A (2:28)

I get it if I'm honest. No, it's fine.

B (2:30)

It's never been, like, my favorite thing to do, but, like, you Seem super cool. So I'm happy to be here.

A (2:36)

We're just gonna chill for an hour, and hopefully you don't hate me by the end of this. I promise it's gonna be chill.

B (2:40)

Yeah.

A (2:40)

You recently just announced that you're going on a North American tour, and. And you are releasing your greatest hits album. How did you decide to do this? It's so iconic and inspiring.

B (2:51)

Yeah. So it's, like, 22 years into my career now, which is super gnarly to even think about, and I'm releasing a greatest hits album in June and going on the greatest hits tour. And it's pretty great to be going back out on the road and doing one of the biggest tours of my career this far, just off, like, celebrating, like, my catalog. And so I feel, like, super stoked and lucky to, like, still be doing my thing and loving it more than ever.

A (3:22)

It's. I just, like, not to freak you out, but I love you, and I grew up.

B (3:27)

Thank you.

A (3:28)

Loving you. And I used to make the most embarrassing music videos to all of your songs. Like, I have one of the most embarrassing music videos to nobody's home, and it's like, little young Alex depressed, being, like, singing in the corner of my room. Six years old, seven years old, eight years old, to now being like, it's dope to be in your presence.

B (3:47)

Wow, that's crazy. Thank you. You made music videos. I feel like you need to, like, find that, bring that up, and, like, little clips on TikTok.

A (3:53)

I see that. See, the thing is, Avril is, like, my version of a music video compared to, like, the young kids on TikTok now, like, they're hot and cool and, like, wear cute outfits and know how to do, like, contour. I was busted with my little, like, acne and braces. So, like, they're not cute. Okay. They're for, like, my parents to see only and be like, you were so cute, Alison. Like, mom, I was hideous. What is the difference? Like, when you go on a tour, what is the difference between touring now versus, like, when you first started out?

B (4:23)

So, like, on my first tour, I wanted to be like, Green Day, because I had gone to one of their shows, and, like, all of their songs were, like, hit after hit after hit, just, like, singles. It was just, like, power all the way through. And so, like, on my first tour, I only had three singles, and the rest was just, like, album tracks. And, like, for me, that just wasn't good enough. I wanted every song to be, like, a banger. So I guess I did I worked super hard to get to this point where now, like, every single song in my set list as a hit song, a single, and like a really big milestone and part of my career. So, like, making a strong set list is like, for me, that's like the biggest thing that goes into the show. But I think every tour has gotten easier. I've come out of my shell more as a performer. Also, like, bringing like, my favorite bands out on the road to open with me. Like, actually like my friends.

A (5:23)

Yeah. Oh, that's.

B (5:23)

So we can play like beer pong backstage, skateboard backstage together, have barbecues backstage.

A (5:30)

Didn't you have Simple Plan come with you?

B (5:32)

So Simple Plan opened for me on my first tour back in Obsessed 2002 or something.

A (5:39)

And you had All Time Low too?

B (5:40)

All Time Lower.

A (5:41)

Oh, my God. I was so obsessed with All Time Low. I had post. I was like, I was like, very, very obsessed with them at a point where I was like, this is concerning. Like, I really thought I was gonna marry one of them. And then, like, I obviously didn't.

B (5:54)

I was.

A (5:55)

No, I was obsessed. And I would, like, wear skinny jeans and, like, the color. Like, I would wear, like, skinny colored jeans.

B (6:00)

Where are you from?

A (6:01)

I'm from Pennsylvania.

B (6:02)

Okay.

A (6:02)

And you're from Canada.

B (6:03)

Yeah, I'm from Canada.

A (6:04)

What do you do to make it fun on tour? Like, give me an example.

B (6:07)

I like touring with my friends and, like, days off. Taking the bus to like a campsite and going camping and going and pulling up into like an RV site instead of like going to a hotel and just like sitting there staring at the ceiling like, what is my life? Seen way too many of those, way too long. Like, I just go on Amazon and I get a bunch of fun. Like, I've got a pink cooler that I've just ordered and pink chairs that'll sit outside of my bus every day. There will be beer there. I'll have my skateboards out. And then usually my bus is the cool bus because of that. And I have my beer pong table out there. And then everyone just like after the show comes my way.

A (6:47)

Do you have any, like, pre show rituals? Like, are you superstitious at all?

B (6:51)

I'm just like, mellow as fuck in the day. Because if you think about it, the show is around like 9pm which is why noon feels like super early for artists.

A (7:01)

You're even awake.

B (7:03)

I'm so sorry that this interview was at noon. I like, come walking. I got like one eye open. I'm just like, I haven't worked out I haven't had breakfast. I need to like, make sure I'm covered here. Oh my God.

A (7:16)

I'm sorry about that. Yeah, Someone came in there. Like, do you think you can lower the lights a little bit? I'm like, oh, right, she's not awake. You're literally doing this asleep. You're gonna leave and be like, what the fuck did I say?

B (7:27)

That interview, my. My time. Even though the interview is at noon, my time was like 8 o'. Clock. Glam stop. Leave the house at 10:30. I was like, can we push glam till 9?

A (7:41)

So not superstitious?

B (7:43)

Yeah, no, I think I just like, what's important is that I do take care of myself before the show.

A (7:48)

Yes. And then do the complete opposite after the show.

B (7:52)

So it's like sleep in hopefully till 3 or noon on the early side. And then like the show that is like the gym session. It's a 90 minute set at like 9 o' clock at night. So that's when I have to like, give it my all and be awake. But that is actually the flow of my body is to like wake up at night. Not a morning person. We've made that clear. Or a new person.

A (8:19)

You're like, why am I here? Can I take a quick nap? Alex, you just talk for the next.

B (8:25)

Hang on. Well, I have some pizza.

A (8:29)

No, but that makes sense though, because I like, I think that's if anyone has a nighttime job. Like, you're sleeping in super late.

B (8:36)

Bring it. It starts and then we don't go to bed till 6am because you get off stage, you're wired, you're in the adrenaline. And then like bus called buses don't leave until like whatever, three o'.

A (8:47)

Clock.

B (8:47)

So it's like after the show we like set up a barbecue, you know, have fun, hang out with the bands and all that.

A (8:54)

And party.

B (8:54)

And for me, like that tour bus, that's my home. So again, another fun Amazon order of just hello the fuck Kitty everything. I've got like 20 hello Kitty pillows in the front lounge. And I've got like hello Kitty bedding, hello Kitty towels, and everything's just pink and fun.

A (9:12)

Oh my God. I didn't even think you would be a hello Kitty girl. Yeah, I would think like maybe a lot of black.

B (9:17)

I have a hello Kitty room on my house.

A (9:21)

On your house.

B (9:22)

The tour bus is hello Kitty tour. But spent room in. At my house, I have Abram. Well, it used to be my bedroom and it's a hello Kitty bedroom.

A (9:33)

When guys came over, would they like be a Little freaked out to, like, have sex in that room.

B (9:36)

Well, I. I wasn't. There wasn't a lot of guys. Okay. Sorry.

A (9:41)

If a man.

B (9:42)

Relationship. Long relationships.

A (9:45)

Right, right, right. If a man.

B (9:46)

I mean, there was, like, a stripper pole. And the coffee in the little coffee table, like, this huge pink velvet couch full of, like, all these stuffed animal hello, kitties.

A (9:59)

Are you getting on the stripper pole?

