EP 409: Quiet Queers

Summary

Decisions, Decisions - Episode 409: Quiet Queers

Release Date: February 24, 2025
Hosts: Mandii B and WeezyWTF
Produced by: The Black Effect and iHeartPodcasts

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1. Introduction

In Episode 409 of "Decisions, Decisions," hosts Mandii B and WeezyWTF delve into the nuanced experiences of "Quiet Queers." This episode explores the intersection of queer identity and societal expectations, challenging traditional narratives and fostering an open dialogue about non-traditional relationships, internalized homophobia, and the importance of community within the LGBTQ+ spectrum.

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2. Defining Quiet Queers

The concept of "Quiet Queers" is introduced as individuals within the queer community who lead predominantly heterosexual lifestyles despite identifying as queer. Mandii B articulates, "A lot of queer people lead hetero lives," highlighting the internal struggles and societal pressures that compel some to suppress their true identities.

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3. Culturally Straight and Internalized Homophobia

The hosts discuss the term "culturally straight," referring to queer individuals who outwardly conform to heterosexual norms, often due to internalized homophobia or cultural expectations. Mandii B comments, "Refusing to dig any deeper because that, like, ownership of the label queer, it's assumed that it, like, absolves you from kind of just doing any further work." This skepticism addresses the superficial acceptance of queer labels without embracing the deeper personal and cultural transformations needed for authentic self-expression.

Notable Quote:

• Mandii B [36:03]: "Culturally straight. People can be queer in identity but still remain culturally straight."

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4. Relationships and Non-Monogamy in the LGBTQ+ Community

The episode transitions into a discussion on non-monogamous relationships within the queer community. Mandii B shares personal experiences, emphasizing the importance of communication and boundaries. She proposes a hypothetical law where faking an orgasm would be punishable, aiming to foster genuine intimacy and better sexual satisfaction. Maisie echoes the sentiment by suggesting, "It doesn't count if I didn't come," advocating for mutual fulfillment in sexual relationships.

Notable Quotes:

• Mandii B [27:59]: "If you fake an orgasm, you go to jail for six months."
• Maisie [28:50]: "It doesn't count if I didn't come."

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5. The History of Love: From Platonic to Romantic

Venturing into the historical context, the hosts discuss Plato's perspective on love, contrasting it with contemporary views. They highlight how romantic love was historically seen as irrational and even harmful, with Mandii B stating, "For most of human history, romantic love was looked at as a sickness." This section underscores the evolution of love from a survival mechanism in arranged marriages to the modern emphasis on emotional and romantic connections.

Notable Quotes:

• Mandii B [49:10]: "The emotional attachment would eventually be known as love."
• Mandy B [52:16]: "Plato, like most people in the ancient world, looked at romantic love with skepticism, if not horror."

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6. Community vs. Romantic Love in Longevity

Mandii B and Maisie explore the role of community and platonic relationships in fostering longevity and well-being. They argue that strong community bonds, rather than romantic relationships alone, contribute significantly to a longer, healthier life. Maisie reflects, "there is a stat that men in nursing homes are more lonely than women because they don't have the friendships that women curate over their lifetimes." This discussion emphasizes the critical importance of platonic love and community support systems.

Notable Quotes:

• Maisie [54:14]: "Cause when you do look at a lot of people... There's so much community amongst women."
• Mandii B [54:30]: "The thing about community, I was like, damn."

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7. Personal Stories and Experiences

The hosts share personal anecdotes that illustrate the challenges and triumphs of navigating queer identities within societal frameworks. Mandii B recounts her experience with a partner who exhibited homophobic behavior despite being in a gay relationship, highlighting the pervasive issue of internalized prejudices. Maisie discusses her family's reaction to her friendships and relationships, shedding light on the intersectionality of race and sexuality.

Notable Quotes:

• Mandii B [43:28]: "Your partner, maybe not ever expressing it, was internally homophobic."
• Maisie [43:06]: "My cousin left Jamaica because he was gay."

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8. Conclusion: Insights and Takeaways

Episode 409 of "Decisions, Decisions" offers a profound exploration of the complexities faced by "Quiet Queers." By addressing internalized homophobia, the necessity of authentic self-expression, and the vital role of community, Mandii B and WeezyWTF encourage listeners to reassess and redefine their understanding of love and relationships. The episode serves as a call to embrace genuine connections and support systems that transcend traditional patriarchal norms, fostering a more inclusive and authentic queer experience.

Final Thoughts: Mandii B concludes with a reflection on the importance of authentic relationships and community bonds, "For most of human history... marriages arranged by families... What's interesting about today's age... people are lasting longer in age because of love." This encapsulates the episode's overarching theme of evolving love paradigms and the enduring significance of community.

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Notable Quotes Summary

• Mandii B [36:03]: "Culturally straight. People can be queer in identity but still remain culturally straight."
• Mandii B [27:59]: "If you fake an orgasm, you go to jail for six months."
• Maisie [28:50]: "It doesn't count if I didn't come."
• Mandii B [49:10]: "The emotional attachment would eventually be known as love."
• Mandii B [54:30]: "The thing about community, I was like, damn."

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This episode of "Decisions, Decisions" not only sheds light on the silent struggles within the queer community but also advocates for deeper introspection and societal change to support authentic and fulfilling relationships. By intertwining personal experiences with broader societal issues, Mandii B and WeezyWTF provide listeners with valuable insights and actionable reflections on love, identity, and community.

Transcript

[Mandy B]

Geico's motorcycle expertise gives me the coverage I need. Like 24. Seven claims.

[Maisie]

I'm on cloud nine.

[Koya]

Clouds are wholly unable to support the weight of an adult human.

[Mandy B]

What's happening?

[Koya]

Furthermore, clouds are not numbered. Even if you procured a jetpack and searched, you'd find no cloud numbered nine. However, at that altitude, you'd likely befriend a flock of migrating snow geese. Geese who'd encourage you to leave your 24.7geico motorcycle claims insurance behind, as they would take you in and even share their dinner of crickets and clovers with you. GEICO assumes no liability for any indigestion that may occur from a clover cricket dinner. GEICO expertise for your motorcycle welcome to Decisions Decisions.

[Maisie]

I don't think you should say Decisions Decisions. It sounded like you was talking and cursing.

[Mandy B]

You definitely say to welcome.

[Maisie]

Welcome to the new podcast.

[Mandy B]

Oh, wait, you want to say it together.

[Maisie]

Decisions.

[Mandy B]

Decisions. Thanks for listening to another episode of Decisions Decisions. I have a surprise for you Throwing a free event this Thursday, February 27th. And guess what? It's free. And and everybody can join because it's virtual. From 6pm Eastern to 8pm Eastern, 3pm Pacific Standard, there is going to be a virtual screening of Risky. It's a dinner conversation that we hosted in Chicago, and you've probably heard me talk about how I've been doing them over the past few years in different cities. But we are going to have a screening of the event we did, and it's going to be followed by a live Q and A with me and my girl Koya. I've been hosting these dinners for a while with her, and I'm telling you, it is such an amazing experience to sit with black women and addressing risky sexual behaviors and the stigmas that contribute to the disproportionate HIV rates amongst black women. Listen, I know it's not that sexy to talk about stuff like this, but you will really enjoy this conversation. It's so educational and it's girl time with me. Hello. So get your ticket for free at Risky Dinner convo. Com and follow Risky on IG at Risky Dinner Convo. They'll be tagged on our page in the description of this episode. See you this Thursday.

[Maisie]

All righty. All righty. All righty. All righty.

[Alex]

When are you ready?

[Maisie]

Welcome to Decisions Decisions.

[Alex]

Why?

[Maisie]

Well, I don't know. I listen.

[Mandy B]

Racist.

[Alex]

What accent was that even?

[Maisie]

Listen, the thing is, as long as you just roll your Rs, it's the accent.

[Mandy B]

I feel like you wanted to make that Italian, French You. It was very.

[Maisie]

In Italy.

[Alex]

Yeah.

[Maisie]

I don't. I don't know. I am not the best with accents. Okay.

[Mandy B]

We need to get you global. We need to.

[Maisie]

No, what's crazy is I'm literally in Atlanta and I'm like, oh, y'all have accents down here? O. I don't know what y'all are saying.

[Mandy B]

You. You six months out, bro.

[Maisie]

Don't do that. I love.

[Mandy B]

We gonna be on this podcast. Like, we will be adding subtitles.

[Maisie]

I ain't gonna hold you. It might happen. It might happen. I am noticing a little twang. A little twang. But no. Y'all, welcome to another episode, y'all. I'm Mandy B. I'm Maisie.

