Shrek

Summary

Podcast Summary

Black People Love Paramore – Episode: "Shrek"

Hosts: Sequoia Holmes & Ryan (Ryann) Graham
Date: May 14, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Black People Love Paramore dives humorously and insightfully into the 2001 animated film Shrek, exploring its unexpected cultural resonance and the peculiar love Black people (and the internet at large) hold for the ogre-centric franchise. Sequoia and Ryan revisit Shrek’s plot, voice cast, political subtext, soundtrack, and representation — all while riffing on nostalgia, monoculture, and the odd tickling presence Shrek retains in pop culture after 25 years.

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Major Discussion Points & Insights

Shrek: Plot Recap & First Impressions

• Sequoia shares her childhood experience:

  • First saw Shrek on a second-grade field trip, didn’t like it (“too boy-coded,” not enough “girl” vibes) [04:00].
  • On a recent rewatch: “Fantastic film... really good film. Actually, very well done.” [05:10]
  • Shrek is an ogre who wants to mind his business in a swamp but has his peace disrupted by fairytale creatures exiled by Lord Farquaad [05:36].
  • Donkey and Fiona (with her ogre secret) join Shrek on a self-discovery journey, challenging fairy tale norms [08:00].

• Ryan highlights Shrek’s subversiveness:

  • “It’s so subversive and so smart. And I don’t think I got how smart it was when I was a kid.” [13:47]
  • “It’s like a government statement...about how the government will try to take your land from you...displace, redistrict, gerrymander if you will.” [10:39]

Voice Cast Standouts & Chemistry

• Eddie Murphy as Donkey:

  • “I laughed out loud almost every time he opened his mouth.” – Sequoia [19:17]
  • “He’s so uncle coded. So many Black men in my life’s personality is built around an Eddie Murphy archetype.” – Ryan [19:22]
  • General agreement that Eddie was likely improvising many lines—raw comedic genius.

• Mike Myers as Shrek:

  • Debate over why Shrek has a Scottish accent when Myers is Canadian [20:24]
  • The Scottish accent adds a “grungy,” everyman contrast to posh accents of Farquaad and Fiona [21:10].

• Cameron Diaz as Fiona:

  • Both hosts felt Diaz was cast mostly for early-2000s star power but did a “fine job,” if a bit flat compared to others [21:21].
  • Fun speculation on what other stars might have voiced Fiona (Reese Witherspoon, Sandra Bullock) [22:30].

• Shrek’s original voice:

  • Chris Farley voiced 80% of the film before passing away; the role was recast with Myers [24:24].

Notable Quote:

"He pushes her real hard into a bush. I didn’t like that. But she liked it. ...I can handle being abused by an ogre." – [08:06] Sequoia & Ryan

Monoculture & Representation

• Nostalgia for shared pop culture experiences (“monoculture”):

  • In 2001, families all watched the same shows and movies—now everyone streams on their own devices, so broad cultural jokes are harder to pull off [33:12-34:16].
  • “The reason Shrek can reference ... the dating game show? Even us as kids, we would watch game shows with our parents. ...Now everyone is in their rooms watching their own little TV shows. ...Kids today don’t know movies from the...” – Ryan [33:52]

• Black culture and generational knowledge:

  • Sequoia observes that Black cultural references transcend generational divides more than in broader American culture [34:16-35:11].
  • Example: Black Gen Z knowing 90s/2000s memes, tropes, and references; mainstream white Gen Z less so.

Woke Critique: Character Design & Beauty Ideals

• A critical look at “ugliness” in Shrek’s features:
  • Sequoia: “I don’t like that his nose is wide and round and that he’s supposed to be ugly for that. ...These are the types of things that subliminally affect children.” [54:54]
  • Ryan brings up the “if they're green, they're Black” theory: “Piccolo, black. The Skeeter from Doug. Black. ...So Shrek and Fiona, black and black.” [55:45]
  • Both: Noting that non-eurocentric features (wide nose, thickness) are used as a shorthand for “not beautiful”—subtle, problematic messaging [56:33].

Notable Quote:

“I’m like, yeah, what about it? They lucky they didn’t get nobody no lips. Because I’d definitely be...then I’d be standing ten toes down.” – Sequoia [57:59]

Soundtrack & Cultural References

• Soundtrack is “iconic”:
  • “When I saw her face” (Smash Mouth’s “I’m a Believer”) and “All Star” now feel exclusive to Shrek’s identity [31:17-31:35].
  • “Whoever is the music person — so good for Shrek. ...They need you on Euphoria. ...They need to get Smash Mouth.” – Sequoia [31:41]
• Pop culture parody:
  • Shrek’s world is full of fairy tale character spoofs and direct references (Matrix hair flips, theme park jokes, game show parodies) — only possible with monoculture [31:01-33:52].

Adult Themes in a "Kid's" Movie

• Both hosts marvel at the wealth of adult jokes and subtexts missed as children.
  • “This is like barely a kids film. ...So adult.” – Sequoia [14:06]
  • Usage of marital, political, and sexual innuendo (e.g., Lord Farquaad’s "Napoleon complex," the “some of you may die” meme) [29:57, 30:04].
• The “pick me” discourse: “Donkey’s also a pick me. He actively screams pick me. Several times in the movie.” – Ryan [43:20]

Shrek's Acclaim and Impact

• Shrek won the very first Oscar for Best Animated Feature (beating out Jimmy Neutron & Monsters, Inc.) [44:31].
  • Surprise that Shrek beat Monsters, Inc., which both hosts loved and considered “the first movie I cried in” – Ryan [45:00].

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Memorable Quotes & Comic Moments

• On Shrek’s Scottish Accent:
  “Shrek me, babe! ...Literally a British character. And, like, this is a Scottish accent is what I am getting from it. I don’t know why an ogre all of a sudden. I don’t know why we land there.” – Ryan [21:02]
• On Lord Farquaad’s “Queer coding”:
  “Do you think he’s queer? He’s queer coded in the way coded.” – Sequoia [28:37]
• On monoculture's decline:
  “Now everyone is in their rooms watching their own little TV shows... I feel like a movie can’t come out and have a monoculture moment where everyone in the family gets that joke.” – Ryan [33:52]
• On Black features as “ugly”:
  “She has a slim, narrow nose when she’s quote unquote, the beautiful [princess]; uglier as princess she gets a wider, rounder nose. ...What about it? They lucky they didn’t get nobody no lips.” – Sequoia [56:38/57:59]

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Timestamped Notable Segments

• Shrek Plot Recap / First reactions – [03:47–09:03]
• Government/political allegory – [10:39–11:06]
• Donkey/Eddie Murphy comic analysis – [19:13–20:10]
• Discussion of Shrek voice & casting (Myers, Diaz, Farley) – [20:24–24:24]
• Monoculture and Black Gen Z’s shared culture – [33:12–35:59]
• Beauty standards critique — coding ugliness as non-Eurocentric – [54:53–58:44]
• Music & pop culture references in Shrek – [31:01–33:52]
• Pick-me discourse / Donkey’s role – [43:20]
• Oscar win, historical context – [44:31–46:00]

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Lighthearted Moments & Games

• The Shrek Fairy Tale Game: Laura, the producer, quizzes the hosts on Shrek’s fairy-tale characters, which leads to hilarious confusion over basic plots like the differences between the three little pigs, Goldilocks, and Red Riding Hood [46:05–51:47].
• Impressions: Sequoia and Ryan attempt Scottish Shrek imitations, bantering about Farquaad and ogre voices [26:21].

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Conclusion

The episode closes with a view to the future (“Let us know if you want a Shrek 2 episode!” [44:05]), a final reflection on the subtle racial/gender codes in animated films, and a loving nod to the community around Black pop-culture obsessions, nostalgia, and inside jokes.

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For Listeners:

If you haven’t watched Shrek or revisited it as an adult, you’ll find new layers—political, comedic, and cultural—waiting for you. The episode highlights how even kids’ movies can be a lens for race, beauty, generational memory, and the shifting world of pop culture.

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To Connect:

• Watch on YouTube, Spotify, or any podcast app.
• Email fan mail, advice questions, or cultural reflections to [e-mail].
• Engage: “Let us know your thoughts on Shrek, if you’ve seen Shrek 2, if you agree about the features, or want Shrek 2 covered.” [58:44–59:08]

Transcript

[Ryan Graham]

Foreign.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Welcome to Black People Love Paramore, a pop culture podcast. Not about the band Paramore, but a show about the common as well as the uncommon interests of black people. In order to help us feel a little bit more scene. I'm Sequoia Holmes.

[Ryan Graham]

And I'm Ryan Graham.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And before we get into the episode, per usual, if you could take a second, if you're listening to this on Spotify, if you're listening to this on Apple Podcasts, or if you're watching on YouTube. If you're watching on YouTube, you can comment, like, subscribe all that stuff. If you're doing the other things, you can rate us 5 stars if you are a 5 star bitch. Because we are 5 star vicious. What about. So that just makes sense, you know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

Also aspiring five star bitches.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

Sometimes we're all work in progress.

[Sequoia Holmes]

The way that you can become is if you rate us 5 stars.

[Ryan Graham]

Right?

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

That's right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It's good juju and just like good, good motion.

[Ryan Graham]

You know how they say be the thing you want to become?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yes.

[Ryan Graham]

That's a part of that.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yes.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. In. In the action of rating us 5 stars, you are behaving like a 5 star bitch would.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? Exactly. So there's that. I would really appreciate it. Thank you so much. There's also merch. I feel like we talk about the merch, but not all of the time. Yeah. And in wake of Ariana Grande announcing her eighth studio album, Pedal Wake.

[Ryan Graham]

In wake. In wake. H. I don't know. I'm. I'm questioning.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I now hold on.