B (10:01)

Oh, hell yeah.

A (10:01)

Wait, you're good on a stripper pole. Wait, you need to teach me. What the fuck? How did you learn to get on?

B (10:07)

You just. You just have a couple of those and wing it.

A (10:10)

You have a couple beers and you're ready to go. Wow, a new talent. I guess. If I'd asked you, like, what's a hidden talent? Would you ever say that or. No?

B (10:19)

No.

A (10:21)

Next time you go to a party and they ask you a fun fact about yourself, you're like, I can rip on a stripper pole. You're welcome. What is one of the craziest, like, fan interactions you've ever had?

B (10:31)

I got a wedding dress when I was, like, over in Korea. Bunny was thrown at me on my lap in, like, a bag. And I was like, oh, what's this? It's warm. And I, like, open it.

A (10:41)

I'm like, ah.

B (10:42)

I thought it was a cat. It was a bunny. But we took care of it, made sure it went somewhere safe. And then I had a wedding dress. And I was like, that's cool. But it's weird.

A (10:50)

Yeah. Because now that, like, woman will never see her wedding dress again.

B (10:53)

No, it was, like, for me, from a guy.

A (10:55)

Wait, what? I thought you were saying, like, a woman gave you her wedding dress to, like, take and sign. A man gave you a wedding dress?

B (11:03)

Yeah, I guess that was a super forward way of proposing.

A (11:07)

So romantic.

B (11:08)

You have that effect on people.

A (11:12)

Literally. Literally. We'll get to that. Your style. Can we talk about this for a minute? Because, again, like, when I was younger, I just remember so many moments in early 2000s, trends were dictated by you, Queen. Like, your style was and is everything. If you had to pick three essential wardrobe items that are, like, your staples, what would you pick?

B (11:38)

A big hoodie. Just, like, an oversized black hoodie like, bondage pants. And, like, military boots. Like, combat boots.

A (11:52)

Okay, so that has, like, kind of changed, because when I was younger, Avril, I remember it was the necktie.

B (11:58)

The necktie.

A (11:58)

But you don't understand, like, I would look at you and be like, oh, my, this is the coolest thing ever, that she's wearing a necktie. So I would venture into my older brother's room, but he went to, like a like, Catholic prep school. So he had ties that were like, wide as fuck and ugly and hideous. And that's the only tie I could find. And I would, like, wear it around my house with, like, a little wife beater. And I stop.

B (12:20)

That is so cute.

A (12:22)

I really thought I was doing something and I hope those photos never surface. But the necktie was iconic. And then like the little, like the sweatbands on your wrist you used to wear, which were so cool.

B (12:35)

Yeah, it's crazy. I've been thinking about the tie a lot lately. And the wristbands, the sweatbands with the skater boys star, which is like my tattoo right here. And I'll probably wear those on stage because I used to wear them all the time.

A (12:50)

All the time.

B (12:51)

Yeah. And that's so fun. Maybe I'll wear the necktie on stage.

A (12:56)

Please. Honestly, do it for me. Like, I will literally have, like a revival in my soul. I need to come do a show. I'm like, so obsessed. But that would be epic. I think everyone, anytime we see you in a tie, it just brings us back to, like, our childhood and it makes us happy.

B (13:12)

It was so crazy. Like, my first show, so I was like 17 and it was. I don't know where it was. It was in Vancouver somewhere. And it was sort of like a warm up show they were putting together for me. And it was like in like a little club and it was like the first real show. And I remember like being up in my dressing room and looking out onto the street and seeing like all the, like, fans lined up to come in. And they were, the girls were. They were dressed like me. They had on the tank, white tank top and the tie and like stick straight hair and black eyeliner. And I was like, what? I was like, this is crazy. And it, like from, like the first show, it was like, from the beginning, it was like a thing and pretty cool too, to see. Like every album, like, my image changed a bit to like, Under My Skin. My second album, I put like, black hair in and was wearing the bondage pants. And then, then all the girls, front row, like, the blonde hair with the black underneath, the bondage pants, black eyes. The third album, the Best Damn Thing, showing up the show with the. The pink streak in the hair and.

A (14:17)

Just like, I will never forget that. Trust me. I thought about doing it. My mom was like, absolutely not. Alex. I'm like, were you always, like, super confident to wear whatever you wanted to wear? Like Your whole life?

B (14:30)

Yeah, it kind of just like came together. I didn't like, think about it or anything. Like, obviously when I was younger, I was like, just dressing in whatever my mom bought. And then when I got, you know, into high school, I was like, okay, I like hoodies and skateboarding clothes. And I started skateboarding and was into like West 49 and vans and started wearing, like really baggy pants. And my parents were just like, are you gonna keep dressing like a boy? So like, when I, like, made. When I went out to New York City and was like, meeting with, like, important people and writing songs in the studio, they were kinda like, can you, like, dress up a little better? But what was awesome was when I got signed by L A Reid, I was sitting in his office, I was like 16, and he just looked at me and he was like, taking a meeting with my mom and I and he's like, you know, you have like, your own thing going on, girl. Like, usually we have like, people come in and you have to, like, figure out what your style is and we, like, help you and whatever. And he's like, you got your own thing going on. Like, you just keep doing you. And like, I think that was awesome. I'm so glad he did that. Probably, like, looking back, that did instill confidence in me, but also, like, I didn't care. I was going to dress that way anyway.

A (15:58)

Right? No, but that's like a great thing to know that someone didn't try to change you. That was probably in a position where, like, if they asked you to, I'm sure your mom and you would have looked at each other and like, fuck, like, is this what we have to do to make it in this industry?

B (16:12)

And like, normally they probably, especially, like, at that time with like all bubblegum pop was so big, they probably would have put me in something sexy, cute, pink, girly, frilly, like mid drift. And like, that wasn't not my vibe. There's definitely like, times that, like, photo shoots, I'd show up at whatever magazine to shoot and they wanted to put me in stuff that, like, I was very afraid of, like, blouses. And I was just like, nah. So I'd like, you know, you'd have to like, have a word with them. The manager would be like, you know, she has her own style and like, pull out my, like, skateboarding book bag and dump like, my ties and my spike bracelets on the floor and be like, my stuff. But we had to go back and forth. But it was like a little bit of a fight. I had to always push for that. But it worked out pretty good.

A (17:06)

It worked out phenomenally. I want to go back a little bit to your childhood because I think like when you're looking at someone so famous and so successful, it is fascinating. Like you grew up in Canada in a really small town with like 5,000 people. How would you describe your childhood like before you were famous? Bet MGM has exciting ways for you to bet on pro football and new customers can sign up for BET MGM using bonus code CHD to unlock their welcome offer and score up to $1500 back in bonus bets if they don't win their first bet. Daddy Gang get involved this football season. BETMGM and Game Sense remind you to play responsibly. See betmgm.com for terms 21/only. This promotional offer is not available in Michigan, Mississippi, New York, New Jersey, Nevada, Ontario, Pennsylvania, Puerto Rico or West Virginia. Gambling Problem Call 1-800-Gambler available in the US for New York, 877-8-Hope NY or text Hop NY 467-369 for Arizona, 1-800-Next Step for Massachusetts, 1-800-327-5050 for Iowa, 1-800-Bets off for Puerto Rico, 1-800-981-0023 subject to eligibility requirements.

