11ish Questions with Ashley and Emily

Summary

Books With Your Besties: Episode Summary – "11ish Questions with Ashley and Emily"

Release Date: January 17, 2025

In this engaging episode of Books With Your Besties, hosts Emily and Ashley dive into a lively Q&A session, responding to a plethora of listener questions gathered from their Instagram followers. The conversation is rich with personal insights, humorous anecdotes, and thought-provoking discussions, making it a must-listen for both regular fans and newcomers alike.

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1. Books They Didn't Finish or Recommend

Emily and Ashley kick off the episode by sharing books they either couldn't complete or wouldn't recommend to their audience.

• Emily candidly admits, "I did not finish The Butcher and the Wren. It was too much for me... the ripping the fingernails off thing at the beginning, I was like, I am really uncomfortable" (02:46).

• Ashley shares two titles:

  • The Club: "It was too After School Special for me, and I just didn't relate to the characters" (03:24).
  • The Great Alone by Kristin Hannah: "Every time I start it, I know it's going to break my heart, and I just can't do it right now" (03:49).

Their honest assessments provide listeners with genuine recommendations on books to approach with caution.

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2. First Jobs

The hosts reminisce about their initial forays into the workforce, highlighting diverse and unexpected roles.

• Emily recounts her time at TCBY (The Country's Best Yogurt): "They offered a manager position, and I said no. And Sig said yes. And she was the manager for a while..." (04:05). She also mentions working as a hostess at Baker Square and a server in a fine dining establishment.

• Ashley shares her unconventional first job at a criminal defense law firm: "I was 15, but I don't understand how they gave me that job" (05:04). From handling arraignments to assisting families, Ashley’s early responsibility levels are both impressive and intriguing.

Their stories emphasize the varied paths one can take early in their careers and the unexpected experiences that come with them.

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3. TV Series They Binge-Watched

When asked about TV series they've binge-watched, Ashley and Emily reveal their favorite shows and the reasons behind their choices.

• Ashley enthusiastically declares, "My favorite is Friday Night Lights. Kyle Chandler and Connie Britton can do no wrong" (06:58). She also praises Schitt's Creek for its heartwarming content.

• Emily reflects on her love for Felicity and recommends modern BBC dramas and thriller series like Broadchurch, The Killing, and Harlan Coben's Safe: "They're really good shows... give me the heebie jeebies just when I think about it" (08:31).

Their varied tastes illustrate their diverse interests beyond the realm of books.

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4. Misconceptions About Themselves

The duo addresses common misconceptions listeners might have about their personalities and dynamics.

• Ashley clarifies, "I am that person who is substantially more likable and fun online. And then people meet me in person and I'm just quiet and I observe and it freaks people out" (09:10).

• Emily adds, "You're fun and you're funny and you are wonderful. But I do think it's just funny how much people put into the idea of what they see online being the whole picture" (09:49).

They emphasize their complementary skills, with Ashley excelling in front-facing roles and Emily handling the backend operations: "Ashley is very much front of house... and I am very, very good at the back end stuff" (11:17).

This segment highlights the importance of understanding that online personas can differ from real-life personalities.

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5. Perfect Reading Room

Listeners are curious about the ideal environment for Emily and Ashley’s reading sessions.

• Emily envisions a cozy cabin setting: "Dark wood, big, cozy couch, nice lighting, a glass of red wine... or a whiskey cocktail" (12:43).

• Ashley prefers comfort at home with her big sectional and heated blanket: "I'd have my heated blanket pulled up around me, my dog at my feet... red wine or a candle that smells delicious" (13:36).

Their descriptions paint a vivid picture of their sanctuaries, emphasizing warmth, comfort, and personal touches.

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6. Pet Peeves

The conversation shifts to the hosts' pet peeves, revealing their low tolerance for certain behaviors.

• Ashley believes she has more pet peeves, particularly valuing punctuality: "I am good at being on time because it matters to me. And then I'm mad if other people are late" (15:38).

• Emily discusses her high threshold but dislikes when it’s surpassed: "I'm... over. Nobody wants to be around if you have [pet peeves] ruffled" (14:55).

Both agree on their shared sensitivity to social generosity and respectful interactions: "We're both socially generous... offering to host or take on more burden of something" (16:27).

This segment underscores their commitment to fostering positive social environments.

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7. Serious or Risky Situations Together

Reflecting on their adventures, Emily and Ashley share moments where they've faced potential danger.

• They recall a hiking experience in Turkey where they found themselves in a precarious spot: "We were like scaling a wall and I thought we were going to die" (18:34).

• Ashley also mentions white-water rafting, adding a dose of adrenaline to their friendship: "I took you white water rafting. Yeah, that was fun" (19:25).

These anecdotes highlight their adventurous spirits and the strong bond forged through shared challenges.

