12 Years, One Pardon, and a Fight That's Not Over - Lyn Ulbricht | Ep. 138

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: You're The Voice with Efrat Fenigson

Episode: 12 Years, One Pardon, and a Fight That's Not Over – Lyn Ulbricht | Ep. 138
Date: May 18, 2026
Guest: Lyn Ulbricht
Theme: The lasting impact of cruel sentencing, the fight for justice reform, and Lyn's personal journey to free her son Ross Ulbricht (Silk Road case), highlighting broader issues in the US criminal justice system.

---

Overview

This episode is an emotional and insightful conversation with activist Lyn Ulbricht, mother of Ross Ulbricht, the founder of the infamous Silk Road website. Lyn discusses the 12-year fight to free her son, who received a double life sentence plus 40 years for non-violent offenses, his pardon and release, and her continued advocacy for criminal justice reform through her organization Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing (MACS). The conversation also addresses problems of mandatory minimums, the war on drugs, the war on crypto, and the lives destroyed by excessively harsh sentencing in the US.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Personal Impact and the Fight for Freedom

• Lyn recounts her enduring commitment to gaining her son's release:

  “I could not live my life without my dying breath trying to get him out of that situation…You don't realize what a gift your freedom is until you lose it.” (00:00)

• She describes the surreal moment of receiving the president’s phone call about Ross’ pardon:

  “He said, I'm going to give your son an unconditional pardon. And I'm like, oh my God…And then he goes, tell him to stay clean. Which is so Trump to me.” (08:16)

2. Panel Reflections and Community Awareness

• Lyn discusses her experience at a recent conference panel, aiming to raise awareness about unjust sentencing among the Bitcoin and crypto community:

  "Our main goal... is to shine a light on this, because a lot of people here aren't even aware of it." (02:30)

• Many in the crypto sector remain unaware that so-called “crypto POWs”—people prosecuted for code or privacy tools—are still imprisoned. She appeals for more community mobilization. (03:41)

3. The “Social Layer” of Bitcoin and the Justice System

• Efrat highlights the need to defend not just Bitcoin’s technology but also its narrative, public perception, and legal environment:

  “If we are not the ones to secure...the ideas that society holds about bitcoin, is it a criminal act to want to have financial privacy and financial autonomy?” (04:36)

• Lyn agrees, noting changes in public attitudes toward crypto since Ross’s trial. (05:43)

4. Ross’ Release: The Story and Its Aftermath

• Lyn recounts the family's anticipation, the dramatic night of Ross's release, and the miracle of his first moments of freedom:

  "It was really kind of a surreal, amazing miracle moment. It really was." (09:46)

• She explains Ross' need for privacy and healing after his ordeal, noting he’s “cocooning” and rebuilding with routines focused on meditation and exercise.

  “He's great. He's like, I'm free...he's appreciating that a lot...He definitely has a routine which always starts with meditation.” (13:50, 14:24)

5. Cruel Sentencing and Families’ Suffering

• Lyn expresses how excessive sentences violate the 8th Amendment’s prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment:

  “A young first-time offender, no violent charges at all, to have his whole life taken. It’s pretty cruel.” (15:35)

• The injustice extends beyond the prisoner to devastate families, especially children. She gives a moving example of a child’s heartbreak leaving prison visits. (16:20-17:47)

6. Mandatory Minimums, “Three Strikes,” and the War on Drugs

• The conversation exposes the inconsistency and severity of US sentencing laws—like people serving life for shoplifting or minor drug offenses, even as the law changes around them:

  “He stole two jackets...He got life in prison in Louisiana.” (23:13) “Close to 3,000 people [are] serving long or life sentences for marijuana, for cannabis.” (24:13)

• Lyn criticizes the patchwork laws and economic incentives that drive mass incarceration:

  “They’re never going to end the drug war. It's too lucrative. They get a lot of money.” (27:48)

7. Systemic Reform, Prison Economics, and Advocacy

• Discussion of how mass incarceration has become a money-making industry, incentivizing longer sentences funded by taxpayer money. (26:41–27:27)
• The imbalanced justice system means wealthy defendants have far better chances against the state, while most are crushed financially. (27:50–28:20)
• Lyn stresses outrageous sentences can raise public awareness and force reform conversations.

8. MACS: Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing

• Lyn explains her motivation and the scope of MACS—it’s not just for mothers, but led by one to harness that powerful symbolism:

  “Well, my main point and my purpose is to use my talent as a big mouth, basically...shine a light on this.” (17:50)

• Call to action to support, donate, spread awareness, and join the movement for more humane sentencing.

