Daughter Discovers Her Dad’s Secret #190

Summary

Bellied Up Podcast #190

Episode Title: Daughter Discovers Her Dad’s Secret
Date: March 5, 2026
Hosts: Myles ("You Betcha Guy") & Charlie Berens
Location: Hooligans, West Fargo, North Dakota

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Episode Overview

This episode of the Bellied Up Podcast takes listeners from light-hearted Midwest banter about brunch and travel plans to truly unique territory, including a call-in about taxidermy addiction and a memorable, therapy-like conversation with a caller whose father is secretly living a swinger lifestyle. Myles and Charlie deliver their characteristic blend of sincerity and sharp-witted comedy as they support, tease, and coach their callers through surprisingly deep issues—delivering both laughs and authentic moments.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Brunch, Boots, and Vegas Warm-Up (00:00–18:00)

• Hosts banter about their brunch at Hooligans, particularly praising omelettes and brunch hours (00:00–01:15).

  • "You can always tell an omelette that's made with love, Miles." – Charlie (00:22)

• Charlie discusses an upcoming show in Vegas and riffs on how Midwesterners retire to places like Las Vegas. Myles quizzes him on his act and they riff on “test-driving” new Vegas material, with plenty of bits about hotel rooms and the perils of minibar and "intimacy kit" charges.

  • Notable bit: The $86 “intimacy kit” saga, leading to speculation and a failed attempt to call the infamous “Billy Deuce” (06:00–08:40).
  • "Can you imagine paying $86 for an intimacy kit you didn't get any intimacy from?" – Charlie (07:02)
  • Ongoing joke: “Only do organic, cage-free lube.” (09:16)

2. Caller #1: Drew & The Taxidermy Addiction (18:02–40:42)

Drew’s Story:

• Drew, an avid hunter in his mid-20s, describes his growing addiction to taxidermy since having his first wood duck mounted at age 14. He now spends adult money on mounting birds and deer and considers learning taxidermy himself.

  • "I can do what I want. I have an adult job, I have adult money, I have my own place, I have my own dog. I can do whatever I want." – Drew (19:30)

• Mountings and Financial Toll:

  • Drew has mounted multiple pheasants (including a rare black one), ducks, geese, and a big buck—spending ~$3,000 in the last year alone.
  • "We're just going to keep chucking down the tube on this one, because I'll pay for a good price on a good quality piece." – Drew (23:05)

• Marriage Dynamics:

  • His wife tolerates (and even names) some of the mounts, but is unaware of all his current stashes; their arrangement includes a one-for-one: more hunts/mounts earns her more tattoos.
  • "Part of me honestly doesn't necessarily care what she thinks because at that point it's my own endeavor." – Drew (25:02)
  • "She's actually started to name some of the taxidermy a couple years ago." – Drew (25:24)

• Hosts Advise:

  • Myles and Charlie caution about turning a hobby you love into full-time work and discuss the dangers of bad taxidermy reputations.
  • "The quickest way to not love something anymore is turn it into a thing that you rely on for money." – Myles (24:17)

• Memorable Moments:

  • Drew describes a “duck shoulder mount” and debates whether he’s ever felt bad shooting a really beautiful duck.
  • “Next thing you’re gonna do is a squirrel shoulder mount as well, or no?” – Myles (28:35)
  • Hosts riff on the logistics of shipping a giraffe for taxidermy and the oddness of such trophies (33:20–34:49).

• Conclusion:

  • Drew leaves with some good-natured ribbing about the practicality of hunting, marriage trade-offs, and the wonders of a “duck shoulder mount” by the gun cabinet.
  • "You can't eat taxidermy." – Charlie (38:23)

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3. Caller #2: “Amber” – The Dad’s Secret Revealed (41:01–70:10)

Amber’s Situation:

• Amber (pseudonym), a stay-at-home mom with twin 14-month-olds, seeks advice on what to call her father and his new wife as grandparents, having discovered they appear to be swingers.

  • "My sisters and I recently put together the pieces that our dad and his new wife have [an] open relationship." – Amber (42:42)
  • The hosts lose it: “You do you. Well, it sounds like not just you, you do you and you and you…” – Charlie (43:05)

• How She Found Out:

  • Online messages outed her dad’s extracurricular activities, and further investigation revealed a network of “swinger signs” like flamingo lawn ornaments (44:25–46:16).
  • "The Philandering Flamingos—you get the alliteration of the sound." – Charlie (46:16)

• The Emotional Fallout:

  • Amber’s discomfort with the idea of labeling her father as simply “grandpa,” due to his lifestyle, unearths deep unresolved feelings about his past infidelity.
  • Hosts gently coach her through why it feels wrong, entering a near-therapy session, complete with role play:
    • “No judgment to him… So you can't just keep judging him and then keep saying no judgment to him.” – Myles (52:52)
    • “Before, he was being dishonest about who he was, and now he’s being honest about who he is with his current partner. So maybe this is a step in the right direction.” – Charlie (55:17)
    • Amber, honestly: “Disgusted… Like, I knew he wasn't a great guy, but, like, come on.” (54:57)

• Therapy-Like Unpacking: (54:57–63:07)

  • Myles and Charlie encourage Amber to acknowledge her disgust, then explore its roots in her childhood wounds from her father’s infidelity:
    • "I'm trying to protect my kids from that." – Amber (60:33)
  • They discuss accepting what you can't control, not projecting trauma onto kids, and the value of assuming the best.
    • "If you could fast forward 20 years and your dad treated your kids just fine, would you feel better?" – Myles (63:07)
    • "Assume the best—otherwise, you spend 20 years worrying." – Myles (63:46)

• Mixing Laughter and Empathy:

  • The hosts joke about passive-aggressive naming ("That’s that passive aggressive—what are you, Catholic?"), but ultimately land on calling him Grandpa and his wife Nana, just as they would otherwise (64:26).
  • Brewed-up bits on swinger party etiquette (“Keep your keys outside the fishbowl and you’ll be fine”) and Facebook sleuthing on “swingers trips” (67:10).

• Closing Reflections:

  • The call ends with more empathy, a reminder to “feel the pain” to reduce its power, and permission not to have all the answers.
    • “A lot of people avoid feeling pain because they think feeling the pain is going to lead to more pain. But I think when you really sit and feel the pain…it gets less and less over time.” – Charlie (62:35)
  • “You shield the trauma so they don’t have to.” – Myles (69:54)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Intimacy Kits in Vegas:

  • “Can you imagine paying $86 for an intimacy kit you didn't get any intimacy from?” – Charlie (07:02)
  • “I only do lube if it's fair trade. Cage free lube.” – Myles (09:25)

• Taxidermy Logic:

  • “You can't eat taxidermy.” – Charlie (38:23)
  • “I think you just call them grandparents. … Why do you feel the need at 15 months to let them know– hey, just so you know…” – Myles (43:27)

• Amber’s Emotional Honesty:

  • "Disgusted… Like, I knew he wasn't a great guy, but, like, come on." – Amber (54:57)
  • “I'm trying to protect my kids from that.” – Amber (60:33)
  • “Assume the best—otherwise, you spend 20 years worrying.” – Myles (63:46)

• Therapeutic Humor:

  • “Just because they go spread eagle at Sandals doesn’t mean that they’re any worse people. You know, there’s different strokes for different folks. And these folks just happen to do a lot of different strokes with a lot of different folks.” – Charlie (53:53)
  • “You don't want to call him something else so he knows you're mad without actually telling him—that's that passive aggressive. What are you, Catholic?” – Charlie (64:29)

• Sibling Bonding:

  • “That's kind of fun...you're like decoding what went on, who was sleeping with who, and then who's commenting on what.” – Myles (67:21)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:00–05:30: Brunch at Hooligans, Vegas show promo and inside jokes about the Midwest
• 06:00–13:15: The $86 hotel “intimacy kit” story, ongoing riff
• 18:02–40:42: Call with Drew on taxidermy, hunting, and marriage impacts
• 41:01: Introduction of “Amber” and her dad’s swinging secret
• 43:26–50:00: The swingers “flamingo” reveal, family dynamic dissection
• 54:57–63:07: Therapy-like section, Amber processes childhood wounds, explores naming issues
• 63:46–69:00: Emotional resolution, practical advice, and moving forward

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Summary

Bellied Up #190 is a standout episode showcasing the podcast’s trademark mix of folk comic storytelling, practical wisdom, and midwestern irreverence. Myles and Charlie manage a delicate dance between hearty laughter and sincere empathy as they coach one caller through the depths of taxidermy obsession and help another work through genuine emotional fallout from discovering her father’s swinger lifestyle. Standout moments include the Vegas “intimacy kit” saga, heartfelt reflections on marriage, and an unexpectedly deep therapy session on generational trauma and acceptance.

