SUTTON FOSTER — on being a showgirl at 17 and mothering herself

Summary

Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson: Episode Summary Episode: SUTTON FOSTER — on being a showgirl at 17 and mothering herself
Release Date: April 1, 2025

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Introduction to Sutton Foster

In this heartfelt episode of Dinner’s on Me, host Jesse Tyler Ferguson welcomes one of Broadway's brightest stars, Sutton Foster. Known for her captivating performances in shows like Thoroughly Modern Millie, Anything Goes, and Once Upon a Mattress, Foster brings her extensive experience from Broadway to a candid conversation with Ferguson.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (01:19): "Watching her rise has been nothing short of exhilarating."

Meeting Sutton Foster

Jesse reminisces about his first encounter with Sutton Foster, highlighting that before she became the two-time Tony Award winner and TV star, she was simply a friend’s sister. This initial meeting left Jesse with the impression that she was destined for stardom.

Notable Quote:
Sutton Foster (01:29): "There she had this energy, this effortless charm that instantly warmed the space."

The Setting: Simonette in Culver City

The conversation unfolds at Simonette, a charming café, bar, and bistro in Culver City. Sutton describes the venue's Parisian-inspired ambiance, perfect for the intimate and genuine discussions that characterize the podcast.

Notable Quote:
Sutton Foster (03:35): "Simonette truly feels like a little slice of Paris right here in LA."

Balancing Career and Motherhood

Jesse delves into his routine as a working parent, discussing how his career as a performer requires meticulous scheduling around his daughter's school. Sutton shares anecdotes about her own parenting experiences, highlighting the challenges and joys of raising young children while maintaining a demanding career.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (06:54): "So it's sort of really nice because I can sleep and I don't have any responsibilities."

Childhood, Family, and Mental Health

The conversation takes a deeply personal turn as Jesse opens up about his complicated relationship with his mother, her struggles with agoraphobia, and how these experiences shaped his own mental health journey. Sutton empathizes, sharing her insights on dealing with anxiety and the importance of creating an environment where all emotions are valid.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (12:55): "I really hope I can create an environment where all feelings are welcome."

Career Milestones and Breakthroughs

Sutton Foster recounts her breakthrough moment in Thoroughly Modern Millie, stepping into the lead role under unexpected circumstances. She reflects on the combination of luck and preparation that led to her success, emphasizing the importance of being ready for opportunities.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (33:13): "It changed my life."

Transition from Broadway to Television

Both hosts discuss their transitions from the stage to the screen. Sutton shares her experiences with Amy Sherman-Palladino's series Bunheads and Younger, highlighting the differences between live theater and the fast-paced nature of television production.

Notable Quote:
Sutton Foster (37:52): "I still feel like I'm just visiting LA to this day."

Inspirations and Influences

A significant part of their discussion revolves around the influence of comedy legend Carol Burnett on Jesse. They exchange stories about Burnett’s support and inspiration, showcasing the enduring impact of mentorship and admiration in the entertainment industry.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (43:08): "She always signs it Love, Carol. It's just the greatest thing."

Reflections on Personal Growth and Self-Love

Jesse talks about his journey towards self-love and independence, especially after dealing with anxiety and panic attacks. He shares how becoming a parent has inspired him to foster a supportive and loving environment for himself and his children.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (29:07): "Can you dare to love yourself as much as you love your children?"

Life's Second Acts and Personal Reinvention

The conversation concludes with reflections on life's second acts and the potential for reinvention at any age. Jesse shares his admiration for his father's revitalization after his mother's passing, illustrating that it's never too late to embrace change and pursue happiness.

Notable Quote:
Sutton Foster (48:53): "It's never too late."

Closing Remarks

Jesse and Sutton wrap up their conversation by reaffirming their deep mutual respect and excitement for each other's projects. They express gratitude for the opportunity to share their stories, emphasizing the value of genuine connections forged over a meal.

Notable Quote:
Jesse Tyler Ferguson (50:06): "This is really awesome. Thank you."

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Key Takeaways:

• Personal Struggles: Both hosts discuss their personal challenges, emphasizing the importance of mental health and self-love.

• Career Insights: The transition from theater to television requires adaptability and continuous learning.

• Mentorship and Inspiration: Influential figures like Carol Burnett play a crucial role in shaping one's career and personal growth.

• Balancing Act: Successfully balancing a demanding career with parenthood requires careful scheduling and prioritization.

• Never Too Late: Personal reinvention and embracing new opportunities are possible at any stage of life.

This episode offers an intimate look into the lives of two accomplished performers, highlighting their journeys, struggles, and the enduring bonds formed through their shared experiences in the entertainment world.

Transcript

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

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[Simon Mayo]

Hello, I'm Simon Mayo. And I'm Mark Kermode. And on this week's take, we have reviews of the new Jason Statham film, A Working Man. Novocaine. He Feels no Pain. And the end, with our special guest, George MacKay, part of an all star cast for the apocalyptic musical the End. And if you're not already a subscriber. What are you doing? Come on, there's all this good stuff waiting.

[Sutton Foster]

Hi, it's Jesse. Today on the show, we have one of the brightest Broadway stars of our generation. From Thoroughly Modern Millie to Anything Goes. From the Drowsy Chaperone to Once Upon a Mattress, From Sweeney Todd to Young Frankenstein. Okay, honestly, I could do this all day. It's Broadway and television star and author Sutton Foster.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I've always been a leaper. And my dad when I was a kid said I would leap into the pool, but I didn't know how to swim, so I would just like jump in and I'd be drowning.

