Denmark's Vaccine Lessons for America

Summary

Chasing Life – "Denmark’s Vaccine Lessons for America" (March 3, 2026)

Episode Overview

This episode of Chasing Life with CNN reporters and Dr. Sanjay Gupta explores the motivations and challenges behind the recent overhaul of the U.S. childhood vaccine schedule, which now recommends fewer vaccines for most American children. Using Denmark—a nation with among the fewest mandatory childhood vaccines and one of the world’s most robust, trusted healthcare systems—as a model, the episode investigates whether adopting Denmark’s approach is feasible or effective for the United States. Through interviews with Danish parents, doctors, and data experts, the episode uncovers the cultural, social, and political factors underpinning Denmark’s vaccine success—raising thoughtful questions about trust, healthcare infrastructure, and national attitudes.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The U.S. Shift Toward a Danish Model

• Background: The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services recently reduced its recommended childhood vaccine schedule, aiming to model after countries like Denmark (00:02–02:09).
• Motivation: The hope is that fewer vaccines might increase public trust and vaccine uptake, addressing growing skepticism in the U.S.
• Comparison: The new U.S. schedule more closely resembles Denmark’s, which routinely vaccinates against 10 diseases (vs. 17 previously recommended in the U.S.).

2. Parent Perspectives and Healthcare Experience in Denmark

• Voluntary Uptake: In Denmark, vaccination is a voluntary but widely accepted choice, built on trust in the healthcare system.
• Parental Confidence: Edith, a new Danish mother, shares, “If they advise it, I would take it,” reflecting the default position of trust (03:33, Edith).
• Healthcare Benefits: Danish parents do not face medical bills for childbirth or vaccination, highlighting the advantages of universal health care (03:17–03:29).

3. Disease Dynamics and Public Health Needs

• Divergent Health Risks: Some diseases (e.g., hepatitis B) are rarer in Denmark than in the U.S., explaining differences in recommended vaccines (04:11–04:54).
• Essential Insight: Danish experts caution that vaccine schedules should reflect local health needs, not just numerical targets.

4. The Central Role of Trust

• Systemic Trust: Denmark ranks near the top globally in public trust; the U.S. ranks last among advanced economies, with only 28% trusting the government (07:00).
• Expert View: Dr. Jens Lundgren, vaccine policy advisor, states:

  "You cannot just take what has been carefully thought through in one geographical location and just extrapolate that and generalize that." (05:37, Dr. Jens Lundgren)
  "You want to have the right vaccines for the public health that you have in your population… That's just common sense." (05:58, Dr. Jens Lundgren)

• Underlying Mechanism:

  “We have come to realize that it’s entirely based on trust. The trust parents need to trust when we come with a new vaccine into the program.” (06:42, Dr. Jens Lundgren)

5. Social Supports and System Differences

• Newborn and Family Support: Danish families benefit from generous paid parental leave and regular home health nurse visits (10:02–10:13).

  “So my first two parental leaves were 12 months each with full payment.” (10:05, Home Health Nurse)

• Community Bonds: Systematic community support and tight-knit social structures reinforce trust in public health recommendations (12:18–12:21).
• Parental Perspective:

  “I do believe it benefits me as a parent…I basically trust the system, right, that they have decided it for me and it works.” (10:43, Home Health Nurse)

6. Data Infrastructure as a “Superpower”

• Centralized Records: Denmark’s National Serum Institute tracks all vaccinations and disease incidence in a unified database, facilitating outbreak prediction and prevention (11:22–12:12).

  “Whenever someone is vaccinated, it goes into one database... it’s quite doable to link all this together.” (11:41, SSI Data Expert)

• Cultural Acceptance: While Americans might be uncomfortable with this level of data integration, Danes accept it as a normal and effective aspect of their health system.

