Lea DeLaria — on breaking barriers as a queer comic, and finding unexpected fame with ‘Orange Is the New Black'

Summary

Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson

Episode: Lea DeLaria — on breaking barriers as a queer comic, and finding unexpected fame with ‘Orange Is the New Black’
Date: September 30, 2025
Location: Little Owl, West Village, NYC

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Episode Overview

In this warm, hilarious, and searching episode, Jesse Tyler Ferguson sits down with his long-time friend, comedian and actor Lea DeLaria. Over breakfast at New York’s iconic Little Owl, they reminisce about nearly three decades of friendship, the early years in New York theater, and Lea’s trailblazing comedy career. The conversation spans Lea's historic coming out on national TV, the transformative impact of "Orange Is the New Black,” the art of reclaiming slurs, family stories, and unforgettable showbiz moments. DeLaria’s signature bawdy wit, candor, and vulnerability shine as she and Jesse reflect on queer history, chosen family, and loving oneself—warts and all.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Friendship & New York Beginnings

• First Meeting: Jesse and Lea recall meeting in 1997 while doing On the Town in Central Park—a pivotal, career-defining moment for both.
  • “I remember what your screensaver was when we met. … Lance Bass.” (04:46, B)
• Quirky Tech & Early Days: Nostalgia for “candy colored Apple Macs” and playing You Don’t Know Jack together. (05:02)
• Musical Roots: Lea talks about her jazz pianist father taking her to gigs as an eight-year-old, fostering a lifelong love of applause.
  • “He’d go, ‘Here’s my daughter,’ and out I'd come … the little eight-year-old freak. And I'd sing whatever, ‘Summertime’…” (09:44, B)

2. Family, Humor, and Identity

• Family Pranks: Hilarious story of Lea and her siblings tricking their mother with the name “Mike Hunt.”
  • “I remember specifically, she goes, ‘I can't picture Mike Hunt.’” (16:27, A)
• Inherited Wit: Lea reflects on her blend of her mother’s smart, dry humor and her father’s goofiness.
  • “I always feel like I kind of got a really good combination of both of them in my sense of humor.” (17:18, B)
• Relationships: Patterns of being drawn to “really quiet” women “who are fucking hilarious,” echoing her mother. (17:47)

3. Career Firsts & Breakthroughs

• Getting the Equity Card: Both reminisce about earning their union cards via On the Town. Lea was already a cabaret and stand-up staple, but broke new ground in theater.
  • “Here’s my boyfriend, he’s much younger than me. This is his first professional job and he’s fucking fearless.” (21:13, B)
• Game-Changing New York Times Review: Lea describes reading a rave review that changed her life, literally sitting on the curb crying.
  • “By the time I got to the third paragraph, that’s when I sat down on the curb… and actually started kind of crying… I knew my life was gonna change dramatically.” (23:33, B)

4. Breaking Barriers as a Queer Comic

• Historic TV Moment: Jesse highlights Lea as the “first openly gay comic on American television,” referencing her 1993 Arsenio Hall Show appearance (“a few years before [Jesse] met [her]”) (31:18).
• Trailblazing Visibility: Lea recounts how few queer comics were out publicly in the early 1990s (“I can do it on one hand. Really.” (32:08, B)), and the parallel rise of RuPaul and herself.
• Reclaiming Slurs: Lea and Arsenio’s pushback against network lawyers over use of “dyke," "fag," and "queer"—a major act of reclamation and representation.
  • “She’s a dyke, and if she wants to call herself a dyke, who the fuck are we to tell her she can’t call herself a dyke? So it’s going on.” (35:49, B, quoting Arsenio Hall)
  • “It’s called reclamation. It’s a political tool. … Whenever anybody says to me, ‘Lea, don’t call yourself a dyke,’ I generally respond, ‘Well, you sound like a self-loathing fag.’” (36:26, B)

5. “Orange Is the New Black” & Butch Representation

• Game-Changer: The extraordinary, global impact of Orange Is the New Black.
  • “It’s watched still by over 200 million people in over 200 countries still… It’s crazy.” (30:46, B)
• Butch Joy and Pain: Big Boo provided butch lesbians representation, visibility, and affirmation. Lea reflects on the emotional reaction from fans and the shared hardships of “butch” identity.
  • “These butches come up to me on the street and cry… It was the first time I ever saw myself in a television show… We all went through the thing where our moms are trying to make us wear a dress… We’ve all been despised by our own community…” (44:25, B)
• Changes in the Community: Shifted attitudes towards gender presentation and queerness, thanks to shows like OITNB and RuPaul’s Drag Race: “That has changed within our community. But before that, we were despised.” (44:25, B)

6. Showbiz Stories & Annoyances

• Recurring Typecasting: Lea’s early Hollywood niche was “the lesbian who inappropriately hits on straight women, PE teachers and police lieutenants.” (41:45, B)
• Naked Anecdotes: Absurd stories of being repeatedly walked in on (naked) during Broadway’s On the Town, including a mortified Betty Comden and Adolph Green.
  • “I am buck ass naked… with my big butt towards the door, inserting a tampon…” (39:14, B)

7. The “U-Haul” Joke Origin & Queer Comedy Legacy

• Origin Story: Lea explains how she invented the now-classic “What does a lesbian bring on a second date? A U-Haul.” joke.
  • “Well, if you’re like most lesbians on a second date, you’ll bring a U-Haul. And the laugh was so humongous.” (50:08, B)
  • The joke first appeared on the album Bulldyke in a China Shop.
• Legacy & Impact: The enduring universality and relatability of the joke for the queer community.

8. Love, Life, and Chosen Family

• Upcoming Marriage: Lea is marrying her fiancée Dahlia in a gothic wedding on November 22nd (JFK assassination date—“seemed appropriate for a goth wedding”). Jesse is best man; Vanessa Williams will sing. (52:51)
• Aging & Enduring Friendship: The episode ends on loving, ribald banter about friendship, getting older, and finally “marrying Lea off at the ripe age of 99.” (53:14, A)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Don’t put this butch in a box. I wanted pink and bubbly.” — Lea DeLaria (05:59)
• “My humor? Always. Always. But my family was always really, really, really funny.” – Lea, on growing up with humor in the household. (17:05)
• “You weren’t afraid of me. You were like, toe to toe… And again, a lot of people at that time were intimidated by me, you know, so it was really kind of fab to have you just be… Boom. Right, you know, right there.” — Lea (21:13)
• “That was stupid. … You said, ‘I am not hiding. I was told to stay here.’ … That 21-year-old kid just let the choreographer have it. I… fell in love with you.” — Lea (21:13)
• “By the time I got to the third paragraph, that’s when I sat down on the curb… and actually started kind of crying… I knew my life was gonna change dramatically.” — Lea, on her breakthrough NY Times review (23:33)
• “He [Arsenio] came in, he sat down with me, he was like, ‘Go out and tell your truth, be you. Blah, blah, blah, blah. You’re on this show because we know how good you are.’… And then I just went out and I kind of tore the roof off the fucker, as they say.” — Lea (35:04)
• “‘She’s a dyke, and if she wants to call herself a dyke, who the fuck are we to tell her she can’t call herself a dyke?’ So it’s going on. He fought hard for it and he won.” — Lea (35:49, quoting Arsenio Hall)
• “These butches come up to me on the street and cry… It was the first time I ever saw myself in a television show.” — Lea, on Orange Is the New Black (44:25)
• “We have our own culture, and we should celebrate that. And those of us who are here presenting it every, every day in a way that maybe you’re not comfortable doing, you should relax and let them be who they are. We’re letting you be who you are.” — Lea (44:25)
• “If you’re like most lesbians on a second date, you’ll bring a U-Haul.” — Lea (50:08)
• “I'm your best man.” “I know. I'm very excited about that, too. And Vanessa’s singing.” — Jesse & Lea on the wedding (53:06)

