Loading summary
Transcript47 lines
- [00:00]
A
Hey, this is the All Pro dad podcast. I'm Ted Lowe, and today I sit down with Tim Timmons. He's a singer, songwriter, a co writer of Mercy Me's Grammy nominated song, Even if an essential figure in the new movie, I can only imagine too. He's also the author of a companion book called Waking Up A Journey of Grief and Gratitude. You know, we talk about gratitude and grief and faith and why joy doesn't disappear just because life gets hard. We also talk about how his journey has impacted as a dad. I can't wait for you to hear this interview. Let's jump in. Tim Timmons, how are you doing, buddy?
- [00:38]
B
I'm great because I'm on this thing with you. My day just got real good. Let's go. Legend. Ted Lowe.
- [00:45]
A
Well, friend, it was so great to get to preview Only Imagine too. I thought I was previewing it for an interview, but mostly I always go, this is interesting on Tam. And then I watched it and wrecked me in the best way. It just wrecked me in the best way. And it's one of those films that stuck with me afterwards. And of course, knowing you and then seeing your story played out, it was just such a ride. It was so powerful. You know, the movie does a great job of showing how these hard seasons had helped you to realize, you know, like you said, help you. Helps you to realize, to continue. You're realizing, you know, what really matters. How has your journey impacted your role as a dad and a husband?
- [01:40]
B
Gosh. I mean, is that 14 books that could be written on that? I don't know. I mean, so I write this X on my wrist every morning for a lot of reasons. One is just I woke up again. So they gave me. I was given five years to live 25 years ago. Incurable cancer, stage four still tumors on my liver today as I woke up. But I woke up and I think the greatest gift of sorrow and pain and calamity and just stuff is sobriety. That's what I think. And I can either embrace sobriety, and I'm not talking about drugs or alcohol. I'm talking about, like actual just being sober in life. The most present to the possible moment. I think drunk is like when we're drunk. I get drunk on worry all the time. I get drunk on worry about my finances all the time. I get drunk on. On scarcity, going, I'm not gonna have enough. I get drunk on trying to work for God all the time. And I want to be more sober this year than I was last year. And I think Calamity, sorrow offers me that invitation. At least it's not guaranteed. But I think the more that I'm just saying, Jesus, you have my attention. I'm sick of giving my attention to everything else. You have my attention. I'm a better dad when I'm able to give Jesus my attention and say, what are you doing in this moment when I've just been lame to my wife or my kids, that's beautiful. Like, come on. I want to be. If there's anything that people will say about Tim at points, I hope my kids and my wife would say that Tim will. He owns things, he will own his crap. And I will, like, make. My goal is reconnection. Reconnection, Reconnection, reconnection. Sever. Reconnection, reconnection. And I think that's like a divine thing that we've been taught by God. Like, he's like, oh, you guys, I know you severed it. I didn't sever it. You severed it. But let's go. I love you like crazy. Let's get up again. You got another day. Just let's reconnect. And so through sorrow, through all those things, I think the invitation is for me, Tim, and for all of us to either reconnect to the heart of God and do stuff with him versus for him. And I want my kids to not feel like they're doing things for me, but they're doing things with me as a dad. I think that's a real change in me as I've. I'm growing. My job is just to kind of say, jesus, you have my attention today. And what. How do I get to love my kids through that? And where did I blow it today? And how do I seek kind of some kind of restoration? There's ADD all over you, so might have to wash off.
- [04:49]
A
But what was it like for you to watch your life played out in a movie? I mean, how many people get to say that?
- [04:57]
B
Yeah, not many people get to say that. I. I mean, Jesus did with Passion of the Christ, you know, and then there's me. So I feel like it's just the two of us figuring this out. Sorry. Good joke, man. I was at most of the filmings and
- [05:18]
A
I cried.