[Ryan Graham]

In the wake.

[Sequoia Holmes]

In the wake.

[Ryan Graham]

In the wake of. Yes. Like. Okay, sorry. Yes.

[Sequoia Holmes]

In the wake up.

[Ryan Graham]

There it is.

[Sequoia Holmes]

There it is. There it is. I'm like in Wake up. Whatever. In the wake of Whatever. Y' all know what the hell I meant. In wake up. Like I said.

[Ryan Graham]

Right, right, sorry.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Ariana Grande's a studio album being named and told the states, coming out in July. It's called petal. All lowercase per usual. She always does that. If you're Mocha Grande and you're into it, like I'm into it, go grab some Mocha Grande merch. You can wear it to the tour. Oh, we're going to the tour. Wait, the tour starts in June. I think it starts in May. Maybe late May. Whatever. We're going to the June show, which is in la, and I'm gonna wear my Mocha Grande shirt. Ryan, you can wear your Mocha Grande Shirt that you don't have but that you should get.

[Ryan Graham]

I will go get one today and yeah, I should. I also grow my hair out and wear a ponytail.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Can you.

[Ryan Graham]

I didn't. What is that supposed to mean?

[Sequoia Holmes]

I have several wigs that you can borrow.

[Ryan Graham]

Do you have a ponytail wig?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No. How do you put a wig in a ponytail?

[Ryan Graham]

Can you. I have wigs. They're all Amazon wigs, so I don't know that they.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, I could put. I could.

[Ryan Graham]

You can put this into a high pony?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, I, I could. What would happen if you did? It just wouldn't look good. Cuz how does it.

[Ryan Graham]

I don't think I understand how wigs work.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It's stuck. It's stuck on the back. It's stuck on the back. If you can see that.

[Ryan Graham]

Stuck on the back. I don't know what that means.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Do you see? Do you see it?

[Ryan Graham]

I, I, I see hair. I don't know what stuck on the back means. So I don't know what I'm looking for. Is this supposed to be glued to the back of your head?

[Sequoia Holmes]

So today we're talking about today. Today we're talking about the 2001 film Shrek.

[Ryan Graham]

Hell yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because it is the 25th anniversary. You see the math that I just did so quickly? My. Oh my God. It's the 25th anniversary. It was a box office success. Like the girlies were really into it. It was. It grossed 8. Saying numbers out loud is difficult. It grossed 484 million crazy dollars at the box office. And it was loosely Based on a 1990s children book of the same name by author and illustrator William Stig Stag.

[Ryan Graham]

Stags.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So let me tell y' all what Shrek is about.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, yeah. Wait. Well, you just. Okay, you have seen.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Do you want to do it or you want me?

[Ryan Graham]

No, we both have seen it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So I think I just. So, so for, for, for context, I saw Shrek for the first time when I was 8 years old. I was in second grade. They took us on a class field trip. They were like, we're gonna go see this new movie, Shrek. I didn't like it. I was not. They also did something similar with Harry Potter. Didn't like that either.

[Ryan Graham]

As a child. You're saying, like, give me a little. Why?

[Sequoia Holmes]

I just didn't like it. I don't remember. I remember being like, too boycoated. Maybe. Maybe there was not enough girl. Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Cuz even the princess in this is like, she's still not. This whole movie feels boycoded. The way that, like most princess movies are not.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So maybe I didn't. Yeah, maybe I didn't like it for that reason. But I also just like, I know this is not Disney, but it kind of reminds me of I was not a Disney kid. Once again. I was a Disney Channel kid. But I have not seen any of the princess movies. Like, this just isn't a fairy tale type situation has never been my jam.

[Ryan Graham]

That's what's crazy to me because, I mean, you not being fairy tale makes sense. I think this would be your type of fairy tale movie because I think they actively adverts. Yeah. They're making fun of every time.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I couldn't get that at 8.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know, I was just like, oh, you guys took me to see a fairy tale movie. I don't care about that.

[Ryan Graham]

Right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know, and I didn't want to sit in the movie theater for an hour and a half. Like, I was annoyed. And I was like, I don't want

[Ryan Graham]

to be here before it is.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know, I was like, I don't want to do this. So I watched it again for the first time last night. Fantastic film.

[Ryan Graham]

So good.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Really good film. Actually, very well done.

[Ryan Graham]

Holds up way better than I thought.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Holds up really, really well.

[Ryan Graham]

But tell us about it. Like, yeah, you have seen it, so it won't be as good as your. I mean, you know how your descriptions of things are so good.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

So. But I think this one will be even better because it's like you. It's fresh on the mind.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Right. Yeah, I like. It's. I don't know how to compare to your lemonade. Now. That was also good.

[Sequoia Holmes]

My lemonade one was fantastic.

[Ryan Graham]

Your high school was questionable.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It was good. And I am really familiar with High School Musical, so let's see how this one goes. Shrek is a film about an ogre who is crotchety and he likes to be by himself. And he. He don't like people he want, you know, he's trying to mind his business, be about his ogreness and ogre dome. Right in ogre land. Right On a swamp.

[Ryan Graham]

On a swamp.

[Max Fun Announcer]

Wow.

[Ryan Graham]

Dochi. Wow.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Somebody say, right? And then one day, these mythical creatures come knock, knock, knocking at his door. And he's like, what's good? Like, what's up?

[Ryan Graham]

Right, Ready?

[Sequoia Holmes]

And they're like, well, we live here now. And he's like, live where? Who? Who live where? And they're like, here? Yeah. He's like, who said that? And very much. And they're like, well, Lord farquaad said that. He said, I don't give up. What lord said, get them out of my land. So he's like, I'm gonna go find this Lord Farquaad and we're gonna have some. Some chats and some comeuppance because why would you send these people to come to my swamp, right? So he sets out to go find Quad. He is taking his friend Donkey along the way, who's not really his friend at this point, just kind of like an annoyance. So him and Donkey set out to go find Lord Farquaad. They find him. He's teeny tiny, itty bitty. He's a very small man.

[Ryan Graham]

And it. It shows in his behavior.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

Everything about it gives.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Like, he has Napoleon complex, right? Yeah, teeny tiny. He. He's like the ruler of the land, the prince. And I think in order to become king, he has to marry, which is also.

[Ryan Graham]

Can we pause? Right. The fact that it's just like, yeah, just marry anyone and you're a king. Crazy. Actively crazy thing to be like, so

[Sequoia Holmes]

many knights all around. You marry one of them. What's the problem? Why are you going out your way to do all this? It's because he's short. That's why he's going out his way to do all that. He has to prove his worth with a woman because he's. Anyways, so they find him. Lord Farquhar's like, yeah, I did send them over there. And I meant that. And if you want him to get away, you have to go find me a princess, right? And so Shrek is like, bet no problem. So Shrek goes and finds the princess Fiona with Donkey. And Fiona is like a damsel. She's like a damsel, and she's like, annoying. She's like, oh, my God, I can't wait to be married. Oh, my God, I can't wait for my Prince Charming to come and sweep me off my feet. It's gonna be so amazing. He's gonna kiss me. It's gonna be so romantic. And she's just not my type of girl. So I ate. I was like, you can't do it

[Ryan Graham]

even today at that point, okay. Cause I'm saying, like, she's not my

[Sequoia Holmes]

type of girl, I think. And I'm like, okay. And then as they dragging her back to Lord Farquaga, she don't want to go.

[Ryan Graham]

She don't.

[Sequoia Holmes]

She didn't like the way the whole thing is set up.

[Ryan Graham]

Well, yeah, because she was like, I was told I was promised I was told by Apple Care that someone would come and save me and then I would live happily ever after. And this ogre showed up.

[Sequoia Holmes]

A man was supposed to come get me.

[Ryan Graham]

And I'm saying this. He didn't have any banners, he didn't have any coins.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He didn't even slay the dragon.

[Ryan Graham]

He sure did. The dragon was still right behind us.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Ragisha was alive and well, batting her lashes at Donkey.

[Ryan Graham]

Donkey trying to get it in.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Trying to really.

[Ryan Graham]

Also we have Donkey. We don't have Steed. I was promised noble Steve.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

Beautiful white horse and no.

[Sequoia Holmes]

No sword, no sleigh, Nothing. Nothing very much. Give me nothing. And green. Like okay.

[Ryan Graham]

And I can look past green because I have my own thing.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And she's triggered by it because she don't even like her own green. She's self hating. Yeah, Matter of fact, she's self hating.

[Ryan Graham]

That's true.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So she looks at me, she's like, ill, gross. Because ugly, nasty.

[Ryan Graham]

Understood.

[Sequoia Holmes]

They drag her back. Anyways, along the way Shrek and Fiona start to get a little. It starts to be some vibes, you

[Ryan Graham]

know what I mean?

[Sequoia Holmes]

He pushes her real hard into a bush. I didn't like that.

[Ryan Graham]

But she liked it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I said why now? Why would you put your hands on her like that? I didn't like it. So okay, you push her real hard into the bush. And then she giggled. Haha. And got back up.

[Ryan Graham]

And then she's like, no, I'm not like regular girls. I'm a different.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I'm a different. I can handle being abused by it.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay, now we're taking it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What else happened?

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, yeah. But then a lot like you're. There's a very key thing that we hinted at but like explicitly happens along the way. When the sun goes down.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And then, and then when the sun goes down, Princess Fiona, who is a redheaded white woman by day, turned into a green, thick, nice and.

[Ryan Graham]

Come on, thickums.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Nice and thick Ogre.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

By night.

[Ryan Graham]

Yammed up.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? Like geeks. Like the sun is still out. It wasn't still out. That's the whole thing, right?

[Ryan Graham]

Right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Double cupped up on a Thursday afternoon.