[Mandy B]

And I know you're so happy that it's just us.

[Maisie]

I mean. Yeah, I mean, but we've also had some really good guests coming on. I mean, we've actually, like, started Decisions, decisions out with a lot of our friends. Like, we just was like, hey, yo, pull up a lot of people. We've worked with a lot of people that we know personally. So I'm fucking with it.

[Mandy B]

That's all right.

[Maisie]

Sorry, Alex. By the way, y'all are watching on YouTube, first seven minutes, bleep out our curse words. Get over it.

[Mandy B]

Yeah, you're healing.

[Maisie]

Fuck. Shit. Damn.

[Mandy B]

You will hear pussy. Fuck. Shit, bitch. Soon. Oh, my God. Speaking of which, there was recently a guest that had Tourette's come into the studio, and Teyana hit me and was like, this is something I've never seen.

[Maisie]

They never watched. It was Bigelow, male gigolo.

[Mandy B]

Maybe in person. I've never.

[Alex]

That's a great movie.

[Maisie]

Such a good movie.

[Mandy B]

She basically said the tics were. Hold on. Let me type in tics in my phone and tell you what these tics were. Sorry again for the bleeps. Bitch. Dick. Tippy, Tippy that wiener. Tippy tap that rotisserie. My flabber has been gassed.

[Alex]

Love that bdc.

[Mandy B]

That's a big black cock. And then she auto wrote. And last but not least, bitch. Asshole.

[Maisie]

And wait, these were tics that just were bursted out. Yeah, I'm not gonna lie. Those are really cool tics.

[Mandy B]

She said she was on a podcast. I don't know the name of it, but the person that hosts it is Amanda Hirsch. Tourette Syndrome. And they never gave Teyana a heads up. So she says she was adjusting the camera and the girl was like, sticking up a middle finger. Fuck you, bitch. She said. I was like, I know she ain't talking to me. So I'm really curious, though, like, what that episode sounds like and how that conversation goes. Because keep in mind, with Tourette's, these are just blurted out, so it can be distracting for the person you're trying to speak to.

[Maisie]

And also, if a man is getting it right from. From behind, I'm trying now to make it nice. And he screams out, rotisserie, bro. I ain't gonna hold you. I don't know. Like, if I could have sex with someone who is yelling out, bitch ass hoe in Rotisserie.

[Mandy B]

Jason Momoa got Tourette's hypothetical.

[Alex]

You letting her rock.

[Maisie]

I'm gonna turn the TV up. I'm gonna take it. You right.

[Mandy B]

I'm be like, yeah, you want that chicken pussy?

[Maisie]

No, no, no.

[Alex]

Yeah. What if it's missionary?

[Maisie]

I'm not gonna lie. I'm just gonna have the music playing loud. Okay? If Jason Momoa has Tourette's and just bursts out, like, bursts out any of those weird things. Okay. He can't.

[Alex]

You heard that, Jason?

[Mandy B]

You know, I don't know if anybody else does this, but sometimes when me and my nigga get drunk, I be like. You know, it's like, if I was a worm, would you love me?

[Alex]

Oh, my God.

[Mandy B]

So we be doing shit like, okay, what if I couldn't do this? What if I couldn't do that? What if I had hunchback? Like, would you still be with me? He's like, since we already locked in. Yeah, but, like, if you were a.

[Maisie]

Worm, I just get. Why are you asking your man if he would be into bestiality?

[Mandy B]

I just want to know if I.

[Maisie]

Was a turtle, if he was that. Is bestiality a word?

[Mandy B]

Doing dumb shit. That's what you do when you in love, Girl, I don't know what the fuck going on. My head is fucked up.

[Maisie]

If I was a worm, would you be with me?

[Mandy B]

Mandy?

[Alex]

Yes.

[Mandy B]

Let me tell you something about being in love. You forgot how you was acting?

[Maisie]

No. I'm not gonna lie. I've never asked that, man. If I was a worm, would you still love me?

[Mandy B]

I mean, I'm exaggerating here, but it's just, like, dumb shit.

[Alex]

Well, what was his reaction?

[Mandy B]

Wait, I didn't ask him that. But I'm thinking, like, something, like, super silly. Like, I'd just be looking with the googly eyes, like, okay. It'd be right after I came if.

[Maisie]

I. I just do a thing. Okay. So I'll ask about an extra toe or an extra finger or, like. Cause my mama white, I be like, what if I didn't have lips and we're gonna look like this?

[Mandy B]

What if I was full?

[Maisie]

I'd suck my mouth in his and be like, would you kiss me if my mouth was like this?

[Mandy B]

When I do that, is he that white shit. That's why sometimes he look at me and be like, I can't believe I'm gonna.

[Maisie]

That isn't white shit. I have full lips, thankfully. But when I be, like, looking at my mama, sometimes I be like, damn, mama, you ain't got no lips.

[Mandy B]

And we're in an era where you could do a little. Go ahead, let's get. Let's get it for her.

[Maisie]

No, I'm not giving my mom no.

[Mandy B]

Filler in the lip.

[Maisie]

I'm not giving her filler. No, I think I would help my mom, though. Like, she had the gastric sleeve, so I'm like, if insurance doesn't cover your. And it's not a mommy makeover. But she's older, so she has the loose skin. I'm like, girl, we gonna snip and tuck that. Girl, that's way worse than a lip. We gonna snip and tuck that.

[Mandy B]

That is way worse than a lip.

[Maisie]

No, it's not.

[Alex]

At least that's just the filler.

[Mandy B]

No, I know.

[Maisie]

No filler be looking awful and can migrate up under your nose.

[Alex]

There's no anesthesia.

[Mandy B]

Not when you're lifting off.

[Maisie]

Cutting off extra skin, which is a health concern, is not worse than filthy.

[Mandy B]

Because you know why I say that. Yeah.

[Maisie]

You know what I mean?

[Alex]

You're still putting down under it, right? They put you down.

[Mandy B]

Yeah. That's vanity. No, mommy makeover's vanity.

[Maisie]

Yeah. To me, it's not like. I'm not saying, like, not to get lips, like. But to me, I'd rather help my mom cut some extra skin off than lip filler.

[Mandy B]

Yeah. I think there's a point where, you know when you see someone, you're like, ooh, that's too much. Imagine them before. That's what we. You got to know. They built up to that.

[Maisie]

What was Kylie like?

[Mandy B]

It just two shots. You know what I mean?

[Maisie]

I mean, yeah, she worked her way.

[Mandy B]

There once you got to the point where you.

[Maisie]

I did. And then she lied to y'all and said it's the lip kit and y'all bought it. It was sold out. I'm not gonna lie. I was them.

[Alex]

I was gonna say y'all bought it.

[Maisie]

Oh, bitch, I love the little lip kit. Y'all can talk about Kylie all y'all want. With all the things baby. Her little Kylie clothing line and the lip kit.

[Mandy B]

I'm here.

[Maisie]

She has put out some good quality shit.

[Mandy B]

I'm gonna tell you, I love a little. You know when you put on a little cooling gel and it be making your shit tingly, but then you be.

[Maisie]

Oh, no, I'm not gonna hold you. The little lip gloss with the little plumper. Ladies do not kiss a man or suck a man with the plumper on your lip. We don't even do hors d'oeuvres anymore. But that's my tip to y'all. I done did it on accident, and it was like, there's a little tingly happening. I said, oh, shit, it's my plumper. The plumper transfers, y'all.

[Mandy B]

Wait, how fresh?

[Alex]

But how fresh?

[Maisie]

But almost immediately, like, when I'm with someone, I just. I constantly am putting on lip gloss and then. And then all of the things, y'all.

[Mandy B]

Wait.

[Alex]

But how again? What's the time between the plumper and the tissue?

[Maisie]

Oh, it tingles for a while. Like, I have this one. I don't think it's tarte. I forgot the brand. I'll bring it. That thing be tingling for about 15 minutes.

[Mandy B]

Oh, my God. This is so random. But I just have to tell y'all about this. Last night at 11. I'm sorry, my add just hit me. Last night at 11:30 at night, okay. There's a knock on my door. Me and my nigga in a bed. I thought about it because the girl got big lips when I see her. So I get a knock on my door, and I'm like, what the fuck? And I'm, like, nervous, like, what? And I've left my key in the door before, so I was like, oh, my God, please don't tell me that's. And it's happening in front of me.

[Maisie]

I leave my key in the door, too.

