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- [00:03]
A
Welcome everybody. Today I am joined. We're going to do a very different format today, but I think you guys are going to love it. I have with me today Emily and Lindsay Stetzer. They are the co founders of Presently, which is two sisters with lived experience and they have OCD and anxiety and they offer tangible reminders, using accessories and jewelry to help people stay grounded in evidence based CBT and mindfulness informed principles. They are regularly recommended by therapists and mental health professionals. They have gifted me one with one beautiful bracelet and I love it. And again, I was just so thrilled and excited about them that I wanted to get them on today to talk about how their OCD brain tricked the them and the tools that they wish they had been given sooner. So they're actually kind of going to give you a master class today of their lived experience and some practical skills based practices that they have used to get them through relapses and setbacks and recovery and all that. So thank you for being here. Emily and Lindsay, thank you for having us.
- [01:16]
B
Thanks for having us.
- [01:17]
A
Who would like to go, Lindsay or Emily? Who would like to go first in sharing your story of OCD and anxiety?
- [01:25]
C
Lindsay, you want me to go first? Okay. Chronologically it makes sense for Lindsay to go first. Oh, okay.
- [01:30]
A
All right. So Lindsay is the eldest. Great. Lindsay, tell us about your story.
- [01:35]
B
My OCD has changed and became a chameleon. Like a lot of people know, ocd, you know, changes through different forms and different types of OCD that can kind of come out. My OCD started at when I was probably elementary school. I started noticing it with the, you know, the thoughts of if I don't line this up, something will happen to my family or if I don't turn the lights off a certain amount of times, someone's going to die or it'll be my responsibility that someone will die. So is that kind of ocd? I don't like saying the word basic, but it's kind of like how most people. The ocd. Yeah, that most people kind of like. Not most people, because usually OCD is shown in the media as like contamination OCD or just cleanliness ocd. And it's not that. It's like there's so much more to it. So it started in, in those, that basic form, which I, I consider the basic form for me. So a lot of like lining things up, a lot of like making sure I did something a certain amount of times. It was more so visual, my OCD when I was younger. And I think it kind of took the form to be more hidden and more mental compulsions. As I got older, that was the hard thing to understand. You know, when you see and you, you have these compulsions to do something and line things up or do something a certain amount of times, or you know, this part of the sideway because you're afraid if you did that your mom's gonna die. It was like all things then started to become internal. And so I didn't know that that was part of ocd. Okay, so I'll take you guys through elementary school, through middle school, and then through high school. I, I would have these things that I had to do a certain amount of times or ask a certain question over and over again. It was more so like your, like I say, my, the basic ocd. And then in high school, my junior year of high school was when I was. My OCD took another form that I never heard of, or never even saw, or never even knew about or learned, which is called existential ocd, which is if anyone is ever experiencing existential ocd, you know that it doesn't even, it doesn't feel like ocd. It just feels like this is happening to me and it feels very scary. When, when it happened to me, I was sitting on the toilet and I had, you know, experience like being in high school, right? And just like the stresses and the anxieties of being in high school. But I think there was just a compilation of different things that I feared and things that happened to me from the past that kind of came to the present moment and kind of hit me all at once. And that was like the first time I actually experienced my first panic attack as well, sitting on the toilet, which was like, not fun. But also the thoughts of like, how do I know if I'm alive right now? Or how do I know if I'm not dead or my parents aren't dead or my siblings aren't dead or how do I, how do I know if all this is real? Like, how do I prove to myself that all this is real or not real? And I literally was left like dumbfounded just sitting on the toilet. And when you're that age and you just like real life experiences that you've experienced and that kind of like shaped how I saw things. So for example, I had, I had tried smoking pot for the first time and had a really bad experience with it. I was feeling an out of body experience similar to what I felt when I had smoked pot. And that scared the shit out of me because first of all, why I hadn't smoked. This was, like, months, months ago, and I was just going to the bathroom. Like, why was I all of a sudden having this. This feeling that I had in the past come to the present and scare me and, like, start trying to, like, trick me in my mind of, like, what. How do I know what is real and what is not? So that is kind of where how my existential OCD started. And from there, it kind of. It manifested into UNs, whether I was alive or dead or whether or not my parents were alive or dead and needing to get the reassurance. And that could scare anyone, obviously, to their core. And, like, I just. I didn't realize that this was the same moment I experienced my first panic attack, which was so scary, because you have that experience of, like, not knowing what's real and then feeling all my insides, like, go numb. That anyone's experienced a panic attack in their own ways. It's different for everyone, but everyone, you know, feels it differently. And my legs just went numb, and, like, I couldn't really feel anything. So that was scary. And that's kind of like, where my OCD story took a turn for me, because I didn't know that that was part of ocd. And we later on, you know, were told when I went to therapy that that is actually existential ocd. There was a label for that, and that what I was experiencing was this existential questions in my mind. And it wasn't just the fact that I had smoked pot. It was just because, you know, it was just something that I had remembered in the past that had the same similar experience as what I had felt sitting on the toilet. And it was just a crazy compilation of feelings that I felt.