[Sutton Foster]

This is dinner's on me, and I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. I remember the exact moment I met Sutton Foster. Now, she wasn't Sutton Foster the Broadway icon, yet she wasn't Sutton Foster the two time Tony Award winner, or Sutton Foster the TV star. She was just my friend Hunter's sister. She was crashing in town on a break from the national tour of Les Miserables, and she decided to help him out with a reading of his new musical, the summer of 42. She walked into the rehearsal room. I think I remember her wearing overalls and sensible shoes. But she had this energy, this effortless charm that instantly warmed the space. And then she opened her mouth and sang. And oh my God, I thought, this girl is a star. Now Broadway fans know the rest of the story. She went on to lead Thoroughly Modern Millie, won her first Tony, and cemented herself as one of the most beloved musical theater performers of our time. Watching her rise has been nothing short of exhilarating. And while she's conquered Broadway, television and beyond, one thing has remained Unchanged the overalls and the sensible shoes. It's my favorite part of Sutton. Now, if you're someone who doesn't follow Broadway, which, frankly, I don't understand, you might know Sutton from her TV roles in Younger or Bunheads. Now, while preparing for this episode, I revisited her memoir, How Crafting Saved My Life. It's brutally honest, deeply personal, and absolutely worth reading. Not just for Sutton fans, but for anyone who has ever faced anxiety or trauma. So when I heard she was in LA starring in Once Upon a Mattress with Michael Urie, another recent podcast guest, I knew we had to sit down and catch up over a meal. Hi, how are you doing? I'm so good. Hey, shimmy out and give you a hug without knocking anything. Oh, my God. How are you?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Hey.

[Sutton Foster]

So good to see you. I brought Sutton Foster to Simonette in Culver City. It's this charming little all day cafe, bar and bistro tucked inside the Palih. Oh, and side note, I absolutely love the cafes and the Pali House properties. Simonette truly feels like a little slice of Paris right here in la. The vibe is effortlessly cool. You can grab an espresso and a croissant in the morning, enjoy a martini and oysters at happy hour, or settle in for some steak frites at dinner. They have an adorable vintage inspired dining room and bar. And if you like to sit al fresco like we did, they have a really cute patio that's equally Instagrammable if you care about those things, which I do. There's lush greenery and the walls are this gorgeous shade of blue. Perhaps cerulean. Devil wears Prada reference, anyone? Simonette has that warm and inviting energy that makes for great conversation. And trust me, Sutton and I had plenty to talk about. Okay, let's get to the conversation. I brought you yarn. You don't have to take it.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Oh, I'm taking it. And I'm gonna make you something.

[Sutton Foster]

Thanks for coming over here.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Oh, it's easy.

[Sutton Foster]

Are you gonna do more things while you're on the side of town? No, you just came over for me.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

Aw, thanks. I think I'm gonna do nicoise salad, actually.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Okay, I have to put on glasses. Cause I can't see.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah, me saying, when did that happen for you?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Everyone, look, I can't even turn my phone off.

[Sutton Foster]

Wait, can I see the fonts on your phone?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

No, I'm still normal.

[Sutton Foster]

Oh, really? Do you wanna see the fonts on mine?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. Are they real big?

[Sutton Foster]

I don't think it's that big. But then people see it and they're like, oh, Jessie, does that seem big to you?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

That's pretty big. Yeah. Yeah, that's pretty big.

[Sutton Foster]

But the moment I changed it to this, like, if it's even a tiny bit smaller, I can't see it at all.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I always wanted glasses. I always wanted to be the kid to wear glasses. So when I would get eye exams, I would sort of fake it a little bit in the hopes they would. And they would. And then I couldn't see. Cause the glass. I was. I had, like, perfect vision. And then when I.

[Sutton Foster]

You actually got them to. Oh, sure.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Because I really wanted to be the kid with glasses.

[Sutton Foster]

But that's so funny.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. And then I was like, damn it, I can't see. And then when I turned 40, around 40, everyone's like, oh, your eyes are gonna go to shit. And then they sort of. I was, okay. And then it just. It was like a slow decline.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And now I can't see in the morning at all. Like, if I. Or at night, I have to use glasses to read. Like, read a book or.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Or anything. And then there's. Sometimes I just a menu. I'm like, oh, well, I mean, the menus are ridiculous. They're ridiculous. It's insulting.

[Sutton Foster]

Hi.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

How are you?

[Sutton Foster]

I. I think we just decided. What do you think?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I'm gonna have the omelette.

[Sutton Foster]

Omelette. Good choice.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Can I also get a coffee?

[Sutton Foster]

Of course.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Could I have a cappuccino?

[Sutton Foster]

Cappuccino.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Whole milk.

[Sutton Foster]

Okay.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Whole milk's great.

[Sutton Foster]

Got it. I'm gonna do an iced coffee with a little bit of milk. Whole milk's fine. Sure. And I'm gonna do the nicoise salad, please. Got it. Can I also get some sparkling water? Of course. Absolutely.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Thank you.

[Sutton Foster]

Of course. You're in town doing Once Upon a Mattress.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes. At the Ahmanson.

[Sutton Foster]

At the Ahmanson. What's your normal, like while you're doing a show? Schedule. Cause you're also a mom, so I know that you have to get up early.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I do. But my daughter's not with me yet. She'll get here late tonight, but I'll. Tomorrow I'll be like.

[Sutton Foster]

And how. Emily.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Right, Emily. She's seven.

[Sutton Foster]

Seven. Okay.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So I've had, like, 10 days. No dog, no child.

[Sutton Foster]

Kind of nice.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

50. 50.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So it's sort of really nice because I can sleep and I don't have any responsibilities. And I'm also, like, not in my apartment, but I'm, like, super lonely and miss him like crazy.

[Sutton Foster]

Of course.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah. For sure. But when you're doing a show. Do you. Do you like to sleep in and wake up when your body wakes you up?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

If I can.

[Sutton Foster]

If you can, yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

But I've sort of trained Emily. This is crazy, to. If it's a school day and I'm taking her to school, then she can't wake me up till seven. But even seven is, like, that's when.

[Sutton Foster]

My kids wake up. Yeah. And that's early. Did you put one of those lights in Emily's room that, like, turns green when she can get out of bed?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I attempted it, but it was insulting. She was. It was like pouring hot acid on her face. She was completely incensed by it.

[Sutton Foster]

Really?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes. She felt betrayed that there was something controlling her in the room. Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

Beckett. So my older son, Beckett. Beckett really is a rule follower. So he really does pay attention to the green light. But the minute. And he'll, like, sit on the edge of the bed waiting for it to turn green, but the minute it turns green, you just hear in the whole house, it's green, it's green, it's green. It's really cute.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Go, go, go.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah. And so now he's, like, trying to. He's doing this thing where he, like, will come out and see if he can, like, maybe get us to, like, let him come out earlier. And we're like, no, we gotta, like, really stick with this. Not until it's green. So now he's using the time because he wakes up, like, around 6:15. Now he's using that time to, like, just do things in his room. But he's also started to get dressed himself, which is very cute.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

How old is he?

