. In la, no one wants to talk.

[A]

About even that word. It's like, yeah.

[B]

And I suspect most don't want to talk about their process because they don't have one or two, or they don't feel. Or they do have one, but they don't feel confident in talking about it because they're not sure it even works. And I get that. And I can relate to that. I feel the same way, actually. I think it's a very awkward thing. When you're in theater, the process, you are part of a process. You are rehearsing with the other actors and the director for weeks upon weeks before you ever display the piece, whatever it is. So everybody's on the same page. You've rehearsed it, all of you, together. You figured it out together. When you were acting in a film, you got to go home and figure it out by yourself. It's like, how the fuck do you do that? It's really weird.

[A]

Yeah. Anyway, in fact, when you're auditioning, often what I feel is being auditioned isn't really your performance. It's your ability to interpret the script correctly. You know what I mean? It's like, oh, well, it's this kind of movie, you know what I mean?

[B]

I found that I had to as a younger actor, I would get in my. Anytime I booked something thing, I would get on camera, I would get in my head about it. Auditioning. I became, I was doing audio, I was auditioning all the time. So I became very comfortable with auditioning. So I started playing the trick of, like, kind of what you said about earlier when you were getting back into character for your character, who is you. Yeah, for crashing. Like, I would have to trick myself by. I would show up on the first day of set and. And I'd be like, just think of it as an audition.

[A]

Yeah, interesting.

[B]

Because otherwise I would be overthinking it, over analyzing it instead. Because with an audition, you don't have that much Time. So you kind of have to go on instinct a little bit. So this is what I'm getting, where I'm going with this. Sometimes I feel like actors feel like they're not supposed to do the thing that they've read in all the acting books that you're not supposed to do. When you read something, you're not supposed to draw conclusions about it right away. You need to read it a bunch of times. Neutral. Stay neutral. Neutral. Stay as neutral as possible. Read it a million times, and then slowly build the character. I think that's. I think that's. I think that's utter nonsense. Or maybe that works for some people. What I came to accept about myself and I've never read a single book, a single act, and I've read a lot of acting books because I find that stuff interesting, that advocates for my position on this. Every single one of them would tell me that what I'm doing is right, wrong.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And I've come to the conclusion that is not wrong. It's right for me. It's right. And I think it's probably right for a lot of people. I do the exact opposite the first time I read it. Whatever I'm feeling, that's the thing. That is the thing. That is my North Star from that point forward. And I read it, and I still read it a million times, but every time I read it, it's like, prove me wrong. Prove that first. That initial feeling. Because when you go see a movie, you're watching it and you're having feelings right away. Nobody tells the audience, like, watch the movie, but don't feel a certain way about it. Watch it again and then watch it again and then see how you feel. No, fuck that. Yeah. If something's well written, you should have an initial instinct of if you're an artist, and I have. Why would I ignore.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The first thing that a script makes me feel. Feel.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's everything to me.

[A]

I agree.

[B]

And I'm like. And so. So. And I build everything off of. Off of that. And often I'll realize, like, maybe upon, you know, rehearsing it or talking to the director, that that's a couple things I was wrong about to begin with. That's fine. I can make the adjustment. But why would I ignore that first feeling that the script gave me? That's the. That's the bible for the thing.

[A]

And it's very Jim. Jim Bosley. You know what I mean? It's that energy.

[B]

Energy.

[A]

Not the whole guy. I just mean, you know what it makes Me think of is when I'm doing stand up. And sometimes I practice the self care, especially if it's been a while. I'll listen to a recording of me doing the hour, like the most recent weekend before. I'll listen to it, and that's prepping and going like, oh, yeah, that's how I sound. That's how I do it. But I know that if I prep, this is going to maybe sound insane. Insane. I'll be forfeiting the, like, raw animal. No, I know how to do this, and no one knows how to do this. And I'm gonna fucking do it however I do it. It might be the only time I do that joke in that way. But I'm. I'm an artist. I live on the edge of the knife. And there's this, like, fucking confidence that you get from not preparing. That sounds similar to going, like, sure, I could. Could put on my reading glasses and have a cup of tea, or I could down the espresso and do the fucking scene. It's the same thing. I always tie it back to sex. But it's like you get into the great lovemakings you've done. You weren't like, I'm gonna do that. I hope we do this position. No, you just. You're there. You're there and you're trusting your gut. And I think there's something David Mamet says, interesting actors are interesting people, and it's trusting. Funny people are funny people. Like Pete, you're funny. Do the joke. And maybe you'll do it in a way you have never done it before and you'll never do it again. Maybe it won't even work that well. But what's more important is claiming, putting the flag in it and going, it's what I say before I do. Stand up as I go. Whatever happens is the show.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know what I mean?

[B]

That's right.

[A]

Whatever happens is the show, not, did I do it right? You. How I did it was how it happened. Do you understand?

[B]

So this is the. So this is the thing, right? So certainly when you're playing, you are yourself on stage. So you're very much the way you are now when you're on stage. It is a heightened version of you, but it's you. Yeah. It's your writing, it's your feelings, it's your passions, it's your you. So I think you're right. Because. So the challenge becomes, though, how do you get that comfortable with a character who is not you?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Right. So that. That when you're not playing yourself, but you want to feel. You want that person to feel as lived in and. And real as you are when you're playing yourself, that. That becomes the challenge. That is the preparation to me.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, and then. And then being able to kind of like, when. So when it. But when the camera rolls to just be like, okay, now I gotta throw all that preparation out and just see what happens.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And just live on the knife's edge, like you said, and just jump and listen and play. And there is no wrong. You know what I mean? Like, there's. There's. There's certain things that need to be hit, but, you know, you got to trust that you've done them. I've done the preparation. I know what beats need to be hit. I. You know, I understand all that stuff. That. And you just trust that it'll be there. And if it isn't, take one didn't work. You got take two.