[Ryan Graham]

Well, yes. Okay. Obviously she. Donkey finds out her secret. Donkey, who runs his mouth the entire movie, decides to stop running his mouth all of a sudden doesn't tell Shrek what actually is going on. Shrek over here thinks she's calling all ogres ugly. Not talking about herself because she's self hating.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But I mean, I mean, I guess she does come.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because you're an ogre, right? I am always an ogre.

[Ryan Graham]

Right? Yeah. If that's what you think about yourself in this form. What do you think about me?

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

And then he's like, she couldn't ever really love me. She goes, farquaad, they are about to get married. But then Shrek, like finally is like, oh, wait, no, he's not your true love. I object.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And so he kisses her and then she takes love's truest form, which is still an ogre, which is an ogre.

[Ryan Graham]

Right. Because love's truest form is loving your self flaws and all.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

You know what I mean? That's what it is. The other thing, I think this movie is kind of. If you really think about it, it's like a government statement. Like about how the government will try to take your land from. You will try to round people up and put them and be like, oh, let me throw them into your land. And that's what I'm saying. They'll try to displace, redistrict if you will. Gerrymander, gerrymander if you will. They try to do that. And what you have to do is stand up to the government because they're all small and overcompensated.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Just. Hello.

[Ryan Graham]

Hey.

[Sequoia Holmes]

In several ways.

[Ryan Graham]

More than one.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So I heard about that orange man. I have heard.

[Ryan Graham]

Kind of crazy though. But yeah, I. I didn't like that Farquaad was just like. Because why, hey, why was he rounding them up? He was like, you're ruining my perfect place, Dulac. Ain't nobody even heard of Dulac. Dulac's not even a real. That's where he's from. Not a real kingdom.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Smack like that.

[Ryan Graham]

It doesn't. It's literally. It's like an amusement park ride. That's effect what this place is. You're not a prince. You need me, Fiona. You need me, Princess Fiona. So you can be king. I'm already a princess.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Feel me?

[Ryan Graham]

You want what I have very much.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's what I'm saying.

[Ryan Graham]

You are nothing.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You're very. You're actually nothing.

[Ryan Graham]

Right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So I could pull ogre and all. You can't pull worth A damn.

[Ryan Graham]

100%.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And you're a prince.

[Ryan Graham]

I also want like, I love. This is like a very random aside. The mirror, mirror on the wall. He's there and he's like 1. He appears in Shrek 2. And he is also the DVD background screen. Do you remember DVD background? My ADHD. He would be the one that would appear and like, what do you want to see? And like, his face would spin to like, behind the scenes or like music videos or whatever. It's so fun.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Do you remember portable DVD players?

[Ryan Graham]

Yes, of course.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Wow.

[Ryan Graham]

I used to be on a road

[Sequoia Holmes]

trip and I had this Shrek game that I used to play on PS2.

[Ryan Graham]

What?

[Sequoia Holmes]

What?

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, was it Shrek 1 or Shrek 2?

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't know. I'm assuming a Shrek 1.

[Ryan Graham]

Probably.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. Because I got my PS2 probably around that time.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. I got it for Christmas.

[Ryan Graham]

Do you remember the plot of the game? Did you also have to save Fiona?

[Sequoia Holmes]

I'm sure I remember. We. I played as Shrek and I just remember running around, running around, you know.

[Ryan Graham]

But you did not like Shrek. What made your parents buy you this game?

[Sequoia Holmes]

They just bought me games. I had to find a Nemo game.

[Ryan Graham]

This is fair.

[Sequoia Holmes]

They were like, you know, let's occupy her. When I got a Wii, I had Medal of Honor. I never played a first person shooter game. It's a first person shooter game like Call of Duty, but it's Medal of Honor.

[Ryan Graham]

Your parents bought you this?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. And I was.

[Ryan Graham]

Did you like it?

[Sequoia Holmes]

I did. I really liked Medal of Honor. I did. But that was because it was the Wii. I didn't like anything where I had to learn to have the dexterity of, like, the buttons in hand.

[Ryan Graham]

I understand what you're saying.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because the Wii was like, I'm just literally. Yeah, I'm literally aiming and I had like the gun attachment.

[Ryan Graham]

I. It is crazy to me that your parents were like, yeah, let's get our daughter. Our daughter. There's no. I mean, not that girls can't play these games.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

I just. You seeming to have not shown any interest in wanting to play like a Medal of Honor. What would make them go that makes you think your dad wanted to play the game and just needed an excuse and did.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And I played a very. I lived in a very. To a black household, which is second amendment. Blacks.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, yeah. Same. No fair.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So, yeah. No. Look at the guns. Worry.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. This was your shooting. They said, you protect yourself. You will learn on the week.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? I'm on the Wii really learning some stuff. So that's the plot of Shrek.

[Ryan Graham]

And you did actually. I think you really did a good job.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Thank you.

[Ryan Graham]

That was a really, really good one.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Thank you.

[Ryan Graham]

I loved this movie when it came out and I distinctly. I think I know we're talking about Shrek. One, we will come to Trek 2 eventually. But I think it sets up this fun little world. It's so subversive and so smart. And I don't think I got how smart it was when I was a kid.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

But re watching it as an adult, there's so many jokes in it that I just did not get.

[Sequoia Holmes]

There are so many jokes.

[Ryan Graham]

It's so funny.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It is so adult. Like, I'm like, yes. This is like barely a kids film. Is it the kids again? I didn't like it as a kid. So like, is it a kids film?

[Ryan Graham]

I. I don't. I feel like it had to have been targeted to. Or I can't tell because I have like a kid's perspective of it when it came out. And now I think the movies that come out are certainly like, this is a family friendly thing.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right.

[Ryan Graham]

At the time, I cannot remember if it was marketed towards us as children, I'm sure because it felt like anti Disney. Like it feels like.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And it was, wasn't it?

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, it was. It's DreamWorks and it's a DreamWorks movie. So it was like not related to the Disney family. It's not in those.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But it has all these Disney properties in it that they're making fun of.

[Ryan Graham]

They're not Disney properties.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I think they are not a Disney property.

[Ryan Graham]

No, those are all like the seven doors. They're. They're

[Sequoia Holmes]

like fairy tale properties that are fairy.

[Ryan Graham]

Old enough. Got it to where, Like, I think that's why they are very intentional about mentioning the things they do mention and then not mentioning other things. Because some things are like Disney branded. And Snow White is a story that is like. No, Cinderella is a story that is known. They made a Disney version.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Sure.

[Ryan Graham]

But I think the way that they subvert all expectations of like. Like who the hero is, like, what it means to be beautiful. It's. And still having like a clear moral 100%. I'm like, oh, it's just such a good movie. And even like, sh. Learning to like, people say he was crotchety. I don't think he's that crotchety. What do you think he was? How was he crotchety?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Donkey was just trying to talk to him and he was like, get away from me.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay. Donkey's own owner in the beginning of the movie tried to sell him away because he won't stop talked. He talked too much. It wasn't just talking. It's like, you won't stop talking.

[Sequoia Holmes]

God forbid a boy like to chat.

[Ryan Graham]

That's the problem. I'm saying like, you ain't never had somebody who was annoying, and it's like, you can go be annoying with somewhere else.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, but he didn't even get. Shrek was living the door and said, get the.

[Ryan Graham]

No, he didn't. That is not how that went, dad. This is revisionist history. Shrek was literally minding his own business. And then Donkey ran into him, and then he scared away the knights. And then Donkey took that upon himself

[Sequoia Holmes]

to be like, oh, that's.

[Ryan Graham]

I'm sticking around because you're gonna protect me. Shrek was minding his business.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That did happen.

[Ryan Graham]

I feel like all of it. Shrek. Shrek is a victim in this movie through and through.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He really is.

[Ryan Graham]

He, like. I don't think he's even that mean.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I found myself feeling really bad for Shrek on several occasions and feeling bad for Donkey. Shrek was being mean to him. The only times when I felt bad for Donkey is when Shrek was being mean to him.

[Ryan Graham]

I'm trying to think of, like, a clear. Like, when I do think it was unkind for Shrek to be like, stay outside and Donkey slip at the door like a dog.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That was fucked up.

[Ryan Graham]

That was kind of mean.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That was mean. Or even when, like, Shrek thought that Donkey.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, yeah, when Shrek. Shrek did become an asshole when. So when Shrek got mad at Fiona because they had that conversation, he's like, oh, yeah. You and your friend were talking behind, right? To be fair. Hurt people. Hurt people.

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, for real. But then he's pretty much like, yeah, I don't give a f. What happened to you. Like, get, like, go. I don't care where you go. Bye.

[Ryan Graham]

That was.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Me and Donkey looked really sad. First of all, the way that they animated the emotion that was coming off of those animated characters was kill too much. I like, oh, stop looking so sad. You're killing me. Shrek looking.

[Ryan Graham]

I hate it. It was. It was Bar motive.

[Max Fun Announcer]

Thank you to all the Max Fun members who supported us during Max Fun Drive. You're helping us as we try to put more good into the. And as part of putting more good into the world, we've opened our annual PostDrive charity sale. Max Fund members, at $10 per month or more, can purchase Max Fund Drive keychains featuring designs for shows across the network. And all members can buy our charity exclusive keychain starring Mikey, our little microphone buddy from this year's Max Fund Drive. This year, we've decided to send the proceeds of the charity sale to the center for Constitutional Rights. They're dedicated to the creative use of law as a positive force for social change. Tackling issues like human rights abuses, racial injust and sexual and gender based violence. These folks are fighting to make things better. So to get your keychains and support the center for Constitutional rights, head to maximumfun.org charitysale and if you're not yet a member, you can still get in on this. To support the show you're listening to and get access to bonus content and the charity sale, just click the link in the show notes. The sale is live now and it ends on Friday, May 15th. That's maximum fun. And thanks again.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Sleep is important, but it's difficult sometimes. I'm John Moe on Sleeping With Celebrities. Famous people help conk you out by talking in soothing voices about unimportant things. Maria Bamford on parking I parked in a bus stop.