With wit and warmth, the hosts turn even the most awkward of family secrets into moments of growth, connection, and—of course—plenty of unforgettable laughs.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome back, everybody, to another episode of the Bellied up podcast. We are bellied up here at Hooligans in West Fargo, North Dakota. I got a belly full of brunch. I had a steak burrito.

[B]

How was it?

[A]

It was good.

[B]

Scale 1 to 10?

[A]

It's, it was, I would say it was not a solid 9.3.

[B]

That's great. I'm a huge fan of the omelette. I even put in a little request, you know, I put, put in some substitutions, which I don't normally do. But I, I, I'm, I'm a big fan of the omelettes they got here. You can always tell an omelette that's made with love, Miles. And one that's made fresh out there and back, as opposed to just pulled out of the freezer, you know?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And they're making fresh omelettes here.

[A]

It was delicious with eggs. You guys are in Wells Fargo. You gotta get to Hooligans. Have a. For brunch. They serve till two, which I love.

[B]

That's awesome. Every day too, dude.

[A]

And I, the way that my schedule works, the operate.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I am never awake. I'm never like out and about early enough to like get early brunch stuff or like breakfast. Like, if I go through McDonald's, I'm always like, what's this up at like

[B]

10, 10:30, I think 10:30.

[A]

I'm always rolling up to the drive thru at like 10:35. It's always the worst.

[B]

Nice to know when a bar's got your back, you know? It's nice to know that.

[A]

So, Chuck, what's going on in your world? I'd love to know. I'm just been up to.

[B]

I'm just living life, doing my best, you know. I'm going to Vegas next week actually. You ever been to Vegas, Miles?

[A]

I have never been to Vegas. Does that surprise you?

[B]

Kind. Do you want to come next week?

[A]

I, No, I cannot. I go on vacation here soon.

[B]

Well, just start early, have a kid. Ah, details. But let's.

[A]

Who are you going with?

[B]

I'm, I'm doing a show out there.

[A]

Oh, okay.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

Hey, Miles, you want to come to Vegas? I just have to work the whole time.

[B]

No, not the whole time time.

[A]

So just go to casino by yourself?

[B]

No, we would actually. We could go see a show at the Sphere after. We could have a good old time.

[A]

No, I think we would. It just, we should have done all that stuff before I had a kid.

[B]

I know I wasn't successful enough when you didn't have a kid to go do it, you know? I know, but speaking of successful, you can buy Charlie barons [e-mail] and if you buy more tickets, I will actually be successful. So do you like that plug I got?

[A]

You know what, Charlie? Don't listen to them. Listen to who you're successful regardless of if people buy tickets.

[B]

Oh, I know. I was just hoping for some pity tickets. Yeah, Charlie's playing it.

[A]

Charlie's gonna be in a bad mental state if you guys don't buy tickets.

[B]

Yes, please.

[A]

I'm gonna have to talk Charlie off a ledge. He's gonna go to the tallest building in Fargo.

[B]

I'll survive.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. It's like, it's like the comfort in off of 32nd Avenue.

[B]

I will break an ankle, though.

[A]

Yeah. And he's gonn. He's going to go live on Instagram, say, I'm going to do it. If you don't buy tickets. And everyone's going to be coming like, dude, you're just going to roll an ankle.

[B]

It's not that big of a deal. You know, People are going to be

[A]

like, just do it, Charlie.

[B]

I'm just looking out over the horizon. Is there not one hill in this whole damn town?

[A]

Yeah, it's like in the middle of winter, so there's like snow right up against the building. So it's actually like you'll cushion you so you don't get hurt at all.

[B]

I just go sled. You can see Milwaukee from the roof.

[A]

Yeah, so. So go buy tickets so Charlie doesn't roll an ankle off the comfort in here.

[B]

Please. Please do. Miles. A bummer about the show though, is at 10pm and you know, some of my fans are on, you know, the older side.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think 10pm might be too late for him.

[A]

But they're in Vegas.

[B]

That's true. All the shows in Vegas are at 10, 10, 10pm so do you think

[A]

a majority of the people coming to your show in Vegas live in Vegas or people visiting?

[B]

We play Vegas before and from what I gathered, chit chat with folks after is that a lot of them live out there. There's a lot of. Vegas is one of those snowbird towns, oddly enough. Vegas, Palm Springs, Phoenix, Scottsdale, everywhere in Florida. These are places that Midwesterners leave because they'll say it's. It's good for my arthritis, you know, and. Or whatever. They just retire. They go somewhere warm and Vegas is on the rise. That's what I've heard.

[A]

So to prep you for your Vegas show, Charlie.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I would like you to test drive a few bits Vegas specific here.

[B]

Okay. Okay. All right. So you put me on the spot to, like, come up with my Vegas material, right?

[A]

So my goal is essentially work out the bad stuff so you don't do that.

[B]

I love it. Stage. I love it when we just riff. Hot. Just. I just riff right for you, and you're like, I hope you do better on stage.

[A]

That's what I'm hoping.

[B]

That's how it usually goes.

[A]

I do.

[B]

When I think about it.

[A]

And the best way to sell, you know, anything is like, you don't. You don't just show up to the dealership to buy a new car and just go, hey, I want this car. And then you just sign. You got to test drive it. So let's test drive your Vegas show right here.

[B]

I'm not. I'm not getting test drive.

[A]

Welcome to the stage, the king of Wisconsin, Charlie

[B]

Baron. That was really great. That was. Right.

[C]

My ears.

[B]

If he does that again, Jared, could you just turn him down just to scotch so I keep my earring. Charlie Miles, let me tell you a little story about the last time I was in Vegas. Okay?

[A]

Is this.

[B]

It's not a comedy bit. I'm totally deflecting. It might be a bit.

[A]

We could just.

[B]

I just spit on you. It might be a bit, but. So I'm going there.

[A]

Spit on the people at your show.

[B]

Spitting. When I was talking, Billy Deuce was there. All right. And Billy Deuce, you know, I obviously put all the hotel rooms on my credit card, and I get. I get the credit card bill back, and there's a charge for $86. And I was like, bill, why would I have a charge for $86 on my credit card? He goes, oh, I think I know what that might be. There was an intimacy kit on the counter, and I picked it up and just looked at it, but because it had a magnetic deal on it, I think I took it off for too long. And you got charged. I was like, well, did you at least take the intimacy kit so we could look inside? He said, no. I thought they might reverse the charges if I left it there. Can you imagine paying $86 for an intimacy kit? You didn't get any intimacy from.

[A]

Well, I think he's lying to you.

[B]

You think he used it?

[A]

I think he definitely used it.

[B]

Should we call him up right now and see?

[A]

Yeah, let's do it.

[C]

All right.

[B]

Let's give him a call.

[A]

So, I mean, hey, hey, Jared, you know, I saw an $86 charge. And it says that.

[B]

Are you role playing this right now?

[A]

It was. It was big natural coeds charges. What was that?

[B]

Oh, it's just something on tv.

[A]

It was something on tv. Did. Did you purchase it or what happened? It just came on. I just came. You just. You just watched the preview for too long that.

[B]

It just charged you?

[C]

I had to finish the end.

[A]

Okay. Okay. Yeah. You definitely didn't purchase that.

[C]

No.

[A]

Yeah. You definitely didn't use it.

[B]

There is something.

[A]

Are we gonna call him or not? I was kind of buying time while you call.

[B]

Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. All right, let's see this.

[A]

Did you. Did he at least tell you what was in the intimacy kit? I'm very curious.

[B]

Let's see.

[A]

All right, this is Billy Deuce. Do you usually call him at this time or is he gonna be.

[B]

Bill usually doesn't answer when I call. Honestly, it's rare when he answers.

[A]

Is that why you didn't want to call him?

[B]

Kind of. It's embarrassing when you call people and they don't.

[D]

Did your call has been.

[A]

See, did you at least get a. Like. Did he tell you what was in it?

[B]

He said that it had lubrication prophylactics.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Two of them. And then some sort of edible jelly.

[A]

Okay, so there's lots of lubes and jellies of some sort.

[B]

Yeah, but I mean, let's do. Let's do the. Let's do the math on that. Think about how much they're profiting on these intimacy kits, what I just mentioned. That must cost, like, some poor bastard in China, like 76 cents to make and distribute and package. And Vegas is not.

[A]

If it was fair trade, it was fair trade lube.

[B]

I don't think Vegas is in the business of fair trade lube, judging by the rest. That's the other thing.

[A]

I. You know, I only do lube if it's fair trade.

[B]

Organic.

[A]

Yeah. Cage free lube.

[B]

Non GMO cage free lubrication. The other thing about Vegas, Miles, is that every single couch, I think we

[A]

just found a new bit.