[A]

Like, that's what I'm saying, that there's an Eminem lyric that comes to mind where he goes, like, first take, no mistakes. Something. Something that's weak shit or something. I relate to that. That rawness. And I know Eminem is doing multiple takes. Every rapper is doing multiple takes. But that. That's the place you want to be in. Meaning, I was going to say, even on Sunny or whatever, there were so many things that we did that were like. That might have even been embarrassing on the day and seemed wrong. The example that came to mind is I'm the voice of the E Trade, baby. And I was shocked. I know. I was shocked at how often they would use me talking to the director in the commercial.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

Because there was something about how I would be like, oh, I see. Just, like, so natural. And they'd have the baby go, oh, I see. Like, but it was just me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I wonder if anything comes to mind like, that that was wrong. There was. There was a. I remember I did a scene with Gina Gershon, and she did something that I remember on the day, and I was a new actor. This is season one one. And I was kind of like, wow, she just went nuts. Like, the character wasn't really supposed to go nuts. And she just did this, like, almost like, childlike. And I remember, you know, we yell, cotton. I'm a comic. And so part of me is going, like, that was weird. That's what we used. And her job was to risk embarrassment.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And then that became the thing. Does anything come to mind that you did that was like embarrassing or weird or not as scripted or not intended. And then it just. Oh, no, that actually is what we're supposed to be doing.

[B]

I mean, certainly on. On Sonny that. That stuff happens all the time. But on. On BlackBerry. Yeah. There were moments there. There were moments in the film that. Where I didn't know I was on camera.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

That was just Glenn preparing for a scene like that, by the way. Like, it wasn't even Jim. It was me. I think there's this one moment when I'm sitting in the car waiting for Jay's character to come down because we're going to New York to pitch the phone or whatever, and I'm just like. And I'm just like. You know what I mean? And I'm just like, that's you steering wheel. And I'm just like, that's me getting ready. That's me getting ready for the scene. But he's found it a compelling moment for Jim getting ready for the meeting in New York. And it totally works. You know what I mean? I think there's a couple moments in there that are. Where. Where I'm not saying anything. That's where it's just. It's just Glenn, like, not realizing that they're rolling.

[A]

That's what Paul Thomas Anderson said. They wouldn't. I don't know if he's a. I don't yell action guy, but I think he would just roll. Whenever Daniel Day Lewis was on set, I don't know how much he was hyperbolizing, but he was like, oh, no. A lot of the movie was. Was Daniel would show up and would just start filming him. And I feel like that has to be true.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's. Matt did a lot of that. There's a lot of Jay's performance in there. That's. That. There's a lot of stuff that he caught, like, very. You know, again, he. He shot it like a National Geographic.

[A]

It's really an animal documentary. An argument for digital, you know, shooting it on digital.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because you can't do that on.

[B]

Yeah, you just burn through film.

[A]

Although I think Paul Thomas Anderson is doing it on film. But that's. If you have $100 million.

[B]

Right. That's Paul Thomas Anderson. There's very few people can get away with that. Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

Very, very cool. Let me see. I just feel like there was something that you brought up that I wanted to touch on, but it might be.

[B]

Well, we're talking about nicotine gum.

[A]

Ah, yeah. That's kind of boring. I remember Dr. Huberman, the Internet psychologist or whatever he is neuroscientist, was saying that nicotine is like. And I'm not even saying other people should do it. I'm just saying there are certain things that grab you, and it really grabs me. But he's like, it's like. It puts you in an ideal state to write or think because it's. It kind of simulates cardiovascular exercise.

[B]

Yeah, it does.

[A]

It's like.

[B]

That's a good way. Yeah.

[A]

He's like, you're sitting, but it's like you're going for a jog.

[B]

Yeah, it does feel that way.

[A]

And that's why Hemingway. All these guys are smoking, right? Because they're getting nicotine in their system.

[B]

Yes. We found a better delivery system that's less. Less unhealthy.

[A]

I. Yeah. I mean, based on. I did a lot of research. No, no, you can say that. I mean, anybody that takes, you know, a podcast as a doctor is a dumb. Dumb. But I did a lot of looking into it, and. And it. It's very benign from the sources that I've found.

[B]

Same.

[A]

And then I remember saying to Bill Burr, who. Your character does remind me of.

[B]

Of.

[A]

I don't mean like you were doing Bill Burr, but I'm like, no, no kind of guy.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

And although he's pretty chill, he's. He's. He's evolved, I think. Not that it's unevolved to be that. I love that. But it's like, you know, he. Last time I saw Bill, he was chill. Bill, chill. Bur.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But anyway, chill Bill is better. What was I saying? Oh, I told Bill to chew nicotine gum because he loves cigars. And I was like, why are we bringing carbon monoxide into this?

[B]

Like.

[A]

And I don't need a doctor. You know how there's that trend. Oh, cigars aren't bad because you don't inhale them. I'm like, no, you put them in your mouth, lungs.

[B]

What the.