[Ryan Graham]

That's just not right. I am not a bus.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Roxane Gay on airports. My favorite airport is Indianapolis. It has a really smart layout. Alan Tudyk on yardsticks.

[Ryan Graham]

You hand somebody a yardstick, yardsticks become part of the family.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Granted it's a weird idea, but it's lots of fun and it works. Listen wherever you get podcasts,

[Ryan Graham]

can we

[Sequoia Holmes]

talk about the characters? Can we talk about Eddie Murphy? A zonkey?

[Ryan Graham]

So I forgot how funny Eddie Murphy is.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So funny I laughed out loud almost every time he opened his mouth.

[Ryan Graham]

Agreed. Like he's I guess like he's so what I what I kept thinking was he's so uncle coded.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Like I'm like I watching Eddie Murphy I'm like oh so many black men in my life's personality is built around an Eddie Murphy archetype and I love that because I'm like he just feels so familiar. Feels so familiar. And like I just, I'm like I I, I feel like I haven't seen him in something recently. I saw that Christmas movie he did a couple years ago but this one like I'm like oh, I forget how like actively talented and funny you are as a human being. Like cuz I I have to believe that he was riffing and I think that same thing.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I'm like you improvise this?

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, like some of his like just like his little like oh yeah. Well I don't know they're like it

[Sequoia Holmes]

just 100% before you rip one like that man. My mouth was open. Well you know like he's like no, I didn't know so I know what

[Ryan Graham]

I smell that a I love Apart Faith. Who I ever know Somebody who ain't love apartheid might be the best food on.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know, Like, I'm like, wow, he's so funny. And then what is Shrek's accent? I know it's Mike Myers that is playing Shrek.

[Ryan Graham]

It's like a Scottish.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What is that accent?

[Ryan Graham]

You know what? I don't know why it's there, because Mike Myers, to my knowledge, is an American man. Like, I don't. Let me double check. I don't believe that Mike Myers is from Europe.

[Max Fun Announcer]

Canada.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He's from Canada.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay, so from the north. Yeah, North America.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He did say certain words. Canadian. Like, I certainly noticed, like, a boot. And like. Oh, not really strongly, but I definitely heard it.

[Ryan Graham]

But to me, I guess, like, the. The thing about hearing Shrek's voice is that, like, it feels like a hair away from Austin Powers. Because Austin. Yeah, Shrek me, babe. Like, that is such a. It's literally a British character. And, like, this is a Scottish accent is what I am getting from it. I don't know why an ogre all of a sudden. I don't know why we land there.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't know what this accent is, but it's. It's interesting.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, but it feels like I keep hearing Austin Powers.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's why I said he has to record Shrek with a Scottish accent.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, good.

[Sequoia Holmes]

As contrast to Lord Farquaad and Fiona's posh accent.

[Ryan Graham]

Ah, that's fair. Because it feels grungy. That's fair. That tracks.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay. No, that makes complete sense. Speaking of Fiona.

[Ryan Graham]

Cameron Diaz.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Cameron Diaz playing Fiona. I feel like, in comparison to everybody else, she fell a little flat. And I think she was in it because of her popularity at the time. Of course, because it's 2001.

[Ryan Graham]

But I'm saying, what.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What?

[Ryan Graham]

She had done something about Mary and she had done the Mask.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What else has she not done?

[Ryan Graham]

Charlie's Angels. Feels like it's supposed. It might be like, a long.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Around the song. Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

So maybe she was like that. She. You know, when they book actress back to back to back. So it's like, let me block your year.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yes.

[Ryan Graham]

Because I agree. I think she does a fine job. But, like, in the 2026 of it all, looking back, I'm like, what an interesting choice.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I certainly felt that way because I'm like, everybody else is above and beyond, like, stellar. Like, John Lithgow is smacking, like, donkey Mike Myers.

[Ryan Graham]

Smack, obviously. Yeah, yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I'm like. And then there's.

[Ryan Graham]

And then there's Kim Diaz. I do you. I was. I. I wonder if there's, like, lore about other people wanting it but you.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right.

[Ryan Graham]

She was, like, hot at the, like, I mean, literally, like the Angenu. The like the blonde, like, hot actress at the time. So it makes sense. But in some weird ways, like, looking back, I'm like, was there nobody else around?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right. Like, I'm like, I'm trying to think who else will be good. I don't even know who would be

[Ryan Graham]

good at that time.

[Sequoia Holmes]

At that time. I mean, even. I guess we could think about it in today's terms.

[Ryan Graham]

Is this pre Reese Witherspoon? And I feel like Reese Witherspoon has, like, a very, like. No, she maybe is too. She'd have been too young then because, like, I think, like, Legally blonde is like 2003. Right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, Reese could have been fun.

[Ryan Graham]

That's what I'm saying. She sounds like she'd be fun. But yeah, no, that's also 2001. So, like. Yeah, that's around the Reese Witherspoon era. What was Alicia Silverstone doing? She. Or maybe even, like, Sandra Bullock.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, that could have been fun.

[Ryan Graham]

You know, I'm trying to think of, like, who else there are.

[Sequoia Holmes]

There are options that I would have gone for before Cameron Diaz, and I can't imagine Cameron Diaz bringing out kids.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

I feel like movies today lean more on star power than then. Maybe I'm wrong. We were kids at the time. I would have had a less understanding.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But I think it's something that they leaned on for kids movies to make your parents excited to go see it. And I guess I can't. I don't have complete context for 2001 because I was 8 again.

[Ryan Graham]

But I'm like, Eddie Murphy makes sense, obviously. I think this is also like Nutty professor era. So Eddie Murphy makes perfect sense.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Mike Meyer. I believe this is also literally Austin Power one. So that makes sense.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Cameron Diaz doesn't make sense. When was Charlie's Angels? I feel like it was after.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I think it is too, because it was in.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, no, it's 2000. So it's the same.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay. So that's why she's coming off of it. She's like, she was just on a hot run.

[Ryan Graham]

Nut tracks. Then it makes way more sense, I guess, y'.

[Sequoia Holmes]

All.

[Ryan Graham]

But yeah, where was Halle Berry? Why was. Why couldn't Halle Berry be enough? Never mind. Actually, no, I would like to know.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And since we talking about black people, what?

[Ryan Graham]

Because then I wouldn't want her. I would need Princess Fiona to be black. A B. I don't want her to turn into an ogre because I saw how y' all did Tiana, and I didn't like that either.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Was a frog. People was not happy. I still haven't seen that movie either. I do need to.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, it's fun.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't like princess stuff. I really don't like. I'm like, okay, I don't care.

[Ryan Graham]

And that one came out when we were like. Like. Like high school. So I could imagine being like, I'm not watching that.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't care. But. But I'm happy that we did get a black one. I am happy about that.

[Ryan Graham]

Speaking of, like, casting, I believe originally this was, like, a Chris Farley project. I believe this. Yeah. He was supposed to be Shrek, and then he passed.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yes. He died in 1997. He had already voiced about 80 of the film. Oh, I didn't know that when he died. Yeah. So they had to, like, scrap all that.

[Ryan Graham]

That. It also feels so. Obviously Chris. Or I shouldn't say obviously Chris Farley died when I was, like, younger. So, like, I'm aware of Chris Farley's work and, like, I know, like, his snl. He's like, legendary SNL cast member.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay.

[Ryan Graham]

But I'm not. He feels so. Or Mike Myers feels so Shrek.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Like, I cannot imagine it with somebody else. So for those of you who might not know, I'm looking at Chris Farley's, like, movies and shows.

[Ryan Graham]

He was in Tommy Boy.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Tommy Boy? Beverly Hills Ninja. He's Coneheads. You probably would recognize that.

[Ryan Graham]

Is he in. Is he one of the dads? Is he the dad?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, I don't know who he is.

[Ryan Graham]

Who is he in Coneheads?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Do you know, Laura?

[Ryan Graham]

I love Coneheads. That is a fun movie, but I don't know. You don't know that movie?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No. He was in all that for six years.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, what?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, he was an.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, man.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Doing what?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Acting?

[Ryan Graham]

I.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Well, no, I'm gonna say.

[Ryan Graham]

Is it. Wasn't he too old? I do. Because. Remember the chef? When Keenan would play the chef, like, he was like. And that he was, like, a character who would pop up with him and, like, he was a chef with him. I am, like, watching it now, and I do remember him popping up and all that. I forgot about that.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Chris Farley was already, you know, 80, done with Shrek as a movie when he died, and they went ahead and replaced him with Mike Myers.

[Ryan Graham]

That feels crazy.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And he. Mike Myers originally voiced Shrek with a Canadian accent, but they didn't Feel like it did the character justice.

[Ryan Graham]

I and I. I feel like, I guess obviously we know the movie the

[Sequoia Holmes]

way it is, right.

[Ryan Graham]

I could not imag in a non Scottish Shrek.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, Scottish. Because. And again, I don't. I don't history that hard. But I feel like the distinguishing between like a posh accent and a Scottish, like Scottish accents were like. It feels lower class, right?

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It feels like we're considered lower class,

[Ryan Graham]

right, to like noble people like it. Like, especially if we're thinking British. Like, because it would be like it's not a cockney accent where it's a little bit like this.

[Sequoia Holmes]

My name's Trick and you get up my swamp.

[Ryan Graham]

That was a good one. Did you enjoy it was.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Do you try? I want to hear you try.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What should I say?

[Ryan Graham]

Say get up me swamp.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Get out me swamp.