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B (19:49)

Normal as fuck. And I'm, like, grateful for that because I came out at a really young age, and I'm glad that I had, like, a normal, steady, like, solid childhood. I played a lot of sports. I was on the hockey team, the guys hockey team.

A (20:08)

How the fuck did you get onto the guys hockey team?

B (20:11)

Well, I just wanted to play hockey, and it was like, the guys. There wasn't a girls league, so I was able to play from, like, novice to pee wee. And then peewee is when there's body contact. And that's when I wasn't allowed to play anymore. But then at that, by that time, I was in grade nine, like, my first year of high school, and they had a girls team in the high school, so I tried out for that and almost said, auditioned. You auditioned? I tried out for the girls team in high school, and I made it. And then I blew it by going to our first tournament out of town and getting expelled from school and kicked off out of the tournament because someone got caught drinking in the hotel room. And someone ratted her out. No, Avril. And my parents were just so mad at me. Like, it was like I, like, did drugs or something, which I've never done, by the way. And it was like I'd done something so terrible. It's like, who cares? Of course I'm away from my parents. I'm in a hotel. We're in Toronto, the big city, doing like an, you know, like an AFSA tournament. And, like, yeah, I got busted, so I had to go home. My parents were like, we're gonna send you to the Catholic school, Avril. And I was just like, oh, what have I done?

A (21:34)

Stop. Did you make friends with all the guys when you were playing with, like, guys, or were you, like, the odd man out and people would make fun of him?

B (21:40)

I was like, my whole life I've been, like, friends with guys all in school, and we would, like, get in real fights. I'm a good blocker. That was my move. I'm a blocker. Like, block the punch. And. Yeah, so I played a lot of sports. Hockey in the winter, baseball in the summer. I was a pitcher. There was a lot of, like. Because I was so into Hockey. Like, there's a lot of, like, rollerblading. So I was rollerblading around town, building forts, skateboarding and. And all that stuff. Yeah, I hung out with the guys, and then I, like, left home, had a band, lived on a tour bus with guys. And still, like, to this day, I'm just like, most of my friends are guys.

A (22:28)

Did your parents ever be like, why don't you have any girlfriends? Like, should we invite, like, Rebecca over? Like, let's try this. Let's give it a whirl, Avril. Or did they, like, not give a shit?

B (22:37)

My parents were really strict with me. Like, if I had a guy over who was just my friend. Even, like, there was no bedroom. It was, like, the middle floor. They monitored it. It was dinner. It was. But all we wanted to do anyway was run around and, like, rollerblade skateboard. Play mini hockey.

A (22:57)

I played hockey, too. And my brother. Yes.

B (23:00)

What position?

A (23:01)

I was like, well, first of all, I was like, not that great. I ended up going and playing soccer, but I was like, like, on offense. And my dad works for the NHL. Yeah. So, like, my whole life, hockey. It was. Oh, my God. We were at full.

B (23:14)

It was. Oh, my God.

A (23:15)

It was cool. But we were like. It was weird. I think in Pennsylvania, like, you're lucky. Canada, it was like, that's the sport.

B (23:21)

Yeah.

A (23:21)

But in Pennsylvania, people were like, why do you have your children playing freaking hockey? And my dad was like, it's just the best sport ever. Like, just trust us. And so we had, like, roller hockey, mini hockey in the basement on the carpet.

B (23:33)

Like, we did sticks and burn them over the stove. Yes. Oh, yeah.

A (23:37)

My God. And, like, I think people are like, what are you guys doing in your basement? We're like, we're playing mini hockey. Living our best lives, literally thriving. And it was so fun. Ever fuck with us? No.

B (23:47)

We're older.

A (23:49)

But it's cool that you played hockey because I feel like it's obviously a sport that makes you really fucking tough.

B (23:54)

It does.

A (23:55)

And you just learn to, like, basically get the shit beaten out of you on the ice. And then you're like, oh, it's normal.

B (24:00)

Day and it's freezing cold and you wake up and just skating alone is so hard. It's like gnarly cardio. And then if you were actually, like, playing and stick handling and shooting and, like, you're out there and the game is happening. Skating is its own thing.

A (24:17)

Oh, my God. I remember, like, I want. Because Matt, my husband, is from LA and I so badly just want to take him like, ice skating, even if it's like, during Christmas time around, like, the little fucking pond. Okay. Because he's so good at sports, but he does not know how to ice skate. So I'm like, watch me backwards skate. Watch me skate around. Watch me do drill the bitch.

B (24:40)

Are you awesome on skating?

A (24:41)

I'm really good.

B (24:41)

Me too.

A (24:42)

We ice skate.

B (24:44)

Yes.

A (24:45)

We're in la.

B (24:46)

Like, I can skate backwards, cross over all of it.

A (24:50)

It's like, it is a pretty good skill to have. And I feel like it's a flex when, like, a guy takes you ice skating during, like, the holidays and you're like, oh, you think I'm gonna have to hold your hand or hold on to, like, the rails the whole time? Bitch, I'm going to be holding you. Like, I know Matt's going to be falling and I'm going to be holding him. I just don't know if I want to take him because I may get the ick. So I just need to be careful.

B (25:09)

Make sure he's ready for that.

A (25:11)

No, literally. So you, like, had a pretty normal upbringing, which I'm happy you're talking about, because it's like you're playing sports.

B (25:18)

I babysat. I shoveled driveways. I mowed lawn.

A (25:22)

Oh, my God.

B (25:23)

And did the Whipper Snipper. The weed whacker Whippers flyers out.

A (25:30)

Stop.

B (25:31)

I cleaned.

A (25:32)

You did it all.

B (25:33)

I worked at a fried chicken place.

A (25:35)

How was that?

B (25:36)

And then I got fired again.

A (25:37)

Were you drinking on the job?

B (25:39)

No, I'm a really good hard worker. I actually asked requested for some time off to perform somewhere and he used it against me.

A (25:48)

Oh, my God, he must feel so fucking dumb now.

B (25:51)

And then I wrote a song about it on my first album.

A (25:53)

Wait, which one?

B (25:54)

It's called My World and that's about.

A (25:57)

The chicken shop you worked at that.

B (26:00)

Fired by a fried chicken ass. All in a small town. Napanee we.

A (26:04)

That was about him. Shut the up.

B (26:06)

And like, I heard after they, like, took the lyrics of my song and like, framed it and put it up in the store, like, yeah, I could have used the extra $20.

A (26:17)

Wait, that's fucking epic. I didn't realize that, like, now I need to go back and listen to that song again. Because sometimes when you're listening to songs, you're like, oh, did they just kind of like, make that up or like, that you literally lived that you got fired from this?

B (26:29)

I talk about my hair is actually so curly. Like, no one knows that I have a really frizzy curly hair. What I Didn't discover the flat iron until the making of my first album. So on that song, also My world, I talk about how I would braid my hair in a zillion braids and it would take me all friggin day.

A (26:51)

Are there lyrics?

B (26:52)

Cause it would take me five hours. So I would just braid my hair in little braids. Because there was no flat iron back then. Or definitely not in my small town. Right then when I came to la, I was like working on my album. My producer took me to get a blow dry and I was like, what? This is all life changing. Do you know what I have done? I used to like shower and like wash my hair and like put on a toque. Stop what you guys call a beanie in the States. A beanie just like let my hair try to dry flat. I couldn't get it flat straight.

A (27:26)

You're trying to like pin it to your head.

B (27:28)

So then she got me, my producer got me a flat iron for actually, yeah, for my birthday. And then it was, it was game over. Everyone just thinks I have stick straight hair. Like never will I ever want curly hair again.

