Michael Kosta - You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes

Summary4 min read

Podcast Summary: You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes – Episode Featuring Michael Kosta

Title: You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes
Host: Pete Holmes
Guest: Michael Kosta
Release Date: May 7, 2025
Description: Comedians delve into their unique quirks and experiences, revealing the weirdness that drives their humor.

1. Overcoming Initial Frustration and Building Rapport (04:20 - 07:17)

The episode kicks off with Pete Holmes welcoming Michael Kosta, who arrives notably late to the session. Initially, there's a brief moment of tension as Katie, presumably the show's co-host or announcer, and Michael discuss the lateness.

Katie: "I'm telling you...we love each other...a little bit of persnickety Pete at the beginning of this episode." [00:16]

Michael acknowledges the lateness and apologizes, sharing his anxiety about an upcoming audition that contributed to his tardiness.

Michael Kosta: "I just figured this out...that's all my cards." [06:11]

Pete empathizes, relating to the challenges of maintaining boundaries and managing performance anxiety.

Pete Holmes: "Enforcement is hard." [07:34]

2. Navigating Performance Anxiety and Personal Boundaries (07:17 - 15:08)

Michael delves into how external pressures, such as auditions, heighten his performance anxiety, making him more irritable and tense throughout the day. He attributes this to his age, reflecting on personal growth and the realization that managing stress is an ongoing process.

Michael Kosta: "I'm gonna be a little persnickety the whole day...I'm 46." [06:11]

Pete shares his own struggles with setting and enforcing boundaries, highlighting the importance of personal space to mitigate anxiety.

Pete Holmes: "I don't want to see anybody before the show...performance anxiety." [07:32]

3. Authentic Storytelling and Audience Connection (15:08 - 28:11)

The conversation shifts to the art of storytelling in comedy. Michael praises Pete's ability to engage authentically with the audience, contrasting it with other comedians who may deliver stories robotically. They reminisce about memorable moments with legendary comedians like Garry Shandling and Ricky James, emphasizing the significance of genuine delivery and emotional connection.

Pete Holmes: "Garry Shandling...He did a bit for one person." [08:31]

Michael Kosta: "Nobody's mad at you whatsoever. I do." [05:58]

4. Sports as a Metaphor for Life and Relationships (28:11 - 43:04)

Using tennis as a central metaphor, Pete and Michael explore how sportsmanship reflects broader life dynamics. They discuss the emotional intensity of competition, the honor in winning and losing gracefully, and how these experiences mirror personal relationships and self-understanding.

Pete Holmes: "In tennis, you clap your racket to the other person...It's a big world out there." [12:21]

Michael Kosta: "If we were teammates or enemies, underneath it all, we're just pretending." [40:37]

5. Parenting Insights and Emotional Regulation (43:04 - 55:18)

The duo delves into parenting, discussing the balance between being present and allowing children space to express themselves. They share personal anecdotes about managing children's emotions, the importance of non-verbal communication, and fostering open, trusting relationships with their kids.

Michael Kosta: "I wrote my book almost exclusively to get my parents to understand me." [23:41]

Pete Holmes: "How was school? Was the painting? Who's the teacher?" [27:36]

6. Exploring Death, Consciousness, and Human Connections (55:18 - 58:11)

The discussion takes a philosophical turn as they contemplate death as the ultimate "game clock" in life. They explore concepts of consciousness, interconnectedness, and how relationships function as microcosms of larger existential themes. The conversation touches on how acceptance and empathy play roles in understanding life's transient nature.

Michael Kosta: "Deep down, what we all are is awareness, is consciousness." [39:43]

Pete Holmes: "It's like sports...a safe place to feel." [38:28]

7. Finding Humor in Life's Challenges (58:11 - 61:51)

Pete and Michael share humorous yet poignant stories about dealing with life's unexpected challenges, such as travel mishaps and parenting hurdles. They emphasize the importance of maintaining a sense of humor and perspective even in frustrating or difficult situations.

Pete Holmes: "We kept it together, but there was some frustration...we now look back on that experience as this wonderful, beautiful travel thing." [51:32]

Michael Kosta: "Couples driven mad by situations and still find laughter in the chaos." [60:19]

8. Reflecting on Success, Forgiveness, and Authentic Relationships (61:51 - 62:12)

In the closing moments, the conversation underscores the importance of releasing the need to control others, embracing forgiveness, and fostering authentic relationships. They touch on the idea that true success lies in creating and sharing meaningful art and connections.

Pete Holmes: "Releasing is the art is the success." [57:50]

Michael Kosta: "We need to empathize and imagine for another person." [56:25]

Notable Quotes:

"Enforcement is hard." — Pete Holmes [07:34]
"In tennis, you clap your racket to the other person...It's a big world out there." — Pete Holmes [12:21]
"If we were teammates or enemies, underneath it all, we're just pretending." — Michael Kosta [40:37]
"Releasing is the art is the success." — Pete Holmes [57:50]

Conclusion:

This episode of "You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes" featuring Michael Kosta offers a deep dive into the complexities of performance anxiety, the nuanced art of comedic storytelling, the parallels between sports and life, and the profound impacts of parenting on personal growth. Through heartfelt narratives and insightful discussions, Pete and Michael illuminate the "weirdness" that fuels their comedy and shapes their lives.