7. Reflections: Can Denmark’s Model Work in the U.S.?

• Not a One-to-One Model: Experts and parents agree that Denmark’s smaller size, homogeneity, and high trust enable a different approach than what may be workable in a more diverse, skeptical U.S. context (10:43–11:22).
• Trust Over Numbers: Danish parents group interviewed unanimously express confidence in their system, indicating that simply changing the number of vaccines is unlikely to rebuild trust without broader cultural shifts (12:30–13:01).
• Final Thought:

  “We have so much trust in the system that if they say yes, then I would do it. I wouldn’t understand why there wouldn’t be trust. I think it would be the entire system that would need to be looked at.” (13:42, Edith)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Dr. Jens Lundgren on U.S. Emulation of Denmark:
  “You cannot just take what has been carefully thought through in one geographical location and just extrapolate that and generalize that.” (05:37)

• On Local Needs: “You want to have the right vaccines for the public health that you have in your population. I mean, that’s just common sense.” (05:58)

• On Trust as the Core Issue:
  “We have come to realize that it’s entirely based on trust. The trust parents need to trust when we come with a new vaccine into the program.” (06:42)

• Danish Parental Perspective:
  “If they advise it, I would take it.” (03:33, Edith)

• Home Health Nurse on Parental Leave:
  “My first two parental leaves were 12 months each with full payment.” (10:05)

• On System Dependence:
  “I basically trust the system, right, that they have decided it for me and it works.” (10:43, Home Health Nurse)

• Tracking as Superpower:
  “The underlying superpower comes from the Social Security number introduction in the 1960s. … It’s quite doable to link all this together.” (11:41, SSI Data Expert)

• Danes’ Group Trust:
  [All mothers present raise their hands in favor of trusting the vaccine system.] (12:42)

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Key Segment Timestamps

| Segment/Topic | Timestamp | |-------------------------------|------------| | Comparison of U.S./Denmark Schedules & New U.S. Changes | 00:02–02:09 | | Parent experience in Denmark, attitudes toward vaccination | 03:00–03:50 | | Deep dive into trust and Danish healthcare system | 04:54–07:00 | | Dr. Lundgren on vaccine policy: Trust and local context | 05:10–07:00 | | Home Health Nurse visit, parenting support | 09:07–10:43 | | Social and data infrastructure in Denmark | 11:22–12:18 | | Danish parent group: Trust in system | 12:30–13:01 | | Edith’s reflection on trust | 13:42–13:59 |

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Conclusion

The episode makes clear that Denmark’s apparent vaccine success hinges not on the number of shots but on high systemic trust, robust social and health infrastructure, and intimate society-wide bonds. Efforts to copy Denmark’s approach in the U.S. are met with skepticism by Danish experts, who stress that American challenges around vaccine hesitancy are rooted in deeper trust and cultural issues. As Edith, the new Danish mother, says:

“I think it would be the entire system that would need to be looked at.” (13:42)

For Americans considering these reforms, the episode urges thoughtful discussion with pediatricians—and prompts listeners to look beyond numbers, toward the social fabric supporting health.

Transcript

[CNN Reporter]

Welcome to a special edition of Chasing Life. Earlier this year, the U.S. department of Health and Human Services, HHS overhauled the childhood vaccine schedule. They are now recommending fewer vaccines for most American children. Now, one of the ideas behind this was to model it after other developed nations, in particular Denmark being the example. So today I'm going to take you along on a special reporting trip I recently took to see if what works in Denmark could in fact work here in the United States. We'll head to Copenhagen right after the break. This should hardly be controversial. Six month old Sylvester is getting his second dose of vaccines. Mom's decision to vaccinate him was entirely voluntary. Like almost everyone here in Denmark, she opted in. In America today, the conversation is very different. You're just getting more and more vaccines.

[Carl Radke]

Logic would state that at some point

[CNN Reporter]

there's going to be a breaking point. My husband and I got together. I'm like, we're not vaccinating our kids.

[Vaccine Expert or Researcher]

And he's like, here is what's in your childhood vaccines right now. Gelatin from boiled pigskin.

[Quaker Oats Advertiser]

We still haven't done the science.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

That's just like, remarkable to me.

[CNN Reporter]

So let's just inject our children here.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

There are some massive changes happening to the childhood vaccine schedule in the United States. And one of the goals is to make the United States vaccine schedule more similar to peer nations, pure nations, like here in Denmark, a country of 6 million people, a country with universal health care, a country with a lot of trust, and a country that gives the fewest doses on their childhood vaccine schedule. So the question for a lot of people is can they do in the United States what they've been doing here in Denmark?

[CNN Reporter]

Earlier this year, the US Government stopped recommending six vaccines for children.

[Vaccine Expert or Researcher]

We took the vaccines that are the vaccines that other countries give our peer nations in Europe. One of the things that they're convinced of from experience and science is that if you add too many vaccines, the schedule, the uptake goes down.