[B]

It could be a bit. Yeah. We could get into that.

[A]

You could just say, you know, I. I would have done the intimacy package, but I only do organic lube. And they didn't have that.

[B]

Is that. Just spit. The thing about Vegas is you walk into these hotel rooms and they're usually really big. Like whether or not they need to

[A]

be, you know, big chair in every corner.

[B]

Yeah. And every horizontal surface, you just see the ghosts of fornications past, you know, that's every Chair. Every surface I'm on in a Vegas hotel room. I'm just thinking of the. There was this one.

[A]

How many surfaces are you on in. In a Vegas hotel room? I would love to know.

[B]

I mean, I'll sit wherever at the

[A]

floor, Floor, bed, and maybe a chair in the corner.

[B]

No, this hotel room that I was in had like six chairs in it, and they were all like that. Like, not even pretending to be faux leather, just straight up plastic, you know?

[A]

Yeah. Easier cleanup.

[B]

I. I know. There was one time that I was walking into my hotel room in Vegas and the, the. There was a fella in the room next to me and the door was wide open. Well, half open. He was, he was the guy holding the door open. So he was the door. Stop. And he was just fully ass naked. And he was like, hey, did you see a girl in the hotel in the hallway? And I said, no, dude, I'm going to bed. He said, could you go check for me? I was like, no.

[A]

What?

[B]

It's just weird things happen in Vegas every time I go there. And this guy, he's just. He's fully. Fully there.

[A]

Yeah. When in Vegas.

[B]

I know, but I mean, he's. He's out of it and not chubbed up or anything. Not a shower, but. But not caring either, you know? And it's. He was asking me like I was his roommate of 10 years, you know?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

They was looking for like more towels or what?

[B]

No, it's just his girlfriend had went down the hall. I heard him. I heard a commotion. He was like saying, can you please just come back? You know? And they were yelling. I. I don't really know. I mean, it wasn't like.

[A]

You think it was maybe a lady of the night?

[B]

I. I don't even know.

[A]

Could have been a lady of the night. And then she found out he didn't have any money.

[B]

Any money. But that was Vegas. Uncut, right there.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Fellow was on.

[A]

Oh, my God. Yeah, you really, you really had the Vegas experience.

[B]

Oh, my God. There was another time in Vegas, Miles. I bet on the packers to win the Super Bowl. Have I told you that? Oh, yeah. I haven't had. I haven't had a ton of super, like, oh, I won so much money kind of Vegas. Usually when I'm in Vegas, I'm ready to go after about 18 hours. Yeah, that's about my max.

[A]

From a guy who's never been there, it seems about right.

[B]

Yeah. But anyways, you should come on out. We'll have a good time.

[A]

Okay. So you're Are you putting the hotel rooms on your credit card?

[B]

Oh, I'll just take my bed, and you can sleep on the plastic couch. How's that sound?

[A]

Okay. What's your policy now on intimacy kits?

[B]

I think we've all gotten the first one. I'll cover the first intimacy kit. The second one is on you. Yeah. So now everyone knows the deal with the intimacy kits. Do not touch. You can look, but you can't touch. Yeah, looky free, touchy. $86.

[A]

You know, I say you can't put a price on a good time, but I think Vegas did it.

[B]

Definitely did. Yes, it did. But anyways, Miles. Yeah, I'm excited to go. I'm excited. It'll be fun. Be a good time.

[A]

All right. Are you finally ready to give the. The people a test ride of your Vegas show here? Just one. Just one bit. Doesn't have to. I. I don't want a bit that you're putting in the show. I want you to come up with one on the spot here.

[B]

I think I was just riffing a bit right there. I think I was. I think I was. I mean, I'm just trying to stress you out. Honestly, it needs some work.

[A]

Am I doing it correctly? Am I stressing out with that?

[B]

No, you're doing good. I'll be fine.

[A]

Like, I. I know what you're going through right now, because it's like you're out doing normal people stuff. Someone comes up to you is like,

[B]

hey, tell me a joke.

[A]

I'm a fan. Whatever. And then you're like, mom, this guy's on the Internet. She's like, he's a comedian. And she's like, oh, say something. Tell me a joke.

[B]

Mm, that's the worst. Do you get that a lot, too?

[A]

A little bit. Probably not as much as you, but it is like. It's the worst feeling in the world.

[B]

Yeah, I'm just like, I'm not that funny. Yeah, I just start repeating things. My dad tells me, you know, you're not that funny. That's what makes you funny. That's what makes you funny.

[A]

Well, should we do some callers, Charlie?

[B]

Let's do it. Miles. Miles. This is the time of the year when everyone thinks that winter, it's basically over. All right? So, you know, you plan a road trip like nothing can go wrong. And then halfway there, the wind picks up, snow starts blowing sideways, and suddenly, geez Louise, you can't see 10ft in front of you. North Dakota roads, I mean, they go from normal to white out in about 33 seconds flat and then you've been

[A]

a part of that. Remember we had a winter squall that one time?

[B]

That squall was insane. It came out of nowhere. Just imagine if I was in your truck and then someone slams on the brakes, another car slides. Next thing you know I'm going ass over teakettle into a ditch full of vehicles. And that's not what I want to see in a ditch. I want to see chickens there. But if a late winter road trip miles turns into an accident and injuries and I'll tell you this much, Nicolet Law is there for you. Okay? So make sure you go to nicolaylaw.com or you dial 1-855-nicolay-MIles, I'll tell you what, this Brunt quarter zip hoodie I got on with the pocket pretty nice. I'm not usually quarter zip guy myself.

[A]

Yeah, now you say it. I don't think I've ever seen you wear one.

[B]

This is the first quarter zip I remember wearing in my life.

[C]

Really?

[B]

Yeah, in my life. Usually what I've had to do is it'll kind of tear here and so I'll think I'm cool at the gym by kind of tearing it a little bit. And that's sort of my quarter ripped hoodie. But I've never had one of these.

[A]

Don't sell yourself short, Charlie. You look quarter ripped in that quarter zip.

[B]

Oh, Miles, Miles. Miles. My God. The listeners are listening, Miles. But yeah, no, I really like this quarter zip hoodie with the pocket. It's pretty slick. And I'll tell you, my new Brunt work boots are doing their thing. Just yesterday, just yesterday. Guess what? I stepped on a screw.

[A]

And what happened?

[B]

Nothing. Nothing happened, Miles. Yeah, I'll step on screws all day with these brown work boots and all. They're comfy. Good on the back too. My side ass doesn't hurt. My mid ass doesn't hurt, my back doesn't hurt and I'm in them. I'm standing up all day on these things. I'm sitting now. But I mean, you know, it's kind

[A]

of a cool little fun fact about the Brunt boots.

[B]

Do tell me.

[A]

They come with two insoles. Is that so? Like if you want a tighter fit on your boot, you leave the two insoles in. You want a looser fit. Like let's say because I got high arches on mine.

[B]

Yeah, sure.

[A]

Popped out. The second insole fit perfectly.

[B]

We can customize these boots ourselves. That's pretty slick.

[A]

I got them on right now. Look at that.

[B]

Yeah, me Too. I've been doing get your feet off the bar miles. Okay. There you go. Real good. So I. I might even try pulling one out just to see how it feels. Feel great right now, but maybe I'll try pulling one out.

[A]

That's right. So, guys, if you're looking for a great work boot, great work apparel, a nice little quarter zip to make you look quarter ripped, you got to go to bruntworkwear.com use code bellied up. They're giving you 10 bucks off. And what better way to start the new spring season? Coming up with a new pair of boots.

[B]

Heck, yeah, Drew.

[C]

Shalom, brother.

[A]

Dude, I am so excited for this call because the only thing I know about this, Drew, is that you are addicted to taxidermy. And the way that you answered the phone, I. You seem like a guy who would be addicted to taxidermy.

[C]

Yeah, I guess you could put it like that.

[B]

Let me get the crowbar out for the rest of this conversation. Drew, what got you into the taxidermy game?