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Transcript717 lines

[00:00]
Pete Holmes
You made it with. You made it with. You made it with. Oh, yeah, you made it with. Yes, you did. You made it weird with Pete Holmes.
[00:15]
Michael Kosta
What's happening, weirdos?
[00:17]
Katie
This is the incredible Michael Costa, who is a Emmy award winning chorus senior correspondent for the Daily show and, and the author of the new book Lucky Loser, which is about his life in comedy and tennis. Tennis. It's a thing. It's a wonderful book. I thoroughly enjoyed it. I actually got the audiobook. He reads it masterfully and he wrote it beautifully. So check out Lucky Loser. It's really, really wonderful. And so is this conversation. I'm gonna say you'll hear it. Cause we're not editing it out. We only had an hour and then he was running a little bit late. And then for some reason we get into it, I was like anxious about this thing I had afterwards. So I kind of like called him out for being late. And it's a little bit.
[01:03]
Michael Kosta
Well, it's a little bit weird.
[01:05]
Katie
But then like 10 minutes later, we're the best of friends and we're talking about it. And like we say in parenting, it's not that you don't make mistakes and are grumpy. It's all in the repair. So we talked about it. We love each other. We are wonderful. But you'll hear a little, a little bit of persnickety Pete at the beginning of this episode. And I'm happy to say that we did the repair very well. So we're leaving it all in. Even though I think in the episode we talk about taking it out. So check out Lucky Loser. Check out Michael Kosta on all his social platforms. And please go to peteholmes.com as I'm going to keep mentioning, this is no longer the PG13 tour. This is now called the Pete Here now tour. Because I did one show in Austin that was going to be the beginning of the PG13 Tour. I got off stage and I was like, am not. I'm not PG13. This hour is not PG13. It is normal dirty. As I like to say. It's not filthy, but it's normal dirty. So we're just calling it the Pete Here now tour. And the upcoming shows are all on my website. Toronto is coming up, Los Angeles on May 24th. Then we have Nashville, Irvine, San Jose, Houston, Royal Oak, Michigan, Washington, D.C. boston, Spokane, Washington, St. Louis, Cleveland, Homestead, Pennsylvania, Atlantic City, New Jersey. And it hasn't been announced yet, so it's not available yet. But right around that New Jersey date, I'm pretty sure we're going to be in New York, which I'm very excited. So when that is official, all of those will be on PeteHomes.com this episode is brought to us by our friends at Magic Mind. When I Fly. I'm currently in Utah shooting a movie. And guess what? I have the whole crew drinking Magic Mind. Why? Because we're trying to make something. We're trying to create something. We're trying to create something special and magical. Trying to keep our energy levels up, trying to keep our minds sharp. And Magic Mind is the perfect creator drink. It's like creator aid. Coffee. Sure, I like a little coffee, but it can get you jittery, it can get you wired, it can mess with your sleep. Magic Mind is matcha. So it's got about as much caffeine as half a cup of coffee. But it's also got nootropics earth grown, which help you focus, concentrate, think, use your brain. And it's got adaptogens like lion's mane, which help you calm down and stay regulated. So you got up with the caffeine, you got down with the. The adaptogens. Putting you right where you wanna be in the middle for that flow state. Lasts about three, four hours. In fact, I did a show while I was here in Utah. I'll drink one, six, seven o'clock at night, still go to bed. Absolutely no problem. It is not jittery. It is dialed in. It's absolutely in flow state. It's flow state in a bottle. It tastes fantastic. I absolutely love it. You got to give it a try. Go to MagicMind Co weird and use our discount code at checkout Weird. For a limited 21st order. That's MagicMind Co weird. Use discount code Weird at checkout. It is absolutely wonderful. Fights off add, fights off. Procrastination, brain fog, fatigue. You got to get it in your life. Magic Mind co Weird. So glad you're here. I love this conversation. I am a huge Michael Kosta fan and I hope you enjoy him as much as I did. Get into it.
[04:21]
Michael Kosta
This is it.
[04:21]
Pete Holmes
You did it.
[04:23]
Michael Kosta
You did it.
[04:24]
Pete Holmes
Welcome, welcome. Thanks and sorry. Sorry about the.
[04:29]
Michael Kosta
It's okay. I almost sent you a snarl. A few minutes. 20 minutes, my man.
[04:34]
Pete Holmes
Is it.
[04:34]
Michael Kosta
That's. That's not a few minutes. I'm gonna call on a few minutes.
[04:38]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. What is it? It's. It's 1228. Yes. It's late. I'm sorry.
[04:42]
Michael Kosta
We are cutting that out. Yes, you are my guest and I'm glad you're here. Start with that.
[04:48]
Pete Holmes
Thank you. Very much. Thank you. Thank you, thank you.
[04:50]
Michael Kosta
Thrilling.
[04:51]
Pete Holmes
No, it's all good. But thank. But yes, I'm happy to be here.
[04:54]
Michael Kosta
And. Well, it's also because we only have until 1:10, so this is. Will now be the shortest episode of your.
[04:59]
Pete Holmes
We can. I can go longer, but I'm not sure if you can.
[05:02]
Michael Kosta
I can't.
[05:03]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[05:03]
Michael Kosta
Told you.
[05:04]
Pete Holmes
110.
[05:04]
Michael Kosta
We're pretty. Here's two things. Your team. Yeah, I'm going to say this. Up top talent seems to never know how. And your team is fine. We got a very firm 110. We push back on that.
[05:15]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[05:15]
Michael Kosta
Nope. 110.
[05:16]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[05:17]
Michael Kosta
All right.
[05:17]
Pete Holmes
All right.
[05:17]
Michael Kosta
And we also said don't call him Mike.
[05:20]
Pete Holmes
Oh, wow. That I'm actually happy with. I can go longer if you want to go longer.
[05:27]
Michael Kosta
I love that. I appreciate it.
[05:29]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[05:29]
Michael Kosta
Unfortunately.
[05:30]
Pete Holmes
Copy that. Copy that.
[05:31]
Michael Kosta
I mean.
[05:32]
Pete Holmes
Yes. Okay. Got it.
[05:33]
Michael Kosta
I hate it. I'm sorry.
[05:34]
Pete Holmes
No, no, no, no. All good.
[05:36]
Michael Kosta
But.
[05:37]
Pete Holmes
But you know, how would you.
[05:37]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[05:38]
Pete Holmes
Tell me when you go to comedy clubs, how sometimes they hate you immediately because they've been dealing with your team, but you don't even know. You don't even know what you're going on.
[05:46]
Michael Kosta
Of course. So nobody's mad at you whatsoever. I do. I. Katie, after this, the reason I can't go longer is because I have. I'm reading for like the producer's read. Yes.
[05:59]
Pete Holmes
Nice.
[05:59]
Michael Kosta
And I just told this to Katie, but I'm putting it to you. If I'm. If I have something hanging over my head.
[06:05]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[06:05]
Michael Kosta
I'll just be a little persnickety the whole day. Like a little tight. And I swear to God, I'm 46. You're 45.
[06:12]
Pete Holmes
Correct.
[06:12]
Michael Kosta
I just. I'm telling you, I just figured this out. That, like, I had another audition. I swear we're gonna get to you. I had another audition. No, no, I had another audition and I did it at 7:00pm over Zoom. I had a show at 8:00. My show.
[06:35]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[06:36]
Michael Kosta
The first of a weekend. Big show.
[06:39]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[06:40]
Michael Kosta
And I said yes.
[06:41]
Pete Holmes
That sounds terrible to me.
[06:42]
Michael Kosta
That was one. I'm like, you ever just feel like a stranger to yourself? Like that's the ABCs of a performer. You're about to do a show.
[06:51]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[06:52]
Michael Kosta
And it was like a new hour. And I was nervous about it. I'm like, sure, I can be in my dumb hotel room setting up lights and putting on my stupid favorite shirt. Of course it went like shit. And I just figured this out. So I want you to know Two apologies. One, you're so welcome, and I'm so happy to meet you and sit down with you. Thank you for taking the time. And two, it's not a big deal at all that you were late. I'm a little tight because I have this thing.
[07:16]
Pete Holmes
Fair enough.
[07:16]
Michael Kosta
That's all my cards.
[07:17]
Pete Holmes
I got a text yesterday. I had a show at the Hollywood Improv, and it was like, pretty. Can you meet before? Can you meet before? Can meet with the four. And finally, I've gotten good at creating boundaries, but it's still hard for me to enforce.
[07:33]
Michael Kosta
Yes.
[07:33]
Pete Holmes
Enforcement is hard.
[07:34]
Michael Kosta
Anyone can take the reservation.
[07:36]
Pete Holmes
Right. I had to then say, I don't want to see anybody before the show, because I don't. I want to be in my space. But it's taken me 22 years in comedy to realize that. I think it's called performance anxiety.
[07:47]
Michael Kosta
Of course it is.
[07:48]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[07:48]
Michael Kosta
You're in Fight Flight.
[07:49]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[07:50]
Michael Kosta
And as much as I like to think that I'm Fonzie, I'm Potsy.
[07:54]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[07:55]
Michael Kosta
I think I'm cool. I'm like. I've seen other performers have a show and hold court. I'm like you. I am not like that whatsoever.
[08:04]
Pete Holmes
It's. It's because you feel that way. And because I feel that way is also why we're good at it.
[08:11]
Michael Kosta
Of course.
[08:12]
Pete Holmes
So there's that.
[08:14]
Michael Kosta
Well, that's the greatest. I say this probably every fifth episode. Seinfeld said to Shandling, they're at a party. Shandling says, when will I be comfortable at a party? And Seinfeld says, the day you are, you'll stop being funny.
[08:23]
Pete Holmes
Right?
[08:24]
Michael Kosta
So I wouldn't trade it for the world. It is hard for us.
[08:27]
Pete Holmes
Can I share with you a very funny Garry Shandling moment I had?
[08:31]
Michael Kosta
Yes, you may.
[08:32]
Pete Holmes
I was at Hermosa Beach Comedy. I tell this to everybody who will listen to me, and I know you'll appreciate it. I know you're proud.
[08:37]
Michael Kosta
I'm here for it.
[08:38]
Pete Holmes