[Ryan Graham]

No, a little harder.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Get out me swamp. Oh, no, you don't get. Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Donkey, donkey, donkey, Donkey. Princess Fiona says you and. Oh, good night. What are we supposed to do for

[Sequoia Holmes]

little folk while sent me Lord Farquaad, you short little.

[Ryan Graham]

You. You shrimp dick little. You shrimp dick little. Wine cat.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Small little wankers.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, Lord Farquaad, sorry.

[Sequoia Holmes]

How do you feel about the short man representation present in this movie?

[Ryan Graham]

Why would that matter to me?

[Sequoia Holmes]

How tall are you?

[Producer Laura]

Huh?

[Sequoia Holmes]

How tall are you?

[Ryan Graham]

Tall enough.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What is the height?

[Ryan Graham]

Tall.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Repeat that?

[Ryan Graham]

It's tall. The height is tall. I go to the doctor, they go, oh, tall. They don't even.

[Sequoia Holmes]

They don't even say it.

[Ryan Graham]

They don't even check it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

They stamp your passport. Tal. Got it. So Ryan's five, seven, five, eight, according to my ID. Okay.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And the lie on your ID. And according to my ID, I'm 120 pounds. Thank you. Yes. You know what I mean? So I don't appreciate.

[Ryan Graham]

Because I saw Laura Farquhar has become a meme. I feel like I went to Ren Fair two weeks ago and he was everywhere. So many people dressed up as him.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

And they just run around and like. I hate that he's just this angry little man. But I will give. He's a man with a vision. Cause did you see there's a shot when he's in his castle. He's making the mirror show him visions of Fiona again. And they pan across his room and he has his and her matching pajamas. He has Fiona's dress made already. He has matching shoes. It's in the background. But it's so funny to watch. And I'm very me coded. And above his bed. So they Make a joke of. It's like the Birth of Venus. So it's a photo of him in the pearl shell. That is.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You literally have that for Ryan's bir birthday every year he does a birthday suit photo shoot where he's naked in it. And it's always different themes. Yeah. And you did the birth of Venus theme already where you're coming out of a clamshell naked.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, yeah. And so Lord Farquhar had that above his bed. And I'm like, oh no, this is so. I. I don't. You know what I don't like? I don't like it because it's too real. I don't like the short man representation

[Sequoia Holmes]

because personally felt very attached. You think he's queer? He's queer coated in the way coded. Right?

[Ryan Graham]

I agree. 100 like literally him sitting in the bed with a Martin having all those outfits prepared. He's so cute.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's what you should have just married one of the knights. All you had to do is get married in order to rule the K.

[Ryan Graham]

But maybe he needed a beard, you know what I mean? And see, what he should have done was just open up and communicate like, hey, Fiona, you and Shrek can go run off and do whatever you need to do. I just need someone in the palace so I can be king. That's all I need. I'm gonna go do what I'm gonna do. I just can't wait to be.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, I just can't wait. He'd be thinking about it, dreaming about it in his sleep. You know who Lord Farquaad reminds me of actually?

[Ryan Graham]

Whomst.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Edna Mode from the Incredibles.

[Ryan Graham]

Wow.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know that I'm like, that is the same. That's the same.

[Ryan Graham]

They went to the same hairdresser. They went to the same blow. They do.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And Michelle Obama and Candace Owens.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. I didn't like how you had to go to Michelle Obama. I do. I love a world and I love

[Sequoia Holmes]

Mish, obviously, of course.

[Ryan Graham]

But I do. I love a world where the same beautician. She's like a trap. She's a beautician to the stars.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I promise.

[Ryan Graham]

And it's Michelle Obama, Lord Farquaad. Edna mode.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And she got that hot comb on the stove. She don't have it in the Marcel. She has it on the stove. And she be pressing the girls from the root down.

[Ryan Graham]

You know, gets a touch up frequently

[Sequoia Holmes]

that stiff wear for Edna and Lord.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay, he says sit.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Where Sith. Where?

[Ryan Graham]

Where?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right. I also.

[Ryan Graham]

Lord Farquaad, he that meme where he's like some of you will die. And that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And that's that.

[Ryan Graham]

And you know, that is what the other man said. Unfortunately, too many people took that to heart.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what? Let's think about. Let's think about the timeline of. Yeah. Some people are gonna die.

[Ryan Graham]

Wow.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Starts with Lord Far. Lord Farquaad.

[Ryan Graham]

Ghost of Vanessa Hudgen.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That orange man.

[Ryan Graham]

Now it's in the government. God. It should have I. It should have stopped with Vanessa Hudgin.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Some ideas need to be killed before they come out of somebody's mouth. When the idea lands on you, you have to know which ones come from the divine and which ones are coming from the devil.

[Ryan Graham]

What are inside thoughts?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right?

[Ryan Graham]

Like, oh yeah, this isn't. This isn't thing. I should.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But y' all had to say it out loud. And look, now we're living it.

[Ryan Graham]

Here we are. I also love the song. When you enter Duke. Wash your shoes or kiss your flower Place welcome to this place. Wash your shoes Kiss your something. It's something where they almost curse. I forget the actual line. But it's very silly.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It's very silly. And it's very much a small world. Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Of course.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. Like it's a play on. It's a small world.

[Ryan Graham]

They reference so much because even when, like Fiona is doing that, like, jump and then they pause and then she flips her hair. It's like the Matrix. I forget how many, like, cultural role references they put in the movie. It also makes me think of, like, the soundtrack which I think is so perfect.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It's a great. Let's talk about the soundtrack.

[Ryan Graham]

Can't think of. And When I Saw Her Face. I can't. Is that song for Trash Mouth. But I can't remember if that was like an exhaust that existed. These all feel so tied to Shrek to me that they don't exist without Shrek. 100 I have to believe they were made for the movie. But I could be wrong.

[Sequoia Holmes]

100 I am wrong.

[Ryan Graham]

They existed before the movie. In my brain. They. They watched the movie and said, oh, I got you.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It mapped on so well. Whoever is the music person.

[Ryan Graham]

Director.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So good for Shrek.

[Ryan Graham]

So good.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. They need you on Euphoria because right now they have Hans Zimmer on Euphoria. And what a strange choice.

[Ryan Graham]

I. I don't get it. I feel like he does epics and

[Sequoia Holmes]

I feel like 1000%. They needed to stay with Labyrinth. Yeah. Or they need to get Smash mouth.

[Ryan Graham]

Is Timbaland not Available.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

I'm so sorry. This is now becoming an aside about. Do you see that Drake is. Is it the.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He's always been an executive producer.

[Ryan Graham]

I never knew that before.

[Sequoia Holmes]

When Euphoria was first coming out, Drake was the first person to tease it. It. And it was like, very unclear what he was teasing. It just said Euphoria. We didn't know if it was a show. We didn't know what was going on. And it was just like an animation. Like a. Like an animation.

[Ryan Graham]

I don't think I've ever noticed it until the season. And I'm like, where did Drake.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, he always been very Degrassi, you know, kind of.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, it was. Especially when they were selling it the first time it felt Degrassi. And now this becomes something else. Right. But back to the movie. The movie and the music.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yes.

[Ryan Graham]

Even the way they use Hallelujah like that, like, and that. It's just like a very pivotal, like emotional. Like them falling in love. Like Hallelujah. It's so pretty. That's beautiful in there.

[Sequoia Holmes]

All Star. Of course. Smash.

[Ryan Graham]

That's the opening scene.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right.

[Ryan Graham]

And it just fits so well also. Sorry, what? The opening credits.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I was literally about to say I miss like Wellth thought out opening credits when like he smashes the mirror and it's. And it's Eddie Murphy and you know, whatever.

[Ryan Graham]

Like it's blended into the actual movie and not just like here's text on screen.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Exactly.

[Ryan Graham]

I feel like there's just a lost art in movies like that where I guess everything just is faster and cheaper. And so stuff like that costs money and time. Agree that they don't want put it into it. And something else I was feeling when I was watching this movie is that like we used to have monoculture. And I think the lack of monoculture now is not ruining movies, but it makes movies hit different. Like the reason that Shrek can reference, like when they're showing all the princesses and they're making it like it's the dating show. Like where the mirror is like. And a bachelor bachelorette number one. It's blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like because even us as kids, we will watch game shows with our parents. And so we understand the concept of that type of the dating game show.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

But like now everyone is in their rooms watching their own little TV shows. So, like, I feel like a movie can't come out and have like a monoculture moment where like everyone in the family gets that joke.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's so true.

[Ryan Graham]

You Know, I mean.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

And I feel like this movie and movies at this time reference so many things that we all experience that I think it's harder to do now because we literally just don't like. Kids today don't know movies from the. Like, they don't.

[Sequoia Holmes]

They wouldn't. 100%.

[Ryan Graham]

No 90s movies the way we knew 70s and 60s movies from our parents.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what? I was thinking tangential to this because, yes, I do agree with that. I've noticed black culture supersedes Generation wars in that black Gen Z know all of the cultural references. All the. They do. And I learned this. Or like many of them do.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I learned this partially. I've learned this from my niece a little bit. But I've also learned this partially when I was watching Love Island USA Season 6 and I was watching Cordell and Serena's banter back and forth. They're both like, very. Cordell was like 21 and Serena was like 24 or something. I'm like, oh, yeah. These are like Gen Z squarely Gen Z people. They. All their cultural references, all the memes that they reference, all the movies that they reference. I'm like, that was made before you were born. But they get it because it's a black culture versus mainstream culture, non black culture. It's way more generational. That's fair. That's because it's just less cultural, you know, but you.

[Ryan Graham]

I, I. And I think specifically now it's even more pushed away. Yeah, but you're. Because I'm like. The argument I was gonna make is like, there was one tick tock I saw, and I shouldn't make that across the board, but there was a girl who didn't know who Whitney Houston was, which.