- [06:14]
A
Amazing. Emily, what about for you? So your sisters tell me about how you realized you had ocd.
- [06:22]
C
So mine was very different than Lindsay's when I was a kid. And Lindsay can, like, add color to this story a little bit later. But I was super anxious. I had a lot of separation anxiety from my mom and from my dad, and I didn't want to go to school. I would often confess to things that really didn't need confessing. Like, I would confess that, like, I had a thought that, like, what. What happens if I grew up and I started smoking cigarettes? Like, am I a bad person? And, like, things like that where, like, random thoughts would pop into my head and I'd have to, like, confess them out loud. But again, when.
- [06:58]
B
When she says confess, she had to. Literally, she would sit in her room and she would cry unconditionally like it was just everything in her body, like, was forcing her to tell this information out. And it, like, was so hard for her. This happened every day.
- [07:12]
C
Yeah. So this was all into middle school, same stuff. And I guess in middle school, like, I had the sort of like common thoughts that other middle schoolers have, I guess. But because of the way my brain was processing it, it like latched onto everything and I was really struggling. Like, at one point, I think there was. I watched an R rated movie and I had to confess to my parents. Or like, I would sit there with my friends and be like, I can't watch this. And I'd literally sit there with my eyes covered because I didn't want to have to confess. And so that was like sort of my whole personality in middle school was just like, goody two shoes. I needed to be with my parents. I didn't like sleepovers. Then high school, it sort of toned down a little bit. I think it manifested more into my schoolwork. I was very regimented with my high school work and studying and, you know, sometimes I wouldn't eat until I finished studying. Like a certain, you know, amount of time. And again, like, this was not labeled as ocd. I was just anxious. I was just a very good student. I was just a sensitive person, I guess. And then when I got to college, sort of similar to when Lindsay was talking about how this like, experience, like, came back to her after months, but this was like sort of after a year. So I was sitting in a psychology class in college and all of a sudden, like, I guess we were talking about, like adolescence and stuff, and I like remembered all the stuff that I had worried about or that I had gone through in middle school that I sort of just like blacked out. I guess in between that time, and I guess you could say it was a panic attack sort of thing. Like my, like, I just like, sort of panicked. Like, I was like, oh, my God. Like, you know, I remember being confused if I, you know, was into men or women. And, you know, I guess I hadn't thought of that in years. And then I was like, how do I know if I'm gay or if I'm straight or. And all that I kept inside. So it started with that, then it went into, you know, when you're in college, you start drinking, you start, you know, maybe you lose memory of some things of the night. So then your mind is like, oh, my gosh, did I do something? Did someone hurt me? Things like that that you could say, like a lot of people Struggle with it at that age. But I think, again, the way my mind was wired, I was attaching to every little thing. And so a lot of the times I would, like, for example, for this sexual orientation ocd, which I now know it as I kept it inside for, like, all four years. I would ask my friends a lot of the times, like, did this happen? Did that happen? I would go to the doctor often to get checked. And, you know, a lot of, like, I feel some, like, weird sensation. Does that mean I have, like, cancer? And I just remember, like, my lowest low is me, like, sitting in the closet in my dorm room, like, just hysterical because I just didn't. I didn't know what to do about it. And I didn't want to go to therapy, I think, because of this sexual orientation OCD stuff, because I didn't want to. I couldn't say it out loud. Just couldn't. And then finally, again in my head, I am anxious, I have anxiety. I know I need to go to therapy, but, you know, it's not. I'm not ready for that. So when I graduated, it took me until I graduated college to finally be like, I'm struggling. Like, I. I need to go to therapy. In the first session, I told, you know, told all this stuff, and she was like, so it sounds like you have ocd. And I was like, no, I don't. Like, my sister has ocd. It's totally different. There's no way, like. And then, you know, she starts explaining it all and how, like, me confessing when I was younger, obviously textbook OCD now that you think about it, but no idea until too many years later, even with Lindsay in the same house, like, and our parents being well versed in OCD stuff, like, we had no idea. So I think that's sort of how we stepped into, like, advocacy and, you know, starting presently, because we realized that even though we both have totally different types of ocd, like, the tools that help us are exactly the same. Wow.
