You've Got Decisions: Reverse Stealthing?

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Decisions, Decisions" – Episode: "You've Got Decisions: Reverse Stealthing?"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Decisions, Decisions
• Host/Author: The Black Effect and iHeartPodcasts
• Description: "Decisions, Decisions" delves into non-traditional relationships, challenging societal norms around dating, sex, and love with humor, vulnerability, and authenticity. Hosts Mandii B and WeezyWTF explore the complexities of modern relationships, sharing personal journeys and engaging in candid discussions.

Episode Details:

• Title: You've Got Decisions: Reverse Stealthing?
• Release Date: May 7, 2025

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Introduction to Reverse Stealthing

The episode begins with a brief promotional break highlighting the upcoming Netflix series Forever Watch, inspired by Judy Blume's novel Forever and created by Mara Brock Akil. This interlude sets the stage for the main discussion but is quickly bypassed as hosts Mandii B and WeezyWTF transition into the core topic.

Listener's Letter: Understanding Reverse Stealthing

[04:01] Mandy introduces a letter from a male listener addressing the concept of "reverse stealthing." The listener describes a complicated relationship scenario involving deceitful contraceptive practices:

Mandy (04:53): "Is it bad that I am quote, unquote, Reverse stealthing and sometimes faking it with my long-term complicated boo."

The listener elaborates on his relationship dynamics, including unprotected sex, a non-committal arrangement, and the discovery of paternity issues. He admits to secretly using vaginal contraceptive film during sexual encounters to avoid unintended pregnancies while maintaining the appearance of unprotected sex.

Defining Reverse Stealthing

[02:50] Weezy attempts to clarify the term:

Weezy (02:50): "Okay, it probably is."

However, the conversation swiftly moves to dissecting the listener's actions, leading Mandy to define "reverse stealthing" in contrast to traditional stealthing (the non-consensual removal of a condom):

Mandy (06:21): "Reverse stealthing is removing the condom. That's what I meant. Stealthing is removing the condom without the other person knowing it."

Discussion on Consent and Communication

The hosts delve into the ethical and psychological implications of the listener's behavior. They emphasize the importance of consent and open communication in sexual relationships.

Weezy (06:12): "How have we not taught you nothing? How are we not teaching you nothing? First of all, it is 100% okay to tell someone, I don't want to have sex like this."

Mandy (09:00) further elaborates on the necessity of clear communication:

Mandy (09:00): "You're violating a verbal agreement… you need to have a very serious conversation about sleeping with each other with protection."

Legal Implications and Real-World Cases

Mandy references a real case to highlight the legal consequences of stealthing, extending the discussion to reverse stealthing:

Mandy (11:42): "A man had 19 convictions to what is believed to be first in Scotland for stealthing… convicted him for stealthing… deemed him a dangerous and manipulative sexual predator."

She underscores that such actions are not only ethically wrong but also subject to legal repercussions.

Personal Experiences and Broader Impact

Both hosts share personal insights and anecdotes to contextualize the issue further.

Weezy (13:30): "I have, I think the first time I experienced it, it was almost like a form. And I hate the word gaslighting, but he was just like, you ain't tell me you, you saw it like you saw me pull it out."

Mandy reinforces the psychological manipulation involved in stealthing and reverse stealthing, stressing the violation of trust and consent.

Advice for the Listener

The bulk of the episode focuses on providing constructive advice to the listener grappling with reverse stealthing.

Weezy (16:16): Emphasizes the need for honest communication:

"You need to make it really nice and clean and be like, hey, after that whole thing that happened last time… I want to pull out. That's my safe form."

Mandy (17:11): Suggests actionable steps:

"Bring this up to her and let it be known that you do not want children with her… suggest a form of birth control… have a serious conversation about sleeping with protection."

They collectively advocate for transparent discussions about contraception and relationship expectations to prevent deceitful practices.

Legal Context and Societal Impact

Mandy informs listeners about the legal standing of stealthing across different jurisdictions:

Weezy (13:08): "Self thing is considered a form of rape. … states that ban something, by the way, in the United States are California, Maine and Washington."

She highlights the prevalence of stealthing, mentioning that 19 to 32% of women have experienced it before the age of 35, thereby emphasizing its widespread nature and the urgent need for awareness.

Concluding Remarks and Final Advice

As the episode wraps up, Mandy and Weezy reiterate the importance of advocating for oneself and fostering open dialogues about sexual health and consent.