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Important Timestamps

• 04:46–05:02 – Reminiscing about first meeting, old computers, early NYC days
• 09:44–10:45 – Lea’s childhood, dad’s jazz gigs, early love of applause
• 16:22–17:34 – The “Mike Hunt” family prank story
• 20:05–23:33 – On the Town, earning Equity card, career-changing review
• 31:18–37:17 – Arsenio Hall, queer comic visibility, reclaiming slurs
• 44:25 – Orange Is the New Black, butch pride, and queer representation
• 39:14 – Naked backstage encounters & Broadway chaos
• 50:08–51:28 – The origination and legacy of the “U-Haul” lesbian joke
• 52:51 – Lea’s wedding plans, chosen family
• 53:38 – Loving teasing on aging and their decades-long friendship

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Tone & Atmosphere

The episode is loose, laughter-filled, intimate, and delightfully raucous—a blend of deep tenderness and crass humor, just as their friendship is. Both are unfiltered but affectionate. Even discussions of hardship, prejudice, and identity are laced with wit and empathy.

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Conclusion

This episode is a must-listen for fans of queer history, New York theater, or anyone who cherishes chosen family. Lea DeLaria’s journey from pioneering comic to global TV icon is relived alongside Jesse Tyler Ferguson’s own growth, all underpinned by genuine respect, joy, and camaraderie.

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Next Week Teaser: Kerri Preston (True Blood, The Good Wife, Elsbeth) joins Jesse for more candid, colorful conversation.

Transcript

[A]

So I'm currently traveling abroad in London right at the moment, which is why so many of my episodes have people with British accents right now. It's amazing here. I love it. And until I need directions or restaurant recs or anything. And I've got no wi fi and sky high roaming fees, which is just. It's not cute. That's why I started using Saily. Saily is an easy to use ESIM app created by the folks behind NordVPN. It gives you instant mobile data in over 190 countries and you only have to install it once. That means I didn't have to line up at the airport for a SIM card, get scammed outside the train station, or keep hunting for public wi fi signals like it's a rare Pokemon. Seriously, I sat outside of Wagamama the other day trying to get onto their wi fi for probably 20 minutes. I just opened the app, picked a regional plan and boom. I had reliable Internet from Italy to Greece without switching a thing. Plus Saily offers private features and 24. 7 support, which makes me feel a whole lot more secure out here. Get 15% off your Saly plan with the code dinnersonme just download the Saly app or head to saily.com dinnersonme s A-I-L y.com dinnersonme stay connected and don't miss your dinner reservation. After doing Here We Are in London and then Shakespeare in the park in New York City this summer I realized something. My closet is a little tired. I am really good on clothes for the rehearsal room, but I definitely need some new basics. Luckily, Macy's is coming through with their fall VIP fashion preview. 30% off their best brands plus 15% off beauty. For me, I'm eyeing Hugo Boss, Scotch and soda and Lacoste. Great pieces I can wear to meetings, a taping of dinners on me, or just chasing my kids around. For those who want the feminine touch, Macy's has Karl Lagerfeld, Paris, Calvin Klein, Avec Lafeu, French Connection, and the beauty picks are heavy hitters like Lacombe, Clinique, Estee Lauder, ysl, Armani, Guerlain, Valentino, Caroline Herrera. The Fall VIP Fashion Preview runs September 25th through October 5th at Macy's.com or in store. I'll be there pretending to quote unquote, help my friend shop while secretly picking out a whole new wardrobe for myself. Hi, it's Jesse. Today on the show. I know her as my girlfriend in the 1997 production of on the Town. You know her as Big Boo on it is my dear, dear friend, comedian and actor Lea DeLaria.

[B]

Ru had his own talk show on MTV.

[A]

Yeah, I remember that.

[B]

I was his first guest.

[A]

I didn't know that.

[B]

That's a fact. Yeah, I was his first guest. I remember the first question he asked. Cause the Spice Girls were really hot. And he said, which Spice Girl are you? And I said, old Spice.

[A]

This is dinner's on Me. And I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. All right. I am so excited to finally have Leah on this show. We have known each other for almost three decades, and she really does go down as the guest on the show who I've known the longest. I asked her to do this while I was in town doing Shakespeare in the park and she said yes. I'm so excited that she is finally going to be a guest on this show. She's probably angry at me for not having her on earlier. But you know what? That's fine. She's just gonna have to deal with it. I'm here at Little Owl in the West Village. It's a corner spot that feels quintessentially New York. The restaurant takes its name from the little faux owls the homeowners once perched outside to keep woodpeckers away. But inside, it's all warmth and comfort. The menu mixes chef Joey Campanero's Italian American roots recipes, inspired by cooking alongside his grandmother, with seafood he brings back from his own fishing trips and local market finds. I should say the building itself is a little bit famous. TV fans will instantly recognize it as the place Ross, Rachel, Monica, Chandler and Joey lived on Friends. Yep, the fire escape and all. Which makes it kind of the perfect place to bring Today's guest, Lea DeLaria, who not only loves a cozy neighborhood hang, but also had her own unforgettable cameo on Friends. Oh, Leah's coming in. Okay, get ready for this one. And by the way, apologies to the editor in advance. Good luck editing this one together. I was thinking, like, you definitely 100% hold the record for the person who's been on this podcast who's known me the longest without question.

[B]

I love it.

[A]

We met.

[B]

I remember what your screensaver was when we met.

[A]

Tell me. Screensaver.

[B]

Lance Bass.

[A]

My computer.

[B]

Yeah, that was your screensaver.

[A]

Wait, I didn't have a laptop. I must have had, like a desktop.

[B]

It was like you had a desktop.

[A]

Like one of those Apple Macs.

[B]

Candy colored Apple Macs we used to play. You don't know Jack on it.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

Are we supposed to order food too? Leah I guess we are.

[A]

I mean, I don't know.

[B]

I took my Ozempic, so.

[A]

Oh, good. Leah's a diabetic. Just so everyone knows.

[B]

I just want everyone in podcast land to know that I'm not trying to lose weight with diet with my Ozempic.

[A]

But it's a nice.

[B]

I'm a diabetic.

[A]

She actually were one of the first people on ozempic back in 1914. Okay. When they discovered it. I'm on coffee, please. Oh, yeah, well, yeah, I'll do a. I'll do a oatmeal latte.