[Sutton Foster]

He's four and a half.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Oh, he's young. Wow, that's big. That's big.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah, I know. It's really impressive. But today he got dressed and he's put on seven shirts.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Okay. Or what was his plan?

[Sutton Foster]

I think he just thought it was funny.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Okay.

[Sutton Foster]

He's like, let's layer some looks.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

That's worthwhile.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Or he, like, already going for the comedy.

[Sutton Foster]

Right.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Truly. I appreciate that.

[Sutton Foster]

Listen, whatever makes him happy.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

I read your book when you sent it to me. Hooked. It's so good.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Thanks.

[Sutton Foster]

And I just love the early stories of you navigating your interest in musical theater. It's so relatable to me. And it's so similar to how I grew up.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Where did you grow up?

[Sutton Foster]

In Albuquerque, New Mexico.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Okay. Was your family involved in the arts at all?

[Sutton Foster]

No.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Okay.

[Sutton Foster]

Similar to yours. Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

Although it sounds like your mom was really super supportive of you and your brother.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She was. But my mom and I had a very complicated relationship. But. And in many ways, I think my mom was living out her unrealized dreams through her children. So for many years, I didn't even know if it was my own dream or hers, even though I was too young to know. But she was incredibly supportive and loved it. And when she was young, she wanted to be a model. She was really beautiful. And her father was like, absolutely not. So she eloped to marry my dad when she was 19 years old, and. Which is so crazy. Yeah, I know. So you can imagine now. I mean, first of all, I can't. I don't even remember who I was dating when I was 19, let alone, like, being married to them. I was like, what? But, yeah, so they. They got married and had my brother when I think she was 21, and then had me at 27.

[Sutton Foster]

That's crazy.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I know. I was like, what was my mom doing when she was 50?

[Sutton Foster]

Do you ever do the math, too, Like. Cause I. So my mom passed away a few weeks ago, which is why you're getting all this yarn. Because I was cleaning out her place, and she has all this yarn. Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Oh, Jesse, I'm so sorry.

[Sutton Foster]

Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. But I've been doing the math a lot. Like, what was she doing when she was 50? It's very humbling because I feel like I've been afforded such a wonderful life to do so many things that I never dreamed I would be able to do. And seeing how she was a registered RN and seeing how, like, little she made and how much she did with that, and I don't know, I found it very moving that she obviously did things to the best of how she could do them with, you know, what she was given. But also just so grateful that I don't know that I've been able to forge my own path without, you know, my history sort of telling me where that's going to be.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It's a brave, blazing trail. You know, my mom didn't work, and my dad, he worked for Chevrolet, and I think he made, like, $46,000 a year. And they always gave us, like, this huge blowout for Christmas, and I'm like, how did they do it?

[Sutton Foster]

I know. I know.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Your kid. So your oldest is four. And then your youngest.

[Sutton Foster]

Youngest has just turned two in November.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Amazing. Is Beckett in the year?

[Sutton Foster]

He's gonna be in kindergarten in the fall.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So this was the thing I just wasn't prepared for, is that Your entire life is scheduled around your child's school.

[Sutton Foster]

Yes. Do you think that there's a spark in her to do this, to be an actress?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She definitely has an interest in creative arts. She loves to sing. She loves to write. Like her dad's a writer too. So she is really creative and she loves to write and create stories. She loves to come with me to the theater. So when I was doing Mattress in New York, she would Saturday matinees with me at the theater and like as soon as the show would start, she was like, turn it up, mommy, turn it up. And she didn't want to monitor.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She didn't want to see it again. She just wanted to listen to it. It was really sweet.

[Sutton Foster]

You talk about your mom in your book so much, about the struggles that she had with mental health and am I saying this right? Agoraphobia. Oh, yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Agoraphobia. Yeah, I think agoraphobia. That's what I always say. But I don't know, it could be wrong.

[Sutton Foster]

I can only imagine how difficult that must have been, you know, as a kid.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

What's fascinating to me is that as a kid, it gradually got worse as I grew up. But as a kid, it was all I knew. I think that my mom only knew what she knew. And I didn't know, like, oh, my mom doesn't have any friends or oh, they never go out or they never. People never come over. She didn't work, she was a stay at home mom, you know, but she didn't have a life beyond that. But I didn't know that that was not normal. Not quote normal. I just didn't know.

[Sutton Foster]

I mean, my parents didn't have a lot of friends too, when I really think about it. But like they had a few.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

But like I never had a babysitter, like ever.

[Sutton Foster]

Right.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And when I was younger, like she would come and see stuff at school. But then as I got older, it just gradually got worse and worse. And again, I didn't really know. And my mom never got help. And I think that's the thing that makes me the most sad is like she never got help. And maybe if that generation, she didn't know, she could. Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

Thank you. French roll omelette.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Thank you. That looks awesome.

[Sutton Foster]

Thank you.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It's perfect. I'm so excited.

[Sutton Foster]

And Denis Wasal. Thank you. Gorgeous. Anything else I can get you?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Good.

[Sutton Foster]

Right now. Thanks.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Great. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me come out. I don't go out much, so this is really. I know you don't.

[Sutton Foster]

I know you don't.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I really do know that at all. So this is a big deal. Thank you. That's so funny. I love that you know that.

[Sutton Foster]

No, I do know that. I've always known that about you.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

But I. But it's funny and it's being the daughter of an agoraphobic that's really interesting. But you're not.

[Sutton Foster]

But you're. I mean, you.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I live such a public life.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

What's fascinating to me is that I've chosen a career where I am so out in the world and I live in a city where you can't.

[Sutton Foster]

You can't disappear.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

You can't disappear. Even though I have tendencies, I'm a bit of a hermit, I'm a bit of a loner. Like, I love my home, but I'm aware of that. I go, ooh, okay, I gotta be careful here. I gotta make sure I'm like, of the world.