So I loved him, loved his shows, and just grew up watching him. And I finally got to meet at Hermosa Beach Comedy Magic Club, and he's sitting next to me. We're having dinner with all the big group there, and Mike Lacy comes in, who owns the Hermosa beach, and says, gary, can I speak to you privately? And as Gary stands up to walk with Mike, he takes a steak knife and he hides it in his hand and walks out of the room as if he's going to go stab Mike Lacy, like, and no one else saw. And I just Think it is such. He did a bit for one person. And I tell it to everybody for 15 years. But what a great bit. And I've been wanting to copy it. I've been wanting to copy it, but I've never had the opportunity. But if someone says, can I speak to you privately? And then you take a knife to that meeting is. Is great. And Katie is dying over there at that story.
[09:27]
Michael Kosta
She's loving it.
[09:28]
Pete Holmes
She's loving it. It's great story.
[09:29]
Michael Kosta
I'm going to tell you this. There's a lot of people in different makes and models of cars that are dying at that story. Yeah, the sliding it. Did he slide it up?
[09:36]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, he did. Like the. What you do if you. If you're. If you. A silent assassin. And so often we meet people's comedy that we love and they don't deliver on attitude or personality as they are in life. As they are in life. And that's an example where he elevated.
[09:53]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[09:53]
Pete Holmes
I liked it even more.
[09:54]
Michael Kosta
I'm trying to remember Ricky J. Yeah. Ricky J. Is that his name? He's a magician. Ricky J. Is in the Paul Thomas Anderson movies. I think it's Ricky J. I'm 99.9. Ricky J. We got it. Ricky James. They were doing this documentary about him, and there's this magic trick. You're gonna see why I brought this up. There's this magic trick that. Imagine if I'm, you know, I'm a magician. But we have lunch, right? And we're eating lunch. And Ricky J. Did this trick. He's meeting with an interviewer. And in the middle of the lunch, he lifts up his menu and there's a block of ice like the size of a microwave on the table. And he gets up and leaves. And she said she. She wept, right? Because what. Yeah, I kind of trimmed the story. The story was the interviewer knew that that trick was Ricky's favorite trick. He sort of. So he seeded the idea that, let's say it was Houdini. Who knows who it was? But there was a classic magician that his signature trick was, you'd be having lunch, and out of nowhere.
[10:53]
Pete Holmes
That is amazing.
[10:53]
Michael Kosta
He'd produce a huge block of ice. And she said. She goes. And it was in the sun, but it wasn't yet melting. How was he keeping it cold? How was he keeping it cold, Michael?
[11:03]
Pete Holmes
I don't know. But also. And comedians do not do this, although my example of Gary Shaling is the opposite. I just said to do the. The thing, to do the trick, and then Walk away.
[11:15]
Michael Kosta
I knew what you were gonna do.
[11:16]
Pete Holmes
You know, we have to. I have to wallow in it. Yeah. Well, I did a thing that's special, and now I'm gonna take it in. It is selfless. It is selfless to do such a straight. Yeah.
[11:26]
Michael Kosta
I would stick around and go, how is it not melting 100. I'd go, where was it? How did I have that ice? I think they had already had the salad course, too. So it was like, that's.
[11:38]
Pete Holmes
That's great.
[11:39]
Michael Kosta
But then you look under the table. It's just a freezer. Just something. Right.
[11:42]
Pete Holmes
Or just like, just a big igloo cooler. Yeah.
[11:44]
Michael Kosta
Or.
[11:44]
Pete Holmes
That was a great trick. But we heard this freezer humming behind us. Let me. Let me reference sports for a second.
[11:51]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[11:52]
Pete Holmes
Okay. Steffi Graff is one of the greatest female tennis players of all time.
[11:56]
Michael Kosta
Steffi Graf.
[11:57]
Pete Holmes
Steffi Graft. German. German tennis player.
[11:59]
Michael Kosta
You got a Steffi Graft, didn't you?
[12:01]
Pete Holmes
What does that mean?
[12:02]
Michael Kosta
Your left arm. You got some Steffi Graft onto you. Please, please walk away from this bed. Please.
[12:09]
Pete Holmes
Beg you, do not respond to this.
[12:11]
Michael Kosta
Is my ice block, by the way. And then I walk away. You got a Stevie graph, didn't you?
[12:16]
Pete Holmes
Steffi Graf is married to Andre Agassi. You maybe know that name.
[12:20]
Michael Kosta
I know I had those shoes.
[12:21]
Pete Holmes
Yes. Unbelievable.
[12:22]
Michael Kosta
Great shoes.
[12:23]
Pete Holmes
So Steffi Graf was being introduced to the Internet. This is going to connect what we're saying. She was getting introduced to the International Tennis hall of Fame, and her husband, Andre Agassi, also a former world number one, was introducing her. His wife.
[12:35]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. With a dangling earring, probably. Yeah.
[12:38]
Pete Holmes
Yes. And he tells the story of playing in Rome one year and in this high hotel and looking down on top of these churches and the. They perfectly decorated the top of these churches, even though at their time there was no high rises. High enough to even see on top. But knowing that the future. That the future would recognize this excellence. And when you told me the story of the block of ice and the restraint it takes to walk away from that, I thought of Andre Agassi introducing his wife to the International Tennis hall of Fame.
[13:20]
Michael Kosta
Because of the building.
[13:21]
Pete Holmes
Because of the buildings. Correct.
[13:22]
Michael Kosta
I completely understand.
[13:23]
Pete Holmes
Isn't that cool, though?
[13:24]
Michael Kosta
I don't have that kind of. No foresight.
[13:26]
Pete Holmes
No. Imagine to spend so much time and energy knowing this isn't even for us, or maybe even for my kids, but for just future generations to maybe. Or maybe the gods.
[13:35]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. Yeah.
[13:36]
Pete Holmes
That's the other thing.
[13:37]
Michael Kosta
Well, like those. I believe it was Peruvian. The guy that doesn't know who it is. Peru maybe.
[13:43]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[13:44]
Michael Kosta
But you know they made those giant like. Like a owl or a hawk or something. And now we see them. Yeah, but they never. Them.
[13:52]
Pete Holmes
It's cool.
[13:52]
Michael Kosta
They were for UFOs, Michael.
[13:55]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[13:55]
Michael Kosta
Well, you're in the news media. What do you make of all that?
[13:59]
Pete Holmes
Of the Peruvian?
[14:01]
Michael Kosta
No, no. Of all the U. UAPs. Is that what it is? Do you have a take on UFOs?
[14:07]
Pete Holmes
Man, I don't. I. I don't get sucked in. I have had numerous people in my life who have felt that they have been contacted by. Contacted by and communicated with commun.
[14:23]
Michael Kosta
Not just a flyby.
[14:24]
Pete Holmes
You're right. No, like conversations. Numerous people through what the fucking clear.
[14:29]
Michael Kosta
Lego triangle that the girl from out of this world to her dad with.
[14:33]
Pete Holmes
I think one of them was the cell phone. I. I don't know exactly.
[14:37]
Michael Kosta
They're calling.
[14:37]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, that's. That was one of the things I heard was that they.
[14:40]
Michael Kosta
Who's this?
[14:41]
Pete Holmes
Well, I don't know. That's what I'm saying.
[14:42]
Michael Kosta
Who told you this?
[14:43]
Pete Holmes
I don't want to start revealing who I want to.
[14:46]
Michael Kosta
It was Christy, the non athletic sister, isn't it? Christy? Who's your sister's name?
[14:51]
Pete Holmes
Christy?
[14:51]
Michael Kosta
How do you.
[14:51]
Pete Holmes
Oh my God. You know my sister.
[14:53]
Michael Kosta
You.
[14:53]
Pete Holmes
Thank you for reading.
[14:54]
Michael Kosta
Deal with that.
[14:55]
Pete Holmes
That's very, very good.
[14:56]
Michael Kosta
Very good.
[14:56]
Pete Holmes
Oh, that's nice that you did that.
[14:58]
Michael Kosta
Very good.
[14:58]
Pete Holmes
Isn't it good pace you. Thank you. You have written a book as well. And isn't it wild how many press things you did where they clearly did not even open it.
[15:08]
Katie
Of course it's wow.
[15:10]
Michael Kosta
And I hosted. I mean you tell me what it's like at the Daily show, but they'll give you a copy of the book highlighted with like post itself. I thought that was the. That was the coolest I ever felt was when someone would read a book for you and be like just read the highlights.
[15:24]
Pete Holmes
Or like they eat the meal and then.
[15:26]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[15:26]
Pete Holmes
They throw it up into your mouth.
[15:27]
Michael Kosta
They throw it up like. Well, my mom was a pelican and makes sense still.
[15:33]
Pete Holmes
Yes, you do. A lot of.
[15:35]
Michael Kosta
Where people ask a question. Here's actually what I think. What is a lucky loser? It's like Jiminy Glick.
[15:41]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[15:41]
Michael Kosta
Or they go or have you ever. Look, everyone that listens to this podcast knows what I'm going to say right now. But I'm going to say it to you.
[15:47]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[15:48]
Michael Kosta
For your response. You ever do radio and you can tell by the order in which they're Asking you questions that they're reading your Wikipedia page.
[15:54]
Pete Holmes
Oh my God, the Wikipedia page.
[15:56]
Michael Kosta
I'm mine.
[15:58]
Pete Holmes
Correct. And mine said I was Greek forever, which I'm not.
[16:02]
Michael Kosta
He's not Greek, folks.
[16:03]
Pete Holmes
So then they would come in with all these loaded Greek questions and I would go, I'm sorry, I think we're referencing my Wikipedia page.
[16:10]
Michael Kosta
Do you think if we took a six week retreat, just you and me, we could write a movie that has the line, yeah, my big fat Greek dick.
[16:20]
Pete Holmes
Right?
[16:20]
Michael Kosta
It has that line.
[16:21]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[16:21]
Michael Kosta
And it's a huge line.
[16:23]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. Like people at the big cheer. Right.
[16:26]
Michael Kosta
People like.
[16:26]
Pete Holmes
But we.
[16:27]
Michael Kosta
We built the movie just for that line. Do you think it's possible?
[16:31]
Pete Holmes
I bet we could do it in less than six weeks.
[16:33]
Michael Kosta
I think we could do it. Well, we're gonna do this in Hawaii. So we take six days.
[16:37]
Pete Holmes
Got it. Okay.
[16:37]
Michael Kosta
Nail it.
[16:38]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[16:38]
Michael Kosta
Got five weeks off. Play a little grab ass. Turn the script in.
[16:44]
Pete Holmes
I want to respond to your ufo.
[16:45]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. Yeah. I. Oh, yeah. You didn't want to say who it was?
[16:48]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, I don't want to say who it was, but that's how we got down there. But I find the people who have been contacted by UFOs or whatever we're calling them are not good at convincing me.
[17:01]
Michael Kosta
I know exactly what you mean.
[17:04]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[17:04]
Michael Kosta
