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- [00:00]
A
Hey, welcome to the All Pro Dad Podcast. I'm Ted Lowe, and today, our big question to start us off is this. How do we help our kids learn from and embrace failures? In this episode, we talk about why failure is inevitable and it's actually essential for our kids. Why it's so hard for dads to watch our kids fail without jumping in, and how we can respond in ways that build confidence, resilience, and character. I'm joined today by BJ Foster and Bobby Lewis, and we're sharing stories and research and practical ways to help our kids embrace failure without letting it define them. Let's jump into it, you guys. How do we help our kids learn from and embrace failure? How do we help our kids learn from and embrace failure?
- [00:47]
B
It's a worthwhile question. What are your biggest failures from when you were growing up?
- [00:51]
A
Gosh, how long you got, buddy?
- [00:53]
B
I mean, we got all day. How many stories you got?
- [00:55]
A
You know, the one when I think about being a kid, it just could be more. The most embarrassing moment is fifth grade basketball. You know, I decide, you know, that I'm going to run down and I'm going to defend the ball, thinking we're about to score, and I'm going to be the one on the other end of the court. I'm going to be ready. I thought we had scored. We had not. But I had run all the way to the other end, and the coach goes, ted, Ted. I turn around all the actions on the other end. Everybody's looking at me, and I was like, oh, this is the worst.
- [01:28]
B
I'm real confused how you thought you'd scored. It's pretty obvious that the ball either goes in the hoop or it doesn't.
- [01:34]
A
Bobby, we've done a lot of podcasts together, and you're still wondering.
- [01:37]
B
I'm just wondering. The ball goes in. That's the score. Well, if it didn't go in, then you didn't score.
- [01:43]
A
Well, that just shows that I believe in my teammates more than you.
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B
I guess so.
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A
Yeah, that's how that works.
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C
He thought it had happened.
- [01:49]
A
Yeah.
- [01:49]
C
I think probably the number one failure for me was a speech I gave in seventh grade where I and I talked about that on a different episode. So I think I'll go different on this one. My baseball team, when I was in Little League, was in the championship game, and we were down by a run and had a guy on second with two outs. And I came up to the plate and the kid on the mound was, this is Little League. So I was 10 years old 9, 10 years old, and he was throwing 60 miles an hour. And that might as well. In Little League. That might as well be 150, for sure.
- [02:29]
B
Yeah.
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C
And so I struck out to. To end the championship game and just kind of came back to the dugout and sat by myself. Everybody was just silent, head down. And.
- [02:42]
A
So no one said anything to you?
- [02:43]
C
No, no one said anything to me. I think my coach, he might have said something as I was headed back to the dugout, but I didn't hear. Whatever it was. I didn't hear it. I don't. And the hard thing was, is I don't think people were expecting me. Like, that's, you know, like, I could just feel it as I went up to the plate.
- [03:02]
B
Like, they knew the season was over.
- [03:03]
C
As you watched, they all were like, this is. There's not going to be a success here.
- [03:09]
A
And so was there any conversation with your parents afterwards, later on that day, or.
- [03:14]
C
They just let it die down to my dad, always. So I grew up a huge. And to this day, I still am a huge Phillies fan. Philadelphia Phillies fan. And he used to always say, mike Schmidt strikes out. So Mike, he doesn't strike out with the regularity that I do, but not that often.
- [03:34]
B
He's talking about that hall of Famer dad. Yeah, you're right.
- [03:37]
C
He does occasionally hits a home run, dad. But I seem to strike out all the time when I get up there.
- [03:42]
B
So failure, I mean, that's just part of growing up. But as we were thinking about this and talking about failure, it made me do some research on famous people who have failed. You mentioned Mike Schmidt. I came across a story about J.K. rowling, who you may know as the author of the Harry Potter series. Just millions and millions of copies of these books sold. Billionaire, like, super famous person, right? You think? All right, well, she hasn't failed very much. Right. Well, in the late 90s, she had just recently been divorced. She's a single mom on welfare, trying to, like, sell some copies of anything she's written, and nobody wanted any of it. And I was kind of looking into that, and I was like, oh, wow. Like, you just kind of assume successful people were always successful. But no, she was failing quite a lot in her pursuit to become an author. So much so that when she finally got a publisher to take her first edition of the Harry Potter series, the first of the seven books, the guy said, okay, well, you probably should go get another job because there's no money in this. You're probably not going to make a Dime from this book, but we'll publish it because we think maybe it has potential to sell a couple of copies here or there. But he didn't even believe in her. And she didn't think anything would come of it. Obviously became super successful. Well, she spoke at the graduation commencement speech for Harvard in 2008. And I really want to share this quote because you think she'd talk about successes, but she actually spoke about failure to the graduates. Here's what she said. You might never fail on the scale that I did, but some failure in life is inevitable. It is impossible to live without failing at something unless you live so cautiously that you might as well not have lived at all, in which case you fail by default. And I thought that was an incredible quote. Basically, she's saying that failure is essential to becoming who you are.