A (27:41)

It's so straight. It's so straight. Like your first album. I remember because my hair is so naturally straight that I was like, oh my. Because so girls used to make fun of me in like middle school being like, your best friend is your straightener. And I was like, I don't own a straightener because my hair was so straight. So when I saw your first album. Album, I was like, oh my God, she's a straight hair girly. Like me. Now I'm realizing, like, average, dude, if.

B (28:02)

You saw my hair, it's like poof. It's like so curly. I hate it. But like, my friends like it.

A (28:09)

I bet it's so gorge. Like, I bet you actually look amazing. But I get when you're younger, like, anything you have, you're like, I want the opposite. I don't want this shit.

B (28:17)

But my hair is so thick. So when I do get a blow dry, it's like lasts for like a week.

A (28:22)

When I'm thinking now of how normal your upbringing was, like, what do you think people in your town thought when you started getting famous?

B (28:36)

I don't know.

A (28:38)

Like, do you think it was a surprise to people?

B (28:40)

Like, okay, so like around school. Okay, so when I was 14, I won a contest to sing on stage with Shania Twain in Ottawa. So it's like a few hours away from my small town. And I sang on stage with her. And then I came back and I was, like, famous in my high school. It was like, walking down the hallway, I was like, ah, singer girl. She's the singer girl. That's several. So everyone kind of knew me as the singer girl.

A (29:07)

You got famous at 17 years old? Yeah, like big, big famous.

B (29:11)

So I'm a high school dropout.

A (29:12)

Love, love, me too.

B (29:16)

I went to New York and I started making my first album. My friends were all doing. What are those things called? The exams. The shit I didn't have to do. Is it an exam?

A (29:26)

Like SATs?

B (29:27)

What's the thing at the end? Yeah, yeah, an exam. Yeah. I didn't have to do that.

A (29:31)

Oh, finals.

B (29:32)

I'd make fun of them and I'd be like, thank God I don't have to do this. I'm just in New York gaining 10 pounds, eating McDonald's and pizza every day. No shit. That's all my brother and I did. Cause he came to chaperone.

A (29:47)

Oh, my God.

B (29:48)

And so. Yeah. But all I was thinking at the same time was, this better work, right?

A (29:53)

Like, fuck. Because I feel like you're a quite competent person. Like, did you have any insecurities back then?

B (30:00)

No. I was like, just like tomboy. Liked hanging out with the guys, loved music. And then, you know, like, when I was. When I was younger, I was singing in church, singing at, like, the country fairs around town. That's kind of like. Those were sort of the, like, options in front of me. Then when I got into high school, so, like, 14, 15, I was, like, not really feeling these songs anymore. So I, like, went through a phase where it was like, it could have gone. You know, I was at a crossroads. It could have been like, okay, I'm not gonna sing anymore. Or it was just like. I was just like, I don't want to do these events anymore. So I started turning them down. And it was kind of like, oh, what are we doing here? And that forced me to write my own songs. So I sat in my bedroom and was, like, playing the guitar. I had no idea what I was doing. I knew one chord, but I was gonna figure it out. And so I started definitely, like, writing for sure at 14. And I know that because one of my songs I wrote. Oh, my God, really? I'm 14 years old. No, I'm not that old. That's one of the fucking lyrics in the song. So I was like, I know. I was writing by 14.

A (31:14)

That's amazing.

B (31:14)

Yeah. So. And then I got into high school, and then I discovered, like, Green Day, Noah facts, blink 182. And I was like, yes. And, like, got an electric guitar, wore it low, and just started writing my own songs. And that's kind of like, where it all shifted for me. And then sort of, like, ended up performing again and making my way to New York City, getting a record deal by, like, 16, and was so young, no one could fathom that, like, I wanted to write my own songs. So that was, like, the biggest sort of challenge on the making of the first album. And that everyone, the producers, you know, they naturally went to, like, polished and fluffy and this and that, and I was just like, no. And it was like, really? I worked with a million people on that album. And then I finally connected towards the end with a couple producers that then understood, and they sat there and listened to me and heard what I was going for. We wrote the songs together, and it was, like, a really perfect collaboration where it was like, okay, there's this young girl. She has a vision. We're gonna work with her and help her get there. And they were all extremely talented people, too, and so fought for that. Got it and developed my own sound and style and. And the rest is history.

A (32:41)

That first, like, sound and style, like, I remember I was reading somewhere you really described it as, like, pretty, like, angsty, and, like, you coming across as, like, a quite, like, chill, happy person. Like, were you actually feeling a lot of those emotions? Because, like, some of the songs are really sad. Because, trust me, I cried to them and I. When I was growing up. So, like, where were those feelings coming from?

B (33:02)

I'm a really big feeler, and I feel everything. And I've gone through, you know, I've obviously experienced all different types of emotion. When you're in high school, when you're going in that age, you know, you're really trying to, like. You're, like, feeling having a crush for the first time or being disappointed, feeling neglected, or, like, being vulnerable and opening your heart to someone. Your first breakup and there. And the excitement of something new. There's so much to, like, tap into and to write about. I was never really thinking about it. It would probably just end up being like. Like, that day, what I was feeling. There's definitely, like, songs like Losing Grip. I'm often, like. I listen to the lyrics and I'm like. And I knew it when I was writing them. Like, where's this coming from? Is this my past life?

A (33:55)

Your parents ever like, what the. Avril, are you okay?

B (33:58)

I. I'm not really, but they were. They were like. They didn't like, the swearing. They were A little like, you know, the clothes and da, da, da. But, like, they get it. My mom, when I was 2, she was like. She knew I was gonna be a singer. Like, came home from church, she's like, She's. Holy shit. Holy God. She's like. She's like, oh, came home, she said, I came home from church singing jesus loves me or Jesus loves you. And she's like, oh, my God, she can sing. And so my parents were, like, so supportive and, like, obviously wouldn't be here without that support.

A (34:31)

Were you always confident getting on a stage? Like, are you? Like, I feel like you're not. You were. You did. Yeah. Cause, like, I. I always have this.

B (34:40)

Weird dream, though, where I'm on stage and I can't remember the words. Why have I been doing that lately?

A (34:46)

Wait, stop.

B (34:47)

But no, I'm confident on stage.

A (34:48)

It's like, you never even thought about it. It's like, nothing. Yeah. That's incredible.

B (34:53)

And when. Okay. And then when I sang with Shania on stage, it was in front of, like, 20,000 people in this arena. Like, packed. I was 14, and I did all I felt, like, felt like, overcome. My whole body was like. Like, walked out on stage, and I was just like, oh, my gosh. Like, I really. This is what I really want, like, for me. And then, like, two years later, three years later, I sold out that arena and played my own show.

A (35:19)

Do you remember, like, how you felt?

B (35:21)

I was like, this is crazy. This is insane.

A (35:24)

And when you would have those moments of, like, holy, like, would you turn to, like, your mom? Like, who was your go to person to, like, freak out with?

B (35:30)

I still, like, have them all the time.

A (35:33)

Wow.

B (35:33)

Just, like, if I'm just, like, walking. I hear myself, like, out in public, and I'm like. I was gonna say, and I'm in a mall, and then I hear myself, but I'm not really in a mall. I don't know where I am. Maybe it's an outdoor mall. I don't know. Wherever I am, and I hear myself on the radio, like, it's. It's definitely like, damn, bitch, you made it. Like, such a small town. No connections. I don't know how I did it. It was supposed to happen. Obviously, a lot of hard work, but.