[B]

You got it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you have anything sparkling? Sure. Okay. Anything pink? Yes, I want. I love pink and bubbly. You got it. Don't put this butch in a box. I wanted pink and bubbly.

[A]

I know you do.

[B]

You're so wrong. That was so wrong. That joke. Is that gonna be edited out or is this an X rated podcast or. That was probably more like PG13.

[A]

PG13? Yeah, that was like under the sweater but above the bra.

[B]

When I first started doing stand up in 1980, as you know, that's when they really changed the rating system. So I had this joke because it was like Halloween time, so slashers were out there everywhere. So I explained to the audience the difference between a PG and a PG 13. And in a PG 13, you could touch a woman's breast. In a PG you couldn't touch it, but you could hack it off with a chainsaw.

[A]

It's true.

[B]

And that actually was true. Why do you think I sold it?

[A]

That's really totally wrong.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But you get a hack off the chainsaw. Oh my God.

[B]

So yeah, that's how old I am.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The rating System didn't have PG13 until I was in my 20s.

[A]

That's hilarious. Oh, my God.

[B]

Is that my pink and sparkling? Sure is. I'm sorry, Jesse, to do this in front of you. Why?

[A]

Because I don't drink.

[B]

I don't care. I don't give a. I don't care if you drink or not. As you know.

[A]

Latte. Do you know what you want?

[B]

I would like a double espresso as well, please.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Could I get a little cream with that? Yeah. I'm gonna have a drink flight in a second. Just offer you some specials.

[A]

Oh, yeah, Yeah.

[B]

I also want to point out our meatball sliders. They're gonna be on this menu.

[A]

Okay, I see those are signature gravy meatball sliders.

[B]

The pork, veal and beef in each slider. And then we also have some pork Enchiladas. On Friday, you're gonna get two enchiladas served with a tomatillo sauce, poached egg over top, and it comes with some green salad.

[A]

That's 1,000% what I'm getting. I had no idea that I was gonna have an enchilada this morning.

[B]

Go for the enchilada.

[A]

Jesus, that's.

[B]

Remember when we couldn't actually order anything remotely Mexican in New York City? Yeah, because everything was shit. Everything was shit.

[A]

But not anymore. It's great.

[B]

Oh, man, it was so great when I lived in Bushwick. And now that I live in Inwood, ask me what the stop is that I live off of.

[A]

What's the stop of the A train that you live off of in Inwood?

[B]

Dyckman.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. No, I. Leah. I was in a sublet in Inwood for a little while. On the corner of Dyckman and Seaman.

[B]

Oh, my God. You know that, right? One block up from there is Seaman and Cumming. Did you not know that? Oh, I've sent a picture of that to Alan so many times because it's spelled exactly like his name. C, U, M, M, I, N, G. Seaman and Cumming. I couldn't. I couldn't.

[A]

That's really funny.

[B]

I laughed so hard for the time.

[A]

You stayed at my house. You're like, I'm not drinking, honey. I'm not drinking this weekend. And then you, like, opened a beer and you're like, beer's not.

[B]

You're not drinking. I knew you would love that.

[A]

No, honey, beer's not drinking. Okay, wait, let's order. I'm gonna order that enchilada.

[B]

I so damn Ozempic. I can't.

[A]

You can have a bite of it.

[B]

Can I have a bite of your enchilada? I mean, that's good. I mean, if I would get anything, I'd probably get just, like, some lightly scrambled eggs. Is that possible? I would love some lightly scrambled eggs. I'll bet. And if I only eat two bites, don't hate me. I won't. It's not because of the food, I promise.

[A]

Because she's on an Ozempic diet, Hannie, so. Okay. So tell me about your early musical experience, though.

[B]

When I was a kid, so my dad was. Was. My dad was a jazz pianist, and he would play piano in St. Louis and East St. Louis. Very famous jazz, like, area. Just the nightclub CD, things like that. So when I was about. I guess about 8 years old, he started taking me to gigs. And, like, the. Like, he would say, you know, I was like the bearded lady. He'd go, here's my daughter. And out I'd come, the little eight year old freak. And I'd sing whatever, Summertime, something like that, you know what I mean? Whatever was good and the audience just loved it.

[A]

Would you wear a little dress?

[B]

I did.

[A]

That's really cute.

[B]

I know. You've seen pictures of me in a little dress. Yes, I know.

[A]

I was baiting that answer. And you know, that's like late at night, he's bringing his daughter out to jazz clubs and she's singing Summertime. And people were excited to see her.

[B]

Oh, my God. They loved it. Yeah, they loved it. And of course, that made me just completely fall in love with applause.

[A]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[B]

What is it that I'm living for, you know?

[A]

Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we return, Leah and I do something that we're basically gonna do a lot on this episode. We take a trip down memory lane. We recall our first impressions of each other and the time she took me to my first gay pride parade. Okay, be right back. After a morning Pilates class, I am sweaty, I am tired, and I need something that's gonna refuel me fast. That's when I head straight to Tropical Smoothie Cafe. Their Peanut paradise smoothie is my go to. It's got 22 grams of protein, it's freshly blended, and it tastes like a vacation in a cup. And if I'm feeling a little extra, one of their tropic bowls always hits a spot. The PB Protein Crunch bowl is loaded with 32 grams of peanut buttery protein. Or I'll go for a mixed berry Greek yogurt bowl topped with fresh strawberries and blueberries. Everything's made to order, it's easy to grab, and you can even order ahead in the app. So you're in and out, just like that. Tropical Smoothie Cafe. You're on tropic time now. You know, between two kids, two dogs, and my rehearsal schedule, sometimes the last thing I want to do is wander the grocery store aisles. That's where Instacart comes in. Instacart is more than a grocery technology platform. It's really a care company. It connects me to thousands of stores across the country and gives me back time to focus on what matters most. The other day, Justin was in Routes to New York City to bring the kids to come see a performance of Shakespeare in the park, and I was realizing we were completely out of snacks here in New York City. I don't Want to talk about who might have eaten all the goldfish crackers? That's not what's important here. With just a few taps, I had fresh groceries and household essentials ready for pickup or delivery to my door in as fast as 30 minutes. Honestly, it saved the day. I also love that I can trust the shoppers. They're reliable, accurate, and it always feels seamless. Instacart helps take care of delivering some of the things I love so I can take care of people I love. So if you want to take something off your plate, pun intended, download the Instacart app and use code DINNERSONME20 to get $20 off first order of $80 or more. That's code DINNERS ON ME20 for $20 off your first order of 80 dollars or more. Offers valid for a limited time. Excludes restaurants. Additional terms apply all right, summer is here, and although I'm working a lot in New York City this summer, I am already planning my next little getaway on my day off. I don't know if it's Provincetown, Nantucket maybe somewhere upstate New York. I love using points for travel and I am always looking for ways to earn more. Now here is a life Pay rent with BILT to earn flexible transferable points and unlock exclusive benefits along the way. There is no cost to join, and just by paying rent, you unlock flexible points that could be transferred to your favorite hotels and airlines, a future rent payment if you will, your next Lyft ride home, and so much more. When you pay rent through bilt, you unlock two powerful benefits. First, you earn one of the industry's most valuable points on rent every month. No matter where you live or who your landlord is, your rent now works for you. Second, you gain access to exclusive neighborhood benefits in your city. Bilt's neighborhood benefits are things like extra points on dining out, complimentary post workout shakes, free mats or towels at your favorite fitness studios, and unique experiences that only BILT members can access. And when you're ready to travel, BILT points can be converted to your favorite miles and hotel points around the world, meaning your rent can literally take you places. So if you're not earning points on rent, my question is, what are you waiting for? Start paying rent through BILT and take advantage of your neighborhood benefits by going to joinbilt.com JTF that's J-O-I-N B I-L-T.com JTF make sure you use our URL so that they know we sent you. Joinbuilt.com JTF to sign up for Bilt today. And we're back with more dinners on me. You have some really funny stories from your childhood. One of my favorite stories that you. This is gonna be a lot of me. Like, tell the story. When. One of my favorite stories that you told me from your childhood is when you and your siblings somehow all agreed to. To talk about fictional people in your class.