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8. Emily's Profession as a Social Psychologist

A significant portion of the episode delves into Emily's role and expertise as a social psychologist.

• Emily explains her focus on psychology and the legal system, particularly in cases of interpersonal and domestic violence: "I study how jurors make decisions in cases... with LGBTQ identities, do people make different decisions" (20:14).

• She emphasizes her non-clinical role: "I'm not a clinician... the only people who should be diagnosing are clinical psychologists who are licensed" (22:05).

The discussion expands to phenomena like mass hysteria and the placebo effect, underscoring the profound connection between the mind and body:

• Emily cites a study where belief influenced physical symptoms: "People were like, you told me it's going to increase my asthma, so it did" (25:27).

• They discuss the impact of media and societal perceptions on mental and physical health, highlighting the power of belief and expectation (22:30).

This segment provides listeners with an insightful look into the complexities of psychology and its real-world applications.

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9. Willingness to Try New Things and Future Projects

When asked about their willingness to embark on new ventures, Emily expresses a desire to delve into thriller writing:

• "It would be a thriller... about book club retreat, which is happening in two weeks. So if we both survive, we could write a thriller" (30:14).

Ashley complements this idea, acknowledging her limited experience in the genre: "It would have to be a thriller because I don't even read anything else" (30:27).

They also touch upon personal connections to writing, mentioning Emily’s colleagues and Ashley’s cousin Rory, who has authored nonfiction works including Aluminum Alley—a tribute to Emily's grandfather. Ashley shares a heartfelt story about her father's enthusiasm for Rory's book: "Rory's book, Aluminum Alley was the last book my dad got before he passed away. He was so excited to read it" (31:04).

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10. Naming the Book Club

The hosts reflect on the origin of their podcast's name, Books With Your Besties, revealing the spontaneity behind its creation.

• Emily states, "We came up with Books With Your Besties after a lot of discussion... books are a little bit of this podcast... we also have other factors" (32:04).

• Ashley adds, "We're just like us" when referring to their dynamic, comparing themselves to another podcast duo: "It's literally what it was about... we're just like us" (35:35).

Their collaborative and organic approach to naming reflects the authentic friendship that underpins their podcast.

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Closing Thoughts

As the episode winds down, Ashley and Emily tease upcoming projects, including a live-recorded episode at their retreat. They maintain their trademark humor, poking fun at their occasional technical mishaps: "I'll probably forget to plug the mics in" (33:35).

In a light-hearted exchange, they underscore the strength of their partnership: "You and I are a dream team. We work so well together because we have such different skills" (11:17).

Emily offers a playful caveat regarding her professional insights: "When you are a psychologist of the research type, it's natural for me to think that I misrepresented everything that I know. None of what I've said is true. So if you know that I have said something wrong or untrue, that's okay. Just keep it to yourself." (34:32).

The episode concludes with a warm invitation to listeners to support them on Patreon for exclusive content and updates: "For more content, find us on Patreon at the Creepy Book Club" (36:05).

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Notable Quotes:

• *"We tricked some people."_ – Emily (01:03)
• *"How you get that job."_ – Emily (05:29)
• *"People think about me very much."_ – Emily (09:00)
• *"I'm proud."_ – Emily (35:35)

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Conclusion

"11ish Questions with Ashley and Emily" offers a delightful blend of personal stories, professional insights, and humorous banter. Through candid discussions and relatable anecdotes, Emily and Ashley provide listeners with a deeper understanding of their lives, their podcast dynamics, and their passions both within and beyond the literary world. Whether you're seeking book recommendations, psychological insights, or simply enjoy hearing best friends navigate life's twists and turns, this episode delivers on all fronts.

Transcript

[Emily]

Hi, I'm Emily. I'm Ashley and this is Books with youh Besties. Remember that time that we recorded the whole episode and then my microphone wasn't plugged in?

[Ashley]

Yeah. Also remember that time we recorded that whole episode but we didn't because I never pressed record.

[Emily]

We are profesh.

[Ashley]

We are absolutely professionals.

[Emily]

Welcome back, besties. We are here this week with a fun Q and A because you asked us a bunch of questions on Instagram and we pulled some of them and are going to answer them for you. This week is light and fun. Stay tuned because we have some pretty amazing stuff coming up. The next few weeks we'll be doing a bit of a series and we have heavy things to get into that are super fascinating. Related to true crime, thriller, books, all the things we love.

[Ashley]

We can't say too much because it's spoilers, but it's kind of a partnership that we have no business being a part of. But here we are. Here we are.

[Emily]

Yeah, we tricked some people.

[Ashley]

I can't wait. I cannot wait. But for this week, we're keeping it light and fun. The last time we did this, it was before our most recent holiday episode. This was our most listened to and downloaded episode. Was just 10 questions with you and I and now we have 35. So are you guys ready for a six hour episode?

[Emily]

I will answer a total of three questions. Also, we want to thank all seven of you who listened to that episode. We appreciate you so much.