[Mandy B]

These two girls are giggling, and we looking through the peephole dish. Oh, my God. Sorry. We're just gonna leave a note on your door. You don't have to open the door. I'm sorry. It's two girls. One white one, one Indian girl. He opened the door and they're like, sorry, we just have a letter for you and you can read it. You don't read it. Oh, my God. That's all right. They like, we're giggling. It's almost midnight. It's a Monday night. I'm fucking livid.

[Alex]

Oh, you about to fight.

[Mandy B]

Oh, I was. Let me tell you. You know, I was. I was like, when she said, we're your neighbors, I'm like, and what do you want? Like, he was trying to be nice. I was pissed. Girl, I'll read this letter. You know, we had to get up early. Hi. These are your neighbors, apartment five and apartment six. Basically, we're all on this one floor, and it's a larger floor. We're considering throwing a party, and we thought it would be fun if we all open up our apartments. Weird.

[Alex]

I mean, they're young, right?

[Mandy B]

I'm assuming they're young. It's downtown. Let us know what you think. Or you can just totally ignore this if you want. Nigga, let me tell you something. When I tell you I almost went and knocked on.

[Maisie]

I saw that shit on TikTok.

[Mandy B]

Oh, I almost knocked on 5 and 6.

[Maisie]

They did that on TikTok. They're like. That's like. It's a trend.

[Mandy B]

Wait, it's real. It's on TikTok.

[Maisie]

No, there's a TikTok where everyone goes to everyone's different apartments, and in each apartment, there's either a theme or drinks. And you literally are partying through everyone's apartments. I literally saw that on TikTok.

[Mandy B]

Hey, let me tell you something. This isn't a fucking corner.

[Maisie]

We said I'm a millennial. I'm not here for it.

[Mandy B]

Are you out here? White mind, Literally. And I'm going off. And I know he's annoyed, too, but now he's trying to calm me down. I'm about to go over there, so I get my phone out because they left their phone numbers. And he's like, no, no, no. Just chill. Just chill. I'm like, yo, do you know how disrespectful it is to knock on someone's door almost at midnight on a fucking Monday? Like, you really got me fucked up, Number two. What really got me tight. Bitch, you only trying to do this with me so that I'm not gonna complain about how loud it is. And ever since that one ho moved in Santacon, my building was flooded. What the fuck do you think this is, a goddamn frat house?

[Maisie]

Oh, yeah, they do.

[Mandy B]

People literally will hear Nina at the door when they walk by and just start barking back. And I'd be opening a motherfucking door like, bitch, what the fuck is you doing now? I know I live in a downtown Manhattan, crazy area, literally by bars. That doesn't mean that I need to now take on this energy. First of all, I am a phony. I have a boyfriend now, bitch. Lisa, I'm Still a party girl. But I just really can't believe these neighbors wanted to do this with me. Like, are you crazy?

[Maisie]

We're going to just sound like millennials right now. Because everyone's asking me about a housewarming, and I said so that people know where I live. No, no, no, no, no.

[Alex]

I get that.

[Maisie]

I don't want anyone coming over my house.

[Mandy B]

Y'all don't think this is cr. That. That's crazy to knock on somebody's. But you used to.

[Maisie]

You used to throw parties at your house.

[Mandy B]

I still do. It doesn't mean I want it with you, but.

[Alex]

Yeah, but that's fair.

[Maisie]

Do you go to your neighbors and are you considerate about how loud it will be?

[Mandy B]

Like, yeah, bottle of wine before you.

[Alex]

Think so that's just. Okay.

[Mandy B]

You know what I mean?

[Maisie]

That's her millennial.

[Alex]

Like, that's.

[Maisie]

Sorry that you didn't like the giggles.

[Alex]

We're fine with the party.

[Mandy B]

Do you see that? Okay, let me just say this.

[Maisie]

She's like, I do it the mature way.

[Mandy B]

I do it for congestion. Let's start with that. If I have a game night at my house, and the music and the shit ain't that crazy. I knock on the door. I'm not asking for permission. I say, hey, I'm going to have some friends over on Friday. I just wanted to bring this by. Hope you know, it's not too annoying.

[Alex]

There's this barefoot. We're going to be loud.

[Mandy B]

This is barefoot Little Chateau Diana. But I mean, no. And I started to think to myself, and I'm like, oh, it's perfect. Because it's decision, decisions. What rules do you have as a neighbor? First of all, she said, you can ignore this. I feel like the nice thing to do is write them and respectfully decline and be like, hey, but if you never need anything, here's my number. I really don't want to do that at all. I don't know why I have to be neighborly. I'm a renter. You're going to be out of here.

[Maisie]

And so am I. Oh, I'm not going to lie. Like, I remember when I lived in Miami. I lived downtown Miami off Biscayne. And I'll never forget, our neighbor from below us came up. Mind you, he, I guess, had a 9 to 5. But me and my roommate at the time were bartenders, and we went out a lot. We would get ready, we would wear heels. He came up and literally said, do I need to buy you guys slippers? I don't like hearing Your heels when I'm having to get up for work or whatever. And I'm not gonna lie. My initial response, and yes, I was 21 at the time, was if you don't want to hear people above you, buy the penthouse or get a house. To me, when you're in an apartment, like, to me, you should be able to listen to your music loud. You should be able to wear heels in your home that you pay for. Like, to me, if you're someone that is really going to be anal about the noise made by having neighbors get a fucking house.

[Alex]

Can we put an asterisk though? What's the asterisk at considerable hours?

[Mandy B]

Yeah, I'm going to say that I would be considerable.

[Alex]

You blast the music at 5:00am?

[Maisie]

No.

[Alex]

Or four years.

[Maisie]

Okay. No, no.

[Alex]

I'm not gonna lie.

[Maisie]

There's, there's. Consider, I believe ours. Yeah.

[Alex]

If you're walking around at.

[Maisie]

But if I'm walking around, bro. No, I, I understand music. I understand loud.

[Mandy B]

So I don't have anyone under me because of structurally how the building is. There's something underneath me, which is great, right? And I'm not even on a bottom floor, but there are people above me. Most recently a guy that likes to do yoga or something and he work out some kind of workout. But I say yoga because I just hear a thump sometimes. Then I hear one foot. It's not like dumbbells. So I let it go because it doesn't last long. And I feel like we live in New York. These apartments are small.

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

What am I like, whatever. But doing one day that did it late night and the next day when I saw him, I said, hey, couldn't sleep last night.

[Maisie]

See, to me, noises.

[Mandy B]

One thumb, one time. Oh, oh, no. He's like doing a full on workout on the. It's like a mat thing he's doing on the ground. So I'll make a comment just so you're aware. That's it. That's all I could do. I think they did make a comment. So you're aware.

[Maisie]

Yeah, I don't know. And it didn't change anything. Bitch, I pay rent. I'm wearing heels in my house. I also remember too, like sound noise complaints. Sorry, bro. Come on, like get earplugs, get it together. Like people are living how they live. I will say the only thing that I have understood. I had another roommate when I lived in the Bronx who was a smoker, smoked all day, every day. And the apartment above us was section eight. Well, if Section eight comes and smells Weed, you could lose your section eight. And so because she didn't want to stop smoking in her home, she moved out. And so that's where, like, again, if you don't like something or if you don't like the complaints from your neighbors, bro, move out. But I don't think you should have to change your whole way of living in your home that you pay rent for to accommodate neighbors.

[Mandy B]

Wait, wait, wait. Hold on, hold on.

[Maisie]

So she moved out because she's like, I'm gonna smoke in my room. I'm gonna smoke in my house. I pay rent. I wake up, I roll a blunt, I smoke. So she moved out and moved to a place that didn't mind her smoking. And I respected that.

[Mandy B]

I thought you were saying, move out. Have the neighbor. Okay, okay, okay.

[Maisie]

No, she moved out. She said, no worries. I am gonna smoke in my home. And she moved out.

[Mandy B]

Oh, yeah. I think that's really honorable.

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

Cause if you tell me, I gotta go, bitch.

[Maisie]

I mean, but again, when you're dealing with Section 8 or newborn babies, like, my loft now, like, my neighbor smokes cigars. The people before me had a baby and literally said, hey, we can't. I mean, when you're sharing vents with people, like, smoke. I understand.

[Mandy B]

I understand smoke too. My partner is a. He owns properties, and one of them, he recently, like, saw. And basically, I guess she. Huh.

[Alex]

It's on the walls kind of a thing.