Mandy (19:46): "There’s a way to still have protected sex and make it sexy… I've done it with plenty of partners… protected sex is not less sexy."

They encourage listeners to engage with their content through Patreon, Discord, and social media, fostering a community around these critical conversations.

Key Takeaways:

• Reverse Stealthing Defined: The act of secretly using contraceptives without a partner's knowledge during sexual activity.
• Consent is Crucial: Open and honest communication about contraception and sexual expectations is essential to maintain trust and respect in relationships.
• Legal Consequences: Stealthing, including reverse stealthing, is increasingly recognized legally as a form of sexual assault or rape in certain jurisdictions.
• Personal Responsibility: Individuals must take responsibility for their actions and prioritize clear communication to avoid manipulative behaviors.

Notable Quotes:

• Mandy (09:16): "If you're in a position where this is clearly just a fuck friend… you need to have a very serious conversation about sleeping with each other with protection."
• Weezy (08:57): "We've all been there, there's been something… you gonna end up exactly where you don't wanna be."

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This episode of "Decisions, Decisions" offers a profound exploration of the ethical and legal ramifications of reverse stealthing, underscoring the necessity of consent and transparent communication in all sexual interactions. Mandii B and WeezyWTF provide valuable insights and practical advice, encouraging listeners to prioritize honesty and mutual respect in their relationships.

Transcript

[Mandy]

You're listening to an iHeart podcast. All right, guys, we're taking a break from this week's episode of Decisions Decisions to put you on game. All right? Inspired by Judy Blume's groundbreaking 1975 novel Forever Watch the reimagined coming of age series about young love by Mara Brock Akil, the iconic creator of Girlfriends, this epic love story follows two black teens, Keisha and Justin, as they explore romance and their identities through the awkward journey of being each other's first watch. Forever. Premiering May 8th only on Netflix.

[Weezy]

If you would like to have us answer your questions, if you have a terrible job, a terrible boyfriend, or a terrible thruffle, guess what? You've got decisions.

[Mandy]

It's another Wednesday in another you got decision, y'all.

[Weezy]

We're doing our you got decisions from Atlanta and New York. This is spring special. This is special because we have a book tour coming up. We have so many things planned, so we were like, you know what? We need to take it back old school. And if you're an OG Hive member, y'all always love the tea that was virtual. So there's not going to be much.

[Mandy]

Tea virtual here because maybe it's you got decisions. And we're reading your letters. And if you haven't yet, make sure you send over your letter. Your question to decisionspodmail.com before we get into you got decisions, make sure that you pre order no holds barred and come join us. Bringing the book from the pages to the stages. We're on tour. Make sure you go to NHB tour. Com. This week we are reading a letter from a male listener, and it's quite interesting, if I may say so in the least. Now, the subject matter for this is, quote, unquote, reverse stealthing. Question mark now, if you guys don't know stealthing, stealthing is something that is a criminal act. And what's crazy about that is I share about my stealthing experience in the book no holds barred under my, um, sexual assault chapters. So I'm really interesting to get into this. And this stuck out. So again, if you have a question, make sure you send in your letter to decisionspotmail.com so that we could read it here on our second drop of the week, you've got decisions. And again, if you want to see the video of this, make sure you subscribe to our patreon patreon.com Horrible decisions. All right, let's see if this is actually reverse stealthing. Weezy.

[Weezy]

Okay, it probably is.

[Mandy]

Is it bad that I am quote, unquote, Reverse stealthing and sometimes faking it with my long term complicated boo. She and I have been doing the grown up for over five years with no commitment. However, a few years ago she had my baby, quote unquote. When a couple of months later, DNA proved that it was not mine. No big deal, bitch. The tea. No big deal. We get back to doing the grown up. I end up having a baby on her. I know, messy. Now though, she is fervently adamant about having my baby. Cream pies and no condoms. I am not with this idea however. So I'm sneaking, slipping in on contraceptive films and during back shots faking it. Thoughts? So I don't know how she doesn't know she's not getting cream pride and I don't know about contraceptive film.

[Weezy]

I think she does know and I think it's just a turn on.

[Mandy]

What do you mean?

[Weezy]

Like, okay, so for a while my partner and I were going crazy with the baby kink. Like it's also known as a breeding kink and it's basically just the idea that somebody can get you pregnant or talking about the cream pies or talking about the type of sex you're having. Sometimes it's not literal. Like literally maybe once a week I'm like, oh, give me pregnant, I don't want to.