[Sequoia Holmes]

A black girl.

[Ryan Graham]

Yes. And that blew my mind.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Where's she from?

[Ryan Graham]

They were on a college campus and he was just showing an image of. And it was like Whitney Houston. Like, in the. One of her in the white tank top. Like, it's like a very classic.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Sure.

[Ryan Graham]

Woody. He. She just didn't know.

[Sequoia Holmes]

She probably knew who she was. She probably did not know her face. She probably couldn't recognize.

[Ryan Graham]

You say the word Whitney Houston, she goes, oh, yes.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Or if you start singing it when he goes. She's like. And that's fair. I know what that is.

[Ryan Graham]

I can imagine that they don't. Especially because when would you have seen her? And Whitney Houston has been gone. Not with us for over 10 years. So, yeah, you don't see her. But you know who Whitney Houston is, right? That's fair. That's valid. You're right. I guess we do kind of like, transcend generation 100%.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I'm like, black people transcend the generations for sure.

[Ryan Graham]

But yeah, I don't know. I just. I do. I do miss some level of monoculture.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I really do. Oh, this is the black. Did you. Have you seen Shrek yet? We're all going to the theater and seeing it. Like, that's like, not a thing anymore. And I think that's why nostalgia is such a big thing right now, because it's trying to galvanize people to go have that monoculture moment again. That's why Freaky Friday. Freaky or Friday, I feel like was a thing. Devil wear Prada too.

[Ryan Graham]

I did consider. That's why they do. Well, A, they make money and, like, it's because we don't have monochromatic culture. We're like, let's go back to when

[Sequoia Holmes]

we did the last time we did. Right. Let's try it again.

[Ryan Graham]

Make that again.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And it works in part, but not in total, because kids don't care.

[Ryan Graham]

A, kids don't care. And then B, I feel like sometimes the actual thing is I don't want to be reminded. I want a new monoculture thing.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Very.

[Ryan Graham]

I don't want to be like 1000. Remember when we did that? I'm like, give me something else.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I want to do something else. You know, something I did not like about Shrek or something that I kind of didn't appreciate about it. And this might be me being too well.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Which I like to get into.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay, great. Because I remember that Tick Tock that went viral this year about. About how Shrek is a cautionary tale. Because he. You don't remember that Tick Tock?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No. Tell me.

[Ryan Graham]

It was in. It was literally in February where this girl went viral for arguing that a man will, like, make. Make you give up being a princess, give up all of your status to be with him in a swamp and, like, and turn you into an ogre. And I'm like. It was this long winded thing. I'm like, you clearly have not seen this movie. Because I'm like, she was turning into

[Sequoia Holmes]

an ogre before Draggin Dragon.

[Ryan Graham]

And Shrek was not trying to fight. He wasn't trying to take her. He was tasked to get her so he could get his home back. I'm like, but yeah, a girl really was, like, ill. Like, men will. They will ruin your life. They'll make you stop being a princess. They'll make you ugly. Blah Blah, blah, blah. All for them. He. And they was like, he was so mean to her. And I'm like, he wasn't. Like. I'm like, you have not.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I didn't like how he pushed her that hard, but he wasn't mean to her.

[Ryan Graham]

He wasn't. He wasn't. I don't think Shrek was active. I think people were mean to Shrek. The only time he was mean was when his feelings were hurt, and that was wrong. But I think in general, Shrek was actively kind to her.

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, y. Y'. All. Y' all be. Y'.

[Ryan Graham]

All. What?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Y' all hear academic language one singular time and extrapolate it and put it in places where it does not belong.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. I'm like, what? How do we.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because you have no actual inferring skills. You repeat talking points that you've heard on the Internet.

[Ryan Graham]

I also feel like it's just, like, an inflammatory thing. Like, it's like, what can I do to piss people off? I'm like. And I'm like, there's no way. You actively watch Shrek recently and thought that, like, you. There's. You. You. You cannot see that movie and think that he brought her down. I'm like, literally, the plot point is

[Sequoia Holmes]

that he helped her be herself and he helped her love herself. Exactly. Similarly, the girl trying to pack me up right now for what? In the comments on a Tick Tock on Black People Love Paramore that I said Devil Wears Prada, because that was the episode before this one. I said Nate was not the villain y' all trying to make him out to be, because the Internet rhetoric is that Nate was just the horrible hater ass boy who was mad at her because she got on and she got popping, her job was important and blah, blah, blah.

[Ryan Graham]

And there's. Before we hold on, because I do think there's some truth. I don't think he was a hater because of her job. I think he was a hater because her job was taking her away from him. It was less about her status and more about, like, hey, you don't spend time with me anymore, and I hate your job for that.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Exactly.

[Ryan Graham]

It was less about the job.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Exactly. It's not about any job. It's not about her being popular. Happen. It's about neglect.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. You were not.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's about that. And again, y', all, I don't like the. If the roles reverse thing, but if suddenly your man started neglecting you when he got a new job, you're like,

[Ryan Graham]

what's wrong with you?

[Sequoia Holmes]

You have you have very short amount of time where I'm gonna give you grace on that before it's gonna become a problem. I can't stay in a relationship where I'm being neglected.

[Ryan Graham]

Right, right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's really it.

[Ryan Graham]

And it doesn't matter what your job is the girl.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It doesn't matter what your job. I actually don't care if you bring it in.

[Ryan Graham]

You could be making donuts all day.

[Producer Laura]

Day.

[Ryan Graham]

And I'm like, why are you not home?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because I'm being neglected and that hurts my feelings. So. And then at the end of we'll get back to Shrek. But at the end of Devil Wor Product, she also comes to the recollection or recollection, she comes to the realization that she is turning into something that she doesn't like. Yes, your friends left you. Your man left you. Cuz they came to that realization before. Now you came to that realization too. But he's still the villain, right?

[Ryan Graham]

No, he saw where it was coming. He was like, hey, girl, the person you're becoming is a bad. You're not going to like this. This isn't who you are.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? But the Internet is really hellbent on this. He's a hater. The jealous of you. And that does happen. This is the case. And again, this is an example of y' all extrapolating something and applying it to something where it does not apply.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, it's like you're not reading his emotion. You're, you're, you're. What is it? You're projecting something on your project. And it's not. It's just he was upset and he was not. I don't even know. I'm trying to. I have to watch it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He wasn't even that unkind to her.

[Ryan Graham]

He was not nice. But I don't think he was like. It never gave jealous.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It did not give jealous at all. Missed his birthday party after keeping saying, no, no, I'm gonna be there. No, no, I'm gonna. I'm gonna be there.

[Ryan Graham]

He's valid.

[Sequoia Holmes]

She missed it. He. She came home with a sorry ass cupcake, which I said on the previous episode. Came home with a sorry ass cupcake. Hi. Sorry I missed your birthday.

[Ryan Graham]

I'm big mad.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And he said, it's fine. And tried to walk past her and go to sleep. And she said, well, no, I want to talk about this. I said, it's fine and I think that's valid and I want to go to sleep before I cuss you clean out. Right?

[Ryan Graham]

Now. Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay.

[Ryan Graham]

And also because I do feel like again, if the worlds were. I know. Which is not about.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because 1000% of a man started neglecting you, you would be mad anyways.

[Ryan Graham]

Because I'm saying you didn't show up to me.

[Sequoia Holmes]

My birthday, my.

[Ryan Graham]

And it would be one thing if you told me ahead of time like, hey, not going to make it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But you kept saying, I'm on my way. I'm on my way. People kept calling you. I'm trying to leave right now. I'm trying to leave right now.

[Ryan Graham]

And you don't. I don't care.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Like Miranda Priestley put her on a last minute project, right? And was like, hey, yeah, you're going to this party tonight. She's like, oh, it's my man's. She didn't even say it's my man's birthday. She says, okay.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh yeah. She didn't even try. And it's one of the scenes where like I get it. I, I. And maybe he even understood. I love this. Became a devil.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I know.

[Ryan Graham]

But it doesn't matter.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He.

[Ryan Graham]

Maybe he even understood that you had to do what you had to do at work. Cuz sometimes I'm like, I'm mad at the situation and I'm still upset.

[Sequoia Holmes]

My feelings still exist. Even though I understand.

[Ryan Graham]

I'm still hurt.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I am understanding and also I'm hurt.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. Man can't do that.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But he's not allowed to be hurt because he's man.

[Ryan Graham]

But I feel like that's how kind of like with Shrek and Fiona where it's like I think had they. Cuz like when they had the whole Fiona talking about her feelings about being an ogre and like, like Shrek misheard. I feel like he would have heard her. If they would have heard each other out. He could have understood. Like it still hurt my feelings that you said because I can like be exactly. Nobody.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Nobody was communicating.

[Ryan Graham]

Right.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know, like she didn't tell him that she was an ogre. She only told Donkey. He overheard situation. He didn't say what he overheard. You know, just like a lot going on. Nobody's communicating.

[Ryan Graham]

And even her. I get it. Cuz I'm like, she probably was like she was told her whole life that. In which you'll find out. You don't even know.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't. I've never seen Shrek 2 years. You guys, Shrek 2 is a perfect. We'll do an episode.

[Ryan Graham]

We should.

[Sequoia Holmes]

If y' all like this episode.

[Ryan Graham]

Shrek 2 is the perfect sequel.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay.

[Ryan Graham]

Because it Expands the world of like, Like, I feel like most sequels just like cash grabs or whatever, but this one expands the world. All the questions you would have about because, like, you know, you know she's a princess, you know she's an ogre. And, like, why Everything's answered in a way that makes sense. It, like, opens up new worlds in a way that doesn't feel like cheap. God, it's. Shrek 2 is so, so good. It is perfect. The music also hits. The soundtrack is great. I know this isn't about Shrek 2. That's good because I like the point I was making. Fiona didn't think people would love her because her whole life she was told, the only way you will ever be your true self in her brain, a beautiful woman is if you were kissed. And that's when someone will love you. So she thinks she cannot be loved as an ogre. And a literal.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Pick me. Quite literal. You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

Donkey's also a pick me. He actively screams pick me. Several times in the movie.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He does.