- [11:08]
B
Even just you sharing that, Emily, like, I always, like, imagine my OCD is like. Because it. I mean, you're talking about, like, life or death, right? But then, like, Emily's describing it as, like, years long of just questionings in her head. And I'm like, shit. Like, Emily's was a lot harder. Must have been a lot harder. And, like, I'm just realizing that now
- [11:27]
C
that it was harder but different.
- [11:29]
A
Yeah, I think they're all versions of hellish experiences from my experience as a clinician of seeing them. Like, there is no easy Way to have ocd. They all suck.
- [11:39]
B
I think.
- [11:40]
A
I think it's so interesting. So just so we get the time of that. So when you, Lindsay, got diagnosed, you were. Were getting treatment but not knowing that at the same time, Emily was struggling with the same condition.
- [11:53]
C
Correct. So we are five years apart. When I was, you know, confessing all those things and crying every night for my mom, I was in, like, leaving elementary school, getting into middle school, and Lindsay was in high school at that point. So both of us, you did make use of each other's experience. Because I remember being my room and listening to Lindsay, like, asking my parents or repeat the answer to the same question over and over again.
- [12:16]
B
It was like an endless night, like, of just me constantly having to, like, having them to repeat something. And it was like, then Emily's stuff would be like, second to this.
- [12:27]
C
Like, wow.
- [12:30]
A
And so it's pretty cool. Though I will say, as much as you guys have suffered, that once you told somebody, the therapist got it pretty quick. Like, sometimes people don't get a correct diagnosis. They get misdiagnosed. It sounds like the clinician got you diagnosed pretty quickly. Was it that you got like, the correct treatment or did you guys have to through years of not great treatment as well?
- [12:54]
B
I'd have to say that our mom was pretty kick ass. And the fact that she basically gathered all the information that she could find online at the time and like, got us the right help or put us in the right place that was able to give us the correct treatment because she immediately, like, I. I only went to maybe like one, I think one or two therapists before I found the right therapist for me. And that was cognitive behavioral therapy. And. Yeah, and there wasn't a lot out there back then. Like, there wasn't a lot of. Not a lot of supporting groups, not a lot of, like, information. So it just amazes me, like, how she was able to figure out and find. She had like, a couple of books that. That came out for OCD and Amazing.
- [13:37]
C
Oh, sorry. I was going to say Lynn, Lindsay was all set up with her therapy and she was, you know, making so much progress. And then her therapist referred me to another therapist. So there that amazing.
- [13:47]
A
What a relief there. And so how did it move then to you now doing the advocacy that you do? What brought that on?