A (36:03)

It'S really interesting to hear you talking about your songwriting process because you're so talented.

B (36:07)

Thanks.

A (36:08)

And hearing you be like, I'm writing. Losing Grip. And I'm literally like, what the fuck am I? Where did I. Did I experience this? Like, nobody's home. Like, it's Right.

B (36:18)

Well, I kind of felt that way too. But like, I was also like, okay, I'm gonna write this about this, like, girl that I know. Or like, the words sort of start and I'm like, oh, I'm gonna take it in this direction. And it's not about me. And I'm tapping into, like, what I know somebody else went through.

A (36:33)

Interesting.

B (36:34)

Yeah.

A (36:34)

How did you feel about all the fame and attention?

B (36:37)

I think I was fine with it. And like, my whole life is, like, weird because of it. Like, everything I do, you're in public, so you just like, do weird things. Like there's people walking, so you just kind of turn or like, you're not just. Not just gonna, like, stand there, you know, it's like, I mean, if I was like, in an airport waiting for like, a suitcase, you know, you're gonna like, kind of stand behind the, like, pillar. You're not just gonna stand. It's all like that. And it never bugged me or anything. I just like, I got it. I was like, okay, this is how things go now.

A (37:06)

That's a really healthy way to look at it. Because I feel like that's a unique perspective.

B (37:11)

Yeah.

A (37:11)

Like, I feel like a lot of people feel like they don't have autonomy over their life once they get famous. And you're like, chillin.

B (37:19)

Like, I get followed every time. Not every time, but I get followed when I leave my house. I don't know how. I try to, like, go different ways and stuff like that. And so, like, I like to go to the grocery store and I like to do all that stuff, but I have to be in the headspace to, like, energetically, Energetically handle it, which I'm totally fine with too. Like, really? Do you really want your picture taken like this? If you walk out right now, are you okay with it? You know what I mean? It's like, you have to think about that.

A (37:46)

That's. I mean, I am really pleased by your answer. Like, there is no right or wrong answer. Like, I've had musicians sit here and be like, I'm such an introvert. It's really hard. And like, I hate it. And I wish I could just write songs and upload it and never be in public. That's awesome to know that you're someone that's like, I don't really care. It's actually kind of chill.

B (38:04)

It is what it is. And like, I. I learned it and how to move with it. And it's like, I would never complain about it because what I get to do is awesome. And that's part of it. Like, how fucking cool is that that like, people know who I am? That means my music got heard.

A (38:18)

So true. Listen, I know it's freezing out there. I know the sun is setting atrociously early. I get it, okay? But hear me out. Just because you have to throw on a couple extra layers does not mean you can't live your best lives and crack a few claws with your friends. Do you hear me, tiny gang? Okay, that means snuggling up in a booth at your favorite dive bar, warming up in the crowd of an epic concert, or having your friends over to watch sports. Listen, seriously, the best winter nights are really just about doing something together. And guess what I'm going to be holding when I'm doing that? A claw. Thank you, White claw. I have stocked my entire drink fridge, my bevy fridge, with white claws. Because I know it is a surefire way to have everyone getting whatever they want because you got all the flavors and then some. So, daddy gang, you know the drill. Pick up a pack from your favorite local spot and grab life by the claw with your favorite flavor this winter. Please drink responsibly. Hard seltzer with flavors. White Cloth Seltzer Works Chicago, Illinois Call Her Daddy is brought to you by T Mobile Daddies. I'm starting to suspect that a night in is the new nightlife. Okay? This is my life now. Snacks, comfy clothes. I want to romanticize doing absolutely nothing. And on those nights when I'm staying in, T mobile has me covered with value that keeps on stacking up the more I use it. Like hi. Streaming benefits and snack perks that truly deliver. Guys, the math is mathing, okay? There are so many, many perks and benefits. T mobile is basically making staying in a full blown lifestyle powered by carbs and content. I am a T mobile Stan, okay? Anyone that makes me feel not only better but great about staying in. Yeah. I love you T mobile. Okay? And if you have T Mobile like I do, you won't believe how good staying in can be. Check it out@t mobile.com magenta Status Disclaimer Streaming benefits included. While you maintain a qualifying experience beyond plan line, what do you think people, if anything like misunderstood about you from your career and like you growing up in the spotlight.

B (40:55)

So I think when people meet me like I think they're oh my God, you're so nice. You're so sweet. No, I found I like ask people too. Like guys are like, like here's like, like more like I don't know what the word is, like soft, like feminine more than girly or something. I think people, because of like my maybe my music videos think I'm like like all the time. I'm not. I'm actually like, well, what do you think? What is your take on it?

A (41:30)

I mean, I. Yeah, I mean just now trying to think about it because I think when you were younger, I really. And I was younger, I channeled like, oh, this girl's sad and angry. Like.

B (41:43)

Because I know it was like angry Avril.

A (41:46)

Yeah. And I think that was like. But now it's kind of really incredible to like get to sit across from you and hear you be like some of these songs I was writing, like there was a girl I knew and I was like writing about her and then like it really wasn't that deep. Like my boss fired me from my chicken spot and so I'm like, you. I wish I got my extra 20 in my new my other paycheck. Like I think it's. I do think though I don't take back though. Like I loved how deep those songs were and NC they were because I felt like a lot of people needed that. That type of music back then. Like I think you're right. There was so much like pop and princess and it was like like let's shake our bodies and be. And I'm like, I don't. My. My crush that doesn't even know I exist broke up with me and he didn't even know he broke up with me but he didn't look at me today. So I'm heartbroken and I'm gonn to losing grip and I'm gonna fucking cry. I needed that. Okay, I don't need like a shake your body and dance and be happy. Sure, maybe on a Friday night but like I in that era needed that depressing esque music up to say, yeah, but it's nice to know you weren't depressed.

B (42:50)

I guess. I mean, I mean I went through it all and I was like a teenager and feeling the feels and I was definitely like in like emo and like going through it and like feeling it all. And it's like I don't want to write a song about being happy because it's gonna be kind of like cheesy and like not that cool. Kind of go and do that right now where I'm like, I don't know what to write about because like it's just like that's the thing. It's like an intense emotion. Like Head above water was like A really dark, heavy song for me. Like kind of like near death experience. Like one of the hardest things I've ever gone through in my life.

A (43:28)

Life.

B (43:29)

But like, real easy to write about. It's literally like laying there in bed. Like I'm dying and I'm accepting it. Oh, there's a song and I literally grab my phone and like the song like channels through me.

A (43:45)

Are you referencing when you got sick?

B (43:47)

Yeah.

A (43:48)

Okay. And that was for like kind of like what, two plus years of your life? You were like in bed?

B (43:53)

Yeah, it was like a. It was kind of like bedridden for a couple years. And like. And then like, you know, you gotta get like stronger coming out of that. And that's something that like rocks you pretty hard. But like, I'm really grateful to be like on the other, other end of that. And so that was like a really in. I'll think twice about riding the dirt bikes out in the woods on the east coast next time.

A (44:16)

Because it was lime season.

B (44:17)

Yes. All I did was like out outside and it's like, you know.

A (44:22)

But I get what you're saying. You're like. Then you're laying there and you're like, yeah, I can write a depressing song right now because this fucking sucks. But it's like waves of emotion that you're like tuning into.