- [05:25]
A
How do your kids feel about failure? When you think about. How do they. How do they respond to it?
- [05:31]
C
I mean, I think my kids. I think my kids are okay with it. Like, they. I mean, you know, failure is never easy, but I think they've. Yeah, I've tried to treat it with a little bit of humor like that. It is inevitable. We were at a. We were at one of those ropes courses one year, and, gosh, I. I think my son was like 11 or 12, and they had one of those. The wall, the ninja warrior course wall. That's kind of like an arc up and you gotta.
- [06:08]
B
That sets everybody up for failure.
- [06:09]
C
Yeah, exactly. And you wanna. You have to run up and grab it and then pull yourself up. And he did one of the lower ones. And then I think he did the mid one. And I said, try the big one. And when he went for that one, I filmed him and I filmed it in slow motion. And he comes running up and eyes wide and goes running up and his hand goes up and it's like the top of the wall. It's like he kind of hits the very top and he just starts sliding down and in slow motion. It's absolutely spectacular. And so I put it to the music. I believe I can fly. And he just kind of hits and goes down. And so then we sort of joked that. I said, I'm going to put together a website called ww.lukefails.com and make a whole videos on his failures. And so just trying to. I just sort of try to make light of the fact that we're gonna fail. And it happens and we can laugh from it and learn from. And sometimes they're sometimes really painful and we can learn from Them. So I think my kids are okay with it.
- [07:35]
A
Bobby, what about you?
- [07:36]
B
I think it depends on the size of the achievement they're trying to hit. If it's a little thing and they fail, okay, it's not that big a deal. But if it's really important to them, if they worked really hard on a project or they really want to achieve and they fall short, that's where the failure starts to hit a little bit harder for them. I think they're okay with the little stuff. Oh, I was trying to, you know, make this, you know, kick, you know, jump off the skateboard, and I didn't nail it. Okay, whatever. Like, it's not a big deal, but bigger stuff, they. They kind of worry about failing more.
- [08:08]
A
We've got four kids, and I think three of them are like, yeah, you know, it happens. And then my daughter, she's. She's a little bit more like me, a little bit more of a perfectionist. And so she's rough on herself, and she's so talented artistically. In fact, she has a. A page on Instagram, the tedshed.com. we'll put that in the show notes, where she just does all this different painting and she makes shirts and she does all these things, and it's incredible. And I see it like, how can you do this? I can't draw stick figures. This is amazing. But she'll only pick out what she perceives as flaws. And so I think kids kind of come in the world a little bit sometimes, wired with failures, more okay than others.
- [08:53]
B
I think my kids have picked up some of that from me, too, because I'm a little bit of a perfectionist. In fact, I just finished making coffee tables. A wooden epoxy river coffee table for our dining room.
- [09:04]
A
Like you do. Yeah, we all do.
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B
Just threw it together on the weekend, but it looks good. But people come over to our house. In fact, it just happened yesterday. Someone's like, oh, this is so cool. I love this. And all I see are the three or four flaws that I didn't get right. And that doesn't mean it's a failure, But I've pointed those out a couple times. I'm like, oh, so my wife. Yeah, this is not right. Or that's not quite right. And she's like, will you stop? It looks good. And I think my kids probably pick up on that for me, and maybe that bleeds over into the way they view failure. And I personally don't like it when they fail because I don't like to see them hurting. Or struggling or upset. It kind of makes me try harder to encourage, but that just kind of makes it worse sometimes.
- [09:44]
A
Sometimes.
- [09:45]
B
You know, is it hard for you guys to see your kids failing it?
- [09:49]
A
It is, it is. Especially my second son. He's, you know, he's a little harder on himself, like one of my daughters. And I just remember being outside and he's got the weed eater, you know, he's probably too young, but I'm like, you know, what do we got to lose? You know, some plants, who cares?
- [10:05]
B
Yeah.