[Mandy]

So wait, you think she actually doesn't want to have a baby by him at all and she's just saying it as a part of like dirty talk?

[Weezy]

If, if she is really like not noticing, I do have a feeling she might know that they're just being dirty. However, I don't like that there's no other backstory for this baby that wasn't yours and why you still fucking. Also when he said we're doing the grown up, I need to know what this person looks like. Let's reverse engineer the email. We're doing the grownup.

[Mandy]

I guess. You know I never give a fuck about what nobody looked like. I believe good looking people and ugly people and everything in between is fucking. My thing was I'm curious because I wonder maybe this isn't a guy because I just looked up that VCF is vaginal contraceptive. So I don't understand how the baby wasn't hers or his because I don't understand how you could use vaginal contraceptive film. Oh, it's spermicide. How do you get a woman to do that without her knowing? Or maybe that's just a part of. I'm only going to come in you if we do this. So essentially Even though she wants a baby, he's adding these other elements so. So that she doesn't get pregnant.

[Weezy]

Because now. Right, right. Like, in case.

[Mandy]

Okay.

[Weezy]

Because herbicide is a liquid gel.

[Mandy]

Yeah. VCF film is a soft square film that dissolves with your body's natural moisture to create a gel barrier that coats the cervix and kills sperm on contact for up to three hours.

[Weezy]

So, so many questions, because how have we not taught you nothing? How are we not teaching you nothing? First of all, it is 100% okay to tell someone, I don't want to have sex like this. I don't want to have sex unprotected. This isn't turning me on.

[Mandy]

I. I agree. I think the fact that. Oh, oh, oh, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Weezy]

Now you're sitting here putting chemical.

[Mandy]

Wait a second. Wait a second. I'm rereading this, which I don't know if I like, so I am not with this idea. So I'm sneaking. He's slipping in and on contraceptive films during back shots. So wait a second. He is sneaking contraceptive, which is why it's probably reverse self thing. So again, if you guys don't know reverse self thing, it is removing the condom. That's what I meant. Stealthing is removing the condom without the other person knowing it. And so essentially, he is sneaking and slipping in and on this contraceptive film. So the VCF is being slid on and in her during back shots. Bitch, I don't. I ain't gonna hold you to me. I never thought of reverse something like that. But the fact that he is on the opposite end not technically wanting to get her pregnant. So not having unprotected sex doesn't sit well with him because clearly he's aware of the consequences. So he's sneaking contraceptive during the act. And it's not even like he's sliding on a condom. He's sliding on vaginal contraceptive.

[Weezy]

Like, I'm gonna be real with you. This is just a testimony, and this is no shade to the listener. I guess it is for some reason. We have a very difficult time advocating for ourselves when we're uncomfortable. And we have very difficult times with hard conversations. And this is why this is happening. For example, one of my homegirls and her man, whenever they, like, get kinky or whatever, she'll say, come in me or do this or no, he'll say, I want to come in you. She doesn't want to ruin the moment, and then she ends up taking plan B. So.

[Mandy]

Oh, hell no. Plan B cannot be popped like Skittles.

[Weezy]

She's like, it's not like I'm telling him no. I've never had the conversation about no. Sometimes I want to get it over with. Sometimes I just don't want to make it awkward because it's very sexy. And then I end up being the one that has to take this thing. I actually do understand somebody feeling so uncomfortable to like a conversation being so hard, but at the end of the day, what you're doing is absolutely wrong and weird.

[Mandy]

It is. It is weird. Yeah. And I would not even know she's.

[Weezy]

Doing something that you don't want. That's the other thing too. That whole conversation of I want you to get me pregnant, blah, blah, blah. It could be sex talk, could be serious, but what you need to do is find out. Talking about we're having, doing grown stuff, nigga, go be grown.