- [05:20]
B
I cried a few real specific times. Just stuff I didn't see coming. And I really wish. Honestly, it's so silly, but I wish everybody could have this experience because it's like when you look at some of the hardships of your story, of your journey, and to, like, see yourself from outside of yourself was really Profound. I think I gained a compassion for myself that I've never had before. I think with hard things, we just push through. It's like, okay, just get through it. You know, it's gonna be good on the other side. And so we're just like bulldozing through. And this really helped me kind of stop and say, ah, Tim, that sucked like that. That was hard, man. Or even just watching my wife in it and seeing a different view of my wife than I. That I saw, but just seeing it from her eyes. So anyways, it was really, really beautiful.
- [06:15]
A
That's powerful. What about for your wife? What was her and your kids, what were their comments on seeing the movie?
- [06:20]
B
Well, I mean, that I'm so good looking, of course.
- [06:23]
A
I mean, you know, I skipped the obvious question because I'm a professional interviewer.
- [06:27]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I mean, so fun for my kids to. They're at a bunch of the filmings too, but one of my kids hasn't even seen it yet. And yeah, I think the whole experience, it's just interesting as a dad to have your kids kind of see. Be able to see stuff in. In my life that they would never be able to see before. Because on the, you know, you just think of your dad and it's like, right, that's. That's this guy. Just know this guy. They didn't know that guy. So that's really like, what a crazy cool gift. And then for my wife, her one note to Andy, to the filmmakers, there are friends. She's like, you can do this movie, but if it's cheesy, I'm out. Like, we're. We're done. And I think they made a great movie, but I think, yeah, I'd be interested to know what her thoughts are. She's only seen it once, so it's been a good process for us. We wrote a book together in this in the meantime, and that was really a great experience too.
- [07:29]
A
So what was it like when you found out who was playing you?
- [07:34]
B
Yeah, well, I was like, cool, great. I mean, they'd Throwing out all these names and. And when I said him, I was like, guy named Milo Ventimiglia. And my girls started like. One of my daughters started crying because she's like, this is Jess from Gilmore Girls, and they're huge GG fans.
- [07:55]
A
Yes.
- [07:56]
B
She starts, like, totally crying. I'm like, babe, you can't cry about the guy who's playing your dad, you know? So. Yeah, no, I just. I. Then I got all into his work. I'm like, oh, that's the guy that makes me cry all the freaking time on this is Us. And he's just as good of a human or better in real life than he is on this is Us.
- [08:18]
A
And watching him play you, wow. Because Tim. There's not a lot of Tim's on the planet. Just the fun you have, just the uniqueness that you have. And watching him play, that was so fun. What's it like? What was it like seeing him be you? I can't imagine that. That dynamic for you. What was that like?
- [08:45]
B
Milo has become a really close friend of mine, which is. I mean, just. We just spent so much time in the beginning, but then even just now, I mean, we. We text all the time and we're talking all the time. And I mean, he picked up all my dumb idiosyncrasies. Like I like always fumbling my glasses and like, I mean, just I watch him. So then in the movie he does it. I'm like, tim, you gotta stop being an idiot. No, it's so fun. I think he. I mean, I feel so seen by how he portrayed me and how Ariel portrayed my wife. So seen so that. So amazing.
- [09:21]
A
Well, and you said, she said, hey, this is cheesy.
- [09:23]
B
We're out.
- [09:24]
A
Which I can appreciate that it was the father's thing from cheesy. So it was, it was so profound. You know, the movie does not shy away from hard places, but yet it did this great job of balancing with Joy. How have you balanced those two things? Hard places enjoy in your own life?