[C]

Well, let's see. Let's. Let's go back to my younger years. Probably about 14 years old. First started duck hunting and feather hunting with dad. Shot my very first wood duck, right? It was like 6:30. Scared the dog crap out of him, basically. Did not call the shot. Did not know any better. He just set me up with a 12 gauge and some number fours, and I saw one calling, and I didn't even question it. Oh, yeah, on the third one, he kind of floated. He floated towards the riverbank there and kind of sailed down, and dad kind of jumped. Scared him. Long story short, that one got mounted, and I sat there and I'm like, that is such a pretty bird, you know, because they got all that iridescent color on them, all that green and blue and purple and the full wing speculum and all that beautiful bird, right? Fully plumed out. So then later that morning, dad sits there and pops a hand, and it lands right in his lap. Honestly, one of the better days that I've ever had. When I was a kid, I thought it was great. So dad got it mounted for me. Took him a little while to get the money and that, but we got it done. Made it into one big piece, all that. So down the line, sit there, and you get pheasants done. And then you look at them, and it's a very similar thing, all the color and everything, and you appreciate it, and you just sit there and admire it. And I'm like, you know what this is? This is nice, right? So then we sit there and now I'm on my own at 26 years old and I'm like, you know what? I can do what I want. I have an adult job, I have adult money, I have my own place, I have my own dog. I can do whatever I want. Right. So then I sit there and I'm going hunting left and right from basically September till like February. Now pushing into April because now I'm starting to get into turkeys a little bit.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

But that's to kind of be. To be seen as to how far that one's gonna play out. So, yeah, now I'm sitting here and I'm just throwing money down the tube with this thing, seeing how far we can go.

[B]

So you got a taxidermy addiction is what you're saying?

[C]

I guess you could say that, yeah. I've got probably like five birds in my freezer right now that I need to get in. I've got. I've got two snow geese that I'm supposed to be picking up here within like a couple weeks. If not here, probably later this week. I got a deer that I just brought in from this past year, which he was a. He was a tank, he was a brick house. So, yeah, that was the first one I got of him. And a lot of these are kind of first. You know, in a way it's like a collector thing, which I don't know if that's necessarily a good way of putting it to some of the audience out there.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, I know what you're saying. So how many taxidermied animals do you have in your house right now?

[C]

Let's see. I started really pushing back in 2020.

[B]

Covet. Really gotcha, huh?

[C]

Yeah, I mean, I. I came back from overseas at one point. I was gone for like six and a half months. So I came back and my boss was like, hey, you got like a month off. He's like, just kind of take your time, like readjust to the US and the lifestyle and that. So I'm like, alright, cool. So it's like December, January. Right. So I'm sitting there and I'm like, I got nothing better to do. Why not go sit in the woods? I was sitting there and I was trying to bow hunt. And then I'm like, you know what, I want to try and change up the pace and go bird hunting that. So a lot of this has really gone to birds. Well, let's see. I got one gold knife, green ring, teal. I'm getting a mallard done. I'M getting a ring neck. Done. I got a pheasant. Actually, I have three pheasants. I got one black and two regulars.

[A]

You shot a black pheasant?

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

That's sweet.

[C]

And then the ones, Charlie, I've only

[B]

seen one, but I've never.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Oh, yeah, no, he. Granted, that was back around when I was, like, 14 or so, but, yeah, I got a nice black rooster. Grandpa, I think, has the hen because he was with me on that one. Stubborn oatmeal. Anyway, what else is there?

[B]

So yours. How much would you say you've spent on your taxidermying?

[C]

Oh, gosh, Charlie. I mean, within the past year alone, I probably sunk in at least three grand. We're just gonna. We're just gonna keep chucking down the tube on this one, because I'll pay. I'll pay for a good price on a good quality piece.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

So at what point do you just start learning to do this on your own?

[B]

That's what I was gonna ask.

[C]

You know, I sat there in this week, actually, this past week, I've really started to kind of think about that myself. And I kind of mentioned to my wife, I'm like, hey, when I retire or I get out, like, I'm done with this job. What if I just go and do this instead?

[D]

And.

[A]

How old are you?

[C]

I'm only 26, dog.

[B]

I got plenty of time talking about retirement.

[C]

So long, ball.

[A]

Okay, so you say, you know, retirement, but I. It sounds a little bit like you've been throwing around the idea of starting your own taxidermy business and getting rid of the nine to five.

[C]

Yeah, a little bit. Or at least doing it on the side.

[A]

Now, one thing I would caution you with, it sounds like you really love this and you love, you know, hunting. You love all that. The quickest way to not love something anymore is turn it into a thing that you rely on for money.

[C]

Well, and I've also thought about that aspect, too, because then my other worry with it is, like, okay, if I don't enjoy or if it starts taking too much time or if I'm obviously not that great at it, why do it? You don't want to sit there and take somebody's trophy or a memory like that and then just sit there and take a giant dump on it.

[B]

Yeah, you don't want to take. Because we've all seen some bad taxidermy before.

[C]

Right. And I don't want to be that guy.

[B]

And you also, you know, you don't wanna. It's kind of like, you don't want the first house you build to be your own either. So, yeah, you. You want to practice on someone else's, but you don't wanna.

[A]

What does your wife think of all this?

[C]

I don't know exactly what she thinks, and part of me honestly doesn't necessarily care what she thinks because at that point, at that point, it's my own endeavor.

[A]

You better hope she doesn't listen to this podcast. That was the wr. Say

[C]

part of me, not the whole thing. So it's a conscious effort.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

How much of the taxidermy is she allowing you to put in the house?

[C]

Well, the snow, gee, she doesn't know about yet. I forewarned her that a few birds are coming in the house. She said she's actually started to name some attacks, starting a couple years ago.

[A]

Okay, that's fine. So she likes it should.

[C]

Yeah. So we got. We got Jerry, we got Gerald, we got Phil. I think we got Walter. I think that that's about it.

[A]

I think you need to name your Jerry and Gerald. You should name one of them Jared for our Jared.

[B]

Yeah, that would be nice.

[C]

It's Gerald. It's Gerald with a G, not a

[A]

G. No, I know. I'm just saying that you should do Jared next. I would love that. Jared would love that.

[B]

What species would you like to be? Jared?

[C]

The water buffalo.

[B]

Oh, I don't know.

[C]

I don't know if I'm reaching that far down the tube yet, my guy.

[B]

Well, figured out. We gotta get Jared on the mic more.

[A]

Not. No, not Jared. I want. I want. I don't give a Jared. Because that's what that was.

[B]

That is good.

[A]

He's like, I don't care.

[B]

I kind of want to go cut to Jared in this podcast, but he's just always a water buffalo on the wall, you know?

[C]

Too bad Jared's not built like a water buffalo. Unless he wants to be. Thank you.

[A]

Is that good or bad?

[C]

Decide that one.

[B]

Have you ever shot a duck so pretty. You felt bad about shooting it?

[C]

I don't think I felt bad. I don't think I've ever felt bad about it. I'll sit there and admire it and be like, wow, this thing was a beautiful living creature. And I just sat there and I just clapped him right out of the sky.

[A]

I thought he was going down.

[B]

He's really tooting his own horn.

[A]

It gave its life so that, you know, we could sustain ours at the meat.

[C]

You gotta have at least a little bit of pride.

[B]

Yeah. Oh, that's. That's a good question. So every time I've gone duck hunting, you know, you breast them up and whatnot. Sometimes you can boil the carcass or whatever. Get yourself.

[C]

Oh, no, we do them all, big dog. We do them whole.

[B]

Okay, so that's my question. Like, so you can't, like, take the meat and then taxidermy it?

[C]

No. A lot of times once that thing is cut up, it's pretty much game over as far as I know.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

However, I did do one thing. Where have you ever seen, like a duck shoulder mount?

[A]

No.

[C]

So it's actually kind of neat in the sense that, like, you can still pull the breast in that out of there and still get your meat net worth out of it. But if you take from like where their breast kind of starts.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Like if you look at like a mallard. Right. Because this is one that I had it on. You basically take from where that skin kind of starts rolling up from the bottom his brown there. And you start to roll it up and you don't tear it or you don't cut into it. You can get them done kind of as a shoulder mount type deal.

[B]

That's hilarious. I've never seen a duck shoulder mount.

[A]

That's how you know that you really are addicted to text.

[B]

Yeah. If you're talking about the duck shoulder

[A]

mount, you know, next thing you do a squirrel shoulder mount as well. Or no,

[C]

tell you what, give me one second here. I'll send it to you guys.

[B]

Yeah, send it over. Yeah, because, like, I, like, I've never gotten any kind of bird taxidermy because usually it's getting the meat. But I was wondering, because, like, with a fish, you can take a picture of the fish, let the fish go, and then they can recreate the fish. But that's obviously much tougher to do with a duck, I'd imagine, huh?

[C]

Yeah, I don't think you're gonna get that far on that one.

[B]

Yeah. All right. You ever do any fish?

[C]

You know, I used to, and then I honestly just kind of quit fishing. Especially since now I'm stuck down here in Illinois. Damn state.

[B]

That's a shame.

[C]

I'm stuck in purgatory down here.

[B]

Don't quit fishing. There's places to fish in Illinois. Yeah.

[C]

It does just feel damn hot and miserable. And it's humid. Oh, I just want out.

[B]

Go out to Northwestern Illinois, though. There's some good. I think you guys actually have some good trout streams over there.

[A]

So what is the coolest thing that you have hanging up in your house?