[Mandy]

Grown stuff is also having the conversation. I mean, to me, if you're in a position where this is clearly just a fuck friend, you guys were fucking for over five years with no commitment. Um, even after she thought she was pregnant by you and DNA proved that it wasn't your baby, y'all continued and went back to clearly sleeping with each other unprotected. You were also dealing with someone else. So I will say this. If anything else, the fact that you said you had a baby, quote unquote, on her brings me to believe and brings me to the conclusion that you're having sex with multiple partners, technically unprotected. You giving her the contraceptive film without her knowing during back shots also lets me know that in other positions during the act, there is a possibility that there is no contraceptive at all being used. And so to me, the conversation has to be had and you need to let her know, Hey, I do not because you put not in all caps in this email, sir, you do not want a baby with her, and although you enjoy sleeping with her, you do not want to procreate, which then in that case, it needs to be a very serious conversation about sleeping with each other with protection, her getting on birth control, or you guys stop stopping the grown up altogether.

[Weezy]

Because if we being real about it, this is so ghetto for me to say, but this is something I've said for a long time. Getting pregnant, you can pay to get rid of you over here. Go having raw grown up time with a woman that was clearly sleeping with someone else when you thought she had your baby in you. So have you heard of any sexually transmitted disease and you worried about that, that part I think you gotta get your shit together, bro. I appreciate the vulnerability and being honest about like, hey, I'm faking it, I'm doing this, I'm doing that. But everyone listening, we've all been there, there's been something. Whether it be sexual, romantic, anything. In this particular situation, you gonna end up exactly where you don't wanna be. And it's either with something that burned or with a baby to cry.

[Mandy]

Yeah. I also want to let you know, and this is, I know this is reverse stealth thing, but you don't want this to be ever used with you. Recently in BBC. So this is an article from 2024. So just last year a man had 19 convictions to what is believed to be first in Scotland for stealthing, of course. Again, where a condom is removed or not used without a knowledge, partner's knowledge. And at 35 years old, he has been jailed and charged with the abuse of nine women.

[Weezy]

Wow.

[Mandy]

But this is from a 12 year period where he subjected a lot of his victims to physical, mental, yes, sexual abuse, but they ended up actually convicting him for stealthing. So you also don't want to be deemed. And I want to let you know what the, the police in Scotland coined this guy to be a dangerous and manipulative sexual predator. Now that's my thing with this. What you're doing on a psychological side of this thing is you're manipulating her to believe something is happening during sex that isn't really happening.

[Weezy]

I mean, I guess it's not necessarily quote unquote reverse in the most horrible way because it's not the most horrible.

[Mandy]

I agree.

[Weezy]

Self thing is considered a form of rape. Right, Right. The states that ban something, by the way, in the United States are California, Maine and Washington. But there are no other laws covering this. And the interesting thing about the rates, 19 to 32% of women have experienced stealthing before the age of 35.

[Mandy]

Yes. And I am of this statistic.

[Weezy]

I have, I think the first time I experienced it, it was almost like a form. And I hate the word gaslighting, but he was just like, you ain't tell me you, you saw it like you saw me pull it out.

[Mandy]

You saw both times for me, I did not see it. And of course men normally will try to make you feel better by saying things like, oh my God, it was just feeling so good, I wanted to feel it all. Or oh my God, you're just so tight. I just wanted to like they'll gaslight you to why they did it. The reason However, I do want to say you can still be considered, and not, of course, in the. In the grand scheme, but in terms of being manipulative in the sense of sex. Sex, I say all the time, is 90% psychological, 10% physical. And to me, we've been sitting here debating for weeks about what happened with the Shannon Sharp ordeal, and there's so many layers to that. But one thing that I keep coming back to is the fact that she explicitly said the things that she didn't want and you did it anyways. So if this woman is explicitly saying that she doesn't want protection and you're doing it anyways, you're violating a verbal agreement, so to speak, on what the two of you agreed upon. This sexual experience would be in no way, shape or form whether you're putting protection on or technically making this experience, quote unquote, safer and of less consequence. I don't think in any act should you go into an agreement with someone to say you're going to do something sexually and during the act, change from doing the thing that you both agreed upon. All right, guys, we're taking a break from this week's episode of Decisions Decisions to put you on game, all right? Inspired by Judy Blume's groundbreaking 1975 novel Forever Watch, the reimagined coming of age series about young love by Mara Brock Akil, the iconic creator of Girlfriends, this epic love story follows two black teens, Keisha and Justin, as they explore romance and their identities through the awkward journey of being each other's first watch forever. Premiering May 8th only on Netflix.

[Weezy]

The largest issue, too, is that there's no communication at all.

[Mandy]

Yeah, one girl is.