- [09:46]
B
Yeah, I don't know if I've always held them well in my book. I also have a little section where I talk about not using words with Ed at the end of them, but I want more words to end with ing. Like more in the process. Like I learned. I figured out. I'm like, no, I'm. I'm learning. I'm figuring. I'm like in process. And so I'm still in the process of figuring out how to hold healthy grief and healthy gratitude at the same time. You know, I mean, it's really. That wasn't just a movie line. That's my real life of I. I want to live that line. And, and even, you know, and like in our circles, we say life's hard. This thing is so hard. But God's good. You know, we like, we run so quickly to put that but right there and then to say God is good. And I think the word and is to me is a, in my view, a better picture. Life is really hard and God's at work in all things. Like, to hold the tension between these two things seems to be so important. It is for me in my life. And I think when I jump too quickly to being grateful, like, oh, no, what? I'm grateful for another day. It's like, that's totally true. And that will, like, that will get me through gratitude for another day. Literally gets me through my life and in the hard things. But if I'm discounting any of the pain and the grief, then I think I'm actually. I'm short circuiting. True joy, like, joy is never found on the mountaintops. In my experience. Joy is only found through the crap. The stuff happens, you know. Right. So I'm in process of learning how to really hold these two tensions well, and put a big old and there not a but. Like, they can. God is still present in the fire, and the fire sucks, and God's present in the fire, and this is hard. And I'm just gonna trust you today.
- [11:50]
A
Wow. So why do you think people in faith circles, Tim, like, we both are, that rush to put the Ed there. Rush to say, but God. But what's the rush there? Like, what do you think? The tendency.
- [12:09]
B
Yeah. I mean, there's scriptures that have, like, but God did this. And I totally get the concept. And, um. And I'm sure there's beauty in there, and I could learn stuff on the other side of that. I. I just. I just hear it all the time. I hear us discounting pain, discounting the hard, and just trying to, like, tell ourselves that it's all going to be okay. It's not always going to be okay. I still have tumors on my liver today, wearing out my heart. In the movie, Sam still has diabetes. You are still dealing with things. Everybody's like, we're still dealing with things. And so for me just to, like, put blinders on to what's hard is not. I don't think it's honoring. I. I think biblically, as I look at so many of the hard things even Jesus was walking through, he didn't. Like when he was crying with people, it wasn't. But you know what? Be thankful today. Like, there was an actual grieving process. And even. Even the idea of the Israel was to sit shiva with people, but which just meant when somebody was grieving that you would just sit with them. If they wanted to get up and eat, you'd get up and eat with them. If they wanted to get up and whatever, you would do that. If they just want to be quiet, you'd do that with them. And I think if we were better at that than just throwing Bible verses at each other and saying, you know what? But God's going to work all things. You're like, you know what? Maybe, but that's really not helpful right now. Like, just sit with me in this and that. We can sit together and then we can find that, but just maybe not right now. Now, so.
- [13:50]
A
And I think the song that you co wrote, even if. Which is highlighted in the movie, paints that beautifully. Why do you think that song has so resonated with so many people? Me included?
- [14:05]
B
Yeah, I think it's honest. You know, the opening line is, they say, sometimes you win some, sometimes you lose some. Right now I'm losing bad. Like, there are a lot of Christian songs that say, life's freaking hard. Like, we just jump to celebration. And one of my heroes, Stan Endicott, would always say, celebration without desperation is empty. And I love that line. I think it's so true. Celebration without desperation is really empty. If you've got a team coming back at the end of the fourth quarter and they've been down all game, I mean, in total desperation, and they win the game, how big of a win is that? Like, we go crazy. But if a team wins, like, the other day, I was like, oh, we all knew they were gonna win from the jump, you know, so celebration without desperation is empty, and I think that's a huge call. So I think this song invites us into celebration. Joy, gratitude, on the other side of desperation. And I think that's actually where people are. And we're not just in little Christian land of ignoring things.
- [15:12]
A
You say, I want to teach my kids that I own it. You've messed up. What does that look like to reconnect with your kid? Because I think every dad that's listening to this podcast, we have those regretful moments where like, oh, I can't believe I said that. I can't believe I did that. I can't. You know, you sit in that regret. How do you own it with your kids?
- [15:31]
B
I say, this was all your fault. I think it's a really strong thing. I say, I feel like you're an idiot. You know, I think it's always start with feeling statements. Just kidding.