  “Go to the Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing website…cruelsentencing.org” (21:23)
  “If you had a mother...there you go.” (20:48)

9. On Justice, Hope, and Faith

• Lyn shares the powerful role of her faith in sustaining her through the ordeal:

  “I was kind of just woke up from sleep and I heard he will be free...I always would remind myself...I believe God told me he will be free.” (36:40)

• Her message: never give up. Ross’s freedom proves miracles can happen when people persist. (38:28)

  “You moved the mountain.” (38:24)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Significance of Freedom:
  "You don't realize what a gift your freedom is until you lose it." – Lyn Ulbricht (00:00; 13:50)

• On Sentencing Injustice:
  "That's kind of like slavery's bad. So everyone's free—except you, because you're still a slave. So, sorry. Bad timing." (26:42)

• On the Economics of Prison:
  “The prisons...It's the largest item on the DOJ list of expenses...There’s a lot of money in it.” (27:07)

• On the Power of Persistence:
  “Don’t give up, you know, and we can change things. Ross’s freedom proves that. The odds of that were so miniscule, it’s a miracle.” (38:28)

• On the Role of Advocacy:
  "My main purpose is to use my talent as a big mouth, basically...shine a light on this." (17:50)

• On the Damage to Families:
  "You’re not only punishing…the criminal, but his family and his children. And we could do better than this." (32:52)

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:00–01:12: Lyn reflects on loss of freedom; critique of the war on drugs and crypto.
• 02:18–03:41: Impact of the prison justice panel at a major crypto conference; the invisible suffering of “crypto POWs.”
• 06:44–10:27: The call announcing Ross’s pardon; family’s surreal reunion.
• 13:50–14:52: Ross’s recovery and post-release life.
• 15:35–17:47: Eighth Amendment, cruel sentencing, and the generational toll on families.
• 23:13–24:13: Extreme examples: life for shoplifting; thousands still locked up for cannabis despite legalization.
• 26:41–27:27: U.S. incarceration economics, and reform battles.
• 29:03–35:03: The vital importance of attention to cruel and unusual sentencing, not just for high-profile cases but for all such injustices.
• 36:40–38:28: Lyn’s faith, final reflections, and her enduring message of hope.

---

Additional Resources & Call to Action

• Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing: cruelsentencing.org or search on X/Twitter and Facebook.

• Other Justice Reform Groups Mentioned:

  • Last Prisoner Project
  • Crypto Prisoners
  • Free Samurai

• How to Help:

  • Donate, volunteer, or share information to help reform the justice system.
  • Support campaigns for fair sentencing and clemency for nonviolent offenders.

---

Closing Reflection

Lyn Ulbricht’s story is ultimately about the power of determined action and the profound cost of injustice—not just to one person, but to families, communities, and society. Her faith, resilience, and commitment to continue the fight, even after achieving the “miracle” of her son’s release, inspire all who care about justice, human dignity, and the right not to be forgotten.

---

Transcript

[Lynn Albrecht]

I could not live my life without my dying breath trying to get him out of that situation. You don't realize what a gift your freedom is until you lose it. That's kind of like slavery's bad, so everyone's free except you because you're still a slave. So sorry. Bad timing. They're never going to end the drug war. It's too lucrative. They get a lot of money. He said, I'm going to give your son unconditional pardon. And I'm like, oh, my God. And then he goes, tell them to stay clean, which is so Trump to me.

[Podcast Host]

So what do you think about the justice system in the United States?

[Lynn Albrecht]

War on crypto has been declared over by President Trump, but we have POWs from that war still in prison. There are colleagues, bitcoin colleagues, sitting in cages right now, and we can change things. Ross's freedom cross proves that the odds of that were so minuscule, it's a miracle.

[Podcast Host]

Hello, welcome to another episode of youf're the Voice frat here from Vegas 2026. We're on day three, the last day of the conference, and I have the honor of sitting here with Lynn Albrecht. Hey, Lynn, how are you?

[Lynn Albrecht]

I am good. It's day three, so it's.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. So the voice is a little bit crackling for me, too. Thank you very much for agreeing to have this conversation. We had a, I think a very important panel 2. Two days ago on the main stage here in which you have voiced not only the injustice that was done for us, but also the larger phenomena that exists today. Wrong prosecutions, but also cruel injustice and sentences that are being imposed on people that may have not committed crimes that are so severe. So do you want to first start with what were your takeaways from the panel? We did, and then we'll keep on with the questions.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Sure. I thought it went really well, and I've gotten feedback all day yesterday how some people said it was the most impactful event they went to all day, which was great to hear.

