Books With Your Besties – "Dark Matter" by Blake Crouch

Hosts: Emily & Ashley
Date: September 5, 2025
Episode Theme:
A smart, heartfelt, and often hilarious deep dive into Dark Matter by Blake Crouch, exploring themes of regret, choices, parallel lives, and what truly makes a satisfying life. Emily and Ashley approach the sci-fi thriller with their trademark honesty, warmth, and authentic friendship, using the story to spark a thoughtful conversation about ambition, relationships, and self-acceptance.

Episode Overview

Emily and Ashley take a break from their usual psychological thriller fare to dive into the science fiction world of Dark Matter. Despite neither being self-professed sci-fi lovers, both found themselves deeply engaged by the novel’s existential themes and gripping narrative. The conversation flows from their reading experiences and star ratings to a meaningful examination of regret, ambition, the impact of our social circles, and parenting in light of the book’s lessons.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Initial Impressions and Ratings

• Ashley: Just finished the book hours before recording, listened while running, and felt so emotionally affected she "ran faster than I wanted to because I was so upset about what was gonna happen." (00:52)
• Both hosts emphasize the difficulty in rating books a perfect five.
  • Ashley: "If I'm putting it up against traditional stuff, I'm giving it a 4.85 because I can't give away 5 stars all the time." (01:20)
  • Emily: "I think I'm like a 4.5. I really, really liked it and I'm not a sci fi lover." (01:42)

2. Science Fiction for Non-Sci-Fi Readers

• Both stress that although Dark Matter is science fiction, it's grounded and accessible:

  • Ashley: "It wasn't so sci fi...It wasn't like The Fifth Element or Matrix. I'm just like, I can't. I have no interest in this at all. And it wasn't like that in any way, shape or form." (02:09)

• Emily: "It's a play on a real field of study...there are real things that have been identified with quantum physics...But what if we could actually use them as humans?" (02:28)

3. Thematic Depth: Regret, Choices, and Parallel Lives

• Emily wanted Ashley to read the book specifically for the podcast because it brings out richer themes than typical thrillers:

  • "It's so much about the choices that we make, regret, thinking about other ways we could have lived. And I just was like, we will have such a good conversation about this." (03:11)

• Both express gratitude for their own life paths, relating to Jason's storyline in the novel.

  • Ashley: "After reading this book, I'm like, oh my gosh. Actually, I kind of have everything I was hoping to have right now and more...wait a second, this is exactly what I was hoping for. Does that make sense?" (04:03)
  • Emily: "I dreamed of having a partner and two children...we're healthy and we have everything that we need and more...I would never wish any change in my life that resulted in something different than where I am right now." (04:36)

• On regret and appreciating life’s path:

  • Ashley: "Even the really hard stuff that has gotten me to where I am today." (05:58)
  • Emily: "Singular decisions have this massive impact on the trajectory of our lives." (05:58)

4. Ambition, Success, and "Jason 2"

• Dark Matter's "Jason 2" is used as a lens to discuss ambition at the cost of humanity:

  • Ashley: "Jason 2 turned out to be like a pretty bad human because of his singular focus on this goal." (07:40)
  • Emily: "We somehow equate wealth and success with like, other good qualities...also there may be some not so great qualities that comes with those that climb." (08:39)

• The discussion turns to relationships and the people who shape us:

  • Emily: "You are the company you keep...who you're surrounded by—that is what you're with versus...the professor with the wife and kid…softened his heart." (10:05)

5. Social Influence & Personal Growth

• Both draw parallels between the book and real-life experiences with work, multilevel marketing, and relationships.

  • Ashley: "You have to have people around you who are going to be like, I see you straying from who you are, and we have to figure out how to not do that." (11:13)
  • Emily: "It was really cutthroat at some point...And it made people really selfish in general." (12:23)

• On choosing friends and partners carefully:

  • Emily: "You are the company you keep. Like, you have chosen this group of friends who are going to always allow you to engage in that kind of behavior." (13:55)

• Reflections on parenting:

  • Ashley: "You have to let your kids figure it out on their own...you have to let your teenager make these decisions to figure it out." (14:47)
  • "If it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck, it's probably a duck." (Her mom’s quote) (15:41)