[Ryan Graham]

When Shrek is like, who knows where Lord Farquaard lives, trying to find one of the people pick me.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Pick me.

[Ryan Graham]

He is actively jumping up and down.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I really felt like Donkey.

[Ryan Graham]

I was like, he didn't want friends that bad because Dragon was trying to back it up on him, trying to throw it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He said, I don't want.

[Ryan Graham]

He was like, whoa.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Type of friend. He said, I'm not ready for a relationship.

[Ryan Graham]

I do love that. Literally, even Dragon emotion.

[Sequoia Holmes]

She would like her little eyes, her batting her eyelashes. Oh, you a girl, Dragon. Yes, you are a girl.

[Ryan Graham]

So you don't know what happens with them?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, I don't know anything.

[Ryan Graham]

Wow. There. There's so much more that happens. Okay, now we have. Even if we don't do an episode, we have to watch Shrek 2.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, I'll definitely watch it.

[Ryan Graham]

So good.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Let us know if you guys like this episode and you want a Shrek 2 episode. Do like put commented, I love this. And then we'll do it. Can we play the game?

[Ryan Graham]

I love games.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Laura, we have a Shrek game prepared. I don't know what the game is. Ryan doesn't know what the game is. Our producer, Laura is going to execute the game for us.

[Ryan Graham]

You know what? We didn't mention we talked about this off cam before while we get the game set up. You know, this also won the first animated, like, for an animated feature at the O.P. oscar.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's crazy.

[Ryan Graham]

First Oscar for an animated feature went to Shrek.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That is Crazy.

[Ryan Graham]

I like. This category did not exist before this movie. And do you know what it was up against?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No. Tell me What? Okay, so 2001 other animated things. I couldn't tell you.

[Ryan Graham]

There were only two other movies it was up.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, okay. So three total.

[Ryan Graham]

Three total.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay, sure.

[Ryan Graham]

It was Jimmy Neutron, Boy genius.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Not. It wasn't a good movie.

[Ryan Graham]

Was actively bad. The show was also bad. And then Monsters, Inc. Which is great. Monsters, Inc. Is the first movie.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I tried it. I know.

[Ryan Graham]

And I'm like, no, it's hard, this.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Taking it over Monsters.

[Ryan Graham]

I agree.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't know.

[Ryan Graham]

I'm with you there, because I'm like, Monsters, Inc. Is actively the first movie I cried in. I had never cried in a movie before. They heard them shredding. Boo's door sent me. I literally. I literally. Bald as a child, was like, oh, sorry.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Spoiler alert.

[Ryan Graham]

If you have anything.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I did it.

[Ryan Graham]

That got me. And so I. I don't know that this should have beat Monsters, Inc. But I wonder if it's because that one is specifically a kids movie in a way that this feels like this is for this is family movie in the sense of if you watch Monsters,

[Sequoia Holmes]

Inc. Again, it is all. It is an adult movie too.

[Ryan Graham]

Is it? So maybe they're all that way.

[Sequoia Holmes]

They are. They are. They want to make sure the parents are engaged while they're watching the kids stuff. This one may be one because it was explicitly way funnier.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah. Oh, my God.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Way more. Way, way funnier.

[Ryan Graham]

And I bet the campaign because I bet, like, a. A Shrek party versus a Monsters, Inc. Party, you know, it's gonna be way more fun.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It's way easier to throw themed events around Shrek than it is Monst. Sure, that's fair.

[Ryan Graham]

That's fair. But yeah, Shrek beat Monsters, Inc. And Monsters, Inc. Is also a great movie.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Wow.

[Ryan Graham]

But, yeah, I know. Wild. First Oscar for an animated feature.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Wow, that's so interesting. Good to know.

[Producer Laura]

I've got eight clips, and the game is identify the. The fairy tale character or the fairy tale.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, this is gonna be hard for me.

[Producer Laura]

You are hearing. Okay, so first. First question. What fairy tale creatures are bothering Shrek in his home? The one who didn't like the cheese had actually consumed goo from Shrek's ear.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I know it too.

[Producer Laura]

Okay, well, I'm not gonna play it, but even. But you're gonna know.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay, here we go.

[Ryan Graham]

It's a far cry from the farm, but what choice do we have? It's not home, but we'll do just fine.

[Sequoia Holmes]

What A lovely bed.

[Ryan Graham]

Gotcha. I've got. Found some cheese. Found some cheese. It's the Three Blind Mice. And I, in hearing it now in my ear. Earphones, you know that in the background, the. The music is Three Blind mice. Like they're playing the score. Actually, like it's doing music.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, no, I did not hear that. That's fun. Yeah. It's the Three Blind Boys. Yeah.

[Producer Laura]

Little factoid. The modern Three Blind Mice rhyme entered children's literature in 1842.

[Ryan Graham]

Jesus.

[Producer Laura]

When it was published in a collection, Cities by James Orchard Halliwell.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay, all right. Before black people were even illegally allowed to read.

[Ryan Graham]

You know what?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Fair.

[Ryan Graham]

That's fair.

[Sequoia Holmes]

All right.

[Ryan Graham]

Who.

[Producer Laura]

Okay, what famous Liana's character upsets Farquaad in this clip? Also, with whom does this character associate in the original fairy tale?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay, okay, here we go.

[Ryan Graham]

Is this not the most perfect kingdom of them all? Well, technically, you're not a king.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Polonius.

[Ryan Graham]

You were saying? I got it. I knew who it is.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't.

[Ryan Graham]

It's the magic mirror on the wall.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Is that the magic mirror? Yeah, I thought that, but I was like, I don't know.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, yeah, yeah. Because like he holds up the mirror and smashes it to threaten him.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Hilarious.

[Ryan Graham]

And who he associates. He's a. The. The Evil Queen.

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, the magic mirror is Snow White. It's from Snow White. Oh, is that the Evil Queen? Oh, you know, I haven't seen it, child.

[Ryan Graham]

Have you not?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, I haven't seen any of the old. I didn't know it was the Snow White.

[Ryan Graham]

I didn't know.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Mirror, mirror, on the wall, who's the fairest of them all?

[Ryan Graham]

You know, Snow White doesn't speak ever. That's not true.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Did Snow White not say, mirror, mirror on the wall, who's the fairest of them all?

[Ryan Graham]

The Evil Queen. Are you being funny? Why would Snow White say that?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Because she was pale.

[Ryan Graham]

No, the Evil Queen is threatened by Snow White because the mirror tells her it's snow.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh. So she's looking in the mirror and she's like. She's expecting me saying that. It's going to say the Ferris of them all. But it keeps saying, like, imagine you

[Ryan Graham]

go to the mirror, be like, damn, who's the baddest? You're looking in an actual mirror expecting to see yourself, and all of a

[Sequoia Holmes]

sudden keep showing you this. This other.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, I don't know. She don't have to be a. But you know what I mean.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So she's like Ursula, kind of similar.

[Ryan Graham]

Similar. Yeah. Well, no, that's not true. Ursula, actually.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Sorry, that's Maleficent.

[Ryan Graham]

No, these are all different people. Ursula was. Ariel went to Ursula. Ursula. She was minding her business. Ariel came to her.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You're getting defensive because she is a.

[Ryan Graham]

Cause Ursula is a drag queen. She is a gay icon. And I don't think she was wrongfully criminalized. It's not her fault her brother tried and sent her away. That wasn't.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, my God. Remind me to come back and tell you why I don't. Why I didn't like Shrek. My actual. My two woke opinion. I didn't give it to y'. All.

[Ryan Graham]

We did it. Okay.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Sorry. And I need to remember to say that.

[Ryan Graham]

Sorry.

[Producer Laura]

This is the third one.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay, let's do it. I'm not a puppet. I'm a real boy.

[Ryan Graham]

Take it away.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It's Pinocchio.

[Ryan Graham]

And also, that's his day. He goes, father, please.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I didn't like that.

[Ryan Graham]

That was sad.

[Sequoia Holmes]

It made me sad. And then looking around, seeing, like, the bears in the cages and them being separated, I was like, what?

[Ryan Graham]

That was a funny story. A kids movie is where he was like, this one's too small. Pineapple.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I was upset by that.

[Ryan Graham]

But yes, Pinocchio, I like that.

[Producer Laura]

Can you name the fairy tale which the creature who answers Shrek's question belongs? Okay, so Shrek's question.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Here we go. Don't look at me.

[Ryan Graham]

I didn't invite them.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh, gosh. No one invited us.

[Ryan Graham]

What?

[Sequoia Holmes]

We were forced to come here by who?

[Ryan Graham]

Lord Farquad. He hoed and he hoed and he

[Sequoia Holmes]

signed an eviction notice.

[Ryan Graham]

That's the Three Little Pigs. One of the Three little. He. Did you not know that? You knew that?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, I burped. But yes, yes, I did not. The Three Little Pigs. Isn't there something else? Three Little Bears.

[Ryan Graham]

No, those are. Yeah. The Three Little Pigs are. The huffed and puff Bears are the ones that. It's too hot. It's too cold.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's right. The fairy tales were. Those two fairy tales were too similar to me. Always. I'm like, it's three of them. They. They talking about one of them. Little Red Riding Hood. A wolf. Wolf. Goldilocks. That's the same people.

[Ryan Graham]

They're actively.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? But they are, I think, in the same way that Alex Hooper and Alex Earl are not the same person.