[Ashley]

If only we could break 10 listeners. 10. 10 people, please. Honestly, you have no idea how much it helps us to rate and review. So if you're listening to this, take 5 seconds, go rate and review our podcast.

[Emily]

Yes. And hop over to Patreon and check us out there. That's how we keep the lights on. Is your support on Patreon? Just knowing that we have you watching us and have our back means a lot to us.

[Ashley]

Okay, are you ready to get into these questions?

[Emily]

I am.

[Ashley]

How about I ask the question, you answer all of them first. Do you like that format?

[Emily]

I really love it. Except for the part where I answer all the questions.

[Ashley]

You can answer it the first time and then we'll flip flop every time. The first question is a gimme. I can't believe you haven't seen these either. This is. You're like a weirdo who just can fly by the seat of your pants. I'd be like, I need to see these in writing before I'm live on a podcast. The first question, super easy. What is a book you did not finish or would not recommend.

[Emily]

Ooh, that's a. That's a toughie. I told you, you should have told me to prepare. Okay.

[Ashley]

It doesn't even have to be like. It's not even being negative. It could be a book you just didn't have time to finish. But what's one book that you did not finish?

[Emily]

I did not finish the Butcher and the Wren. It was too much for me. Like, the ripping the fingernails off thing at the beginning, I was like, I am really uncomfortable, like, squirming here, and it's just not. And you. And then I asked you. I was like, this is a lot. And you were like, that book's not for you, Emily. And so I just let it go.

[Ashley]

Not for you.

[Emily]

What about you? What's one you didn't finish?

[Ashley]

I have two. I mean, we can't love all books, so I don't feel like this is completely shaming this book or this author. Maybe you loved it. I just didn't like a book called the Club.

[Emily]

Oh, yeah.

[Ashley]

I just. It was too After School Special for me, and I just didn't relate to the characters. Anyway, it had great reviews. Other people loved it. I just did not. So I wouldn't recommend it for most of our readers. And then a book I didn't finish, and I. It's just Next to my bed is the Great Alone by Kristin Hannah. Because every time I start it, I know it's going to break my heart, and I just can't do it right now.

[Emily]

I. I know Kristin Hannah is a toughie.

[Ashley]

Yeah, this one is. I love that someone asked this question, and I don't know if this was truly your first job, but it better be the one you talk about. People asked us what were our very first jobs. Babysitting doesn't count.

[Emily]

I mean, I had, like, little kid jobs, you know, where I was, like, the leader for one of the groups at the Nutcracker. But my first, like, job job, I think, was working at tcby, the country's best yogurt. It's like a yogurt hut, you know, where you serve froyo. And we didn't have. They didn't have the serve your own version then. So I had to serve their froyo to them. That was a good job.

[Ashley]

Didn't they want you to be a manager, promote you? And you were like, I know. No, thank you. I just want to serve the yogurt.

[Emily]

Yes. They offered to my friend Sigrid and I a manager position, and I said no. And Sig said yes. And she was the manager for a while, and she was, like, deep in the weeds of managing a tcby. That was tough stuff.

[Ashley]

I love tcby the places. Now I'm just like, we're gonna get norovirus or hand, foot and mouth here. Everybody's sharing sample cups. Everybody putting their hands in the containers. I loved tcby.

[Emily]

Yes, I did, too.

[Ashley]

My first job is. Sounds illegal and is too long to get into, but I worked at a criminal defense law firm. I would go to arraignments, which is where the person who is accused of a crime, they tell them, here's what you're accused of. Here are your next dates. I would write it all down on a piece of paper, and then I would meet with the families and tell them, these are the next steps for your loved ones. I was 15, but I don't understand.

[Emily]

How they gave you that job. Was that. How'd you get that job?

[Ashley]

My. I got invited to go to the Bahamas with a friend, and my parents said, unless you can pay for it, you're not going. And I got a job a week later. I saw an ad for basically, like, somebody at a law firm to be, like, a file clerk. And I thought I would just be making copies, but nope. I ended up in the courthouse. But I then got. Kept going back to that job for, like, five years in college. I'd go back and work in the summer.

[Emily]

Wow, that's impressive. You started out strong. I started out also strong.

[Ashley]

Did you get free yogurt?

[Emily]

Oh, yeah.

[Ashley]

People really want to know?

[Emily]

Yeah, I did. I got free yogurt. And then I also. I had so many jobs. Like, I worked as a host at a Baker Square, which is like a Applebee's or like Chili's kind of a restaurant. I was a hostess, and then I was a server in college at a fine dining establishment. I was. I worked retail. I've done so many different types of jobs.

[Ashley]

Yeah, you did. You didn't work at Volcano Stadium that summer. We all worked there. Did you work Stadium?

[Emily]

I did not.

[Ashley]

That was. That was a job.