[Podcast Host]

Amazing.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And how, you know. Yeah, it really, I think, got people's attention, seeing Lauren Rodriguez, husband in prison up there. It's very moving. And our main goal, or mine, anyway, is to shine a light on this, because a lot of people here aren't even aware of it.

[Podcast Host]

Correct.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah. And that there are colleagues, bitcoin colleagues, sitting in cages right now, and they haven't hurt anybody. And a lot of it's kind of what I understand from the lawyers is questionable tactics in terms of their charges. So I was happy about it getting out there a little more. And just we kept on going. I'm carrying around, I guess it's over there by samurai. So we can bring samurai and. And then there's ones for other. Well, that someone bring the big one. But anyway, there's that. But that's Mothers Against Cruelty Sentencing. But I will carry that other thing anyway. It's a big. I just showed the same.

[Podcast Host]

Ah, the free samurai.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Sorry. We'll bring it. Leaving a trail here, but yeah. And we have one for Roman Sterlingoff. Thank you. Yeah. So, yes, this. It's. Code is not a crime. And my point is, it's. The war on crypto has been declared over by President Trump, but we have POWs from that war still in prison. And so, come on, this isn't right. And bitcoin and crypto in general is a big block of votes and funds, and I feel like the community should step up like they did for Ross, and we can do this. And it also is a. It protects bitcoin in a sense. This is not something. A crime that you need to attack. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So oftentimes, I think bitcoiners think that in order to keep bitcoin decentralized and secure, they have to look at the different layers of a protocol and make sure that they are secure. Like the miners and the nodes and the code itself, the maintainers that are handling the code and obviously the users and the rules. However, there's a very large part of the protocol, I would say, which is the social, legal, public discourse around it, that also needs to be taken care of. If we are not the ones to secure that. The narratives around Bitcoin, the ideas that society holds about bitcoin, Is it a criminal act to want to have financial privacy and financial autonomy? We are the ones also given the responsibility to hold that torch and to make sure that that layer of the protocol is secure.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Right. And I think it's come a long way, Right. Since Ross's trial, where half. Most of the jury had never heard of it.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And then it was this dark, you know, kind of thing that was mysterious and, you know, evil and criminal. Well, now it's all over the place. Right.

[Podcast Host]

Now the governments use it.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah. Right. So they're the ones after it.

[Podcast Host]

Correct.

[Lynn Albrecht]

So I think this is another case. And there's like five. We had five or seven on a sheet. There's. There's more, of course. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And there's Roman, the tornado cache.

[Lynn Albrecht]

There's two Romans.

[Podcast Host]

Two Romans, yes.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Ian Freeman in New Hampshire and others. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

All Right, let's take it forward. So Ross is home. What it was actually like when you heard about the news, when you understood that that's reality and it's coming home.

[Lynn Albrecht]

It was very surreal, actually. But we were hoping almost 12 years. And it had always been fervent prayer and hoping and working and talking and doing everything to not let him be forgotten.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Because that's what happens in prison. People are. You know, we don't think about the prisoners. They're all over there on their. I don't know. So it was a long time, but we kind of had word that it was maybe going to come and, you know, some kind of clemency. Certainly not a party. We didn't. Never expected a party, but something. Because he had a double life plus 40 year sentence without parole.

[Podcast Host]

Wow.

[Lynn Albrecht]

That's a death sentence.

[Podcast Host]

That is a death sentence.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah. And as Ross said, yeah, it's a death sentence. It just takes longer. Yeah. And I could not live my life without my dying breath trying to get him out of that situation. It's just not right. But when I heard, actually the president's office called me, but I was in another room. I missed the call. So I came back and I look at my phone and I'm like, what? Who called me? The president. Will I talk to him? Yes, I will talk to him. So I called back. It was a text saying, call this number if you. I'm like, yeah. I'm like. So he gets on the phone and he said, I'm going to.

[Podcast Host]

It was here.

[Lynn Albrecht]

It was the man himself, unmistakably. Wow. And he said, I'm going to give your son an unconditional pardon. And I'm like, oh, my God. You know, I was just blubbering, essentially. I was like, oh, my God. Thank you. Oh, my God. And then he read me the whole part on the phone. And then when we were getting off, he. And I'm of course, thanking him profusely, and I am so grateful to him, but. And then he goes, tell him to stay clean. Which is so trump to me. But anyway. And then I'm like, don't worry, he will.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, yeah.

[Lynn Albrecht]

So. Oh, yeah, you bet. Yeah, no problem there. So, yeah, and then we. We didn't really get word from Ross. We were thinking we would hear a call or something, but we just all jumped in the car and we were in Tucson, where the prison was, and went down there.

