Jackson White: Toxicity and Tell Me Lies

Wed Feb 18 2026

Join Alex in the studio for an interview with Jackson White. Jackson talks all about his experience on Tell Me Lies, what it was like playing the most toxic man alive, and his reaction to the series finale. He also opens up about his relationship with Grace, his complicated childhood, and his sobriety. Enjoy!

Transcript

Alex Cooper (0:00)

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Host (Call Her Daddy co-host, possibly Sofia Franklyn or another co-host) (0:12)

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Alex Cooper (0:13)

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Host (Call Her Daddy co-host, possibly Sofia Franklyn or another co-host) (1:06)

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Alex Cooper (1:10)

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Host (Call Her Daddy co-host, possibly Sofia Franklyn or another co-host) (1:22)

What is up Daddy gang?

Alex Cooper (1:24)

It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy Jackson White.

Host (Call Her Daddy co-host, possibly Sofia Franklyn or another co-host) (1:31)

Welcome to Caller Daddy.

Jackson White (1:32)

Thank you.

Host (Call Her Daddy co-host, possibly Sofia Franklyn or another co-host) (1:33)

How are you doing?

Jackson White (1:34)

I'm doing as if we haven't like like asked that question like nine times before we started this.

Host (Call Her Daddy co-host, possibly Sofia Franklyn or another co-host) (1:42)

Summary

Call Her Daddy: Jackson White – Toxicity and Tell Me Lies

Host: Alex Cooper
Guest: Jackson White
Release Date: February 18, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode features Jackson White, star of Hulu's Tell Me Lies, diving deep into the complexities of playing a toxic, polarizing character, emotional detachment, personal growth, and his own relationship history—including a rare, open look at his background and journey to stability. The hosts (primarily Alex Cooper) and Jackson also get candid about addiction, family, and love.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Processing the End of Tell Me Lies

Discovering the Series Finale: Jackson reveals he (and the rest of the cast) only recently learned this would be the series, not season, finale ([07:03]).
- "I felt really, really sad initially, even though I knew creatively that's what was supposed to happen … It's a mixed bag." (Jackson, [07:40])
Cast as Family: Four years turned the cast into a family, making the end feel like both a personal and professional loss ([08:06]).

2. Stephen DeMarco’s Character & Jackson’s Approach

Creating a Sociopath:
- At first, playing Stephen was fun and exploratory, but the writers ramped up his toxicity as the show continued. (Jackson, [02:59])
- "He turned into this, like, absolute garbage fire of a guy … he's the worst." ([02:59])
Physicality of Acting: Jackson blended his own "bad posture" and isms with character traits—like intense eye contact—to create Stephen’s unnerving vibe ([04:44]-[05:29]).
- "Half are mine, half are invented … he's very physical. He moves kind of like that … calculating and still." ([04:59])
Detachment Over Time: Watching himself became emotionally draining, leading Jackson to detach more from Stephen in later seasons ([06:46], [07:03]).
- "It's very emotional to watch a lot of yourself. It kind of sucks." ([06:31])

3. The Finale & Its Reception

Unexpected Ending: Jackson laughed when reading the finale script, noting the dark irony of Stephen "winning" in the end ([09:19]):
- "He wins. That's so funny. That's so cosmically funny … it's a big tragic comedy at the end." ([09:19])
- “A lot of bad people win.” (Jackson, [10:33])
Fan Expectations:
- The online fandom expected Stephen to get his comeuppance, but the show subverted expectations ([09:39]).
Iconic Wedding Scene:
- Jackson shot the crucial finale scenes while sick with the flu, adding a layer of chaos to the late-night shoot ([10:51]).

4. The "Steven" Experience: In-Character Toxic Advice

Advice as Stephen: Audiences submitted dilemmas for Jackson to answer as Stephen ([13:54]):
- "Use it when you have to. You weaponize it … reveal that you know about his dating profile at the moment of climax." (as Stephen, [14:32])
- "Hold information, put it on your computer, and then use it at a horrible [moment]." (as Stephen, [15:30])
Why Stephen Acts This Way: When asked about Stephen giving back the tape to Lucy, Jackson suggests, “He was bored … he's done.” ([15:49])

5. Real-Life Relationship with Grace Van Patten

Quirky Beginnings: Grace had the role first; Jackson felt pressure and "actor energy" during their initial meeting ([21:07]-[21:23]).
Who Made the First Move? Jackson waited for Grace to initiate romantically, subconsciously worried about overstepping given the power dynamic ([24:19]-[25:09]).
- "She kind of had to make the first move. ... She was my boss."
“Grace is my daddy.” Hilarious catchphrase—“She’s my daddy, Grace is my daddy” becomes a running joke ([25:32]-[25:53]).
Tattoos as Commitment: Jackson let Grace tattoo him several times early in the relationship, describing himself as impulsive and riding on adrenaline ([26:14]-[26:50]).

6. Personal Growth and Vulnerability

Fear and Relationships: Jackson repeatedly references starting relationships with fear and working to find comfort and trust ([27:33]-[28:37]).
- "I just grew up in fear … It gets better and better over the last ten years." ([27:40])
Healthy Dependence: Emphasizes the need for balanced dependence and maintaining individuality in relationships ([28:53]-[29:42]).
- "It’s a discipline for me to round out my life ... so that you don’t put too much pressure on a relationship."
Impact of Divorce: Being a child of divorce led to instability, abandonment issues, and a tendency to create patterns Jackson now recognizes ([30:12]-[31:22]).
- “Because we therapy now, it’s all … it’s too much. … Figure yourself out and then let it go.” ([31:02])
Internalizing Past Trauma: "You can’t weaponize your past and use that in your relationships … people won’t stick if you’re doing that." ([32:07])
Abandonment & Clinging: He describes clinging to early relationships for stability, fearing being left ([33:33]-[34:10]).