6. Relationships and Forgiveness

• They explore what it means to forgive and move forward, both in marriage and in friendships.
  • Ashley: "It's kind of shitty for you to then sit in that and to not forgive yourself...if someone you love says you're forgiven, that you are allowed to move on also." (21:01)
• Emily: "When someone hurts you, if you decide to let that go, you really want the other person to also." (22:11)

7. Mental Habits: Regrets and Neural Pathways

• Emily shares insights from psychology about letting go of regret and changing mental habits:
  • "If we instead change our narrative to be like, I'm grateful for my eyes, I love my eyes...if we practice that, that's going to be our default pathway." (18:18)
  • "One of the keys to happiness is a bad memory." (Rita Mae Brown quote) (20:20)
  • "Happiness is nothing more than good health and a bad memory." (Albert Schweitzer) (20:35)

8. Book Structure and Reading Experience

• Ashley disliked the audio repetition of "Jason" and numbers:
  • "I can't listen to this anymore." (23:21)
• Emily found the repetition clever:
  • "It's still the same person...the responses are going to be 99% the same." (23:37)
• Both loved the ending, especially with Jason and his son, Charlie:
  • Ashley: "When Charlie was like, but what door do I pick? And he goes, I trust you. I was like, oh, I have to cry and run at the same time. This is hard." (24:37)

9. Adaptations and Casting: Apple TV’s Dark Matter

• Mixed feelings about casting for the Apple TV series:
  • Emily: "I do not like that person cast for Jason. Who is it?" (25:25)
  • Both agree on liking Jennifer Connelly but are unsure about Joel Edgerton as Jason.
  • Ashley: "I tried to find Dark Matter on Audible with a different cover and...I could only find it in German." (25:30)
• Both plan to watch the series despite their reservations.

10. Blake Crouch’s Other Books

• The hosts reveal Dark Matter was published in 2016, not recently as assumed.
• They discuss other Blake Crouch novels like Pines, Wayward, and a forthcoming title, Famous (2025).
  • Ashley: "He has a. A lot of books." (27:45)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Ashley: "I immediately texted Emily, 'Read this book with my ears.'" (00:52)
• Emily: "It's so much about the choices that we make, regret, thinking about other ways we could have lived." (03:11)
• Ashley: "Even the really hard stuff that has gotten me to where I am today." (05:58)
• Emily: "Jason 2 turned out to be like a pretty bad human because of his singular focus on this goal." (07:40)
• Ashley: "The company you keep. My mom used to say if it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck, it's probably a duck." (15:41)
• Emily: "One of the keys to happiness is a bad memory." (20:20)
• Ashley: "It's kind of shitty for you to then sit in that and to not forgive yourself." (21:01)
• Ashley: "When Charlie was like, but what door do I pick? And he goes, I trust you. I was like, oh, I have to cry and run at the same time. This is hard." (24:37)
• Emily: "I ruined the book for myself by just thinking (Jason) was Benedict Cumberbatch." (26:16)

Important Timestamps

• 00:52 – Ashley’s emotional reaction finishing the book
• 03:11 – Why Emily picked the book for the podcast
• 04:36 – Both reflect on their own life choices and regrets
• 07:40 – Discussion of ambition and “Jason 2”
• 10:05 – “You are the company you keep” thematic discussion
• 14:47 – Parenting and the power of social circles
• 18:18 – Emily’s insights on neural pathways, regret, and memory
• 21:01 – On forgiveness and letting go
• 23:21 – Repetition in the audiobook
• 24:37 – The ending, Charlie’s choice, and emotional resonance
• 25:25 – Thoughts on Apple TV adaptation and casting
• 27:45 – Blake Crouch’s bibliography

Episode Tone

Warm, candid, insightful, and often irreverently funny—Emily and Ashley’s 23 years of friendship shine through as they balance heartfelt reflection with relatable and entertaining banter about books, life, and human nature.

For Listeners: Takeaways

• Dark Matter opens up meaningful questions about regret, ambition, and satisfaction, and is relatable even to those wary of science fiction.
• Who you surround yourself with—and the choices you make—shape your path and your sense of self.
• Letting go of old regrets (and maintaining a “bad memory” for past hurts) is a powerful tool in happiness.
• The book’s narrative is emotionally gripping and fuels thought-provoking conversation about the multiverse of paths each life can take.

For more Books with Your Besties, support the show on Patreon and check out their bonus episodes and book picks.