[Emily]

I bet that was fun.

[Ashley]

It was fun. Ben quit the second day. But that's a story for another day. Okay, this one, the person specifically said, it doesn't have to be now, but what is one TV series that you binged like you watched the whole thing. Do you want me to go first on this one?

[Emily]

Yes.

[Ashley]

Okay. Do you like how I did that? Because I want to talk about mine. Mine is Friday Night Lights. People are going to be like, that's. From 20 years ago. I don't care. Kyle Chandler and Connie Britton can do no wrong. And I have watched the whole thing through probably four times.

[Emily]

I think I need to rewatch it because I. I never watched it really consecutively, and so I don't even remember most of it.

[Ashley]

Do it. And then more recently would be Schitt's Creek. I know one of yours, but I don't know all of them. What's one that you watched every season of?

[Emily]

Well, you know, my old school one is Felicity was my favorite, but also Felicity was running at the same time we were in college. I feel like I've already talked about Felicity on this podcast.

[Ashley]

I don't know. I. I watched it just to try to feel more connected to you. Last year I watched the whole thing, all of it.

[Emily]

And then you were like, I don't know why we're friends. I feel disconnected. I'm going to take a step back.

[Ashley]

No, I. I would be like, I'm mad at this character. And you'd be like, yeah, I know. You had to relive the whole thing.

[Emily]

I love. Honestly, you know what the best shows are now are, like, BBC dramas or like, thriller shows on Netflix, like, okay. Or Hulu Broad church. The killing, Dr. Foster. Man, I loved all of those. They're safe. Harlan Coben's Safe. That they did. The Fall, that was really dark, though. But good, really good shows.

[Ashley]

I loved the Fall.

[Emily]

Oh, that was that. It gives me the heebie jeebies just when I think about it.

[Ashley]

And I loved the Killing. I really also. It was set in Seattle. Right. So it had the, like, Pacific Northwest stuff you and I are used to. Okay, let's do a harder one. Do you think that there are any misconceptions people have about you? Like someone who doesn't really know you? Are there any misconceptions you think people might have.

[Emily]

No, I don't think people think about me very much. But. But I think this question was for you because you have a social media presence.

[Ashley]

Maybe.

[Emily]

But I think talking about you and I and our dynamic is interesting because I think the common misconception. You know, I rant about this all the time because I just kind of figured it out. Even though we've been doing this business for, like, three years, almost four years, I. I first realized just a handful of months ago that I think people think that you started a book business and you let your sad little bestie follow along and that I just, like, live in your shadow of this. Like, you're this like bossy dynamic, which you are. You're dynamic. You're not bossy, but you're dynamic. But I don't think they realize how.

[Ashley]

How alpha I am. I'm going to set the record straight and say Emily started the entire book club and luckily I tried to convince her not to do it with me. I was like, no, this is a bad idea. This is a bad idea. You should just do this on your own. The most common is the one we talk about all the time, that unfortunately I am that person who is substantially more likable and fun online. And then people meet me in person and I'm just quiet and I observe and it freaks people out. And you don't have an online presence because you choose not to. And then you're just the most fun person on earth and risky and willing to just have the best time. So I'm like, great. The second people meet us, they're going to be like, emily's awesome. Leave Ashley at home.

[Emily]

No, but they love you. Everybody loves you. And you're fun and you're funny and you are wonderful. But I do think it's just funny how much people put into the idea of what they see online being the whole picture. So that, that's the misconception, I would say. And two, you and I are a dream team. We work so well together because we have such different skills. Like Ashley is very much front of house, putting it out there, getting the interest out there and sharing about us and just really amazing at all of that and is a connector with a lot of people. Like you're great at relationships and I am very, very good at the back end stuff, the detail work, the stuff.

[Ashley]

That keeps our business literally alive, like single handedly building a website and doing everything for retreat.

[Emily]

No, there's. But see that's why we work so well together because we joke, we always joke about what would happen to the business if one of us died and it would just crash.

[Ashley]

I also think when people find out your job that oftentimes they think you could potentially be a more serious person, which when it comes to your job you are. But when it comes to day to day life, I hate to tell the people you're not that serious of a person. You're actually really blind and really like carefree and just a blast.

[Emily]

Oh, that's so nice of you to say. I can't believe. Is my husband listening? I hope so.

[Ashley]

Steve.

[Emily]

Steve, I'm a good time. Ashley said it. No, I know. You know, I was actually just talking to Steve, about this because I love my colleagues so much. And academics, we like to have fun and laugh. Like that's a thing. Also, sometimes those nerdy smart people are so funny. Cause they're clever. Cause they're witty. Cause they're quick. Because they're smart. So some of my colleagues are just the funniest people ever.

[Ashley]

Okay, let's go on to an easier one. And I think this one is fun. Somebody said, I want to know what your perfect reading room looks like. Like, if someone left you alone all day and you could just read, what would that room look like? What kind of a drink would you have? Just the whole setup.