[C]

You know, it's hard, it's hard to sit there and say. Because I don't necessarily have a favorite because I sit there and I admire all of them.

[A]

Okay, but just, just pick one, I

[C]

guess, I guess I could sit. I just two. I guess I'm gonna go with the pheasant on that one because you don't really see that many black ones.

[A]

Yeah, the black pheasant is pretty rare.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And then I've got a 10 point coming with split G2s. And I mean, that thing, it. We tried to hang him up from a tractor, and I mean, he was barely an inch off the ground. He was a horse.

[A]

Oh, nice. Well, cool, dude.

[B]

Hey, I like your duck shoulder mount. That's that. I think the duck still needs his

[C]

shoulders, but, well, he's got the wings and that, but yeah, that's what, that's what he's working with. I should be picking him up here later in the month.

[B]

Oh, you bought those?

[C]

No, no, no, no, no, no. He's dead. I physically, like, he's. He got murked. He got murked.

[B]

No, I, I, I know, but I mean, you, you, those are your, you got the birds and then that's a taxidermy being done on your birds, right?

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

Okay. Got it.

[C]

Yep, yep.

[B]

Oh, that's a nice, nice little paperweight for the desk there, I'll tell you that.

[C]

Yep. So he's gonna go in the spare room there by the gun cabinet, and then the two snow geese are getting cupped up, and then they're gonna go right over top of the stairwell.

[B]

How do you know you can trust a taxidermist?

[C]

Well, personally, I don't ever bring the bird in first. I sit there and I ask other people, like, hey, let me see your bird. Where did you go?

[B]

Okay.

[C]

I kind of do the references and stuff like that. I kind of dig a little bit on there, like Facebook pages or whatever. I do, I do a lot of investigating and background research.

[B]

Good, good. Do you have any taxidermists you recommend you want to shout out right now?

[C]

Ooh, whitetails and waterfowl. I want to say he's down near Carbondale, Illinois.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Does really good work. Really good work.

[B]

What's the best name for a taxidermist you've ever come across?

[C]

The best name of taxidermists, I mean, they're all pretty much old dudes, like, named Brian or something.

[B]

The name of their business.

[C]

My fault, My fault. Big dog. Let's see. Big dog, me, one, One guy's. His is wildlife Designs.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

That's the one that I brought my buck to this year.

[D]

All right.

[A]

It sounds upscale.

[B]

Yeah, it sounds very. That sounds like they sell some wildlife pictures in there as well.

[C]

He does a lot of. A lot of deer obviously come through there since he's in the Midwest and that. And then he does a lot of exotic stuff, too. Surprising. He does get some water buffalo and cape buffalo and stuff like that in there. I don't think he's done any, like, giraffes or anything like, super, super huge. He's done a muskox in there. He's got a bunch of stuff.

[B]

Does he. Like, like, if a zoo, if an animal, like, passes away, do the zoos donate it to the taxidermists or. How the hell do you get a freaking giraffe?

[A]

I think you know how. Yeah, you pay and go to Africa.

[B]

Oh, it's one of those.

[C]

Yeah. Oh, where you been, Charlie?

[B]

Well, I didn't, I didn't know if they would. What, are they going to ship a giraffe over here? What the hell are you talking about? Oh, you're going to ship a live giraffe overseas or a dead giraffe. You're going to ship a dead giraffe? I didn't mean to say live. Yeah, like, you have to. What? Think about the process, Miles.

[A]

I know it's the second time you've talked about it being alive. Like, I just imagine you think that the process is bringing a live animal to the taxidermist and then they do that.

[B]

When else I say last? Did I say live at a different time? No, you shoot a. Okay, so you, okay, you shoot one of these overseas and you're. What is there a plane with just a big giraffe sized refrigerator?

[A]

I think you put it in a shipping container and you send it back.

[C]

Oh, yeah, I. I would imagine so. I can't. I can't say I haven't gotten to that, that peak of life, you know?

[B]

Okay, all right. No, I'm the idiot. My bad, my bad.

[A]

I'm with you. That. The logistics on a giraffe is quite extensive.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Oh, I would imagine so.

[B]

I mean, even if it's just a shoulder mount you're talking about, you know, pretty big box.

[A]

Where do you got be in life that you're. You're going. You're paying to shoot a giraffe and then shipping it back, and where are you gonna put that?

[B]

You better have high ceilings.

[C]

Yeah, you gotta have some, some giant ceilings in there, man. That's gotta be at least like a 30 foot, ceiling at a minimum.

[A]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I fed a giraffe at the.

[B]

I fed a giraffe, too, at the.

[A]

The Phoenix Zoo when I was there.

[B]

Their tongues are like sandpaper.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I don't know what you're doing.

[B]

Hungry little fellas.

[A]

They do like, the little. Wrap your. Their tongue around the food.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think I could shoot a giraffe.

[A]

No.

[C]

No. I don't think I could either. I don't think I have that kind of taste in my life.

[B]

Yeah, I'm. I'm. For me, I'm. I'm. I'm kind of a fisher first, but I kind of draw the line on pretty close after deer. I'm not much for one, but, you

[C]

know, I would concur.

[B]

What's that?

[C]

So that would concur.

[B]

Yeah. But I mean, to each their own. I just am fascinated by the process,

[A]

the line of, like, things like population control and stuff. It's like. Like, gets to be a slippery slope, like. Yeah, what are we doing?

[C]

Should I really be doing this?

[A]

You know, like, if you got bears running wild in your area and for a safety reason that we need to control the population, go ahead.

[B]

Yeah, if the. If the population is healthy enough. But, yeah, I'm not, You know. Yeah, that's. That's kind of how I feel. Deer, I get it. They're gonna. You know, they're. You. They get overpopulated. They start getting that CWD getting crazy. You hit them with a car, then you're taking CWD backstraps home,

[C]

which some guys are sitting there nowadays saying that that's a whole missing net. But I'm obviously no scientist. I just sit here and work on airplanes.

[B]

Here we go. Some guys are just saying that. They've been saying that since the beginning. But either way. Either way, we're excited for you. And, you know, we hope that the wife takes these snow geese in stride, because it sounds like this might be a bit of a fight. Did she put up a fight on any of this stuff, or are you just hoping for the best?

[C]

I'm partly hoping for the best. Her thing is, like. She's like, okay, if you bring any more birds in here. At one point, this was. Anyways, she's like, if you bring any more birds in here, I want a tattoo in return. Kind of like a one for one thing.

[A]

Yeah. Because that's what marriage is about, is keeping score and having leverage over the other person.

[C]

Yes, yes, yes, it is, Miles. It always has been. Always will be.

[A]

Anyone tells you differently is lying to themselves.

[C]

Get. Damn right.

[B]

How many tattoos does your wife have?

[C]

I think it's only two, maybe three now.

[B]

It's not like.

[C]

It's not like she's tatted up and has sleeves and stuff like that.

[A]

Yeah. Good trade off, you guys. It sounds like you guys got a good setup going.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. Generally speaking, we're on the same page for the most part. Every once in a while, I'll tell her. I'll be like, look, this is kind of the way things are going to go. So just kind of a heads up. I straight up told her. I straight up told her when I left for deer season, because I. I took off about two weeks. She's like, we have kids. She's like, you can't do this anymore. I'm like, we go through this every year. What do you expect?

[B]

You took off two solid weeks. Two weeks straight.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Dude, your wife deserves, like, five tattoos, man.

[C]

I mean, we go through this every year. I don't ever buy burger.

[B]

Well, that's good. That's good.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But I'm out there on a mission, and if I say I got early, cool. I come home early. My job is done.

[B]

You're providing is what you're saying.

[C]

Yeah, I mean, mission accomplished. What else are you going to do? Sit there and fart around?

[B]

Yeah. You can't eat taxidermy.

[A]

That is. I can't argue with that. I now know how your wife feels. This is a very logical argument, and I. I agree. What, are you just gonna sit there and fart around?

[B]

That's just every conversation ender.

[A]

It's like, how can you argue with that?

[B]

You know, Honey, I'm going to.

[A]

I'm gonna go to Vegas with the boys for two weeks.

[C]

What?

[A]

You can't do that. What, do you want me just to sit here and fart around?

[C]

I mean, what are you gonna do? So, yeah, before. Before I even left for deer season this year, I straight up told her. I'm like, hey, if I get a shot at this thing and I. I finish the job, I finish what I started. Like, he's going on the wall. Oh, okay.

[B]

Wow, dude. So not only are you gone for two weeks, you're. You're demanding wall space, too.

[C]

I mean, I haven't. This is the first buck that I've had hung up, like, on, like, a full blown shoulder mount.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Otherwise, I just kind of zip the racks and. Sure, do what I will with it.

[A]

Well, I thought. I thought I knew what you would do.

[B]

With that now I got way more questions.