And there's not no worse feeling for two lovers of truth and reality.
[17:09]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[17:10]
Michael Kosta
You want them to wow you.
[17:13]
Pete Holmes
I.
[17:13]
Michael Kosta
And it's always, I'm open.
[17:14]
Pete Holmes
I'm open. I'm ready.
[17:16]
Michael Kosta
A rock of cocaine falls out of their nose or whatever it is.
[17:18]
Pete Holmes
There's just something that you go, I. I'm ready. I'm open. I'm not closed minded. I. It's a big. It's. It's. You're Mulder. I'm older. It's a big world out there and. And you're not. You're not getting me.
[17:32]
Michael Kosta
I can't tell you how many days of my life I'm. I'm almost emotional. I feel so sane that. Not in a bad way. I just feel great that you brought this up. So much of my life is talking to somebody and going like, I believe maybe that did happen to you. And I hated the way you told it. It's like everybody should be a waiter for two weeks and everybody should take like a one day course in how to tell a story.
[17:57]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. Oh my God. The story.
[17:59]
Michael Kosta
If you came to me and you had a UFO calling you.
[18:02]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[18:03]
Michael Kosta
The first line. In fact. As a comic, you'll appreciate this. Something I say on Stage all the time is I'm not lying and I'm not lying.
[18:12]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[18:12]
Michael Kosta
And I say this really happened.
[18:14]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[18:15]
Michael Kosta
Because we need it.
[18:16]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[18:17]
Michael Kosta
So many robotic, dead faced, motionless comedians. These are my people. I love them. Tell these unbelievable stories and nothing in their body, their face, their inflection, nothing says this really happened. And often it didn't, but sometimes it did. And I'm like, you had the most precious antique and all you had to do was wipe the dust off of it with a little. I know this sounds unbelievable, but it was Mikhail Gorbachev.
[18:45]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[18:46]
Michael Kosta
I don't know why he was flying coach. Like, anticipate my questions and answer them, Pete. Why would he fly southwest? Sorry.
[18:52]
Pete Holmes
One of your strengths as a comedian. I'm serious. I'm serious now as someone who's enjoyed your comedy for many years. And we did a, A, we did a show together many years at the Irvine Improv.
[19:01]
Michael Kosta
Oh, my goodness.
[19:02]
Pete Holmes
I mean, I re. I remember it was. You were doing your bit about. No, we'll tag, We'll. We'll tag ourselves in Facebook. No, we'll. We'll tell you who it.
[19:15]
Michael Kosta
Was. New.
[19:16]
Pete Holmes
Yes, yes, yes.
[19:17]
Michael Kosta
It was like, they don't need to surveil us.
[19:18]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, we'll tag our own family. Yeah, it was great.
[19:21]
Michael Kosta
So that was the big punchline. Let me tag those for you.
[19:24]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, it was great. But I, But I would say one of your strengths as a comedian, and I hope I have the same strength, but not your strength. My strength, but similar, is you are very in touch and aware of your audience in the sense where they need to know that I'm not lying right now.
[19:41]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. Yeah.
[19:41]
Pete Holmes
And what I find so frustrating with so many comics is the same thing you're saying. They're not reading the faces or the room or the vibe.
[19:50]
Michael Kosta
I'm so with you.
[19:51]
Pete Holmes
What is going on?
[19:52]
Michael Kosta
I couldn't be more excited about this. I've had a lot of conversations about comedy. I don't think I've had a lot. This one.
[19:58]
Pete Holmes
Okay, good.
[19:59]
Michael Kosta
Because, you know, let's go ahead.
[20:00]
Pete Holmes
No, I'll say you have had a lot of conversations about comments, but not this. Okay, good.
[20:04]
Michael Kosta
And I couldn't be more passionate about it. You know, like Google, not the old Google Glass, but like the new ones, the AI Glasses that they haven't even released. It doesn't matter. They all have. Or. Or a waymo. They all have. I think it's called Ludar. It's some sort of laser, I see.
[20:19]
Pete Holmes
That goes like this.
[20:20]
Michael Kosta
It shoots a laser and it's 200 yards that it can see. Wow. A lot of comics don't have. Is it called Ludar? I'm gonna sound like a Luddite. That's a bad joke. But I'm gonna sound like a dumb. Dumb. It doesn't matter. Some people have car. Like, as comics, they have cruise control, but they don't have the.
[20:36]
Pete Holmes
Come on.
[20:37]
Michael Kosta
The constant checking of, like.
[20:39]
Pete Holmes
I like that.
[20:41]
Michael Kosta
I know. You know, the. The crowd makes a gelatinous frequency when they don't believe you or when you've been too rough with them. And it's. It's a hyper Vigilant. Hypersensitivity thing.
[20:56]
Pete Holmes
Vigilant is a good word.
[20:57]
Michael Kosta
Yes.
[20:58]
Pete Holmes
But I also fall into a trap where then yesterday somebody made a noise. I was being hyper vigilant. And then had felt like I had to stop the show and address the noise when I should have. If I didn't have good Ludar, which we still don't know if that's the word.
[21:13]
Michael Kosta
That's it. We don't know.
[21:15]
Pete Holmes
I just would have ignored that. Like, is what I should have done. Because then I halted the whole deal and talked about the thing, and the woman was like. It was just a small noise. And you're like. You're right. But now I've stopped everything.
[21:23]
Michael Kosta
I. Well, Caperland, who is, I think, a genius. She has this as well.
[21:28]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[21:28]
Michael Kosta
And I've watched her, you know, she has lidar. She has.
[21:31]
Pete Holmes
Okay, we don't even know if it is ladder. Why were my glasses right there?
[21:38]
Michael Kosta
But I liked it. Yeah, but I've seen her. Meaning it's easy to diagnose in others. Like, she should have let that go.
[21:44]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[21:44]
Michael Kosta
And then 99 of the time, when my wife. Well, she comes with me. Most Largos. I'll come off stage and he'll go, no one knew what you were talking about.
[21:53]
Pete Holmes
This is our. This. I know.
[21:54]
Michael Kosta
It's across the bear.
[21:56]
Pete Holmes
It is. It is. And usually it almost always has to do with some fear or anxiety. That's here.
[22:03]
Michael Kosta
Totally.
[22:04]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[22:04]
Michael Kosta
Well, if you got. I wrote that down.
[22:06]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[22:07]
Michael Kosta
I listened.
[22:07]
Pete Holmes
Oh, you wrote stuff down, Pete, that's so professional and nice.
[22:11]
Michael Kosta
You think I don't know how to play conversation tennis? You don't know what I'm talking about. The book is called the. Wait, Sorry.
[22:19]
Pete Holmes
Lucky loser.
[22:19]
Michael Kosta
I was gonna say the winningest loser.
[22:21]
Pete Holmes
Oh, I like that, too. That's the second lucky loser.
[22:24]
Michael Kosta
Lucky loser. And am I correct? It's a slight wink to Lucky Louie.
[22:28]
Pete Holmes
Correct. Correct. That. That was the. Correct. The worst interviewer no, but there is there Lucky losers is a 10 is a tennis. It's a tennis term.
[22:37]
Michael Kosta
It's a tennis term. It's for the getting into a tournament.
[22:39]
Pete Holmes
Even though you didn't qualify by losing.
[22:41]
Michael Kosta
Because someone else dropped out.
[22:42]
Pete Holmes
You sports. There's our clip. We got our clip. We got our clip. We got our clip. Phew. God. I always do these pods and I'm.
[22:52]
Michael Kosta
Like, we got our clip.
[22:55]
Pete Holmes
Okay, we got a clip.
[22:56]
Michael Kosta
And then sometimes Joe doesn't clip it. And I'm like, that was that. I'm just kidding. He always gets it. What were we saying?
[23:02]
Pete Holmes
Lucky loser.
[23:03]
Michael Kosta
Lucky loser. But one clickback.
[23:04]
Pete Holmes
I don't know.
[23:05]
Michael Kosta
I said, I know. Conversation, tennis. We're talking about comics.
[23:08]
Pete Holmes
Kate Berlance.
[23:09]
Michael Kosta
L. Kate Berlance. Ludar Letting things cross. Bear let things go. Hyper vigilance. I wrote it down. Remember? I wrote it down and you said you wrote things down.
[23:23]
Pete Holmes
We did it.
[23:23]
Michael Kosta
This is what I wrote down. Something that I realized. You mentioned my book. And this is actually. This is pretty a sensitive subject for me. I'm bringing it up. I'm happy to talk about it. I46 now look back and I'm like, I wrote my book almost exclusively to get my parents to understand me.
[23:42]
Pete Holmes
Oh, interesting.
[23:42]
Michael Kosta
My whole life trying to get my parents to understand.
[23:44]
Pete Holmes
That's a very poignant. Right Statement.
[23:47]
Michael Kosta
But then you say in your book, and this made me think we might have this in common. You were like, I got into stand up because you say, I want attention from my parents. I'm going one click more vulnerable, maybe one click more sad. Not saying that.
[23:59]
Pete Holmes
Okay, this is you. I'm with you.
[24:01]
Michael Kosta
I'm saying actually to just like to know me. So when I'm being hyper, Kate Berlant. It's because I'm like the A bomb for me is we didn't understand each other. And then my child self will interpret that as I am unsafe. I'm actually in danger. I'm gonna die. I'm gonna vanish. So like, I hear a sound and I'm like, nobody's leaving this show thinking I didn't hear that sound.
[24:27]
Pete Holmes
Right? When you're like, interesting.
[24:28]
Michael Kosta
Slow down. Sometimes the Hulk just needs to eat a. A sandwich.
[24:32]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[24:32]
Michael Kosta
You know what I mean? Like, just slow down and eat a sandwich. Tell me what you got.
[24:36]
Pete Holmes
Your understanding of yourself is really important to know that. And I think one similar to you. I am still figuring out if I, Michael, need more attention and affection from mom and dad because I do or.
[24:56]
Michael Kosta
I grew up in siblings or just Other.
[24:58]
Pete Holmes
Other people in the whole world.
[24:59]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, yeah.
[25:00]
Pete Holmes
You know, I don't know. Also, you know, anyone that does stand up, there is some delusion we have or necessary need for public attention, affection, acceptance, I don't know.
[25:11]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[25:11]
Pete Holmes
Or did I grow up in a home with three other kids and it was a busy home. And that's just a healthy reaction, a normal reaction to, hey, I want mom and dad to pay more attention to.
[25:22]
Michael Kosta
Right, right, right.
[25:23]
Pete Holmes
And now am I doting on my own children too much? Because that's what I wanted and what fucked up thing am I doing to them?