[Podcast Host]

And how long did it take from the call until he was actually out?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, yeah, I mean, it was meant to drive down there. Right. We get there and there's a couple of guards, just a couple of guards at the gate. It was already dark. It. It was night. Yeah. And all these media people had been wanting to be there, make a whole thing. Nobody was there. He was very laid back and took our names. Who are you? But they knew what was going on. And Ross's wife Caroline, they had her come and suddenly he's driving out with his little plant.

[Podcast Host]

No way. Like that.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Oh, she was driving and stopped. And we were all like, oh, my God. It was so. Because he was in his sweats out of those walls, which were right there in the background that he had been confined in what is real scene. It was just. It was really kind of a surreal, amazing miracle moment. It really was. And we had taken a. In the hopes of he would get out, as Trump had promised. Right. So we were kind of betting on that and I did trust that he'd do it. And we were just got a big Airbnb and had a week together as a family. It was amazing. So wonderful. It was amazing.

[Podcast Host]

So miracles do come sometimes.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And he's. Ross, you know, he's out, he's, you know, so and so, you know, that's what inspired me to do Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing because I know what it's like for the families, for the kids and for the people. And so I'm just like, well, I have a lot of connections. I've, I've done a lot of speaking. I have some skills to bring to the table. I'm going to help them, you know, I need to help them as I can, you know.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

Ever find yourself needing cash but refusing to sell your bitcoin? That's real life for many bitcoiners. Because most bitcoin sells aren't financial decisions, they're liquidity decisions. And that's exactly what LEDN solves. LEDN is the global leader in Bitcoin backed lending. They've issued over $10 billion in loans since 2018, with a perfect track record for protecting client assets. Here's what makes LEDN different. With their custody loans, your Bitcoin collateral is not lent out to generate interest. No credit checks, no monthly payments, and no penalties for early repayments. You apply in minutes and you repay whenever you want. LEDN also publishes proof of reserves reports every six months with full transparency. So if your capital is in Bitcoin, but your expenses are not, you still have options. LEDN lets you unlock liquidity without selling your Bitcoin. Learn more@LEDN IO Efrat that's LEDN IO you're the voice is brought to you by Trezor, the original Bitcoin hardware wallet company pioneering the development of self custody for crypto assets since 2013. Empowering individuals with an open source device enabling beginners and experts to easily and securely hold their coins. I find my Trezor super easy to use and recommend it to my friends and family. Enjoy my 5% discount on Trezor products by clicking the link in the show notes and and using the code.

[Podcast Host]

It is so noble of you. It's so amazing because, you know, anyone that have gone through what you've gone through in those 12 years could just say, okay, I am so tired. I need to rest a little bit

[Lynn Albrecht]

after everything I've done. That is true too.

[Podcast Host]

I know, but I'm sure you are balancing both acts, which is very noble. Oh, you don't have to do that.

[Lynn Albrecht]

I kind of feel like in the

[Podcast Host]

fight again, you know, it's amazing.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah, it is different. You had asked that right before during our panel. It is different. It's not the desperation and the emotional roller coaster. Of course, I'm not as attached to the outcome. Couldn't do that again. I don't think I could. I think it would kill me. But I do care. Every once in a while I feel I can't do this. I'm tired. Then I'm like, I think of the people I know I met in there. I know it. And I'm like, I've been giving. I think God wants me to. I do. Of course. I really do. I feel like, you know, hey, you got this. I gave you this. Pass it on.

[Podcast Host]

Yes, pass it on. It's incredible. How is Ross doing today? I'm sure many people want to know. He's okay.

[Lynn Albrecht]

He is okay. He's great. He's like, I'm free. You know, it's fantastic. And he's appreciating that a lot. He's also, I would call it maybe cocooning. Yes. You know, where, you know, he's not here. This is a lot, you know, and everyone would want to talk to him and he just isn't. He's not ready for that. But yeah, he's happy, you know, he's very happy to be free. And it's such. You don't realize what a gift your freedom is and you lose it.

[Podcast Host]

Does he try to put together like a good routine?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Oh, yeah, he definitely, It's. He definitely has a routine which always starts with meditation.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Lynn Albrecht]

He still. That's what really helped him get through his ordeal. So he became a very skilled meditator. So he's very disciplined about that. Wow. Yeah. And exercise and all of that. And you know, just like he has. He definitely has a routine. He eats really clean because he had such horrible food, of course, for all those years. And is his health better?

[Podcast Host]

I remember he was sharing that he had some rough patches near his back

[Lynn Albrecht]

and with his back. I think his back. As far as I know, his back's good.

[Podcast Host]

Good. Excellent. I'm very happy to hear that.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Thank you.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. Ross case became a flashpoint for conversations about. I always say this word gone. Prosecutorial.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Prosecutorial. It's a. It's a tough.