[B]

Yes. We're at the dinner table. My mom is sitting there. My siblings and I, all basically teenagers, are preteen, old. Old and everything. And Richard, my older brother Rick, said, oh, I saw Mike Hunt today.

[A]

Mike Hunt. Yeah.

[B]

So, of course, we actually didn't agree to this. We didn't know what was gonna happen. And we all kind of went like that. We're just like, huh?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then Thana goes, oh, how is Mike? So I think it was. How is Mike Hunt? I think it was between Thana and Rick that this was. So they're across the table, and the other three are right here. So I'm. Pick it right up. Oh, my God. Mike Hunt. I haven't seen him in ages. And it goes on for about five minutes, and we just say, mike Hunt.

[A]

Mike Hunt.

[B]

Wasn't your mom, like, My mom was like, who's Mike Hunt? Who is Mike Hunt?

[A]

I remember specifically, she goes, I can't picture Mike Hunt.

[B]

I can't picture Mike Hunt. So that almost destroyed the whole thing. That almost caused a train wreck. But we kept ourselves really dry. And Rick said, come on. You remember Mike Hunt. We went to great school together. And my dad was, like, eating, and.

[A]

He went, cut it out.

[B]

He didn't even raise his head. I love that you love that story. It's such a classic, but it just.

[A]

Adds to, like, your humor at a young age.

[B]

Oh, please. My humor? Always. Always. But my family was always really, really, really funny. I would say my mom was incredibly dry and smart funny, and my dad was incredibly. You love my dad. You saw my dad.

[A]

Both your parents? Yeah.

[B]

He was a big goofball. And, you know, my mom was always very dry and quiet, and when she opened her mouth, it was always hilarious. And pop was just, like, center of attention. Big, big goofball. And I always feel like I kind of got a really good combination of both of them in my sense of humor.

[A]

Can I also just, like, say. And I'm sure you've thought about this before, but, like, a lot of your relationships have been with women who are really quiet and when they have something to say, are fucking hilarious.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You recognize what's smart, right?

[B]

Oh, of course I recognize that.

[A]

And that's like what a lot of my relationships.

[B]

How about every single one of them?

[A]

That's true. Yeah, it's true.

[B]

Yes. I'm involved with my mother, apparently.

[A]

Yeah. I just wanted to say. I just wanted to point it out.

[B]

I'm surprised at how many of her there are out there. You know, she read my book.

[A]

I know.

[B]

I remember that.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. What was the. What was it called? Not the one that tries.

[B]

Leah's Book of Rules for the World.

[A]

That's right. That's right.

[B]

She asked for a copy. And I remember I signed it. I gave it to her and I signed it and I wrote, mom, please don't read this whole book. I love you. And I gave it to her. She read the whole book?

[A]

Of course she did. What did she say?

[B]

She loved the book.

[A]

What were you most concerned about in that book for her to read?

[B]

Honey, there was just so much like sex and shit. Don't you. The fucking.

[A]

You were talking about all that stuff on stage.

[B]

I know, I know.

[A]

And she was seeing that.

[B]

Oh, yes. I think it's easier when it's in the ether and then it's gone and then it's gone when it's a printed thing that's writing.

[A]

Go back and read it again.

[B]

She can go back and read again about how, you know, my vibrator in the forward, remember? Cause the book has. It's all drawings of. It's me and I draw myself and I do little cartoons. So me is just a little stick figure me and I'm holding a vibrator. And then I explained that about. And I say that I lived in the Zeckendorf Towers, which was right by Union Square, and that I had an industrial strength vibrator. I had to have a big orange cord that went out the window and plugged into the generator. The generator. Generator at Union Square. When I jerk off, the 6 train doesn't run.

[A]

I feel like I helped you workshop that train.

[B]

You did. That's why we used to do shit like that all the time. You did?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You did the thing about having the orange thing.

[A]

The orange cord. The orange eccentric cord.

[B]

And then I said, when I jerk off, the 6 train doesn't run. And we were both screaming with laughter. And I went, that's it. Right in the book. Right in the book.

[A]

Oh my God. Okay, rewind. Okay, so we met when we did. On the town at the park, literally 28 years ago, meeting you. But first of all, that whole experience for me, and I know for you as well was such a big deal because it was how I got my equity card. And for you it was like, you.

[B]

Know, first how I got my equity card.

[A]

That's right. I always forget you didn't have your equity card. You just have been working and doing other things for, you know, so many years. But that was such a big moment for, for us. And I remember coming into the rehearsal room and I'm 21 years old and I. I don't know a lot about you at that point. I knew your name and I knew that you had a career. And I walk in and I'm like, oh, that's my girlfriend.

[B]

Did you freak out a little bit?

[A]

I mean, maybe a little bit.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, I was like, oh, boy.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And I think a lot of people know this about you after they meet you. But like, you have an exterior that maybe like people like, oh, okay. And then like, you were so gooey and sweet and gentle on the inside. You cry at the drop of a hat. I mean, you know, we had an immediate connection and it was like, that's where the friendship started. Obviously, you know, here we are like 28 years later, almost 30 years later, and we're still such good friends. But like, what were your initial reactions about this relationship?

[B]

Oh, I was gonna just jump right in on that. I just remember. And I remember talking to my Terry Danzer, my manager at the time, and I remember talking to him and I went, okay, so here's my boyfriend, he's much younger than me. This is his first professional job and he's fucking fearless. That's, you know, that was my immediate reaction to you. And it wasn't about how you were with me. It was like how you were in the room, how you were reading, how you. You know what I mean, all of that. I remember when there was a choreographer who said something really stupid to you, and I remember sitting in the audience going, that was stupid. And you came out, he said that you were hiding. That's right, yeah. And you stepped out and you said, I am not hiding. I was told to stay here. And this is where I'm waiting to be told to move. And I thought, wow, this 21 year old kid just let the choreographer have it. I'm just like, Then I really kind of fell in love with you. I was like, I was already digging you no end. Because you weren't afraid of me. You were like, toe to toe. Whatever I did, you responded in kind. It was real acting, you know. And again, a lot of people at that time were Intimidated by me, you know, so it was really kind of fab to have you just, like, be. Boom. Right, you know, right there.