[Sutton Foster]

I think being a stage actor, I think a lot of people don't understand how demanding that is. You know, they look at it as, oh, you work for two hours a night. I mean, that's really not the case.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It's a 24 hour job. The realities of being almost 50, I'm not 25 anymore, and I'm running around like a crazy lady, and it's incredibly physical and demanding and there's a lot of pressure of being on the poster. And sure, I don't think of myself that way, but I go, oh, wow. Yeah. People are expecting me to be there and to show up.

[Sutton Foster]

Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Sutton tells me how her career started with a lie. Okay. A white lie. And skipping senior year of high school to become a showgirl. Okay, be right back. I don't know about you, but when I was a kid, one of my favorite errands was going to the deli counter with my parents. I'd press my nose against the glass, watching as they sliced the perfect cut of turkey or ham. And if I was lucky, I'd get a sample handed over the counter like a little gift. Now, as a dad, I love the idea of recreating that experience with my own kids. Picking up some Boar's Head Oven Gold Turkey or Smokemaster Beechwood Smoked Black forest ham and some aged cheddar for a picnic in the park. Because there's making a sandwich and then there's crafting a sandwich. Boar's Head uses premium whole cuts of meat, hand trimmed and slow roasted to perfection. Every flavor is carefully chosen. And every recipe is crafted with purpose. So when I want a meal to be truly great, I choose Boar's Head. And I know when we spread out the picnic blanket just like I did when I was a kid, it'll be a meal worth remembering. Boar's Head. Committed to crafts since 1905. Discover the craftsmanship behind every bite at Boar's Head.com Vacation season is nearly upon us and this year, you know, I'm treating myself to luxe upgrades that I deserve with Quince's high quality travel essentials at fair prices. Think lightweight loungewear that's perfect for those long haul flights or premium luggage options. The best part, all Quince Items are priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the costs of the middleman and passes the savings on to us. And Quints only works with factories that use safe, ethical and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes. I just love that. I've been eyeing their expandable carry on hard shell suitcase, which comes in four sizes and a bunch of colors. It's just so nice to be able to get an extra inch of packing space in if I need it. I love options. I also just had a tab open for the Nappa leather duffel bag, which for under $200 feels like a steal. For your next trip, treat yourself to luxe upgrades you deserve from quints. Go to quints.com JTF for 365 day returns plus free shipping on your order. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com JTF to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com JTF and we're back with more dinners on me. How do you, you know, have this career that you have and still be present in the world and still be a mom?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

You know, my mom really did instill the importance of independence. You know, she raised me to be an independent, you know, career driven person. And I think I've just latched onto that for so many years and it's served me very well. I mean, I feel so grateful and lucky and then as I head into like the second half of my life.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah, yeah, act two.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I know it's sort of taking this opportunity to really evaluate, like how I want to spend my time and what really excites me and just evaluating the balance and just making sure I'm choosing. Everything that I'm choosing is something I really, really want to do and that is worthwhile.

[Sutton Foster]

Well, I mean, it's Also, when the first 50 years of someone's life are as full as I think yours and mine have gotten to be, you know, it is sort of that thing of, like, okay, how. One of the questions, like, how do I top that? But also. And how do I maintain that? But also, like, how do I grow as a person and not just spin the wheels and do the same things over and over? Which is, you know, maybe why you had such a crazy year last year. I mean, you were doing Once Upon a Mattress at City Center. Encores. And while you were doing that, you were rehearsing one of the most difficult roles in all of musical theater. Mrs. Lovett and Sweeney Todd went right into that. I don't know how you did that. Like, literally, you finished Once Upon a Mattress, and then when you were performing, like, the next Monday or Tuesday, and then you started Once Upon a Mattress again, you know, those opportunities aren't going to come along again, and here they are. They're being presented to you at the same time, and it's not convenient. I remember just thinking, God, the resilience that you had to get through that and then do it. So what seemed so effortlessly when I watched you was really remarkable. But, I mean, I find the way you entered into, you know, being a professional musical theater actor so fascinating because it happened so young. It started with deceit. You were. You lied about your age.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes, I lied about my age.

[Sutton Foster]

It was on the national tour of Will Rogers Follies, and they were looking for people. You had to be at least 18 and you would.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I just turned 17.

[Sutton Foster]

So you lied about your age.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

My mom. My mom told me to lie.

[Sutton Foster]

But you left high school to do it.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I did. It's so crazy. I was 17 and just watched it on the Tony Awards. It was the year that it was.

[Sutton Foster]

Miss Saigon and Bo Ruddy Scholar.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes, it's once on the. And Will Rogers Follies.

[Sutton Foster]

That's right.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I remember watching the Tonys and being like, Ms. Icon's gonna win.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And then Will Rogers Follies won. But I remember watching Will Rogers Follies.

[Sutton Foster]

Perform, and they did that great number with the hats.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes. They had these tambourine hats and girls with, like, powder puffs on their boobs. But there were, like, 18 girls, and they all looked this. They were all, like, really tall, big teeth.

[Sutton Foster]

Follies girls.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

They were folly. You know, Zigfeld Follies girls. And. And I was like, that looks like me because I was really tall and I had big teeth, and I thought I could do that and about, like two months later, less than that, there was an article in the Detroit Free Press. They were looking for girls for the national tour of Will Rogers Follies. And I was like, why would they come here? I was like, it can't be the same thing that I just saw on my tv, right?

[Sutton Foster]

It is interesting that they were going there.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

They ended up doing very smartly. So they sought girls all over the country. So they went to Detroit, they went to Chicago, they went to Vegas. So that when we went to the local hometowns, there was a hometown girl.

[Sutton Foster]

That'S actually really smart, right?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So I saw the thing in the paper and my mom's like, you should audition. And I was like, but it says you have to be 18. And she's like, well, tell them you'll be 18 on your next birthday. I was like, okay. So my mom and dad drove me down to the Fisher Theater in downtown Detroit. There were like, I don't know, 50 girls or so from local area. And we all danced on the stage and we had to sing. And Jeff Calhoun was there, who was Tommy Tunes associate. And he came up to me and he's like, how old are you? And I said, I'll be 18 on my next birthday. And he's like, keep tapping, we'll see you in New York. And of course I'm like, what does that mean? I then never auditioned, you know, it was crazy. And then they called me in for a callback in New York City. It was a two day audition and we did the audition on the stairs. I was 17.