[Weezy]

I mean, one party is asking for something and you're complying to that you actually really don't want. So the crazier thing about this message is that you're the one who is being that avoidant. I feel like the email should be, hey, like, this guy is saying this to me and I see this happening. It's actually a pretty weird scenario.

[Mandy]

It's the guy who wrote in.

[Weezy]

I know.

[Mandy]

I'm saying, oh, normally, yes, you're right, you're right, you're right.

[Weezy]

You know, the fact that someone thinks they're doing something with you that's consensual. And it's absolutely not like, yeah, no, I feel like my feelings would be hurt if someone was like, hey, I've been slipping on spermicide. I'd be like, damn, why are you just saying something? You know?

[Mandy]

Well, then advice then. Do you do you think that this is a larger conversation? Does he admit to what he's been doing or moving forward, should he just suggest, hey, we're not committed, I don't really want kids right now. I want to only fuck with protection. How would you advise him?

[Weezy]

Well, he doesn't want to have sex. Protection. He just doesn't want to.

[Mandy]

No, he doesn't want to have kids with her.

[Weezy]

No, no, no. He's not using condoms on purpose. He. He's only doing the spermicide. Cause of this cream pie talk. So I think in reality, you need to cut all that out because how.

[Mandy]

Does he approach the situation? Because, okay, maybe it's not condoms, but clearly he feels safer using spermicide. He's using it without her knowledge. So should he recommend this to her? How would you suggest. What would your advice be to him to actually communicating this to this partner?

[Weezy]

Oh, I think you've got to make it really nice and clean and be like, hey, after that whole thing that happened last time with the baby, it makes me real uncomfortable when we start talking about babies during sex. So I want to just leave all that cream pie stuff out. Like, I want to pull out. That's my safe form. Which, by the way, don't stop baby pull out. Yeah.

[Mandy]

No, no, no, no. Way too grown. We in our 30s. A man saying I'll pull out to me is not enough knowing that you don't want a baby. That's what I'm saying.

[Weezy]

To say that that doesn't turn you on?

[Mandy]

Well, no, she. But if he feels comfortable with the contraception being vaginal film, then that is the contraception that you alert her of and that she agrees to using. It doesn't have to be condoms. Clearly there's other ways of contraception. But he doesn't want a baby, and pulling out is not a realistic form of birth control. We all know that as adults. So to me, then my advice would be, is to bring this up to her and let it be known that you do not want children with her. You're not interested in having any other kids with her or just because you don't want them. And to suggest a form of birth control. Maybe she doesn't want to use vcf. So then you go to condoms. Maybe she's willing to get on birth control. There's a lot of options for contraception, but if you feel safer still engaging in sex with her with the use of a contraception, that becomes a conversation that you have with her. It's that simple. Like, it's not that you don't like using contraception because you're using it just without the knowledge of her. And I think that maybe you find a way to still make it sexy. I mean, y'all know I'm an advocate on safe sex, protected sex, condom dick. And so I'm aware that you can still have all the fun. My advice, too, would be, is maybe not saying, you know, in terms of dirty talk, not that you want to put a baby inside of her, but that you want to put all the babies on her or you want her to swallow your baby or you want them on her back, you can place the baby somewhere else.

[Weezy]

No, Mandy looked directly into the camera, into my soul when she said, I would like to go.

[Mandy]

I mean, there's other odds.

[Weezy]

I'll get advice, though. Yeah.

[Mandy]

I think there's a way to make protected sex sexy. And I know that there's all these stigmas and things said on these podcasts and social media about protected sex not being sexy. I 100%, 100,000% disagree with that. And there's a way to still have protected sex and make it sexy. Trust me, I've done it with plenty of partners that y'all have heard on this podcast and currently doing it with my partner now, and we are exclusive together. So the fact that you could still have sexy, protected sex with someone you're with or not with definitely takes the conversation, especially in terms of family planning. Um, so hope that we helped you again. If you have any comments on this, make sure you join our Patreon. We love to talk to you. There's a Discord channel where the conversation continues and you could always leave comments underneath the clip on our social media at underscore. Decisions, decisions. Again, guys, make sure you buy your ticket and get your pre order, no holds barred, get your ticket for the tour. Nhb tour dot com. All right, guys. Well, thank you guys so much for tuning in to another you Got Decisions. Make sure you join us every Wednesday.

[Weezy]

See you next Wednesday.

[Mandy]

Bye. You're listening to an iHeart podcast.