[A]

I think the one thing.

[B]

Plus I also thought you were hilarious. You were so funny.

[A]

I was pretty funny in it.

[B]

You were so funny.

[A]

I mean, you ran away with the show. Like, all the reviews were about you and. And Mary Testa. But, like, I mean, you ran away with that show in a way that, like, was so exciting. I mean, the first crazy. The New York Times review was like, the first five paragraphs were about you.

[B]

It was crazy.

[A]

And like, where has this person been?

[B]

The first five and the last two. And it was 20. It was a 21 paragraph review. See, I'll never forget this because.

[A]

Because at the time I had to.

[B]

Count because I was like, what's going on?

[A]

Yeah. You got the New York Times and sat on the street corner as you told me on the curb outside the New York Times and read the review with your manager. Right. Is that right?

[B]

Yeah. Well, it started. I couldn't read it. So I was standing there and I couldn't read it. So I said, terry, start reading. So Terry started reading it, and this big smile was on his face, and he got. He was ready just reading and reading, and then finally he went, you have to read it.

[A]

You have to read it.

[B]

So, yeah, so I started to read it, and then it was like, first paragraph's about me, Second paragraph about me, third paragraph about me. By the time I got to the third paragraph, that's when I sat down on the curb on 42nd street or 43rd, in front of 41st, in front of the Time building and, you know, just filthy, disgusting curb. And actually started kind of crying a little bit while I was reading it because, you know, I knew my life was gonna change dramatically.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it did.

[A]

Huge deal.

[B]

Yeah. And then John Simon said I was too Grotesquely Globulus.

[A]

Grotesquely Globulus. Which I love that you put onto your, like, posters when you did shows. You had all these great reviews about, like, you know, from Brent Brantley and, you know, the Wall Street Journal and all these incredible things. Entertainment Weekly. And then the last one, Grotesquely Globulus.

[B]

That would. My last.

[A]

Simon. I love it. I love to embrace the bad review or, you know, just like a dicky review. I mean, that was such a horrible thing to say.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

During that time when we were doing out in town, I, you know, I'm 21 years old and gay pride happens at the end of every June.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Last Sunday In June, and we are in the height of rehearsal for Shakespeare in the park, for on the Town, and you and George C. Wolfe, our director, decides to take me to my first Gay Pride parade in New York. In New York.

[B]

Was it your first ever Gay Pride or just the one in New York ever?

[A]

I was too scared to go to the. Like, I was. You know, I didn't have the confidence.

[B]

That's interesting, because, like I said, you were, to me, fearless. So maybe your confidence only exuded. On stage, I had a confidence. Not as a human.

[A]

Yeah, that's fair to say. But I remember wandering the streets with you and George. No one knew who the fuck I was. Anyone knew who you and George were. And I remember just being like, wow, this is, like, first of all, what it looks like to be famous. Like, my God.

[B]

Right?

[A]

I mean, just everyone was so excited to see you. And, I mean, it was. It was wild. Also, like. I mean, you two were. You are. You still are, but you were pillars of the. The LGBTQ community as well. And, like, you're walking into the parade, and everyone was just so excited to see you. And I was. It was, like, the greatest introduction to a New York pride parade. And now I can't even go to the Pride parade. It's too much. We went that one year, remember? Yeah, yeah. It was, like, a few years ago, we decided to try Gay Pride again together. And we're like, nope, nope, not doing again.

[B]

Well, when they legalized gay marriage. Yeah, that was crazy.

[A]

It might have been that year, because, I mean, maybe we felt, like, the impetus that we had to go out and, like, celebrate.

[B]

I know that it was. You and I should never walk through a gay neighborhood together.

[A]

Never again. Now for a quick break, but don't go away after the break. Leah shares the impact her character, Big Boo from Orange Is the New Black had on the butch community. And we recall a story that involves Vanessa Williams and an embarrassing group chat mishap. And me, I'm the core to this story. Okay, be right back. So apparently, I'm what they call a procrastaver. You know, someone who keeps putting off saving money even though it's staring me right in the face. You've never heard of Procrastaver? What are you talking about? Yes, guilty as charged. But then I heard about Mint Mobile's best deal of the year and thought, okay, Jesse, this might be the universe telling you to stop being stubborn. Here's the thing. With Mint Mobile, you can cut your wireless bill to just 15amonth when you switch all Their plans come with high speed data and unlimited talk and text on the nation's largest 5G network. And you don't have to buy a new phone. You can keep your current one, your number, all your contacts. I love Mint mobile. I mean three months of unlimited premium wireless for just 15amonth. That's a deal worth not procrasta saving on, you know. But it does end September 22nd. So quit stalling and start saving when you make the switch. Shop plans.comjesse that's mint mobile.com/jesse upfront payment of $45 required equivalent to $15 a month limited time new customer offer for first three months only. Speeds may slow above 35 GB on unlimited plan taxes and fees Extra Cement Mobile for details Anyone else ever look at their dog's dinner bowl and think, oh buddy, you deserve better than this? I feel that all the time with my two dogs, Sam, my Golden Doodle and Leaf, my tiny but mighty Morkie. I want meal time to be more than just fuel. It should be something exciting. I mean, yes, they do act so excited when I feed them anything, but sometimes I just think they're faking it, you know? That's why I've been eyeing Nom Nom. Their recipes are gently cooked and actually designed to engage your pup senses with textures, smells and vibrant ingredients that keep things endlessly interesting. They've got six different recipes like Pork Potluck, Chicken Cuisine, Beef Mash and more. And every one of them is crafted by vet nutritionalists, which gives me real peace of mind. The idea that Salmon Leaf could have meals with premium and proteins and vibrant veggies cooked in small batches so the nutrients and textures stay intact. Sounds like something I definitely want them to try. After all, I wouldn't want to eat the same thing day after day. So why should they keep mealtime exciting with Nom Nom available at your local Pet Smart store or Chewy? Learn [e-mail] JTF that's trynom.com JTF okay, let's be honest. Staying hydrated is the only thing keeping me from turning into a raisin these days. That's why Fiji Water is always close by. Fiji Water really is from the islands of Fiji, 1600 miles from the nearest continent. It's filtered through ancient volcanic rock, naturally protected from external elements, and it picks up a unique profile of electrolytes and minerals along the way that gives it more than double the electrolytes of the other top premium bottled water brands. And that soft, smooth taste that I absolutely love Unlike some other top premium bottled water brands, Fiji's water electrolytes are 100% naturally occurring, and Fiji's water has a perfect balance. 7.7 pH. I have no idea what that means, but I like the word perfect score. Okay. And since 2022, Fiji's water's 330 and 500 milliliter bot have been made with 100% recycled plastic. So whether I'm backstage at home with the kids or planning our podcast recording, I know I'm hydrating the earth's finest way. Fiji water. It's Earth's finest water. And we're back with more dinners on me. I know that we're gonna talk about Orange is New Black, but, like, after Orange is New Black, there was another level of, like, just it's world fame.