[Sutton Foster]

Had you taken like professional tap classes?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I had at Juliana's Academy of Dance in Detroit, Michigan, and did tap and jazz and ballet and all of that stuff and did competitions. So I had danced my whole life, but I'd never done anything like this. And then the next day we sang. And then at the end of that day, they like literally, Chorus Line style. There were like 25 girls left. They kept making cuts. And the thing that I will remember is that for some reason my name was the last name on the list. So they would list the names and then they would go and Sutton Foster. And I'd. Cause I'd have to wait to see if I made the cut. And I would. And my name would be the last name. And I'd be like, oh my God. So they lined us all up and they made one final cut. And then Tommy Tunes like, congratulations, you're the Follies girl of the national tour. And all I could think of was, I gotta tell My parents. I'm like, what do I do? I was like, I just got this thing and I'm just standing there looking around at everybody going, holy shit, now what?

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And then I was on tour. I spent my senior year of high school on tour and we had to ask my principal for permission to leave. And I finished it.

[Sutton Foster]

And you weren't at a performing arts school, right?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

No, I was at a public school in Troy, Michigan. Troy High School. So on tour I would go to, like, local schools and I would talk about my experience and I would get credit and then I would read plays and write essays. Oh, my gosh. And that's how I graduated high school.

[Sutton Foster]

That's wild. Yeah, I do you talk about it in your book. And the Will Rogers flight was a bit of a traumatizing experience for you. You know, you felt like you really couldn't connect with any of the other girls, partly maybe because of your age difference.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I was so young, and I was also a young 17.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I don't blame anybody. I was young and eager and naive and energetic and obnoxious. And I'd never lived on my own. I had never done a professional job. And I just had a really hard time fitting in.

[Sutton Foster]

Do you ever zoom out and think about that's actually asking a lot of a 17 year old to be a part of a national tour and live that life and be away from your family and friends.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And also think about it too. I was a 17 year old suddenly thrust into a world of being a showgirl, where I am sexualized, being ogled by men, literally wearing horns on my head and swinging a tail. And I was around grown adult women and I was a kid.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So it was.

[Sutton Foster]

Did anyone ever find out that you were as young as you were? Or did you?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah, I mean, eventually. Yeah. And I even go back and I go, like, what is the age when you're allowed to, like, be on your own? Like, I probably should have had some type of parental support. I felt very alone and isolated and I had no other contemporary. I was reading Sweet Valley High and like, Teen Beat, right?

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah. And I mean, you tell in your book a story that is so relatable to me because I've suffered panic attacks. But having your first panic attack and not really knowing what that was.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

No, I didn't know what was going on. And see, that's the other thing you think about. I have perspective on it now. I can look back and go, oh, my mom had mental illness and in many ways I thought something was wrong. With me, everything became so overwhelming, and I did not have the vocabulary or the tools to talk about it, identify it, ask for help. I literally imploded. And in my 20s, I struggled a lot with anxiety, panic attacks, and I still struggle with it. It's not like it goes away. But one of the things I hope I can do as a mom is create an environment where all feelings are welcome. She's allowed to be angry, sad, mad, whatever it is. And that there's no shame, there's no shutting down. And I think I didn't grow up in a house that was like that. I grew up in a house where I felt like the only feeling I could have was be happy, keep smiling. And so when you're faced with that and then all of a sudden you're like, I don't know what these other things are. And then you can't process it, and it just shows up. And for me, it showed up in a massive panic attack that happened on stage. And I started crying and couldn't stop and didn't know what was happening and really didn't understand what had happened until many years later.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I felt enormous shame and embarrassment, and I really kind of shut down after that.

[Sutton Foster]

Do you feel like the community, the Broadway community, was in any way sort of responsible for helping you?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Isn't that funny?

[Sutton Foster]

Figure yourself out at that age, or was this work that you did have to do on your own?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I'm grateful for my mother in so many ways because she really taught me independence, drive, ambition. But she wasn't there. And I really see it now as a parent. So I go, oh, wow. And essentially I've had to become my own parent. Even more true. Now, as I'm a mother, I'm mothering myself at the same time because every night when I put my daughter to bed, I say, I love you. I'm so proud of you. And so now I say that to myself. So I look at myself in the mirror and I go, I love you. I am so proud of you all of a sudden.

[Sutton Foster]

I love that.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Essentially it's all self love. Can you dare to love yourself as much as you love your children?

[Sutton Foster]

It's really powerful.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I was like, what? Like, the concept of it was new to me. And I was like, I don't even know what that means. And so I, like, look at myself in the eyes and I'm like, all right, can I love myself more than anything? Cause essentially, that's what we all want, right? We want to be loved. And finding that so that no matter what, I am so proud. I'm so proud of myself, you know?

[Sutton Foster]

You should be. Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

You've had some major milestones in your career, but, like, the big one I think that most people love to talk about is, of course, Thoroughly Modern Millie, which came to you in an interesting way. Originally, you were the understudy or standby understudy, and then out of town were bumped up to take over the role.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

You came in and you brought that show into New York. It was a huge hit. You won the Tony Award for Best Actress. I mean, what are your reflections on that time? You know, first of all, I mean, it must have been somewhat difficult to step into a role that was being played by someone else.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes. I had auditioned for the role. I went in maybe six, five or six times. And I remember having a conversation with my agent, and he's like, it didn't go your way. And I said, do they need an understudy? And he's like, let me ask. And then he called back, like, five minutes later, and he's like, they do an understudy. I was like, great, I'll do it. And I was really excited about it. And I loved. I loved being in La Jolla. I loved being. I wanted to be a part of something new. And I thought it was so awesome. I loved watching Aaron Dilley. So Aaron grew up in Detroit, Michigan, and I was, like, obsessed with her because she was so brilliant. And so I was just, like, thrilled to be able to be a part of it and watch her. And I always look back at that time, I wasn't there with the bag of marbles, trying to take someone down. It was like a fever dream, it all. She got sick, and I stepped in, and I was rehearsing for her for a couple of days. And at the end of the week, I got a call from Michael Mayer, who was the director, and I was preparing to go back into the ensemble, and we were heading into tech, and he called me, and he's like, aaron's leaving the show, and the role of Millie is yours if you want it. And I just remember bursting into tears because I was so confused. And I think my first question was, is Aaron okay? And I remember sitting with Erin that day. I went to go see her, and I was on her couch, and I was, like, sobbing because I was so scared. And I also didn't know what was happening.