[A]

It's not good to put smoke absorbing.

[B]

Whatever it is. Whatever compound is in your mouth.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is absorbing through your gums.

[A]

That's what your mouth is. Exactly.

[B]

That's how you're getting the nicotine.

[A]

That's right. It's all these.

[B]

You're getting all the other stuff, too.

[A]

It's all these open hands. Your mouth is just thousands of open hands. Like, what do you got, nutrition or. So you're putting smoke in. So I said to Bill, I was like, just. I thought it was you.

[B]

That's a funny image.

[A]

You can't Give Bill. He won't take it. It's like your character says when they offer him water, it's like, nah, don't never take the drink. Yeah, thirst is a sign of weakness. You know, Bill. I could see Bill saying something like that. And I was like. And I think advice is a sign of weakness. I'm not sure about that, but I was like, like, bill, you gotta just try nicotine gum. You like the way nicotine feels. By the way, a Cigar has about 300 milligrams of nicotine in it, I bet, which is like chewing. Does it actually a hundred pieces of nicotine gum? Yeah, between 100 and 300, depending on the size. It's insane. Which is why you get high if you smoke one. So all that, like, lightheaded well being and also nausea and all that stuff is because you just had way too much nicotine, Right? So I tell Bill, I'm like, just chew the gum. And in this situation, I'm like, maybe I could tell my dad something. You know, there's like, will the dad listen to the son?

[B]

What'd he say?

[A]

He goes, no, I don't just want the thing. I want the. I want the experience.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

I want to light it and smoke it. He did just. And I'm like, no, you just want the thing. Like, I feel like that's a generational. I wanted to say to him, like, if there was a gum that was alcohol, wouldn't you just chew a couple pieces? Like you want everything, right? You know, to sip whiskey.

[B]

Well, I think it depends, right?

[A]

I get both.

[B]

I get it. You want to sit and have a cigar with your, with your friends and.

[A]

Yeah, but if I was. Have a glass of water right now I look like an.

[B]

No, I think you look pretty cool. I don't know if I'd want to sit in here with you, but.

[A]

No, that. Well, that's true. Which is why a cigar is the official appendage of comedy. George Burns said this. It's like, because it's invasive, it doesn't care. A cigar is also. It's. It's the fact that it's phallic is perfect because it does everything around you. Smoking a cigar is like, no, you'll breathe my air. It goes back to shaving calluses in the pool.

[B]

Yeah. Really?

[A]

I was gonna say, but a comedian is sort of like shaving calluses in the pool. You know what I mean? There's. There's an element of, like, in my new hour, I talk about my butt and I'm like, and my butt kind of has a double chin. Like, my butt stops, and then it stops again, and the punchline is go. I don't know why I'm telling you this. I just. I just feels like it's a rush to share it with somebody, and that's kind of what it is. And that's why when standup goes badly, you're like. You're right. Why was I telling you any of that? Like, to get up on stage and be like, my daughter said a funny thing yesterday, and they're with you is the greatest thing in the world. But to me, when you don't have that connection with the crowd and you're just talking about your daughter, you're like. You get the feeling you were at a party and you talk too much.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You're like, why did I say all that? That. That's when standup goes wrong.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

For me. Have you ever seen a ghost? You seem like you haven't.

[B]

Have I ever seen a ghost?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

No.

[A]

Ufo? Nope. Anything unexplainable? You ever go to a psychic and they knew something?

[B]

Well, I had a. That's.

[A]

Go ahead.

[B]

This was probably just a. Just a dream, but fine. I had an experience a couple of times in my apartment in New York, where it seemed like I was being visited by something.

[A]

There you go.

[B]

One time in particular, I remember I was laying in my bed and I was asleep, and I felt this entity sort of enter my room. And my eyes were closed. It was like I was asleep, but I was aware of my position, and I was aware that I was asleep. Sleep. And then as it got closer, I wanted to open my eyes, but I couldn't. I couldn't open my eyes. And as it got closer, it was making this, like, humming noise. It was like. As it got closer, and I was. And I was like, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck. And I was, like, trying to open my eyes, and I couldn't. And it was just hovering over me with this, like, loud, like. And. And it was scary as shit. And finally, like, I did, like, get my eyes open, and it was still there.

[A]

What?

[B]

It was there.

[A]

What was it?

[B]

I don't know. It was just this entity. It was just this. This, like, blob. Not blob. Like a. Just a. I don't know, like a shapeless kind of entity. Black. And the noise was still there. I opened my eyes. The noise was there, and then it just went. Oh. And it was gone, like, So I opened my eyes. It was just there for a second, and then it. And Then it dissipated and the noise went away. And I was like, holy shit. Yeah, like that. That's about as close as any as I've come to anything like that. And then there was an. I had another experience in the apartment. Yeah. It happened more than once. I don't remember the other time. I just. I just remember. I just. That was the most intense one, but I just remember that that was. That it had maybe happened like, two or three times.

[A]

Very. Salem. Which trials, by the way. Yeah, that's very like. Is it A spectre visited me?

[B]

Yeah, it was a spectre. Yeah, that's what it was. It was. It was very, very real.

[A]

And the paralysis is very normal.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Okay.

[B]

So. I don't. I don't know. I mean, I. I don't know what that means. I. It could have all just simply been, you know, my brain and dreaming and all that. I mean, that's probably what it was, but.

[A]

Right.

[B]

That's the closest I've ever come to what you're asking.