[CNN Reporter]

American health officials declined our request for an interview. Leaders of the movement to make America healthy again say that giving kids fewer vaccines will. Will increase trust in the vaccines they do get. So will those changes lead to more people then vaccinating their children? That's the hypothesis we've come here to test. Edith and Kenneth, both 35 years old, are new parents. Very new parents.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Well, first of all, congratulations.

[Edith (New Parent)]

Thank you.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

How old now? 13 hours?

[Edith (New Parent)]

I think so. Yeah. A little bit. Still cloudy.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Yeah, I bet. How is the whole process here of delivering a baby for people who don't live in Denmark. What's it like?

[Edith (New Parent)]

It's been a really good experience.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

It's just very easy and all covered. I mean, this is a nationalized healthcare system, so everything is. You're not going to walk home with any bills?

[Edith (New Parent)]

Not at all.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Do you worry about vaccines at all?

[Edith (New Parent)]

I think with COVID there came a little bit of kind of like a worry. Not that it was big enough that I didn't take the vaccine, but in general, no. If they advise it, I would take it.

[CNN Reporter]

Edith's confidence in that advice is built on a foundation of positive experiences with Denmark's health system. Denmark has long recommended fewer childhood vaccines than the United States. Babies here leave the hospital without any shots. By the time they're 12 years old, most Danish children have gotten vaccines against 10 diseases. Now, compare that to the United States. Until recently, American officials recommended children get vaccinated for 17 diseases. Now, six of those are still available, but no longer recommended. Hepatitis A and B, meningitis, rotavirus flu, and COVID 19. Some of those, like hepatitis B, are still a serious threat in certain parts of America, but not in Denmark. About six in every 100,000Americans are diagnosed every year with chronic hepatitis B. Compare that to less than 2 per 100,000 in Denmark. That means around 18,000Americans diagnosed every year, compared to about 100 in Denmark.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Fundamentally, this is a story about trust in the medical system. So we've decided to come to one of the biggest hospitals in Copenhagen to meet one of the most trusted doctors in Denmark. So this is a referral hospital?

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

That's right. If the condition is very serious or they feel that it actually warrants more expertise to handle, they would then transfer the patient in here.

[CNN Reporter]

Dr. Jens Lundgren sits on the panel that decides which vaccines to give Denmark's children.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Did it surprise you when you heard that the United States is trying to emulate their vaccine schedule on Denmark?

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

Yeah, I certainly didn't see that coming. You cannot just take what has been carefully thought through in one geographical location and just extrapolate that and generalize that.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

I think part of the reason that they emulate Denmark is because Denmark has the fewest vaccines on the schedule.

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

But you see, that's not a good argument. Right. So why do you want to content your vaccine program against the fewest vaccine? You want to have the right vaccines for the public health that you have in your population. I mean, that's just common sense. And you have a problem in managing a measles outbreak that continues to involve. Right.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Hundreds of cases of measles in a single state now and we've had several measles outbreak.

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

You don't need my degree or my expertise to say there's something fundamentally wrong.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

You believe these vaccines that we're talking about on the childhood vaccine schedule, you believe they are safe and effective, Correct? That's not the concern.

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

That's not the debate here.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

So what is it fun fundamentally about?

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

We have come to realize that it's entirely based on trust. The trust parents need to trust when we come with a new vaccine into the program. They need to trust that that's very sensible to do and they would therefore adhere to that.

[CNN Reporter]

Lundgren and his colleagues are now considering adding another vaccine, the one for chickenpox. But we keep coming back to that word trust. The polling shows it most Danes trust their government. Of the world's most advanced economies, it ranks near the top. And here's the United States dead last. Just 28% of Americans trust the government.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

We've come here to do a medical story, but in some ways this is a cultural story.

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

It's a cultural.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

And yes, and not just about vaccines, but about trust and about attitudes and things like that.

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

Absolutely.

[CNN Reporter]

Up next, what really sets Denmark apart?

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[Carl Radke]

Hey guys, I'm Carl Radke. You may know me from Bravo's Summerhouse. I'm launching a new podcast called More Life. I want to learn from folks who are doing the work and from friends who've inspired me along the way. We'll talk the good, bad and the ugly, but most importantly the the healing, reinvention and self discovery. I definitely don't have it all figured out, but none of us really do. That's why we're here. Listen to More Life on Spotify, YouTube or wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes are out now.