[Podcast Host]

Yes. And also mandatory minimums and the war on drugs. For someone just encountering his story, what do you most want them to understand about what was done to him wrongly?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, it's a lot of my. The background or the foundation of Max is the 8th amendment of the Constitution, Bill of Rights, which prohibits cruel and unusual punishment. And by any standard, a young first time offender, no violent charges at all to be given, have his whole life taken. It's pretty cruel. And actually I wish it were more unusual. It used to be, but since the drug war in the 1980s, the sentences have gotten longer and longer. And I don't think it's necessary. There's a congressional act called the Sentencing Reform act that says a sentence should be no longer than necessary. That was way longer than necessary. He never would have reoffended after a week, never mind his whole life. It's very cruel. And it's not only cruel to the person who gets the sentence, but their families. It's heartbreaking. And children and I would go into the prison to visit him. And I remember one little boy, you had to go up in an lr. Same prison that Jeffrey Epstein was in and El Chapo and kind of high profile people because you go under a tunnel to get to the courthouse. It's a whole thing. So anyway, I remember him going with me up in the elevator. He says, I love my dad T shirt. He was so excited and happy and couldn't wait to see his father. And it was all over him in the visiting room and in his lap. And then he had to be torn away. And he broke down in that elevator and he was so hurt and he was so, you know, bereft that he wasn't. Had to leave his father again, you know. And I don't know. It's harming those kids. And statistically they'll probably end up in jail too. A lot of families fall apart, and a lot of it's just not necessary.

[Podcast Host]

So what does Max do?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, my main point and my main purpose is to use my talent as a big mouth, basically. We love that. Just call shine a light on this, because I don't think a lot of people realize. Well, first of all, I know they don't realize how horrible prison is, because I didn't even fully realize it. I did over time, but when Ross gave his speech at Freedom Fest last year, and he described some of the things, and I was like, ross, you didn't even tell me that. He said, I didn't want to. I didn't want to tell you.

[Podcast Host]

I was there in the.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Oh, you were there.

[Podcast Host]

I was there. I spoke at that conference, and I saw his speech, and I was shocked of some of those things.

[Lynn Albrecht]

He was crying. I know I was crying. He was crying, but it was just. It's awful to hear. I still.

[Podcast Host]

He was telling about some of his friends or other prisoners.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And what they went through. Oh, my God.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Permanent damage. Physical. Permanent damage.

[Podcast Host]

Permanent damage. You can find that speech on YouTube.

[Lynn Albrecht]

It's online.

[Podcast Host]

It's online, right?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah, yeah. Yep. Absolutely.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lynn Albrecht]

So. And even just the loss of your whole life, you know, look, I have said to many people I was talking to about Rossism and legislators that I would go talk to. Can we all say that we never made a mistake in our 20s? And I've had them go, oh, whoa, no, I wouldn't want to have my mistakes known. These are congressmen. And we kind of laughed, but it's true. And Ross was 26 and full of idealism and had to, you know, and he's still an idealistic person. Sure. I am, too. But he's an adult. He's 42, you know, and. And these life sentences don't give an option to grow out of it, to be reformed and all of that. And he said at that speech that he thought that at least 50%, as a conservative estimate of people that are in there, shall be there. Right. And he's not the only one who's told me that. Leonard Picard said the same.

[Podcast Host]

So Max stands for Mothers Against Cruel Sentencing. So is it really predominantly for mothers to step up and.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, it's hardly. It's anybody.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Right. But I think because I'm a mother and I'm leading it, and I think it's. I went round and round about it, actually, but I think it's a good brand, you know, mothers and in the prisons, Ross said it was almost Always. Not always, but it was the mothers who would never desert the mate. They would never. They would always stick by them. Other family members. I do know some very devoted fathers too, but of course, please help us. Whether you're a mother or not.

[Podcast Host]

Exactly.

[Lynn Albrecht]

If you had a mother, you know, there you go.

[Podcast Host]

Well, everyone had a mother.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Exactly.

[Podcast Host]

Everyone should participate in this. Fantastic. Where should people come and get more information?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah, at cruel sentencing is kind of where everything is on X or on X. Facebook mainly X as far as social media, I would say. But Facebook, Instagram, getting kind of slow start on social media. There's been a lot of great. And you can just also go. We do have it. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Google mothers again. Cruel sentencing and you'll get the website.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah, also. Well that [e-mail] too. Either one will get you there. And yeah, it's a non profit. You want to save some money on your taxes, you know, help us. You know, it just gets the word out, this lean thing. At this point, because of my own personal limitations of being overwhelmed, I'm going to. I'm kind of working with other organizations who can do things that a nonprofit can't do like lobby for an individual or help with legal issues and all. I just, I can't do that. I'm not exactly that stuff.