- [13:57]
C
So this happened during COVID which a lot of, like, new things started up during COVID when people were sitting in their houses, like, having nothing else to do. So Lindsay and I both moved back home. We were living in our house I was personally struggling with the fact that my boyfriend was starting law school in D.C. so we were about to start a long distance relationship. And I remember, like, I have this vivid memory of me being upstairs in my room. Lindsay was downstairs doing work, and I was like, you know, just looking at my jewelry, and I was like, I really wish I had something that could, like, remind me of things that I learned in therapy. Because I was so frustrated with the fact that, like, I was in therapy. I've been in therapy at that point for. For years. And I was like, why can't I get myself out of these, like, loops? Like, it's very. It's so frustrating. I know what to do. I know it's like, in my toolbox, but I couldn't bring it to the surface when I was super, super anxious. I feel like I need, like, a reminder or something on my wrist. And all those beaded bracelets, you know, people were making, those lettered beaded bracelets came out, and I was like, I don't want that. I want a nice piece of jewelry with a phrase on it. So I was like, okay, I'll get one, like, custom. But then I didn't know what phrase to use. I was like, how do you get, like a big, broad teaching into one little phrase that fits on a bracelet? And then I remembered, like, before I even went to therapy, Lindsay obviously had given me, like, tools to use when I was struggling. And the first thing she taught me was my thoughts are passing clouds, which is very much based in, like, mindfulness. And I had just finished reading this mindfulness book, Peace is Every Step. I think it was like a titch nh book. And that phrase, I was like, that's the perfect phrase. But then, like, I think I was googling. And I. And I realized that there weren't any bracelets out there that had phrases that I would be looking for that my therapist would approve of. A lot of the phrases were good vibes only. And, like, especially during COVID like, everyone's trying to cheer everyone up. So it was like, good vibes only. Hakuna matata. She believed she could, so she did. Like, all those phrases were everywhere. And I was like, I don't understand how there's not one phrase here that, like, reminds me of the things that I learned in therapy. So I ran downstairs and I got.
- [16:10]
B
I remember I have a visual of Emily coming down stand, like, in her. Her matching pajama set, because, you know, it was the thing to have during
- [16:18]
C
the pandemic, really shoot her hair in
- [16:21]
B
A bun, very comfy.
- [16:22]
C
And then so I came down and I was like, first of all, I was like, lindsay, I need you to make me a bracelet. Because she was doing beading at the time, and I don't know, she had, like, cooler beads. And then I was like, I think, like, there's a problem I just realized that we need to, like, solve maybe. So, yeah, we started, you know, thinking of all the different things we learned in therapy and breaking them down and finding these phrases that we could put on bracelets that look really nice and are helpful, too.
- [16:50]
A
Yeah, you're right.
- [16:51]
D
And I.
- [16:51]
A
It's beautiful. And this. I'm not sponsored by you guys either, so I don't want listeners to think that you. This is a sponsored episode. Like, it. They are beautiful. They are beautiful pieces of jewelry. So, okay, this is amazing. And you guys have such a unique story, and you've done some such a cool way to advocate. You had shared that you had sort of, like, a pocket toolkit that you guys use that you wanted to share because you had said, like, you guys have been through the ringer. You've obviously gotten good therapy. Of course, you know, do you still struggle, or do you both consider yourself in recovery? Where are you in regards to that?
- [17:29]
B
That's a daily, like, get reminded of, like, how much I need to open my toolbox and use it and look at my bracelets when I have them on and really remind myself that, like, I just. It's just like, every day, there's always something new. Like, you know, OCD doesn't go away, and don't expect it to go away. You just have to learn how to, like, sit with it and just live with it. And that's kind of what we've been doing since then. It's just like, sitting with it, letting it be in the room, but not giving it too much attention and living
- [17:59]
C
anyway, regardless of the discomfort.
- [18:01]
B
And.
- [18:01]
C
Yeah, so I think same. Same for me, it's like, it's funny because a lot of the times I'll be like, I feel like I'm like, an imposter of having ocd because I don't feel like I have as much, like, as many, like, symptoms as I did before sort of thing. So I'm like, am I even qualified to be talking about this stuff as this all the time? Because I'm like, do I even have ocd? Anyway, that's just another. Another thing. But as you, like, start to really think about it, like, there are things every single day that I do that, you know Back then would have been extremely debilitating, but now I'm like, okay, that's, that's an OCD thought. I'm just going to like, let that be here and sit with the discomfort, sit with the uncertainty and not let it ruin my day or like what I'm doing in that moment. And I think that it's not so much getting rid of those symptoms or those intrusive thoughts, but learning to pivot faster away from it.