[Emily]

No one is going to believe this, but you would never guess. I'm going to go with, like, a cabin y vibe. Like, dark wood, big, cozy couch, and it's gonna be nice lighting, like good lamps and just really cozy. I've got my readers, and I've got a nice glass of red wine maybe, or a whiskey cocktail that you've made me that doesn't taste gross. I don't know. Something fun like that coffee. If it's the morning and outside, the weather, what do you think, Ashley? What weather might I like?

[Ashley]

85 and humid.

[Emily]

85 and humid. That's just what I was going to say. With a strong air conditioner inside. No, Everybody knows it has to be snowy and really snowy. I'd like to be snowed in somewhere because then that way my vacation lasts longer. Okay, what about you?

[Ashley]

I do not want to be snowed in. That's my worst nightmare. If it. If I was with you, I'd be okay. I could just be like, okay, I'm going to just read and have wine and be here. Mine, unfortunately, also leads me to fall asleep. So this is my perfect reading for about 30 minutes, and then I fall asleep. I like to just be on my big sectional. No one would be home. I'd have my heated blanket pulled up around me, my dog at my feet. If it was the morning, I'd have coffee. At night, I'd either have wine or I don't really do margaritas with books. Something warm, maybe? No, I would definitely have red wine. And I would have a candle that smells delicious. Because I love that going in my house. And that's about it. I think it's. I'm pretty simple. As long as nobody comes home.

[Emily]

Yeah, that's the problem. If you're at home and you're like, oh, and it's over.

[Ashley]

That sounds perfect. I want to do that right now. Okay, this one's funny. Who has more pet peeves and what are they?

[Emily]

You have more pet peeves?

[Ashley]

I think so. I don't. You're not. Your feathers don't get easily ruffled by things that I think bother me a lot.

[Emily]

Well, I, I just, I think maybe my threshold is higher. But then it's just a. I'm, it's. Then I'm like over. Nobody wants to be around if you have ruffled, it is all the way ruffled. Am I not right? Come on. And then you, you just are more like I don't like that. I don't like that. I don't like that kind of thing. Right.

[Ashley]

Yeah. But are you okay. So are any of your pet peeves something you are good at that you're mad that other people aren't? Like I'm good at being on time because it matters to me. And then I'm mad if other people are late. Even though I'm not really mad. I just can't figure out why they can't get their shit together and be on time.

[Emily]

Oh yeah, totally. No, okay. You're right. So maybe we both have the same kinds of pet peeves actually because those are similar. Some of those. And you know what else? I think both of us, we talk about this but we're both socially generous. So for a long time I've thought about that. Social generosity is really important to me. That doesn't mean that you're buying things for everybody necessarily, but you're being mindful of giving in a generous way or being having a generous spirit in social circumstances. So like offering to host or offering to take on more burden of something or helping or like bringing a bottle of wine or that kind of thing. Offering to pay and not always taking. And so I, I think we're both very sensitive to that, don't you think?

[Ashley]

I think we are hyper aware. And I have a hard time not instantly marking it as a character trait when I see someone treating a customer service person poorly.

[Emily]

Yes.

[Ashley]

Or in a group setting participating in a selfish off putting way that makes you think wait, is that really how you are? Right. And see it once I see it.

[Emily]

Agreed. Same. I'm just really. It's not like I'm clocking it every single time. And there's always nuance. It's just that yeah there are some behaviors that I'm just like that you are just take, take from that person. Like you are suck trying to suck the energy out of that person. And I don't, I don't care for that.

[Ashley]

Does Anyone in your family. We're not going to say husband or children follow you around the house and they don't realize they're doing it. That's another pet peeve of mine.

[Emily]

Oh. Oh, that's funny. Yeah, a little bit. I think not to the same extent that yours does. I mean, my kids do, my husband does. But Ben follows you more.

[Ashley]

He does. It's okay if he hears this. Stop following me around the house, Ben. Every time I turn around, you're right there. Okay.

[Emily]

I just always see us see him in the background. Hey, what's up, man?

[Ashley]

Okay, I'm gonna ask you also. I'm asking all the questions. Just because I have them in front of me. Don't think that I'm a jerk. Everybody just asking them all. I am answering this one first, so you don't steal my answer. Somebody said, have you ever been in a serious or risky situation together? We have been quite a few because we did Semester at Sea. But I just. I need you to tell me if this is a real memory or if I just blew this up in my brain. Because you're more of a risk taker. We went hiking and we ended up in a precarious spot and had to like. Or was this on Semester at Sea? I can't remember where we were. That we were hiking and it seemed very safe and very non threatening until it was. And then we were like scaling a wall and I thought we were going to die. Do you have any recollection of this?

[Emily]

That was in Turkey, right?

[Ashley]

Yes.