[Sutton Foster]

How old were you at this time?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I was 25. Wow.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I wanted to make sure she was all right. And then the next thing I know, I was in, like, a costume fitting, crying, and then we had to go tell the company. And the company was a little bit like, what the fuck is happening? And they all kind of were like. And then they all made a decision collectively to rally behind me. And I was just this sort of green, scared kid who was suddenly thrust into this position. And we opened the show out of town and. And then they asked me to take it to New York. And a lot of it's like, it's a blur. What was crazy about that time is that it was. Not only was it my first show, it was like, everybody's first show.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Everyone was flying by the seat of their pants. No one knew what they were doing.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

But I remember when we opened in New York, because we got mixed reviews, and I just remember thinking, oh, no, I've let everybody down. And I didn't realize that that was, like, the first time I was so naive. I didn't realize, oh, shit, $11 million is, like, on my shoulders. I had no idea.

[Sutton Foster]

My memory thinks it was just. It was a huge hit.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It ended up being a huge hit, but it wasn't initially received well by the critics, but the audiences loved it.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So it, like, it was exactly what it was supposed to be. And it changed my life. It really did. You know, one phone call changed the trajectory of my career and. But I was also. I look back at that time and I go, because don't. Don't you think that careers or opportunities, it's a little bit of luck, but it's also preparation.

[Sutton Foster]

So your job is to be ready if the.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I was understudied, you know, so it.

[Sutton Foster]

Was literally the definition. Yeah. You have to be ready, be ready. I agree with you, everything you're saying. The difference is sometimes people, when they're doing that leap, they really leap. And sometimes people just, like, tentatively leap. And I think really taking the leap and be like, I'm going to either fall really hard or fly. I think that's. That's the difference is just the bravery to, like, actually leap with both feet.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I've always been a leaper, and I've. My dad, when I was a kid said I would leap into the pool, but I didn't know how to swim, so I would just, like, jump in and I'd be drowning.

[Sutton Foster]

Great analogy.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. There's not this part of me that's going, oh, no. Oh, no. What if. What if. What if? I'm like. I'm like, what if? You know, And I figure it out as I go.

[Sutton Foster]

It's also that thing that you were just talking about, about having faith in yourself and like looking in the mirror and saying, I love you and you're fantastic. Knowing that you can do it and like, whether or not you really can, you have to have that faith that you. And I think that's so important. I think that's also what gives someone the bravery to jump with both feet and make the decision as they're in the air.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Exactly. And also knowing that no matter what, if you crash and burn or if you fly, you're okay. There's lessons everywhere, and there are always opportunities in everything.

[Sutton Foster]

Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Sutton tells me about her big TV break with Amy Sherman Palladino's series Bunheads. And she reveals a hilarious, hilarious mix up she had with comedy legend Carol Burnett. Okay, be right back. This episode of Dinners on Me is brought to you by Nissan. These days, it feels like the world and our lives are moving at hyperspeed. I mean, that's why I love doing this podcast. It's a chance to slow down, to truly connect with another human being and to enjoy the feeling of actually being in the present moment. On that note, I am very excited that Dinners On Me is partnering with Nissan because Nissan understands that sometimes the greatest rush comes from not rushing at all. And with the all new Nissan Murano, you can enjoy an unapologetic refuge amidst the daily hustle and bustle of life. The Nissan Murano is not just a vehicle. It's a space where you can take a beat to catch your breath and re energize to be in the present moment. And trust me, this is the moment you'll want to be in and drive in. The Nissan Murano features an elevated modern interior design and a bold new exterior look. Plus, the expansive panoramic moonroof adds tons of natural light to the roomy cabin with massaging leather appointed seats to help melt away the tension of the day and ambient mood lighting. With 64 color options to set the vibe just right, what's not to love? So thanks again to Nissan for sponsoring this episode of Dinner's on Me and for reminding us to take a moment and breathe. Learn more about the all new nissan [e-mail] Panoramic moonroof, ambient lighting and massaging leather appointed seats are optional features.

[Simon Mayo]

Hello, I'm Simon Mayo. And I'm Mark Kermode. And on this week's take, we have reviews of the new Jason Statham film A Working man. Novocaine. He feels no pain. And the End, with our special guest, George MacKay, part of an all star cast for the apocalyptic musical the End. And if you're not already a subscriber, what are you doing? Come on. There's all this good stuff waiting.

[Sutton Foster]

And we're back with more dinners on Me. How was it for you? Because, I mean, we sort of also had the same thing happen to us where we were doing work on stage and then we got plucked out and put into tv. Very high profile TV jobs.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

You got to do Bun Heads and Younger, which were both so great. What was that transition like for you? Was it something that you were intimidated by or.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I'd be curious to know your experience too. It wasn't anything that I was seeking. I don't know. Were you?

[Sutton Foster]

Same. I wasn't seeking it.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. And I was like, I'm theater.

[Sutton Foster]

I still feel like I'm just visiting LA to this day.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

No, because people, like, people ask me, do you want to do more tv? I'm like, well, sure, if someone wants, you know. But I was such a Gilmore Girls fan.

[Sutton Foster]

Right? Same credence as Gilmore Girls. Yep.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So, yes. So when Bunheads came my way, I just read the script and I'm like, oh, my God, this is incredible. And it was Amy Sherman Paladino, who I was obsessed with from Gilmore, and it was about dance. And I went, oh, this is like a perfect fit. But I had never done. I had done, like little tiny, maybe a day player. I think I had done svu.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I didn't know how to read a call sheet. I didn't know. I didn't understand anything. But what was great is because of Amy and she knew I had a theater background. I felt very taken care of. And then I would just start asking people questions. I'm like, what's that? What's that? And then when I got. Then when Younger happened, how did that come to you?