- [10:05]
A
So he's over there and out doing it and I'm watching and he like, Nick's, you know, a shrub or whatever. And he looks at me, I'm like, who cares? And a little bit later, he keeps going. He, you know, hits another one. I'm like, buddy, it doesn't matter. And then I look and there's tear running down, down his face. And that's how he handles things. He won't say anything and he does not demonstrate with his face. But when I see that tear. I'd rather you punch me in the face. Yeah. Than to see that. So I hated to see that. It's impossible to talk him especially out of that. So I don't want to see him fail. And part of that is you see him hurting. The other thing is I don't do great with the emotions that come along with failure sometimes when they're making a big deal about it.
- [10:52]
C
No, no, it's not a big deal.
- [10:53]
A
Stop it. And so that's my flaw on this. Many flaws. But that's one of my flaws on this and handling their failure is me just trying to talk them out of being sad about it.
- [11:03]
C
I always worry when they fail. You know, it's, I, I try to have a sense, I try to have a sense of humor about it and I, I try to treat it like, like this is not the end of the world. You know, we're going to grow from this, that kind of thing. But there are, I do get concerned, boy, there's, there's a line from the movie Invincible with Mark Wahlberg where his dad is just kind of like there's almost so much. There's almost, there's only so much failure a man can take, you know. And so that kind of thing gets into me a little bit and where I hope that their failure is not a self esteem hit. And the biggest concern that I would have is that it becomes an identity. Like, not, I failed, but I'm a failure. That's what I am. And then it Becomes sort of this self fulfilling prophecy where they sort of envision failure as they walk into something. And that's what I don't want. It's envision success as you, you might experience failure, but envision success. See, see, see what's going to happen beforehand. I'd rather they go in there with that kind of mentality. But it's, I mean failure is one of those things again. Like I, I get concerned that it's going to be something that just destroys them, you know and I think a lot of parents probably do. Boy, it's, this is going to destroy my kids. I do think this is one of the things that this is one of the major negatives of video games because they're able to instantly achieve and so it's, it's, it's easy for them to kind of quit. Rather you know, getting hit with. Yeah. Because they're so used to getting instant success on video games and that's just not how the real world works. We, we go in, we butt up against something. We, we're just learning how to do this. We're learning how to do life, we're learning how to do relationships, we're learning how to do tasks. And of course we're gonna fail. You know, no one is ever gonna just jump into something and be great at everything. We're gonna fall short. And if that teaches us to persevere, then great. If we just kind of, if video games are teaching them to kind of like, oh it, the, the whole world is going to be instant success. And when they don't achieve instant success, they pack it in. You know that that's kind of a fear. Gosh. I like, don't let it be something that just completely takes you out of the game.
- [13:32]
A
Yeah.
- [13:32]
C
But, yeah, so like I think one of the things that we can do with our kids is just, just to normalize failure.
- [13:39]
A
Do you think that's what humor does? Cause I was gonna ask you. I think that's what it does to you.
- [13:43]
C
I hope it does that.
- [13:44]
A
How do you know this is a time for humor and this is not a time for humor? Like what's your gauge on that?
- [13:53]
C
Just think. I think, I think number one, if they're very upset, humor is not going to land. Like if they are, if they're tear filled, it's, it's not time for it yet. It'll, it'll, it'll, it'll probably be time for it later. But, but what you're talking about sitting, like the emotions, like I don't Want to deal with this when they're getting really down on themselves, Sitting with them and, you know, and. And asking them, boy, I, you know, it's. It's telling them, like, I'm sorry. I know how hard you worked. Like, read the room. Yeah, Reading the room. Validating. I. Look, I know how hard you worked on this. I know you had your hopes high on this, and you were really wanting something better. And this happens. I mean, there's a great clip Bobby shared about over the Summer Olympics. I think it was a diver, and she had just lost. She had performed well the day before and had a really rough go that day. And he said, I'm so proud of you. Even just saying something sincere, like, I'm so proud of the way she's from Britain.
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A
Yeah.
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C
You stepped out of there, and, boy, a lot of people admire what you do. And this is.
- [15:13]
B
And you made the Olympics.
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C
You made the Olympics. But he was like, this is what sports are.
- [15:18]
A
Is.
- [15:18]
C
He's normalizing it. This is what happens.
- [15:20]
A
Right?
- [15:21]
C
There's success, there's failure. Someday it's going to be your day. Someday it's not. And so. But it's important. This, this whole identity thing, like, just because you failed a task doesn't make you a failure as a person. That's good.
- [15:38]
B
Yeah.