[25:31]
Michael Kosta
Right. I think.
[25:33]
Pete Holmes
What's their book going to be called? Winningest Losers.
[25:36]
Michael Kosta
We got it from a podcast. They asked AI to listen to every podcast you were ever on, right. And say like, give me. And they were like, well. And they're like, I don't need to know why, just tell me the title.
[25:45]
Pete Holmes
Right, Winston.
[25:47]
Michael Kosta
And then they go, please write the book for me. And then it's out. I had something in my.
[25:52]
Pete Holmes
There's a lot to unpack. What I just said.
[25:54]
Michael Kosta
I know.
[25:54]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[25:54]
Michael Kosta
I mean, my daughter sometimes goes, not in a bad way, but she. I'll be looking at her like lovingly, which is exactly what I've always wanted. Is just like a quiet beholding, they call it. There's actually terms in therapy for it. It's like the gaze of the father. G A Z, E, obviously.
[26:11]
Pete Holmes
Oh, that's so interesting.
[26:12]
Michael Kosta
Like, just like a. A spacious sort of like. Like imagine if you're about to play tennis and your dad. It sounds like your dad did do stuff like this, but if he was just like.
[26:21]
Pete Holmes
But gaze of the father is one of acceptance and acknowledgment.
[26:24]
Michael Kosta
Just like a quiet allowance of you. Meaning the dad, meaning me. I stop insisting my own identity. So much so that I actually become inverted and I'm only like. Like some sort of neutron thing. Something in science that holds a neutral right. It's the most. And I become a neutron holder for my daughter. And I do it so often, I don't do it it on purpose, but I'll just be looking at her and just like amazed.
[26:52]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[26:52]
Michael Kosta
And she'll be like, what? Like, you know what I mean? So am I doing it too much? Probably.
[26:59]
Pete Holmes
I just came from a friend's place and he was. Has teenage girls and he said that his strategy because all he wants to do is go, are you being bullied? Who's hurting you? How can I protect you? How's school? What's your math test? How'd you do? Is he. He picks him up. Up. They sit in the car and he doesn't say anything. And they see him, they feel him. And then he says, then they open up.
[27:22]
Michael Kosta
Open up.
[27:22]
Pete Holmes
And I go, that is not how I parent. I do not wait. I mean, my kid's five, but I'm like, how was school? Was the painting? Who's the. What's the teacher? And it's like, hey, man, just make. You know, maybe she needs to see you and feel you and then she'll talk.
[27:37]
Michael Kosta
I think that's lovely. And. And also, if your baby is five, I. I think it's not too. My wife and I talk about this all the time.
[27:43]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[27:44]
Michael Kosta
Like, it's not set in stone yet. In fact, just last night we were like, I think we need to stop constantly talking.
[27:52]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[27:52]
Michael Kosta
She isn't only. So we're like, yeah, right.
[27:55]
Pete Holmes
Like, four eyes are on.
[27:57]
Michael Kosta
Can't have two butlers. And like, everyone's trying to behold. And so there is time. In fact, it becomes very precious time where we're just hanging out and I'm really purposefully not saying anything. And that is when she'll be like, God, that's hard.
[28:12]
Pete Holmes
Why is that hard? I'm just kidding. Yeah, but. But we have to leave space for our children to tell us that they saw a dead body in the woods.
[28:23]
Michael Kosta
I know. You know, otherwise. Well, you're. You're picking up on it.
[28:26]
Pete Holmes
I've never said that sentence in my life.
[28:28]
Michael Kosta
Look, if they see a dead body, they're not gonna. When you say, how was your day?
[28:32]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[28:32]
Michael Kosta
The hope is that they'd say, I saw a dead body.
[28:34]
Pete Holmes
I saw a dead body.
[28:35]
Michael Kosta
But the truth is, they might not be sure if it's. When do you bring that up? It's kind of a buzzkill.
[28:40]
Pete Holmes
I remember watching Stand by me as a kid, and I never understood.
[28:43]
Michael Kosta
Brought that to mind.
[28:44]
Pete Holmes
I never understood why it was so important for them to go see this body.
[28:47]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[28:47]
Pete Holmes
Isn't that what the whole driving force of the film was?
[28:49]
Michael Kosta
Let's go see the body.
[28:50]
Pete Holmes
And then I went to a funeral, you know, as a. And saw a body. And I said, it is something that to behold. To behold. It is something to look at.
[29:01]
Michael Kosta
But imagine that body, look in the woods. Bloated, right. Not fixed up.
[29:09]
Pete Holmes
And you get to do a trip with your buddies to go do it.
[29:11]
Michael Kosta
If you told me if, like, if River Phoenix. It's River Phoenix.
[29:15]
Pete Holmes
I think so.
[29:16]
Michael Kosta
And like Corey Feldman.
[29:18]
Pete Holmes
Feldman.
[29:19]
Michael Kosta
If those boys that age saw me in 2025 and were like there's a body in the woods. I'd go with them.
[29:25]
Pete Holmes
That would, that would be a great.
[29:26]
Michael Kosta
It'd be insane story to tell. Insane.
[29:29]
Pete Holmes
I mean, Pete Holmes, River Phoenix and Corey Feldman. But yes, the body. Yeah, that's.
[29:37]
Michael Kosta
But I mean, did Everybody we see is so cleaned up.
[29:39]
Pete Holmes
Did your, did your parents read your book? Is that, Is that, Is it. Is it loaded? Should I ask you?
[29:46]
Michael Kosta
Because they said they did, but I. I can't be sure.
[29:50]
Pete Holmes
Okay. And I don't have to answer. That's a personal question.
[29:52]
Michael Kosta
I feel really considered that you asked.
[29:55]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[29:56]
Michael Kosta
I think they read maybe the beginning and then when it stopped being about them, this is my guess is that they might have fallen off.
[30:03]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[30:03]
Michael Kosta
My mom might have read all of it.
[30:05]
Katie
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[33:19]
Michael Kosta
But this is actually I again, 46. And I'm just going like, I need to stop wanting them to be something that they're not. And that's. I mean, I'm shooting a movie and I have to cry. And that's something I wrote down to think about when I have to cry in this movie because it's, it's really, it's really hard. And I did this therapy session where I was like surrendering this hope, me and my child self being like, I got you. We don't need that. Let's stop.
[33:50]
Katie
And.
[33:50]
Michael Kosta
And it was like, thank you for sharing that. Yeah, of course. It's hard, right? Well, go ahead.
[33:56]
Pete Holmes
It is hard to surrender that you cannot change people, or they may not give you what you want. What you want, what you.
[34:08]
Michael Kosta
What you think you need.
[34:09]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's hard.
[34:11]
Michael Kosta
What. Who in your family. You don't have to. Is it dad?
[34:16]
Pete Holmes
What? That is.
[34:18]
Michael Kosta
When you dedicated your book to your dad. Yeah. I was like, here we go.
[34:21]
Pete Holmes
Here we go. Here's the. Here's the good stuff. My father passed in the writing of this book.
[34:27]
Michael Kosta
Oh, wow.
[34:28]
Pete Holmes
So.
[34:28]
Michael Kosta
Oh, my God.
[34:29]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. Yeah. So it just felt. Michael, that's okay. It felt very. It felt very appropriate. And I love this picture of my dad and I shaking hands. It's not printed very well, but take.
[34:42]
Michael Kosta
That, Simon Harper Collins. Let me see.
[34:48]
Pete Holmes
There's this beautiful moment in tennis, Pete. And I don't know how much you know or care about. Okay. Yeah, exactly. But you're going to battle with this person, and you're doing everything you can't. Thank you for that. You're doing everything you can to trick them. You're doing everything you can to defeat them. You're doing everything within the rules to belittle them, to humiliate them. You know? And then there's my favorite part of all sport, but in particular tennis, because it's so personal and there's no other teammates to hide behind or masks or is. Is you. You approach each other and you. And you look each other in the eye and you shake hands.
[35:25]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[35:26]
Pete Holmes
And hockey is the closest where they will kick each other's asses and then go, hey, man, good fight. You know, it's like, I freaking love that.
[35:33]
Michael Kosta
I wrote about this in my book.
[35:34]
Pete Holmes
You did.
[35:34]
Michael Kosta
Somebody plays for the Red Sox for the most of their career, gets traded to the Yankees.
[35:39]
Pete Holmes
Outrageous.
[35:40]
Michael Kosta
But then they come back to Fenway, Everyone gives them a standing ovation. That's the handshake of thousands of people at once.
[35:46]
Pete Holmes
That type of silly thing makes me cry.
[35:48]
Michael Kosta
Can't handle it.
[35:49]
Pete Holmes
One time I was at Dodger Stadium, which is right behind this studio right here. That's why I'm pointing to it this way. And one of the players on one of the teams was traded that afternoon to the team they were playing the same day. This is crazy.
[36:03]
Michael Kosta
Yes.
[36:03]
Pete Holmes
So. And. And no joke. And this will be.
[36:05]
Michael Kosta
He just walked across.
[36:06]
Pete Holmes
Dude. No joke. Someone can find this on the Internet. When the inning was over, the first inning, he ran to the wrong dugout because for 15 years he'd been running to the Dodgers dugout, and he was on the other team. Anyway, so when I found this picture of my father and I shaking hands at the net, it was like, oh, man, I can't.
[36:24]
Michael Kosta
You've, you're very good at conversation. Tennis, my man. Well, good, Good, Mom.
[36:29]
Pete Holmes
That is what. That was what my mom taught us.
[36:32]
Michael Kosta
It's beautiful because you've really, like, five times now touched on something that I'm like, That's like my number one thing. Like, my number one thing. Even though I don't play sports, I love sports. Movies. Who cares? I'm just.
[36:46]
Pete Holmes
No, I want to talk about that actually, too.
[36:47]
Michael Kosta
I can get in touch with sports. I just. Because I was never good at it. I was like, this isn't paying out. I'm going to walk away. But, but when it comes to people transcending. So sports, and I'm going to put this to you, is like, let's, let's play a game. Just like reality, obviously, but you and I are playing a game, and there's dynamics and there's rules and all this other stuff, but we're going to be like, it's going to, we're going to accordion it down, and we're going to live a whole life in three periods or four quarters. It's going to be the whole life of this thing. And we're gonna be mad at each other, and we're gonna be angry and we're gonna cry and all this stuff. And at the end, there'll be this little twinkle in your eye, like all of this was pretend. All of this was. We did this for each other.