[B]

It's ridiculous.

[A]

Yeah, it's different. I mean, there was something happened that was like. It was. It became bigger.

[B]

It's. What? It's watched still by over 200 million people in over 200 countries still. It's still in the top 10 on Netflix. It's crazy.

[A]

It's a great show.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I remember even when. When I was 21 years old and walking into the parade with you and George, and specifically, I mean, George was obviously a celebrated director in. On Broadway and a little bit in film, but like, you, it was different with you because you had had this moment on the Arsenio hall show where you were the first openly gay comic, I think, on American television.

[B]

On American television. Yeah.

[A]

And that was only a few years before. I always forget. It was only a few years before I met you that that happened.

[B]

93. We met. 97. Yeah.

[A]

It was not that long before. For some reason, I keep thinking it was, like, way before I met you. It was not that long before I met you. And, you know, people really, I think, responded to, you know, obviously your. Just how visible you were, but also how fearless you were. And I think that was something that not a lot of people were. I know, not a lot of people were doing. I mean, you really were a pioneer in so many ways. I mean, this is. I mean, you look now we have so many queer comics and comedians and writers and stars and people who are just openly themselves. But in the early 90s, it was not something that was. That was not happening on television.

[B]

I can do it on one hand. Really.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

In the early 90s. You know what I mean? I can tell you exactly who was out. I think the most interesting experience for me about the whole thing was that RuPaul and I both became famous at basically the same time, at the same year. And at basically the same time, I even talked about Ru in my standup on the Arsenio hall show. It was, you know, I was saying how hip it was to be gay at the time. And then I say, look at RuPaul. She's tall, she's gorgeous. She's beautiful in that dress. I put on a dress. I look like a man in a dress. That was the joke, Something like that. But Ru and I basically toured the world together after that. Every time I would go to any Gay Pride, Ru was there. And every time I would go to do something, Rue had just been there, or Rue was gonna be there afterwards. So Ru put out his book earlier this year and talks about this actual experience. We've talked about it quite a bit. Ru had his own talk show on mtv. Yeah, I remember I was his first guest.

[A]

I didn't know that.

[B]

That's a fact. Yeah, I was his first guest. I remember the first question he asked. Cause the Spice Girls were really hot. And he said, which Spice Girl are you? And I said, old Spice. And that's what he did.

[A]

Fucking hilarious.

[B]

Yeah. So it just. So, yeah, I mean, that was one of the. One of the things. But it did put me into a. Because the thing about Arsenio, it was seen in every English speaking country in the world.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So then I toured every English. Yeah.

[A]

Like, Arsenio hall at that time, just to put into context, was like, what? I mean, Fallon is. Or like Kimmel is now.

[B]

Yeah. Arsenio was the number one talk show. Late night talk show. He was. He far surpassed Letterman. He far surpassed Leto. He was it. And he was the younger. You know, this is for the younger, hipper crowd. And he always. He broke a lot of barriers. It wasn't just me. There were a lot of things. And he did stuff like that very quietly. That's one of the reasons I like Arsenio so very much. And one of the reasons I was so mad, the way they fucked him over at the end there. But, like, for example, what people don't know, he would go into neighborhoods and buy, you know, condemned houses. He'd fix them up, and then he'd sell them to needy people in the neighborhood for a dollar.

[A]

That's incredible.

[B]

Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, he quietly did a lot of wonderful things that people don't. Don't know about. And like, before I did his show, I mean, I was nervous, obviously, because I'm gonna do television. It's at the time. 20 million people were watching it all over the world. I was really like, nervous. I'm in my dressing room, there's a knock on the door. And it's art. And I know talk show horrors never do this. They never do this. It's always a producer. He came in, he sat down with me, he was like, go out and tell your truth, be you. Blah, blah, blah, blah. You're on this show because we know how good you are. You know what I mean?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He was really, really. He gave me ease. And then I just went out and I kind of tore the roof off the fucker, as they say. I was shocked by how well I did.

[A]

Yeah. And he also came to bat for you because I know that the network was nervous about your use of the lawyers.

[B]

It was actually the lawyers for Fox.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, because whatever the FCC says, obviously they have the final call. But it wasn't the fcc. It was the lawyers trying to, you know, negotiate.

[A]

Right. And they were not having to deal with it. Words like dyke, dyke, fag and queer. Right.

[B]

So as soon as the show was over, Arsenica got called into the, I guess the editing booth and it was the lawyers up there.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And they were saying, we don't think we can air this. And he, they gave him the reason why. And Arsenio very strongly said, she's a dyke. And if she wants to call herself a dyke, who the fuck are we to tell her she can't call herself a dyke? So it's going on. He fought hard for it and he won.

[A]

And he won.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And how empowering must have been for people to hear that on television also.

[B]

But.

[A]

And those words can be tricky for people. And I think, you know, I've always been in the camp that like reclaiming those words. Like we, we need to reclaim those words.

[B]

It's called reclamation. It's a political tool. We hardly are the first people to do it. No, it's been used throughout history. So whenever anybody gives me, I mean, you know me, I don't have a lot of patience. So whenever anybody says to me, leah, don't call yourself a dyke, and I generally respond, well, you sound like a self loathing fag. So, yeah, you know me, you know that I say shit like that. So it's, you know, we, I actually, in my current standup and doing a whole thing about the progression of what we've called ourselves throughout time, starting with homosexual. Homosexual to now. And it gives. And that is a brief history of how we use certain words as political tool within Our community. That's kind of what's going on with my new show. So. Yeah, I'm with you.

[A]

Do you want a bite of this?

[B]

I do want to bite. Because I'd like to try it. Oh, I'm so sorry.

[A]

Try it. All right. Try it. Okay, I'm not gonna move this. I mean, I'm gonna move this for you, but I'm not taking it away.

[B]

Okay. Am I gonna use your fork or my fork?

[A]

I don't care.

[B]

I'm gonna use your fork again.

[A]

I just want to.

[B]

I've seen you naked.

[A]

Okay, well, it's true.

[B]

It's true. Again, not just on stage.

[A]

No, I know, I know.

[B]

I know.

[A]

Again, when I was very young.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Everything happened when I was so young. Isn't that delicious? It's not great. So on the Town, written by Betty Comden, Adolf Green, who were old. Who were old and, you know, couldn't hear very well. But at the end of their life, that's Adolf.

[B]

Betty was fired.

[A]

Betty was fire. But, you know, also, icons of the.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

They wrote every.

[B]

You remember when I had my audition, the first audition, and I went through and I met everybody, and I was so shocked, and I was, like, shaking everybody's hand. And then I got to Betty, and it was like, it was a pleasure to meet. And then when I got to Adolf, I went, oh, Mr. Green, I can't believe I'm meeting you. I thought you were dead. Which I'm sure that's how I got the part.

[A]

But anyway, so we're at the Gershwin Theater, the show's transferred to Broadway, and Betty Condon and Adolf Green are at Leah delaria's door, and they're knocking.