- [15:38]
C
And that needs to. We need to communicate that to our kids. Sarah Blakely, who started the. Who started the organization Spanx, she used to say her. Her dad at dinner every night, he would ask them how they failed that day.
- [15:53]
B
That's a great question.
- [15:54]
C
Yeah, it is. Because if they hadn't failed at anything, then he. He would have the discussion in their family was that they didn't take any risks, that they didn't step out there and do anything challenging.
- [16:06]
A
Oh, of course, this happens today.
- [16:07]
C
This.
- [16:08]
A
We asked this question because this is something happened day. It's like saying, what happened to school today? Something happened. Where'd you feel today? I love that. Normalize it. Mark Merrill has a great line. He says, when failure is an option, children can gain wisdom. And I love that when it's. When it's an option, we can gain wisdom. One of the phrases that we use at our house is, we know tragedy and this isn't it. Or from. Depending if we're feeling more, you know, Southern will say, this ain't it. We know tragedy. This ain't it. And so the other day, you know, my daughter, she had made something or whatever and had not turned out exactly like she wanted it, and she stops very uncharacteristically and goes, well, we know tragedy and this ain't it. So it was just one of those moments.
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C
Yes.
- [16:55]
A
It's sticking with her to go, this is as big a deal as it's feeling right now. This just perspective, just perspective builder.
- [17:04]
B
I, I think as dads, one of the best things we can do for our kids is to remove the stigma around failure. Because there is one for sure and you mentioned it with identity. If you fail at this task, you are a failure. That's totally untrue. I think that when we do that, our kids are going to act more confidently, they're going to speak more confidently, they're just going to walk with their chest out a little bit more. Because failure is just a byproduct of ambition and discovery. When you're trying to do something and you fail, guess what? That's part of the process. You tried. That's what I want my kids to do. I don't want them to think that failure is negative. Failure is a positive if you're doing it with a good end goal. And so I think we should just remove that stigma. Tell kids if you're not failing, you're not trying. Get out there and try.
- [17:50]
A
The other thing I think we've got to do is, you know, we got to encourage failure. You know, we got to give them situations where they may not win and be okay with that. I have found that DIY projects is a great time to do that. Like if you've got, you know, a low risk, low impact thing, let, let them play and do a lot of DIY stuff around our house and you know, working on the deck, you know, hey, let's nail these boards down, right? And if you make a dent, who cares? You know, it's like doing the weed eater with my son. You know what, you hit the bush. Who cares? It's part of it, right?
- [18:23]
B
That just reminded me of a story recently. We were remodeling our bathroom and I don't fit very well under a sink. I don't know if you've noticed. I'm like, just, I just don't get under there very well. So I was like, come here 10 year old son. Get down there with a wrench. And he's like, okay, I'll do it. And I told him exactly what to do. Tighten it all. Turned the water right in his face because he did it lightning enough. Like, who cares? Like we can wipe up the water. You're trying it. Eventually he got it and he felt so proud that he fixed the sink and I was proud too, because I didn't hurt my back getting under the sink and all that sort of stuff
- [18:53]
A
gave him an opportunity to fail.
- [18:55]
B
Yeah, and, and he did, but it didn't matter because we wiped it up and then he fixed it. And so that was a really cool growth moment in our house.
- [19:03]
C
This is the time, like when our kids are this age that they can take opportunities to risk and learn and grow and fail. I kind of like to think of it like our kids are on a high wire act and they're just kind of walking across and we're the net underneath. Like right now they can do these things, they can fail, they can fall short, and then we can use this as an opportunity to help them grow, learn, build, and then build them back up when they get out into the world. The risks are probably going to be higher. You know, the net's not going to be there. And so, you know, now's the time to let them do it.
- [19:44]
A
Well, I think part of this is to define success differently, that failure's a part of this and that being successful doesn't mean you're flawless. That's not how, that's not how this works. You know, every example of anybody getting great at anything, you see the growth on it. I think too, they're watching us. How are we handling failure? Do they see us to get really, really frustrated when we mess up? I think they're watching to lean in, to go, how does dad handle failure? Does he get mad at himself? Does he get mad at other people? Like, how does that work?
- [20:19]
C
I mean, I like to think about risking and failure. Like we're running experiments. Like it's kind of like a science experiment. You test, you try these things, you see what works, what doesn't. It's a great opportunity to learn. Here's the reality that we have as dads. If you are trying to create and provide a fail free childhood for your kids, then you are going to fail as a dad.