[Emily]

And we were going through people's yards.

[Ashley]

Yes, but do you remember? We had to skit. I was like, we are on a cliff. This is not safe.

[Emily]

Yes.

[Ashley]

Okay, so this happened.

[Emily]

That. Did I have another one from Semester at Sea. Were you. No, I don't think you were there. That's. That's. Why. Were you on the. The nomadic. The Berber village track in the Saharan desert?

[Ashley]

No, I wasn't.

[Emily]

Morocco. Okay.

[Ashley]

Back of the. When we got in a taxi in Russia with random people. That was.

[Emily]

I. I wasn't on that one. I wasn't on that. Isn't this great? Because Ashley and I, we did so much together, but we also lived our own lives and did our own adventures and still survive.

[Ashley]

So otherwise I can't think of. I mean, we've done so many things together, but not. I took you white water rafting.

[Emily]

That was. Yeah, that was fun.

[Ashley]

That was fun. Yeah.

[Emily]

Yeah. We're. We're not huge risk takers in terms of on our regular basis. I mean, we made a whole lot of horrible decisions up in, in our twenties, but.

[Ashley]

But looking back, we're very unsafe.

[Emily]

Yeah. In our 40s, we're just like, let's go to a really great restaurant in a really cool place.

[Ashley]

And I'm like, does leaving the door unlocked in a hotel room count anymore? Like, oh, no.

[Emily]

They remember. Somebody walked in on us. Oh, yeah. While we were trying to record.

[Ashley]

Oh, hello. Okay, a couple more. Someone actually asked what type. They said, I just don't understand what type of a psychologist Emily is. If you're comfortable answering this, they wanted to know if you were a therapist or just what you do in your practice.

[Emily]

I am a experimental psychologist is what my PhD is in. Listen, psychology has a lot of different disciplines, so essentially I'm research trained and I studied in a psychology and law lab. I am primarily a social psychologist. So I study the environment and how we impact the environment that we're in and the environment impacts us. And it's obviously a huge amount. My particular research is in the area of psychology and the legal system and typically actually interpersonal violence and domestic violence types of cases in jury decision making. So I look a lot at how jurors, or mock jurors, as we call them, because they're not actually serving as jurors for our research, but they're jury eligible folks, how they make decisions in cases. For example, my current research looks at, in a domestic violence case, if the identity of the people involved in the domestic violence are LGBTQ identities, do people make different decisions about the severity of the crime or their thoughts around the crime? So that is what I do. I looked. For a lot of years, I spent time on research looking at battered women who kill their abusers and investigating factors around that being perceived as self defense or not. Because the legal definition in most states does not meet the criteria for self defense in those cases. So that's a lot of what I've. What I've done. So I have a lot of background in psychology and law. I took a little bit of law, not much, but a lot of psychology, and have been teaching psychology for 15 years.

[Ashley]

So what you're saying is you're not a therapist?

[Emily]

No, I'm not a clinician, which is why. Which is why I always say we should not be diagnosing people. And why I rant about how on TikTok we're like, oh, you have ADHD or you have social anxiety, and there's all these kinds of trends to do that. I'm like, the only people who should be Diagnosing are clinical psychologists who are licensed and. And trained to do that.

[Ashley]

Total side note from that, but you just made me think of it. I'm gonna link this in the show. Notes. I just listened to a podcast, Em, that was about a high school where a bunch of girls started to have, like, tics. And they were trying to figure out, is this something that they are. Are they actually sick? I'm not gonna give anything away. Are they actually sick? Is there something in the water? Is there something making them sick?

[Emily]

Or.

[Ashley]

Or is this something.

[Emily]

No, we. You should just give it away because this is a. This is actually a mass hysteria. It's considered a mass hysteria.

[Ashley]

Well, you tell. You talk about it then. The podcast just interviewed people who were a part of it, and some of them are still convinced they're like, yeah, they were part of the mass hysteria. I was not. I was really sick.

[Emily]

Exactly. Well, because nobody knows that they're faking it. They don't. And it's not fake. It's psychosomatic. So psychosomatic means your mind and body are connected. Right. So your. Your mind can create your body and your body can create your mind. So it's called Tick Tock Ticks. Is that what they called it in the podcast? TikTok?

[Ashley]

Tics. I'll look at the name of the podcast. Maybe they can't for, like, liability reasons, but that's literally what it was about.

[Emily]

Yeah. So there was a girl with tourette syndrome on TikTok, and she often said, beans. Did they talk about beans?

[Ashley]

No, but they did talk about how there were actually obviously people like her who have Tourette's who were like, hey, like, I didn't give this to you. Tourette's is not contagious.

[Emily]

Right? Yeah. So there was just this huge uptick in young people exhibiting neurological symptoms. I even know personally somebody who was impacted by this, and they saw neurologists and they tried treatments, and it extinguished naturally. There was no evidence of any neurological actual basis for it.