[B]

Remember, my music's playing really fucking loud always.

[A]

But also, I think you heard them, and you're like, just a second.

[B]

Oh, I did say just a second.

[A]

And Adolf can't hear. Adolf can't hear. Knock, knock, knock, knock, knock. Leah. Leah, we want to say just a second. Just a second. Now, the reason you were saying just a second is because you were changing your tampon.

[B]

No, wait. I am buck ass naked. I'm not just changing my tampon. I am buck ass naked with my big butt.

[A]

Please keep this in.

[B]

With my big butt. Towards the door, inserting a tampon. Go.

[A]

And Adolf opens the door, and Betty's like, oh, Adolf. Oh, Adolf. No, no, no. And Adolf just starts going nakedly.

[B]

Give me a second. Betty goes, adolf, we can't come in here. Leah's naked. And that's what Adolf Were doing with just two songs. Leah's naked. Naked Leah.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

But then, remember how everybody kept doing that? Like, people kept walking in when I was naked. They would knock. I would say, just a minute. And they would come in. Finally, Robert Guy was the last one. Remember Robert Guy? I guess he knocked in. Mr. Guy who was like, knocked. And then I said, just a minute. And he opened the door and came walking in again. I was fuck ass naked. And that was. That was it. Don't you remember this? And I walked out into the hall of the Gershwig Theater. So it was the principal's hall, basically. So all the principals had a dressing room in this hall. Walked out and completely naked went, who hasn't seen me naked? Come on. Who hasn't? Everybody come. I walked down to the stage. Stage management. You want to see me naked? Like, I was just so.

[A]

I wish you had walked out. It's like 51st. Just, like, caught the subway at home.

[B]

Birdman walk onto the subway naked. Who wants to see me naked?

[A]

Oh, my God, it was so funny.

[B]

Apparently, everybody's seeing me naked.

[A]

Hello. Hi. What's crazy, And I think. I don't know if you realize this, but this restaurant is in the building that they use for the exterior of Friends.

[B]

Oh, yeah, that's right. No, I know.

[A]

So that's why there's, like, so many people doing tiktoks outside this window.

[B]

Outside this window.

[A]

So they're like, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba. By the way, I just. I took a video outside. Cause we had Lisa Kudrow on the show. So I sent a video to her. I was like, look at where I'm. You know, I'm joking, but I'm the one that picked her up. I said. I said. I said, leah delaria, ironically, is on the podcast today. And she's like. And like, we're here at this building. Yeah. We talk about Friends for a second. I mean, that was like. I remember when I. That was the thing I knew you from.

[B]

Oh, that's cool. That was only that. Not First Wives Club either.

[A]

No, bad First Wives Club.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

You have, like, a series of, like, really very prolific, like, poppy, like, guest stars.

[B]

The lesbian who inappropriately hits on straight women at every function. That was my Hollywood niche. That and PE teachers and police lieutenants. This is what I did on film and television for the. You know, the beginning of my career after I became the first openly gay comic on television in America. Therefore, I was very thrilled when I got on the Town, as you can imagine.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. Like, wear a dress and a wig and pick up men.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I wanna talk a little bit about when you got Orange is the New Black. Because I. It's so funny. And this happened to me, too, with a friend of mine who was on Mad Men. And she's like, I'm on this new show. It's on amc. And I was like, oh, honey, honey. Oh, sweetheart. And then it was Mad Men. And I remember thinking the same thing with you. Because it was on Netflix.

[B]

And no one knew it.

[A]

No one knew there was House of Cards, but it was still, like, that was still new. And then Orange is the New Black was the next show that they were doing. And you're like, yeah, I'm on this new show for Netflix. And I was like, oh, honey, I know, I know.

[B]

But do you remember? I was like, how can I say no to it? It's Jen G. Cohen, of course.

[A]

No, no, absolutely. And all the people involved. And I'm sure the script must have been like.

[B]

The script was fantastic. And then every week. I know. I know that I was, like, calling you and texting you. Cause every week I'd be like, holy shit. Natasha Lyonne is in this.

[A]

Yeah, I remember that.

[B]

Holy shit. Yeah. Laura Prepon is coming in this week. Holy. You know, Kate Mogra, I knew right away. Cause she was already cast. And that was the gift that, like, I have two of these things that are really popular and that everyone knows Orange is a New Black Pot is. And they both have this kind of unique thing. Like, in my wildest dreams, did I think I would have so much in common with Kate Mulgrew and Vanessa Williams?

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

So, yeah. So every week there'd be like, this is on it. This is on it. So there was. It was. There's no way I could say no.

[A]

And I just know, because we were talking about it when it was happening, how meaningful it was for you to be able to play someone who was so you, but with so much, so many layers and so much. There was so much life in Big Boo. And, like, I just. I could see you blossoming as an actor, just being able to play all that and playing, like, the story of the Butch and playing. And when they flash back with your character, how I remember getting these phone calls from you, like, oh, my God, I'm like, I'm losing my mind. What they've written for me is so, so incredible. And it was such a powerful thing to see on television.

[B]

Thanks.

[A]

And I hope that you're really proud of.

[B]

I am so proud of that. I'm so proud of everything. I mean, to me, it's like. Like, you know, and, you know, these butchers come up to me on the street and cry. Like, they cry and they need a hug. And it was like the first time I ever saw myself in a television show. And I, you know, I really. It means. It means a lot to me. But as a, you know, as a. As a butch, which is sort of a segment of our queer community, we really do have a shared life experience. And all of that came out in that story. We all went through the thing where our moms are trying to make us wear a dress. You know what I mean? We all went, you know, through that thing where they called that a costume, some kind of costume, you know, that we were. That we were going to. We've all been despised by our own community, which is. I think that happens to Nellie Faggs and that happens to Bush dykes big time. Especially at that time. That has. Since Orange is. Since the popularity of RuPaul's Drag Race and definitely La Verne, that has changed within our community. But before that, we were despised. We were looked down upon. We were like. I used to have that joke about, why can't you be like everyone else? We're just like everyone else. Gay people are just like everyone else. And that's when the six and a half foot tall drag queen walks by wearing six foot spangled platforms and opens up their butterfly wings. Right? Yeah. You know, and the point is obvious that we're not like everybody else. We have our own culture, and we should celebrate that. And those of us who are here presenting it every, every day in a way that maybe you're not comfortable doing, you should relax and let them be who they are. We're letting you be who you are. We should all let each other within our community be who we are. Yeah. I think one of the things that is so great about Orange and what it did for me was that I was working nonstop in front of a camera. I really feel like I can act in front of a camera now. Do you know, I always felt, in fact, when I got to potus, I kept saying to Stroh, that would be Susan Stroman, Tony winner, choreographer, comedy genius. I said to Stroh, am I big enough? I was concerned that I wasn't big enough because I'd been on. He's laughing because he saw me in the part. My God, I was concerned. And here's. You know what? You just Said, that's fucking what Stroh did. She burst out laughing. She went, you're fine, you're fine.

[A]

Yeah. You know, I want to tell the story about this group text that I had with the POTUS cast.