[Sutton Foster]

Because Darren Starr.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Right, it was Darren Starr who was also a big theater fan.

[Sutton Foster]

Yes.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I remember reading the script in my kitchen, and I think I was 39. I was on the verge of turning 40. And I read it and I was like, oh, my gosh, I could do this because it was about a woman trying to pretend she was much younger than she was. And I was like, oh, and Darren Starr. So that was seven seasons. And that I felt like, was like, I went to college and then grad school, and every season I learned more and more and more about how to Be on a set, how to be on camera, how to, like, learn lines, and how to, like, handle a character that grows. You know, we play characters that do the same thing every other. Every single night, and then suddenly I'm. I'm on a journey. So there were. There were things about TV that I absolutely loved. And there's a thing in tv, too, where you have to leap. You have to be strong about it.

[Sutton Foster]

I always talk about this. You also have to make decisions on the fly, and then you're tied into those decisions.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Exactly.

[Sutton Foster]

Which is what really scares me, because I love a rehearsal process where I could try something one day. Like, that did not work. We're gonna try this thing this day. I just did a guest spot on a. On Max Muchnik's new TV series, and I took a big swing with the character, and I was like, well, now this is what I'm tied into. And like, okay, here we go.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I didn't realize that. But what's been interesting then, coming back to theater is that I feel like I've taken those big swings, big leaps to theater. So, like, even with Mattress or Sweeney, I was, like, leaping in with big choices, big decision. Because there's no time. There's no time for you to be like, I'm scared. I don't want to do it. Because everyone, literally everyone's staring at you with cups of coffee going, hurry the fuck up.

[Sutton Foster]

Make the day.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Make the day.

[Sutton Foster]

In your book, in one of the early chapters, you talk about Carol Burnett being such an inspiration of yours and how you took a lot of the rules of her comedy and some of your early roles. And, you know, you. You discover that, you know, if you fall down, you can get a laugh, even as a kid.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

And you know, this book was written before you knew that you were going to be doing.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah, and before I was doing Mattress.

[Sutton Foster]

Mattress. I mean, talk to me. You have met her. I know because I saw you guys did a photo shoot together, and I met her. I've met her a few times, and I was brave enough. At the last Emmy Awards, I approached her and had a bit of a conversation with her, and the first thing I asked is, I was like, what can I do to keep the conversation going? So we started talking about you and Once Upon a Mattress, and she just lit up and she's like, I love her. I've met her. I haven't seen the show yet. I'm gonna see it. When it comes to la. Talk to me about what it's meant for you to have that relationship with her. And she's coming. I think she is gonna come at some point. Do you know when she's coming?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I want to know, because I want to know that I'm performing on stage and that my idol is in the.

[Sutton Foster]

Audience in a role that she created. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And even though my head may explode, I want to have it.

[Sutton Foster]

I always want to know, too.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She just texted me. It cracks me up. I have her number, and she texts me, but every time she texts me, she goes, sutton, it's Carol. And I'm like, I know.

[Sutton Foster]

I'm like, I know.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She always signs it Love, Carol. It's just the greatest thing. Oh, I have another crazy story, too. Side story. She sent me flowers for opening night here. And it was a weird card, and I didn't know they were from her, but it said, happy birthday, Dee. You're the best. Love ya. See? And I was like. I was like, I don't know what this is. This is obviously wrong. And so Julian, my longtime dresser, calls the florist diva. And the florist. The florist says, oh, they're from Carol Burnett. But we're like, this says, happy Birthday. And then we. Michael Urie comes in, and we show it to him, and he goes, you got Dick Van Dyke's card? Because it was Dick Van Dyke's birthday. And I bet you know all this, he don't know. Cause he was like, it's Dick Van Dyke's birthday. And he's like, I bet you Carol sent Dick Van Dyke flowers. This is what. This is the story we've created.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah. He got opening night flowers for Sutton.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

He got, like, happy openings. Sutton. Love, Carol.

[Sutton Foster]

That's incredible. I.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

So cool. So I. I grew up watching the Carol Burnett show. And so the story I've created in my mind was that the Carol Burnett show was on in tandem with the Muppet Show. And I would watch them, like, back to back. And so I. I think I'm part Carol Burnett, part Muppet.

[Sutton Foster]

And that's actually a really accurate.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It kind of is kind of perfect.

[Sutton Foster]

Kind of is, yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And so what I really remember about the Carol Burnett show, and even as I watch it, I've watched it later in life, it was the ensemble. So it wasn't just Carol Burnett. It was a brilliant ensemble, like Harvey Korman, Tim Conway.

[Sutton Foster]

Vicki.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Vicki Lawrence.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And Carol Burnett. Like, those. The four of them, and how they worked together and how they played off each other and how they supported, how generous they were. So, yes, it was, but it was like it wasn't fictional.

[Sutton Foster]

They were creating magic together.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It was magic. And I think there was something that imprinted. So it's. I have been very attracted to ensemble things and like Mattress is very much that. It's an ensemble of players that we are always throwing the ball to each other. It's full of generosity and play and fun and it's never about one person. And so I think that really landed with me with her being able to talk to her, meet her.

[Sutton Foster]

She's your friend.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I have.

[Sutton Foster]

She's your friend now.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. We have to get where she can just say hi and not have to tell me that it's her. But it is, it's incredible because, like, I'm still the. I'm still the 15 year old kid in the beanbag.

[Sutton Foster]

Do you, you know, I'm sure you're aware of this. There is a, A, a children's book. The, the A through Z of Broadway.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes.

[Sutton Foster]

Broadway divas.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yes.

[Sutton Foster]

And, you know, your S. Yes.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah, it's a yes.