- [18:58]
A
It's so true that it's so common that I hear. And I just want listeners to know that people with OCD always question whether they have ocd. It's a part of the condition, like one of the sort of the characteristics of having it. So that makes total sense to me. Okay, tell me, you guys, you have brought with you a pocket toolkit. You've talked about these sort of core phrases or exercises that listeners can practice between therapy or during the day when they're struggling. Do you guys want to walk me through that pocket toolkit that they could use or. And I think you even shared, like, these are tools that you have used and wished that you had. Have had earlier.
- [19:37]
C
Yeah. So our pocket toolkit is a four step process. So the first one is observe.
- [19:43]
B
It started off with a whiteboard that we purchased online.
- [19:46]
C
Yes, tough. So we, we purchased a whiteboard and we had a good old march and brainstorming session and this is what we came up with. So step one is observe. It's I'm having a thought, I'm having an anxious thought, I'm having an intrusive thought that X, Y, Z. So you're just naming what it is that you're thinking about or the thing that you're feeling putting on the table
- [20:08]
B
and like letting it be in the room.
- [20:10]
C
The second is to feel. So you're calling out, you're really paying attention to how you're feeling in that moment. Are you feeling it in your stomach? Are you feeling it in your chest? Are you feeling it in your fingertips? Like, like where exactly are you feeling this and what is it that you're feeling? So you could say, maybe this is uncomfortable. And I, you know, I feel like I am in danger or I feel
- [20:37]
B
this was something that I, like my therapist would always ask me is like, okay, now where do you feel it? Like, truly, where do you feel it inside your body? Because then if you stop for a second, you take a moment to just like observe what you just said out loud and then you feel it. Like, where do you feel it? Do you Feel it in your stomach? Do you feel it in your heart? Do you feel it? Is it just a tingling feeling? Like, that's how I felt it when I had my first panic attack. It was, like, tingling in my legs. Yeah.
- [21:04]
A
May I ask a couple questions about that? So when you had to observe and you had to feel, was that an easy learning process for you? What was the process of. Of you adapting and adopting those that practice in specific, for folks who are. Maybe they've heard it on the podcast, but they want your lived experience experience. Like, what was that like to. How many times did you have to practice it? How long did it take for you to get that? Did you hate it? Like, kind of give me a little bit of feedback?
- [21:32]
B
For me, that was, like, the rudimentary basics of, like, what I learned was like, observing what was going on in your mind, like, observing what you're feeling, calling it out in front of you. And then I think that first was such a weird concept to me because one like Emily was saying that she never even, like, told us about those thoughts that she had, you know, so it's all these things that kind of people keep internally and kind of keep it to themselves and keep it as secrets, you know, and calling it out out loud is something that, like, you're not. No one typically does. So it's very weird assignment when you're kind of in therapy. And. And that's kind of like, the first thing is, like, observe all these thoughts and all your feelings.
- [22:14]
C
And I just remember also, like, having
- [22:17]
B
to, like, say it out loud was a big. That was a big challenge because I think saying it out loud so that everyone can hear it, you know, not just myself. You're giving it, like, a platform to stand on and kind of not letting it just hide in the corner, I think was something that was important for me.
- [22:34]
A
What about for you, Emily? How was it to practice that?
- [22:37]
C
Yeah, that was definitely tough because that was one of the reasons why I didn't want to go to therapy was because they didn't want to say these things out loud or, like, admit that these thoughts were happening. But I think, you know, it. It does take time, and it takes practice, but the first time you do it is the hardest. Like, after that, it just gets easier and easier because you learn that this is a normal human response. Like, like, we. One thing I learned that I wish I had learned sooner was that we have, like, I probably got the number wrong. Like, six. Six thousand thoughts a day. Like, everyone has these random thoughts, and it's just that with ocd, you tend to just, like, cling on to them and, like, somehow morph them and attach them to things that you care about and things that you love. So I think observing that this is what you're going through is just like. It's just step number one. And it's again, like, the first time is the hardest. So once you do it once, then you get better and better at it. And I think Lindsay was right. Like, you do have to, like, observe how you're feeling and that. I think that is part of. Part of step one and then step two with feel. It's like, can you feel those feelings? Can you sit with those feelings?
- [23:47]
B
It's very. It's very difficult to, like, separate that. Like, observing it and saying it out loud is different than, like, where are you actually feeling it Inside?