[A]

What are you. You doing something weird with the racks or what?

[C]

No, you just kind of go in the basket in the garage. Or I sit there and I'm doing plaster pairs and I put them up on the wall.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

Okay. All right. Thank you for clarifying.

[C]

Yeah, well, I figured you'd need that.

[B]

Well, look, we are excited for you and for your taxidermying and for your wife and for the health of your marriage.

[C]

Well, I appreciate that, Charlie.

[B]

Yeah. And let us know if you get anything. Any chipmunks done. I've never seen a chipmunk mounted before. I think that would be cool.

[C]

Sounds good. All right.

[A]

All right, well, we appreciate calling in, dude.

[C]

Yeah, thank you, guys for taking my call. And tip your bartender, watch out for deer, and catch you later.

[B]

All right, you too. We'll see you soon.

[A]

Well, he's got a good. He's got quite the arrangement with his wife.

[B]

No, Miles, this is the exact moment where I really wish we had the other side of the story.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

To have his wife on.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, the way he talks about. He plays it convincing. Like, that's just the way rolls in his house.

[A]

But you never know.

[D]

This is Amber.

[B]

Hey, Amber. How you doing today?

[D]

Fantastic. It's a lovely day.

[B]

Yes, it is. Yes, it is.

[A]

Where are you at?

[D]

We're gonna keep that anonymous.

[B]

Oh, she's at work.

[A]

All right, let's buckle in. I'd like an anonymous call. I like an anonymous call.

[B]

Is Amber your real name?

[D]

No.

[B]

All right. It sounded like a stripper name, dude.

[D]

Well, I'm a stay at home mom, so there's that. That's true.

[A]

No.

[B]

Oh, thank God. Sorry, Sorry.

[A]

What'd you say?

[B]

You're a stay at home mom?

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[A]

All right. How many kids right now?

[D]

We got twin 14 month olds and. Yeah.

[A]

And you said right now you're gonna have more twins or. No. Maybe try for triplets next time?

[D]

Maybe. Maybe.

[A]

You know, they always say when you have, you know, like, you don't expect twins, you know, and, like, I feel like, for, like, psychology or, like, karma in the world, I should start telling Anne that we should try for twins. That means that I'll never get twins, Right?

[B]

How do you try for twins?

[A]

That's also. I'm gonna do that from now on. New. You guys gonna have any kids? Yeah, we've been trying for twins

[B]

just

[D]

to play it safe.

[B]

Yeah, that's good.

[A]

So how. Yeah, anyways. So you got two twins at home?

[C]

Yep.

[B]

One set of.

[A]

One set of Twins.

[D]

Correct. Correct. Okay, so we need your boy's advice.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Okay. Yeah.

[D]

So my sisters and I recently put together the pieces that our dad and his new wife have opened relationship.

[A]

Oh.

[D]

Which, no judgment, you do you.

[B]

Well, it sounds like not just you,

[A]

you do you and you and you and you, but.

[D]

So the twins are 14 months, so they're getting to the age where they're getting nicknames for everyone. And I need your advice on what we should. What would you call swinger Grandparents?

[C]

I think.

[A]

I think you just call them grandparents. I don't know. Why do you feel the need at 15 months old to let them know, like, hey, just so you know, you're old enough now. You just started solid foods. It's time we had to talk now

[B]

that you're about to eat pineapples.

[A]

Okay, you just. I can't hold it any longer. You're 15 months old. You can't fully talk, but you need to know that your grandparents are fooling around with other people.

[D]

It's not. Obviously not like that, but, like, it just doesn't feel right to say grandma and grandpa. Now. They don't know that we know, but we know.

[B]

Okay. Okay. How do you know? Let's take it.

[A]

We.

[B]

We're, like, on step five. Let's go back to step one. What was the day you found out, your parents or your husband's?

[C]

I forget.

[D]

My. My dad and his new wife.

[B]

Your dad and his new wife. How did you find out they were swingers?

[D]

So there was a lot of hints, but one of my sisters has started receiving messages online, kind of like, hey, did you know your dad and his wife are swingers?

[A]

Rude.

[D]

It's. There's. There's a lot of signs of, like.

[A]

I mean, I don't know what. I don't think that's a sign. I think that's just someone telling you.

[D]

Why did they do that leading up to the messages?

[B]

Well, were they creeped out or why did they. Why? That's an odd thing to Just message. It is.

[D]

It is. I don't know why.

[B]

Okay?

[D]

I have no clue.

[B]

Do they have weird lawn ornaments?

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

What certain animals?

[B]

Flamingo, maybe.

[C]

Wow.

[B]

All right, so they got flamingos up. Flamingos up.

[A]

Do they like pineapple on pizza?

[D]

Pineapple isn't their sign.

[A]

Okay, so what is that? All right, so you must have done some research. So their sign is flamingos, then? And what does that mean in the swinger community? Flamingos.

[D]

From my research, different groups have different signs. Okay, so that would be their sign.

[A]

Okay, so it's like. It's like. Like a motorcycle club. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The different attire, and it's almost like sports team.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Their logo.

[C]

Right.

[B]

I like motorcycle club more because it's like the Hell's Angels, you know, the.

[A]

What is.

[B]

The Philandering Flamingos. You know?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you like that, Miles? The Philandering Flamingos.

[C]

Right.

[B]

Get the alliteration of the sound.

[A]

You know, I'm gonna. I'm gonna paint a picture of your dad, because this is why I imagine a guy who's a grandpa who's also a swinger. I imagine he. He's wearing a jumpsuit, track suit a lot, with lots of, like. Like, gold bracelets and necklaces. He never wears a hat, but he wears, like, really comfortable, like, New Balance sneakers.

[B]

Easy to remove. Describe your dad for us. Describe your dad. Does he look like a swinger?

[D]

He's keeping young for his age.

[B]

He's keeping young for his age. So he's working out.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you have a hot dad?

[A]

You got a hot dad?

[D]

I think I want to say. You can.

[A]

Go ahead, say it. You got a hot dad. Friends have suggested that your dad is a swinger or that he's hot?

[D]

Both.

[B]

He's a dilf and a guilt.

[A]

So is that. You know, if I hear from my friends that my dad is a swing swinger. Are you starting to wonder if any of your friends have swung with your dad?

[D]

I want to question their parents.

[A]

Oh, so you think, like, hey, when we were doing, like, you know, like, hockey tournaments as kids, they let us go play in the pool by ourselves for a reason.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

You seem quite disturbed.

[B]

Yeah, you're. You're a little quiet, a little coy over there for someone who just called a podcast Talk. Talking about his dad's swinging.

[A]

Swinging his, you know, around.

[B]

What about your mom? Is she in the picture?

[D]

She is.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

She's. She's great. She has her own wife doing her own thing.

[A]

Does she have any opinion on it?

[D]

She's mortified, but it makes sense because my dad could not keep faithful during their marriage, so it works out for him.

[B]

Okay. All right. Well, that's unfortunate for your mom, but

[A]

worried for your dad.

[B]

We're. Miles.

[A]

He found a lifestyle that fits him so he doesn't get into trouble.

[B]

Is his new wife his age? Is she older? Is she younger?

[D]

She's. She's his age.

[B]

Okay. All right. And so they are flamingos. So what does the Flamingo mean?

[D]

It's their group sign. So I think. Okay.

[A]

It's like the. It's like the. You're saying, like.

[B]

Oh, no, sorry. I wasn't. I wasn't cutting you off. I was cutting Miles off. I was. I was. I was. Was trying to. He was giving me a look, so I was trying to get more clarity. What I mean by that is. Weren't you giving me a look? No, I saw it out of the corner of my eye. What I mean by it is, like, do you know, like, what swingers prefer or what. What Flamingo people prefer?

[A]

Yeah. Are they swappers? Are they, like, full group?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

Are they. You know, is it maybe. Is it a guy? Guy? Girl. Girl.

[B]

That's what I was asking.

[A]

Basically, you're one wondering, like, what if they're a football team? What playbook are they? Yes, exactly. Are they running the spread offense or. They're going under center. They're probably going under center, if we're being honest.

[D]

You know, I try not to think about that part too much.

[B]

Oh, okay. Sorry, Amber.

[D]

I don't care. You can talk about it. I won't.

[A]

We are really curious now, though.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

But I think it's our friends growing up. I think it's. All of our parents have all dabbled.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Wow.

[D]

Now that all of us kids are out of the house, all the parents go on vacations together.

[A]

They go to Sandals.

[D]

They go to resorts.

[A]

Do they probably go to Sandals?

[C]

I've heard.

[A]

Yeah, I've heard things about Sandals. Jamaica.

[B]

Do they have a place in Florida?

[D]

No, not that I know of.

[A]

They go to Sandals.