[Podcast Host]

But. And there are professionals who are really

[Lynn Albrecht]

good at it and organizations that are set up already and have a whole team, you know, so join forces.

[Podcast Host]

Absolutely. Very smart. You said that the pardon was a victory but not the end. What does the end actually look like to you?

[Lynn Albrecht]

I did. I think so. No, no, I'm not denying it. That sounds good.

[Podcast Host]

I think I took it from one of your like right after the pardon.

[Lynn Albrecht]

But maybe because I was thinking about that, because I had been thinking about this for a few years, a couple of years, because I kept getting letters from people, mostly mothers, telling about their kid who got some ridiculous. Even if it's not like some of these huge sentences, even if it was one boy, I remember he got 16 years for a minor drug thing or whatever. For his age, 16 years was a life changing sentence. Overkill. But I've also come across unbelievable things like the ACLU talked about Ronald Washington, I think his name is. He stole two jackets and it was his third shoplifting offense. He was a habitual offender. He got life.

[Podcast Host]

What?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Life in prison in Louisiana for.

[Podcast Host]

For stealing jackets.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Jackets. You know, I mean this is America. This isn't right.

[Podcast Host]

And Lynn, correct me if I'm wrong now there are some states in the United States. I, I believe Democratic, that there are actually legislation in place to allow them to do shoplifting without touching them. So it's like.

[Lynn Albrecht]

That's a good point.

[Podcast Host]

Irony.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And it's true.

[Podcast Host]

What's going on. Like this guy.

[Lynn Albrecht]

That's true. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

A life sentence and here you're allowing people to do shoplifting with. With nothing.

[Lynn Albrecht]

That's not Louisiana. And I'm not saying absolutely, but I'm

[Podcast Host]

like, what's going on? Where is there close sense? Where is justice?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Where is like consistency? There's close to the figure. I've gotten different figures. But close to 3,000 people serving long or life sentences for marijuana, for cannabis.

[Podcast Host]

Oh my God, 3,000.

[Lynn Albrecht]

That's really crazy.

[Podcast Host]

While they are legalizing it everywhere, not just in the United States, all around

[Lynn Albrecht]

the world, it's being legalized and three people for life. Some of them.

[Podcast Host]

Why don't they just blanket release.

[Lynn Albrecht]

I keep hoping they will, you know, once it's. The schedule changes or whatever. It's horrible destroying people's lives over. And they're young, a lot of them are dumb, you know, whatever. But young people do stuff. You know, it's a friend of Ross in prison. He knew in prison he was pardoned by President or commuted sentences commuted by President Trump. And he had life. He was serving life in Colorado where it was legal on a state level, but he was in a prison in Colorado for life.

[Podcast Host]

Why?

[Lynn Albrecht]

It's a federal case.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, my God. That's incredible.

[Lynn Albrecht]

It's not right.

[Podcast Host]

So what do you think about the than the justice system in the United States?

[Lynn Albrecht]

I think it needs some reforming. Right. And certainly is it always like down

[Podcast Host]

at the list of things that are of importance to the administration to get to.

[Lynn Albrecht]

You know, this administration actually has been good on. You know, Trump brought in the First Step act, which helped with the Third Strike act, which had come from the Clinton administration. Where on your third strike, like the jacket guy. Yes, I know people serving life on that. Peaceful people. It's not violent charges. One friend of Ross in there serving life for having a user amount of meth in his pocket. And it was his third strike. He was an addict. And I've talked to his sister, I've met his daughter. Life sentence for that. And it's too much. You know, it's too. It is cruel to the whole family, to the community sometimes. Absolutely. But Trump mitigated it to 25 years as your third strike, which he had to fight for that and there were others on board with that and he had to fight for it. And Actually, some people in Congress didn't want it to be retroactive. So if you already had a third strike, it didn't fix your thing.

[Podcast Host]

Only the new ones.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Only the new ones. And I'm like, well, that's kind of like slavery's bad. So everyone's free except you because you're still a slave. So, you know, sorry, bad timing. What? It's a big money making thing too. The prisons. The prisons. They get what I've been told. Subsidies, taxpayer. Huge. It's the largest item on the DOJ list of expenses. Right. To build and maintain and house in these giant, huge prisons. Super expensive. There's a lot of money in it.

[Podcast Host]

And the citizens pay for it.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah. Billions of dollars.