7. Honest Reflections on Family

Stepmoms & Stepdads: Jackson found step-family dynamics complicated and admits giving his stepmoms a hard time as a child ([34:18]-[35:52]).
Empathy in Adulthood: He’s developed empathy for the adults in his life and now recognizes the difficulties they faced ([36:13]).
- "I just had this conversation with my stepdad… That must be so hard." ([36:13])
Bonding with His Dad via Music & Booze: His father’s musical talent and troubled coping mechanisms (drinking, instability) left a complex legacy ([36:42], [38:44]).
- "I drank a lot with him... just a lot of drinking and smoking with dad." ([37:15]-[38:33])
Loss and Growth: Jackson is open about wishing he’d known his dad better before he died, and the painful transition from idolizing a parent to seeing flaws ([39:10]-[40:06]).

8. Addiction, Coping Mechanisms, and Healing

Addiction as Avoidance: Jackson articulates how addiction and behaviors can be ways to avoid underlying fear and pain ([45:54]-[48:18]).
- “Fear is like the core, and anger is a symptom ... But it starts with that—I'm not enough, I won’t be enough.” ([47:34])
Facing Consequences & Self-Knowledge: Recognizing when his actions sabotaged his relationships and success pushed him to change ([48:18]-[49:55]).
- "If you're missing your audition, if you're shitty on the phone, if you're reacting poorly ... you just gotta focus on it."
Sobriety and Realization: Sobriety brought clarity, but also revealed deeper, unmasked insecurities and core wounds ([52:59]-[53:55]).
- "All I want is to be like, like a worker among workers ... I want life to be calm and serene." ([54:00])
Emerging from the Darkness: He now feels more connected, able to care for others, and hopeful ([54:00]-[54:57]).
- "I genuinely give a shit about how someone else is doing ... That's the best thing to come out of it." ([54:00])

9. Rapid Fire & Light-Hearted Questions

Audition Fails: “All of them. So many of them. I’ve got like 150 of them.” (Jackson, [58:04])
Most Insufferable Character in Tell Me Lies: “Evan. ... I think he's actually bad news. ... [And] The teacher Oliver.” ([58:15]-[58:40])
Pettiest Breakup Act: Disintegrating (not just deleting) his own Instagram so he wouldn’t have to see ex-related content ([58:45]-[59:14]).
Best Gift Given to Grace: Accidentally gave her a Cartier wedding ring as a regular gift ([59:28]-[59:57]).
Love Languages: Gives acts of service, wants to receive words of affirmation ([60:12]).
First Paycheck Splurge: Bought a Dodge Durango with a Hemi; chose it because it’s loud and has “power”— a nod to his late dad ([60:47]-[61:29]).
What’s Next: Filmed a project after Tell Me Lies with a very different, more naturalistic character ([61:59]-[62:17]).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

"He turned into this, like, absolute garbage fire of a guy ... he's the worst."
— Jackson White on Stephen DeMarco ([02:59])
"He wins. That's so funny. That's so cosmically funny ... it's a big tragic comedy at the end."
— Jackson White about the series finale ([09:19])
"You weaponize it ... wait until you're making love, and at the moment of climax, reveal that you know about his dating profile."
— Jackson as Stephen DeMarco, giving "advice" ([14:32])
"Grace is my daddy."
— Jackson White ([25:33])
"I just grew up in fear. ... I absolutely go into things on the defense thinking that it's not going to work out."
— Jackson White ([27:40])
"All I want is to be ... a worker among workers. I want life to be calm and serene."
— Jackson White ([54:00])
"If you’re taking it out in your relationship, you’re gonna hurt somebody. If you’re taking it out with substances, you’re gonna hurt yourself."
— Jackson White ([52:25])

Key Timestamps

[02:59] Creating the complexity of Stephen DeMarco
[07:03] Learning the show was ending for good
[09:19] Laughing at the series finale's twist ending
[13:54] Audience Q&A: "Advice from Stephen"
[21:07] Meeting and first impressions with Grace Van Patten
[27:33] Processing fear and relationships
[31:02] Therapy, growing out of childhood patterns
[37:15] Musical family and bonding through substance use with his dad
[47:34] Fear as a root emotion/facing unhealthy coping mechanisms
[52:59] Benefits and challenges of sobriety
[58:04] Rapid fire questions begin

Tone & Takeaway

The episode is classic Call Her Daddy—equal parts vulnerable, irreverent, and insightful. Jackson White is candid about everything from the craft of inhabiting 'the worst guy on TV,' to the messy realities of addiction, love, and healing. His willingness to "get real" makes for a cathartic and sometimes darkly funny ride, whether discussing onscreen toxicity, awkward relationship beginnings, or the everyday work of self-improvement.

For listeners:
Whether you're a Tell Me Lies fan, relationship drama enthusiast, or interested in honest mental health conversations, this episode offers an actor's vulnerable inside view—and plenty of humor and warmth.