[Mandy B]

She opened the door and he's like, yo, I couldn't even see the floor. It was just filthy. Hoarding kids. He was like. And not just regular. I have kids. Messy. And he's like, all of it. You can. It's gonna take over the walls.

[Maisie]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mandy B]

And I literally was like, how do you know if someone has bad cleaning habits or. Or even smoking or anything? A lot of people are invested nowadays. We get into that age where we wanna get an investment property. What do you do? We just watched fucking 5eo foreign smoking in a motherfucker's crib.

[Maisie]

It's so crazy. That's what even I saw. It was either a tweet or maybe it was a TikTok, but it was saying that, ladies, you shouldn't even open your legs for a man until you see how he lives.

[Mandy B]

Oh.

[Maisie]

A, to see if he clean or not, but also B, to make sure he don't live with his wife. Uh, you should definitely.

[Mandy B]

That's hilarious.

[Maisie]

You should. You should go and be able to see the inside of his home. And you should know the color of his shower curtain.

[Mandy B]

Bro. And you know what's crazy?

[Maisie]

You should know. You should know you don't really have.

[Mandy B]

A right to own. Enter a tenant's property. But also, at the same time, you want to make sure your shit is being upheld. I'm like, so what do you.

[Maisie]

That's why renting is tough. I mean, but that's why a lot of home like owners or people that get into investment properties don't want to rent to section 8 because the. The possibility of their home being destroyed is higher than. Than not. Because they genuinely. If you're not paying in Section 8, you're paying very minimal. You don't seem to care about things that you don't pay for.

[Alex]

Question.

[Mandy B]

So what do you. But sorry. On the other hand, he does have a Section 8 tenant. Was like, I get my rent.

[Maisie]

Oh, I'm not gonna lie. I grew up. I grew up as a Section 8 tenant. Like my mom and us. We were a section. We were. We were on Section eight growing up. And we took very good care of the house.

[Alex]

What do you wish that they had done instead?

[Mandy B]

Slid it under the door and not a knock in the middle of the fucking night.

[Maisie]

I think that's sliding under the door. Yeah.

[Mandy B]

11:30 on a Monday, bro. I understand the age of the world right now, but I just think there needs to be some decorum. And these kids, I really feel like they disrespectful. Not these kids.

[Maisie]

We is aging the hell if you're a fucking kid.

[Mandy B]

Whoa.

[Maisie]

Decisions, decisions, decisions.

[Mandy B]

You think I'm about to open my door to. Are you insane? Look and ruin my.

[Maisie]

She's like, ooh, y'all done got. Oh, you want some soundproofing, T. Decisions.

[Mandy B]

Hold on, hold on. Sound ordinance, tv, y'all. I opened a gym. I'm gonna tell you all about it. It's called Trap House. If you haven't seen it on my IG yet. It's in the Lower east side. We have a neighbor. Uh.

[Maisie]

Oh.

[Alex]

Oh, boy.

[Mandy B]

It just came from the floor above.

[Alex]

Oh, boy.

[Mandy B]

And my partner was upstairs with them, introducing themselves, and he said it was pretty loud yesterday. What was going on? You guys having a party? And she was like, no.

[Maisie]

We were doing our workout normally with commercial, though. Don't you have to, like. Aren't you aware of who you're. Who else is in the building before you joined the building?

[Mandy B]

Well, that person said. She said, did you not know we were a gym? He said, I knew you were a Pilates studio.

[Maisie]

Oh. Didn't know that you were going to be playing Rap, bitch.

[Mandy B]

It is Trap. And so she's like, well, what level of noise would be comfortable for you? He said, a pin drop.

[Maisie]

Yeah, girl.

[Mandy B]

She came downstairs, said, well, we're getting kicked out. I said, no, the hell we ate. I signed my lease first. Nobody else was in the building. They were very aware what this would be. I'm following the decibels of what's allowed. The apartments on the side. So it's New York, right? You have some commercial, then they on the side. I turn it off at a certain time. I've soundproofed the windows. Like, sound is gonna travel up. And if you think I'm not gonna have a subwoofer when I wanna hear sexy right on the reformer. You got me. So now we just waiting, girl. He's a white gay man. And whereas gay men steal my heart, I have a feeling one day he's just going to be like, I've had it. I am terrified. Luckily, our schedule is like 7, 8, 9, 30. He comes in around 11. We do have a 12 class, but the rest is late night. 5, 6, 7. I'm like, all right, maybe you'll hear a one. But I think what already makes it worse? Because when I thought about it, I was like, okay. If I knew there was a Pilates studio as well, I'd be like, oh, you wouldn't. You can see the name of Trap house. Oh.

[Alex]

I mean, he can't assume.

[Mandy B]

Dog it. I'm a little. I'm a little scared.

[Alex]

What's the business, if you don't mind me asking?

[Mandy B]

They're a designer showroom.

[Maisie]

Oh.

[Alex]

Oh, y'all Judy.

[Maisie]

Oh, I know, but she probably has elevator music playing. And I woke up in a boo woo gotta my Buddha hole brown about to be on my baby dad.

[Mandy B]

You know my baby daddy, but my baby dad. Oh, wait, no, the song. The last time I saw him in a hallway and I felt so bad because it's a big bangs was bing, bing.

[Alex]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

I was like, hey, how are you? I was like, oh. I mean, it wasn't cursing, but it's just so loud.

[Maisie]

No, you're just yelling, fiend. It's eliciting drugs. Yeah.

[Mandy B]

Wow. Is it?

[Maisie]

That's what a fiend is, bro.

[Mandy B]

I know that's what a fiend is. I thought it was just like, we're feening for the party.

[Maisie]

You're feening for.

[Alex]

For the party?

[Maisie]

Sure, for the party.

[Mandy B]

But anyway, it's super fun. Come. I made a code for Jorge. It's 10 bucks off and it's half Pilates inspired moves and half lifting, and it's been really, really dope. Dave and Eddie got to come through and you did Pilates. Now you gotta come.

[Maisie]

You didn't do it.

[Alex]

I didn't do the Pilates. You didn't do the Pilates, so I felt like I was doing it.

[Maisie]

I've never done Pilates, though, with machines. I do Pilates with my bodies, so I don't know about it.

[Alex]

Looks good, though.

[Maisie]

I don't. Yeah, the machines be scaring me. That's what I be seeing. The athletes.

[Mandy B]

A lot of people are scared. We do, like, we started an int because I realized a lot of girls come in. Like, I'm kind of nervous or I'm scared, and you don't want to be. The worst thing for me is when I go to a hard workout and everybody's better than me or making me feel like I'm not keeping up. So. I understand that too.

[Maisie]

Like Pilates, barre, yoga. Like, I realize my. My intimid I'm intimidated by machines. So I've really enjoyed working out with just moving my muscles.

[Mandy B]

Interesting.

[Maisie]

Yeah. I don't like. I don't like machines. I think even when I go into gyms. Like, I. I had a gym in my last building, and I was just like, learning really the usage of them. I prefer, like, using just my body weight. So, like, seeing my love over the years grow for barre class and yoga and hot yoga and Pilates. It's always been just a mat.

[Mandy B]

The thing with Pilates too. So I can't call it Pilates and I can't call it Legree, but it is the closest to Legree. The fitness director is Legree certified, but there is like a. A monopoly on using the name. So the machines are literally that. But I can't say it because other studios own that. So I've had to say Pilates inspired. But basically I just went from what changed my body the most. And everybody know y'all have come with me to workouts and shit over the years. Like, there's a bunch that I love, and I'm like, this is what changed me the most. Lifting weights and the reformer. So the regular Pilates machine is kind of light. This one is heavier, so you feel it more. But it's really. Cause I want n on it. Like, my goal was to have, like, a workout that men could do. I even made one spot in the gym called the boyfriend Bench. And it's a bench that is only lifting and you don't have to do the machine.

[Maisie]

Okay.

[Mandy B]

Cause I knew it was gonna be niggas up in there and it's a dude in there every time. Also, girls bringing their boyfriends. Girl, you got to hold on down. They be bringing some fine ass niggas in trash.

[Maisie]

Not you looking at the girl's boyfriend. Sorry.

[Mandy B]

Ok. No coke girl.

[Maisie]

You are the owner. Can you be respectful today? Relationships. Damn.

[Mandy B]

Speaking of which, I have realized that the culture of WTF media and owning this business is drastically different from starting a new one. And you know, everybody has a language. Mandy and I talk a certain way in the group chat with you. I talk a certain way in the group chat with Jeff and Alex and Clara. Whoever this new business, I have to really watch my mouth. Literally someone came in and I was like, damn, her ass looks so good. And they all looked at me like, yeah, you can't. So no one else's ass looked like, well, bitch, you can't talk like that. No, I was like, HR guard. Oh yeah. I don't. There's guard.