[Ashley]

I went to a live show, armchair expert Dax Shepard, and he interviewed David Ferrier, who is an expert in different areas, and he. The whole live show was about Havana syndrome.

[Emily]

Yeah.

[Ashley]

Which to this day is still like, is it something or is it not? And they. They paid people who claim to have been a part of this. Anyway, it was a fascinating live show. I'll link the podcast, too. That was all about it.

[Emily]

Yeah. There. It's really fascinating phenomena. But that's why I actually, the reason I rant about that is because as a social Psychologist. I would be remiss not to talk about how the media you're consuming literally is creating your reality. And so you might come up with Tourette's syndrome symptoms because you are watching too much of it. And by. And. And it's so unintentional, it's so non conscious.

[Ashley]

And it doesn't mean the symptoms aren't real like these people were actually having symptoms. It just means it's not probably what you think the underlying quote unquote condition is.

[Emily]

Right. People, really, I think we have this societal concept that something like a placebo effect isn't meaningful. Like a placebo effect being that if we give you a sugar pill and you don't know if you're getting a medication or a sugar pill. Right. And so you believe you're getting a medication and then you see improvements from that. That. That's not powerful. Like you got improvements. Placebo. There. There's actually something now where people talk in ethics about open placebo. So they literally tell you it's a placebo. And it can still be helpful. It can still be helpful to be doing something that feels like it might treat your condition. It can improve symptoms. Okay, I'm going to tell you one story. Researchers Han and Dalton did a study where they had asthmatic folks smell a rose scent that was completely benign. And they told half of the asthmatic folks, it's totally benign. It's not going to do anything to you. Those people were like, okay, smelled the little rose smell. The other half, they told that it could exacerbate their asthma symptoms. Those people actually for the next 24 hours reported increased asthma symptoms. Right. Which isn't terribly surprising. You tell them it's likely to, they're going to notice their symptoms more. But here's the kicker. In the 24 hours after smelling this totally benign rose scent that they believed would increase their asthma, they actually showed increased lung inflammation.

[Ashley]

I had to unmute myself and pick up my jaw from the floor if this was only 24 hours. Oh, my gosh.

[Emily]

Our mind is so powerful in impacting our body. And what we put into our mind, what we think about and what we consume is really important to the way that our body responds. Which is why reading thriller books and talking about true crime is a great idea.

[Ashley]

I just thought, I'm going to think about Patreon, Patreon members. If I just think about them, will they come and support us?

[Emily]

Your body will believe that you have a very thriving, successful podcast in business.

[Ashley]

Oh, we'll link that. That's Fascinating. Okay, one other per. Not personal question for you or not question, just topic. Because I talked about this on a run the other day with Mary about jury selection, and the timing of this conversation is fascinating. And that she was like, I. I could be on. I could help pick a jury, and I would be okay if I knew that the jury basically did the quote unquote right thing. But Mary's like, I don't know if I could live my. With myself if I knew I had helped pick a jury that wrongfully convicted someone. She's like, I could stomach if someone got off. And I thought, well, they're probably guilty. But the justice system worked. But Mary's like, I feel like the one case where someone got convicted who was not guilty, I'd like, I had a hand in that. And I can't handle it.

[Emily]

Right.

[Ashley]

Did you talk to anyone when you were considering it, who was in that field and just kind of how they handled it, or did you never get that far in it?

[Emily]

Well, so I. Yeah. Cause I trained. I did three cases of training toward becoming a trial consultant, helping with that. And I talk about those stories with my students because I think it's informative. You don't get to select who you're. Who you're helping. You are helping who has hired you. I think, though, there's value in that, the courtroom, as much as it is we'd like to think, like, idealistically, we want it to be truth finding. It is conflict resolving. And so that means that there are manipulations that are happening no matter what on both sides. So being involved in a way that you best can resolve the conflict might feel fine. Right. And it's important I'm more comfortable where I am looking at. How do we attenuate bias in the courtroom? What are methods and practices by which we could reduce these human biases that come up?

[Ashley]

There are errors that are going to happen because we're human. Yeah.

[Emily]

Yeah. We're going to come into where I start, you know, ranting mercilessly about things in the next few weeks.

[Ashley]

Can't wait. Okay, let's do two more. And these are way, way easier than that was. That one's too easy. Who's more willing to try new things? Emily is more willing to try new things. 1000%. This one is fun. Somebody said, if you were going to write a book, what would it be about?

[Emily]

It would be a thriller. It would be a thriller. It's going to be about book club retreat, which is happening in two weeks. So if we both Survive. We could write a thriller.

[Ashley]

Probably about that heavy on the.

[Emily]

If.

[Ashley]

I wouldn't know how to write not a thriller. Not that I know how to write a thriller. That sounded like I know how to write a book. It would have to be a thriller because I don't even read anything else.