[Ryan Graham]

Goldilocks and the Big Bad Wolf.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

You know what?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Goldilocks and Red Riding Hood are the same people.

[Ryan Graham]

Is not a part of the three. Like Red Riding Hood is a whole separate story. Goldilocks goes into the three bears home and robs them. The three little pigs build houses and the big bad wolf tries to take down their houses.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Who is Puffs?

[Ryan Graham]

And he blows their houses.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Who is Red Riding Hood?

[Ryan Graham]

She is trying to get to her grandmother. And the wolf is in.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't have time. I actually don't have time for this. I don't care. You didn't. I don't give a damn. I was an only child who did not like other children. No, I did not, little kid. I actually don't give a damn. I am a gabe. I can't believe that's three separate sisters stories that.

[Ryan Graham]

I love that you blended them.

[Sequoia Holmes]

No, I really did.

[Ryan Graham]

Not the same story at all. But I love that none of them

[Sequoia Holmes]

was black, so I didn't know. Anyways, it's fair.

[Ryan Graham]

Okay.

[Producer Laura]

Who is far quad interrogating?

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, yeah. Who's hiding them?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay, I'll tell you. Do you know the muffin man? The muffin man, the muffin man, Muffin man.

[Ryan Graham]

I know the muffin man who lives on J Land. Muffin man lives on Jury Land.

[Sequoia Holmes]

She's married to the muffin man. Not my gumdrop, but a muffin man.

[Ryan Graham]

Muffin man. A muffin that is so iconic. That's Gingy. Gingerbread man. That scene I remember being like a meme forever.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Like, truly the muffin who's hiding them. Okay, I'll tell you. Do you know the muffin man? The muffin man, the muffin man.

[Ryan Graham]

Yes, I know the muffin man who lives on Drury Lane.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Well, she's married to the muffin man. The muffin man, the muffin man, the muffin man man. Stupid. So done.

[Ryan Graham]

I love it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Very funny.

[Ryan Graham]

Of course. Please let. Oh, Mary man. You know it.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I don't know the fairy tale it's associated with. Oh, really? I don't think so. Oh, Robin Hood.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, exactly.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

This was an original song that they made. Please let me introduce. They wrote this for it and, like, this is like, one of the only, like, original songs in it. And they do a similar thing for fairy God. Spoiler. Fairy godmother is in the Shrek 2 and she also has, like, a similar villainous.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I'm not spoiling Shrek too. Sorry.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh, my God. I'm surprised you haven't seen it. Spoiling a movie that came out 20 years ago. It's not 20 years, but you know what I mean. But yes, that is Robin Hood.

[Producer Laura]

There's Bachelorette Number one and Bachelorette Number two, Do we. Do I play them?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Sure.

[Producer Laura]

All right.

[Ryan Graham]

You don't know them off Rip?

[Sequoia Holmes]

No.

[Ryan Graham]

Damn. Maybe I shri harder than I thought.

[Producer Laura]

All right, Bachelorette number one.

[Ryan Graham]

Who is bachelorette number one? It's a mentally abused shut in from a kingdom far, far away. She likes sushi and hot tubbing anytime. Her hobbies include cooking and cleaning for her two evil sisters.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That's Cinderella.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah, I like this. I wonder what makes her like sushi. That is like messing up. Like, where do they.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. Where did they pull that from?

[Ryan Graham]

I'm trying to think what in her is sushi Sushi like she is. She is stuck. Stockholm syndrome. Similar. Her and Belle from Beauty and the Beast, right? Very much. Yeah. I wonder what. I wonder where the sushi pulls from. That's gotta mean something. And then who's bachelorette number two? Bachelorette number two is a cape wearing girl from the land of fat fancy. Although she lives with seven other men, she's not easy. Just kiss her dead frozen lips and find out what.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, okay.

[Ryan Graham]

That is a fun. That line made me laugh out loud

[Sequoia Holmes]

when I watched the movie Dead Frozen.

[Ryan Graham]

No, not that one. She lives with seven men, but she's not easy.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I did not hear that. That's hilarious.

[Ryan Graham]

That's a funny one. Yeah, that was a good line. Silly.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah. Here's me being too woke.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Something about Shrek that I did not love. But I don't like that his nose is wide and round and that he's supposed to be ugly for that. You know, in part for that. Not entirely, but in part for that. I'm like, these are the types of things that like subliminally affect children.

[Ryan Graham]

You know what else? Bald.

[Sequoia Holmes]

That too. You know what I mean? Like, I'm like, what do you mean? He what?

[Ryan Graham]

Why? Why?

[Sequoia Holmes]

Why? Why is he ugly? Yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

Cuz if you really look at Shrek's face, is he ugly?

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Ryan Graham]

Is he ugly?

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? And then Fiona becoming ugly. Her nose also gets. She gets thick, wider, rounder, and she gets a little thicker.

[Ryan Graham]

Wow.

[Sequoia Holmes]

And I'm like, I don't really like that aspect of it.

[Ryan Graham]

You've heard that if they're green, they're black theory.

[Sequoia Holmes]

I haven't.

[Ryan Graham]

Oh yeah. People say that like if you think of like cartoon characters or anything like that. If they're green, they're black.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Whoa.

[Ryan Graham]

Black. Piccolo, black. W. The Skeeter from Doug. Black.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Whoa. If they're green, they're black. So Shrek and Fiona, black and black.

[Ryan Graham]

Wow. That's kind of crazy cuz now that I'm looking at him, this is a black man.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? Like, I'm like, he reminds me of my grandpa.

[Ryan Graham]

Wow.

[Sequoia Holmes]

So like, what about him is so ugly?

[Ryan Graham]

Is this too woke now? You know, I felt when you started I was gonna be like, all right. But now my third eye is why

[Sequoia Holmes]

I didn't cracked it open.

[Ryan Graham]

Baby, I'm wide awake. Cuz. Yeah, he does look d. I'm wide awake.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Come on. Come on, get married.

[Ryan Graham]

Yeah.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Wow.

[Ryan Graham]

I. I don't like that. I don't like that. Yeah. Even if it was just like thickness being. Sorry. Even if thickness was it being them ugly.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? Yeah. Like. Yeah, I don't. I don't really appreciate that. And yeah, I'm looking at Fiona. She has a slim, narrow nose when

[Ryan Graham]

she's quote unquote, the beautiful uglier as princess.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Agree.

[Ryan Graham]

I think she looks better plain in like.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Yeah, agree.

[Ryan Graham]

So now let me look at Princess Fiona before and after. I think she was cuter before or as. As a. As Shrek.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what the way that they animated her face before. She looks male with a wig.

[Ryan Graham]

And that's why Laura Farquhar picked her.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Hello. You said if I gotta marry one of you, it's gonna be this one here. Because it's something about her. It's something about her I like. I like like it. I kind of. I don't. You know, I love it.

[Ryan Graham]

I also imagine that that is just like the animation style. It was 2001. So bad. Or worse technology to anime. She goes back to being a princess a little bit and I'm sorry. So much spoiler in in two. That is a. I'm gonna stop talking about you.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Oh my God.

[Ryan Graham]

Cuz for. Maybe you all haven't seen it either. I don't want. I'm sorry.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Everybody's seen it. I'm sure. But I. No, you might.

[Ryan Graham]

If you have it, let us know. You might also be in the comments club with Sequoia.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right.

[Ryan Graham]

Because wow. Two is just so good. It's such a good movie.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You're upsetting me.

[Ryan Graham]

I'm sorry. But yeah, yeah, I think she looks better as Shrek. Wow, that's a good take. I didn't realize that they do just kind of get like black features or non eurocentric features and they are ugly.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know, like I'm like, yeah, what about it? They lucky they didn't get nobody no lips. Because I'd definitely be. Then I'd be standing ten toes Down Shrek.

[Ryan Graham]

His lips.

[Sequoia Holmes]

He don't have no lips.

[Ryan Graham]

You know what I will say maybe they modeled Shrek after Chris Farley when they were animating. Although his nose is. It's like not as wide, but it's wider. But like, I. I had Chris Farley pulled up. His face is Shrekish. More Shrekish than I would say Mike Myers.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Okay. Yeah, he don't have no lips, I'll tell you that.

[Ryan Graham]

And his nose is not his, like round. Like, it's not. It's not Shrek round, but it's not like the smallest nose. And so I wonder if that is more. So what it is is that they were like, we have Chris Farley. Let's model this character after him.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Right? Maybe so.

[Ryan Graham]

I don't know.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But yeah.

[Ryan Graham]

So that's a good little woke take. That's a good woke.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Dang.

[Ryan Graham]

Sometimes y' all go too far.

[Sequoia Holmes]

But that one, I've never gone too far. I'm always right. Thanks. Okay. That's all that I have for Shrekisha. If you enjoyed today's show, please let us know in the comments. Let us know your thoughts on Shrek. If you've seen Shrek 2. If you want us to do an episode on Shrek 2, if you agree, agree that they made them, quote unquote

[Ryan Graham]

ugly by just giving them black features or non Eurocentric.

[Sequoia Holmes]

You know what I mean? Non Eurocentric features. And that's it. If you want to support us, you can become a maximum fun member. Please do always per usual. And you can watch us on YouTube, you can watch on Spotify and you can listen literally everywhere else. And you can connect with us at BPOP or you can shoot us an email. You can send us like fan mail. We will be doing more fan mail episodes. Just like reading out, you know, if you want our advice or you just have a story you want to tell us or whatever, you can email us at Black People love Paramore Gmail dot com.

[Ryan Graham]

That's it. We'll see you next time.

[Sequoia Holmes]

Bye. Oh, what the hell did I just do with my hand? I said bye. I was cripping a little bit.

[Ryan Graham]

Sam.