- [20:46]
A
I think too, we got to say to our kids and even to ourselves that failure is what happens when we're trying to be successful at something again. I keep saying it over and over, but that's part of the process. I love the promu from episode 36. We had FSU coach Mike Norvell and he, he says, your kid needs to know you'll be there during the highs and the lows. And that's what we're talking like. Yeah, you know, I'm not disappointed in you, right? Because I just think of a kid, you know, Looking up at the bleachers at dad after striking out, like, what's he gonna do? What's he gonna say? What's the look gonna be on his face? And I think it's got to be, man, nothing. But I love you more than this for sure. So a couple action steps. What do we do when our kids fail? How do we. How do we do this? They're brokenhearted. They're frustrated. What do we do with stats?
- [21:39]
C
Well, number one, you got to affirm their worth. And this is bigger than just words. I mean, you just talked about it. You got to do it with your facial expressions. And, you know, I kind of go back. Ted, you and I had a conversation about the. About the show adolescence. And one of the things that kid talked about was that he wasn't good at soccer and that he would look over and see that his dad was embarrassed. And so when our kids fail, we have to affirm their value in the way that we look. Does the look of pride in your eyes dim when our kids fail? It can't. I mean, we can be very honest about what happened, but we need to let them know that their value is not in their performance. We need to know this. That's the message that's being sent to them all day long. And we have to be a different voice and a different face.
- [22:40]
B
The what have you done for me lately? Kind of feeling.
- [22:43]
C
How have you performed today? And even the. In the chap. In a Chap Clark episode, he even made the point, I love you, but I'd love you a little bit more if you made that field goal.
- [22:55]
A
That that's what they're hearing from us.
- [22:57]
C
That. That might. They. If they're perceiving that, like, if we
- [23:02]
A
said it right, we need to know
- [23:04]
C
that if we have that even a little bit in our attitude, they're gonna. They're gonna pull that out.
- [23:09]
A
One of the phrases that we've used with our kids forever and we taught them when they were little was, when do I love you? And we trained him to say all the time. You know, when they were little, all the time. You know, of course, Judson, when he gets 16, you know, hey, buddy, when do I love you? When you want to. So, you know, low. Low humor. It's going to be involved in everything. But I think that's what we're seeing. The goal of this is I love you all the time. It doesn't matter if you succeed. If you fail, I love you all the time. And I think at the end of our days, when My kids describe me as a dad. I want them to say they not only said that, he lived that.
- [23:48]
B
Yeah, yeah. I think a second thing that we can do as dads is something that I've tried to practice in my own home, and it really has proven to be a really wise thing, is to applaud effort. Every single hockey game on Saturdays, I tell my son, he puts his little skates on, and as he walks out of locker room, I pat him on the head and I say, what am I gonna say? He just mumbles it and I go, effort over results. I'm like, I know it's true. And it really came in handy this weekend because we were watching his first two games of the year. They lost 10 to 1 and they lost 9 to 2. And so I leaned over to my wife during the game, like, we're really leaning into this effort over results thing today, aren't we? Because it isn't. The results aren't very good. But it's fine because at the end of it, he forgot. An hour later he went and he played at home, did Legos or whatever. It wasn't about the result, it was about the effort that he gave. And I thought that was a really cool thing. Helps you get over failure much quicker when you lean into the effort. And I found this quote from boxing legend Joe Frazier, if I lose, I'll walk away and never feel bad because I did all I could. There was nothing more to do.
- [24:51]
C
I think sometimes, like with our kids, it's just it. There's a certain victory involved, like what you said, like yours was effort. My daughter started swimming about a year ago, and not that she knew how to swim, but she joined a swim team. And my daughter, I love her. She's the most least competitive person on the planet in a really beautiful way. She just wants everybody to have fun and everybody to be together and all that stuff. So beating people is not what she does. And so she came to her first swim meet and she was so nervous. She didn't want. She didn't. She's like, I really don't want to go. And I told her, look, here's your victory. Put your suit on, step up on the block, dive into the pool. I was like, if you put your feet down and get disqualified at that point, it doesn't matter. Like, I just. Your bravery, courage, risk taking moment is to get your suit on, show up for the meet, get up on the block and dive into the pool.
- [26:01]
A
You redefined success for her. Yeah. And that. This is success for you.
- [26:05]
C
This is the success. This is the success. And not only did she dive into the pool, but she finished fifth in her heat out of eight in her very first deal. Now her backstroke, she finished. Yeah, but. Yeah, but it was one of those. The.
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D
The.
- [26:22]
C
The entire pool is silent as we wait for the last person to finish. But. But anyway, yeah, some. Sometimes just. That's the victory. And. And it's. It's okay.