[Emily]

I know some of my colleagues have written some books that are textbooks and handbooks and stuff. Just cool things. Like, one of mine's working on one right now that's going to be more like, accessible, a little bit more like pop psychology book. I think there's some great stuff. And one of my co workers wrote a sci fi book, so I should share that one once he gets it published. So he's working right now on that process. But I don't have any desire to write in my field, a whole book.

[Ashley]

And your cousin wrote a book, right?

[Emily]

Oh, my cousin's written two books, Rory. Yeah, two nonfiction books. And one of them comes out in May. He wrote Aluminum Alley, which was about my grandfather's life. Super cool. His name's Rory Laverty, so you can go look up Rory Laverty, Aluminum Alley. And then he's. He wrote another nonfiction about World War II delivery man that's coming out in May.

[Ashley]

On a sad note. But also, I love this story. You know, my dad was a voracious reader. Like, absolutely. He wouldn't read fiction to save his life. He'd be like, get that out of my face. And Rory's book, Aluminum Alley was the last book my dad got before he passed away. He was so excited to read it. Like, he was so, so excited. So it's cool to see that he had another book come out. And the last question is. I don't even know the answer to this. You tell me. Somebody said, who ultimately chose the name of the book club and how did you come up with it?

[Emily]

Everything we've done has been both of our fingers stirring up the pot.

[Ashley]

I can't even remember alternate names. I feel like once we settled on it, that was just it, you know?

[Emily]

And also, I'm pretty sure that the creepy book club was, like, pretty quick smash and grab for us. Like, oh, this is a good name.

[Ashley]

Yeah.

[Emily]

We didn't know what it would be yet, so I think we weren't as thoughtful. And here's the thing, here's the thing. Here's the real answer to the question we came up with. The creepy book club. We came up with books with your besties. After a lot of discussion and a lot of thoughts around what we want this Podcast to be. But the reality is books are a little bit of this podcast. I mean, they're important to us, and we talk about books, but we also have other factors. We talk about things related to what we read that come up. And we read thriller books. So a lot of crime stuff and a lot of just topics around that. And so I'm not sure that books with your besties captures it, what we're doing.

[Ashley]

I agree. I have been telling a lot of people recently, I'm like, it's books, it's true crime, but also it's storytelling. It's a lot of. Just all of those. And if people listen enough, they'll be like, okay, this is what we're getting into this week. You just never really know.

[Emily]

It's a little different every week. Are we going to make this more consistent? Probably not. Probably not.

[Ashley]

We might. You know, it will be more consistent the next month.

[Emily]

Maybe half.

[Ashley]

It'll be. It'll be pretty focused.

[Emily]

Actually. One other thing that is coming is that we are going to film record a podcast episode live at our retreat. And so hopefully there's something we can release from that. I'll probably forget to plug the mics in.

[Ashley]

Probably forget to press record. Maybe somebody will have it on their iPhone for us.

[Emily]

Plus, people will be asking questions or talking and we won't be able to hear anything. No, we'll see. We'll figure it out. We got to figure that out.

[Ashley]

Ash, do you feel like there is anything that wasn't covered? There's like 30 more questions, but also, it's been almost an hour, so I think people are sick of hearing.

[Emily]

I think so, too. I probably also. I'd like to, you know, just caveat something. When you are a psychologist of the research type, it's. It's natural for me to think that I misrepresented everything that I know. None of what I've said is true. So if you know that I have said something wrong or untrue, that's okay. Just keep it to yourself. Okay.

[Ashley]

Definitely don't tag her anywhere and play it and be like, listen to what she said.

[Emily]

No, just delete it and I'll tell us. Delete that episode.

[Ashley]

I'm allowed to say anything. Oh, wait, wait. There's. I want to say one more thing because I. I literally bent over laughing so hard because it made me think of you and me. So there's this new podcast I have found I will link. It's called Diabolical Lies, and it's also two female hosts. I'm Blanking at their names, but one of them is, I think she also has a podcast about money. Anyway, she was. She was being interviewed for something, and they were like, tell us about, you know, what you do and then what your other podcast host does. And basically the answer was like, I'm like an economist and a super smart person. And the other lady, they're like, this is her Internet friend. She yells on the Internet. And I was like, oh, no, that's us. Like, Emily is like, Ph.D. professor of psychology, and here's her friend who yells on the Internet. I'm like, we're just like us.

[Emily]

I love that so much. It's because I have no personality outside of my job, so. So you just be proud.

[Ashley]

All right, besties. Thank you. And come back because we do have actually go to Patreon. That's where we'll drop the news first about what we have coming. That's a really, really big deal, and we want you to be part of it with us. We would like to thank our and producers Emily reader and Ashley DeSanto. Thanks for listening.

[Emily]

For more content, find us on Patreon at the Creepy Book Club.

[Ashley]

Happy reading.