[37:39]
Pete Holmes
I, I, I resonate with that wholeheartedly.
[37:43]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[37:44]
Pete Holmes
And the beauty, in my opinion, is all of those words you mentioned, we're gonna. You didn't say love. I'll add love. Because sometimes in a competition, you do look to your opponent with, with admiration and vice versa.
[37:58]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[37:58]
Pete Holmes
In tennis, you, you clap your racket to the other person, they hit a good shot, and you go, hey, you know what, man? I hate you, and I'm trying to kill you. But good shot. All of those words you said were life in real words. But the trick of sport is it's not real stakes. That's the, that's the beauty.
[38:13]
Michael Kosta
Right?
[38:14]
Pete Holmes
No one's made up. It's made up. It's a game we've made. It's a play. They draw lines.
[38:18]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[38:18]
Pete Holmes
Just like my daughter draws lines in this. I mean, that's what a line is.
[38:21]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. This space and in this space, you're my opponent. But it gives you this, like, safe place to feel. All right. Feelings.
[38:29]
Pete Holmes
I think it's so funny that there's lines on a court. We drew lines. It's so game. It's so gamey. It's so childlike.
[38:38]
Michael Kosta
You mean like a board game?
[38:39]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, like a board game. Like a sandbox.
[38:42]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[38:42]
Pete Holmes
I mean, I. You know, it's a. It's silly. It's silly.
[38:46]
Michael Kosta
It is silly.
[38:47]
Pete Holmes
Much like borders are silly.
[38:49]
Michael Kosta
Right.
[38:49]
Pete Holmes
Someone did that. And now that's. This.
[38:51]
Michael Kosta
And this is a great piece you did. The Great Britain was like, now there's two Irelands. It was an island.
[38:57]
Pete Holmes
Was that my bit?
[38:58]
Michael Kosta
Was it your bit?
[38:59]
Pete Holmes
Oh, my God.
[38:59]
Michael Kosta
You did that about. You were talking about Palestine. So what else. What else do you have to say?
[39:07]
Pete Holmes
Just kidding.
[39:08]
Michael Kosta
But it was. It was your Israel, Palestine segment when you guest hosted.
[39:12]
Pete Holmes
Correct? Yep, Correct. Thank you for. For. Wow.
[39:16]
Michael Kosta
You feel researched, my man.
[39:17]
Pete Holmes
You did do your research.
[39:19]
Michael Kosta
Feel researched.
[39:20]
Pete Holmes
That's very nice of you. Thank you.
[39:22]
Michael Kosta
I would say I don't want to force this, but I'm gonna lob it to you.
[39:26]
Pete Holmes
Nice.
[39:27]
Michael Kosta
I actually think I would have said that even if it wasn't you.
[39:29]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. Which makes you think. Was it vernacular first?
[39:33]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[39:34]
Pete Holmes
Tennis took it, or was it tennis?
[39:36]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. Is it like. Oh, that was, like, when you lob. So, yeah, I think it was tennis.
[39:40]
Pete Holmes
It's gotta be tennis first. It feels. Tennis first.
[39:42]
Michael Kosta
Feels tennis.
[39:43]
Pete Holmes
Yes. Yeah.
[39:43]
Michael Kosta
But the reason I like it and feel free, and I trust you to disagree with me. I think deep down, what we all are is awareness, is consciousness. And consciousness takes these different forms, but deep down, it's the same consciousness that's in me, that's in you. And it's one thing, it's one knowing, but it's playing this game. It's like sports.
[40:10]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[40:10]
Michael Kosta
It's like, I'll be in life. Let's say I'll be your teammate. We're both comedians. I'm your teammate. We're allies.
[40:19]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[40:19]
Michael Kosta
If you and I were at a wedding and there were no comedians there, oh, man. We would go right for each other.
[40:23]
Pete Holmes
Correct.
[40:23]
Michael Kosta
Like your great line in your book, if I saw a tennis racket and a dog, I'd be good. Those are your allies. Yes. Comics, too. I think we're drawn towards each other. But, like, I also might be your enemy. I might, like, blackmail you, or I just listen to something about black.
[40:38]
Pete Holmes
Right, Right.
[40:39]
Michael Kosta
Or, you know, I steal something from you or. Or whatever it is, but underneath it all you know, I'm just pretending to be a Yankee and you're just pretending to be a Red Sox. And I think without talking about. I like talking about it and ruining it. But the reason why we're all so emotional, when Johnny Damon takes his hat off at Fenway, even though he's a Yankee, we go like, we're all the same. We're all the same. And you can say that we're all consciousness. We can just say we're all in this together is a more human way to say it, right?
[41:09]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. It is wild how it strikes these emotions. And what's interesting about your metaphor or analogy, I'm not sure which one it was, is that in life, the game clock, it's when it's zero, is death.
[41:24]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[41:25]
Pete Holmes
And how important is death, man? We have to have death, buddy.
[41:29]
Michael Kosta
I can't believe we have listened to this podcast because I often. Don't answer that.
[41:33]
Pete Holmes
I've listened. I listened to your. The. The last one, which I loved. The. The. The J. Jesse.
[41:39]
Michael Kosta
Oh, Jesse Fox.
[41:40]
Pete Holmes
So great you got. And it was. It was a bummer that. That you guys could have talked comedy for four hours.
[41:46]
Michael Kosta
I know. And it was the only day in my life.
[41:49]
Pete Holmes
And that made me laugh. It also made me think of the. Of. Of. It made me laugh with the. The Conan O'Brien, Rory Scoville and John Doerr double booking comedy bit. That made me think of that.
[42:01]
Michael Kosta
One of the best late night things.
[42:03]
Pete Holmes
That was just so funny simultaneously. But yeah, yeah, you guys touched on death a little bit. And it connected with. It connected with me. And I remember this childish book we read in elementary school called Tuck Everlasting. And somehow Tuck drank from the fountain of whatever Everlasting and never died. And it was the first time in my life that I learned and kind of everything that he loved died around him. The dog, the family. But you don't want to live forever.
[42:37]
Michael Kosta
That's a dark book.
[42:38]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. For. Especially for first graders. I know. No, it wasn't first graders. It was like. I forget what it was. But yeah, later, later.
[42:43]
Michael Kosta
A little bit later. No, this is the Curse of the Vampire. Christian Finnegan, I always think of Christian Finnegan had this bit where he's like, why are vampires going out? Oh. He goes, why do they live in castles? And then he's like, well, they live forever. So a few prudent investments, it pays off.
[42:59]
Pete Holmes
You can let. You can let the market come to you after 150 years. Yeah. Yeah. That's great.
[43:03]
Michael Kosta
What a great bet.
[43:04]
Pete Holmes
That's a good bet.
[43:04]
Michael Kosta
Christian Finnegan.com I don't know why I'm doing that, but yeah. He's so funny. Anyway, I was saying, I've said before that death is like the clock on the game and what makes it so fun and what makes sports resonate and be relevant throughout. Again. See, I love sports even though I don't watch them or play them. But it's a great metaphor for life.
[43:29]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[43:30]
Michael Kosta
And we love sportsmanship because sportsmanship is transcending or having some sort of cap on your emotion that you can be so mad at your opponent, so tough and clap for them is incredible. That's the whole thing.
[43:43]
Pete Holmes
That's my. The thing I get most impressed by now.
[43:48]
Michael Kosta
Yes.
[43:49]
Pete Holmes
Is sportsmanship. I. I couldn't agree more. I cannot fathom with the stakes. Even though there's no real stakes. Money, winning, pride, fame, effort, devotion to the sport. That then people will lose with class. I can't believe it.
[44:05]
Michael Kosta
It's literally. We sound like, I don't know, we sound like two dignitaries. Like we should be wearing powdered wigs.
[44:10]
Pete Holmes
Correct.
[44:10]
Michael Kosta
Because this sounds like an old timey conversation. Like, like nothing more than the class of a good sportsman.
[44:16]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[44:16]
Michael Kosta
But it's true. And listen to what I was about to say. I should be in a top coat. It's like. It is what separates us from the animal.
[44:24]
Pete Holmes
It is. It is.
[44:25]
Michael Kosta
There are no two animals.
[44:27]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[44:27]
Michael Kosta
I mean literal animals.
[44:29]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[44:29]
Michael Kosta
That will fight like boxers.
[44:31]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[44:31]
Michael Kosta
And then when a bell rings, we'll stop.
[44:33]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, exactly. And go like, nice fight.
[44:36]
Michael Kosta
Good fight. Like a wolverine claw across the face and be like, like, you know what you've been practicing.
[44:41]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[44:42]
Michael Kosta
That's why I love seeing opponents hanging out like anytime. They're like classic rivalries. And it's like. Did you like McEnroe and his arrival with Bjorn Borg? But they were friends. I think. All I know is McEnroe had a friend and they made each other better.
[44:57]
Pete Holmes
Bjorn Bork.
[44:58]
Michael Kosta
Okay. That's for sure.
[44:59]
Pete Holmes
The Swede.
[45:00]
Michael Kosta
It's like we need those relationships. I was also going to put this to you is like when you're playing another fantastic tennis player.
[45:09]
Katie
Maybe 1% of.
[45:10]
Michael Kosta
The audience, audience, crowd knows why the other player might be better. Like, what I'm saying is it's like mathematicians. It's like Good Will Hunting. He's like the difference between me and you, only I know it.
[45:23]
Pete Holmes
Correct.
[45:23]
Michael Kosta
I'm the only one who knows that you're a genius. But you have to be a genius to know what a genius you are. So you must be like, not only do I love this person, but this person actually defines me.
[45:34]
Pete Holmes
Well. And that's why you start to kind of hate the sport when you're in it so much, because it takes over your life. But then as you get older and I'm 45 years old, you're 46 now. When I go to a party and I find someone plays tennis, it's like, boom, locked in. We know each other's.