[Maisie]

Guard.

[Mandy B]

It's already a sexual energy. It's sweaty in there and it's like beautiful people. So you're just.

[Maisie]

You know what's crazy? I have the opposite thought. Like going to the gym is never sexual energy. Like, I don't know, I guess, I guess that goes to like the people that don't.

[Mandy B]

Horny.

[Maisie]

No, you're horny, but I get it. But I don't think the gym is not. Does not bring about sexual energy.

[Mandy B]

What?

[Alex]

Really? The sweat, the heat that surprised me. Body movement.

[Mandy B]

I understand a group fitness class because mainly being around a bunch of girls doing like something.

[Maisie]

We're also bi, so. No. Like I'm in yoga and asses in the air. I eat lick ass. You would think it. I don't go to like when I'm in the gym.

[Mandy B]

You don't feel sexy either.

[Maisie]

I'm. I'm hurting. I'm stretching.

[Mandy B]

I'm hurting. No, no, you put on seriously.

[Maisie]

No, I don't. No, I don't.

[Mandy B]

Oh, I can't.

[Maisie]

I go with my little cut up.

[Mandy B]

That's why I go.

[Maisie]

I go to sweat, but I don't go to look good. I go to like. I go to feel good. I don't go to like look good. I don't do my makeup. I'll put on a baseball bag.

[Mandy B]

No, no, no, no, no. I'm not talking about girls that go to look good. I've never put on makeup for the gym. I'm talking about going to feel good.

[Maisie]

I go to feel good, but I'M not going to feel good in my pussy. I'm going to feel good everywhere else.

[Mandy B]

Yeah, I ain't gonna lie to you, bitch. I do feel like a. Especially with lower body workouts. Like, it literally bring. It builds testosterone for men. You just start doing squats and shit. Like, it. It definitely gets the blood flowing. I. I felt sexy.

[Maisie]

When you, when you squat, does your dick get hard?

[Mandy B]

Edd, not hard.

[Maisie]

You said it builds testosterone and blood.

[Alex]

Like, but there's blood blood flowing, right?

[Maisie]

So is it flowing like when you squat or even. Dave, when you do anything lower body hard, is your. Is your dick getting hard?

[Alex]

Maybe like a half chobe? Like, not.

[Maisie]

Not a half chobe. Okay, can we get to hypotheticals now?

[Mandy B]

Half chobe is crazy. Half chobe is crazy.

[Alex]

Like, you just asked me if my dick got hard during the workout.

[Maisie]

Oh, my bad, sorry. Clearly, there's no hr.

[Mandy B]

Well, now I feel like I can't say anything, but I be getting horny. And I ain't gonna lie to you. On a machine, like, there's this one move, like, it's almost like a cat cow. It's in tabletop position when you're doing it.

[Maisie]

I do like cat cow.

[Mandy B]

Oh, I really was.

[Maisie]

Like, I be feeling in my lower back. I love a cat cow.

[Mandy B]

I be tooting it up. Or if I do rows where one arm is on the bench and I'm just rowing the other, I'm gonna toot my ass up.

[Alex]

Do you stare at yourself in the mirror?

[Mandy B]

Duh.

[Koya]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

Hello. Have you like. I'm sorry. Eco distrust. Anyway, Geico's motorcycle expertise means I'm covered.

[Koya]

By people who know bikes like I do.

[Mandy B]

I'm happy as a clam.

[Koya]

Disclaimer. No conclusive scientific research has shown clams can experience.

[Mandy B]

I just meant that I feel really good about my coverage.

[Koya]

I mean, even if you took the climb out for the best day ever, visiting the zoo, taking a scenic ride, knowing you're insured by specialists, and sharing a strawberry ice cream cone together, the clam would not feel happy. And your strawberry cone would taste sort of clammy.

[Maisie]

Ew.

[Koya]

Geico's motorcycle specialists who know bikes like you do, assume no liability for clammy ice cream cones. Geico expertise for your motorcycle.

[Mandy B]

Hypothetical.

[Maisie]

Okay, yes.

[Mandy B]

If you could make one universal law in the realm of sexual, what would it be?

[Maisie]

Can you start with this?

[Mandy B]

Okay, so for me, the law I would make is, like, if you fake an orgasm, you go to jail for six months. And the reason I say that is because the faking of the orgasm, which I have done before, has promoted so much lack of interest in what someone wants because you're already getting the instant gratification. So we're not learning what we're doing wrong. And even it's. It's not that you're doing anything wrong. I think it's. You're not learning how to please someone else. So now we just. Is it good?

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

Instead of saying, how can I get you off? What do you like? Do you like harder? More pressure? Like, we just don't ask.

[Maisie]

I agree. I agree. I mean, a. A universal law for me would be, it doesn't count if you don't come. And I think it would limit the conversation.

[Alex]

What do you mean it doesn't count?

[Maisie]

It doesn't count if I didn't come.

[Mandy B]

I've only fucked five niggas.

[Maisie]

It didn't count if I didn't come. That would be the law I would create. Because there's no way in hell, like, even if I had to sign a little waiver, like, yes, I came so then you could acknowledge me as a body. You could tell people we had sex. However, if I did not come, it didn't happen.

[Mandy B]

Did you really blow my back out?

[Maisie]

I don't recall. It didn't happen. That would be my universal law. So then what?

[Mandy B]

Is it the same for you? It's like, have you fucked anybody? Let's say you fucked 50 women, and.

[Maisie]

If you didn't make any of them.

[Mandy B]

Come, you only vote two women.

[Maisie]

You're a virgin.

[Alex]

That's crazy.

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

I'm not gonna lie. This is fucking insane.

[Maisie]

No, I would. I mean, I think that that's because there's guys that be acting like they did a whole lot of something and it was a whole lot of nothing. And now I want my pussy muscles back. And guess what? I'm going to take them back because you didn't even make them contract. Hello. Now I feel like a rapper. What would your law be for sex? Do you have a sex law that you would.

[Alex]

There's always gotta be head.

[Mandy B]

If you're DL, you gotta.

[Maisie]

That would be your sex law.

[Alex]

There's head on.

[Maisie]

You have to give head before penetration or.

[Alex]

Yeah, it doesn't have to be before, but like, head has to happen at one point.

[Mandy B]

Head has to happen on one or the other. Yes, I like that.

[Maisie]

I'm not mad at that.

[Mandy B]

I think that's actually a really good line.

[Maisie]

I mean, I'm not gonna lie. You're kind of childish. If there's no oral, are you, you're childish. If you are having sex as a grown ass adult, I'm gonna say 19 and up. Cause by 18 years you may still be there. I don't think anyone who is mature is having any sex without having aura.

[Mandy B]

So my drug dealer is like, well, he's a new one, but he's like a super hood nigga. And to be honest with you, the type of drugs I like ain't super hood. So something about it is just kind of fun. When he comes through. So we talking or whatever, he's like, yo, I found out about horrible decisions I ain't even know I've been serving. Like, I ain't know who you was. We talking. He was like, you know, it's crazy. A lot of girls be trying to cut me off because I don't really kiss or eat pussy unless I'm super in love. And I literally was like, then what do you do?

[Maisie]

Put his dick in you finger then and spit.

[Mandy B]

Yeah, I was so. I'm like, I can almost see. I can understand the kissing and like, like titty like what?

[Maisie]

I mean, I use that anyway.

[Mandy B]

I'm never buying mushrooms from him again.

[Maisie]

I mean, I used to have sex and not kiss. I get kissing being intimate. It's so crazy because I think, you know, kissing is more intimate.

[Alex]

Kissing or the head.

[Maisie]

Yeah, no, kissing is way more intimate than giving head.

[Mandy B]

I agree.

[Maisie]

It is like I said, like, I agree with you. I think oral is a part of sex. Oral.

[Alex]

Oral should be a part of sex.

[Maisie]

It should be. One or the other is giving head. Yeah, someone has to give head. Even if we're not 69ing it out. Someone has to give head.

[Mandy B]

Like one of my homegirls just opened up her relationship and she was asking me about my rules and how they and what we're both allowed to do. And one of the things she said to me was, do you let him eat other pussy? Oh, wait.

[Maisie]

Because men will say they don't want you to suck other dick, right?

[Alex]

100%.