[Podcast Host]

Or they print more money.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, both. We know how it works, so it's a lot of incentive. I had someone who was working against all of this and he's in law enforcement, but he had leap, his organization, Law Enforcement Against Prohibition. He said, they're never going to end the drug war. It's too lucrative. They get a lot of money.

[Podcast Host]

It's an engine. Right.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Big and kind of to come up against it is so daunting. It's like, wow. And they have unlimited money to go after you. So I know what, you know, the samurai and these other guys are facing. They're. She, you know, Lauren was saying she's terribly in debt. Right. You know, just for an appeal, you know, so it's a rough. If you have enough money, you can raise enough money. It helps a lot of money.

[Podcast Host]

People don't think about that side of the fight.

[Lynn Albrecht]

I certainly never did. Right.

[Podcast Host]

You know, you're like, okay, if I have a good way to convince them that this is wrong and if I have all the right things to say, maybe that's enough.

[Lynn Albrecht]

No, it helps. But yes. Yeah. It's like with, I think like the sentencing, which is what I'm focused on because it's so like the guy with the jackets. Everyone has your reaction. They're like, what? You know, and I think Ross's outrageous sentence actually helped us. And Trump himself was saying, he said to me and to others, a sentence, I just, that's horrible sentence, you know, And I think it helped because what are you going to do with that sentence?

[Podcast Host]

A lot of awareness.

[Lynn Albrecht]

It needs to be corrected. And if it had been just 20 years, which is very long, I don't think it would have had the shock appeal. And that helped. So outrageous, you know.

[Podcast Host]

Right. And that's where I always go to say, you know, maybe God's way is to rattle us so badly so that we wake up of that slumber sleep to the point.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And I think this is what Ross case may have done to a lot of people, which is great. So we just need to help Lauren push through.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And the others.

[Podcast Host]

There's always.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Of course, I always want to throw that in.

[Podcast Host]

You are 100% right.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah. She was on the panel, but there was a. There was a panel later with my friend Sasha Hodder, who's a lawyer maturating and mentor Eklund and my other friend who's the lawyer for Roman Stroganoff. Sterling Off. Not Beef Stroganoff. Look at these names. But. And you know, it's. It's horrible. He's Tor says he's innocent and. But I feel like even if he's not innocent, what would he do? Something so horrible that he needs to be in prison for 12 years. He's already served, what, five. Prison's a horrible place. It's not like, you know, people are like, oh, put them away. They don't understand what they're saying.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, it's very cruel. It brings me back always to, you know, the spiritual war that I think we're in right now.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Oh, absolutely.

[Podcast Host]

Battling evil on so many different levels.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Absolutely.

[Podcast Host]

In so many different places and battlegrounds and prisons and the judicial system is one of them.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

I want to introduce you to Abundant Mines because they take a very different approach to bitcoin mining. Most people buy bitcoin, but the smart ones mine it straight into self custody. With Abundant Mines, you can do it without giving up your privacy. Abundant Mines was founded by Beau and Christine Marie Turner, a couple who lost more than half a million dollars to providers making empty promises. Instead of walking away, they built a company that raises the industry standard and puts client first. And that's why I like. With Abundant Mines, you own your machines, they never touch your bitcoin, never skim a revenue share, and you choose your own mining pool. Their customer care is unusual. Clients speak to a real person for self custody, education, privacy consulting, and even visiting their site. They serve clients from around the world, but US investors specifically enjoy a big tax benefit and 100% bonus depreciation. This is more than just mining bitcoin. It's about freedom, privacy, and purpose. You can book a free strategy call, see how it works, and mine some of your first bitcoin for free with a special offer for my audience. Learn more on abundantminds.com effort.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah, Ross did a little experiment in prison where he took a survey of the fellow prisoners and said, if you could choose between torture, real torture, like flogging, burning, pulling out your nails, whatever, the rack, whatever, and that. And serving your time. Decades, you know, a lot of them had a long time. Which would you choose? And they all said, give me the torture. I want that physical torture to get it over with. I'll do it. Let me pay my thing and get it over with. And that proves to me it's. It's torture. To them. It's torture.

[Podcast Host]

Yes.

[Lynn Albrecht]

You know, they. Yeah, so, okay, bring it up. Bring it all back. Do it. That's, you know, but don't keep people. Don't steal their lives, their time and their family, you know, and core families. Yes, I knew all my life. Well, but we kind of make friends with the other prisoners. And actually I ended up running into her in New York and then Chicago. I'm like, at prisons, I'm like, we have to stop beating like this kind of thing. But she was lovely and she lived in New York, tough neighborhood, raising good kids that are getting good grades, all that. And she said once their dad was put in prison, everything started block. It was just difficult. And they were kind of running wild now and all of this stuff. So it's not only the. You're not only punishing, you know, the perpetrator, the criminal, but his family and his children. And we could do better than this.