[C]

Sandals.

[B]

Sandals. Jamaica has got the swingers.

[A]

Have they been to Sandals, Jamaica?

[D]

See, all the pieces are there. All these pieces were coming together. And then all of a sudden, my sister got messages like, hey, did you know your dad's a swinger? She goes, no, but I do now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Tough to be that person to break the news. But they definitely wanted to message someone.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

So it just doesn't feel right.

[A]

Yeah. Back to the original question.

[D]

Grandma and Grandpa.

[A]

Why? What's so wrong with that?

[D]

It just.

[A]

What do you. You want to call them? What do you want. What do you want to call them?

[D]

I don't know what to call them.

[B]

Well, is it just the. Because your mom is Grandma, right?

[D]

Yeah. Yep.

[B]

And then your. Your dad can be Grandpa. You know, he can be Daddy.

[A]

Granddaddy. We're gonna go to Granddaddy and grand. Mommy's place.

[B]

Oh, God.

[D]

Icky.

[B]

This is an interesting question, though.

[A]

I mean, we gotta. We. There's. We can't leave a stone unturned here because you're Your twins are getting to the age where they're gonna start asking questions. You know, if they cross over that 18th month mark, I don't know how you're gonna handle this. It might be they're gonna find out from one of their friends, just like

[C]

you guys found out a whole nother thing.

[D]

Bad gas travels fast.

[B]

I love that phrase. Amber, you're great. Okay, so what about your dad is Grandpa, your mom is Grandma, and then the other woman, what's her. Whatever her name is? Let's say it's Bertha.

[A]

Nana. Just call her Nana.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

How about Nana?

[D]

Okay,

[A]

well, what were you thinking? Because we're doing our best here.

[D]

I appreciate it. I appreciate it. The sentimental value behind Grandma and Grandpa. There's like a certain sentimental value, because my experience, my grandparents were good, honest, Christian people, loved the Lord. And then you have my dad, who just is doing his own thing. And again, no judgment to him.

[A]

So you can't just keep judging him and then keep saying no judgment to him. You know, it's like, hey, Charlie, no offense, but you're a piece of shit.

[B]

Oh, none taken, Miles. Thanks, but I'm gonna go home and cry now, Amber. So, you know, let's just be. Let's just call a spade a spade. You got judgment, and that's okay. It's okay.

[A]

I think if you look at it from a unemotional. Unemotional standpoint, before you found out he was a swinger, what would his name have been?

[D]

Yeah, I mean, run of the mill standard.

[A]

He'd been Grandpa.

[B]

And what would her name have been?

[D]

Probably Nana.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Okay. So him. Him being part of the Pink Flamingos, it doesn't affect your life at all in terms of. It doesn't. You think he's. What? He's not going to interact with your kids any differently. What's wrong with just calling him Grandpa?

[D]

That's true. That's true.

[B]

And just because they go spread eagle at Sandals doesn't mean that there are any worse people. You know, there's different strokes for different folks. And these folks just happen to do a lot of different strokes with a lot of different folks.

[D]

A lot of different folks.

[B]

And at the end of the day, who are we to judge?

[D]

Exactly.

[B]

So Grandpa and Nana.

[A]

And like, honestly, I think this whole thing, I. I think think the. The Grandpa and grandma's thing is really about a larger issue here, Charlie.

[B]

That's what I'm getting.

[A]

I think it's. I. I don't think you've come to terms with what's happened here. And so thus, you're channeling it through your freshly born twins. And what, you're gonna tell them their names are. You know, and. Charlie, maybe we should help her, you know, work through this a little bit. How does it. How does it make you feel when you found this news out?

[D]

Disgusted.

[C]

What?

[A]

Yeah, that's good. Keep coming. What else?

[D]

Like, I knew he wasn't a great guy, but, like, come on. That. Anyway.

[B]

Well, let me ask you this. Just devil's advocate.

[A]

Okay. Okay, go ahead. Sorry.

[B]

Okay, well, all I'm saying is, before, he was being dishonest about who he was, and now he's being honest about who he is with his current partner. So maybe this is a step in the right direction.

[D]

Right. And I can respect owning up to who you are. I can respect that.

[A]

Okay. What would if. Okay, so let's. Let's role play it here.

[C]

Charlie. Yeah.

[A]

You're her dad. And it's just you two, you've. You've taken a potion that you are suddenly comfortable talking about the truth and telling your dad the truth. What would you tell him here to his face? Oh, you turn the mic off.

[B]

Amber, honey, how are you?

[D]

Fantastic.

[B]

What's wrong? Seems like something's wrong.

[D]

It just. You know, my sister got a message that you and your new wife have been fooling around.

[B]

Yeah,

[D]

I don't know. What am I supposed to say?

[B]

Well, you know, here's the deal. Me and Bertha, we love each other. And we view love as sort of a overflowing cup. And we have so much love to give that we're wasting water. It's going on the floor. So our hope here is to spread the wetness around.

[D]

Honey, I think this just boils down to different values. Dad, I really think it does.

[B]

Okay, well, honey, I respect who you are, but I understand that you don't respect the values that I have. I do. I am who I am, and I have to accept that. But you do not. And I love you.

[D]

Okay. Okay. Interesting.

[B]

Can I get some donuts for the kids?

[A]

Hey there, kid. Come sit on Papa's lap.

[B]

Amber, what came up for you there?

[D]

A lot of. A lot of something. I don't know.

[A]

A lot of anger. Is that what it was?

[C]

Anger?

[D]

Disgust.

[B]

Disgust. Have you seen Inside Out, Amber?

[D]

I have. I have.

[B]

Well, we know that disgust sometimes is running cover for some other emotion. And when the time's right, we just want to touch that emotion. Then it'll have less power.

[D]

You know, you might be onto something.

[B]

I just saw it this movie.

[A]

Do you think he's on something?

[D]

No, but I was going along with it.

[B]

Ah, geez.

[A]

So do you think you're ever going to confront him about it, or is this going to be. Are you guys a sweep it under the rug family?

[D]

Sweep it under the rug.

[A]

Nice.

[B]

So then just send them the podcast when it drops.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Just say, hey, dad, here's a podcast you might like.

[A]

You could just do, like, what the rest of us do and just drink and just ignore it.

[D]

You know, I like that plan. It's been working for the last number of years. I think that'll work.

[B]

Well, hang on here, Miles. The way she just responded to that, I, I.

[A]

If I'm a therapist, I'm to trying. Trying to get. I'm trying to get another session out of this.

[B]

Oh, you're trying to get another session.

[A]

Therapists, do they. If they don't, it's bad business to fix people.

[B]

That's true. Don't put a period on it. Put a comma on it.

[A]

Yeah. A dot, dot, dot.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. More to discuss next time. Have you had a therapist, Amber?

[D]

I have, I have.

[A]

And what does therapist say?

[D]

Well, we didn't know about the whole swinger situation when we were with the therapist.

[B]

Okay. Who's you and your old family counseling?

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Well, I'm saying for you personally, do you have your own personal therapist?

[C]

No.

[A]

That's why she called on this podcast.

[B]

I love it. I love that you trusted us.

[A]

Do you think this is just reopening old wounds from when you were a child? When your dad was being unfaithful to your mother?

[D]

It makes me think about it.

[B]

Yeah, I get that.

[D]

Makes me think.

[A]

Yeah. It probably feels just like when you were a kid, doesn't it? When? For when it first happened.

[D]

I'm trying to protect my kids from that.

[B]

Ah,

[D]

well, we're unpacking stuff.

[A]

We're unpacking stuff.

[B]

And Amber, you're also trying to protect your inner child.

[A]

That is true.

[C]

Mm.

[B]

Yep. And you know what? Your kids are a good excuse to do that, but you don't need an excuse to protect your inner child. You're able to do that anytime you want, and you don't need to justify it.

[D]

Okay.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

One thing also, that maybe will help you sleep a little better at night. Kind of a band aid situation. Grandchildren of divorce have it the best because they just get more Christmases without all the childhood trauma. So that's true. It's like a silver lining of this whole thing. I think you're gonna tell her to

[B]

get a zero gravity Bed.

[A]

That too. If you want to sleep better at night, get a zero G bed. They'll change your life.

[D]

Tempur pedic?

[A]

No, no, no. I had a tempur pedic. It sucks. It'll ruin you. Do not buy a tempedic mattress.

[C]

Sorry.

[D]

Never mind.

[A]

Sorry. That just opened up a childhood wound.

[D]

Let's unpack that there. What emotion are you feeling?

[A]

Pain in my lower lumbars.

[D]

And have you seen a physical therapist about this?

[A]

Well, I have a sister in law who's a chiropractor and I've talked to her about it and got a few, few adjustments. So we're working through it.

[D]

Good. Good.