[Mandy B]

So she was like, do you let him eat other pussy? And I was like, well, it's not a rule that he can't. I was like, isn't head part of sex? I was like, and my nigga's not busting down bitches every week. Like, this is not something like our, our sex life is not. It's not a frequent non monogamy thing. We don't. He doesn't have many other partners, right? I was like, I didn't even think to police that. And she was like, that's insane to me because that's so intimate. I'm like, bro, my boyfriend is allowed to have sex with other women. We have sex with other women together. Now you're telling me that's so intimate.

[Maisie]

Oh, I'm not gonna lie. There was an argument with my ex. I didn't mind him having sex with other women. But you went to a bar with a bitch. Like, I thought it was intimate to spend outside time out of the bedroom with a woman. Like, for what? Why do you have to talk to her? Aren't you just supposed to be having sex? So, like, to me, intimacy is giving someone your time on the other front.

[Mandy B]

What's interesting is I agree. So whereas it didn't bother me before, at this juncture of my life, I don't really want that. Like, I don't want a woman feeling like you are owed, like, your time is owed, like a birthday or something like that. Like, I had a bad day at work and I think that's too deep. So basically he was like, yo, I'm not like, going out meeting bitches that are like, birds. Like, these girls are decent people. I can't just be like, let me pull up.

[Maisie]

Yeah, but decent women like to just get fucked and left too.

[Mandy B]

So he was like, what about our thing was, if I ever meet a new person that I sleep with, can I at least go to a bar with them for the first time? I don't want to just go to a woman's home or they come to mind like, I need something there. I was like, fine, the first time is it. And my homeboys were laughing about it because they were like, what if he don't kill the first night? I'm like, that's his problem. That n got a motherfucking 90 out of 100 record. Fuck it. Like, you better work that night. But to be fair, something that is very important to me. And again, in decisions decisions, we're talking about non monogamy. So I love and appreciate that. Anyone he could meet while out knows he has a girlfriend. I think that's something that is part of the ethical non monogamy. You don't get the number and then say, oh, I have a girlfriend, right?

[Maisie]

You say it before the number.

[Mandy B]

Generally speaking, if that's happening, you're probably knowing this is for sexual. So I think that's where it's kind of worked out. Um, I don't know. We haven't had this conversation in a while. He ain't missing new bitches in a minute. But when we did have the convo. That was something I pressed on in the beginning. Like, are you sure you're saying it? Are you sure? Like, please make sure, because I never want to be in a position where you're a liar to someone else.

[Maisie]

Yeah, I think that's my problem. Now I know I am engaging in a lot of heavy conversation and potential relationship planning with the three guys that I'm talking to. And all of them are monogamous. And I'm, like, just hoping through conversation I could change their mind.

[Mandy B]

But what about monogamish? Having sex together? Are they okay with that?

[Maisie]

That's my problem. I like all three of them. So, like, I kind of want to date off. Oh, my God.

[Mandy B]

You guys should be up in my fantasy, y'all. You can't see and I've never wanted more than one baby. Baby's wearing a jersey. Oh, game night, Super Bowl?

[Maisie]

No. Well, none of them. None of them. None of them live in the same city. So I think, you know, if it's, you know, you know, long, long distance relationship type shit, like, we can find ways to enjoy each other. Long distance.

[Mandy B]

Yeah. Okay.

[Maisie]

I don't know.

[Mandy B]

I saw this clip, and while it's a lot to think about, I just found the opinion to be so interesting, and I thought it'd be good to share on horrible. Because we're both kind of gay.

[Maisie]

Yes.

[Alex]

So what's your take?

[Mandy B]

My take is that a lot of queer people lead hetero lives.

[Alex]

A lot of queer people lead hetero lives.

[Mandy B]

Not unpacking their homophobia.

[Alex]

Secret homos, if you will.

[Maisie]

Exactly.

[Alex]

Can I say secret homos?

[Mandy B]

Sure.

[Maisie]

Oh, no.

[Alex]

Quiet queers.

[Maisie]

Quiet queers.

[Mandy B]

Me too.

[Alex]

These quiet queers living straight lives.

[Mandy B]

Exactly.

[Alex]

Wearing khaki pants and tucked in blue T shirts saying, I'm gay, but you're not.

[Mandy B]

Well, also because they refuse to destigmatize, decolonize their brain. It's like people can be queer in identity but still remain culturally straight.

[Alex]

What is culturally straight?

[Mandy B]

Refusing to dig any deeper because that, like, ownership of the label queer, it's assumed that it, like, absolves you from kind of just doing any further work.

[Maisie]

And there's this constant process of re.

[Mandy B]

Education that's necessary to kind of due diligence.

[Alex]

Like, once you realize you are queer.

[Mandy B]

Well, I'm looking at gentrifier bisexuals, specifically.

[Alex]

Gentrifier bisexuals.

[Mandy B]

What are those Gentrifiers who are bisexuals not digging deeper into their internalized homophobia?

[Alex]

Gentrifier bisexuals are homophobic?

[Mandy B]

Yes.

[Alex]

This is Fascinating.

[Mandy B]

Yeah. Okay.

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

First of all, why do gay people always come for the bis? That's number one.

[Maisie]

They do.

[Mandy B]

Give it a break, bitch.

[Maisie]

They don't allow us to be a part of the community like that.

[Mandy B]

Now where I will give this person some credit, I will say watching her talk, I don't know if she's non binary. I feel like the way that she's using language, it could be it's giving non binary.

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

However, where I will give them credit is something specifically about culturally straight. At first I didn't understand it and I was like, oh, you could come out of the closet and still be a fucking bigot. You could be a racist, you could be pro Israel. You know what I mean? Like, there could be a lot of things about you. Just because you're queer or gay don't necessarily mean you're for the people.

[Maisie]

Well, when I heard this, I immediately, especially now being in the south and just seeing too that all my friends go to church on Sunday and being more heavily religious, being in the Bible Belt, that this is a privileged way of thinking because she's probably a New Yorker. I think the way that people can exist or be open as non binary or how they dress or how they kind of can live as their individualistic selves, New York allows that. I think the south and other parts of the country, you can. Sexuality is still something that is kept behind closed doors. And so I don't think that just because you're a man who sucks dick or a woman who eats pussy that you have to be this openly outward, gay, existing being for society.

[Mandy B]

I agree with that too.

[Maisie]

And I think that that's why she was saying culturally straight. I don't think people need to be like us that wear their labels on their shirt. I think you can go to work and everyone doesn't need to know you're gay just because you're gay. And I think that that's my point.

[Mandy B]

There's a lot of privilege sometimes in people that live out loud where they.

[Maisie]

Push you a little bit.

[Mandy B]

Right. I had to check myself recently in a conversation about just radical blackness. Like me telling someone it's gonna be XYZ like this fuck white shit, da da da. And being light skinned and being loud is a privilege, you know what I'm saying? I'm operating in a world where I can talk like that. I'm a woman, I'm young, whatever. Not every black person has this experience. Right. And so, yes, it's a privilege to be able to be loud in that I Use that as an example, because this person is out and well received by whoever or has her community. And not everybody's like that. So I think sometimes demonizing someone for not being gay enough sucks, but the only thing I did kind of ride with is like, watching gays for Trump become a thing. When I made that joke on the Breakfast Club about, I didn't even connect the dots, but it was like, oh, yeah, Trump fucks with the gays can't be trans because we're watching the gays celebrate Trump. Love him down. And then Megyn Kelly and all these other people get up there and put all this fear in your heart about trans people, and it's like, what the fuck, then? So it's just the gays, not the G's, not the Q's, not the T's. Nuh. Everybody else is confusing me. Not the non binaries. I don't like that. But this is all an umbrella for us in being fluid in your sexuality. For most trans people, I understand it's gender, not sexuality, but for most trans people, it is. And so it is a disappointment to then think that, like, you could be gay and also not necessarily be for any other civil rights.

[Maisie]

I mean, I will say bringing it back to relationships. If I think of culturally straight within the LGBTQ community as well, there's oftentimes the, well, who's the man, who's the woman, who's the feminine, who's the masculine? And so if we talk about maybe how homosexual relationships adapt or try to incorporate very heterosexual means of how to operate in relationships, I do agree that that does take unlearning, and it does take a little bit of homophobia. The idea that we have to have these heterosexual ideas even within a homosexual relationship, I do agree to a bit, but like I said, I think that there's a privilege in someone speaking that way, depending on your community where you're at. And I think if you're someone in New York, you don't understand your privilege as a queer individual and how you're able to just exist here, having places like the Village and having, you know, whole communities where there's rainbow flags take you in. It's not the same if you go to some of these sundown towns or, like I said, even in the south or going to Florida where you can't even say gay.