[B]

Oh, my God, this is the best story ever. It's the best story ever.

[A]

So I was very friendly with basically the entire POTUS cast. It was you and Vanessa Williams and Julie White and Susie Nakamura, who was in an episode of Modern Family. Don't forget Rachel and Rachel Dratch.

[B]

You literally knew everyone.

[A]

Lily Cooper.

[B]

Did you know Lily?

[A]

Not really well, but I became friends.

[B]

You didn't know Lily and you didn't know Julianne.

[A]

I didn't know Julianne.

[B]

Julianne Hoff, by the way. Just.

[A]

So anyway, I had this group text. Cause I was doing Take me Out across the Street. And, you know, I've been texting you back and forth for a while. Like it'd been, you know, a three month run. And you all would respond. Vanessa Williams would never respond. You're all responding. She's never responding. I didn't really notice that. And on your last performance, I text, happy closing, you cunts.

[B]

Because that's right.

[A]

First line of the show. And everyone's laughing. Oh, thank you. Thank you. We love you. We love you. And then it says, vanessa Williams has left the conversation. And so I was like, oh, no. So I call Leah. And I was like, leah, why? Why did Vanessa leave the conversation? You're like, I don't know. That was really weird. I'm gonna call her. So I separately text Vanessa. I was like, I am so sorry if I offended you. Like, I was quoting a line from the show. I'm really sorry. I love you. And then this person responds back, this is not Vanessa Williams. Please lose my number.

[B]

It was wrong number, asshole. He literally wrote asshole. He said, wrong number, asshole.

[A]

And so I, for years, had been texting this random person I was talking to Vanessa Williams. So you give me Vanessa's real number. And I call her.

[B]

I showed her.

[A]

She facetimes me from her dressing room.

[B]

I showed her the thing. I showed her the thing. Like, you sent me a picture of it. She scared.

[A]

She's like, why, of course. She's like, first of all, that's hilarious. I've never. She's like, I have not gotten a text message from you ever, Ever.

[B]

It's so funny.

[A]

So fucking funny. What else can we talk about? What else do we have to remember?

[B]

I'm gonna say this was one of the favorite jokes I've ever written and it was talking about us on stage when I was doing a long run at Joe's Pub and I went, you know, Jesse Tyler Ferguson and I, we were in on the Town. It closed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Then Jesse and I did. Most fabulous story ever told. It closed. I'm pleased to announce that Jesse and I are going into Cats. Remember that?

[A]

Because cats have been running for 1700 years.

[B]

So long. And everybody hated it. So it was just like that got one of the biggest New York laughs of all time. I really, really, really love that.

[A]

Speaking of jokes you've written, I do want to like.

[B]

You gonna go to U Haul?

[A]

Yeah, why not? We should go to U Haul. Why not? Like, wrap it up up with this. I mean, it is truly astonishing to me that we can credit the U Haul lesbian joke to you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I honestly, honestly can't believe it. Because it's such a. It's such a zeitgeisty joke.

[B]

Yeah. And of course, the companion joke, Right. What does a lesbian bring on a second date? A U Haul. What does a gay man bring on a second date? What? Second date? So, yeah, both of them. Pretty in the community.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I mean, it also is. Listen, there is so much truth to that.

[B]

Oh, hell yes. You know, why do you think it's funny?

[A]

It's fucking hilarious. But why do you think it's funny? What I love is that you know.

[B]

How I wrote it? Have you ever heard this story? Do you know how I wrote it? I used to do this crazy ass thing in my show where people would write down questions on a three by five card. And then I would just pull a three by five card out. And whatever the question was, I would answer it. Some chick, some dyke who thought she was funny was like, I never brushed my teeth. It went on and on. I chew with my mouth full, I never brush my teeth. I don't know how to dress, blah, blah, blah, blah. It just went on and on and on. And the very last line was, for the first time in my life, I have a second date. What should I bring? And I went, well, if you're like most lesbians on a second date, you'll bring a U Haul. And the laugh was so humongous. Yeah. And if you look, if you bulldike in a china shop, it's on Bulldog in a China Shop, which was my first comedy record.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

But I just, I cut. I cut all the. Oh, I cut all that out. And just on Bulldogen in China Shop, you just get. I've got a second Date? What do I bring on a second date?

[A]

It's incredible.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, but it's so funny, because even you know, in your recent relationship, I remember when you and Chelsea broke up, you were like, I'm not doing this again. I'm not doing this again, honey.

[B]

No girlfriends.

[A]

No more girlfriends. And then you meet Dahlia, who was incredible. And then I was like, I'm giving you literally six weeks before you guys are moving in together. You're like, oh, honey, she already lives with me.

[B]

No, that's not true.

[A]

She basically did live with you already.

[B]

Well, we were spending all the time together, but she didn't move in with.

[A]

Spending all the time together with her suitcases at your house.

[B]

Okay, dude, we were together for over a year before I said, move in.

[A]

With me, but how much stuff did she actually have to move at that point?

[B]

Oh, you're killing me right now. She's a Jew. She's a Jew. She had a lot of shit. There was a lot of shit in Staten Island. She's a du femme. A high femme. She didn't even have half of her high heels at my house. She didn't have a quarter of her red lipstick at my house. You know what I mean? Also, she's, you know, gorgeous. She's gorgeous.

[A]

Yeah. No, Dahlia is incredible. You guys are getting married this November?

[B]

Yeah, we're getting. It's a goth wedding. It's on November 22nd. Because that's the anniversary of the assassination of JFK. It seemed appropriate for a goth wedding.

[A]

I'm really excited.

[B]

It's gonna be so much fun.

[A]

It's gonna be a lot of fun.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

I'm your best man.

[B]

I know. I'm very excited about that, too. And Vanessa's singing.

[A]

Vanessa's singing. I'm so excited. I'm just happy it's happening.

[B]

Yeah, me, too. Me, too. Yeah.

[A]

Oh, my God. Finally get you married off at the ripe age of 99.

[B]

Yeah. Or 103 or whatever. 67, bitch. 67. You're 50.

[A]

I'd be 50 this year.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can you believe it?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can't believe it. My oldest friend, literally and figuratively.

[B]

It's lunacy.

[A]

It's lunacy. I'm tough. He did this.

[B]

Why did it take you so fucking long to ask me, you little bitch? He knew that was coming.

[A]

This episode of Dinner's On Me was recorded at Little Owl in New York City's West Village. Next week on Dinner's on Me. You know her from True Blood, the Good Wife, and the titular character on the hit CBS show Elsbeth Titular always sounds so erotic. It's Kerri Preston. And if you don't want to wait until next week to listen, you can download that episode right now by subscribing to Dinners On Me. Plus, as a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, you'll also be able to listen completely ad free. Just click Try Free at the top of the Dinners on Me show page on Apple Podcasts to search your free trial today. Dinners on Me is a production of Sony Music Entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions. It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Our associate producer is Alyssa Midcalf. Sam Behr engineered this episode. Hans Dale. She composed our theme music. Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tameka Balance Kolasny and Justin Makita. I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week.