B (44:30)

And I've gone through a lot in my life in love. Like tons of ups and downs. And I've definitely written the angry songs and the sad songs and going through something hard in life. It's easy to sit down at the piano. Especially that instrument really pulls it out of me. But unlike my last album, Love Sucks, it was much lighter. Even though it was like little boy bashing and poking fun at love and stuff. I kind of putting a twist on my songs now where it's like, it's like, it's funny. I'm just rolling my eyes at myself for it not working out again or something and just having fun with it. I don't like, I'm in a phase in a place right now, today where I'm writing. I don't really like, want it to be like that dark. I say that means nothing at all. Because tomorrow I could write. Go write a boohoo song.

A (45:37)

I think that's something that I just.

B (45:38)

Never know, like with. It's like when I. When I'm in the kitchen and I'm cooking, I don't know what I'm cooking. And it turns into what it turns into. I got a canvas. I love to paint. I Have no idea what I'm doing. I'm like, oh, well, looks cool. That can go on the wall. That one. Not so much.

A (45:52)

Total no.

B (45:53)

When you write a song sometimes, like you can be intentional with an album, go in and be like, this is my vibe. Or you can just like wing it, right and just see what kind of comes out and gets put together.

A (46:05)

I think that some people may not know. Like, I love that you said, like, when you walked into those meetings, people were like, how is like a 15, 6 year old, 16 year old girl trying to write? Like, here, let us give you writers and like, just go sing, sweetie. And I think you're such an incredible. I know you're such an incredible writer that, like, I know one of the fun facts online that everyone still can't get over is that you wrote Breakaway for Kelly Clarkson. And that's like a perfect example of, like, you're so talented. Do you remember writing that song? And like, was it about a heartbreak?

B (46:36)

The lyric used to be, I grew up in a small town and when the snow would fall down, I would just stare out my window.

A (46:43)

Oh my God.

B (46:44)

I'm actually gonna probably will perform that Breakaway, Kelly Clarkson's Breakaway on the greatest hits tour.

A (46:51)

That would be fucking amazing. But how did you decide to get rid of it?

B (46:57)

I just, like, wasn't feeling it. And I'm so glad it went to her. She killed it. It was a massive hit for her. And yeah, it's kind of like just like growing, being from a small town and taking a chance and like going into the big city and going after your dream.

A (47:14)

There is a crazy rumor out there about you that I obviously have to ask about. And I always ask people when they come on my show, like, oh, what's the craziest rumor that you've ever heard about yourself? I guess I could just first ask you, like, what would you answer before I ask you something?

B (47:27)

Oh, yeah, that one. I know what you're talking about. I mean, it's just funny to me. Like, on like one end, everyone's like, oh my God, you look the exact same. You haven't aged a day. But then other people are like, you know, there's a conspiracy theory that I'm not me.

A (47:49)

There is a cool.

B (47:55)

Honestly, it's not that bad. It could be worse, right? Like, I feel like I got a good one.

A (47:59)

But is it okay?

B (48:00)

I don't think it's like negative or anything. Like, creepy.

A (48:04)

It's a. Avril, this conspiracy theory about you is a little creepy. Come on.

B (48:09)

Oh, no, Yeah, I don't know. It could be worse.

A (48:12)

It could. Yeah. No, you could be getting, like, online books.

B (48:17)

I am me. It's so dumb.

A (48:20)

To people that don't understand. Just to give people context, there's a conspiracy theory that Avril Lavigne is no longer with us, and there is a woman named Melissa who took over. And you, I can't even say, seriously, you sitting across from me, you are Melissa. And there are like. Like, conspiracy theories that run so deep. Like, does it annoy you that there will be people that comment on this episode being like, that's Melissa. That's not.

B (48:45)

When did it start? My second album? Like, I don't even know. Like, I think, like, from the beginning. Ish second album. I don't know.

A (48:52)

And why do you think people think that?

B (48:54)

I think that they've done that with other artists. I'm not the only one. I think, like, other people have that.

A (49:00)

I feel like yours is, like, really prominent.

B (49:01)

Oh. I mean, I feel like you might.

A (49:04)

Believe that I'm honestly the one that started the conspiracy. I'm one of those freak bloggers that's, like, I went undercover to interview Melissa. Oh, my God. No. But it's. It's crazy. And I just have empathy for you. But it's good again to know you don't give a where people are like, oh, Melissa showed up today. And I'm like. I remember, like, being like, what are people talking about? And then I went and started looking and, like, oh, people are insane. So you don't care? We're over it. Okay. So your name is Avril Lavigne. Yeah.

B (49:39)

I knew you half believed it.

A (49:43)

I'm telling you. What's crazy is you haven't aged. I'm staring at you and, like, I'm picturing you with your, like, auburn hair, and I'm like, oh, my God. You literally look the same from when you were younger. You're beautiful. Let's talk about your love life. Your career exploded when you were so young. Like, were you still able to go on dates with guys and then not be freaked out by yourself?

B (50:02)

I never really did the dating thing. I was always, like, in a pretty major relationship.

A (50:07)

You're a relationship girl?

B (50:09)

Yeah.

A (50:10)

What are you, like, in a relationship?

B (50:11)

I'm fucking awesome. I would date me.

A (50:18)

I love that.

B (50:20)

I cook. I'm a really big cook. Really big into, like, the house and decorating, and I have, like, a lot of fun with that. So. Yeah, I'd always have people over at my house, throw parties, cook big, huge dinners at the dining room table. I'm gonna order that keg sand. There's going to be a full bar. We are going to have beer pong and stay up until the sun comes up. It's gonna be a good time.

A (50:45)

And there will be hello Kitty instrumentals.

B (50:47)

And there will be matching tattoos involved. All of my tattoos were drunk tattoos, and, like, they'd be boring if I was sober.

A (50:55)

All of them are drunk.

B (50:57)

So let's finish this beer, and then we'll call my tattoo art. We'll go to Shamrock on Sunset. Okay.

A (51:03)

So all these are drunk tattoos?

B (51:05)

Mm. Yeah. Like, the Sk8er Boy star was my first tattoo. I was 19, and then.

A (51:11)

Do your parents have tattoos?

B (51:13)

All my tattoos are. Oh, I have tattoos on my hips. No. I think I'm the only one in the family, really, with a bunch of tattoos. My dad had a couple.

A (51:23)

Okay. What is the hardest lesson you've ever learned about love?

B (51:28)

I mean, I definitely went through my, like, jaded phase with my previous album called Love Sucks, and I had gone into a place of. All right, I'm just gonna, like, focus on myself. I'm gonna move to Malibu. I'm gonna build my own life for me, and I'm not gonna, like, wait for a guy or rely on a guy to, like, do that. And I definitely felt like I had the wind knocked out of me. I had been through, like, enough, and it was definitely, like, I was in a place of, like, never trust a guy again. And just, like, you're gonna have to, like, rely on yourself. But I didn't feel that way today, thankfully.

A (52:19)

That's amazing. Yeah. Have you ever been cheated on?

B (52:21)

Have I been with a male before? Then the answer is yes. As much as anyone's ever me over, which has happened a ton. I've always just, like, been the classy and taken the high road and kept. Kept it to myself.

A (52:39)

I appreciate that. I think a lot of people stay in things because they're, like, nervous to start over. I think that's, like, a really normal feeling, especially for women. It's like, yeah, people are fearful. Fearful. Do you have any advice of, like, how to know when to move on and, like, how to get yourself out of something that's, like, maybe comfortable, but, you know, you need to, like, be on your own and be single.