[Mandy B]

Did you watch the Jerry Springer doc on Netflix yet?

[Maisie]

It's not that good, unfortunately, as background noise, but, yes, it was on, so.

[Mandy B]

It'S not that good. But there was something very interesting. They Talked about where people were from. And I thought they were gonna expose Jerry Springer shit for being fake, right? And they're like, yo, we. One girl got fired for something being fake, right? And she goes, I should have known it wasn't real, cuz he was from Boston. And no, none of this shit is happening in Boston. And they circled on a map the middle of America where 80% of the Jerry Springer guests were from middle America, right? And so there's something about when you're not in the. And even a Florida is a crazy fucking town, but these are still larger cities where you get to be interacting with other people. So I think we do forget that a lot. And you hate her. But those people, we need to have grace for in accepting themselves, their sexuality and oh, no.

[Maisie]

I just think a lot of them are more ignorant than most, but it's because they haven't been exposed to more. I think they just live in their ignorance.

[Mandy B]

So I don't know if I've talked about this on Horrible, but I feel like I have. Maybe it's been a while, but I was dating a man whose brother was gay and he blamed me for exposing that. I ever tell you about that?

[Maisie]

Yeah, I think you've shared that here.

[Mandy B]

So basically the gist of it was he had a brother come from a South American country. It was Venezuela. And when he got here, he goes, gila, baby, we need to put him on the dating apps. I'm like, yeah, I met his brother for five minutes and I'm like, I know what dating app you like. And I introduced his brother to Grindr. All right? His brother ended up getting engaged to a wonderful man. They are still married to this day, by the way. And I want to say this was when I was 22, this happened. I say this to say I remember when his brother came out and said, I have a boyfriend. And he was like, bitch, you made him gay.

[Maisie]

But this was your same partner that left you for Jesus, right? Yes, but that's what I'm saying. So the homophobia within the church.

[Mandy B]

Oh, no, no, no, not him. I wanted to just say his brother was in his 20s at the time, never had heard of Grindr is leaving Venezuela. And it's like, you don't really. You need somebody like me being that doc connector to that world. How else was he gonna get that? He's living with his brother, he doesn't have friends, he's not going out. Maybe you're closeted. Maybe. And I don't know if he was closeted or not. I Just knew.

[Maisie]

Well, no, he was. He probably had internal homophobia like my friends growing up. Which is why I don't like my Latina friends saying the N word. I was friends. My best friends growing up. One was Colombian, one was Mexican. And never forget, both of their parents blamed me as to why their daughters liked black men. Not that we went to majority black schools. No, it's because they were friends with me. And so knowing that they were. Yeah. And so the fact that your parents are blaming me as to why you like black men is crazy. But I knew that that was their internalized racism towards black people. Your partner, maybe not ever expressing it, was internally homophobic. And I think. Oh, no, no, no.

[Mandy B]

He was.

[Alex]

No.

[Maisie]

Yeah.

[Mandy B]

And so that was expression. The thing about, like, how the Midwest doesn't really have community. I was so. But it's because to be that guy, like, your brother just came to a new country where we can be open.

[Maisie]

Where we can be open. Oh, the same. My. My cousin left Jamaica because he was gay. Like, and there was not safety for him in Jamaica.

[Mandy B]

Just Ed. And think about. Or even Dave. Eden, think about the way you go on a date and you kiss someone in a restaurant or on the street. Gay men fucking look over their shoulders.

[Maisie]

But are you. Are you ready? It's the same thing we're dealing with now, which is why parents and everyone, they're blaming television, they're blaming drag queens, they're blaming everything but the scientific fact that as people, psychologically, environmentally, we have these attractions to people, not because gayness was thrown into our face, but because of who we naturally are. They aren't.

[Mandy B]

You just said the drag queens. And so this weekend, I just made dinner for my man's family I've never made dinner for. And he was like, make them gumbo. And I'm like, that must be the blackest shit I make. That's why he said that.

[Maisie]

Yeah, bitch. Don't nobody want avocado toast, girl.

[Mandy B]

I'll be cooking up a Dover. So, bitch, I be there. But basically we're sitting down at the table and his dad loves politics and. Thank God. Same vibe on politics, right? Talking about how Trump is terrible and whatever and how the campaign was run for fear. And I started to say something, and I know my man was looking at me like, bitch, you better shut your liberated ass up. I said, you know what's crazier about Trump is the trans ads. I was like, how many times? Cuz they watch tv, they're watching the news. Did you see, like, the guy with the football jersey and the dress. Like, it's so crazy to me that 1% of the population made a lot of people. They say trans people are 1.3 right now and we're blessed to know about, you know what I mean?

[Maisie]

The ones were in the right job.

[Mandy B]

I was like, how crazy is it that all these people are voting red just because they're scared of this? Meanwhile they aren't scared of the guns in their kids schools. But the advertisement saying, be very scared of a man going in your kid's bathroom. Be scared of the fucking aks. And so I'm starting to go in. I know you're looking at me like, oh my God, bitch, shut up.

[Maisie]

It's funny. That's why like I like really it's funny because I just had the same conversation with Activae's dad. So he went to Europe and was with his family for the holidays and like was really excited for me to meet his parents via FaceTime. And we literally got into the discussion about freedom of speech and he was telling me about like all these little black, either Sudanese or something about the. We correlated what's happening overseas with all these little black girls that started dying, but the government not wanting to look into it because of racism. And I literally compared it to what happened with the new bill in California where there was evidence that they weren't going to look for black girls that were mixed.

[Mandy B]

Okay, okay, okay, sorry.

[Maisie]

And so like having this real like liberal conversation about also the way in which politics are in Europe compared to what they are here and that we aligned. He was like, I don't know if you have time for this. I was like, oh no, of course. And we had a whole conversation about politics.

[Mandy B]

Honestly, that's the way I realized. And it's funny cuz his dad was saying like, you know how you make a man's parents fall in love with you? You ask them if they need help in the kitchen. You care. You do these things that millennials, people just don't care about. And I was like, oh no, it's really this politics, politics.

[Maisie]

Then he switches the phone to his mom and is like, oh my God, you have her dream apartment. Give her a tour. And so I'm touring my new loft and showing it to her and she's telling me her dream was to live in New York and this thing. And it's like not you having me bond with your parents right now. Like, whoa, whoa, we haven't even. We don't know what this relationship is.

[Mandy B]

But this is becoming more people should do FaceTime meetups with parents.

[Maisie]

Yeah, it was great.

[Mandy B]

Cause it's not too much pressure. No, it's fun.

[Maisie]

I done been facetiming him for hours and his sister was a part of the conversation, so I done met the sister, the mom, the dad. I don't know.

[Mandy B]

I think that's very special.

[Maisie]

Woo. And we haven't even had sex yet. Well, crazy.

[Mandy B]

Speaking of sex, what comes after?

[Maisie]

Normally for you, but I need it before we're romantically involved at the moment, so.

[Mandy B]

No, you absolutely are. Geico's motorcycle expertise means I'm covered by.

[Koya]

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[Mandy B]

It just meant that I feel really good about my coverage.

[Koya]

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[Mandy B]

We're gonna talk a little bit before we get out of here about the history of romance, so.

[Maisie]

And we gonna stop treating this segment like homo. We gotta get here sooner, bitch. We supposed to be educating these homies. We was cooking bitch.

[Mandy B]

Okay, so, yeah, gumball. Step one. Apes evolved the ability to become.

[Maisie]

Here we go.

[Mandy B]

Emotionally attached to one another.

[Maisie]

We're doing evolution.

[Mandy B]

We said the history, ho.

[Maisie]

Oh, Lord. I don't know.

[Mandy B]

The emotional attachment would eventually be known as love. It literally started from apes growing the ability to love. And through evolution, it kind of just turned into humans evolving. So the ability to become attached to someone is then loving each other because it helps you survive.

[Maisie]

I'm curious how they did the science on this, only because what we see throughout the entire animal kingdom is the bonded connection, from ducks to lions to all the things with their offspring. Right? So I'm curious to know how they identified the romantic love.

[Mandy B]

The attachment is how they're describing it. Right? So they're saying.

[Maisie]

But they normally only notice that attachment, right, when there's offspring.

[Mandy B]

No, no, no. They're saying being around each other, spending time, okay. That then becomes a bond. So the third thing, third step. As humans, we instinctively develop loyalty and affection for those who show us most loyalty and affection. And that's all love really is. It is an irrational degree of loyalty and affection. To another person. You agree with that to the point that we'd let ourselves harm or even die for that person. Seems insane. But it's symbiotic with what happens with humans. Conversations with humans that say, I would do anything for you.