[Podcast Host]

Absolutely.

[Lynn Albrecht]

You know, especially you start with the non violent. There's tons of those.

[Podcast Host]

The easier, the.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Yeah, it's not as risky. Other people could perhaps be reformed. But Ross and Leonard Picard, who also served life, was serving life and he is now free, thank God. Both said, you have to have some prisons. There are prisons. It's not like I'm an abolitionist. No prisons. Because there are dangerous people in prisons that we need and the point is to protect us. So they both agree. Now, we knew people in there that they maybe eventually, but maybe never. You know, Ross said it's easily more than half, probably a lot more than half could be safely released. And they're decent people that maybe made mistakes, but let's have them make due restitution to their victims, which often there's no victims named, you know, community service, wear an ankle bracelet, all this stuff. Yes. They don't need to be in a cage.

[Podcast Host]

Sure.

[Lynn Albrecht]

At the taxpayer's expense, which is pretty expensive to support, you know, all of these bad apparatus and their medical and their, you know, which is terrible. But, you know, and their food and everything and the staffs and the guards. It's all very expensive.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, so let's end with a call to action. Go to the Mothers Against Cruel Sentences website or social media channels. Crypto prisoners. There's also a website for that, right, the cryptic prisoners.

[Lynn Albrecht]

There are websites for that.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And one of the things I do want to do is start again working with, but also supporting other groups that are. I'm not focused on prisoner. I can't. I focus on one thing. Right. And it's these sentences. They all want to get out. But there are groups that do wonderful things for, you know, people in there, and I totally support that. Of course.

[Podcast Host]

Yes.

[Lynn Albrecht]

So. But I don't have that capacity for. Sure.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, it makes sense. As you said. I just want to make sure that people are aware that it exists.

[Lynn Albrecht]

So.

[Podcast Host]

Crypto prisoners. Free samurai.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Billinkiani.org There's a last Prisoner project who I've consulted with and want to help and work with. They've gotten people out, but they also work on things like, you know, quality of life and letter writing campaigns and that kind of thing. A lot of the criminal justice organizations do that.

[Podcast Host]

Wonderful.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Any last words?

[Podcast Host]

Anything you want to leave our audience with, where you draw your hope from?

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, for me, really, we've touched on it. Is that for me, I really felt that I was relying a lot on my faith and took things one day at a time. I had a very interesting experience at early days. I was kind of just woke up from sleep and I heard he will be free. And it wasn't in my ears and it wasn't a thought. I heard it and I'm like, oh, my God. And that was years before Ross was pardoned. But I always would remind myself, no, I believe God told me he will be free. And I was. I would, you know, I felt I was divinely led. Things opened up and, oh, I can talk to this person. Oh, I can. As I. I think I mentioned, barge in on President Trump while he was having dinner, because there was a space. And I just went, you know, scary things and, you know, like, okay, I'm going for it. But, you know, just in. In many ways protected and led. And so, I don't know, I guess, you know, that's. That's my personal thing. But I do believe in prayer when people are praying all over the world. Yes. So I would. I know there are a lot of people who don't believe in that, but I'm not saying. I'm just saying for me personally, but also, just don't give up. I mean, yes, like, keep going and keep going and we can change things. Ross's freedom proves that. The odds of that were so miniscule, it's a miracle.

[Podcast Host]

You moved the mountain.

[Lynn Albrecht]

It did. Yes. It really did.

[Podcast Host]

Yes.

[Lynn Albrecht]

And, you know, don't give up, you know, and we can change things in this country. There's a lot of people who agree that this needs to be reformed. And, you know, I think that let's do it. You know, I'm nobody. Seriously. It's like I'm. Like, I'm a mom and I'm going to make. Make this happen. Sometimes I have to. And we can all be that individual who makes a difference.

[Podcast Host]

You're a very important, significant, lovely nobody. You're great. Thank you so much, Lynn, for everything you do.

[Lynn Albrecht]

I'm sure.

[Podcast Host]

I'm also speaking on behalf of my audience. You're incredible, and I appreciate everything you do.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Well, thank you for having the panel. Being the best panel organizer ever. Really were prepping us and everything and. Yeah. And just, you know, shine yourself shining a light on these things.

[Podcast Host]

Absolutely. I'll continue from my side. Thank you so much for being on this show.

[Lynn Albrecht]

Happy to be here. Yes.

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

Thanks for being with us. Please take a minute to give this episode a like a comment and subscribe or follow and please share it with your friends so they can also get value value and choose to take some positive action in their lives. Till next time.