[A]

I think that's pretty good.

[B]

Yeah, it was pretty cool.

[A]

That's pretty excellent.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Great sound work.

[B]

It was.

[A]

You were like the saxophone in morphine. It was excellent. And then what was the other thing that happened in your. Your apartment?

[B]

No, that was it. It was just multiple visitations of that.

[A]

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought.

[B]

But it felt like the same entity each time it happened. And I think it happened like, two or three times, but that's the one. I remember that.

[A]

And there was one. Ones where you weren't in bed?

[B]

I think so. I don't remember. Again, this was like. I mean, we're talking 25 years.

[A]

But also, when the brain can't make sense of something, it tends to discard it. It's like we impose the limitations of our finite minds on reality, even though reality isn't imposed by those.

[B]

Well. So do you believe in ghosts? Is that where you at?

[A]

Like, why did I vanish? No, it's just. I mean, it's not so much that I believe in ghosts as much as I like the types of conversations that it encourages. I like the feeling of thinking about it. But I'm more. What is your mind anyway? You know, I had that. I was on LSD once, and I was like, but these are just things I'm picturing. Like, I'm just imagining these things. And it was like, what? It doesn't make sense now, but it was like, why is it a dismissal to say it was a dream when we don't really understand the phenomenon of that which is observing the dream.

[B]

Right. Is it possible that you are connecting to something? In other words, like, that it's not just your imagination.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But it's an actual connection being made.

[A]

And even what is your imagination is like an even more perplexing question. Like if you just picture a giant banana sitting on that couch. Both. Both you and I can do that. And it's like, what. What are you doing? Like, what happened? The brain. The mind more than the brain. The mind, the phenomenon that the brain seems to be in control of or channeling, can make sounds like you can hear. Like hear a flute. You know what I mean? Now make it like kind of one of those Chinese kind of flutes or. Or make it a violin. You can manuf. Manifest sound more easily. You can manifest sight. You can close your eyes and picture the Reverend L. Sharpton. And there he is. He's not perfect, but he's there. So you see that the mind is capable of creation in two of the five senses. You can't do it with smells, really. You can kind of remember a smell. You can't really remember feeling as well. But, like, you do see the beginnings of manifestation as a phenomenon of the mind. Meaning. Spirituality is like, either we are conscious beings that are experiencing a material world, or all there is is consciousness. Meaning.

[B]

Yeah, Right.

[A]

I feel this, and I think it's here, here. But really, all that's happening is.

[B]

Is your brain is. Is making it so.

[A]

And the spiritual approach would say that's because this whole thing is one mind localizing itself. Like a dream. At night, you localize. And this is all Rupert Spira. All respect to Rupert. I get these ideas from him, but he's like, at night, you dream of a. Of London, but you can't experience London. You have to localize yourself in the dream to be a point of reference. So you can go around London, even if it's flying, even if it doesn't have a body, you have to give it a camera. Basically. You have to become a thing. So you could kind of extend that to here and say, what if there was a mind that could localize itself as millions of things? And that's. That's a fun. These are fun things to think about.

[B]

Who. Who's that author?

[A]

Rupert Spira. He's a dualist. I actually just saw. That's why I was in San Francisco. I went to a talk. He was giving, giving. And he was incredible. And he is incredible. Do you have any spiritual leanings? That's usually something we touch on on the show or another Way to put it, if you don't want to. Like, a more general way to put it is like, what do you think is going on here? Is it just kind of like a change in the dryer or.

[B]

Yeah, I don't have any idea. Yeah, I don't. But I also don't necessarily aspire to know. Not that I'm not a curious person, but I also. I guess I've come to accept that we're not meant to know. And so there's a certain surrender that I feel to that where it's like, I would never profess to be an atheist because to me, that's just as well.

[A]

That can be certain. Is that what you mean?

[B]

Yeah. The certainty of that, to me is just as ridiculous as the certainty of actually believing that your religion, your particular religion is the right one and that, you know, whoever your savior is, the only one you know, the certainty of that is absolutely fucking ridiculous to me. The ridiculousness of believing that God is like, infinite and all. Infinite and all knowing and impossible to understand. Yet we have a book that explains all of it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You don't see that. Like, people don't see the die cut, like, how ridiculous that is that you. So you've contained God into this, right? This one volume book and that. And you buy that, and. And yet God is every. Okay, it just. It doesn't make sense.

[A]

Right, right, right.

[B]

But also to say that God doesn't exist, that also doesn't make sense.

[A]

Right.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

Right?

[B]

Like, I don't know. Yeah, I don't know, and I'm okay with that.

[A]

That's a beautiful place to go. It's interesting. I don't think Glenn or Pete will know, but I would say that that in you, which does the knowing, meaning your spacious field of awareness that the part of you that would. If I say, again, this is Rupert Spiral. But if you say, are you aware? And you go, yeah, I'm aware. So that awareness that perceives and experiences, or knows, knows the experience of. Of all the changing phenomena in the world that can't know, but it is it. That's what I would say.

[B]

Well, it's. Yeah, it's similar to what Eckhart Tolle refers to as the Watcher.

[A]

Right, Right.

[B]

I think he calls it the Watcher.

[A]

He does, yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The Witness.

[B]

Is that what he calls it?

[A]

It doesn't matter. A Witness is just a watcher.

[B]

Yeah. But the fact. The fact that, you know, you can observe yourself feeling something. Right. Tells you that you're not the thing.