[45:54]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[45:55]
Pete Holmes
Comedy's very similar. I mean, this is what I love about late night in that. That only so many people can, like, talk to you about the late night writers room. You obviously can, but it's like, oh, it's. I'm not even saying anyone's better than anybody. It's just we've all had that one singular experience that is very small and specific.
[46:13]
Michael Kosta
That's right. When I was doing my talk show, I had a meeting with Seth Meyers, and I swear to you, I'm not just changing this revisionist history, but he was like, we're in a really interesting group, like you and I are in. This group of people had late night shows. And I remember thinking, I was like, it's not the same. Like, I'm doing this little dinky. I wasn't putting myself down. But he's still on the air.
[46:36]
Pete Holmes
I know, but I.
[46:38]
Michael Kosta
He's been doing it for a decade longer. Yeah.
[46:40]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, probably. I mean, I like that though.
[46:42]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[46:43]
Pete Holmes
And I agree with him.
[46:44]
Michael Kosta
It was nice to step it out.
[46:45]
Pete Holmes
And it is cool when you see, like the pictures of like, Jay Leno and David Letterman hanging out or whatever. It's like, okay, they're at least have a similar experience. Yes, I agree.
[46:55]
Michael Kosta
Yes, I agree. Yeah, I'm sure. Well, I can't speak to Conan if he, like, really had an animosity towards Jay, but I have to think that even if he did, at the end of the game, we all take our hats off and we're Johnny Damon and we cheer. Like you can see.
[47:09]
Pete Holmes
That's so. That's such an interesting question.
[47:11]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, I. I couldn't.
[47:12]
Pete Holmes
Wow, what a wild situation that was.
[47:15]
Michael Kosta
I know.
[47:15]
Pete Holmes
Remember, that was a while. And I think I was. Yeah, I was here in la. I talked about a little bit of that situation in the book.
[47:21]
Michael Kosta
Oh, really?
[47:21]
Pete Holmes
Because that situation behooved me because Jay got the Tonight show back, which a lot of the comedy industry was frustrated with.
[47:35]
Michael Kosta
Yep.
[47:36]
Pete Holmes
But then I had a relationship with Jay's bookers, and so then they offered me the Tonight show, which was a wild situation. That I said yes to. And I'm very stand up on it to do stand up on it. I'm very thankful I did. But there was a part of me thinking, seven months ago, this was Conan's Tonight Show.
[47:50]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[47:51]
Pete Holmes
And it's like, I needed a break. We all need a break. And I was thankful for it. But what a wild time.
[47:56]
Michael Kosta
Well, I actually remember. I don't think Team Conan liked this. Right. It's all imagining.
[48:04]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[48:05]
Michael Kosta
But Seinfeld was like, the whole thing with show business is you stay. Like, if you get something, you stay.
[48:11]
Pete Holmes
Oh.
[48:11]
Michael Kosta
So he would agree with what you.
[48:12]
Pete Holmes
Just what I just said.
[48:13]
Michael Kosta
And there is a logic to it.
[48:16]
Pete Holmes
Does Seinfeld say that?
[48:17]
Michael Kosta
He sort of, in my mind, famously said that Conan should have taken the 12 o'clock tonight show. Like, this whole idea of, like, it's not the Tonight show if it's on at 12. He's like. Seinfeld was like, once you get the gig, keep it.
[48:34]
Pete Holmes
But that's not how he says it. He says it like, if you have.
[48:37]
Michael Kosta
A gig, you gotta keep it.
[48:40]
Pete Holmes
That's how I wanted. That's what I wanted. That's what I wanted.
[48:44]
Michael Kosta
Don't walk away from the gig.
[48:46]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. Fun.
[48:47]
Michael Kosta
It's fun, though.
[48:48]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. I don't know. I, I, I remember wholeheartedly Conan sending the letter out.
[48:55]
Michael Kosta
Yep.
[48:56]
Pete Holmes
Earthling. Dear Earthlings. And I just thought that was so respectful and cool and good sportsman. Good sportsman.
[49:01]
Michael Kosta
But see, at the end of the day, that's tough, though. But at the end of the day, what we're talking about, Leno and Conan backstage. I mean, like, I'm picturing it in, like, heaven. Like a classic child's understanding of heaven. They hug each other.
[49:17]
Pete Holmes
I think so.
[49:18]
Michael Kosta
They go, I really fucked you. Or you really tried to fuck me, or whatever it is. What a game. It's like the worst days of our lives are like. David Mamet wrote this really great essay about the perfect baseball game. I think about it all the time. It's basically, home team is winning, home team is losing. Home team is losing. Way beyond hope. Home team comes back. It's every movie.
[49:42]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[49:44]
Michael Kosta
So, too, with our lives, we want it when your car breaks down or whatever it is. Like, I think about it every time I drive home from the airport. Val and I hit a pothole and it turned into this really sweet little inconvenient adventure where it was raining, but we were laughing about it. And I was like, yeah, home team down.
[50:05]
Pete Holmes
That's really good. That. Were you laughing in the moment.
[50:08]
Michael Kosta
We can do that now.
[50:09]
Pete Holmes
Okay. Because.
[50:10]
Michael Kosta
Because that was amazing.
[50:11]
Pete Holmes
We took the whole family to Canada last Christmas and babies don't need passports to fly. Right? Right. Wrong. So it is.
[50:22]
Michael Kosta
So I just say, as someone who had a baby passport, is there anything funnier?
[50:26]
Pete Holmes
Dude, I had to hold her head up.
[50:28]
Michael Kosta
Baby. Yeah, of course.
[50:29]
Pete Holmes
It's like, I'm like, literally like my hand, my hands are in her passport picture. Signature. Yes. No. It is insane.
[50:37]
Michael Kosta
Your whole. You're weakened at Bernie.
[50:40]
Pete Holmes
She can't hold her head up yet. And yes.
[50:42]
Michael Kosta
But now she has official documentation that she is currently chewing on and doesn't.
[50:47]
Pete Holmes
Look anything like that picture because she's.
[50:49]
Michael Kosta
Leela flew with that. We. I forget why we went. She came to see me in Canada or something.
[50:53]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[50:54]
Michael Kosta
So she's got her baby passport. We just updated it. But yes, you.
[50:59]
Pete Holmes
So, okay, so this couldn't go. Yeah. Okay. So we get to the airport. It's like, you know, we're counting down the days. We're going to be on an airplane to the kids. We're going to be on an airplane. Oh, my God. We get there. They go, the baby needs a passport. We go, no, she doesn't. I googled it, you know, and it was like, they don't need a passport. Exactly. They don't need a passport if they cross over a land border, but over air border you do. So all of this to say that's a disaster. We had four airplane flights and we decided to drive across the border to Montreal, which is five and a half hour drive. Pain in the butt. Now we're in a hotel rebooking all the flights. This whole thing, right. Everything's a disaster. Kind of like your pothole. Time time a million.
[51:39]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[51:41]
Pete Holmes
We kept it together, but there was some frustration. All of this to be said. We now look back on that experience as this wonderful, beautiful travel thing.
[51:52]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[51:52]
Pete Holmes
And even crazier because we were in Montreal. We needed a last minute hotel. We booked this place quickly. We get there. It's where I met my wife. We didn't. It was a new hotel name. We didn't realize it.
[52:06]
Michael Kosta
Oh, wow.
[52:06]
Pete Holmes
So now I'm like in a hotel room with my wife, with our children now, reminiscing about when we met. Yeah, what a beautiful life thing.
[52:15]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[52:16]
Pete Holmes
But my challenge is when that pothole gets hit. I don't see that. That is going to be a great story. I get mad. I get mad is what happens.
[52:24]
Michael Kosta
But that look, in your defense, that's the artistry of life. Look, I'm always going to spiritualize things. That's just who I am.
[52:32]
Pete Holmes
I'm happy you do, but.
[52:33]
Michael Kosta
Okay, Yes. I feel safe then for real. Imagine there's one consciousness. We call this God. There's one knowing, and it splits itself into 10,000 people, 10,000 things, all this stuff. Then it gets so lost in the drama. Just exactly the same way you get lost in a movie, there's a bomb that's going to go off. It's a flat screen, you're on your couch, but you're in it. The artistry is actually you getting mad.
[53:00]
Pete Holmes
I'm supposed to get mad. It's okay. If that's what I feel, I'm going.
[53:02]
Michael Kosta
To say it's beautiful.
[53:03]
Pete Holmes
Right?
[53:03]
Michael Kosta
Let's not say if it's okay or bad. I think it transcends that category. But put it this way. If I was playing peekaboo with myself and I got so lost in the dream. When you have a lucid dream and you realize you're dreaming, the dream is kind of over, right?
[53:18]
Pete Holmes
It's. It's.
[53:19]
Michael Kosta
It continues in a way, but it's sort of ruined when you're like, ah, good episode, right? Look.
[53:25]
Pete Holmes
Right.
[53:26]
Michael Kosta
We really thought we were Michael. We really thought the vacation mattered in exactly the same way we really thought the point mattered in this sandbox we drew correct. It's exact. It's all meaning making.
[53:40]
Pete Holmes
Oh, I had a thought. Michael. Think it was that. That's gone. Does that happen to you more and more?
[53:51]
Michael Kosta
Single day. More and more though I'm going to say I think I have a neuro talked a lot. No, you don't. You do not talking about 45. 46.
[53:58]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[53:59]
Michael Kosta
When I turned 46, I swear, like an airlock on a spaceship, a door opened and just thousands of docum flew out. And I am. Or is it.
[54:08]
Pete Holmes
Is it parenting?
[54:09]
Michael Kosta
Maybe it might be parenting.
[54:10]
Pete Holmes
Parenting kills you slowly because I'm thinking about this other person and wanting to protect and provide for them.
[54:17]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. And I know every dog on puppy paw patrol. I know puppy dog pals.
[54:22]
Pete Holmes
That's true.
[54:22]
Michael Kosta
When my daughter goes, what's that show with the ooze? And I'm like Captain Underpants. And I know.
[54:29]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, that's also.
[54:31]
Michael Kosta
That's me re parenting.
[54:33]
Pete Holmes
I did get it back.
[54:35]
Michael Kosta
He got it.
[54:36]
Pete Holmes