- [15:43]
A
It's your fault.
- [15:44]
B
Yeah, no, I. Gosh, I've. How many times have dads. We've just struck idiot status and let our emotions and all the things take over. And I think what worked, what we're learning, what we're like in process of. Is I'm trying to, like, pull it back a little bit. I think my dad didn't rev up at me, but I. I'm like, the only way they will sometimes my boys will listen is if I'm like, come up. I'm like, dude, you guys, you know, like, you get kind of strong, right?
- [16:18]
A
Absolutely.
- [16:19]
B
And, man, it just doesn't work. It works for a moment, but every time I'm like, dang it, that doesn't work. Hillary's like, man, I don't think that really works. I'm like, well, you're not working. And so I'm. I'm really, like, literally, past two years, I have really made a conscious effort to practice breathing and practice in those moments saying, jesus, you have my attention. So I'm trying. I'm leaning more that way than just reacting because, man, I am totally right in most of the places that I've reacted poorly. It wasn't that I was wrong in those places. Like, one of our great friends, and he was a therapist for Hill and I. He would always say, tim, if you win this battle, this argument, you've just lost, like, if you're trying to win the battle, win the argument with your wife, you just lost. Like, you might have won that thing, but, like, in. In the grand scheme of the relational equity, you just lost. So there's no winning in it. Every time there's some kind of winning I'm trying to do, or I feel like it's my job to prove something, man, I think I've just lost. So I'm trying to look at that in parenting by saying, I can't. I can't win. And when I win, I will actually lose. Relational connection. So I don't fully know how to do it well, other than I'm just admitting when I'm like, dude, I'm sorry. I. I didn't need to say that. That was actually not cool to me. I. What you did was actually really hurtful. It actually hurt my feelings. Or, man, that just hurt your brother. And that's. That's not all. I'm not a fan of that. But I shouldn't have said what I said to you or come at you strong. I. I don't want to be that guy, man. I love you too much. And so please forgive me with that. So I'm. I'm aiming that way, and I think I'm. I'm doing. Doing a decent job. And also, every day is like, this is the hardest job I've ever done in my life is parenting.
- [18:20]
A
Amen and amen to that. So you've been through a lot. You're going through a lot. How have you talked to your kids about hard things? Because every dad listens going, hey, there's some hard things going on in our life. I want to make my kids feel safe, but I want to share appropriately. How have you balanced that or continuing to balance that?
- [18:39]
B
Yeah, so much of that is age appropriate, you know, so Hill and I did a little experiment years ago when they. Most of my kids didn't. My kids didn't know about cancer. And I was really struggling with how to tell them because everybody that they knew that had cancer was dead with the C word. And so I was like, how do we bring this up? They were little, and Hill and I were just in a season of saying, what if we were dumb enough to just experiment with trusting Jesus for even conversations? Like, let's just be those people that would try this out as an experiment. And. And so we did. We said, jesus, would you open the door? Just like Paul prayed every city, he went. He didn't, like, go, like, knocking down doors telling them, hey, Jesus loves you. He asked for the spirit to actually open doors. So we decided, let's just do that. And we started praying that for our kids. And, man, sure enough, within like a week and a half or something, my oldest came to me and asked me about one of my scars.
- [19:40]
A
And
- [19:43]
B
each kid, we've kind of done that practice. We've gone, jesus, would you open the door for this conversation? And I will be waiting. You have my attention.
- [19:52]
A
So good. That's so helpful. You've written a book in the middle of all this that's called Waking Up Again.
- [20:00]
B
Yeah.
- [20:00]
A
When you're writing that book, who are you thinking about?