B (53:03)

It's hard when you're in something because, like, you're in it, so, you know, it's a big deal to leave a relationship to. To change is hard to have to step out. It's. It requires a lot. You know, and some people can't. You can't see like that clearly. It's like always easier once you're on the other end. But if you're not happy, you're never gonna be happy. And life is short and you should just really get out as soon as possible so you can move on and then have a better future for yourself. Some people like to have something that they're leaving and going to, and sometimes you have to take that leap of faith and just trust that if you're not happy, it's not a healthy relationship, it's not a good situation just to get out. And it's okay to have like, time on your own in between if you need it. And you know, just believe and hope that something greater is out there for you. And if not, you're better off on your own than someone draining the fuck out of you.

A (54:06)

Facts. Thank you. Are you seeing anyone right now? Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Anytime Fitness. Okay, here's the thing. I always want my new year resolution to be hit the gym, do the thing, get into it. You know what I mean? But I promise myself this year I'm actually going to do it. And so if you're actively pursuing your goal to be fit and strong, not just for bigger muscles, but for a bigger, better life, Anytime Fitness has everything you need to do just that. The right equipment Easy Anytime access to the world's largest network of gyms. Trendy workouts not really working out. At Anytime Fitness, you can get a customized workout plan based on your biometric data. You'll get a personalized training, nutrition and recovery plan tailored to your body, strength and goals. Plus expert coaching anytime anywhere through the Anytime Fitness app. Enjoy 24. 7 access to the world's largest network of gyms. All equipped to help you level up your strength and your life. So get a scan and make a plan at Anytime Fitness. Visit anytime fitness.com to get started. This is an ad by BetterHelp. Okay, I am going into 2026 honestly feeling lighter, I would say, than maybe most years. And I think it's because of the work that I have put in on myself and my relationships with my family. A new year is a new opportunity to feel lighter and you don't have to become a whole new person to do it, obviously. But signing up for therapy with Better Help can shine a light on what has been weighing you down and illuminate possibilities for the year ahead. Daddy Gang Better Help handles the initial therapist matching work for you, right? So you just take a short Questionnaire to share your needs and preferences. And thanks to Better Help's industry leading match fulfillment rate, they usually get your match right the first time. And if your match isn't the right fit, switching to a different therapist is easy. Let Better Help provide you an unbiased perspective on your life so you can head into the new year taking only what truly serves you. You can't step into a lighter version of your yourself without leaving behind what's been weighing you down. Therapy can help you clear space. Sign up and get 10 off@betterhelp.com Daddy. That's better. H lp.com Daddy. Now I know even if you were, you're never gonna tell me. Maybe. Okay, what do you look for in a partner?

B (56:57)

Do you remember the cheers?

A (56:59)

Oh, kind of. Okay, let's try it again. You're avoiding my question. Okay, here.

B (57:07)

Tops crisscross. Okay, do it again.

A (57:09)

Do it again. Okay, tops, bottoms. Bottoms.

B (57:13)

Tops, crisscross.

A (57:15)

Okay, that's pretty good.

B (57:18)

And are you a beer drinker?

A (57:20)

I am. When I'm like, whether I'm like outside for summer, like, I'm not drinking beer usually if it's like winter, but if it's like summer, I like to drink it. Like with Matt. If I'm sitting outside with my dogs, like, it's like a chill drink. If I'm like, oh, I don't want to be drinking tequila tonight, I will drink beer. And also in college, are you kidding me? I was drinking Natties like a freak. And like, it was bad. And beer bonging and everything.

B (57:46)

So like, any day, anytime, anytime in California, you could be beer drinker.

A (57:51)

Absolutely. Exactly.

B (57:52)

Pennsylvania, you should come to my house in Malibu. We'll have a beer. We'll have a beer and play beer pong.

A (57:57)

And you'll answer some of my questions off camera. Yeah.

B (58:01)

Oh, honey, if you only knew.

A (58:05)

You're giving us blue balls. Okay, what do you. Okay, so you may be seeing someone. What do you look for in a partner?

B (58:15)

So I think the most important thing is finding someone that you're compatible with because you could be two different great people. But if you're not compatible, you're not going to get along. So, like, you're going to argue. So compatibility, obviously, it all just sounds cliche. Someone that is trustworthy. Because if you don't have that, you're just never going to feel grounded in the relationship and you're going to be spinning. So that's just not healthy. I'm looking for, you know, I. A healthy relationship is ideal.

A (58:49)

Duh.

B (58:49)

Yeah, but like do we really have to say these things are so simple and cliche and basic, but that's what you need.

A (58:56)

No, it's true.

B (58:57)

Compatibility, trust.

A (58:59)

Like, do you have a type?

B (59:00)

I don't think I have a type, but, like, someone who's at least, like. I think someone who's like me, who's, like, sporty, got a little rough around the edges, likes to have a good time, but is like, like, you know, a solid. I need someone who's, like, a solid that I can lean on to.

A (59:17)

Yeah. Oh, my God. Would you ever date, like, an athlete? What about a hockey player? No, you're like, they're too. No. What about a guy from Canada that's on the. In the NHL? Come on. Wait, that's fucking perfect. No, we're done with the rappers. Did you ever date Tyga? You're like, get out of here. Wait. Does it annoy you that every time you upload something with Tyga, people are like, is this your announcement that you're dating or you don't care?

B (59:48)

Like, I didn't Google myself. Is that what it says?

A (59:51)

Yes, Melissa, it says you really believe it. I promise. I don't. What does it take for a guy to impress you on a first date?

B (60:03)

I think I've changed a lot and my expectations and what I am looking for because I've, like, you know, learned through my experiences and just, you know, I'm into something that's just like, stable, healthy, fun, just well rounded.

A (60:23)

Yeah. What?

B (60:27)

Like, this shit just sounds super cheesy. That's why I don't write love songs.

A (60:34)

Avril, this is good. This is like therapy. Like, you can totally be happy and say happy thoughts, but then, like, please keep writing bangers that, like, make me cry. Although, like, girlfriend was like, not pop. Well, that was actually not happy.

B (60:50)

It was just, like, sassy and cocky. I don't like your girlfriend. I think you need a new one. I could be your girlfriend.

A (60:57)

Oh, my God.

B (60:57)

I wrote that fucking song in two minutes. That chorus, literally two minutes. I was like, putting my book bag on, leaving the studio. It was like 11 o' clock at night. And I was like, play me a riff. Because we were borrowing. We had this amazing Les Paul and I was talking to Luke and I was like, yo, play me something like punk rock right now. And he's like, darren. And I was like, hey, you. I don't like a girlfriend. And he's like. And we're like, no way. And he's like, think you need a new one? And I was like, hey, You. I could be a girlfriend. Literally. He puts the drums to it. Two minutes. Wrote that, put it on a cd. I got a cd, put it in my car, and I took it home. I was like, this is gonna be the song of the summer.

A (61:40)

It was.

B (61:41)

And I knew it. And my body has done that to me. Like, with my happy ending. I sent. We were in the studio, made the song. I came in after I was done singing it, sat down, they played me the song. And I was like, I just got this entire feeling over my body, and I just like, I can't explain it. I was like. It was like. I knew it was big, but I wasn't like, this is a hit. Like, I didn't like, talk like that, but I was like, this is gonna be. Like, I could feel it. Like, I knew it was gonna be a big song for me. The same with Complicated. Laying in. In the grass in California. One of my first trips, and around the orange trees with writing with Lauren. And we're like, working on this song. And I just remember, like, sitting on the floor and I'm like, I hear this on the radio. Like, I have, like, feelings with, like, some of my big songs.