[Maisie]

Well, that's just a figure of speech.

[Mandy B]

Yeah, but I think I wouldn't die. But yeah, I would definitely do shit.

[Maisie]

You would take a charge for someone you love. Like when I hear of people, look at Edison. Oh my God.

[Mandy B]

Also, for example, let's make it small, okay?

[Maisie]

What's small? Would you put a car in someone's name? Would you put. You're different. You would put your name on something that you know could cause you debt or go into something bad because you love marriage.

[Mandy B]

Like, that's literally sharing things. Like, if I got to that point of love, that's marriage to me. I've put no, before marriage.

[Maisie]

You can love someone before marriage.

[Mandy B]

Two apartments, baby. And five at the same time. Two of my own, my mama. And two friends.

[Maisie]

A man that you are dating. We're not talking because you can love someone before marriage. Marriage is a whole nother battle.

[Mandy B]

That's my point. But I'm the friends that I put my name in.

[Maisie]

You would co sign something for a partner.

[Mandy B]

I'm not talking about a serious partner.

[Maisie]

Yeah, okay.

[Mandy B]

And I only say that because I've done it for a friend. God, I'm so crazy. I'm so fortunate that me and this nigga in the 800.

[Maisie]

It's so crazy because what I would do for friends is normally, I mean, and I've talked about my hierarchy of how I show up for people. It's friends, family, then men. And the way I show up for friends is still quite different than what I right now think logically. I could do and show up for a partner.

[Mandy B]

I mean, but it's only because platonic love comes in and so here's literally the next one. Yeah.

[Maisie]

Platonic love is.

[Mandy B]

The ancient Greek philosopher Plato argued that the highest form of love is actually non sexual.

[Maisie]

Yep.

[Mandy B]

It is a non romantic or an attachment form to another person known as brotherly love. And reason that since passion and romance often make us do things we regret, the passionless love between two family members or close friends is a height of virtuous human experience. In fact, Plato, like most people in the ancient world, looked at romantic love with skepticism, if not horror. Because with most things non sexual love, platonic love never meant that you took risk. And for most of human history, romantic love was looked at as a sickness. Bitch.

[Maisie]

I am Plato.

[Mandy B]

Yeah, you are.

[Maisie]

I'm about to read that. Nigga got books and stuff.

[Mandy B]

Oh, look at the word decision. They said poor decision making from romantic love. The ancients were so skeptical of romantic loves. You what is it useful for? So much so that many cultures treated it as an unfortunate disease that we'd have to get over in our lives. In fact, classic stories like Romeo Juliet. Romeo and Juliet weren't celebrations of love. They were warnings against negative consequences of love. For most of human history, people didn't marry because of their feelings. One of each other.

[Maisie]

And it didn't stop with the Disney Channel. This bitch gave up her voice for a nigga. Like, what else happened? What else happened in the Disney World?

[Mandy B]

Yeah, the voice was crazy, bro.

[Maisie]

Giving up your whole singer voice.

[Mandy B]

So for most of human history, for the majority, their sustenance and survival hung on by a thread. People didn't have very much of a large life expectance. Everything was done from survival. Marriages arranged by families. Families because for money. Of money. Wheat, barley, help during a flood. Purely economic arrangements designed to promote survival and prosperity between the families. And so what's interesting about today's age. People are lasting longer in age because of love.

[Maisie]

No, that's not true. Maybe love with friendships again, brotherly love.

[Mandy B]

And community. I always talk about the type in 100 on Netflix, the Centurion documentary. People living to 100.

[Maisie]

Oh, yeah, there's the women say that they all walk no matter where. They didn't. They weren't in relationships.

[Mandy B]

No, no, no. They last long because of community.

[Maisie]

Oh, community. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

[Mandy B]

Some of them have husbands or what? Or they died or whatever. I saw it, but like, the community was the consistency and the walking. Everybody else, Some, most. Some people gardened. A lot of people gardened. But the thing about community, I was like, damn. And what's sad is, you know, when people fall in love, what do they tend to do? Give up on your community.

[Maisie]

It's so crazy too. Cause that conversation is constantly had too, when people question why I don't want children. And it's funny because one of the number one things, if it's not legacy, it's, well, who's gonna take care of you when you're old? And I'm like, I said, it's so crazy because when you do look at a lot of people, and I'm not talking about you, because clearly you're looking after your older parents, but there's a lot of people that end up in nursing homes whose kids don't even come and see them, or they're in nursing homes because their kids were too busy to look after them. And what's also crazy is there is a stat that men in nursing homes are more lonely than women because they don't have the friendships that women curate over their lifetimes. Women have a lot more friends. And I know we talk about the girls that don't know how to have homegirls. There's way more community amongst women, and I think we've been able to see that even with the whorehive, than men have in terms of how they create bonds and friendships platonically.

[Mandy B]

It's so crazy thinking about nursing homes. I remember. And literally, you know, when someone does end up there, it's mainly if you have family to rely on, because they can't.

[Maisie]

The family can't help.

[Mandy B]

So I was seeing my grandma once, and my mom was probably going three times a week and, like, making meals and stuff. Cause, you know, nursing home food sucks. And I was flying down to Orlando just to, you know, keep in touch. There was a woman I saw on the other side. There was an Asian lady next to her. And I was like, oh, my God, you must be her daughter. I've never met you. And. And so she's smiling. This is true story. Doesn't reply to me. I'm leaving. She's like, I'm not her family. But we are part of an outreach thing for people that don't get visitors.

[Maisie]

Oh, wow.

[Mandy B]

And she was also Chinese. Not just Asian. Chinese. The lady was Chinese. And she was Chinese. She's like, yeah, you know, I'll just speak in Mandarin and we'll talk and we'll. Or, sorry. The woman didn't talk, but she was like, it's just memories.

[Maisie]

Conversation can keep people alive longer. You can hate these people, literally.

[Mandy B]

And so she said she gets paid to do this.

[Maisie]

Oh, wow.

[Mandy B]

She's like, sometimes I'll just come. If people can't get to their family if they don't live in the same country city. She's like, there's some people I visit four times a week. But she said this was pro bono. She does it as volunteer work. And the nursing home will say, hey, these people need someone to connect with, et cetera.

[Maisie]

Oh, wow.

[Mandy B]

Right?

[Maisie]

That's dope.

[Mandy B]

But also fucked up.

[Maisie]

That's dope. I love that. I'm not gonna lie. You about to have me go Google play doh. Like, I feel like this was a documentary, like, where I be, like, ooh, let me go look more into this.

[Mandy B]

Oh, my God.

[Maisie]

Because me and Plato on the same.

[Mandy B]

Type of time, girl, all I wanna do is brotherly love is first. Okay, if you want more whore shit. Since we're at the end and now we can curse, check us out on patreon.com horribledecisions cause we went nowhere. It's five bucks a month and you literally get plus, if you upgrade to the next tier, you get town halls and our decisions, decisions, episodes too, in video.

[Maisie]

Oh, and video.

[Mandy B]

Yeah.

[Maisie]

Yeah, we do a lot over there. And now we have a newts here where you can become a producer. So you'll be able to either let us know some of the sex history you want to hear on here. You could shoot us hypotheticals, or you could send us videos that you want us to react to. But we have now a producer tier for you guys to be a part of the show, and we are gonna literally shout you out. So if you want to have a nickname or not, we'll shout you out and give you producer credit. But yeah, that'[e-mail] HolePrecisions by the way, our book is on pre sale, so you can pre order our book, no holes barred on Amazon, on Barnes and Nobles, wherever you. No Holes Barred. Um, it's a dual manifesto of sexual exploration and power. And Weezy and I are giving you more stories than you've heard on this podcast. We're digging deep and we are hopefully giving you some insight on how to get in your journey. No, we get real deep in all the holes.

[Mandy B]

It'll make you come and cry.

[Maisie]

Yeah. So make sure you pre order our book that comes out June 24th. And again, follow us wherever. Make sure you rate, subscribe all the things. And guys, we will see you on Wednesday or next week. But we're around. Y'all got us three times a week now. Okay.

[Mandy B]

Like a threesome.

[Maisie]

Oh, my goodness.

[Mandy B]

The only threesome we'll ever have.

[Maisie]

Tree ways the three holes you can insert.

[Mandy B]

Bye.

[Maisie]

Okay, bye.

[Koya]

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