When I'm angry about the pothole. Metaphorical pothole in this case. The baby's passport. Emotions are present and our memory remembers when emotions were present.
[54:49]
Michael Kosta
It's in the book.
[54:50]
Pete Holmes
It's in the book because it's. It helped. It helps us to Remember, we don't remember folding laundry last Wednesday because there was no emotions present. I mean, maybe we can draw.
[54:58]
Michael Kosta
And I love that you said that's what makes it hurtful when someone forgets your birthday, because they're not having an emotional response to you.
[55:04]
Pete Holmes
They're not attaching emotions to you.
[55:06]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. So if your husband does forget your anniversary, you're right to be a little upset.
[55:10]
Pete Holmes
It's okay to be mad.
[55:11]
Michael Kosta
It doesn't go ahead and read into it, too. It's like, yeah, come on.
[55:14]
Pete Holmes
Yeah, come on. And also, what's an important part of relationships is forgiveness.
[55:19]
Katie
Thank you.
[55:19]
Pete Holmes
Thank you. Because I just see that. Which cameras.
[55:21]
Michael Kosta
Which one is mine? They're all getting a piece of us. Actually, that's not true. This one is only getting you.
[55:30]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. So that's that.
[55:31]
Michael Kosta
Okay, speed round, because we're. We're four minutes out.
[55:35]
Pete Holmes
Oh, man. Flies by with you, Pete, again, thank you for the time.
[55:38]
Michael Kosta
Can I say, again, I'm sorry I gave you any guff about being late. I'm gonna replay that a thousand times.
[55:43]
Pete Holmes
Is it gonna be on the pod? Let's. Let's.
[55:45]
Michael Kosta
Maybe we should leave it in. Yeah, you want to leave it in? It's a real moment when I go, you were 20 minutes late.
[55:50]
Pete Holmes
You. Well, I was late.
[55:52]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, but I'm your. I'm your host. I'm hosting you.
[55:56]
Pete Holmes
Thanks for taking hosting seriously. Serious. No, I mean, I've. I've been drawn to hosts my whole life. That's what I always loved as hosts. And people see it. A lot of people, especially comedians, see it as like, I'll do the thing at the beginning of the show.
[56:10]
Michael Kosta
Oh, yeah.
[56:11]
Pete Holmes
But it's like, hosting is a thing. It's an action verb.
[56:14]
Michael Kosta
It's also a. I'm gonna. It is an action verb, and I'm gonna say it's a good life. Is like trying to empathize and be imaginative about another person. I can't always do it.
[56:25]
Pete Holmes
It.
[56:26]
Michael Kosta
But if you can make that space, that's why. Well, we covered it. I have this audition.
[56:30]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[56:30]
Michael Kosta
Now.
[56:31]
Pete Holmes
Yes.
[56:31]
Michael Kosta
So I was tense. I feel better now. Thank you. But, like, when I'm tense, that's when Pete says things like, you were 20 minutes late. It's just a hurt person.
[56:39]
Pete Holmes
No, stop.
[56:40]
Michael Kosta
It is.
[56:42]
Pete Holmes
It's. It's. I. I.
[56:46]
Michael Kosta
What?
[56:46]
Pete Holmes
I. I get it. I. I get it.
[56:48]
Michael Kosta
You do?
[56:49]
Pete Holmes
I get it. I connect.
[56:50]
Michael Kosta
This is forgiveness. I really appreciate it. And it wasn't a big deal. And you could even flip the tables and go, you're Doing this podcast for free. This is your time.
[57:00]
Pete Holmes
Oh, I didn't know that. Of course. I'm just kidding.
[57:04]
Michael Kosta
Do you get a gift basket?
[57:05]
Pete Holmes
Oh, that's nice. Perfect.
[57:07]
Michael Kosta
Modern mammals. You like it?
[57:09]
Pete Holmes
I love. You can have two any time. I mean this truly, authentically in. In organically. I love when a comedian has figured out a way to provide for themselves through the content they make.
[57:26]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. Isn't that great?
[57:27]
Pete Holmes
It's like, I love when comics are like, I don't like that show. I'm like, okay, you don't like the show. That's. That's yay for comedy. That this person created a thing that now is out there and works for them and lets them be in the business.
[57:40]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, that's right. It's a win for everybody.
[57:42]
Pete Holmes
Win for everybody.
[57:42]
Michael Kosta
Rising Tide.
[57:43]
Pete Holmes
Rising Tide. And what is. What does Rick Rubin say? Releasing the art is the success.
[57:50]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[57:51]
Pete Holmes
Do we like him? I like what he says. Okay. Okay. I like it. But I'm always like, am I falling for the cliche spiritual?
[57:58]
Michael Kosta
We like. We like Rick Rubin.
[57:59]
Pete Holmes
Everyone needs to know that. I'm saying this as much to myself as I am to everyone watching. Releasing is the art is the success.
[58:05]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is the success. I love that. And it's a nice note to end on. Although I do want to ask.
[58:12]
Pete Holmes
Ask.
[58:12]
Michael Kosta
Risking going a little over. Who cares?
[58:15]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[58:16]
Michael Kosta
Can you think of a time you laughed really, really hard? I imagine growing up in this big family, you had lots of moments. I'm gonna prime you a little bit.
[58:23]
Pete Holmes
Okay.
[58:24]
Michael Kosta
Sometimes someone fell. Oh. I. I usually say it doesn't have to be a good story. I'm not looking for, like, a. It was Christmas Eve. It's not like that somebody fell, somebody farted, or. It was a situation where you're not allowed to laugh.
[58:37]
Pete Holmes
Yeah. Catholic church, we would have laughing fits a lot.
[58:41]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[58:41]
Pete Holmes
Because you weren't allowed to the best. And mom would get mad immediately. So we'd have a lot of those. The one that comes to mind when you said this to me was in seventh grade, we went on a cruise. My dad took our whole family on a cruise, which now sounds like the biggest nightmare of my life. At the seventh grade, it was cool because there was a casino and I could drink virgin pina coladas.
[59:02]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[59:03]
Pete Holmes
You ever been on a cruise?
[59:04]
Michael Kosta
Virgin pina.
[59:05]
Pete Holmes
Have you ever been on a cruise?
[59:06]
Michael Kosta
Yes, unfortunately. Okay.
[59:08]
Pete Holmes
So people get very, like, reactionary about cruise.
[59:12]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[59:13]
Pete Holmes
They bring you out at the very beginning, and they do this safe, light safety vest thing where everybody. They have to Wear their life vest and they show you, like, if the cruise ship.
[59:25]
Michael Kosta
I'm already dead.
[59:26]
Pete Holmes
Do you remember this or no?
[59:27]
Michael Kosta
Yes, I do remember this. So what a great backdrop, right?
[59:31]
Pete Holmes
So I am the punchline of this story, but it, it does make me laugh. And I hated my brother ties, gets the credit for this one. So they bring out thousands of people. They do the thing over the thing. You tie the thing, the life vest on. And as we're all walking away now, thousands of people are heading in this direction. My brother had tied my loose life jacket to this pole behind me. And I didn't know you know the trick I'm talking about.
[59:57]
Michael Kosta
So now it's an elevation of tying the shoes late. It's exactly that.
[60:02]
Pete Holmes
So now thousands of people are all moving this direction, and I'm moving with them, but I have to now go backwards to untie myself. And it was a great joke. It was also probably why I'm a comedian today, because I still just want someone to say they love me and stop making fun of me.
[60:18]
Michael Kosta
You know, fuck you, clown. Do you know that joke?
[60:19]
Pete Holmes
I don't know that.
[60:20]
Michael Kosta
Guy gets insulted by a clown, goes to clown college. It's one of those jokes you make it as long as you can. He majors in comebacks. He finally sees the same clown. He goes, fuck you, clown.
[60:28]
Pete Holmes
Oh, that's exactly right. So that was a very funny bit. And, and when, when you said that, that's what I thought of.
[60:35]
Michael Kosta
What a fantastic answer. I, I, I can see it. I'll never forget it.
[60:39]
Pete Holmes
And it's also how my family said, I love you.
[60:42]
Michael Kosta
Yeah.
[60:42]
Pete Holmes
Even though it's fucked up.
[60:44]
Michael Kosta
No, Everything you read about my family gave me like, some, some jealousy, actually. I was like, this sounds really sweet. I related mostly to Christy, who couldn't play sports.
[60:54]
Pete Holmes
Chris, you know what Christy does now?
[60:56]
Michael Kosta
What's that?
[60:56]
Pete Holmes
She's a nurse practitioner at a hospice.
[60:59]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, you told me in the, you.
[61:00]
Pete Holmes
Told me every single day she helps people pass.
[61:04]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. Yeah.
[61:04]
Pete Holmes
Isn't that unbelievable?
[61:05]
Michael Kosta
She's doing great.
[61:06]
Pete Holmes
Isn't that.
[61:07]
Michael Kosta
It is unbelievable.
[61:08]
Pete Holmes
A crazy, amazing job. And she says, I love it because it's the only part of medicine where I, I don't have to fix it. You can't fix it.
[61:16]
Michael Kosta
Yeah. You can't fix it.
[61:17]
Pete Holmes
You're there to become from.
[61:18]
Michael Kosta
The art is letting it go or really releasing it.
[61:22]
Pete Holmes
Releasing it.
[61:23]
Michael Kosta
Something like.
[61:23]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[61:24]
Michael Kosta
What a beautiful calling.
[61:25]
Pete Holmes
Yeah.
[61:25]
Michael Kosta
If she, she doesn't need any help. But Ram Dass has some great talks on hospice.
[61:31]
Pete Holmes
It's unbelievable. Oh, great. Right. Okay.
[61:33]
Michael Kosta
Yeah, I'm trying. I'll try. And it might be called, like, Death and dying. It's with CDs. It doesn't matter. Thank you so much.
[61:40]
Pete Holmes
Thank you.
[61:40]
Michael Kosta
Called Lucky Louie fx. Lucky Loser.
[61:44]
Pete Holmes
Lucky.
[61:45]
Michael Kosta
Lucky Loser.
[61:46]
Pete Holmes
Lucky.
[61:46]
Michael Kosta
Oh, no, here we go.
[61:48]
Pete Holmes
Do that.
[61:49]
Michael Kosta
But Lucky Loser, it's available now, and it's a great audiobook.
[61:51]
Pete Holmes
It's a great. I read it. And thanks for having me. I've been a fan of yours for a long time. It's a pleasure to be on your pod. For real.
[61:57]
Michael Kosta
It's a pleasure to have you.
[61:58]
Pete Holmes
Thank you.
[61:59]
Michael Kosta
Thank you for being here. Bye.
[62:00]
Pete Holmes
Bye.
[62:00]
Michael Kosta
Oh, you have to say, keep it crispy. What am I doing? Doing?
[62:02]
Pete Holmes
Okay, so I didn't understand this.
[62:05]
Michael Kosta
It's not a trick.
[62:06]
Pete Holmes
Okay?
[62:06]
Michael Kosta
No hyper vigilance, no Ludar. It's just how you say goodbye. You get to say goodbye, though.
[62:11]
Pete Holmes
Keep it crispy.
[62:12]
Michael Kosta
That's right.