- [23:55]
A
Amazing. Amazing.
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C
The second hardest thing to do is to, like, actually, like, sit with your feelings and, like, physically and emotionally, like, just feel, like, what are you feeling? And then the next step would be to accept. So accept is also something really difficult. It's all very difficult, but it works if you can get it down. And so accept is. This is like. I think this is like, the. The one step that, like, pivots at all, because it's the one thing that you're, like, learning was different than what you would normally, like, believe. So if for. To, like, accept, for example, could be, like, life is filled with uncertainty. Like, you're accepting that uncertainty exists and that getting 100% certainty is not really possible. And so it helps you, like, sort of figure out what to do next in a way.
- [24:51]
B
And I can give an example if that maybe it would be easy or. I don't know. Let's see. But I was just. I just came back from vacation, and my boyfriend had made me pasta, which was great, the day before, and was using canned red. Not red sauce, like red tomatoes, because he had had to make the sauce. Yeah. And I was told this was, like, years and years ago that, like, you shouldn't use dented cans. So that being something that I've had in the back of my mind after we purchased this can, I didn't do anything about it. I just kind of accepted it and forgot about it, to be honest, until the day that he made the meat pasta with red sauce, which was the day before leaving for vacation. And I had to figure out, like, what I was going to do. Was I going to ask him to remake the red sauce and remake the pasta, or was I going to eat it and accept whatever Happens and kind of live according to my values of, like, I want to enjoy this night before we go on vacation, have this moment together and not have OCD steal the show. So this is something that, like, I kind of had to accept. So I basically, like, all this was in my head and I was like, okay, I literally can just not eat the pasta. And you know what? I. I can give myself reassurance in that moment because I know that I'd be okay because I didn't eat the red sauce. But I'm not living how I want to live my life, which is I don't want to live under OCD control. I want to, like, live it for my own control. I want to, like, make my own decisions. I want to live my life, have the experiences that I experience. And I had to accept that, like, okay, maybe the can was ended, maybe, maybe it's not great that I eat it, but what else is there for me to do? What else would I have done? And I did the right thing, which was I just accepted it and, you know, knew that, like, I made the right choice. And it's crazy because, like, the first time you do it is the scariest moment. How am I convinced myself that this makes sense to do? And it's like you keep practicing this and you keep using it on a daily basis, which you always do, which is, you know, I'm just giving this explanation or this example right before vacation. It's something that I had to deal with, you know, and it's like something that. It was so hard the first time I had to do it, but it was so easy choosing to accept it and choosing to align with what I believe and what I feel that I was okay, you know, and I was. I kept going and I kept doing the things that I wanted to do. Went on vacation, and now I'm discussing it now just to give an example. So just showing that, like those moments do come up and you have to pivot.
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A
Yeah.
- [27:36]
D
Now, as you know, I have a private practice. I have six amazing therapists in Calabasas, California. However, we do not take insurance. Now, if you are looking for insurance covered OCD or BFRB treatment, I want to let you know about nocd. NOCD provides face to face live video sessions with specialized licensed OCD therapist. Now, their therapists use exposure and response prevention. We know this is the gold standard for ocd. So you can be absolutely confirmed that you're in the right place there. And they have a clinically proven app that helps you stay connected to your therapist. And others who have OCD between sessions. So you'll always feel supported. Now the cool thing is NOCD is available in all 50 US states and even internationally, and they accept most insurance plans, making it affordable and accessible.
- [28:33]
A
We love that.
- [28:34]
D
Now if you think you might have OCD or you're struggling to manage your symptoms, you can book a free call. Just click the link in the show notes@nocd.com I am honored to partner with NOCD. I want to remind you that recovery is possible. Please do. Do not forget that. Now, big hugs and let's get back to the show.
- [28:56]
A
Emily, do you have a recent example of going through those steps as well?