- [26:34]
A
Well, I think we've talked a lot about redefining success, and I'm gonna say this, and I'm gonna tell them this, and. But I think at the same time, with failure for everybody comes emotions that don't feel good. They're like, oh, I embarrass myself in front of my friends. I feel so ashamed. Will I ever be able to. To do this again? I think we have to acknowledge that with them, because most people run from those emotions to sit there and say, are you embarrassed or are you frustrated? You know what? That's a frustrating situation you're in.
- [27:06]
C
I get it.
- [27:07]
A
And give them room to feel that before we rush in once again to fix it. Because we do have our mottos, but when they're in the emotional part of their brain, those mottos and all of our philosophies, it is not what they're searching for in that moment. So we got to let them have the emotions that come with failure, too.
- [27:26]
C
Oh, well, there's nothing worse. There's. There's nothing worse than number one failing. Okay, you fail. So we. We. We tend to, as dads, quickly, we want to. We want to make sure they're prepared the next time so they overcome. So they fail. And our first instinct is, well, let me tell them the ways that they could have done things different that would have been successful. So they're getting the lecture of all the things that they could fix. And then when they're upset, we tell them that they're not allowed to feel the things that they're. So they're weak for feeling the way that they are. So not only do they fail, and then we tell them all the things they did wrong, which it's not like they need that we come in and tell them that they shouldn't feel as bad as they do and they should just move on and kind of minimize. So it's. It's a failure on top of a failure. Not only did you fail, but you're not even handling failure in the right way. So we need to just kind of not be in a rush and let them. Exactly what you said is Let them feel the things and don't rush in to tell them all the things that they could have done to succeed for the next time. There'll be time for that later. And honestly, I don't even know if they necessarily need it from you. Wait until they ask.
- [28:39]
A
Oh, so this is one of those things that, oh, I wish I could back them and someone would tell me this because I think probably a lot of dads are listening to go, oh, I've never thought about it this way. Especially if you're coaching your kid and we all, whether our kids play sports or not, we're all coaching our kids.
- [28:55]
C
Right.
- [28:56]
A
But I had a dear friend of mine, he's a great dad. He says you don't coach after the game if they've had a failure. You wait before the next game, next
- [29:07]
B
week when you're on your way to practice.
- [29:09]
A
Yeah. You don't talk about, you know, how to do that. And we have a great episode with Dan Orlovsky. We'll put that in the show notes where he talks about how dad should act in the bleachers. Yeah, it's one of the most powerful episodes. I think everybody that ever dad ever sits in a bleacher should be required by the government to listen to this episode. He did such a great job. But the other thing we want to do, I think when it comes to our kids when they're failing is to avoid flattery. You know, we've got to avoid saying, giving them false praise because they can smell it a mile away. And I'm guilty of that. So I think too, with all the encouragement we want to give them, giving them space is way better than give them flattery when they're, they're frustrated. They know better, right?
- [29:54]
C
Yeah.
- [29:55]
A
They got to know they can trust us.
- [29:57]
C
Yeah. And that's the thing. I think we can be honest about what happened and even, even the. We can be honest about the consequences and what, you know, sometimes they risk and fail and there are consequences to it are hard. You know, we can kind of. But we can also be honest with the fact that it's not the end of the world either too. But when we do that, when we come in and we give credibility when we lose credibility when we do stuff like that.
- [30:22]
A
I'm so glad we had this episode. This was a topic I would have never thought to think about, you know, all those years ago when my kids were smaller. So hopefully it was helpful for dads is as you were listening to this. Now we're moved to our pro move of the week when you have alone time with your kid, ask them what'd you fell out today? It helps to normalize it and then listen to them, empathize with them, but also tell them maybe a time that you have failed. And bj to your point, have a little fun with it. Well, thanks to BJ and Bobby for joining me for this discussion. Thank you for joining us. Hey, if you're listening to this podcast, did you know you could check it out on YouTube? Just go there and subscribe. You're going to hear thousands of hours of content. But most of all, we want to say to you right now, as always, thank you for listening. We know that you and your kids will be glad that you did.
- [31:14]
D
Thanks again for listening to the All Pro Dad Podcast. Behind every episode is our amazing team producer Haley Mwat, audio and video editor Buck Buchanan, and production coordinator Corey Walliffe. All Pro dad is the fatherhood program of the non profit family for along with our motherhood program imom, we exist to help you love your family well. So remember, if you have more questions than answers, then you're probably in the right place. See you next time.