[A]

I did finally face it.

[D]

Glad you're on that journey.

[A]

I, I, I swallowed my pride and I got a real bed instead of a bed in a box, so.

[D]

Time to grow up.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

In the world.

[A]

I want. Yeah. I mean, any other thoughts? Because Charlie, you know, we're being therapists here. Any other thoughts for her to think about or actually don't think about?

[B]

No, I think, Amber, the thing here is a lot of people avoid feeling pain because they think feeling the pain is going to lead to more pain. But I think when you really sit and feel the pain and it gets less and less over time, never goes away. But I think if you have a moment to spare, just don't be afraid to sit there with that feeling and, you know, and just let it be there.

[D]

Okay. Okay.

[A]

One other question for you. If you could fast forward, we had a button. We could fast forward 20 years from now. And I told you, I said, oh, I'm gonna give you a rundown of your children's relationship with their grandfather and said that he treated them just like normal grandchildren and didn't do anything bad to them. Would you be feel a lot better?

[D]

I would feel relieved.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

All right.

[A]

So let's just live life assuming that that's what's gonna happen.

[D]

Assume the best.

[A]

Well, it's just you could spend the next 20 years worrying about it, ruin these 20 years with it, and then it never happens. Or you could not worry. You know, just like assume that something good will happen and then if something does bad happen, then you can deal with it then, you know, like calling them something different probably isn't going to change anything for what will happen. You know what I mean?

[B]

But you want, you kind of want

[A]

protecting him from anything.

[B]

You kind of don't want to call him something else so he knows that you're mad without a actually telling him.

[A]

Is that what it is? That's what it is.

[D]

Kind of.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

You.

[B]

That's that passive aggressive. What are you, Catholic?

[D]

Maybe?

[B]

Yeah, for sure.

[C]

Catholic.

[A]

I also want you to think about.

[D]

Sweep it all under the rug.

[B]

Sweep it under the rug.

[A]

So I want you also to think about maybe your dad's got some childhood trauma, too. Have you thought about that?

[D]

Hurt people. Hurt people. I've thought about that. I've thought about that.

[A]

You know, maybe he feels the same thing inside that you do, but about a different scenario.

[D]

Yeah, maybe.

[B]

And instead of feeling his feelings, he's feeling Trish and Diane and. Yeah. Claire, Bill.

[A]

Rob. Rob and Mark.

[B]

Mark, too, then.

[A]

Tim.

[B]

Oh, well.

[A]

Oh,

[D]

a lot to unpack. A lot to.

[B]

I know some friends that are swingers, by the way, and they have a lot of fun. So at some point, if you do ever get over the whole. Which probably is going to be a long shot, but they might be fun to party with.

[D]

Party with my swinger dad.

[A]

Well, you don't have to. You can leave before that begins. They don't just walk in and then just start doing stuff.

[B]

No, just go for the cocktail hour.

[A]

Yeah. Go for the social hour. Don't stay for the main event.

[B]

Yeah. Just keep your keys outside the fishbowl and you'll be fine.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Go to the prelims, you know.

[D]

Yeah, okay. Okay.

[A]

Go to the groom's dinner, not the wedding.

[D]

Oh, gosh. Okay. Well, I appreciate your input and unpacking my childhood trauma.

[B]

Yeah, we did our best, you know, And.

[A]

And maybe think about, instead of getting mad, just get more curious, you know?

[B]

Miles, read that on the back of a book somewhere.

[D]

Curiosity kill the cat.

[B]

Yeah, that's true. Her dad got curious and now look where we are.

[A]

He's killing cats left and right.

[D]

Cat killer.

[C]

Meow.

[A]

But also, like, hey, life would be pretty boring if this wasn't going on. So, like, at least look at that. Like, you and your siblings have something to talk about now. Like, that's kind of fun. Like what? You know, if you didn't have that, what are you guys gonna be like? So, how's work lately?

[D]

Right.

[A]

Come on.

[B]

Instead you're like, what's dad working on lately?

[D]

Analyzing the Facebook posts.

[B]

Wait, what Facebook posts?

[D]

From the swingers trips that aren't.

[A]

Oh, yeah, dude, that's fun. You're, like, decoding what went on, who

[D]

was sleeping with who, and then who's commenting on what.

[A]

Ah, it's a classic who done it? Situation. That's awesome. Don't look at this as a bad thing with your dad. Look at it this is a bonding experience with your siblings.

[D]

It is. It really is.

[A]

That's fun.

[B]

Very fun.

[A]

I mean, it's not really that fun for you, but it can be if you.

[B]

You know, if you let it.

[D]

Emotions separating the emotions and just.

[B]

Yeah. And the more you.

[D]

What is that?

[B]

The more you feel the emotions, maybe the less power they have over you. And you can just talk to your dad, like, dad, how is. How is Sandals?

[D]

How is Sandals? Who's. Who's Bill and Joan? And why do they love you so much and comment on your Facebook posts?

[B]

Yeah. Why do they keep borrowing your hammer? You know,

[D]

cup of sugar.

[B]

Is that what they said? Cup of sugar?

[D]

I think that was one of the comments that we found.

[A]

Nice, man. You are in it. You are fully in it.

[B]

Sugar daddy. Sorry, sorry.

[A]

Y.

[B]

Didn't mean to say that.

[A]

You call him daddy.

[B]

I call him sugar daddy. That's what she said. Cup of sugar. So I put two things together, came up with sugar daddy.

[D]

Very clever. Very clever.

[B]

Thank you. Amber.

[A]

What?

[D]

Saw what you did there.

[A]

Amber, before we let you go, what were you planning to get from this call?

[D]

You know, some good banter and see. And see where it goes. And I didn't quite know what you guys would. I wasn't expecting a therapy session, but here we are. We unpack some stuff. We learned some things.

[B]

We rearranged the garage, you know?

[A]

Yeah, I don't think we really learned much. I think we just pointed out a lot of.

[B]

We swept a little. We slept.

[D]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Now we're just gonna sweep it out of the garage, let the wind take care of it. All right.

[D]

Yeah, we can do that. We can do that.

[C]

All right.

[B]

What's too much for you to bear? Give to the wind, Amber.

[D]

There you go. Well, I appreciate your time.

[B]

We appreciate you, Amber. You keep her moving and tell your folks we says hi.

[A]

Good luck having the talk with your. With your 14 month olds.

[D]

That will not happen anytime soon.

[B]

It's good. Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

All right.

[D]

We'll save them. We'll save them from the trauma.

[A]

That's right. That's what. That's what life's about. You. You shield the trauma so they don't have to.

[B]

Exactly.

[D]

Exactly.

[B]

They won't feel it in any other way.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

All right, Amber.

[D]

You boys drive home safe.

[C]

You too.

[B]

Now. Watch for deer.

[D]

Yes, sir.

[B]

Bye bye. Bye bye.

[A]

She was not ready. She's not. She's not ready for a conversation with her dad.

[B]

I don't think I. I think. But I think we. I think we did some bushwhacking.

[C]

In there.

[B]

I mean, her dad did the bushwacking, but I think we cleared some trail that, you know, it's still a little rough, but there's a treasure at the end of that trail.

[A]

And hopefully we start filling some of

[B]

these cracks, you know, plugging some holes.

[A]

Plugging. Plugging up some holes in the boat, you know? Yeah. You know, started mopping up the floor.

[B]

I think I took it too far with that cup analogy.

[A]

Was aggressive way to start. That was the beginning, too.

[B]

I know. Not much foreplay in that conversation, was there, Miles?

[A]

No. Amber will be all right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

She's not the first person to find out that their parents aren't perfect. She won't be the last.

[C]

Right?

[B]

It's just how she goes.

[A]

Well, guys, thanks for tuning in to another episode of the Bellied up podcast.

[B]

It's been real, Miles.

[A]

It's been fun.

[B]

And to Amber.

[A]

Cheers.

[B]

We're praying for you and your dad.

[A]

I don't think your dad needs praying for that dude to live.

[B]

He's had his prayers answered.

[A]

I just, like, the whole time I was thinking, I'm like, dude, he feels so free. He's like, this is why I was born. I was born for this. Andy's. And he's hot on top of it.

[B]

Like, you could tell he's really hot, too. Yeah, the way she ignored that one.

[A]

She knows that he's hot.

[B]

He's working out. Probably taking some tea, too, you know? Yeah, well, she gave us the tea, and her daddy's taking the tea, and. Yeah, that's how life goes.

[A]

And his wife is sucking the tea.

[B]

Yep. All right, well, on that note, you guys make sure you tip your bartender, okay?

[A]

We'll see the next one.

[B]

And if you meet a swinger, don't tip them. Well, never mind.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Hope you guys have a good one. Goodbye now.

[B]

Toodaloo.