- [29:01]
C
Yes, I do. I would say that just this morning or no, sorry, that was last night. Just last night. My room is a mess, there are clothes everywhere. And I was picking up a pair of jeans that I had previously sat on the subway with. So the back of my jeans, the back pocket, and I picked it up from that same position and I observed that my thought was, now my hand is contaminated and I need to clean it and feel was I was noticing my thought, my feelings, and I let the feelings rise. And what I felt was super uncomfortable knowing that I had just touched this germ infested pair of pants that I had because I sat on the subway. And just for some context, which is probably something I should be working on, but I don't normally sit on the subway in New York City. I normally, I surf on the subway. I don't hold onto the poles, I hold onto my boyfriend. And yeah, that's something I'm still working on. Just to give you the idea that, like, we're also working on things like it's, you're never fully cured. And so I let that feeling rise of the uncomfortable, of the discomfort. And then the accept part of that was I need to accept that, like, in order for me to get better with ocd, I need to not give into it. And I need to accept that I may have picked up a germ or I may not have picked up a germ. And then like the aligned part is like choosing values over fear. It's like my values are I don't want to keep, I don't want to have to keep washing my hands. I don't want to have to start this cycle again with something so small as a pair of jeans. So I chose to put the pair of pants in the hamper and not go to the bathroom, wash my hands. And I went right into bed and I, you know, I felt you Know, I noticed how I was noticing me, like, touching the sheets and touching everything else and just, like, needing to let those feelings be there, let the uncomfortableness be there, but allowing the uncertainty to also be there and accepting that maybe there are germs, maybe there aren't. Maybe I'm dirty, maybe I'm not.
- [31:17]
B
Maybe they're still in your bed. Right.
- [31:18]
C
That. That and choosing values over fear is like choosing to, like, keep going and not let OCD take over, because the. The one time you give in, then the rest starts spiraling again.
- [31:33]
A
Well, that's really powerful. I'm so grateful you guys gave me two really wonderful examples of that. We're talking today about, like, how your OCD tricks us and the tools we wish we did have sooner. What message would you maybe have given to yourself or somebody who's early in this process?
- [31:52]
B
Okay, I have one that my therapist shared with me.
- [31:56]
C
Right now.
- [31:57]
B
I feel like I'm. I'm living. Adopting an exposure lifestyle, which means that I'm constantly doing exposures. And that is something I'm really proud of myself because it keeps pushing me to, like, take on these little challenges and bigger challenges and do the exposure of, like, eating the pasta, even though it could have killed me or maybe it killed me. I don't know. We don't know. But, like, doing an exposure lifestyle, always making sure you put time into doing these small exposures and whether it being the smallest, littlest thing propels you forward. Just the smallest act of, like, doing exposure and not allowing the OCD to win and giving yourself the win goes a long way.
- [32:39]
A
Amazing. What about you, Emily?
- [32:41]
C
I would say I think I always go back to this idea of, you know, my thoughts are passing clouds or, like, separating myself from my mind. Because a lot of my thoughts, A lot of my OCD history was based on random thoughts that pop in my head and, like, putting a lot of weight to that. And I think, first, this is probably more for someone who is just starting to get into this treatment and hopefully getting, you know, the right kind of therapy. But it's just reminding yourself that, like, this is normal. You are normal. The thoughts you have are normal. The thoughts are not facts. You don't need to give weight to them. You don't need to hold on to them. You can just imagine them floating by, like, clouds in the sky, and you don't. It doesn't matter where they came from or where they're going, but, like, being able to observe them as, like, an outside person, like, not as. This is Emily's thought this is, this is an OCD thought that really just
- [33:43]
A
like helps I think so powerful. Can you tell us where people can learn about you and presently, where can they go to get in touch with you?
- [33:53]
C
Yeah. So we are at Presently Bracelets on Instagram. We are Presently bracelets. Com and yeah, everything's pretty much Presently Bracelets. If you Google us, you'll find us. So I worked very hard, I worked very hard on that SEO.
- [34:11]
A
Good. We'll make sure to have it in the show Notes. Thank you both so much for being here. It's been such an honor to spend some time with you both.
- [34:18]
C
Thank you so much.
- [34:19]
B
Thank you so much for having us.
- [34:24]
D
Please note that this podcast or any other resources from CBTSchool.com should not replace professional mental health care. If you feel you would benefit, please reach out to a provider in your area. Have a wonderful day and thank you. Thank you for supporting CBTSchool.com.