[A]

And that impartial witness you. That does the knowing, I think the more you explore it. And it's here right now. It's. You can I. You can recognize it and remember it even while we're talking. Is it whether or not we can have the right signpost pointing to it or not or explain it. I don't think that's correct. Meaning Glenn and Pete don't get to go along for the ride. Meaning I've had a lot of what I would consider spiritual experiences or moments of self remembering. And then when Pete comes back, the best he can do is a little volume of a book. But any of those good books would go, this isn't it. You know, this is the finger pointing to the moon. But the moon isn't. The moon is kind of interesting. We always say the finger point of the moon because the moon is so far away. But the moon is looking at your eyes right now. But. But when you get even more curious about it, Rupert has this great thing where he goes, like, there's awareness. And we. And it appears to be in house, in us. Right? In the same way that the space of this room is open, spacious, free, but it's the same space that would be in outer space.

[B]

Yeah, right.

[A]

But it appears so. We're like rooms. We're the space in the room. And we've been in the room so long, we start thinking where the walls and the floor, but you blow those away and it's. It's just one space. He would say one knowing there's only one. And when you see how impersonal that knowing is, you. You know that it's not yours. You're just sort of renting it, right? Or it's sort of momentarily appearing as you. All of this is a fun thought experiment, but the reason I'm sharing it with you, and the reason I share it most episodes is because it's not just a belief, it's actually something. On your ride home, you can just try to listen to the. Listen to morphine as that knowing presence. And. And when you are. When you. It's. It's. Again, Rupert would say it's not an efforting to remember that you're just consciousness. It's actually the relaxation of effort. You withdraw the effort to be Glenn and you rest in that simple knowing. The simple I am. And then listen to music just as that I am. Why? Or do whatever you're doing just as that I am. Why not? So you can be in the Peak Club and believe what I believe. Who fucking cares? But because you can experience this, like, causeless peace and joy. That's why I can't share it. Have you.

[B]

Have you actually experienced, like, a deep.

[A]

Like, sense of that it's not exotic. You. I bet you have, too.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He would say that when you do something you enjoy, one of the reasons you enjoy it is because when you like what you're doing, you don't resist the moment, so you surrender into it. And in that moment, the true I am shines. And this is why we're obsessed with things like food and sex, mountain biking or whatever is. Because it can kind of put us a little bit in the back seat.

[B]

Yeah, no, you. You. When you're living. When you're. When you're living in a moment of danger, you can't. You can't overthink it. You have to be totally present. Probably why you like it is. It is why I like acting. It's. It's. It's why I like acting, and it's why I like snowboarding. Those two activities. I feel like I'm not fully in control in a way that I like.

[A]

It gets Glenn out of the way.

[B]

Yeah, it gets Glenn out of the way.

[A]

And Glenn, yeah, he's not a problem, but he is a collection of memories. And what Rupert always says is, close your eyes, you don't have to do it, and just pretend it was your first moment as if you were just a baby born. And tell me about yourself. Yeah, like, what are you?

[B]

Right?

[A]

And even if you say something, and this is what he did this past weekend, and you go, like, well, I'm spacious. He goes, well, that's referring to a memory that, you know, there's spacious and there's confined, but you. You don't have any memory. So tell me about. About yourself. That's what he does to people constantly just go, what is it? You just go. Most people are just left with. It just is. I just am. And that space, and this is his whole thing. It's not exotic. It's not for the chosen few that God has elected or whatever. It's for Glenn on his drive home to just go, like, what if I just. He likens it to walking into a room you've been in a bright. Let's say you're snowboarding. It's bright. And the snow is bright, and it's bright. Then you walk into a dark room after doing that, that. And you can't see. And what do you have to do? Nothing. You just have to relax. And when we do that in the same exact way and just try to remember, not as a religion or a belief, what are you? And just settle into it. Your anxiety doesn't get to come, your fear doesn't get to come. Your identity doesn't get to come. So it can be unsettling. But with practice it becomes less like, oh, I've been this the whole time. Like when you were eight, if you remember a memory when you were a child, Fred Davis says this was there a sense of being there. Right. Like think of a childhood memory. Were you aware? So that was with you then and it's with you now. And it hasn't changed. It's neutral. Like the space in this room. Your body has changed, your feelings have changed, but all that stuff is impermanent. And spirituality is trying to drive. Draw you to the, to the constant. The. The I am that doesn't go anywhere. And that's what. It's outside of time.

[B]

It makes me want to. I don't know, my brain goes immediately to this place of like, just wanting to like, throw my phone away.

[A]

Well, because you're phone.

[B]

Because it's such a distraction.

[A]

It's like another brain.

[B]

We just don't. I don't allow myself time to just sit and be anymore, ever. The space has to be filled with something at all times, whether it's work or conversation or watching something or being on my phone or typing an email or reading an email. And it's exhausting. It's exhausting and I'm sick of it. Yeah, I'm really sick of it.

[A]

Like.

[B]

Like I was reading somewhere recently that a common symptom of ADHD is exhaustion. You know, there's so many things for our brains to ping around about and think about and just we're jumping around all over the place and I think I'm burning more calories than the average person because I'm just fucking exhausted, man. Like, I just. I went recently, I was in Montana with a couple of buddies of mine and. And we barely really even ever looked at our phones. We were just, you know, going on hikes and like playing disc golf and shooting guns and fishing and just hanging out and it was. And the air was so clean and we didn't have service a lot of places that we went to and it was just magical.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I was like, man.