A (62:35)

Do you remember?

B (62:36)

I never had that feeling with a song that didn't like, that's wild.

A (62:41)

Yeah.

B (62:41)

Go to number one.

A (62:42)

When you came up with Complicated, was that one where you were actually, like, experiencing it in your life or you were just like. I just was kind of like. It just felt right. And I, like, came up with this verse and it worked.

B (62:51)

I would had like a couple weeks or a month with the Matrix, and Lauren and I were just like, getting blow dries and, like, getting cupcakes at Ralph's and, like, sitting in the backyard and just talking. I was just like, you know, like, I love skater boys, and this is the only type of guy I'm attracted to. I will literally walk down the street and I see someone wearing big fat skate shoes, and I will look twice. So it's like our conversations and then them as a team, working musically on stuff and us all getting together and just Complicated. Skater boy, I'm with you. Those are the singles off the first album.

A (63:31)

Where were you when you wrote I'm with you?

B (63:32)

We were sitting on the piano.

A (63:34)

It was like, that one's horrible.

B (63:36)

That was like one of those days where you're, like, getting in touch with the sad. Like, more like depressed, like, self. And that's. That's okay. And, you know, people, you know, really connected with that song. And still to this day, that's like, one of my favorite songs to perform live. It's fucking powerful. Like, Even to me, 22 years later, I play that fucking shit on stage. I'm seeing people, like, we're going for. From, like, all the pop rock songs. Everyone's, like, fist pumping and, like, losing their shit. I go into that tears. People, like, moved, and it's like, you see all the different emotions. And that's why writing is important to me, because I'm so connected to the songs. I think there's something with, like, my me being, like, super authentic in the way that, like, I dressed and, like, wrote the songs and just the way I was and didn't give a fuck and wasn't calculated and it was all. And then people really, like, like, were attracted to that and. And, like, connected with that.

A (64:38)

Well, yeah, because when you look at someone in the industry, you can literally tell, like, and. And I'm not being, like, rude. It's just obvious when someone has been, like, constructed by, like, these dance moves and this song and this, this. I'm like, you didn't write that song. You wouldn't wear that. If a stylist, like, the stylist put that on you, you can tell, like, you've been yourself since day one and you've stuck up for what you believe in. Literally, from the fashion to your writing, to your sound to your look. Like, like, thank God we got you a straightener. Now you're happy. I want to see your glitter.

B (65:09)

I didn't want to think about what I was wearing today, and I was like, oh, my God. You have this really cool, like, sweat line. It's called Unwell. Yeah, that's so cool. I was like, oh, yeah. I just want to, like, pull up and, like, wear sweats. And instead I just wore the, like, shirt I was, like, wearing the night before. I literally been wearing this T shirt for two days.

A (65:24)

I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. I know, because when I thought you were going to wear sweats, I was like, oh, my God, I would totally give you sweats, but this outfit is so cute.

B (65:33)

I will put the sweats on and go home and veg in them for three days.

A (65:37)

No, Avril, I just want to say thank you for coming because, like, I had no idea what to expect. Obviously meeting you, I was, like, obviously hoping that we would hit it off because, again, like, I'm such a huge fan. But it's fascinating and it was incredible to meet you and to, like, listen to where you came from and your upbringing and your story and, like, how talented you are. Like, the way that. I'm sorry. Like, I could listen to you for 10 more hours, talk about your songwriting process, because, again, like, we don't see that that often nowadays. I feel like a lot of people are just, like, very manufactured, and you are such an artist from the start to finish. I think this tour and this album is, like, I'm freaking out about it, so I can imagine all of your other friends or fans are also freaking. What do you hope they take away from this tour when they come?

B (66:26)

It's just like, for the fans that have been with me from day one, it's just like. Like, even for myself, it's just all the years and all the different eras and all the different phases in our. In our lives, from, like, high school to this date to that date and connecting with the songs and, like, you hear a song, and it takes you back. I even hear, like, one of my songs, and it takes me back to, like, that time of my life. It's like, it's been, you know, so long. It's been 22 years, and I feel like I have, like, another 22 ahead of me, but. But it's a journey of our lives. It, like, takes us back to high school, college, like, this phase, that phase, that relationship, this summer, that summer. And that's like, the power and beauty in music is, like. It can take you right back there. You can feel it all over again. I think it's just, like, a celebration of life, our lives, and remembering, like, all the good times, and music does that. And I think the shows are going to be, like, super fun. I'm stoked to be going back out on tour. My seventh, seventh world tour. And I'm, like, so grateful to, like, be from a tiny little town, you know, playing hockey and skateboarding, and to have been able to, like, write music and to have it be successful internationally and to have, like, to still be doing my thing today. I'm, like, looking forward to, like, growing, like, creatively and dipping my toes in and to. In the, you know, other creative waters and doing film and, like, turning skater boy into a movie and, like, you know, all that other stuff. So I'm super grateful. But I just want everybody to have a good time, and most importantly, I want to have a good time.

A (68:05)

Last question. What are the top three favorite songs for you that you're going to be performing? Like, if you had to pick my own song. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When you're going out there from the album and on this tour, like, what are your top three favorites to perform if you had to pick. I know that's hard.

B (68:18)

Well, it's funny cause there's no new songs, right? So, like, I definitely want to bring a cover song in. And I recently just met up with the Green Day Boys and gave them an award at the iHeart Awards. And it's like seeing them again, I was like, these guys are cool. Like, Dookie was one of the first CDs like my brother and I had. And like, they're celebrating that right now. And so, like, I definitely want to do a Green Day cover. And girlfriend is really fun. I love. I'm with you. My happy ending. So good. And of course, skater boy.

A (68:57)

Skater boy. Boom. Avril, thank you so much.

B (69:00)

And maybe I'll put the tie on for you.

A (69:01)

Please send me a fucking picture.

B (69:04)

And you have to come out to the LA show.

A (69:06)

Please. Oh, my. That's when you're gonna wear it. Please, like, literally. Please, like, make me feel so special.

B (69:12)

But you and your hubby should come to the show.

A (69:13)

Oh, my God, we would love to. I would love to come. Thank you for coming on the show. You can go to bed now. I love you. Call her. Daddy is brought to you by Alka Seltzer Plus. Life's already messy. Enough drama, dating, working a cold or flu. We do not have time for that. Alka Seltzer plus effervescent tablets are designed to deliver fast cold and flu relief. Just drop the two tablets in water and hear those bubbles bursting into action. Instantly ready to start providing cold and flu relief fast. Next time a cold or flu strikes, reach for Alka Seltzer plus cold and flu effervescent tablets. Nothing works faster for cold and flu symptom relief. Among oral OTC products, use as directed.

B (70:12)

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A (70:18)

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B (70:21)

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A (70:25)

And when it's go time, your 11.3-inch diagonal touchscreen's got the playbook, the playlist, and the tech to stay a step ahead.

B (70:33)

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A (70:34)

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B (70:37)

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A (70:38)

Let's drive. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of angie. One thing I've learned is that you buy a house, but you make it a home. And for decades, Angie's helped millions of homeowners hire skilled pros for the projects that matter. Get all your jobs done well@angie.com.