Forever35 Podcast Episode 340: How to Invest In Your Friendships with Rhaina Cohen

Release Date: February 17, 2025

Hosts: Doree Shafrir & Elise Hu
Guest: Rhaina Cohen
Episode Title: How to Invest In Your Friendships

Introduction

In Episode 340 of Forever35, hosts Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu delve into the intricate dynamics of modern friendships with guest Rhaina Cohen. This episode is part of their special Friendship Month series, focusing on redefining and deepening the bonds that sustain us as we navigate adulthood. Together, they explore the concept of platonic partnerships, the historical evolution of friendships, the impact of social media, and practical steps to invest meaningfully in existing and new friendships.

Guest Introduction

Rhaina Cohen, a producer and editor for the NPR documentary podcast Embedded, joins Doree and Elise to discuss her debut book, The Other Significant Others. Supported by the National Endowment of the Humanities Public Scholars Program, Cohen's work examines friendships that mirror life partnerships, challenging traditional notions of romance and family. With a rich background in social sciences and journalism, including her time as a Marshall Scholar at Oxford, Cohen brings a thoughtful and scholarly perspective to the conversation.

Defining Platonic Partnerships

At the heart of the discussion is Cohen's central argument: friendship holds untapped potential and is often undervalued compared to romantic relationships. Through her book, she introduces the term "platonic partnerships" to describe friendships that offer the same depth, commitment, and intimacy typically associated with romantic bonds.

"I'm arguing that friendship has untapped potential and that we undermine friendship by expecting too little of it. At the same time, we undermine romantic relationships by expecting too much."
— Doree Shafrir [18:35]

Cohen shares personal experiences that highlight the depth of her friendships, illustrating how these relationships provide support, connection, and fulfillment beyond societal expectations.

Historical Context of Friendships

Cohen provides a compelling historical perspective, noting that the contemporary devaluation of friendship is a historical anomaly. Traditionally, same-sex friendships often served as primary intimate relationships, especially in contexts where marital bonds were more transactional.

"The way that we treat friendship now, I think, is actually a total historical anomaly. Historically, marriages were often arranged for economic reasons, and intimate same-sex friendships played a crucial role in providing emotional support."
— Doree Shafrir [23:16]

She references practices like "sworn brotherhood" in religious contexts, emphasizing that public acknowledgment and societal support for deep friendships were more common in the past.

Societal Norms and Counterarguments

Cohen addresses the pushback against elevating friendships to the level of romantic relationships, especially amidst resurgent advocacy for the nuclear family. Some critics perceive this shift as anti-marriage, a narrative Cohen actively counters.

"I've been accused of being anti-marriage, which I was expecting, but I'm not an anti-marriage person. I'm critiquing how we venerate marriage and romantic relationships, which often overshadow the potential of friendships."
— Doree Shafrir [25:53]

She emphasizes a pluralistic approach, advocating for recognizing diverse relationship structures without devaluing traditional ones.

Personal Experiences and Living Arrangements

Cohen and Shafrir share their unconventional living arrangements as examples of platonic partnerships. By cohabiting with close friends and even considering shared property ownership, they demonstrate the practical application of investing deeply in friendships.

"My husband and I moved in with two of our good friends and their child, which deepened our relationships in ways that traditional living arrangements might not."
— Doree Shafrir [28:26]

These arrangements challenge the notion that the nuclear family is the only viable or stable living unit, showcasing how friendships can provide extended support systems.

Social Media's Impact on Friendship

The conversation shifts to the role of social media, particularly platforms like TikTok, in shaping modern friendships. While Cohen acknowledges that social media can foster connections, she also highlights its potential downsides, such as promoting boundaries in ways that may inadvertently weaken bonds.

"There are viral videos on TikTok about platonic life partners, which support the idea that friendships can be deeply fulfilling. However, the emphasis on setting boundaries can sometimes lead to friends becoming avoidant and resistant to conflict."
— Doree Shafrir [38:52]

Cohen reflects on how algorithms often present a dichotomy between promoting strong friendships and encouraging self-isolation for mental well-being, noting the complexity of these influences.

Cultivating Closer Friendships

To foster deeper friendships, Cohen suggests intentionality through time, togetherness, and touch—the key ingredients of attachment.

1. Time: Spending significant time together in meaningful activities beyond superficial interactions.

   "Find ways to spend a lot of time with another person. Our closest friendships often came from environments like school or camp, where interactions were intense and frequent."
   — Doree Shafrir [32:14]

2. Togetherness: Engaging in shared experiences that build a sense of camaraderie and mutual support.

   "Having more in-person interactions, like running errands together or collaborating on projects, can create lasting bonds."
   — Cohen [32:14]

3. Touch: Incorporating physical connection, whether through gestures or shared activities that promote closeness.

   "Being willing to initiate physical connection, like giving someone a ride or engaging in communal activities, can significantly strengthen friendships."
   — Cohen [35:36]

The hosts and Cohen emphasize the importance of overcoming the fear of rejection and taking proactive steps to deepen friendships, even if it means stepping outside comfort zones.

Investing in Existing Friendships

When asked how to invest more actively in existing friendships, Cohen advocates for meta-conversations—discussions about the friendship itself.

"How often do you talk to your friends about your friendship and how it's doing? Bringing meta conversation into friendship is one thing that I would recommend."
— Doree Shafrir [49:01]

By reflecting on and discussing the state and needs of the friendship, individuals can identify ways to enhance and sustain their bonds.

Conclusion

Episode 340 of Forever35 offers a profound exploration of the vital role friendships play in our lives. Through Rhaina Cohen's insights and personal anecdotes, listeners are encouraged to reimagine the potential of their friendships, invest intentionally in these relationships, and challenge societal norms that may undervalue the depth of platonic bonds. By embracing time, togetherness, and touch, and engaging in honest conversations about friendship, individuals can cultivate more fulfilling and resilient connections.

Notable Quotes:

• "Friendship has untapped potential and that we undermine friendship by expecting too little of it."
  — Doree Shafrir [18:35]

• "The way that we treat friendship now, I think, is actually a total historical anomaly."
  — Doree Shafrir [23:16]

• "I've been accused of being anti-marriage, but I'm not. I'm critiquing how we venerate marriage and romantic relationships."
  — Doree Shafrir [25:53]

• "Find ways to spend a lot of time with another person. Our closest friendships often came from environments like school or camp."
  — Doree Shafrir [32:14]

• "Bringing meta conversation into friendship is one thing that I would recommend."
  — Doree Shafrir [49:01]

Key Takeaways:

1. Platonic Partnerships: Friendships can be as deep and committed as romantic relationships, offering emotional support and intimacy.

2. Historical Perspectives: The undervaluing of friendships today contrasts with historical practices where same-sex friendships were primary intimate bonds.

3. Intentional Investment: Building strong friendships requires deliberate efforts in spending time, creating shared experiences, and fostering physical connections.

4. Social Media Influence: While platforms like TikTok can both support and challenge the depth of friendships, balancing virtual and face-to-face interactions is crucial.

5. Meta-Conversations: Discussing the nature and health of friendships can lead to more fulfilling and resilient relationships.

By embracing these principles, listeners can transform their approach to friendships, recognizing them as essential pillars of a fulfilling and balanced life.