[A]

I know.

[B]

And yet I feel. I do feel like I'm in control of it, but it's. It's like we're all slaves. Like, all right, I mean, maybe, maybe you're not and wonderful if you're Not. I'm.

[A]

No, no. I feel like everything you're saying. We're slave Leia's and Java is the phone.

[B]

Yeah. Jabba is my fucking email.

[A]

Well, Jabba is your brain. Again, I relate to everything. I'm not floating off my chair right now. I'm drawn to this because for those of you not watching on YouTube, but I'm drawn to this because I need it and. And because I also have. I'll just say I have adhd. I mean, like, that's. That. That seems very clear to me. And I relate to that exhaustion. And I also can enjoy my yearning, you know, that, like, life, like, I want more. I want more. It. It just has been hacked. Isn't it funny that BlackBerry is kind of the.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The precursor to, like, crackberry.

[B]

It was exactly. I mean, when. When everybody was getting blackberries and everything that everyone loved about the BlackBerry was exactly why I did not ever want a black. Which is like.

[A]

No.

[B]

But you can. You can check your email, like, wherever you go. And I'm like, that's exactly what I don't want.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

Is to be. It's to have people be able to get in touch with me everywhere I am.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And now, like, they talk about the dopamine hit that you get from, like, your phone pinging. I have the exact opposite response. Every time my phone makes a noise, I want to throw it into the ocean.

[A]

Me too.

[B]

It drives me.

[A]

Because it's asking you to change gears.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

That's add.

[B]

I'm doing something. And then my phone's like, no, me, though. And I'm like, but I'm. You could shut the up.

[A]

You won a million dollars. And I'm still mad that you texted me. Like, I hate it. Do you. Do you rock the do not disturb? That's a huge.

[B]

All the time.

[A]

Yeah. You got.

[B]

My phone is almost always on do not disturb. And, like, and my laptop is on do not disturb 100%.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

My wife can sit there and be working on a document, like, typing something. Like, working on something, and just ding, ding, ding, ding.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Ding. And she doesn't even notice it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I'm like, oh, my.

[A]

Your wife sounds like a real piece of.

[B]

No, she's, like, amazing. She can focus. She can focus even.

[A]

No, she just has a different wiring in that regard.

[B]

Yeah. I can't. I can't.

[A]

And that's good that you found that, because Val. Val. I don't know if she'd do that, but, like, to find a counterpart, find the balancing energy to Your neuroses.

[B]

She's definitely.

[A]

That is a good thing.

[B]

Technique. She is definitely that.

[A]

I think it's funny that you met your interesting. Worth talking about that you met your wife on set, right?

[B]

I did not.

[A]

Okay, well, let me tell you how you did it.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I thought she was on an episode.

[B]

She was, but we were. We were already dating at the time.

[A]

Oh, okay. Yeah, There goes that line.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I just think it's funny that people. I actually think it's beautiful that people meet people while they're working because it's like the best version. Like, it's like you're juiced. There's a lot of energy, but I get it both ways.

[B]

That is how Rob and Caitlyn met.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But yeah, no, no, my wife and I met. We had a mutual friend.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Met at a house party real quick.

[A]

Cute.

[B]

Yeah, it was pretty cute.

[A]

It's very cute.

[B]

It was.

[A]

You've been married a long time too?

[B]

Yeah, 14. 14 years. That's a long time. Yeah, we've been. We've been together for 16 years, right? 16, yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

That's great.

[A]

I'm also terrible at that. I love Val more than anything, but she'll be like, you know, we've been married. It's our seven year anniversary. And I'm like, really? It's like news to me.

[B]

How long have you guys been together?

[A]

It's been seven years. It'll be seven years since you've been.

[B]

Married or since you've been together?

[A]

I think We've been together 10 years.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And it's been seven years, Mary. But these are guesses.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'll be working. I'll be in Bloomington, Indiana, on our anniversary. And there's not. There's nothing you could say. Say that is like the most loving thing to me is that it's like I'll be telling jokes in a comedy club on my anniversary and usually am. Because if it falls on a weekend. I love that. I love that she understands.

[B]

Yeah. That.

[A]

And it's not an issue. And.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Valentine's Day and. And even birthdays, to a certain extent, birthdays are a little more special. But it's like I received that as love. That. And I also see it as add love. It's like, okay, yeah, you booked a weekend on our anniversary. I probably asked her. You know what I'm saying? I love that she lets me be. Lets me be me. And I don't have to be afraid because I've had relationships where you're afraid of the person.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And that Would never fly. I have a line in my act right now. I go, so many of my friends are afraid of their partners. They walk on eggshells. And I go, cut and run. Get out of that situation.

[B]

Definitely.

[A]

Yeah, right. Because I needed to hear that.

[B]

Definitely.

[A]

Some people don't know they're unconsciously reenacting the trauma of their past. And sometimes you need, like, our boy Jim, that energy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That just goes, you don't need this. Yeah, you don't need this. That's why I'm so drawn to it. That's why it's so moving to me when I watch that character and people like that. Sometimes you just need a cold shower. You need someone that goes like, you don't need to be in a garage making modems, and you don't need to be afraid of the girl you're dating or the woman you're dating. Cut and run.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And, you know, in my experience, most people, that's not enough. And I think that's what's frustrating to those, like, truth tellers. You go around and you go, like, you don't need that. You deserve this. And they don't do it. And that can be so disheartening to both parties. But I'm a guy that, like, if you go, pete, snap out of it. You don't need to do that. That.