- [20:03]
B
I think, gosh, I. I feel like a missionary to Christians. Not that I got my crap figured out, just so you know. I do not. Hopefully you guys can see that Timmins does not have his crap figured out. So for me, I just have so many stories of myself going, man, I missed it here, missed it here, missed it here. So the book is just full of a ton of stories, a ton of funny stories, and then some really powerful, gnarly stories, even cancer stories about where we've gotten it right and where we've gotten it wrong and what we're learning in the midst of it. And so it's. My wife and I wrote it together, which is really fun, and I think people will really be encouraged by it. There are a ton of practices. I think that's really what I get most Excited about is that this would just invite us as a whole community, including me, to just practice the way of Jesus together. Because what could happen in our world if we looked like Jesus, not like a religious system, but like the person and the heart and the words of Jesus in this world? So that's when I go, like, let's do that. And so when I get excited about my cancer journey or this movie, I don't care about Tim Timmons, who's that bald douche. But if we get to invite the world into, like, looking like actual Jesus, then I'm. I'm in. So that's, like, the greatest hope in all this stuff.
- [21:19]
A
Okay, I've got a million things to say about that, but I'm gonna keep them down to one word. Amen. So, Tim, each week we on the podcast, we give dads what we call a pro move, which is just a simple, practical, doable thing. Cause we know dads are moving a million miles. If you could give dads something doable and practical, I'm ready. Go.
- [21:45]
B
I got it. So I love word studies. I did a whole podcast, Whole podcast thing on. On word studies. And one of them was on the word blessing. And I thought blessing, like, had to do with finances or I got a job. We really got blessed. Come to find out, that's not even the biblical word. It's like, that is such an American, Christian, Western way of seeing the word blessing. The word blessing. One of the definitions is to call out what already exists. To call out what already exists in each other. When I bless God, I'm not just going, hey, I'm this lowly human blessing God. How does that work? It only works if I'm calling out what already exists in God. I'm saying, God, the way that your character is so beautiful. And I'm like, calling it out. That's blessing God. So the invitation is for us dads is, how do we bless our kids? How do we bless our wife or whoever? We're like, we are the blessers. And if we are trying to raise blessers, because that's actually the whole job of God's people, are to be the blessers of everybody around them. Then we get to start with our home. And I've been challenged to start calling out what already exists in my kids. So when I'm blessing my kids, I'm not financially saying, hey, I'm going to hook you up. My blessing is saying, son, I see this in you. I see the. You are. You look like God in this way, buddy. And I just Want to say that was so beautiful.
- [23:08]
A
So the pro move, then, is calling out what you already see in your kid. You know, you're so brave. You're so kind. You're so compassionate. You're. You're calling out what is. Am I hearing you right?
- [23:19]
B
You're giving identity statements to your kid. That's. That's a blessing. A blessing is not all the dumb things. It's just giving identity statements as children of God. But that's such a huge statement. So, like saying, man, I just see that. I see God in you here. I see God in you here, man. I see God in me here. And this is a place right here, buddy, that I actually am like Jesus. I need you to make this even more beautiful in me. Make generosity so much more beautiful in me. But, you know, it's like, it's just this gift of blessing. How do we bless and call out what already exists, even when we don't see the whole picture? But even this one little thing in my son, I just see this, like, little seed. I get to call that out. That is blessing. So let's start with our family as being the blessers of the world.
- [24:03]
A
Tim Timmons. But I am so thrilled by this movie. I want everybody I know to see it. I don't say that a lot about movies, and so thank you for doing that. Thank you for being who you are, buddy. I love you, and it's so good to see you.
- [24:17]
B
You too, buddy. Thank you.
- [24:19]
A
What a fun conversation. Make sure you check out the movie. It comes out February 20th. Take your kids, take your wife. It's a great, great film. And as always, we want to say thank you. Thank you for listening. We know that you and your kids will be glad you did. Thanks again for listening to the all pro dad podcast. Behind every episode is our amazing team producer, Haley Mwat, audio and video editor Buck Buchanan, and production coordinator Corey Wolfe. Allprodad is the fatherhood program of the nonprofit Family first, along with our motherhood program imom. We exist to help you love your family. Family well. So remember, if you have more questions than answers, then you're probably in the right place. See you next time.