[CNN Reporter]

In the United States. Trust and vaccine Information from the CDC has dropped 12 percentage points since the beginning of the second Trump administration. Dane's trust in government goes far beyond vaccines. Even after parents leave the hospital, child rearing looks a whole lot different here.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

We've come to visit two and a half month old Esther. Of course, we expected to find her inside the house, given how cold it is. But Instead, here she is in a stroller outside. Freezing cold temperatures.

[CNN Reporter]

You'll see this everywhere in Denmark. Parents swear by the fresh air for their heavily swaddled babies. The family is waiting for a home health nurse to arrive who will come free of charge five to six times during the baby's first year of life. Soon, baby Esther wakes from her nap and it's time for her exam.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

I have to say, just visiting Denmark to see Esther outside, that was quite striking. It's freezing cold outside.

[Home Health Nurse]

It's not even as cold now as it has been.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

And what is parental leave here in Denmark?

[Home Health Nurse]

So my first two parental leaves were 12 months each with full payment.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

And then you show up as well? Yeah, five to six times a year.

[Edith (New Parent)]

Yeah, the first year.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

The first year. And what is the purpose of your visit?

[Edith (New Parent)]

My main purpose is to check up on the child, to see if the child is developing and is attaching to the parents.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

What I'm struck by is Denmark is so different than the United States. You're here, parental leave, nationalized health care system.

[Dr. Jens Lundgren]

Obviously there's a lot of people in the US who are not that fond of the government actually running anything at all.

[Home Health Nurse]

And I think it's easy to implement something like a more simple vaccine program seen visiting us here, because it's a smaller country, I think then in many ways you can compare us and Denmark. Right. It's two completely different countries. Right. And it's run differently and politically, governmentally. But I would want for the people in us to have some of the benefits that we experience, because I do believe it benefits me as a parent, I believe it works. So I basically trust the system, right, that they have decided it for me and it works.

[CNN Reporter]

Vaccination isn't the only reason that outbreaks are less common here in Denmark. The National Serum Institute, or SSI here in Copenhagen keeps meticulous medical records of all Danish citizens and that helps predict and even prevent outbreaks.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

What makes Denmark's superpower this data tracking?

[SSI Data Expert]

Well, the underlying superpower comes from the Social Security number introduction in the 1960s. And from there, the linking. At this place where you're looking here, we track the disease incidents from all the physicians. Whenever someone is tested for something, it goes into one database. Whenever someone is vaccinated, it goes into one database. It doesn't go to all kinds of places. It's one place and then it's quite doable to link all this together.

[CNN Reporter]

Americans might be uncomfortable with that level of tracking, but it is one of the many factors that makes the Danish

[Edith (New Parent)]

system Work if you feel like one

[CNN Reporter]

side is soft, community bonds here are tight. This is just one of many places new moms gather to meet and learn with their new babies.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Hello, everybody. Your babies are very cute. Do you all have trust in the vaccine system here in Denmark? By show of hands. Okay.

[CNN Reporter]

Letting you know that every single person raised their hand.

[CNN Correspondent or Interviewer]

Would that trust go down if they added more vaccines? No. So adding more vaccines does not lead to less or more trust.

[CNN Reporter]

After spending a week here, it's easy to see why American officials would want to emulate Denmark. It's often ranked as one of the happiest countries in the world. And it's easy to see reflections of the movements to make America healthy again. Here, Danes emphasize personal health to ward off disease and they are skeptical of too much medical intervention. But the success of the Danish system is based on so much more than the number of vaccines. Parents give their children nationalized health care, high trust and a lot of co dependence on one another. Edith, the new mom, she also seems wise beyond her years.

[Edith (New Parent)]

We have so much trust in the system that if they say yes, then I would do it. I wouldn't understand why there wouldn't be trust. I think it would be the entire system that would need to be looked at.

[CNN Reporter]

I want to say I really enjoyed my trip to Denmark. I understand how important it is to make the right decision for your children. But the question is, can what they do in Denmark really work here in the United States? Whatever your thought is on this, make sure to have conversations about vaccines with your pediatrician. Also want to let you know you can watch the video version of this story. It's pretty remarkable. It's now streaming on the CNN app or you can go to CNN.com watchformore We'll be back next week to answer your health questions. And as always, if there's something you want to know, reach out, record a voice memo, email it to paging Dr. Gupta.com that's paging Dr. Gupta.com or give us a call 470-396-0832 and leave a message. Thanks so much for listening.