[B]

Well, I do think this step one is feeling like you deserve better. Right. Because I think a lot of people don't think they do. Right. I think that that's. That's. It starts with that, right. If you. If you feel like you deserve to be happy, that you deserve to find someone where, look, all relationships are work. But, like, I had a buddy who was in the worst, most unhealthy relationship ever, and that was always his thing. He's like, well, you know, I mean, relationships are work. And I'd be like, right.

[A]

Not in a coal mine.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it shouldn't be, like, all work, all the time, constant stress.

[A]

That's a reenactment of totally somewhere in his life, maybe his childhood. Definitely. That's what it was. And you go, this is what love is. It's supposed to be painful, definitely. And we form bonds. There's these connections between suffering and love and pain and love and sacrifice and love. Love. And at a certain point, you know, I'm so fortunate I met value. Just go, oh, it can just be kind. It can be respectful.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It can be gentle. It can be silly. And I say that not to brag. I say that to Be like it can.

[B]

Yes. And, like, I'll vouch for that. I mean, my. My wife and I, you know, we deal with all the highs and lows of a. Of a marriage and a relationship and raising kids just like anyone does. But. But the majority of the time that we are together, we are happy to be in each other's presence, like I can. She is definitely my best friend. Yeah, she makes me laugh like nobody else makes me laugh. She. She brings me comfort and joy, and I like to think that I bring her those same things. And then there are times where she drives me nuts and I drive her nuts. Usually it's me driving her nuts. She doesn't usually drive me nuts. It's usually me driving her nuts in some way. And she puts up with it.

[A]

But I wonder if she even loves it, too. You know what I mean?

[B]

She does. I mean, she. She.

[A]

I don't mean she loves like she's suffering.

[B]

No, no, no. She accepts.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Dating an artist is interesting. Val says that too. She goes, Pete's 25 people a day. And she's like, I'm never bored.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. It's true. Yeah, she. She. She puts up. She puts up with a lot when it comes to that, but, you know, and I can be. I can be volatile. I'm never, you know, know, I'm never. I'm rarely ever angry or upset about anything that she does or did, or even my kids. It's usually something else, and I'm venting about it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And she's able to make space for that, which I appreciate. You know what I mean?

[A]

I love it. Because you feel safe. It's the same as a kid that throws a tantrum.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I was just playing safe. They go, that's good. It means. It means she feels safe. You did a good job.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What is it called? It doesn't matter.

[B]

I don't know. But you're right. Yeah.

[A]

It's a compliment to the parents when they go. To.

[B]

Have to go to school all day and they have to be good little boys and girls and they hold it all in and then they come home and they melt the down. And I think a lot of parents are like, why are you so nice in the world and such an asshole to me? And they're like. And you have to explain this because that's what. Because they feel safe with you. They can't be an asshole out in the world.

[A]

It's a compliment. Yeah.

[B]

It's really hard in the moment to deal with that.

[A]

No, we were just the Santa Barbara Zoo. And Leela was on her back having a full scream for a while, and I have to go. Like, it's because she knows I'm her homeboy. I got her.

[B]

I got you.

[A]

It's okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's what we tell her. I know that seems kind of like whatever it seems to be like, yeah, big feelings. But, fuck, man, I would have loved that. I think it's healthy, you know?

[B]

Wow.

[A]

I know it's healthy. Fuck past Pete. We can't repair in him. It's what I do now.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Big feelings. Feelings.

[B]

It's just that as an adult, you figured out how to channel it into your comedy, and you've. You've. You've transposed it into something. A net positive for the world.

[A]

Right, right.

[B]

All your frustrations, all your anger, all your irritations with the world, all your misophonia and, And. And all that. Yeah, you. You have figured out how to turn it into something positive for the world to give people joy and laughter and make other people who feel those same things feel seen and heard, you know, again. You know, I would also be an absolutely insufferable person had I not found comedy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Had I not found an outlet for it and a place to put it, because I would just be. Yeah. I would just be angry and irritable all the time.

[A]

Well, you were saying that to me, but that is exactly what I would say to you. And I think you're just recognizing, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's why, you know, that's true. And it's. It's. It's really wonderful. This. This is. This has been great.

[B]

Yeah, I really enjoyed this. Yeah, I like. I like. I really enjoy having these deeper, longer conversations.

[A]

I appreciate you making the time. Yeah, it's. It's. It's. It's not a small ask. And I was. I was very glad that you did it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I was sort of like. I don't know why with you in particular, it's. Maybe it's because your character is on. On Sunny. I was like, that guy won't do it. You know what I mean?

[B]

I don't. I'm so very. I mean, I'm very different from. From a lot of the characters that I've played. There's. There's a lot of me in them. You know, I think the parts of me that I actually need to exorcise.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That I don't necessarily like and don't want to act on in my real life, because, again, those are the things that's why I have trouble watching Jim Balsali sometimes, because I find his petulant. Really hard to watch because I see it in myself, of course. Whereas, like, other people enjoy watching that, you know, whereas I, But I, I have a tough time with it.

[A]

No, it's, it's incredible. And when I spot.