[Sutton Foster]

Yes, of course. But it's a book that's, you know, it's Audrey McDonald, it's Sherlyn MacLaine. It's unbelievable. Burnett, Peters. I mean, you know, when they talk about Broadway legends, like you're now being mentioned in this group of people that can't like be, you know, something that you ever get used to feeling or hearing. I mean, it's. Does it. Is it lost on you that that's how, like we look at you now? Because you are like, you are. You have seven Tony nominations, you've won twice, and you are like one of the premier Broadway female powerhouses that we have it.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

How do I feel about it? I don't think about it. Yeah, but then I will meet people or I'll teach a class or I'll see young people and I go, oh, that's how I felt about Patti LuPone. Or you know, when I was like, it's the thing I want to do and it feels so far away. And I just want to be like, it's not that far away. Like, that's why, like sitting with Carol Burnett, I'm like, what? It felt so far away. I have Patti LuPone's number too.

[Sutton Foster]

Makes me laugh.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

But I'm still intimidated by Patone. But we're friends too. And all of a sudden I'm going, how is this possible?

[Sutton Foster]

I just did Wheel of Fortune with Bernadette Peters and I was like, what is happening? What is my life right now? I'm playing Wheel of Fortune with Bernadette Peters.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. It's like, yeah, Bernadette.

[Sutton Foster]

And we exchanged numbers.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

And now she just casually texts in.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Checks in.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah, checks in.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah. Brenda Peters. I know.

[Sutton Foster]

Brenda Peters.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

I know. And it's. Yeah, it's a thing. And I'm like, she's human too. She just wants friends.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

You know, like, we all just want. We're all just human beings, like, just trying to be accepted and, you know, all of the things I'm trying to.

[Sutton Foster]

Do the math in my head. Was your mom still around when you did Millie?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She was.

[Sutton Foster]

Was she able to see you in that?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

She did come up. So my mom, she wasn't at opening. My mom was. Didn't travel. My dad didn't travel. He sort of stayed with my mom. And so when she did, she came to see Millie. She flew up. No, they drove and they, they like stayed at the Marriott Marquis. I think they saw Matinee, which is.

[Sutton Foster]

The building that the theater was in.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Sutton Foster]

So they just had to go down the elevator to the theater.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It was like, very easy. And then they went right back to New.

[Sutton Foster]

Uh huh.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And then I think that was the last thing she ever saw me do in New York. And I would get like bootlegs for her and so I would get bootlegs of all my shows and send her those.

[Sutton Foster]

Wow.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And I know. And my dad never came up. So when my mom passed away in 2013, my dad reclaimed his life and he, he has a lady friend and he travels and he came to the opening night of Mattress Incredible. He's like awesome grandpa. And they moved down there and they live in North Carolina. And I talk to him like three or four times a week. And we're really close. And yeah, he's really like.

[Sutton Foster]

There's also something so lovely about seeing that even, you know, when people are in their quote unquote, we've been talking a little bit like we're about to enter our second acts of our life.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Yep.

[Sutton Foster]

You know, when people are in their. The second act of their life, they still can change and they can still redevelop and rekindle relationships.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

My dad is a perfect example, and I write a lot about it in the book. But my mom died when she was 66, so my dad was 60. They were the same age. And so he, I remember in his 60s, he was like, he had like one foot in the grave and they were miserable. And when she died, he got his teeth fixed, he got his heart fixed, he quit smoking, he started dating, he's active and they adopted three dogs. Incredible. He's just full of life.

[Sutton Foster]

And he's a grandpa.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

He is a grandpa. He's pawpaw. Yeah. It's pretty awesome. And you're right. It's never too late.

[Sutton Foster]

It's never too late.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

And my dad is like. He's like, life is short. He's 77 now. He's like, life is short. He's like, you gotta live, you gotta go. You know? And I was like, all right, dad.

[Sutton Foster]

That's so great. Yeah, I'm so happy. You gotta see you in mattress. I can't wait to see you. I'm so excited.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

It is such a silly show.

[Sutton Foster]

I love it. It's one of my favorite shows.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Oh, it's so silly. And this cast is, like, bonkers. Yeah, it's really fun.

[Sutton Foster]

Yeah. I cannot wait. Thank you for doing this.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Are you kidding? This is really awesome. Thank you.

[Sutton Foster]

Oh, my God.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

We got a little deep.

[Sutton Foster]

We did, but that's the point.

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Okay.

[Sutton Foster]

Can you imagine if we hadn't?

[Jesse Tyler Ferguson]

Then it would have a waste of our time. What? A waste of our time.

[Sutton Foster]

This episode of Dinners on Me was recorded at Simonette in Culver City, California. Next week on Dinners on Me. You know him from White Collar, Magic Mike, and more recently from the new Hulu series, Mid Century Modern, it's Matt Bomer. We'll get into his coming out story, sending his kids off to college. And he tells me the story of the time he got sent home from the set of White Collar. And if you don't want to wait until next week to listen, you can download that episode right now by subscribing to Dinners On Me. Plus, as a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, you'll also be able to listen completely ad free. Just click try free at the top of the Dinners on Me show page on Apple Podcasts to start your free trial today. Dinners on Me is a production of Sony Music Entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions. It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Our associate producer is Alyssa Midcalf. Sam Baer engineered this episode. Hans Dale, she composed our theme music. Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tameka Balance Kolasny and Justin Makita. I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week. I don't know about you, but when I was a kid, one of my favorite errands was going to the deli counter with my parents. I'd press my nose against the glass watching as they sliced the perfect cut of turkey or ham and if I was lucky, I'd get a sample handed over the counter like a little gift. Now as a dad, I love the idea of recreating that experience with my own kids. Picking up some Boar's Head Oven Gold Turkey or Smokemaster Beechwood Smoked Black Forest Ham and some aged Cheddar for a picnic in the park. Because there's making a sandwich and then there's crafting a sandwich. Boar's Head uses premium whole cuts of meat, hand trimmed and slow roasted to perfection. Every flavor is carefully chosen and every recipe is crafted with purpose. So when I want a meal to be truly great, I choose Boar's Head. And I know when we spread out the picnic blanket just like I did when I was a kid, it'll be a meal worth remembering. Boar's Head Committed to crafts since 1905, discover the craftsmanship behind every bite at boarshead.

[Simon Mayo]

Com.