[B]

But when I first saw the movie.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I was like, I, I, I had dinner with the director and I was like, this, you, this is the most petulant, unlikable character. I'm like, dude, you go, we got to figure out a way to fix this. He's like, what are you talking about?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He's like, we've screened it for audiences. Your, your character's testing through the, through the roof.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I was like, why? Yeah, he's insufferable.

[A]

Yeah, no, he's not.

[B]

And they're, and he's like, he saved the day. Wrong, dude.

[A]

I told Val it's about a guy who saves a bunch of dorks with like, dad energy. And there's that line right up top where he says, you don't, the director guy says to Jay, you don't have to do what he says. He's not your dad. And I was like, that's a very deliberate. Yes, he is your dad.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And we all crave. I mean, when I see Joe Rogan being like, shut the up and eat venison or whatever it is, I see this, like, cultural craving for an involved dad. Even if it has, even if it's wrong sometimes. I'm not talking about Joe anymore. I'm just talking about like, yeah, decisive, strong jawed men.

[B]

Or, or that's why people buy, Buy. Go into trouble here. We can always cut this. But that's why people buy Trump's bullshit.

[A]

Yeah, for sure.

[B]

Because he makes, he's like, he's like, I'm in charge. I know my dad's dad. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, and, and, you know, whereas, like, I see that and I go, I, I find it repulsive. And it all feels very, you know, it doesn't feel like actual confidence. It feels like I know the exact opposite and just narcissism. A complete lack of confidence to the point like, anybody who was to talk about how great they are all the time is clearly not feeling good about themselves.

[A]

Totally. Like, it reminds me of a dad that you have bad seats at the ball game and he's like, we're gonna float. And you float down to the good seats and not only do you steal other people's seats, who didn't show up. You throw popcorn at other people and you're yelling at the players and you're lying to yourself. If there isn't part of you that goes, like, that's a safe dad, like a crazy.

[B]

He.

[A]

I've said that about Trump before. It's like he's. And, and again, I am not a fan of Trump, and that is also. But I identify the appeal as the guy that goes, we're not going to school to get today, we're going to Disney World. But then later you find out he's going to Disney World because the cops were chasing him. You know what I mean? Like, there's, you know what I mean? Like, there's the other. There's the dark side of it as well. But you can be like, you know, he's going to throw sand and he's going to kick in the ball, and you get it because it makes you.

[B]

Feel that person in your life, you could mistake that for the, for the version. For the right version of it. Whereas the, there's the, there's the right version of that, which is someone whose confidence and decisiveness is just inherent. But there's, there's also kindness and generosity and restraint. Restraint. Yeah. And not this, like, bluster, but just like a way of carrying yourself to where that confidence is automatically instilled in you because you are actually those things instead of just talking about being those things.

[A]

Right. And I think if you feel like you're in line to get a loaf of bread, like, you're in a bread, literally a bread line, and it's a really long line, and that's how you feel. You're more drawn to the guy that's the, like this. It never happened. I don't know why I'm not doing the impression, like, it was just like, you. You're drawn to that and Joe Biden, I think, and, And a lot of Democrats seem like the guy that's like, it's fine. It'll work out. And the implication is because we're not as desperate it. It seems. I don't know how the Democratic Party came this way, but it's like, don't worry, we have money or something. Don't worry, we'll throw some money at it. They're. They'll accept you. And we're eating steak at dinner. And I, I think, think again, these are all just compassion exercises. But if I'm a farmer and certain things are being relegated and I can't, whatever it is, you go for the guy that's like, I'll fart in your tuba. You know what I mean? Like, like whatever it takes. Even if I do think it is an illusion. I think it's all sort of an illusion. I think it's all sort of like, pick your, Pick your mascot.

[B]

Well, I, I, let's not go.

[A]

I, I know, I know. And by the way, I can't even back up what I'm saying. I'm just going to off of I'm not smart enough to have a deep enough political conversation.

[B]

No, neither am I, actually. I. And I, I just find Trump in particular fascinating because he reminds me of our characters on Sonny.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Interesting. I blame you. I blame Sonny.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It was those boys, Glenn. Yeah, Charlie. They made me. They made me. You watched. Then it became me. Oh, I don't do it. No, Glenn, I'm here to confront you. You. I am your first father. It's just like Return of the Jedi. Remember that?

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

I cut off your hand and I take off my mask. I got a big fat head. You made me like that. Look at me, Glenn. I'm your dad. It's always sunny in Trump Tower.

[B]

I think I would react like Luke if I found out the.

[A]

Yeah, but we do have to culturally back to full circle it. We do have to. Look, we can't scapegoat and go, this guy's a blustering this. Blah, blah, blah, blah. We have to go, where is that in me? And let's. Let's shine a light on it. And the same with every conflict, every side of every issue. It's very tempting. The ego always wants to go. You're king of the road, and I'm the good driver. When cut to me sailing over three lanes because I almost missed my exit 100. Like it was us the whole time. Glenn. It turns out it was us the whole time. Would you say, keep it crispy? It's just how we end. This was one of my favorites. Thank you for doing it. Yeah, it's. It's written in Legos behind you. But it's just. It's just how we sign off. The guest gets to sign us off by saying, keep it crispy.

[B]

And just, just. I say just that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, everybody, keep it crispy.

[A]

That was great. Wait, you're. You're on Velma. That's good voiceover. It was clean. That was clean. Very clean.

[B]

Nobody ever wants to talk about Velma.

[A]

You've made me very proud.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I love you, boy.